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Hello everybody and welcome to an episode of the Awaken Together podcast.

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I'm Kat.

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I'm Jen.

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And we are leading up to the holidays.

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So with the holidays, you know that food and gift giving are a huge part of the season,

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especially here in the US.

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We're marketed about it through all sorts of mediums, TV, social, online, everywhere

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you look, right?

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So today's episode is all about that over consumption and materialism and attachment

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to things and how those are so closely correlated to identity and societal expectations.

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So Jen and I, we were just talking about our relationships with shopping and materialism

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and all the things and how that's really changed over the years quite a bit.

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So would you like to start by sharing a little bit about your story?

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Yes, Kat.

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And happy holiday season.

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We are here.

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Yeah.

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So it is so funny.

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I was sitting here in reflection, like when did things fully shift for me?

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And I honestly can't even pinpoint an exact.

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So I'm just going to kind of share what I used to look like and where I'm at now and

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just some of the processes that happened on the in between.

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But I remember firstly, like I remember like age 19, like going high heeled shopping.

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Like I had like shoes.

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I'm just guessing I must have been influenced by all the movies of like people with shoe

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closets.

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Yeah, that was like so cool.

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I was like, I have to have all these shoes.

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And yet I also like never like I don't have any memory of hardly ever wearing those shoes.

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But I had this relationship to shopping that was like so, so ingrained.

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I feel like I did a lot of shopping with my family growing up.

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And that was kind of yeah, like a family kind of tradition was to do a lot of shopping,

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especially around the holidays and definitely falling into that over consumption.

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But I remember just filling in time all the time with going to the store.

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Like I would go to work, be exhausted and then head to go clothes shopping, which is

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so far from where I'm at now.

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And it's wild to think that I used to just spend so much time just going to the store

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and buying things that I didn't necessarily even need.

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I think there was such a practice around just going to the store and browsing through and

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just picking stuff out.

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But I reflect back and I think a lot of that was very due to me being so scared of space,

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space to think, space to rest, space to relax, that I think it was almost like a nervous

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habit of like, OK, how can I stay busy?

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How can I keep going?

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I also think probably in those years, my nervous system was so dysfunctional that the fact

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that I would leave work and then want to go do more things that stimulated me is showing

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kind of like where my baseline sympathetic fight, flight, freeze and fawn mode was.

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I was just constantly craving like stress and high sensory input all the time.

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And yeah, I just had so much crap.

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Like I just remember having so much stuff and I think I was proud.

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I was like making money and working and I just didn't really know the value of things

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and where to put all of that.

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I think there was a lot I still had to learn.

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But through yoga teacher training, I know that I did a lot of reflection on my relationship

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to consumption and how much stuff I owned and had.

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I remember doing a giant like purge where we brought items in and kind of release what

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wasn't working anymore and got rid of a bunch of stuff.

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And I remember as I've shared in this podcast before watching the documentary minimalist

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and being really inspired by that.

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And along the journey, I think I piece to that because of my neuro divergences, I pay

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attention a lot to my environment.

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I definitely am always like noticing what's around me.

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And the less stuff that I have around, the more present I can be, I'm not using stuff

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outside of me to distract me as much.

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And yeah, it's beautiful to be in a spot now where I really shop when I absolutely like

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really need to.

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And a lot of times when I do go shopping, I I'm getting rid of stuff to replace it.

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You know, I'm not adding to this like overabundance.

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So there's a few of my points there.

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And why don't you share a little bit of your relationship to stuff and how it's evolved

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as well?

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Yeah, I resonate with a lot of what you said, especially like growing up in a family that

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going shopping was just like a normal thing and something that you did together.

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I know that like my mom and my grandmother, they that's still how they spend time together.

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And it's funny because I call my mom every day.

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I call my grandmother every Sunday.

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And whenever I call them on the weekends, like, oh, what are you doing?

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And over there together, they're shopping like, oh, again.

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Oh, I thought you were just shopping like yesterday or last weekend.

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Oh, we were like, what are you shopping for?

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Like, oh, a dress for this thing.

