1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:01,000 Hello! 2 00:00:01,000 --> 00:00:02,000 Hello! 3 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:04,960 Welcome back to another episode of Diagnosing a Killer. 4 00:00:04,960 --> 00:00:05,960 I'm Koelle. 5 00:00:05,960 --> 00:00:06,960 And I'm Kenna. 6 00:00:06,960 --> 00:00:07,960 My voice sounded really low. 7 00:00:07,960 --> 00:00:08,960 Low. 8 00:00:08,960 --> 00:00:09,960 Low. 9 00:00:09,960 --> 00:00:10,960 Low. 10 00:00:10,960 --> 00:00:35,960 Ugh. 11 00:00:35,960 --> 00:00:36,960 What is that? 12 00:00:36,960 --> 00:00:37,960 Ugh. 13 00:00:37,960 --> 00:00:39,960 I'm so over it already. 14 00:00:39,960 --> 00:00:40,960 Ugh. 15 00:00:40,960 --> 00:00:41,960 I'm just, you know what it is? 16 00:00:41,960 --> 00:00:46,320 Is that I'm just now getting a little bit of caffeine in my body and I'm like, ugh. 17 00:00:46,320 --> 00:00:50,520 Like I'm settling into this feeling of like, okay, I'm getting re-energized. 18 00:00:50,520 --> 00:00:54,440 I'm getting my second wind of the day because we're recording this a little late in the 19 00:00:54,440 --> 00:00:55,520 evening. 20 00:00:55,520 --> 00:01:00,840 I'm the opposite because I had a doctor's appointment today like you know and I had 21 00:01:00,840 --> 00:01:01,960 to get my blood drawn. 22 00:01:01,960 --> 00:01:03,200 Not had to, but I needed to get my blood drawn. 23 00:01:03,200 --> 00:01:04,200 I had to get my blood drawn. 24 00:01:04,200 --> 00:01:05,200 And you know, doctors. 25 00:01:05,200 --> 00:01:06,200 Ugh. 26 00:01:06,200 --> 00:01:07,200 Yeah. 27 00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:08,200 Ugh. 28 00:01:08,200 --> 00:01:09,200 God, how embarrassing. 29 00:01:09,200 --> 00:01:13,160 I was feeling an anxiety like all day, even sitting in the room like I was worried. 30 00:01:13,160 --> 00:01:18,400 And then as soon as I left like all of that crash and so now my body's all like imbalanced 31 00:01:18,400 --> 00:01:19,400 emotionally. 32 00:01:19,400 --> 00:01:20,400 Yeah. 33 00:01:20,400 --> 00:01:21,400 So I'm like, ugh, I'm just tired. 34 00:01:21,400 --> 00:01:24,720 I definitely get that way that if I have quite a bit of anxiety about, you know, like 35 00:01:24,720 --> 00:01:28,920 you said like a doctor's appointment or a meeting or something and then it's over, 36 00:01:28,920 --> 00:01:32,280 my body just starts to like relax and I was like, okay, you can take a nap now. 37 00:01:32,280 --> 00:01:33,280 No, seriously. 38 00:01:33,280 --> 00:01:34,280 And I'm like, thanks. 39 00:01:34,280 --> 00:01:36,040 Like this wasn't a life or death situation. 40 00:01:36,040 --> 00:01:37,040 Yeah. 41 00:01:37,040 --> 00:01:38,040 You made it feel like it was. 42 00:01:38,040 --> 00:01:39,040 And now I'm tired. 43 00:01:39,040 --> 00:01:40,040 I've been crying. 44 00:01:40,040 --> 00:01:41,040 Yeah. 45 00:01:41,040 --> 00:01:42,040 Welcome back everybody. 46 00:01:42,040 --> 00:01:45,040 I hope you guys are enjoying our episode lately. 47 00:01:45,040 --> 00:01:48,880 I know that we've had a little change in schedule, but we've had some really good comments about 48 00:01:48,880 --> 00:01:49,880 that as well. 49 00:01:49,880 --> 00:01:50,880 I think so. 50 00:01:50,880 --> 00:01:55,920 And you guys have been so nice and just expressing your concern with us and you said, you're 51 00:01:55,920 --> 00:02:00,520 happy that we're taking time for ourselves and focusing on school and work and the holiday 52 00:02:00,520 --> 00:02:01,520 season. 53 00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:02,520 Yeah. 54 00:02:02,520 --> 00:02:04,520 But yeah, so thank you guys for continuing to support us. 55 00:02:04,520 --> 00:02:05,520 Of course. 56 00:02:05,520 --> 00:02:09,000 And I have heard some pretty good feedback on well, I mean, for you guys. 57 00:02:09,000 --> 00:02:13,960 maybe like, you know, because it's like, I heard from a listener the other day that's 58 00:02:13,960 --> 00:02:24,000 like, I am so addicted that I'm craving another episode and it's been too late. And you know, 59 00:02:24,000 --> 00:02:27,320 thank you guys so much for your patience on that. They also did say though that I gave 60 00:02:27,320 --> 00:02:31,760 them a chance to kind of go back and listen to maybe some ones they didn't listen closely 61 00:02:31,760 --> 00:02:37,680 enough to. Yeah, exactly. Or maybe try out some mental breakdowns or some DAK lives. 62 00:02:37,680 --> 00:02:43,080 So yeah, some good content to freshen up on. For sure. And if this is your first episode 63 00:02:43,080 --> 00:02:47,280 listening, welcome. And you have plenty of bingeable content. Yeah. It'll be months 64 00:02:47,280 --> 00:02:50,920 before you guys are like, where's the next episode? I was thinking about that trailer 65 00:02:50,920 --> 00:02:57,000 we did for Jason, for Santa May be a criminal. And it has yet to air because I think he's 66 00:02:57,000 --> 00:03:01,280 waiting until next season, which makes sense. Because I've been listening to it. Yeah, I 67 00:03:01,280 --> 00:03:06,120 was listening yesterday. I'm so obsessed. I'm a little farther than you, I think. Or 68 00:03:06,120 --> 00:03:11,320 maybe I'm at the Cardelphians right now. Maybe I'm not. I think I'm on Easter Bunny 69 00:03:11,320 --> 00:03:14,360 unmasked. Have you heard that one? Oh my gosh, yeah. Okay, I'm on that one. Yeah, 70 00:03:14,360 --> 00:03:17,960 E.B. Cooper. Yeah. Easter Bunny. Well, he's not Easter Bunny. I think his name is like 71 00:03:17,960 --> 00:03:23,280 Edward Barker. Yeah, something hilarious. Yeah. So I was thinking about the trailer 72 00:03:23,280 --> 00:03:27,400 that we did for Jason and how that's going to air. It's going to be like, catch us on 73 00:03:27,400 --> 00:03:33,800 Mondays for a bunch of hours. Oh yeah. Well, it'll be better. January 1st, we're going 74 00:03:33,800 --> 00:03:37,480 to start that episode. That's true. And if he does do the season throughout the holidays, 75 00:03:37,480 --> 00:03:41,520 then yeah, it won't be that long. It won't be that long. We're not liars, I promise. 76 00:03:41,520 --> 00:03:46,400 At the time we recorded it, we were doing two a week. That's true. But you know what? 77 00:03:46,400 --> 00:03:50,720 Things change. Change is good. Change is good. I definitely want to hear your case, but first 78 00:03:50,720 --> 00:03:57,280 I do want to read a DM we got from a listener in Italy recently. Is it Little Italy? I 79 00:03:57,280 --> 00:04:02,280 don't think so. No, it's just Italy. Yes. This is from a listener named Alessandro. 80 00:04:02,280 --> 00:04:07,920 He said that we can use his name and he said, hello. Hello. How are you doing? I hope everything's 81 00:04:07,920 --> 00:04:11,600 fine. Let's get straight to the point. Thank you. I bumped into your podcast a month ago 82 00:04:11,600 --> 00:04:16,160 and now I have you in my earphones every day. You might be wondering what thank you is about. 