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Hello!

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Hello!

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Welcome back to another episode of Diagnosing a Killer.

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My name is Kenna.

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I'm Koelle.

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Woo!

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I just want to have everyone know that my face from the beginning is a killer.

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It looks like it hurts because you're not really opening your mouth a lot when you talk.

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It does hurt.

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Well, the good news is that today's my case, so you don't have to talk the whole time.

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I'm just going to be quiet the whole time sitting here and sipping my coffee.

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Yeah, we have a really good one for today, so I'm really excited about it.

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This was a request by one of our listeners, but before I get into who I'm going to be

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talking about and what we're going to be talking about, just want to share with you

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guys our social media.

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This is your first time listening.

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Welcome.

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Thank you for choosing to listen to DAK.

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We have a lot of exciting things going on.

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You can follow us on Instagram at Diagnosing a Killer.

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Twitter is at Killer Diagnosis.

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Everywhere else is at Diagnosing a Killer.

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We also do have a website that's diagnosingakiller.com, complete with resources, a little bit about

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us and our merch line, which is really cool.

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And check us out.

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If you want to meet us in person, we are going to be at the True Crime and Paranormal Podcast

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Festival this August in Austin from the 25th through the 27th.

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That is going to be a weekend long meet and greet, and we're super stoked about it.

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It's coming up.

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It's really quick.

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Yep.

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And if anybody saw for like 20 seconds yesterday that we were verified on Instagram, that was

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cool.

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And then we weren't anymore.

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It's like, there's a checkbook, there's a checkbook.

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And then I deleted it because it was really exciting.

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Well, they require you to have a photo of yourself that's present on your ID.

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But I was saying, they don't have Jared Fogle out there for Subway.

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Yeah.

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Well, the thing is, is that I kind of figured out like the meta verification, which is the

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new type is, I guess for like an individual person, because it does make you like submit

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proof of identity, your profile picture and your name has to match your ID.

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Then you can do like an original verification, which you have to request for.

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However, your like brand has to be searched like a certain amount of times in order to

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reach like verification status essentially.

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So Google us, search us on every platform and maybe we can get verified.

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Isn't that weird that the verification team sees like Justin Bieber's identification?

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Yeah.

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And that's strange.

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It's like, hey, send me a picture of your ID, homie.

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Exactly.

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I know where you live.

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And his Canadian passport.

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Canadian passport?

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He's from Canada.

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Is he?

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Yeah.

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We said that.

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He's from Canada.

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He's from Canada.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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While speaking of accents, we're doing a foreign case today.

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We'll just get right into it because I don't really think I have anything else to say.

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Right.

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I'm already talking super fucking fast.

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So this week, we are going to be doing a request, like I said, on Monday for our mental breakdown.

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This is a week of requests.

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If you guys do not remember or you did not listen to that episode that we shouted this

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person out, we did mention recently that we got a message on Instagram from someone in

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Norway.

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Well, she's from Norway.

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She lives in London currently.

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But originally from Norway and she did suggest a case from Norway, perhaps Norway's most

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infamous person.

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Interesting.

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So the person we are going to be talking about today is one.

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Let me figure out how to pronounce his name because I don't want to say it wrong.

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Anders Bryvik.

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Okay.

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Anders.

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Bryvik.

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Bryvik.

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Okay.

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Yes.

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So anybody that's in Norway, just please bear with me because I am not the best at pronunciations.

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I'm trying my hardest.

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Everyone in these names are going to be butchered.

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Yes.

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So Anders Bering Bryvik is his name.

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That sounded pretty good, right?

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That's in the Norwegian.

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Yeah, I like that.

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Okay.

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So if you're into this, if you are from Norway or even if you live in Europe at all, you

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probably have heard this guy's name because he's kind of fucked up really bad.

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So ready?

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Yeah.

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Without further ado.

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Content warning.

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This episode contains depictions of child abuse, neglect, serious mental illness, suicidal

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tendencies, and child victims.

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If this episode is not for you, we encourage you to find another episode.

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Remember, your mental health is important and we love you.

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We love you.

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Bye.

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Bye.

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Okay, everyone take a deep breath.

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Anders Bering Bryvik.

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I sounded wrong already.

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Bryvik.

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I already said it so you know how it's pronounced.

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Was born in Oslo, Norway on February 13th, 1979 to parents Venka Bering and Jens David

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Bryvik.

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Is Jens J-E-N-S?

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It is.

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I love that name.

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And Venka is W-E-N-C-H-E.

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Wow.

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I thought it was Winch.

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So I would say or Winchy.

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But no, it's Venka.

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Like Venka.

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That's how it's pronounced.

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Anders Mother was a nurse.

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Anders Mother was a nurse.

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Anders Mother was a nurse.

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I was trying to press record and then quickly get back to my notes when I kept doing this

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like giant pause of like time and then I had to remember the sentence so I kept going Anders

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Mother was a nurse.

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Anders Mother was a nurse and it sounded like fuzzy was he was a bear.

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So she was a nurse while his father was a civil economist who worked as a diplomat for

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the Norwegian Embassy in London and then later on he would work in Paris in the same position.

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Got through that.

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Okay.

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Anders would also be born into a blended family with a maternal half-sister by the name

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of Elizabeth and three paternal half-siblings by the names of Eric, Jan and Nina.

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It's probably not Jan, it's probably Jan.

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Yeah.

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Jan.

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Venka would flee her abusive home at the age of 17 and soon after that she would become

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pregnant with Elizabeth.

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So Elizabeth was much older than Anders.

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Okay.

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She would meet Jan when she was in her 30s.

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Jens.

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Jens?

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Would I say that?

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Jens?

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Jens?

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Yeah.

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She would meet Jens when she was in her 30s and would become pregnant with Anders shortly

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after marrying Jens due to the pregnancy.

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Even before his birth Venka seemed to have disdain for Anders.

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According to her, Anders was particularly rough while he was in the womb.

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What?

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I know, we never really hear that, right?

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She would state about this, quote, it's as if he kicks me almost on purpose to torment.

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Ew, I don't like that.

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Like, immediately no.

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He's Damien.

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Yeah.

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Venka would frequently refer to her unborn child as a, quote, nasty child and she would

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say that she wanted to abort him.

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However, when she went to the hospital to try to have this done she was already three

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months along and they would not allow her to abort.

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Yeah, I know it's different for, well, not just countries but state-worn.

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Well, we're a different story over here.

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Area-wise.

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Area-wise.

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Venka's fears became even more real the day that Anders was born and he would arrive

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into the world looking abnormally blue.

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So it seems as though he might have had oxygen cut off either during birth or shortly after

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birth.

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Hmm.

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If there was something seriously wrong with her child Venka would sink into a major depression

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shortly after Anders was born.

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He would eventually be okay health-wise and although he was born slightly ill looking

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this would not be the only reason that Venka would become depressed.

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She was known as saying that Anders was a quote, fundamentally nasty and evil child

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and determined to destroy her.

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What?

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Do you think that maybe she was going through, I mean, clearly postpartum, right?

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Yes.

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But even, I mean, you said that even while she was pregnant she didn't want to be pregnant,

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she even saw out maybe getting a procedure or something.

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I just, I don't know, that's like a level of person, like, that feels personal.

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Yes.

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Like she feels personally victimized by Regina George.

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Yes.

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Well, we do know that she came from an extremely abusive household like I said and we will

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find out in just a second that she also is mentally ill.

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Okay.

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Now Venka would actually stop breastfeeding, stopped breastfeeding.

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She would stop breastfeeding Anders at a very early age because he was quote, sucking the

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life out of her.

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That's what she would say about him.

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I see that happen to a cat.

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Immediately like when he's born, like he's, according to her, like already this like demon

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child, like if you will, it's not bad.

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Now not only was Venka experiencing depression but she had also been previously diagnosed

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with paranoid schizophrenia years prior to this.

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A disorder that her own mother was also diagnosed with.

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Wow.

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Well, we say it can be hereditary.

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Yeah.

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Going down the lineage here.

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While Jens was not known to have been diagnosed with anything, he was known as being a cold

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and distant husband and father throughout Anders childhood.

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When Anders was just six months old, the family moved to the embassy in London to be with

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their father, but he would return to Oslo six months later when Venka had had enough of

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the lifestyle, the political lifestyle.

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Venka and Jens would ultimately divorce following this move.

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So when Anders was like four months old, sorry, what was it?

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He was, I'm sorry, six months old.

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Yeah.

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Well, he was, it was six months after they moved.

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So he would be about a year old.

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Oh, I see.

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Okay.

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So after they moved back to Oslo, neighbors would claim that there were many fights and

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noises coming from the house like all the time.

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Seemingly how?

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I don't know.

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But just, you know, it's not like the one year old was screaming.

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Right.

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They also noticed that Venka would frequently leave the children completely alone for extended

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periods of time while she was at work.

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Oh my gosh.

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Now she does have an older daughter.

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Maybe she was old enough to watch the baby.

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Who knows?

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But it was noted that she was frequently absent.

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Never home.

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In 1981, Venka would apply for welfare benefits specifically for financial aid and monetary

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payment to help support her and her children.

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While Anders was still an infant, his mother became very overwhelmed with having to take

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care of him seven days a week.

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And when he was still very little, she would apply for respite care for him, describing

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him as being quote, clingy and demanding.

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You know, shit, he's a fucking baby.

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He's a child.

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Like, yeah, he's a toddler.

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Literally.

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God, you're so demanding.

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God, you're so fucking needed.

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Like, can't you do anything for yourself?

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You need to get a skin.

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So Anders would end up getting placed with another young couple.

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Just on the weekends so that Venka could either work or pretty much didn't have to take care

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of him on the weekends.

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Well, excuse me.

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The young couple was willing and able to look after Anders for a while, but were extremely

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taken aback when Venka asked them something out of left field.

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Quote, she asked if Anders could occasionally touch his weakened dad's penis.

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It was important for the boy's sexuality.

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Wait, what?

258
00:11:15,740 --> 00:11:20,160
She literally said, like, Anders doesn't have a dad in his life.

259
00:11:20,160 --> 00:11:24,360
So can you, like, assume the role of dad and, like, make sure that you show him your penis

260
00:11:24,360 --> 00:11:27,560
and let him touch it because he's quote, only ever seen girl parts.

261
00:11:27,560 --> 00:11:31,560
So he needs, like, some guidance on, like, what it is to be like a man.

262
00:11:31,560 --> 00:11:35,520
Um, yeah, you can do that without having him touch your fucking penis.

263
00:11:35,520 --> 00:11:38,520
Like, that's, that's disgusting.

264
00:11:38,520 --> 00:11:39,520
That is disgusting.

265
00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:43,920
She's essentially, like, exposed him to sexual fucking things immediately.

266
00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:46,160
Like, she's, like, sexually abused my son.

267
00:11:46,160 --> 00:11:47,160
Yeah, exactly.

268
00:11:47,160 --> 00:11:49,520
I mean, there's no other way to cut it.

269
00:11:49,520 --> 00:11:53,720
So of course the couple were speechless, did not allow this to happen, and immediately

270
00:11:53,720 --> 00:11:54,720
contacted police.

271
00:11:54,720 --> 00:11:58,440
They were like, uh, yeah, this is fucking wild and out over here.

272
00:11:58,440 --> 00:12:03,280
Do you think that she was trying to encourage them to just take the baby?

273
00:12:03,280 --> 00:12:06,080
Um, I'm not sure if she was.

274
00:12:06,080 --> 00:12:08,520
I don't really think she cared either way.

275
00:12:08,520 --> 00:12:11,320
Like, I think that she was like, yeah, if he's with me, he's with me.

276
00:12:11,320 --> 00:12:14,080
But if he stays with you guys, then like, sure, but like, just make sure you, like,

277
00:12:14,080 --> 00:12:15,080
let him touch your dick.

278
00:12:15,080 --> 00:12:21,040
Well, like, in very sick cases, parents will use their children to, for drugs.

279
00:12:21,040 --> 00:12:22,040
Yeah.

280
00:12:22,040 --> 00:12:23,280
Trading, like, stuff like that.

281
00:12:23,280 --> 00:12:26,080
Um, or whatever, or just because they don't give a shit.

282
00:12:26,080 --> 00:12:27,080
Yeah.

283
00:12:27,080 --> 00:12:30,600
And so I'm wondering if in her mind she wasn't, like, trying to entice them to, like, keep

284
00:12:30,600 --> 00:12:31,600
him.

285
00:12:31,600 --> 00:12:32,600
I'm not sure.

286
00:12:32,600 --> 00:12:36,800
Either way, he does eventually leave her care, so I think maybe, I mean, you could be

287
00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:37,800
right.

288
00:12:37,800 --> 00:12:41,920
But I would say exactly what her goal was other than, like, teaching him about male

289
00:12:41,920 --> 00:12:44,440
parts, which is not the fucking real thing.

290
00:12:44,440 --> 00:12:45,440
Yeah.

291
00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:46,440
You know what I mean?

292
00:12:46,440 --> 00:12:47,440
That's just what she said.

293
00:12:47,440 --> 00:12:48,440
Because books don't exist.

294
00:12:48,440 --> 00:12:49,440
Yeah, exactly.

295
00:12:49,440 --> 00:12:51,800
So the couple did contact police, but nothing came of it.

296
00:12:51,800 --> 00:12:54,280
Like, they just kind of said, like, oh, don't do that bad.

297
00:12:54,280 --> 00:12:55,640
Like, that was it.

298
00:12:55,640 --> 00:12:56,640
Go home.

299
00:12:56,640 --> 00:12:57,640
Yeah, exactly.

300
00:12:57,640 --> 00:12:58,640
Have a good one.

301
00:12:58,640 --> 00:13:02,560
Now, young Anders was noted as being extremely different from other kiddos.

302
00:13:02,560 --> 00:13:09,040
And his hobbies included things like snapping the heads off of roses, killing ants, throwing

303
00:13:09,040 --> 00:13:11,600
rocks at windows, etc.

304
00:13:11,600 --> 00:13:13,840
A normal child would be a behavior.

305
00:13:13,840 --> 00:13:14,840
Just antics.

306
00:13:14,840 --> 00:13:16,840
Well, normal rage-filled child, and I wonder why.

307
00:13:16,840 --> 00:13:20,640
Because your mom's fucking not taking care of you.

308
00:13:20,640 --> 00:13:27,120
He would find rats to keep as pets, but he would be frequently found, like, poking them

309
00:13:27,120 --> 00:13:29,760
with, like, various objects, like, pencils.

