Hello!
Welcome back to another episode of Diagnosing a Killer, the mental breakdown.
I'm Kenna.
I'm Koel.
Oh, I feel like I always say, and I'm Kenna.
So saying, I'm Kenna first sounds weird.
And I'm Koel.
And I'm...
And I'm Kenna.
Always gonna just come back.
It's me, Kenna.
How's it going?
Pretty good.
Good.
I'm really excited.
We went to a Boba tea place earlier, and so that's what I'm drinking.
I'm drinking Mango Boba with the little Explody Bobas, not the tapioca ones.
Oh, no.
I don't...
Oh, I know what you're saying.
They're like little bursts of flavor.
They're so good.
They used to have those at Orange Leaf, the self-serve frozen yogurt place, and you could pick all your toppings.
They had those little balls of juice.
They are.
What is up with frozen yogurt?
I don't think I've ever had frozen yogurt because it sounds so gross.
It's delicious.
It tastes just like ice cream, actually.
It does?
Yeah.
I think it's just smoother.
It's like more crystal-y.
Like ice cream is more creamy and frozen yogurt is more like a sherbet kind of.
A sherbet?
It's sherbet.
Sherbet.
Yes.
Not sorbet.
No, it's...
Yeah, sorbet is what I meant, but it's pronounced sherbet.
There is no R at the end of that word.
Look it up.
Sorbet.
Yes, like a sorbet.
Not sor-bert.
No, sherbet and sorbet are two different things.
Sorbet and sherbet.
Look it up.
I'm telling you.
Sherbet?
Yes, it's sherbet.
Sherbet.
Yes.
Sherbet.
I'm telling you, everyone needs to comment what they think it is.
Anyway, yeah, so those little ball of things.
I was going to say tapioca.
I hate Boba because I do not like tapioca.
I had to be in the mood for the tapioca, like the pearls.
No, yeah, the texture thing for me.
Yeah, but the juice is good.
Do you want to try?
No.
You sure?
I'm good.
Okay.
D-d-wo-t.
You were right there.
Oh my goodness.
Before we start, would you like to give everyone our handles on social media in case this
is their first time listening?
Absolutely, welcome.
You can catch us on social media at diagnosing a killer other than ex formerly known as Twitter,
which is at killer diagnosis.
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And what else?
We have a cash app, a PayPal, a Venmo.
I think that's it.
I think you did great.
Yeah, dollar donations, y'all.
Do it.
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It's my birthday weekend, so come and hang out with us.
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Yep.
Woo.
Well, it is my mental breakdown today, but before we get started, I do want to quickly
share a cool message we got from one of our loyal listeners regarding the Joseph Edward
Duncan case.
At the end of the episode, I'm not sure if you remember, but we had talked about how
he was afraid to die of natural causes and then he ultimately died of cancer.
And I was like, well, would that be considered natural causes?
I'm not exactly sure.
So she says, hi friends.
I know we don't know each other, but I definitely consider y'all a friend because listening
to y'all gives me comfort, especially in hard days like today.
I just listened to the last episode and I wanted to share something that y'all didn't
feel too concrete over.
When Joseph said that he didn't want to die from natural causes and y'all mentioned that
when he died from cancer, I lost my mom to cancer and her death certificate says that
the cause is natural causes.
So even if that's not what he meant and assuming it would be the same countrywide, his death
certificate should stay natural causes and that gives me such joy.
I don't think there's a crime worse in my eyes than a crime done to children.
He's truly a sick man.
As usual, y'all did great.
I look forward to listening every week.
Thanks for your input, listener.
Yes, we love hearing from you guys.
It makes our day that much brighter and it also gives us a lot of joy to know that we
bring you guys so much joy.
So thanks for listening.
And if it's your first time here, hello.
Hello.
Welcome.
Okay, are you ready to get into this one?
I am.
I'm excited to hear what your topic is.
This is a little bit of a different Mindy Breakie, but I decided that it might be kind
of interesting to talk about because we don't really have many times where we've broken
this down.
So I decided to just make it a whole topic.
Today we are going to be talking about homicide charges and types of killing.
Okay.
