Hello!
Yeah, I have 45 hours now to record.
Let's go!
I just had to clear all the storage of my computer, all of the stuff, because I had no storage
left and it cut us off in the middle of recording this.
Well, at least it is fixed.
Yep, another one solved.
Problem solved.
Woo!
Now, for your listening pleasure, we are back with Diagnosing a Killer.
Welcome back to Diagnosing a Killer, episode 4.
I'm Kenna.
I'm Koelle.
We already said that.
No, we didn't.
We did.
When we first started?
Sure.
I was wrong.
I like how confident you were, though.
I was.
I think I was thinking about us recording before it cut out.
You're like, sure.
Sure.
Yeah, that's it.
Soopscash.
What's that?
What's that on my computer?
What?
It sounded like a dog barking from very far away.
Yeah.
It was like, I was removing something from the dog on my Mac and it went like that.
Soopscash deleted it.
Proceed.
So I am going to talk about a case that I feel like a few people probably know, not
a few people, like literally it was national news.
So a lot of people know about this case.
Not everyone knows about it probably in the last few years, especially like, well, there's
always going to be documentaries coming out about it just because it was a really intriguing
case and it took the media by storm and everybody was involved in it.
But it's kind of been dwindling into obscurity, I would say, because this happened in the
early 2000s.
And we're going to talk about Scott Peterson.
I don't know if I know this.
You may or may not, I don't know.
I feel like I might know the crime.
I just might not know the name.
Yeah.
I think we'll see.
You might know the mug shot because it was hilarious.
Oh no.
So Scott Lee Peterson was born October 24th, 1972 to parents Lee Arthur Peterson and Jackie
Helen Latham.
Latham?
Latham.
Lee was a businessman who worked for a trucking company and then eventually he owned his own
crate packaging company.
Don't know what crate packaging means.
Sounds like he works with eggs.
Crate packaging.
Yeah.
Is it like, does he make pallets and then like packages those pallets?
Crate packaging.
Yeah.
That makes sense.
Or is it like those milk crates where you're putting milk in there?
Or is it like he works for a crate and packing company.
They make crates and they pack things.
Do they pack them?
But it's crate packaging.
I don't know.
Either way, if the world might never know.
So Jackie, Mama Peterson, she owned a small boutique in La Jolla called the Put-On.
She would regularly take little baby Scott to work with her.
She was incredibly doting.
She was a great mom.
She ran the shop while Scott was like in his crib and like playing and people would come
by and be like, look at a baby.
And she was a really, like I said, an incredibly doting mother.
She had to experience her own tragedy growing up.
Jackie's father was actually murdered when she was like two, two and a half.
Oh my God.
So, and it actually kind of tore the family apart.
She was pretty much orphaned at a certain age and she was actually mostly raised by
Catholic nuns.
So the story's out there.
If you want to Google it, she wasn't shy about it later in interviews much later.
So like I said, if you want to look that up, you can just for time sake, I didn't get
into it.
Yeah.
So she was super concentrated on Scott.
She even said that Scott didn't walk before he was one because she just carried him everywhere,
which I think is cute.
Oh, that's cute.
Carrying around your little baby.
Lee and Jackie actually had six kids from a previous marriage, like altogether.
They were actually joked as like being kind of like the Breedy Bunch.
But so that was, they were both previously married before that, before they had Scott.
So six kids including Scott or seven including Scott?
It was six before Scott.
Scott was like the seventh.
So he spent his childhood in a two bedroom apartment in La Jolla where he had shared
a bedroom with his half brother, John, who was Jackie's boy.
And he was six at the time.
John was.
Scott became playing golf at a super early age, like three.
I know it's really cute.
The Leeds have pretty much taught all of his kids, you know, especially the boys, like
everything about fishing, hunting, golfing, things like that.
And the way that Lee saw it is like if they concentrated on things that he also liked,
then the kids will want to spend more time with them, right?
Yeah, of course.
Which is really sweet.
So they really had like an idealic life.
The parents were super involved and it was kind of like a stereotypical suburban life.
It was Cub Scouts, Little League, Golf on the Weekends, Fishing Fan, Family Fishing Trips.
Scott was also described in school as like the kind of kid to stay out of trouble.
As a boy, he was rarely in trouble and teachers also described him as quote quiet and polite.
So you don't really see that a lot in these cases.
You usually see like physical or like emotional abuse, like conflict or you know violence
and that doesn't seem to be the case at all.
No.
Here we go.
Not yet.
Here we go.
So why did I say that?
In elementary school, he was actually a crossing guard.
Oh, I know.
Oh my God, like the big ol' stop sign with the tiny little.
Yeah, exactly.
Oh my God.
So he was involved, the parents were involved and clearly he was trusted to be able to do
things like that.
You know, he was really involved in school.
I don't like how this is going.
Yeah, he was a standout achiever, like all throughout his school.
Yeah.
So as he grew, his love for golf grew and by age 14, which was 1986 at this point, he
could actually beat his father at golf.
Oh, I bet his father didn't like that.
He's like, well, he kind of liked it though.
What's kind of funny is that when Scott was younger, Lee had told him, if you ever beat
me in a game of golf, I'll buy you a Ferrari.
Hell yeah.
I probably would have tried to do that as well.
So he didn't get a Ferrari, I think he got like a, some type of a Chevy sedan.
But either way, like, you know, so yeah, he could beat it.
He could definitely beat his dad by age 14.
And so as soon as he was able to drive, his dad bought him a car, which is kind of cool.
It's like you're teaching your kid to work or something.
Of course.
Yeah.
Friendly competition never hurt anybody.
So in high school, Scott did odd jobs at the golf course.
Okay.
Totally going into that golf, like leaning into that golf.
So he actually played at his Catholic high school's golf team alongside the famous pro
golfer, Phil Mickelson.
Really?
They went to high school together.
Wow.
Yeah.
So by the end of high school, he was one of the top junior golfers in San Diego.
Okay.
So really, like again, he's dedicated to this.
Doing the damn thing.
A friend said about Scott, he was more of a leader.
He was a strong minded person and he was really confident in whatever he was doing.
So Scott graduated from the University of San Diego High School in 1990 and through
a partial golf scholarship, Scott was actually accepted at Arizona State University.
Wow.
So it was around that time that Scott's father would actually state to his son, he was almost
like Mr. Perfect.
He's on this really great path, career wise, school wise, like he's going to do stuff.
That's not good.
You're not supposed to tell your kid that they're perfect because then they won't ever
try to be better than they are because I'm perfect the way I am, so why am I going to
try and start a career?