310
00:13:29,760 --> 00:13:32,760
Which is not funny, I'm sorry.

311
00:13:32,760 --> 00:13:39,520
It just reminds me of, like, me sad of a family guy they found like a dead body.

312
00:13:39,520 --> 00:13:41,240
He's like, poke it with a stick.

313
00:13:41,240 --> 00:13:42,720
Poke it with a stick.

314
00:13:42,720 --> 00:13:43,720
It's terrible.

315
00:13:43,720 --> 00:13:45,200
Anyway, so yeah, he did that.

316
00:13:45,200 --> 00:13:50,080
So when Anders was just four years old, there were two different reports filed expressing

317
00:13:50,080 --> 00:13:52,080
concerns about his mental health.

318
00:13:52,080 --> 00:13:53,080
Okay.

319
00:13:53,080 --> 00:13:54,080
Four?

320
00:13:54,080 --> 00:13:55,080
Yes.

321
00:13:55,080 --> 00:13:59,720
It seems as though the reports came from neighbors, the same ones that noticed Venka's absence.

322
00:13:59,720 --> 00:14:03,760
It was like the same neighbors that noticed him poking rats with sticks.

323
00:14:03,760 --> 00:14:04,760
Probably so as well.

324
00:14:04,760 --> 00:14:09,280
But they would essentially, like, encourage Venka, like, to take him to get evaluated.

325
00:14:09,280 --> 00:14:10,280
Yeah.

326
00:14:10,280 --> 00:14:14,600
So either way, he was taken to be evaluated by psychologists at age four.

327
00:14:14,600 --> 00:14:19,400
In one report, a psychologist made a note of the boy's peculiar smile, suggesting that

328
00:14:19,400 --> 00:14:25,240
he was not smiling due to any emotion, but rather as, like, a seemingly deliberate response

329
00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:26,520
to his environment.

330
00:14:26,520 --> 00:14:27,520
Like doopers?

331
00:14:27,520 --> 00:14:28,520
Yes.

332
00:14:28,520 --> 00:14:32,200
He's smiling because he knows that you want him to smile, kind of.

333
00:14:32,200 --> 00:14:35,040
Which is like, so essentially, yeah, he was faking it.

334
00:14:35,040 --> 00:14:36,040
At age four.

335
00:14:36,040 --> 00:14:37,040
At age four.

336
00:14:37,040 --> 00:14:38,040
Nuts.

337
00:14:38,040 --> 00:14:42,600
It was noted that he would have long phases of emotional voidness only to be met with

338
00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:45,360
a huge outburst after the dissociation.

339
00:14:45,360 --> 00:14:46,800
Do you think, like, bipolar?

340
00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:48,280
Well, I don't know.

341
00:14:48,280 --> 00:14:49,600
He was, like, really zoning out.

342
00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:54,880
I think it, I mean, I think it was a defense mechanism zoning out and then you can no longer

343
00:14:54,880 --> 00:14:58,800
control those emotions for so long, it just all comes out at once.

344
00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:05,360
Like maybe precursor for DID, like trying to dissociate and then come back, like.

345
00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:07,200
I'm really not sure, but maybe.

346
00:15:07,200 --> 00:15:08,200
That's very strange.

347
00:15:08,200 --> 00:15:09,200
Yeah.

348
00:15:09,200 --> 00:15:10,200
Especially at such a young age, too.

349
00:15:10,200 --> 00:15:11,200
Right.

350
00:15:11,200 --> 00:15:15,520
So it kind of became clear to the psychologist that he was not allowed at home to express

351
00:15:15,520 --> 00:15:20,080
his emotions, so he kind of never learned how to, which is really sad.

352
00:15:20,080 --> 00:15:22,200
Do you remember Child of Rage?

353
00:15:22,200 --> 00:15:27,720
It was like this little girl, her name was Beth Thomas, and she was, like, highly abused

354
00:15:27,720 --> 00:15:29,440
when she was a little girl.

355
00:15:29,440 --> 00:15:32,000
And there's, like, all these interviews with her where she's talking about how she wants

356
00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:34,280
to, like, murder people and kill people.

357
00:15:34,280 --> 00:15:35,280
Jesus.

358
00:15:35,280 --> 00:15:37,920
Yeah, at a very, again, a very young age.

359
00:15:37,920 --> 00:15:42,120
And, but she grew up, and she's, like, a psychologist now, I think, or a child psychologist.

360
00:15:42,120 --> 00:15:43,120
It's for her.

361
00:15:43,120 --> 00:15:47,480
Seriously, Beth Thomas, and she's a huge success story, but there are videos of her.

362
00:15:47,480 --> 00:15:49,880
I'm surprised that you don't remember this, but.

363
00:15:49,880 --> 00:15:50,880
Yeah.

364
00:15:50,880 --> 00:15:55,040
I remember one of the first psychology courses I took.

365
00:15:55,040 --> 00:15:58,720
It's like a 30 to 40 minute clip of an interview with her.

366
00:15:58,720 --> 00:16:03,480
But yeah, Googler, because it's really interesting, but that's what this kind of sounds like, is

367
00:16:03,480 --> 00:16:09,720
that at a very young age, they've just been abused so much or exposed to so much and not,

368
00:16:09,720 --> 00:16:16,600
like, given good nurturing, you know, of any type of real substance, and they just, their

369
00:16:16,600 --> 00:16:17,600
brains break.

370
00:16:17,600 --> 00:16:18,600
Yeah.

371
00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:21,760
You know, you're not a positive adult role model in your life at all.

372
00:16:21,760 --> 00:16:24,760
Like, even the family, there's that couple he was staying with on the weekends, like,

373
00:16:24,760 --> 00:16:28,160
who knows how quick that ended, because of what his mom did.

374
00:16:28,160 --> 00:16:32,120
So, again, it became clear he wasn't allowed to express his emotions.

375
00:16:32,120 --> 00:16:36,320
In another report from Norway's National Center for Child and Adolescent Psychiatry,

376
00:16:36,320 --> 00:16:41,280
helpful, concerns arose about the way his mother was treating him, even in public.

377
00:16:41,280 --> 00:16:42,280
Hmm.

378
00:16:42,280 --> 00:16:46,840
So, the report stated that she had sexualized Anders, hit him, and frequently told him that

379
00:16:46,840 --> 00:16:50,200
she wished he was dead, which is fucked up.

380
00:16:50,200 --> 00:16:52,120
That's so fucked up.

381
00:16:52,120 --> 00:16:58,040
Why wouldn't she go to, like, an adoption agency or, like, a, you know, what are those,

382
00:16:58,040 --> 00:17:00,160
they call them safe havens?

383
00:17:00,160 --> 00:17:01,160
Safe havens, yeah.

384
00:17:01,160 --> 00:17:06,200
I don't know, she's also undiagnosed, not undiagnosed, untreated, mentally ill as well,

385
00:17:06,200 --> 00:17:08,840
you know, it's just, it's a bunch of untreated shit.

386
00:17:08,840 --> 00:17:13,560
She just felt like she just had to, like, I have to be a mom.

387
00:17:13,560 --> 00:17:18,280
Also in the report, Venka is described as being, quote, a woman with an extremely difficult

388
00:17:18,280 --> 00:17:23,360
upbringing, borderline personality disorder, and an all-encompassing, if only partially

389
00:17:23,360 --> 00:17:24,880
visible, depression.

390
00:17:24,880 --> 00:17:27,640
So, she's got her own shit going on.

391
00:17:27,640 --> 00:17:28,800
Yeah, across the gambit here.

392
00:17:28,800 --> 00:17:32,200
She's not worried about Anders, I guess, and she's clearly not worried about his well-being,

393
00:17:32,200 --> 00:17:33,200
if at all.

394
00:17:33,200 --> 00:17:34,960
Yeah, she's not getting any treatment.

395
00:17:34,960 --> 00:17:35,960
Exactly.

396
00:17:35,960 --> 00:17:39,920
They also added that she, quote, projects her primitive, aggressive, and sexual fantasies

397
00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:41,440
onto Anders.

398
00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:42,440
Like lizard brain?

399
00:17:42,440 --> 00:17:43,880
I don't know, actually.

400
00:17:43,880 --> 00:17:44,880
You know, like...

401
00:17:44,880 --> 00:17:46,400
It doesn't seem like it was, I mean...

402
00:17:46,400 --> 00:17:49,720
Prefrontal cortex, if she was going on here.

403
00:17:49,720 --> 00:17:55,120
Also stated in the report, quote, Anders is a victim of his mother's projections of paranoid

404
00:17:55,120 --> 00:17:58,440
aggressive and sexual fears towards men in general.

405
00:17:58,440 --> 00:18:02,760
She projects onto him her own primitive, aggressive, and sexual fantasies, all the

406
00:18:02,760 --> 00:18:06,720
qualities in men that she regards as dangerous and aggressive.

407
00:18:06,720 --> 00:18:08,240
But he's four.

408
00:18:08,240 --> 00:18:12,400
So, leaves her husband, she can't deal with the lifestyle.

409
00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:16,960
You're four, you're a boy, biologically, so now you're the enemy just because you were

410
00:18:16,960 --> 00:18:18,480
born male.

411
00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:21,480
And you're a fucking child, but I'm not even gonna fucking mention that part.

412
00:18:21,480 --> 00:18:24,360
I'm just gonna take out all my aggressions of men on you.

413
00:18:24,360 --> 00:18:25,360
Yeah.

414
00:18:25,360 --> 00:18:26,360
Because it's his fault, right?

415
00:18:26,360 --> 00:18:27,360
It's just working.

416
00:18:27,360 --> 00:18:28,600
It's his kid.

417
00:18:28,600 --> 00:18:33,080
The findings of the report also determined that Anders needed to be immediately, forcibly

418
00:18:33,080 --> 00:18:37,080
removed from his mother's care and placed into foster care, and that she was extremely

419
00:18:37,080 --> 00:18:40,240
emotionally and psychologically abusive towards him.

420
00:18:40,240 --> 00:18:44,600
The conclusion in the report stated, quote, the family is in dire need of help.

421
00:18:44,600 --> 00:18:47,840
Anders should be removed from the family and given a better standard of care.

422
00:18:47,840 --> 00:18:52,200
The mother is provoked by him and remains in an ambivalent position when prevents him,

423
00:18:52,200 --> 00:18:55,000
which prevents him from developing on his own terms.

424
00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:58,720
Anders has become an anxious, passive child that averts making contact.

425
00:18:58,720 --> 00:19:02,960
He displays a manic defense mechanism of restless activity and a feigned, deflecting

426
00:19:02,960 --> 00:19:04,440
smile.

427
00:19:04,440 --> 00:19:08,440
Considering the profoundly pathological relationship between Anders and his mother, it is crucial

428
00:19:08,440 --> 00:19:12,960
to make an early effort to ward off a severely skewed development in the boy.

429
00:19:12,960 --> 00:19:13,960
God.

430
00:19:13,960 --> 00:19:15,360
Damn, my drop.

431
00:19:15,360 --> 00:19:18,040
Remember that, okay?

432
00:19:18,040 --> 00:19:23,200
This suggestion, however, was never carried out by the Child Welfare Service, and instead,

433
00:19:23,200 --> 00:19:27,200
Anders was placed in respite care only during the weekends again.

434
00:19:27,200 --> 00:19:28,440
Just the weekends again?

435
00:19:28,440 --> 00:19:29,440
Just what it was?

436
00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:35,000
Like, do you have all these findings, all of this evidence, all of these suggestions?

437
00:19:35,000 --> 00:19:38,520
Uh, well, let's go back to what we were doing already.

438
00:19:38,520 --> 00:19:42,920
And it's like, okay, the psychologist, like, or a psychiatrist, excuse me, at this point,

439
00:19:42,920 --> 00:19:46,080
it kind of seems like all they can do is just suggest something.

440
00:19:46,080 --> 00:19:47,720
They can't forcibly remove him.

441
00:19:47,720 --> 00:19:52,480
All they can do is suggest that he be forcibly removed because the Child Welfare Service essentially

442
00:19:52,480 --> 00:19:53,880
has like jurisdiction.

443
00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:54,880
Yeah.

444
00:19:54,880 --> 00:19:56,560
So they're just like, oh, whatever, he'll be fine.

445
00:19:56,560 --> 00:19:57,720
He's with his mom.

446
00:19:57,720 --> 00:19:58,720
He's smiling.

447
00:19:58,720 --> 00:19:59,720
Look at him, he's smiling.

448
00:19:59,720 --> 00:20:00,720
He's smiling.

449
00:20:00,720 --> 00:20:01,720
He's so happy, he's smiling.

450
00:20:01,720 --> 00:20:05,120
You are not a fucking psychiatrist for a reason.

451
00:20:05,120 --> 00:20:08,640
The facility hoped that he would eventually be placed into foster care.

452
00:20:08,640 --> 00:20:12,360
We'll just let it slide until he's eventually placed.

453
00:20:12,360 --> 00:20:14,880
That's awful.

454
00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:19,360
Despite this horrible miscarriage of justice, once Yen learned of this happening, I keep

455
00:20:19,360 --> 00:20:23,840
saying Yen, once Yen's learned of this happening, he filed for custody of Anders.

456
00:20:23,840 --> 00:20:24,840
Good.

457
00:20:24,840 --> 00:20:29,400
Although Venke was completely fine with Anders being in respite care and potentially foster

458
00:20:29,400 --> 00:20:33,800
care, when she learned that Yen's filed for custody, she immediately tried to gain custody

459
00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:34,800
back for herself.

460
00:20:34,800 --> 00:20:35,800
Ew.

461
00:20:35,800 --> 00:20:36,800
Okay, so she enjoys this.

462
00:20:36,800 --> 00:20:41,160
This isn't just like, yeah, she enjoys this.

463
00:20:41,160 --> 00:20:42,600
She absolutely enjoys this.

464
00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:44,640
This is something that is therapeutic for her.

465
00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:46,360
Yeah, which is gross.

466
00:20:46,360 --> 00:20:47,360
It's gross.

467
00:20:47,360 --> 00:20:51,240
Both of the parents would eventually involve lawyers in this, but the case would eventually

468
00:20:51,240 --> 00:20:56,080
be dropped because the Welfare Services did not think they were going to be able to prove

469
00:20:56,080 --> 00:21:03,200
enough evidence in court to warrant the placement of Anders in foster care.

470
00:21:03,200 --> 00:21:04,200
Come again?

471
00:21:04,200 --> 00:21:05,200
What?

472
00:21:05,200 --> 00:21:10,600
What's the purpose in having the evaluations then, if they're not even going to use this

473
00:21:10,600 --> 00:21:11,600
evidence?

