1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:16,040 Hey everyone, Ashley here with RSS.com. 2 00:00:16,040 --> 00:00:19,520 In this episode, we're chatting all about AI and podcasting. 3 00:00:19,520 --> 00:00:23,600 We're jamming with Diedrich Chen, CEO and co-founder of CapShow. 4 00:00:23,600 --> 00:00:29,400 Join us as we explore the role of AI in idea generation, scripting, and even post-production 5 00:00:29,400 --> 00:00:31,080 of your podcast. 6 00:00:31,080 --> 00:00:33,080 Enjoy the show. 7 00:00:33,080 --> 00:00:36,080 All right. 8 00:00:36,080 --> 00:00:43,320 So, Diedrich, welcome to the show. 9 00:00:43,320 --> 00:00:44,760 I'm so excited you could be here. 10 00:00:44,760 --> 00:00:46,960 Can you do us a favor and tell us what you do? 11 00:00:46,960 --> 00:00:47,960 Yes. 12 00:00:47,960 --> 00:00:48,960 Oh my gosh. 13 00:00:48,960 --> 00:00:50,360 Thank you so much for having me on here, Ashley. 14 00:00:50,360 --> 00:00:55,880 So I am the CEO and co-founder of CapShow, which is the fastest way to repurpose and 15 00:00:55,880 --> 00:00:58,280 market your expert content. 16 00:00:58,280 --> 00:01:02,880 And so essentially what our users do is they will upload their podcast audio file or a 17 00:01:02,880 --> 00:01:04,600 video file. 18 00:01:04,600 --> 00:01:10,040 And in literally under 10 minutes, we create a lot of their content marketing assets for 19 00:01:10,040 --> 00:01:11,040 them. 20 00:01:11,040 --> 00:01:17,120 So the title and description, their social media captions across multiple platforms, 21 00:01:17,120 --> 00:01:21,360 and emails, a couple of emails, one that's promotional, one that's engagement, a YouTube 22 00:01:21,360 --> 00:01:24,920 description, LinkedIn article, four types of blog posts. 23 00:01:24,920 --> 00:01:28,040 We identify soundbites for them. 24 00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:29,680 We pull out quotes. 25 00:01:29,680 --> 00:01:35,400 We help them create a short three to five minute YouTube segment from their long form 26 00:01:35,400 --> 00:01:36,400 episode. 27 00:01:36,400 --> 00:01:38,720 And we also have a short form scripts generator. 28 00:01:38,720 --> 00:01:43,320 So a lot of things that CapShow does for a podcast stuff. 29 00:01:43,320 --> 00:01:48,520 So it sounds like you're using, I'm guessing like an AI technology to take all these assets 30 00:01:48,520 --> 00:01:49,520 and make them happen. 31 00:01:49,520 --> 00:01:50,520 Is that accurate? 32 00:01:50,520 --> 00:01:51,520 Yeah. 33 00:01:51,520 --> 00:01:52,520 Yeah. 34 00:01:52,520 --> 00:01:57,360 So basically how I guess AI works is there's like large language models. 35 00:01:57,360 --> 00:02:02,280 And basically there are a few in the market that have kind of pretty dominated the market 36 00:02:02,280 --> 00:02:03,280 right now. 37 00:02:03,280 --> 00:02:08,520 So OpenAI being one, but there are a handful of others, Google bar, et cetera. 38 00:02:08,520 --> 00:02:13,400 And so when we first started, so we launched, we went live just over a year ago, a year 39 00:02:13,400 --> 00:02:16,160 and like three weeks ago. 40 00:02:16,160 --> 00:02:21,840 And at that time, we were actually thinking, we were actually in the middle of looking at 41 00:02:21,840 --> 00:02:23,160 building our own. 42 00:02:23,160 --> 00:02:27,680 But then because all of these large language models came out, it just didn't make sense 43 00:02:27,680 --> 00:02:28,680 to do that. 44 00:02:28,680 --> 00:02:35,120 So we've instead just started to train these large language models for our use case, which 45 00:02:35,120 --> 00:02:42,520 is specifically how do we help a podcaster and their anchor, how do we help amplify their 46 00:02:42,520 --> 00:02:43,520 anchor content? 47 00:02:43,520 --> 00:02:47,720 So it's not about making up content outside of that. 48 00:02:47,720 --> 00:02:51,880 It's really anchored in that expert content that they're putting into CapShow. 49 00:02:51,880 --> 00:02:52,880 Yes. 50 00:02:52,880 --> 00:02:56,120 And that's what actually got me so excited and made me want to kind of talk to you about 51 00:02:56,120 --> 00:02:59,920 this because we recently did a post on AI and podcasting. 52 00:02:59,920 --> 00:03:04,240 And so I want to ask you, in terms of AI and podcasting, what do you think the biggest 53 00:03:04,240 --> 00:03:08,040 benefit of all these amazing software that are coming out? 54 00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:12,600 What do you think the big benefit is to podcasters and why should they consider using it for 55 00:03:12,600 --> 00:03:13,600 themselves? 56 00:03:13,600 --> 00:03:14,600 Yeah. 57 00:03:14,600 --> 00:03:18,040 So it depends because AI is across the board in terms of where it can help podcasters. 58 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:24,200 So I kind of think about it in terms of from a process perspective where AI can and needs 59 00:03:24,200 --> 00:03:26,320 to play a part in that process. 60 00:03:26,320 --> 00:03:28,440 And I can even identify parts of that. 61 00:03:28,440 --> 00:03:30,960 I would recommend that we don't leverage AI. 62 00:03:30,960 --> 00:03:34,520 And that's probably more from like an ethical, moral perspective. 63 00:03:34,520 --> 00:03:39,280 But obviously, people can just like bin that advice and do what they want to do. 64 00:03:39,280 --> 00:03:40,280 So I'll start there. 65 00:03:40,280 --> 00:03:46,720 And then we can kind of talk about what makes AI so powerful in those parts of the process. 66 00:03:46,720 --> 00:03:51,720 So if we think about podcasting, there's kind of like in my mind three really big parts 67 00:03:51,720 --> 00:03:52,720 of it. 68 00:03:52,720 --> 00:03:58,320 There's the idea generation, scripting, the pre-recording part of it. 69 00:03:58,320 --> 00:03:59,720 Then there's the recording part of it. 70 00:03:59,720 --> 00:04:03,080 And then there's the post production part. 71 00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:07,560 So the first bit, which is really how do I come up with the ideas? 72 00:04:07,560 --> 00:04:08,640 How do I find guests? 73 00:04:08,640 --> 00:04:14,560 How do I even if anyone scripts, I script some of my episodes as well. 74 00:04:14,560 --> 00:04:16,800 And then it comes scripting. 75 00:04:16,800 --> 00:04:23,760 AI, let's say chat, GPT, for example, is great at helping to inspire thoughts or to maybe 76 00:04:23,760 --> 00:04:27,800 give you a different perspective or highlight something that maybe you hadn't thought about 77 00:04:27,800 --> 00:04:28,800 before. 78 00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:30,480 And you're like, oh, actually, it's a really good thought starter. 79 00:04:30,480 --> 00:04:35,080 Let me just take that one little piece and expand upon it myself. 80 00:04:35,080 --> 00:04:39,520 But that's the extent to which I'll use AI in the pre-production process. 81 00:04:39,520 --> 00:04:44,840 Because really, I'm very, very passionate about the fact that as creators, as podcasters, 82 00:04:44,840 --> 00:04:50,680 we need to be telling our own stories, leveraging our own experiences and sharing the value 83 00:04:50,680 --> 00:04:56,280 that we've earned, I guess, in our lifetime. 84 00:04:56,280 --> 00:05:00,480 And AI cannot replace that and definitely should not be replacing that. 85 00:05:00,480 --> 00:05:05,800 Because when you think about what it is that we're doing, why we're creating is because 86 00:05:05,800 --> 00:05:09,080 fundamentally we want to be creating a connection with our audience. 87 00:05:09,080 --> 00:05:13,360 And the only way that we can create a connection with our audience is if we share about ourselves. 