In episode 221 of the GTO on 5G, it's the latest
Insight Scoop on everything 5G. We cover six
topics in about 20 minutes, and it's brought
to you by More Insights and Strategy. I'm Will
Townsend, and joining me again this week is fellow
analyst Anshul Saag. Let's get started with my
first topic, and I've got a couple related to
AT &T. This first one is around an announcement
between AT &T and Celona for neutral hosts. Celona
is a private cellular networking company that
I've followed. since nearly its inception. And
there's been a lot of dialogue back and forth
on the viability of neutral host and the monetization.
Last year, Solona announced a partnership with
T -Mobile. around neutral host. And so this announcement
this week follows that with AT &T. From my perspective,
when you look at, and it's not necessarily just
venues, I mean, that's been really the focus
for neutral host from my perspective, but it's
really in buildings and in deployment scenarios
where it's economically not viable to densify
with Wi -Fi access points is when a neutral host
solution. can really be advantageous to boost
indoor cellular performance. But getting back
to venues, DAS solutions tend to be very expensive.
And you've got Greenfield, you've got Brownfield
considerations there. What I like about what
Salon is doing is it can supplement DAS and very
large sporting venues and concert venues and
that sort of thing. But then at the same time,
it can provide a very economically viable alternative
when densifying with Wi -Fi access points just
isn't feasible. With this announcement, Stanford
Healthcare was also highlighted as a use case.
So they're deploying private networking in a
neutral host. solution to deliver point of care.
And in fact, the Salona management team is going
to afford me the opportunity to speak with them.
And I'm hoping to write a research note or an
analyst insight on our website in the near future.
But what do you think about all that? I think
Salona is definitely like the leader in this
space. I didn't really know that they did a lot
of neutral host stuff. Fairly new. Like I said,
T -Mobile was the first announcement last year.
Yeah, because I knew that they did a lot of like,
private 5G networks for stadiums. I think they
even built one, helped build one out here in
San Diego. But yeah, it seems it's really about
providing like a secondary infrastructure that
can coexist with other infrastructure. And in
general, it seems they're on a roll with anything
that they do. And it also seems like they're
very focused, which I think is part of their
success. And I just think that Solana signing
a pretty big deal with AT &T is a major step
forward for them in this area. Yeah, no, I totally
agree. And by the way, it's also supporting AT
&T FirstNet as well. And just a final few points
before we move to your first topic. What I like
about their infrastructure, it's a complete end
-to -end solution. So they provide core and radio
and a software layer. They offer microsegmentation,
which is akin to network slicing as well. And
what I also like about their radio infrastructure
is that it supports both LTE and 5G. So there's
a lot of flexibility there. There are a lot of
use cases that leverage LTE, but then if a company
starts with LTE and they want to move to 5G,
it's simply, it's a software upgrade. provides
a tremendous amount of flexibility. It is CBRS,
right? So I need to state that. So it's not an
end -all be -all replacement. It's an augmentation
to your point to supplement connectivity in areas
like, think about in a hospital that's very dense
with metal and medical metal equipment and that
sort of thing, basements and that sort of thing.
And it's a solution where customers can start
small, see how they like it. and then they can
broaden it. And the opportunity, again, I think
beyond venues is immense when you look at use
cases that span not only healthcare, but retail,
light manufacturing, heavy manufacturing, logistics,
and whatnot. So pretty compelling stuff. But
like I mentioned, I'm hoping to get the chance
to speak with Stanford Healthcare and be able
to share those insights with our viewers and
listeners at a future date. But with that, let's
go to your first topic. You want to talk about
HP Go's new connected PC 5G experience. And this
was announced in Amplify, right? Just recently.
