Hey everyone, Ashley here with RSS.com.
In this episode, we're chatting all about AI and podcasting.
We're jamming with Diedrich Chen, CEO and co-founder of CapShow.
Join us as we explore the role of AI in idea generation, scripting, and even post-production
of your podcast.
Enjoy the show.
All right.
So, Diedrich, welcome to the show.
I'm so excited you could be here.
Can you do us a favor and tell us what you do?
Yes.
Oh my gosh.
Thank you so much for having me on here, Ashley.
So I am the CEO and co-founder of CapShow, which is the fastest way to repurpose and
market your expert content.
And so essentially what our users do is they will upload their podcast audio file or a
video file.
And in literally under 10 minutes, we create a lot of their content marketing assets for
them.
So the title and description, their social media captions across multiple platforms,
and emails, a couple of emails, one that's promotional, one that's engagement, a YouTube
description, LinkedIn article, four types of blog posts.
We identify soundbites for them.
We pull out quotes.
We help them create a short three to five minute YouTube segment from their long form
episode.
And we also have a short form scripts generator.
So a lot of things that CapShow does for a podcast stuff.
So it sounds like you're using, I'm guessing like an AI technology to take all these assets
and make them happen.
Is that accurate?
Yeah.
So basically how I guess AI works is there's like large language models.
And basically there are a few in the market that have kind of pretty dominated the market
right now.
So OpenAI being one, but there are a handful of others, Google bar, et cetera.
And so when we first started, so we launched, we went live just over a year ago, a year
and like three weeks ago.
And at that time, we were actually thinking, we were actually in the middle of looking at
building our own.
But then because all of these large language models came out, it just didn't make sense
to do that.
So we've instead just started to train these large language models for our use case, which
is specifically how do we help a podcaster and their anchor, how do we help amplify their
anchor content?
So it's not about making up content outside of that.
It's really anchored in that expert content that they're putting into CapShow.
Yes.
And that's what actually got me so excited and made me want to kind of talk to you about
this because we recently did a post on AI and podcasting.
And so I want to ask you, in terms of AI and podcasting, what do you think the biggest
benefit of all these amazing software that are coming out?
What do you think the big benefit is to podcasters and why should they consider using it for
themselves?
Yeah.
So it depends because AI is across the board in terms of where it can help podcasters.
So I kind of think about it in terms of from a process perspective where AI can and needs
to play a part in that process.
And I can even identify parts of that.
I would recommend that we don't leverage AI.
And that's probably more from like an ethical, moral perspective.
But obviously, people can just like bin that advice and do what they want to do.
So I'll start there.
And then we can kind of talk about what makes AI so powerful in those parts of the process.
So if we think about podcasting, there's kind of like in my mind three really big parts
of it.
There's the idea generation, scripting, the pre-recording part of it.
Then there's the recording part of it.
And then there's the post production part.
So the first bit, which is really how do I come up with the ideas?
How do I find guests?
How do I even if anyone scripts, I script some of my episodes as well.
And then it comes scripting.
AI, let's say chat, GPT, for example, is great at helping to inspire thoughts or to maybe
give you a different perspective or highlight something that maybe you hadn't thought about
before.
And you're like, oh, actually, it's a really good thought starter.
Let me just take that one little piece and expand upon it myself.
But that's the extent to which I'll use AI in the pre-production process.
Because really, I'm very, very passionate about the fact that as creators, as podcasters,
we need to be telling our own stories, leveraging our own experiences and sharing the value
that we've earned, I guess, in our lifetime.
And AI cannot replace that and definitely should not be replacing that.
Because when you think about what it is that we're doing, why we're creating is because
fundamentally we want to be creating a connection with our audience.
And the only way that we can create a connection with our audience is if we share about ourselves.
So that's a part that I would never use AI to do.
The second part, which is the recording.
Now there are a lot of AI tools and it's only going to get better and smarter that can clone
your voice, that can start to clone your image and create videos out of you.
I also at this stage would not recommend doing that.
And the reason why, using AI for that part of it.
And the reason why is because again, when we think about connection, our voice, our accent,
the way that we, you know, I, and I just did it right there, which is like, I will stop
in mid-sentence because another thought comes up and I'm like, oh my gosh, I have to jump
into it.