88 00:05:13,360 --> 00:05:18,640 So that's a part that I would never use AI to do. 89 00:05:18,640 --> 00:05:20,240 The second part, which is the recording. 90 00:05:20,240 --> 00:05:25,000 Now there are a lot of AI tools and it's only going to get better and smarter that can clone 91 00:05:25,000 --> 00:05:30,800 your voice, that can start to clone your image and create videos out of you. 92 00:05:30,800 --> 00:05:34,720 I also at this stage would not recommend doing that. 93 00:05:34,720 --> 00:05:37,560 And the reason why, using AI for that part of it. 94 00:05:37,560 --> 00:05:44,200 And the reason why is because again, when we think about connection, our voice, our accent, 95 00:05:44,200 --> 00:05:48,080 the way that we, you know, I, and I just did it right there, which is like, I will stop 96 00:05:48,080 --> 00:05:50,880 in mid-sentence because another thought comes up and I'm like, oh my gosh, I have to jump 97 00:05:50,880 --> 00:05:51,880 into it. 98 00:05:51,880 --> 00:05:53,640 You know, we do that as humans. 99 00:05:53,640 --> 00:05:58,200 And that's actually what creates the connection as well is that, you know, you listen to that 100 00:05:58,200 --> 00:06:01,680 and it's like, because I get so passionate, excited about something, you, that energy 101 00:06:01,680 --> 00:06:03,200 comes through. 102 00:06:03,200 --> 00:06:06,920 And that's what other, you know, your audience is picking up on. 103 00:06:06,920 --> 00:06:10,280 Now it's not for everyone because some people might listen to me and be like, oh my gosh, 104 00:06:10,280 --> 00:06:12,200 it's, she's so frustrating and irritating. 105 00:06:12,200 --> 00:06:15,720 We first should have complete a sentence or X, Y, Z, whatever. 106 00:06:15,720 --> 00:06:20,600 But you know, that's, that's also what you want to be doing with, that's how you connect 107 00:06:20,600 --> 00:06:25,160 you, either connecting to repel the people that just are never going to be part of your 108 00:06:25,160 --> 00:06:27,840 community or you want to attract the ones that do. 109 00:06:27,840 --> 00:06:34,200 So that's why even in that recording part, I would always say, do not use AI there. 110 00:06:34,200 --> 00:06:36,280 It should, it needs to be you. 111 00:06:36,280 --> 00:06:40,880 Now, once you've, you know, you've pre-con, you've, you've done your pre-show stuff, 112 00:06:40,880 --> 00:06:46,040 you recorded it, then there's kind of the post-production part of it. 113 00:06:46,040 --> 00:06:51,080 And that's where I fundamentally believe AI can do the best and should do the heavy 114 00:06:51,080 --> 00:06:58,040 lifting because A, it takes a lot of time and B, because in my experience, and the reason 115 00:06:58,040 --> 00:07:02,920 why I created CapShow is because the podcast itself or whatever anchor content that you're 116 00:07:02,920 --> 00:07:08,800 creating, whether that's a YouTube video or podcast or a live stream, for example, like 117 00:07:08,800 --> 00:07:14,160 that only gets you so far, which is in my experience, not very far at all. 118 00:07:14,160 --> 00:07:18,640 Because the one, like what you really need to do is the marketing of it. 119 00:07:18,640 --> 00:07:21,720 It's actually the promote, the getting it out there. 120 00:07:21,720 --> 00:07:28,320 And when I figured this out with my first podcast and I started doing the things, like 121 00:07:28,320 --> 00:07:33,320 it got to the point where it broke me and my team around all of the content that we had 122 00:07:33,320 --> 00:07:34,320 to create and all the things. 123 00:07:34,320 --> 00:07:36,920 Now, it was great because we got the results, you know, I did multiple six figures in my 124 00:07:36,920 --> 00:07:41,880 first year podcasting just through my business because of what we were doing. 125 00:07:41,880 --> 00:07:48,400 But that, by breaking, like it's not sustainable way of doing it without leveraging technology 126 00:07:48,400 --> 00:07:50,240 like AI to help you there. 127 00:07:50,240 --> 00:07:55,240 So for me, that part, which is, and the great thing is, and again, this is what CapShow 128 00:07:55,240 --> 00:07:59,920 does is it's anchored in your content, in your stories, in your experiences, in the 129 00:07:59,920 --> 00:08:06,960 value that you've, you're providing because you've done the manual human work upfront. 130 00:08:06,960 --> 00:08:11,960 And so that means that at the back end, you can use AI to just amplify that. 131 00:08:11,960 --> 00:08:13,840 And it's such a great use case. 132 00:08:13,840 --> 00:08:18,240 And why, and for, you know, to come back to your original question, which is like, why 133 00:08:18,240 --> 00:08:23,040 is this so important is because from a podcasting perspective, I think we all know the stats 134 00:08:23,040 --> 00:08:25,840 about around pod fade and how prevalent that is. 135 00:08:25,840 --> 00:08:29,000 And it's because we're not doing a few things. 136 00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:34,480 A, we're probably not being consistent in recording and publishing. 137 00:08:34,480 --> 00:08:36,920 And B, we're not being consistent in marketing. 138 00:08:36,920 --> 00:08:42,000 And the, the combination of, of those two things means that we're actually not going 139 00:08:42,000 --> 00:08:45,840 to get the results that we want, which means that we're going to look at our podcast and 140 00:08:45,840 --> 00:08:49,080 be like, why am I doing this thing? 141 00:08:49,080 --> 00:08:54,000 It's not actually creating any kind of, I'm not getting any kind of ROI on the time that 142 00:08:54,000 --> 00:08:56,480 I'm spending on it or the money that I'm spending on it. 143 00:08:56,480 --> 00:08:59,320 And so that's why we stop our podcast. 144 00:08:59,320 --> 00:09:05,520 And so, yes, I fundamentally believe you need to be using AI in your, you know, your podcasting 145 00:09:05,520 --> 00:09:09,280 flow, but it's really in where and how you use it. 146 00:09:09,280 --> 00:09:10,280 All right. 147 00:09:10,280 --> 00:09:11,520 So back to this though. 148 00:09:11,520 --> 00:09:13,440 So I agree with you completely. 149 00:09:13,440 --> 00:09:17,920 You can't really replicate, you know, like inflection and voice and things like that. 150 00:09:17,920 --> 00:09:20,960 So what do you think about like the overdub, like with the script, you know, what do you 151 00:09:20,960 --> 00:09:25,160 think about using it in post to, if you misspoke or something like that? 152 00:09:25,160 --> 00:09:26,160 I'm curious about that. 153 00:09:26,160 --> 00:09:27,160 Yeah. 154 00:09:27,160 --> 00:09:32,760 I think that like to just do the little tweaks and stuff, there's absolutely no issue. 155 00:09:32,760 --> 00:09:34,400 I would, I'd do it myself. 156 00:09:34,400 --> 00:09:37,880 I mean, I haven't tried it in a while, so they've probably come leaps and bounds, but 157 00:09:37,880 --> 00:09:40,800 I remember when I first released it, I did try it. 158 00:09:40,800 --> 00:09:47,000 And it was a little bit weird too, because it wasn't quite hitting the mark. 159 00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:52,080 Yeah, I would totally use it if I'm like, oh, I need to change my lead magnet or the 160 00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:55,440 thing, just like one small piece, 100%. 161 00:09:55,440 --> 00:09:56,600 I would, I would do that. 162 00:09:56,600 --> 00:10:02,280 But I know that there are people who are literally standing up full podcasts and getting an AI 163 00:10:02,280 --> 00:10:05,080 to, you know, record the whole thing. 