83 00:04:16,160 --> 00:04:19,960 He did share a personal story about his mental health and then he said it's incredible to 84 00:04:19,960 --> 00:04:23,440 see that there's people who actually care to talk about mental health. Anyways, love 85 00:04:23,440 --> 00:04:29,840 the way you deliver the stories. And he kind of like, yo, like why oh? And then when I 86 00:04:29,840 --> 00:04:34,120 messaged back, he's like, I accidentally sent that first message. It's not finishing it, 87 00:04:34,120 --> 00:04:40,240 but I'm from Italy. Yes. Thank you for that lovely message. We love not only hearing 88 00:04:40,240 --> 00:04:44,600 from people across the fucking world, but people that we know that we're truly making 89 00:04:44,600 --> 00:04:48,160 an impact on. Like that's our whole goal in this. So thank you for reaching out and letting 90 00:04:48,160 --> 00:04:51,440 us know because that warms our hearts to hear that from you. Absolutely. Yeah. Definitely 91 00:04:51,440 --> 00:04:55,600 opens up a little bit more of a dialogue to talk about, you know, what the heart of what 92 00:04:55,600 --> 00:05:04,120 we do is. Yeah. Yeah. For sure. That's okay. For sure. Today we're going to be talking 93 00:05:04,120 --> 00:05:11,720 about Henry Lee Lucas. Oh yeah. Okay. A confession killer. Okay. All right. Not who I thought 94 00:05:11,720 --> 00:05:17,800 you were doing. No. All right. No. My, my wrist just popped. I was like, are you okay over 95 00:05:17,800 --> 00:05:24,160 there? Content morning. This episode describes scenes of child abuse, sexual abuse, psychological 96 00:05:24,160 --> 00:05:31,160 abuse of a child, attempted suicide, substance and alcohol use, rape, B.C. Allity, arson, 97 00:05:31,160 --> 00:05:36,680 incest, necrophilia and decapitation. If this episode is not for you, we encourage you 98 00:05:36,680 --> 00:05:40,040 to check out another one of our episodes. Remember that your mental health is important 99 00:05:40,040 --> 00:05:46,920 to us and we love you. Love you. Love you. Bye. Bye. I'm fucking sorry. It's a bit of 100 00:05:46,920 --> 00:05:52,400 a do-say. It's just a bit much. It's a bit much. It's a bit much in it. In it. In it. 101 00:05:52,400 --> 00:06:00,800 In it. In it. We love you guys. Henry Lee Lucas was born on August 23rd, 1936. So it 102 00:06:00,800 --> 00:06:08,760 was the 1930s. Oh, it was actually this time. It's the 1930s. His parents were Nelly Viola 103 00:06:08,760 --> 00:06:14,400 and Anderson Lucas. Nelly's cute. Nelly is a cute name. I know one Nelly. This spelled 104 00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:19,480 that way. N-E-L-L-I-E. It's cute. Cute. The couple would have a total of nine children 105 00:06:19,480 --> 00:06:30,320 over the course of 22 years. Opal, Elmer, Nora, Frida, Harry, Almeida, Warden, Andrew, 106 00:06:30,320 --> 00:06:34,720 and then Henry was the youngest. Okay, so they name all of their kids cute-ish names 107 00:06:34,720 --> 00:06:42,120 and then they name one Almond? Almeida, I think it has A-L-M-E-D-A. Or is it Almeida? 108 00:06:42,120 --> 00:06:46,880 I don't know. It sounds like Almond. It sounds like Almond. I think it's Almeida. And also 109 00:06:46,880 --> 00:06:52,960 Elmer. Almeida. Maybe it's funny. Elmer is cute. I like Frida. Frida, F-R-I-D-A. Yeah. 110 00:06:52,960 --> 00:07:00,200 Yeah. No, F-R-E-D-A. Frida. Like Freda. Don Frida. Don Frida. Although I'm rewatching 111 00:07:00,200 --> 00:07:04,200 Orange right now and I love Frida. Frida's the best. See, I haven't seen it in so long. 112 00:07:04,200 --> 00:07:08,480 I don't even remember that character. Frida? She's the survivalist girl? The survivalist 113 00:07:08,480 --> 00:07:13,840 lady with the octopus tattoo on her neck? Damn, Frida's awesome. Nelly was actually 114 00:07:13,840 --> 00:07:21,200 48 when she had Henry. His father being just 35. Whoa. Yeah. She was literally... Especially 115 00:07:21,200 --> 00:07:30,000 for the 1930s. Fuck, I missed a great opportunity to go whoa, Nelly. Whoa, Nelly. Damn it. Why 116 00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:33,880 would she do this to us? It could have paused it and then like pretended like I was that 117 00:07:33,880 --> 00:07:38,840 quick on it. Yeah. I would have been authentic. I'd have to fake react to you. Like, that's 118 00:07:38,840 --> 00:07:43,800 hilarious. I'll see that one again. Like a horse. We're tangenting too much already 119 00:07:43,800 --> 00:07:50,680 come on. Sorry. Let's go. The family was residing in Blacksburg, Virginia. Anderson once worked 120 00:07:50,680 --> 00:07:56,280 for a railroad company. However, after a workplace accident, Anderson would actually lose both 121 00:07:56,280 --> 00:08:05,240 of his legs. And this is not funny, but his nickname was No Legs. That's not funny. Anderson 122 00:08:05,240 --> 00:08:15,640 No Legs, Lucas. Okay. Also good opportunity to say, Anderson No Legs. All Anderson No Legs. 123 00:08:15,640 --> 00:08:24,600 You made a whoa Nelly joke. Okay. That's not funny. It's not funny, but what that situation 124 00:08:24,600 --> 00:08:35,160 is not funny, but all Anderson No Legs. No, seriously, I'm really not trying to be a 125 00:08:35,160 --> 00:08:44,880 funny person. I'm so sorry. She's crying. She's got tears coming out of her eyes. I'm 126 00:08:44,880 --> 00:08:49,680 not joking. I just took probably a five minute break. I had to blow my nose. Well, yeah, 127 00:08:49,680 --> 00:08:55,440 I had to get up and everything too, but I am so sorry. I could not stop laughing at the 128 00:08:55,440 --> 00:08:59,720 name. It's the name. That really sucks though, the situation. It really does. Well, it just, 129 00:08:59,720 --> 00:09:03,880 you know, it's interesting because we've done that one about railway, railway spine. Yeah. 130 00:09:03,880 --> 00:09:07,600 Remember when they used to call it PTSD? Can you imagine the amount of PTSD you would have? 131 00:09:07,600 --> 00:09:13,440 Oh, absolutely. That's terrifying. Forced to make ends meet. Anderson began to make illegal 132 00:09:13,440 --> 00:09:17,920 alcohol out of the house to sell. Hmm. Can't go anywhere, really. Okay. You know, he's 133 00:09:17,920 --> 00:09:21,240 probably on, I didn't even know if they had disability. No, I don't think they did. Probably 134 00:09:21,240 --> 00:09:26,920 not. No, for sure. Anderson soon turned to alcohol himself and became an alcoholic. That's 135 00:09:26,920 --> 00:09:33,320 so sad. He was also apparently a pencil salesman. I don't know. Look, Wikipedia is not the 136 00:09:33,320 --> 00:09:39,720 best reference, but apparently he used to sell pencils. I mean, I frequently needed pencils. 137 00:09:39,720 --> 00:09:44,880 Yeah. I mean, everyone needs them. I think pencils were huge. Yeah. They were huge. They were huge. 138 00:09:44,880 --> 00:09:50,160 Nelly too became addicted to alcohol and would often rage at her family when under the influence, 139 00:09:50,160 --> 00:09:55,560 especially taking out her rage on her husband and her sons. Oh, that's so awful. Nelly also 140 00:09:55,560 --> 00:10:01,360 began participating in sex work to make extra money for the family. Nelly would also engage in 141 00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:07,120 sexual acts with men in front of the children. Oh my God. Specifically Henry was made to watch. 142 00:10:07,120 --> 00:10:14,600 Oh, yeah. Just made to which one of them grew up to be a murderer? Probably a lot of them, 143 00:10:14,600 --> 00:10:20,040 actually. I mean, there's nine. I guess one out of nine isn't bad. That's terrible though, 144 00:10:20,040 --> 00:10:23,640 because like, I don't know, I always think like when we do these, I always think of like, 145 00:10:23,640 --> 00:10:28,640 if you had just not done that, if you had not done that, maybe he would have been a decent human. 146 00:10:28,640 --> 00:10:33,640 Yeah, or at least sought help. Henry said about this time, quote, first thing I can remember 147 00:10:33,640 --> 00:10:39,280 was my mom in bed with another man in the house and she made me watch it. I just couldn't stand 148 00:10:39,280 --> 00:10:43,960 there and watch. I had to turn my back and walk out of the house. And after I did that, 149 00:10:43,960 --> 00:10:50,040 she would beat me because I didn't watch. That's fucking twisted. Like, that's sick. Nelly had 150 00:10:50,040 --> 00:10:55,360 expressed several times that she wanted to bring up Henry to be a pimp as she knew that it was the 151 00:10:55,360 --> 00:11:03,160 easiest way to make money. And he's like a kid. He's like 10. 