You know, we do that as humans.
And that's actually what creates the connection as well is that, you know, you listen to that
and it's like, because I get so passionate, excited about something, you, that energy
comes through.
And that's what other, you know, your audience is picking up on.
Now it's not for everyone because some people might listen to me and be like, oh my gosh,
it's, she's so frustrating and irritating.
We first should have complete a sentence or X, Y, Z, whatever.
But you know, that's, that's also what you want to be doing with, that's how you connect
you, either connecting to repel the people that just are never going to be part of your
community or you want to attract the ones that do.
So that's why even in that recording part, I would always say, do not use AI there.
It should, it needs to be you.
Now, once you've, you know, you've pre-con, you've, you've done your pre-show stuff,
you recorded it, then there's kind of the post-production part of it.
And that's where I fundamentally believe AI can do the best and should do the heavy
lifting because A, it takes a lot of time and B, because in my experience, and the reason
why I created CapShow is because the podcast itself or whatever anchor content that you're
creating, whether that's a YouTube video or podcast or a live stream, for example, like
that only gets you so far, which is in my experience, not very far at all.
Because the one, like what you really need to do is the marketing of it.
It's actually the promote, the getting it out there.
And when I figured this out with my first podcast and I started doing the things, like
it got to the point where it broke me and my team around all of the content that we had
to create and all the things.
Now, it was great because we got the results, you know, I did multiple six figures in my
first year podcasting just through my business because of what we were doing.
But that, by breaking, like it's not sustainable way of doing it without leveraging technology
like AI to help you there.
So for me, that part, which is, and the great thing is, and again, this is what CapShow
does is it's anchored in your content, in your stories, in your experiences, in the
value that you've, you're providing because you've done the manual human work upfront.
And so that means that at the back end, you can use AI to just amplify that.
And it's such a great use case.
And why, and for, you know, to come back to your original question, which is like, why
is this so important is because from a podcasting perspective, I think we all know the stats
about around pod fade and how prevalent that is.
And it's because we're not doing a few things.
A, we're probably not being consistent in recording and publishing.
And B, we're not being consistent in marketing.
And the, the combination of, of those two things means that we're actually not going
to get the results that we want, which means that we're going to look at our podcast and
be like, why am I doing this thing?
It's not actually creating any kind of, I'm not getting any kind of ROI on the time that
I'm spending on it or the money that I'm spending on it.
And so that's why we stop our podcast.
And so, yes, I fundamentally believe you need to be using AI in your, you know, your podcasting
flow, but it's really in where and how you use it.
All right.
So back to this though.
So I agree with you completely.
You can't really replicate, you know, like inflection and voice and things like that.
So what do you think about like the overdub, like with the script, you know, what do you
think about using it in post to, if you misspoke or something like that?
I'm curious about that.
Yeah.
I think that like to just do the little tweaks and stuff, there's absolutely no issue.
I would, I'd do it myself.
I mean, I haven't tried it in a while, so they've probably come leaps and bounds, but
I remember when I first released it, I did try it.
And it was a little bit weird too, because it wasn't quite hitting the mark.
Yeah, I would totally use it if I'm like, oh, I need to change my lead magnet or the
thing, just like one small piece, 100%.
I would, I would do that.
But I know that there are people who are literally standing up full podcasts and getting an AI
to, you know, record the whole thing.
And that's where I'm like, oh, I do.
Yeah.
That I ethically can't stand kind at this point in time.
That makes sense.
And you know, the thing is though, like the other thing about it is it kind of scares
me.
You know, and that's one of the big things that people talk about, you know, you have
your deep big Tom Cruise videos that are going on, TikTok and all these other deep fakes
that are happening.
What do you think about, well, deep fakes in podcasting?
Oh, it's scary.
It's scary.
This, can you imagine, can you imagine a world where like, we don't even know what's
real and not real?
And that's going to be everywhere.
That's going to be everywhere.
And it feels like we're on the cusp of it.
Oh, 100%.
Yeah.
It's going to be happening.
You know, it was already such a big thing around like, you know, misinformation.
I know that that's like an extreme, you know, example of it.
