1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:02,000 Hello! Hello! 2 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:05,000 Welcome back to another episode of Diagnosing a Killer. 3 00:00:05,000 --> 00:00:31,000 I'm Kenna. How's it going? 4 00:00:31,000 --> 00:00:35,000 It's going okay. I had a bit of a rough time today. 5 00:00:35,000 --> 00:00:38,000 Just all of a sudden, not feeling well. 6 00:00:38,000 --> 00:00:41,000 I ate some weird typhoon the other day. 7 00:00:41,000 --> 00:00:45,000 And I remember, as I was eating it, it's one of those things you're like, 8 00:00:45,000 --> 00:00:49,000 hmm, this tastes kinda funky, but it's not so funky that you're like, 9 00:00:49,000 --> 00:00:51,000 it's gonna be bad, you know? 10 00:00:51,000 --> 00:00:56,000 I can't do that. If I feel like it's passable, I'm like, that's not good enough. 11 00:00:56,000 --> 00:01:00,000 No, I agree. And I used to kind of just look past it, 12 00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:03,000 but this time I was like, no. And I took like three or four big bites 13 00:01:03,000 --> 00:01:06,000 and I was like, I'm throwing it away, but those three or four bites 14 00:01:06,000 --> 00:01:10,000 still made my stomach hurt. But it wasn't to the point of throwing up. 15 00:01:10,000 --> 00:01:13,000 So I think it just affected me today, because it's like a couple days later. 16 00:01:13,000 --> 00:01:16,000 It's really unfortunate, because I love that typhoise. 17 00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:20,000 I love really good. They have some of the best crab rangoons, although I don't do dairy, 18 00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:24,000 but not anymore. But yeah, their crab rangoons are so good. 19 00:01:24,000 --> 00:01:28,000 They're lightly fried, very lightly. 20 00:01:28,000 --> 00:01:31,000 I can't stand the ones that are like really thick, you know, like hard to eat. 21 00:01:31,000 --> 00:01:36,000 There used to be a place down, well, not that the listeners know where Blanco is, 22 00:01:36,000 --> 00:01:40,000 but down on Blanco, and they're, I forgot what they were called, 23 00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:46,000 but they had some of the best crab rangoons, but they were sweet. 24 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:49,000 They had like honey in them. Oh my gosh, they were so good. 25 00:01:49,000 --> 00:01:52,000 But they had really thick, like, wonton wrappers too. 26 00:01:52,000 --> 00:01:55,000 But yeah, I don't know, they were just really good. 27 00:01:55,000 --> 00:01:59,000 They were the exception to the rule. It was almost like a pastry, instead of just 28 00:01:59,000 --> 00:02:02,000 like a dumpling. 29 00:02:02,000 --> 00:02:05,000 Yeah, I've been getting into Thai food more recently. 30 00:02:05,000 --> 00:02:10,000 I used to not really, not that I didn't ever like not like it, but I never not liked it. 31 00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:13,000 I don't know how to say that, but I just didn't really eat it enough, I guess. 32 00:02:13,000 --> 00:02:16,000 Yeah, it's my favorite food of all time. 33 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:19,000 Thai food is my favorite food. I've always wanted to go to Thailand. 34 00:02:19,000 --> 00:02:21,000 Elephants are my favorite animals. 35 00:02:21,000 --> 00:02:27,000 I love it. I just, yeah. And I have different Thai restaurants in San Antonio 36 00:02:27,000 --> 00:02:32,000 that I go to for different things. Like one place I'll get red curry, then another place I'll get green curry, 37 00:02:32,000 --> 00:02:37,000 then the next place I'll get, you know, tam yum, and then, you know, yeah. 38 00:02:37,000 --> 00:02:39,000 They all have differing flavors. 39 00:02:39,000 --> 00:02:41,000 I haven't eaten dinner yet, we gotta stop talking about food. 40 00:02:41,000 --> 00:02:47,000 Anyway, yeah, so that was my day, but hopefully it'll pass by tomorrow and everything will be good. 41 00:02:47,000 --> 00:02:49,000 What about you? 42 00:02:49,000 --> 00:02:55,000 Well, you know, I had a little rough in my feels kind of a few days, but I'm coming out of it, you know, 43 00:02:55,000 --> 00:02:59,000 and I always get that feeling, not feeling, but I have to remind myself like this is temporary, 44 00:02:59,000 --> 00:03:02,000 like I'm not gonna feel this way all the time. 45 00:03:02,000 --> 00:03:06,000 So I was telling Kenna yesterday that, you know, she was doing all this stuff for the merch, 46 00:03:06,000 --> 00:03:13,000 for the live coming up tomorrow and, or on Friday, and yeah, I was just like, 47 00:03:13,000 --> 00:03:15,000 I feel like I've accomplished nothing. 48 00:03:15,000 --> 00:03:21,000 Like my biggest accomplishments yesterday were watching my son perform in a performance, 49 00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:25,000 and then the second best thing that I did yesterday was eat an impossible whopper. 50 00:03:25,000 --> 00:03:26,000 There you go. 51 00:03:26,000 --> 00:03:28,000 Those were my accomplishments yesterday. 52 00:03:28,000 --> 00:03:30,000 You fed yourself, you got out of bed. 53 00:03:30,000 --> 00:03:32,000 Those are accomplishments in my book. 54 00:03:32,000 --> 00:03:36,000 That all being said, I'm glad that you're feeling a little bit better. 55 00:03:36,000 --> 00:03:41,000 Just on that same note, we made some really cute koozies for the merch. 56 00:03:41,000 --> 00:03:43,000 It's gonna be a new koozy drop. 57 00:03:43,000 --> 00:03:46,000 I made them, I made like, I think 15 of them. 58 00:03:46,000 --> 00:03:48,000 Oh my gosh, they're so cute. 59 00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:51,000 We've been talking about doing some mental breakdown merch, 60 00:03:51,000 --> 00:03:54,000 and I'm really excited to show you guys that tomorrow, 61 00:03:54,000 --> 00:03:59,000 as well as like Kowal said, a bunch of other merch items. 62 00:03:59,000 --> 00:04:06,000 So make sure to check us out on what not on Friday the 8th at 6pm central time. 63 00:04:06,000 --> 00:04:10,000 I think we're gonna hang out for maybe like two hours, maybe a little bit longer. 64 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:13,000 Yeah, we're just gonna chat about merch, give us your suggestions. 65 00:04:13,000 --> 00:04:16,000 You wanna ask us questions about the podcast, feel free. 66 00:04:16,000 --> 00:04:19,000 And if you haven't already, click that link, it's in our link tree. 67 00:04:19,000 --> 00:04:21,000 You get $15 off just by using that link. 68 00:04:21,000 --> 00:04:23,000 It's like basically a free shirt. 69 00:04:23,000 --> 00:04:24,000 Mm-hmm. 70 00:04:24,000 --> 00:04:26,000 But yeah, that's all I got, I think. 71 00:04:26,000 --> 00:04:31,000 Yeah, we'll have, so far right now, if you go to our what not profile, 72 00:04:31,000 --> 00:04:36,000 and you go to the buy it now section, you'll see all of our new merch items on there. 73 00:04:36,000 --> 00:04:39,000 And I mean new, buy as I'm never used. 74 00:04:39,000 --> 00:04:44,000 That's not gonna be our upcycle stuff, that is gonna be brand new stuff. 75 00:04:44,000 --> 00:04:49,000 We also have the koozies on there in the buy it now that you can purchase now ahead of time. 76 00:04:49,000 --> 00:04:54,000 We have limited supply on a few of those items, so if you wanna grab them, grab them now. 77 00:04:54,000 --> 00:04:59,000 Otherwise, I think we're gonna just be doing upcycle stuff for auction. 78 00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:02,000 So essentially the way that it works is it's kind of like a live eBay, 79 00:05:02,000 --> 00:05:05,000 where you go, you're essentially watching a live stream, 80 00:05:05,000 --> 00:05:09,000 and then you input all your information, your card information, your shipping information, 81 00:05:09,000 --> 00:05:14,000 and you casually shop, it's kind of like an, what is it, like a HGTV? 82 00:05:14,000 --> 00:05:15,000 Is that what it is? 83 00:05:15,000 --> 00:05:16,000 I don't know. 84 00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:17,000 At Home and Garden. 85 00:05:17,000 --> 00:05:18,000 You know, one of those like shopping. 86 00:05:18,000 --> 00:05:19,000 Oh, like catalog? 87 00:05:19,000 --> 00:05:21,000 Yeah, shows. 88 00:05:21,000 --> 00:05:22,000 So it's kind of like that. 89 00:05:22,000 --> 00:05:26,000 So we will just be essentially showing you the merchandise, 90 00:05:26,000 --> 00:05:33,000 and if you're interested in something, we just automatically input it into the auction tab thing. 91 00:05:33,000 --> 00:05:35,000 We'll run the auction. 92 00:05:35,000 --> 00:05:38,000 It usually lasts anywhere from like 10 seconds to 30 seconds, 93 00:05:38,000 --> 00:05:40,000 and you guys can just bid on it. 94 00:05:40,000 --> 00:05:42,000 If you guys wanna throw a little extra you can on there. 95 00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:44,000 I think there's also like a tip option. 96 00:05:44,000 --> 00:05:49,000 If you don't feel like any merch items, you can just tip us for our... 97 00:05:49,000 --> 00:05:50,000 Human. 98 00:05:50,000 --> 00:05:52,000 Human and hard work. 99 00:05:52,000 --> 00:05:55,000 Well, we're also gonna be doing dollar bracelets starts, 100 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:58,000 and the way that that works is that every bracelet is a dollar. 101 00:05:58,000 --> 00:05:59,000 We'll just run it. 102 00:05:59,000 --> 00:06:03,000 You just swipe your little thingy to say, yeah, I accept this auction, 103 00:06:03,000 --> 00:06:05,000 and then you guys can all bid each other if you want. 104 00:06:05,000 --> 00:06:10,000 It's a lot of fun, and it's all like with talking and connecting and things like that. 105 00:06:10,000 --> 00:06:11,000 It's so much fun. 106 00:06:11,000 --> 00:06:12,000 I'm so excited. 