1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:06,000 Welcome at episode 209 of the GTO on 5G. It's the latest insight scoop on everything 5G. We cover 2 00:00:06,000 --> 00:00:10,560 six topics in about 20 minutes and it's brought to you by More Insights and Strategy. I'm Will 3 00:00:10,560 --> 00:00:15,280 Townsend and joining me again this week is Federal Analyst Anshul Sag. But before we get started, 4 00:00:15,280 --> 00:00:21,120 just an apology to our listeners and our viewers. Both Anshul and I have been road warriors. I was 5 00:00:21,120 --> 00:00:27,360 in Tokyo for a week. There was travel to Palo Alto Networks, Ignite before that. We had our first 6 00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:36,240 farm-wide planning session on the 15th. Where have you been Anshul? I have lost track. I think I've 7 00:00:36,240 --> 00:00:43,280 been in New York, Berlin, everywhere. Austin, yeah it's been a blur to be honest with you. 8 00:00:43,920 --> 00:00:50,640 And I wish it were slowing down. But I would say this is the Thanksgiving lull. I'm actually 9 00:00:50,640 --> 00:00:57,280 traveling to DC for Thanksgiving and then I'm not coming home. Going straight to New York for Dell. 10 00:00:58,080 --> 00:01:04,240 And then I'm coming back to California, not home for something else. And then I will finally be 11 00:01:04,240 --> 00:01:09,120 home sometime in mid-December. And then I've got a little bit more travel before the end of the year. 12 00:01:09,120 --> 00:01:14,960 But I can't wait for it to slow down at least a little bit for the holidays. I bet. I've only got 13 00:01:14,960 --> 00:01:23,680 two more trips. I'll be with AT&T on the 3rd at their Analyst Summit at the Dallas Cowboys Stadium 14 00:01:23,680 --> 00:01:31,280 there. Whatever they call that. Jerry World. And then I'll have in mid-December, HP is holding an 15 00:01:31,280 --> 00:01:36,160 Analyst Summit. It's a security summit. And I'll be at that and I'll be done. But I've already 16 00:01:36,160 --> 00:01:42,000 been invited to an event with Cisco on January 15th. I thought in January I'd get a break. 17 00:01:42,000 --> 00:01:48,640 Typically it's January and July. I have CES. Yeah. And you've got CES, right? Yep. It's going to be 18 00:01:48,640 --> 00:01:53,680 a fun one. Yeah, I bet it is. Yeah. You didn't go last year, right? Because you had the little one. 19 00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:59,360 Yeah. Thankfully she wasn't born during CES. She was late five days. So she was born after CES. 20 00:01:59,920 --> 00:02:05,440 I don't have to feel bad about going to CES because her birthday is afterwards, thankfully. 21 00:02:05,440 --> 00:02:08,720 Let's get started. I want to start with my first topic. And I want to talk about 22 00:02:08,720 --> 00:02:16,240 NTT, Dockamon, SK Telecom. And there was news this week that they have successfully conducted a pre-6G 23 00:02:16,240 --> 00:02:24,000 trial. And no surprise, it involves artificial intelligence. And this is something that you and 24 00:02:24,000 --> 00:02:32,560 I have been watching pretty closely. We're certainly not at any sort of 3GPP standardization for 6G. 25 00:02:32,560 --> 00:02:39,040 We still have a lot of legs and a lot of work to do with 5G, especially standalone deployments. But 26 00:02:39,920 --> 00:02:46,720 this is interesting. And with NVIDIA, they are very focused on bringing their AI stack to the RAN 27 00:02:47,280 --> 00:02:53,360 to optimize transmission and that sort of thing. So this was a very similar test. So this was an 28 00:02:53,360 --> 00:03:01,200 indoor test. The spectrum was 4.8 gigahertz. And this is obviously in Japan. And what they focused 29 00:03:01,200 --> 00:03:08,240 on was using AI-based baseband transmission and reception processing. And this is a technology 30 00:03:08,240 --> 00:03:15,360 developed by Nokia. So Nokia is also involved in this. And the trial demonstrated up to an 18% 31 00:03:15,360 --> 00:03:23,840 improvement over sort of conventional methods of baseband. So I think it's pretty exciting. 