But it's a very small, again, a very small tweak to go from like, oh, what we're doing
is okay.
And, you know, we're just going to have something else AI to replicate our voice or replicate
out, you know, to then going into misinformation, which is a really, really scary thought.
So I'm, yeah, not, I am a little bit perturbed by what is to come.
And I do, if I'm going to be honest, have a bit of a dystopian view on what AI is going
to do to society and definitely in the future.
But, and that's why, you know, honestly, with Capture, we did a few things inside of it,
which we launched as part of Capture 2.0 early this year.
We did a few things that counter-intuitively put a little bit more friction into the platform
so that we could force our users, our Capture Indians to actually interact with their content
because we could see it's a very slippery slope that we start to go down when we try
to rely on AI to do everything without us as a human, as a creator, putting in thought
or, you know, in like actually engaging with our own, with the things that we're putting
out there.
Yeah, so I, it's on my mind around like what AI is going to do and the things that it's
going to bring.
And as much as possible, being in the space, I'm trying to do what I can to counteract
some of it.
And keep it ethical.
Yes, exactly.
Exactly.
Yes, I can't help but think about, you know, like one of the things that's happening right
now in Hollywood that I'm hearing about a lot, and, you know, writer's strike aside
and all the stuff that's going on.
I've been hearing a lot about contracts being changed so that if they decide that they're
going to use Overdub or that they're going to use your face or whatever to basically,
you know, fix things in post, that they are now updating contracts for celebrities, that
if they do a movie and then they want to go and make some changes, that they have to now
get paid extra to use their face for those things.
And I think that's, I think it's fascinating and it scares the cred out of me, but, you
know, who knows what's going to happen.
That kind of reminds me of, you know, Will Smith and Irobot when he's like, you're experiencing
a car accident.
He's like, no, I'm not.
I don't know.
I guess I get nervous about the AI overlords, but at the same time, I feel like if we don't
lean into it since it's coming anyway.
It's yeah, exactly.
You were, yeah, we're going to get left behind.
So with that in mind though, what do you think, like in terms of your workflow for a podcast,
what do you think a person needs to do whenever they're doing things in post?
What are the top things they should use AI for to market it?
I know we've already touched on like emails and social media and stuff, but I'm trying
to map from your perspective, what do you think is the best?
Yeah.
So I have a whole like content dripping system that I, that I leverage myself, but I also
do teach some of the Capshovians as well.
And it's really anchored in, okay, so let me talk about, first of all, if it's okay,
I'll talk about my traffic pyramid framework just to set context as to how I think about
it.
Oh, I would love that.
Yeah, let's go.
Do it.
Okay.
And then we can go into the content dripping strategy.
But okay, so the traffic pyramid framework is there's four tiers to it.
And this is literally, if you can hit all these four tiers, then you will get unlimited
traffic to wherever it is that you're trying to get them to.
So whether it's your podcast or your business, wherever.
And so those four tiers is the bottom tier is what I call passive organic marketing.
And that's what we're doing when, you know, we record a podcast, we publish it, and then
we kind of sit back and we're like, yes, job done.
All right.
The podcast is out.
Or we do that a lot on social media, right?
We'll just like put up a post and then it's like, cool.
Like I feel good about myself.
I posted something and we'll just let the algorithms do its thing, which in a lot of our cases is
nothing.
He really doesn't do anything for us.
So that's kind of like the passive organic marketing is where we're just creating content
and we're putting it out there, but we're not, we're just hoping, we're crossing our
fingers and hoping that it'll do something.
How we actually make that start to work for us, how we make our content work for us is
to get going to the second tier, which is active organic marketing.
And this is where we start to, there's kind of like, in my mind, two areas that we need
to be actively optimizing our content for.
So one is what I call in discovery, so think about search.
So Google, YouTube, Pinterest, even the podcast player apps, there's a lot that we can do
to optimize for, to get discovered through search.
And we can start to make it active and work for us that way.
We start to actually make the algorithms work for us.
And then on the other hand, there's like, how do we actually get visible smartly?
So this is where we're now talking about social media platforms.
Like what is it that we need to do on those platforms to actually activate our content
for us?
