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So what do you see for the future of podcasting?

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I mean, we've already covered the future of the magazine, but what do you see

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for the, for the platform itself, the medium itself?

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Yeah, I think you're going to continue to see growth, certainly from an ad standpoint.

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Although I will say that people are going to have to get a lot smarter and more

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strategic in terms of their approach to advertising as a show host, as a show

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owner, because you're starting to already see a lot of ad burn, just folks are

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kicking back pretty hard on that.

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So I think the advertising rates will go up pretty substantially, especially on

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the larger shows, because the number of ads that run will have to be

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reduced pretty significantly.

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You just can't keep the run rate that we've been at.

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There's just too much, there's too much resistance there.

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And so, and so to that end, I think you'll continue to see the growth

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of ad free opportunities.

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So networks that charge a premium for ad free access to their shows.

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And no doubt that you'll continue to see subscribers growing in that paid

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weight in the same way that Disney, you know, just, I mean, they're over

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230 million subscribers now just past Netflix.

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And I will be able to date stamp on this interview.

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And, but they were smart about it because they understand that

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consumers willing to pay a little bit more to have access to the content

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that they want and, and pre-content is something that, that people clearly want.

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So, but the third, the third thing I would say here is, is not great.

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Which is that you're going to see the rich get richer and the poor disappear.

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And there just will be very little middle ground.

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And so the, you know, the bigger shows will continue to get bigger.

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And the smaller shows will ultimately disappear because they're not, it's

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not sustainable unless you just absolutely love what you're doing.

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And you're doing it absolutely because you don't care about the money.

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You know, you'll, you'll have some longevity, but, but your

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growth is going to be pretty minimal.

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So it's, it's, it's scary in terms of what's happening there, but to, to

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break into the charts, the Apple charts, not, you know, not our chart, you know,

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because vote and you can get on our chart there, but, you know, to break

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into a top 10 of Apple, top 100 of Apple, almost impossible.