1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:09,600 Welcome to the Azure Security Podcast where we discuss topics relating to security, privacy, 2 00:00:09,600 --> 00:00:14,040 reliability and compliance on the Microsoft Cloud Platform. 3 00:00:14,040 --> 00:00:16,000 Everybody welcome to Episode 34. 4 00:00:16,000 --> 00:00:19,280 This is a slightly different episode than our normal episodes. 5 00:00:19,280 --> 00:00:27,040 This one is focused on exams and certification and security on the various Microsoft platforms. 6 00:00:27,040 --> 00:00:29,440 Normally we'd have the whole gang here but we don't this week. 7 00:00:29,440 --> 00:00:33,920 It's just myself, Eurydia Janus and Sarah's here. 8 00:00:33,920 --> 00:00:35,400 We're also going to have no news. 9 00:00:35,400 --> 00:00:39,960 We're here just to talk about one topic which is certification and exams. 10 00:00:39,960 --> 00:00:42,680 And there's a good reason for it. 11 00:00:42,680 --> 00:00:48,720 Basically Sarah and Eury have got a book coming out which is a study guide for the SC200. 12 00:00:48,720 --> 00:00:56,560 So before we get stuck into the book, Sarah why don't you explain briefly what SC200 actually is? 13 00:00:56,560 --> 00:01:00,720 Sure. So we have mentioned it on some previous episodes of the podcast. 14 00:01:00,720 --> 00:01:07,760 But SC200 is the Microsoft Security Operations Analyst exam. 15 00:01:07,760 --> 00:01:11,440 It came out a few months ago now. 16 00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:15,360 It was in beta for a little bit. 17 00:01:15,360 --> 00:01:22,000 I think end of April it came out as a fully fledged, real and inverted commas exam. 18 00:01:22,000 --> 00:01:32,560 And it's an exam that measures proficiency across Azure Sentinel, Azure Defender and Microsoft Defender. 19 00:01:32,560 --> 00:01:38,880 There are a couple of other Microsoft exams that have come out alongside it as well. 20 00:01:38,880 --> 00:01:42,560 But we'll stick with my baby SC200 today. 21 00:01:42,560 --> 00:01:48,720 So Eury, there are other exams as well or other certifications that are available. 22 00:01:48,720 --> 00:01:54,000 So another one is SC900. So how does that compare and contrast with SC200? 23 00:01:54,000 --> 00:02:01,440 So the 900 is more around the entire Microsoft Secure Solutions and Compliance. 24 00:02:01,440 --> 00:02:06,560 It's more basic if you think about SC200 is way more advanced. 25 00:02:06,560 --> 00:02:12,000 So if you think about taking the exam, the order that you should take is definitely SC900 first. 26 00:02:12,000 --> 00:02:16,000 Because it will give you a good foundation of terminologies. 27 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:20,240 There is a lot of terminology that you need to be aware. It talks about zero trust. 28 00:02:20,240 --> 00:02:28,080 It talks about very basic concepts that you need to know in order to, when you move on to SC200, 29 00:02:28,080 --> 00:02:31,760 you will not spend time understanding terminologies. 30 00:02:31,760 --> 00:02:36,000 So it's a good way to get started going through those. 31 00:02:36,000 --> 00:02:38,560 It's very massive as far as content. 32 00:02:38,560 --> 00:02:41,920 It goes all over the place because it covers Azure AD. 33 00:02:41,920 --> 00:02:45,280 It talks a little bit about Azure Defender. 34 00:02:45,280 --> 00:02:51,840 It talks a little bit about Sentinel, but all like 100, not more than 200 level. 35 00:02:51,840 --> 00:02:57,280 While SC200 goes up to 311, even for some areas. 36 00:02:57,280 --> 00:02:59,840 So it's way more advanced. 37 00:02:59,840 --> 00:03:03,680 So I know we've spoken about this, but one thing that I've been doing over the last few months 38 00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:09,520 is trying to take all the 900 level exams available on Azure. 39 00:03:09,520 --> 00:03:14,480 So for example, a few months ago, I did the DP900, which is database technologies. 