474
00:21:11,600 --> 00:21:12,600
Thank you.

475
00:21:12,600 --> 00:21:13,600
What's the purpose?

476
00:21:13,600 --> 00:21:14,600
It's ridiculous.

477
00:21:14,600 --> 00:21:17,760
So they said that one of the main reasons they thought that they weren't going to have

478
00:21:17,760 --> 00:21:23,120
a good case was the fact that staff from a nursery that Anders had been attending for

479
00:21:23,120 --> 00:21:28,760
a few years prior testified that he was a happy child and nothing was wrong with him.

480
00:21:28,760 --> 00:21:31,640
Because they're fucking psychiatrist, right?

481
00:21:31,640 --> 00:21:32,640
Like, what?

482
00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:33,640
Oh my god.

483
00:21:33,640 --> 00:21:36,520
Look, he knows how to play.

484
00:21:36,520 --> 00:21:37,520
He's smiling.

485
00:21:37,520 --> 00:21:38,520
Look at him.

486
00:21:38,520 --> 00:21:41,040
He's smiling as he's killing those ants and poking those rats.

487
00:21:41,040 --> 00:21:42,040
He's smiling.

488
00:21:42,040 --> 00:21:43,040
Right at me.

489
00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:44,040
When I asked him a question, he looked right at me.

490
00:21:44,040 --> 00:21:45,040
He looked right at me.

491
00:21:45,040 --> 00:21:46,040
He can hear.

492
00:21:46,040 --> 00:21:47,040
He's fine.

493
00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:48,040
He's fine.

494
00:21:48,040 --> 00:21:50,360
There's no physical abuse signs on him.

495
00:21:50,360 --> 00:21:54,760
It's just emotional and mental abuse, which is terrible just as bad, but the fucking people

496
00:21:54,760 --> 00:21:58,440
at the nursery aren't going to notice that just because he doesn't have a broken arm.

497
00:21:58,440 --> 00:21:59,440
Yeah.

498
00:21:59,440 --> 00:22:00,960
It's almost like they should have gotten him evaluated or something.

499
00:22:00,960 --> 00:22:01,960
Oh wait.

500
00:22:01,960 --> 00:22:02,960
They fucking did.

501
00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:05,920
And then you didn't take the advice of the psychiatrist.

502
00:22:05,920 --> 00:22:13,640
I think that these people in the child welfare services should have been held liable.

503
00:22:13,640 --> 00:22:14,640
What happens later?

504
00:22:14,640 --> 00:22:16,200
Oh, I always believe in that shit.

505
00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:17,200
Yeah.

506
00:22:17,200 --> 00:22:18,200
Fucking dumbasses.

507
00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:19,200
Dummy.

508
00:22:19,200 --> 00:22:20,200
Dummy.

509
00:22:20,200 --> 00:22:24,400
Now during the court proceedings, the psychiatrist unit maintained their stance from the reports

510
00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:29,000
that the psych eval stated that urgent action was needed to remove him from the care of his

511
00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:34,360
mother and a letter was even written to child welfare to urge them to have an order placed

512
00:22:34,360 --> 00:22:37,400
that he needed to be forcefully removed from her custody.

513
00:22:37,400 --> 00:22:38,400
Right?

514
00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:40,400
The letter didn't result in anything.

515
00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:45,600
And the child welfare service lost the case.

516
00:22:45,600 --> 00:22:47,200
Like their whole job.

517
00:22:47,200 --> 00:22:48,600
This is their job.

518
00:22:48,600 --> 00:22:53,840
It came out much later that the agency was being represented by a social worker with

519
00:22:53,840 --> 00:22:57,600
no experience of representing a case in front of a committee.

520
00:22:57,600 --> 00:22:58,600
What?

521
00:22:58,600 --> 00:23:04,960
So they literally gave less of a shit than a fucking microscope thing.

522
00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:10,160
They just put some guy that had no experience out there to put the fucking fate of a four

523
00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:14,640
year old in his hands and he fucking didn't know what he was doing, probably not his fault.

524
00:23:14,640 --> 00:23:18,120
He just got thrown out there and they fucking lost the case.

525
00:23:18,120 --> 00:23:22,480
So in closing, it was ruled that Anders would remain in the care of his mother.

526
00:23:22,480 --> 00:23:24,680
But the family would be supervised.

527
00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:27,640
That's what I was gonna say with no supervision though.

528
00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:29,800
Well they said we're gonna supervise her.

529
00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:31,720
This is what's gonna move forward.

530
00:23:31,720 --> 00:23:33,920
However, you're gonna love this.

531
00:23:33,920 --> 00:23:34,920
After only three visits.

532
00:23:34,920 --> 00:23:38,240
It was a guy that was like taking a nap every time you go over there or what?

533
00:23:38,240 --> 00:23:41,440
After only three visits, the supervision was discontinued.

534
00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:42,440
Three visits?

535
00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:46,200
And Anders would not even return to respite or foster care after this.

536
00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:48,840
Just stayed with his mom.

537
00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:50,880
Until he was old enough to move out?

538
00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:53,240
Well, we'll see.

539
00:23:53,240 --> 00:23:58,920
So after all this shit, Anders is stuck under the same fucking roof with the woman that

540
00:23:58,920 --> 00:23:59,920
has caused this.

541
00:23:59,920 --> 00:24:00,920
That's abusing him.

542
00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:01,920
Yeah.

543
00:24:01,920 --> 00:24:02,920
Yeah.

544
00:24:02,920 --> 00:24:03,920
He's abuser.

545
00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:07,720
Continuing to live in an abusive household, Anders went to school and continued his antics,

546
00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:11,520
despite concerns being brought up during his evaluations, like we said.

547
00:24:11,520 --> 00:24:14,600
And it's arguably not his fucking fault at all.

548
00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:16,240
You know that he's hurting animals and stuff.

549
00:24:16,240 --> 00:24:17,240
He doesn't know any fucking better.

550
00:24:17,240 --> 00:24:19,640
He thinks that that's what you do to people or things, you know?

551
00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:21,560
Yeah, you hurt them.

552
00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:25,120
While Anders was a young boy in grade school, a fellow classmate recalled that he really

553
00:24:25,120 --> 00:24:28,880
enjoyed bullying other children and making people very upset.

554
00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:30,720
He's probably smiling when he did it too.

555
00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:32,240
So he's nice.

556
00:24:32,240 --> 00:24:35,920
This student, whose name was not mentioned, stated about this quote, if he could make

557
00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:39,800
someone cry, he would gloat and his eyes would sparkle.

558
00:24:39,800 --> 00:24:40,800
He's just a happy little boy.

559
00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:42,280
He's just a happy boy.

560
00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:46,800
Ironically, while attending junior high at Hart's Vigneson's Upper Secondary School,

561
00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:50,800
and also Commerce School, thank you, also into the most...

562
00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:51,800
Also.

563
00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:54,800
The easiest to learn.

564
00:24:54,800 --> 00:24:59,240
A former classmate of his recalled about Anders that he was a very intelligent student,

565
00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:02,880
and while he was much bigger physically than other students, he would often stick up for

566
00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:05,280
kids that were being bullied.

567
00:25:05,280 --> 00:25:08,680
So this is like two different testimonies from two different... peers from two different

568
00:25:08,680 --> 00:25:09,680
schools.

569
00:25:09,680 --> 00:25:16,520
He's probably looking for any fight, whether it be like him bullying someone or him protecting

570
00:25:16,520 --> 00:25:17,520
someone from a bully.

571
00:25:17,520 --> 00:25:18,520
Either way, he's looking for a fight.

572
00:25:18,520 --> 00:25:19,520
That's a good point, actually.

573
00:25:19,520 --> 00:25:22,320
I didn't think about it that way, but you're probably right.

574
00:25:22,320 --> 00:25:25,760
Or I don't know, maybe he was like one last ditch effort to be nice and then it fucking

575
00:25:25,760 --> 00:25:28,280
backfired again, you know?

576
00:25:28,280 --> 00:25:33,880
At age 13, Anders briefly became part of a gang, and he was known to graffiti often.

577
00:25:33,880 --> 00:25:34,880
Oh.

578
00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:35,880
He was a tagger.

579
00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:36,880
He was a tagger.

580
00:25:36,880 --> 00:25:39,240
He's known to graffiti often.

581
00:25:39,240 --> 00:25:41,120
His tag name was morg.

582
00:25:41,120 --> 00:25:42,120
Morg?

583
00:25:42,120 --> 00:25:43,120
M-O-R-G?

584
00:25:43,120 --> 00:25:44,120
Morg?

585
00:25:44,120 --> 00:25:46,920
And he would tag this name on anything that he tagged.

586
00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:51,120
It wasn't like morg, like... like a morg?

587
00:25:51,120 --> 00:25:52,120
No.

588
00:25:52,120 --> 00:25:57,520
He actually named himself that after an executioner in a Marvel comic who murders his own people.

589
00:25:57,520 --> 00:26:01,720
I didn't really look into that, but yeah, he's just like an executioner.

590
00:26:01,720 --> 00:26:04,360
I thought you meant like a morg, like where you keep bodies.

591
00:26:04,360 --> 00:26:05,360
No.

592
00:26:05,360 --> 00:26:07,360
That would be like pretty cool, but you won't get that far.

593
00:26:07,360 --> 00:26:09,360
Did I say that already?

594
00:26:09,360 --> 00:26:11,360
I don't know.

595
00:26:11,360 --> 00:26:12,360
Okay.

596
00:26:12,360 --> 00:26:17,960
Anyway, so he was known as taking his graffiti much more seriously than his friends, who

597
00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:22,280
also partook, and he was even caught by the police on several occasions for tagging.

598
00:26:22,280 --> 00:26:24,120
Like he was like a big old tagger.

599
00:26:24,120 --> 00:26:25,120
Oh, morg.

600
00:26:25,120 --> 00:26:26,120
Watch out for morg.

601
00:26:26,120 --> 00:26:27,120
Watch out for morg.

602
00:26:27,120 --> 00:26:32,480
Child welfare services were notified again, because he's only like 13 or 14 at this time,

603
00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:36,640
and he was fined on two different occasions for tagging.

604
00:26:36,640 --> 00:26:41,600
Once again, nothing was done by Child Welfare Services to assist Anders and his clear downward

605
00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:42,720
spiral.

606
00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:44,600
And they have fucking files, right?

607
00:26:44,600 --> 00:26:45,600
They have to have files.

608
00:26:45,600 --> 00:26:46,600
Yeah, they have an entire-

609
00:26:46,600 --> 00:26:49,320
Some time sure when they found him or fined him, they were like, oh, this kid has a long

610
00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:50,320
fucking record.

611
00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:51,320
Yeah.

612
00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:52,320
Pass it on to the next person.

613
00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:53,320
Thank you very much.

614
00:26:53,320 --> 00:26:54,320
Double it and what is it?

615
00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:56,560
Double it and he goes to the next person.

616
00:26:56,560 --> 00:27:01,360
According to Venke, Jens seized communication with Anders when he was just 15, and after

617
00:27:01,360 --> 00:27:05,160
he had been caught and fined for one of his graffiti antics in 1995.

618
00:27:05,160 --> 00:27:08,160
So Jens is like, oh, you're criminal in the making.

619
00:27:08,160 --> 00:27:09,160
I don't want anything to do with you.

620
00:27:09,160 --> 00:27:10,160
Yeah, of course.

621
00:27:10,160 --> 00:27:14,080
Well, it was reported that the two had not been in contact since then, but Jens had a

622
00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:15,880
much different story.

623
00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:20,320
He claims that it was Anders who originally cut off contact, stating, quote, I was always

624
00:27:20,320 --> 00:27:23,960
willing to see Anders, unquote, despite his poor behavior.

625
00:27:23,960 --> 00:27:29,160
Well, willing is different than making a concentrated effort to go spend time with your biological

626
00:27:29,160 --> 00:27:30,160
child.

627
00:27:30,160 --> 00:27:33,000
Yeah, so it's kind of unclear whether or not it was the dad that was like, I don't want

628
00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:35,840
anything to do with that or Anders just kind of like didn't reach out.

629
00:27:35,840 --> 00:27:39,120
But then again, Anders is the child here, so you know, you can't really travel to fucking

630
00:27:39,120 --> 00:27:40,520
Paris.

631
00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:46,840
I said biological, but for any parent, any care person, person that you care for.

632
00:27:46,840 --> 00:27:51,160
So at this age as well, so again, he's 15, Anders would leave the gang he had been affiliated

633
00:27:51,160 --> 00:27:54,880
with and joined a different group of people, Norway's Progress Party.

634
00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:56,120
Oh, okay.

635
00:27:56,120 --> 00:28:00,760
This was an anti socialist, anti tax, an anti immigrant group that was very politically

636
00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:03,000
involved and motivated.

637
00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:04,400
So we all kind of see this a lot.

638
00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:06,480
They always get like really radical groups.

639
00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:07,480
Yeah.

640
00:28:07,480 --> 00:28:08,480
Well, a sense of belonging, right?

641
00:28:08,480 --> 00:28:09,480
Yeah, exactly.

642
00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:11,480
We saw that in the Timothy McVeigh case as well.

643
00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:12,480
Yeah, definitely.

644
00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:16,000
Around this same time as well, Anders would spend his spare time on weight training and

645
00:28:16,000 --> 00:28:18,120
would begin to use anabolic steroids.

646
00:28:18,120 --> 00:28:19,120
Yeah.

647
00:28:19,120 --> 00:28:20,880
This is if he wasn't already bigger than everyone.

648
00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:21,880
Yeah.

649
00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:25,280
He began to focus a lot on his image and he would frequently talk negatively about people

650
00:28:25,280 --> 00:28:26,280
that didn't.

651
00:28:26,280 --> 00:28:27,280
He's like, normal.

652
00:28:27,280 --> 00:28:30,280
He wouldn't say normal, but he would be like, fuck, no.

653
00:28:30,280 --> 00:28:31,280
Fuck, ignore me.

654
00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:32,280
Yeah.

655
00:28:32,280 --> 00:28:33,280
So I don't know.

656
00:28:33,280 --> 00:28:36,280
He would just be like, oh, you're not worried about your health, your food news.

657
00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:37,280
How much you bench, bro?

658
00:28:37,280 --> 00:28:39,000
Yeah, things like that.

659
00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:44,680
By the age of 18, he had risen to the post of deputy chairman on the Oslo West Youth

660
00:28:44,680 --> 00:28:46,160
Wing of the Progress Party.