Yeah, so this was announced at HP Amplify two
weeks ago now. And I didn't actually get an opportunity
to talk about or even learn about much detail
about it because you go online. I'm online right
now. There's like a paragraph this big about
it. And I actually got a briefing last week that
kind of... illuminated more about the program
and how it works and all these things. And really
what's interesting about HP Go is, first of all,
it's a MNO solution. So they're actually integrating
AT &T, Verizon, and T -Mobile as a single service
that auto switches between carriers based on
the location that you're at, whichever has the
best service. On top of that, it already comes
pre -integrated on a module at the manufacturing.
like level so when you get the laptop it's already
connected you basically do like a one button
push as a user and the it department already
gets an email when they ship the laptop so that
it can ingest it into their management console
whether that's an hp management console or a
different one and they can actually manage their
devices before you even touch it. And they can
ensure that the correct provisioning is done.
And that when you do have issues, HP manages
all of those connectivity problems. So IT doesn't
have to deal with that or deal with the carriers.
They're really simplifying the 5G connected PC
experience. And they're not really relying on
one carrier to do that. On top of that, billing
is pretty simple in the sense that it's $20 a
month starting price for unlimited data in the
US. And then as you want to uplevel your management
of the laptop, having deeper capabilities, being
able to remote wipe, all those kinds of more
advanced management capabilities will be at a
higher tier. And then also at higher price tiers
is global roaming. So you can roam all over the
world. So let's say you have an executive who
you know is going to be traveling all around
the world. You don't want them having to roam
on different networks that you don't trust. yeah
and using wi -fi in a coffee shop or anything
that or even using a hot spot so this is like
a perfect solution for that but also like all
of your marketing and sales people that are traveling
around like it's cheaper than paying for hotel
wi -fi and in my experience and in your experience
most likely it's faster too yeah i think the
roi is there it was just always difficult to
get people on board. And really what HP Go is
trying to do is reduce the onboarding process
and make it simpler for IT because we've gone
through so many different phases of this. And
every time it's, oh, we'll give it away for free.
People love it, but then it doesn't get deployed.
Why? Because onboarding is just such a pain.
And right now this is available for one. It's
the HP EliteBook 6 G1Q, which is a Qualcomm -based
solution. But HP tells me that they plan to go
far beyond this. And they call it the world's
first AI PC with zero -touch multi -garrier 5G
deployment. I think you hit the nail on the head.
The challenge here with connected PCs, cellular
connected PCs, has been the activation experience,
right? And it really sounds like HP's done their
homework. And they really resolved that. I love
the fact that it's activated out of the box.
I love the fact that it's multi -carrier. And
I love the fact that they've taken kind of the
guesswork out of the whole experience. And our
buddy Bob O'Donnell, he's been a big proponent
of connected PCs. He's done surveys. And he and
I have always discussed the biggest limiting
factor has been this friction with the activation.
And so it really sounds like HP did their homework.
And so this is only available on one model, it
sounds like, right? Currently, yes. And I think
that's them trying to dip their toes in and see
how it gets absorbed and probably figure out
some of the other kinks that might be in the
program before they go broader. But HP's had
a lot of... 5G connected PCs in the past that
weren't Qualcomm based. I think this is a matter
of time. And also by being able to do one module,
because if they've modularized this, by doing
a module, potentially they could just ship this
module on many different platforms and now have
to customize it to each. And since they're the
manufacturer of the laptop, they can build their
PCB around this module and make it easy to integrate
afterwards as well. And that's critical from
a supply chain perspective because many years
ago, this is how I got introduced to mobility
and it was in the 3G world. But I was with Dell
at the time and I was in worldwide procurement
and I was working on activating mobile broadband
connectivity on the Dell Latitude notebooks.
And one of the challenges was, do we burden the
bill of material with this, at the time, a very
expensive cellular modem? in the hopes of getting
an activation. And there was a bounty that was
paid from the operator to Dell. And I was managing
the relationship with Tallis and AT &T, ironically,
at the time. And so it was always chicken and
egg. It's can we get the value for the increase
in the cost, right? Because it wrecks the profitability
if you can't. And so that modular approach, it
really sounds solid. They figured out the whole
user experience and the activation, and they
figured out the supply chain. So pretty compelling
stuff, man. Very cool. Hey, let's go to my second
topic. And it's a gratuitous plug for a research
that I recently posted to the More Insights and
Strategy website. I had the opportunity to spend
time with the Dallas Cowboys and understand what
they are doing to provide secure connectivity,
not only for their back office and front office
operations, but for users that visit AT &T Stadium
in Dallas. And it's pretty compelling. The one
thing that Matt Messick and I talked about, and
Matt is the CTO for the Cowboys, he also manages
Jerry Jones' IT needs across multiple businesses.
