1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:07,680 Hello everyone and welcome to the Awaken Together podcast. 2 00:00:07,680 --> 00:00:14,560 I am Jen and we don't have Kat today, but I have a very special guest that I want to 3 00:00:14,560 --> 00:00:15,560 introduce. 4 00:00:15,560 --> 00:00:23,560 We are going to cover the topics of neurodivergences and sensory needs, which encompasses all 5 00:00:23,560 --> 00:00:24,920 kinds of stuff. 6 00:00:24,920 --> 00:00:27,620 So we're going to talk it out with you. 7 00:00:27,620 --> 00:00:30,640 So welcome my good friend, Haley. 8 00:00:30,640 --> 00:00:32,640 Hi everyone. 9 00:00:32,640 --> 00:00:35,640 Excited to be here. 10 00:00:35,640 --> 00:00:38,680 We're so happy to have you. 11 00:00:38,680 --> 00:00:47,240 Me and Haley met on a random bachelorette party trip and connected right away. 12 00:00:47,240 --> 00:00:54,320 She is an occupational therapist, so she's in the rehab world with me. 13 00:00:54,320 --> 00:01:00,160 And yeah, we connected right away and since then have had so many breakdowns of conversations 14 00:01:00,160 --> 00:01:04,380 on sensory needs in general, what that looks like. 15 00:01:04,380 --> 00:01:06,960 I think we can nerd out on this subject forever. 16 00:01:06,960 --> 00:01:07,960 Oh yeah. 17 00:01:07,960 --> 00:01:11,040 One of my favorite topics. 18 00:01:11,040 --> 00:01:12,040 Yeah. 19 00:01:12,040 --> 00:01:16,940 So tell us a little bit first of what your job entails and then I can kind of share my 20 00:01:16,940 --> 00:01:24,160 personal experience with the term even neurodivergences and what sensory needs actually even means 21 00:01:24,160 --> 00:01:25,160 to you. 22 00:01:25,160 --> 00:01:26,160 Yeah. 23 00:01:26,160 --> 00:01:30,340 As you said, I'm an occupational therapist, but I work in the realm of children under 24 00:01:30,340 --> 00:01:31,340 OT. 25 00:01:31,340 --> 00:01:32,340 That's scope. 26 00:01:32,340 --> 00:01:39,040 We get to do sensory integration and we work with a lot of kids on autism spectrum, Down 27 00:01:39,040 --> 00:01:44,080 syndrome, just kind of all over the board with diagnoses specifically. 28 00:01:44,080 --> 00:01:45,080 Yeah. 29 00:01:45,080 --> 00:01:52,040 Like you'll kind of see an OT swinging kids around on different spandex equipment or swings 30 00:01:52,040 --> 00:01:54,280 or getting it like slides. 31 00:01:54,280 --> 00:01:58,760 There's just the equipment is what usually people like think of first when they think 32 00:01:58,760 --> 00:02:01,400 of OT, I feel like. 33 00:02:01,400 --> 00:02:04,680 So yeah, it's all that good stuff. 34 00:02:04,680 --> 00:02:05,680 Very cool. 35 00:02:05,680 --> 00:02:06,680 Yeah. 36 00:02:06,680 --> 00:02:09,800 Do you guys actually use the term neurodivergences? 37 00:02:09,800 --> 00:02:15,240 Do you hear that in your professional world or more just outside of it? 38 00:02:15,240 --> 00:02:19,160 So we use that and we'll say like neurotypical and like neurodivergent. 39 00:02:19,160 --> 00:02:21,720 Yeah, we'll use both of those. 40 00:02:21,720 --> 00:02:22,720 Okay. 41 00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:27,720 And so neurodivergences, if you've never heard that term and you're listening, the everything 42 00:02:27,720 --> 00:02:34,760 it kind of encompasses like the full spectrum, which can include ADHD, sensory processing 43 00:02:34,760 --> 00:02:42,640 disorders, dyslexia, autism, Asperger's, OCD, all of that. 44 00:02:42,640 --> 00:02:43,640 Correct. 45 00:02:43,640 --> 00:02:44,640 Oh yeah. 46 00:02:44,640 --> 00:02:45,640 All that good stuff. 47 00:02:45,640 --> 00:02:48,160 I think kind of is like the umbrella term. 48 00:02:48,160 --> 00:02:49,280 Yeah. 49 00:02:49,280 --> 00:02:53,400 And so I had not even heard the word neurodivergences. 50 00:02:53,400 --> 00:02:57,680 I personally was diagnosed with ADHD like very young. 51 00:02:57,680 --> 00:03:04,320 I think they told my mom that around age five, but she didn't really believe in treatment 52 00:03:04,320 --> 00:03:05,320 stuff. 53 00:03:05,320 --> 00:03:07,040 I got no help with that growing up. 54 00:03:07,040 --> 00:03:12,440 So I went through school, like I was known as the problem child that just like wouldn't 55 00:03:12,440 --> 00:03:17,720 sit still, like constantly like sit down, Jennifer, stop talking, always getting in trouble 56 00:03:17,720 --> 00:03:19,560 for my behavior. 57 00:03:19,560 --> 00:03:27,160 My mom was a little bit, she liked my uniqueness and I think she did stand by me with that 58 00:03:27,160 --> 00:03:28,460 side pretty well. 59 00:03:28,460 --> 00:03:31,400 So she would just be like, that's how she is. 60 00:03:31,400 --> 00:03:38,700 So she kind of embraced it as being who I am, not really a mental kind of disorder that 61 00:03:38,700 --> 00:03:41,840 maybe I could get some like outside help to assist with. 62 00:03:41,840 --> 00:03:45,600 She was just like, Jennifer's just quirky, you know? 63 00:03:45,600 --> 00:03:47,160 That's how it got written off. 64 00:03:47,160 --> 00:03:51,920 But as I got older, I got treatment for it in college. 65 00:03:51,920 --> 00:03:58,880 I could not believe when I was first like medicated for it, like the night and day difference. 66 00:03:58,880 --> 00:04:02,920 And I was like, if my brain is supposed to work like this, the difference between the 67 00:04:02,920 --> 00:04:06,400 two is like profound. 68 00:04:06,400 --> 00:04:08,600 And I was shocked by that. 69 00:04:08,600 --> 00:04:14,040 And then I read, I think the big turning page where I got like even deeper into this was 70 00:04:14,040 --> 00:04:20,560 the book, The Divergent Mind, where I really got to read kind of the newer studies on what 71 00:04:20,560 --> 00:04:27,160 has been done, especially in women in the neurodivergent field, which is still relatively 72 00:04:27,160 --> 00:04:33,400 newer and just hearing all the different details, what that looks like and how much it actually 73 00:04:33,400 --> 00:04:38,320 was playing out in my day-to-day life in ways I didn't realize. 74 00:04:38,320 --> 00:04:39,880 Yeah, absolutely. 