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I'm Drea. I'm Meg. I'm Tina. And I'm Jess. And this is Part in My Stash.

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Welcome to Part in My Stash, a podcast about knitting within the fiber arts and how awesome it is.

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Before we get into today's topic, let's check out what we're working on this week. Jess?

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Well, I was working on the vest and then I got mad at the pattern. So now I am working on

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the wrap, which is between the dragon and his wrap. And it's a color work and I love it.

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That's so bright.

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Right? Isn't it awesome?

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What is that blue?

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This blue is Thunderwave.

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Is it?

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Yeah, it's Thunderwave from Critical Hit Dies and Copper Dragon from Critical Hit Dies.

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And they're both on Paladin, which is like, I haven't worked with a worsted weight yarn in

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forever, but it's not so bad. I did go down a needle size because working with nines was like,

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Awful.

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No, eights is okay.

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Broomsticks?

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You know, it doesn't look like that big of a difference, but it feels like that.

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I don't like knitting worsted in nines. It just feels too much.

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I also felt like it would give a little too much. Like this is coming out really nice where I'm at.

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Can I touch it? It looks squishy.

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It is super squishy. You may touch it.

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And I like this one. It's a nice color work. For the record, it is squishy.

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It's super squishy, right?

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But yeah, so I'm excited about this one. I am doing a little bit of a modification on the middle

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of the pattern because I wanted the dragon's horns to be longer, so I've tested it because I

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thought it just looked too flat. So I changed it a little bit, but I haven't gotten that far yet.

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So we'll see how that works out. But that is what I am working on now and it's lots of fun.

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And then at the end, I get to stick it.

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So we're going to have fun with that too. Oh Lord.

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Lots of fun stuff. This is also part of my matchy make along with Meg now because we changed.

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I forgot. I actually did Rose on mine.

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I'm almost turning the hem on it. I'm almost turning the hem.

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It's just taking forever and there's 467 stitches per row.

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Once you get to the color work, it's going to be awesome.

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It's a lot of stitches. The bottom of this was garter and it was

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only like 300 stitches in garter and I'm like, oh, it's so taking forever. So I can understand.

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Well, I think I'm doing the same thing as Meg because Meg's also working on her

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Calliope. So I'm working on a Calliope and she knows the designer and I don't.

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Nice. What are you guys working on?

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It's Calliope by a space Trico.

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That. Tina, tell me about your yarn.

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Why you were like Meg's also doing it. I'm like, why is she saying it?

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Because I don't know who the designer is. Tell me about your yarn.

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So I am working my Calliope in the colorway bless with I believe it's.

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It's Druid.

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Druid. Yeah. I was going through all the classes in my head from D&D.

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And I kept wanting to say rogue, but I was like, no, that's a fingering way. That's wrong.

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That's wrong. It's Druid DK.

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I know.

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From Critical Hit Dies, which happens to be at this table.

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Tell me about your project.

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Good Lord.

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I am also working. This is my second Calliope. I mentioned before, I wanted to make it without

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the mohair because as luscious as the mohair is, I am a warm being. It's much.

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I'm actually knitting this one out of fiber spates, vivacious DK in the colorway heavenly.

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I really love this yarn. I really do.

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It looks so pretty.

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I love the color. It's like an undefinable, like there's some purple, there's some blue.

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There's a little bit of pink.

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Depending on the light, it does kind of.

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It looks gray when you just look at it head on, but then when you shift it, it actually does change.

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There's even like a little bit of peach in there. It's a really cool color.

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It's like opalescent.

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Opalescent?

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Yeah.

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No, it is almost. I'm knitting this and I'm like, this would look really good with a mohair,

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but at the same time, I'm like, I don't need two sweaters that are stice.

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Yeah, I just don't.

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I also did not do a mohair.

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Oh, God. I tell you, the fabric of the sweater is so nice, but then you put it on and you're like,

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and that's enough of that. I'm done with the collar. I'm doing the raglan increases now.

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This is like my portable project because that I'm not doing the same one as her,

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but I'm also doing a color work to be staked and that's not really portable.

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It's just massive. So it's my portable project for now.

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It's the one I take to gymnastics and nobody talks to me because they're like, look at that weirdo

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sitting there knitting. What are you working on?

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I am still working on the arachnishawl by Claire Slade or Verily Knits.

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I am using Plies and Hellhounds Penny in Flower Moon and Nightmares.

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Thank you.

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It is a good combo. It's orange and black.

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And that is my matchy make along for the matchy make along with my partner, Tina,

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who is doing black and orange instead of orange and black.

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Yes, I am.

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Yeah.

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Because it's spooky.

