Hello!
Welcome back to another episode of Diagnosing a Killer, the mental breakdown. I'm Kenna and I'm Koel.
How's it going? Pretty good. Pretty good? Yeah. It's going alright. It's going alright.
That's a total lie I went to the ER the other day. Oh my god. No, it's totally fine though. I have um,
what do they call that? Br- not Britesvus. That's like tuberculous. Yeah, no, it was like uh,
Brysytus. Brysytus, yeah. In my hip and the doctor told me that I'm just old, so that's great. That's just how you are now.
That's just your hip now. Yeah. So I got shot in my behind and I did not feel nice. Gross. I'm sorry about that.
But I am- We both have the bad hips now. Yeah. We both got the hip. They both got the hip. They don't lie. They don't lie.
I gumped over on the way home today. No you didn't. You got a fucking fat ticket. What? Were you speeding? I was.
Yeah, I was going 80 and a 65 bad Ken. It was on the highway. Oh, it was on the highway. Still, I was on the left lane and I like
pretty much like almost flew past this cop and then I slowed down and he saw me. So he got like right behind me and let me up.
I was like, shh. Do you never slow down? You just stop accelerating. Well, that's what I did. I didn't like hit the brakes.
You know what I mean? But I definitely like- I saw him too late. You know what? That's my bad. I was speeding. Yeah.
I was actually listening to our podcast because I'm super vain and I was just kind of zoned out. Like I really didn't even realize how fast
I was going and then he was like, hmm, you had to hurry to get somewhere. Like where are you going? And I was like 3 o'clock in the afternoon.
No, I'm just zoned out. Just a bad driver. No. But yeah, so $230 ticket later. Oh wow. I'm not going to speed anymore.
I know you always say that I drive so fast. Yeah, I'm sorry. So we are going to get into this mente bréqui.
But before we do, would you like to give everyone our social media? If it's their first time here.
Sure. You can check us out anywhere on social media at Diagnosing a Killer, other than ex formerly known as Twitter, which is at Killer Diagnosis.
We have a PayPal, Cash App, and Venmo set up at Diagnosing a Killer. We also have that Patreon. And those include four tiers.
Tier 1 gets Adfree Mental Breakdown episodes. Tiers 2, 3, and 4 get Adfree Every Episode. And of course, Tier 3 and 4 receive that added bonus episode towards the end of the month every month.
That one's coming up really soon. And who are you covering? We are covering James Ian Holmes. The Aurora Cinema Perpetrator.
Well, we saw like the same person there. That was weird. Perpetrator.
And then how weird of us to say perpetrator. And they're like, Suspect or not Suspect, but criminal or whatever you want to call them. Interesting.
We're just twin telepathy. Yeah, so you guys go check out that Patreon if you want to get access to those bonus episodes.
I think there's like 12 out right now. Just takes a few minutes to sign up. Again, that's just tiers 3 and 4.
And we really appreciate the support of our current Patreon members. And I think we're going to get into this episode. I'm excited.
So, as people may or may not know, we are now changing our content warning with each other. So I will not be telling Koel the content warning right now.
I will be recording it at the end of the episode as to not give anything away. But you guys will hear your content warning right about now.
Content Warning. This episode contains depictions of depression, adolescent mental disorders, violent crimes against minors, and serious mental illness.
If this episode is not for you, we encourage you to find another one of our episodes. Remember, your mental health is very important and we love you.
Love you. Bye. I love doing that. Me too. It's so fun.
Today, we are going to be talking about the infamous Slender Man.
No. Oh, I am so excited about this. I am. I'm so excited.
The Slender Man is a fictional supernatural character that first originated as a creepypasta internet meme in 2009.
More like Slim Daddy.
Eric Nudson, also known by the alias Victor Surge, is known to have created the Slender Man and posted about his existence on the forum called Something Awful.
The Slender Man is depicted as a thin, unnaturally tall, human-like figure with an all white head but no facial features.
But you have to mention the suit though, because that's what makes him big.
Absolutely. So essentially, he has a blank face, nothing there, and he's also known to wear a black suit and tie.
So he's real formal. No face.
Shortly after the creation of the fictional character, many stories about the Slender Man began to emerge.
Most commonly, the stories of the Slender Man had to do with him stalking, abducting, or traumatizing people, mostly children in particular.
And I'm sure a lot of people can relate. I learned a lot about the Slender Man when I was in my late middle school, early high school years.
My friend Evan was obsessed with him and he would always talk about him, and I was always real scared.
But he's a fictional character, y'all.
Where is he?
Since his creation, the Slender Man has become an icon in many different ways on social platforms,
even including being part of video games and online discussion boards.
This dark, mysterious character would go on to inspire people to create stories to scare others,
explore creepy places in search of the Slender Man, and even commit heinous crimes on his behalf.