So types of homicide charges, what you can be charged with, and different, I guess, specifics
when it comes to exactly what you would be charged with if you did this and that and
the other.
It's going to be kind of just an outline of that.
Of course, there's always mitigating circumstances to your case.
For sure.
Yeah, I'm not going to talk about any specific case that was like, oh, and he did this, but
his left finger was cut off and not the right one.
It's a different chart.
Content warning, this episode contains descriptions of killing, explanations of different types
of murder, and child violence.
If this is not for you, we encourage you to find another one of our episodes.
Remember, your mental health is very important to us and we love you.
Love you.
Bye.
Okay, so what are the types of charges and types of killing?
Here we go.
So what is homicide?
Homicide is an act in which a person causes the death of another person.
A homicide requires only a volatile act or a mission that causes the death of another.
So this pretty much means that in order to commit a homicide, the perpetrator either has
to knowingly commit the act or change circumstances that cause the act to happen.
This being the case, the act of homicide may result from accidental, reckless, or negligent
acts, even if there is no intent to cause harm.
Like a DUI or something?
Yes, exactly.
Depending on the circumstances of the death, homicide is put into many different categories.
These types of homicides are often treated differently in many cultures, as some will
consider them crimes and others will not.
So the first type of homicide we're going to talk about is plain old murder.
Plain old murder, just some vanilla murder.
Yeah, just some casual shit.
Just some casual murder.
Murder is the most serious crime that can be charged following a homicide, and there
are different types of murder one can be charged with.
The sentences following a murder conviction may be life imprisonment or even capital punishment
based on the circumstances of the murder.
So capital punishment could be death or life imprisonment or...?
So yeah, in certain states, capital punishment is just the death sentence.
Certain states don't have that, so it would be life.
Okay.
Yes.
In 2019, a study by the United Nations Office on Drug and Crime reported that nearly 464,000
people around the world were killed in homicides.
What?
In 2017, in the year 2017 only.
But just around the world.
But still.
But still, almost one year.
One half a million people in one year.
That's incredible.
Yeah.
So the first type of murder that one can be charged with is aptly named first degree murder.
This murder is premeditated, unlawful, and intentional.
Premeditation requires that the perpetrator either planned the murder before it was committed
or were lying in wait for the victim before attacking.
Isn't that...I think I've also heard that too.
It's a first degree murder while lying in wait.
Yes.
Like it's an added charge.
It's creepy.
Ooh.
So the other type of murder one can be charged with is second degree murder.
This is the act of intentionally and unlawfully killing another person without premeditation.
Hmm.
Although the act of killing is the same in first and second degree murder, the mental
state of the person doing the killing at the time of the crime is said to be different.
That's interesting that we, like as a judicial system, would take that into account.
For sure.
Because I feel like it's, I mean, just like it says here, it's worse if you plan it for
weeks and then you go do it.
Yeah.
Rather than you get mad and there's a knife on the counter and you stab someone and they
die.
Right.
Yeah.
So in the case of the most common distinctions, a homicide that occurs during the commission
of a dangerous crime may be labeled as murder regardless of the perpetrator's intent to
commit murder.
This is known as the felony murder rule.
So essentially like we're going to go buy some drugs and you get killed over it.
You can get charged with murder if you intentionally went to do the crime.
Right.
Yeah.
So if, okay, yeah, like a drug deal gone wrong, but if you're the driver, you can get
charged with your partner's death.
Exactly.
So the felony murder rule essentially states that if someone dies as a result of a different
felony crime, the person who commissioned that crime can be charged with murder.
Oh, just like what I said, but more.
The drug killer.
Yeah, specific.
Yeah.
Lastly, another type of murder one can be charged with is manslaughter.
Manslaughter is a form of homicide in which the person that commits the homicide either
does not intend to kill the victim or kills the victim as a result of circumstances that
would cause a reasonable person to become emotionally or mentally disturbed to the point of potentially
losing control of their actions.
Good job.
Take a breath.
Whoa.
It was like the longest sentence in the world.
So like vehicular manslaughter we've heard that one before that's like you strike someone
with your car, but you know, it was not necessarily malintended.
Yes.
And yeah, you can be, you can still be charged because you were what, maybe not paying attention.