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It is spooky. It's going to be good. And I'm really enjoying the knit,

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even though I'm not enjoying it often. It's still good.

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Be sure to check out our website, pardonmystache.com for more information

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as well as pictures regarding our current projects, patterns and yarns.

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Welcome to this week's topic. This week, we're going to get a little controversial up in here.

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We're going to press some buttons.

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And spooky, I guess, because it's so dangerous.

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You're setting the ambiance. Thank you.

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No problem.

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We're going to talk about pattern and design ethics.

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That's right. Get your pitchforks out.

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You know, when you're on Ravelry and you see some patterns and they look really similar.

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Yes, I have seen that. And it is quite interesting seeing two patterns

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looking very similar to each other. You wonder if they may be inspired or something.

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Like, well, is it inspiration or is it that it's it's blatant?

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Like, do you think it's intentional? And how do you feel about it?

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I think one of the issues is like, if you if you look for a stitch Bible,

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quote unquote, for lack of a better word, or a stitch book, there are only so many.

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It is actually really hard to make up a new stitch pattern that has never been used before.

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So many ways to stitch a stitch. Yeah.

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And I'm trying to think off the top of my head, I do not believe you can copyright.

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And I'm sure that someone will will tell me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe you can copyright a stitch.

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I don't think you can do that. You can copyright a colorwork pattern.

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Sometimes you can loophole and copyright the name of a stitch, but then someone else can just

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change the name and change the name.

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Change the name, change the name. And you can cop and some lace patterns

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are copyrighted. Like you can't you can't pirate those.

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It's murky at best. But yeah, it's it's I don't know how you can take take a stitch out of, say,

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like the Vogue knitting, whatever the hell it is. I have it downstairs. But God, if I know the name,

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make a pattern from a bunch of those cobbled together and then say, these are mine.

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Yeah. You did not come up with with those stitches. Right. You came up with you put them together.

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You made the pattern. Guys, people can't make the notes on a piano. What they make is an arrangement.

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Those can be. That's a good point. Yeah, that's actually a good analogy. Yeah.

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You can't steal a note. Yeah. It's been around for so long. Right. And crafting and crochet and like

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so many different textile arts have been around for so long. Can you really say that anything is

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really original anymore? Well, I don't know, though, because like let's just use, for example,

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like the just because it's it's super well known, the Elizabeth Zimmerman Baby Surprise jacket.

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It's basically if you're not familiar with it, it it's you knit a piece of what looks like really

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weird origami and then you fold it up and you put a little seam in it and it makes a cute little baby

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jacket. Nobody can make that same thing and then say, well, this is original. I made this. Everybody

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knows who made that. Everybody knows that sweater, that exact pattern. But that's a pattern. Right.

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But isn't that what we're kind of talking about to an extent? Like, can you can you say if nothing is

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new, does that mean that everything is up for grabs? Or are there things that we have to say,

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like we have to acknowledge this designer made this and we can't pirate it? So I like to think

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of my seed dot beanie. I literally called it the seed dot beanie because it's the seed stitch and

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it's the dot stitch. And those were pulled from a Bible. Right. So the copyright, there is a

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copyright on there, but the copyright is not for the seed and the dot stitch. The copyright is

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my arrangement of the notes and the math so that you can produce the same item that I create in the

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photos. So and that's how I feel about copyright on any of those things, including the sweater that

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you just mentioned. If it comes out the same exact way in the same exact directions, like that are

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written in the same exact way. Yeah, I think that's copy. That's piracy. That's piracy. Yeah, if it's

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copy paste, but it's also the coincidental of someone else who has never seen your work is like,

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oh man, I like these two stitches together and there's only so many ways you can math up a beanie.

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Correct. Correct. But it would be written exactly. But then that would expect it would. There's no,

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no, it's not even it's, it's absolutely expected. There's no way that it would be written the same.

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It might have similar directions. So like you might have to do a similar knit one, purl one ribbing

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or the, the seed stitch where your knit one, purl one, and then you purl one, knit one, like whatever,

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like you may have those similar directions, but the design of the pattern itself, the way the PDF

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is laid out, if it's accessible or not, like there's so many, the photos, the colors, the like

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everything. Well, the base yarn, the yarns that you're using, the gauges, the needles, like all of

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that, like would be different no matter. There's so many infinite different possibilities of putting

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those items together. There's no way, unless you've seen it before that it would be exactly the same.