661
00:28:46,160 --> 00:28:48,200
So it's kind of like in a higher position.

662
00:28:48,200 --> 00:28:51,920
Now I wanted to bring up this point because people listening in other countries might

663
00:28:51,920 --> 00:28:56,360
be confused as to why he was not placed in conscription.

664
00:28:56,360 --> 00:29:01,360
So conscription in Norway means that all men and women between the ages of 19 and 44 are

665
00:29:01,360 --> 00:29:04,040
required to conduct military service for 19 months.

666
00:29:04,040 --> 00:29:05,040
Oh, okay.

667
00:29:05,040 --> 00:29:07,520
Essentially it's the same thing as men in the United States signing up for the draft

668
00:29:07,520 --> 00:29:09,240
when they turn 18.

669
00:29:09,240 --> 00:29:13,760
The Norwegian Defense Security Department, which conducts the vetting process for conscription,

670
00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:17,560
stated about Anders personally that he was deemed quote, unfit for service.

671
00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:18,560
Okay.

672
00:29:18,560 --> 00:29:20,520
So he wouldn't have been required to join the draft.

673
00:29:20,520 --> 00:29:21,520
Mm-hmm.

674
00:29:21,520 --> 00:29:22,520
Draft.

675
00:29:22,520 --> 00:29:25,880
And he was also not flagged for being unfit regardless of his past, which is weird.

676
00:29:25,880 --> 00:29:26,880
Okay.

677
00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:33,880
So he wasn't like, when I say he wasn't flagged, I mean he wasn't unfit enough to be like needing

678
00:29:33,880 --> 00:29:38,560
more treatment, but he also wasn't fit enough to have been required to join the military.

679
00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:39,560
Don't give him a gun.

680
00:29:39,560 --> 00:29:40,560
Yeah, exactly.

681
00:29:40,560 --> 00:29:41,560
Funny.

682
00:29:41,560 --> 00:29:44,480
You're funny.

683
00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:48,440
So using his newfound position in the political party, Anders decided that he wanted to try

684
00:29:48,440 --> 00:29:53,080
and run for a higher power and tried to maintain a position in a city election.

685
00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:54,080
Okay.

686
00:29:54,080 --> 00:30:00,080
So personally for him, others saw him as sort of unhinged and unpredictable and he was unable

687
00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:02,440
to reach any higher position than he was already in.

688
00:30:02,440 --> 00:30:04,080
Yeah, he's just a meathead.

689
00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:05,080
Yeah.

690
00:30:05,080 --> 00:30:12,240
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691
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693
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696
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697
00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:40,480
I mean he's also like seriously mentally ill.

698
00:30:40,480 --> 00:30:41,480
Yeah.

699
00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:43,040
It's a fact, you know.

700
00:30:43,040 --> 00:30:47,200
And it's terrible, but I mean thankfully people were able to recognize that and not

701
00:30:47,200 --> 00:30:49,320
give him, put him in a position of power.

702
00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:50,320
Yeah.

703
00:30:50,320 --> 00:30:53,880
So at the age of 21, I mean shit he still fucking does whatever he wants, but at the

704
00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:59,080
age of 21, Anders would work in customer service for a company that declined to be named, working

705
00:30:59,080 --> 00:31:04,400
with quote people from all countries and being quote kind to everyone.

706
00:31:04,400 --> 00:31:05,800
Is it like a call center or something?

707
00:31:05,800 --> 00:31:06,800
Yeah, essentially.

708
00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:07,800
Yeah.

709
00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:11,920
A former coworker would even describe Anders at this time as being a quote exceptional

710
00:31:11,920 --> 00:31:16,360
colleague, although his friends would refer to him as having somewhat of a big ego.

711
00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:17,360
Okay.

712
00:31:17,360 --> 00:31:21,200
So again, putting on this mask for people that he doesn't know very well, kind of letting

713
00:31:21,200 --> 00:31:22,800
his guard down in front of his friends.

714
00:31:22,800 --> 00:31:23,800
Yeah.

715
00:31:23,800 --> 00:31:25,800
Same thing when he did with the psychiatrists years before.

716
00:31:25,800 --> 00:31:26,800
Yeah.

717
00:31:26,800 --> 00:31:27,800
Or the bullies.

718
00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:28,800
Yes.

719
00:31:28,800 --> 00:31:32,040
According to other friends of his, Anders would undergo multiple cosmetic surgeries

720
00:31:32,040 --> 00:31:37,960
in his early 20s, changing his chin, nose, and forehead, but he was ultimately very pleased

721
00:31:37,960 --> 00:31:39,680
with his decision.

722
00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:45,400
So I think when we first did this suggestion, I first read the message, we looked at a picture

723
00:31:45,400 --> 00:31:48,720
of him and I was like, Oh my God, he looks like a domestic terrorist.

724
00:31:48,720 --> 00:31:52,320
I need to Google him because I don't know what he looks like.

725
00:31:52,320 --> 00:31:55,280
Let me show you because I don't want you to Google him and then see what he did.

726
00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:56,280
Oh, I see.

727
00:31:56,280 --> 00:31:57,280
Pause.

728
00:31:57,280 --> 00:31:59,800
Well, first of all, I'm terrified.

729
00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:00,800
Oh, no.

730
00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:01,800
Okay.

731
00:32:01,800 --> 00:32:03,680
That's not the picture I was going to show you.

732
00:32:03,680 --> 00:32:04,680
Oh, that's him.

733
00:32:04,680 --> 00:32:05,680
He's doing the Nazi salute in that photo.

734
00:32:05,680 --> 00:32:06,680
That's terrible.

735
00:32:06,680 --> 00:32:07,680
In court.

736
00:32:07,680 --> 00:32:08,680
Yeah.

737
00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:09,920
I mean, like you got to mention that it's in court.

738
00:32:09,920 --> 00:32:10,920
Yeah.

739
00:32:10,920 --> 00:32:11,920
I'll say it later.

740
00:32:11,920 --> 00:32:14,000
But I mean, like you can see he's had some work done on his face.

741
00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:16,240
He looks like he looks like AI almost.

742
00:32:16,240 --> 00:32:17,240
Yeah.

743
00:32:17,240 --> 00:32:21,880
He looks like he would be Elon Musk's like if Elon Musk and Vladimir Putin had a baby,

744
00:32:21,880 --> 00:32:22,880
that's what he looks like.

745
00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:23,880
He doesn't look real.

746
00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:24,880
Doesn't look real.

747
00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:25,880
Yeah.

748
00:32:25,880 --> 00:32:30,200
He does look like those AI, those automatic generated like pictures of someone.

749
00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:32,000
But he was like, girl, I'm popping.

750
00:32:32,000 --> 00:32:33,000
Like I look good.

751
00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:34,000
I don't need hair.

752
00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:35,880
I was going to say, did he have hair then?

753
00:32:35,880 --> 00:32:36,880
I'm sure he did.

754
00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:39,200
It was in his early 20s, but he doesn't have hair now.

755
00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:43,920
So it's unclear what specifically made onters want to harm other people intentionally instead

756
00:32:43,920 --> 00:32:45,440
of just animals and stuff.

757
00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:52,240
But what we do know is that in 2002, he began what would become a nine year plan to commit

758
00:32:52,240 --> 00:32:54,760
a domestic attack on multiple groups of people.

759
00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:59,240
So like, it's not, I don't want to say out of the blue because it's not, but it kind

760
00:32:59,240 --> 00:33:04,120
of seems like, oh shit, like he was planning this for so long, but he had never harmed

761
00:33:04,120 --> 00:33:06,040
anyone that we know of before.

762
00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:07,040
Right.

763
00:33:07,040 --> 00:33:08,040
Yeah.

764
00:33:08,040 --> 00:33:09,960
Other than beating up children and poking rats with pencils.

765
00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:10,960
Okay.

766
00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:11,960
Let me rephrase.

767
00:33:11,960 --> 00:33:12,960
He never killed anyone.

768
00:33:12,960 --> 00:33:13,960
There we go.

769
00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:14,960
He never killed anyone.

770
00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:18,560
Do you think that he purposely shaved his head because he was part of that area of Nazi

771
00:33:18,560 --> 00:33:19,560
shit?

772
00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:20,560
Yeah.

773
00:33:20,560 --> 00:33:21,560
I think so.

774
00:33:21,560 --> 00:33:22,560
Okay.

775
00:33:22,560 --> 00:33:25,120
As the age of 23, Anders would form his own computer programming business while continuing

776
00:33:25,120 --> 00:33:27,120
to work in customer service.

777
00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:31,880
He would claim that his company grew to six employees and quote, several offshore bank

778
00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:32,880
accounts.

779
00:33:32,880 --> 00:33:33,880
I have six employees.

780
00:33:33,880 --> 00:33:34,880
I have six employees.

781
00:33:34,880 --> 00:33:36,480
That was a success for me.

782
00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:41,440
He also claimed that he made his first million kroner at the age of 24, which for those who

783
00:33:41,440 --> 00:33:45,040
don't know, that's the dollar of the Norway.

784
00:33:45,040 --> 00:33:46,440
What was that Jeopardy question?

785
00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:47,440
Remember that?

786
00:33:47,440 --> 00:33:48,440
Yeah.

787
00:33:48,440 --> 00:33:51,440
It was funny that you say that because I thought about that too when I wrote it down.

788
00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:52,440
I don't remember.

789
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:56,640
Unbeknownst to the people he was bragging to, in reality, Anders' company was legit,

790
00:33:56,640 --> 00:34:00,800
but had been losing a bunch of money over the past couple of years, causing him to have

791
00:34:00,800 --> 00:34:03,440
to move back in with his mother at one point.

792
00:34:03,440 --> 00:34:04,440
Oh, great.

793
00:34:04,440 --> 00:34:05,440
She's just a peach.

794
00:34:05,440 --> 00:34:07,840
She's just a peach.

795
00:34:07,840 --> 00:34:11,520
And the psychiatrist that he was seeing at this point as well also indicated that his

796
00:34:11,520 --> 00:34:16,840
mental health was deteriorating rapidly alongside his business and it was really affecting his

797
00:34:16,840 --> 00:34:17,840
stability.

798
00:34:17,840 --> 00:34:19,480
So he's still getting mental health treatment.

799
00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:23,120
I'm not sure if it was mandated because of the draft kind of thing we were talking about

800
00:34:23,120 --> 00:34:25,080
or if he just took it upon himself.

801
00:34:25,080 --> 00:34:30,680
Either way, even though his business was failing, Anders continued to work on his idolizations

802
00:34:30,680 --> 00:34:32,400
about his future crimes.

803
00:34:32,400 --> 00:34:38,160
And in May of 2009, he would found a farming company under the name Brevik Geofarm.

804
00:34:38,160 --> 00:34:39,160
Okay.

805
00:34:39,160 --> 00:34:45,160
He would describe this business as a farming sole proprietorship set up to cultivate vegetables,

806
00:34:45,160 --> 00:34:47,160
melons, roots, and tubers.

807
00:34:47,160 --> 00:34:48,160
Tubers?

808
00:34:48,160 --> 00:34:49,160
I don't know what a tuber is.

809
00:34:49,160 --> 00:34:50,160
Probably some sort of veggie.

810
00:34:50,160 --> 00:34:51,160
Do you think it's like roots or probably?

811
00:34:51,160 --> 00:34:52,160
Yeah, probably.

812
00:34:52,160 --> 00:34:53,160
Like what am I trying to say?

813
00:34:53,160 --> 00:34:54,160
Like rhubarb?

814
00:34:54,160 --> 00:34:55,160
Like root vegetables.

815
00:34:55,160 --> 00:34:56,160
Yeah.

816
00:34:56,160 --> 00:34:57,160
Rhubarb or yeah.

817
00:34:57,160 --> 00:34:59,160
What was I just thinking?

818
00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:04,480
In 2010, Anders would visit Prague in an attempt to buy illegal weapons that were not legal

819
00:35:04,480 --> 00:35:05,480
in Norway.

820
00:35:05,480 --> 00:35:06,480
Proud.

821
00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:07,480
Proud.

822
00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:08,480
Whatever.

823
00:35:08,480 --> 00:35:09,480
No, whatever.

824
00:35:09,480 --> 00:35:10,480
No, it's pronounced Prague.

825
00:35:10,480 --> 00:35:11,480
Is it?

826
00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:12,480
Oh yeah.

827
00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:13,480
I just think it's funny because it's felt like Prague.

828
00:35:13,480 --> 00:35:15,480
I thought you were making fun of me because I couldn't pronounce this right.

829
00:35:15,480 --> 00:35:17,640
We're arresting you under suspicion of...

830
00:35:17,640 --> 00:35:18,640
Proud?

831
00:35:18,640 --> 00:35:21,320
If you're from Prague, I'd like to suggest.

832
00:35:21,320 --> 00:35:24,640
He was unable to obtain these weapons, so he decided that he would just go ahead and

833
00:35:24,640 --> 00:35:30,280
gain them legally in Norway, like other ones, getting specific weapons that were legal for

834
00:35:30,280 --> 00:35:31,280
him.

835
00:35:31,280 --> 00:35:34,280
Not for him, but you know, in the country.

836
00:35:34,280 --> 00:35:35,840
No weapons should be legal for him.

837
00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:36,840
Yeah, absolutely.

838
00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:41,720
I'm pretty sure that the military said that, so it must be true.

839
00:35:41,720 --> 00:35:45,600
During this time, Anders was not only using his business to make money, but also as a

840
00:35:45,600 --> 00:35:50,120
cover to obtain large amounts of fertilizer and other chemicals as well.

841
00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:51,400
What are we going to do with that?

842
00:35:51,400 --> 00:35:52,400
How much?

843
00:35:52,400 --> 00:35:53,400
Was it 5,000 pounds?

844
00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:54,400
It was a lot.

845
00:35:54,400 --> 00:35:56,520
I don't know if it was 5,000 pounds, but it was close.

846
00:35:56,520 --> 00:35:58,080
This does sound so similar to Tim and the others.

847
00:35:58,080 --> 00:35:59,080
Thank you.

848
00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:00,080
I know.

849
00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:01,080
I was telling you, I was like, oh my gosh, my case is so similar.

850
00:36:01,080 --> 00:36:02,840
Other than the early life stuff.

851
00:36:02,840 --> 00:36:05,520
Although Tim did feel abandoned.

852
00:36:05,520 --> 00:36:06,520
True.

853
00:36:06,520 --> 00:36:09,720
And from all accounts, it sounded like his mom wasn't really around that much.