A lot of that is, hey, we just need to use social media platforms for what they were
designed to do, which is to engage and be social and build a community.
And you know, like a lot of that heavy lifting is actually what we need to do to activate
our organic content on social media to get ourselves visible.
So that's like the second tier.
And the third tier on top of that is I call that leveraging other people's audiences.
Now in the podcasting space, it gets to be like pretty second nature to us because a
lot of times we guest a lot, or we get guests on our own podcast, and that's a great way
to leverage someone else's audience.
But it doesn't just stop there.
I mean, there's a whole host of ways that you can leverage people's audiences, all sorts
of collaborations.
You know, there's a lot of virtual summits that happen, there's a lot of stages, other
stages that you can be speaking on, there's just so many things that we can be doing above
and beyond just guesting on other podcasts.
So that's the third tier.
And then the fourth tier, which I actually don't spend a lot of time at this stage on
the fourth tier, but it's paid ads because there's already so much that you can do in
the bottom three tiers that's quote unquote free that can get you so much traffic and
so much visibility that even for me, I'm not even looking at paid ads right now at this
stage, even for our business.
So those are the four tiers of the traffic pyramid.
Passive organic, active organic, leveraging other people's audiences and paid ads.
So when you think about that, then you kind of go into where AI can really, I mean AI
can play a part in any of those tiers.
But there's a reason why it's a pyramid and you want to be focusing on the bottom, on
the foundations first, is because anytime you try to ascend it, even when you're looking
to leverage other people's audiences, a lot of times, you know, like they'll, so for example,
Ashley, I'm sure that you might have checked me out maybe on social media or some, you
might have gone to my website or something just to learn more about me.
Now, if I was not present on any of those platforms, you might be like, oh, is this
person a real and, you know, do they even have a community or an audience that is going
to care about, you know, listening to this podcast because she's like all these things,
right?
So you kind of have to have those bottom tiers working for you before you can really meaningfully
ascend up the pyramid.
So that's why I say, you know, we're from an AI perspective, if we can focus on the
bottom two tiers first, so yes, create like helping to create some of that content or
helping to make that creation process more efficient for you without losing your humanity,
like the humanness part of it, then you want to be using AI there.
And then definitely in the second part around how you actually make that content active,
there's so many opportunities to leverage AI there as well, which is some of what Cap
Show does too.
So that was a lot.
And I'm sure that when people are listening to this, the first thing they're thinking
is, oh my goodness, everything that she just described is going to take me so much time.
What would you say to that?
Okay, I'm not going to lie and say it's not because it does.
But what I would say is that, you know, I'm talking about just like we all do, right?
We paint the picture.
That's like the future.
If you can build this whole pyramid for yourself and have it, you know, working like on an
evergreen basis, that's like what you want to inspire to.
But you're not going to get there from day one.
Like I'm not even there, to be honest.
And I came up with the dang things.
I mean, I kind of think like she must be there.
But as I said, like I'm not even leveraging paid ads, for example.
I really take in my time to build those foundations to start at tier one.
All right, I'm going to set up my podcast and I'm going to do that consistently.
And then it's like, okay, now I'm ready to do things with it.
I'm ready to start to amplify the message that I'm creating on my podcast.
Use Capture to do that.
So it creates my social media captions.
It creates my emails.
It creates my blog posts.
It creates my LinkedIn articles.
It creates all of these things.
And that's all, by the way, still in tier one, right?
Because it's just creation of things.
And then it's like, okay, so I've got that.
And if I can do that consistently for a period of time, it starts to become a habit.
It's like, yep, okay, I feel good.
I'm releasing a podcast episode every week.
I'm blogging every week.
I'm sending out an email every week.
Okay, this is now a habit.
This is just something that I do.
And then it's like, okay, now let's start to activate it.
Let's start to make it active and work for us.
That's the second.
So it could take you four weeks.
It could take you three months.
It could take you a year.
Like there's no time limit on this, by the way, because we all have different lives.
We're all in different situations.
You just have to know what does that look like?
What could that look like for you by way of, hey, I'm full time on this thing.
And I want to really like not, I've got the time.
I've got the energy.
I'm going to knock this out of the park.
Awesome.
I'm going to spend four weeks, just head down creating my first tier.