Oh, I got the heaves I actually did.
Because many people took the story of Slender Man and ran with it in different directions, there's really no set origin story about the tales of the Slender Man.
However, among the different stories, some things continued to remain the same across the board.
Slender Man is most commonly described as, again, being very tall and thin with unnaturally long, tentacle-like arms.
Oh, with salad fingers.
These arms, they say, can be used to extend out and grab any prey that the Slender Man wants to take, like Elastigirl.
She just stents them out.
That is weird. I didn't think about that specifically. But that must be like an adaptation, right?
Yeah, well, that's what I'm saying. That's not what the cartoon maybe looks like or the, you know, character,
but the arms are kind of long-looking, so now it makes sense that people always norm can stretch all this way.
Stretch arms strong. Gonna get ya.
In most of the stories, the Slender Man's face is white and featureless, but occasionally, this face has been said to appear differently to different people who claim to have witnessed it.
So like, if he sees you see him, then he makes a face or something.
Oh my god, can you imagine? It's like there's no face, and then he makes face contact, not eye contact.
A Rorschach painting. No, I was wondering if the face looks different to each individual, which is even creepier.
Yeah, that's what I was thinking that they were saying. And then again, it's described differently by people who claim to have witnessed it.
Again, in most stories, the Slender Man is seen wearing a black suit and tie, and is typically associated with being spotted in the forest.
Furthermore, the Slender Man has been thought to be able to teleport quickly in order to grab children, and there is often talk of a quote, slender sickness, and quote, when one is in close proximity to him.
Ew.
So essentially they're like, oh, I can tell he's in the area because I'm starting to feel ill.
Ew. Yeah, the teleportation reminds me of Enderman from Minecraft.
They self-of him.
Yeah.
Accompanying this sickness is also a rapid onset of paranoia, nightmares, and delusions, along with nosebleeds, according to the lore.
Oh, that's creepy.
Early stories of the Slender Man include him targeting young children, but some state that the Slender Man was also responsible for driving adults insane, or influencing them to commit acts on his behalf.
Oh, that's scarier.
Yeah.
Especially if you're a kid.
Because Slender Men told me to do it.
Yeah, exactly. Is the Slender Man controlling my parents?
Yeah.
Oh, that's terrifying.
Early stories would suggest that investigating the Slender Man or trying to find out where he is or more about him would cause him to reveal himself.
So it's like, if you go looking for him, you're more likely to see him.
You gotta, like, want it.
You gotta really want it.
Well, I mean, that makes sense, because the human mind wants to see what it wants to see.
Right, and you can, like, influence yourself to have hallucinations.
Yeah.
However, although some people would eventually take it upon themselves to commit a heinous act on Slender Man's behalf, the lore does not suggest that he is influencing violence,
or bodily harm, just abduction or scaring.
So, like, he takes the kids, but there's not any stories that say, like, what he does, like, if it's heinous or violent or anything.
Well, it's a fear of the unknown.
Right.
A professor by the name of Shira Chess, who has studied a lot about the Slender Man, stated about this, quote,
It is important to note that few of the retellings identify exactly what kind of monster the Slender Man might be and what his specific intentions are. These points all remain mysteriously and usefully vague, end quote.
Uhhh, usefully vague.
Yeah.
Like, no one knows.
No one knows what he does.
When the Slender Man was first created, it was posted on the Something Awful Internet forum, in which a Photoshop contest challenged people to, quote, create paranormal images, end quote.
Okay.
Eric Nudson would post two black and white images of groups of children, both in which he added the tall, thin, man-like figure wearing a black suit, like, in the background.
Uhhh, just watching a group of kids.
Yes.
Although previous entries of Eric's included just photos, this submission would include little snippets of texts that were stated to have been written by victims of the Slender Man.
The quote under the first photograph read, quote,
We didn't want to go. We didn't want to kill them. But its persistent silence and outstretched arms horrified and comforted us at the same time, end quote.
Fuck that.
Following the quote, the words were written, quote, 1983 photographer unknown, presumed dead, end quote.
Eww.
The quote underneath the second photograph stated, quote,
One of two recovered photographs from the Sterling City Library blaze, notable for being taken the day which 14 children vanished and for what is referred to as the Slender Man.
Deformity cited as film defects by officials. Fire at library occurred one week later. Actual photograph compensated as evidence, end quote.
So there was like a fire at this library?
That's what the, like, almost like caption of the photo says, but I'm not sure how true that is. I didn't really look that up.
This photo was signed, quote, 1986 photographer, Mary Thomas, missing since June 13th, 1986, end quote.
That's like a whole mystery thing. When we were younger in like high school, maybe fresh out of high school, and YouTube really became a thing, there's all these like hidden meaning videos that came out back then, and a friend of mine was super into them.