Why am I going to change?
So professional golfer Phil Mickelson was Scott's high schoolmate, but he also attended
classes on a scholarship at ASU as well.
Okay.
So they went to the same college.
Lee, Scott's dad later testified that it was a considerable amount of competition that
Mickelson presented while they were at Arizona State.
Yeah, of course.
Why wouldn't he?
Because this guy's like amazing, right?
Yeah, he is really good.
I think he won last year.
What is it, the open or whatever?
The golf, TGA golf tour or whatever.
I think he won.
But again, Phil Mickelson being right there next to Scott, it really discouraged him.
Really?
Yeah, Scott.
You think he'd light a fire under him?
You would think, but I'm not going to be as good as that guy.
So why even try?
It's not like what you said.
It's literally the mindset.
If you tell somebody they're perfect, they're not going to try to be better.
That's really bad to tell your kid things like that.
So one instance, Scott had actually gone out with a friend named Chris, who was a fellow
golfer.
And at the time, Chris was the top junior golfer in the country.
Wow.
Yeah, huge, right?
It was a seal.
Yeah.
So they actually stayed out all night.
They were partying and whatnot, hanging out with girls.
But by the next morning, they were completely hungover.
And they had a competition the next day.
And so this compromised their position in the competition.
It sounds like me at high school.
And I think about that and I'm like, I'll finish the rest of this and then I'll go back
to what I'm about to say.
So Chris's dad, Chip, was really upset by this.
And he labeled Scott as a really bad influence on his son and his son's future career.
So this guy made such a stink complaining to the golf club that the golf club actually
kicked him off the team.
Oh my God.
No.
It's like your son has free will.
He took it and forced those drinks down his throat.
Right.
And I'm thinking about this as like, because we all know that things are going to get dubious.
Right?
Yeah.
Do you think that maybe Scott was jealous that Chris was a top golfer and he was like,
no, bro, let's go out, let's party, let's drink, let's whatever.
Even if he was though, again, this guy, Chris, has free will.
No one, it's like, it reminds me of that movie, 21 and Over.
Have you seen that movie where it's like Skyler Aston, who's like beautiful.
And then Miles Teller.
I have no idea who these people are.
So Skyler Aston and Miles Teller are like the two main characters and then they go visit,
like they're all like a trio.
They visit their friend, I don't know the actor's name.
They visit him and he's like, you know, he has like a really important interview the
next morning and they convince him to go out like the night before and his dad keeps coming
in.
He's like, all right, remember, I'm picking you up at 6am and the guy's like, oh, it's
okay.
I'll just go for one drink.
And then he's like, wow.
He gets like really crazy.
And the dad like blames his friend.
There you go.
Same thing.
No, that's BS though.
I don't freaking, like no one forced alcohol down this guy's throat.
No, I mean they are in college and like, I don't know.
I'm just saying, okay, I'm getting mad, sure, but getting him kicked off the team, like
that's a little extreme.
It's excessive.
Sorry, I went on for like this whole time.
But apparently like Scott stopped caring about it anyways, potentially right.
So anyways, he was kicked off of the team for, they cited him for inappropriate conduct.
Oh my God, whatever.
He's a fucking college student.
I know.
So after Scott was kicked off of the team, he actually dropped out of the university.
Yeah, so sad.
So Scott eventually transferred to Cuesta College in San Luis Obispo.
Then after that he transferred to California Polytechnic State University.
So what they used to say, Cal Poly is what they call it.
Cal Poly.
I feel like that.
So although he initially majored in international business, he actually changed his major to
agricultural business.
And his professors said that he was a model student, one even quoted, was quoted in saying,
I wouldn't mind having an entire classroom full of Scott Peterson's.
Oh, that's a great compliment.
I know, that's a great compliment.
I'd love for someone to say that about me.
So this was in 1994 and while at Cal Poly, Scott worked at a restaurant in Morro Bay
called the Pacific Cafe.
And one of his coworkers would receive visits from a friend named Lacey Rocha.
So Lacey Denise Rocha was actually born May 4th, 1975 to parents Sharon and Dennis Rocha.
Her parents were high school sweethearts and they owned a dairy farm on a really large
property east of Escalon, California.
Love that for them.
I know.
I do.
Dairy farm is amazing.
Well, pork cows.
Lacey was named after a girlfriend of Sharon's in high school who she thought was really,
really pretty, which is like another really sweet compliment.
Yeah, I think that's how Cameron was named, I think.
Really?
Yeah, and whose daughter was named Cameron.
Yeah.
And she was like, oh my God, I love that name.
And then she used it like way later on.
A guy friend of mine used to date this girl, I won't say her name, but I loved her name
so much.
And then he was completely like clobbered by this girl.
And I was like, can't name my baby that.
Yeah, that's awful.
Because then every time I would just say.
So Lacey had one older brother and his name was Brent.
He was about four years older than her.
And Brent, Lacey loved growing up on a farm and she started pulling her weight around
the farm at a really early age.
Yeah, that's usually how it works out.
It's like a lot of people like that have kids just so they have extra hands.
Yeah, I'm not saying just so, but you know.
No, but yeah, of course.
As soon as they can walk, they're holding shit.
But her passion would be in gardening.
She loved to garden and she loved gardening with her mother especially and was absolutely
enamored by making things grow.
Oh my God.
And she had a super green thumb.
I wish I had one.
I do.
I have a black thumb, I think.
I see.
So yeah, plants were like a huge passion of Lacey's.
So I say all that, but like with her growing up on a farm, but she, her parents divorced
when she was two and a half.
Okay.
So they were little, but they would go to the farm every weekend and that's when they
would get all that exposure to gardening and helping around the dairy farm.
So yeah, once the parents divorced, Sharon actually moved the kiddos to Modesto.
And so they pretty much grew up there.
But again, they would regularly go back to the farm on the weekends to see their dad
and be with nature.
So Ron Gransky is actually Sharon's second husband.
And he pretty much raised Lacey and Brent along with Sharon since Lacey was two, two
and a half.
So Dennis also remarries and through this marriage he gains a stepson.
So his wife was also previously married and then they had one more daughter and her name
was Amy.
So she's got, Lacey's got her older brother, Brett, a semi kind of same age step brother
and then a baby sister, Amy.
Blended families for sure.
Yeah, for sure.
But by all accounts, it seems like this family dynamic really worked.
They were great co-parents.
Lacey was always smiling and bubbly, talkative and usually the center of attention.
Lacey was a cheerleader in high school at Thomas Downey High School.