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I'm like, oh, don't you have a lot of dresses?

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I try not to be judgmental, but it's so hard.

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It's so hard.

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Like, what are you shopping for again?

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And yeah, I don't know.

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I just don't know what else to do.

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I think that might be a part of it at that age.

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I don't know.

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Yeah, so that was a big part of like my growing up experience of like, OK, well, let's go

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shopping.

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Let's spend some time together.

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And my one of my screenings going back to the AIM days was literally shopaholic.

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Can you believe that?

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I think it's really funny now because I don't get imposter syndrome doing many things, but

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shopping clothes shopping, I think is like probably when I experienced the most imposter

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syndrome because I look around, I'm like in my athleisure and everyone is like really

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well dressed.

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And I don't know.

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It's just not a part of my experience.

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Like I try sometimes, but it's not like something you're really passionate about.

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I go shopping now, like maybe once or twice a year max for clothes.

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And yeah, back then it was just like an every week occurrence.

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And it was enough of your identity to put that into AIM screening.

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Yeah, that's a lot.

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Shopaholic 211.

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Holler to girl.

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I love it.

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Oh my God.

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Yeah, it's just wild to think back to that time.

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I had a massive shoe collection just like you.

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My mom still whenever I go back and visit is like, can we go through your old shoes

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and every time like, OK, you can get rid of this fair.

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And it's funny because I don't live in Massachusetts.

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I go back a couple of times a year, but I never wear the shoes that I have there because

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they're really high heels.

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There's still a little part of me that's like, oh, those are actually cute.

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Maybe I'll wear them again one day.

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But I make myself every time I go back, like let go of at least one.

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Love that.

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Love that.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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And then I would just get to make up and just all like the quintessential girly girl things

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because that's the mode that I thought I had to fit into.

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And I would get compliments, you know, on my things.

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And so that filled this void in me that felt like I needed to uphold that and keep up with

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it.

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Kind of like keeping up with the Joneses just to be feel some some sort of worth.

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Mm hmm.

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Yeah, I think that's a really good point that a lot of it is probably just a real lack of

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self love and identity that's not tied in to stuff that's so fleeting.

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I think when you start having a greater sense of self, you kind of see naturally the side

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effect of that is more of a release of this need to validate yourself through what others

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are are perceiving about you, what others are thinking about you.

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I think there's so as we said, we wanted this episode to be to kind of point to the identity

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that can come with stuff.

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And I think when you get over complimented about something, it's very easy for that to

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become an ego identity.

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And I think it's so easy to fall into that with stuff.

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And not that I believe that your clothes can be a sense of expression, a sense of self.

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But you really have to, I think, look at your just overall attachment to that because it's

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not something that is inherently always going to belong to you.

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And you have to know that the grip on that needs to be pretty loose.

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You know, does that make sense?

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It sure does.

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Yeah.

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And the word the yama is a parigraha.

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And this translates literally to non-breed, non possessiveness and non-attachment.

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And yet one of the five yamas from Patanjali's Eight Limbs of Yoga, if you remember that

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episode where we talked about all the yamas, so many yamas.

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So the more that we can unattach ourselves from things, because at the end of the day,

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like Jenny, you were saying this before when we were chatting, but like if all of your

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things burned down in a fire one day, who would you be?

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Who would you be?

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Right.

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If you're so closely tied with your identity to your things, then what happens next?

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You kind of have to rebuild and learn.

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Yeah.

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I think that that is something I try to always check myself on is if I, if I lost this item,

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could I find like a sense of peace even without it?

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I think that's the relationship you should have to the stuff around you.

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And yeah, I mean, coming from a girl who used to participate in Black Friday and go like

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insane and be right at the door ready to like bust some down.

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And I told Kat like shamefully, I literally remember watching the security guard getting

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like trampled at the mall.

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And I was not a part of the trampling, but I was a bystander and I watched it happen.

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And like just we were monsters.

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Like it's actually crazy because it shows so much that that seed of capitalism and greed

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is so deep that we like forget our humanity.

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It's a super big reflection to where we've gotten to as society.