164 00:10:05,080 --> 00:10:07,280 And that's where I'm like, oh, I do. 165 00:10:07,280 --> 00:10:08,280 Yeah. 166 00:10:08,280 --> 00:10:12,040 That I ethically can't stand kind at this point in time. 167 00:10:12,040 --> 00:10:13,040 That makes sense. 168 00:10:13,040 --> 00:10:16,080 And you know, the thing is though, like the other thing about it is it kind of scares 169 00:10:16,080 --> 00:10:17,080 me. 170 00:10:17,080 --> 00:10:18,320 You know, and that's one of the big things that people talk about, you know, you have 171 00:10:18,320 --> 00:10:22,560 your deep big Tom Cruise videos that are going on, TikTok and all these other deep fakes 172 00:10:22,560 --> 00:10:23,560 that are happening. 173 00:10:23,560 --> 00:10:26,920 What do you think about, well, deep fakes in podcasting? 174 00:10:26,920 --> 00:10:29,280 Oh, it's scary. 175 00:10:29,280 --> 00:10:30,280 It's scary. 176 00:10:30,280 --> 00:10:36,840 This, can you imagine, can you imagine a world where like, we don't even know what's 177 00:10:36,840 --> 00:10:39,280 real and not real? 178 00:10:39,280 --> 00:10:41,280 And that's going to be everywhere. 179 00:10:41,280 --> 00:10:42,280 That's going to be everywhere. 180 00:10:42,280 --> 00:10:43,280 And it feels like we're on the cusp of it. 181 00:10:43,280 --> 00:10:44,280 Oh, 100%. 182 00:10:44,280 --> 00:10:45,280 Yeah. 183 00:10:45,280 --> 00:10:46,280 It's going to be happening. 184 00:10:46,280 --> 00:10:49,800 You know, it was already such a big thing around like, you know, misinformation. 185 00:10:49,800 --> 00:10:53,480 I know that that's like an extreme, you know, example of it. 186 00:10:53,480 --> 00:10:59,120 But it's a very small, again, a very small tweak to go from like, oh, what we're doing 187 00:10:59,120 --> 00:11:00,120 is okay. 188 00:11:00,120 --> 00:11:05,560 And, you know, we're just going to have something else AI to replicate our voice or replicate 189 00:11:05,560 --> 00:11:10,880 out, you know, to then going into misinformation, which is a really, really scary thought. 190 00:11:10,880 --> 00:11:17,240 So I'm, yeah, not, I am a little bit perturbed by what is to come. 191 00:11:17,240 --> 00:11:21,160 And I do, if I'm going to be honest, have a bit of a dystopian view on what AI is going 192 00:11:21,160 --> 00:11:25,240 to do to society and definitely in the future. 193 00:11:25,240 --> 00:11:32,600 But, and that's why, you know, honestly, with Capture, we did a few things inside of it, 194 00:11:32,600 --> 00:11:36,160 which we launched as part of Capture 2.0 early this year. 195 00:11:36,160 --> 00:11:41,720 We did a few things that counter-intuitively put a little bit more friction into the platform 196 00:11:41,720 --> 00:11:47,480 so that we could force our users, our Capture Indians to actually interact with their content 197 00:11:47,480 --> 00:11:52,640 because we could see it's a very slippery slope that we start to go down when we try 198 00:11:52,640 --> 00:11:58,720 to rely on AI to do everything without us as a human, as a creator, putting in thought 199 00:11:58,720 --> 00:12:04,080 or, you know, in like actually engaging with our own, with the things that we're putting 200 00:12:04,080 --> 00:12:05,080 out there. 201 00:12:05,080 --> 00:12:11,760 Yeah, so I, it's on my mind around like what AI is going to do and the things that it's 202 00:12:11,760 --> 00:12:12,760 going to bring. 203 00:12:12,760 --> 00:12:17,480 And as much as possible, being in the space, I'm trying to do what I can to counteract 204 00:12:17,480 --> 00:12:18,480 some of it. 205 00:12:18,480 --> 00:12:19,960 And keep it ethical. 206 00:12:19,960 --> 00:12:20,960 Yes, exactly. 207 00:12:20,960 --> 00:12:21,960 Exactly. 208 00:12:21,960 --> 00:12:25,720 Yes, I can't help but think about, you know, like one of the things that's happening right 209 00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:30,200 now in Hollywood that I'm hearing about a lot, and, you know, writer's strike aside 210 00:12:30,200 --> 00:12:31,760 and all the stuff that's going on. 211 00:12:31,760 --> 00:12:36,840 I've been hearing a lot about contracts being changed so that if they decide that they're 212 00:12:36,840 --> 00:12:41,600 going to use Overdub or that they're going to use your face or whatever to basically, 213 00:12:41,600 --> 00:12:47,000 you know, fix things in post, that they are now updating contracts for celebrities, that 214 00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:51,080 if they do a movie and then they want to go and make some changes, that they have to now 215 00:12:51,080 --> 00:12:54,520 get paid extra to use their face for those things. 216 00:12:54,520 --> 00:12:58,000 And I think that's, I think it's fascinating and it scares the cred out of me, but, you 217 00:12:58,000 --> 00:12:59,120 know, who knows what's going to happen. 218 00:12:59,120 --> 00:13:03,000 That kind of reminds me of, you know, Will Smith and Irobot when he's like, you're experiencing 219 00:13:03,000 --> 00:13:04,000 a car accident. 220 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:05,000 He's like, no, I'm not. 221 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:06,000 I don't know. 222 00:13:06,000 --> 00:13:11,640 I guess I get nervous about the AI overlords, but at the same time, I feel like if we don't 223 00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:13,880 lean into it since it's coming anyway. 224 00:13:13,880 --> 00:13:14,880 It's yeah, exactly. 225 00:13:14,880 --> 00:13:16,600 You were, yeah, we're going to get left behind. 226 00:13:16,600 --> 00:13:23,240 So with that in mind though, what do you think, like in terms of your workflow for a podcast, 227 00:13:23,240 --> 00:13:26,880 what do you think a person needs to do whenever they're doing things in post? 228 00:13:26,880 --> 00:13:30,080 What are the top things they should use AI for to market it? 229 00:13:30,080 --> 00:13:33,320 I know we've already touched on like emails and social media and stuff, but I'm trying 230 00:13:33,320 --> 00:13:36,400 to map from your perspective, what do you think is the best? 231 00:13:36,400 --> 00:13:37,400 Yeah. 232 00:13:37,400 --> 00:13:44,240 So I have a whole like content dripping system that I, that I leverage myself, but I also 233 00:13:44,240 --> 00:13:47,640 do teach some of the Capshovians as well. 234 00:13:47,640 --> 00:13:51,800 And it's really anchored in, okay, so let me talk about, first of all, if it's okay, 235 00:13:51,800 --> 00:13:55,600 I'll talk about my traffic pyramid framework just to set context as to how I think about 236 00:13:55,600 --> 00:13:56,600 it. 237 00:13:56,600 --> 00:13:57,600 Oh, I would love that. 238 00:13:57,600 --> 00:13:58,600 Yeah, let's go. 239 00:13:58,600 --> 00:13:59,600 Do it. 240 00:13:59,600 --> 00:14:00,600 Okay. 241 00:14:00,600 --> 00:14:01,600 And then we can go into the content dripping strategy. 242 00:14:01,600 --> 00:14:05,520 But okay, so the traffic pyramid framework is there's four tiers to it. 243 00:14:05,520 --> 00:14:10,200 And this is literally, if you can hit all these four tiers, then you will get unlimited 244 00:14:10,200 --> 00:14:12,200 traffic to wherever it is that you're trying to get them to. 245 00:14:12,200 --> 00:14:16,040 So whether it's your podcast or your business, wherever. 246 00:14:16,040 --> 00:14:21,480 And so those four tiers is the bottom tier is what I call passive organic marketing. 247 00:14:21,480 --> 00:14:26,800 And that's what we're doing when, you know, we record a podcast, we publish it, and then 248 00:14:26,800 --> 00:14:28,840 we kind of sit back and we're like, yes, job done. 249 00:14:28,840 --> 00:14:29,840 All right. 