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It could be similar. It could be similar, but it wouldn't be exactly the same. So, and, and I think

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that's where it gets murky because, you know, then it turns into, okay, well, which one was published

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first, you know, and, but then you get into, well, the issue of techniques, patterns and designs that

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weren't really written down because they're so well known. They're so well thought out, you know,

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for example, my very vital beanie is free. Why is it free? Because there is no possible way that my

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way of thinking of making a simple stocknet beanie is unique. There is just, there's just absolutely

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no way that there isn't somebody out there that has also figured that out because I know for a

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fact, there is some grandma who used to make stocknet beanies for their grandkids and is not

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using a pattern, just figured the math out just like I did. So that pattern is just, I figured the

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math out for you. Here you go. And I honestly did that for myself because I kept doing it for myself

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and I was like, I can't get, I forget. I don't want to do math every time. Exactly. So I wrote it down

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for myself and I was like, well, I'm not going to, why would I charge for this? This doesn't make

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any sense. So I saw recently a pattern get called out and it was literally chain stitch and then you

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put it together and you make a bracelet. Like that was the pattern and they were charging $6 for it.

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Oh, wait, just space. I mean guys do a YouTube tutorial. You can make those bracelets.

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Yeah. Well, I mean, yeah, it's like, wow. So like, but like, is it wrong? Is it like not ethically

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like sound? Sure. I was like, illegal? No, I, I, I would, I judge the person for doing it and I kind

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of side anyone who's paying six bucks for that. So can I, can I play devil's advocate here really

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quick? So here's the thing. And I, I, to an extent, I, I agree. Like, I don't like, I don't like the

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idea of somebody slapping a price on something that they didn't invent, doesn't belong to them.

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But on the flip side, I remember my early, early days of knitting and having first off, no,

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no confidence in myself to be able to figure out a, a complicated pattern and absolutely no confidence

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in myself to wing it in any way, shape or form. I would have loved, you know, as I'm sitting there

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ticking the box of only free patterns on Ravelry, I would have loved some patterns that were more

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than just like, you know, the simple stockinette to be free. But I also acknowledge that like,

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to an extent, like you did put work into grading that beanie into making sure that the numbers

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worked. So to an extent, I can see why somebody who's like, yes, I'm making something that is,

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it is very simple. I don't own this, but I did put the work in to check my math and I am providing

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you with a service that you apparently require enough to want to pay for. Does that make me

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unethical? I don't know if it does. So I would say, I would say in that sense, no,

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it doesn't make you unethical. The unethics about it is, I think, taking advantage of the

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new, the newbies, because you're right, as a newbie, you have no idea. You wouldn't say,

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you would not know that, hey, this, I'm going to go back to my beanie, the stockinette beanie

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is a very, very typical pattern and is a very, very typical design that has been made a hundred

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ways to Sunday. So no, you wouldn't know that because you're new to the craft and you wouldn't

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have no idea. So do I think that other people who sell a stockinette beanie for a price are unethical?

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No, I don't. Cause I agree with you about like, you know, you have to put, you put, I did, I put

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work into the grading and stuff like that. There was time in that. Is there a sense of like duty?

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Maybe is the question as a veteran, you know, somebody who's been doing this for decades or

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more to pave the way for the new noobs, the new noobs. Come on now it's the new to say, hey,

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like, you know, we need to make our options for things that are insanely

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simple, repeatable or simple or something that's going to help them elevate their own skills.

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Cause like, I find a stockinette beanie, you learn a lot of different skills with a stockinette.

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Right. You do increases, decreases, uh, ribbing, uh, working in the round. There's like a lot of

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different things that you can learn inside of that, that little beanie that really seems

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inconsequential, but when you're new to knitting, it is, it does teach you, teaches you a lot.

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Checking some boxes.

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Yes. So I don't, so like that, I think maybe that it's maybe less of an ethics question.

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I told you at the start of this, I have very conflicted feelings because I can definitely

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see it on both sides. When I say I'm playing devil's advocate, like I'm not even sure as I'm

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sitting here, which side I'm on. So I don't know if there is a side, but I think, right. But I think

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also there is the whole, I don't think there's a problem with putting a price on something that

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you graded and you put together. I am definitely going to side eye you if you then turn around and

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somebody who does the same thing and you try to say, well, they stole that from me.

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If you're taking a simple stockinette beanie, I think that's pretty universally like what is

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wrong with you. Um, unless again, they took your pattern, took your name off it, slap their name

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on it and put it online, um, without, you know,

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Oh yeah. I know those pictures where you're using the pictures you use and they like cut out your

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water monitor. It's the top half of the hat so they don't see you're the one wearing it.

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I don't know. I kind of look at it more like, and we've all done things like paid more money

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for convenience. Um, I have a pretty terrible problem with, with the Grubhub. Like for example,

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I could go pick that up, but I'd rather somebody pick it up for me. Like, so, you know, some days

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it's like, yeah, I could sit down and I could math out doing a stockinette beanie, but you know what?