And then after graduation, she attended Hal Polly, the state university where she majored
in ornamental horticulture.
So are they, her and Scott are like about the same age?
They're three years apart.
She's 75, 1975, he's 1972.
So three years.
While at Polly Tech, Lacey would sometimes visit a friend who worked at a restaurant
in Morro Bay called the Pacific Cafe where we all know Scott Peterson works.
That reminds me of what is it in finding an emo or something.
They say like Morro Bay, California.
Like they talk about, maybe it's not Morro Bay, maybe I don't know, whatever.
I thought, because I thought, I wasn't finding Dory.
Yeah.
I thought it was the Joel of Morro Bay, California.
That's what he says.
Yeah, I was like, I thought you said finding an emo at first.
I was like, that was in Australia.
Yeah, you're right.
So Lacey was actually the one to kind of break the ice.
She left her number for Scott the first time that Scott served her at this restaurant.
So she told her mother shortly after meeting Scott that she thought that she had met the
man that she was going to marry.
Wow.
I know.
So sweet.
Scott eventually called Lacey and they set their very first date, which was to go deep
sea fishing.
Okay.
How freaking cool.
I would love that.
Oh my gosh.
It would be really cool if Lacey didn't get terribly seasick the entire time.
Okay.
Well, that would have been awesome to me.
So it was actually kind of sweet because I feel like it just strengthened their relationship
anyways.
So this didn't end the relationship.
In fact, it grew into a very serious one.
I mean, if you can get sick in front of somebody, you can pretty much do anything.
That's so sweet.
God, what episode was that?
Was it the Bachelor?
I think it was Nick's season when they went into that plane where they could do the zero
gravity.
Oh no.
And then I think it was Nick's season because I think it was Crystal.
I haven't seen Nick's season.
Brostow or whatever.
The one that she ended up getting with Sean.
Anyways, I think it was their date, but it was like they were in a plane and it was supposed
to be like zero gravity, so the plane just does this.
Oh my God, that's so nauseating.
Nobody can see what I'm doing, but it goes up and down very slightly so you actually
float.
And she got so sick, she threw up.
And I don't think it was Crystal now that I think about it.
Either way, she threw up.
But it was really sweet because you was holding her and they were floating, and then the plane
started to regulate and they just lowered back onto the floor of the plane while they're
holding each other.
It was so amazing.
Oh my God.
And he still kissed her.
Aw, it was really sweet.
So that's what I think of when I think about this first date.
So by all accounts, the couple seemed very happy together, and after two years of dating,
the couple actually moved in together.
And Lacey graduated in 1997 and the couple decided to marry.
So they were married at the Sycamore Mineral Springs Resort, which I looked at pictures,
it's actually really cute.
It's super rustic-y, but it's out in nature and the grass is super green and there's
just flowers everywhere.
It's really pretty.
Sounds like my kind of place.
Yeah, it looks really remote, quiet, peaceful, everything like that.
After they got married, Lacey went to work in Prudendale, which I didn't Google where
that was, sorry.
And Scott decided to go back to college and focus on business rather than golf.
So he had dropped out?
He had.
I'm sorry, I don't remember you saying that yet.
I did.
When after he got kicked out of the golf team.
So Scott decided to go back to college and focus on business rather than golf.
However, during this time, we know now that Scott was actually engaged in an affair at
this point.
Oh no.
Yeah.
With Phil Mickelson.
He was so in love with Phil Mickelson, he ran off together.
I'm kidding, don't at me.
Never mind seeing that book in that movie.
I love you, Philip Morris, but it's I love you, Philip Mickelson.
So it is not like her name has never been released and it's not entirely, it hasn't
been entirely said how long this affair was or whatever.
I'm not sure who would know the details and it was absolutely unclear if Lacey knew about
it.
But it did happen between 97 and 98.
So Scott would then later go on to complete a bachelor's degree of science in June of
98.
I'm assuming after this the affair was no more.
It just again, it was just that brief moment in time.
So after they both graduated, Scott and Lacey decided to open up a sports bar and restaurant
called The Shack.
It's been totally different, right?
Although initially the business was really slow, they started to see an influx of people,
especially on the weekends.
And believe it or not, Scott's parents never invested in the bar and grill because they
just did not approve.
They did not think that it was going to make any money.
Which is kind of interesting because it would become something.
And up until now, it seems like the parents have been nothing but supportive.
Right, exactly.
Yeah.
That's what it was like shows how supportive they were.
Either way, on one account, Scott needed to replace an air vent in the restaurant and
since both of them couldn't find a technician that they could afford, Scott actually went
and got a certification course just to be able to do it on his own.
So he was super dedicated to the structure.
It's not like he was trying to slack.
And that's why I kind of appreciate the fact that they didn't invest in it.
Because if they didn't believe in it and they didn't want to support it, well then
he doesn't owe any money back, right?
Yeah, and it was more rewarding to know that you did it on your own.
That you did it on your own.
And I think he really loved that.
So eventually this dedication was completely worth it because the business did begin to
boom.
So much so that in 2000, the couple would sell the establishment and move closer to Modesta
which is Lacey's hometown.
So with the money that they made from selling the bar off, the couple actually bought their
three bedroom two bathroom house near La Loma Park.
Lacey became a substitute t-shirt and Scott went on to the fertilizer trade business,
which is kind of funny because you can say he was a dealer in bullshit.
I liked that.
Lacey was described as the perfect housewife.
She loved to cook and entertain company.
A couple planned on becoming pregnant and in mid-2002 it was announced that the couple
would be expecting.
So they would learn that they were having a boy and his name would be Connor.
So Lacey enrolled in prenatal yoga classes and together they attended LaMoz classes.
They decorated the nursery blue with a nautical theme.
So they seemed really excited for the babies.
Yeah and it seems like by all accounts their marriage is like flourishing and everything's
fine.
So tell me what happens that goes wrong.
On October 24th, 2002 at a trade convention in Fresno, Scott was working on behalf of
the company that he worked for and he met a woman named Sean.
That's his birthday, isn't it?
October 24th?
I thought.
His is October 24th?
You didn't remember him dropping out of school but you remembered his birthday.
Because that birthday is shared with someone that I'm very close with.
I don't want to say who because I don't want to put that information on your ears.
That's why I remembered it because I correlated it with something else.
Word association.
So he told her that he was single and that he was quote looking for someone.
Escalating quickly.
So again this is in Fresno, this is not in Modesto where this is where he went to this
convention and he had probably a little booth, right?
I also have a child on the way.
Yeah.