107 00:06:12,000 --> 00:06:13,000 I'm really excited. 108 00:06:13,000 --> 00:06:15,000 This will be my first time hosting one of those, 109 00:06:15,000 --> 00:06:19,000 but I've seen you host multiple for a different platform many a time. 110 00:06:19,000 --> 00:06:20,000 Yeah. 111 00:06:20,000 --> 00:06:21,000 Yeah, that's gonna be awesome. 112 00:06:21,000 --> 00:06:23,000 We hope to see you guys there. 113 00:06:23,000 --> 00:06:26,000 Well, I'm excited to see who you're doing today. 114 00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:28,000 I've been trying to guess it, and I've been guessing wrong. 115 00:06:28,000 --> 00:06:29,000 Sure. 116 00:06:29,000 --> 00:06:31,000 Do you want to give everybody our handles? 117 00:06:31,000 --> 00:06:32,000 Sure. 118 00:06:32,000 --> 00:06:34,000 You can follow us anywhere at Diagnosing a Killer. 119 00:06:34,000 --> 00:06:37,000 You can follow us on Twitter, or now X, at Killer Diagnosis. 120 00:06:37,000 --> 00:06:40,000 We do have a website, DiagnosingAKiller.com. 121 00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:44,000 There you will find links to resources, some of our merch items as well, 122 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:48,000 and as well as information for the True Crime and Paranormal Podcast Festival 123 00:06:48,000 --> 00:06:52,000 that is happening in July and Denver, the 12th through the 14th. 124 00:06:52,000 --> 00:06:54,000 It is my birthday weekend. 125 00:06:54,000 --> 00:06:55,000 Come see us. 126 00:06:55,000 --> 00:06:56,000 Yes. 127 00:06:56,000 --> 00:07:00,000 I got 15% off those tickets, like I said, for using our code, D-A-K. 128 00:07:00,000 --> 00:07:02,000 I just slammed my elbow into the wall. 129 00:07:02,000 --> 00:07:03,000 I heard that. 130 00:07:03,000 --> 00:07:04,000 I was like, what was that? 131 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:08,000 And if you'd like access to some extra content, go to patreon.com. 132 00:07:08,000 --> 00:07:10,000 Slot's Diagnosing a Killer. 133 00:07:10,000 --> 00:07:13,000 Our tier two and three Patrons get an extra bonus episode every month, 134 00:07:13,000 --> 00:07:15,000 and they actually got two for the month of February. 135 00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:18,000 Ad free, content warning free, big all-away episodes. 136 00:07:18,000 --> 00:07:19,000 Yeah. 137 00:07:19,000 --> 00:07:20,000 That's it. 138 00:07:20,000 --> 00:07:21,000 Ready? 139 00:07:21,000 --> 00:07:22,000 Yes. 140 00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:25,000 Today, we're gonna be talking about Michelle Carter. 141 00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:26,000 Oh, shit. 142 00:07:26,000 --> 00:07:28,000 You didn't do this one, did you? 143 00:07:28,000 --> 00:07:31,000 No, I didn't do this one, but now I'm thinking I might be... 144 00:07:31,000 --> 00:07:32,000 It's on your left. 145 00:07:32,000 --> 00:07:33,000 Conrad? 146 00:07:33,000 --> 00:07:34,000 Yes. 147 00:07:34,000 --> 00:07:35,000 Okay, that's... 148 00:07:35,000 --> 00:07:36,000 I was thinking of Michelle Conrad. 149 00:07:36,000 --> 00:07:37,000 I was like, that's not the right person. 150 00:07:37,000 --> 00:07:38,000 That's not the person. 151 00:07:38,000 --> 00:07:41,000 Oh my gosh, what a case. 152 00:07:41,000 --> 00:07:43,000 It's horrible. 153 00:07:43,000 --> 00:07:47,000 Content warning, this episode discusses the topics of self-harm, eating disorders, 154 00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:51,000 severe depression and anxiety, and ultimately suicide. 155 00:07:51,000 --> 00:07:54,000 If this episode is not for you, we encourage you to find another one of our episodes. 156 00:07:54,000 --> 00:07:57,000 Remember that your mental health comes first and we love you. 157 00:07:57,000 --> 00:07:58,000 Love you. 158 00:07:58,000 --> 00:07:59,000 Bye. 159 00:07:59,000 --> 00:08:02,000 Oh my gosh, I'm not ready. 160 00:08:02,000 --> 00:08:04,000 This case breaks my heart. 161 00:08:04,000 --> 00:08:05,000 It's really sad. 162 00:08:05,000 --> 00:08:06,000 It's awful. 163 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:12,000 Michelle Diana Carter was born August 11th, 1996 in Plainville, Massachusetts, to her 164 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:14,000 parents, Gail and David Carter. 165 00:08:14,000 --> 00:08:20,000 David was a sales manager for a forklift company, and Gail would come to work with real-estate 166 00:08:20,000 --> 00:08:23,000 agents, staging properties for show for open houses. 167 00:08:23,000 --> 00:08:26,000 Michelle had one younger sister named Hayden. 168 00:08:26,000 --> 00:08:30,000 However, an exact age is unknown since she was little. 169 00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:32,000 I love Hayden for a girl I think. 170 00:08:32,000 --> 00:08:33,000 Me too. 171 00:08:33,000 --> 00:08:37,000 Oh my gosh, me and Clif started watching that American Horror Story the first season. 172 00:08:37,000 --> 00:08:42,000 Hayden's the, what's his face's, girlfriend. 173 00:08:42,000 --> 00:08:44,000 Dylan McDermott's girlfriend. 174 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:45,000 Dylan, he gets pregnant? 175 00:08:45,000 --> 00:08:46,000 Oh my god. 176 00:08:46,000 --> 00:08:47,000 I haven't seen that. 177 00:08:47,000 --> 00:08:48,000 Season one? 178 00:08:48,000 --> 00:08:49,000 Season one, yeah. 179 00:08:49,000 --> 00:08:50,000 The Murder House. 180 00:08:50,000 --> 00:08:51,000 The Murder House. 181 00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:53,000 Maybe Fall in Love with Evan Peters. 182 00:08:53,000 --> 00:08:55,000 Maybe Fall in Love with Dylan McDermott again. 183 00:08:55,000 --> 00:08:57,000 The family moved into the haunted house. 184 00:08:57,000 --> 00:08:58,000 Yeah, I remember the whole thing. 185 00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:03,000 And the reason they moved is because he was having an affair with his client or something. 186 00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:05,000 And then she shows up on the doorstep and it turns out she's pregnant. 187 00:09:05,000 --> 00:09:07,000 It's like, oh fuck. 188 00:09:07,000 --> 00:09:11,000 And when they leave and she can't leave the house because the daughter can't leave the 189 00:09:11,000 --> 00:09:14,000 house anymore, they're like, come with us and they put her in the car and they drive 190 00:09:14,000 --> 00:09:15,000 away and she's in the window. 191 00:09:15,000 --> 00:09:16,000 Spoiler alert. 192 00:09:16,000 --> 00:09:20,000 That came out like 15 years ago. 193 00:09:20,000 --> 00:09:23,000 And I love that I'm in love with Kim Kardashian's in this last season. 194 00:09:23,000 --> 00:09:24,000 Yeah. 195 00:09:24,000 --> 00:09:25,000 And they did like a half season break. 196 00:09:25,000 --> 00:09:29,000 So now it's been like months and the second part of the season hasn't come out yet. 197 00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:30,000 Oh my god. 198 00:09:30,000 --> 00:09:31,000 And it's actually really good. 199 00:09:31,000 --> 00:09:33,000 I love when they cast like major celebrities. 200 00:09:33,000 --> 00:09:35,000 Oh yeah, Lady Gaga was in one. 201 00:09:35,000 --> 00:09:36,000 Yeah. 202 00:09:36,000 --> 00:09:37,000 That was hotel. 203 00:09:37,000 --> 00:09:39,000 I never, I just said that and I was like, I didn't care for hotel. 204 00:09:39,000 --> 00:09:41,000 We're getting off on two minutes. 205 00:09:41,000 --> 00:09:42,000 Sorry. 206 00:09:42,000 --> 00:09:45,000 Michelle and Hayden seem to have a typical home life. 207 00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:48,000 Their parents worked hard and the girls would want for nothing. 208 00:09:48,000 --> 00:09:53,000 Michelle seemed to be a pretty well adjusted young woman being described by her parents 209 00:09:53,000 --> 00:09:55,000 as quiet, kind and sympathetic. 210 00:09:55,000 --> 00:09:59,000 That is until about middle school and high school age. 211 00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:04,000 Michelle and her mother would often get into disagreements and rarely saw eye to eye on 212 00:10:04,000 --> 00:10:08,000 things, especially when it came to Michelle's social interactions with others. 213 00:10:08,000 --> 00:10:11,000 I feel like that's kind of typical like teenage girl behavior though. 214 00:10:11,000 --> 00:10:12,000 I think so too. 215 00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:13,000 Yeah, that was me. 216 00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:14,000 Yeah. 217 00:10:14,000 --> 00:10:17,000 I mean, it wasn't me, but I saw you guys do it and I didn't want to do it because it's 218 00:10:17,000 --> 00:10:20,000 like that's not going to end well for me if I try that shit. 219 00:10:20,000 --> 00:10:21,000 Yeah, for sure. 220 00:10:21,000 --> 00:10:25,000 Yeah, I think that there's, you know, I was just having this conversation with Cliff the 221 00:10:25,000 --> 00:10:26,000 other day. 222 00:10:26,000 --> 00:10:28,000 I was like, my child will resent me one day. 223 00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:31,000 Like that is this circle of life, you know. 224 00:10:31,000 --> 00:10:33,000 It's terrible. 225 00:10:33,000 --> 00:10:37,000 Michelle on the surface seemed to get along with her peers. 226 00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:41,000 However, her peers found Michelle to be odd and would say that Michelle did not usually 227 00:10:41,000 --> 00:10:46,000 find deeper, more meaningful connections with other students outside of school. 228 00:10:46,000 --> 00:10:47,500 So just kind of like surface level. 