250 00:14:29,840 --> 00:14:32,040 The podcast is out. 251 00:14:32,040 --> 00:14:33,920 Or we do that a lot on social media, right? 252 00:14:33,920 --> 00:14:36,680 We'll just like put up a post and then it's like, cool. 253 00:14:36,680 --> 00:14:38,320 Like I feel good about myself. 254 00:14:38,320 --> 00:14:45,080 I posted something and we'll just let the algorithms do its thing, which in a lot of our cases is 255 00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:46,080 nothing. 256 00:14:46,080 --> 00:14:48,080 He really doesn't do anything for us. 257 00:14:48,080 --> 00:14:51,280 So that's kind of like the passive organic marketing is where we're just creating content 258 00:14:51,280 --> 00:14:55,960 and we're putting it out there, but we're not, we're just hoping, we're crossing our 259 00:14:55,960 --> 00:14:59,080 fingers and hoping that it'll do something. 260 00:14:59,080 --> 00:15:03,360 How we actually make that start to work for us, how we make our content work for us is 261 00:15:03,360 --> 00:15:07,840 to get going to the second tier, which is active organic marketing. 262 00:15:07,840 --> 00:15:14,360 And this is where we start to, there's kind of like, in my mind, two areas that we need 263 00:15:14,360 --> 00:15:18,040 to be actively optimizing our content for. 264 00:15:18,040 --> 00:15:22,760 So one is what I call in discovery, so think about search. 265 00:15:22,760 --> 00:15:27,520 So Google, YouTube, Pinterest, even the podcast player apps, there's a lot that we can do 266 00:15:27,520 --> 00:15:30,720 to optimize for, to get discovered through search. 267 00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:33,360 And we can start to make it active and work for us that way. 268 00:15:33,360 --> 00:15:36,080 We start to actually make the algorithms work for us. 269 00:15:36,080 --> 00:15:40,280 And then on the other hand, there's like, how do we actually get visible smartly? 270 00:15:40,280 --> 00:15:43,880 So this is where we're now talking about social media platforms. 271 00:15:43,880 --> 00:15:49,200 Like what is it that we need to do on those platforms to actually activate our content 272 00:15:49,200 --> 00:15:50,200 for us? 273 00:15:50,200 --> 00:15:53,640 A lot of that is, hey, we just need to use social media platforms for what they were 274 00:15:53,640 --> 00:15:59,120 designed to do, which is to engage and be social and build a community. 275 00:15:59,120 --> 00:16:05,280 And you know, like a lot of that heavy lifting is actually what we need to do to activate 276 00:16:05,280 --> 00:16:09,360 our organic content on social media to get ourselves visible. 277 00:16:09,360 --> 00:16:10,760 So that's like the second tier. 278 00:16:10,760 --> 00:16:15,640 And the third tier on top of that is I call that leveraging other people's audiences. 279 00:16:15,640 --> 00:16:19,880 Now in the podcasting space, it gets to be like pretty second nature to us because a 280 00:16:19,880 --> 00:16:26,520 lot of times we guest a lot, or we get guests on our own podcast, and that's a great way 281 00:16:26,520 --> 00:16:29,600 to leverage someone else's audience. 282 00:16:29,600 --> 00:16:30,600 But it doesn't just stop there. 283 00:16:30,600 --> 00:16:36,000 I mean, there's a whole host of ways that you can leverage people's audiences, all sorts 284 00:16:36,000 --> 00:16:37,000 of collaborations. 285 00:16:37,000 --> 00:16:41,920 You know, there's a lot of virtual summits that happen, there's a lot of stages, other 286 00:16:41,920 --> 00:16:46,400 stages that you can be speaking on, there's just so many things that we can be doing above 287 00:16:46,400 --> 00:16:49,600 and beyond just guesting on other podcasts. 288 00:16:49,600 --> 00:16:50,600 So that's the third tier. 289 00:16:50,600 --> 00:16:56,520 And then the fourth tier, which I actually don't spend a lot of time at this stage on 290 00:16:56,520 --> 00:17:00,920 the fourth tier, but it's paid ads because there's already so much that you can do in 291 00:17:00,920 --> 00:17:07,920 the bottom three tiers that's quote unquote free that can get you so much traffic and 292 00:17:07,920 --> 00:17:14,080 so much visibility that even for me, I'm not even looking at paid ads right now at this 293 00:17:14,080 --> 00:17:15,320 stage, even for our business. 294 00:17:15,320 --> 00:17:18,680 So those are the four tiers of the traffic pyramid. 295 00:17:18,680 --> 00:17:22,640 Passive organic, active organic, leveraging other people's audiences and paid ads. 296 00:17:22,640 --> 00:17:29,560 So when you think about that, then you kind of go into where AI can really, I mean AI 297 00:17:29,560 --> 00:17:32,920 can play a part in any of those tiers. 298 00:17:32,920 --> 00:17:38,000 But there's a reason why it's a pyramid and you want to be focusing on the bottom, on 299 00:17:38,000 --> 00:17:42,600 the foundations first, is because anytime you try to ascend it, even when you're looking 300 00:17:42,600 --> 00:17:47,920 to leverage other people's audiences, a lot of times, you know, like they'll, so for example, 301 00:17:47,920 --> 00:17:52,840 Ashley, I'm sure that you might have checked me out maybe on social media or some, you 302 00:17:52,840 --> 00:17:55,240 might have gone to my website or something just to learn more about me. 303 00:17:55,240 --> 00:18:00,360 Now, if I was not present on any of those platforms, you might be like, oh, is this 304 00:18:00,360 --> 00:18:06,120 person a real and, you know, do they even have a community or an audience that is going 305 00:18:06,120 --> 00:18:10,880 to care about, you know, listening to this podcast because she's like all these things, 306 00:18:10,880 --> 00:18:11,880 right? 307 00:18:11,880 --> 00:18:19,960 So you kind of have to have those bottom tiers working for you before you can really meaningfully 308 00:18:19,960 --> 00:18:21,800 ascend up the pyramid. 309 00:18:21,800 --> 00:18:26,960 So that's why I say, you know, we're from an AI perspective, if we can focus on the 310 00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:31,560 bottom two tiers first, so yes, create like helping to create some of that content or 311 00:18:31,560 --> 00:18:40,680 helping to make that creation process more efficient for you without losing your humanity, 312 00:18:40,680 --> 00:18:44,880 like the humanness part of it, then you want to be using AI there. 313 00:18:44,880 --> 00:18:49,600 And then definitely in the second part around how you actually make that content active, 314 00:18:49,600 --> 00:18:53,880 there's so many opportunities to leverage AI there as well, which is some of what Cap 315 00:18:53,880 --> 00:18:56,560 Show does too. 316 00:18:56,560 --> 00:18:58,280 So that was a lot. 317 00:18:58,280 --> 00:19:01,280 And I'm sure that when people are listening to this, the first thing they're thinking 318 00:19:01,280 --> 00:19:06,360 is, oh my goodness, everything that she just described is going to take me so much time. 319 00:19:06,360 --> 00:19:07,680 What would you say to that? 320 00:19:07,680 --> 00:19:13,760 Okay, I'm not going to lie and say it's not because it does. 321 00:19:13,760 --> 00:19:18,120 But what I would say is that, you know, I'm talking about just like we all do, right? 322 00:19:18,120 --> 00:19:19,120 We paint the picture. 323 00:19:19,120 --> 00:19:21,400 That's like the future. 324 00:19:21,400 --> 00:19:25,880 If you can build this whole pyramid for yourself and have it, you know, working like on an 325 00:19:25,880 --> 00:19:28,800 evergreen basis, that's like what you want to inspire to. 326 00:19:28,800 --> 00:19:30,400 But you're not going to get there from day one. 327 00:19:30,400 --> 00:19:32,840 Like I'm not even there, to be honest. 