Nope, doesn't mention that.
He joked to Sean that he should put quote horny bastard on his name tag.
Okay, that pisses me off because you know that him and his wife are probably not getting
it in because she's pregnant and that fucking pisses me off.
That's gross, right?
He's like, I'm so horny.
Get the fuck, she's creating a life.
He thought it was funny and that it would help him meet women.
Oh, that's hilarious, Scott.
If I saw that I'd be like, you're a fucking pig.
Like you're a man pig.
That is so gross.
Every time I say pig I think I sound like Jesse Spano from Saved by the Bell.
She's like, okay, pig.
Pig.
You pig.
Gross.
So it really, again, it doesn't seem like this is new to him.
If you think about it, the way that he's portraying this is like, oh, I'm lonely, I'm looking for
someone.
So he's been doing this.
I feel like he has.
I feel like this probably is, if he's not already fucking someone else, then he's probably
like flirting with people regularly.
I mean, I would not put it past him.
So Sean was already taken, but she was like, hey, I have a friend you might be interested
in or she might be interested in you.
Would you be willing to get, can I give her your number?
Her name is Amber Fry.
So wait, hold on, that name sounds really familiar.
Keep going.
So Sean gave Scott Amber's contact information and Scott waited about a month ish to decide
to call her on November 19th.
Okay.
So this was the 24th ish around there probably that weekend.
So about a month later, so he ended up meeting up with Amber the next day.
Like couldn't wait to meet her.
So Amber is actually a massage therapist and she's a single mom and she's living in Fresno
on her own.
So on their first date, which was a blind date because they hadn't seen a picture of each
other, they went to dinner and they flirted the whole night and they actually ended up
back at his hotel room and then would have sex.
Yeah.
Okay.
I'm sorry.
I might have misheard this.
He went back for another business trip or he's in his hometown and he's just staying
in a hotel.
I'm sorry.
Okay.
So Amber lives in Fresno.
He lives in Modesto.
Yeah.
So when they met up for dinner, it was in Fresno.
Okay.
I see.
So what did he tell us why if he was doing overnight in Fresno?
Like what the hell?
I have no idea.
Okay.
So theoretically in an hour and a half, he could say he's anywhere.
That's true.
And they did have a boat and so they had a dock area at Berkeley Marina.
And so I mean, it's feasible.
He could just be like, I'm going to go fishing.
At night or whatever.
At night.
So yeah, they went back to his hotel room and they did have sex.
She said at the time that this was occurring, she felt like it was just going to be a one-night
stand kind of deal.
Amber did?
Yeah.
She was like, we're in a hotel room.
He didn't invite me to his house.
It's probably just a hookup, right?
Which is like, whatever, do you girl?
Which is fine.
Yeah.
I mean, again, I don't think that she felt shameful about it.
She was just like, it's just a one-night thing, like not a big deal.
But Scott was the one that eventually ended up continuing to contact her to her surprise.
So throughout the next month, Scott and Amber would hang out a lot.
He started going over to her place, would cook for her.
She remembered this one time that she thought it was really sweet that she had mentioned
in passing that she had never had a candy to apple before.
So he made her candy to apples.
Things like that being really nice and just being really sweet.
And it's kind of like, where's the poop?
That pisses me off though, because it's like, you could be doing all of this for your fucking
pregnant wife.
Yeah.
Surprised her with gifts regularly.
Again, she appreciated all this, but something just rubbed her the wrong way.
She's like, this guy has to be too good to be true.
Exactly, it's too perfect.
So Amber said that things were going pretty well, and she asked Scott to be her date for
an upcoming Christmas party during one of these nights that they were hanging out.
And she noticed that Scott began to get really uncomfortable and kind of like almost quiet
and kind of shut down.
Because he doesn't want to be seen in public with her in case he runs into somebody.
I mean, he's only an hour from home.
Yeah.
So Amber pushed the subject just a little bit more, and Scott said that he needed to
come clean about something.
Oh my God.
And that he wanted to tell Amber, but he didn't want it to affect their relationship.
That was just beginning.
Okay, when you start something like that, like you know that's gonna affect their relationship.
What's going on?
Scott told Amber that he was in fact married, but that he had lost his wife recently.
And this would be the first Christmas without her.
The first holiday he was experiencing without her.
Okay that is fucking far from the truth, but alright.
This is December 9th.
But not only that, so Amber pretty much said that she wasn't gonna push the subject.
She saw that he got really bothered by it.
And that's what didn't do out of his foot.
Right, well she didn't want to upset him further.
Yeah, she doesn't know any better.
She doesn't know any better.
And so all she did was console him since it was clearly whatever he was going through
was traumatic.
So Scott said not only with the things with his wife and that's what was going on, but
to kind of get his mind off of it, he was actually gonna go on a trip to Europe for
the holidays.
And it was to get away because he didn't want to experience a holiday without his wife.
And so he was like, I'm gonna go with a few friends and we're gonna go tour Europe during
the holidays so I'm not so lonely basically.
So he actually wasn't going to Europe.
He was just using that as an excuse to not see Amber throughout the holidays because
he spent time with his fucking wife and his unborn child speculating here.
But he did say when he got back from his European trip that he wanted to continue talking with
Amber towards improving the relationship or getting through the difficult time together
or whatever it was to continue that conversation at another date.
So on December 23rd, 2002, Lacey and Scott went to visit her sister Amy who regularly
cut Scott's hair, so this was Christmas Eve Eve.
So they were hanging around at the, I don't know, it didn't specify where they were, but
might have been Amy's house.
Either way, the family was talking about their plans for Christmas Eve the following day
and he had mentioned that he did have plans to go golfing for Christmas Eve.
So later in the evening, Lacey's mom Sharon called the house and had a brief conversation
with her daughter.
The next morning, the morning of the 24th, again, this is Christmas Eve, Scott said that
at about 9.30 a.m. he was leaving the house to go fishing in Brinkley Marina.
Okay.
First it was golfing.
First it was Europe.
That's true.
Then it was golfing.
Now it's fishing.
So it's about, I actually googled where Berkeley Marina, where the closest, what do you call
that, like a drop port?
Yeah, the closest port is there and it's literally 15, 20 minutes from their house.
It's really close.
They're pretty much almost on the water.
And when he left the house, he said that Lacey was watching a cooking show while baking
cookies, preparing to mop and then she was going to walk the dog.
Okay.
She's busy.
She's very busy on Christmas Eve.
She's very, very busy.
So later that morning at about 10.30 a.m., a neighbor named Karen.
I love that.
Karen.