229 00:10:47,500 --> 00:10:52,500 Yeah, that her friendships were often superficial and they never spent time with her outside 230 00:10:52,500 --> 00:10:55,000 of school, like going to movies or anything like that. 231 00:10:55,000 --> 00:10:56,000 Oh, got it. 232 00:10:56,000 --> 00:11:00,000 Often other girls would make up excuses for not hanging out with Michelle. 233 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:03,000 They're like, oh, did I tell you that day? 234 00:11:03,000 --> 00:11:06,600 Oh, it got canceled or oh, yeah, no, you can't come to that party. 235 00:11:06,600 --> 00:11:09,000 My mom's really weird about certain people. 236 00:11:09,000 --> 00:11:12,000 Yeah, or it's like, hey mom, can I go spend the night at So-and-So's and you're looking 237 00:11:12,000 --> 00:11:14,000 at your mom like, say no, say no, say no. 238 00:11:14,000 --> 00:11:15,000 Yeah, yeah, exactly. 239 00:11:15,000 --> 00:11:16,000 Oh, who hasn't done that? 240 00:11:16,000 --> 00:11:17,000 I've done that for sure. 241 00:11:17,000 --> 00:11:21,000 Or like text someone and like call me in feign in emergency so I can come home. 242 00:11:21,000 --> 00:11:22,000 I did that one. 243 00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:27,000 I told Cameron to call me one time and pretend like she needed me home and Cameron like, 244 00:11:27,000 --> 00:11:32,000 you know, drama queen took it to this whole, kind of get the fuck home right now. 245 00:11:32,000 --> 00:11:34,000 You're so much trauma on this piece. 246 00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:36,000 All the she's that has an acting opportunity. 247 00:11:36,000 --> 00:11:37,000 Exactly. 248 00:11:37,000 --> 00:11:38,000 I had her on speaker. 249 00:11:38,000 --> 00:11:39,000 I was like, damn, she really shit. 250 00:11:39,000 --> 00:11:40,000 She puts. 251 00:11:40,000 --> 00:11:44,000 However, there was one friendship that seemed to deepen. 252 00:11:44,000 --> 00:11:49,000 Michelle was looking for a way to connect with others and become more widely accepted. 253 00:11:49,000 --> 00:11:52,000 So she joined the softball team in high school. 254 00:11:52,000 --> 00:11:53,000 Not I don't think it was in high school. 255 00:11:53,000 --> 00:11:57,000 I think it was it was during her high school years, but it was a softball team. 256 00:11:57,000 --> 00:11:58,000 Not at the school. 257 00:11:58,000 --> 00:11:59,000 Not at the school. 258 00:11:59,000 --> 00:12:00,000 Okay. 259 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:03,000 Here she met a girl known only as Alice. 260 00:12:03,000 --> 00:12:06,000 Alice and Michelle became fast friends. 261 00:12:06,000 --> 00:12:10,000 The two would often spend time together outside of school, like going to the movies, going 262 00:12:10,000 --> 00:12:13,000 shopping and staying the night at each other's houses. 263 00:12:13,000 --> 00:12:18,000 But after sometime during the friendship, Alice would be going to become uncomfortable around 264 00:12:18,000 --> 00:12:19,000 Michelle. 265 00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:24,000 Alice would come to believe that Michelle had had a crush on her to which Alice did not 266 00:12:24,000 --> 00:12:25,000 reciprocate. 267 00:12:25,000 --> 00:12:30,000 Alice would notice that the friendship resembled more of that of a relationship. 268 00:12:30,000 --> 00:12:33,000 Michelle would ask Alice to sneak around with her at night. 269 00:12:33,000 --> 00:12:38,000 She would sometimes get jealous of other friends and in general become clingy and even sometimes 270 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:39,000 texting obsessively. 271 00:12:39,000 --> 00:12:40,000 Like, where are you at? 272 00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:41,000 What are you doing? 273 00:12:41,000 --> 00:12:42,000 Where are you? 274 00:12:42,000 --> 00:12:44,000 I have been dating some girls who are like that. 275 00:12:44,000 --> 00:12:48,000 Not recently, but in high school, you know, I've had some girls that treated me like 276 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:54,000 that and it was kind of like, okay, just homies, you know, like, it's not the wrong idea. 277 00:12:54,000 --> 00:12:56,000 Honestly, it did drive me away. 278 00:12:56,000 --> 00:12:59,000 I didn't really want to hang out with them anymore because it made me uncomfortable. 279 00:12:59,000 --> 00:13:03,000 Yeah, you feel pressured into the friendship more than just wanting to be that person's 280 00:13:03,000 --> 00:13:04,000 friend. 281 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:05,000 Exactly. 282 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:09,380 Michelle would write to another peer about this relationship, quote, I thought it was 283 00:13:09,380 --> 00:13:10,900 a phase at first. 284 00:13:10,900 --> 00:13:15,240 Like, thought we were really good friends, but we started talking like a relationship 285 00:13:15,240 --> 00:13:17,480 would flirting and stuff and quote. 286 00:13:17,480 --> 00:13:24,120 So this is Michelle telling another girl, like, she's my girlfriend, essentially. 287 00:13:24,120 --> 00:13:28,640 So yes, Michelle may have been inflating her relationship with Alice to others, like calling 288 00:13:28,640 --> 00:13:31,560 her her girlfriend and stuff. 289 00:13:31,560 --> 00:13:34,880 Realizing that Michelle felt this way, Alice decided to confide in her mother that she 290 00:13:34,880 --> 00:13:39,000 felt uncomfortable and was encouraged by her mother to end the friendship with Michelle, 291 00:13:39,000 --> 00:13:41,440 which she did. 292 00:13:41,440 --> 00:13:44,280 Michelle became noticeably depressed after this. 293 00:13:44,280 --> 00:13:48,320 She began to self harm and she had difficulties with eating. 294 00:13:48,320 --> 00:13:52,560 Michelle often felt outcasted and in an effort to become more popular, she would often refuse 295 00:13:52,560 --> 00:13:56,880 to eat or skip meals in order to lose weight. 296 00:13:56,880 --> 00:13:59,920 Michelle's parents noticed a difference in their daughter's behavior and would seek 297 00:13:59,920 --> 00:14:01,920 professional help for her. 298 00:14:01,920 --> 00:14:05,480 Michelle would be prescribed cytolopram, cytolopram. 299 00:14:05,480 --> 00:14:06,480 Cetylopram. 300 00:14:06,480 --> 00:14:08,480 Cetylopram, also known as Cilexa. 301 00:14:08,480 --> 00:14:15,280 In 2012, Michelle's family decided to spend some time in Florida for family gathering, 302 00:14:15,280 --> 00:14:18,080 Michelle being 16 at the time. 303 00:14:18,080 --> 00:14:21,480 One night while walking along the beach, she would come across a young man by the name 304 00:14:21,480 --> 00:14:22,480 of Conrad Roy. 305 00:14:22,480 --> 00:14:24,920 Conrad Roy is such a cool first name. 306 00:14:24,920 --> 00:14:26,160 I know. 307 00:14:26,160 --> 00:14:28,760 That's my ex-husband's middle name. 308 00:14:28,760 --> 00:14:29,760 Oh yeah. 309 00:14:29,760 --> 00:14:32,000 Oh my gosh, really quick. 310 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:35,080 Sorry, speaking of him, did you see the post that he made about your son earlier? 311 00:14:35,080 --> 00:14:36,080 Oh, you don't have Facebook. 312 00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:40,520 Oh gosh, he posted that, this is like earlier today, he posted that when he got his phone 313 00:14:40,520 --> 00:14:45,080 back or whatever, your son had made him a playlist like, oh, dad's playlist or whatever, 314 00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:46,080 like dad's new songs or whatever. 315 00:14:46,080 --> 00:14:47,080 I did hear that. 316 00:14:47,080 --> 00:14:48,080 And his dad was like, oh, that's so sweet. 317 00:14:48,080 --> 00:14:50,080 He's like, I almost got choked up or whatever. 318 00:14:50,080 --> 00:14:54,080 And he clicked on it because it was 24 hours of Rick Astley's never going to give you up. 319 00:14:54,080 --> 00:14:56,920 Like that kid is a genius. 320 00:14:56,920 --> 00:14:57,920 He's trying to troll him. 321 00:14:57,920 --> 00:14:58,920 He's a Rick Roll disaster. 322 00:14:58,920 --> 00:14:59,920 He's only eight. 323 00:14:59,920 --> 00:15:00,920 Yeah, he's only eight. 324 00:15:00,920 --> 00:15:02,720 He knows how to Rick Roll people. 325 00:15:02,720 --> 00:15:03,840 He was doing that in the car. 326 00:15:03,840 --> 00:15:09,000 He was singing some theme song like, oh, oh, oh, oh Riley's or whatever. 327 00:15:09,000 --> 00:15:10,440 And he kept doing it, kept doing it. 328 00:15:10,440 --> 00:15:11,440 It was like baby. 329 00:15:11,440 --> 00:15:12,440 I was like, please. 330 00:15:12,440 --> 00:15:16,840 He's like, would you rather me sing never going to give you up? 331 00:15:16,840 --> 00:15:17,840 Oh my gosh. 332 00:15:17,840 --> 00:15:18,840 Over. 333 00:15:18,840 --> 00:15:19,840 Oh, I got you. 334 00:15:19,840 --> 00:15:20,840 So funny. 335 00:15:20,840 --> 00:15:26,560 Conrad Roy, the third was born at September 12, 1995. 336 00:15:26,560 --> 00:15:32,920 And I think it's Madapoisette, Madapoisette, Massachusetts to his parents, Conrad Jr. and 337 00:15:32,920 --> 00:15:33,920 Len Roy. 338 00:15:33,920 --> 00:15:38,880 So Conrad, the young man that we're going to be talking about is a third, but his dad 339 00:15:38,880 --> 00:15:40,280 is also a Conrad. 340 00:15:40,280 --> 00:15:45,680 So Conrad's father, grandfather and uncle all worked for the same family business, which 341 00:15:45,680 --> 00:15:49,480 was Tucker Roy, Marine, Toeing and Salvage, Incorporated. 342 00:15:49,480 --> 00:15:50,480 That's got to be confusing. 343 00:15:50,480 --> 00:15:51,480 All of them are named Conrad. 344 00:15:51,480 --> 00:15:52,480 Except for the brother. 