1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:17,040 Hey everyone, Ashley here with RSS.com. 2 00:00:17,040 --> 00:00:20,280 In this episode, we're chatting with Kate Vulman, who is the host of the Create For 3 00:00:20,280 --> 00:00:21,680 No Reason podcast. 4 00:00:21,680 --> 00:00:26,040 We're talking about giving yourself permission to play with the podcasting medium and enjoying 5 00:00:26,040 --> 00:00:28,040 the creative process. 6 00:00:28,040 --> 00:00:30,040 So, let's get started. 7 00:00:30,040 --> 00:00:32,040 Well, Kate, welcome to the show. 8 00:00:32,040 --> 00:00:34,040 I'm so excited you could be here today. 9 00:00:34,040 --> 00:00:36,040 Can you do us a favor and tell us what you do? 10 00:00:36,040 --> 00:00:37,040 Sure. 11 00:00:37,040 --> 00:00:39,040 Well, Ashley, first of all, thank you so much for having me. 12 00:00:39,040 --> 00:00:43,040 This is such a fun little blast from the past that we met so many years ago and now we get 13 00:00:43,040 --> 00:00:45,040 to reconnect. 14 00:00:45,040 --> 00:00:47,040 I am the CEO of Floyd Coaching. 15 00:00:47,040 --> 00:00:52,040 So, my team and I, we get to work with organizations to help them build dynamic cultures. 16 00:00:52,040 --> 00:00:55,040 And of course, like many of your listeners, I am a creator. 17 00:00:55,040 --> 00:01:01,040 I'm a very multi-hyphenate entrepreneur who just does a lot of different things. 18 00:01:01,040 --> 00:01:02,040 I'm a podcaster. 19 00:01:02,040 --> 00:01:03,040 I'm an author. 20 00:01:03,040 --> 00:01:05,040 I love creating videos. 21 00:01:05,040 --> 00:01:07,040 I'm a creator. 22 00:01:07,040 --> 00:01:08,040 I love that so much. 23 00:01:08,040 --> 00:01:12,040 And it's interesting you say the coaching because that's not actually how we met. 24 00:01:12,040 --> 00:01:15,040 We met in the content creation space. 25 00:01:15,040 --> 00:01:20,040 And I found you again because you have an awesome newsletter that says Create For No 26 00:01:20,040 --> 00:01:21,040 Reason. 27 00:01:21,040 --> 00:01:28,040 And what got me so excited about that is that you really stand by what you say of just getting 28 00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:30,040 out there and just playing. 29 00:01:30,040 --> 00:01:32,040 So, when did podcasting come into your world? 30 00:01:32,040 --> 00:01:34,040 Podcasting came in... 31 00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:38,040 Okay, so like a lot of podcasters, I dabbled. 32 00:01:38,040 --> 00:01:40,040 I was a dabbler in podcasting, right? 33 00:01:40,040 --> 00:01:46,040 So, I actually, Ashley, if I really think about it, it was all the way back in probably 34 00:01:46,040 --> 00:01:51,040 like 2008 when I learned about podcasting and I learned what it was. 35 00:01:51,040 --> 00:01:54,040 And I still remember going into my friend's office and he was like, oh yeah, there's this 36 00:01:54,040 --> 00:01:56,040 thing called podcasting. 37 00:01:56,040 --> 00:02:01,040 And I started, I quote unquote, started this podcast called Smart Talk for Women, which 38 00:02:01,040 --> 00:02:05,040 was a program that I did for the Chamber of Commerce and I worked there at the time. 39 00:02:05,040 --> 00:02:06,040 Now, this is forever ago. 40 00:02:06,040 --> 00:02:07,040 Nobody was listening to podcasts. 41 00:02:07,040 --> 00:02:09,040 It wasn't like a thing. 42 00:02:09,040 --> 00:02:11,040 But it kind of introduced me to the world of podcasting. 43 00:02:11,040 --> 00:02:15,040 And then, you know, Facebook came out and all the things started coming out. 44 00:02:15,040 --> 00:02:18,040 And so, I really wasn't doing any kind of podcasting. 45 00:02:18,040 --> 00:02:24,040 And then it wasn't until years later that a friend of mine said, hey, let's start a 46 00:02:24,040 --> 00:02:25,040 podcast. 47 00:02:25,040 --> 00:02:28,040 This was probably, I don't know, maybe like five years ago. 48 00:02:28,040 --> 00:02:31,040 And we started a podcast called Trajectory. 49 00:02:31,040 --> 00:02:34,040 Trajectory, and it was with my friend. 50 00:02:34,040 --> 00:02:37,040 And we kind of, we came up with this title because it was like, you know, trajectory 51 00:02:37,040 --> 00:02:40,040 just sounds like you're making your way into your future. 52 00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:41,040 You're creating your life. 53 00:02:41,040 --> 00:02:47,040 And so, we had that podcast for a little while and then, like a lot of podcasters, life gets 54 00:02:47,040 --> 00:02:48,040 in the way. 55 00:02:48,040 --> 00:02:50,040 You kind of stop doing it. 56 00:02:50,040 --> 00:02:52,040 And so, we really stopped doing that podcast. 57 00:02:52,040 --> 00:02:59,040 And then a couple years later, this is two, about two years, this is October 2020. 58 00:02:59,040 --> 00:03:06,040 So, my friend Sean, Sean Funder, who you know, he and I were talking and I said, we should 59 00:03:06,040 --> 00:03:07,040 start a podcast. 60 00:03:07,040 --> 00:03:09,040 And so, we were thinking, what are we going to talk about? 61 00:03:09,040 --> 00:03:14,040 And Sean and I, we could talk about the creative process all day. 62 00:03:14,040 --> 00:03:19,040 Just writers, authors, comedians, creator, any type of content creator, we just, we could 63 00:03:19,040 --> 00:03:21,040 just geek out on it all day long. 64 00:03:21,040 --> 00:03:25,040 And so, we thought we would have a podcast that was just kind of talking about that kind 65 00:03:25,040 --> 00:03:30,040 of stuff, like what happens when you're creating, imposter syndrome and perfectionism and all 66 00:03:30,040 --> 00:03:31,040 of those topics. 67 00:03:31,040 --> 00:03:35,040 And so, we brainstormed forever. 68 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:37,040 Ashley, it was forever. 69 00:03:37,040 --> 00:03:41,040 We could not figure out the perfect title of the podcast. 70 00:03:41,040 --> 00:03:46,040 And like, again, so many of the listeners, we probably spent way too much time contemplating 71 00:03:46,040 --> 00:03:48,040 it because you just have to kind of pick one and roll with it. 72 00:03:48,040 --> 00:03:53,040 And then at some point, I remember, I still remember, you know, you have those memories 73 00:03:53,040 --> 00:03:55,040 where you're, you know, where you were and what you were doing. 74 00:03:55,040 --> 00:03:59,040 I was on the phone with him and I was in my kitchen and I was like cutting something up 75 00:03:59,040 --> 00:04:01,040 for making my dinner. 76 00:04:01,040 --> 00:04:03,040 And I said, create for no reason. 77 00:04:03,040 --> 00:04:05,040 I said, create for no reason. 78 00:04:05,040 --> 00:04:11,040 Just because I love that title because it's create for no reason, but also there is a 79 00:04:11,040 --> 00:04:12,040 reason. 80 00:04:12,040 --> 00:04:15,040 You're creating for the joy of it, like just for the joy of it. 81 00:04:15,040 --> 00:04:16,040 So, I love its double meaning. 82 00:04:16,040 --> 00:04:19,040 And I thought that is the name of our show. 83 00:04:19,040 --> 00:04:25,040 And once we named it, the next week, we got on the microphone and recorded our first episode. 84 00:04:25,040 --> 00:04:30,040 And in October of 2020, create for no reason was put out into the world. 85 00:04:30,040 --> 00:04:33,040 You birthed your podcast. 86 00:04:33,040 --> 00:04:37,040 We birthed our podcast and it was a beautiful thing. 87 00:04:37,040 --> 00:04:40,040 Now, is he still recording with you? 88 00:04:40,040 --> 00:04:44,040 So, this is, okay, this is another thing about the creation process. 89 00:04:44,040 --> 00:04:46,040 You never know what's going to happen. 90 00:04:46,040 --> 00:04:48,040 And so, he and I recorded podcasts. 91 00:04:48,040 --> 00:04:52,040 We did about, I think it was about 40 episodes. 92 00:04:52,040 --> 00:04:56,040 And after about 40 episodes, we did a bunch of them, just the two of us. 93 00:04:56,040 --> 00:04:59,040 And then we started inviting guests to come on. 94 00:04:59,040 --> 00:05:00,040 So, we started doing that. 95 00:05:00,040 --> 00:05:05,040 And then about 40 episodes in, he just kind of was doing a lot of other projects and things. 96 00:05:05,040 --> 00:05:07,040 And life for him got really, really busy. 97 00:05:07,040 --> 00:05:11,040 And so, he decided to go and pursue other projects. 98 00:05:11,040 --> 00:05:17,040 And I was like, okay, I am a really great starter. 99 00:05:17,040 --> 00:05:21,040 I can start anything like the best of them, right? 100 00:05:21,040 --> 00:05:25,040 Like I'm sure that if you're listening, you probably, maybe you're like that, right? 