1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:04,000 Hello! Hello! 2 00:00:04,000 --> 00:00:09,000 Welcome back to another episode of Diagnosing a Killer. I'm Kenna. 3 00:00:09,000 --> 00:00:35,000 And I'm Koel. 4 00:00:35,000 --> 00:00:51,000 And I'm Kenna. 5 00:00:51,000 --> 00:01:19,000 Oh no. 6 00:01:19,000 --> 00:01:26,000 And he said that he is willing to give them a full confession and that he should be arrested for Heather's murder. 7 00:01:26,000 --> 00:01:28,000 So that's where we left off. 8 00:01:28,000 --> 00:01:32,000 Oh he said that? He said I should be arrested for her murder. 9 00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:54,000 Content warning. This episode contains depictions of the brutal deaths of children, incest, bestiality, graphic sexual and physical abuse of children, graphic descriptions of illegal medical procedures, serious symptoms of mental illness, grooming of young children, suicide, dismemberment of adults and children after death, and necrophilia. 10 00:01:54,000 --> 00:02:00,000 If this episode is not for you, we encourage you to find another one of our episodes. Remember your mental health is very important and we love you. 11 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:02,000 Bye! 12 00:02:30,000 --> 00:02:37,000 I don't know about you, I don't strangle people out of anger, but I don't know. 13 00:02:37,000 --> 00:02:39,000 Someone's tried to strangle me out of anger. 14 00:02:39,000 --> 00:02:40,000 Oh gosh. 15 00:02:40,000 --> 00:02:41,000 Jesus Christ. 16 00:02:41,000 --> 00:02:44,000 You know, I'm not saying it's impassable. 17 00:02:44,000 --> 00:02:54,000 So this strangling would result in Heather passing away and Fred would do the next logical thing and dismember her body with a heavily serrated knife. 18 00:02:54,000 --> 00:03:03,000 Yeah, because that's where your mind goes too, right? Like, oh, she tried to, like I strangled her out of like anger, self-defense or whatever it might be, but I'm just going to go ahead and dismember her. 19 00:03:03,000 --> 00:03:04,000 Like that makes sense. 20 00:03:04,000 --> 00:03:06,000 That makes so much sense to me. 21 00:03:06,000 --> 00:03:07,000 Mm-hmm. 22 00:03:07,000 --> 00:03:15,000 Fred went on to explain that he then stored Heather's remains in a nearby trash can while he waited for an opportunity to bury her in the garden. 23 00:03:15,000 --> 00:03:16,000 He said he needed- 24 00:03:16,000 --> 00:03:18,000 Yeah, that's another step that you have to take, right? 25 00:03:18,000 --> 00:03:19,000 Exactly. 26 00:03:19,000 --> 00:03:21,000 Yeah, like why take the next step? 27 00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:29,000 He said he needed to keep this a secret because Fred insisted that Rose had no knowledge of what happened to Heather as she was busy during this argument. 28 00:03:29,000 --> 00:03:35,000 So he's like, I needed to hide her body because I didn't want Rose to find her because I didn't want her to know about this at all. 29 00:03:35,000 --> 00:03:36,000 Okay. 30 00:03:36,000 --> 00:03:44,000 Fred would also add that the only reason the search team had not yet found Heather's remains is because they had been excavating the wrong part of the garden. 31 00:03:44,000 --> 00:03:46,000 So he like was like, oh I'm going to point over there. 32 00:03:46,000 --> 00:03:47,000 Right. 33 00:03:47,000 --> 00:03:57,000 And in an even more strange turn of events, Fred would tell police that he'd be happy to lead them to the exact location of where Heather was buried. 34 00:03:57,000 --> 00:04:02,000 So it's like, why are you all of a sudden like about to confess like you're ready to do it? 35 00:04:02,000 --> 00:04:03,000 I know why. 36 00:04:03,000 --> 00:04:04,000 Okay, go ahead. 37 00:04:04,000 --> 00:04:05,000 Okay. 38 00:04:05,000 --> 00:04:10,000 May and Stephen would quickly be informed by authorities of what Fred had confessed. 39 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:15,000 And in response, Stephen was noted as slumping against a wall and sobbing. 40 00:04:15,000 --> 00:04:16,000 Aw. 41 00:04:16,000 --> 00:04:24,000 Fred would be struck with complete shock and even tried to correct authorities telling them that there was no way Fred was responsible for the death of Heather. 42 00:04:24,000 --> 00:04:33,000 It's just like again, right, they're so abusive, but the children are just so in like they just, they still love them and they trust them, right? 43 00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:34,000 They want to protect them. 44 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:35,000 Yeah. 45 00:04:35,000 --> 00:04:42,000 So the following day after the confession, police would begin excavation of the part of the garden that Fred had led them to. 46 00:04:42,000 --> 00:04:50,000 By the afternoon, authorities had come across a human thigh bone that was sticking out from one section of the garden that Fred insisted police need not look in. 47 00:04:50,000 --> 00:04:52,000 He's like, no, you don't need to go there. 48 00:04:52,000 --> 00:04:53,000 Don't need to remind that. 49 00:04:53,000 --> 00:04:55,000 You're only here for one person, right? 50 00:04:55,000 --> 00:04:59,000 You don't have, you know, you don't have the legal right to be searching my whole damn house. 51 00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:01,000 Just the spot I'm leading you to. 52 00:05:01,000 --> 00:05:10,000 On the other side, authorities excavating the area that Fred pointed out discovered a mess of human remains as well that were encased in a trash bag. 53 00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:21,000 These remains would be taken back to the station for examination and it was quickly determined that they were the remains of a young woman and it was noted that the fingernails of the deceased woman were missing. 54 00:05:21,000 --> 00:05:35,000 This suggested that police, this suggested to police, excuse me, that there must have been a struggle or they were removed prior to her death, most likely via torture, which is fucked up. 55 00:05:35,000 --> 00:05:41,000 Several hours later, the police would positively ID the remains as those of Heather West. 56 00:05:41,000 --> 00:05:44,000 Okay, so they were like, okay, this is Heather. 57 00:05:44,000 --> 00:05:56,000 Although police had Fred West in custody for the murder of Heather, authorities back at the home had discovered an additional two thigh bones leading the police to set up another round of questioning for Fred. 58 00:05:56,000 --> 00:05:59,000 He's like, wait a second, there's more. 59 00:05:59,000 --> 00:06:01,000 But wait, there's more. 60 00:06:01,000 --> 00:06:07,000 It's terrible, but like, that's yeah, it's probably what he's thinking like, oh, if I just lead them to Heather, then I'll only go away for one murder, right? 61 00:06:07,000 --> 00:06:09,000 And then they won't have to look for anything else. 62 00:06:09,000 --> 00:06:10,000 Yeah. 63 00:06:10,000 --> 00:06:18,000 Fred would willingly divulge that there were two additional victims naming one of them as Shirley Robinson. 64 00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:27,000 He told police that Shirley was a former tenant at the home and was a lesbian who had been very heavily pregnant with his child at the time of her murder in 1978. 65 00:06:27,000 --> 00:06:29,000 Yeah, but she's a lesbian. 66 00:06:29,000 --> 00:06:34,000 Yeah, no, yeah, she especially, especially wouldn't touch this guy on purpose at least. 67 00:06:34,000 --> 00:06:43,000 Fred would go on to tell police that the other thigh bone belonged to quote Shirley's mate and quote, but he did not reveal the identity of this person. 68 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:47,000 So he's just trying to explain it away like, oh, I killed her and her lover or whatever. 69 00:06:47,000 --> 00:06:50,000 But I don't know her name, her name, her lesbian lover. 70 00:06:50,000 --> 00:06:51,000 Yeah. 71 00:06:51,000 --> 00:06:58,000 Fred would formally be charged with both of these additional murders on March 2, 1994. 72 00:06:58,000 --> 00:07:06,000 Due to the fact that police had located three sets of remains in the garden, a warrant was issued and approved to excavate the entire property. 73 00:07:06,000 --> 00:07:09,000 Yeah, duh, like, I mean, why not? 74 00:07:09,000 --> 00:07:10,000 Where there's smoke, there's fire. 75 00:07:10,000 --> 00:07:11,000 Mm-hmm. 76 00:07:11,000 --> 00:07:23,000 Meanwhile, Rose would be placed in a safe house in a town nearby and Fred would continue to be questioned over 16 hours each day about the whereabouts of his first wife, Rita and his stepdaughter, Charmaine. 77 00:07:23,000 --> 00:07:25,000 They're like drilling his ass. 78 00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:37,000 During one of these rounds of questioning, Fred would tell his solicitor or legal advisor to pass a handwritten note to the leader of the investigation, Superintendent John Bennett. 79 00:07:37,000 --> 00:07:40,000 So they call them solicitors in the U.S. 80 00:07:40,000 --> 00:07:44,000 Isn't John Bennett the guard from Orange is the New Black? 81 00:07:44,000 --> 00:07:46,000 Oh, Orange is the New Black? 82 00:07:46,000 --> 00:07:47,000 Just go ahead. 83 00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:52,000 And that's like such a, like, like, did you ever watch Lost? 84 00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:57,000 Either way, they never explain where the polar bears come from for the most part. 85 00:07:57,000 --> 00:07:59,000 That's the whole thing is like they never explain the polar bears. 86 00:07:59,000 --> 00:08:01,000 Like they never explained John Bennett. 87 00:08:01,000 --> 00:08:06,000 Like I was for sure thought the last season, like he would have come back or whatever. 88 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:12,000 It just pisses me off that like we loved Bennett so much and he turns out to be this giant pussy who doesn't want to take care of his kid. 89 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:14,000 Me too. 90 00:08:14,000 --> 00:08:16,000 I liked him a lot. 91 00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:19,000 So again, Fred, Fred. 92 00:08:19,000 --> 00:08:23,000 Yeah, Fred actually is that's why I thought it was Fred. 93 00:08:23,000 --> 00:08:28,000 This is the third episode and I'm like still messing up his name. 94 00:08:28,000 --> 00:08:33,000 So Fred was like, I'm not going to talk to this John Bennett. 