32 00:03:23,840 --> 00:03:29,760 I just spent time with NTT last week, and I learned a little bit about what they're calling their 6G 33 00:03:29,760 --> 00:03:35,680 harmonized intelligence. And it's funny how these Asian companies, sometimes the translation to 34 00:03:35,680 --> 00:03:43,040 English is interesting. But what NTT Docomo is focusing on are five key pillars or value 35 00:03:43,040 --> 00:03:50,240 propositions for 6G that involve sustainability, efficiency, customer experience, network for AI, 36 00:03:50,240 --> 00:03:57,280 and connectivity everywhere. Hey, I'm not surprised to see AI being applied to the baseband, but 37 00:03:57,280 --> 00:04:01,520 what do you think? What are you hearing? This is an assumption that everyone has is that 38 00:04:01,520 --> 00:04:09,600 6G will involve a lot of artificial intelligence, right? I think this really lends super well 39 00:04:10,320 --> 00:04:17,040 to NVIDIA. If you remember, we were on that call where they talked about 6G quite a bit, 40 00:04:17,600 --> 00:04:22,000 and a lot of the development they're doing. I can't imagine that it's a coincidence that 41 00:04:22,000 --> 00:04:29,280 T-Mobile is already looking and working with NVIDIA to deploy AI in the RAN. And I think that 42 00:04:29,280 --> 00:04:34,400 when you look at what's happening with the network, if there is really so much AI that's going to be 43 00:04:34,400 --> 00:04:39,760 necessary to drive the network, and there can be applications that need AI at the edge, it does 44 00:04:39,760 --> 00:04:48,080 make sense to have a software defined, open RAN kind of situation where you get two for one, right? 45 00:04:48,080 --> 00:04:53,440 Yeah. I'm actually playing with my NVIDIA ruler here that they gave me at an event, 46 00:04:53,440 --> 00:04:58,560 which is like all the capacitors, and then all the chip layouts for all the different chips they 47 00:04:58,560 --> 00:05:02,240 make. Yeah, I think NVIDIA is actually really well positioned for this. I was going to ask you if 48 00:05:02,240 --> 00:05:07,520 NVIDIA was involved in all in this NTD DoCoMo SK Telecom thing, because it sounds like something 49 00:05:07,520 --> 00:05:11,680 that'll be right up their alley. And maybe behind the scenes, but it was really the focus on the 50 00:05:11,680 --> 00:05:17,040 article, and I believe it was an RCR wireless article where I caught this news, was with Nokia, 51 00:05:17,040 --> 00:05:23,760 and what they're doing. But you know what? So this investigation is not unlike what we've seen in 52 00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:31,920 enterprise Wi-Fi with respect to AI ops and applying AI to do more efficient things with 53 00:05:31,920 --> 00:05:39,120 traffic steering and micro segmentation and that sort of thing. So it was an inevitable circumstance 54 00:05:39,120 --> 00:05:46,000 that it would come to mobile networks. There is deployment within 5G to a certain extent. You and 55 00:05:46,000 --> 00:05:51,680 I have talked about that. But it's been more or less around not necessarily ran tuning, but 56 00:05:51,680 --> 00:05:57,440 intelligent truck rolling and that sort of thing. Again, this is not surprising. This is what 57 00:05:57,440 --> 00:06:06,640 everyone is expecting from pre-GPP whenever the 6G standard discussions occur. But hell, up to 58 00:06:06,640 --> 00:06:11,920 an 18% improvement. I think that's just scratching the surface. I think there can be a lot more done 59 00:06:11,920 --> 00:06:16,240 to improve performance using artificial intelligence. Because you think about it, it's going to be 60 00:06:16,240 --> 00:06:22,240 continuously learning and it's going to be fed continuous data, as well as data at the network 61 00:06:22,240 --> 00:06:28,160 edge. And so I think it's going to be an exciting phenomenon. And it's going to do a lot of things to 62 00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:34,880 improve performance and reliability and availability. And hopefully we get to a point where absent of 63 00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:41,200 bad actors hacking mobile networks, which continues to occur, it's really going to improve the 64 00:06:41,200 --> 00:06:46,960 overall quality of service. And one of the pillars that NTT talks about is customer experience. And 65 00:06:46,960 --> 00:06:53,760 hey, anyone that tuned in to that Mike Tyson fight knows that quality of service was lacking there. 