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I don't feel like doing it. And if I want to pay somebody money to do it for me, I don't know if

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that's taking advantage, I guess. I don't know. This is why I'm torn. Like here's right. It's all

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a matter of, okay. So like using the crochet chain bracelet as an example, if it is literally like

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you pay six dollars, cause you don't see any of these patterns until you made it. So you pay six

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dollars and it's like, okay, chain until it'll fiddle around your wrist and then bind it off

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and sew it together. No, no. Now you pay for six hours for this is like, okay, here's how you do a

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chain stitch. Now if you measure your wrist, if your wrist is like six inches, you're going to want

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to change this many. So it's actually more of a tutorial tutorial. Okay. Yeah. Like, but yeah,

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if it's just like, okay, chain stitch, so it fits your hand. Yeah. Okay. So, okay. Going, I'm going

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to use again, my patterns as an example. And the reason why I'm doing this, cause I know my patterns,

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right? So my very vital, I don't know about this, this wrist lit thing. I just saw it and I went,

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wait, what? But, um, even I know how to do that. But, um, for the high vis cowl, right? It's a

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brioche cowl. I don't teach you how to brioche in that. And that's why it's free. And that's why

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it's free. I'm not saying this is how you bark and this is how you burp. Yeah. There is, there is

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like an extent of you should know how to do this. You can look, you can look up bark and burp,

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but I'm not going to teach it for you. I thought you were making those words up. I legitimately

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had no idea. I had no idea what that was. I thought you were just being weird. It's brioche,

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brioche knit and brioche pearl is the, so they, it's BRK and BRP. So it's bark and burp. I had

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no idea. I've never tried it. To an extent, you still did do the math for how high it is and how

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wide it is. So like, if you did want to charge an amount for that, that would make sense. Now,

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I might side I you, if you're like, yeah, $20 for this pattern, I might be like, Tina, what?

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Jess, this was an exclusively Louis Vuitton. Listen, it's a Louis Vuitton. It's the tape

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rolled bracelet for $5,000. From his neon season, because remember it's the high vis. Have you seen

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that? Speaking of that was cracking me up. That's what I'm wearing. I, a scotch tape bracelet. And

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I'm like, I've been doing that since I started working at the store. Like, why aren't I getting

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10 grand for this bracelet? Because you didn't do it. Like you didn't sell it through Hubert for

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50 bucks guys. I could get a whole six pack of them. We can all be like top of the line fashionistas.

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It's the same reason why Kanye West can charge like $200 for an undershirt. But you know what,

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yeah. Luxury brands is actually a really good example of the same kind of, okay,

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what is your personal ethos? Like where is your personal ethics? And that's kind of what is right

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and wrong because everybody's is different. Everybody's is different for me. I'm going to

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go pick up the food for you. You don't want to pick up a lazy jerk. Me. I would go pick up the

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food. I'm a lazy jerk. I want my $4. I just, I'm very cheap. Listen, cheap supersedes. It really

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depends. It just depends. If it's a Saturday night and the kid is like not feeling it, I don't feel

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like putting her in the car. But, but I think, I think that's why it kind of, um, that's why it's

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murky because your definition and my definition and Dre is and jet, however, we all have a kind of a

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slightly different take on what we think is right, quote unquote, or wrong. People are going to pay

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for what they think has value for them. Correct. Right. Exactly. And for someone that's like,

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I really don't feel like doing the math. I'll spend the $4 to get this pattern. You know, that's,

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that's worth it to them. Now, um, to Jess's comment about bait and switch patterns.

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Unfortunately, I have not seen too many of these on, on Ravelry or, you know, where they don't tell

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you until you buy it. Like they don't give you certain parameters until you buy the pattern.

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And I don't mean things like the pattern, like the stitches itself, but like when they don't list in

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the thing, like these are the techniques you should know before you do this, or this is a top down

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sweater instead of a bottom up, or you're going to need X amount of yardage. Like did you ever

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like, didn't you just buy a pattern and it was just the color chart. It didn't even give you how to do

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the mitten. Cause like, it's like that, that I feel like that's bait and switch. I find, I find that

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after a call. I had it just sort of, I guess this is what I'm doing for the cuff. I guess it needs

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the cuff somewhere. Cause a cuff, a thumb, a decrease. Cause like it should have just been like,

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this is where you put the thumb. I'm like, I guess I'm doing it this way. Cause like, I feel like

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that should have been, I'm selling you a color work chart. Right. And you can put this on anything.