345 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:53,480 They're all Roy's. 346 00:15:53,480 --> 00:15:56,360 Yeah, their last names are all Roy too. 347 00:15:56,360 --> 00:16:01,640 Their job was to salvage and tow sunken or broken down vessels, specializing in trickier 348 00:16:01,640 --> 00:16:04,040 or more dangerous jobs, which I found really interesting. 349 00:16:04,040 --> 00:16:05,040 That is interesting. 350 00:16:05,040 --> 00:16:08,200 It's like one of those odd jobs, you know, that you don't really know about. 351 00:16:08,200 --> 00:16:10,920 And especially to like build a business from the ground up. 352 00:16:10,920 --> 00:16:14,360 That's kind of like a unique thing to want to do. 353 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:17,240 Conrad was not the kind of kid to struggle making friends. 354 00:16:17,240 --> 00:16:21,200 He had an infectious slough and was described as a sweet and charming young man. 355 00:16:21,200 --> 00:16:26,560 He was also described by his own mother as being a beautiful and happy child. 356 00:16:26,560 --> 00:16:29,160 Conrad was constantly on the honor roll. 357 00:16:29,160 --> 00:16:33,560 He participated in various school sports, including baseball and track. 358 00:16:33,560 --> 00:16:36,800 Conrad was also incredibly talented and bright. 359 00:16:36,800 --> 00:16:40,800 And in telling you this, his problems were not outside of the home, but instead inside 360 00:16:40,800 --> 00:16:42,800 of the home. 361 00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:47,240 Conrad's father would sometimes become enraged, taking his anger out on his family. 362 00:16:47,240 --> 00:16:51,760 On occasion, these outbursts would also become physical. 363 00:16:51,760 --> 00:16:55,480 Especially to Conrad as he was the eldest of three and the only boy in the house. 364 00:16:55,480 --> 00:16:56,760 He had two younger sisters. 365 00:16:56,760 --> 00:17:00,640 Yeah, that's unfortunate, but that's usually how we see it happen. 366 00:17:00,640 --> 00:17:01,640 Yeah. 367 00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:10,120 If you want great tasting meals daily, but can't find the time to shop or even cook, 368 00:17:10,120 --> 00:17:12,360 we have the solution for you. 369 00:17:12,360 --> 00:17:16,520 Fresh meal plan is a convenient, easy way to create custom meals delivered right to your 370 00:17:16,520 --> 00:17:17,680 door. 371 00:17:17,680 --> 00:17:21,400 With hundreds of rotating meals each week, there's always something new to look forward 372 00:17:21,400 --> 00:17:22,880 to. 373 00:17:22,880 --> 00:17:26,640 Many of their meals are ready in three minutes or less, so you don't have to spend all night 374 00:17:26,640 --> 00:17:27,880 cooking. 375 00:17:27,880 --> 00:17:32,040 Just select your meals, heat, eat, and bon appetit. 376 00:17:32,040 --> 00:17:36,180 Click the link in our show notes today for an exclusive offer with Fresh Meal Plan and 377 00:17:36,180 --> 00:17:43,240 create the perfect menu for you. 378 00:17:43,240 --> 00:17:48,600 In 2011, police were called to the Roy home after a domestic violence incident. 379 00:17:48,600 --> 00:17:53,920 Lynn Roy would be arrested on domestic violence charges, but would ultimately not be convicted. 380 00:17:53,920 --> 00:17:54,920 The mom? 381 00:17:54,920 --> 00:17:55,920 Mm-hmm. 382 00:17:55,920 --> 00:17:59,400 Lynn Roy was found to have left bruises on his father. 383 00:17:59,400 --> 00:18:02,680 Conrad began to withdraw more and more as time went on. 384 00:18:02,680 --> 00:18:07,320 As Conrad's depression worsened, his parents would have him attend behavioral therapies, 385 00:18:07,320 --> 00:18:11,680 group therapies, and ultimately he would be diagnosed with social anxiety disorder and 386 00:18:11,680 --> 00:18:12,680 clinical depression. 387 00:18:12,680 --> 00:18:20,240 I mean, yeah, even being exposed indirectly to abuse like that is really detrimental for 388 00:18:20,240 --> 00:18:22,480 your mental health growing up. 389 00:18:22,480 --> 00:18:27,680 Yeah, it makes sense with the social anxiety just because like how do you speak? 390 00:18:27,680 --> 00:18:31,600 How do you communicate your feelings when you know what's going on, you know? 391 00:18:31,600 --> 00:18:36,760 Or you're afraid like everyone else outside of that is just gonna, you know, snap, you 392 00:18:36,760 --> 00:18:37,760 know, any second. 393 00:18:37,760 --> 00:18:39,480 Right, exactly. 394 00:18:39,480 --> 00:18:44,200 Conrad would ultimately be described Cetylopram, also known as Cilexa. 395 00:18:44,200 --> 00:18:47,720 So they were both prescribed the same thing. 396 00:18:47,720 --> 00:18:48,720 Okay. 397 00:18:48,720 --> 00:18:52,560 However, no amount of medication would help resolve the discourse still going on in the 398 00:18:52,560 --> 00:18:54,600 Roy household. 399 00:18:54,600 --> 00:18:58,920 Needing a vacation, the family traveled down to Florida in 2012 to visit with other family 400 00:18:58,920 --> 00:19:05,520 members and it was here that 17-year-old Conrad would meet 16-year-old Michelle Carter. 401 00:19:05,520 --> 00:19:08,280 After learning that they didn't live that far from each other, I think they were only 402 00:19:08,280 --> 00:19:11,560 like an hour away from one another. 403 00:19:11,560 --> 00:19:15,360 The two would spend the vacation essentially inseparable, going on bike rides and getting 404 00:19:15,360 --> 00:19:17,280 ice cream together. 405 00:19:17,280 --> 00:19:22,280 They would exchange information after this trip and once home began texting regularly. 406 00:19:22,280 --> 00:19:26,240 The two would bond over their shared experiences with depression and keep each other company 407 00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:31,120 in ways that the people around them in their everyday lives couldn't. 408 00:19:31,120 --> 00:19:36,480 Michelle began to become very attached to Conrad, even at points telling her classmates 409 00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:38,360 that this was her boyfriend. 410 00:19:38,360 --> 00:19:39,660 Okay. 411 00:19:39,660 --> 00:19:40,960 Even though it was an official. 412 00:19:40,960 --> 00:19:42,520 Yeah, seen this before. 413 00:19:42,520 --> 00:19:43,520 Yeah. 414 00:19:43,520 --> 00:19:47,560 Michelle's especially seemed interested that Michelle had had this secret long distance 415 00:19:47,560 --> 00:19:50,760 relationship with an older mysterious boy. 416 00:19:50,760 --> 00:19:51,760 Sounds like Martha Beck. 417 00:19:51,760 --> 00:19:52,760 Yeah. 418 00:19:52,760 --> 00:19:53,760 Oh, he died. 419 00:19:53,760 --> 00:19:54,760 He died. 420 00:19:54,760 --> 00:19:55,760 Don't worry. 421 00:19:55,760 --> 00:19:57,320 Yeah, Peter. 422 00:19:57,320 --> 00:20:01,240 As they, oh my God, I just remembered that that guy threw himself off of that bridge 423 00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:03,160 after she said she was pregnant, remember? 424 00:20:03,160 --> 00:20:04,160 That's terrible. 425 00:20:04,160 --> 00:20:05,160 That's awful. 426 00:20:05,160 --> 00:20:06,160 He threw himself into a bay. 427 00:20:06,160 --> 00:20:07,160 Yeah. 428 00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:08,160 Sorry. 429 00:20:08,160 --> 00:20:09,160 That was Lonely Hearts. 430 00:20:09,160 --> 00:20:11,560 Lonely Hearts killers, Raymond, Fernandez and Martha Beck. 431 00:20:11,560 --> 00:20:12,920 I just re-listened to it recently. 432 00:20:12,920 --> 00:20:14,160 That's why it's fresh out the noggin. 433 00:20:14,160 --> 00:20:15,160 Yeah. 434 00:20:15,160 --> 00:20:18,240 Fresh out the noggin. 435 00:20:18,240 --> 00:20:22,400 So yes, as the girls had only seen her as a weirdo in an outcast before, this afforded 436 00:20:22,400 --> 00:20:24,400 Michelle with a lot of new attention. 437 00:20:24,400 --> 00:20:25,920 Yeah, she's getting popular. 438 00:20:25,920 --> 00:20:27,880 Yeah, she craved it. 439 00:20:27,880 --> 00:20:34,640 In October 2012, after having found out that his parents intended to file for divorce, Conrad 440 00:20:34,640 --> 00:20:38,840 came to the conclusion that his life was only getting harder for him. 441 00:20:38,840 --> 00:20:44,320 He constantly worried and had anxiety, and it was entirely too much for him to handle 442 00:20:44,320 --> 00:20:46,240 any longer. 443 00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:50,520 Conrad took an entire bottle of over-the-counter medication in an attempt to take his own life. 444 00:20:50,520 --> 00:20:52,840 I did not know that. 445 00:20:52,840 --> 00:20:56,840 The only person that he told was a young girl that he had met while in group therapy, and 446 00:20:56,840 --> 00:20:59,400 she did the right thing by immediately contacting police. 447 00:20:59,400 --> 00:21:01,200 Good for her. 448 00:21:01,200 --> 00:21:05,600 When Michelle couldn't get a hold of Conrad that day, she became extremely worried. 449 00:21:05,600 --> 00:21:09,600 She knew of Conrad's past with his depression, and was afraid that he had in fact done something 450 00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:11,400 to himself. 451 00:21:11,400 --> 00:21:15,240 Michelle would bring up Conrad's absence to her classmates, who were all more than willing 452 00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:19,280 to be there for Michelle when they learned that something serious might have happened. 453 00:21:19,280 --> 00:21:23,320 Once again, Michelle would take great satisfaction in this attention. 454 00:21:23,320 --> 00:21:27,880 But you know, if I can just imagine it, it's not her being like, I can't get a hold of 455 00:21:27,880 --> 00:21:30,200 Conrad, I'm really worried that something's happened. 456 00:21:30,200 --> 00:21:32,520 It's probably like, he probably killed himself. 