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And I think part of my I used to have fun doing it way less even about the stuff, but

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I thought it was just kind of like this very interesting social experience.

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But now really knowing the intricacies of our system, I'm realizing like how much it

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reflects just as having such a poor order of priorities, you know, and where there's

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so many people that don't even have enough resources and some people that have just an

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overabundance.

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And it is so important to check and stay close to.

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But as you were saying, Kat, like, yeah, we could lose everything.

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And all you have is your relationship to yourself.

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Nothing around you is fully guaranteed.

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But who you are on the inside, when you can become safe with that sense of identity that

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doesn't hinge on external, you're going to be safe no matter what.

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Like that is where your ultimate value needs to be driven to improve, not so much what

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is necessarily around.

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And I've thought of this a lot.

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I've shared my spiritual awakening really happening like hugely around when I had my

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DUI and I ended up in jail.

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And I remember for a moment when I was in jail, having this sense of peace that I hadn't

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felt before, and it was I didn't let it last very long before, you know, driving myself

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back into like complete fear cycle.

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But I was I remember being perplexed why I felt like a sense of peace.

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And it was because in that moment, I had nothing that belonged to me.

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I had nothing I could run to to distract myself.

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I was just there with my thoughts.

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And there was a moment of like, wow, I don't know if I've even let myself have this before,

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like to be able to look around and there's literally nothing I can do but be here.

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I honestly think that was like my first moment of ever feeling that because I've always stayed

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busy.

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I've always found something to be an excuse to not like learn to sit with myself and develop

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a relationship to me.

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And that's something that came along on my spiritual journey that completely shifted

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my priorities, because now, I mean, I could care less about the stuff that I that used

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to have like so much weight.

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Totally.

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And it's that shift in perception of looking outside of ourselves for happiness to looking

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within.

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And that's that's the teacher.

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Right.

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That's everything.

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Yeah.

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And let's talk about.

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Oh, go ahead.

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I think about like how I do have some items that I really like that are important to me.

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But now, whenever I lose an item like that or it breaks, I just tell myself like, oh,

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well, you know, it served me so well.

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And that was it's time to say goodbye.

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And now we parted and it makes space for something else that I love the same or even more to

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come my way.

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It's such a good perspective.

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And, yeah, let's talk sentimental items, because I think that came up a lot in yoga teacher

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training.

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I remember when we had this reflection on our relationship to things outside of us,

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a lot of people had loved ones that had passed away or old relationships where there was

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stuff that they were holding on to that just brought them so many memories.

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And we all really set with that.

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Like, is there potential that some of these items, just even being in our presence, are

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putting us back into old loops of ourselves when we are meant to evolve and grow?

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And yet these items are continuously bringing us to moments in the past.

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And we set with that.

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I remember we had like a giant releasing ceremony of all of our stuff.

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And we had some we had some huge cries as like a group and yoga teacher training people.

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Remember one student in my class brought a rocking chair that had belonged to his grandpa.

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And there was just a lot of realizing that when you look at something and it it flashes

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you back, it can seem so nice to have that.

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And I think there can be processing time or having that can help kind of teeter off from

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the grief that can come with loss.

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But you also have to reflect that if you have all these items that are holding this sentimental

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value, it also potentially could be driving you into past cycles and patterns.

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Yes, absolutely.

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That's like it's not about the actual item itself.

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Right.

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It's about the meaning behind it.

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And I think that's what gets lost on so many people.

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Like I remember growing up my best friend crying when she lost this ring that her grandmother

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gave her.

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And, you know, like at first you think, oh, that's so understandable.

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But like really, it's not about the ring.

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Like it's about her grandmother and her relationship to her and having something that reminded

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her of her.

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And yes, that is really hard not trying to diminish that.

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But like having a moment to celebrate your grandmother in those times can bring you a

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lot more peace than just like trying to find a replacement of the ring that looks similar

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to it, just to like have that physical item back.

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Yeah.

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I think a lot of the root of us holding on to physical items is still kind of based in

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that societal way of thinking of we need stuff to hold value, that our material gains are

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equivalent to status or identity.