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You can make a scarf with it. You can make a hat, but that to market that as a, this is a mitten

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pattern. That's not even a gusset. That's on ethical. And I mean, that's one of the things

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I really like about the Ravelry. Like, um, you know, the categories that you can put in when you,

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when you go to do a pattern, like you can say, Hey, this has baubles or this has, um, you know,

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stranded color work or stinking or whatever. Um, but those are the kinds of things that you should

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put up front before you sell a pattern. What are the elements in the pattern? Right. What,

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what should you be expected to know before you do this? What's the difficulty level? Um,

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or need even like, cause sometimes you'll get the pattern you think you have all of it. And these,

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this one's minor, but it's like, then you go into it and it's like, Oh, PS to cast on, you actually

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need this size needle. We only told you about this other size needle before you bought it. So now

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it's like, Oh, now I gotta go find this needle again. That's a minor inconvenience, but just

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something to be like, maybe like, I know designers that I won't call out right now that won't put

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the, the stitches, the type of stitches they're using, cause they're afraid if they put it in

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the summary, I put mine in the summary. There's a list at the bottom, all the stitches, stitch types

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I use in the pattern so that if you don't know something or it's not something you want to do,

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you can skip it. You're like, okay, I'm not going to do this. It just says like, Oh, there's knit

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togethers and noops and there's never new, but whatever, but there are, there are, there are

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designers and they didn't tell me there was a new, I at least want to know. No, but there are

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designers that won't do it because they feel like that will allow you to steal down and do this.

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No, like that is so much work. There's a new blood. Let me look at this tiny picture. I am a lazy.

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Listen, listen, I can't do fifth grade math. Like that's a confession right here. I am not

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mapping out how to do your pattern just so I don't have to pay the $6 to download it. Hold on. That

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is not a thing I'm going to do. I need to, I need to get into, into my persona. Oh God.

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Oh God. Let me flick my hair real quick. So like Meg, you don't understand. Like I am a fantastic

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designer and everybody wants to steal my work. So I don't want to let everybody know what's going on.

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I just, like that's, this is, this is me. Like if there's ever an issue where there's some sort of

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math in a pattern, I just whine at Jess until she maths it for me because I don't do that.

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I like, this is not my forte. I can't do it. There is no way I'm reverse engineering anything.

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And you don't need to be like, have my math caliber or lack thereof to just be like,

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that is so much work. Patterns are not, I don't mean to say they're not horrifically expensive,

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but they're not horrifically expensive. They're not. They're a way under price compared to other

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crafts. Other crafts. Absolutely. So I just don't, but I guess, I guess there's also a part of me

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that's like, man, you want to do all that work. Like I shine on you crazy diamond, like go ahead.

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That's a lot of work. I don't know why you ever want to put in that much work. I feel like I,

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I don't know unless somebody like physically stole like my PDF design layout, I'm really not going

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to care. Like if you want to make, if you want to make the dot seed beanie and like it's essentially

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the beanie I made, but like, I don't know, they're flipped or something. And then like, and then like

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you have your own like pattern layout and stuff. Like I literally don't care. I don't know.

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I certainly see. So one of the things, and this is maybe a whole other question for you guys,

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but one of the most common ones I see are people that they want to make a sweater.

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They don't want to do the trouble of grading. So they buy or they take a color work sweater pattern.

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They copy the same stitch counts. They figure out a color work that fits in the same count

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and they market it as their own. Is that piracy? Oh, that's kind of lame. I don't know if that's

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piracy, but that's because it'd be really hard to prove. Yeah. I think it would be hard to prove.

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Yeah. I think it would be hard to prove. Right. But I think it's, it has something more to say

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that you're not, you're, you're not creating a new sweater. You're just creating a new chart.

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Right. Well, and, and it's also like, you're not,

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you let somebody else do the hard work of grading and testing. And, and especially if it comes in

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multiple sizes. Oh, you mean buying somebody else's pattern? Yes. Taking, taking an existing

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sweater pattern. One that you did not, one that you yourself, no, no, no, no. If you want to,

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if you want to slap different charts in there by all means, like that's your sweater. I'm talking

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about like people who take a sweater pattern. Like that exists and you just take it and you find,

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or you create a chart that fits in those same numbers. And then boom, pattern's done. You

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don't have to grade it. You don't have to even really test it. You can just market it. That's

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lame. I think that's a little, I don't like that. I don't like it either because you're basically

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taking half of somebody of somebody else's work. Right. And that's the heavy load. Yeah. Like,

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and I'm not, this is not to denigrate, like making color patterns. Um, there are a lot of fun,

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like to try to play around with color charts and stuff. That's a lot of fun. That's the fun part

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of making a color work sweater. The crappy part is doing all the grading and the stitch counts

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and the different weights and you know, so on and so forth. And I feel like that's kind of taking

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the cheap and dirty way out. I feel like I'm getting kind of snobbish when it comes to sweater

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patterns too. And I'll tell you why, because I feel like I, so the Calliope doesn't bother me

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because it's free. So I don't care. But like, for example, if I'm going to pay for a sweater

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pattern at this point, you better give me darts. You better give me, uh, you better give me German

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short rows. You better give me an ability to adjust the waist, the shoulder, the bust, all custom.