And there would be like an interactive space. So someone would post a video of them sitting on a beach and they bury something in the sand.
Well, you could actually go out if you knew where that location was and find the very thing and then you start a video and showing where you put something.
And then someone finds it's like geo catching.
Yeah, like I was just gonna say that.
And so it's really interesting that there's this world being created around Splendor Man, that's what I'm saying. So it doesn't necessarily all have to be true.
Yeah.
It's all fiction, but the immersion of it is real.
Yeah, it's almost like a docu, not a docu series, like a fantasy series or like a movie, you know?
You're probably already aware that craft beers have exploded in popularity over the past decade.
But what you might not know is that there are thousands of awesome craft beers being produced by these new micro breweries every day.
With Craft Beer Club, each order will showcase two breweries from different regions in the US and includes four beer styles with a brand new box with each shipment.
You will also receive publications that detail the history about the featured breweries, tasting notes, pairing options, and maybe even a little trivia.
Click on our link in the show notes and receive an exclusive offer today with Craft Beer Club.
Due to the captions on these photos, people were left to their own interpretations, giving way for many different stories to be created from the images.
According to Eric Nudson, he was inspired to create the character of Slenderman primarily by quote, that insidious beast, end quote, by Zach Parsons.
Stephen King's The Mist, reports of shadow people and the mad gasser of Mattoon.
Just like he got his inspiration from a lot of places and kind of just like made one character based on all of that.
Eric's intention was quote, to formulate something whose motivations can barely be comprehended and which caused unease and terror in a general population.
End quote.
Because like what does it want?
Yeah.
What is it doing?
What does it do?
Where did it come from?
Why?
I don't know.
Why is this a thing?
Due to the forum that Slenderman was posted on and the growing population of the internet at the time, Slenderman quickly became viral, spawning numerous works of fan art, cosplay, and horror stories that spread from site to site.
So yes, you're right.
Like it literally just like took off running.
People would begin posting videos of their alleged encounters with Slenderman, but these are mostly vague and hard to make out.
Most videos, as I remember, showed the point of view of people walking through the woods at night and the camera either glitching or dropping when the quote, citing, happened.
Although there are many differing accounts of Slenderman, the interest would grow and grow, with many people leaning into the fictional character and becoming scared that he may be real.
In 2012, the Slenderman was adapted into a video game entitled Slender the Eight Pages, and the official website would almost immediately crash after too many people tried to download the game.
I'm gonna do it right now.
Let's just go back and look.
The sequel to this game, Slender the Arrival, would launch in 2013, and several independent films would also be released about the Slenderman.
Unfortunately, with the interest in Slenderman growing, the development of individuals who began almost worshiping him also grew.
This is wild.
Anisa Weir was born on November 10, 2001, in Wakesha, Wisconsin, to Bill and Kristie Weir.
Her childhood and upbringing were relatively typical according to sources, but she was known as somewhat of an outsider at school.
When she was in elementary school, Anisa would meet a girl by the name of Morgan, and the two would bond over fantasy stories, internet legends, and supernatural tales.
To Morgan, she was good friends with Anisa, but to Anisa, the two were inseparable.
Morgan Geyser was born on May 16, 2002, to Angie and Matt Geyser in Wakesha, Wisconsin.
According to her parents, Morgan began to exhibit some disturbing signs of lacking empathy at a really young age.
In fact, it was when Morgan saw the movie Bambi for the very first time that her parents realized something may be off.
Angie Geyser recalled this moment, quote,
We were so worried to watch it with her because we thought she was going to be so upset when the mother died.
But the mother died and Morgan just said, run Bambi, run, get out of there, save yourself.
She wasn't sad about it, end quote.
However, Morgan's parents would also describe their child in wonderful ways growing up.
Angie stated about Morgan's younger years, quote,
Morgan loved animals and was always gentle and kind.
She enjoyed reading, writing, drawing, anime, and playing with her American girl dolls.
She was an excellent student and her teachers always loved having her in class.
She used to stay after school to help her English teacher clean up the classroom.
She was always a quirky kid who marched to the beat of her own drum.
She was intensely creative and had a silly sense of humor.
She was a loving and affectionate member of our family, end quote.
Really great things to say about someone.
Yeah, but it all still seems like, not to dog on the mom at all, but it definitely seems like,
well, there is nothing wrong with her. She was great with academics.
She was great, you know, I mean, essentially nothing to having to do with emotions.
Everything to do with processes or routines.
That's true.
When Morgan was in the fourth grade, she would meet and become friends with another girl in her grade named Peyton Lutner.
Peyton describes the day that she met Morgan, quote,
she was sitting all by herself and I didn't think anyone should have to sit by themselves, end quote.