101 00:05:25,040 --> 00:05:26,040 Like you can start a podcast. 102 00:05:26,040 --> 00:05:29,040 You can start a channel on YouTube or something. 103 00:05:29,040 --> 00:05:31,040 But it's consistency and finishing. 104 00:05:31,040 --> 00:05:33,040 That's the hard part. 105 00:05:33,040 --> 00:05:37,040 And I said when we started the podcast, I said, I really want to do 100 episodes. 106 00:05:37,040 --> 00:05:41,040 Like if we're going to do it, we have to at least do 100 episodes. 107 00:05:41,040 --> 00:05:46,040 Even if no one listens, even if no one likes it, we have to commit to doing 100 episodes. 108 00:05:46,040 --> 00:05:48,040 And so, he decided to not do it. 109 00:05:48,040 --> 00:05:50,040 And I immediately was like, I'm doing this. 110 00:05:50,040 --> 00:05:52,040 I said we were going to do 100 episodes. 111 00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:54,040 And I am not stopping. 112 00:05:54,040 --> 00:05:56,040 And so, I started getting more guests. 113 00:05:56,040 --> 00:05:58,040 And so, I started having more of these conversations. 114 00:05:58,040 --> 00:06:01,040 And so, that was in October 2020. 115 00:06:01,040 --> 00:06:08,040 Now, I was super, super consistent every single week getting one out, getting one out, getting one out. 116 00:06:08,040 --> 00:06:12,040 I will say the past few months I haven't because of some other projects. 117 00:06:12,040 --> 00:06:14,040 But I'm still committed to doing it. 118 00:06:14,040 --> 00:06:17,040 And I'm at episode 90 right now. 119 00:06:17,040 --> 00:06:20,040 So, I have 10 more to go to get to that 100. 120 00:06:20,040 --> 00:06:27,040 And because I gave myself a little bit of grace and I took a little bit of time off to just allow myself 121 00:06:27,040 --> 00:06:35,040 to not feel like I was doing it just for the purpose of doing it and because I really wanted to live 122 00:06:35,040 --> 00:06:38,040 what the podcast was about, which is the joy of it. 123 00:06:38,040 --> 00:06:40,040 I did lose a little of the joy of it. 124 00:06:40,040 --> 00:06:44,040 And so, I thought, okay, give myself a little bit of break, came back, and now I'm back on track. 125 00:06:44,040 --> 00:06:49,040 And so, I'm like, okay, even after 100, I'm going to keep doing it because I just enjoy doing it. 126 00:06:49,040 --> 00:06:53,040 I like the practice of it all. 127 00:06:53,040 --> 00:06:54,040 I love that. I really do. 128 00:06:54,040 --> 00:07:02,040 So, now, a lot of episodes have been done in a short amount of time in podcaster terms, I guess you'd say. 129 00:07:02,040 --> 00:07:07,040 So, what was it like trying to get that many episodes cranking? 130 00:07:07,040 --> 00:07:15,040 Well, what's funny is it's almost like we have to trick our brains into just starting, right? 131 00:07:15,040 --> 00:07:17,040 Like, I was like, okay, 100 episodes. 132 00:07:17,040 --> 00:07:19,040 And 100 episodes seems like a lot. 133 00:07:19,040 --> 00:07:20,040 It's like, oh, my gosh. 134 00:07:20,040 --> 00:07:24,040 And if you're only focused on that, then you're thinking, oh, my gosh, we're only on episode one. 135 00:07:24,040 --> 00:07:27,040 We're only on episode five or 10 or whatever it is. 136 00:07:27,040 --> 00:07:30,040 And so, in the back of my mind, I had the goal of 100. 137 00:07:30,040 --> 00:07:35,040 But every week, it was more of like a, Sean, we just have to show up every week. 138 00:07:35,040 --> 00:07:39,040 Like, as long as we show up every week, then it's going to be a year. 139 00:07:39,040 --> 00:07:42,040 We're going to have 52 episodes, and we're not going to even know what happened. 140 00:07:42,040 --> 00:07:45,040 And it was just the consistency and the practice. 141 00:07:45,040 --> 00:07:52,040 And what we also noticed was if we skipped a week or two, we kind of lost that podcasting muscle. 142 00:07:52,040 --> 00:08:02,040 And you know, because you're a podcaster, as a podcaster, we're so critical of the ums, the ahs, the likes, the you knows. 143 00:08:02,040 --> 00:08:07,040 It's so cringeworthy when I do it because I'm like, I should know better than that. 144 00:08:07,040 --> 00:08:08,040 You know, this is what I do. 145 00:08:08,040 --> 00:08:14,040 And the more that you do it, the more that you recognize it and the better you become as a podcaster, as an interviewer. 146 00:08:14,040 --> 00:08:22,040 And so if we just switch our mind from, hey, we have to hit this goal or we have to hit this number or how many downloads or any of that kind of stuff, 147 00:08:22,040 --> 00:08:28,040 and we focus more on showing up, doing the work, more on the content, what am I saying? 148 00:08:28,040 --> 00:08:30,040 What should I, what needs to be said? 149 00:08:30,040 --> 00:08:34,040 What do I find interesting that I think other people would really resonate with? 150 00:08:34,040 --> 00:08:43,040 And if we focused a lot more time on that, I wonder how many more, how much more success people would see because they're just focused on what they can control. 151 00:08:43,040 --> 00:08:45,040 Versus what they can't control. 152 00:08:45,040 --> 00:08:57,040 We can't control how many downloads or how many people are going to listen, but we can control the messaging, why we're doing it, and honestly just showing up every single day or week or whenever you decide the cadence of your podcast is. 153 00:08:57,040 --> 00:09:02,040 So you mean I don't have to show up with the intention of making a whole bunch of money? 154 00:09:02,040 --> 00:09:08,040 I know, right? Shocking. 155 00:09:08,040 --> 00:09:12,040 Can you imagine doing something and not getting paid for it? 156 00:09:12,040 --> 00:09:15,040 I mean, that's kind of what I want to talk about though. 157 00:09:15,040 --> 00:09:23,040 Like, I mean, you know, a lot of people, whenever they come to us, you know, they want to start a podcast because they have a passion for something. 158 00:09:23,040 --> 00:09:31,040 But then you just get inundated with a lot of information about how to monetize and how to grow and how to get more downloads. 159 00:09:31,040 --> 00:09:37,040 I'm getting the impression from you though, if you're not enjoying it, none of that matters. 160 00:09:37,040 --> 00:09:42,040 I mean, look, everyone has their thing. 161 00:09:42,040 --> 00:09:46,040 And it's about the intentionality. 162 00:09:46,040 --> 00:09:57,040 If it was my intention to have a podcast business, well then yeah, I would look at things a completely different way than I did when I started Create for No Reason. 163 00:09:57,040 --> 00:10:00,040 It would be a completely different strategy. 164 00:10:00,040 --> 00:10:09,040 So if the dream, if anyone listening has a dream of being a full-time podcaster and earning a living from it, that's awesome. 165 00:10:09,040 --> 00:10:11,040 And you can absolutely achieve that dream. 166 00:10:11,040 --> 00:10:14,040 I have friends that do it for a living and they do very well. 167 00:10:14,040 --> 00:10:23,040 And now they teach other people how to do it and they have courses and they've really designed their life around podcasting and they were very strategic about it. 168 00:10:23,040 --> 00:10:28,040 At least for me right now in my journey, I am not interested in that. 169 00:10:28,040 --> 00:10:30,040 I am not of interest in me. 170 00:10:30,040 --> 00:10:35,040 I, for whatever reason, now that totally could change a year from now. 171 00:10:35,040 --> 00:10:40,040 But for me, it's more of an outlet that I use just to have fun and it brings me a lot of joy. 172 00:10:40,040 --> 00:10:44,040 It has also allowed me to meet some really interesting people. 173 00:10:44,040 --> 00:10:53,040 And it also is, so I wrote a book this year and it helped me with the practice of the creative process. 174 00:10:53,040 --> 00:11:03,040 And I think that the fact that I can show up and flesh out your ideas on a podcast is really cool because maybe sometimes I don't feel like sitting down and writing, but I kind of want to riff on a specific topic. 175 00:11:03,040 --> 00:11:12,040 So the practice of having to get behind the microphone and share a specific message, it's almost like it does a lot for me in the creation process. 176 00:11:12,040 --> 00:11:14,040 So that's the purpose of my podcast. 177 00:11:14,040 --> 00:11:16,040 I want to share really great information. 