75 00:04:39,880 --> 00:04:46,680 I mean, girls and boys present in completely different ways, especially with like autism, 76 00:04:46,680 --> 00:04:50,400 that's kind of who I see the most. 77 00:04:50,400 --> 00:04:54,920 They're presented so differently that boys are a little bit easier to diagnose and you 78 00:04:54,920 --> 00:04:58,560 can diagnose them sooner, as early as like three years old. 79 00:04:58,560 --> 00:05:04,120 But girls can go a lot, lot longer, just kind of like, we use the term masking. 80 00:05:04,120 --> 00:05:11,640 You can mask like your different, I get people will say their quirks or their sensory needs. 81 00:05:11,640 --> 00:05:17,240 And there's like adult women our age that probably have some sort of level of autism, 82 00:05:17,240 --> 00:05:20,800 but will never have never been diagnosed. 83 00:05:20,800 --> 00:05:26,960 And I think the schools are doing a lot better these days of giving kids IEPs to like allow 84 00:05:26,960 --> 00:05:33,160 them to have like a fidget in class or like some extra movement breaks or to help some 85 00:05:33,160 --> 00:05:37,520 of those kids like you that were like the quote unquote problem child when they just 86 00:05:37,520 --> 00:05:40,960 really needed some like additional sensory supports. 87 00:05:40,960 --> 00:05:45,080 So luckily they are making strides in that. 88 00:05:45,080 --> 00:05:46,880 But that is good to hear. 89 00:05:46,880 --> 00:05:49,360 Can you explain masking a little bit more? 90 00:05:49,360 --> 00:05:54,880 Because that is, that was definitely a term that I had not heard and didn't really realize 91 00:05:54,880 --> 00:05:57,080 until I read that book, which you've also read. 92 00:05:57,080 --> 00:05:59,640 You said they made you read it in school, which I freaking love that. 93 00:05:59,640 --> 00:06:00,640 Yeah. 94 00:06:00,640 --> 00:06:05,640 Tell me a little bit more about masking and also how masking do you see that? 95 00:06:05,640 --> 00:06:09,600 I guess you don't see as much in children because they are hiding anything, but I'm 96 00:06:09,600 --> 00:06:14,400 sure you see it in the parents behavior too. 97 00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:15,400 Yeah. 98 00:06:15,400 --> 00:06:19,840 And so the children I see haven't learned how to mask yet. 99 00:06:19,840 --> 00:06:23,480 So that's why they're obviously already at therapy. 100 00:06:23,480 --> 00:06:29,120 They've been referred to because you know, they're already exhibiting these behaviors. 101 00:06:29,120 --> 00:06:35,920 But as far as like adults go, we are kind of all masking our like sensory needs in a 102 00:06:35,920 --> 00:06:36,920 way. 103 00:06:36,920 --> 00:06:42,920 Like now you know your preferences of like how much you can tolerate like certain textured 104 00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:46,200 clothings that might like irritate you. 105 00:06:46,200 --> 00:06:51,120 Or I think the most common thing people will think of with masking is like your facial 106 00:06:51,120 --> 00:06:52,120 expression. 107 00:06:52,120 --> 00:06:59,680 Like when you're in a group of people socializing, you kind of naturally have this like happier 108 00:06:59,680 --> 00:07:00,680 looking face. 109 00:07:00,680 --> 00:07:06,320 You know, you're like want people to come to conversate with you and appear like you're 110 00:07:06,320 --> 00:07:07,320 happy. 111 00:07:07,320 --> 00:07:11,320 But sometimes neurodivergent minds don't see the need. 112 00:07:11,320 --> 00:07:12,960 They feel like that's kind of trivial. 113 00:07:12,960 --> 00:07:17,540 Like why does my facial expression have to match like what I'm talking about? 114 00:07:17,540 --> 00:07:23,920 So they mask and you know, they'll kind of take off their mask later. 115 00:07:23,920 --> 00:07:29,800 And it's more of just like you can see your facial expression just kind of go blank is 116 00:07:29,800 --> 00:07:34,520 usually how they present when they're not masking. 117 00:07:34,520 --> 00:07:38,760 It's kind of just like the way they present themselves to like in front of other people 118 00:07:38,760 --> 00:07:39,760 basically. 119 00:07:39,760 --> 00:07:40,760 Yeah. 120 00:07:40,760 --> 00:07:46,280 And that was I started I think I really started like learning that term from TikTok and being 121 00:07:46,280 --> 00:07:51,480 on neurodivergent TikTok and getting to see all the videos I really saw. 122 00:07:51,480 --> 00:07:54,440 I really kind of connected that for myself. 123 00:07:54,440 --> 00:07:58,960 There's so many things that I think because I didn't get like a proper treatment that 124 00:07:58,960 --> 00:08:04,080 I just naturally started learning that, oh, people respond better when I'm not moving 125 00:08:04,080 --> 00:08:05,080 so much. 126 00:08:05,080 --> 00:08:09,400 And you know, I just did all these things to make people comfortable, which you hear 127 00:08:09,400 --> 00:08:12,640 people talk about chronic people pleasing. 128 00:08:12,640 --> 00:08:18,240 It could actually be that you've just kind of learned that when you act out in the way 129 00:08:18,240 --> 00:08:23,160 that feels more natural to you, it kind of disturbs the person in front of you. 130 00:08:23,160 --> 00:08:27,920 Like I notice if I'm tapping like as much as probably I'm like wanting to or wanting 131 00:08:27,920 --> 00:08:34,920 to like rock more fidget, like it really does like rub a lot of people wrong if I'm like 132 00:08:34,920 --> 00:08:35,920 all over the place. 133 00:08:35,920 --> 00:08:40,000 So I think I naturally learned like, let me hold a little bit more still. 134 00:08:40,000 --> 00:08:44,560 Let me make better eye contact and just these little things. 135 00:08:44,560 --> 00:08:51,040 But I think what was profound for me to learn and I went on kind of a deep dive in addition 136 00:08:51,040 --> 00:08:53,760 to that, that divergent mind book. 137 00:08:53,760 --> 00:09:01,880 But masking really causes long term effects and we hear the term burnout and exhaustion, 138 00:09:01,880 --> 00:09:03,700 like just chronic fatigue. 