95 00:08:33,000 --> 00:08:41,000 I'm going to have my legal advisor do all my communication for me, but I'm going to write a note and I'm just going to have my advisor pass it over for me. 96 00:08:41,000 --> 00:08:45,000 So he's still like communicating, you know, verbatim, but he's just not talking out loud. 97 00:08:45,000 --> 00:09:01,000 So this note dated March 4th, red quote, I Frederick West authorized my solicitor Howard Ogden to advise Superintendent Bennett that I wish to admit a further approximately nine killings expressly Charmaine, 98 00:09:01,000 --> 00:09:06,000 Rena, Linda Gao and others to be identified signed F West end quote. 99 00:09:06,000 --> 00:09:07,000 And that was a typo. 100 00:09:07,000 --> 00:09:08,000 It's Linda cough. 101 00:09:08,000 --> 00:09:09,000 I'm sorry. 102 00:09:09,000 --> 00:09:10,000 Her last last name is not. 103 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:13,000 But he was just like, yeah, I did it online. 104 00:09:13,000 --> 00:09:14,000 Yeah. 105 00:09:14,000 --> 00:09:15,000 Yeah. 106 00:09:15,000 --> 00:09:16,000 And why couldn't you just say that out loud? 107 00:09:16,000 --> 00:09:17,000 You should have just said that from the beginning. 108 00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:18,000 You're dumb. 109 00:09:18,000 --> 00:09:20,000 It would have saved us all a lot of trouble and digging. 110 00:09:20,000 --> 00:09:22,000 Right. 111 00:09:22,000 --> 00:09:24,000 Yeah. 112 00:09:24,000 --> 00:09:31,000 So authorities would continue their questioning of Fred, hoping to gain insight on these new murders he was now confessing to. 113 00:09:31,000 --> 00:09:39,000 Fred would calmly explain to police that most of the victims he claimed to have killed were hitchhikers or girls he picked up at bus stops. 114 00:09:39,000 --> 00:09:51,000 Initially, Fred claimed that six victims had been killed when they threatened to tell Rose of his infidelity and that he had taken their bodies to the West home to abuse, dismember and bury in the garden. 115 00:09:51,000 --> 00:09:56,000 Fred claimed the only reason that he dismembered his victims was to make it easier to bury them in shallow graves. 116 00:09:56,000 --> 00:09:58,000 But how to see. 117 00:09:58,000 --> 00:10:07,000 Fred would then tell police that he would take them to those specific spots in the garden as well to find these new victims. 118 00:10:07,000 --> 00:10:16,000 So he's kind of admitting that, okay, but he's essentially saying that these people are essentially people he cut. 119 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:17,000 His phrasing is weird, I guess. 120 00:10:17,000 --> 00:10:19,000 It sounds like he doesn't care about these people. 121 00:10:19,000 --> 00:10:35,000 When in actuality, the people that he's killing are people that he's slept with or his children or his, you know, or his wife's girlfriends or whatever it is, you know, like, it's just interesting that it just sounds like he's like, oh, well, like they weren't, 122 00:10:35,000 --> 00:10:38,000 he just makes it sound like he's phrasing it like they're not good people. 123 00:10:38,000 --> 00:10:44,000 Like he's like, oh, they're just people that like, you know, I was trying to cover my tracks and, you know, it's just, I don't know. 124 00:10:44,000 --> 00:10:53,000 Yeah, I think that maybe a lot of it was like he abducted these women and then he sexually assaulted them and then he's trying to say like, well, I sexually assaulted them, but like I was gonna let them go. 125 00:10:53,000 --> 00:10:56,000 And then they were like, well, we're gonna tell your wife that we had sex or whatever. 126 00:10:56,000 --> 00:10:57,000 Like he doesn't make any sense. 127 00:10:57,000 --> 00:10:58,000 Yeah, right. 128 00:10:58,000 --> 00:10:59,000 Yeah. 129 00:10:59,000 --> 00:11:08,000 So over the next few days from March 3rd to 5th, 1994, police would uncover six further bodies of young females at the West Home. 130 00:11:08,000 --> 00:11:16,000 Each victim had been extensively mutilated and each body showed evidence of being subjected to extreme sexual abuse prior to the murders. 131 00:11:16,000 --> 00:11:17,000 And I'm so sorry. 132 00:11:17,000 --> 00:11:22,000 I know I just said a second ago that it was a typo, that it was Linda Gao and it was Linda Koff. 133 00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:25,000 I said Linda Koff in the first part, I think. 134 00:11:25,000 --> 00:11:26,000 That was a typo. 135 00:11:26,000 --> 00:11:29,000 So her last name is Gao, like G-O-U-G-H. 136 00:11:29,000 --> 00:11:30,000 Just want to make sure that's clear. 137 00:11:30,000 --> 00:11:31,000 Which is the name? 138 00:11:31,000 --> 00:11:32,000 I know. 139 00:11:32,000 --> 00:11:35,000 I just want to make sure that's clear because I definitely don't want to disrespect one of the victims. 140 00:11:35,000 --> 00:11:36,000 So I don't want to make sure that's clear. 141 00:11:36,000 --> 00:11:37,000 Right. 142 00:11:37,000 --> 00:11:40,000 It is Linda Gao and she actually gets brought back up here. 143 00:11:40,000 --> 00:11:42,000 Her body was actually discovered here. 144 00:11:42,000 --> 00:11:50,000 When it was discovered, her jaw was noted to be completely wrapped in adhesive and surgical tape, most likely to silence any screams. 145 00:11:50,000 --> 00:11:51,000 Cheers. 146 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:53,000 And two small tubes were found. 147 00:11:53,000 --> 00:11:59,000 Police think that these were likely inserted into her nose to help her breathe because her mouth was covered. 148 00:11:59,000 --> 00:12:00,000 Very, very often. 149 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:01,000 Jesus. 150 00:12:01,000 --> 00:12:02,000 Yeah. 151 00:12:02,000 --> 00:12:11,000 Long sections of string and knotted fabric were also found suggesting that she had been suspended from the beams in the cellar like other victims. 152 00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:15,000 And it was determined that Linda likely died of suffocation or strangulation. 153 00:12:15,000 --> 00:12:17,000 Oh my God. 154 00:12:17,000 --> 00:12:18,000 I know. 155 00:12:18,000 --> 00:12:23,000 Linda's dismembered body was also missing five cervical vertebrae. 156 00:12:23,000 --> 00:12:35,000 Not only was her body missing parts of her bone, but it was noted as a theme that all of the bodies found were not completely intact, suggesting maybe he kept pieces or something. 157 00:12:35,000 --> 00:12:37,000 That's what police think. 158 00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:38,000 That's interesting. 159 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:43,000 Or I mean, I guess he wouldn't be decapitating them. 160 00:12:43,000 --> 00:12:52,000 Yeah, that's interesting that he was, I mean, because if you're going to strangle someone, you can break those bones in your neck. 161 00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:54,000 But yeah. 162 00:12:54,000 --> 00:13:01,000 And the reason I say that too is because when questioned about why the bodies were not a complete set, Fred would refuse to answer. 163 00:13:01,000 --> 00:13:02,000 He didn't want to tell them. 164 00:13:02,000 --> 00:13:04,000 Interesting. 165 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:11,000 On top of the murders of the victims exhumed from the West Home, we know that Fred also confessed to the murders of Rena and Charmaine. 166 00:13:11,000 --> 00:13:19,000 Fred would also confess to knowing the location of Ann McFauls remains, although he would deny having anything to do with her death. 167 00:13:19,000 --> 00:13:22,000 Because remember, Rose, it was Rose. 168 00:13:22,000 --> 00:13:23,000 Yeah. 169 00:13:23,000 --> 00:13:29,000 Fred would agree to lead police to these spots and the excavations would begin on April 10th. 170 00:13:29,000 --> 00:13:33,000 So it's unclear exactly how Rose became back under police suspicion. 171 00:13:33,000 --> 00:13:41,000 It obviously makes sense that it's the wife, but as far as I know, Fred didn't tell police that Rose was involved in anything. 172 00:13:41,000 --> 00:13:42,000 Yeah. 173 00:13:42,000 --> 00:13:58,000 In some sources, I read that Fred divulged to one Janet Leach that Rose is actually mutually responsible for Heather's death, while other sources stated that police suspected otherwise and arrested Rose on other charges so that they could try to get more information on her. 174 00:13:58,000 --> 00:14:02,000 So yeah, this Janet Leach that I had just mentioned, like I said, once you're in the police, you can't tell the police. 175 00:14:02,000 --> 00:14:06,000 Like I said, one source said that Fred told her that Rose was mutually responsible. 176 00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:09,000 She was appointed as Fred's appropriate adult. 177 00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:12,000 And I think I said this either in part one or part two. 178 00:14:12,000 --> 00:14:24,000 But when you get arrested in the UK, apparently, at least at this time, you got appointed an appropriate adult, which is essentially someone that's there to support you when you go through questioning or anything having to do with the police. 179 00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:27,000 Like it's just like a peer almost. 180 00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:29,000 Not a appointed lawyer. 181 00:14:29,000 --> 00:14:30,000 It's like a. 182 00:14:30,000 --> 00:14:32,000 It's just a regular person. 183 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:36,000 Well, she's probably part of the legal system, but she's not a lawyer. 184 00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:39,000 She's not a prosecutor, you know, anything like that. 185 00:14:39,000 --> 00:14:43,000 She's just made to just essentially just hang out with him and make sure he's good. 186 00:14:43,000 --> 00:14:44,000 Okay. 187 00:14:44,000 --> 00:14:45,000 All right. 188 00:14:45,000 --> 00:14:46,000 Yeah. 189 00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:58,000 I think we did talk about that maybe in part two because we were saying or maybe it was another episode, but we were saying that like, yeah, it was part two because it was like children should have someone there with them during things. 