457 00:21:32,520 --> 00:21:34,440 Like, give me attention, he probably did something to himself. 458 00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:37,880 I don't know what I'm going to do without him, like, you know, all this stuff. 459 00:21:37,880 --> 00:21:43,360 I mean, it's the most exaggeratory of what, even though that was the case, he attempted 460 00:21:43,360 --> 00:21:44,360 to do that. 461 00:21:44,360 --> 00:21:48,200 I just feel like she wouldn't have been discreet in that. 462 00:21:48,200 --> 00:21:49,200 Right. 463 00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:53,520 Soon, she would be contacted by Conrad, who then confessed to her that he did in fact 464 00:21:53,520 --> 00:21:56,240 try to take his own life. 465 00:21:56,240 --> 00:22:00,760 Michelle was beside herself as she loved Conrad, and couldn't understand why he wouldn't 466 00:22:00,760 --> 00:22:06,040 come to her when he needed something like in his time of need. 467 00:22:06,040 --> 00:22:09,160 Which again is like, spinner of attention, why didn't you come to me? 468 00:22:09,160 --> 00:22:14,640 It's like, well, we've met once, you know. 469 00:22:14,640 --> 00:22:19,520 Conrad further explained that his deep depression in the hostile living situation brought on 470 00:22:19,520 --> 00:22:24,880 by his father and his mother's inability to get along, or it was rather. 471 00:22:24,880 --> 00:22:29,120 His parents would ultimately separate Conrad and his sisters spending on and off time with 472 00:22:29,120 --> 00:22:34,040 their father, but Conrad especially stayed close with his dad, visiting more often than 473 00:22:34,040 --> 00:22:35,240 his sisters. 474 00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:40,160 However, the arguing in Conrad Roy at Junior's home escalated once again with the police 475 00:22:40,160 --> 00:22:41,880 being called. 476 00:22:41,880 --> 00:22:47,600 This altercation resulted in markings and bruises that were left on Conrad, the third. 477 00:22:47,600 --> 00:22:52,720 These marks and bruises were caused by a physical altercation between Conrad and his father. 478 00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:56,560 Not much is known about the details regarding this incident, however, as it has never been 479 00:22:56,560 --> 00:22:59,000 released by the state of Massachusetts. 480 00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:03,240 All of their domestic violence reports are kept private in order to keep victims safe. 481 00:23:03,240 --> 00:23:04,240 That's awesome. 482 00:23:04,240 --> 00:23:05,240 It's really cool. 483 00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:10,920 Because that's usually like the most dangerous time to leave a domestic violence situation 484 00:23:10,920 --> 00:23:16,840 is when you break it off, and especially after you file legal stuff. 485 00:23:16,840 --> 00:23:22,000 But what we do know is that no one was convicted of any crime regarding this incident. 486 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:26,840 Michelle was once again by Conrad's side to hear his story of what transpired, and once 487 00:23:26,840 --> 00:23:30,800 again she was not shy with telling her classmate about his struggles. 488 00:23:30,800 --> 00:23:33,080 Like it's his fucking private information. 489 00:23:33,080 --> 00:23:34,080 Like shut up. 490 00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:38,160 No, but she's like, oh he's in this terrible situation with his family, and like his family 491 00:23:38,160 --> 00:23:40,280 hates him and you know all this stuff. 492 00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:42,440 I just wish I could be there. 493 00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:44,480 Making someone else's trauma your trauma. 494 00:23:44,480 --> 00:23:45,480 Yeah, exactly. 495 00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:46,600 That is like the worst. 496 00:23:46,600 --> 00:23:48,920 That's gross. 497 00:23:48,920 --> 00:23:53,880 Even so, Michelle encouraged Conrad to continue to get professional help, often telling Conrad 498 00:23:53,880 --> 00:23:58,560 that things would eventually get better. 499 00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:00,800 Conrad seemed to make somewhat of a change. 500 00:24:00,800 --> 00:24:05,320 He focused on graduating and his schooling and was able to bring his grades back up. 501 00:24:05,320 --> 00:24:08,160 He would graduate with a 3.88 GPA. 502 00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:09,160 Wow. 503 00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:10,160 It's like, it's pretty impressive. 504 00:24:10,160 --> 00:24:11,160 Yeah, it's almost perfect. 505 00:24:11,160 --> 00:24:12,160 That's what I have right now. 506 00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:13,160 I just say, ooh. 507 00:24:13,160 --> 00:24:17,960 I had the pepper that in there. 508 00:24:17,960 --> 00:24:23,360 And in early spring 2014, he was able to actually earn his captain's license and was looking 509 00:24:23,360 --> 00:24:25,720 forward to working with his father in the family business. 510 00:24:25,720 --> 00:24:26,720 Cool. 511 00:24:26,720 --> 00:24:28,840 So he learned how to like be a boat captain. 512 00:24:28,840 --> 00:24:29,840 That's awesome. 513 00:24:29,840 --> 00:24:31,240 So cool. 514 00:24:31,240 --> 00:24:35,200 His grandfather had gifted him a truck to get around, and he was also even accepted 515 00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:37,840 to Fitchburg State University come the fall. 516 00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:38,840 Fitchburg. 517 00:24:38,840 --> 00:24:40,340 Fitchburg. 518 00:24:40,340 --> 00:24:45,360 Even with all of these achievements, Conrad still could not get a hold of his depression. 519 00:24:45,360 --> 00:24:49,400 He began making video blogs and an effort to voice his feelings, and he used this as 520 00:24:49,400 --> 00:24:52,840 a type of therapy because he felt completely unjudged by doing so. 521 00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:53,840 Yeah. 522 00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:54,840 I mean, he's trying. 523 00:24:54,840 --> 00:24:55,840 Like he really is. 524 00:24:55,840 --> 00:24:56,840 He's reaching out. 525 00:24:56,840 --> 00:24:57,840 He's asking for help. 526 00:24:57,840 --> 00:24:58,840 Yeah. 527 00:24:58,840 --> 00:25:03,120 In these videos, Conrad says, quote, for me, social anxiety feels like it's overwhelming 528 00:25:03,120 --> 00:25:04,560 my life. 529 00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:09,520 The first thing I want to do is be more proactive in a social environment, try to contribute 530 00:25:09,520 --> 00:25:15,840 to the conversation as well, as I can just be more confident in myself. 531 00:25:15,840 --> 00:25:17,120 End quote. 532 00:25:17,120 --> 00:25:20,040 He goes on to say, quote, there's people that love me. 533 00:25:20,040 --> 00:25:24,400 I have a great mom, great dad for the most part, but I'm so depressed. 534 00:25:24,400 --> 00:25:27,880 I feel like I am differently wired from everyone else. 535 00:25:27,880 --> 00:25:30,040 Like there's something wrong with me. 536 00:25:30,040 --> 00:25:33,120 What I am doing is looking at myself so negatively. 537 00:25:33,120 --> 00:25:38,400 I look at myself so minuscule, little particle on the face of the earth, no good trash. 538 00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:44,280 I will never be successful, never have known life, never have kids, never, never learn, 539 00:25:44,280 --> 00:25:45,280 end quote. 540 00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:49,240 It's like you can tell that he's capable of being introspective. 541 00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:51,920 And he really is recognizing his feelings and he's expressing them. 542 00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:54,520 So why the fuck isn't he getting the help that he needs? 543 00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:56,640 Is he in therapy or is he just on medication? 544 00:25:56,640 --> 00:25:58,120 I think he's still in counseling. 545 00:25:58,120 --> 00:26:05,640 He's on medication still, but I just feel like in my opinion, I feel like no matter 546 00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:10,760 the amount of therapy or medication can fix what's going on in the home. 547 00:26:10,760 --> 00:26:11,760 Exactly. 548 00:26:11,760 --> 00:26:12,760 Yeah. 549 00:26:12,760 --> 00:26:16,360 And I think that the people that really needed to benefit from therapy is his mom and dad. 550 00:26:16,360 --> 00:26:17,360 The whole family. 551 00:26:17,360 --> 00:26:18,360 The whole family therapy. 552 00:26:18,360 --> 00:26:22,960 So I feel like he's really good at expressing all of these things on a platform like social 553 00:26:22,960 --> 00:26:27,640 media and maybe not out loud in therapy when he's there or in the home. 554 00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:28,640 It's true. 555 00:26:28,640 --> 00:26:29,640 And I think that's what it is. 556 00:26:29,640 --> 00:26:34,160 It makes sense that he has social anxiety, so he wouldn't always vocalize it to another 557 00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:35,480 human being. 558 00:26:35,480 --> 00:26:38,080 He would vocalize it through a video. 559 00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:41,880 And maybe that's why it's easy for him and Michelle to communicate is because he's texting. 560 00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:45,880 He's not making phone calls and having to be in person all the time. 561 00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:47,640 Yeah, that's true. 562 00:26:47,640 --> 00:26:53,640 He also says, however, seemingly in opposition, quote, I have a lot to offer someone. 