So the Peterson's dog Mackenzie was alone outside the home and returned to the Peterson's
backyard by Karen.
And was like, that dog not supposed to be out.
So she put him back in the backyard.
So another neighbor named Mike said that he saw Mackenzie again at 10.45 a.m.
Okay.
So this is another 15 minutes later and he was playing catch with his own dog outside
and he saw Mackenzie.
And so he also returned Mackenzie to the backyard.
Good neighbors.
Apparently this happened at least one or two other times.
That neighbors had seen the dog at different times and was returning the dog.
I mean, that's like seemingly like, if it's a close knit neighborhood, that seems normal
to me, but it also seems like I would be like, hey, like your dog got out, like just
so you know, like here he is or whatever.
Like I kind of want to like maybe knock on the door, like let them know instead of just
like taking it upon myself to enter their backyard.
Well, yeah, I mean, they're just putting the dog back in the gate.
So Scott claims later when he returned at home around 2.30 ish, maybe he had seen, he
had found Mackenzie in the backyard.
So Scott found Lacey's Range Rover in the driveway, but decided now would be a great
time to strip down and watch the clothes that he was wearing and take a shower.
Well he did just come home from fishing.
So he just like came home, didn't like say hi or anything like that.
I just immediately took a shower and Mackenzie was muddy apparently is what he described.
He was like, oh, Mackenzie is muddy.
The Range Rover is here, but Lacey's not.
Better take a shower.
Yeah, that's really odd.
A little weird.
So although Scott claims to be the first person to call police, there are accounts that find
this not to be true.
Scott seemingly concerned waited around until 5.15 to call his mother-in-law Sharon and say,
well, I don't know, she was gonna walk the dog this morning when I left at 9.30 is the
last time I saw her.
It's now almost 5.30.
Haven't seen my wife.
And I've been home for three hours.
I've been home for three hours.
She was gonna walk the dog with the dogs here.
The dog's here.
The Range Rover is in the driveway.
Super sus.
Immediately concerned, Lacey's parents were the ones that informed police.
She's seven and a half months pregnant.
Yeah, exactly.
By the way.
Yeah, she's due in February.
Okay.
So yeah, yeah, again, Ron was the first one to call police.
So when police arrived at the Peterson home, investigators would come to find Lacey's purse,
wallet, keys, and sunglasses shoved into the back of a closet.
What at the Peterson home?
Just shoved in the back of a closet.
Oh, so what was happening is that he was trying to make it look like all of her shit was gone.
So she must have it with her.
Exactly.
To throw it in the closet to try to not let everyone see.
Dummy.
Knowing, not even realizing that they're gonna fucking search his house.
Yeah, like the first place you would look would be the house.
Yeah.
Maybe she, I don't know if they have a basement.
Did she fall in the basement?
Yeah.
Did she, you know, crawl up in the attic for some reason?
Looked around the house.
They're gonna check in the closet.
They're gonna check everywhere.
What the hell?
Dummy.
So, one of this, on the kitchen counter, when police arrived, there was a phone book open
on defense attorney pages.
God damn it.
What a fucking idiot.
Like, what an idiot.
It's pretty cut and dry.
I mean, come on.
Like, clearly you're fucking trying to cover your tracks.
Oh, what are you doing?
Oh, I don't know.
I'm just reading the phone book.
I don't know.
Yeah.
And I just so happened to be on D today for defense attorneys.
I'm just reading these yellow pages.
Yeah.
The dining room table had actually been set for the Christmas feast the next day.
So which, I, it didn't denote whether or not that was done before Scott left, but it
seems like she was the one that said.
She did it after he left, right?
I mean, because she was gonna mop.
So I don't know.
So during all of this, Scott's demeanor was described as calm.
Modesto police detectives, Bueller and Bertini, they were the lead investigators in the case,
questioned Scott that evening.
Well, though Scott initially said that he spent the day golfing, he did say that he
had gone fishing at Berkeley Marina.
He even had a receipt for checking into the port anyways.
So he had to have gone down there sometime.
So at 2.15, he left a message for Lacy stating, Hey, beautiful, it's 2.15.
I'm leaving Berkeley.
It's 2.15.
Why the fuck would you say that ever?
Ever says that.
Hi.
I'm with you now at 7.36.
And also it's a voicemail.
There's a timestamp when it was left.
Well, maybe it might be the house phone, but still, yeah, even the answering machine would
say that.
That is so dumb.
What?
Sorry.
Scott stated that he went fishing about 90 miles from the couple's Modesto home.
There's my other.
This dude not know how far 90 miles is.
Literally.
I took it on the map and I clicked on their home and I went like seriously way up in a
North California.
90 miles is a long way.
Even by boat.
That's like two hours driving time.
He would have had to have gone.
If it was really 90 miles, he would have been out in the Pacific Ocean.
Yeah.
I looked because it's where Berkeley Marina is.
It's San Francisco Bay and then, I forget what that lake is called, but all the way
through up there, it's only six miles.
Yeah.
Like 90 miles is a long way.
The middle fucking ocean.
Yeah.
So this guy's a dummy.
Clearly.
Was he dumping her body out there?
So, detectives immediately launched a search, but they were surprised by Scott's behavior.
Bueller said that, quote, I suspected Scott when I first met him.
Didn't mean he did it, but it was a little, I was a little thrown off by his calm, cool
demeanor and lack of questioning.
Why didn't he ask me, will you call me back?
Can I have your card?
What are you guys doing now?
Yeah.
Like he's not very interested in trying to find out where his wife is.
Right.
Brecini described Scott's reaction as, quote, strange and a combination of polite and arrogant,
disaffected, distanced and an impatiently irritable.
Okay.
Like he's like, I don't know what you want from me.
I don't know.
Can you get this search over with?
Like I'm fucking tired.
Like shit like that.
Ew.
Yeah.
He just didn't seem like a man who was crushed or even greatly disturbed by his wife's disappearance
and possible death.
Yeah.
That's all one quote, by the way.
Investigators took Scott to the station to further question him about the events that
were leading up to Lacey's disappearance and about the relationship itself.
And during this time, Scott said that he had a wonderful relationship with no complications,
although the police were almost immediately suspicious of Scott.
Yeah.
Lacey's family didn't believe that Scott had anything to do with the disappearance of
Lacey at this point and Scott was able to go home after this interview.
Lacey was officially a missing person on Christmas Eve.
Oh my God.
So 60s after Christmas Eve, Amber was actually hanging again.
This is Amber Fry.