Peyton Lutner was born on February 13, 2002 in Waukesha, Wisconsin, to parents Joe and Stacy Lutner.
When Peyton met Morgan in the fourth grade, the two girls would instantly hit it off.
Morgan would describe Peyton or her nickname Bella as, quote,
my only friend for a long time, end quote.
While Peyton would say it about Morgan, quote,
she was funny.
She had a lot of jokes to tell.
She was great at drawing and her imagination always kept things fun, end quote.
Once Morgan met Anissa in the sixth grade, however, her friendship with Peyton began to get pushed to the side.
Being really into fantasy and paranormal stories, Morgan and Anissa quickly began engaging in a lot of talk and interest in The Slender Man.
This interest would quickly become an obsession, and Morgan and Anissa would begin to act as if they were worshiping the fictional character.
Peyton began to grow uncomfortable about the other girls obsession, stating that, quote,
it scared me and that I didn't like it, end quote.
She would further express her uncomfortability to Morgan, who she described as, quote,
really liking it as in Slender Man and thought it was real, end quote.
I mean, I guess like every kid goes through a phase, right?
So it's like, how seriously do you take this as a parent?
Yeah, exactly. It's like, there's posters on the wall.
It's like, okay, well, I was into some dork stuff.
Yeah, spooky stories.
Yeah, goosebumps.
How harmful can spooky stories be?
Yeah. Furthermore, Peyton was also not the biggest fan of Anissa after meeting her.
She thought that Anissa was a cruel person and was jealous that Morgan had any other friends besides her.
Hmm.
However, Peyton did not express this to Morgan, and she truly believed that everybody deserved to have a friend,
so she kept quiet about her true feelings of Anissa.
She's a nice girl.
Yeah.
As Anissa and Morgan fell deeper into the Slender Man rabbit hole, Morgan would begin referring to herself as, quote,
creepy and, quote, a mental case, and quote, and letters written to Anissa.
She referred to herself that way?
Yes, Morgan to herself, yeah.
Meanwhile, Anissa was dealing with the fallout from her parents' recent divorce,
and she began falling into a deep depression over it.
That's gotta be rough at that age, too.
Yeah, they're like, like 11 at this point.
Yeah, 11, 12-ish. You're already going through this like angsty teen phase.
Mm-hmm.
Anissa and Morgan both found an odd sort of comfort in the dark fantasies they were obsessing over.
During this time, knowing that Peyton was uncomfortable with the Slender Man thing,
the two would also constantly show her photos just to scare her, which is me.
Over a few months, Morgan and Anissa would begin to believe that they were more attached to Slender Man than most,
and this would quickly turn into feelings that they were his, quote, proxies,
and, quote, whose purpose would be to carry out acts for Slender Man.
Unbeknownst to Peyton, the two girls that she was hanging out with had been planning to do the work of Slender Man
and murder her as a sacrifice to him.
Anissa and Morgan had been planning the sacrifice of Peyton for months prior,
even whispering about it in public and using code words like, quote,
tracker, end quote, when talking about the knife, end quote, itch, end quote, when discussing the actual killing.
Yeah.
Like, oh, I got a really bad itch, you know, things like that.
Ooh.
Yeah.
That's so messed up.
Like, why code it?
Yeah.
I mean, why even say it?
Yeah, I mean, why even...
They want to be able to get away with saying it in public.
Yeah.
That's why.
Yeah.
I guess.
The girls believed that the sacrifice of Peyton would appease Slender Man
and that he would let them live at his house as a reward for their good deed.
He has a house?
Apparently.
I thought he just lives in the woods.
One of the lords, I guess, he has a house.
He just stands next to trees.
That's all he does.
He just creeps around.
The girls would also begin to believe that if they did not go through with the killing,
Slender Man would kill their families in revenge.
It's like folly adieu.
I was going to say, this is like pretty detailed for just having believed a story, you know?
On May 30th, 2014, Morgan Geyser had just finished celebrating her 12th birthday a few weeks
prior and she had invited Anissa and Peyton over to celebrate with a sleepover.
The three would go into an indoor roller rink to have some fun and return home around 9.30pm.
Once home, the girls would play dress up, play on their laptops, and just generally
hung out before going to bed.
Peyton noted that it was odd that Morgan wanted to go to bed around the same time as her,
as she was typically a girl who wanted to stay up late, especially during a celebration.
Yeah.
The following morning, the girls woke up to donuts and strawberries
before asking Morgan's mom if they could go outside to play.
Little did Peyton know the girls had originally planned to kill her the previous night,
but they ultimately decided that they were too tired after roller skating.
Oh, just too tired.
We'll just wait till tomorrow.
Couldn't possibly be bothered.
The girls set off for David's Park with Peyton leading the way in Anissa and Morgan following.