563 00:26:53,640 --> 00:27:00,680 I'm introverted, nice and caring with some benefits and I'm a nice kid and quote. 564 00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:05,840 On July 12th, 2014, Conrad woke up and asked his mother and his sisters if they would like 565 00:27:05,840 --> 00:27:08,080 to go to the beach for the day. 566 00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:12,400 While walking along the beach with his mother, Conrad told her that he felt conflicted about 567 00:27:12,400 --> 00:27:14,200 what his future held. 568 00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:18,920 Did he go to college full time or should he work in the water full time with his dad? 569 00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:22,440 Lynn reassured her son that there's plenty of time to do both, that he didn't have to 570 00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:24,600 make the decision right away. 571 00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:29,160 Abruptly, Conrad walked over to the failing vehicle in order to use the phone. 572 00:27:29,160 --> 00:27:32,840 Lynn did find it odd that he sort of just walked away and stayed in the car for some 573 00:27:32,840 --> 00:27:33,840 time. 574 00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:37,680 But either way, Conrad would return and ask his mother if he could take the girls out 575 00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:39,240 for ice cream. 576 00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:42,080 The four went and came back home. 577 00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:45,440 Lynn remembers that she was doing the dishes in the kitchen while Conrad and her finished 578 00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:47,720 up their previous conversation. 579 00:27:47,720 --> 00:27:53,240 Eventually, Conrad went upstairs to his room, but after some time, Lynn heard Conrad come 580 00:27:53,240 --> 00:27:54,880 back downstairs. 581 00:27:54,880 --> 00:28:00,120 Conrad, rushing past her, quickly shouted goodbye to his mother but would ultimately leave without 582 00:28:00,120 --> 00:28:03,160 hugging or kissing his mom goodbye. 583 00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:06,160 The all these details are not a good sign. 584 00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:11,280 Hours later, Conrad Roy would be found on his truck in the store's parking lot. 585 00:28:11,280 --> 00:28:15,560 He had placed a generator in his truck and left it running, causing him to die by carbon 586 00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:17,800 monoxide poisoning. 587 00:28:17,800 --> 00:28:22,440 Later that night, Lynn and Conrad Jr. were informed that Conrad had in fact taken his 588 00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:24,920 own life. 589 00:28:24,920 --> 00:28:27,960 Conrad's funeral was held just a week later. 590 00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:32,000 Michelle would attend Conrad's service, and this would be one of the only times Lynn 591 00:28:32,000 --> 00:28:35,160 Roy would see Michelle in person. 592 00:28:35,160 --> 00:28:40,920 Lynn would find it very odd that Michelle talked so deeply about Conrad, as Lynn rarely 593 00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:44,360 heard Conrad ever talk about Michelle. 594 00:28:44,360 --> 00:28:49,040 Michelle would also break the news to her classmates that Conrad had in fact passed 595 00:28:49,040 --> 00:28:50,680 away. 596 00:28:50,680 --> 00:28:55,800 This too yielded a lot of attention from Michelle's classmates. 597 00:28:55,800 --> 00:28:59,680 Months would go by, and the Roy family was still very much healing from the tragedy of 598 00:28:59,680 --> 00:29:04,640 losing their son, brother, grandchild, and friend Conrad. 599 00:29:04,640 --> 00:29:09,720 Investigators however, were hard at work uncovering disturbing messages that were found on Conrad's 600 00:29:09,720 --> 00:29:13,240 phone, which was with him at the scene. 601 00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:16,720 Text messages were exchanged between Michelle and Conrad. 602 00:29:16,720 --> 00:29:19,360 Do you want to be Conrad? 603 00:29:19,360 --> 00:29:20,360 Sure. 604 00:29:20,360 --> 00:29:21,360 Okay. 605 00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:23,360 Me, Michelle. 606 00:29:23,360 --> 00:29:27,640 Quote, I think your parents know you're in a really bad place. 607 00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:33,160 I'm not saying they want you to do it, but I honestly feel like they can accept it. 608 00:29:33,160 --> 00:29:35,120 They know there's nothing they can do. 609 00:29:35,120 --> 00:29:36,480 They've tried helping. 610 00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:41,200 Everyone's tried, but there is a point that comes where there isn't anything anyone can 611 00:29:41,200 --> 00:29:43,920 do to save you, not even yourself. 612 00:29:43,920 --> 00:29:47,800 And you've hit that point, and I think your parents know you've hit that point. 613 00:29:47,800 --> 00:29:52,040 You said your mom saw a suicide thing on your computer and she didn't say anything. 614 00:29:52,040 --> 00:29:56,120 I think she knows it's on your mind and she's prepared for it. 615 00:29:56,120 --> 00:29:59,920 Everyone will be sad for a while, but they will get over it and move on. 616 00:29:59,920 --> 00:30:01,280 They won't be in depression. 617 00:30:01,280 --> 00:30:02,920 I won't let that happen. 618 00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:07,040 They know how sad you are and they know that you are doing this to be happy, and I think 619 00:30:07,040 --> 00:30:09,040 they will understand and accept it. 620 00:30:09,040 --> 00:30:12,680 They will always carry you in their hearts. 621 00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:13,680 Your turn. 622 00:30:13,680 --> 00:30:16,320 Aw, thank you, Michelle. 623 00:30:16,320 --> 00:30:20,160 They will move on for you because they know that's what you would have wanted. 624 00:30:20,160 --> 00:30:24,320 They know you wouldn't want them to be sad and depressed and be angry and guilty. 625 00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:28,800 They know that you want them to live their lives and be happy, so they will for you. 626 00:30:28,800 --> 00:30:29,800 You're right. 627 00:30:29,800 --> 00:30:35,280 You have to stop thinking about this and just do it because overturning always kills overthinking. 628 00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:37,480 Yeah, it does. 629 00:30:37,480 --> 00:30:40,320 I've been thinking about it for too long. 630 00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:42,920 Always smile and yeah, you have to just do it. 631 00:30:42,920 --> 00:30:44,480 You have everything you need. 632 00:30:44,480 --> 00:30:45,880 There's no way you can fail. 633 00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:46,880 Tonight's the night. 634 00:30:46,880 --> 00:30:49,000 It's now or never. 635 00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:51,280 This is so infuriating. 636 00:30:51,280 --> 00:30:55,480 Every time I hear it, I just get more and more fucking pissed off. 637 00:30:55,480 --> 00:30:57,920 Like, fuck you. 638 00:30:57,920 --> 00:30:59,120 Smile. 639 00:30:59,120 --> 00:31:00,120 Just remember to smile. 640 00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:01,120 I'll take care of your family. 641 00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:02,120 I'll take care of your family. 642 00:31:02,120 --> 00:31:04,360 Like, that was really loud and noise, sorry. 643 00:31:04,360 --> 00:31:05,760 Like what the fuck? 644 00:31:05,760 --> 00:31:06,760 Yeah. 645 00:31:06,760 --> 00:31:10,600 Fucking, she wanted the attention for him doing that. 646 00:31:10,600 --> 00:31:15,920 Furthermore, Michelle gave Conrad step-by-step instructions on how to kill himself, saying 647 00:31:15,920 --> 00:31:22,400 quote, yeah, it will work if you emit 2,300 ppm of it or five to 10 minutes, you will 648 00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:24,320 die within half an hour. 649 00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:26,240 You lose consciousness with no pain. 650 00:31:26,240 --> 00:31:28,040 You just fall asleep and die. 651 00:31:28,040 --> 00:31:31,320 You can also just take a hose and run that from the exhaust pipe to the rear window to 652 00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:35,320 your car and seal it with duct tape and shirts so it can't escape. 653 00:31:35,320 --> 00:31:39,000 You will die within like 20 to 30 minutes, all pain free. 654 00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:40,680 So she's over here fucking googling shit. 655 00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:42,680 She's telling him how to do it. 656 00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:44,520 That is so fucking gross. 657 00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:49,440 Like, how could you think about that? 658 00:31:49,440 --> 00:31:51,560 Then type it out and then hit send. 659 00:31:51,560 --> 00:31:54,400 Like, I don't understand. 660 00:31:54,400 --> 00:31:58,960 Police began to look into potential criminal charges against Michelle, but was it really 661 00:31:58,960 --> 00:32:01,480 illegal to tell someone to commit suicide? 662 00:32:01,480 --> 00:32:06,360 No, according to investigators, however, she would still be indicted on counts of involuntary 663 00:32:06,360 --> 00:32:08,480 manslaughter. 