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Like I am not paying for it unless you have legitimately went through and given me a lot

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of fricking options because I have bought way too many patterns at this point for a garment

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where all they change is the bust and they don't consider your cup size. They don't consider like

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your waist. They don't consider your arms. And then like you make this thing and yeah, it fits

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your chest. Great. But like, I can't get my arms through it because I have excess skin or I can't

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like my waist, like it's blooming in my waist because I have a tinier waist than my bust or like,

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it's just like, I'm, I'm a little snobby when it comes to sweater patterns at this point. And I

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think it's honestly because I've tested a few now. I liked some of the ones I tested keyword. Um,

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and I just feel like at this point, it's like almost like not saying that like other sweater

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patterns should be free, but I'm not paying like Boko bucks. Yeah. Yeah. That's my personal choice.

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I am not going to pay Boko bucks. And when I say Boko bucks, I mean like over $10 for a sweater

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pattern that doesn't have an extensive amount of work done to it. Well, yeah, because if you're

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spending the time and the money and the energy to make yourself custom clothes, you want them to

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custom fit. And I think I think honestly, it's because I'm getting bougie with my own pattern.

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So, and I'm not even doing garments. I'm doing accessories. And if my accessory, if I can make

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enough options in my accessories, I feel like you can do it with other things too. Like take the

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time. And if you're not going to take it to time, price it accordingly. Like, and that's fine. Like

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you don't have to take the time. You don't have to make it. I don't think I, you don't have to make

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it size inclusive. I don't, and I know that's a terrible thing. Oh, come after me. You, I will

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support every size inclusive pattern that I see. I think it's really important, but if somebody

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doesn't want to do it, that is their choice. I hope they price it that way. And I hope they deal

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with the fact that there's people that are not going to buy it because it's not size inclusive,

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but it's again, every designer has their own choice of how they're going to put out that

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design in that pattern. And then you choose as a consumer based on how they're presenting. Okay.

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Like this, I'm going to buy from this person because they do all this extra stuff that it is

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size inclusive. It is this, it is that, or I'm our, I, Oh, I know this person's just going to

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give me a chart for my mittens and like nothing else. So I'm not going to buy any further patterns

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or, you know, like whatever. Like I think it's, well, I think to an extent you, you need to,

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um, to own that as well. Um, we've gotten as, as, uh, dyers, we've had some feedback that people

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wish we would offer more non-superwash. It's not our forte. I don't like that. It's something that

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we have tried. We do have two, two non-superwash options. We don't enjoy it. Like we've tried it.

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We really struggle with it. It's definitely not our forte and we're not, we don't hide behind that.

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It's we've been very open with this is not something we enjoy doing. There are so many

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wonderful yarn dyers that do that. And we do not, you know, if, if that is what you were looking

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for, like, man, I can give you a list of people that I absolutely love that I would a hundred

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percent support, but I'm not going to sit here and cry and be like, Oh, you know, we lost these people.

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Like they don't want to shop from us because we don't, we don't use enough non-superwash. It's

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like, that's our choice. They don't like that we use acid dyes. It's like, that's fine too. And that's

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fair. That's a preference. Yup. So it, but it is, we're not going to be like, wow, well, that's awful.

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You should like acid. And it's like, no, you don't have to. People are allowed to have preferences,

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but you don't have to cater to them. Exactly. Well, and it's, but that's the thing. It's like,

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I also, I don't have to cater, but I also don't have the right to complain. Yeah. You know what

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I'm saying? Like it's, that's the ticket. We have made a decision and you have made a decision and

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that's fine. But then it's, it's own that choice. Own the decision that you have made. Yep. Because

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you don't get to tell the rest of the world how they have to behave. You can only choose how you

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behave. And I think that, yeah. And I think that gets back to the whole like, you know,

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is it ethical? Is it not? Is it whatever? I think we've established what illegal is, which is

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basically just, just stealing and putting your name on it. Just straight up plagiarism. But like in

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terms of being ethical or not, you're right. It's at that point, it's you're going to do what you're

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going to do. And based on your own ethos, what is, you know, the answer is going to be based on what,

377
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what's important to you. You have no right to tell other people what you're going to do to them.