And then I'm going to be ready for the second tier.
Right?
So it depends.
And so then when you get into the second tier, then it's like, okay, now I need to optimize
all of the discoverability content that I'm creating.
So we're talking like blog posts and we're talking YouTube videos, things like that.
And even the podcast, how do I now get really, way more intentional around how I create that
content and how I put it out there?
So that could look like things like, well, I know that YouTube.
Yes, I could put my whole podcast onto YouTube and I've been doing that week after week.
But then I'm like, okay, but actually what works really well on YouTube are more tutorial
style or how to videos and shorter.
People don't want to spend too long just watching a conversation.
They just want three to five minutes.
Just give me the good stuff.
Awesome.
Okay.
Now I know if that's my hypothesis going in, I'm going to start creating those.
And by the way, Capture helps you do that too.
But I'm going to start to create that so that I can start to optimize for YouTube.
Or you know what?
I'm going to go all in on, and by the way, this is another tip just to answer your question
Ashley as well, or to add onto it is like only focus on like one or two platforms.
So I generally focus on one discoverability style platform and one visibility style platform.
So discoverability, I'm like Google, right?
Like I've just gone all in on how do I get my podcast found on Google?
And we know that there are certain things like, yes, you could, you should be looking
for good keywords that you know, your audience wants to, but that's like the tip of the iceberg.
Because there's actually so much more around rich media, around backlinks, around all these
other things that you need to be doing for your blog posts if you really want to activate
it and get it found.
I was already in the habit of like, yep, I'm just publishing blog posts.
They don't have to be perfect.
They don't have to have all these things, but now I'm like, okay, I've become a habit.
I freed up some time that mental capacity that's been used, that was used to create this thing.
Now it's that's freed up so I can actually go in and be like, okay, I'm going to create
rich media for this.
That might look like an infographic.
All right, I'm going to start to actually create infographics now for all my blog posts,
or it might look like me trying to get, you know, backlinks.
So I'm going to start to reach out to people to be like, hey, do they want to maybe share
about this blog post or is this a topic that's of interest to them?
You know, like, pick like one, two things, do that for another four weeks, and then the
next thing, and then the next thing, everything just builds on each other.
And so, and by, and then by the time you do, it's like, it all just happens quicker than
I think we think it does.
But then before you know it, you have your traffic pyramid build.
And that was just because you were able to very like intentionally go from one thing
to the next to the next to the next.
So yeah, it's a lot, it's a lot of work.
But everything that is worth it takes time.
And if we believe enough in the thing that we're building and the message that we're
putting out there, then yes, it's going to take time, but also leveraging tools like
Capture, like RSS.com, like a whole bunch of like it, you know, it is going to help
you and you're going to not feel so alone in the process.
I mean, that makes complete sense to me.
And I mean, you know, I come from the blogging world and so building things on top of each
other already is like kind of ingrained in me.
And you know, the great thing is nowadays, the more you update your blog posts, the better
it looks good to Google that you keep going back and touching it.
So I like what you said about the idea of then going back and making rich media, because
then you can go back and update all your old blog posts with all your good juicy news
stuff.
So I'm going to be, I'm going to be taking advantage of that because I think that's a
fun idea.
I never would have thought of that actually to just make an infographic of something
that I already did.
Like I love talking about repurposing, but yeah, because what a great idea.
Really just like that alone.
Like that's it.
I'm good.
Just with the interview.
Have a great day.
I love that too.
I'm just kidding.
I'm totally kidding.
But yeah, that's really good stuff.
And the other thing that you said that, you know, about how if it, if it, you know, something
that's good, it's going to take time.
That's one of the biggest things I always say is that's why you need to know your why
before you start podcasting.
Like any, anytime I talk about starting a podcast, it's always like, but why are you
doing it?
And if you can't answer that with something other than, oh, I want to get rich.
Because like, like, you know, like we had people not, it's not going to help you get
rich.
Oh, no, like we had, we had Kate Volman on and she said to me, she's like, if you want
to make money podcasting, please do something else.
You know, like, it's really the truth.
Like you can make money podcasting, but unless you are already a celebrity and you already
have an audience, it's going to be a little bit harder of a climb.