40 00:03:14,480 --> 00:03:16,160 That was actually really cool. 41 00:03:16,160 --> 00:03:21,280 I enjoyed taking it. I got a 970 on it. 42 00:03:21,280 --> 00:03:25,280 But the reason why I enjoyed taking it and the reason why I want to take all the 900, 43 00:03:25,280 --> 00:03:29,680 and I will take the SC900 because Sarah told me to take it. 44 00:03:29,680 --> 00:03:33,600 But the main reason why I want to take them is because I think there's another one for 45 00:03:33,600 --> 00:03:38,320 like the Power Platform. There's an AI 900 and there's a couple of others. 46 00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:43,280 But the reason why I want to take them is to make sure that I have a broad coverage 47 00:03:43,280 --> 00:03:46,720 of technologies that I may not actually use on a day-to-day basis. 48 00:03:46,720 --> 00:03:50,160 So for example, I don't use the Power Platform on a day-to-day basis. 49 00:03:50,160 --> 00:03:53,520 I mean, I kind of do, but I don't really use it in anger. 50 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:58,160 It's mainly just sort of helping people out with some of their security questions. 51 00:03:58,160 --> 00:03:59,440 And that's kind of it. 52 00:03:59,440 --> 00:04:04,560 And to be frank, I don't understand a lot of the Power Platform nomenclature and a lot of the wording. 53 00:04:04,560 --> 00:04:09,760 So if nothing else, the 900 exams personally will just give me a good, 54 00:04:09,760 --> 00:04:14,480 broad understanding of what these different technologies are capable of 55 00:04:14,480 --> 00:04:16,800 and what their terminology is. 56 00:04:16,800 --> 00:04:21,120 So I know both of you probably got an opinion on this, but in my humble opinion, 57 00:04:21,120 --> 00:04:26,160 I think everyone who is designing and building anything on Azure really should be looking at 58 00:04:26,160 --> 00:04:30,480 SC900, at least as a starting point. Is that a fair comment? 59 00:04:30,480 --> 00:04:36,880 Yeah, yeah. Because as you said, it covers a vast scope. 60 00:04:36,880 --> 00:04:43,680 For example, in SC900, COVID data classification, data loss prevention, sensitive labels. 61 00:04:43,680 --> 00:04:48,720 So areas that you might not go there every day if you are, for example, dedicated to 62 00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:55,280 Azure Defender or dedicated to Sentinel, but are things that are important for you to be aware 63 00:04:55,280 --> 00:04:59,440 they are there. So I think it's a very good foundational exam. 64 00:05:00,080 --> 00:05:05,040 When you look at the outline, you may think it's extremely massive and you may think, 65 00:05:05,040 --> 00:05:09,600 how I'm going to learn all that, but don't overthink. It's not deep. 66 00:05:10,560 --> 00:05:17,840 The level of questions that the exam offers, I know that's because I also co-authored the SC900 67 00:05:17,840 --> 00:05:22,960 with other folks and it's coming out as well. It's already a bit of a pre-order. 68 00:05:23,520 --> 00:05:30,000 But we had to many times step back and remove things from the book because we were going too deep 69 00:05:30,000 --> 00:05:33,920 and it was like, no, no, we need to remove that because this is not necessary. 70 00:05:33,920 --> 00:05:39,200 We just need to stick 100 level, 200 level at most in some topics. 71 00:05:40,880 --> 00:05:46,560 Yeah, I like to think of them as these 900 exams as just being sort of a mile wide and an inch deep. 72 00:05:47,600 --> 00:05:51,760 It's going to give you a broad exposure to the technologies without understanding necessarily 73 00:05:51,760 --> 00:05:55,120 how absolutely everything works in those various techniques and technologies. 74 00:05:55,760 --> 00:05:58,800 So what's your opinion on SC900 as a starting point? 75 00:05:58,800 --> 00:06:05,360 I think it's a good starting point. All the 900 exams are a good place to start. 