378
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Unless they're legitimately plagiarizing your stuff. Listen, if you don't, again, if you don't

379
00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:16,080
see your head cut off, you're also making a t-shirt guys. It's existed. Okay. Like t-shirts are older

380
00:34:16,080 --> 00:34:21,280
than everybody. No. And I think there is something also to be said for like color work motifs or,

381
00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:27,360
you know, if somebody chooses a leaf motif, Oh God, the leaves. And you have a leaf motif. I mean,

382
00:34:27,360 --> 00:34:32,000
there are, if I, if I put leaf motif into Ravelry, I'm going to get 10,000 patterns. Like,

383
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:40,160
you know, I think there's, but I mean, like, I think, I think maybe it's like, and also take a,

384
00:34:40,160 --> 00:34:45,440
take a breather. And I think this is really, this is something that I have struggled with a lot is

385
00:34:46,080 --> 00:34:52,240
take a breath, think. And one of the things that I tell my kids, because I teach politics and that

386
00:34:52,240 --> 00:34:59,920
gets real contentious at times is try to remember or try to at least go into everything, not assuming

387
00:34:59,920 --> 00:35:07,840
the worst out of the person that you feel a problem with. Try to go in with the, with imagining the

388
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best of intentions. They didn't plagiarize unless, I mean, again, unless your head is literally

389
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cropped up. But like, yeah, it's, it's like, okay. So maybe they also had the idea to do a leaf motif

390
00:35:20,400 --> 00:35:25,200
sweater. That doesn't necessarily mean that they're plagiarizing. And I mean, granted, if they, if you

391
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get pushback and they're like, hell yeah, I did steal it. Like, what are you going to do about it?

392
00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:35,280
Yeah. Then you can be upset about it. But again, guys, knitting is so old and it's been around for

393
00:35:35,280 --> 00:35:40,960
so long. There's only so many ways that you can put stitches together. There's, there's so much

394
00:35:40,960 --> 00:35:47,920
that isn't. And I really do feel like going into every, every interaction, elbows up, ready to fight

395
00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:53,360
and assuming that everyone out there is about to steal your product. It's just, I don't, I don't know.

396
00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:57,600
I think that's going to cause more grief than it's going to heal. I feel like most people

397
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don't care enough. I feel like it's there's a lot of isolation too. If you're going to go

398
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as far as to steal, I mean, if you want my personal advice, I think if you're going to be a thief,

399
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be a good thief, you know, like let's, let's look at it from the thief's point of view. Okay.

400
00:36:16,240 --> 00:36:21,760
My D and D character, uh, really is listening to this right now. Okay. All right. Listen,

401
00:36:21,760 --> 00:36:28,560
Raya. No, I'm actually being serious and I'm saying if you're going to be a thief, be a good

402
00:36:28,560 --> 00:36:34,080
thief. And what I mean by that is if you're going to go through with, okay, I'm going to buy this

403
00:36:34,080 --> 00:36:40,080
pattern. I'm going to like, be lazy. I'm not going to do any of this work. Then shoot. The work you

404
00:36:40,080 --> 00:36:46,560
should put in is to make it look like you did it. Right. Like do the extra shift and increase,

405
00:36:46,560 --> 00:36:52,320
like change the word somewhere. Like if you're going to go, if you're going to be lazy,

406
00:36:52,320 --> 00:36:57,840
somebody else's picture, even if it doesn't make sense, if you're going to be lazy in the stealing,

407
00:36:57,840 --> 00:37:04,560
okay. And not do the work there, you should do the work. So I'm making it not look,

408
00:37:05,520 --> 00:37:12,000
it's just like when people take future thieves, it's just like when people take Chad GBT to write

409
00:37:12,000 --> 00:37:16,800
an essay for school, right? Meg's going to love this. And then you take the essay and you're like,

410
00:37:16,800 --> 00:37:20,320
okay, I'm not just going to copy paste it from Chad GBT. I'm going to like go in and like change

411
00:37:20,320 --> 00:37:24,240
some words and like, you know, do this thing. I'm not going to feel bad about telling this story

412
00:37:24,240 --> 00:37:28,560
because it's about a college student. She's an adult. So I don't feel bad. My favorite,

413
00:37:28,560 --> 00:37:35,360
my favorite ever plagiarism story. It's my favorite. I was teaching college and I asked

414
00:37:35,360 --> 00:37:39,840
my kids to write an essay about literally anything like to do with American history. Like they could

415
00:37:39,840 --> 00:37:44,400
pick any topic and they had to connect it to American identity. Like how did this help us