Definitely.
So the distinction between murder and manslaughter is said to have first been made by ancient
Athenian lawmaker Draco in the 7th century BC.
Whoa.
And the penalty for manslaughter is usually last in that of murder.
But yeah, that's how long ago did they make that distinction?
Yeah.
Well, you didn't mean to.
So we're not going to kill you.
You didn't mean to.
Yeah.
You were, this is a crime of the passion.
Yeah.
Well, that would be second degree.
That would be second degree.
But this is when it was just like if someone died and you were responsible, you were a
murderer, it didn't matter what.
That's it.
This guy invented manslaughter.
Invented.
So there are actually two broad categories of manslaughter.
The first one is voluntary manslaughter.
This is the intentional, unpremeditated killing of another person as the result of a disturbed
state of mind or heat of passion.
So kind of like a passion, a killing of passion, but it's kind of different when it comes into
it.
So you think that, where do you think Mun Chow's and Biproxy would fit in there?
I think that would...
Like if you harmed your child to death, but you didn't really necessarily intend to kill
them.
I think that would fall into a defense rather than a charge.
Like I feel like you would have to claim like insanity or something.
I see.
Yeah.
I don't know what they would be charged with though.
Yeah, you would have to claim like some type of mental disorder.
Yeah.
So the second category is aptly named involuntary manslaughter.
This is the unintentional killing of another person through an act of recklessness that
shows indifference to the lives and safety of others or an act of negligence that could
be reasonably foreseen to result in death.
So that reminds me of that Paul Murdoch, the Alec Murdoch's son in the Bodhi accident.
Absolutely, and that girl died.
Yes, absolutely.
Same kind of thing if it's like you're planning a gun and you pull the trigger and someone
dies.
You're being negligent because you should have unloaded it right if you were cleaning
it, something like that.
Well now there's a lot of parents being charged for not safely keeping their guns away from
their kids and their kids fucking around with these guns and killing another neighborhood
kid.
Yeah.
And the dads are now, and the moms are being charged with manslaughter because they, you
know, I mean some of them have been charged for murder.
Yeah, I've even heard cases of the moms being charged or the parents being charged when they
neglected to report that their kid was making threats and they go shoot their school out.
You know, it's awful.
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The act that results in deaths may be intentional, such as pushing somebody in anger, but their
deaths like them falling and hitting their head is not.
Oh my gosh, that teacher today.
Do you hear about that?
No.
Brandeis High School?
Well, the student won't be charged because they have some kind of cognitive deficiency.
But he's a 73-year-old educator that got knocked over and he hit his head and that was on the
7th and he just passed away.
Oh my god, that's awful.
But it's like you can't charge someone for that, right?
I mean, this kid has, like I said, a cognitive deficiency of some kind that they're not responsible
for it.
And in certain situations, just like that, I'm meaning to push you but I'm not meaning
to kill you.
Oh my gosh, that happened at that bar.
Remember?
No.
But that's really scary.
It is scary.
I'm like, it's scary.
That's so scary.
That's bad.
So in some jurisdictions, there is a third category of constructive manslaughter in which
a person may be charged with causing death without intention but as a result of violating
an important safety law or regulation.
I have never heard of this.
Yeah, me either.
Would this be like falling off a ladder or something?
Exactly.
If you're making it constructive, like literally, if you're at a construction site and you
don't make your guys wear hard heads and then someone dies.
You know what I mean?
You're making your guys wear hard hats.
Hard hats.
And you didn't...
You didn't...
You didn't hire guys with hard enough heads.
You're liable because you didn't hire hard heads.
You didn't test out the hardness of their head before they got hired.
Oh man, okay.
I'm sweating.
I had to take my blanket off of me.
I got so sweaty because I was sweating too hard.
You didn't make your guys wear hard hats at the construction site and someone died.
Hilarious.
Oh no.
Okay.
So...
Go ahead.
So yeah, okay.
Essentially what you were saying.
Yeah, so if they don't have proper training or equipment or things like that.
Or even like going through the laws like if you're on a boat or something and you don't
do your safety procedures and then the boat sinks or whatever.
Anything like that.