8 or 10. Nelly began seeing a man 152 00:11:03,160 --> 00:11:09,320 she called Uncle Bernie, which is immediately sounds creepy, that does sound gross, who would 153 00:11:09,320 --> 00:11:13,600 eventually move into the home and become Nelly's boyfriend, a living boyfriend. She's living with 154 00:11:13,600 --> 00:11:19,680 her husband, all those children, and a living boyfriend. And Anderson just like doesn't mind 155 00:11:19,680 --> 00:11:27,120 or he doesn't know what to say. Sure, he's passed out most of the time. I'm sure he doesn't. Yeah, he's drinking a lot. Yeah. Nelly 156 00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:33,040 encouraged Uncle Bernie to beat the children as well, especially Henry, Henry, since their father 157 00:11:33,040 --> 00:11:38,600 was disabled and the children needed a father figure. Because you can't be a father figure when you 158 00:11:38,600 --> 00:11:41,480 have a disability, right? Yeah, when you have a disability. Well, he is also an alcoholic. He's 159 00:11:41,480 --> 00:11:47,320 probably not, again, he's probably, that's true, not functional, functional, which is probably 160 00:11:47,320 --> 00:11:51,920 another reason why, you know, Anderson's probably dealing with a lot of depression. Let's not forget 161 00:11:51,920 --> 00:11:59,360 that PTSD, the drinking is probably in his mind helping those things. And yeah, he's probably like, if you 162 00:11:59,360 --> 00:12:06,280 think that this guy can parent better than I can, then what's the harm? Yeah. Plus, you know, he probably 163 00:12:06,280 --> 00:12:11,960 knows that she's engaged in sex work anyways. It's true. Many times the three adults in the home would be 164 00:12:11,960 --> 00:12:17,240 passed out leaving the children to fend for themselves. Or more than not, Nelly would have strange men 165 00:12:17,240 --> 00:12:23,280 coming and going from the one bedroom home in order to keep working. So it wasn't just people in this 166 00:12:23,280 --> 00:12:31,000 one bedroom home, Jesus, in a one bedroom home. Yeah. But again, it's like, she's not going out and 167 00:12:31,000 --> 00:12:36,400 doing this. She's like bringing it in the house. That's dangerous as fuck. Yeah, especially to the kids. 168 00:12:36,680 --> 00:12:41,160 Nelly would beat and humiliate the children whenever she could. And Henry being the youngest took the 169 00:12:41,160 --> 00:12:47,280 brunt of the abuse. Nelly was hitting Henry with various objects at any given point. And once Henry 170 00:12:47,280 --> 00:12:52,560 was just eight years old, Nelly actually bloodshed Henry with a wooden plank so hard he fell into a 171 00:12:52,560 --> 00:12:59,040 coma for three days. Holy shit. Yeah, that's scary. She never once sought help for Henry's injuries. 172 00:12:59,080 --> 00:13:05,120 And yeah, he would just come to a few days later. Oh, she always thought he was dead. She probably did. 173 00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:09,880 And imagine that fucking frontal lobe injury. Oh, yeah, absolutely. This is eight. He was eight years old. 174 00:13:09,880 --> 00:13:16,400 That's terrible. Nelly would also dress up Henry and his sister's clothing in order to emasculate him at a 175 00:13:16,400 --> 00:13:22,360 young age. Nelly would even send her son to school in his sister's clothing. Oh my God, I was just 176 00:13:22,360 --> 00:13:25,720 about to ask, is he going to school? Yeah, this is also in public, like whenever they would go out in 177 00:13:25,720 --> 00:13:32,640 public. He said about this time, quote, I hated all my life. I hated everyone. When I first grew up, 178 00:13:32,680 --> 00:13:37,440 and I can remember, I was dressed up as a girl by my mother. And I stayed that way for two or three 179 00:13:37,440 --> 00:13:43,480 years. And after that, I was treated like what I would call a dog of the family. I was beaten, and I was 180 00:13:43,480 --> 00:13:50,080 made to do things that no human being would want to do. End quote. That brings my heart. It's really fucking 181 00:13:50,080 --> 00:13:54,360 sad. And he's the youngest. Yeah, I'm sure, you know, all of the other siblings have probably gone 182 00:13:54,360 --> 00:13:59,800 through very similar things. Yeah. Henry at this time tried to escape into school, and we see that 183 00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:05,280 often with abused children. He didn't seem to have trouble making friends. And once he was actually 184 00:14:05,280 --> 00:14:10,920 given a teddy bear by a teacher. Upon arriving home, however, Nelly took the bear from Henry and 185 00:14:10,920 --> 00:14:17,600 beat him severely for bringing home the bear. What? Yeah. It's like a Lisa Montgomery story. 186 00:14:17,600 --> 00:14:23,920 Remember like how the mom hit Lisa? I forgot what it was. She came home with something. I don't 187 00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:27,720 remember. Or she killed the dog. She killed the family dog. Oh my God. Yeah, I remember that. Yeah, 188 00:14:27,720 --> 00:14:32,720 it just, she simply doesn't want Henry to be happy at all. Yeah. It's like, how dare you bring 189 00:14:32,720 --> 00:14:37,920 home something that could bring you joy. Yeah. Nelly's abuse was not limited to her children and 190 00:14:37,920 --> 00:14:44,240 husband. Actually, in one instance, she shot and killed a young mule that was given to the family 191 00:14:44,240 --> 00:14:51,920 by his uncle, by Henry's uncle, his actual uncle. Yeah, uncle Bernie. Not uncle Bernie. Yeah, so 192 00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:59,760 she shot and killed this gift. Sad. When Henry was 10 or 11 years old, he was fighting with his 193 00:14:59,760 --> 00:15:05,680 older brother and his brother would brandish a knife. His brother swatted the knife at Henry and 194 00:15:05,680 --> 00:15:13,720 at some point had grazed or cut his eye. His actual eye? Henry's actual eye. Oh, hell no. Nelly 195 00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:20,680 refused to take Henry to the hospital. So over the course of four days, he would get an infection. 196 00:15:20,680 --> 00:15:29,040 And while at school, his eye had become so enlarged and infected that it burst at school. Shut up. 197 00:15:29,040 --> 00:15:33,920 That's so gross. Should I put that in the content warning? Sorry. No, I don't think that's just 198 00:15:33,920 --> 00:15:38,560 gross. It's just gross. Like picture in the head. Henry was then rushed to the hospital where he 199 00:15:38,560 --> 00:15:42,320 underwent surgery and they removed his eye and fitted him for a prosthetic. I did not have you 200 00:15:42,320 --> 00:15:48,640 to be a guy. That's so awful. And you could have done something to prevent that. Yeah. But you 201 00:15:48,640 --> 00:15:52,560 didn't. You just didn't take him. Well, I mean, we're not really expecting much from the later 202 00:15:52,560 --> 00:15:55,760 lives of a fucking coma for three days. Yeah, she left him in the coma for three days and then 203 00:15:55,760 --> 00:15:59,840 not only that, but she would have to probably admit that she wasn't watching her son brandishing a knife. 204 00:15:59,840 --> 00:16:03,840 That's true. Yeah. Oh my god, that's so awful. I don't know if the brother even felt bad. I 205 00:16:03,840 --> 00:16:07,120 bet he hopefully he did, but probably thought it was just all in good fun. Yeah, I mean, 206 00:16:07,120 --> 00:16:12,160 they're probably all being taught to like just do whatever the fuck ever. Yeah, just stay out of my 207 00:16:12,160 --> 00:16:18,000 way. Imagine being in that classroom when his eyeball popped. Oh my god. Gross. I don't wish 208 00:16:18,000 --> 00:16:23,200 that upon anybody. It's awful. And you're 10. You're 10 or 11. Yeah. Permanently, like you don't 209 00:16:23,200 --> 00:16:27,120 have an eye for the rest of your life. I didn't realize that your eyeball could pop. Yeah, it was 210 00:16:27,120 --> 00:16:35,600 just infected. Okay. And then shortly after this, Henry began to drink heavily, which isn't surprising 211 00:16:35,600 --> 00:16:41,120 because his role models are these assholes. But he's 12. Yeah, he's like 10, 11, 12 somewhere in there. 212 00:16:42,240 --> 00:16:48,320 He also began to act out sexually in school around his peers. Well, he's been exposed to sex 213 00:16:48,320 --> 00:16:54,480 and sex. Yeah, exactly. Henry actually began to start a sexual relationship with his half 214 00:16:54,480 --> 00:16:59,920 brother that lasted for some time. I'm sorry. Because that's again, that's all they're doing. 