But, but do you think it is possible, you know, leveraging the assets that you're creating
with CapShow or with whatever you're creating it with, in your opinion, is it still possible
in 2023 and 2024 to take all these assets that we're creating and still leverage them
in a way that we can get, I guess, some form of internet fame?
Oh, I guess it depends on what we, what you know, we think internet fame is because like
for so CapShow was specifically, we built it really for expert entrepreneurs.
So we're talking like coaches, consultants, service providers.
So internet fame in that world looks a lot different to internet fame in like the, the
Kardashian world.
Yeah, exactly.
Right.
So very, very different.
Can it, can it help you get internet fame in your world, in your niche, like to your
audience?
100%.
Yeah.
Like, you know, even for me, and this is like, I was so surprised by this, but I was talking
to Brian Balletta, so he has the Sounds Profitable newsletter, and he was like, he was saying,
you know, I don't know if you know this, but you're like one of my favorite or my top podcasting
influencer.
And I'm like, what?
Like that makes absolutely no sense because A, I don't think that I'm a podcasting influencer
at all.
I mean, I'm like, there are way cooler people out there that's, you know, but that's, but
I think that's the thing.
It's like, again, you just, when you're talking about the things that you're so passionate
about all the time and you're finding, you know, and you're, you know, for me, like on
social media and email, like a lot of the, I mean, I do a lot more than just talk about
my podcast because I have a business.
So, you know, but even if I was just talking about my podcast, like, yes, I use Capture
to do that, but I also put my own spin on it, which is also a really, really important
thing by the way, if we're talking about AI coming back to that, you've got to put your
own edit, like you've got to make it yours.
It's a great starting point, but you still fundamentally have to make it yours.
And I was, I was really surprised, but even that is like, would you call that internet
famous?
Like, I don't think I would in the traditional sense, but to my audience, like to the people
that I actually care about reaching and talking to, then yeah, maybe I am a little bit internet
famous, you know, from that perspective.
So I think it really depends on, I would say that in, in your need, only, and I would say
for most of us, we should really only care about our niche, our audience, whether or
not you're able to make an impact on them.
So yeah, it's possible, probably not to do the Kardashian scale, but yeah.
But who wants that anyway?
I like that idea in the way that you said that, because yes, it's so important that
if you're, in fact, if you're, if you're trying to reach your people, the people that
actually need to hear your message, it sounds like using AI is a great way to actually make
that happen.
You're getting the messages to the people that actually need to hear it.
And one of the things that, that keeps coming through in this is how important it is to
have your authentic message.
And that's why I like the idea of basically focusing on AI and post is because then you're
making sure it's still your words.
It's still your authentic voice.
It's still you.
You're just using a little bit of help to streamline that process.
Clean out the cobwebs.
Yeah, exactly.
Clean out the cobwebs.
Yes.
That's awesome.
Well, everything that you've talked about has just been awesome and I love everything
you've said, but I have to ask you, is there anything that I haven't asked you that you
think that we need to cover in AI and podcasting that you really want to make sure we put in
this episode?
Not.
I don't think so.
I'm happy to just go with the conversation leads us.
Yeah, that's always a really hard question for me to answer.
No, but if there's anything else that you want to talk about, I'm totally happy to talk
about that too.
Okay.
Well, then since we're already giving you complicated questions, I got to ask you my,
I guess I guess it would be my, my Barbara Walters question.
What is one question I didn't ask you, you really wish I had it could be on anything
doesn't even have to be podcasting related.
Hmm, that I wish you had.
I also don't really have, yeah, yeah, I'm, yeah, no, I, I'm good.
I mean, you can ask me a Barbara Walters question, I'd be like, what's your deepest darkest
hidden views?
But no, I, I actually, no, I think I, this was a lot of fun.
What was it talking about?
Yeah.
Yeah, since we've talked about your podcast a few times, you haven't actually name dropped
it.
What's your podcast?
Yeah, well, it's called grow my podcast show.
Um, essentially it's, it's what it is.
It's like that I talk to a lot of experts on, you know, what they've, um, they've done to
grow their show.
So we talk a lot of strategies, a lot of tactics.
I also do.