66 00:06:53,760 --> 00:06:58,800 That was an entirely different issue with Netflix and their CDN network. But I think it's all 67 00:06:58,800 --> 00:07:04,000 exciting stuff. But let's go to your first topic. And you were at Qualcomm's Investor Day and this 68 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:10,320 follows Snapdragon Summit. And I know you were very actively live tweeting, live accessing, 69 00:07:10,320 --> 00:07:17,280 whatever we call it these days. So what did you learn? I would say that a lot of it was review. 70 00:07:18,000 --> 00:07:25,360 A lot of it was stuff that they've shown it at Summit. I think what was really demonstrated 71 00:07:25,360 --> 00:07:31,440 at the event and what the focus was actually IoT and PC. So on the PC side, I was a little 72 00:07:31,440 --> 00:07:36,640 surprised they still aren't talking about 5G. And I think that might just be because they know that 73 00:07:36,640 --> 00:07:42,800 they will be the leader in 5G if it ever happens on the PC side at least. And I think it's in their 74 00:07:42,800 --> 00:07:47,840 best interest to get the market going before they start pushing something like 5G, which has cost. 75 00:07:48,640 --> 00:07:54,800 But in addition to PC, they were really talking IoT quite a bit, really talking up how they're 76 00:07:54,800 --> 00:08:03,040 going to change their strategy again. They've now put IoT under Nakul, who used to run and 77 00:08:03,040 --> 00:08:09,280 still runs auto. So now he has both. And yeah, I think when you look at what they're doing, 78 00:08:09,280 --> 00:08:14,080 IoT is a big growth opportunity for them. I think they're also realizing that their previous 79 00:08:14,080 --> 00:08:19,440 strategies just didn't work. Also, the IoT market wasn't really in a great place when they tried. 80 00:08:19,440 --> 00:08:25,040 It's bad timing as well. I think I'm waiting to see what our colleague Bill thinks about Bill 81 00:08:25,040 --> 00:08:30,960 Curtis, about their IoT strategy, because ultimately he's the one who has the most insights. 82 00:08:30,960 --> 00:08:36,800 So we'll wait for that to see what he thinks. But I would say that it also feels like they're 83 00:08:36,800 --> 00:08:41,440 very much leaning on big partners to make these things happen. And one of them is actually 84 00:08:42,160 --> 00:08:46,400 a company you're going to be talking about, which is around. And in general, it seems the big 85 00:08:46,400 --> 00:08:53,840 takeaways outside of IoT and auto were that they plan on having their non smartphone business, 86 00:08:53,840 --> 00:09:00,720 basically equaling their smartphone business by 2030, I think, with the number. In the next five 87 00:09:00,720 --> 00:09:07,680 or six years, they're going to balance out their smartphone business with IoT, which includes auto 88 00:09:08,160 --> 00:09:14,480 and PC. So it's basically all the stuff that isn't mobile is technically IoT, but really it's auto and 89 00:09:14,480 --> 00:09:20,800 IoT and PC versus smartphone. And the truth is smartphone is still doing great for them. They've 90 00:09:20,800 --> 00:09:26,080 picked a high end of the market and they're doing really well there in margins and growth is decent, 91 00:09:26,080 --> 00:09:31,520 better than it was in the last few years. And they're hammering on AI super hard. And the only 92 00:09:31,520 --> 00:09:37,440 thing I would say is they also teased that they've got another Snapdragon X series chip coming at 93 00:09:37,440 --> 00:09:44,560 the low end. And then they also said that they're going to have a new high end chip sometime next 94 00:09:44,560 --> 00:09:50,160 year using third generation Snapdragon X elite. We're already getting ready for a refresh of the 95 00:09:50,160 --> 00:09:57,200 the Snapdragon X elite series. Yeah, I learned a lot about X elite at summit and it's quite impressive 96 00:09:57,200 --> 00:10:07,440 what they're doing with NPA GPU, CPU, and just in such a small form factor and such a very power 97 00:10:07,440 --> 00:10:12,960 efficient package as well. And I did write a Forbes article about that. So for our viewers 98 00:10:12,960 --> 00:10:17,920 and listeners, if you missed that hit my social handles, you can learn a little bit more. You 99 00:10:17,920 --> 00:10:22,960 mentioned AI and obviously they're fully invested in AI and they can do some pretty amazing things 100 00:10:23,520 --> 00:10:29,120 