215 00:16:59,920 --> 00:17:06,480 Fucking show. Yeah, I'm sure his brother was also abused. Henry was also at some point exposed to 216 00:17:06,480 --> 00:17:15,440 animal abuse and bestiality. So Henry around 12, 13 would begin to capture animals, torture them, 217 00:17:15,440 --> 00:17:22,640 engage in sexual acts with them, and then ultimately kill them. Oh my God. In 1949, when Henry was just 218 00:17:22,640 --> 00:17:28,880 13 years old, Henry's father, Anderson, would get extremely inebriated and accidentally pass out 219 00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:35,840 outside overnight. This was a particularly snowy night, a blizzard even, and Anderson would ultimately 220 00:17:35,840 --> 00:17:46,000 die of exposure and hypothermia. Holy shit. That's wild. Yeah. So he just was so intoxicated. 221 00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:51,600 So say, how drunk do you have to be? Very. I feel not. There's an episode of orange where that happens. 222 00:17:52,240 --> 00:17:59,920 Linda's sorority, what's like the head sorority chick? The president? Oh, was it like a president? 223 00:17:59,920 --> 00:18:05,680 Yeah. Okay. Yeah, so the president, I guess, like, tried to like pee outside and then she got stuck 224 00:18:05,680 --> 00:18:09,680 out there or something and then she died of hypothermia. Oh my God. So it's like, man, apparently that 225 00:18:09,680 --> 00:18:14,000 fucking happens. Well, yeah, for sure. Overnight, I mean, some places are super fucking cold. Where is 226 00:18:14,000 --> 00:18:20,480 this Virginia? This is Virginia. Yeah. So now dealing with the loss of his father, his own alcoholism, 227 00:18:20,480 --> 00:18:25,520 his sexual proclivities, Henry would drop out of school and begin touring around Virginia, 228 00:18:25,520 --> 00:18:29,520 stealing and robbing whenever he could. Oh my God. It's just like violence is a way of life, 229 00:18:29,520 --> 00:18:31,920 because that's exactly what you're teaching your kids. Yeah. And if you want something, 230 00:18:31,920 --> 00:18:38,560 you just take it. Yeah, exactly. In 1951, when he was just 14 or 15 years old, Henry would claim to 231 00:18:38,560 --> 00:18:46,240 take the life of a 17 year old, Laura Everlene Burnseley. So she had apparently denied his sexual 232 00:18:46,240 --> 00:18:52,560 advances. Henry claimed that he fell in love with Laura, although the last known sighting of her was 233 00:18:52,560 --> 00:18:57,680 her waiting at a bus stop. Okay. Doesn't know, like, there's not a clear picture of how long they 234 00:18:57,680 --> 00:19:02,320 might have known each other. Yeah. So when Henry tried to act on these feelings of either love 235 00:19:02,320 --> 00:19:07,920 or sexual frustration, he actually strangled Laura and left her body near Harrisburg, Virginia. Oh my 236 00:19:07,920 --> 00:19:14,080 gosh. So again, she was last seen at a bus stop in Lynchburg, Virginia. Henry later claimed that 237 00:19:14,080 --> 00:19:19,600 Laura's death was a result of consensual sex that became aggressive and then went too far. Although 238 00:19:19,600 --> 00:19:25,600 Henry confessed to these crimes later in 1984, saying about this crime, quote, it scares me 239 00:19:25,600 --> 00:19:30,880 quite a little bit because the first girl I killed was when I was 14 years old. I wanted to try the 240 00:19:30,880 --> 00:19:36,880 sex I had been watching. I got to playing too rough with her. The pressure of seeing my mom hit me 241 00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:42,080 and my emotions more or less took over and I couldn't quite handle it. End quote. So he is 242 00:19:42,080 --> 00:19:46,720 saying like, after all of it, he's saying like it was consensual. Maybe it wasn't for her, 243 00:19:46,720 --> 00:19:52,160 but like I was trying to just be rough sex and then everything came out emotion wise and I just 244 00:19:52,160 --> 00:19:57,680 like lost it. Snapped, yeah. Laura's body hasn't never been recovered. Oh man, that's a bummer. 245 00:19:58,480 --> 00:20:03,200 A few years later in 1954, Henry and his half brother were arrested on burglary charges. 246 00:20:03,920 --> 00:20:10,560 The two would be convicted with Henry sentenced to six years imprisonment. Henry would immediately 247 00:20:10,560 --> 00:20:17,360 begin to plan an escape. Right. To which actually he was able to follow through with. Oh great. 248 00:20:17,360 --> 00:20:21,840 However, just a mere three days later, Henry would be recaptured and taken into custody to carry 249 00:20:21,840 --> 00:20:27,760 out the remainder of his sentencing at Virginia State Prison. Henry served five years being 250 00:20:27,760 --> 00:20:33,760 released in 1959 and he immediately went to go live with his older sister Opal. Although Henry 251 00:20:33,760 --> 00:20:38,480 had been corresponding with a woman by the name of Stella Harris and the two were engaged, he did 252 00:20:38,480 --> 00:20:45,680 elect to stay with his sister when he got out. So yeah, he's engaged to Stella. Stella. Stella. 253 00:20:45,680 --> 00:20:55,200 It's no secret that we value your mental health. So we are thrilled to announce that we are sponsored 254 00:20:55,200 --> 00:21:00,800 by BetterHelp to support you. BetterHelp is the world's largest therapy service and it's 100% 255 00:21:00,800 --> 00:21:06,480 online. With BetterHelp, you can access a network of over 30,000 licensed therapists with a wide 256 00:21:06,480 --> 00:21:12,480 range of specialties and be linked with the perfect match. Whether it's via text, chat, or video call, 257 00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:16,960 you can talk to your therapist when it works for you. When it comes to your mental health, 258 00:21:16,960 --> 00:21:22,320 BetterHelp is a convenient and affordable option for therapy. Get 10% off of your first month at 259 00:21:22,320 --> 00:21:30,400 betterhelp.com slash dakpod. That's better h-e-l-p slash d-a-k-p-o-d for 10% off your first month. 260 00:21:35,680 --> 00:21:39,840 Henry at this time was not interested in reconnecting with his mother. However, 261 00:21:39,840 --> 00:21:44,880 Nelly had other plans for Henry. Oh my god, he's like, I want nothing to fucking do with you. 262 00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:51,360 Yeah. And she's like, oh no, just let me come see you and hang out. I still need to be my pimp. 263 00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:57,200 Yeah. She was able to track the siblings down and demanded that Henry move in with her in order to 264 00:21:57,200 --> 00:22:03,200 take care of her. By this time, Nelly was 71 years old and told her son, due to her being incapable 265 00:22:03,200 --> 00:22:09,200 of caring for herself, he was to move in at once. She also did not care for her son's fiancé, 266 00:22:09,200 --> 00:22:14,640 Stella. And she made this very clear, perhaps jealousy is what I'm thinking. Oh, for sure. 267 00:22:14,640 --> 00:22:19,200 Oh, you're not going to come over with me because you're engaged now. Nelly stayed with the siblings 268 00:22:19,200 --> 00:22:25,120 throughout Christmas and New Year's, but by the 11th of January 1960, Henry was spiraling deep into 269 00:22:25,120 --> 00:22:29,440 his thoughts of trauma and the threat of Nelly ruining his life yet again. I mean, yeah, he's 270 00:22:29,440 --> 00:22:34,960 got to have some crazy PTSD like from his childhood and like, this is all bringing it back up. Yeah. 271 00:22:34,960 --> 00:22:39,200 With his mom, especially being separated from her while he was in prison for about five years. Yeah. 272 00:22:40,080 --> 00:22:45,200 After a day's worth of arguing back and forth, Henry picked up a broomstick and began to strike 273 00:22:45,200 --> 00:22:50,880 Nelly about her body and head. Oh, shit. He then in a further fit of rage picked up a knife and began 274 00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:57,600 to stab her in the neck repeatedly. He said about this quote, I was pretty well drunk when she started 275 00:22:57,600 --> 00:23:02,160 arguing with me, wanting me to go back to live with her in Virginia. But I told her I didn't want 276 00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:07,600 nothing to do with her. All I remember was slapping her alongside the neck. But after I did that, 277 00:23:07,600 --> 00:23:12,800 I saw her fall and I decided to grab her. But she fell on the floor and when I went to go pick her 278 00:23:12,800 --> 00:23:17,520 back up, I realized that she was dead. Then I noticed that I had a knife in my hand and she had been 279 00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:25,680 cut end quote. The last sentence doesn't sound very accurate. Yeah, that I mean, again, it kind of 280 00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:31,360 seems like, I mean, he's not saying like, I didn't do it. He's saying like, these are the details 281 00:23:31,360 --> 00:23:36,400 I'm a little fuzzy on like what actually happened. Yeah, but like, I knew I had a knife. But I did it. 282 00:23:36,400 --> 00:23:42,080 Yeah, exactly. That's not funny. But that's terrible. I mean, not nobody deserves that, obviously. 