190 00:14:58,000 --> 00:14:59,000 Yeah. 191 00:14:59,000 --> 00:15:00,000 Yeah. 192 00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:01,000 Yeah. 193 00:15:01,000 --> 00:15:02,000 Yeah. 194 00:15:02,000 --> 00:15:06,000 An adult can have it, but or children can have it for some reason we need. 195 00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:08,000 We don't have them for adults regularly. 196 00:15:08,000 --> 00:15:10,000 Yeah, but that's interesting. 197 00:15:10,000 --> 00:15:11,000 Yeah. 198 00:15:11,000 --> 00:15:22,000 On April 20th, 1994, police would arrest Rose on offenses relating to the rape charge of Anna Marie and the physical assault of an eight year old charges that she had been acquitted from in the past. 199 00:15:22,000 --> 00:15:23,000 Okay. 200 00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:25,000 So she was already on the radar. 201 00:15:25,000 --> 00:15:26,000 Right. 202 00:15:26,000 --> 00:15:32,000 And then on the day Rose was refused bail and transferred to Puckle Church prison to be held in the maximum security wing. 203 00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:35,000 So police are like, there's no way you didn't have something to do with this. 204 00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:37,000 You know, like, yeah. 205 00:15:37,000 --> 00:15:44,000 Meanwhile, police were doing everything they could to try to build a case against her for at least the murder of Heather. 206 00:15:44,000 --> 00:15:52,000 While in prison, Rose would be questioned more closely about the murders, specifically those of Heather and Linda. 207 00:15:52,000 --> 00:15:58,000 Throughout the questioning and excavations, police were able to pin together substantial evidence that they were confident with. 208 00:15:58,000 --> 00:16:03,000 And Rose would officially be charged with the murder of Linda on April 25th, 1994. 209 00:16:03,000 --> 00:16:05,000 Damn. 210 00:16:05,000 --> 00:16:14,000 While the evidence continued to pile up back at the West home, Fred and Rose would be jointly charged with five counts of murder by May 6th within like less than a few weeks. 211 00:16:14,000 --> 00:16:15,000 Yeah. 212 00:16:15,000 --> 00:16:22,000 When being read the charges, Rose simply replied with quote, I'm innocent and quote to each one. 213 00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:23,000 Fuck off. 214 00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:24,000 Yeah, right. 215 00:16:24,000 --> 00:16:32,000 This same statement would prove to be a theme throughout the nearly 50 interviews investigators did with Rose leading up to her trial. 216 00:16:32,000 --> 00:16:33,000 She's like, I'm innocent. 217 00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:34,000 50? 218 00:16:34,000 --> 00:16:35,000 Yeah. 219 00:16:35,000 --> 00:16:37,000 That's a lot. 220 00:16:37,000 --> 00:16:45,000 Meanwhile, the excavations were still going on and the remains would be located of Rena, Charmaine and Ann McFall. 221 00:16:45,000 --> 00:16:50,000 The autopsy of Charmaine's body determined that her body had been severed at the hip. 222 00:16:50,000 --> 00:17:01,000 Several bones, including finger, wrist, toe and ankle bones were missing from the skeleton, leading to the speculation again that the missing parts were kept on purpose. 223 00:17:01,000 --> 00:17:03,000 Okay, I have a theory. 224 00:17:03,000 --> 00:17:09,000 Does he, because I was thinking I was like, okay, how does he get like her vertebrae bones? 225 00:17:09,000 --> 00:17:11,000 Like that's weird, right? 226 00:17:11,000 --> 00:17:19,000 But like, what if he's digging them up and then collecting them when they're like skeletal? 227 00:17:19,000 --> 00:17:21,000 Because I'm like an animal. 228 00:17:21,000 --> 00:17:23,000 Yeah, that's true. 229 00:17:23,000 --> 00:17:25,000 Because they're buried. 230 00:17:25,000 --> 00:17:31,000 The limbs of the body of Ann McFall had been carefully dismembered and some fingers were missing from the body. 231 00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:35,000 The pregnant teenagers seemed to have her unborn child cut from her body. 232 00:17:35,000 --> 00:17:37,000 Oh my God. 233 00:17:37,000 --> 00:17:46,000 Again, Fred would initially deny that he had anything to do with the murder of Ann, but he would later confess to one visitor following his arrest that he had stabbed her to death following an argument. 234 00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:48,000 Although we know that that's not true. 235 00:17:48,000 --> 00:17:49,000 Yeah. 236 00:17:49,000 --> 00:17:52,000 So he's trying to cover for Rose, I guess? 237 00:17:52,000 --> 00:17:55,000 Or, I mean, trying to cover for the torture, right? 238 00:17:55,000 --> 00:18:04,000 However, Ann's wrists were noted as having sections of dressing gown cords wrapped around them, suggesting that she may have been tied up prior to her murder. 239 00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:05,000 Mm. 240 00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:07,000 Evidence never lies, folks. 241 00:18:07,000 --> 00:18:08,000 That's true. 242 00:18:08,000 --> 00:18:10,000 Dr. Lee. 243 00:18:10,000 --> 00:18:19,000 With the discovery of Rena's body, evidence came out that suggested she may have been restrained and possibly sexually assaulted prior to her murder as well. 244 00:18:19,000 --> 00:18:27,000 Her body was extensively dismembered, placed into plastic bags, and buried close to a cluster of trees about one mile from where she was killed. 245 00:18:27,000 --> 00:18:29,000 Oh my God. 246 00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:33,000 The excavations would come to a close on June 7th, 1994. 247 00:18:33,000 --> 00:18:45,000 Fred would be transferred to Birmingham's H.M. Prison, Birmingham, around this time, and his noticeable depression would force authorities to place a 15-minute interval suicide check on him. 248 00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:46,000 Damn. 249 00:18:46,000 --> 00:18:47,000 That's pretty severe. 250 00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:53,000 I know. Fred and Rose West were both brought before a court in Glaucuster on June 30th, 1994. 251 00:18:53,000 --> 00:18:58,000 At this point, Fred was charged with 12 murders and Rose with nine. 252 00:18:58,000 --> 00:19:00,000 Wild. 253 00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:02,000 It is wild. 254 00:19:02,000 --> 00:19:08,000 When the couple arrived at the court, it was the first time they had seen each other since Fred's initial arrest. 255 00:19:08,000 --> 00:19:10,000 Oh, how romantic. 256 00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:12,000 What is it? 257 00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:14,000 Managing jumpsuits. 258 00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:16,000 Yeah. 259 00:19:16,000 --> 00:19:22,000 When the couple first stood together during the trial, Fred placing a gentle hand on the shoulder of Rose. 260 00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:31,000 Rose had ignored Fred's presence up until this point, and when he placed his hand on her shoulder, Rose visibly winced in discomfort. 261 00:19:31,000 --> 00:19:36,000 Like, fuck you, bitch! We did all this shit together and you're gonna act like you don't even like me? 262 00:19:36,000 --> 00:19:37,000 Yeah. 263 00:19:37,000 --> 00:19:38,000 I know. 264 00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:40,000 I can just see it. 265 00:19:40,000 --> 00:19:42,000 Maybe she had the Stockholm Syndrome. 266 00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:44,000 I don't know. 267 00:19:44,000 --> 00:19:49,000 The trial would actually get stayed and the two would continue to be held in prison to await the convictions. 268 00:19:49,000 --> 00:19:53,000 I'm not sure why, but it didn't nothing happen at this point. 269 00:19:53,000 --> 00:20:00,000 As police attempted to escort Fred out of the courtroom, he would shove away from them an attempt to reach out to Rose, 270 00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:03,000 who again, noticeably wins at his advances. 271 00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:06,000 Just like, get the fuck away from me. 272 00:20:06,000 --> 00:20:09,000 No, no, no, no, no! 273 00:20:09,000 --> 00:20:15,000 Immediately following this court appearance, Fred would be re-arrested on suspicion of murdering Anne McFall, 274 00:20:15,000 --> 00:20:18,000 as he had not been initially charged with this murder. 275 00:20:18,000 --> 00:20:25,000 Fred would be charged officially with this murder on July 3rd, 1994, and appeared in court the following morning. 276 00:20:25,000 --> 00:20:30,000 After returning to jail, Fred would become even more notably depressed. 277 00:20:30,000 --> 00:20:39,000 This was heightened by the coldness of Rose during the first trial, and the fact that she was refusing to return any of the letter correspondence that he had been sending her. 278 00:20:39,000 --> 00:20:41,000 She's like, nope, I can't answer you. 279 00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:43,000 Fuck off. 280 00:20:43,000 --> 00:20:47,000 She's like, I'm sure this is all at the advisement of her defense attorney. 281 00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:54,000 Steven West and Anna Marie West were allowed to visit Fred while he was awaiting trial, and they would take the chance. 282 00:20:54,000 --> 00:21:01,000 Fred would plead with them to tell Rose that he loved her, but again, he would not receive any response from her. 283 00:21:01,000 --> 00:21:08,000 In response to no response, Fred would withdraw his earlier confessions as to having acted alone in some of the murders, 284 00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:13,000 and instead, he would accuse Rose of total culpability in the murders. 285 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:15,000 That's the culpability I'm covering for. 286 00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:19,000 You ain't gonna talk to me on a ruin your life. 287 00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:26,000 He would then add that in the case of Ann McFall, Rose was the sole murderer, which is the truth. 