664 00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:13,120 In 2015, Michelle would see a jury in juvenile court that agreed that Michelle would be charged 665 00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:18,720 with quote, wantingly and recklessly in quote, assisting a suicide. 666 00:32:18,720 --> 00:32:22,160 She was just 17 at the time of her arraignment. 667 00:32:22,160 --> 00:32:26,520 Michelle would waive her right to a jury and would therefore be sentenced by a judge. 668 00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:30,360 During trial, the defense argued that Michelle and Conrad's texts were protected under the 669 00:32:30,360 --> 00:32:35,560 First Amendment and that Conrad had a history of attempted suicides, not making her responsible 670 00:32:35,560 --> 00:32:36,880 for Conrad's death. 671 00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:37,880 Shut up. 672 00:32:37,880 --> 00:32:42,080 However, the prosecution would reveal more incriminating texts between Michelle and another 673 00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:44,880 one of her friends after Conrad's death. 674 00:32:44,880 --> 00:32:49,520 Quote, his death was my fault, like honestly I could have stopped him. 675 00:32:49,520 --> 00:32:53,640 I was on the phone with him and he got out of the car because it was working and he got 676 00:32:53,640 --> 00:32:57,920 scared and I fucking told him to get back in, end quote. 677 00:32:57,920 --> 00:33:05,240 And later, quote, I heard him die on the phone, end quote. 678 00:33:05,240 --> 00:33:08,880 Like it doesn't get more fucking cut and dry than that. 679 00:33:08,880 --> 00:33:12,080 I'm so mad. 680 00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:14,240 Oh my god. 681 00:33:14,240 --> 00:33:17,120 Like you, she literally said, it's my fault. 682 00:33:17,120 --> 00:33:18,120 Yeah. 683 00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:22,200 I got in the car and I told him to fucking get back in. 684 00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:24,880 If, sorry, I'll let you finish and then I'll give you my thoughts. 685 00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:25,880 No, it's okay. 686 00:33:25,880 --> 00:33:27,000 Go ahead. 687 00:33:27,000 --> 00:33:34,920 It's infuriating because I feel like if Conrad had met a decent woman and decided to start 688 00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:41,160 dating a decent person, he wouldn't have ever done that because he was coaxed by someone 689 00:33:41,160 --> 00:33:43,560 that was also mentally ill. 690 00:33:43,560 --> 00:33:46,200 And he, like I've seen a lot of the text messages. 691 00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:50,240 A lot of it suggests that he doesn't want to go through with it and it's her like inching 692 00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:53,200 him and inching him and pressuring him and pressuring him. 693 00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:58,760 And like he tries to back out so many times and she says, no, like if you don't do it now, 694 00:33:58,760 --> 00:33:59,760 you're never going to do it. 695 00:33:59,760 --> 00:34:02,080 Like all this disgusting shit. 696 00:34:02,080 --> 00:34:05,680 When it could have been a young girl that was like, why would you think that that would 697 00:34:05,680 --> 00:34:06,680 be the answer? 698 00:34:06,680 --> 00:34:08,560 Like I'll help you through this blah, blah, blah. 699 00:34:08,560 --> 00:34:11,480 And I think that he would have like thrived in that situation. 700 00:34:11,480 --> 00:34:12,480 I think so too. 701 00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:17,160 And it's like, what, that makes me question like what had to happen for him to meet this 702 00:34:17,160 --> 00:34:20,920 girl on vacation and then this, it caused his death, you know, like that's, ugh. 703 00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:26,400 And that's the thing is like when these things go to court, it is if this person had not 704 00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:28,400 met this person, would they be alive? 705 00:34:28,400 --> 00:34:29,400 Exactly. 706 00:34:29,400 --> 00:34:30,400 Yes. 707 00:34:30,400 --> 00:34:36,520 She's responsible because had they never met, he would not have, I can't say that. 708 00:34:36,520 --> 00:34:37,520 Okay. 709 00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:38,520 We know that. 710 00:34:38,520 --> 00:34:39,520 Yeah. 711 00:34:39,520 --> 00:34:41,640 Just given our personal experience, we know that. 712 00:34:41,640 --> 00:34:44,760 But it certainly wouldn't have happened this way. 713 00:34:44,760 --> 00:34:45,760 Yeah. 714 00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:51,080 There would have been a chance that he could have survived and done, you know, gotten more 715 00:34:51,080 --> 00:34:52,080 help. 716 00:34:52,080 --> 00:34:57,880 But the fact that literally he has a voice in his head every day telling him to do it. 717 00:34:57,880 --> 00:34:58,880 Every day. 718 00:34:58,880 --> 00:35:01,120 God, that's disgusting. 719 00:35:01,120 --> 00:35:05,840 She made no attempt whatsoever to contact for help for Conrad even after this, showing 720 00:35:05,840 --> 00:35:09,000 that she had no intention of stopping what had occurred. 721 00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:10,160 That's another thing too. 722 00:35:10,160 --> 00:35:13,720 It's like she said that she heard the moment that he died. 723 00:35:13,720 --> 00:35:17,960 How long did she fucking sit on the phone with him after that? 724 00:35:17,960 --> 00:35:20,680 Because I'm sure she didn't immediately just fucking hang up. 725 00:35:20,680 --> 00:35:21,680 No. 726 00:35:21,680 --> 00:35:24,520 She probably just sat with the fucking open line for who knows how long. 727 00:35:24,520 --> 00:35:25,520 Yeah. 728 00:35:25,520 --> 00:35:26,680 Like that's fucking gross. 729 00:35:26,680 --> 00:35:28,640 That's, yeah, that's fucking disgusting. 730 00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:32,440 And I'm sure there's, I would think that that's one of the things that they probably 731 00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:34,040 kept in wraps in court. 732 00:35:34,040 --> 00:35:35,040 I'm sure. 733 00:35:35,040 --> 00:35:39,280 And I think that it was in my mind probably her wanting to make sure that he was actually 734 00:35:39,280 --> 00:35:42,640 dead instead of just hanging up when she thinks that he dies. 735 00:35:42,640 --> 00:35:47,960 She's probably saying his name, asking him questions, waiting for him to respond. 736 00:35:47,960 --> 00:35:49,920 And when he didn't even after so long. 737 00:35:49,920 --> 00:35:51,600 She texts him too when they get off the phone. 738 00:35:51,600 --> 00:35:53,000 She's like, are you still there? 739 00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:54,000 And like, what nothing? 740 00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:55,000 Yeah. 741 00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:57,840 She just wanted to make sure. 742 00:35:57,840 --> 00:36:03,160 Even after confessing this to friends, she pushed the idea that Conrad had raped or attempted 743 00:36:03,160 --> 00:36:04,960 to rape her at some point. 744 00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:08,560 And that's why there was encouragement there. 745 00:36:08,560 --> 00:36:09,560 I gotta go. 746 00:36:09,560 --> 00:36:10,560 I'm outta here. 747 00:36:10,560 --> 00:36:11,560 See you later. 748 00:36:11,560 --> 00:36:13,320 Love you, bye. 749 00:36:13,320 --> 00:36:18,160 The prosecution said this was how powerful Michelle's thirst for attention was that she 750 00:36:18,160 --> 00:36:22,800 would talk her own boyfriend into killing himself, all for the sympathy of others. 751 00:36:22,800 --> 00:36:26,120 Not only that, but drag his name through the fucking mud. 752 00:36:26,120 --> 00:36:27,200 Seriously. 753 00:36:27,200 --> 00:36:32,080 In June of 2017, Michelle Carter would be found guilty of an voluntary manslaughter for 754 00:36:32,080 --> 00:36:35,720 her failure to act appropriately in Conrad's death. 755 00:36:35,720 --> 00:36:37,000 Which we know is a homicide. 756 00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:40,000 If you listen to the homicide of the murder. 757 00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:41,400 Still a homicide. 758 00:36:41,400 --> 00:36:47,240 Before her sentencing trial in According to the Sun paper, Michelle's parents pleaded 759 00:36:47,240 --> 00:36:50,840 with the court saying, quote, I prayed to God you will take into consideration that 760 00:36:50,840 --> 00:36:55,960 Michelle was an extremely troubled, vulnerable teenager in an extremely difficult situation 761 00:36:55,960 --> 00:36:57,960 and made a tragic mistake. 762 00:36:57,960 --> 00:37:03,120 I am 100% sure that she is only trying to do what in her mind was right for Conrad. 763 00:37:03,120 --> 00:37:04,120 End quote. 764 00:37:04,120 --> 00:37:08,040 Go ahead and go through those text messages and pull out every single time she said the 765 00:37:08,040 --> 00:37:11,200 words do it or don't give up. 766 00:37:11,200 --> 00:37:14,000 Some are thinking all those things will let him do it. 767 00:37:14,000 --> 00:37:16,280 I guarantee you it's in the hundreds. 768 00:37:16,280 --> 00:37:19,240 And then we'll see that she really just, she's made a mistake. 769 00:37:19,240 --> 00:37:22,280 She just made a tragic mistake. 770 00:37:22,280 --> 00:37:24,240 She was doing what was right for Conrad. 771 00:37:24,240 --> 00:37:25,240 Yeah, yeah, totally. 