328 00:19:32,840 --> 00:19:34,840 And I came up with the dang things. 329 00:19:34,840 --> 00:19:38,720 I mean, I kind of think like she must be there. 330 00:19:38,720 --> 00:19:42,360 But as I said, like I'm not even leveraging paid ads, for example. 331 00:19:42,360 --> 00:19:46,800 I really take in my time to build those foundations to start at tier one. 332 00:19:46,800 --> 00:19:51,600 All right, I'm going to set up my podcast and I'm going to do that consistently. 333 00:19:51,600 --> 00:19:54,960 And then it's like, okay, now I'm ready to do things with it. 334 00:19:54,960 --> 00:19:59,600 I'm ready to start to amplify the message that I'm creating on my podcast. 335 00:19:59,600 --> 00:20:00,720 Use Capture to do that. 336 00:20:00,720 --> 00:20:03,760 So it creates my social media captions. 337 00:20:03,760 --> 00:20:04,760 It creates my emails. 338 00:20:04,760 --> 00:20:05,760 It creates my blog posts. 339 00:20:05,760 --> 00:20:07,000 It creates my LinkedIn articles. 340 00:20:07,000 --> 00:20:09,360 It creates all of these things. 341 00:20:09,360 --> 00:20:11,440 And that's all, by the way, still in tier one, right? 342 00:20:11,440 --> 00:20:14,720 Because it's just creation of things. 343 00:20:14,720 --> 00:20:17,240 And then it's like, okay, so I've got that. 344 00:20:17,240 --> 00:20:21,640 And if I can do that consistently for a period of time, it starts to become a habit. 345 00:20:21,640 --> 00:20:23,040 It's like, yep, okay, I feel good. 346 00:20:23,040 --> 00:20:25,320 I'm releasing a podcast episode every week. 347 00:20:25,320 --> 00:20:26,640 I'm blogging every week. 348 00:20:26,640 --> 00:20:28,440 I'm sending out an email every week. 349 00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:30,120 Okay, this is now a habit. 350 00:20:30,120 --> 00:20:32,280 This is just something that I do. 351 00:20:32,280 --> 00:20:34,920 And then it's like, okay, now let's start to activate it. 352 00:20:34,920 --> 00:20:36,760 Let's start to make it active and work for us. 353 00:20:36,760 --> 00:20:37,760 That's the second. 354 00:20:37,760 --> 00:20:40,520 So it could take you four weeks. 355 00:20:40,520 --> 00:20:42,360 It could take you three months. 356 00:20:42,360 --> 00:20:43,560 It could take you a year. 357 00:20:43,560 --> 00:20:46,840 Like there's no time limit on this, by the way, because we all have different lives. 358 00:20:46,840 --> 00:20:48,920 We're all in different situations. 359 00:20:48,920 --> 00:20:52,000 You just have to know what does that look like? 360 00:20:52,000 --> 00:20:56,480 What could that look like for you by way of, hey, I'm full time on this thing. 361 00:20:56,480 --> 00:20:58,520 And I want to really like not, I've got the time. 362 00:20:58,520 --> 00:20:59,520 I've got the energy. 363 00:20:59,520 --> 00:21:01,400 I'm going to knock this out of the park. 364 00:21:01,400 --> 00:21:02,400 Awesome. 365 00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:06,960 I'm going to spend four weeks, just head down creating my first tier. 366 00:21:06,960 --> 00:21:08,960 And then I'm going to be ready for the second tier. 367 00:21:08,960 --> 00:21:09,960 Right? 368 00:21:09,960 --> 00:21:11,640 So it depends. 369 00:21:11,640 --> 00:21:15,840 And so then when you get into the second tier, then it's like, okay, now I need to optimize 370 00:21:15,840 --> 00:21:20,080 all of the discoverability content that I'm creating. 371 00:21:20,080 --> 00:21:24,920 So we're talking like blog posts and we're talking YouTube videos, things like that. 372 00:21:24,920 --> 00:21:34,680 And even the podcast, how do I now get really, way more intentional around how I create that 373 00:21:34,680 --> 00:21:37,200 content and how I put it out there? 374 00:21:37,200 --> 00:21:41,160 So that could look like things like, well, I know that YouTube. 375 00:21:41,160 --> 00:21:46,720 Yes, I could put my whole podcast onto YouTube and I've been doing that week after week. 376 00:21:46,720 --> 00:21:52,840 But then I'm like, okay, but actually what works really well on YouTube are more tutorial 377 00:21:52,840 --> 00:21:55,600 style or how to videos and shorter. 378 00:21:55,600 --> 00:21:58,720 People don't want to spend too long just watching a conversation. 379 00:21:58,720 --> 00:22:00,400 They just want three to five minutes. 380 00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:01,800 Just give me the good stuff. 381 00:22:01,800 --> 00:22:02,800 Awesome. 382 00:22:02,800 --> 00:22:03,800 Okay. 383 00:22:03,800 --> 00:22:07,080 Now I know if that's my hypothesis going in, I'm going to start creating those. 384 00:22:07,080 --> 00:22:08,680 And by the way, Capture helps you do that too. 385 00:22:08,680 --> 00:22:14,040 But I'm going to start to create that so that I can start to optimize for YouTube. 386 00:22:14,040 --> 00:22:15,040 Or you know what? 387 00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:18,960 I'm going to go all in on, and by the way, this is another tip just to answer your question 388 00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:25,040 Ashley as well, or to add onto it is like only focus on like one or two platforms. 389 00:22:25,040 --> 00:22:31,240 So I generally focus on one discoverability style platform and one visibility style platform. 390 00:22:31,240 --> 00:22:34,480 So discoverability, I'm like Google, right? 391 00:22:34,480 --> 00:22:40,760 Like I've just gone all in on how do I get my podcast found on Google? 392 00:22:40,760 --> 00:22:44,280 And we know that there are certain things like, yes, you could, you should be looking 393 00:22:44,280 --> 00:22:48,320 for good keywords that you know, your audience wants to, but that's like the tip of the iceberg. 394 00:22:48,320 --> 00:22:53,520 Because there's actually so much more around rich media, around backlinks, around all these 395 00:22:53,520 --> 00:22:57,360 other things that you need to be doing for your blog posts if you really want to activate 396 00:22:57,360 --> 00:22:59,600 it and get it found. 397 00:22:59,600 --> 00:23:02,400 I was already in the habit of like, yep, I'm just publishing blog posts. 398 00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:03,400 They don't have to be perfect. 399 00:23:03,400 --> 00:23:07,520 They don't have to have all these things, but now I'm like, okay, I've become a habit. 400 00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:13,600 I freed up some time that mental capacity that's been used, that was used to create this thing. 401 00:23:13,600 --> 00:23:18,800 Now it's that's freed up so I can actually go in and be like, okay, I'm going to create 402 00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:20,080 rich media for this. 403 00:23:20,080 --> 00:23:21,480 That might look like an infographic. 404 00:23:21,480 --> 00:23:26,240 All right, I'm going to start to actually create infographics now for all my blog posts, 405 00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:30,400 or it might look like me trying to get, you know, backlinks. 406 00:23:30,400 --> 00:23:34,680 So I'm going to start to reach out to people to be like, hey, do they want to maybe share 407 00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:37,120 about this blog post or is this a topic that's of interest to them? 408 00:23:37,120 --> 00:23:42,120 You know, like, pick like one, two things, do that for another four weeks, and then the 409 00:23:42,120 --> 00:23:46,000 next thing, and then the next thing, everything just builds on each other. 