76 00:06:05,360 --> 00:06:11,840 And certainly there's a lot, it's quite broad, but it's definitely a good way of gauging kind of 77 00:06:11,840 --> 00:06:20,320 where your Azure security knowledge is at as well. And just to give you, you can have that tick to 78 00:06:20,320 --> 00:06:26,080 say, hey, I actually did this and I have a good foundational knowledge. I mean, it's very easy 79 00:06:26,080 --> 00:06:31,920 for us to who work in Microsoft and live and breathe all the products every day, but not 80 00:06:31,920 --> 00:06:38,560 everybody does that. So definitely I think it's a good way to make sure that you, to measure 81 00:06:38,560 --> 00:06:46,160 yourself against the whole suite of Microsoft security things. And of course, there are lots of 82 00:06:46,160 --> 00:06:52,960 people, security became cool, didn't it? A few years ago, maybe four, five years ago, security 83 00:06:52,960 --> 00:06:58,320 became cool. And there's tons of people trying to break into the industry. I talked to lots of 84 00:06:58,320 --> 00:07:04,000 students and other people who might be doing career changes. And I think these foundational 85 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:11,760 certificates, Azure security, et cetera, any of the 900 level exams is a really good way to 86 00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:16,400 prove that you're keen if you're trying to break into the industry as well. 87 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:21,520 Because I know there are plenty of people out there who do want to. 88 00:07:21,520 --> 00:07:22,080 Thank you. 89 00:07:22,960 --> 00:07:26,400 Actually, you bring up an interesting point there. I was speaking to my nephew in New Zealand 90 00:07:27,520 --> 00:07:32,400 this about a year ago, and he was looking at sort of moving on to, he basically does 91 00:07:33,120 --> 00:07:39,360 Windows server support for a city government. And I'm like, you know, you really should be 92 00:07:39,360 --> 00:07:44,160 looking at spreading your wings a little bit. And I said, you know, this cloud thing, this cloud 93 00:07:44,160 --> 00:07:50,080 thing is going to be big. You heard it here first. And so one of the things I suggest that he does is, 94 00:07:50,080 --> 00:07:54,160 you know, get first of all, get a free Azure subscription and then look at some of the 900 95 00:07:54,160 --> 00:08:00,880 exams, right? Just to force you to learn certain parts of the environment. So yeah, I think we 96 00:08:00,880 --> 00:08:06,400 all agree. SC900 is probably a really good starting point, a mile wide inch deep, but at least it 97 00:08:06,400 --> 00:08:13,280 will expose you to the various controls and technologies around security compliance and 98 00:08:13,280 --> 00:08:19,840 identity that we have in Azure. And I will say that is a little bit even beyond Azure, because if 99 00:08:19,840 --> 00:08:25,840 if you go for example, for the first domain, because the outline is dividing domain, the first 100 00:08:25,840 --> 00:08:33,600 domain talks about some concepts that are almost vendor neutral, such as share responsibility model, 101 00:08:34,800 --> 00:08:40,640 defense in death, right? Things that you talk about on your SDL book back in 2006, right? But 102 00:08:40,640 --> 00:08:47,040 it's still being used today, but in a cloud model, right? So there are a lot of key concepts that 103 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:52,800 are covered in this exam as well. Actually, it's funny, you should bring that up. One of the 104 00:08:52,800 --> 00:09:00,000 certifications that I'm looking at doing is actually an AWS certification. You know, 105 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:04,000 because a lot of customers that I deal with it, I know you folks are the same. You know, 106 00:09:04,000 --> 00:09:09,120 you deal with a lot of customers and they're, you know, they're multi cloud and it's not just 107 00:09:09,120 --> 00:09:14,400 Azure. And sometimes you need to understand again, what the terminology is that's used in 108 00:09:14,400 --> 00:09:19,360 different cloud platforms. So I'm actually going to take the, you know, essentially the AWS equivalent 109 00:09:19,360 --> 00:09:26,880 of AZ 900, which is our sort of foundational Azure certification. So yeah, I'm doing the same, 110 00:09:26,880 --> 00:09:33,040 but you know, across other platforms as well. So while we're talking about SC 900, 111 00:09:34,080 --> 00:09:39,280 and we're talking about SC 200 just briefly, so what are the major topics that are in SC 200? 