Makes sense.
Not all homicides are crimes or subject to criminal prosecution.
In certain instances, the perpetrator can use a defense to suggest they should not be
punished for their crime.
So we're going to talk about some common defenses that are used.
So self-defense is one of them in which somebody causes the death of another person to prevent
themselves from being harmed.
That's probably got to be like the number one defense.
It has to be.
I don't see why it wouldn't be.
I mean that makes a lot of sense.
And I'm sure any defense attorney can be like...
Well, so def...
You know, like...
Yeah, exactly.
Another one is mental incapacity in which a defendant may attempt to prove that they
are not criminally responsible for a homicide due to a mental disorder, otherwise known
as maybe the insanity plea, insanity defense.
Early incompetent killers may be involuntarily committed to a mental health facility in lieu
of criminal trial.
But I thought that was interesting.
It's like you don't even have to go through trial.
If you can prove that, you just go straight to the hospital.
Mental health and development are often taken into consideration during sentencing.
For example, in the United States, the death penalty cannot be applied to convicted murderers
with intellectual disabilities.
I would think that...
Although Andre Thomas is still on death row, just fucking saying.
Yeah.
I would think that a lot...
I mean, of course, everybody's mental health should be taken into account, but I feel like
the reason that that is is because most people would think that humans are inherently incapable
of that.
And I understand that it is like it can be a fight or flight response in certain situations,
but I think that's why it's so intriguing to us and especially why it's very important
to get that mental evaluation right at the beginning of the court process.
Because again, you would think that someone that has the ability to murder, especially
multiple people, must be out of their minds.
Of course, because why else would you do that?
Right.
Although it's very...
And we've talked about this before.
It's very hard to get the insanity defense approved or processed.
It's like that Katja dollar guy.
Yeah.
Just dangling in front of you.
Yeah.
This is an option here.
No, really.
So, another type of defense is the defense of infancy.
This can be used when a young child is the perpetrator of a homicide.
The age of majority is different in every jurisdiction, but at the federal level in
the United States, the minimum age of delinquency is 11, meaning that no child under that age
can be convicted of murder.
So even if a kid was playing with a gun and he's like six, you couldn't really do anything.
Even if a six-year-old purposely killed someone with a gun, they could not be convicted of
murder.
Every country has a different minimum age for this requirement, but none go under the
age of seven.
Yeah.
I'm not saying that maybe we should just imprison six-year-olds.
I'm just saying, you know.
Maybe look into it.
Yeah, that's all.
Just saying.
Mental illness can be discovered very early.
It's true.
Depending on the case, a person under the age of 18 may be sentenced to juvenile prison
or be tried as an adult and sent to the big house depending on the circumstances.
And lastly, justifiable homicide or privilege is a defense that's widely used.
This means that due to the circumstances, although a homicide occurs, the act of killing
is not unlawful.
For example, a police officer killing a dangerous suspect or a military member killing in war.
Yeah.
Although it would be rare for them to go to court over that.
Yeah.
Like, I don't know.
I feel like more now, you know, we're definitely seeing more police officers being held accountable
for their actions.
For sure.
Yeah, for sure.
And that's why it needs to be investigated, of course.
And that's why body cam footage is so essential.
Yeah, I agree.
So next, we want to talk about, or I want to talk about, there's 50 different types
of homicide that describe different circumstances in which to kill somebody.
50?
50 different types, but I'm just going to talk about a few because that would be way too
much.
That's a lot.
And I'm probably going to butcher all of these.
Oh yeah, I can't wait.
Oven-solicide.
Ooh.
Oven-solicide is the act of killing one's uncle.
Oven-solicide?
Like your own uncle.
Yes.
Oven-cool-a-side, maybe.
I have Oven-cool-a-side.
Oven-cool-a-side.
You killed your uncle.
Oven-cool-a-side.
I think this is, yeah, Oven-cool-a-side.
Actually, I'm not even joking.
It might be Oven-cool-a-side.
Oven-cool-a-side.
I think it's like Simon and Garfunkel.
I want that on a band-team.
Okay.
Simon and Garfunkel-a-side.
I want that on a band-team, Simon and Garfunkel-a-side.