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And I think that kind of ends up making us latch to items being so tied in with people.

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And this shifts us right into kind of gift culture, because I remember a lot of the stuff

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that was kind of hard to let go is remembering what people had bought me for gifts and just

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feeling guilty to get rid of certain things.

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And honestly, once again, it's so not a reflection of the item.

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And if someone gets that upset that you no longer have X, Y, Z that they gave you, like

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gifts should not come with the stipulation of how long you keep it.

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If you value it, and that I think comes back to insecurity of putting material focus over

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actual relationship building and things that are more substantial and deeper than that.

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And I think with the gift giving culture, me and Kat both have gifts on the lowest of

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our love language.

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So sorry to the people listening that have gift giving really high.

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I think it's beautiful to be able to give an item and just say like, I was thinking

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of you, here's what I got.

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But I do think we have to watch the pressure that can come with gift giving.

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I feel like personally, when I'm getting gifts from someone repetitively, it adds this like

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social pressure that I need to make sure I stay on top of reciprocating that same way.

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And I think that can get a little tricky.

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I think there is gift giving that can be done with a lot more intention and could be like,

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you know, more crafty, like fun gifts that are a pour out of your creative spirit versus

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having to be these like pricier items or items that hold a lot of like, you know, value to

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them.

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I think that's where we're kind of letting that societal pressure once again, drip into

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what we think is normal when it is not normal to crave social interaction via stuff, you

283
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know, thousand percent.

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Heck yes.

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And I mean, like, let's not fall privy to capitalism.

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Let's not let capitalism win.

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That's what all of this is about.

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Seriously, it's like the things, it's our capitalistic society that teaches us all of

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these things from a really young age of like, the more things you have, the better the shinier

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object, the better you are.

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And that is just so not true.

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So if you're like us, if you're like Jen and I and gift giving is a lot of pressure and

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brings about a lot of expectation, here are a couple of ideas for you.

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You can have a conversation with your friend group if you usually exchange gifts or your

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family and come to an agreement and just kind of say like, hey, I've been doing some thinking

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this holiday season and rather than having a whole gift giving season like we usually

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do, how about we do a white elephant or how about we do a secret Santa or better yet,

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how about we do like a group outing together and we pay for our own individual tickets,

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but that way we're spending the time together.

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The reason I said the white elephant and secret Santa is because then you're getting one gift,

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but everybody gets to still participate in a group exchange.

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So that whole like ceremonial aspect is there, the ritual continues, but you're spending

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a lot less money and it's the same agreed upon upon amount.

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So you're not feeling like, like this comparative nature of, oh, they spent more on me than

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I'm spending on them and all these arbitrary rules that just come with like our normal

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gift giving society and culture.

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And then, I mean, conscious experiences over things.

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I would be absolutely thrilled if a friend asked me, you know, how about we all do this

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really cool thing that we've been talking about.

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We go see the show together and we make it like our holiday get together.

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I'd love that.

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I love giving massages.

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I try to use my physical, like something I can do.

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That's like taking some of my time, which this is right on brand for quality time, love

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language, top, top slide.

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But I like something that is like a service, something that helps you relax, like doing

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yeah, like leading family yoga or like leading a sound bath, like doing something where I

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can kind of pass on this more sense of relaxation and healing versus having to add to this like

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overstimulated kind of mindset.

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And another big point is, first of all, yeah, what you said, Kat, like, oh my gosh, the

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anxiety I used to have making a list of like 30 people I needed to get gifts for coming

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up with an idea for each of them and just stressing myself out, knowing that I was going

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to get gifts from those people and I wanted to make sure I was being kind and reciprocating.

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It was just all too much on already kind of like overstimulating time of the year.

325
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And I think we also need to keep in mind that our planet is suffering now.

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We know that this over consumption, this like fast fashion, we are putting a lot of resources

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into constantly producing items and we really need to tone that back, not just for our own

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mental well-being and less stress to save our mind and body connection, but also our

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planet needs a break.

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Like we are pumping out stuff.

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They've shown that the clothing industry uses so much water.

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There is just so much resources that are being wasted by this overproduction.