854
00:36:09,720 --> 00:36:12,000
And when she was, she would abuse the fuck out of him.

855
00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:13,000
Exactly.

856
00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:16,960
Around this time as well, Anders just seemed like a regular guy to others around him.

857
00:36:16,960 --> 00:36:21,600
His other farmer neighbor described him as being a quote, city dweller who wore expensive

858
00:36:21,600 --> 00:36:24,080
shirts and who knew nothing about rural ways.

859
00:36:24,080 --> 00:36:28,720
Ooh, sassy.

860
00:36:28,720 --> 00:36:32,520
An owner of a local bar who knew Anders as a regular also noticed that there seemed to

861
00:36:32,520 --> 00:36:34,800
be nothing unusual about him.

862
00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:36,600
But again, these people aren't fucking psychiatrists.

863
00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:37,600
Yeah.

864
00:36:37,600 --> 00:36:38,600
He seemed like a nice guy.

865
00:36:38,600 --> 00:36:39,600
Yeah, that's his fucking thing.

866
00:36:39,600 --> 00:36:41,600
He can put it on if he needs to.

867
00:36:41,600 --> 00:36:42,600
Yeah.

868
00:36:42,600 --> 00:36:43,600
He seemed like a nice guy.

869
00:36:43,600 --> 00:36:44,600
What is that from?

870
00:36:44,600 --> 00:36:45,600
He smiles when he's around.

871
00:36:45,600 --> 00:36:46,600
I don't know.

872
00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:48,280
And all you can say is, he seemed like a nice guy.

873
00:36:48,280 --> 00:36:50,120
Oh, it was a Tommy boy.

874
00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:51,120
Oh.

875
00:36:51,120 --> 00:36:52,120
Yeah.

876
00:36:52,120 --> 00:36:56,680
In July of 2011, Anders was noted as visiting his father's new wife and telling her that

877
00:36:56,680 --> 00:37:01,200
he was going to be doing something that would make his father extremely proud.

878
00:37:01,200 --> 00:37:06,400
Was it getting a job and getting mental health treatment?

879
00:37:06,400 --> 00:37:09,560
You'd think.

880
00:37:09,560 --> 00:37:11,840
On July 22nd, quite the opposite.

881
00:37:11,840 --> 00:37:18,400
July 22nd, 2011, Anders would plant and detonate a bomb from a truck outside the office of

882
00:37:18,400 --> 00:37:21,400
Prime Minister Jens Stoltenberg in Oslo.

883
00:37:21,400 --> 00:37:24,360
It's the same name as his fucking dad, which is wild.

884
00:37:24,360 --> 00:37:25,360
That is nuts.

885
00:37:25,360 --> 00:37:27,920
And he put it in a truck outside the building.

886
00:37:27,920 --> 00:37:28,920
Oh my gosh.

887
00:37:28,920 --> 00:37:29,920
Just like Timothy.

888
00:37:29,920 --> 00:37:31,400
Y'all stop putting bombs on trucks.

889
00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:32,400
Seriously.

890
00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:33,400
Just don't do it.

891
00:37:33,400 --> 00:37:37,920
It was unclear whether or not the Prime Minister was there during the attack or before, but

892
00:37:37,920 --> 00:37:38,920
he was unharmed.

893
00:37:38,920 --> 00:37:40,840
But he was the incendent target.

894
00:37:40,840 --> 00:37:41,840
He was.

895
00:37:41,840 --> 00:37:46,520
And the bombing unfortunately would kill eight people, an injure at least 209 others.

896
00:37:46,520 --> 00:37:47,520
Oh my gosh.

897
00:37:47,520 --> 00:37:48,520
12 very severely.

898
00:37:48,520 --> 00:37:49,520
Oh my gosh.

899
00:37:49,520 --> 00:37:55,680
While this bombing was horrific, it would be just the beginning of Anders' plan for

900
00:37:55,680 --> 00:37:56,680
the day.

901
00:37:56,680 --> 00:37:57,680
There's more?

902
00:37:57,680 --> 00:37:58,680
Oh it's way worse.

903
00:37:58,680 --> 00:38:00,720
Oh shit.

904
00:38:00,720 --> 00:38:05,520
After setting off the bomb, Anders would travel by boat to the island of Utoia, where a summer

905
00:38:05,520 --> 00:38:12,960
camp by the name of AUF was hosting camp for nearly 600 kids.

906
00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:18,120
Around 5pm the same day, people on the island noticed a man in a police uniform coming onto

907
00:38:18,120 --> 00:38:22,360
the island shore and beginning to be concerned.

908
00:38:22,360 --> 00:38:26,000
Anders would tell the first people he met that he was following up for a security check

909
00:38:26,000 --> 00:38:27,680
because of the bombing.

910
00:38:27,680 --> 00:38:30,760
And it had just happened an hour and a half before this, so he was like, oh I just want

911
00:38:30,760 --> 00:38:32,280
to make sure everyone's okay.

912
00:38:32,280 --> 00:38:36,480
Did you guys know anybody that was part of the bombing?

913
00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:39,960
Unfortunately Anders was not finished with his sinister acts and he would ultimately

914
00:38:39,960 --> 00:38:44,320
begin opening fire on anyone and everyone that he could see.

915
00:38:44,320 --> 00:38:46,920
Just 26 minutes after reaching the island.

916
00:38:46,920 --> 00:38:48,880
Was this a kids camp?

917
00:38:48,880 --> 00:38:58,080
So camp counselors and children I want to say as young as like, probably like 10 to 18.

918
00:38:58,080 --> 00:39:02,640
Not being able to defend themselves, hundreds of kids watched in horror as Anders made his

919
00:39:02,640 --> 00:39:07,040
way around the island shooting anybody in his path.

920
00:39:07,040 --> 00:39:10,400
Other people on the island would hear loud banging noises but didn't really know where

921
00:39:10,400 --> 00:39:12,880
they were coming from because they were so far away.

922
00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:17,000
They were probably thinking fireworks, I mean it's a kids camp.

923
00:39:17,000 --> 00:39:22,640
So they didn't know where the shots or noises were coming from until they did, essentially.

924
00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:27,320
This horrific attack from Anders would last nearly one whole hour.

925
00:39:27,320 --> 00:39:31,880
Many of the campers on the island were teenagers and some were able to phone police right when

926
00:39:31,880 --> 00:39:33,240
the shooting started.

927
00:39:33,240 --> 00:39:38,440
However, since they were on an island it would take authorities until 6.25 to reach them,

928
00:39:38,440 --> 00:39:40,880
so almost an hour later.

929
00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:45,160
Anders killing people the entire time that the police are trying to make their way.

930
00:39:45,160 --> 00:39:47,320
That's fucking terrifying.

931
00:39:47,320 --> 00:39:52,160
Unfortunately during this time some people knew that police had been phoned and since

932
00:39:52,160 --> 00:39:56,520
Anders was in a police uniform it was the perfect cover to get close to them before

933
00:39:56,520 --> 00:39:57,520
killing them.

934
00:39:57,520 --> 00:40:00,960
Well and the fact that he talked to them for what you said 20 minutes before he started

935
00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:06,640
he was trying to lull them into like safety for the trap.

936
00:40:06,640 --> 00:40:10,920
Many children tried to play dead and even positioned their bodies to make it look like

937
00:40:10,920 --> 00:40:16,240
they were dead, but somehow it seemed like Anders remembered his path and every single

938
00:40:16,240 --> 00:40:20,640
person that he killed so when he came across the kids that were playing dead he would shoot

939
00:40:20,640 --> 00:40:23,400
them in the head one by one.

940
00:40:23,400 --> 00:40:25,640
It's so awful.

941
00:40:25,640 --> 00:40:28,800
Like I said police would get to the island about an hour after the first calls were made

942
00:40:28,800 --> 00:40:32,960
as there was a shortage of helicopters actually that delayed their response.

943
00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:38,320
I bet it's because of the bombing, I mean that's the whole point of it probably, was

944
00:40:38,320 --> 00:40:39,920
to distract everybody.

945
00:40:39,920 --> 00:40:44,880
The police presence would be huge because this is a politician and yeah I'm sure helicopters

946
00:40:44,880 --> 00:40:49,080
and everything were over in that area not worried about shooting.

947
00:40:49,080 --> 00:40:52,160
Yeah I think that was absolutely his plan.

948
00:40:52,160 --> 00:40:57,240
By the time police arrived on the island Anders Braavik had killed 66 people, the youngest

949
00:40:57,240 --> 00:41:00,520
being just 14 years old.

950
00:41:00,520 --> 00:41:05,920
Police walked through the bodies on the island hearing numerous cell phones going off as

951
00:41:05,920 --> 00:41:07,360
they searched for Anders.

952
00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:10,200
Oh my god that's heartbreaking.

953
00:41:10,200 --> 00:41:13,000
That makes me like wanna seize.

954
00:41:13,000 --> 00:41:18,120
Like my body like clamps up like hearing that.

955
00:41:18,120 --> 00:41:23,400
Minutes after police arrived Anders would just surrender himself and be captured by police.

956
00:41:23,400 --> 00:41:24,400
Yeah got makeovers.

957
00:41:24,400 --> 00:41:25,400
It's me.

958
00:41:25,400 --> 00:41:27,400
I did it.

959
00:41:27,400 --> 00:41:31,200
After they captured Anders police would hold him on the island overnight in order to make

960
00:41:31,200 --> 00:41:35,160
their way around the rest of the island and also question him before bringing him in.

961
00:41:35,160 --> 00:41:41,080
And it was probably getting dark, it was probably safer just to keep him on the island.

962
00:41:41,080 --> 00:41:45,200
He would be moved to a cell in Oslo after they returned to the mainland.

963
00:41:45,200 --> 00:41:49,000
Anders would almost immediately admit to his crimes stating that the purpose of his attack

964
00:41:49,000 --> 00:41:54,600
was to save Norway and Western Europe from a Muslim takeover and that the Labour Party,

965
00:41:54,600 --> 00:41:59,360
the people that founded the camp, had to quote, pay the price for letting down Norway and the

966
00:41:59,360 --> 00:42:01,360
Norwegian people.

967
00:42:01,360 --> 00:42:03,200
Cause that makes fucking sense right?

968
00:42:03,200 --> 00:42:04,200
What?

969
00:42:04,200 --> 00:42:05,200
What?

970
00:42:05,200 --> 00:42:11,080
I was gonna say what's wrong with this guy but he just told me the entire story of his

971
00:42:11,080 --> 00:42:12,160
life.

972
00:42:12,160 --> 00:42:17,120
After his arrest Anders would then begin referring to himself as quote, the greatest monster

973
00:42:17,120 --> 00:42:19,400
since Quisling.

974
00:42:19,400 --> 00:42:22,400
For those of you who don't know I had to look it up too.

975
00:42:22,400 --> 00:42:27,160
Vidkun Quisling was a politician in Norway during the Nazis capture of the country and

976
00:42:27,160 --> 00:42:31,040
when he left office he essentially created a fascist group and tried to become super

977
00:42:31,040 --> 00:42:32,040
powerful.

978
00:42:32,040 --> 00:42:34,600
So he thinks he's just the coolest guy ever.

979
00:42:34,600 --> 00:42:36,760
Yeah, he's like boss.

980
00:42:36,760 --> 00:42:39,600
He would actually, this guy, what's his name?

981
00:42:39,600 --> 00:42:40,600
Quisling.

982
00:42:40,600 --> 00:42:44,640
He would be arrested and found guilty of embezzlement, murder and high treason against the Norwegian

983
00:42:44,640 --> 00:42:48,280
state and was sentenced to death in 1945.

984
00:42:48,280 --> 00:42:52,440
So he's like all about like the Nazi party and like died before the war was even over.

985
00:42:52,440 --> 00:42:58,160
So I'm sure Derz at this point is like, like I don't know, wants the same fate?

986
00:42:58,160 --> 00:43:01,280
Well he wants to be infamous is exactly what he wants at this point.

987
00:43:01,280 --> 00:43:05,360
So this guy was very infamous in Norway and apparently Anders idolized him.

988
00:43:05,360 --> 00:43:06,360
Anders Anders.

989
00:43:06,360 --> 00:43:07,360
Anders.

990
00:43:07,360 --> 00:43:08,360
He's Anders.

991
00:43:08,360 --> 00:43:13,560
Due to the fact that Anders admitted to being the perpetrator of not only the island massacre

992
00:43:13,560 --> 00:43:18,120
but the bombing as well, he was immediately charged with both attacks.

993
00:43:18,120 --> 00:43:22,440
On July 25th, three days after the attack, Anders was also charged with violating section

994
00:43:22,440 --> 00:43:28,320
147A of the Norwegian criminal code, which is anti-terrorism provision.

995
00:43:28,320 --> 00:43:32,360
So you're like, yeah, I'm a terrorist and I, you know, committed the crime.

996
00:43:32,360 --> 00:43:33,360
He's like, I'm not a terrorist.

997
00:43:33,360 --> 00:43:34,360
He is.

998
00:43:34,360 --> 00:43:35,360
I mean, that's what he is.

999
00:43:35,360 --> 00:43:36,360
Yeah, exactly.

1000
00:43:36,360 --> 00:43:37,360
He's crazy.

1001
00:43:37,360 --> 00:43:41,200
He would also be charged with quote, establishing or destroying basic functions of society and

1002
00:43:41,200 --> 00:43:46,000
quote, creating serious fear in the population, which is like kind of a cool thing to be

1003
00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:47,000
charged with.

1004
00:43:47,000 --> 00:43:48,640
You created serious fear in the population.

1005
00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:49,640
You created serious fear.

1006
00:43:49,640 --> 00:43:51,160
Well, that is like, I don't know.

1007
00:43:51,160 --> 00:43:52,960
I think they call it something else now.

1008
00:43:52,960 --> 00:43:53,960
Yeah, they do.

1009
00:43:53,960 --> 00:43:57,800
If you purposely create chaos, it's a chargeable offense.

1010
00:43:57,800 --> 00:43:58,800
Yeah, absolutely.

1011
00:43:58,800 --> 00:44:01,280
It's like filing a false police report.

1012
00:44:01,280 --> 00:44:02,280
It's a felony.

1013
00:44:02,280 --> 00:44:07,320
Well, did you see that dumbass, the video of them in a restaurant or something and

1014
00:44:07,320 --> 00:44:08,920
he screams, he's got a gun.

1015
00:44:08,920 --> 00:44:10,840
Yeah, no, I fucking hate those videos.

1016
00:44:10,840 --> 00:44:12,280
I was telling Casey that yesterday.