288 00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:28,000 I don't know why he tried to cover for her. 289 00:21:28,000 --> 00:21:33,000 I'm already on trial for 12 murders, I might as well just add a 13. 290 00:21:33,000 --> 00:21:37,000 That was the one that he had said, well, I didn't do it, but I don't know who did. 291 00:21:37,000 --> 00:21:39,000 I just dismembered her, but now he's saying it's Rose. 292 00:21:39,000 --> 00:21:45,000 But then he did tell, he went and told police between then and now that he did have culpability in it. 293 00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:47,000 And now he's saying, you know what, I lied again. 294 00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:50,000 I didn't. Yeah, you know, I'm gonna take that back. 295 00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:58,000 The year would come to an end and Fred would level out a little bit with his emotions, or so the prison guards thought. 296 00:21:58,000 --> 00:22:06,000 On be known to guards, Fred had spent a few days collecting items such as a blanket and tags he had stolen from laundry bags. 297 00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:12,000 On January 1st, 1995, Fred West would die from intentional strangulation in his cell. 298 00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:16,000 As a suicide watch he was previously on had been lessened. 299 00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:27,000 Oh my God. No, I feel like if you start out like in jail or something like that, I mean, I don't know. 300 00:22:27,000 --> 00:22:33,000 If you start out on suicide watch, you should be on suicide watch until the completion of your trial. That's my opinion. 301 00:22:33,000 --> 00:22:40,000 Here's what I think happened. I think that throughout the holiday season people got comfortable and there was not a lot of staff. 302 00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:44,000 And they decided it's not a big deal. He's been fine this whole time. 303 00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:47,000 Yeah, that makes sense. 304 00:22:47,000 --> 00:22:54,000 A suicide note was located in his cell and the bottom of it read, or sorry, the whole thing read, quote, 305 00:22:54,000 --> 00:23:04,000 Two rows west, Steve and May. Well Rose, it's your birthday on 29 November 1994 and you'll be 41 and still beautiful and still lovely and I love you. 306 00:23:04,000 --> 00:23:09,000 We will always be in love. The most wonderful thing in my life was when I met you. 307 00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:15,000 Our love is special to us. So love, keep your promises to me. You know what they are. 308 00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:23,000 Here we are put together forever and ever is up to you. We loved Heather, both of us. I would love Charmaine to be with Heather and Rena. 309 00:23:23,000 --> 00:23:31,000 You will always be Mrs West all over the world. That is important to me and you. I haven't got you a present, but all I have is my life. 310 00:23:31,000 --> 00:23:37,000 I will give it to you my darling. When you are ready, come to me. I'll be waiting for you, end quote. 311 00:23:37,000 --> 00:23:48,000 Oh my God. Kind of poetic though. I know. Well, the fact that he's like the ultimate test now. Are you going to kill yourself too? 312 00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:50,000 Right. Oh my God. 313 00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:56,000 At the bottom of the note was a drawn gravestone, which also had writing inside of it. 314 00:23:56,000 --> 00:24:06,000 This quoted in loving memory, Fred West, Rose West, rest in peace where no shadow falls. In perfect peace he waits for Rose, his life, end quote. 315 00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:08,000 Oh my God. 316 00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:13,000 Like you think we're going to write that on a headstone for you? No, you're going to get put in the prison cemetery and that's where you're going to be. 317 00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:18,000 With a number. Yeah. Oh my God. I know. 318 00:24:23,000 --> 00:24:29,000 Bright Cellars is a monthly wine club that matches you to delicious wines tailored completely to your tastes. 319 00:24:29,000 --> 00:24:34,000 Take their personalized seven question quiz and be paired with wines you are sure to love. 320 00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:38,000 You can even improve your matches by rating each wine after you try them. 321 00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:44,000 Bright Cellars offers a unique tasting experience as each bottle comes with tasting notes and pairing suggestions. 322 00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:51,000 It's like having your very own sommelier at home and their expert wine concierge will customize your subscription to fit any lifestyle. 323 00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:56,000 Click the link in the show notes for an exclusive offer from Bright Cellars today. 324 00:24:56,000 --> 00:25:03,000 With Fred being deceased, Rose West would be subsequently solely charged with the murder of Charmaine West. 325 00:25:03,000 --> 00:25:05,000 Just screw it over. 326 00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:12,000 Rose's trial would begin on October 3rd, 1995 at Winchester Crown Court with Mr. Justice Mantell presiding. 327 00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:22,000 Justice Mantell would immediately state that it would be allowed to admit testimony relating to the sexual mistreatment of three women by both Fred and Rose, 328 00:25:22,000 --> 00:25:29,000 which were among the other charges, as it established a pattern of behavior that was repeated in the murders. 329 00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:37,000 Prosecutor Bryan Levinson would begin with an opening statement in which he portrayed Fred and Rose as sex-obsessed, sadistic murderers. 330 00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:41,000 He referred to the victims discovered, stating that they endured, quote, 331 00:25:41,000 --> 00:25:53,000 secrets more terrible than words can express, the victims last moment on earth were as objects of the depravity of this woman and her husband, end quote. 332 00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:55,000 I mean, he's not wrong. 333 00:25:55,000 --> 00:25:59,000 Hell yeah. Not like hell yeah, like that's cool that they did that. 334 00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:00,000 No, but- 335 00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:01,000 Tell them, yeah. 336 00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:02,000 What a recap, yeah, for sure. 337 00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:04,000 Sorry, made a noise. 338 00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:05,000 You're fine. 339 00:26:05,000 --> 00:26:11,000 He would further point the finger at Rose by adding that Fred was incarcerated at the time of Charmaine West's death. That's what it was. 340 00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:14,000 I'm so sorry, not Ann McFall, so now that makes sense. 341 00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:18,000 It's been a while since we did the first two. 342 00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:20,000 Well, that's what it was. Sorry, yeah. 343 00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:22,000 If you go back and you listen to that. 344 00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:24,000 You'll are like, what the hell? 345 00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:29,000 And the gag on another victim had a quote, a feminine touch. 346 00:26:29,000 --> 00:26:32,000 So this is what the prosecution's like, wait, there's a feminine touch. 347 00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:35,000 It was like a silk, it was tied in a certain way. 348 00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:38,000 It was like a silk, kind of saying like that couldn't have been Fred. 349 00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:40,000 He wouldn't have been like that meticulous with it almost. 350 00:26:40,000 --> 00:26:44,000 Yeah, but I mean, what was he doing like Sailor's Knotts and- 351 00:26:44,000 --> 00:26:45,000 Yeah, right. 352 00:26:45,000 --> 00:26:48,000 She's got a pretty red ribbon, like with a red bow. 353 00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:51,000 I mean, that makes sense if it's the only one that doesn't look like the others, right? 354 00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:55,000 Witnesses for the prosecution included lodgers of the West Home, 355 00:26:55,000 --> 00:27:02,000 Rose's mother Daisy and sister Glenece and survivors Anna Marie West, Catherine Halliday, 356 00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:05,000 which was a former lover of the couple, or who was, excuse me, 357 00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:08,000 Carolyn Owens and a woman named Miss A. 358 00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:15,000 Miss A was reportedly sexually assaulted at the age of 14 by Fred and Rose in 1977. 359 00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:16,000 Jeez. 360 00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:20,000 Miss A would describe Rose as the more aggressive perpetrator of the two. 361 00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:26,000 And on top of these testimonies, neighbors would also speak on behalf of the prosecution and state that Charmaine, 362 00:27:26,000 --> 00:27:32,000 in fact, disappeared while Fred was in prison, and Rose was very casual following the disappearance of Heather. 363 00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:36,000 So everyone's like, yeah, no, these motherfuckers are crazy. 364 00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:37,000 Yeah. 365 00:27:37,000 --> 00:27:46,000 Working on behalf of the defense, Richard Ferguson, who immediately tried to discredit the prosecution witness as either motivated by grudges against the Wests 366 00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:49,000 or seeking money for their participation in the trial. 