178 00:11:16,040 --> 00:11:32,040 I want to help people understand that getting back to the joy of creating, whether it's a podcast, whether it is doing videos or you want to write a book or you want to do photography or art or painting or any of that stuff, you don't have to earn a living doing it. 179 00:11:32,040 --> 00:11:36,040 Just because you're a really great painter doesn't mean you have to sell everything that you create. 180 00:11:36,040 --> 00:11:39,040 And so that's the message that I want to share. 181 00:11:39,040 --> 00:11:42,040 So it's just a very different outlook on it, right? 182 00:11:42,040 --> 00:11:46,040 Neither one is good or bad, it just is. 183 00:11:46,040 --> 00:11:52,040 And so I think everyone has to be really clear on what is your outcome, what is the goal that you're really looking to do. 184 00:11:52,040 --> 00:11:58,040 But obviously, like any business, there's no get-rich-quick scheme. 185 00:11:58,040 --> 00:12:06,040 I don't think anybody should think, hey, I'm going to start a business and within three months I'm going to be earning six figures and it's going to be this multimillion dollar business. 186 00:12:06,040 --> 00:12:08,040 It's the same thing if you start a podcast. 187 00:12:08,040 --> 00:12:11,040 You have to go into an understanding, like, are there ways to monetize? 188 00:12:11,040 --> 00:12:18,040 Yes, but it's a process and you have to kind of structure it and just kind of know what you're getting yourself into. 189 00:12:18,040 --> 00:12:22,040 And like any other, it's like any other business. 190 00:12:22,040 --> 00:12:25,040 But those are different ways to look at it. 191 00:12:25,040 --> 00:12:29,040 I'm glad you said all of that because I don't know if you follow Denise Stufield Thomas. 192 00:12:29,040 --> 00:12:34,040 I've mentioned her a couple of times on the podcast before, but she had a podcast episode. 193 00:12:34,040 --> 00:12:37,040 I think it was a podcast episode or maybe it was just a YouTube video. 194 00:12:37,040 --> 00:12:42,040 But she basically was just saying, you don't have to monetize every hobby you have. 195 00:12:42,040 --> 00:12:44,040 You're allowed to do it just for fun. 196 00:12:44,040 --> 00:12:54,040 And that's kind of what's resonating so much with me right now with what you're saying is, you know, there's so many things that it's like you get into it and then you think, God, I'm spending a lot of time on this. 197 00:12:54,040 --> 00:12:56,040 Maybe I should try to make some money from it. 198 00:12:56,040 --> 00:13:01,040 But it's like, why can't we just instead just have fun with it? 199 00:13:01,040 --> 00:13:05,040 And that's one of the reasons I like what your message is so much. 200 00:13:05,040 --> 00:13:11,040 So I'm going to ask you, to you, what does the phrase create for no reason really mean? 201 00:13:11,040 --> 00:13:13,040 What does that embody for you? 202 00:13:13,040 --> 00:13:26,040 Well, I had mentioned, I think one of the reasons why I love the title so much is because it was like the essence of when I said it when we were trying to come up with the term. 203 00:13:26,040 --> 00:13:38,040 Because I love the creative process, because I love hearing about authors and comedians and writers and artists that just they show up and do the work. 204 00:13:38,040 --> 00:13:43,040 And it's almost like they can't not do it. 205 00:13:43,040 --> 00:13:45,040 They love it so much. 206 00:13:45,040 --> 00:13:46,040 They can't not. 207 00:13:46,040 --> 00:13:49,040 I've heard comedians talk about how this is a horrible life. 208 00:13:49,040 --> 00:13:54,040 We are on the road so many days and we're in bad hotels and eating crappy food. 209 00:13:54,040 --> 00:13:56,040 And don't choose this life. 210 00:13:56,040 --> 00:14:00,040 But they have to because they love the practice of getting up on stage. 211 00:14:00,040 --> 00:14:05,040 And so for me, create for no reason is around, hey, create for no reason. 212 00:14:05,040 --> 00:14:12,040 Give yourself permission to just have fun, to just enjoy, to just see what happens. 213 00:14:12,040 --> 00:14:22,040 Like, let's just allow ourselves to be creative because we as we get older and we're we are so focused on return on investment and all of that stuff. 214 00:14:22,040 --> 00:14:33,040 We forget that we used to love to paint and take pictures and and do photography or whatever that craft is that you love so much. 215 00:14:33,040 --> 00:14:38,040 And for a lot of your listeners, it's it's things like podcasting and videos and putting content out into the world. 216 00:14:38,040 --> 00:14:40,040 You're allowed to do that just for fun. 217 00:14:40,040 --> 00:14:52,040 And when we think about the monetization piece of it, what's fascinating to me is we have to remember the second that we trade our craft for a dollar amount. 218 00:14:52,040 --> 00:14:57,040 And when someone pays us for that work, our relationship with that work changes. 219 00:14:57,040 --> 00:15:00,040 It doesn't we see it all over. 220 00:15:00,040 --> 00:15:07,040 I saw with my friend who is who is a designer and he goes into his workshop and his workshop used to be his happy place. 221 00:15:07,040 --> 00:15:11,040 And he loved creating and making all of these really cool. 222 00:15:11,040 --> 00:15:14,040 He was like a woodworker, like with his hands and he loved it. 223 00:15:14,040 --> 00:15:16,040 And then all of a sudden people were like, you should start a business. 224 00:15:16,040 --> 00:15:20,040 He started the business. He started hating going into his workshop. 225 00:15:20,040 --> 00:15:25,040 This place that was his sanctuary of just music and creating. 226 00:15:25,040 --> 00:15:33,040 He hated it because he's like, I feel like I'm now working at just like, hey, you could just order this online and I'm going to I'm not Amazon. 227 00:15:33,040 --> 00:15:39,040 I'm a I'm an artist. And so he just that he really lost a lot of the love that he had for the pieces that he was creating. 228 00:15:39,040 --> 00:15:42,040 And so he really stopped doing it for a few years. 229 00:15:42,040 --> 00:15:45,040 And so that is something to to recognize. 230 00:15:45,040 --> 00:15:48,040 And remember, we see it all the time with all these influencers. 231 00:15:48,040 --> 00:15:54,040 Right. How many influencers say it is so stressful because someone's paying us money to create these videos. 232 00:15:54,040 --> 00:15:56,040 They have to perform. They have to do well. 233 00:15:56,040 --> 00:16:00,040 People have to actually buy from the link or it's not considered a success. 234 00:16:00,040 --> 00:16:03,040 And so, again, not good or bad. 235 00:16:03,040 --> 00:16:05,040 But these are things that we have to remember. 236 00:16:05,040 --> 00:16:11,040 And so to go back to your original question, that's really what it means to me is just like giving yourself that permission. 237 00:16:11,040 --> 00:16:13,040 Grieve for no reason. Have fun with it. 238 00:16:13,040 --> 00:16:19,040 There's so much joy that comes out of that comes out of creating in the book that I wrote. 239 00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:21,040 I talk about return on investment. 240 00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:23,040 Well, what about return on creating? 241 00:16:23,040 --> 00:16:26,040 What about your rock instead of your ROI? 242 00:16:26,040 --> 00:16:29,040 What about your turn on on creating your return on creating is? 243 00:16:29,040 --> 00:16:32,040 How much more energized do you feel? 244 00:16:32,040 --> 00:16:33,040 How it helps your relationships? 245 00:16:33,040 --> 00:16:37,040 You become a better leader, a better parent, a better friend because you're happier. 246 00:16:37,040 --> 00:16:40,040 You're living a more fulfilling life. 247 00:16:40,040 --> 00:16:46,040 So why don't we kind of in terms of our creativity, think about what is that doing for us? 248 00:16:46,040 --> 00:16:48,040 And then we might see it a little bit differently. 249 00:16:48,040 --> 00:16:56,040 Then we might allow ourselves and give ourselves permission to make the time and space for the creating of the creating what we really want to create in our life. 250 00:16:56,040 --> 00:17:03,040 I guess the big question I have for you is how do you prevent yourself from getting caught up in all the things? 251 00:17:03,040 --> 00:17:08,040 Because I mean, creating so many episodes, you still have to put a lot of thought into it. 252 00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:13,040 You still have to do a lot of steps to get the episodes ready to go. 253 00:17:13,040 --> 00:17:22,040 So kind of walk me through how you, I guess, create a podcast episode without stress, without freaking out about the end result. 