112 00:09:39,280 --> 00:09:46,480 What are the major areas? So the exam is dividing three domains and they work 113 00:09:46,480 --> 00:09:53,840 pretty good. Can I also mix a little bit about the book, how we did it? Yeah, because we did, 114 00:09:53,840 --> 00:10:01,440 we have three authors in this book and we divide on each domain per author. So Sarah got the entire 115 00:10:01,440 --> 00:10:07,760 Sentinel part of it, her specialty where she focused for the most part. So she wrote the entire 116 00:10:07,760 --> 00:10:13,840 Sentinel part. I wrote the entire Azure defender part. And then we have Jake from our Microsoft 117 00:10:13,840 --> 00:10:19,520 Defender for endpoint team, writing the Microsoft 365 defender. So it's three domains, 118 00:10:21,120 --> 00:10:25,360 where it covers Microsoft Defender for endpoint Microsoft 365 Defender as a whole. 119 00:10:26,000 --> 00:10:31,600 And then Azure Defender and then Sentinel is a very well structured exam, to be honest. 120 00:10:31,600 --> 00:10:40,720 It's, we had a small update that was released July 23rd on the exam. That's why our book got a 121 00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:44,720 little delay because we have to do some minor audacious estimates, but it's really minor. 122 00:10:46,080 --> 00:10:50,560 So the entire structure of the exam is basically the same in the topics as well. 123 00:10:52,480 --> 00:10:56,720 Sarah, you have any thoughts there? I mean, obviously you had to write about your baby. 124 00:10:56,720 --> 00:11:04,880 I did write about my baby. And unlike yourself and Yuri, this was the first time I have written a book. 125 00:11:05,600 --> 00:11:13,280 And yeah, it was an interesting and fun experience. And now I can say I'm a published 126 00:11:13,280 --> 00:11:18,640 author or I will be able to in a couple of months, which is quite cool. But yes, I did get to write 127 00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:25,360 about my baby. And because my baby is still relatively new, there's not too many books out there. 128 00:11:25,360 --> 00:11:32,240 So hopefully people find it useful and it makes sense. You can tell I have a little bit of imposter 129 00:11:32,240 --> 00:11:38,320 syndrome still because I am not an experienced author like you two gentlemen, but it was fun. 130 00:11:38,320 --> 00:11:44,320 And I genuinely do hope people find it useful because Sentinel being a pretty new product, 131 00:11:44,320 --> 00:11:50,160 it is, you know, there's not as much material out there as like, oh, for other things. So, 132 00:11:50,160 --> 00:11:54,880 you know, hopefully, whether you're taking the exam or you just want to know more about Sentinel, 133 00:11:54,880 --> 00:12:00,640 I hope it's actually useful for people because it's quite comprehensive everything that we go 134 00:12:00,640 --> 00:12:06,560 through, you know, from considerations for setting up a workspace to analytics rules to doing some 135 00:12:06,560 --> 00:12:11,360 logic apps, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You know, there's a lot of stuff in there. I mean, 136 00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:18,000 that took me a good solid two months of my spare time to write. But yeah, it was a good 137 00:12:18,000 --> 00:12:22,720 it was a good experience. And yeah, I'm looking forward to having a book that I can say I wrote 138 00:12:22,720 --> 00:12:28,720 and taking my picture with it and sending it to grandma. Right. That's what you do. Yeah, yeah, 139 00:12:28,720 --> 00:12:36,560 exactly. And then just one thing to add, I think Sarah also covered a lot of QKL as well, because 140 00:12:36,560 --> 00:12:44,960 there are QKL questions on the exam. So the book, the set, the entire domain that Sarah wrote also 141 00:12:44,960 --> 00:12:53,520 has some examples of QKL. Oh, yeah. KQL is a KQL is just a bit of a beast in itself. You could 142 00:12:53,520 --> 00:13:00,400 probably write a whole book on KQL. And so yeah, I mean, in my section, I talk about some of the 143 00:13:00,400 --> 00:13:07,920 operators and some examples of the, you know, the KQL that you would need to typically write 144 00:13:07,920 --> 00:13:13,440 Sentinel queries. But of course, one of the great things about Sentinel, and