Amber was spending some time with a girlfriend one day and the girlfriend handed Amber a
copy of a newspaper.
Okay.
And the article contained information regarding a missing woman from Modesto and although
Scott's face wasn't printed on the newspaper, enough details were given in the article that
Amber now knows that this is her Scott Peterson from Modesto.
Oh my God, that's so scary.
Within a few days, Amber would approach police saying that she had potentially important
information towards the case.
Investigators sat down with Amber and gained some pretty good information at the beginning.
They sat down and talked for more than an hour or so.
Clearly she wasn't fabricating this, but she was seeing this guy.
So Amber agreed to cooperate with investigators and the investigators went down to a local
radio shack with her.
LOL.
That's amazing.
Yeah.
So they purchased a recording device that would attach to her cell phone so that they
could monitor any conversations that her and Scott were to have.
As they're literally standing outside of the radio shack and Scott calls and they had just
hooked up the recording device.
Oh my God, so they're going to get his ass.
So Amber was super nervous and she was shaking.
So the connection was super rickety and eventually they lost connection, quote unquote, which
totally feeds him because like story about him being in Europe, right?
How convenient.
Oh wait, I'm sorry.
He called her, right?
Yes.
Oh, I thought you said that he was in person for some reason.
No, no, he called her because again, she's in Fresno and he's supposed to be like out
in Europe backpacking.
And she's like, that's funny.
It's totally like 4.30 a.m. in Europe.
Why are you awake?
Whatever.
No, that's the thing is like he was trying to call her like at specific hours so that
it would seem like he was in Europe, right?
What a fucking idiot.
It's like he's totally thought this out.
So again, like I said, the call drops, which again plays into the story that he's in Europe.
So after the call, investigators told her like it's okay, just remember, just talk to
them like normal.
Yeah.
And we don't have anything on this guy.
It's just suspicious.
Dude, I would be shitting myself.
It's just suspicious, but they have no real evidence that he did anything to his life.
But if there's any chance that he knows where she is alive, then they want that information
too, right?
Of course.
And they convinced Amber like it's going to be some time, so just relax.
It's okay.
So I feel like there's a giant twist coming and I'm really nervous.
So again, they take their time listening.
And anyways, so later that night, that same night, Scott calls again.
He starts to tell Amber about his current location, which is quote, just outside of Normandy.
Oh my God.
But that he'll quote, and it's 2.15.
But he'll quote, be in Paris tomorrow for New Year's and hopefully the phones will be
better than.
So like meaning that again, like it's totally playing into his like, oh, there's such a
bad connection.
Does she so she knows he's not in Europe.
Right.
And he thinks but he doesn't know that she knows and that he's totally like my wife's
missing and like whatever.
Does she know that she knows he's married and stuff or nothing?
Like she she remember he said that he had quote lost his wife and this is going to be
the first Christmas out.
Yeah, exactly.
So she doesn't know that she knows that his wife is actually very much well, maybe not
alive, but he was she was alive recently.
Now she knows because he said that on the 9th of December and she didn't go missing until
Christmas.
Yes.
And but he doesn't know that she knows all this information.
He's trying to just play it up like he's still having this like relationship with her
and what was me my wife and like yeah exactly the fact that the wife had probably already
died well had died at some point and that he's in Europe to like escape the holidays
without his wife.
Yeah.
And so she knows now.
Oh, your wife just went missing and you're a fucking freak.
Yeah.
Yeah, literally.
So knowing full well, he's a Modesto, right?
So the next day this is Christmas or I'm sorry, New Year's Eve, right?
So this is the 31st.
Scott calls Amber to tell her all about his amazing New Year's experience in Paris,
right?
And he claims that he was under the Eiffel Tower and there were crazy fireworks going
off and that he and his two friends are now at a bar for the rest of the New Year's celebration.
He even fabricates his two friends.
Not a fucking joke, right?
Francois.
And Pascuali.
Like Pascuali.
Francois.
Yeah.
And Francois and Pascuali.
Yeah.
And Francois and Pascuali.
Yeah.
And Francois and Pascuali.
Yeah.
And Francois and Pascuali, right?
So they're French and Spanish.
He's like, oh, my friend Pascual came up from Spain.
Now it's me and Francois at the bar.
That is so funny.
Like he's like what?
He gets on the phone and he's like, wee wee, it's Francois.
Yeah.
He's like, oh, it's me.
It's Pascuali.
He even puts his finger over his face like he has a mustache, but he doesn't because
he can't even, he can't see her.
He can only hear her.
Wee wee.
So of course, like, but okay.
So on the other side of what's interesting about the recording is on the other side,
you hear a bunch of people.
So you hear a bunch of people talking and it sounds like he's in a really loud atmosphere,
right?
Maybe he was in a bar just in Medesco.
He was in a really loud, Medesto.
You would think so.
But he was actually at Lacy's Candlelight Vigil.
No, he was not.
Oh, that is so messed up.
So sick.
He was at his wife's Candlelight Vigil while he was on the phone with Amber Fry saying
that he was in Paris out of bar when everybody there is there to mourn and raise awareness
because she's still missing it this way and raise awareness for his wife who is seven
months pregnant.
Oh my God, what a freaking asshole.
Asshole.
So continuing on to the new year on January 5th, divers began searching the Berkeley
Marina for any signs of Lacy or Scott dumping evidence.
So since that's where he said that he was last at, and again, I mentioned earlier that
he does have a receipt from Marina, so he definitely went there that day.
So however, their search was actually called off a few days later because they just really
didn't find any evidence.
They had a few suspicions of certain things being found certain places with sonar, but
they turned out to be nothing.
So Sharon, Lacy's mom, actually said that she didn't believe, first of all, she didn't
believe that Scott did anything wrong, and second of all, she just didn't think that
Lacy was there.
She just didn't feel like Lacy would be there.
So with all that, again, like I said, they called off the search in the Marina.
So the next day on a phone call, Amber had pushed the issue of Lacy's disappearance towards
Scott.
So this would be the 6th of January.
Wait, so he knows that Amber knows now?
During this phone call, this phone call that they're about to have, Amber is going to say,
I know who you are.
I know.
Like a girlfriend said something really weird to me about a missing woman and mentioned
to Scott Peterson, is that you?
And Scott did confess to Amber that his wife had gone missing on Christmas Eve and that
he was not in Europe.
Oh my God, what the hell?
Such a dummy.
He's just like, yeah, I've been lying to you this whole time.
You got me.
So he did say, she was like, Scott, you told me you lost your wife.
And that was before she even went missing.
Yeah, like that's really nice.