254 00:17:22,040 --> 00:17:26,040 Well, podcasting without stress, that's a book. 255 00:17:26,040 --> 00:17:31,040 Something that Ashley needs to write that book. 256 00:17:31,040 --> 00:17:39,040 So my initial reaction right when you said that was reps. 257 00:17:39,040 --> 00:17:41,040 It's all reps. 258 00:17:41,040 --> 00:17:44,040 You know, the more that you do, the easier that it becomes. 259 00:17:44,040 --> 00:17:45,040 That's what I have found. 260 00:17:45,040 --> 00:17:55,040 You know, one of the apps that I'm not huge on social media these days, but one app that was really big during the pandemic was Clubhouse. 261 00:17:55,040 --> 00:17:59,040 And it's an audio only app for those that don't know. 262 00:17:59,040 --> 00:18:04,040 And so I am part of this community called Breakfast of Champions over on Clubhouse. 263 00:18:04,040 --> 00:18:11,040 And I do a segment, a 30 minute segment every week, which is kind of like a podcast episode. 264 00:18:11,040 --> 00:18:15,040 And every week I have to come up with what am I going to say to these people? 265 00:18:15,040 --> 00:18:17,040 There's like a couple hundred people in the room. 266 00:18:17,040 --> 00:18:21,040 I'm like, what am I going to say to these people every Thursday morning? 267 00:18:21,040 --> 00:18:25,040 And because I do it every single week, I always come up with content. 268 00:18:25,040 --> 00:18:33,040 I always come up with a story, what I want to share, something that happened to me, a person that I met, a book that I read, something I listen to. 269 00:18:33,040 --> 00:18:37,040 And so when it comes to podcasting, that's how I create my podcast episodes, too. 270 00:18:37,040 --> 00:18:39,040 I mean, you get my weekly newsletter. 271 00:18:39,040 --> 00:18:42,040 I have to think about what am I going to write in this newsletter every week? 272 00:18:42,040 --> 00:18:47,040 And last week I was thinking, what am I going to write in my newsletter? 273 00:18:47,040 --> 00:18:50,040 And I was going back and forth with all these different topics. 274 00:18:50,040 --> 00:18:52,040 And then I said, you know what? 275 00:18:52,040 --> 00:18:54,040 This is a podcast episode. 276 00:18:54,040 --> 00:18:59,040 And I got on my mic and I called the episode The Thing About Creating. 277 00:18:59,040 --> 00:19:05,040 And I talked about the thing about creating is it's like, we want it to be perfect, but it's not perfect. 278 00:19:05,040 --> 00:19:07,040 And you have to show up and you have to do the work. 279 00:19:07,040 --> 00:19:09,040 And it's all of these. 280 00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:14,040 It's just like a collection of all of the things that we've done in the past that helped push us forward to create these different messages. 281 00:19:14,040 --> 00:19:18,040 And so I would say it's so much about the reps. 282 00:19:18,040 --> 00:19:21,040 Like, there are some episodes that I do that I'm like, nailed it, killed it. 283 00:19:21,040 --> 00:19:22,040 I love this episode. 284 00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:26,040 And then there's some episodes I do, I'm like, that was kind of lame. 285 00:19:26,040 --> 00:19:34,040 But either way, I put it out because sometimes the kind of lame ones, I get people that say, oh, my gosh, I needed to hear that. 286 00:19:34,040 --> 00:19:36,040 You were speaking directly to me. 287 00:19:36,040 --> 00:19:39,040 And so who am I to judge what somebody else needs? 288 00:19:39,040 --> 00:19:40,040 Who am I? 289 00:19:40,040 --> 00:19:45,040 I mean, there's a beautiful TED Talk by Ethan Hawke, and it's about creativity. 290 00:19:45,040 --> 00:19:49,040 And I love what he talks about because he's like, it's so fickle. 291 00:19:49,040 --> 00:19:50,040 The audience is so fickle. 292 00:19:50,040 --> 00:19:53,040 We never know what they're going to like or what they're not. 293 00:19:53,040 --> 00:19:56,040 And so that's why the only thing you can control is your message. 294 00:19:56,040 --> 00:19:58,040 So if you're proud of it, if you think it's going to help. 295 00:19:58,040 --> 00:20:00,040 But you got to put in the reps. 296 00:20:00,040 --> 00:20:15,040 Putting in the reps is the only way to be more comfortable with getting behind the mic and doing the episodes, not being afraid to put out mediocre work, not being afraid that every single one of your shows is perfect because none of them are. 297 00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:17,040 But you got to show up, doing the work, putting in the reps. 298 00:20:17,040 --> 00:20:18,040 That's what it is. 299 00:20:18,040 --> 00:20:26,040 Like every comedian, author, creator, artist, they always will say, it's like, you just got to keep doing them. 300 00:20:26,040 --> 00:20:34,040 Yeah, because you never know when inspiration is going to strike and you're talking about just keep showing up because the more that you do, the easier it becomes. 301 00:20:34,040 --> 00:20:37,040 One of my favorite books is by James Altucher. 302 00:20:37,040 --> 00:20:38,040 It's called Choose Yourself. 303 00:20:38,040 --> 00:20:43,040 And in it, he talks about how he started doing an idea brainstorming session. 304 00:20:43,040 --> 00:20:48,040 Like every single day he would commit to sitting down and just writing down 10 ideas. 305 00:20:48,040 --> 00:20:51,040 Something simple, just 10 ideas of anything. 306 00:20:51,040 --> 00:20:52,040 It could be on anything. 307 00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:56,040 And the more you do it, the more you just come up with things. 308 00:20:56,040 --> 00:21:02,040 And I remember I did this for about 30 days and just writing on anything. 309 00:21:02,040 --> 00:21:10,040 And I came up with so many blog post ideas, so many YouTube video ideas, so many everything ideas that don't have anything in common. 310 00:21:10,040 --> 00:21:14,040 They're not necessarily like, I think one day was about different flavors of ice cream. 311 00:21:14,040 --> 00:21:18,040 Like it's just, just completely different things that don't necessarily make any sense. 312 00:21:18,040 --> 00:21:22,040 But the fact that I kept doing it kept giving me more ideas. 313 00:21:22,040 --> 00:21:25,040 And the more I tried, the more ideas I had. 314 00:21:25,040 --> 00:21:26,040 Yeah. Oh my God. 315 00:21:26,040 --> 00:21:28,040 I love his 10 ideas a day. 316 00:21:28,040 --> 00:21:29,040 I love it. 317 00:21:29,040 --> 00:21:34,040 And he writes them on those little, those little notepads and he just brings them with him. 318 00:21:34,040 --> 00:21:36,040 And it's, it is the practice. 319 00:21:36,040 --> 00:21:44,040 Like in my book, I shared the seven myths, stopping people from pursuing their creative pursuits, really their passion projects. 320 00:21:44,040 --> 00:21:48,040 And myth number seven is inspiration will strike. 321 00:21:48,040 --> 00:21:51,040 We wait for inspiration, but inspiration doesn't strike. 322 00:21:51,040 --> 00:21:56,040 There's no, there's no muse that's going to come down from the sky and sprinkle you with fairy dust. 323 00:21:56,040 --> 00:21:59,040 And all of a sudden you're going to feel like doing your podcast. 324 00:21:59,040 --> 00:22:00,040 It's just not the way it works. 325 00:22:00,040 --> 00:22:04,040 You feel like doing your podcast when you sit down and do your podcast. 326 00:22:04,040 --> 00:22:07,040 Like then that's what you feel like doing the podcast. 327 00:22:07,040 --> 00:22:14,040 And so Stephen King talks about muses because I love this idea of muses, like inspiration. 328 00:22:14,040 --> 00:22:24,040 And he, he talks about how his, how a muse is actually, he said, he describes it as a muse is a basement kind of guy. 329 00:22:24,040 --> 00:22:29,040 He lives in the basement and he's smoking his cigars and he's looking at his bowling trophies. 330 00:22:29,040 --> 00:22:32,040 And we have to get down into the basement. 331 00:22:32,040 --> 00:22:37,040 We have to get down and when we do get down in the basement, he, the muse isn't even looking at us. 332 00:22:37,040 --> 00:22:39,040 He's not even paying attention to us. 333 00:22:39,040 --> 00:22:41,040 He just wants to know that we're there. 334 00:22:41,040 --> 00:22:47,040 And when we're there and we show up every day at the same time and we're doing the work, that's when, that's when the muse will come to you. 335 00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:52,040 The muse comes to you when you're working, not to inspire you to do the work. 336 00:22:52,040 --> 00:22:55,040 And I love that imagery that he used. 337 00:22:55,040 --> 00:22:56,040 That's really good. 338 00:22:56,040 --> 00:23:00,040 Like, I mean, that's kind of, it's almost profound. 