1017
00:44:12,280 --> 00:44:13,680
He's like, oh, it's so funny.

1018
00:44:13,680 --> 00:44:14,880
I'm like, what is funny about that?

1019
00:44:14,880 --> 00:44:15,880
What is funny?

1020
00:44:15,880 --> 00:44:16,880
He's screaming, help, help.

1021
00:44:16,880 --> 00:44:17,880
He has a gun.

1022
00:44:17,880 --> 00:44:19,440
Like in today's society, you fucking serious.

1023
00:44:19,440 --> 00:44:20,440
Absolutely not.

1024
00:44:20,440 --> 00:44:22,080
In case he was like, no, it's not funny.

1025
00:44:22,080 --> 00:44:25,040
He's like, it's just so like wild that he would do that.

1026
00:44:25,040 --> 00:44:26,040
It is.

1027
00:44:26,040 --> 00:44:27,040
It's like, it's fatfully.

1028
00:44:27,040 --> 00:44:32,320
It's wild that that creates such a fear response now in our society.

1029
00:44:32,320 --> 00:44:36,440
You could literally give someone a heart attack or like, you know, like a panic or whatever.

1030
00:44:36,440 --> 00:44:38,600
People trampling each other trying to get out of a building.

1031
00:44:38,600 --> 00:44:39,600
It happens.

1032
00:44:39,600 --> 00:44:42,760
I mean, he used to happen all the time at like concerts and shit.

1033
00:44:42,760 --> 00:44:44,400
You know, I mean, it's awful.

1034
00:44:44,400 --> 00:44:48,360
But yeah, I mean, you could totally incite getting someone killed.

1035
00:44:48,360 --> 00:44:51,200
Yeah, absolutely.

1036
00:44:51,200 --> 00:44:55,800
In the weeks following the attacks, more victims would succumb to their injuries from the shootings

1037
00:44:55,800 --> 00:45:00,280
and the death toll would rise to 80 in total, making the attacks the deadliest in Norway

1038
00:45:00,280 --> 00:45:01,760
since World War Two.

1039
00:45:01,760 --> 00:45:02,760
What?

1040
00:45:02,760 --> 00:45:03,760
Yes.

1041
00:45:03,760 --> 00:45:04,760
Since World War Two.

1042
00:45:04,760 --> 00:45:05,760
Yes.

1043
00:45:05,760 --> 00:45:10,600
And I feel like that's only unbelievable because we grow up, like, you know, with mass

1044
00:45:10,600 --> 00:45:11,600
shootings.

1045
00:45:11,600 --> 00:45:12,600
Yeah.

1046
00:45:12,600 --> 00:45:14,600
Exactly.

1047
00:45:14,600 --> 00:45:17,120
And this was in 2011, so it was way before.

1048
00:45:17,120 --> 00:45:20,240
And it's also in Norway, you know, so it's not, you know, it's not like here where every

1049
00:45:20,240 --> 00:45:23,480
fucking day is another mass shooting, which is awful.

1050
00:45:23,480 --> 00:45:27,160
In early March, 2012, Anders would be indicted on the charges.

1051
00:45:27,160 --> 00:45:31,640
The director of public prosecutions had initially decided to censor the document to the public,

1052
00:45:31,640 --> 00:45:35,520
which would leave out the names of the victims as well as details about their deaths.

1053
00:45:35,520 --> 00:45:36,520
They are minors as well.

1054
00:45:36,520 --> 00:45:37,520
Right.

1055
00:45:37,520 --> 00:45:38,520
So that's probably why.

1056
00:45:38,520 --> 00:45:41,800
However, the public would react very poorly to this and the decision was reversed prior

1057
00:45:41,800 --> 00:45:43,160
to the release of the documents.

1058
00:45:43,160 --> 00:45:44,160
Yeah, and they deserve respect.

1059
00:45:44,160 --> 00:45:46,160
Well, yeah, and I'm sure people were like, fuck that.

1060
00:45:46,160 --> 00:45:47,960
We're not gonna, like, cover up what he did.

1061
00:45:47,960 --> 00:45:51,800
We want the world to see what this asshole did, you know.

1062
00:45:51,800 --> 00:45:55,640
Anders was kept at Isla Prison after his arrest, where he had access to three different

1063
00:45:55,640 --> 00:46:00,560
prison cells, one where he would rest, sleep, and watch TV, another where he was set up

1064
00:46:00,560 --> 00:46:05,320
with a computer without internet but still access, and a third gym cell had a gym equipment

1065
00:46:05,320 --> 00:46:06,920
for him to be able to work out in.

1066
00:46:06,920 --> 00:46:07,920
Which one did he poop in?

1067
00:46:07,920 --> 00:46:09,520
Why does he need all this shit for?

1068
00:46:09,520 --> 00:46:10,520
Like, sorry.

1069
00:46:10,520 --> 00:46:11,880
He's got a toilet and every single one.

1070
00:46:11,880 --> 00:46:12,880
Yeah, he doesn't need all that shit.

1071
00:46:12,880 --> 00:46:13,880
He doesn't need all that shit.

1072
00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:18,280
Let him fucking get, like, dick fall off from the steroids and his muscles deteriorate.

1073
00:46:18,280 --> 00:46:23,600
To be fair, he's probably the only prisoner in that Norway prison.

1074
00:46:23,600 --> 00:46:27,600
So only selected prison staff with specific credentials were allowed to be around him

1075
00:46:27,600 --> 00:46:31,840
and the staff were told not to let his presence as a high security prisoner affect any of

1076
00:46:31,840 --> 00:46:32,840
the other inmates.

1077
00:46:32,840 --> 00:46:33,840
Oh, okay.

1078
00:46:33,840 --> 00:46:34,840
So they kept him secluded.

1079
00:46:34,840 --> 00:46:39,600
That's probably why he had all these extra things though.

1080
00:46:39,600 --> 00:46:43,400
While he was incarcerated, police obviously searched his personal belongings at home

1081
00:46:43,400 --> 00:46:48,920
and they found a 1518 page manifesto that he had left.

1082
00:46:48,920 --> 00:46:50,960
Do you see 1000?

1083
00:46:50,960 --> 00:46:58,960
1518 pages manifesto entitled, quote, 2083, a European Declaration of Independence.

1084
00:46:58,960 --> 00:47:00,960
Ew, ew, ew.

1085
00:47:00,960 --> 00:47:02,960
You're not fucking cool.

1086
00:47:02,960 --> 00:47:06,920
You're not, like, you're a Nazi.

1087
00:47:06,920 --> 00:47:09,920
What?

1088
00:47:09,920 --> 00:47:10,920
God.

1089
00:47:10,920 --> 00:47:16,400
In the manifesto, he raged against multiculturalism, liberalism, and Muslims, also while describing

1090
00:47:16,400 --> 00:47:20,080
his attack in brutal detail and meticulous planning.

1091
00:47:20,080 --> 00:47:23,160
Obviously he wrote it before the attack, but what he was going to do.

1092
00:47:23,160 --> 00:47:25,440
Some quotes from the manifesto are as follows.

1093
00:47:25,440 --> 00:47:26,440
Oh, great.

1094
00:47:26,440 --> 00:47:27,440
I can't wait.

1095
00:47:27,440 --> 00:47:28,440
I can't wait.

1096
00:47:28,440 --> 00:47:29,440
I can't wait.

1097
00:47:29,440 --> 00:47:30,440
The whole thing, it was way too long.

1098
00:47:30,440 --> 00:47:31,440
You tried though?

1099
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:32,440
No, I didn't.

1100
00:47:32,440 --> 00:47:33,440
Okay, good.

1101
00:47:33,440 --> 00:47:34,440
I actually couldn't find the whole thing.

1102
00:47:34,440 --> 00:47:35,440
It's not available, I don't think.

1103
00:47:35,440 --> 00:47:38,440
I'm going to upload that shit and translate it.

1104
00:47:38,440 --> 00:47:39,440
Translate it.

1105
00:47:39,440 --> 00:47:43,600
Quote, I've spent a total of nine years of my life working on this project.

1106
00:47:43,600 --> 00:47:48,880
Quote, I took a year off when I was 25 and played World of Warcraft, PVE Hardcore for

1107
00:47:48,880 --> 00:47:49,880
a year.

1108
00:47:49,880 --> 00:47:53,040
I'm currently playing Modern Warfare 2 casually.

1109
00:47:53,040 --> 00:47:54,040
Soups cash.

1110
00:47:54,040 --> 00:47:59,120
Quote, stealing is bad, I admit, but then again, when you've devoted your entire life

1111
00:47:59,120 --> 00:48:03,440
to a good cause, you can allow yourself some naughtiness, especially if I can contribute

1112
00:48:03,440 --> 00:48:06,720
to converse your funds, cough, winky face.

1113
00:48:06,720 --> 00:48:14,400
Yes, yes, no one's perfect with the, like the pee, like the tongue sticking out face.

1114
00:48:14,400 --> 00:48:18,280
Like wait, without the, well clearly not the emoji, right?

1115
00:48:18,280 --> 00:48:19,280
It's the colon.

1116
00:48:19,280 --> 00:48:20,280
Yes.

1117
00:48:20,280 --> 00:48:23,640
It's the colon with the little bloop.

1118
00:48:23,640 --> 00:48:24,640
Like LOL.

1119
00:48:24,640 --> 00:48:25,640
LOL.

1120
00:48:25,640 --> 00:48:26,640
Yeah.

1121
00:48:26,640 --> 00:48:27,640
And quote.

1122
00:48:27,640 --> 00:48:31,600
However, since I manifest their worst nightmare in parentheses, talking about Systematical and

1123
00:48:31,600 --> 00:48:35,600
Organized Traders, they'll probably just give me the full propaganda rate package and

1124
00:48:35,600 --> 00:48:37,600
propagate the following accusations.

1125
00:48:37,600 --> 00:48:45,280
Pedophile, Engages and Incest Activities, Homosexual, Psycho, ADHD, They're, Non-Educated,

1126
00:48:45,280 --> 00:48:49,240
Imbrid, Maniac, Insane, Monster, etc.

1127
00:48:49,240 --> 00:48:52,800
I'll be labeled as the biggest monster ever witnessed since World War II.

1128
00:48:52,800 --> 00:48:53,800
End quote.

1129
00:48:53,800 --> 00:48:54,800
Ewwew.

1130
00:48:54,800 --> 00:48:56,800
Left tongue emoji.

1131
00:48:56,800 --> 00:48:57,800
Ewwew.

1132
00:48:57,800 --> 00:48:58,800
LOL.

1133
00:48:58,800 --> 00:48:59,800
LOL.

1134
00:48:59,800 --> 00:49:01,800
LOL.

1135
00:49:01,800 --> 00:49:02,800
Cough, cough.

1136
00:49:02,800 --> 00:49:03,800
Winky face.

1137
00:49:03,800 --> 00:49:09,800
And when I say winky face, I'm sure everyone knows like semi-colon clothes for the seas.

1138
00:49:09,800 --> 00:49:10,800
Yeah.

1139
00:49:10,800 --> 00:49:11,800
Oh gosh.

1140
00:49:11,800 --> 00:49:12,800
Emojies.

1141
00:49:12,800 --> 00:49:13,800
Emojies.

1142
00:49:13,800 --> 00:49:14,800
Emojies.

1143
00:49:14,800 --> 00:49:15,800
Emojies.

1144
00:49:15,800 --> 00:49:16,800
Like where you have to type it.

1145
00:49:16,800 --> 00:49:17,800
Oh well.

1146
00:49:17,800 --> 00:49:24,000
Be the biggest cringy person ever since World War II.

1147
00:49:24,000 --> 00:49:27,880
So over the next several months, Anders would be interviewed and examined by court appointed

1148
00:49:27,880 --> 00:49:28,880
psychiatrist.

1149
00:49:28,880 --> 00:49:29,880
Yeah, they did.

1150
00:49:29,880 --> 00:49:32,920
Was there any, he labeled himself as a pedophile.

1151
00:49:32,920 --> 00:49:33,920
Was there anything that-

1152
00:49:33,920 --> 00:49:36,960
He didn't, he's saying that people are gonna assume these things about me.

1153
00:49:36,960 --> 00:49:37,960
Right.

1154
00:49:37,960 --> 00:49:38,960
He's like I'll be labeled as this.

1155
00:49:38,960 --> 00:49:42,800
Exactly, but I mean most, more than half of the stuff that he said is kinda correct.

1156
00:49:42,800 --> 00:49:43,800
Yeah.

1157
00:49:43,800 --> 00:49:48,840
So I was wondering if there was any documentation of him messing around with kids or anything.

1158
00:49:48,840 --> 00:49:49,840
Not that I found, no.

1159
00:49:49,840 --> 00:49:51,960
I mean he's just saying it didn't happen, but not that I found.

1160
00:49:51,960 --> 00:49:52,960
Yeah.

1161
00:49:52,960 --> 00:49:53,960
But then again that wasn't really his thing.

1162
00:49:53,960 --> 00:49:55,760
I know that his mom like sexualized him when he was younger.

1163
00:49:55,760 --> 00:50:00,200
I don't think he was ever sexually abused and usually, I don't wanna say usually, but

1164
00:50:00,200 --> 00:50:04,400
we see it a lot where someone that sexually abuses was sexually abused themselves.

1165
00:50:04,400 --> 00:50:05,720
I don't think he was ever sexually abused.

1166
00:50:05,720 --> 00:50:08,240
He was definitely abused, but I don't know if he was ever sexually abused.

1167
00:50:08,240 --> 00:50:09,240
But he was sexualized.

1168
00:50:09,240 --> 00:50:10,240
And the whole lies.

1169
00:50:10,240 --> 00:50:11,240
He was sexualized for sure.

1170
00:50:11,240 --> 00:50:12,400
I wonder if he had fantasies about kids.

1171
00:50:12,400 --> 00:50:18,320
I have no idea and who knows what the fuck happened during that hour on the island.

1172
00:50:18,320 --> 00:50:20,960
So again he was interviewed by multiple psychiatrists.

1173
00:50:20,960 --> 00:50:25,640
He would be diagnosed by multiple of them as well with paranoid schizophrenia, concluding

1174
00:50:25,640 --> 00:50:29,800
that he had developed the disorder over time and was psychotic at the time that he carried

1175
00:50:29,800 --> 00:50:32,120
out the attacks and at the time of observation.

1176
00:50:32,120 --> 00:50:34,680
Oh gosh, I can't wait to hear what the sentencing is.