283 00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:47,840 But I mean, it kind of seems like she was still in that role of, well, you're not going to do 284 00:23:47,840 --> 00:23:51,600 anything to me. I'm your mother. Yeah. You know, and now you're looking at a grown ass fucking man 285 00:23:51,600 --> 00:23:57,920 that's already served prison time. Yeah. And she's this 71 year old lady, you know, Henry then packed 286 00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:02,400 a very light bag and proceeded to flee the area. Was anyone else there when that happened? No. 287 00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:08,880 Opal arrived home to find her mother in a pool of blood, but apparently still alive. Oh, she called 288 00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:13,840 for an ambulance and police. However, upon their arrival, Nellie was unfortunately pronounced deceased. 289 00:24:15,200 --> 00:24:19,440 Henry was later found in Ohio. And when asked about the incident, he claimed that it was self 290 00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:25,680 defense and gave the torrid history of the parent child relationship. The coroner later determined 291 00:24:25,680 --> 00:24:30,160 that the cause of death was actually a heart attack from the assault and not the assault itself that 292 00:24:30,160 --> 00:24:35,520 resulted in Nellie's death. However, when the case went to trial, Henry Lucas would be found guilty 293 00:24:35,520 --> 00:24:41,520 of second degree murder and sentenced to 40 years in the Jackson State Penitentiary in Michigan. 294 00:24:41,520 --> 00:24:47,840 40 years? 40 years. Oh, shit. Okay. So that's the end of the story. That's Henry Lee Lucas. 295 00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:53,840 You're lying. You're totally lying. Henry would attempt suicide multiple times by slashing at 296 00:24:53,840 --> 00:25:01,760 himself before being transferred to a psychiatric hospital. I think it's Ionia State Hospital. 297 00:25:01,760 --> 00:25:08,160 It's also known as Michigan State Asylum. Henry here began to receive treatments such as shock 298 00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:13,760 therapy, behavior therapy, and would begin taking antidepressants as well. I'm on board with the 299 00:25:13,760 --> 00:25:21,520 behavior therapy and antidepressants, but shock therapy, especially with all of the brain trauma 300 00:25:21,520 --> 00:25:28,960 he had experienced. You think that's all the new? In 1966, Henry was evaluated and deemed 301 00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:34,480 safe to return to prison, but was also recommended for early release. So he was working closely with 302 00:25:34,480 --> 00:25:40,080 a psychologist this whole time. And the psychologist was like, look, he is seriously mentally ill. 303 00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:43,680 Look at his childhood. Yeah. He killed his mom after years of abuse and torture, 304 00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:48,880 kind of like Gypsy Rose. He doesn't need to do 40 years. He's probably not going to be a repeat 305 00:25:48,880 --> 00:25:53,520 offender because of course they didn't know about the 17 year old. Yeah. And this psychologist 306 00:25:53,520 --> 00:25:59,040 probably feels like a dick today if they're alive, which it probably is. It's a long time ago. 307 00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:05,280 Therefore, he was released after serving just 10 years in 1970. So he's what in his 40s now? 308 00:26:05,920 --> 00:26:13,200 30s? Yeah. So he was, well, he was born in 36. So yeah, he's 34. Right? Did I do the math on that 309 00:26:13,200 --> 00:26:17,440 right? I don't know. What year is it? Yeah, 36, right? Because then four would be 40 and then 310 00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:25,040 30 would be 34. Cool. Within a year of his release, Henry attempted to kidnap a young girl at gunpoint. 311 00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:31,680 Great. We love a wrong psychologist. Love a psychologist is wrong. No, that's hard though, 312 00:26:31,680 --> 00:26:35,760 honestly. Yeah, they're doing the best that they possibly can, especially with the information that 313 00:26:35,760 --> 00:26:41,920 they know in the 60s. For sure. Yes, this is thankfully unsuccessful and Henry would be sentenced 314 00:26:41,920 --> 00:26:46,000 to another three years of imprisonment for the attempted kidnapping. This time he needs to stay 315 00:26:46,000 --> 00:26:51,040 in. Three years is way too short for that. That's way too short. While in prison, Henry's cousin 316 00:26:51,040 --> 00:26:56,880 would actually pass away and his cousin's widow, Betty Crawford, would begin to write Henry in prison. 317 00:26:58,320 --> 00:27:04,080 They corresponded over the years and when Henry was released in 1975, the two would quickly 318 00:27:04,080 --> 00:27:08,960 move to Maryland with Betty and her two daughters. Oh my gosh. But they would also quickly marry. 319 00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:14,240 By the end of the year, the new family would move to Pennsylvania 320 00:27:14,240 --> 00:27:19,360 and Henry would begin working on a mushroom farm. Oh, I kind of like that. I know, right? Could you 321 00:27:19,360 --> 00:27:22,960 imagine working in a mushroom farm? It's so cute. So how do you know which ones to grow though? 322 00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:25,920 So cottage quark. You might die if you eat this one, but you might have a really great time 323 00:27:25,920 --> 00:27:30,480 if you eat this one. Oh, they probably know. They're probably, I don't know. Imagine the 324 00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:34,240 first people that founded that mushroom. So like this one makes you feel like you're going to fall 325 00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:38,960 off the earth. Right. This one makes you actually leave the earth. Was it Andre Cicatillo, where 326 00:27:39,840 --> 00:27:43,920 that couple were going into the woods to pick mushrooms? Yeah. It's so cute. Yeah, I did hear 327 00:27:43,920 --> 00:27:48,560 that. I did remember that. That would be a really cute date. Go to a mushroom farm. I like that. 328 00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:54,560 Anyways, the marriage to Betty would be a short one just after one year. 329 00:27:55,120 --> 00:27:59,840 Betty's daughter had come to her claiming that Henry had been molesting and raping her for 330 00:27:59,840 --> 00:28:04,880 quite some time. What was he taught his whole life? I know, right? As a dude for your family. 331 00:28:04,880 --> 00:28:08,080 When I was reading this and I was like, oh my god, he married this woman with children. 332 00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:11,760 Like there's no way he's not going to abuse these children. Like, it's awful. 333 00:28:11,760 --> 00:28:17,760 It was actually Henry who would end up leaving the situation, not Betty, which I found disturbing. 