I mean, I must 145 00:13:13,440 --> 00:13:18,640 have this discussion with customers every day. One of the great things about Sentinel is that we 146 00:13:18,640 --> 00:13:25,840 have a lot of pre-populated things to get you going. But the possibilities of what you want to 147 00:13:25,840 --> 00:13:30,400 detect on and your queries and what you want to search for are pretty much endless. And, you know, 148 00:13:30,400 --> 00:13:35,840 it depends on each business, what products they have, what security things are important to them. 149 00:13:35,840 --> 00:13:43,040 So, so yeah, it's a bit of a beast, bit of a bit of a beast, but hopefully it will get people 150 00:13:43,040 --> 00:13:51,040 started. So, you know, the building blocks to make your own KQL things. Yeah. And then the people 151 00:13:51,040 --> 00:13:57,200 who are usually asked, do I need to know that for the exam? I will say, you should know. And you 152 00:13:57,200 --> 00:14:02,800 should mainly know the operators and the syntax, because there will be questions 153 00:14:02,800 --> 00:14:10,480 that you see the entire query, and you're going to have to select an option that we 154 00:14:11,120 --> 00:14:16,000 actually make that query to work. If you select the wrong option, the query is not going to work. 155 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:20,800 So that's a cool thing about this exam is that it's almost like they have practical 156 00:14:21,440 --> 00:14:25,200 questions. You don't have to type because the query is there, but you have to select the right 157 00:14:25,200 --> 00:14:32,080 operator to make sure that that query is going to run. Yeah, I'm a huge Custer KQL fan, but like 158 00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:38,000 you say, Sarah, it's almost like an endless technology, right? There's so much you can do, 159 00:14:38,000 --> 00:14:43,520 there's essentially like full-fledged query language in every possible way. 160 00:14:44,640 --> 00:14:49,280 So one other topic I just want to touch on real quick about SC200 is, from my perspective, 161 00:14:49,280 --> 00:14:54,560 know my background. To be frank, I think I may actually struggle with that exam. My background 162 00:14:54,560 --> 00:15:00,240 is more about security design, security development, security deployment, least privilege, cryptography, 163 00:15:00,240 --> 00:15:06,000 key management, key lifecycle, that kind of stuff. And so this is probably an area where I'm not 164 00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:09,600 going to say I'm going to struggle, but I've probably got a lot more to learn than say you two 165 00:15:09,600 --> 00:15:14,720 if I was to take this exam. I mean, I'll take SC900 just so Sarah doesn't yell at me or laugh at me, 166 00:15:15,360 --> 00:15:19,920 but SC200 may actually be a bit of a stretch for me because it's just not my background. 167 00:15:19,920 --> 00:15:24,240 And that's why we have on the podcast, we have people with different skill sets. On purpose is 168 00:15:24,240 --> 00:15:30,640 because security is such a massive area and obviously operations is also a critically 169 00:15:30,640 --> 00:15:37,840 important area as well, but it's not an area that I really am exposed to much. So we've covered SC200 170 00:15:37,840 --> 00:15:45,280 and SC900. Let's talk about the gorilla in the room, which is AZ500. So Sarah and I, we actually 171 00:15:45,280 --> 00:15:50,160 took it the same week and we didn't even realize that we'd both taken the exam the same week. 172 00:15:50,160 --> 00:15:56,640 We both passed. I'm going to be honest with you, I squeaked in. It's a difficult exam. It is a 173 00:15:56,640 --> 00:16:02,000 difficult exam. It's got a lot of moving parts, a lot of technology. And basically what it does is 174 00:16:02,000 --> 00:16:08,800 it focuses on, as it mentions, Azure security technology. So for example, Key Vault, actually 175 00:16:08,800 --> 00:16:16,480 the Key Vault stuff was easy. PIM, privileged identity management, RBAC controls, network 176 00:16:16,480 --> 00:16:24,720 isolation, network security groups, configuration settings for various Azure services. I mean, 177 00:16:24,720 --> 00:16:30,640 it's not just wide, it is deep as well. And I don't know about you guys, but I found AZ500 178 00:16:31,200 --> 00:16:39,360 a real struggle. It was a hard exam. It is a hard exam. And I wrote that one with Ory and Thomas. 