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So even like just watching it from that standpoint, not just a mental health standpoint, but knowing

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that we've got to get more conscious on stuff like that.

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It is time, it is needed, and we got to change what is considered normal for our society,

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especially around the holidays.

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Seriously, it's like if there weren't enough reasons, that is a massive one right there.

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So like leaning into thrifting gifts, like using things, let's bust the shame around

339
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that.

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That is cool.

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Items have more of a history, more of a story, and that gives them more character.

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And people always love a story behind something too.

343
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I so agree.

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We wanted to cover a few other things about over consumption.

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So the other like biggie around the holidays, what if we can cut down on some of that need

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to over overly give, overly receive.

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We also want to look at our over consumption on food.

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We wanted to touch briefly on that because it is kind of insane guys.

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If we just like sit with it for a second, this little second that we eat so much for

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Thanksgiving.

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Like I remember last year, I like took a little Thanksgiving kind of break and it felt actually

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really good because first of all, we kind of are learning, you know, more and more that

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there is history to be reflected on in that.

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And I just think some of our traditions, what it's turned into can go from just spending

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time together and gratitude and is so much more like you have to have these 20 dishes.

356
00:24:05,420 --> 00:24:09,800
You're going to get like sick because you ate so much food and then you're going to

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be down for like a week.

358
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And that is like a known thing.

359
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Like what is that?

360
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You guys were like, that's a problem.

361
00:24:17,400 --> 00:24:22,240
Seriously, we just gorge ourselves and that's like, oh, it's the holidays.

362
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I used to eat like six biscuits.

363
00:24:24,320 --> 00:24:25,320
Like, yeah.

364
00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:31,040
And it's like, I know people who will not eat for like a day or two leading up to Thanksgiving

365
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just to quote unquote make room.

366
00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:35,920
Like no, that's not how it works.

367
00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:40,960
You're actually shrinking your stomach first of all, by decreasing your appetite and starving

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yourself.

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And then you're just gorging yourself and your tummy's going to hurt really bad and

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you're going to have some indigestion.

371
00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:48,600
Yeah.

372
00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:51,760
Everyone just like lays around and does it look good for the whole day?

373
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No.

374
00:24:52,760 --> 00:24:57,000
And then you'll be on the toilet the whole next day and nobody wants that.

375
00:24:57,000 --> 00:24:58,480
Let's be real.

376
00:24:58,480 --> 00:24:59,480
Yes.

377
00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:06,120
So even redefining some of the expectations around that, like making it a lot more about

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00:25:06,120 --> 00:25:08,480
the intention of coming together.

379
00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:13,920
I know life can get busy and there can be really little time to actually sit and communicate

380
00:25:13,920 --> 00:25:14,920
together.

381
00:25:14,920 --> 00:25:22,040
I would think of Thanksgiving so much more as sitting and pausing and gratitude, bringing

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00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:28,200
awareness to the fact that we are rewriting a lot of what society's expectations look

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like.

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00:25:29,200 --> 00:25:34,520
And this can be a moment of like deep reflection and deeper communication, actually carving

385
00:25:34,520 --> 00:25:40,560
out the time to make it happen since a lot of us get like holiday around that.

386
00:25:40,560 --> 00:25:45,560
And yeah, redefining what it means, because I think it's really time to do that.

387
00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:47,000
I totally agree.

388
00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:49,080
And hey, like I'm a foodie too.

389
00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:53,040
I love eating, but mindful eating.

390
00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:57,280
It's like a great opportunity to incorporate a little bit of mindfulness into the day at

391
00:25:57,280 --> 00:25:58,560
the holiday table with you.

392
00:25:58,560 --> 00:26:04,000
So just like be with that food that maybe you've been smelling as it's been cooking,

393
00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:10,760
practice gratitude for it, for the moment, for the people surrounding the table with

394
00:26:10,760 --> 00:26:11,760
you.

395
00:26:11,760 --> 00:26:12,760
And yeah, just like listening to your body.

396
00:26:12,760 --> 00:26:14,240
It doesn't have to be so complicated.