139 00:09:03,700 --> 00:09:09,960 And a lot of that can be because it is so much to not honor those like normal ticks 140 00:09:09,960 --> 00:09:15,120 and stems and just the things your body naturally needs to kind of output energy. 141 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:16,520 It's really hard on you. 142 00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:21,800 And so I'm sure in your profession, Haley, finding a balance between the kids being able 143 00:09:21,800 --> 00:09:27,820 to kind of exist in the world we've created, but also honor some of their own quirks. 144 00:09:27,820 --> 00:09:32,740 There's like a balance there because you can't teach kids to fully not play the game we've 145 00:09:32,740 --> 00:09:38,560 created, but at the same time, you don't want them having to blend in so much that yeah, 146 00:09:38,560 --> 00:09:41,360 they're having to repress kind of all of their natural instincts. 147 00:09:41,360 --> 00:09:42,360 Yeah. 148 00:09:42,360 --> 00:09:46,520 And I mean, it's mentally exhausting for them. 149 00:09:46,520 --> 00:09:52,320 I'm sure like you're constantly having to be on and they're not really giving their 150 00:09:52,320 --> 00:09:55,320 brain like a break. 151 00:09:55,320 --> 00:10:01,600 So it would be, I think just the more we talk about it and how people know like, okay, Jen's 152 00:10:01,600 --> 00:10:04,520 over here like tapping away at the table, just let her do her thing. 153 00:10:04,520 --> 00:10:07,080 Like she just needs that input right now. 154 00:10:07,080 --> 00:10:08,720 And like that's okay. 155 00:10:08,720 --> 00:10:13,440 And then, but you know, for the other person, like that tapping noise might be like an auditory 156 00:10:13,440 --> 00:10:15,200 defensiveness thing for them. 157 00:10:15,200 --> 00:10:18,200 And so then that's also a sensory thing going on. 158 00:10:18,200 --> 00:10:24,400 So I just really feel like every person, whether you're neurotypical or neurodivergent has 159 00:10:24,400 --> 00:10:27,960 some sort of sensory defensiveness or something going on. 160 00:10:27,960 --> 00:10:31,840 Like I personally feel like I have a bit of like auditory defensiveness. 161 00:10:31,840 --> 00:10:34,640 Like I just hate some certain noises. 162 00:10:34,640 --> 00:10:39,360 I know that about myself and I know like how much of that input I can like tolerate before 163 00:10:39,360 --> 00:10:45,720 I get tempered or start to get overstimulated, which we'll talk about. 164 00:10:45,720 --> 00:10:46,720 Yeah. 165 00:10:46,720 --> 00:10:50,960 You kind of have to, the first step is definitely identifying what your sensory quirks are. 166 00:10:50,960 --> 00:10:51,960 Yeah. 167 00:10:51,960 --> 00:10:56,020 And I want to build off of that exactly what you said. 168 00:10:56,020 --> 00:11:01,200 It's not, I don't think it's that necessarily it was like unpleasing necessarily for the 169 00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:06,280 other person to see me like rocking and moving, but I can be triggering overstimulation for 170 00:11:06,280 --> 00:11:07,280 another person. 171 00:11:07,280 --> 00:11:12,020 And it's so interesting because I think a lot of the things that we write off as people's 172 00:11:12,020 --> 00:11:19,860 personalities really underlying all of that is probably some form of a sensory issue or 173 00:11:19,860 --> 00:11:20,860 a neurodivergency. 174 00:11:20,860 --> 00:11:26,640 And the problem is though, when we don't learn proper communication to explain it, it can 175 00:11:26,640 --> 00:11:27,640 come off so personal. 176 00:11:27,640 --> 00:11:31,480 And I think that's where the masking starts happening because you don't want to get hurt. 177 00:11:31,480 --> 00:11:34,780 There's like a emotional connection to that. 178 00:11:34,780 --> 00:11:40,600 So learning to communicate, like I don't want you to feel bad, like do what you got to do, 179 00:11:40,600 --> 00:11:42,500 but that's just like kind of a lot for me. 180 00:11:42,500 --> 00:11:43,500 So I just need a second. 181 00:11:43,500 --> 00:11:47,240 And we're like just saying that you need space, but making it more about you instead of, can 182 00:11:47,240 --> 00:11:53,040 you stop moving or can you stop making that noise or these little lines that I know a 183 00:11:53,040 --> 00:11:59,240 lot of parents that probably never got diagnosed that are like on the brink of overstimulation 184 00:11:59,240 --> 00:12:07,260 probably snap at their kids a lot for these little things, but there's really a real need 185 00:12:07,260 --> 00:12:12,000 to learn how to communicate it and make it about advertising your own needs instead of 186 00:12:12,000 --> 00:12:15,620 blaming the other person for what they're naturally doing. 187 00:12:15,620 --> 00:12:22,200 One of those things is when I get very excited with my ADHD, I talk faster and louder and 188 00:12:22,200 --> 00:12:28,100 I the one wound for me is like, Jen, please like quieter, like stop. 189 00:12:28,100 --> 00:12:30,200 And so then all of a sudden I just won't want to talk. 190 00:12:30,200 --> 00:12:31,560 I'll be like, Oh crap. 191 00:12:31,560 --> 00:12:32,560 Like I, yeah, sorry. 192 00:12:32,560 --> 00:12:35,280 I was on like volume contrary. 193 00:12:35,280 --> 00:12:37,080 I hear what you mean. 194 00:12:37,080 --> 00:12:41,900 And so I think a way that would make me feel less hurt with that, that would also be addressing 195 00:12:41,900 --> 00:12:47,500 is someone saying, Hey Jen, real quick, I'm like super sensitive to sound. 196 00:12:47,500 --> 00:12:50,660 And I don't know, like there's just a lot of noise going on in the background and the 197 00:12:50,660 --> 00:12:52,760 volume, like it's all just making me nervous. 198 00:12:52,760 --> 00:12:57,500 Like, can I just have like a two second pause or like just sharing something like that? 199 00:12:57,500 --> 00:13:01,100 And then I'll hear you without making it feel like such a personal attack. 200 00:13:01,100 --> 00:13:06,460 You know, there's a way that we can find like a balance between those things. 