within the automotive segment. But as I started looking at just the guts of elite, 101 00:10:30,560 --> 00:10:36,320 it got me thinking that, hey, they're already doing really cool stuff with like edge AI within 102 00:10:36,320 --> 00:10:43,680 their most recent Wi Fi seven solution announcement. And that could cascade down into a new class of 103 00:10:43,680 --> 00:10:48,800 potentially edge enabled devices, right? And bringing that compute because you've already got 104 00:10:48,800 --> 00:10:54,160 Snapdragon compute power like on smart cameras that's driving computer vision applications and 105 00:10:54,160 --> 00:10:58,720 that sort of thing. So I think you could see a whole host of additional edge use cases that 106 00:10:58,720 --> 00:11:04,080 are unlocked with this edge AI. But no, it's pretty exciting stuff. And that is actually a great 107 00:11:04,080 --> 00:11:09,920 segue to my second topic, because I do want to talk about a RAM code digital. And there are rumors 108 00:11:09,920 --> 00:11:18,960 that they are considering investing up to $1 billion in Mavenir. And Tarek Amen, who you and 109 00:11:18,960 --> 00:11:25,520 I know very well, he's the CEO of Aramco digital, haven't really heard a lot coming out of Aramco 110 00:11:25,520 --> 00:11:31,200 and with what they're planning and what Tarek is up to. Tarek has to be his thing, right? 111 00:11:31,200 --> 00:11:37,200 It has to be right because Tarek's a disruptor. That's his thing. When he was at Rakuten, 112 00:11:37,200 --> 00:11:43,360 they were talking about crazy things like giving away the RIC for free and to be able to hook 113 00:11:43,360 --> 00:11:49,040 mobile network operator customers. So this is actually quite interesting. Mavenir continues 114 00:11:49,040 --> 00:11:53,840 to not perform well. And they're at a point where they're almost completely out of gas. So 115 00:11:54,480 --> 00:12:00,960 this would be a much needed infusion of cash. It's a huge amount of money. And if it happens, 116 00:12:01,520 --> 00:12:06,480 Aramco would take a minority stake in Mavenir, which it's interesting. Haven't we seen this 117 00:12:06,480 --> 00:12:13,600 playbook before with Tarek at Rakuten? What do you think, buddy? I think a billion dollars is a lot. 118 00:12:14,240 --> 00:12:20,000 I'm not sure Mavenir is at that point. I have a feeling that a billion dollars is very close 119 00:12:20,000 --> 00:12:26,720 to 50% of the company if it's not a majority share. So I think this is one of those things where 120 00:12:27,520 --> 00:12:34,400 they want to have control, but they don't want to have a controlling stake. So it'll be interesting 121 00:12:34,400 --> 00:12:39,200 to see what they do. They obviously need the money, but this might buy them some more time, 122 00:12:39,200 --> 00:12:42,880 which I think is what they need. Yeah, they definitely did. And I've probably not been too 123 00:12:42,880 --> 00:12:48,080 kind to Mavenir in the past, but I would say you're being generous. Yeah, being generous there, 124 00:12:48,080 --> 00:12:54,640 but hey, they're still viable. They're still participant in a lot of deals. They're a part 125 00:12:54,640 --> 00:13:01,120 of a lot of Open RAN deployments that are finally beginning to take off. So it'll be interesting. 126 00:13:01,120 --> 00:13:06,160 Again, this isn't confirmed. These are rumors, but usually they're pretty well-found rumors, 127 00:13:06,160 --> 00:13:10,400 especially on the Fierce Network where I caught this particular article. 128 00:13:11,040 --> 00:13:18,560 Maven, let's go to your second topic. You want to talk about CV2X and its journey to becoming 129 00:13:18,560 --> 00:13:26,640 a standard. Yeah, so CV2X is a technology standard that's been around for a while, 130 00:13:26,640 --> 00:13:34,080 and it's mostly been centered around FIBE. And it's supposed to replace an older technology 131 00:13:35,440 --> 00:13:42,000 that failed to take off in the auto sector. That was like a direct-to-vehicle, I forget, 132 00:13:42,000 --> 00:13:47,920 it was like DSD or something like that. It never took off, but it was like a 4.9 gigahertz 133 00:13:47,920 --> 00:13:55,120 technology. And CV2X looks to replace that in a more standards-based way. This 5.9, 134 00:13:55,120 --> 00:14:02,240 that's a 4.9, I meant 5.9. That's 5.9 