And he said, well, there's different types of loss, Amber.
Okay.
Like it was like emotional loss?
Like that's pretty cut and dry.
You're getting mad at me because you, okay.
No.
So that was the 6th of January.
So I'm going to fast forward just a little bit more.
On January 24th, the Rochas had actually denounced their support of Scott after the information
about Amber was revealed because the investigators kept that really hush-hush that they were
doing this thing with Amber because they didn't want her to be compromised or harassed or
anything.
Yeah, or killed.
Or yeah, exactly.
Again, the family was told about Amber.
There's actually a very public press release that Amber does.
But before this press release, the family was pulled aside before she was going to be broadcast
on national television.
Well, that's really respectful.
And they pulled Sharon and Ron aside and they said, look, this is the information that we've
gathered over this time.
They said that their final straw besides the photographs of the two of them together because
she thought they were in a relationship, but she was taking photographs of them and their
Christmas outfits and the shit together.
So again, besides the photographs, they were more upset that he had stated 14 days before
Lacey went missing, but he in fact lost his life.
And that's when they were like, OK, this guy, we don't believe he didn't do anything
anymore.
Probably cause, yeah.
So content warning, on April 13, 2003, a couple walking their dog found a decomposing body
of a late-term fetus in a marshy area of the San Francisco Bay Shore in Richmond Point,
Isabelle Regional Shoreline Park, which is our lot of words.
And this is north of the Brinkley Marina.
So they found just the fetus?
So they found a fetus of a late-term male.
This makes me think that either, OK, go.
One day later, the decomposing torso of a woman was found one mile away from the fetus.
So the woman was wearing a beige pants and a maternity bra.
The woman was unrecognizable given the state of decomposition and mutilation that had been
done to her body.
Again, severe content warning.
She was missing her head, arms, legs, and all of her internal organs were missing except
for her female anatomy.
Like her uterus and everything was still intact.
DNA tests would confirm that these bodies are that of Lacey and Connor.
The Emmy later released the autopsy report stating that Connor's skin was not decomposed,
although that the right side of his body was subject to trauma, possibly wildlife.
But other than that, he was intact.
So the Pleasant and umbilical cord had not been found, but they said it probably fell
off at some point, just because it's really thin and it's pliable.
So an expected date of death was not confirmed for Lacey.
Again, her female organs were intact and she had suffered two cracked ribs, although this
is not determined of whether or not this happened before or after her death.
It was concluded that Connor had been protected by Lacey's intact female organs, whether
or not Connor was alive when he was expelled by Lacey's dying or dead body was unclear.
Although meconium, which is a, meconium was found in Connor's bowels, which is the first
stool that a baby has.
So when the baby processes that first stool, it's because it's through the umbilical cord
and it's all the dead red blood cells, so it looks like blood were black.
So that was in his body.
So he wasn't like cut out of her body.
He was just pretty much delivered when she was after she had died.
Yeah.
So, which is awful.
So again, the indication that that was found inside of his body again, they, they expel
that within like an hour of them being born.
So if he had been born alive, that probably wouldn't be there is what I'm saying.
So the fact that it was, yeah.
He had passed before he was expelled.
Before he, yeah, could defecate pretty much.
So awful.
So the day that the DNA was confirmed to be Lacey and Connor's police sought to arrest
Scott Peterson, they found him on a La Jolla golf course, which is right on the border
of Mexico.
Oh, what, I wonder what his plan was.
He was claiming to meet his dad and his brother on this golf course, but he was waiting for
them.
In his car, investigators found miscellaneous items, including nearly $15,000 in cash, 12
Viagra tablets.
What the fuck?
Survival gear, camping equipment, several changes of clothes, four cell phones, and his
brother's driver's license.
So he was planning on fleeing to like the mountains of Mexico.
In addition to, this is in addition to his own, is the brother's driver's license.
His naturally dark brown hair had been dyed bright blonde.
That's why I said that the mugshot is hilarious because it just looks like a freak.
So on April 21st, 2003, Scott was remained in Stanislaus County Superior Court before
judge Nancy Ashley.
He was charged with two family accounts of murder with premeditation and special circumstances.
So what was the evidence that they've now dimmed on?
Did they have physical evidence at the scene?
His trial began on June 1st, 2004.
Mark Garagos was Scott's defense attorney, and he claimed that although Mr. Peterson
was a cad, quote, it hardly made him a murderer.
The defense focused on the theory that someone else had kidnapped and killed Lazy, potentially
for monetary gain.
So there were reports of a woman stealing checks from mailboxes around the neighborhood
at this time.
So they were thinking that maybe they were going to kidnap her or keep her.
Maybe they thought it would be too much to do that, so they just killed her anyways.
A single hair was the only piece of forensic evidence that was identified throughout the
entire trial.
Forensic evidence.
It was a hair that matched through DNA comparison to the hair from Lazy's hairbrush, and it
was stuck to pliers found on Peterson's boat.
All other evidence was circumstantial.
Scott's changed appearance, a vehicle rented in his mother's name, several porno channels
that he purchased the day after Lazy went missing.
I guess they entered that into evidence.
They said that it showed proof that he was determined to move on, like he didn't care.
I mean, kind of, like he dyed his hair, he seems like he's trying to escape.
Yeah.
Well, I mean, the porn is what I was talking about.
That it was evidence that he was moving on already.
I mean, that's fucking gross.
He did talk of selling the house that him and Lazy shared, and he did talk about trading
in Lazy's car for a new truck for himself.
Okay.
Yeah.
So, on a while, she's a missing person, and he's like treating it like she's dead already.
So on November 12th, 2004, Scott Peterson was convicted of first-degree murder for his
wife's death and the second-degree murder for Connor's death.
The penalty phase of the trial began on November 30th and concluded December 13th, when the
jury rendered a sentence of death.
On March 16th, Judge Delucci followed the jury's verdict, sentencing Peterson to death
by lethal injection and ordering him to pay $10,000 towards the cost of Lazy's funeral.
A judge called the murderer of Lazy cruel, uncaring, heartless, and callous.
After 17 years on death row on August 24th, 2020, in a 7-0 decision, the Supreme Court
of California upheld Peterson's conviction but overturned his decidence.
This is after he had been applying for appeals on a new trial.
On September 22nd, 2021, okay, this like, right, like yesterday, California's Superior
Court Judge, Ann Christine Masullo, scheduled Peterson to be resentenced that, or this November,
it says that November, but this November to life in prison without the possibility of
parole.
Wow.
I know.
We'll have to update on that whenever it does reach that time.