201 00:13:06,460 --> 00:13:07,460 And it's tough too. 202 00:13:07,460 --> 00:13:12,980 Like if you don't know what your sensory quirks are, like if they're not able to communicate 203 00:13:12,980 --> 00:13:18,420 that or haven't even realized, Hey, I'm feeling this way and kind of aggravated because of, 204 00:13:18,420 --> 00:13:22,560 you know, that volume or something like, like if they can't make that connection and they're 205 00:13:22,560 --> 00:13:28,220 just feel they're, they're probably gonna be like, I don't like her because you know, 206 00:13:28,220 --> 00:13:34,060 she had a bad, um, I'm gonna try to like, like I didn't feel good around that person 207 00:13:34,060 --> 00:13:35,060 at that moment. 208 00:13:35,060 --> 00:13:36,060 Yeah. 209 00:13:36,060 --> 00:13:38,980 Cause she's triggering for me, but they might not know why. 210 00:13:38,980 --> 00:13:42,260 So that's also tough if they've never been educated in that either. 211 00:13:42,260 --> 00:13:44,260 They've never heard of their sensory stuff. 212 00:13:44,260 --> 00:13:45,260 Then. 213 00:13:45,260 --> 00:13:46,260 Yeah. 214 00:13:46,260 --> 00:13:48,820 That's why the, yeah, this is super important. 215 00:13:48,820 --> 00:13:50,780 So yeah, let's talk a little bit about that. 216 00:13:50,780 --> 00:13:56,300 We can also go into like what over stimulation and like what under stimulation looks like, 217 00:13:56,300 --> 00:13:59,000 but you want to think of it kind of in terms of the senses, right? 218 00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:02,100 Like some people take in way more visual input. 219 00:14:02,100 --> 00:14:04,920 Some people take in more audio input. 220 00:14:04,920 --> 00:14:07,420 Some people are very tactile sensitive. 221 00:14:07,420 --> 00:14:09,820 So sensitive to textures. 222 00:14:09,820 --> 00:14:13,740 Some people will see this as they eat just in textures with food. 223 00:14:13,740 --> 00:14:14,740 Yeah. 224 00:14:14,740 --> 00:14:19,220 Can you just go over a little bit more of what each of the senses and what that looks 225 00:14:19,220 --> 00:14:23,100 like and maybe even how you guys do kind of evaluations on that? 226 00:14:23,100 --> 00:14:24,100 Yeah. 227 00:14:24,100 --> 00:14:29,700 So like the first place to start is everybody kind of thinks that there's five senses when 228 00:14:29,700 --> 00:14:32,100 there's actually eight of them. 229 00:14:32,100 --> 00:14:33,100 And so we'll go into these. 230 00:14:33,100 --> 00:14:35,860 There we'll start with like tactile. 231 00:14:35,860 --> 00:14:43,300 So your touch that is, I see it more of like kids who have aversion to like tags in their 232 00:14:43,300 --> 00:14:51,940 clothes or light touches can be very like aversive for some of the children that I see. 233 00:14:51,940 --> 00:14:54,580 Then we have your sense of smell. 234 00:14:54,580 --> 00:14:55,580 We don't see that. 235 00:14:55,580 --> 00:15:00,420 That is a really tough one to try to work on. 236 00:15:00,420 --> 00:15:06,340 And some kids do have a really strong sense of smell and can, you know, are more susceptible 237 00:15:06,340 --> 00:15:08,580 to like gagging from random smells. 238 00:15:08,580 --> 00:15:10,180 Usually it's around food related. 239 00:15:10,180 --> 00:15:14,340 That is like the toughest one to try to like treat. 240 00:15:14,340 --> 00:15:18,180 But so we have our smell. 241 00:15:18,180 --> 00:15:19,180 We have our sight. 242 00:15:19,180 --> 00:15:22,140 Some kids are very visually overstimulated. 243 00:15:22,140 --> 00:15:28,260 So you kind of try to like neutralize like their workspace, you know, or they might have 244 00:15:28,260 --> 00:15:29,980 one eye is stronger than the other one. 245 00:15:29,980 --> 00:15:35,660 So you try to do different activities to strengthen like their ocular motor skills. 246 00:15:35,660 --> 00:15:39,420 And then we'll have our taste. 247 00:15:39,420 --> 00:15:44,980 Obviously we work on feeding a lot in OT and we try to do it sensory based feeding. 248 00:15:44,980 --> 00:15:48,620 So we try to start with can the child touch the food? 249 00:15:48,620 --> 00:15:50,100 Can they now smell the food? 250 00:15:50,100 --> 00:15:52,540 Can they now like kiss it, lick it? 251 00:15:52,540 --> 00:15:54,580 And then we try to take bites. 252 00:15:54,580 --> 00:15:58,220 And it's usually a very slow process to get through all the steps. 253 00:15:58,220 --> 00:16:03,620 But we find that we do see a lot more success when you could do it, break it up into like 254 00:16:03,620 --> 00:16:08,100 those, you know, each of those sensory areas with food. 255 00:16:08,100 --> 00:16:10,540 So then we have our auditory. 256 00:16:10,540 --> 00:16:17,420 So like I said, I kind of have some auditory defensiveness, but some of these kids are the 257 00:16:17,420 --> 00:16:23,500 sound of the toilet is terrifying to them or like the hand dryer in the bathroom. 258 00:16:23,500 --> 00:16:26,140 Sirens are a big one. 259 00:16:26,140 --> 00:16:27,720 The vacuum, you know. 260 00:16:27,720 --> 00:16:32,900 So all of these different sounds, sometimes they will just go into like a panic mode. 261 00:16:32,900 --> 00:16:35,660 It's kind of like the fight, flight or freeze. 262 00:16:35,660 --> 00:16:38,140 That's exactly what they're feeling. 263 00:16:38,140 --> 00:16:41,220 They think, you know, we're being attacked basically. 264 00:16:41,220 --> 00:16:43,140 The vacuum's coming to get us. 265 00:16:43,140 --> 00:16:45,220 So we work on those sort of things. 266 00:16:45,220 --> 00:16:49,940 So those are our all five senses that we all kind of know group learning. 267 00:16:49,940 --> 00:16:56,100 So the other three are vestibular proprioceptive and interoception. 268 00:16:56,100 --> 00:16:59,300 The vestibular is it's within our ear. 269 00:16:59,300 --> 00:17:03,420 It has to do with like the crystals within inside your ear canal. 270 00:17:03,420 --> 00:17:07,940 And it gives you it shows you where your body is in space. 271 00:17:07,940 --> 00:17:11,700 Basically it's kind of the way of telling your brain, hey, I'm not floating around in 272 00:17:11,700 --> 00:17:14,940 the sky like I'm standing on the ground. 