179 00:16:39,360 --> 00:16:47,040 And it was even hard to cover everything on the level of depth that was necessary for the exam. 180 00:16:48,320 --> 00:16:54,640 It's very broad. And there is also a lot of considerations, right? Which option is the best 181 00:16:54,640 --> 00:16:59,920 one? So there is a lot of design questions, which is something that the AC200 does not have. So 182 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:07,360 the AZ500 is not only about the technology, but about how to design the best solution based on 183 00:17:07,360 --> 00:17:14,000 the different options that the technology offers. And that's tricky many times, because if you do 184 00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:18,000 not pay attention to the scenarios, you might select the wrong option. 185 00:17:20,000 --> 00:17:24,160 Yeah. And that's why I'm kind of happy that the AC900 exists. Because if people are sort of dipping 186 00:17:24,160 --> 00:17:29,360 their toes in Azure security, I mean, AZ500 is just going to have people screaming for the hills. 187 00:17:29,920 --> 00:17:35,360 Whereas AC900 is a really nice, gentle introduction to, like you say, as you mentioned, 188 00:17:35,360 --> 00:17:41,440 Uri, not just Azure security compliance and identity. It is Azure security compliance, 189 00:17:42,240 --> 00:17:46,080 and the identity fundamentals in the cloud. It's not just Microsoft. So I think that's a, 190 00:17:46,640 --> 00:17:51,760 if someone wants to get into security, then I think AC900 is a really great entry point. 191 00:17:51,760 --> 00:17:59,920 AZ500 will just have you running away terrified. So also, Uri, you mentioned earlier before we 192 00:17:59,920 --> 00:18:05,680 started this, there's also an identity exam as well. And one thing I want to make sure everyone 193 00:18:05,680 --> 00:18:11,840 understands, identity is not security. I mean, obviously, they overlap in some areas, 194 00:18:11,840 --> 00:18:18,160 but they are quite a different set of skills. And I think someone who's a security generalist 195 00:18:18,160 --> 00:18:23,200 needs to understand at least the basics of identity as well. So that's another option as well. 196 00:18:23,200 --> 00:18:32,080 Yeah, that's the AC300, Microsoft Identity and Access Administrator, which will cover basically 197 00:18:32,080 --> 00:18:39,520 identity management solutions, authentication, access management, access management for apps, 198 00:18:39,520 --> 00:18:44,800 identity governance. So it's very heavily on the identity solution. 199 00:18:45,520 --> 00:18:50,480 Do both of you want to just chime in quickly about the book, when it will be available, 200 00:18:50,480 --> 00:18:56,000 roughly how big is it, let's somehow be interested in. Yeah, and can it be pre-ordered? And if so, 201 00:18:56,000 --> 00:19:04,160 where? It can be pre-ordered on Amazon or on MicrosoftPressStore.com. It's available in both 202 00:19:04,160 --> 00:19:12,000 places right now to pre-order. The last date that I got from Microsoft Press is that it's going to, 203 00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:19,120 whoever order is going to be receiving in October. Because, I mean, Sarah, I and Jake, 204 00:19:19,120 --> 00:19:26,480 we've done reviewing, we already reviewed even the final PDF. But now that is the post-production 205 00:19:27,120 --> 00:19:34,800 and then send it over to the printer. And so it takes a little time, but it should be out in October. 206 00:19:36,160 --> 00:19:40,640 Very nice. I just had a little story about the very first book that ever wrote back in the day, 207 00:19:40,640 --> 00:19:45,520 which was designing secure web applications for Windows 2000. That was the IIS security 208 00:19:45,520 --> 00:19:51,600 PM at the time, program manager at the time. And I wrote, you know, I started writing this book 209 00:19:51,600 --> 00:19:56,640 and wrote the first chapter. And I thought, man, you know, this is fantastic prose. You know, this 210 00:19:56,640 --> 00:20:02,640 is worthy of a Pulitzer Prize. And it's sent it to the editor and a guy called Devin Musgrave. 