When Peyton wasn't looking, Morgan got Anissa's attention and flashed her something she was hiding beneath her jacket.
It was a kitchen knife.
Shortly after getting to the park, the three girls went into the bathroom,
where the plan was for Morgan to restrain Peyton while Anissa knocked her out by hitting her head against the wall.
However, when it came time to do this, Morgan was noted as panicking,
and Anissa would try and hit Peyton's head against the wall.
Anissa would later state about this quote,
from what I read on the computer, it's easier to kill people when they're either asleep or unconscious,
and it's also easier if you do not look them in the eyes.
I kind of banged her head up against the concrete.
So they already attacked her at this point?
They're attempting to.
Okay.
Morgan would corroborate the story, stating quote,
Anissa tried to knock Bella out, Bella got all mad and stuff, and I was pacing in circles.
End quote.
In response, Peyton would flee the bathroom, and Anissa was noted as calming Morgan down
before they both met Peyton outside, and just casually suggested that they play hide and seek.
After that?
Peyton obviously being aware that there was something weird going on, reluctantly accepted,
because, you know, we've seen so far, she's like,
gonna go along with it, I don't want to make any waves, you know, she's a nice girl.
She's probably just like, what the hell, that was kind of weird, but like,
I don't know, let's play hide and seek, maybe I can get away from them for a little bit,
and calm down, you know.
Distance herself.
Right.
Morgan would later state about suggesting hide and seek, excuse me, quote,
we let her there and tricked her, people who trust you become very gullible,
and it was sort of sad, end quote.
This is the mind of an 11 year old?
Well, they're 12 now, but yes.
12?
Yeah.
12 years old?
She's kind of sad that she trusts an ass.
Yeah.
And she's done all this research clearly on the internet about how to knock people out?
Yeah.
It's wild.
While they were going to hide, Anissa suggested to Peyton that she should try and conceal herself
by covering herself with leaves.
Peyton would do just that, and once she was covered with the leaves,
Anissa was noted as looking at Morgan and stating, quote, go ballistic, go crazy, end quote.
She like made, she made her cover herself, like almost bury herself.
Almost, I guess so it was like less obvious, maybe.
At this time, Morgan would pull the knife from her jacket pocket and begin stabbing Peyton.
Peyton would be stabbed a total of 19 times in her arms, stomach, liver, and pancreas.
Miraculously, the knife never hit Peyton's heart and came within a millimeter of hitting other major arteries.
That is incredible.
Morgan would say about this part of the attack, quote, stab, stab, stab, stab, stab.
It was weird.
I felt no remorse.
I would, I actually felt nothing, end quote.
Of course, this is later on.
Morgan continued about this quote, the last thing she said to me was, I trusted you.
Then she said that I hate you.
And then we lied to her.
Anissa said that she'd go get help, end quote.
Of course, the girls did not go and get help and instead fled the scene, leaving Peyton for death.
Unbeknownst to Anissa and Morgan, however, Peyton was still very much alive and she would eventually gather up enough strength to crawl to a nearby trail where a biker passing by would find her bloody and dying after she flagged them down.
She would stab 19 times.
How much blood she must have lost.
And how far was this bike trail we don't know.
But what an incredible feat, you know, for a 12 year old.
Born and brewed in Southern California since 1963, the coffee bean and tea leaf has always been passionate about connecting loyal customers with carefully handcrafted products.
Their coffee master, J.I. Zaeus, only selects the top 1% of Arabica beans from the world's best growing regions, giving customers the best quality product every time.
Whether you're looking for a dark roast to liven up your day or a soothing tea to relax into the night, the coffee bean and tea leaf has it all.
Click the link in our show notes today to access an exclusive offer and get sipping.
Authorities would be called and Peyton would quickly be rushed to the hospital to undergo surgery.
At a miraculous turn of events, Peyton would wake up from her successful surgery.
Peyton recalls this moment of regaining consciousness stating, quote,
I remember the first thing that I thought after I woke up was like, did they get them?
Are they there?
Are they in custody?
Are they still out?
End quote.
Little did Peyton know the girls were in custody already.
A few hours after the attack, police would locate Morgan and Anisa walking along the highway and bring them both into the station.
While being interviewed, it was noted that Morgan and Anisa showed complete opposite emotions.
Morgan was noted as being stoic and calm, almost emotionless, while Anisa was hysterical and cried the entire time.
During her interview, Anisa made it abundantly clear that Morgan was the one who did the actual stabbing, as Anisa was, quote,
too squeamish, end quote, to do it herself.
Morgan, on the other hand, was unable to correctly recall if it was her or Anisa that held the knife during the stabbing,
but she did state that Anisa was the mastermind behind the idea.
Of course, Anisa would say the same thing about Morgan, that it was all her idea.