367 00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:50,000 Totally. 368 00:27:50,000 --> 00:27:51,000 Yeah. 369 00:27:51,000 --> 00:27:54,000 Because everybody wants to talk about the fact that they're a fucking sexual abuse victim. 370 00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:56,000 That's just like something that, yeah. 371 00:27:56,000 --> 00:28:02,000 Carolyn Owens, although admitting to receiving money for her testimony, also shared her extreme survivor's guilt, stating, quote, 372 00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:05,000 I only want to get justice for the girls who didn't make it. 373 00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:08,000 I feel like it was my fault, end quote. 374 00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:10,000 I know. 375 00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:19,000 Ferguson would continue his argument, stating that Fred had committed at least one murder that was very similar to those in the present trial before he even met Rose. 376 00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:30,000 He would state that the prosecution's argument was mostly circumstantial, and that Rose was unaware of the extent of Fred's sadism as she was simply promiscuous and naive. 377 00:28:30,000 --> 00:28:31,000 No, I don't think so. 378 00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:32,000 So naive. 379 00:28:32,000 --> 00:28:33,000 She was the one. 380 00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:34,000 You're going to love this. 381 00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:40,000 Against the advice of her counsel, Rose would also testify on her own behalf. 382 00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:42,000 Love when they do that. 383 00:28:42,000 --> 00:28:43,000 Please do that, yes. 384 00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:44,000 Continue to do that. 385 00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:45,000 That's the right move. 386 00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:46,000 Yeah. 387 00:28:46,000 --> 00:28:53,000 If you're a defendant on a murder trial, please testify for yourself because you are yourself, like you're the best character witness, is yourself. 388 00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:54,000 You're your biggest advocate right there. 389 00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:55,000 Do it. 390 00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:57,000 Stand up for yourself. 391 00:28:57,000 --> 00:28:58,000 God. 392 00:28:58,000 --> 00:28:59,000 Please. 393 00:28:59,000 --> 00:29:04,000 Rose was noted as being morose and tearful, but also upbeat and humorous at times. 394 00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:05,000 Like, ew. 395 00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:12,000 She cried as she described herself as a victim of child abuse and rape, who naively married a violent and domineering man. 396 00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:22,000 But she also laughed as she joked about, quote, always being pregnant, end quote, and while describing one victim's, quote, grandfather glasses, end quote. 397 00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:24,000 So you're like laughing at the victims. 398 00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:25,000 She laughed? 399 00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:26,000 Like, ew. 400 00:29:26,000 --> 00:29:28,000 She was like, oh yeah, grandfather glasses. 401 00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:30,000 She likes to dig grandpa with that. 402 00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:32,000 Like, you're on a trial for murder, homie. 403 00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:33,000 Multiple murder. 404 00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:34,000 Whoa. 405 00:29:34,000 --> 00:29:43,000 Rose would go further to state that she did not recall the six victims that were found at the home, and she did not remember much about her alleged assault of Carolyn Owens. 406 00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:46,000 Like, that's a cop out. 407 00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:47,000 It is a cop out. 408 00:29:47,000 --> 00:29:57,000 I mean, she's not, like, I mean, I don't know if they were abusing alcohol or drugs at the same time, but at the same time, like, you're not, we haven't heard necessarily anything about her being drug addled or having substance abuse. 409 00:29:57,000 --> 00:29:58,000 Issues. 410 00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:00,000 So you're telling me you don't remember. 411 00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:02,000 You don't remember sexually assaulting someone? 412 00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:05,000 Like, are you serious? 413 00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:16,000 When shown photos of the victims buried at the home and asked whether she recognized them, Rose was noted as turning bright red and settering no sir over and over. 414 00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:26,000 Rose would continue by stating that she and Fred had lived separate lives at the home, which was inconsistent with other testimony by lodgers about their relationship. 415 00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:28,000 Yeah, they slept together all the time, probably. 416 00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:36,000 Rose would admit that her relationship with Heather was strained most of the time, but she was a lesbian and she was psychologically abusing her other siblings. 417 00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:38,000 Like, why does that keep coming back up? 418 00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:40,000 Why is that? 419 00:30:40,000 --> 00:30:41,000 Why is that the... 420 00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:42,000 But you're honest, she was a lesbian. 421 00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:44,000 How is that defaming someone? 422 00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:46,000 Oh, okay, all is forgiven. 423 00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:47,000 Yeah, you're acquitted. 424 00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:48,000 Okay. 425 00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:56,000 However, Rose stated that regardless of these things, she loved her daughter and had no knowledge of her alleged murder. 426 00:30:56,000 --> 00:31:05,000 The defense would also call to the stand a number of women who claimed to have been attacked by a solo Fred between 1966 and 1975. 427 00:31:05,000 --> 00:31:06,000 The seven... 428 00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:08,000 Sure. 429 00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:09,000 Oh, I just meant sure. 430 00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:11,000 Like, yeah, like, that's probably happened. 431 00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:19,000 Yeah, the seven women would testify that they had recognized their attacker as Fred West when his photo appeared in the media in 1994. 432 00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:26,000 The defense's purpose in this was to show that Fred was indeed capable of committing heinous crimes without Rose. 433 00:31:26,000 --> 00:31:34,000 The thing is, the prosecution never tried to say that Fred wasn't capable of this alone, that they were saying that Rose was as well. 434 00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:35,000 Yeah. 435 00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:36,000 The final... 436 00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:42,000 Because she had murdered someone with her own bare hands too, so, and that was essentially proven because of the bow, right? 437 00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:46,000 So she's clearly capable of also committing these crimes solo. 438 00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:52,000 The final witness to testify at the trial was one Janet Leach, Fred's appointed appropriate adult. 439 00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:59,000 Janet would testify on behalf of the prosecution that while she was working with Fred, he had gradually began to view her as a confidant, 440 00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:08,000 and had confided in her that on the evening prior to his arrest, he and Rose had formed a pact in which he would take full responsibility for the murders. 441 00:32:08,000 --> 00:32:12,000 Duh, duh, duh. 442 00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:24,000 She stated that Fred had described the murders as, quote, some of Rose's mistakes, and, quote, and further divulged that Rose was responsible for the murders of Charmaine and Shirley Robinson. 443 00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:25,000 They're just mistakes. 444 00:32:25,000 --> 00:32:27,000 You know, she's human. 445 00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:28,000 Mistakes happen. 446 00:32:28,000 --> 00:32:29,000 Cut her some slack. 447 00:32:29,000 --> 00:32:30,000 Yeah. 448 00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:39,000 Upon cross-examination, Janet would indicate that she lied under oath about having sold her story to a newspaper, although she was adamant that her testimony was sincere. 449 00:32:39,000 --> 00:32:41,000 So the newspaper thing does not even fucking matter. 450 00:32:41,000 --> 00:32:43,000 She's like, my testimony was sincere. 451 00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:44,000 Yeah. 452 00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:48,000 I might have lied that I made money off the story, but my testimony was true. 453 00:32:48,000 --> 00:32:49,000 Yeah. 454 00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:50,000 Yeah. 455 00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:57,000 While in this cross-examination, Janet would actually collapse and the trial would subsequently be adjourned for six days. 456 00:32:57,000 --> 00:32:58,000 I know. 457 00:32:58,000 --> 00:32:59,000 Oh my God. 458 00:32:59,000 --> 00:33:03,000 Janet would return to complete her cross-examination on November 13th. 459 00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:17,000 After seven weeks of evidence, the judge would emphasize that circumstantial evidence can be sufficient for a guilty verdict and that if two people take part in a murder, the law considers them equally guilty, regardless of which one of them did the actual killing. 