I learned quite a bit. Mr. Jones is quite an
entrepreneur. He has many businesses beyond just
being the owner and the general manager of the
Dallas Cowboys. But one of the things Matt and
I talked about was the concern around security.
And if you think about it, The Dallas Cowboys
have a big star or target painted on them. They
are the most valuable sport franchise in the
world worth, I think, nearly $11 billion. When
you look at just their ticket sales and their
merchandise and just their footprint and popularity.
I used to be a Dallas Cowboys fan. I lived in...
the Dallas area. And I'm a little bit older than
you. I can remember the Roger Staubach days.
I can remember when the Cowboys would play the
Steelers, when Terry Bradshaw was the quarterback
for the Steelers. And so security is a huge issue.
What was publicly announced most recently was
that the Dallas Cowboys are employing AT &T's
dynamic defense to secure the inline connection
and circuit. into TNT Stadium that also supports
a lot of the connectivity needs for Mr. Jen's
businesses as well. And I'm not going to go into
a ton of detail because I want to encourage our
viewers and listeners to go hit the More Insights
and Strategy website and read the article. But
I go into a lot of depth about the value, the
fact that dynamic defense provides a layered
approach. It complements other security controls
and provisions, and it's all in line. It doesn't
require any sort of incremental equipment to
operate and at a very high level i will say one
thing what i really like about it is that it
provides the ability to filter out and weed out
a lot of the noise and the alerting and allow
matt and his team to really focus on What are
the critical threat vectors and attacks that
are coming in that could potentially thwart operations,
create denial of service, or bring down the entire
network during a Taylor Swift concert? Again,
from my perspective, it's very innovative. The
other piece of the article, I focus on Extinet.
So they've been the Cowboys' partner since the
inception of building that massive venue in Dallas
or in Arlington. And in the article, I do talk
to one of Extinet's executives about what they
had done to improve the connectivity experience
from a mobility perspective, from a fiber perspective.
And again, I encourage our viewers and listeners
to go read that article. I'm a Chiefs fan these
days. My wife grew up in Kansas City. I follow
the Cowboys, but I'm not a Rabbit fan like I
used to be. But what do you think this whole
notion about dynamic defense, the value it can
provide? Because you and I have talked. talked
about this. Mobile networks are huge targets
by threat actors because there are massive numbers
of subscribers on these networks. The ability
for a bad actor to attack a network, bring it
down and extort ransomware is quite high. This
has occurred with AT &T, with T -Mobile, with
Verizon, with Vodafone. What do you think? Do
you think this is something that other MNOs should
consider? I think yes. I also think A lot of
these venues end up becoming a single point of
failure. Let's say Cowboy Stadium probably has
a couple lines of fiber going into it. But if
you were to take out the right one, it might
not actually have enough bandwidth to keep the
venue running, let alone serve customers. So
I think just being able to lean, because these
are public venues now, and people are becoming
more and more dependent on these venues. to provide
connectivity let's say not even for entertainment
purposes just for safety so i think it's one
of those things where it will probably become
mandated at some point that there be more security
at these venues simply because they become because
they become bigger points of attack for bad actors
whether that's someone with malicious software
intent or malicious physical intent and if you
wanted to inflict harm, you would want to make
sure that there's no way for people to communicate.
So I think that there's inherently going to be
a need for more security at these venues, because
this is probably one of the few places where
you have so many people in such a small space.
And this is a public safety nightmare if connectivity
goes down. You're echoing the exact point that
the Exinet executive mentioned to me. He mentioned
that the best level of security that you can
provide in a large venue is connectivity, to
your point, right? So that if you need to contact
a first responder, heaven forbid, if something
happens, a criminal activity or, you know, you
have a health issue. And I know we're both busy
and we don't get an opportunity to read each
other's articles, but you're echoing kind of
the punctuation that I highlighted with the Exinet
executive. Nobody even gets to read my own article.