So the act of killing one's uncle.
Familicide is a multiple-victim homicide where a killer's spouse and children are slain.
Think Chris Watts.
Think who else have we done?
Scott Peterson.
Yeah, Scott Peterson.
Filicide is the act of a parent killing their child, whereas Fratricide is the act of killing
a brother or in military context, death by friendly fire.
Fratricide.
Frat.
Like a fraternity.
Fratricide.
That's hard to say.
Geronticide is the abandonment of the elderly to die or be killed, while an honor killing
is the act of murdering a family member perceived to have brought disgrace to the family.
Seen aside is the act of killing one's elderly family members when they can no longer work
or have become a burden, which is fucked up.
Whoa.
Yeah.
A miss aside is the act of killing a friend, while Andricide is the systematic killing
of men.
Whoa.
He's hasn't booked it.
Assassination is the act of killing a prominent person for either political, religious, or
monetary reasons.
You did an episode on that, didn't you?
Yes, assassinations and contract killers.
Yeah, contract killers.
That was an interesting episode.
Political damage are deaths during wartime due to imprecise or incorrect targeting or
friendly fire.
War crimes.
Yes.
Democide or populicide is the murder of any person or people by a government.
Feticide is the act of killing an embryo or fetus, and fragging is the act of killing
a fellow soldier.
Fragging.
I think I've only heard that term in like video games.
Moving on, gender side is the act of killing members of a specific sex or gender, and omniside
is the act of killing all humans or to create intentional extinction of the human species.
Oh shit.
That's terrifying.
Omniside.
That's like fucking pans ram.
Is that?
He was like, no, I'm just gonna destroy the whole earth.
Wow.
He was like that.
He's a big guy.
You ready for this next one?
I don't know.
Xenocide is the genocide of an entire alien species.
Whoa.
It's so funny how these words have names, but like, as far as I know, that's never happened.
No.
I mean, you could just, etymology, right?
You can just kind of base it off of that.
Exactly.
Just create a word.
Deicide is the killing of a god, divine being, or deity.
Papachad.
Papachad is the killing of a pope while Regicide is the killing of a ruler or king or queen.
I think Pappyside is-
Pappy, it's P-A-P-I.
Oh, so it's like Boppy.
Boppyside.
Died with this fucking episode.
Tyrannicide is the killing of a tyrant, and Magnicide is the killing of a major political
figure like JFK.
So I have just a couple more stats about just homicide in general.
In 2020, there were 18,439 cases of single homicide in the US.
There were 695 cases of multiple homicide and 571 cases of homicide followed by suicide.
This led to an overall homicide rate of 7.5 per 100,000 people.
Oh my gosh.
Yeah.
Oh, need a palate cleanser after this episode.
So every state has different sentencing for different types of murder.
Since we are based in Texas, I'm just going to talk about our sentences.
Texas.
In Texas, the mandatory sentencing for a second degree murder is 5 to 99 years with the convicted
being eligible for parole after half of the sentence or 30 years, whichever comes first.
Life sentencing can also be given for a second degree murder, but the defendant must serve
30 years before being eligible for parole.
For capital murder or first degree murder, the mandatory sentencing is death or life
without the possibility of parole.
However the defendant can be eligible for parole after 40 years if they were under 18
or had been sentenced to life before September 1st, 2005.
Interesting.
So that's when that went into place.
Of course, murder is the crime that carries the most serious penalty, pretty much anywhere
it's committed.
However, there are some other crimes that hold some serious weight when it comes to sentencing.
So I'm going to just pepper these in there as well.
Following murder, drug crimes carry the next largest sentences.
Depending on the type of drug that's involved in the crime, the sentence for drug possession
varies.
Having possession of drugs in group 4 is a class B misdemeanor for less than 28 grams.
These include morphine and opium, which can come with a sentence of up to 6 months in
jail and a $2,000 fine without a prescription.
I didn't mean to boo that.
I know.
Boo, drugs and kill people.
Let heroin run our streets.
I feel like there's some law reforms that we could probably have out there, especially
for minor infractions.
But a heroin.
Larger quantities can be punished by 5 to 99 years in prison and a max $50,000 fine for
morphine and opium.