397
00:26:14,240 --> 00:26:15,240
Yeah.

398
00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:18,920
And if it's stressful to make every single dish happen in the whole day, it's just this

399
00:26:18,920 --> 00:26:25,920
giant stress to get it done the way you expect it to be also kind of challenging what that

400
00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:30,360
looks like too, because that is super, super important.

401
00:26:30,360 --> 00:26:35,800
And I wanted to share too that, you know, I think as we said, there's so many advertisements

402
00:26:35,800 --> 00:26:40,320
for expectations around holiday season as it is.

403
00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:42,140
It can be very overstimulating.

404
00:26:42,140 --> 00:26:48,960
We talked about this in our hacking the holidays last year at this time when we had that episode.

405
00:26:48,960 --> 00:26:53,840
But I think a lot for a lot of us, if this is a time where you're going to be around

406
00:26:53,840 --> 00:27:00,060
more family or family you're not usually around with, you're allowed to carve out boundaries

407
00:27:00,060 --> 00:27:01,060
for that.

408
00:27:01,060 --> 00:27:07,000
I think so much of the overeating and over snacking isn't always just because you're

409
00:27:07,000 --> 00:27:09,200
just deciding to do it for the holidays.

410
00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:14,420
I think a lot of it is so unconscious because you're trying to regulate yourself because

411
00:27:14,420 --> 00:27:17,580
all that is happening around you is just too much.

412
00:27:17,580 --> 00:27:23,340
So versus like heading to something to snack to because you're literally stressed out listening

413
00:27:23,340 --> 00:27:25,920
to the conversations that are happening around you.

414
00:27:25,920 --> 00:27:28,280
Why don't you just go take a little outside break?

415
00:27:28,280 --> 00:27:30,520
Say you know, I'm feeling a little antsy.

416
00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:36,480
I'm feeling like I just need to go take a little piece, a little moment of peace, maybe

417
00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:40,520
going to your room a little more often and just sitting and going and take taking some

418
00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:41,520
deep breaths.

419
00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:46,600
I think a lot of our eating habits can point to the state of our nervous system.

420
00:27:46,600 --> 00:27:52,980
And I know that when it's a lot, I either under eat or overeat because I'm really trying

421
00:27:52,980 --> 00:27:59,920
just to deal instead of like carving out the boundaries, which I now know are so important

422
00:27:59,920 --> 00:28:05,520
to give myself actual breaks so that I'm not just trying to cope and coast through it.

423
00:28:05,520 --> 00:28:06,520
Totally.

424
00:28:06,520 --> 00:28:07,520
So well said.

425
00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:12,200
And if you want more tips like that, definitely go listen back to that episode hacking the

426
00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:14,840
holidays from last year, like Jen said.

427
00:28:14,840 --> 00:28:18,640
And next week, we're also going to be talking about this a little bit more.

428
00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:23,560
Just like how to calm your nervous system down, a little bit of review as well as a

429
00:28:23,560 --> 00:28:25,040
meditation around the five senses.

430
00:28:25,040 --> 00:28:29,240
You can take that into the rest of the holiday season with you.

431
00:28:29,240 --> 00:28:33,160
We are so grateful for all of our listeners.

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00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:38,760
Stay tuned for December 1st, where we are going to offer another giveaway for sharing

433
00:28:38,760 --> 00:28:43,520
our posts and continuing to spread the word of our Awaken Together podcast.

434
00:28:43,520 --> 00:28:48,360
We are growing each and every season and we want to keep adding to our community.

435
00:28:48,360 --> 00:28:50,020
So thank you guys for being here.

436
00:28:50,020 --> 00:28:55,240
Thank you for reviewing our podcast and please continue to share it with people you love

437
00:28:55,240 --> 00:28:58,840
so we can grow and keep building.

438
00:28:58,840 --> 00:28:59,840
Thanks so much, everybody.

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00:28:59,840 --> 00:29:00,840
We love you.

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00:29:00,840 --> 00:29:01,840
See you next week.

441
00:29:01,840 --> 00:29:02,840
Bye.

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Free