So, um, we had, for example, Alexey, um, from Voxelize on and he was talking about podcast
visibility optimization.
And then the next episode, we spoke about what it is that we've done based on that.
What do we do?
What, um, changes that we make and what results do we get?
Uh, so it's also one of those podcasts where we're doing it alongside, uh, our listeners
and our audience as well, which is super cool.
So grow my podcast show, definitely go check it out.
I also talk about the traffic pyramid.
I talk about content tripping strategy.
I talk about like everything on this.
With the wildest strategy you've heard.
Oh, okay.
So one of our catchovians, um, J.S.
Barris, so I had him on and he was, he, he, he's brain just thinks very differently, but
he was saying that since using CAPSHO he, um, for his, his episodes, he's gone from
single digit downloads to like over 22,000 downloads.
And I'm like, what, okay, you've got it.
What did you do?
Yeah.
And so he was saying one of the novel, I mean, he does multiple novel things, but one of
the novel things that he does is he actually uses, um, like the social media, um, function
of CAPSHO, um, to help him come up with the content and then he'll put it on Snapchat.
Actually.
So this is a very, I mean, snap, like, is that still a thing?
But anyway, he didn't know it was.
Wow.
Yeah.
So he puts it on Snapchat, but then he does this, um, geo, um, locating thing.
So he'll, he'll actually push it out in like, he'll target it to like his location.
And then from there, cause I'm not a user Snapchat.
So I'm going to do this totally a disservice, um, his strategy, but then there's, um, something
can, where then people in that location share it as well.
There's something that happens.
I don't know.
So they share.
And so before you know it, it's like kind of just gone out to like thousands and thousands
and tens of thousands of people, um, because it's just a nice thing.
It's, it's really weird.
Anyway, you'll have to listen to that episode.
We've just, yeah, well, I'll have to look for it and put it in those show notes.
Cause I mean, we're all looking for the upper edge.
So let's, let's just be honest.
We're all trying to figure out how can we get more downloads.
Yes.
Yeah.
And more attention.
Yes.
But yeah, definitely that.
But also definitely listen to the episode that, um, we did on podcast visibility optimization,
because that is a very, there's a sound sound, um, data backed strategies that everyone,
like literally everyone should be doing.
So yeah, that's a good thing.
So unfortunately it sounds like what you're saying is podcasting is not like field of
dreams.
Yeah.
And yeah, I know.
I wish it can't, you can't build it and they will come.
Yeah.
No, no.
Unfortunately, like nothing in my experience in like is that way, which is, yes, it's a
bit of a bummer, isn't it?
Yeah.
But at the same time, the good thing about it is if you do build your foundation and
you're pyramid in the right way, it sounds like you're going to at least find the people
that you need to be finding.
So speaking of finding, where else can we find you online?
Yeah.
So, um, I guess the biggest thing if anyone who was listening about capture and they're
like, oh my gosh, I've got to try this amazing software, which you do.
Um, then what we've done is we've actually packed packaged up a, um, extended free trial
capture, but with some really cool bonuses.
Um, I spoken about visibility and discoverability.
So I've actually got a free audio mini course for each of those.
So how can you actually get yourself discovered inside podcast apps, inside, um, and on search
and also how do you get yourselves, yourself visible on social media?
Um, so those are some free bonus audio mini courses that come with the extended free
trial capture.
And that's at free gift.capture.com.
Awesome.
That is fantastic.
Well, Jodra, I want to thank you again for, for being here with us.
I mean, we've shared a lot of amazing stuff and I definitely have some notes that I'm
going to be going over and seeing what else I can learn about the whole AI and podcasting
thing.
But I guess if they don't take over the world, we'll try to have you on the show again and
we'll follow up on this and see what else happened and what other ideas you have.
But, uh, but yeah, I think this was great.
Thank you so much.
And next time I'll send my AI robot to have these.
I think that's coming.
I think that I'll see that very soon.
Thanks again.
Well, my fellow podcasters, we hope you enjoyed the insights, tips and ideas shared in this
episode.
To learn more about launching and growing your own show, head over to rss.com backslash
blog.
And if you're ready to launch a podcast of your own, you can get started for free with
your first episode on us.
Thanks for tuning in.