See that like, well, yeah.
But that can ruin lives in some cases too.
Absolutely.
Because you'll never get out of that hole.
For sure.
Possession of drugs in group 3 in small amounts is a misdemeanor.
These drugs include valium and riddlein, and punishment starts at one year and a $4,000
fine.
For larger quantities of over 400 grams, sentencing can be up to 99 years in prison and
fines of $50,000.
For group 2 possession, felony charges are punishment.
These drugs include PCP and ecstasy, and punishment includes 6 months to 2 years in jail and a
fine of up to $10,000 if you have less than a gram.
If you have more than 400 grams, which is wild, you can get 5 to 99 years and fines up to
$50,000.
Wow.
One can assume that would be like with intent to distribute.
Oh, absolutely.
Yeah.
Like you're not just gonna do all that by yourself.
I don't know.
But still, they can at least charge you with that, especially if it was an individual.
Yeah.
For sure.
Lastly, in the drugs, group 1 and 1A include serious drugs such as heroin and cocaine,
and penalties for these begin at 6 months to 2 years in jail and up to a $10,000 fine.
However, if you have more than 400 grams of these drugs, you can receive 10 to 99 years
in prison and a fine as high as $100,000.
Wow.
It's pretty wild.
That is.
Sexual assault, of course, also carries a large sentence.
If the victim is over the age of 16, the sentence may include any number of years in prison
to life.
If the victim is younger than 16, the minimum sentence begins at 30 years to life.
Kidnapping can carry a sentence of 25 years or longer with massive fines and penalties
after leaving prison.
However, kidnapping charges usually involves being charged with other crimes as well, giving
way for a much larger sentence.
Yeah.
First-degree arson can carry a sentence for up to 25 years and has a potential fine of
up to $20,000.
Prison is so heavily sentenced because it usually puts human lives in danger.
For sure.
Yeah, it's endangering other people.
And lastly, government fraud is a crime punishable by up to 20 years in prison.
That white collar crime.
While all of these crimes carry large sentences, of course, murder is the absolute highest
one.
And that is all I have for today.
That was really interesting.
I think it was.
It was.
It was a wild ride.
I'm surprised we're here.
It took us probably an hour to film or to record a 30-minute episode because we had to keep
pausing.
A lot.
But yeah, that's all that I have for today.
Well, thank you for bringing the topic.
Mac is freaking out in the background.
It happens.
Well, check it us out on Thursday for another case coming your way.
Then we have the Patreon coming up sometime at the end of the month.
And just be on the lookout for any updates.
We might have some new announcements later on this week or next week.
So yeah, stay tuned.
Check us out on social media anywhere at Diagnosing a Killer, other than ex formerly known as
Twitter, which is at Killer Diagnosis.
Thanks for joining us.
We will talk to you guys next time.
Yeah.
Love you.
Bye.
Love you.
Bye.
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So another one is the defense of infancy.
Sorry.
So, starting.
Depending on the case or person under what?
I'm just saying that.
Oh.
A minicide.
Nope.
A seed of minifit.
What's his name?
Pansram.
I love my nose.
And Magnicide is the killing of a major political figure.
Interesting.
Like JFK.
Yeah.
What is that noise?
Was that you?
No, that was all that.
And Magnicide is the killing of a political figure.
Sorry.
Political figure.
And Magnicide is the killing of a major political figure.
Interesting.
Damn.
And Magnicide is...
I got fuh all over my fucking sweater.
And Magnicide is the killing of a major political figure.
Say it really quick to get it off.
The end.
And Magnicide is the fucking dick.
What is it?
Oh my god, my pits fucking smell.
I don't know.
We kind of...
Nope.
I feel like that one.
In Texas the mandatory sentencing for second degree murder is 5 to 99 years.
For larger qualities of over qualities.
Fuck.
Quality.
For better quality drugs.
They like tested it like, damn this is some good shit.
You're going to slay her forever.
Yeah.
That was my way of trying to quietly clear my throat.
Suddenly she threw up in her hand.
I tried to be so quiet.
And then I realized I wasn't getting it and I was like fucking I'm going full force.
Oh no.