273 00:17:14,940 --> 00:17:23,220 So we'll provide the vestibular input through the use of swings or scooter boards or doing 274 00:17:23,220 --> 00:17:25,660 yoga is a great way. 275 00:17:25,660 --> 00:17:31,740 Anything that can like invert the plane that you're in, head upside down, rolling, anything 276 00:17:31,740 --> 00:17:33,700 like that counts as vestibular. 277 00:17:33,700 --> 00:17:38,540 So some of the kids that I see, they probably do feel like their body is floating around 278 00:17:38,540 --> 00:17:39,540 in space. 279 00:17:39,540 --> 00:17:41,700 They're just not within their body at all. 280 00:17:41,700 --> 00:17:48,780 And then we have proprioceptive input, which is kind of any kind of input into your muscles 281 00:17:48,780 --> 00:17:49,780 and your joints. 282 00:17:49,780 --> 00:17:55,740 So think of like heavy work, kind of workout at the gym with weights, anything weight bearing, 283 00:17:55,740 --> 00:17:57,060 stuff like that. 284 00:17:57,060 --> 00:18:03,100 So that's, and it also gives you the idea of how much pressure that you need to use 285 00:18:03,100 --> 00:18:04,420 for like pressure grading. 286 00:18:04,420 --> 00:18:09,340 So like, I know if I go push that door, how much pressure muscles I'm going to have to 287 00:18:09,340 --> 00:18:15,500 use to like get it open without it flinging across, like breaking the glass or something. 288 00:18:15,500 --> 00:18:22,140 So that's proprioceptive input and then interoception is all of the feeling you have inside your 289 00:18:22,140 --> 00:18:23,140 body. 290 00:18:23,140 --> 00:18:27,780 So like, I can tell when I have stomach ache, I can tell when I need to use the bathroom. 291 00:18:27,780 --> 00:18:31,700 So that was also a tough one. 292 00:18:31,700 --> 00:18:37,820 Usually see problems with that when like toileting and potty training comes up and they're having 293 00:18:37,820 --> 00:18:41,620 a really hard time with that, then they'll come to OT. 294 00:18:41,620 --> 00:18:42,620 So yeah. 295 00:18:42,620 --> 00:18:43,620 Yeah. 296 00:18:43,620 --> 00:18:46,460 So insightful, it's so insightful. 297 00:18:46,460 --> 00:18:54,300 And it's so important that with all of those, all of those sensory needs, the fact that 298 00:18:54,300 --> 00:18:59,100 we're starting to address them more in kids and seeing it as significant as it is, my 299 00:18:59,100 --> 00:19:03,060 husband's also a behavioral therapist and works with a lot of the behaviors that are 300 00:19:03,060 --> 00:19:08,340 coming up from what Haley's working on in OT from their sensory needs not being met. 301 00:19:08,340 --> 00:19:14,780 And then it looking like really bad behavior when in reality it's one of these things just 302 00:19:14,780 --> 00:19:20,300 not being addressed or not being received by the mind and body connection enough or 303 00:19:20,300 --> 00:19:21,860 properly. 304 00:19:21,860 --> 00:19:28,380 And I think so many adults are walking around having had these maybe limitations in one 305 00:19:28,380 --> 00:19:33,200 of those categories or receiving too much information in one of those categories. 306 00:19:33,200 --> 00:19:38,700 And then they're trying to move through life and they just are coming off like they are 307 00:19:38,700 --> 00:19:42,020 very easily angry and frustrated. 308 00:19:42,020 --> 00:19:47,860 And it's, I just all, once you learn about sensory needs, almost every behavior, I'm 309 00:19:47,860 --> 00:19:51,940 just like, I link it to sensory stuff. 310 00:19:51,940 --> 00:19:58,580 So I think it's so much of what we're actually dealing with and seeing within people. 311 00:19:58,580 --> 00:20:05,700 To go on some of the ones you spoke of with my, I have ADHD and dyslexia and I definitely 312 00:20:05,700 --> 00:20:09,340 have a lot of sensory issues, but who knows? 313 00:20:09,340 --> 00:20:15,620 I'm going to fall on the spectrum even deeper if I go on more of a deep dive into that direction. 314 00:20:15,620 --> 00:20:25,260 But I, as a child, I remember also like I would spend for hours a day and I loved to 315 00:20:25,260 --> 00:20:29,580 spend like constantly on a chair, constantly to spend in the middle of the living room 316 00:20:29,580 --> 00:20:31,260 and doing flips. 317 00:20:31,260 --> 00:20:35,260 Like I did flips all the time, not realizing that I was just trying to like bring some 318 00:20:35,260 --> 00:20:37,260 sensation to my body. 319 00:20:37,260 --> 00:20:40,220 And I just had this natural instinct of doing that. 320 00:20:40,220 --> 00:20:43,700 And I also never wanted to have clothes on. 321 00:20:43,700 --> 00:20:47,980 I hated touch sensation on me. 322 00:20:47,980 --> 00:20:49,700 I could not stand it. 323 00:20:49,700 --> 00:20:55,240 And I think one of the interesting things, which I've worked on a lot more as an adult, 324 00:20:55,240 --> 00:21:00,620 but as a kid, I never felt like I stopped feeling my clothes. 325 00:21:00,620 --> 00:21:03,340 Like when they were on me, I felt them the entire time. 326 00:21:03,340 --> 00:21:07,620 Like I have a shirt on and I know I have a shirt on all day, the entire day. 327 00:21:07,620 --> 00:21:12,740 So the whole day I'm taking inventory of my shirt, all the sounds around me, probably 328 00:21:12,740 --> 00:21:15,540 more sound input than the average person. 329 00:21:15,540 --> 00:21:22,060 I'm very sensitive to overhead lighting and I'm just like taking in like triple the amount 330 00:21:22,060 --> 00:21:24,460 of information in my environment. 331 00:21:24,460 --> 00:21:28,740 And that was coming off as me being a behavior problem child. 332 00:21:28,740 --> 00:21:34,180 And as an adult, I think I came off, I think I tried to start numbing a lot of it, like 333 00:21:34,180 --> 00:21:35,820 high masking. 334 00:21:35,820 --> 00:21:41,580 And then yeah, I would drink and just things to calm me down, but not doing any of probably 335 00:21:41,580 --> 00:21:45,060 what the sensory needs I actually needed to do were. 336 00:21:45,060 --> 00:21:49,220 So what do you think this looks like in some of these sensory inputs? 337 00:21:49,220 --> 00:21:54,380 Do you see kind of the transfer into adulthood or have you learned some of the like cross 338 00:21:54,380 --> 00:21:55,380 over on those things? 