Right.
Another important thing that occurred during the interviews was Anisa admitting that she knew this slender man was not real.
She stated about this, quote, beforehand I believed.
Now I know it's just teenagers who really like scaring people and making them believe false things, end quote.
Morgan was noted as asking authorities during her interview, quote, is she dead?
I was just wondering.
Sometime went by, quote, I might as well say it, we were trying to kill her, end quote.
Just stoic.
Police would begin to suspect that Morgan Geyser was the mastermind behind the stabbing due to her emotionless responses and catatonic approach to her interview.
Detective Tom Casey has stated about this, quote, there was a lot of deception in Morgan's interview, end quote.
Furthermore, Detective Michelle Trusoni would state that there was a, quote, clear sense of who the ringleader was driving this.
It was definitely Morgan, end quote.
Both of the girls would initially be charged with attempted first degree intentional homicide.
Following the arrest and interviews, police would search the girls' houses.
In Morgan's bedroom, they would find drawings of slender man and mutilated dolls.
They would also find internet searches on her computer stating things like, quote, how to get away with murder, end quote, and quote, what kind of insane am I, end quote.
Y'all stop looking at things on the internet.
Yeah, just stop.
We're the ones telling them that we have all this gruesome shit.
I know. That's the thing though, it's like, I think about that too.
But we have a, I mean.
We have a podcast to back it up.
Yeah.
When Morgan's family was informed of her arrest and confession, her mother Angie was noted as saying, quote, I couldn't believe what I was hearing.
I would never have imagined that my daughter was capable of hurting another person, end quote.
In fact, both of the girls' mothers said in interviews that they did not ever see any warning signs that their daughters would want to harm someone else.
Angie would state about Morgan and Peyton's get togethers, quote, they would sit up in Morgan's room and they would do each other's nails and they would laugh and make a mess.
They were just typical girls, end quote.
However, Morgan's mother did admit that she knew about her daughter's fascination with slender man and they even talked about him together.
She stated, quote, she would show us some of the pictures and she would read us some of the stories and while some of the subject matter was a little dark, I wasn't concerned.
When I was Morgan's age, I was reading Stephen King novels.
I remember being 11 years old and writing home from the library with the book It Under My Arm.
And that's a very scary and dark story.
So I just thought it was normal for a child of middle school age to be interested in scary stories, end quote.
Just like what you said.
Yeah.
And they just get curious, you know, they want to know that adrenaline, right?
It's like that episode we did about why we choose to consume scary content or true crime content, you know?
It's all part of that.
It's human nature.
Yeah, exactly.
On the other hand, Anise's mother, Christie, stated that her daughter, quote, never mentioned anything to me about her belief in slender man, quote.
Peyton would be in the hospital for seven days following the attack, but she would ultimately make a full recovery and be released.
Physically.
Yes.
During the police investigation and pre-trial psychiatric evaluations, Morgan Geiser would admit that she had been having extreme visual and auditory hallucinations beginning in early childhood.
She stated that these figures included things that she interpreted as ghosts, colors melting down walls, and imaginary friends named Maggie and Sev.
One recurring hallucination that she spoke of was a man she named It, and she described his body as the color of smoke and ink.
She would state that she would most often see this man behind her in mirrors or around corners, which is like petrifying.
I'm sorry.
That's terrifying.
That's a lot.
While she was awaiting trial, correctional officers would report that Morgan would frequently talk to herself, pretended to be a cat, and kept Anse she would find as pets.
She was also reported to have talked of seeing unicorns and believing that she was still having ongoing conversations with slender man and other fictional characters.
This is so early.
Yeah.
For something like what you're going to say.
Well, what is it?
Schizophrenia.
Correct.
In the fall of 2014, Morgan was relocated to the Winnebago Mental Health Institution to determine if she was competent to stand trial.
On October 22, 2014, Morgan was officially diagnosed with early onset childhood schizophrenia.
That is wild.
At 12.
Like probably even before then, she was having symptoms.
I think maybe Mark David Chapman is the only other one that we've covered that shows signs of schizophrenia spectrum disorder at a young age, but he was never diagnosed.
Yeah.
I mean, it can happen.
It doesn't happen very often, but it can happen.
That's where that early onset is important.
Right.
Morgan would go on to receive treatment for her schizophrenia diagnosis, but it would be erratic and inadequate for 19 months.
During this time, Morgan would continue to experience her symptoms and would fall into a psychosis in which she was not able to differentiate between reality and delusions.
In December of 2015, Morgan would begin a constant long-term regimen of antipsychotic medication, which would finally lead her to being able to understand the full extent of what she had done to payton.
Once her medication was stabilized and Morgan was fully able to comprehend what had occurred at her hands, she began showing true signs of guilt and remorse.