334 00:28:18,480 --> 00:28:21,840 She knew the information and she approached him. I was like, this is what my daughter's saying about 335 00:28:21,840 --> 00:28:28,160 you. And he was like, nope, never happened. Bye. Like, and just did instead of her being like, 336 00:28:28,800 --> 00:28:34,960 I heard this about you. I'm leaving you. Yeah. Henry went back to stealing and robbing to support 337 00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:40,000 himself while traveling through the United States. He would end up in Jacksonville, Florida, 338 00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:46,960 where he would meet a man by the name of Otis Tool. Otis was also highly abused as a child. 339 00:28:47,600 --> 00:28:52,480 Parallels between the two included being raised by alcoholics. His father would also dress him 340 00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:59,440 up in dresses and call him Susan. What? He too had engaged in ancestral relationships with a family 341 00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:05,040 member. Oh my gosh. And Otis was very violent from a young age. Yeah. Otis was also intellectually 342 00:29:05,040 --> 00:29:10,080 disabled with a low IQ and experienced grand mal seizures from a very young age. Dang. So he 343 00:29:10,080 --> 00:29:17,520 probably has some brain damage. Otis said that he could never remember a time where he didn't find 344 00:29:17,520 --> 00:29:24,800 fires sexually arousing. Okay. Right. Well, it's again McDonald, right? Well, yeah, but the fire 345 00:29:24,800 --> 00:29:30,080 thing is one thing. And then the, I feel like you don't really hear about like fires being 346 00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:34,080 sexually arousing. I think it's just like exciting, like mentally. I don't know. Well, that's like, 347 00:29:34,080 --> 00:29:39,760 that's what I've heard as far as like arsonist go, like arsonists find the fire attractive somehow. 348 00:29:39,760 --> 00:29:45,520 Oh, even that. I don't, I'd never heard that before. Yeah. Interesting. In his teen and early 349 00:29:45,520 --> 00:29:52,000 adult years, Otis began to cross dress and this too sexually aroused him. Unable to function in 350 00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:57,520 society and keep a job either by unattended mental illnesses or disabilities, Otis began 351 00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:03,680 engaging in sex work himself and looting to support himself. It was after that he began working in a 352 00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:09,040 soup kitchen that he would meet Henry Lee Lucas. The two immediately struck up a friendship and 353 00:30:09,040 --> 00:30:14,240 quickly began a sexual relationship. By all accounts, the relationship seemed to flourish. 354 00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:18,560 And at the time of their meeting, Otis was actually living with his family and this included 355 00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:24,800 his 11 year old niece, who was also intellectually disabled. Oh, no. Henry became very close to 356 00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:30,000 Otis's niece. Her name was Becky. And he was almost like a second uncle to her, not an uncle, Bernie. 357 00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:36,400 Did he molester? The two settled in together and Otis's family home and both began working for a 358 00:30:36,400 --> 00:30:42,640 roofing company and making decent money, at least enough to stabilize the two. All was quiet for 359 00:30:42,640 --> 00:30:50,800 some time. However, in January, 1982, Otis barricaded a 65 year old man by the name of George 360 00:30:50,800 --> 00:30:57,200 Sonnenberg in a boarding house and lit the home on fire. What the fuck? Yeah, he just like barricaded 361 00:30:57,200 --> 00:31:01,680 this dude in there and then lit the house on fire. Like, I know that's not random, but like it seems 362 00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:06,480 random like in this time. Like he's kind of been like, like kind of low and slow for a long time, 363 00:31:06,480 --> 00:31:12,080 like kind of under the radar. I think it's mostly like the way that I wrote it is like, 364 00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:17,200 it definitely seemed to the outside that these two guys are doing well together. They're living 365 00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:21,680 together. They're providing for this niece, you know, it just kind of like their child in a way. 366 00:31:21,680 --> 00:31:28,000 So it's, yeah, it's like they kind of, again, they kind of look like this happy couple together. 367 00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:32,320 Yeah. And yes, they're both career criminals, but maybe they're turning their life around. 368 00:31:32,320 --> 00:31:38,480 And then Otis just is like, I'm gonna light this man's house on fire. I wonder what the motive 369 00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:43,440 behind that was like, obviously the arson itself, like that's, you know, his thing. Right. But the 370 00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:49,200 man, yeah, you know, George would ultimately succumb to his injuries as well. And so off. Yeah. 371 00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:56,080 And he would be arrested for murder. Otis. Yeah. Would be arrested for it. So while Otis was dealing 372 00:31:56,080 --> 00:32:01,520 with all of this legal, this little legal snafu here, you know, just a little hiccup. Yeah. 373 00:32:01,520 --> 00:32:06,640 Henry decides to take off with 15 year old Becky after learning that Child Protective Services 374 00:32:06,640 --> 00:32:10,560 were looking to remove Becky from the home. Well, yeah, that's not his fucking child. Or 375 00:32:10,560 --> 00:32:16,800 it's not his child. Yeah, exactly. Possibly unbeknownst to Otis, Henry was actually involved 376 00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:21,360 in sexually abusing Becky for a number of years. I figured so. I'm so awful. 377 00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:26,560 And Henry eventually would claim at this point that he was in love with Becky. He was obviously 378 00:32:26,560 --> 00:32:31,920 grooming her. Yeah. Like for sure. And she's, unfortunately, she is old enough at this point to 379 00:32:32,720 --> 00:32:36,640 maybe not think that he's doing anything wrong. That's true. Well, she's also intellectually 380 00:32:36,640 --> 00:32:42,880 disabled as well. Yeah. So I don't, I didn't seek it out. I didn't see what her IQ was. I know that 381 00:32:42,880 --> 00:32:48,800 Otis is, I think was, I get a 75. Okay. So the two were on the run for a few weeks until they 382 00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:54,480 settled in California. After Henry began work, a fellow employee had expressed their concern 383 00:32:54,480 --> 00:33:01,440 about their elderly mother living alone when Henry expressed that him and his wife were looking for 384 00:33:01,440 --> 00:33:06,320 permanent residency. Oh my gosh. He's like, yeah, I'm also 15 years old, not 15. I'm also 385 00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:11,760 like more than twice her age older than her. Yeah. Yeah. Like some people thought that she was his 386 00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:16,640 wife because that's what he said. But I'm sure other people probably thought that he was her dad. 387 00:33:16,640 --> 00:33:22,560 Yeah. Which is gross. Gross. So this fellow employee agreed to the arrangement. The couple 388 00:33:22,560 --> 00:33:28,240 were to live in the home to provide care to 82 year old Kate Rich. And while living with Kate, 389 00:33:28,240 --> 00:33:32,080 you know, they're, they're going to provide care to her. I can tell you what's going to happen. 