I know, man. I don't get to either, man. But
hey, it's the life of an analyst, right? But
hey, let's go to your second topic. And you want
to talk about Disney and using T -Mobile 5G for
a new Lilo and Stitch live action film production.
And I'm just going to do another call out to
my wife, Megan. She's a huge Lilo and Stitch
fan. Oh, really? Yeah, she really is. I can do
a perfect Stitch. Oh, do it real quick. Stitch.
My little Stitch. That's scary. Pretty good,
right? I'm going to get her to watch this video,
man. I'm going to get her to watch it. So I'm
a big fan of Lilo and Stitch as well. Yeah. The
original animated movie, which is why I can do
a Stitch voice. But basically, this is from a
partnership that T -Mobile actually started in
2022, which makes sense because live film productions.
usually take a couple years to shoot edit and
publish this movie's coming out in a month uh
on may 23rd and this is i think it's like a co
-marketing deal in my opinion because they did
this probably in 2023 or 2024 and they were doing
live shoots in hawaii because lilo stitch is
based in hawaii if you don't know about the story
Lilo and Stitch is about an alien who lands on
Earth, and a girl mistakes him for a dog and
makes her his pet, but he's actually like a fugitive
from a foreign alien empire, and he's actually
very dangerous and could easily kill someone,
but he takes on being her pet. But they use real
people in this production that's really being
shot in Hawaii. Disney is based out of Burbank,
and that's where a lot of their production happens,
and they are basically... as they're filming
they want to review the footage and ensure that
the shots that are that need to be gone are good
and can be usable in the film and part of that
is sending those dailies back to the studio so
they can be reviewed by the editors and get the
movie moving and part of that is they got to
stream this stuff and move all these drives over
to the us across the pacific Sometimes those
have to physically be flown. Other times they're
using fiber lines. But the fastest way to get
this done is actually to stream it in real time
from the film set straight into Burbank. And
that's what they're doing with T -Mobile 5G.
They're also using T -Mobile 5G for scouting
locations, which Disney had actually talked about.
A long time ago, when I was actually working
with Disney, they were talking about at this
USC conference that I was speaking at, how they're
using drones to scout locations. And that's how
they were doing some of the Marvel stuff, being
able to figure out exactly which is the right
shopping center for the shot they want to do
and all these things and having drones help them
automate these processes. And now they're using
5G to also reduce the amount of infrastructure
they need to have in place so that they can actually
make sure that they're setup and teardown times
are much shorter. So they don't have all these
cables running to send that data back. Helping
them improve production speed, get editors on
editing faster and make sure that production
staff are able to review footage quickly. So
it's improving the speed of production cost and
time. And that's really important, but also this
is a very much a co -marketing deal. I think
where I have a feeling T -Mobile is going to
talk a lot about Lilo and Stitch just to promote
it and maybe even promote products and deals
with it, but also be able to talk about how they're
enabling the production to move faster. And it's
a very, it's a great proof point of how 5G can
improve production and film and really save money
and time. And I feel like this week, all my proof
points are very like rubber hitting the road
kind of things, but I'm happy to talk about those
this week. Yeah, I know. this is a fantastic
example of a long -standing relationship between
disney and t -mobile i've had the pleasure and
opportunity to serve as a judge for the 5g unconventional
awards the t -mobile for business 5g unconventional
awards and we actually i think it's been two
years going we've recognized disney and sony
and t -mobile for their work together so this
is a great proof point and it's another great
example of the power of 5G and the low latency,
the high throughput and film production. And
I also just want to mention before we move on
to my third and final topic, if you don't know
the story of Lilo and Stitch, what rock have
you been living under? People don't have kids.
Hey, true. Not to offend those out there that
have never seen the movie, but. It's amazing.
I'm probably going to watch it again this weekend.
Hey, I'm going to hit my third and final topic.
I'm going to be really quick with this one. There's
a decided security theme. I do cover cybersecurity
for our viewers and listeners that don't know
that. I'm not only a 5G infrastructure guy, an
enterprise networking guy, but I also cover cybersecurity.