339 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:02,040 Yeah. 340 00:23:02,040 --> 00:23:09,040 And, you know, one of the things that you were saying is that, you know, some of your, what you consider to be your lame episodes are the ones that take off. 341 00:23:09,040 --> 00:23:21,040 I just had Lloyd George on the show and we were talking about TikTok and how some of the ones that, that he'll take, you know, two, three, four hours to prepare for get no views. 342 00:23:21,040 --> 00:23:26,040 And then he'll pick up the phone and riff for 30 seconds and it gets like 11 billion views. 343 00:23:26,040 --> 00:23:36,040 And so it's, it's very interesting how the, the tide almost feels like it's turning and it's becoming more of a space for creativity. 344 00:23:36,040 --> 00:23:45,040 Because if you're, if you're showing up fake almost, I mean, I guess, I guess that's the best way to put it is if you're faking it, everyone can tell. 345 00:23:45,040 --> 00:23:53,040 But if you're authentically having a good time and enjoying yourself on the mic, then it's going to be more fun, not just for you, but also for your audience. 346 00:23:53,040 --> 00:23:55,040 Yeah, totally. 347 00:23:55,040 --> 00:23:58,040 That's, this is why I feel like you can tell. 348 00:23:58,040 --> 00:24:04,040 I mean, this is, that's why TikTok is very interesting platform because it truly is the people that do well on TikTok. 349 00:24:04,040 --> 00:24:08,040 It truly is no mask, no makeup, no fancy stuff. 350 00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:17,040 It's like them getting ready with their putting makeup on and doing all the things and sharing all their stories and crying and being so real because they're being so vulnerable. 351 00:24:17,040 --> 00:24:21,040 And that's what we look for in other people because it makes us feel human. 352 00:24:21,040 --> 00:24:23,040 It makes us feel like we're not alone. 353 00:24:23,040 --> 00:24:28,040 It makes us feel like, oh, I'm not the only one dealing with these emotions, these feelings, these situations. 354 00:24:28,040 --> 00:24:33,040 And that's what I think is so fascinating about that particular platform. 355 00:24:33,040 --> 00:24:48,040 I think that's honestly why, like going back to creativity kind of has blown up a lot more lately because, you know, during the pandemic, we all got really lonely and we were trying to find things that could help us connect with other people. 356 00:24:48,040 --> 00:24:53,040 And I honestly think that's one of the great things about podcasting is it does connect you with other people. 357 00:24:53,040 --> 00:24:58,040 And I've truly enjoyed all the people I've gotten to talk to because of this medium. 358 00:24:58,040 --> 00:25:08,040 So I guess my question to you would be, if I was starting a podcast today, what advice would you give me before I buy my microphone or even podcast host? 359 00:25:08,040 --> 00:25:09,040 Ooh, okay. 360 00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:16,040 So if you want to start a podcast today, especially if you've thought about it for longer than you care to admit, because it's something that you keep, right? 361 00:25:16,040 --> 00:25:18,040 Like how many people are like, I'm going to start a podcast. 362 00:25:18,040 --> 00:25:20,040 And they've been saying it for like the past three years. 363 00:25:20,040 --> 00:25:24,040 And you're like, seriously, dude, just start your podcast. 364 00:25:24,040 --> 00:25:34,040 So I would say that before you even care about the microphone or any of that stuff, which of course is important, you got to have good audio if you're going to be a podcaster. 365 00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:44,040 But it would be to decide what is the name of your podcast and then just write down the first episode. 366 00:25:44,040 --> 00:25:45,040 What is your first episode? 367 00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:46,040 What are you going to talk about? 368 00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:51,040 Now, I will say, I was going to say three episodes, but I'm trying to keep it even that easier. 369 00:25:51,040 --> 00:25:56,040 But I feel like a lot of people get stuck because they overthink what it's going to be. 370 00:25:56,040 --> 00:26:00,040 And I think about like, if you're going to start a podcast, you're in it for the long haul. 371 00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:02,040 You're going to have to come up with a lot of ideas. 372 00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:09,040 So like Ashley was saying, I think that James Altiger's like 10 ideas a day is a great way to kind of create that muscle. 373 00:26:09,040 --> 00:26:12,040 But think about what would be the first three episodes? 374 00:26:12,040 --> 00:26:13,040 Like, what are they going to be? 375 00:26:13,040 --> 00:26:14,040 And what are they going to talk about? 376 00:26:14,040 --> 00:26:15,040 What would I talk about? 377 00:26:15,040 --> 00:26:23,040 And then give yourself permission to create them knowing they are probably going to be bad. 378 00:26:23,040 --> 00:26:25,040 Like, they're probably not going to be the best episodes. 379 00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:33,040 You're going to go back to your first episode after you've done 10, 20, 50, and look back to your first one and think, oh, my gosh, I'm so embarrassed. 380 00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:34,040 That was horrible. 381 00:26:34,040 --> 00:26:35,040 Like, what was I thinking? 382 00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:37,040 But it doesn't matter. 383 00:26:37,040 --> 00:26:42,040 So I think a lot of people get really stuck in the process of the strategy, right? 384 00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:44,040 Like, I have to make all of them perfect. 385 00:26:44,040 --> 00:26:50,040 No, because if it really is about the reps, then you do the first episode and then you learn and you get feedback. 386 00:26:50,040 --> 00:26:52,040 And then you do the second episode and you learn and get feedback. 387 00:26:52,040 --> 00:26:54,040 And you just keep getting better and better and better. 388 00:26:54,040 --> 00:26:58,040 And so if you haven't started one, this is your time. 389 00:26:58,040 --> 00:27:00,040 You're going to create the name of it. 390 00:27:00,040 --> 00:27:04,040 And you are going to just create what are your first episodes? 391 00:27:04,040 --> 00:27:10,040 What do you feel so passionate about that you think, I need to be behind the microphone sharing this message? 392 00:27:10,040 --> 00:27:17,040 If you don't feel that strongly about something, you're not going to want to do it every week. 393 00:27:17,040 --> 00:27:22,040 Like, you're just not going to be excited to find people to talk about that specific topic. 394 00:27:22,040 --> 00:27:25,040 You're not going to be excited to sit down and figure out what am I going to talk about? 395 00:27:25,040 --> 00:27:26,040 What am I going to write? 396 00:27:26,040 --> 00:27:28,040 And what am I going to say? 397 00:27:28,040 --> 00:27:37,040 And then again, once you do, I mean, honestly, you know, once you do a few episodes, you just kind of get hooked. 398 00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:45,040 But I will say, I think it's really important, just like when people ask me, you know, how the writing process and writing a book, 399 00:27:45,040 --> 00:27:50,040 it is literally sitting down, giving yourself that goal. 400 00:27:50,040 --> 00:27:57,040 When I wrote my book, I, like a lot of people, I put it off because it seems like a big project, just like a podcast, seems like a huge project. 401 00:27:57,040 --> 00:28:00,040 If you think 100 episodes, that's a big project. 402 00:28:00,040 --> 00:28:02,040 But you can do one episode. 403 00:28:02,040 --> 00:28:04,040 You can do one episode. 404 00:28:04,040 --> 00:28:07,040 So writing the book, you can write 250 words today. 405 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:08,040 That's it. 406 00:28:08,040 --> 00:28:10,040 That's all you have to do is write 250 words. 407 00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:12,040 And then tomorrow you write 250 words. 