211 00:20:03,200 --> 00:20:07,600 Fantastic guy. Oh, I work with him the best. Yeah, I know him. He sends it back to me and, 212 00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:13,680 oh my God, it looked like a blood bath. I mean, I very quickly learned about passive voice. I very 213 00:20:13,680 --> 00:20:20,960 quickly learned about who is the subject. Oh my God, I learned so quickly about just basic grammar. 214 00:20:21,920 --> 00:20:26,240 Yeah, I thought I was really, really good at writing. It turns out I was pretty much sucked. 215 00:20:26,880 --> 00:20:30,560 But anyway, let me ask you something just, Sarah, what did you think about the experience, 216 00:20:30,560 --> 00:20:34,560 Sarah, of the tech review? It was okay. Do you like it? 217 00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:42,000 Yeah, you know what? Because, well, as you well know, Yuri, we have tech review, and then we have 218 00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:49,120 like the editorial review for the quality of English. Now, do you know what? The tech review, 219 00:20:49,120 --> 00:20:57,120 well, the tech review was done by both of our boss, Nick. And do you know what really, the tech 220 00:20:57,120 --> 00:21:03,200 review just annoyed me because I made some really dumb, there was a couple of things where I was 221 00:21:03,200 --> 00:21:07,920 like, yeah, that's wrong. As soon as Nick pointed it out, I was like, why have I written this? 222 00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:16,560 And I was like, oh my God, that's quite embarrassing. There were a couple of those. 223 00:21:16,560 --> 00:21:24,880 For me, the tech review was fine. I think there was only one point where probably we had to agree 224 00:21:24,880 --> 00:21:37,520 to disagree. But for the review in terms of the quality of the English, now, I always fancied 225 00:21:37,520 --> 00:21:43,680 myself as a pretty decent writer. And I can't compare of course with Michael or maybe your first 226 00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:51,760 attempt, Yuri. But I think most, it wasn't that bad. And so I was like, cool, maybe I am as good 227 00:21:51,760 --> 00:21:59,840 as I thought I was. Or maybe I'm not. But I didn't have change it. Yeah, it was an interesting 228 00:21:59,840 --> 00:22:05,600 experience. And of course, because it is my first go at something like this, I was like fully 229 00:22:05,600 --> 00:22:10,880 prepared for it to be absolutely covered in in markups and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, 230 00:22:10,880 --> 00:22:18,160 exactly like you, Michael. But it wasn't too bad. I feel like I feel like my my English teacher 231 00:22:18,160 --> 00:22:24,560 at school would be relatively proud of me. And I did do an arts degree. So I did just write essays 232 00:22:24,560 --> 00:22:30,640 for three years. So this is one of those rare occasions when my tertiary education comes in 233 00:22:30,640 --> 00:22:35,120 handy. You know, it's funny to say that I only scraped through English in my last year of high 234 00:22:35,120 --> 00:22:40,080 school in New Zealand because the book for English was Lord of the Rings. And I actually 235 00:22:40,080 --> 00:22:46,400 knew more about Lord of the Rings than the actual teacher. But anyway, so one of the little 236 00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:52,000 interesting sort of facts is when David LeBlanc and I were writing Runny Secure Code, the second 237 00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:59,680 edition, the crypto chapter, which was 48 pages long, I actually wrote it in one in one sitting. 238 00:22:59,680 --> 00:23:06,640 And it was the the chapter that came back from Devon with the least number of edits. 