And I found this announcement interesting. And
it's T -Mobile. T -Mobile is partnering with
Zscaler to improve their overall mobile network
security. Like we mentioned, we're not going
to pick on any M &As. These are huge challenges
that they have in securing massive infrastructure,
a massive number of subscribers. But what I really,
and I spent a lot of time with Zscaler as well,
is that T -Mobile recognizes the power of what
Zscaler can do. From a zero trust access, a threat
deception, in a digital experiencing monitoring
perspective, to augment what T -Mobile does in
providing mobile network services to its subscribers,
both consumers and enterprises. And this is huge
because all of the M &Os measure their success
by subscriber churn. And they all want to be
below 1%. On any given day, that vacillates back
and forth here. What I really like about it,
T -Mobile has invested very heavily in security,
but security is a layered approach. It's a team
sport. And the more layers that you can introduce,
it does tend to introduce complexity. But with
Zscaler, what you have is you have, in my mind,
one of just a handful of end -to -end platforms
that support. Again, access, whether it's broader
internet access or private access, and also that
digital experience monitoring piece as well,
which is really important, Anshul, when you think
about why do we use our phones? Like, we do use
them for phone calls, but we're using all of
those applications on the phones as well. And
when they don't perform well, people get upset.
So again, I just wanted to highlight this one.
I thought it was a great, it was a great partnership.
I'm sure Zscaler is working with other MNOs as
well, but I caught the news this week and wanted
to share it. Do you have anything to add before
we go to your third and final? I do not really,
other than I definitely think that T -Mobile
could use improved mobile network security. And
I think all carriers can and should. And I think
security should actually be. probably at the
top of their list of things that they offer consumers,
especially considering all the data leaks that
have happened from all carriers at this point.
And I just think that these are a single point
of failure for a lot of people. And there's a
lot of trust on these networks. I talk about
5G connectivity on PCs as a secure connection.
I think it's really important that Consumers
can trust carriers to be secure, especially when
you consider how much banking and private information
is transmitted over those devices now. I would
say most people do most of their most private
things over their phones. So I think that there
needs to be a robust private secure connection.
Yeah, I couldn't agree more. And I've probably
spoken about this a million times, but one of
5G superpowers. is improved encryption over LTE.
But that's just simply not enough. Again, a layered
approach to security, like we've just been discussing
with T -Mobile and Zscaler, is definitely the
right approach. So with that, let's go to your
third and final topic. And you want to talk about
Hyundai. And they are building a massive smart
factory in Georgia. And surprise, 5G and AI are
playing a role. Yeah, so this factory has actually
been under development for quite some time. This
new plant is officially open today, and it's
now part of their Industry 4 .0 world firsts.
It's called the HMG Mega Plant America, so Hyundai
Motor Group Mega Plant America. The full name
is HMGMA. And basically... It's a factory that
costs $7 .5 billion to build. And it mostly does
this for electric vehicles. So it's going to
be for the Ioniq 5, which rolled off the line
last year. And we'll also build the Ioniq 9,
as well as some Genesis vehicles down the road.