On March 23, 2016, Morgan would return to the county jail to await her trial.
Although she was now being properly medicated, Morgan's mental health would continue to deteriorate while awaiting trial.
Professionals would suggest that her mental state was fragile due to her incarceration and coming to terms with what she had done.
When beginning trial, Morgan Geiser would ultimately be charged with attempted first-degree homicide, a class A felony, while Anissa Weir was charged with attempted second-degree homicide, a class B felony.
Due to the horrific nature of these offenses, both Anissa and Morgan were waived out of juvenile court and tried as adults.
I believe it.
In 2017, Anissa would plead guilty to being a party of attempted second-degree homicide, but the jury would ultimately find her quote, not guilty by mental disease or defect.
I'm not sure what Anissa had going on mentally exactly, but again, if it's like, Follyadu kind of following the leader, they might have been able to assume that, like the jury.
However, we all know that the judge has final say in the sentencing, and Anissa would be sentenced to 25 years to life, with three of these years required to be in a forensic psychiatry institute.
Furthermore, following her release, if and when it happened, Anissa was to be under communal supervision until age 37, which would be the time that her sentence would be up if she hadn't been released.
Morgan would accept a plea offer that stipulated she would not undergo a trial if she pleaded guilty and agreed to further psychiatric evaluation to determine appropriate duration of commitment to a forensic psychiatric hospital.
Oh.
Morgan would later plead guilty, but would be found not guilty by reason of mental disease or defect due to her schizophrenia diagnosis.
However, Morgan would face time as well, and she was given the maximum sentence of 40 years to life, with three of these years required to be served at a forensic psychiatric unit.
Just three out of 40 years, though?
Three required.
Oh, I see.
In addition, the terms of her sentence were for her to be involuntarily treated in a similar institution until resolution of symptoms or age 53, whichever happens first.
So it's like three required here, and then now you're involuntarily placed either way.
Yeah, but the fact that it's like, oh, you know, until you get better, but you have schizophrenia.
Yeah, exactly.
It doesn't get better.
Well, that's probably what the thought was behind it, honestly.
Also, in the agreement, if Morgan were to be released, she would remain under communal supervision and undergo periodic re-evaluations of her mental state, which is like, how often do we hear that?
Not a lot.
Yeah.
That should be a thing a lot more.
I agree.
At her sentencing, Morgan was noted as stating, quote, I just want to let Bella and her family know I'm sorry.
I never meant this to happen, and I hope she is doing well, end quote.
Don't talk to me.
I'd be like, don't fucking talk to me.
Well, it's just, it's hard too, because it's like she's so seriously mentally ill, but also it's like you did the tainest thing to me.
How can I wrap my brain around that?
Well, and then, I don't know if you'll mention it or not, but the only thing that my mind goes back to is Peyton's mental health, what's been perpetrated on her.
Right.
She could have lived her whole life without having something like PTSD.
Exactly.
And not for nothing, but Morgan's father was also diagnosed with schizophrenia, and I think it was, actually I think it was undiagnosed, but he had signs and symptoms.
Yeah.
Regardless, he definitely had it, whether it was diagnosed or not.
So I feel like it should have been a little bit more of a push to get her evaluated early on.
Yeah.
Although they did say that she didn't acknowledge that any of this was even happening to her, like in her mind, until after she was arrested.
I mean, I understand what you're saying, that maybe the parents should have kind of been on the lookout a little bit for signs and symptoms.
However, at that age.
At that age.
You know, I mean, that's the thing.
At that age, where they're trying to consume all this content and be on the internet and be spooked and like all this stuff and.
I'm not blaming anybody at all.
No.
I feel like if I were to make a suggestion, it would have been if the father had a psychiatrist, it would have been maybe the psychiatrist saying, okay, I'd like to evaluate your children just like every, you know, six months.
I'd like to talk to them, you know, just in case.
I don't know.
And the fact that it's very unusual given her age.
Yeah.
And we don't even know if he was diagnosed.
I'm pretty sure he wasn't.
I think they had just said that he was showing signs as well.
Yeah.
And that might have developed later in life in his 20s.
Yeah.
Late 20s.
They weren't, you know, on the lookout for it at 11.
That's so true.
In 2020, Morgan would petition that she be retried as a juvenile considering the age at which she committed her crime and her mental state.
This would be rejected by an appeals court and her attorney, Mathur Pinnick's, would argue in defense that Morgan should have been charged with attempted second degree intentional homicide rather than first degree.
His name's Mathur.
No, it's Matthew.
Did I say Mathur?
Well, I've made a lot of mistakes this episode, but I've cut them all out.
I'm going to leave that one.
Matthew, his name's Matthew.
And the next sentence is, Michael would also argue.
What's his name?
One sec, please.
I'd like to take a moment to publicly apologize to Matthew.