408 00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:19,040 And then sometimes you sit down to write 250 words and you end up writing 500, a thousand words, just like in podcasting. 409 00:28:19,040 --> 00:28:26,040 Sometimes I sit down to record one podcast and I think, oh, I could do another episode because I'm on a roll and I get another episode in. 410 00:28:26,040 --> 00:28:28,040 But you sit down and you do the work. 411 00:28:28,040 --> 00:28:41,040 So whatever habit you have to create that gets you in your seat at the same time, whether it's every week, every day, whatever it is that gives you that so that you're able to actually create. 412 00:28:41,040 --> 00:28:51,040 And again, not wait for inspiration, but you're creating the inspiration by actually sitting down and making it more of a practice and process than outcome. 413 00:28:51,040 --> 00:28:52,040 Wow. 414 00:28:52,040 --> 00:28:54,040 All that was so good. 415 00:28:54,040 --> 00:28:58,040 And you said something that kind of made me remember. 416 00:28:58,040 --> 00:29:00,040 I don't remember who it was that shared this with me. 417 00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:03,040 And so, and I've heard it from many different people. 418 00:29:03,040 --> 00:29:06,040 So whoever was the starter of it, I have no idea. 419 00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:11,040 But they basically were saying, like, don't worry about the fact that your first episodes are not going to be polished. 420 00:29:11,040 --> 00:29:17,040 And they were recommending that you go to any YouTube channel, any YouTube channel that you like. 421 00:29:17,040 --> 00:29:24,040 And instead of looking at their most recent video, look at their first uploads, just to see that. 422 00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:27,040 Yeah, the first one's the lighting's terrible. 423 00:29:27,040 --> 00:29:28,040 They forgot to put on makeup. 424 00:29:28,040 --> 00:29:30,040 They might even have a stain on their shirts. 425 00:29:30,040 --> 00:29:32,040 But the point is they showed up. 426 00:29:32,040 --> 00:29:37,040 And so I really love all that you said about basically just keep doing it. 427 00:29:37,040 --> 00:29:44,040 And if you do find that you hate it, give yourself permission to quit, but try it, given the actual try. 428 00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:50,040 And so I like that you committed to 100 episodes, but I also like that you said, at least start with just three. 429 00:29:50,040 --> 00:29:54,040 Yeah, I mean, honestly, like you really might hate it. 430 00:29:54,040 --> 00:29:55,040 And that's totally OK. 431 00:29:55,040 --> 00:30:06,040 But that's what I love, too, about in creativity is we, my team always teases me because I always say everything is an iceberg. 432 00:30:06,040 --> 00:30:08,040 Everything is an iceberg. 433 00:30:08,040 --> 00:30:12,040 There's so much, there's so many layers of what you think you want to do. 434 00:30:12,040 --> 00:30:18,040 There's so many layers in becoming an influencer or becoming a manager or a leader or all. 435 00:30:18,040 --> 00:30:20,040 There's so many other pieces that we have to consider. 436 00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:23,040 And we don't know because we've never been in that situation. 437 00:30:23,040 --> 00:30:30,040 If you've never done a podcast from the outside looking in, you think, you know, oh, it's just it looks easy. 438 00:30:30,040 --> 00:30:33,040 I just have to get on the microphone and say some things and put it up. 439 00:30:33,040 --> 00:30:36,040 Then you're like, oh, my gosh, who hosts this thing? 440 00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:39,040 If you get into the weeds of it all, then you're not going to do it. 441 00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:43,040 But this is why I always love reminding people of what's your MVP? 442 00:30:43,040 --> 00:30:45,040 What's the minimum viable product? 443 00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:49,040 What is the minimum that I need to do in order to get this podcast out there? 444 00:30:49,040 --> 00:30:55,040 Fortunately, there are places like RSS.com where you can get your first your first podcast up for free. 445 00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:57,040 Like, that's all you have to you start there. 446 00:30:57,040 --> 00:31:04,040 You start there and then you start to learn and then you start to be part of that community and you start to meet other podcasters and you learn new things. 447 00:31:04,040 --> 00:31:07,040 And that's what I love about communities like this. 448 00:31:07,040 --> 00:31:12,040 This is why it's so important for us to be connected with other people that are doing this kind of work. 449 00:31:12,040 --> 00:31:17,040 So that's what we have to think about when we when especially when we're first starting. 450 00:31:17,040 --> 00:31:25,040 And then what's really cool is you learn so much that we actually launched another podcast or we're launching one. 451 00:31:25,040 --> 00:31:35,040 It's coming out next in two weeks because I learned so much about creating for no reason and creating my podcast that I decided, hey, 452 00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:40,040 I actually do want to create a podcast and be more strategic about it and actually use it for business. 453 00:31:40,040 --> 00:31:47,040 And so I created a podcast. My my team and I we started a podcast called it's I was going to say create for no reason. 454 00:31:47,040 --> 00:31:49,040 No, it is called Lead with Culture. 455 00:31:49,040 --> 00:31:58,040 And we interview CEOs, CFOs and executives and leaders all about company culture and team building and employee engagement. 456 00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:06,040 And it definitely has more of a while it's, of course, authentic and we're having authentic conversations with leaders. 457 00:32:06,040 --> 00:32:10,040 The strategy and purpose behind it. 458 00:32:10,040 --> 00:32:13,040 Definitely there's a reason for it, right? 459 00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:17,040 Like we're using resources. I have my team on it where we've worked. 460 00:32:17,040 --> 00:32:21,040 We're working with other with some people that are kind of helping us with the project. 461 00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:25,040 And so it's very different. And so, again, this goes back to what is your intention. 462 00:32:25,040 --> 00:32:29,040 You have to get started if your intention is just to start getting into the podcasting world. 463 00:32:29,040 --> 00:32:33,040 That's easy enough. You have everything that you need right now to do that. 464 00:32:33,040 --> 00:32:40,040 We've said team a couple of times. So people listening to this are going to be like, OK, so she's monetized. 465 00:32:40,040 --> 00:32:44,040 Oh, no, I'm not. I'm not monetized. 466 00:32:44,040 --> 00:32:48,040 So fortunately, again, so we just started the podcast, Lead with Culture. 467 00:32:48,040 --> 00:32:51,040 We'll see what happens like down the line with with that podcast. 468 00:32:51,040 --> 00:32:57,040 But with Create for No Reason, no, it went my team is the team with the business that I run, the podcast I run. 469 00:32:57,040 --> 00:33:01,040 That is me, my friends. I record them. 470 00:33:01,040 --> 00:33:05,040 I edit them. I get them up and I share them. 471 00:33:05,040 --> 00:33:09,040 I post them. I create the audiograms. I do all the things. 472 00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:16,040 I do all the things. So. But again, I could never have done that when we started. 473 00:33:16,040 --> 00:33:20,040 It was so overwhelming. I told Sean, I said the only reason I don't want to start a podcast 474 00:33:20,040 --> 00:33:23,040 is because that stuff is a nightmare. I don't want to edit. 475 00:33:23,040 --> 00:33:25,040 I don't want to figure any of that stuff out. 476 00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:30,040 But when I started learning how to do it, I thought, you know, it's really not that bad. 477 00:33:30,040 --> 00:33:33,040 And now I actually I don't mind it at all. I do it. 478 00:33:33,040 --> 00:33:38,040 I usually do them on the weekend and I'm just kind of, you know, doing my thing on my computer. 479 00:33:38,040 --> 00:33:43,040 I have some music I'm listening to and maybe I'm on the I'm just like doing it. 480 00:33:43,040 --> 00:33:48,040 It's become just routine. It's become part of my weekly creativity. 