1177
00:50:34,680 --> 00:50:38,600
So his mom and then his grandmother also had that same diagnosis.

1178
00:50:38,600 --> 00:50:45,560
He was also diagnosed with abuse of non-dependence producing substances prior to the attacks.

1179
00:50:45,560 --> 00:50:51,080
Non-dependence producing substances, so non-addictive substances, he was abusing them prior to

1180
00:50:51,080 --> 00:50:52,080
the attacks.

1181
00:50:52,080 --> 00:50:53,080
Like weed?

1182
00:50:53,080 --> 00:50:54,080
Yeah.

1183
00:50:54,080 --> 00:50:55,080
Or the steroids I guess.

1184
00:50:55,080 --> 00:50:56,080
Yeah, exactly.

1185
00:50:56,080 --> 00:50:58,520
Something that won't develop addiction.

1186
00:50:58,520 --> 00:51:02,520
So for listeners that don't know, the determination of being criminally insane means that the

1187
00:51:02,520 --> 00:51:06,080
person did not know they were committing a crime or could not understand that their actions

1188
00:51:06,080 --> 00:51:09,200
were wrong while committing a crime.

1189
00:51:09,200 --> 00:51:15,960
According to the report, Anders displayed an appropriate and blunted affect and a severe

1190
00:51:15,960 --> 00:51:17,600
lack of empathy.

1191
00:51:17,600 --> 00:51:20,540
He referred to himself as the future regent of Norway.

1192
00:51:20,540 --> 00:51:23,600
This is someone who would be appointed in the case that their current leader couldn't

1193
00:51:23,600 --> 00:51:25,200
complete their duties.

1194
00:51:25,200 --> 00:51:26,840
I had to look at that.

1195
00:51:26,840 --> 00:51:31,840
He also referred to himself as a master of life and death while calling himself, quote,

1196
00:51:31,840 --> 00:51:36,760
inordinately loving and, quote, Europe's most perfect knight since World War II.

1197
00:51:36,760 --> 00:51:38,640
Oh my god, he's such a white knight.

1198
00:51:38,640 --> 00:51:40,640
He's fucking obsessed with World War II also.

1199
00:51:40,640 --> 00:51:41,640
He's such a white knight.

1200
00:51:41,640 --> 00:51:47,080
I bet he holds the door open for girls and tips his fedora of malady.

1201
00:51:47,080 --> 00:51:49,200
Shows them his skinned head.

1202
00:51:49,200 --> 00:51:51,960
I was gonna say show them their sword collection.

1203
00:51:51,960 --> 00:51:54,720
Who was that that had a sword recently?

1204
00:51:54,720 --> 00:52:00,200
Oh, it was when he tried to give the kid his sword to kill his wife with.

1205
00:52:00,200 --> 00:52:02,240
Yeah, he's like, oh, here's my sword.

1206
00:52:02,240 --> 00:52:03,240
Oh, my god.

1207
00:52:03,240 --> 00:52:06,240
Just my wife still alive right here.

1208
00:52:06,240 --> 00:52:07,240
Gosh.

1209
00:52:07,240 --> 00:52:08,240
Inconvenient.

1210
00:52:08,240 --> 00:52:12,240
That's the, I keep wanting to say assassin, but it's the hired hitman episode.

1211
00:52:12,240 --> 00:52:13,240
Oh my gosh.

1212
00:52:13,240 --> 00:52:14,240
That one was so fun.

1213
00:52:14,240 --> 00:52:15,760
It was fun.

1214
00:52:15,760 --> 00:52:20,160
Anders also described his plans to carry out, quote, further executions of categories

1215
00:52:20,160 --> 00:52:24,160
A, B, and C traitors by the thousands.

1216
00:52:24,160 --> 00:52:27,560
So in his manifesto, he was essentially saying like, if I'm not caught, I'm gonna continue

1217
00:52:27,560 --> 00:52:29,520
to do this.

1218
00:52:29,520 --> 00:52:34,800
He wanted to organize Norwegians and reservations for the purpose of selective breeding and was

1219
00:52:34,800 --> 00:52:39,160
also determined to be suicidal and homicidal at the time of his evaluation.

1220
00:52:39,160 --> 00:52:40,880
Oh my gosh, this is disgusting.

1221
00:52:40,880 --> 00:52:41,880
Breeding.

1222
00:52:41,880 --> 00:52:42,880
Just the word.

1223
00:52:42,880 --> 00:52:43,880
The word breeding.

1224
00:52:43,880 --> 00:52:46,880
It's like, ew.

1225
00:52:46,880 --> 00:52:52,200
According to his defense attorney, Anders expressed surprise and felt insulted by the

1226
00:52:52,200 --> 00:52:57,720
findings and the report, but later said, quote, this provides new opportunities for fucking

1227
00:52:57,720 --> 00:52:58,720
for what?

1228
00:52:58,720 --> 00:52:59,720
Prison.

1229
00:52:59,720 --> 00:53:00,720
For what?

1230
00:53:00,720 --> 00:53:01,720
For what?

1231
00:53:01,720 --> 00:53:02,720
God.

1232
00:53:02,720 --> 00:53:06,680
The outcome of Anders first evaluation was heavily debated by mental health experts

1233
00:53:06,680 --> 00:53:09,760
as they did not think that he was criminally insane.

1234
00:53:09,760 --> 00:53:13,040
According to the senior psychiatrist who was commissioned by the prison to examine Anders,

1235
00:53:13,040 --> 00:53:15,360
remember the people that have already examined him were with the court.

1236
00:53:15,360 --> 00:53:17,360
These are with guys with the prison.

1237
00:53:17,360 --> 00:53:18,840
His name is a Randy Rosenquist.

1238
00:53:18,840 --> 00:53:21,120
I love the Quist.

1239
00:53:21,120 --> 00:53:23,960
They're so, I mean, just the last name.

1240
00:53:23,960 --> 00:53:24,960
Yes.

1241
00:53:24,960 --> 00:53:26,440
Anything with Quist at the end is amazing.

1242
00:53:26,440 --> 00:53:30,240
According to Randy, Anders rather appeared to have personality disorders.

1243
00:53:30,240 --> 00:53:35,240
On January 13th, 2012, the Oslo District Court ordered a second expert panel to evaluate

1244
00:53:35,240 --> 00:53:37,000
Anders mental state.

1245
00:53:37,000 --> 00:53:40,400
He initially refused to cooperate with these new psychiatrists, but eventually changed his

1246
00:53:40,400 --> 00:53:45,120
mind and a new evaluation took place in late February of 2012.

1247
00:53:45,120 --> 00:53:49,080
In the pre-trial hearing in February, Anders read a prepared statement demanding to be

1248
00:53:49,080 --> 00:53:54,520
released and treated as a hero for his quote, preemptive attack against traitors accused

1249
00:53:54,520 --> 00:53:56,680
of planning cultural genocide.

1250
00:53:56,680 --> 00:54:01,000
So you don't want people to commit cultural genocide, but you want selective fucking

1251
00:54:01,000 --> 00:54:02,000
breeding?

1252
00:54:02,000 --> 00:54:03,000
Like that's an oxymoron.

1253
00:54:03,000 --> 00:54:04,800
What do you mean?

1254
00:54:04,800 --> 00:54:10,080
He's the hero we don't deserve and never asked for.

1255
00:54:10,080 --> 00:54:14,560
He also stated, quote, they are committing or planning to commit cultural destruction,

1256
00:54:14,560 --> 00:54:18,240
including deconstruction of the Norwegian ethnic group and deconstruction of Norwegian

1257
00:54:18,240 --> 00:54:19,240
culture.

1258
00:54:19,240 --> 00:54:22,040
This is the same as ethnic cleansing.

1259
00:54:22,040 --> 00:54:24,240
You said you wanted that, didn't you?

1260
00:54:24,240 --> 00:54:25,240
Yeah.

1261
00:54:25,240 --> 00:54:26,240
Sorry.

1262
00:54:26,240 --> 00:54:27,240
For yourself.

1263
00:54:27,240 --> 00:54:29,240
Like screaming into the microphone.

1264
00:54:29,240 --> 00:54:32,480
Okay, so now in Norway, it's a little bit different than here in the States.

1265
00:54:32,480 --> 00:54:36,160
So if their original diagnosis of criminally insane was upheld by the court, it would

1266
00:54:36,160 --> 00:54:39,840
have meant that Anders could not have been sentenced to prison at all.

1267
00:54:39,840 --> 00:54:43,960
The prosecution could instead have requested that he be detained in a psychiatric hospital

1268
00:54:43,960 --> 00:54:47,960
and medical advice would then have determined whether or not the courts release him at some

1269
00:54:47,960 --> 00:54:48,960
point later.

1270
00:54:48,960 --> 00:54:53,360
Shortly after the second evaluation took place, the prosecution announced that they expected

1271
00:54:53,360 --> 00:54:57,160
Anders would be found legally insane.

1272
00:54:57,160 --> 00:54:58,320
Expected.

1273
00:54:58,320 --> 00:55:01,840
On April 10th, 2012, the second evaluation was published with the finding that Anders

1274
00:55:01,840 --> 00:55:06,320
was not psychotic during the attacks and he was not psychotic during the evaluation.

1275
00:55:06,320 --> 00:55:07,320
Okay.

1276
00:55:07,320 --> 00:55:10,800
Instead, they diagnosed him with an, with antisocial personality disorder and narcissistic

1277
00:55:10,800 --> 00:55:11,800
personality disorder.

1278
00:55:11,800 --> 00:55:15,120
Uh, seems a little mild, but uh, okay.

1279
00:55:15,120 --> 00:55:19,640
A letter was written to several Norwegian newspapers by Anders during this time, urging

1280
00:55:19,640 --> 00:55:21,760
the courts to find him sane.

1281
00:55:21,760 --> 00:55:25,760
He stated, quote, I must admit this is the worst thing that could have happened to me

1282
00:55:25,760 --> 00:55:27,920
as it is the ultimate humiliation.

1283
00:55:27,920 --> 00:55:32,760
To send a political activist to a mental hospital is more sadistic and evil than to kill him,

1284
00:55:32,760 --> 00:55:33,760
exclamation point.

1285
00:55:33,760 --> 00:55:35,320
It is a fate worse than death.

1286
00:55:35,320 --> 00:55:36,520
You know what's humiliating?

1287
00:55:36,520 --> 00:55:45,280
The fact that you took out this rage or whatever you have going on on innocent children that

1288
00:55:45,280 --> 00:55:48,040
are unarmed, that's, that's embarrassing.

1289
00:55:48,040 --> 00:55:49,040
That's embarrassing.

1290
00:55:49,040 --> 00:55:54,520
You should feel like the ultimate piece of shit because how is that not humiliating?

1291
00:55:54,520 --> 00:55:58,680
He's not like you went in, it's not like you were a war hero.

1292
00:55:58,680 --> 00:55:59,680
Yeah.

1293
00:55:59,680 --> 00:56:00,680
You know?

1294
00:56:00,680 --> 00:56:01,680
You decimated children.

1295
00:56:01,680 --> 00:56:02,680
No, and that's what he's saying.

1296
00:56:02,680 --> 00:56:03,680
He's like, I am the hero.

1297
00:56:03,680 --> 00:56:06,600
Like, I don't understand why you guys think that I did anything wrong.

1298
00:56:06,600 --> 00:56:08,840
I did this to prevent a worse attack.

1299
00:56:08,840 --> 00:56:10,240
You should be thanking me.

1300
00:56:10,240 --> 00:56:12,720
It's embarrassing for you to say that I'm crazy.

1301
00:56:12,720 --> 00:56:15,440
Well, if the shoe fucking fits.

1302
00:56:15,440 --> 00:56:17,440
Yeah, you pussy.

1303
00:56:17,440 --> 00:56:18,800
God.

1304
00:56:18,800 --> 00:56:24,320
On June 8th, 2012, professor of psychiatry, Ulrich Frederick Malt, testified in court

1305
00:56:24,320 --> 00:56:28,320
as an expert witness stating that he found it very unlikely that Anders suffered from

1306
00:56:28,320 --> 00:56:30,200
schizophrenia.

1307
00:56:30,200 --> 00:56:34,640
According to Ulrich, it was much more likely that Anders had Asperger's syndrome, Tourette's

1308
00:56:34,640 --> 00:56:39,720
syndrome, narcissistic personality disorder, and possibly paranoid psychosis.

1309
00:56:39,720 --> 00:56:43,560
So if you haven't been counting, this is now the eighth diagnosis he's received.

1310
00:56:43,560 --> 00:56:46,760
Do you think he has delusional disorder?

1311
00:56:46,760 --> 00:56:47,760
Actually I don't know.

1312
00:56:47,760 --> 00:56:49,320
You might as well pepper that in there too, just for shiggles.

1313
00:56:49,320 --> 00:56:50,760
You might as well have delusional disorder as well.

1314
00:56:50,760 --> 00:56:51,760
Just for shiggles.

1315
00:56:51,760 --> 00:56:53,760
Which I think you had actually mentioned earlier.

1316
00:56:53,760 --> 00:56:54,760
Delusions.

1317
00:56:54,760 --> 00:56:55,760
He had delusions.

1318
00:56:55,760 --> 00:56:56,760
Yeah.

1319
00:56:56,760 --> 00:56:59,000
So again, eighth different diagnosis.

1320
00:56:59,000 --> 00:57:03,320
He's been diagnosed with different things multiple times, but this is like the eighth

1321
00:57:03,320 --> 00:57:04,320
different.

1322
00:57:04,320 --> 00:57:10,640
However, this time, Ulrich listed a number of factors to back up his suggestion.

1323
00:57:10,640 --> 00:57:16,880
Deviant behavior as a child, extreme specialization in Anders's study of weapons and bomb technology,

1324
00:57:16,880 --> 00:57:22,080
strange facial expressions, a remarkable way of talking and an obsession with numbers.

1325
00:57:22,080 --> 00:57:27,040
So he's backing up his suspected diagnosis of Asperger's syndrome, Tourette's syndrome,

1326
00:57:27,040 --> 00:57:28,880
narcissistic personality disorder, and psychosis.

1327
00:57:28,880 --> 00:57:29,880
But not an OCD.

1328
00:57:29,880 --> 00:57:30,880
No.

1329
00:57:30,880 --> 00:57:36,880
But Asperger's syndrome I think also has a numbers solution.

1330
00:57:36,880 --> 00:57:42,480
Eric Johansson, a psychiatrist who had spoken with Anders for over 20 hours, disagreed.

1331
00:57:42,480 --> 00:57:45,600
He stated that Anders was lying, it was not delusional or psychotic.