460 00:33:17,000 --> 00:33:19,000 Yeah, I appreciate that law. 461 00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:22,000 I think there's other states in the United States that have those laws as well. 462 00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:27,000 I think California is probably one of them. 463 00:33:27,000 --> 00:33:38,000 I think even Texas says that if you commit a crime and someone dies, even if you're the accomplice, even if you're the driver and you were driving someone to go rob a bank, well, that person that robbed the bank shot and killed someone during that. 464 00:33:38,000 --> 00:33:46,000 Even you as the driver are still liable as a murderer because you helped facilitate a crime that was already being committed and a crime in which someone died. 465 00:33:46,000 --> 00:33:47,000 Absolutely. 466 00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:56,000 And so I think that he was also trying to let the jury know, like, look, Jessica's friend is dead does not mean that these murders need to not be convicted for, you know. 467 00:33:56,000 --> 00:33:57,000 Right, of course. 468 00:33:57,000 --> 00:34:00,000 Somebody still needs to be liable for these and especially if she was there. 469 00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:01,000 And she is here. 470 00:34:01,000 --> 00:34:03,000 Like she is liable. 471 00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:11,000 On November 21st and 22nd, 1995, the jury would return unanimous guilty verdicts for all 10 murders. 472 00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:24,000 In response, Mr. Justice Mantell would sentence Rosemary West to life in prison, referring to her crimes as quote, appalling and depraved and quote, and emphasizing that she should never be paroled. 473 00:34:24,000 --> 00:34:28,000 Initially, Rose would be incarcerated at HMP Bronzefield. 474 00:34:28,000 --> 00:34:29,000 Nobody can see me. 475 00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:32,000 Yes, you just, you just, oh, I kicked the scene. 476 00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:34,000 I was like, well, I mean, yeah, checks. 477 00:34:34,000 --> 00:34:40,000 She would later be transferred to HMPrison Newhall where she would continue to protest her innocence. 478 00:34:40,000 --> 00:34:47,000 So while 10 murders were convicted, there are a number of victims that Fred and Rose West are responsible for. 479 00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:56,000 They are known to have committed at least 12 murders between 1967 and 1987, but there are many people who believe there are others who have been murdered at their hands. 480 00:34:56,000 --> 00:35:09,000 Police would go through the nearly 110 hours of tape recorded interviews with Fred over the years, one in which he claimed to have murdered 15 year old Mary Basform in 1968. 481 00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:12,000 Mary was a waitress at a cafe that Fred frequented. 482 00:35:12,000 --> 00:35:15,000 She would be abducted from a bus stop in Glaucuster. 483 00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:23,000 Fred claimed to have picked her up and raped her in his car before burying her body, and police were unable to locate any remains of Mary's. 484 00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:26,000 Her body has actually never been found. 485 00:35:26,000 --> 00:35:34,000 So he didn't, he said that he buried the body, but not necessarily in his backyard like he had been doing with his own love, love. 486 00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:38,000 Yes, and I think this was before he was even like with Rose. 487 00:35:38,000 --> 00:35:49,000 Fred was also noted to have claimed to Janet that there were up to 20 further victims that he and Rose had killed together, quote, not in one place but spread around, end quote. 488 00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:55,000 And his intent was to reveal the location of one victim per year to investigators. 489 00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:59,000 He was trying to keep himself interesting. 490 00:35:59,000 --> 00:36:02,000 But you're not relevant, bro. I mean, you're dead now, but you know. 491 00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:07,000 Well, I think he might have said that too, to avoid the death penalty had even prosecuted, you know. 492 00:36:07,000 --> 00:36:10,000 That's true. Yeah, they still need information from him. 493 00:36:10,000 --> 00:36:16,000 Fred was also known to have divulged information to his son, Stephen, about the fate of his victims buried at the West home. 494 00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:27,000 Fred claimed that he had extensively tortured the victims prior to the murder, but he had not raped them, but instead engaged in necrophilic acts with their bodies at or shortly after the point of death. 495 00:36:27,000 --> 00:36:32,000 He told Stephen this, like, after he was arrested. 496 00:36:32,000 --> 00:36:33,000 Yeah. 497 00:36:33,000 --> 00:36:36,000 But like, his own kid. 498 00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:38,000 He said, you know, he was a terrorist. 499 00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:46,000 Stephen would recount these conversations with investigators stating, quote, he said to me, can you remember helping me dig holes in the garden when you were a kid? 500 00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:57,000 I said, I couldn't remember. I couldn't remember. But he said, we did it together, you know, then he said, that's where the girls were found in the exact holes, end quote. 501 00:36:57,000 --> 00:37:03,000 He made his kid dig the graves that his own sisters essentially would be put into. 502 00:37:03,000 --> 00:37:08,000 He could have gone his whole life without fucking knowing that. Thanks very much. 503 00:37:08,000 --> 00:37:11,000 Jesus. 504 00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:14,000 How have I never heard of this guy? This guy's awful. 505 00:37:14,000 --> 00:37:23,000 For investigators, it is thought that Fred and Rose had many other victims indicating up to 18 other undiscovered victims. 506 00:37:23,000 --> 00:37:24,000 Whoa. 507 00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:33,000 In 2021, police would announce their intentions to excavate the grounds of a cafe in Glauchester in order to look for their remains of 15 year old Mary. 508 00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:35,000 Underneath the cafe? 509 00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:42,000 I'm not sure. It might have been like around it, like in that area, because he had said that he frequented that cafe that she worked at. 510 00:37:42,000 --> 00:37:46,000 I'm not exactly sure how they got that location. 511 00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:55,000 Unfortunately, the search would discover no remains and there have not been any other victims that have been located in this case so far. 512 00:37:55,000 --> 00:38:03,000 So I want to turn back time just a little bit to talk about some of the aftermath of the trials. 513 00:38:03,000 --> 00:38:14,000 So following his death, Fred's body was cremated in Coventry on March 29, 1995 in a funeral that was attended only by his four children. 514 00:38:14,000 --> 00:38:17,000 Wow, I'm surprised even they showed up. 515 00:38:17,000 --> 00:38:26,000 Yeah, the service was just five minutes long and during the service, Red friend Robert Simpson added a reminder to those present that they must quote, 516 00:38:26,000 --> 00:38:31,000 also remember everyone else who has also suffered because of these tragic events, end quote. 517 00:38:31,000 --> 00:38:36,000 So he essentially was like, this isn't just a funeral for you, motherfucker. It's a funeral for all your victims. 518 00:38:36,000 --> 00:38:38,000 For all your shit. 519 00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:40,000 We're burying your shit. 520 00:38:40,000 --> 00:38:48,000 Fred's ashes are believed to have been scattered at the Welsh Seaside Resort of Berry Island, a location he regularly visited as a child. 521 00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:58,000 After the 1994 arrest of their parents, the four youngest West children were given new identities to protect them from negative impact and they all remained in foster care. 522 00:38:58,000 --> 00:38:59,000 Good. 523 00:38:59,000 --> 00:39:10,000 The remains of Charmaine and Rena were cremated in Kettering and at the insistence of Anna Marie, the two shared the same coffin and no roses were allowed to be brought to the service. 524 00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:11,000 Wow. 525 00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:14,000 Why no roses? Oh, roses. 526 00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:15,000 Yeah. 527 00:39:15,000 --> 00:39:16,000 Got it. 528 00:39:16,000 --> 00:39:18,000 Don't fucking give me anywhere near here. 529 00:39:18,000 --> 00:39:26,000 Two weeks after Anna Marie West delivered her testimony in 1995, she would attempt suicide. 530 00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:32,000 Anna Marie would attempt suicide once again in 1999 by throwing herself off of a bridge into a river. 531 00:39:32,000 --> 00:39:34,000 Oh my God. 532 00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:42,000 Anna Marie would be asked in the final trial of Rose why she did not want to testify years prior against her father about the abuse she had suffered. 533 00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:48,000 She stated, quote, my father and stepmother were all I had, end quote. 