239 00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:13,040 So even though I was exhausted at the end of it, it was just like this flow of consciousness being 240 00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:18,000 put down in words. So there's something to be said for just working, you know, working nonstop 241 00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:24,400 to get something done. So let's wrap this up. Do either of you have any final thoughts on 242 00:23:24,400 --> 00:23:31,600 any of our exams, but most notably the book and SE200? I guess I'll just add, because we talked 243 00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:36,960 about where you can get the book. But if you're not in the US, because of course there's Amazon 244 00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:44,960 and Microsoft Press, but if you're not in the US, and not all of those places deliver everywhere, 245 00:23:45,520 --> 00:23:52,880 I've had a look online, so places like book depository, even some of the like all the local 246 00:23:52,880 --> 00:23:59,120 book shops, the way you might go to look for it if you're not in the US should have it for pre-order 247 00:23:59,120 --> 00:24:04,960 as well. I mean, I personally use book depository a lot that have free shipping worldwide, and you 248 00:24:04,960 --> 00:24:10,320 can pre-order it on there too. Just thought I'd mention that just for anyone listening who is not 249 00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:17,680 US based. Yeah, that's a good point. And also, since I always receive this question, I just want to 250 00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:24,160 emphasize because a lot of friends from Brazil, I'm originally from Brazil, they ask, are we going 251 00:24:24,160 --> 00:24:30,640 to have a Portuguese version of the book? And the chances are almost zero that we are going to localize 252 00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:39,760 the book. So it'll be English only. I mean, is the exam available in Portuguese? Most of the 253 00:24:39,760 --> 00:24:49,840 exams are localized nowadays. But the book, it's really rare, is going to be localized based on 254 00:24:49,840 --> 00:24:57,520 nowadays policy. Well, Yuri, Sarah, thank you so much for dropping by this week. Although, 255 00:24:58,160 --> 00:25:01,760 not sure why I'm saying that with Sarah because I get to see Sarah every couple of weeks 256 00:25:01,760 --> 00:25:08,560 to do the Azure Security podcast. But thanks again. I think as much as I hate to say, I'll probably 257 00:25:08,560 --> 00:25:14,000 end up trying to take SE 200 as well, even though it's way outside of my field of comfort. I will 258 00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:22,240 definitely do SE 900 just so that Sarah doesn't really kill me. And the other thing is, if in 259 00:25:22,240 --> 00:25:29,840 2022 we are back to in-person conference, make sure to follow Sarah, myself, and see where we're 260 00:25:29,840 --> 00:25:35,040 going to speak because we definitely want to do book signing sessions next year. Right, Sarah? 261 00:25:35,040 --> 00:25:41,520 Oh, I've never done one of those. Yes, I do. That would be kind of cool and make me feel like more 262 00:25:41,520 --> 00:25:48,720 important than I really am. But no. Oh, I never even thought of that, Yuri. How cool. Yeah, that's 263 00:25:48,720 --> 00:25:56,960 cool. You're so easily entertained, aren't you, Sarah? I am. Small things, small minds, you know. 264 00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:02,720 Let's bring us to a close. Again, thank you, Yuri. Thank you, Sarah. Best of luck with the book. 265 00:26:02,720 --> 00:26:08,080 Again, I'll take the exam as well. I'll buy the book, I promise. And to all of you out there, 266 00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:11,840 thank you so much for listening. Stay safe, and we'll see you next time. Thanks for listening 267 00:26:11,840 --> 00:26:17,600 to the Azure Security Podcast. You can find show notes and other resources at our website, 268 00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:24,400 azsecuritypodcast.net. If you have any questions, please find us on Twitter at Azure SecPod. 269 00:26:24,400 --> 00:26:37,520 Background music is from ccmixter.com and licensed under the Creative Commons license.