339 00:21:55,380 --> 00:22:03,060 Yeah, I mean, so we try to get them just different skills to be able to like address those needs. 340 00:22:03,060 --> 00:22:10,020 Like, it sounds like you were seeking a lot of input through, because you're all you're 341 00:22:10,020 --> 00:22:12,180 trying to do is sit there in class and listen. 342 00:22:12,180 --> 00:22:16,180 But like, how are you supposed to do that if your brain is only thinking about, you 343 00:22:16,180 --> 00:22:19,660 know, your shirt on or the lights out above you? 344 00:22:19,660 --> 00:22:22,540 Like that's a lot to do to try to focus. 345 00:22:22,540 --> 00:22:25,540 So the spinning, I hate spinning. 346 00:22:25,540 --> 00:22:30,140 Yeah, kids. 347 00:22:30,140 --> 00:22:34,700 A lot of kids, they just they, like you said, they want to feel something they want to feel 348 00:22:34,700 --> 00:22:36,220 like their body. 349 00:22:36,220 --> 00:22:41,380 So spinning is a really easy way of getting that input right away. 350 00:22:41,380 --> 00:22:46,740 But there's actually a lot of negative effects that come from spinning around 45 minutes 351 00:22:46,740 --> 00:22:49,160 to an hour after a lot of spinning. 352 00:22:49,160 --> 00:22:53,900 You get a lot of more behaviors come out. 353 00:22:53,900 --> 00:22:56,140 You can get extra nauseous. 354 00:22:56,140 --> 00:23:00,460 It really messes like your whole nervous system up spinning in general. 355 00:23:00,460 --> 00:23:07,540 So those spinning kids, if you give them proprioceptive input, it combats that. 356 00:23:07,540 --> 00:23:09,340 It's like the opposite. 357 00:23:09,340 --> 00:23:14,540 So you got to try to give them a lot of input into their body through like deep pressure 358 00:23:14,540 --> 00:23:20,540 or in a little box or anything to just get them back into their body. 359 00:23:20,540 --> 00:23:27,420 It's going to try to prevent them from feeling those adverse effects later on in the day. 360 00:23:27,420 --> 00:23:31,900 So I'm trying to teach these kids that you can do this after you spin if you really feel 361 00:23:31,900 --> 00:23:32,900 like you need to spin. 362 00:23:32,900 --> 00:23:37,940 And hopefully that'll translate over into adulthood if they still feel like they need 363 00:23:37,940 --> 00:23:40,540 these certain inputs. 364 00:23:40,540 --> 00:23:46,780 Just trying to give them as many skills as possible and make them as independent and 365 00:23:46,780 --> 00:23:48,460 successful as they can be. 366 00:23:48,460 --> 00:23:49,460 Yeah. 367 00:23:49,460 --> 00:23:50,460 So good. 368 00:23:50,460 --> 00:23:53,340 And yeah, I think I slowly started learning. 369 00:23:53,340 --> 00:23:54,340 Yeah. 370 00:23:54,340 --> 00:23:59,540 Deep pressure, a hundred percent was the answer that I would probably have been so good for 371 00:23:59,540 --> 00:24:06,900 me to, for my parents to kind of know about my, it's so funny because my parents, yeah, 372 00:24:06,900 --> 00:24:11,260 they did not ever see me as having like a mental health issue. 373 00:24:11,260 --> 00:24:17,780 It was really, Jen is just quirky as I said, but my dad has even said, he's like, when 374 00:24:17,780 --> 00:24:20,580 you were a baby, you would cry all the time. 375 00:24:20,580 --> 00:24:24,160 The only thing that would calm you down is if we squeezed you like really tight. 376 00:24:24,160 --> 00:24:30,180 And like that is the most obvious, obvious sensory issues. 377 00:24:30,180 --> 00:24:33,540 But you know, there wasn't even that much therapy for that at that time. 378 00:24:33,540 --> 00:24:35,860 I don't think it could have gone a lot different. 379 00:24:35,860 --> 00:24:40,300 But as I got older, I was constantly putting weight on myself. 380 00:24:40,300 --> 00:24:47,780 I felt so much better when I would press into my body, when I, I obviously love like weighted 381 00:24:47,780 --> 00:24:53,420 blankets and those are the things that I know, like help guide me back into sensations and 382 00:24:53,420 --> 00:24:58,340 talking to the link into spirituality, which Haley's also deep into that with me. 383 00:24:58,340 --> 00:25:04,340 It's it's just really cool because yeah, a lot of the things in yoga and stuff that I 384 00:25:04,340 --> 00:25:11,340 was doing to just work on breath work and body were really great resources for so many 385 00:25:11,340 --> 00:25:13,460 of my sensory needs as well. 386 00:25:13,460 --> 00:25:15,580 Yeah, definitely. 387 00:25:15,580 --> 00:25:17,260 I love deep pressure. 388 00:25:17,260 --> 00:25:21,780 I sometimes at the end of the day, I feel like overstimulated from work and I have a 389 00:25:21,780 --> 00:25:22,780 long drive. 390 00:25:22,780 --> 00:25:28,500 So I really like have to do a bunch of stuff when I get home to just start relaxing. 391 00:25:28,500 --> 00:25:33,340 And sometimes I just have my partner lay his entire body on top of me and just sit here 392 00:25:33,340 --> 00:25:38,900 for a minute because I just need that input, you know, and it really calms me. 393 00:25:38,900 --> 00:25:42,660 But we do like weighted vest on little kids, body socks. 394 00:25:42,660 --> 00:25:45,300 I think I sent you a body sock link. 395 00:25:45,300 --> 00:25:46,300 I love it. 396 00:25:46,300 --> 00:25:50,300 They're super fun, but they're great, a great friend. 397 00:25:50,300 --> 00:25:52,300 But yeah. 398 00:25:52,300 --> 00:26:00,580 Haley, do you, do you look at people as being sometimes more prone to being overstimulated 399 00:26:00,580 --> 00:26:04,740 versus under stimulated or is this a spectrum that is ever changing? 400 00:26:04,740 --> 00:26:10,060 Because over is having like way too much input under stimulated is having way too little. 401 00:26:10,060 --> 00:26:14,740 Is there some people that are more starting off with one extreme or is this just like 402 00:26:14,740 --> 00:26:19,540 a constant up and down swing when you have one of these neurodivergences? 403 00:26:19,540 --> 00:26:20,540 Yeah. 404 00:26:20,540 --> 00:26:22,500 That's a good question. 405 00:26:22,500 --> 00:26:27,260 Like I think it's all over the board for sure. 406 00:26:27,260 --> 00:26:33,900 But I think in my job, I'm definitely seeing more of the overstimulation just because it's 407 00:26:33,900 --> 00:26:36,140 impacting like their day to day. 408 00:26:36,140 --> 00:26:39,460 So then that's when they're referred to therapy. 