gigahertz. And basically, it's already part of the 3GPP 135 00:14:02,240 --> 00:14:10,640 standard. The FCC is now coalescing around CV2X and making sure that it's part of the standard 136 00:14:10,640 --> 00:14:18,880 for the US. And it's been in the process since before 2020. And they basically are saying that 137 00:14:18,880 --> 00:14:28,080 the FCC will allocate 30 megahertz between 5.895 and 5.925 specifically for V2X. And that's 138 00:14:28,080 --> 00:14:35,520 obviously going to need a 45 megahertz guard band. So that way, Wi-Fi doesn't interfere with it 139 00:14:36,160 --> 00:14:42,000 outdoors. And that's part of the reason why Wi-Fi and the five-ish, six gigahertz bands has to 140 00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:50,080 listen for signal. And the FCC adopting CV2X actually works in Qualcomm's favor because they 141 00:14:50,080 --> 00:14:57,360 were a big driver of the technology. And it will likely be the standard that all automotive 142 00:14:57,360 --> 00:15:03,840 companies use for connecting to the 5G network and being able to connect to other devices. So 143 00:15:03,840 --> 00:15:12,640 the dream here with V2X is that you can have this modem or this technology in the car. It will 144 00:15:12,640 --> 00:15:19,360 communicate both with infrastructure and cellular networks and user devices. So that way, it can see 145 00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:24,560 things that it can't actually have line of sight to. If there's a fire truck coming down the road, 146 00:15:24,560 --> 00:15:29,440 it can slow the car down before the fire truck even comes close. It can anticipate someone's 147 00:15:29,440 --> 00:15:34,400 crossing the street using sensors and wireless communications. There's a lot of really cool 148 00:15:34,400 --> 00:15:39,520 features that I've talked about for a long time and I've been really excited about with V2X. 149 00:15:39,520 --> 00:15:46,240 But the problem is that it just hasn't come through the standards with FCC yet. And it seems like 150 00:15:47,200 --> 00:15:52,880 US Department of Transportation is also on board. So this might be the turning point for V2X. And 151 00:15:52,880 --> 00:15:57,040 we might actually down the road, unfortunately, when it comes to auto things take a while, but 152 00:15:57,040 --> 00:15:59,760 we could see this in three to five years, if not sooner. 153 00:15:59,760 --> 00:16:04,560 Yeah, I was just going to ask you. So you think it's a three to five year time horizon once? 154 00:16:04,560 --> 00:16:09,360 That's generally how the automotive industry works. Three is like the new standard for fast. 155 00:16:09,920 --> 00:16:14,560 Five is the old way of doing things. But it's possible that some of those chipsets, 156 00:16:15,120 --> 00:16:19,440 all in cars today already support V2X, in which case it would just be a software update. 157 00:16:19,440 --> 00:16:24,640 To your point, Qualcomm has a huge footprint in automotive now, right? What's their share relative 158 00:16:24,640 --> 00:16:31,040 to say? I know BlackBerry has a competing sort of mission for Qualcomm. 159 00:16:31,040 --> 00:16:39,440 Qualcomm's business is predominantly a split between ADAS and digital cockpit. And the ADAS 160 00:16:39,440 --> 00:16:43,920 isn't as big as digital cockpit right now, but that's growing. They see ADAS as a growth 161 00:16:43,920 --> 00:16:49,120 opportunity for them. And actually, their original business in auto was telemetry. They've been doing 162 00:16:49,120 --> 00:16:55,280 telemetry for auto for decades. So this is just going to be an up level for them. And they'll 163 00:16:55,280 --> 00:17:01,280 probably be able to bundle it with cockpit and ADAS as a complete system. And they're even talking 164 00:17:01,280 --> 00:17:06,560 about how they're going to have this flexible, they're calling it flex, where you can have 165 00:17:06,560 --> 00:17:11,920 multiple chips doing both ADAS and cockpit together, as opposed to having to have them separate 166 00:17:11,920 --> 00:17:18,320 systems, which can save on costs for OEMs, which then probably spins into telemetry and 167 00:17:18,320 --> 00:17:23,440 5G cellular. Because the reality is, a lot of these cars are going to need 5G to just keep updating 168 00:17:23,440 --> 00:17:30,000 models and keeping things up to date. Yeah, good point. Again, another more upside for 169 00:17:30,000 --> 00:17:35,040 Qualcomm. And we don't often state this on our podcast, but this is for entertainment purposes. 