410 00:23:46,000 --> 00:23:52,080 And so, and by, and then by the time you do, it's like, it all just happens quicker than 411 00:23:52,080 --> 00:23:54,760 I think we think it does. 412 00:23:54,760 --> 00:23:59,480 But then before you know it, you have your traffic pyramid build. 413 00:23:59,480 --> 00:24:03,160 And that was just because you were able to very like intentionally go from one thing 414 00:24:03,160 --> 00:24:05,680 to the next to the next to the next. 415 00:24:05,680 --> 00:24:08,160 So yeah, it's a lot, it's a lot of work. 416 00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:13,440 But everything that is worth it takes time. 417 00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:17,200 And if we believe enough in the thing that we're building and the message that we're 418 00:24:17,200 --> 00:24:23,960 putting out there, then yes, it's going to take time, but also leveraging tools like 419 00:24:23,960 --> 00:24:30,320 Capture, like RSS.com, like a whole bunch of like it, you know, it is going to help 420 00:24:30,320 --> 00:24:33,840 you and you're going to not feel so alone in the process. 421 00:24:33,840 --> 00:24:36,760 I mean, that makes complete sense to me. 422 00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:40,680 And I mean, you know, I come from the blogging world and so building things on top of each 423 00:24:40,680 --> 00:24:43,680 other already is like kind of ingrained in me. 424 00:24:43,680 --> 00:24:48,440 And you know, the great thing is nowadays, the more you update your blog posts, the better 425 00:24:48,440 --> 00:24:50,960 it looks good to Google that you keep going back and touching it. 426 00:24:50,960 --> 00:24:55,080 So I like what you said about the idea of then going back and making rich media, because 427 00:24:55,080 --> 00:24:58,880 then you can go back and update all your old blog posts with all your good juicy news 428 00:24:58,880 --> 00:24:59,880 stuff. 429 00:24:59,880 --> 00:25:02,480 So I'm going to be, I'm going to be taking advantage of that because I think that's a 430 00:25:02,480 --> 00:25:03,480 fun idea. 431 00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:06,880 I never would have thought of that actually to just make an infographic of something 432 00:25:06,880 --> 00:25:07,880 that I already did. 433 00:25:07,880 --> 00:25:12,960 Like I love talking about repurposing, but yeah, because what a great idea. 434 00:25:12,960 --> 00:25:14,760 Really just like that alone. 435 00:25:14,760 --> 00:25:15,760 Like that's it. 436 00:25:15,760 --> 00:25:16,760 I'm good. 437 00:25:16,760 --> 00:25:17,760 Just with the interview. 438 00:25:17,760 --> 00:25:18,760 Have a great day. 439 00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:19,760 I love that too. 440 00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:20,760 I'm just kidding. 441 00:25:20,760 --> 00:25:21,760 I'm totally kidding. 442 00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:24,320 But yeah, that's really good stuff. 443 00:25:24,320 --> 00:25:28,920 And the other thing that you said that, you know, about how if it, if it, you know, something 444 00:25:28,920 --> 00:25:31,280 that's good, it's going to take time. 445 00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:34,080 That's one of the biggest things I always say is that's why you need to know your why 446 00:25:34,080 --> 00:25:35,760 before you start podcasting. 447 00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:39,480 Like any, anytime I talk about starting a podcast, it's always like, but why are you 448 00:25:39,480 --> 00:25:40,480 doing it? 449 00:25:40,480 --> 00:25:43,760 And if you can't answer that with something other than, oh, I want to get rich. 450 00:25:43,760 --> 00:25:47,600 Because like, like, you know, like we had people not, it's not going to help you get 451 00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:48,600 rich. 452 00:25:48,600 --> 00:25:52,960 Oh, no, like we had, we had Kate Volman on and she said to me, she's like, if you want 453 00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:55,760 to make money podcasting, please do something else. 454 00:25:55,760 --> 00:25:57,920 You know, like, it's really the truth. 455 00:25:57,920 --> 00:26:02,680 Like you can make money podcasting, but unless you are already a celebrity and you already 456 00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:06,080 have an audience, it's going to be a little bit harder of a climb. 457 00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:10,360 But, but do you think it is possible, you know, leveraging the assets that you're creating 458 00:26:10,360 --> 00:26:14,840 with CapShow or with whatever you're creating it with, in your opinion, is it still possible 459 00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:20,640 in 2023 and 2024 to take all these assets that we're creating and still leverage them 460 00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:24,360 in a way that we can get, I guess, some form of internet fame? 461 00:26:24,360 --> 00:26:32,160 Oh, I guess it depends on what we, what you know, we think internet fame is because like 462 00:26:32,160 --> 00:26:38,120 for so CapShow was specifically, we built it really for expert entrepreneurs. 463 00:26:38,120 --> 00:26:41,800 So we're talking like coaches, consultants, service providers. 464 00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:47,120 So internet fame in that world looks a lot different to internet fame in like the, the 465 00:26:47,120 --> 00:26:48,120 Kardashian world. 466 00:26:48,120 --> 00:26:49,120 Yeah, exactly. 467 00:26:49,120 --> 00:26:50,120 Right. 468 00:26:50,120 --> 00:26:51,120 So very, very different. 469 00:26:51,120 --> 00:26:57,720 Can it, can it help you get internet fame in your world, in your niche, like to your 470 00:26:57,720 --> 00:26:58,720 audience? 471 00:26:58,720 --> 00:26:59,720 100%. 472 00:26:59,720 --> 00:27:00,720 Yeah. 473 00:27:00,720 --> 00:27:07,280 Like, you know, even for me, and this is like, I was so surprised by this, but I was talking 474 00:27:07,280 --> 00:27:14,520 to Brian Balletta, so he has the Sounds Profitable newsletter, and he was like, he was saying, 475 00:27:14,520 --> 00:27:22,360 you know, I don't know if you know this, but you're like one of my favorite or my top podcasting 476 00:27:22,360 --> 00:27:23,360 influencer. 477 00:27:23,360 --> 00:27:25,360 And I'm like, what? 478 00:27:25,360 --> 00:27:29,800 Like that makes absolutely no sense because A, I don't think that I'm a podcasting influencer 479 00:27:29,800 --> 00:27:30,800 at all. 480 00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:38,520 I mean, I'm like, there are way cooler people out there that's, you know, but that's, but 481 00:27:38,520 --> 00:27:39,520 I think that's the thing. 482 00:27:39,520 --> 00:27:43,280 It's like, again, you just, when you're talking about the things that you're so passionate 483 00:27:43,280 --> 00:27:48,640 about all the time and you're finding, you know, and you're, you know, for me, like on 484 00:27:48,640 --> 00:27:53,560 social media and email, like a lot of the, I mean, I do a lot more than just talk about 485 00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:55,320 my podcast because I have a business. 486 00:27:55,320 --> 00:28:00,760 So, you know, but even if I was just talking about my podcast, like, yes, I use Capture 487 00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:04,720 to do that, but I also put my own spin on it, which is also a really, really important 488 00:28:04,720 --> 00:28:07,560 thing by the way, if we're talking about AI coming back to that, you've got to put your 489 00:28:07,560 --> 00:28:10,040 own edit, like you've got to make it yours. 