481 00:33:48,040 --> 00:33:50,040 This is what I do and this is what I get out. 482 00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:57,040 And so, again, it doesn't take me a lot of time, but it took me a lot of time two years ago 483 00:33:57,040 --> 00:33:59,040 when I had no idea what I was doing. 484 00:33:59,040 --> 00:34:05,040 And so you do have to put in some of the there's a lot of front like upfront work 485 00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:07,040 that you have to do to figure all this stuff out. Right. 486 00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:11,040 You have to go to like RSS.com and figure out what am I doing? What do I need? 487 00:34:11,040 --> 00:34:13,040 How do I get this uploaded? What happened? 488 00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:18,040 I mean, again, this is why there's been millions of people that have done this before 489 00:34:18,040 --> 00:34:21,040 that you can connect with that you can find out how they did it. 490 00:34:21,040 --> 00:34:24,040 And it just makes it easier. 491 00:34:24,040 --> 00:34:28,040 I'm really glad you said that because that's one of the big concerns 492 00:34:28,040 --> 00:34:32,040 that I know a lot of people have is, you know, they hear, oh, well, it's a lot of work to start a podcast. 493 00:34:32,040 --> 00:34:34,040 And then it scares them away. 494 00:34:34,040 --> 00:34:39,040 But like you keep saying, and it's so true when you put in the reps, it gets easier. 495 00:34:39,040 --> 00:34:42,040 It's kind of like how if you go to lift a, you know, 100 pound weight. 496 00:34:42,040 --> 00:34:44,040 Yeah, it's going to be really, really hard. 497 00:34:44,040 --> 00:34:48,040 But if you keep going back every single day, eventually it's going to be easy to lift it up. 498 00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:49,040 Yeah. 499 00:34:49,040 --> 00:34:54,040 And it's the girl who hasn't worked out in a while. 500 00:34:54,040 --> 00:34:56,040 Hey, at least you're honest about it. 501 00:34:56,040 --> 00:34:59,040 Yes. 502 00:34:59,040 --> 00:35:02,040 I mean, look, anything, anything that you start is hard, right? 503 00:35:02,040 --> 00:35:08,040 Like anything that you first get started on, you start a new position in a, at a company, it's going to be hard. 504 00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:13,040 I mean, if you start a new, I mean, whatever you get started on is at first going to be hard. 505 00:35:13,040 --> 00:35:18,040 I mean, I, again, just going, I mean, the podcasting world is so interesting. 506 00:35:18,040 --> 00:35:23,040 And I think we can all get, there's so much information on the internet. 507 00:35:23,040 --> 00:35:30,040 We have access to every single thing that we go from, I'm going, so we get stuck in this passion loop, right? 508 00:35:30,040 --> 00:35:32,040 Like we get stuck in the passion loop. 509 00:35:32,040 --> 00:35:35,040 And the passion loop is basically when we say, hey, I'm going to start this podcast. 510 00:35:35,040 --> 00:35:39,040 And then you think, oh my gosh, I don't have a microphone. 511 00:35:39,040 --> 00:35:42,040 What is it going to, what am I going to talk about? 512 00:35:42,040 --> 00:35:43,040 Who's going to listen? 513 00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:44,040 What if it's not successful? 514 00:35:44,040 --> 00:35:45,040 What if I don't get the downloads? 515 00:35:45,040 --> 00:35:49,040 Like you start making yourself, making all these excuses. 516 00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:58,040 And instead of what we should be doing, which is thinking about all of the benefits that we will get from starting the podcast. 517 00:35:58,040 --> 00:36:00,040 Like what are all the benefits? 518 00:36:00,040 --> 00:36:01,040 You're going to meet cool people. 519 00:36:01,040 --> 00:36:03,040 You're going to share your message. 520 00:36:03,040 --> 00:36:04,040 You're going to change people's lives. 521 00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:06,040 You're going to learn new skills. 522 00:36:06,040 --> 00:36:07,040 You're going to have this. 523 00:36:07,040 --> 00:36:14,040 I mean, you're basically learning a lot when you start something new like this, that you can take, even if you decide, hey, I did five episodes and I'm done. 524 00:36:14,040 --> 00:36:16,040 You could absolutely use some of the skills. 525 00:36:16,040 --> 00:36:24,040 Or maybe what you decide is, hey, I really didn't enjoy podcasting, but I really loved this idea of getting my message out into the world. 526 00:36:24,040 --> 00:36:26,040 I'm going to start a blog, you know, whatever. 527 00:36:26,040 --> 00:36:31,040 You might just decide something completely different, but it would never have happened had you not started the podcast. 528 00:36:31,040 --> 00:36:36,040 So to get out of that passion loop, we have to decide what are the action steps. 529 00:36:36,040 --> 00:36:38,040 What is the simplest thing that I can do? 530 00:36:38,040 --> 00:36:42,040 What is the simplest thing I can do is what is the episode? 531 00:36:42,040 --> 00:36:44,040 And I'm just going to get out my first episode. 532 00:36:44,040 --> 00:36:46,040 Like honestly, that's it. 533 00:36:46,040 --> 00:36:49,040 Because no one's watching. 534 00:36:49,040 --> 00:36:51,040 Like no one's waiting for you to start a podcast. 535 00:36:51,040 --> 00:36:54,040 No one's waiting for you to share your message. 536 00:36:54,040 --> 00:37:02,040 And so even just the fact of getting it out into the world, putting it out there, there's something that shifts in your mind and your body. 537 00:37:02,040 --> 00:37:06,040 Even if nobody listens to it, you're like, I shared this. 538 00:37:06,040 --> 00:37:08,040 Like I put it out there. 539 00:37:08,040 --> 00:37:11,040 And then you do it again the next week. 540 00:37:11,040 --> 00:37:13,040 So you just have to take the next right step. 541 00:37:13,040 --> 00:37:14,040 Just one. 542 00:37:14,040 --> 00:37:16,040 Just one more step. 543 00:37:16,040 --> 00:37:20,040 And then learn along the way. 544 00:37:20,040 --> 00:37:21,040 Right? 545 00:37:21,040 --> 00:37:24,040 If we tried to learn everything about all the things we started, we wouldn't start anything. 546 00:37:24,040 --> 00:37:26,040 It's way too overwhelming. 547 00:37:26,040 --> 00:37:27,040 Yeah. 548 00:37:27,040 --> 00:37:28,040 Yeah. 549 00:37:28,040 --> 00:37:30,040 I mean, it's so true. 550 00:37:30,040 --> 00:37:36,040 And the thing is, it's like, if you just start and you just start playing, you never know what's going to happen. 551 00:37:36,040 --> 00:37:43,040 And so do you want to keep moving forward wondering what could have been or do you just want to try to play a little? 552 00:37:43,040 --> 00:37:44,040 Yeah. 553 00:37:44,040 --> 00:37:45,040 That's right. 554 00:37:45,040 --> 00:37:46,040 Play. 555 00:37:46,040 --> 00:37:47,040 Play a little. 556 00:37:47,040 --> 00:37:48,040 Create for no reason. 557 00:37:48,040 --> 00:37:49,040 Create for no reason. 558 00:37:49,040 --> 00:37:52,040 That's a great segue. 559 00:37:52,040 --> 00:37:56,040 Well, speaking of creating for no reason, where can people find you online? 560 00:37:56,040 --> 00:38:00,040 Well, the podcast, as we've said, is Create for No Reason. 561 00:38:00,040 --> 00:38:07,040 You can find it on my website, KateVulman.com, or anywhere you listen to podcasts. 562 00:38:07,040 --> 00:38:14,040 But in order to get to know a little bit more about me and find me, KateVulman.com is the easiest place to go. 563 00:38:14,040 --> 00:38:16,040 And when does your book come out? 564 00:38:16,040 --> 00:38:18,040 Oh, I'm so excited, Ma. 565 00:38:18,040 --> 00:38:21,040 It's going to be on presale in the next couple of weeks. 566 00:38:21,040 --> 00:38:24,040 So by the end of—we're recording this in January. 567 00:38:24,040 --> 00:38:27,040 So January—by the end of January, it'll be out in presale. 568 00:38:27,040 --> 00:38:32,040 And then released—I'm getting the release date from my publisher, hopefully, this week. 569 00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:34,040 So I'm very excited about it. 570 00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:40,040 But yeah, definitely in the next couple of—in the next two months or so, it'll be out and released. 571 00:38:40,040 --> 00:38:43,040 But it will be on presale in January, February. 