170 00:17:35,040 --> 00:17:41,680 Only we don't provide investment advice on any of the companies that we cover, but Qualcomm 171 00:17:41,680 --> 00:17:46,960 continues to execute and they keep raising the bar on performance as well and low power. 172 00:17:46,960 --> 00:17:52,960 And to your point, they've been in this area in automotive for quite some time, so they're very 173 00:17:52,960 --> 00:17:57,840 well positioned. So I don't think we're sharing anything that the average person that's knowledgeable 174 00:17:57,840 --> 00:18:02,160 about Qualcomm already knows. But hey, bud, let's go to my third topic. And I want to talk about 175 00:18:02,160 --> 00:18:09,760 Nokia. And they've had two recent pretty big wins that have really helped on the financial front. 176 00:18:09,760 --> 00:18:15,520 It's been a tough couple of quarters for Nokia and there's no mystery that 177 00:18:15,520 --> 00:18:21,760 the RAN market has cooled off quite a bit. Most mobile network operators have deployed 178 00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:28,640 the RAN infrastructure. Now they're focused on core to get to standalone. But what's interesting, 179 00:18:28,640 --> 00:18:34,160 and Nokia has cited that India, sales declines in India have been a big part of why their 180 00:18:34,160 --> 00:18:39,040 financials have been weak. This week, they announced a multi-billion dollar deal with 181 00:18:39,040 --> 00:18:46,240 RT Airtel. And this is to help that mobile network operator in India deploy 5G advanced. And so 182 00:18:46,240 --> 00:18:51,840 a big win there for them. And then this week as well, they announced some support with 183 00:18:51,840 --> 00:18:58,560 switches for Microsoft Azure and what they're doing with cloud data center. And so yes, 184 00:18:58,560 --> 00:19:03,360 this is great. I think they're coming towards the end of the calendar year for Nokia, but 185 00:19:03,360 --> 00:19:09,280 it's been a tough year for Nokia. Hey, it just demonstrates the fact that they are still very 186 00:19:09,280 --> 00:19:15,920 viable. They're very viable in the data center. They're very viable in transport. And they're 187 00:19:15,920 --> 00:19:20,160 certainly very viable when you look at RAN and core infrastructure. So what do you think? Did you 188 00:19:20,160 --> 00:19:26,160 catch the news? I did catch the news. I do think it's good for Nokia, especially since it seems 189 00:19:26,160 --> 00:19:30,720 like T-Mobile might be moving away from them. I read that one. Yeah. I think that was good news 190 00:19:30,720 --> 00:19:35,760 to balance potential bad news. And yeah, I think he has a bit of a roller coaster, but 191 00:19:35,760 --> 00:19:44,640 I think they also, they rely a lot on RAN and yeah, it's just been a very ebb and flow kind of 192 00:19:44,640 --> 00:19:49,520 thing. Hey, we're going to end the podcast because you like to find these controversial 193 00:19:49,520 --> 00:19:56,960 topics for us to discuss, but you want to talk about RFK Jr. and he's front and center with 194 00:19:56,960 --> 00:20:05,600 president elect Trump and he's got some concerns about wireless technology. Yes. So back in 2020 195 00:20:06,480 --> 00:20:14,960 and in 2023, he talked about how 5G was designed to harvest human data. He also said that wifi 196 00:20:14,960 --> 00:20:22,560 radiation opens up your blood brain barrier. So all these toxins are in your body can now go into 197 00:20:22,560 --> 00:20:32,400 your brain. That is an direct quote. And yeah, this guy really just thinks 5G has zero to do with 198 00:20:32,400 --> 00:20:38,960 giving you faster downloads. It is a completely, it is a system completely geared towards harvesting 199 00:20:38,960 --> 00:20:46,480 human data. I think you would be wrong to say it's 5G. Technically 4G also does that, but the truth 200 00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:56,080 is he's also talked about RF emissions being a health risk. I think we need people to be more 201 00:20:56,080 --> 00:21:03,200 educated on these topics. Perhaps Mr. Brendan Carr can educate him on this topic. I'm not sure 202 00:21:03,200 --> 00:21:10,000 that he will, but it's going to be very interesting if he actually does add up health and human 203 00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:16,800 services. Hopefully someone can talk some sense into him, but it doesn't seem like anyone's able 204 00:21:16,800 --> 00:21:22,080 to. Sounds like he's been talking to Dr. Oz. Didn't I hear that Dr. Oz was a rumor for 205 00:21:22,880 --> 00:21:29,360 surgeon general or something? No, he is, I think it's the Veterans Administration. Oh my goodness. 