390 00:33:32,080 --> 00:33:38,960 Yeah. Right. Right. Yeah. While living with Kate, her family noticed that her money was being 391 00:33:38,960 --> 00:33:44,640 spent at an alarming rate. And the couple were then asked to leave the home. Oh, so they were just 392 00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:50,800 like, you got to get out of here. Something's fishy. I was half right. Becky distraught over the loss 393 00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:56,480 of a roof over her head insisted Henry find this a solution for the two of them. So he suggested 394 00:33:56,480 --> 00:34:04,400 that the two traveled to Florida, which I guess Becky had family there. So at some undetermined 395 00:34:04,400 --> 00:34:10,880 amount of time, Becky mysteriously went missing. Oh, seemingly heartbroken that he couldn't find 396 00:34:10,880 --> 00:34:16,880 his wife. Henry returned to the home of Kate Rich in order to plead with her to help in the search 397 00:34:16,880 --> 00:34:23,280 for Becky. I'm sorry. She kicked you out because you were stealing from her. And now you want 398 00:34:23,280 --> 00:34:28,160 her to help you. Kate had become close with Becky in the time that she stayed with Kate. So 399 00:34:28,160 --> 00:34:36,480 Kate agreed to help him find Becky and Henry knew that in June 1982. Henry was picked up on 400 00:34:36,480 --> 00:34:43,440 weapons charges. However, he was alone at this point. So last known sighting of Kate Rich was 401 00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:51,440 with Henry. And when he was arrested, he was alone. Jesus. Once in police custody, Henry began to tell 402 00:34:51,440 --> 00:34:58,000 a story that would shock the general public. No. Henry claimed that he did in fact kill Becky. 403 00:34:58,000 --> 00:35:02,960 That while the two were headed to Florida, he stopped in a field, stabbed Becky to death, 404 00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:09,040 and then engaged in necrophilic acts after Becky was deceased. He dismembered her and scattered 405 00:35:09,040 --> 00:35:14,640 her remains throughout the field. He admitted that when he went back to the Rich residence, 406 00:35:14,640 --> 00:35:20,880 it was with the intent to lure Kate to her death as well. Oh my god. He took Kate Rich to a camp 407 00:35:20,880 --> 00:35:25,840 ground where he then stabbed her to death, had sex with her lifeless body, and dumped her in a 408 00:35:25,840 --> 00:35:31,520 drainage pipe. Oh my god. How brutal. He would claim that he would go back to this drainage pipe 409 00:35:31,520 --> 00:35:37,840 regularly in order to engage in further necrophilic acts. All right, Bundy. This was shocking enough 410 00:35:37,840 --> 00:35:42,560 to investigators as they hadn't picked Henry up for murders. Yeah. They're picking him for a 411 00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:47,680 double homicide. That's not funny, but it's like, yeah, we have you on weapons charges. He's like, 412 00:35:47,680 --> 00:35:55,840 yeah, by the way, I'm like a serial killer. By the way. Yeah. But this is not all. Oh no. A few 413 00:35:55,840 --> 00:36:00,880 days later, he wrote to the sheriff, quote, I have killed for the past 10 years and no one will 414 00:36:00,880 --> 00:36:07,840 believe me and I cannot do this. Can't do what? Can't go on doing this. End quote. Henry claimed 415 00:36:07,840 --> 00:36:13,600 that between 1978 and 1981, while him and Otis the two were together, the two had committed 416 00:36:13,600 --> 00:36:22,880 over 100 murders together during their lull. Oh my gosh. He said it in an interview, quote, 417 00:36:22,880 --> 00:36:27,360 I killed him every way there is except poison. There's been strangulations. There's been 418 00:36:27,360 --> 00:36:32,240 knifeings. There's been shootings. There's been hit and runs. I don't have any emotions. I had no 419 00:36:32,240 --> 00:36:37,600 feeling for the people themselves or any of my crimes. I'd pick them up hitchhiking, running, 420 00:36:37,600 --> 00:36:42,080 and playing stuff like that. We'd get going and have a good time. First thing you know, 421 00:36:42,080 --> 00:36:48,240 I'd kill her and throw her out somewhere. I don't know how to really explain why I kept on. 422 00:36:49,120 --> 00:36:55,440 It was just like I say as though I left my body and just as though the more you look at them as 423 00:36:55,440 --> 00:37:00,960 though that person wasn't dead and you just keep stabbing them and imagining that person's not dying. 424 00:37:00,960 --> 00:37:06,640 End quote. Geez. So he like completely dissociated like himself out of what was actually happening. 425 00:37:07,280 --> 00:37:11,840 Many of the people described by Lucas were in fact very similar to more than a few 426 00:37:11,840 --> 00:37:17,280 unsolved cases in multiple states. Lucas would continue to confess over the course of a year 427 00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:21,440 and he was regularly interviewed and seemingly his knowledge of details of these crimes were 428 00:37:21,440 --> 00:37:26,960 something that only investigators knew. Eventually Lucas confessed to over 200 killings, 429 00:37:27,680 --> 00:37:33,040 but one major thing was missing. Any evidence of not only him being connected to actual missing 430 00:37:33,040 --> 00:37:36,880 persons, but any evidence that some of these people were even missing in the first place. 431 00:37:36,880 --> 00:37:41,600 Hmm. Sometimes he would confess to kidnapping in areas where no one was reported missing 432 00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:47,360 and in at least one instance he confessed to killing someone that had previously been ruled 433 00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:54,080 by a suicide or that it was a suicide. Yeah. Henry claims started to become unreal. At one 434 00:37:54,080 --> 00:37:59,520 point he claimed that he provided the poisoning used in the Jonestown mass suicides. He just said 435 00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:03,120 he's never killed anyone by poisoning. Yeah. So what is it? Well this is probably different 436 00:38:03,120 --> 00:38:06,640 interviews because he was regularly interviewed. Yeah. So which one is it though? He also 437 00:38:06,640 --> 00:38:11,120 claimed that he killed Jimmy Hoffa who disappeared in 1975 and has never been found. 438 00:38:11,120 --> 00:38:17,360 Doubtful. Right. Slowly one by one some of Henry Lee Lucas's confessions began to follow apart, 439 00:38:17,920 --> 00:38:21,520 especially when technology began to advance in DNA testing. He's like, 440 00:38:21,520 --> 00:38:24,720 shit didn't see that one coming. Yeah. It's like Golden State. Fuck. 441 00:38:25,840 --> 00:38:31,120 An entire task force was formed in order to determine which of Lucas's claims were in fact 442 00:38:31,120 --> 00:38:37,920 true. Oh my god. So much wasted energy and resources and money and people's time. This took 443 00:38:37,920 --> 00:38:43,040 mountains of time and effort on the part of the police and in the end there were only 11 confirmed 444 00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:48,080 deaths of Lucas that he would be tried for over time. I think that he probably figured like, 445 00:38:48,080 --> 00:38:51,600 fuck it, like I'm going to prison for the rest of my life anyway. Might as well just like make 446 00:38:51,600 --> 00:38:56,320 myself super prolific. Yeah. You know, super infamous. Claim all these highest numbers. Yeah. 447 00:38:56,320 --> 00:39:01,440 Claim all these other murders and all these other murderers can like walk the street. Yeah. It was 448 00:39:01,440 --> 00:39:08,320 also determined at another point that he had had access to the prison because he was constantly going 449 00:39:08,320 --> 00:39:16,160 in and out of interviews and talking to police and it was like he was like profiled by FBI agents 450 00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:22,240 for that, you know, that whole thing where they would they can determine a profile. So he participated 451 00:39:22,240 --> 00:39:26,480 in that like all this stuff. So he got a lot of privileges and they had determined that he was going 452 