534 00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:55,000 So even though they were her abusers and horrific, horrific people in her life, that was all she felt she had. 535 00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:58,000 She never had, yeah, she never had a life outside of that. 536 00:39:58,000 --> 00:40:04,000 Like it's probably consumed everything that she is and every thought that she'll ever have. 537 00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:06,000 And I mean, it's shaped her for life. 538 00:40:06,000 --> 00:40:08,000 Like that's all she had. 539 00:40:08,000 --> 00:40:13,000 Steven West is also known to have made a suicide attempt in 2002. 540 00:40:13,000 --> 00:40:21,000 And in 2004, he would be arrested and jailed for nine months for having unlawful sex with a 14 year old girl on multiple occasions. 541 00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:29,000 It kind of seems like it was statutory, like it might have been like he was in a relationship, but he obviously has, he's choosing inappropriate people. 542 00:40:29,000 --> 00:40:32,000 Well, she's 14. What do you mean? 543 00:40:32,000 --> 00:40:37,000 I'm saying he might have been a little bit older, older than 18, but he's choosing an inappropriate partner. 544 00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:39,000 He was arrested for having unlawful sex. 545 00:40:39,000 --> 00:40:42,000 He wasn't arrested for rape or for sexual assault. 546 00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:43,000 I see. 547 00:40:43,000 --> 00:40:44,000 Sexual assault, yeah. 548 00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:54,000 But still, I mean, that is another cycle of, for that abuse cycle, right, is that he was exposed to that at a young age and he doesn't see anything wrong with that, you know. 549 00:40:54,000 --> 00:40:55,000 Exactly. 550 00:40:55,000 --> 00:41:02,000 DC Hazel Savage would be placed upon the annual New Year's Honors List for her investigative work in the West case. 551 00:41:02,000 --> 00:41:04,000 Which I think, I just think that's fun. 552 00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:06,000 I like when the detective gets praised for their good work. 553 00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:07,000 Me too. 554 00:41:07,000 --> 00:41:17,000 The West's house was demolished in October of 1996 with every piece of debris destroyed in order to discourage potential trophy hunters in the area. 555 00:41:17,000 --> 00:41:18,000 Good. 556 00:41:18,000 --> 00:41:27,000 In November of 1996, nearly two years after Fred died, his younger brother John would hang himself in the garage of his home. 557 00:41:27,000 --> 00:41:36,000 At the time of his death, he was awaiting the jury verdict in his own trial for the alleged multiple rapes of his niece Anna Marie and other young girls at the West home. 558 00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:40,000 Well, I mean, I don't know what to say about that. 559 00:41:40,000 --> 00:41:42,000 I'm not going to say anything that would be kind. 560 00:41:42,000 --> 00:41:43,000 Yeah, for sure. 561 00:41:43,000 --> 00:41:54,000 In September of 2001, after many years of appeal attempts, Rose announced her intentions to abandon her efforts to appeal, stating that she would never feel free even if she was released. 562 00:41:54,000 --> 00:41:55,000 As you shouldn't. 563 00:41:55,000 --> 00:41:56,000 She shouldn't. 564 00:41:56,000 --> 00:42:09,000 Anna Marie, May and Steven would visit Rose in prison on a regular basis until 2006 when Rose ceased contact with them following May asking her about her role in the murders. 565 00:42:09,000 --> 00:42:18,000 Rose would justify her decision of cutting contact with her children by stating, quote, I was never a parent then and could never be now, end quote. 566 00:42:18,000 --> 00:42:22,000 Anna Marie would eventually continue visiting her mother in prison. 567 00:42:22,000 --> 00:42:27,000 Another friend of the West worth mentioning is one Terrence Crick. 568 00:42:27,000 --> 00:42:33,000 Terrence had reported Fred to authorities on several occasions during the time he lived in the home. 569 00:42:33,000 --> 00:42:43,000 It was reported that Fred had shown Terrence surgical instruments Fred used to perform abortions and Polaroid photos of victims genitals following the procedures. 570 00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:45,000 Oh my God. 571 00:42:45,000 --> 00:42:47,000 Yeah, this guy. 572 00:42:47,000 --> 00:42:52,000 Post humor humor humorously, right? Still a dick. 573 00:42:52,000 --> 00:43:00,000 Terrence would later tell police that Fred had asked him to assist him in finding pregnant girls so that he could perform abortions upon them. 574 00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:01,000 Like, no. 575 00:43:01,000 --> 00:43:02,000 So it's like a kink. 576 00:43:02,000 --> 00:43:04,000 I think so. 577 00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:11,000 Terrence would later claim that he thought police ignored the reports because Fred was actually a police informant himself. 578 00:43:11,000 --> 00:43:18,000 So he thinks that the police didn't prosecute him after he reported him anonymously because they were like, oh, we don't want to mess with that guy. We get like stuff from him. 579 00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:21,000 We'll just let him continue to do abortions illegally. 580 00:43:21,000 --> 00:43:25,000 The stress and guilt Terrence had felt over the years would ultimately get the better of him. 581 00:43:25,000 --> 00:43:31,000 And in January of 1996, a 48 year old Terrence Crick would be found deceased in his car. 582 00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:37,000 He had intentionally killed himself via carbon monoxide poisoning. 583 00:43:37,000 --> 00:43:39,000 This is lawless. 584 00:43:39,000 --> 00:43:42,000 Why isn't this a Patreon case? I don't understand. 585 00:43:42,000 --> 00:43:43,000 It's too long. 586 00:43:43,000 --> 00:43:45,000 It's lawless. 587 00:43:45,000 --> 00:43:46,000 Yeah. 588 00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:53,000 In 2004, one of the West's youngest children by the name of Barry claimed to have witnessed the murder of his sister Heather. 589 00:43:53,000 --> 00:44:05,000 According to Barry, who was just seven at the time, Fred and Rose had restrained then sexually and physically abused Heather before Rose had repeatedly kicked and stomped on her until she was deceased. 590 00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:11,000 In October of 2020, Barry West would take his own life at the age of 40 by means of overdose. 591 00:44:11,000 --> 00:44:19,000 Like, this is like now four people that have either attempted suicide or been successful with it after this. 592 00:44:19,000 --> 00:44:24,000 I mean, their deaths are on Fred and Rose's hand too. 593 00:44:24,000 --> 00:44:30,000 For years prior to his death, Barry was known to have struggled with drug addiction and psychiatric problems. 594 00:44:30,000 --> 00:44:37,000 When noting Fred's relaxed attitude towards the aspects of his crimes, many members of the investigative team were bothered. 595 00:44:37,000 --> 00:44:46,000 Wanting to understand more, Superintendent John Bennett sought the assistance of a criminal psychologist for an expert opinion on Fred's state of mind. 596 00:44:46,000 --> 00:44:59,000 Psychologist Paul Britton would advise John Bennett that Fred's casual manner indicated that he had committed so many offenses over such a long period of time that he was now indifferent to the acts of torture, mutilation, and murder. 597 00:44:59,000 --> 00:45:01,000 Yeah. 598 00:45:01,000 --> 00:45:10,000 Paul would add that although an offender of this nature usually eventually offends less frequently, Fred would have been unlikely to stop killing altogether. 599 00:45:10,000 --> 00:45:17,000 Rose was thought to have been doomed from the start when her mother underwent electroconvulsive therapy while she was in the womb. 600 00:45:17,000 --> 00:45:23,000 Rose, while maintaining her innocence, has not been so quiet and lovely in prison. 601 00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:29,000 While in prison, Rose would meet and become friends with another notorious killer by the name of Myra Hindley. 602 00:45:29,000 --> 00:45:31,000 Is that her lesbian lover? 603 00:45:31,000 --> 00:45:39,000 Yeah. Myra and her boyfriend Ian Brady were jailed in 1966 after killing five children in what became known as the Moore's Murders. 604 00:45:39,000 --> 00:45:43,000 Myra would receive a life sentence just like Rose. 605 00:45:43,000 --> 00:45:48,000 The two would meet in the 90s and have been said to have quickly become close. 606 00:45:48,000 --> 00:45:59,000 Rose was known to have told a legal representative of hers called Leo Goatley, quote, Yeah, Myra, she's alright, we get on, I want to see how it goes, end quote. 607 00:45:59,000 --> 00:46:06,000 Leo was noted as saying that Rose was, quote, impressed by Hindley's knowledge and ability, end quote. 608 00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:17,000 He would go further in a published book of his to note, quote, Rose's first paramour was the Moore's Murders, Myra Hindley, who happened to be in the hospital wing at HMP Durham at the same time in 1995 609 00:46:17,000 --> 00:46:21,000 and early 1996, end quote. 610 00:46:21,000 --> 00:46:29,000 However, Leo also noted that the women's relationship did not last long, with Rose stating that Myra could be, quote, very manipulative, end quote. 611 00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:31,000 Oh, isn't that your cup of tea kettle meat pot? 612 00:46:31,000 --> 00:46:33,000 Oh, that's rich. Yeah. 613 00:46:33,000 --> 00:46:34,000 Kettle pot, right. 614 00:46:34,000 --> 00:46:36,000 Yeah, exactly. 615 00:46:36,000 --> 00:46:41,000 He told sources, quote, When I visited a few months later, Rose's opinion of Hindley had changed dramatically. 616 00:46:41,000 --> 00:46:43,000 She was saying you have to watch Hindley. 617 00:46:43,000 --> 00:46:48,000 Mind, she is very manipulative, you don't realize it, but she gets you doing stuff for her. 618 00:46:48,000 --> 00:46:50,000 Oh, she's clever, alright. 619 00:46:50,000 --> 00:46:52,000 She's flipping dangerous, that one. 620 00:46:52,000 --> 00:46:54,000 She ain't gonna take me for a cunt again. 621 00:46:54,000 --> 00:46:58,000 And so hurled at the end of the romance, end quote. 