409 00:26:39,460 --> 00:26:45,900 But like the under stimulated is going to appear as more like a really laid back chill 410 00:26:45,900 --> 00:26:54,900 kind of kid might be kind of like lazy or not really seeking that much stimulation. 411 00:26:54,900 --> 00:26:59,660 They're not usually going to be like categorized as like a behavior kid or anything. 412 00:26:59,660 --> 00:27:04,340 But I think that there's still some needs there that could be met. 413 00:27:04,340 --> 00:27:09,380 They could be, they could tolerate some like extra input, but it's not really going to 414 00:27:09,380 --> 00:27:15,100 come across as like a big need as much as what the overstimulation is going to cause. 415 00:27:15,100 --> 00:27:19,820 It's going to, you're going to see a lot of tantrums and meltdowns and stuff like that. 416 00:27:19,820 --> 00:27:23,500 So, which is obviously more concerning for parents and teachers. 417 00:27:23,500 --> 00:27:24,500 Yeah. 418 00:27:24,500 --> 00:27:26,940 It doesn't fit our world very easily. 419 00:27:26,940 --> 00:27:27,940 So, yeah. 420 00:27:27,940 --> 00:27:33,540 So some of the things that I learned from that divergent mind book that I just want 421 00:27:33,540 --> 00:27:37,920 to share on here, that was just wild to me. 422 00:27:37,920 --> 00:27:43,180 She really talks about in the book about how our environment and the world we've created 423 00:27:43,180 --> 00:27:51,940 is really so opposite of the design that would really accommodate the neurodivergencies, 424 00:27:51,940 --> 00:27:56,020 which I think she said in the book, it's about 35% of the population. 425 00:27:56,020 --> 00:28:02,300 So it's, it, we should have more of a world catered for this, but she talked about how 426 00:28:02,300 --> 00:28:08,220 the infrastructure of even buildings, like with tile floors that obviously you hear like 427 00:28:08,220 --> 00:28:14,120 the click clacking of your shoes and just the walls kind of not absorbing a whole lot 428 00:28:14,120 --> 00:28:19,580 of the sound and a lot of that reverb and bouncing and just the fluorescent lights that 429 00:28:19,580 --> 00:28:26,580 are in most stores that we go into and in our schools, it's, it's kind of a nightmare 430 00:28:26,580 --> 00:28:30,900 for a sensory need kid to go into. 431 00:28:30,900 --> 00:28:35,420 And then especially as an adult, when we're just in this constant bombarding of sensory 432 00:28:35,420 --> 00:28:40,920 input, and then we're wondering why we're like so burned out and so tired and like have 433 00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:46,840 trouble being productive beyond our job when this entire, if we had buildings that were 434 00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:52,760 designed to absorb more of those sounds, lower lighting, maybe not the radio blasting and 435 00:28:52,760 --> 00:28:56,020 echoing off the tile floors everywhere you freaking go. 436 00:28:56,020 --> 00:29:02,740 And we were accommodated to this, maybe the overall energy we had at the end of the day 437 00:29:02,740 --> 00:29:08,020 when we get off of work to do other things could be vastly different if our needs were 438 00:29:08,020 --> 00:29:11,900 more met in kind of the outside worlds. 439 00:29:11,900 --> 00:29:17,940 Yeah, absolutely, I think it's very overwhelming for a lot of a lot of people, not just kids, 440 00:29:17,940 --> 00:29:22,260 but yeah, I definitely think there's something there. 441 00:29:22,260 --> 00:29:27,580 And just the idea of like, expectation to have to sit at a desk for eight hours like 442 00:29:27,580 --> 00:29:33,340 straight like who like that's insane, like to ask a child to have to sit at a desk and 443 00:29:33,340 --> 00:29:42,100 like actively pay attention to a lesson for hours on end like it's just, whatever, for 444 00:29:42,100 --> 00:29:46,980 whatever reason like that's the society standard and it's not great for everyone. 445 00:29:46,980 --> 00:29:47,980 It's wild. 446 00:29:47,980 --> 00:29:49,580 It's not great for majority. 447 00:29:49,580 --> 00:29:52,380 I feel like it's a lot. 448 00:29:52,380 --> 00:29:59,220 And I think, I think you see kids responding to the sensory up and downs more kind of in 449 00:29:59,220 --> 00:30:04,860 the moment, but I think it's also important to know in your adult years that it doesn't 450 00:30:04,860 --> 00:30:08,500 always hit you necessarily right in the moment. 451 00:30:08,500 --> 00:30:15,020 Some of the times I had a very like overstimulated day like if I do a grocery store day, I usually 452 00:30:15,020 --> 00:30:20,140 really feel that like hours later and I just feel like kind of zapped like I do think there's 453 00:30:20,140 --> 00:30:22,400 sometimes a little bit of a delay. 454 00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:26,220 So I think when you start thinking in terms of sensory as you move through the world, 455 00:30:26,220 --> 00:30:31,780 like knowing what you do, like maybe you love to go to social events, but then the payoff 456 00:30:31,780 --> 00:30:37,780 of doing some of those things more often is kind of like, yeah, you have like a two week 457 00:30:37,780 --> 00:30:40,800 period where I don't know, I just don't feel right. 458 00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:46,180 It's really important to look at how much you're doing when you're doing it and maybe 459 00:30:46,180 --> 00:30:51,380 what the payoff energetically is later because you want to find a balance. 460 00:30:51,380 --> 00:30:56,420 The burnout is so real and if you're going into social situations where yeah, you're 461 00:30:56,420 --> 00:31:01,180 saying hi to everyone kind of over happy, there's music, there's all this stuff, but 462 00:31:01,180 --> 00:31:05,100 then yeah, for weeks you don't feel right. 