00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:34,960 down into evidence rooms or getting a hold of files and were reading up on these missing people's 453 00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:40,000 cases. So he knew details about stuff that when he probably didn't do it. When he didn't do it. 454 00:39:40,000 --> 00:39:44,480 Yeah. Yeah. He would just claim or he would listen to like other people's accounts of stories and 455 00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:51,360 just make up his own. Oh gosh. He was originally sentenced to death but his sentence was commuted 456 00:39:51,360 --> 00:39:58,480 to life imprisonment by George W. Bush in 1998. Henry Lucas would die of a heart attack in prison 457 00:39:58,480 --> 00:40:06,320 in 2001 at age 64 years of age. I said age twice. But that's just ironic because his mom died of a 458 00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:12,640 heart attack too even though he stabbed her but still right at 64. That's wild. As for Otis Tull, 459 00:40:12,640 --> 00:40:17,760 the man would be convicted for six deaths of his own including the arson case that claimed the life 460 00:40:17,760 --> 00:40:23,360 of George Sonnenberg. He was also suspected of killing Adam Walsh. Do you know who Adam Walsh is? 461 00:40:23,360 --> 00:40:28,800 I don't think so. He's the son of the victim advocate in America's most wanted host, John Walsh. 462 00:40:28,800 --> 00:40:35,680 Yes, I know who that is. Yeah. So anytime anybody here is in code Adam, that's code like we used to 463 00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:40,960 have it at a grocery store I used to work at where if someone calls a code Adam you lock the doors 464 00:40:40,960 --> 00:40:49,280 no in and out until the child is located. Yeah. Yes, Adam Walsh is the son of John Walsh and Adam 465 00:40:49,280 --> 00:40:54,000 was taken from a department store while shopping with his mother. His decapitated head was later 466 00:40:54,000 --> 00:40:59,440 found a few days later. I think it was like four days later. The rest of his remains were never 467 00:40:59,440 --> 00:41:05,680 recovered. Otis Tull was known to decapitate his other victims some of whom were young boys. 468 00:41:05,680 --> 00:41:11,360 Tull did confess to the murder and told the cops how he did it but then later recanted. 469 00:41:12,240 --> 00:41:16,080 He's like, oh I did that. This is all the details. He's like had a written confession and then was 470 00:41:16,080 --> 00:41:21,760 like, oh no wait no I was all just a lie. Which recanting was like Henry Lucas' thing. He was 471 00:41:21,760 --> 00:41:28,240 like, oh yeah you're right I didn't do that my bad. Just to be like a fucking troll. Although this 472 00:41:28,240 --> 00:41:33,600 has been a long-standing suspicion it has yet to be confirmed forensically that Tull was 473 00:41:33,600 --> 00:41:40,080 Adam's murderer. Another possible suspect for the Adam Walsh murder is actually Jeffrey Dahmer. 474 00:41:40,720 --> 00:41:46,000 Really? Yes. Although this too was never confirmed. Interesting. Tull would die in prison due to 475 00:41:46,000 --> 00:41:50,800 cirrhosis of the liver at 49 years old. Not even the alcoholic. Yeah, he was three 476 00:41:50,800 --> 00:41:54,800 alcoholics in this story and none of them died from cirrhosis except for it. Except for it. 477 00:41:55,680 --> 00:42:02,160 Damn. Yeah, that is the case of Henry Lee Lucas. There is a documentary that is on Netflix called 478 00:42:02,160 --> 00:42:10,320 The Confession Killer. That goes into all of the details of the victims of the crimes, the toll 479 00:42:10,320 --> 00:42:16,000 that it took on the families that they thought that these murders were being solved and they weren't. 480 00:42:16,000 --> 00:42:20,240 That's so awful. He was just using up these resources. It goes through his trial process, 481 00:42:20,240 --> 00:42:25,600 all that stuff. So very interesting stuff. Tons more information out there for sure but I did 482 00:42:25,600 --> 00:42:32,400 want to focus just solely on his early childhood and those contributing factors versus... I mean, 483 00:42:33,120 --> 00:42:38,480 there's no secret, there's no question why he did what he did with all of the things that he 484 00:42:38,480 --> 00:42:43,280 went through as a child. The psychological abuse, the psychological torture if anything, 485 00:42:43,280 --> 00:42:49,920 you know, the physical abuse, the coma, all that. That obviously takes a toll on someone's 486 00:42:49,920 --> 00:42:55,600 fucking mental health and it ruined him as a person, I think. Yeah, I agree with that and I 487 00:42:55,600 --> 00:43:01,600 definitely think that just given the amount of instances that he was physically harmed to the 488 00:43:01,600 --> 00:43:08,080 point of needing medical attention and didn't receive it, in fact was made to suffer longer 489 00:43:08,080 --> 00:43:13,840 through that, I think really took away a lot of that empathy he possibly could have had for other 490 00:43:13,840 --> 00:43:19,200 people because he went through physical pain that way. He's like, I want to do this so I can't 491 00:43:19,200 --> 00:43:25,280 hurt other people. Yeah, he's probably, you know, was able to, I can never say this word and that 492 00:43:25,280 --> 00:43:30,880 clip was... Compartmentalized. Yes, thank you. I can never say that word that he had to do that 493 00:43:30,880 --> 00:43:38,720 and put his pain away and, you know, it was kind of like mind over matter and how easy after repetition 494 00:43:38,720 --> 00:43:42,960 of that being repeated over and over and over and over and over again, how easy it must have been 495 00:43:42,960 --> 00:43:48,400 for him to just check out, you know? Yeah, I think so. So yeah, interesting case. Well, good case. 496 00:43:48,400 --> 00:43:52,720 Thanks for bringing that. Thank you guys for joining us today. Yeah. Do you have anything else? 497 00:43:52,720 --> 00:43:56,000 Do you want to give more handles? Yeah, you can catch us anywhere on social media at 498 00:43:56,000 --> 00:44:00,960 diagnosia killer other than x which is at killerdiagnosis. Check out our website 499 00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:06,640 diagnosiaciller.com and there you will find links to merch and resources. Grab some merch you 500 00:44:06,640 --> 00:44:14,000 merch, use that bracelet form and fill out a bracelet. We've got a few requests for those, 501 00:44:14,000 --> 00:44:19,440 so they're in our... it's on our link tree on our Instagram. Yes, thank you. Well, keep coming 502 00:44:19,440 --> 00:44:24,960 back. Listen guys, we have another Patreon only case coming out on the 29th of this month. Did you 503 00:44:24,960 --> 00:44:30,000 already say you were doing? I did. It's Columbine. Yes, Columbine. Yes. Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold. 504 00:44:30,000 --> 00:44:34,960 Yes, that's going to be a fukin doozy and that is going to be for our tier two and three Patreon 505 00:44:34,960 --> 00:44:38,960 members. Yes. Thank you guys so much for your continued support. We literally could not be here 506 00:44:38,960 --> 00:44:43,280 without you, so we really appreciate everything that you guys do for us and any people that want 507 00:44:43,280 --> 00:44:48,080 to do that can go to patreon.com slash diagnosia killer to support us that way. Yeah, keep requesting 508 00:44:48,080 --> 00:44:56,080 cases y'all. Yeah, please and keep DMing us and saying love you bye. We'll talk to you later. Love you. Bye. 509 00:45:01,280 --> 00:45:06,720 Featured in Vogue, Forbes and more, Alleriz has the most beautiful and expertly crafted diamond 510 00:45:06,720 --> 00:45:11,920 jewelry for that special someone in your life. From engagement rings, pendants and earrings, 511 00:45:11,920 --> 00:45:15,600 you're sure to find the perfect gift that expresses exactly how you feel. 512 00:45:15,600 --> 00:45:20,080 Click the link in the show notes to receive $10 off all orders plus free shipping. 513 00:45:20,080 --> 00:45:44,080 Alleriz, fitting all your jewelry needs from A to Z.