622 00:46:58,000 --> 00:47:02,000 I don't remember that part, Mary Potter, do you? 623 00:47:02,000 --> 00:47:04,000 Oh, geez. 624 00:47:04,000 --> 00:47:13,000 So get this, in February of 2019, it was reported that Rose was, quote, dangerously overweight, end quote, at around 250 pounds. 625 00:47:13,000 --> 00:47:17,000 Which is so funny, because us Americans are like 250 pounds, that's really not a lot. 626 00:47:17,000 --> 00:47:22,000 I had to like do the conversion to make sure that it actually was 250 pounds. 627 00:47:22,000 --> 00:47:27,000 Yeah, she gained 250 pounds or she was 250 pounds. 628 00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:29,000 Oh, okay, that's not right. 629 00:47:29,000 --> 00:47:30,000 That's what I'm saying. 630 00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:33,000 I mean, that's heavy, but that's not heavy. 631 00:47:33,000 --> 00:47:37,000 Well, I mean, we don't, I would have to see it before and after photo, I guess. 632 00:47:37,000 --> 00:47:38,000 Right. 633 00:47:38,000 --> 00:47:41,000 So Rose was told by doctors to lose weight or face an early death. 634 00:47:41,000 --> 00:47:44,000 So she chose to do a keto diet. 635 00:47:44,000 --> 00:47:45,000 How do you do that in prison? 636 00:47:45,000 --> 00:47:46,000 Cute. 637 00:47:46,000 --> 00:47:47,000 Come on, Keto. 638 00:47:47,000 --> 00:47:49,000 Yeah, how do you do that in prison? 639 00:47:49,000 --> 00:47:51,000 I don't eat, I don't know. 640 00:47:51,000 --> 00:47:59,000 The same year, the same year, Rose removed out of the prison cell she had been in for a decade after another inmate threatened to kill her. 641 00:47:59,000 --> 00:48:09,000 After being convicted of the murder of three men, prison inmate Joanna Denny stated about the prison location, quote, send me there and I'll fucking kill Rose West, end quote. 642 00:48:09,000 --> 00:48:11,000 Oh, damn. 643 00:48:11,000 --> 00:48:14,000 I'm like, move me out, please, thank you. 644 00:48:14,000 --> 00:48:16,000 Thanks, yeah, I need a protection cell. 645 00:48:16,000 --> 00:48:23,000 In response, prison officials would move Rose to another location and reportedly changed her name to Jennifer Jones. 646 00:48:23,000 --> 00:48:25,000 We know it. 647 00:48:25,000 --> 00:48:27,000 Put me in there and I'll fucking kill Jennifer Jones. 648 00:48:27,000 --> 00:48:29,000 It's not a secret anymore. 649 00:48:29,000 --> 00:48:30,000 Jennifer Jones. 650 00:48:30,000 --> 00:48:32,000 Put me in there, I'm going to get Jennifer Jones. 651 00:48:32,000 --> 00:48:33,000 Yeah. 652 00:48:33,000 --> 00:48:42,000 The other inmates at this prison were reportedly upset about this name change with one stating, quote, Rose thinks the name will give her some anonymity, but there's a lot of anger about it. 653 00:48:42,000 --> 00:48:48,000 She's chosen the new surname because it's so common and the Christian name just because she's always liked it. 654 00:48:48,000 --> 00:48:50,000 Christian name. 655 00:48:50,000 --> 00:48:52,000 Jennifer's a Christian name. 656 00:48:52,000 --> 00:48:53,000 I guess, I don't know. 657 00:48:53,000 --> 00:48:55,000 I haven't heard that one before, but I guess it is. 658 00:48:55,000 --> 00:48:56,000 Me neither. 659 00:48:56,000 --> 00:49:03,000 There's some strange, I mean, there's like Seth is in the Bible, which you think is kind of more of a modern name, but it's not, you know, the biblical name. 660 00:49:03,000 --> 00:49:04,000 It's just funny. 661 00:49:04,000 --> 00:49:12,000 The quote goes on, quote, for her, it's more about getting rid of any association to Fred for good, and quote. 662 00:49:12,000 --> 00:49:15,000 But like, I mean, she's not right. 663 00:49:15,000 --> 00:49:17,000 I'm just saying wouldn't you though? 664 00:49:17,000 --> 00:49:18,000 She's not. 665 00:49:18,000 --> 00:49:19,000 I'm saying, Rose is right. 666 00:49:19,000 --> 00:49:20,000 I mean, Rose isn't right. 667 00:49:20,000 --> 00:49:21,000 Right. 668 00:49:21,000 --> 00:49:22,000 Yeah, she's not. 669 00:49:22,000 --> 00:49:23,000 She's not right. 670 00:49:23,000 --> 00:49:25,000 But yeah, I mean, I don't know. 671 00:49:25,000 --> 00:49:31,000 I guess, like, I get like you're changing your name, but are you changing your name to escape Fred or are you changing your name to escape what you did? 672 00:49:31,000 --> 00:49:32,000 Right. 673 00:49:32,000 --> 00:49:34,000 If I was innocent, I feel like it would make more sense. 674 00:49:34,000 --> 00:49:35,000 But yeah. 675 00:49:35,000 --> 00:49:38,000 So just lastly, a silly side note. 676 00:49:38,000 --> 00:49:39,000 I just thought that was so silly. 677 00:49:39,000 --> 00:49:49,000 There is a competition show in the UK called Dancing on Ice and Rose really likes it in 2021. 678 00:49:49,000 --> 00:49:50,000 Is it like Dancing with the Stars? 679 00:49:50,000 --> 00:49:51,000 Yeah, I think so. 680 00:49:51,000 --> 00:49:55,000 In 2021, a source stated quote, Rose is a huge fan. 681 00:49:55,000 --> 00:49:59,000 Every weekend, she clears a slot in her evening to watch the latest episode. 682 00:49:59,000 --> 00:50:01,000 It's a big part of her prison life. 683 00:50:01,000 --> 00:50:07,000 She's for a friend outside prison who she chats to and who makes the call to put a vote in for Rose. 684 00:50:07,000 --> 00:50:12,000 If you were the dancer she was backing, it'd be enough to send a shiver down your spine and quote. 685 00:50:12,000 --> 00:50:14,000 Oh my God. 686 00:50:14,000 --> 00:50:15,000 Could you imagine? 687 00:50:15,000 --> 00:50:18,000 Like, how do you feel about Rose West being your biggest fan? 688 00:50:18,000 --> 00:50:20,000 Like, fucking go away. 689 00:50:20,000 --> 00:50:23,000 I'm sorry Jennifer, whatever. 690 00:50:23,000 --> 00:50:26,000 And this vote is from Rose West. 691 00:50:26,000 --> 00:50:28,000 Yeah, right. 692 00:50:28,000 --> 00:50:34,000 But three hours later, that is the story of Fred and Rose West. 693 00:50:34,000 --> 00:50:37,000 Rose is still alive and she is still in prison. 694 00:50:37,000 --> 00:50:39,000 She won't ever get out hopefully. 695 00:50:39,000 --> 00:50:44,000 But thank you Amy Jane for the duty of a request. 696 00:50:44,000 --> 00:50:45,000 I'm actually not exactly sure. 697 00:50:45,000 --> 00:50:46,000 Yeah, thank you. 698 00:50:46,000 --> 00:50:53,000 Let me look it up really quick actually because I want to know too. 699 00:50:53,000 --> 00:50:54,000 She's 70. 700 00:50:54,000 --> 00:50:56,000 Yeah, that is an absolute wild case. 701 00:50:56,000 --> 00:50:57,000 Oh my gosh, 70 years old. 702 00:50:57,000 --> 00:50:59,000 Yes, I mean she'll be there for life, right? 703 00:50:59,000 --> 00:51:01,000 Oh, hopefully. 704 00:51:01,000 --> 00:51:02,000 That's bizarre. 705 00:51:02,000 --> 00:51:06,000 That is such a wild case and not to know about it. 706 00:51:06,000 --> 00:51:10,000 I mean, I'm not saying the little island over here in the States, but jeez, you know. 707 00:51:10,000 --> 00:51:11,000 Right. 708 00:51:11,000 --> 00:51:13,000 So thank you so much for that request. 709 00:51:13,000 --> 00:51:16,000 I'm so glad you're here and you've listened to all three parts. 710 00:51:16,000 --> 00:51:18,000 Bless you and you guys are the real ones. 711 00:51:18,000 --> 00:51:21,000 Yeah, you love me. 712 00:51:21,000 --> 00:51:22,000 But yeah, I'm so glad. 713 00:51:22,000 --> 00:51:23,000 Can I sit in Alaska still? 714 00:51:23,000 --> 00:51:42,000 Yeah, I'm so glad that we were, I was just going to say, I'm so glad we were able to get all of this recorded before I leave for my trip because it's going to be nice and breezy knowing that I don't have to not worry about you guys, but that I don't feel like, oh my gosh, like we need to do podcast stuff and we didn't do it, you know, as I'm gone, I can just relax and enjoy my vacay and know that the listeners still have content. 715 00:51:42,000 --> 00:51:43,000 Yeah, for sure. 716 00:51:43,000 --> 00:51:49,000 I'm excited to listen back to all these because by the time this airs, the first one still hasn't come out yet. 717 00:51:49,000 --> 00:51:50,000 So I'm excited. 718 00:51:50,000 --> 00:51:51,000 Yeah. 719 00:51:51,000 --> 00:51:52,000 Right. 720 00:51:52,000 --> 00:51:53,000 Right. 721 00:51:53,000 --> 00:51:55,000 Well, the first one, it came out today, actually. 722 00:51:55,000 --> 00:51:56,000 Right. 723 00:51:56,000 --> 00:51:57,000 Yeah. 724 00:51:57,000 --> 00:51:58,000 It dropped, oh, I guess at 4pm today, didn't it? 725 00:51:58,000 --> 00:51:59,000 It did. 726 00:51:59,000 --> 00:52:00,000 Yeah. 727 00:52:00,000 --> 00:52:01,000 So it came out a few hours ago. 728 00:52:01,000 --> 00:52:02,000 4pm last Thursday. 729 00:52:02,000 --> 00:52:03,000 Right. 730 00:52:03,000 --> 00:52:04,000 A couple of Thursdays ago. 731 00:52:04,000 --> 00:52:05,000 Two Thursdays ago. 732 00:52:05,000 --> 00:52:06,000 It's funny. 733 00:52:06,000 --> 00:52:07,000 Alrighty. 734 00:52:07,000 --> 00:52:09,000 Well, thank you guys for joining us. 735 00:52:09,000 --> 00:52:10,000 Do you have anything else? 736 00:52:10,000 --> 00:52:11,000 Yeah. 737 00:52:11,000 --> 00:52:12,000 No, that's it. 738 00:52:12,000 --> 00:52:18,000 I need to go watch some puppy and kitten videos as a palette buzzer after this one. 739 00:52:18,000 --> 00:52:23,000 You guys take care of yourselves and we will see you soon with another mental breakdown and episode. 740 00:52:23,000 --> 00:52:24,000 Yes. 741 00:52:24,000 --> 00:52:25,000 Yes. 742 00:52:25,000 --> 00:52:26,000 All right. 743 00:52:26,000 --> 00:52:27,000 Love you. 744 00:52:27,000 --> 00:52:28,000 Love you. 745 00:52:28,000 --> 00:52:29,000 Bye. 746 00:52:29,000 --> 00:52:30,000 Bye. 747 00:52:30,000 --> 00:52:39,000 If you want great tasting meals daily but can't find the time to shop or even cook, we have the solution for you. 748 00:52:39,000 --> 00:52:44,000 Fresh meal plan is a convenient, easy way to create custom meals delivered right to your door. 749 00:52:44,000 --> 00:52:49,000 With hundreds of rotating meals each week, there's always something new to look forward to. 750 00:52:49,000 --> 00:52:54,000 Many of their meals are ready in three minutes or less, so you don't have to spend all night cooking. 751 00:52:54,000 --> 00:52:58,000 Just select your meals, heat, eat, and bon appetit. 752 00:52:58,000 --> 00:53:09,000 Click the link in our show notes today for an exclusive offer with Fresh Meal Plan and create the perfect menu for you.