1332
00:57:45,600 --> 00:57:47,640
He's just full of shit.

1333
00:57:47,640 --> 00:57:49,600
He's just a fucking liar.

1334
00:57:49,600 --> 00:57:54,240
On August 24th, 2012, Anders was ruled sane at the time the crimes were committed and

1335
00:57:54,240 --> 00:57:59,120
sentenced to preventative detention for a period of 21 years, the maximum penalty in

1336
00:57:59,120 --> 00:58:03,240
Norway, with a minimum non-parole period of 10 years.

1337
00:58:03,240 --> 00:58:07,960
This allows the court to continue Anders' detention indefinitely, five years at a time,

1338
00:58:07,960 --> 00:58:12,840
for as long as the prosecuting authority deems it necessary to protect society.

1339
00:58:12,840 --> 00:58:17,560
So essentially, they can continue to extend his sentence as long as they feel necessary

1340
00:58:17,560 --> 00:58:20,320
to keep people safe.

1341
00:58:20,320 --> 00:58:24,840
Anders would plead not guilty but did not appeal the sentence as it was handed down,

1342
00:58:24,840 --> 00:58:28,880
and on September 8th, the media announced that the verdict was final.

1343
00:58:28,880 --> 00:58:34,360
Also in August of 2012, an independent inquest to the attacks were completed, harshly criticizing

1344
00:58:34,360 --> 00:58:38,480
the actions of Norwegian law enforcement and intelligence agencies.

1345
00:58:38,480 --> 00:58:42,920
The July 22nd commission, which took its name from the date of the attacks, ruled that police

1346
00:58:42,920 --> 00:58:47,000
could have prevented the incident or disrupted it when it was occurring.

1347
00:58:47,000 --> 00:58:52,200
The findings of the report led to the resignation of numerous officials, including Norway's

1348
00:58:52,200 --> 00:58:53,680
National Police Chief.

1349
00:58:53,680 --> 00:58:56,320
So they realized that they fucked up.

1350
00:58:56,320 --> 00:58:59,080
I don't know if it was the helicopter thing that they were mad about, but essentially

1351
00:58:59,080 --> 00:59:01,240
they're saying you could have gotten their way fucking faster.

1352
00:59:01,240 --> 00:59:05,400
Or you could have been more present at the political building and caught him before he

1353
00:59:05,400 --> 00:59:07,240
even got over there.

1354
00:59:07,240 --> 00:59:08,960
Yeah, for an hour.

1355
00:59:08,960 --> 00:59:14,200
In January of 2022, a three-day trial began at Telemark District Court to decide whether

1356
00:59:14,200 --> 00:59:18,080
or not to uphold the DA's refusal of parole for Anders.

1357
00:59:18,080 --> 00:59:22,080
The indictment stated that the prosecuting authority does not consent to parole because,

1358
00:59:22,080 --> 00:59:25,840
quote, preventative detention is deemed necessary to protect society.

1359
00:59:25,840 --> 00:59:28,160
So they're like, no, he's fucking saying.

1360
00:59:28,160 --> 00:59:32,560
At the start of the trial, Anders gave Nazi salutes to both the judge and members of the

1361
00:59:32,560 --> 00:59:36,160
public in the courtroom, which is the photo that he saw.

1362
00:59:36,160 --> 00:59:40,640
Anders testified that he is still a Nazi and will continue to work for white power, but

1363
00:59:40,640 --> 00:59:43,520
no longer wanted to pursue it through violence.

1364
00:59:43,520 --> 00:59:45,160
Which I read that I was like, white power.

1365
00:59:45,160 --> 00:59:46,160
Doing white-

1366
00:59:46,160 --> 00:59:47,160
Fucking Timothy McFay.

1367
00:59:47,160 --> 00:59:48,680
He's working white power for Jesus now?

1368
00:59:48,680 --> 00:59:49,680
Yeah.

1369
00:59:49,680 --> 00:59:53,680
He said that he is trying to register a Nazi political party in Norway and is applying

1370
00:59:53,680 --> 00:59:57,360
aspiring to be a candidate running for parliamentary election.

1371
00:59:57,360 --> 01:00:01,040
So he's trying to like reinstate the Nazi party.

1372
01:00:01,040 --> 01:00:03,440
Is he not getting ongoing help in prison?

1373
01:00:03,440 --> 01:00:04,440
I don't know.

1374
01:00:04,440 --> 01:00:05,440
I doubt it.

1375
01:00:05,440 --> 01:00:09,480
I mean, if he's still fucking talking about shit like this, probably not.

1376
01:00:09,480 --> 01:00:17,680
I mean, I guess there are technically non-mentally ill neo-Nazis, but this man clearly needs help.

1377
01:00:17,680 --> 01:00:18,680
Yeah, absolutely.

1378
01:00:18,680 --> 01:00:22,080
There were many witnesses that took the stand over the three days, but ultimately the court's

1379
01:00:22,080 --> 01:00:25,520
decision was upheld and Anders remained in prison.

1380
01:00:25,520 --> 01:00:29,880
So as of 2022, another court appearance will not be available for at least two years.

1381
01:00:29,880 --> 01:00:33,720
So next year he will have the option to go back to court, but they're probably going

1382
01:00:33,720 --> 01:00:35,200
to extend it again.

1383
01:00:35,200 --> 01:00:40,280
He's only 44, so he'll most likely try to get released again if he continues to give

1384
01:00:40,280 --> 01:00:42,400
a spiel about trying to reinstate the Nazi party.

1385
01:00:42,400 --> 01:00:44,360
I'm sure they'll be like, yeah, you can stay.

1386
01:00:44,360 --> 01:00:46,120
Maybe hang out a little longer.

1387
01:00:46,120 --> 01:00:50,600
So like I said, the manifest is so long, there's so much more information about it online,

1388
01:00:50,600 --> 01:00:53,720
but just for time's sake, I decided not to read all 1500 pages.

1389
01:00:53,720 --> 01:00:54,720
Yeah, thanks.

1390
01:00:54,720 --> 01:00:57,760
And the island events are also very specifically laid out online as well.

1391
01:00:57,760 --> 01:01:02,200
If you want to read more about that, you can definitely find it, but that is that case.

1392
01:01:02,200 --> 01:01:03,200
What a doozy.

1393
01:01:03,200 --> 01:01:04,200
I know.

1394
01:01:04,200 --> 01:01:06,640
It's a great recommendation, honestly, to do this case.

1395
01:01:06,640 --> 01:01:07,640
Yeah, I think so.

1396
01:01:07,640 --> 01:01:10,760
I know it's right off the heels of Tim and Mick Vey, but everybody knows how we do.

1397
01:01:10,760 --> 01:01:13,480
We don't tell each other what cases we're going to do.

1398
01:01:13,480 --> 01:01:18,720
So Kenna had no idea last week that I was doing something pretty similar, somebody with

1399
01:01:18,720 --> 01:01:24,120
similar ideals about what they think should happen in the world.

1400
01:01:24,120 --> 01:01:26,120
But yeah, you know, yeah.

1401
01:01:26,120 --> 01:01:27,120
Wow.

1402
01:01:27,120 --> 01:01:28,120
I know.

1403
01:01:28,120 --> 01:01:31,560
I was like, I was researching this and I was like, everything just kept coming, especially

1404
01:01:31,560 --> 01:01:32,560
with his childhood.

1405
01:01:32,560 --> 01:01:34,880
I was like, man, I feel so bad for that little kid.

1406
01:01:34,880 --> 01:01:39,840
His mom was clearly just uninterested and taking care of him.

1407
01:01:39,840 --> 01:01:44,720
She had another daughter too, and I didn't hear anything significant about her, but who

1408
01:01:44,720 --> 01:01:46,120
knows what her childhood was like.

1409
01:01:46,120 --> 01:01:47,120
Yeah.

1410
01:01:47,120 --> 01:01:51,800
Well, you did say that she was much older than, not much, but I mean, I think she was

1411
01:01:51,800 --> 01:01:53,720
like 13 years older than Anders.

1412
01:01:53,720 --> 01:01:54,720
Yeah.

1413
01:01:54,720 --> 01:01:55,720
But yeah.

1414
01:01:55,720 --> 01:01:58,600
But she lived with, I mean, when he was a baby, she lived with him, the younger daughter,

1415
01:01:58,600 --> 01:01:59,600
you know.

1416
01:01:59,600 --> 01:02:04,160
I don't know, but yeah, that's that story, and if you're in Norway and you have any say

1417
01:02:04,160 --> 01:02:06,800
in the political system, don't let him out.

1418
01:02:06,800 --> 01:02:08,080
Yeah, seriously.

1419
01:02:08,080 --> 01:02:12,040
I don't think that he'll be released, especially if he's still trying to say like today that

1420
01:02:12,040 --> 01:02:16,800
he wants to like become a politician and start this like new, like reinstate the Nazi party.

1421
01:02:16,800 --> 01:02:17,800
Like that's essentially what he's saying.

1422
01:02:17,800 --> 01:02:18,800
Yeah.

1423
01:02:18,800 --> 01:02:22,840
If I get out, I'm going to run for election in this, you know, new party, which is not,

1424
01:02:22,840 --> 01:02:24,160
well, it was not going to happen.

1425
01:02:24,160 --> 01:02:25,160
There's no way.

1426
01:02:25,160 --> 01:02:30,920
I don't even said it was the worst attack on Norway soil since World War II.

1427
01:02:30,920 --> 01:02:31,920
Yeah.

1428
01:02:31,920 --> 01:02:32,920
They're going to let this fucker out.

1429
01:02:32,920 --> 01:02:33,920
I would hope not.

1430
01:02:33,920 --> 01:02:36,840
And that's honestly like real, of course, the whole thing is tragic.

1431
01:02:36,840 --> 01:02:41,400
I think it's really telling that he genuinely thinks that he was doing it.

1432
01:02:41,400 --> 01:02:45,480
If, whether he thinks that or not, he's preaching that he, he says that he did it for the right

1433
01:02:45,480 --> 01:02:46,480
reasons.

1434
01:02:46,480 --> 01:02:47,480
Yeah.

1435
01:02:47,480 --> 01:02:50,600
I did it because I wanted to prevent a bigger counterattack or a bigger future attack or

1436
01:02:50,600 --> 01:02:51,600
whatever.

1437
01:02:51,600 --> 01:02:52,920
Whether he really believes that or not.

1438
01:02:52,920 --> 01:02:53,920
Yeah.

1439
01:02:53,920 --> 01:02:54,920
That's what he's saying.

1440
01:02:54,920 --> 01:02:57,760
If he really, truly believes that, then he's very clearly super mentally ill.

1441
01:02:57,760 --> 01:03:00,720
If he doesn't believe that, then he might have a psychosis or he might be a psychopath,

1442
01:03:00,720 --> 01:03:04,040
honestly, because no one just makes something like that up for shiggles.

1443
01:03:04,040 --> 01:03:05,040
For shiggles.

1444
01:03:05,040 --> 01:03:06,040
For shiggles.

1445
01:03:06,040 --> 01:03:08,040
But yeah, so that's my case.

1446
01:03:08,040 --> 01:03:09,040
Yeah.

1447
01:03:09,040 --> 01:03:10,040
Timmy Thimmevee was kind of that way too.

1448
01:03:10,040 --> 01:03:14,560
He thought that this was in retaliation for Waco and that it was going to give people

1449
01:03:14,560 --> 01:03:20,800
to wake up and, you know, and revolutionize, you know, the way that the government participates

1450
01:03:20,800 --> 01:03:21,800
in these things.

1451
01:03:21,800 --> 01:03:23,640
And maybe they'll think twice before serving a warrant.

1452
01:03:23,640 --> 01:03:24,640
Yeah.

1453
01:03:24,640 --> 01:03:27,200
But just, I don't know, it's just all awful.

1454
01:03:27,200 --> 01:03:31,160
And like, honestly, I truly believe had he gotten the help he needed when he was little,

1455
01:03:31,160 --> 01:03:32,720
then he, this probably wouldn't have happened.

1456
01:03:32,720 --> 01:03:37,400
He would have been raised, hopefully, in a loving family that taught that you don't harm

1457
01:03:37,400 --> 01:03:41,480
people and you don't, you know, not everyone's out to get you and against you and stuff.

1458
01:03:41,480 --> 01:03:44,560
And it might, you know, very well might be delusional disorder, who knows, especially

1459
01:03:44,560 --> 01:03:48,160
now that he's in his 40s and he's still having these conversations with people.

1460
01:03:48,160 --> 01:03:49,160
Right.

1461
01:03:49,160 --> 01:03:50,160
I don't know.

1462
01:03:50,160 --> 01:03:51,160
But yeah, that's my case.

1463
01:03:51,160 --> 01:03:52,160
Thanks for bringing it.

1464
01:03:52,160 --> 01:03:55,600
Yeah, you guys can check us out on social media, diagnosing a killer, check out diagnosing

1465
01:03:55,600 --> 01:03:56,600
a killer.com.

1466
01:03:56,600 --> 01:03:59,240
We have a bunch of merch available.

1467
01:03:59,240 --> 01:04:00,600
Yeah, get some merch.

1468
01:04:00,600 --> 01:04:01,600
Get some merch.

1469
01:04:01,600 --> 01:04:02,600
Let us know.

1470
01:04:02,600 --> 01:04:05,840
If you get any merch, send us photos of it so we can see and we'll shout you guys out.

1471
01:04:05,840 --> 01:04:06,840
That's true.

1472
01:04:06,840 --> 01:04:07,840
Yeah.

1473
01:04:07,840 --> 01:04:11,720
We should get like pictures of Thai with his, what is it?

1474
01:04:11,720 --> 01:04:12,720
Is he the lady shirt?

1475
01:04:12,720 --> 01:04:13,720
Is he the lady?

1476
01:04:13,720 --> 01:04:14,720
And put it on our Instagram.

1477
01:04:14,720 --> 01:04:15,720
Yeah, for sure.

1478
01:04:15,720 --> 01:04:16,720
All right.

1479
01:04:16,720 --> 01:04:18,720
We love you guys and we will talk to you later.

1480
01:04:18,720 --> 01:04:19,720
Love you.

1481
01:04:19,720 --> 01:04:20,720
Bye.

1482
01:04:20,720 --> 01:04:21,720
Bye, Norway.

1483
01:04:21,720 --> 01:04:32,080
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and advocacy in the true crime sphere.

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Get your tickets now at truecrimepodcastfestival.com and join us in Austin for an unforgettable

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experience.