And it will produce 300 ,000 vehicles per year
in the first year, and then move up to 500 ,000
vehicles per year in the future. And it uses
a lot of AI and some private 5G to do extremely
high levels of automation, which is how you're
able to produce 300 ,000 vehicles with only 1
,200 workers. So it's very similar, I would say,
to almost like a fab. I was going to say it's
not quite a full fab, but it's like a semiconductor
fab. Yeah. And they say that it's North America's
largest and most advanced smart factory. But
I'm not sure if that necessarily probably takes
up more space than a fab just because of the
vehicles and all the parts. But also part of
this is they have a joint venture with LG to
create batteries for these vehicles. And then
on top of that, they're also building. a steel
mill in Louisiana for $5 .8 billion that will
enable the capacity to increase by 60 % to 500
,000 vehicles per year. So they're building in
the U .S., which is why I get really frustrated
when I hear about tariffs on cars. That's actually
exempt now. People don't realize that. Autos
and auto parts are exempt from the tariffs that
dropped yesterday. Oh, that's good to hear. Yeah,
because it would have been really stupid considering
how much BMW, Mercedes, and Hyundai have invested
in the U .S. Exactly. Probably, it's over $100
billion, probably. One sec, I've got a barking
dog. That's okay. Sorry about that. But yeah,
he's quite loud. But yeah, I think that in general,
there's a really strong... I might have to grab
him. There's a really strong... focus here on
ai and 5g and there's a video i'll link to in
the description where you can see there's drones
there's robots there's agvs there's all kinds
of automation occurring that you would expect
to be at this level in this way and it will enable
scale and it will enable cost and these will
be competitive vehicles both technologically
and in terms of quality And yeah, it's just quite
clear that they've made the investment and they're
using the right technology and that 5G is a big
component of enabling this kind of automation
and also investment in the US. yeah i continue
to be impressed with hyundai they when they launched
they did heavy machinery like mitsubishi for
many years got it in the market was considered
a value kind of car they've moved up through
the ranks and then they've really been just killing
it in evs and from my perspective they're a leader
in that category and making this investment not
only in the us is super positive but it just
it echoes their technology Yeah, and I'll give
you a quick summary of the things that were mentioned
in the video. Thanks to our friends at RCR Wireless.
It has AI automation and control system for vehicle
parts management, AI drone system for inventory
management, AI vision system to verify component
assemblies, digital command center for digitizing
and creating product production data, AI vision
system to precisely and automatically align metal
sheets, smart... press to control and speed for
optimal metal forming, AI vision system for detect
holes, cracks, and panels, AI vision system to
guide precise positioning of automatic loading
systems, unmanned transport vehicles to carry
pallets, automated warehouses to efficiently
store and manage pallets, robot main book system
to integrate robots and vision technology, autonomous
adjustment system to... adjust vehicle door gaps
metal finish line flow agv as collaborative workspace
automated overhead robot to grab and move heavy
parts automated electro coating scarf sanding
system to sand vehicle parts and then 10 more
automated things so in a partridge in a pear
tree yeah it's just like the future of manufacturing
is automation it doesn't matter where you are
and With these kinds of expensive, high -touch
vehicles, you have to really have as much automation
as you can because labor is expensive and it
introduces errors. Yeah, yeah. I'm just going
to end on this point. Another gratuitous plug.
I got to spend time with John Deere and Waterloo,
and I've probably mentioned this. I like to repeat
myself. But they're using 5G to do exactly a
lot of the things that Hyundai is doing as well.
And I've spoken about one of the... one of the
most compelling use cases for for 5g is within
manufacturing automation it could be nearly 50
of the addressable market there so this is a
great example of that and in our friends sean
kinney and others at rcr wireless they always
do a really great job of getting down to the
nitty -gritty and getting into the details so
a shout out to sean and your team as well and
yeah i will just add since you plugged john deere
yeah i want to give john your credit i will not
name the auto manufacturer i have a feeling they've
worked with all of them but they actually have
invited auto manufacturers to visit their 5g
manufacturing facility to understand how it's
being used yeah and they're actually offering
their knowledge and expertise to American auto
manufacturers to help them modernize their facilities.
So they're not really being, they're not being
closed about these things. They're trying to
be helpful and help American companies modernize
their infrastructure, utilizing the ideas and
capabilities that John Deere has developed. Yeah.
And John Deere is an American brand. And so they're
invested in that. And I'm not surprised to hear
that. That is a private deployment. I will mention
John Deere has stood that up on their own. It's
incredible the investment that Jason and his
team has made and bringing that capability to
bear for John Deere. But hey, it's been a great
podcast, man. We've really gone deep. And I'm
in Amarillo. I've been in Colorado this week.
I'm headed back home. But why don't you take
us home? Absolutely. We hope our viewers and
listeners found this week's topics interesting.
And if anyone would like to reach out to us about
a specific 5G topic for a future podcast, please
reach out to us on social media. Will's at WillTownTech
and I'm at Anshul Saag. We hope you have a great
weekend and please tune in next week. And don't
forget to rate us and subscribe.