What's his name?
His name is Matthew.
I made sure to look it up.
That's so funny.
Not Michael, not Mathur.
Matthew.
Yes.
Matthew would also argue that Morgan gave statements to investigators before being read her Miranda Wright.
So he's like trying to get her a retrial because of all these reasons.
In early 2021, this appeal would also be denied.
On March 10, 2021, Anissa, then 19 years old, submitted a letter to the court stating that she was, quote, sorry and deeply regretful for the agony, pain and fear I have caused, end quote.
She went on to state that she was not only apologetic to Peyton, but to quote my community as well, end quote.
She continues, quote, I hate my actions from May 31, 2014, but through countless hours of therapy, I no longer hate myself for them, end quote.
It's pretty wise.
Yeah.
On July 1, 2021, Wukasha County Judge Michael Borhin ordered Anissa be released from the Winnebago Mental Health Institute, gave state officials 60 days to draft a conditional release plan and required that Anissa be assigned to case managers to supervise her progress until she is 37 years old.
On September 13, 2021, Anissa was released with multiple stipulations, including 24 hour GPS monitoring.
However, this would be removed two years later in September of 2023.
Wow.
Although she is released, Anissa is still restricted in many ways.
Her internet use is being monitored.
She is not allowed to use social media and she is required to take medications and continue her counseling sessions.
I had no idea she was even out.
Yeah.
In January of 2024, Morgan Geiser would petition the court for release two years after withdrawing a similar petition in 2022.
At a hearing in April of 2024, a judge would deny this request for release.
So she's still in instituted.
After the gruesome attack of Peyton, slender man creator Eric Nudson would release a statement of condolences.
Quote, I am deeply saddened by the tragedy in Wisconsin and my heart goes out to the families of those affected by this terrible act.
End quote.
In response to the attack, Governor Scott Walker issued a proclamation declaring Wednesday, August 13, 2014, quote, Purple Hearts for Healing Day.
End quote. And encouraged the people of Wisconsin to wear purple to honor the victim of the stabbing.
Hmm.
On August 24, 2014, the city of Madison, Wisconsin held a one day Broadworth's Festival to honor the survivor of the stabbing.
At this point, Peyton's name had not been released.
Hmm.
The event was run by over 250 volunteers and raised over $70,000.
Wow.
On October 24, 2019, survivor Peyton Lutner, then 17 years old, spoke publicly about her experience for the first time.
She discussed her scars, stating, quote, I don't think much of them.
They'll probably go away and fade eventually.
End quote.
When asked what she would say if she ever saw Morgan again, Peyton stated that she would thank her because the attack inspired her to pursue a career in medicine.
Whoa.
Oh, heave.
So that is the Slender Man stabbing that was requested by our lovely patron number, Sarah.
Thank you, Sarah, for requesting that.
Thanks, Sarah.
I hope you enjoyed the episode and we always appreciate requests.
Yeah, absolutely.
I think it's been a little bit on our radar, the Anisa Weir, Morgan, Geyser situation.
Mm-hmm.
And, but, you know, it's just such a bizarre case.
Yeah.
For sure.
And so, yeah, thanks for bringing that.
Thanks for the suggestion.
I learned something today.
Oh, good.
About the origin of Slender Daddy.
Yeah, I knew I had to kind of go into the history of Slender Man because we have listeners that maybe don't know about Slender Man.
You know, I'm pretty sure it's an American lore, so I don't see why it would be like a nationwide thing.
What is it?
I think it's a worldwide thing.
It is.
Okay, well.
I think it's big in the UK.
Oh, well, some places I'm sure have not heard about or some people.
I'll just say that.
For sure, yeah.
It is definitely like kind of one of those, I wouldn't say it's deep underground internet.
It's surface level internet, but it became huge, became a huge thing.
Yeah, it's also been almost 20 years since it was even created.
One of the more viral themes, if you will.
Well, yeah, that is the Slender Man stabbing Anissa Weir and Morgan Geyser and then survivor Peyton Lutner.
And we hope that you guys enjoyed this episode.
We will see you soon.
Patreon members with another bonus episode in the next couple days.
And then we have our regularly scheduled case on Thursday.
All right.
Talk to you later.
Bye.
Love you.
I mean, love you.
Bye.
Bright Cellars is a monthly wine club that matches you to delicious wines tailored completely
to your tastes.
Take their personalized seven question quiz and be paired with wines you are sure to love.
You can even improve your matches by rating each wine after you try them.
Bright Cellars offers a unique tasting experience as each bottle comes with tasting notes and
pairing suggestions.
It's like having your very own sommelier at home.
And their expert wine concierge will customize your subscription to fit any lifestyle.
Click the link in the show notes for an exclusive offer from Bright Cellars today.