416
00:37:44,400 --> 00:37:49,760
become a country and form an identity? Somebody wrote theirs on the Boston Tea Party. I love this

417
00:37:49,760 --> 00:37:56,560
story. It's a great story. And, and she definitely plagiarized it. And I could, I could tell because

418
00:37:56,560 --> 00:38:02,080
you can, you can tell, especially when you've had a student all semester. But she did that ingenious

419
00:38:02,080 --> 00:38:06,080
thing that kids do where they think they're being really slick. And unfortunately, Chad GBT, like,

420
00:38:06,080 --> 00:38:10,960
they don't have to do this anymore because I can't just take a line and put it in Google and,

421
00:38:10,960 --> 00:38:15,920
and there pops up the article. What she did was she took an article off Google and she

422
00:38:15,920 --> 00:38:21,920
strategically changed words, but the word that she changed was, was tea. And she changed it to

423
00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:29,520
Boston Beverage Party. The entire essay was the Boston Beverage Party. And I was like, oh my God,

424
00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:36,800
the BBP guys, the BBP. That was my favorite. And, and it's, it was scandal. Oh my God.

425
00:38:39,120 --> 00:38:42,960
And it literally took me like five minutes of sitting there and looking at it to be like,

426
00:38:42,960 --> 00:38:46,560
oh my God, that's what she means by this. Like what are you saying? They're like,

427
00:38:46,560 --> 00:38:52,800
what is she talking? What beverage? I was really confused. But yeah, like that's,

428
00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:56,080
but I think honestly, I was thinking about that before when we were talking about like,

429
00:38:56,080 --> 00:39:02,240
um, you know, notes and, um, and stitches, but it's the same with writing in that you,

430
00:39:03,360 --> 00:39:08,960
unless you're Shakespeare, you're not making up words. But if you take an entire sentence

431
00:39:09,600 --> 00:39:17,440
or an entire paragraph that somebody else wrote and you don't credit it, we all, I hope,

432
00:39:18,240 --> 00:39:23,760
except that that is theft. Oh yes. Yeah. That that is dishonest. It's not your work. So

433
00:39:23,760 --> 00:39:29,360
I should hold on to crafting as well. Hold on. Let me put an asterisk on my whole segment back

434
00:39:29,360 --> 00:39:35,440
there. So my asterisk, yeah, this is going to be quote misquoted and then people are going to be

435
00:39:35,440 --> 00:39:42,400
like, she's a thief. No. Um, so here's my asterisk is that entire segment was a joke and you really

436
00:39:42,400 --> 00:39:48,160
shouldn't thief from people. I hope you understood the sarcasm everybody, but, uh, welcome to the

437
00:39:48,160 --> 00:39:58,720
show. Oh my God. A plus plus. Oh God. No, I don't, I don't support thievery. I'm just saying if

438
00:39:58,720 --> 00:40:10,080
you're going to be lazy, damn or Dan Dan. Yeah. Dan. Yeah. Dan. I think, I think it is one of

439
00:40:10,080 --> 00:40:16,880
those things like, like with conscience of if it doesn't feel good, you probably shouldn't be doing

440
00:40:16,880 --> 00:40:24,640
it. I agree. You know, if it do what you, what you do with your craft that this doesn't apply

441
00:40:24,640 --> 00:40:30,640
to sociopaths, by the way, I know, I know, but they have no feelings, but if, if there is something

442
00:40:30,640 --> 00:40:37,920
in the back of your head telling you this is not right, you should probably listen to that. Yeah.

443
00:40:37,920 --> 00:40:44,560
To the little voice. Yeah. I'm just saying things these days are not unique in the knitting world.

444
00:40:44,560 --> 00:40:51,280
Correct. Rarely, very rarely are things unique in the knitting world today. You can't copyright

445
00:40:51,280 --> 00:40:56,400
your stitches, but you can copyright your patterns. Yes. And if you see a pattern and you like it,

446
00:40:56,400 --> 00:41:01,120
you should pay somebody for it. If they put the work in for it and that's what they're asking for,

447
00:41:01,120 --> 00:41:05,280
you should give them what they want, which if free is what they want, free is what they get.

448
00:41:05,840 --> 00:41:13,120
Right. Right. Yeah. And you shouldn't steal. Don't be a thief. If it feels wrong, it probably is

449
00:41:13,120 --> 00:41:21,920
wrong. I agree. That's it for this week's topic for additional content and opportunities to connect

450
00:41:21,920 --> 00:41:28,080
with us, the cast, check out our website at part of my stash.com. Be sure to tune in next time

451
00:41:28,080 --> 00:41:43,520
for more laughs, love, and llamas at part of my stash.