We'll have to update when we find out.
Right.
And again, I just, I took that little snippet of information, especially the sentencing.
I mean, I kind of shaped it up a little bit, but I did take it off a wiki and again, like
I said, it hasn't updated anything else since then.
So it was him.
Yeah.
I mean, honestly, I thought you were going to be, I thought you were going to be like
plot twist.
Amber and him were feigning this whole thing and she actually knew the whole time and she
took out.
She's, she's read, read, she's written multiple books about her account because, and then
she really goes into her and Scott's relationship, Amber.
And it's really interesting, like this guy has like anti-personalities, sociopathic tendencies
here and he's clearly a narcissist.
Yeah.
That's what I looked up to.
That is so wild.
That poor mom and that poor baby.
I know.
It's awful.
It's my heart.
It almost reminds me of Chris Watts.
And yeah.
And that's, yeah, that's kind of why I wanted to do it.
It's, it's, yeah, it's really tragic, especially when you talk like with Chris Watts, same thing.
Shanann was pregnant.
Yeah.
And then they had two babies and like, it's just, and I think that he probably has a lot
of that Scott Peterson shit in him too.
I can't even imagine like being married to somebody, starting a family with somebody
and then them turning out to be that kind of piece of shit that Chris Peter, Chris Peterson
and Chris Watts and Scott Peterson are.
Like that is so, so awful.
My heart really goes out to the families of the victims.
Yeah.
It's, it's really sad, especially for someone like Lacey who seemed to have like a pretty
good life and a pretty good outlook on life.
And it seemed like she was a really sweet person.
And I know she was excited to have this baby and just, yeah.
Yeah.
It's a nursery set up and everything.
It's a first time part.
And poor Amber.
I mean, she's just as much as a victim.
Yeah.
She's a single mom.
Like she was definitely looking for someone, someone to have settled down with and have
a partnership with.
Yeah.
That's, that's really, really awful.
And that sounds bad, but like you never know.
Like you always, you're always taking a risk when you start a relationship with someone
new and it's very scary.
It's very awful.
So psychologists have actually speculated that Scott is some combination of a narcissist
and they say sociopath, but we know that that's probably not the correct terminology.
Sociopath meaning like socially having like some type of a disorder, like an anti-personality
disorder.
Lack of empathy, lack of emotion towards other people.
Right.
So here's some of the instances.
If you want to take a trip down memory lane with me.
Peterson told that his neighbors that he was playing golf on Christmas Eve when he was
actually fishing, which we know, or fishing.
Yeah.
So clearly that's something that, oh, this is even though his fishing rod was not assembled
and his lures were still in the packaging.
Oh, cute.
So you can easily tell like that's a lie.
He's not ready.
Peterson began an affair with Amber Fry thinking that that wouldn't be an issue either.
No one's going to find out.
Right.
No one's going to find that out.
Again, tearfully confessing to her that he had lied to her saying that he was married
when he wasn't or that his wife was dead when she was or wasn't.
Manipulative as fuck.
Yeah.
The candlelight vigil that he was like literally giggling on the phone with Amber Fry while
he was there.
People saw him talking in the corner and then her family, like they had them up on this kind
of like stage where they were talking about and Scott never went up and said anything.
Like he just didn't give a shit.
So signs of narcissistic personality disorder include a grandiose sense of self-importance,
i.e. you exaggerate your achievement or your abilities.
You have a preoccupation with the idea of gaining success, power, love and physical attractiveness,
a belief that you are special or in high status and can only be understood by similar people
or should only associate with those specific people or institutions, a need for excessive
admiration, a sense of entitlement and expectation that others will simply just comply or give
them favorable treatment, exploits other people for personal gain, you lack empathy for others,
you envy others or believe that others envy you and you're arrogant.
You're arrogant.
You have arrogant behaviors and attitudes.
And then signs of anti-personality disorder are repeatedly failing to follow social norms
resulting in grounds for arrest potentially, engaging in deceitful actions such as lying,
using aliases, not paying off debts, impulsivity and lack of planning ahead, irritability and
aggressiveness that leads to physical altercations, recklessness or a lack of concern for the safety
of other people, chronic irresponsibility that leads to failure to maintain a job, finish
school or keep financial commitments, and a lack of remorse for hurting other people.
That's like all him.
Yeah, every single one and I'm pretty sure you only need about two or three of those.
So that's two types of narcissistic personality disorder and anti-personality disorder, but
they can coincide.
And when they coincide, it's these specific things.
So in order for someone to fall into this category, they need to show several of the
diagnostic criterias, this is kind of what we just talked about.
So a sociopathic narcissist or an anti-personality disorder and narcissist personality disorder,
and those are combined, that person can be cold and callous, but will also seek the admiration
of others and will also believe that they deserve it.
They will have a disdain for people and think that it's okay to exploit and dispose of
people in whatever ways it helps them get ahead.
Yeah, sounds about right.
These kinds of people may be charismatic and charming, unreliable and controlling, selfish
and dishonest.
They both feel entitled and deny responsibility for their actions.
They usually lack empathy and emotional responsiveness and an insight into their own personality disorders.
So they think that they're just a highly successful person.
Why wouldn't people not love me?
Yeah, well that really, really shows what kind of a piece of shit that that guy is and
we'll definitely update when we see anything about his case, any movement or anything.
But thanks for sharing.
I actually didn't know that case.
You didn't?
I did not and I'm glad that I do not glad, but interesting.
Yeah, it was definitely something that I dived into when I heard about it.
I was in my high school years.
Like that was something that was definitely intriguing to me.
Yeah, she was found in 2003, so I was definitely in like a sophomore.
I mean, yeah.
So it was definitely something that I remembered being really big news.
Yeah, I mean even Nancy Grace was talking about it.
You know if Nancy Grace talks about it, then it's true.
Yeah, exactly.
Well, thanks for sharing.
I hope that you guys are enjoying our content.
We're really enjoying researching these cases and giving insight into the diagnoses that
these people have or may not have.
And we're going to commit to making something for you guys to attach to within the next
episode probably.
Yeah, absolutely.
And yeah, just keep listening to us if you like what we're doing.
We'll definitely again reach out when we find those lines of communication and we have them
open.
I did set up an Instagram for us, so that is going to be at diagnosing a killer.
And I also set up a Twitter for us as well, so that's at Killer Diagnosis.
So give us a follow, give us a shout if you want to direct message us or if you want to
tweet at us.
We're here and we're available to respond.
So please, please, please hit us up.
Yeah.
All right.
Love you.
Bye.