206 00:21:29,360 --> 00:21:34,400 Yeah. So we don't want to get too political on this webcast, but. Sorry, Medicare and Medicaid 207 00:21:34,400 --> 00:21:40,480 services. So grandpa and grandma's. At least it's not the Doge, right? The Department of Government 208 00:21:40,480 --> 00:21:47,520 Efficiency. I just, I hope that we have people who are more competent running our government. 209 00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:53,040 We do. And I will say one positive thing. So during Trump's first administration, at least at 210 00:21:53,040 --> 00:21:59,440 the very beginning of it, he brought together a council of technology CEOs that include Michael 211 00:21:59,440 --> 00:22:05,600 Dell and I think it included at the time, probably Jeff Bezos. That's the right approach to go. So 212 00:22:05,600 --> 00:22:12,320 the government needs to bring private industry into these discussions, use people with knowledge 213 00:22:12,320 --> 00:22:18,400 and context as consultants, as policy is established and that sort of thing. And that's whether it's a 214 00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:24,400 Republican administration or a Democratic administration. You need to bring smart people 215 00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:29,440 into the discussion that have the context so that they make the right decisions. But yeah, 216 00:22:29,440 --> 00:22:36,560 my concern is that we don't have an FCC that causes the same thing that happened during the FAA crisis. 217 00:22:37,120 --> 00:22:41,360 Yeah. Well, you and I talked a lot about that over the last couple of years. 218 00:22:41,360 --> 00:22:45,040 That was from the first Trump administration. I'm hoping we don't have something like that happen again. 219 00:22:45,040 --> 00:22:52,240 At least Pi is not coming back, right? Who knows? Former FCC chairman, right? Ejet Pi. 220 00:22:52,240 --> 00:22:58,080 Yeah. He's busy doing private equity stuff. Interesting. Oh, before we get too much further 221 00:22:58,080 --> 00:23:03,920 into the political realm, what are you doing for Thanksgiving, my friend? We are flying to DC. 222 00:23:03,920 --> 00:23:08,400 Oh, you mentioned it. I'm out for Thanksgiving with family. And then yeah, I'm not coming home. 223 00:23:08,400 --> 00:23:13,520 I'm flying to New York. But honestly, New York in December is gorgeous. It's probably one of the 224 00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:17,760 best times to be in New York. Oh man. Listen, I'm looking forward to spending time with the HP 225 00:23:17,760 --> 00:23:21,200 security team there. I'm going to go to Rockefeller's office and I'm going to go to 226 00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:27,360 Rockefeller center. I probably won't go ice skating. I want to see the jewelry. Yeah. And all of that. 227 00:23:27,360 --> 00:23:31,360 It's going to be great. Hey, listen, my friend, I hope you have a great Thanksgiving and I hope our 228 00:23:31,360 --> 00:23:36,880 viewers and listeners do as well. I'm glad we finally were able to record this podcast after 229 00:23:36,880 --> 00:23:41,520 a three week hiatus. Why don't you take us home? Absolutely. We hope our viewers and listeners 230 00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:44,720 found this week's topics interesting. If anyone out there would like to provide insights on the 231 00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:49,920 specific 5G topic for a future podcast, please reach out to us on social media. Will's at Wilenton 232 00:23:49,920 --> 00:23:54,080 Contact and I'm at Anshul Saag. We hope you have a great Thanksgiving weekend and please 233 00:23:54,080 --> 00:24:20,960 tune in next weekend. Don't forget to rate us and subscribe.