490 00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:14,120 It's a great starting point, but you still fundamentally have to make it yours. 491 00:28:14,120 --> 00:28:18,360 And I was, I was really surprised, but even that is like, would you call that internet 492 00:28:18,360 --> 00:28:19,360 famous? 493 00:28:19,360 --> 00:28:23,560 Like, I don't think I would in the traditional sense, but to my audience, like to the people 494 00:28:23,560 --> 00:28:29,520 that I actually care about reaching and talking to, then yeah, maybe I am a little bit internet 495 00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:31,880 famous, you know, from that perspective. 496 00:28:31,880 --> 00:28:37,680 So I think it really depends on, I would say that in, in your need, only, and I would say 497 00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:42,160 for most of us, we should really only care about our niche, our audience, whether or 498 00:28:42,160 --> 00:28:44,880 not you're able to make an impact on them. 499 00:28:44,880 --> 00:28:50,520 So yeah, it's possible, probably not to do the Kardashian scale, but yeah. 500 00:28:50,520 --> 00:28:52,720 But who wants that anyway? 501 00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:56,640 I like that idea in the way that you said that, because yes, it's so important that 502 00:28:56,640 --> 00:29:01,200 if you're, in fact, if you're, if you're trying to reach your people, the people that 503 00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:06,040 actually need to hear your message, it sounds like using AI is a great way to actually make 504 00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:07,040 that happen. 505 00:29:07,040 --> 00:29:09,880 You're getting the messages to the people that actually need to hear it. 506 00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:14,120 And one of the things that, that keeps coming through in this is how important it is to 507 00:29:14,120 --> 00:29:15,960 have your authentic message. 508 00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:22,120 And that's why I like the idea of basically focusing on AI and post is because then you're 509 00:29:22,120 --> 00:29:23,920 making sure it's still your words. 510 00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:25,360 It's still your authentic voice. 511 00:29:25,360 --> 00:29:27,000 It's still you. 512 00:29:27,000 --> 00:29:30,240 You're just using a little bit of help to streamline that process. 513 00:29:30,240 --> 00:29:31,240 Clean out the cobwebs. 514 00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:32,240 Yeah, exactly. 515 00:29:32,240 --> 00:29:33,240 Clean out the cobwebs. 516 00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:34,240 Yes. 517 00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:35,240 That's awesome. 518 00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:38,960 Well, everything that you've talked about has just been awesome and I love everything 519 00:29:38,960 --> 00:29:44,080 you've said, but I have to ask you, is there anything that I haven't asked you that you 520 00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:47,960 think that we need to cover in AI and podcasting that you really want to make sure we put in 521 00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:48,960 this episode? 522 00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:49,960 Not. 523 00:29:49,960 --> 00:29:52,200 I don't think so. 524 00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:55,760 I'm happy to just go with the conversation leads us. 525 00:29:55,760 --> 00:29:59,840 Yeah, that's always a really hard question for me to answer. 526 00:29:59,840 --> 00:30:03,600 No, but if there's anything else that you want to talk about, I'm totally happy to talk 527 00:30:03,600 --> 00:30:04,600 about that too. 528 00:30:04,600 --> 00:30:05,600 Okay. 529 00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:08,920 Well, then since we're already giving you complicated questions, I got to ask you my, 530 00:30:08,920 --> 00:30:11,600 I guess I guess it would be my, my Barbara Walters question. 531 00:30:11,600 --> 00:30:16,240 What is one question I didn't ask you, you really wish I had it could be on anything 532 00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:18,880 doesn't even have to be podcasting related. 533 00:30:18,880 --> 00:30:25,920 Hmm, that I wish you had. 534 00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:33,400 I also don't really have, yeah, yeah, I'm, yeah, no, I, I'm good. 535 00:30:33,400 --> 00:30:38,560 I mean, you can ask me a Barbara Walters question, I'd be like, what's your deepest darkest 536 00:30:38,560 --> 00:30:40,880 hidden views? 537 00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:44,400 But no, I, I actually, no, I think I, this was a lot of fun. 538 00:30:44,400 --> 00:30:46,400 What was it talking about? 539 00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:47,400 Yeah. 540 00:30:47,400 --> 00:30:51,000 Yeah, since we've talked about your podcast a few times, you haven't actually name dropped 541 00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:52,000 it. 542 00:30:52,000 --> 00:30:53,000 What's your podcast? 543 00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:55,400 Yeah, well, it's called grow my podcast show. 544 00:30:55,400 --> 00:30:57,880 Um, essentially it's, it's what it is. 545 00:30:57,880 --> 00:31:02,760 It's like that I talk to a lot of experts on, you know, what they've, um, they've done to 546 00:31:02,760 --> 00:31:03,760 grow their show. 547 00:31:03,760 --> 00:31:06,400 So we talk a lot of strategies, a lot of tactics. 548 00:31:06,400 --> 00:31:07,400 I also do. 549 00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:13,600 So, um, we had, for example, Alexey, um, from Voxelize on and he was talking about podcast 550 00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:14,600 visibility optimization. 551 00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:19,520 And then the next episode, we spoke about what it is that we've done based on that. 552 00:31:19,520 --> 00:31:20,520 What do we do? 553 00:31:20,520 --> 00:31:22,480 What, um, changes that we make and what results do we get? 554 00:31:22,480 --> 00:31:27,680 Uh, so it's also one of those podcasts where we're doing it alongside, uh, our listeners 555 00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:29,440 and our audience as well, which is super cool. 556 00:31:29,440 --> 00:31:31,640 So grow my podcast show, definitely go check it out. 557 00:31:31,640 --> 00:31:32,880 I also talk about the traffic pyramid. 558 00:31:32,880 --> 00:31:34,160 I talk about content tripping strategy. 559 00:31:34,160 --> 00:31:36,880 I talk about like everything on this. 560 00:31:36,880 --> 00:31:38,680 With the wildest strategy you've heard. 561 00:31:38,680 --> 00:31:39,800 Oh, okay. 562 00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:42,200 So one of our catchovians, um, J.S. 563 00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:48,600 Barris, so I had him on and he was, he, he, he's brain just thinks very differently, but 564 00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:54,080 he was saying that since using CAPSHO he, um, for his, his episodes, he's gone from 565 00:31:54,080 --> 00:31:58,200 single digit downloads to like over 22,000 downloads. 