772 00:37:25,240 --> 00:37:29,200 By convincing him to do something that he really didn't want to do. 773 00:37:29,200 --> 00:37:32,360 Michelle would be sentenced to two and a half years, but her sentence would be reduced 774 00:37:32,360 --> 00:37:36,040 to just 15 months. 775 00:37:36,040 --> 00:37:38,120 Eventually this conviction was held up by the Supreme Court. 776 00:37:38,120 --> 00:37:39,920 They took it all the way to the Supreme Court. 777 00:37:39,920 --> 00:37:41,600 The Supreme Court was like, hell no. 778 00:37:41,600 --> 00:37:45,000 It's a very interesting and unique set of circumstances. 779 00:37:45,000 --> 00:37:46,520 Especially because she's 17. 780 00:37:46,520 --> 00:37:47,520 Yeah. 781 00:37:47,520 --> 00:37:52,160 Lynn Roy said about this conviction, quote, I was surprised that she even got 11 months. 782 00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:53,320 We had to be the voice for him. 783 00:37:53,320 --> 00:37:56,440 So yes, I was satisfied that she was convicted. 784 00:37:56,440 --> 00:38:00,760 I wanted to make a point that his life mattered and that was the most important thing to me. 785 00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:05,760 I wish I knew how he felt when she was messaging him that whole month before Conrad died. 786 00:38:05,760 --> 00:38:07,800 I wish I knew what he was thinking. 787 00:38:07,800 --> 00:38:09,240 Was she really his friend? 788 00:38:09,240 --> 00:38:10,920 Did she really care about him? 789 00:38:10,920 --> 00:38:14,600 I mean, for someone to do what she did, how could he think that she cared? 790 00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:16,720 End quote. 791 00:38:16,720 --> 00:38:21,120 Lynn Roy would file a civil suit against Michelle Carter for the wrongful death of Conrad. 792 00:38:21,120 --> 00:38:25,400 And the $4.2 million settlement was settled out of court. 793 00:38:25,400 --> 00:38:29,960 Michelle Carter participated in several educational programs while in prison. 794 00:38:29,960 --> 00:38:34,280 She attended mental health meetings and even created her own blogs about mental health, 795 00:38:34,280 --> 00:38:38,600 her struggles, and her journey to get healthy mentally and physically. 796 00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:44,880 She was released in January 2020 and has since been out of the public eye. 797 00:38:44,880 --> 00:38:49,360 It is a part of an ongoing sentence that she will have zero contact with the Roy family, 798 00:38:49,360 --> 00:38:51,840 like duh. 799 00:38:51,840 --> 00:38:55,880 Since 2019, Lynn Roy and her husband have fought to get a law passed in which there 800 00:38:55,880 --> 00:39:00,960 would be a mandatory five-year sentence for anyone who, quote, intentionally coerces or 801 00:39:00,960 --> 00:39:06,880 encourages another individual to die by suicide or attempt to die by suicide by using physical 802 00:39:06,880 --> 00:39:12,080 acts or mental coercion that manipulates a person's fears, affections, or sympathies. 803 00:39:12,080 --> 00:39:13,080 End quote. 804 00:39:13,080 --> 00:39:14,880 I agree. 805 00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:18,760 Although that has been in review for many times, Lynn is still fighting for this new 806 00:39:18,760 --> 00:39:20,480 law to be passed. 807 00:39:20,480 --> 00:39:25,840 She said, quote, with this tragedy, my son would want to help other people, other families, 808 00:39:25,840 --> 00:39:31,120 and if we get the law passed, when we do, that's going to be a win for me and for him. 809 00:39:31,120 --> 00:39:32,400 End quote. 810 00:39:32,400 --> 00:39:35,840 If passed, this new law would be referred to as Conrad's law. 811 00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:37,840 Oh my gosh. 812 00:39:37,840 --> 00:39:41,640 It's heavy for the entire time. 813 00:39:41,640 --> 00:39:44,240 Every time I hear that case, I just get mad. 814 00:39:44,240 --> 00:39:45,240 It's just infuriating. 815 00:39:45,240 --> 00:39:46,800 I truly do, though. 816 00:39:46,800 --> 00:39:51,680 I truly hope Michelle got the help that she needed and she is now better for it. 817 00:39:51,680 --> 00:39:57,720 I truly do because I would hate for this to happen again when she got out early and all 818 00:39:57,720 --> 00:39:59,120 this stuff. 819 00:39:59,120 --> 00:40:04,000 She also, I mean, not another coercibility with whatever she was experiencing was also 820 00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:05,000 that ED. 821 00:40:05,000 --> 00:40:07,240 She had an eating disorder. 822 00:40:07,240 --> 00:40:12,240 There was disorders that were going around and that's- 823 00:40:12,240 --> 00:40:13,240 The ptylopram. 824 00:40:13,240 --> 00:40:14,240 Ptylopram. 825 00:40:14,240 --> 00:40:15,240 The ptylopram. 826 00:40:15,240 --> 00:40:22,080 They said that especially under age 24 that it can cause suicidal thoughts. 827 00:40:22,080 --> 00:40:23,080 Yep. 828 00:40:23,080 --> 00:40:24,080 Yeah, no. 829 00:40:24,080 --> 00:40:27,800 I think that there's a lot of factors that went into that and it's hard because like 830 00:40:27,800 --> 00:40:28,800 I said, I get mad. 831 00:40:28,800 --> 00:40:33,080 It's really easy to be like, fuck this or whatever, but yeah, you're right. 832 00:40:33,080 --> 00:40:34,080 She was just a kid. 833 00:40:34,080 --> 00:40:42,360 She was on medication that's known to cause mental manipulation and mental emotional distress. 834 00:40:42,360 --> 00:40:43,360 I don't know. 835 00:40:43,360 --> 00:40:44,920 It's a very hard case. 836 00:40:44,920 --> 00:40:48,960 That being said, if you or someone you know is struggling with depression or suicidal thoughts, 837 00:40:48,960 --> 00:40:50,680 remember that you are not alone. 838 00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:55,160 You can always reach out to the National Suicide Lifeline at 988 for information and resources 839 00:40:55,160 --> 00:40:56,840 in your local area. 840 00:40:56,840 --> 00:41:02,200 And of course, if you or someone you know is experiencing an emergency, always dial 911 841 00:41:02,200 --> 00:41:05,320 999 or your local emergency service number. 842 00:41:05,320 --> 00:41:06,320 Absolutely. 843 00:41:06,320 --> 00:41:07,320 Okay. 844 00:41:07,320 --> 00:41:08,840 Heavy, heavy, heavy. 845 00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:13,480 That was heavy, but I don't want to say I'm glad you covered it, but- 846 00:41:13,480 --> 00:41:14,480 It's needed to be covered. 847 00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:20,600 I find it very interesting that it's not just about Michelle Carter and her difficulties 848 00:41:20,600 --> 00:41:23,640 with mental disorders, but Conrad Roy's too. 849 00:41:23,640 --> 00:41:24,640 Absolutely. 850 00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:31,320 And you know, definitely, especially when you're in that, I can see how he might have 851 00:41:31,320 --> 00:41:34,520 been like, someone knows my struggle. 852 00:41:34,520 --> 00:41:39,000 Someone understands me to my depth with this struggle because he felt like he could actually 853 00:41:39,000 --> 00:41:40,480 talk to her. 854 00:41:40,480 --> 00:41:43,040 Because again, he's behind a phone screen. 855 00:41:43,040 --> 00:41:45,840 And unfortunately, he confided in the wrong person. 856 00:41:45,840 --> 00:41:46,840 I think so too. 857 00:41:46,840 --> 00:41:47,840 You know? 858 00:41:47,840 --> 00:41:49,840 Ugh, I'm so sad. 859 00:41:49,840 --> 00:41:50,840 Yeah. 860 00:41:50,840 --> 00:41:51,840 I know. 861 00:41:51,840 --> 00:41:52,840 Do you have anything else? 862 00:41:52,840 --> 00:41:53,840 That's it. 863 00:41:53,840 --> 00:41:54,840 Okay, I think we're going to end here. 864 00:41:54,840 --> 00:41:56,720 I know, I need a shower. 865 00:41:56,720 --> 00:42:00,920 We will see you guys next week with another Mental Breakdown and be on the lookout this 866 00:42:00,920 --> 00:42:03,880 Saturday for a special DAK Live. 867 00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:05,360 See you tomorrow for the live. 868 00:42:05,360 --> 00:42:06,360 Friday for the live. 869 00:42:06,360 --> 00:42:07,360 No, Saturday. 870 00:42:07,360 --> 00:42:08,360 Merch Drop Live. 871 00:42:08,360 --> 00:42:09,360 Oh, the Merch Drop Live. 872 00:42:09,360 --> 00:42:10,360 Yes. 873 00:42:10,360 --> 00:42:13,360 And then DAK Live episode on Saturday. 874 00:42:13,360 --> 00:42:14,880 Will you do me a favor? 875 00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:15,880 Sure. 876 00:42:15,880 --> 00:42:17,720 For this episode, will you put a picture of her really ridiculous eyebrows? 877 00:42:17,720 --> 00:42:18,720 I will. 878 00:42:18,720 --> 00:42:19,720 Thank you. 879 00:42:19,720 --> 00:42:20,720 Okay. 880 00:42:20,720 --> 00:42:21,720 Love you. 881 00:42:21,720 --> 00:42:22,720 Bye. 882 00:42:22,720 --> 00:42:29,760 Bright Cellars is a monthly wine club that matches you to delicious wines tailored completely 883 00:42:29,760 --> 00:42:31,480 to your tastes. 884 00:42:31,480 --> 00:42:36,400 Take their personalized seven-question quiz and be paired with wines you are sure to love. 885 00:42:36,400 --> 00:42:40,600 You can even improve your matches by rating each wine after you try them. 886 00:42:40,600 --> 00:42:44,960 Bright Cellars offers a unique tasting experience as each bottle comes with tasting notes and 887 00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:46,640 pairing suggestions. 888 00:42:46,640 --> 00:42:49,240 It's like having your very own sommelier at home. 889 00:42:49,240 --> 00:42:54,160 And their expert wine concierge will customize your subscription to fit any lifestyle. 890 00:42:54,160 --> 00:43:08,200 Click the link in the show notes for an exclusive offer from Bright Cellars today.