572 00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:46,040 Well, we'll make sure that we leave a link to it in the show notes. 573 00:38:46,040 --> 00:38:51,040 Now, before we started this call, is it okay for us to say that you also said you're starting to write another book? 574 00:38:51,040 --> 00:38:53,040 Oh, I am. 575 00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:59,040 So, you know, my author friends always tease me now because they said, 576 00:38:59,040 --> 00:39:00,040 we knew it. 577 00:39:00,040 --> 00:39:04,040 You write your first book, and then all of a sudden you already want to start your second book. 578 00:39:04,040 --> 00:39:09,040 So my newsletter, as you know, is called Massive Optimism. 579 00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:14,040 And so I'm playing around with this new book, a little bit of a new concept, 580 00:39:14,040 --> 00:39:16,040 and calling it Massive Optimism. 581 00:39:16,040 --> 00:39:23,040 And I am so excited because I've already started to kind of like do some research and build and write. 582 00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:28,040 And I am—I definitely practice writing all the time. 583 00:39:28,040 --> 00:39:34,040 And so this book allows me to continue the writing process of just every day showing up and writing and journaling 584 00:39:34,040 --> 00:39:36,040 and figure out what I want to say in the book. 585 00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:40,040 So I really thought, Ashley, that it was going to be a lot easier to write the second book 586 00:39:40,040 --> 00:39:46,040 because I've already written the first one and I'm already noticing I don't really feel that way. 587 00:39:46,040 --> 00:39:53,040 So I don't know how other authors feel, but I'm still feeling like it's a lot of work. 588 00:39:53,040 --> 00:39:56,040 I think it would probably be easier if it was still on the same subject. 589 00:39:56,040 --> 00:40:01,040 But if it's something that's not, then I can imagine it being a lot more like, okay, what do I say now? 590 00:40:01,040 --> 00:40:07,040 Yeah, it's almost like I took the first book is very much like, hey, it's this process. 591 00:40:07,040 --> 00:40:09,040 I shared the seven myths. 592 00:40:09,040 --> 00:40:10,040 It's very linear. 593 00:40:10,040 --> 00:40:13,040 You could kind of open it up to any chapter and you're going to get something. 594 00:40:13,040 --> 00:40:17,040 And in this book, I have a very different idea of what I want it to be. 595 00:40:17,040 --> 00:40:19,040 And so I'm still kind of percolating on what that is. 596 00:40:19,040 --> 00:40:25,040 But again, it goes back to the creative process and why give yourself permission to trust your gut 597 00:40:25,040 --> 00:40:27,040 and just explore. 598 00:40:27,040 --> 00:40:32,040 And only by exploring will I know what this book is supposed to be and how it's going to come alive. 599 00:40:32,040 --> 00:40:36,040 And whether I publish it a year from now or five years from now, that doesn't really matter. 600 00:40:36,040 --> 00:40:40,040 It just matters that I show up and I continue to kind of put these thoughts in place 601 00:40:40,040 --> 00:40:44,040 and figure out where I want to go with it so that I create work that I'm really proud of 602 00:40:44,040 --> 00:40:46,040 and proud to put out into the world. 603 00:40:46,040 --> 00:40:47,040 So good. So good. 604 00:40:47,040 --> 00:40:53,040 Well, I got to, before I can let you go, I got to ask you the one question I ask everyone before I let them off the show. 605 00:40:53,040 --> 00:40:57,040 And that is, what is one question I did not ask you wish I had? 606 00:40:57,040 --> 00:41:01,040 Oh, what is one question that you didn't ask? 607 00:41:01,040 --> 00:41:04,040 Um, Ashley. 608 00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:11,040 What is one question? 609 00:41:11,040 --> 00:41:18,040 Um, maybe, maybe. 610 00:41:18,040 --> 00:41:21,040 Oh, my gosh. That is such a great question. 611 00:41:21,040 --> 00:41:27,040 Um, well, I guess I would say, I, it's so, that question, I love asking people that question, 612 00:41:27,040 --> 00:41:30,040 and then I totally overanalyze what I, what I should say. 613 00:41:30,040 --> 00:41:36,040 But my kind of initial response was something around what is, uh, what are some of, 614 00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:41,040 what are some of your favorite books that really inspire you and your creativity? 615 00:41:41,040 --> 00:41:46,040 And that. 616 00:41:46,040 --> 00:41:50,040 Because that is, I'm a huge reader. 617 00:41:50,040 --> 00:41:52,040 I absolutely love reading. 618 00:41:52,040 --> 00:42:01,040 And so I am a big fan of, I've done a lot, I've done a lot of reading about writing this past year. 619 00:42:01,040 --> 00:42:07,040 Uh, I read a book, uh, one of my favorite books last year that I read is called The Storyteller by Dave Grohl, 620 00:42:07,040 --> 00:42:09,040 who, which is a fascinating book. 621 00:42:09,040 --> 00:42:14,040 I'm, I'm not even a Foo Fighters fan, but just his story is, uh, phenomenal. 622 00:42:14,040 --> 00:42:16,040 I love Austin Kleon. 623 00:42:16,040 --> 00:42:18,040 I love his trilogy of books. 624 00:42:18,040 --> 00:42:25,040 Um, he, if, if you're listening and you're looking for, you're looking for someone who's going to push you into your creativity, 625 00:42:25,040 --> 00:42:28,040 steal like an artist, uh, he has a trilogy. 626 00:42:28,040 --> 00:42:29,040 It's steal like an artist. 627 00:42:29,040 --> 00:42:32,040 It's share your work and it's keep going. 628 00:42:32,040 --> 00:42:39,040 And if you need some inspiration to recognize that other people are going through all this mental stuff that you go through when you're in the creative process, 629 00:42:39,040 --> 00:42:43,040 he is definitely someone who, um, who I would turn to. 630 00:42:43,040 --> 00:42:49,040 And of course I love Elizabeth Gilbert's work, Big Magic and Twyla Tharp's The Creative Habit. 631 00:42:49,040 --> 00:42:52,040 Um, and of course, uh, I'm a huge journaler. 632 00:42:52,040 --> 00:42:55,040 So, uh, I do journal, I do morning pages in the morning. 633 00:42:55,040 --> 00:43:03,040 And so Julia Cameron, The Artist's Way, these are all big influences over my life over the past however many years, 634 00:43:03,040 --> 00:43:10,040 but I'm a huge voracious reader and learner and I, I could, I could learn about the creative process all day. 635 00:43:10,040 --> 00:43:16,040 It sounds like you just create all day, create and read all day. 636 00:43:16,040 --> 00:43:21,040 Create, read, write, you know, and repeat, and repeat. 637 00:43:21,040 --> 00:43:23,040 How about lead, lead, create, read, write. 638 00:43:23,040 --> 00:43:24,040 That's it. 639 00:43:24,040 --> 00:43:25,040 That's what I do. 640 00:43:25,040 --> 00:43:26,040 That's the, that's the plan. 641 00:43:26,040 --> 00:43:30,040 A little bit of sleep in between, you know, every now and then. 642 00:43:30,040 --> 00:43:32,040 That's awesome. 643 00:43:32,040 --> 00:43:35,040 Well, Kate, I think that everything you share has been pretty awesome. 644 00:43:35,040 --> 00:43:42,040 And I hope that this inspires our listeners to just start a podcast because you never know what's going to come from it. 645 00:43:42,040 --> 00:43:44,040 You never know if you'll enjoy it. 646 00:43:44,040 --> 00:43:45,040 You just got to try. 647 00:43:45,040 --> 00:43:48,040 Just find out what you like and what you don't and play. 648 00:43:48,040 --> 00:43:50,040 Just play more. 649 00:43:50,040 --> 00:43:51,040 I love it. 650 00:43:51,040 --> 00:43:52,040 Well, Ashley, thank you so much. 651 00:43:52,040 --> 00:43:57,040 I was so happy to get your email and I'm so glad that we had an opportunity to do this. 652 00:43:57,040 --> 00:43:58,040 I am too. 653 00:43:58,040 --> 00:44:00,040 Thanks for being here today. 654 00:44:00,040 --> 00:44:06,040 Well, my fellow podcasters, we hope you enjoyed the insights, tips and ideas shared in this episode. 655 00:44:06,040 --> 00:44:12,040 To learn more about launching and growing your own show, head over to rss.com backslash blog. 656 00:44:12,040 --> 00:44:18,040 And if you're ready to launch a podcast of your own, you can get started for free with your first episode on us. 657 00:44:18,040 --> 00:44:46,040 Thanks for tuning in. 658 00:44:48,040 --> 00:44:49,040 I'm sure you're going to love it. 659 00:44:49,040 --> 00:44:50,040 And we'll see you next time. 660 00:44:50,040 --> 00:45:18,040 Bye.