566 00:31:58,200 --> 00:32:00,560 And I'm like, what, okay, you've got it. 567 00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:01,560 What did you do? 568 00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:02,560 Yeah. 569 00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:06,840 And so he was saying one of the novel, I mean, he does multiple novel things, but one of 570 00:32:06,840 --> 00:32:12,920 the novel things that he does is he actually uses, um, like the social media, um, function 571 00:32:12,920 --> 00:32:18,000 of CAPSHO, um, to help him come up with the content and then he'll put it on Snapchat. 572 00:32:18,000 --> 00:32:19,000 Actually. 573 00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:21,800 So this is a very, I mean, snap, like, is that still a thing? 574 00:32:21,800 --> 00:32:23,800 But anyway, he didn't know it was. 575 00:32:23,800 --> 00:32:24,800 Wow. 576 00:32:24,800 --> 00:32:25,800 Yeah. 577 00:32:25,800 --> 00:32:29,320 So he puts it on Snapchat, but then he does this, um, geo, um, locating thing. 578 00:32:29,320 --> 00:32:35,480 So he'll, he'll actually push it out in like, he'll target it to like his location. 579 00:32:35,480 --> 00:32:37,680 And then from there, cause I'm not a user Snapchat. 580 00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:44,000 So I'm going to do this totally a disservice, um, his strategy, but then there's, um, something 581 00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:48,880 can, where then people in that location share it as well. 582 00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:49,880 There's something that happens. 583 00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:50,880 I don't know. 584 00:32:50,880 --> 00:32:51,880 So they share. 585 00:32:51,880 --> 00:32:56,880 And so before you know it, it's like kind of just gone out to like thousands and thousands 586 00:32:56,880 --> 00:33:01,680 and tens of thousands of people, um, because it's just a nice thing. 587 00:33:01,680 --> 00:33:02,680 It's, it's really weird. 588 00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:04,480 Anyway, you'll have to listen to that episode. 589 00:33:04,480 --> 00:33:08,160 We've just, yeah, well, I'll have to look for it and put it in those show notes. 590 00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:10,240 Cause I mean, we're all looking for the upper edge. 591 00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:11,360 So let's, let's just be honest. 592 00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:14,680 We're all trying to figure out how can we get more downloads. 593 00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:15,680 Yes. 594 00:33:15,680 --> 00:33:16,680 Yeah. 595 00:33:16,680 --> 00:33:17,680 And more attention. 596 00:33:17,680 --> 00:33:18,680 Yes. 597 00:33:18,680 --> 00:33:20,160 But yeah, definitely that. 598 00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:26,760 But also definitely listen to the episode that, um, we did on podcast visibility optimization, 599 00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:33,520 because that is a very, there's a sound sound, um, data backed strategies that everyone, 600 00:33:33,520 --> 00:33:35,400 like literally everyone should be doing. 601 00:33:35,400 --> 00:33:37,080 So yeah, that's a good thing. 602 00:33:37,080 --> 00:33:39,960 So unfortunately it sounds like what you're saying is podcasting is not like field of 603 00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:40,960 dreams. 604 00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:41,960 Yeah. 605 00:33:41,960 --> 00:33:42,960 And yeah, I know. 606 00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:45,000 I wish it can't, you can't build it and they will come. 607 00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:46,000 Yeah. 608 00:33:46,000 --> 00:33:47,000 No, no. 609 00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:51,520 Unfortunately, like nothing in my experience in like is that way, which is, yes, it's a 610 00:33:51,520 --> 00:33:53,800 bit of a bummer, isn't it? 611 00:33:53,800 --> 00:33:54,800 Yeah. 612 00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:58,840 But at the same time, the good thing about it is if you do build your foundation and 613 00:33:58,840 --> 00:34:01,920 you're pyramid in the right way, it sounds like you're going to at least find the people 614 00:34:01,920 --> 00:34:02,920 that you need to be finding. 615 00:34:02,920 --> 00:34:05,920 So speaking of finding, where else can we find you online? 616 00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:06,920 Yeah. 617 00:34:06,920 --> 00:34:10,840 So, um, I guess the biggest thing if anyone who was listening about capture and they're 618 00:34:10,840 --> 00:34:14,920 like, oh my gosh, I've got to try this amazing software, which you do. 619 00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:20,920 Um, then what we've done is we've actually packed packaged up a, um, extended free trial 620 00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:23,440 capture, but with some really cool bonuses. 621 00:34:23,440 --> 00:34:26,080 Um, I spoken about visibility and discoverability. 622 00:34:26,080 --> 00:34:30,640 So I've actually got a free audio mini course for each of those. 623 00:34:30,640 --> 00:34:36,920 So how can you actually get yourself discovered inside podcast apps, inside, um, and on search 624 00:34:36,920 --> 00:34:41,360 and also how do you get yourselves, yourself visible on social media? 625 00:34:41,360 --> 00:34:46,320 Um, so those are some free bonus audio mini courses that come with the extended free 626 00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:47,320 trial capture. 627 00:34:47,320 --> 00:34:49,320 And that's at free gift.capture.com. 628 00:34:49,320 --> 00:34:50,320 Awesome. 629 00:34:50,320 --> 00:34:51,320 That is fantastic. 630 00:34:51,320 --> 00:34:55,160 Well, Jodra, I want to thank you again for, for being here with us. 631 00:34:55,160 --> 00:34:58,880 I mean, we've shared a lot of amazing stuff and I definitely have some notes that I'm 632 00:34:58,880 --> 00:35:02,840 going to be going over and seeing what else I can learn about the whole AI and podcasting 633 00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:03,840 thing. 634 00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:06,680 But I guess if they don't take over the world, we'll try to have you on the show again and 635 00:35:06,680 --> 00:35:11,080 we'll follow up on this and see what else happened and what other ideas you have. 636 00:35:11,080 --> 00:35:13,440 But, uh, but yeah, I think this was great. 637 00:35:13,440 --> 00:35:14,440 Thank you so much. 638 00:35:14,440 --> 00:35:17,400 And next time I'll send my AI robot to have these. 639 00:35:17,400 --> 00:35:19,400 I think that's coming. 640 00:35:19,400 --> 00:35:21,400 I think that I'll see that very soon. 641 00:35:21,400 --> 00:35:22,400 Thanks again. 642 00:35:22,400 --> 00:35:23,400 Thanks again. 643 00:35:23,400 --> 00:35:35,560 Well, my fellow podcasters, we hope you enjoyed the insights, tips and ideas shared in this 644 00:35:35,560 --> 00:35:36,560 episode. 645 00:35:36,560 --> 00:35:41,960 To learn more about launching and growing your own show, head over to rss.com backslash 646 00:35:41,960 --> 00:35:42,960 blog. 647 00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:47,080 And if you're ready to launch a podcast of your own, you can get started for free with 648 00:35:47,080 --> 00:35:48,960 your first episode on us. 649 00:35:48,960 --> 00:35:55,960 Thanks for tuning in.