463 00:31:05,100 --> 00:31:10,920 Maybe you've never even thought of linking past event to what you're currently experiencing, 464 00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:15,460 but when you start thinking in terms of sensory, those bridges between things, I think get 465 00:31:15,460 --> 00:31:19,860 a little bit more insightful and clear thoughts on that. 466 00:31:19,860 --> 00:31:23,540 Yeah, I think that that is exactly right. 467 00:31:23,540 --> 00:31:29,620 We be invited to a lot of weddings and weddings are such big events and you're meeting most 468 00:31:29,620 --> 00:31:34,060 of the people you might not know, so you're just constantly having these quick conversations 469 00:31:34,060 --> 00:31:40,460 with basically a stranger and there's usually loud music and a lot of movement and a lot 470 00:31:40,460 --> 00:31:45,820 of new foods and you usually have to travel and so it's a lot of over love stimulation 471 00:31:45,820 --> 00:31:46,820 there. 472 00:31:46,820 --> 00:31:54,420 If you don't come home and know how to regulate your nervous system back to your natural state, 473 00:31:54,420 --> 00:32:01,500 then you're going to keep feeling the effects a lot longer than you would have if you hadn't 474 00:32:01,500 --> 00:32:04,220 gone to the wedding or whatever. 475 00:32:04,220 --> 00:32:05,780 Yeah, it's a balance. 476 00:32:05,780 --> 00:32:10,020 I think knowing your neurodivergencies and the fact that you're going to have to build 477 00:32:10,020 --> 00:32:20,380 boundaries along what you can take and manage is so freaking important. 478 00:32:20,380 --> 00:32:23,380 Let's talk about options for sensory regulation. 479 00:32:23,380 --> 00:32:26,860 I'll share a couple of mine and you can add. 480 00:32:26,860 --> 00:32:29,740 Fidget toys are literally amazing. 481 00:32:29,740 --> 00:32:37,020 I wish so bad that this would have been more of a thing in our elementary and middle school 482 00:32:37,020 --> 00:32:38,020 years. 483 00:32:38,020 --> 00:32:46,220 I, the little fidget spinners that got popular, I love, I have this little mesh, like little 484 00:32:46,220 --> 00:32:49,380 mesh thing that has a marble in it that you can roll around. 485 00:32:49,380 --> 00:32:52,540 Oh yeah, I like that. 486 00:32:52,540 --> 00:32:57,300 But yeah, fidget toys are just giving your mind like kind of a constant where you can 487 00:32:57,300 --> 00:33:02,120 play with something and that usually helps me to take in less of my environment. 488 00:33:02,120 --> 00:33:07,500 So when I'm fidgeting more, I can focus more on what is happening in front of me than taking 489 00:33:07,500 --> 00:33:13,020 in absolutely everything, which is what happens when I don't like find some kind of consistency. 490 00:33:13,020 --> 00:33:16,660 I think without fidget toys, I usually like am rubbing my legs a lot. 491 00:33:16,660 --> 00:33:22,220 I notice I do that all the time, like kind of self-soothing, like it's okay. 492 00:33:22,220 --> 00:33:26,900 And I use noise canceling headphones a lot. 493 00:33:26,900 --> 00:33:31,800 Like when I'm going around the house, it just turns the volume down on everything. 494 00:33:31,800 --> 00:33:34,500 And then yeah, I can play music just in my headphones. 495 00:33:34,500 --> 00:33:41,860 If I want, I play with 8D music a lot, which kind of circles the audio around you, which 496 00:33:41,860 --> 00:33:47,620 is really good for kind of using both lobes of the brain, working, kind of giving you, 497 00:33:47,620 --> 00:33:53,020 yeah, just auditory, consistent, more sensory activity. 498 00:33:53,020 --> 00:33:59,700 And yeah, I obviously do regular kind of shaking and yoga just to like, yeah, get into my body 499 00:33:59,700 --> 00:34:00,700 more. 500 00:34:00,700 --> 00:34:06,220 So it was like a couple little things and trying to tell myself that I need to mask 501 00:34:06,220 --> 00:34:11,380 a lot less and just let quirky Jen out again, because she is still here. 502 00:34:11,380 --> 00:34:15,900 She hasn't gone anywhere and learning that I can communicate my needs. 503 00:34:15,900 --> 00:34:20,580 Like, sorry, if I'm moving a lot, like I, yeah, I'm just kind of like, I've dealt with 504 00:34:20,580 --> 00:34:24,220 a lot and you don't want to end up having a panic attack because you're repressing this 505 00:34:24,220 --> 00:34:25,760 stuff down. 506 00:34:25,760 --> 00:34:29,860 You need to just find a way that you can ebb and flow with what works for you. 507 00:34:29,860 --> 00:34:34,140 And then, yeah, letting other people communicate what their needs are. 508 00:34:34,140 --> 00:34:38,700 And if they are taking it personal, maybe have a conversation like, listen, okay, I 509 00:34:38,700 --> 00:34:44,640 fall on a spectrum disorder and I need to be able to live my life in accordance to that. 510 00:34:44,640 --> 00:34:48,420 And so, yeah, we might need to talk this out and see what's going to work or take larger 511 00:34:48,420 --> 00:34:50,020 breaks when we're together. 512 00:34:50,020 --> 00:34:53,860 Maybe you both go cool out for a second in the middle of hanging out. 513 00:34:53,860 --> 00:34:55,420 Does that seem weird socially? 514 00:34:55,420 --> 00:34:56,420 Yeah. 515 00:34:56,420 --> 00:35:00,460 These are the kind of conversations we need to have so that we stop the repression and 516 00:35:00,460 --> 00:35:01,460 masking anyway. 517 00:35:01,460 --> 00:35:11,420 Hailey, tell me some of the other sensory management tools that you use. 518 00:35:11,420 --> 00:35:12,420 Yeah. 519 00:35:12,420 --> 00:35:14,900 So, the fidgets are super great. 520 00:35:14,900 --> 00:35:16,580 I get to play with them all the time. 521 00:35:16,580 --> 00:35:21,700 It's like literally right now as we're speaking, I'm bending the crap out of a paper clip. 522 00:35:21,700 --> 00:35:23,900 I have my fidget toy too. 523 00:35:23,900 --> 00:35:31,500 Yeah, it's just something that your body can do while your mind is trying to stay on track. 524 00:35:31,500 --> 00:35:35,180 So we can use, the kids are allowed to use them in class a lot of the times if they're 525 00:35:35,180 --> 00:35:37,580 on their IEP. 526 00:35:37,580 --> 00:35:43,980 Or we typically will tie some TheraBand to the bottom of their chair legs so they can 527 00:35:43,980 --> 00:35:45,460 bounce their feet on it. 528 00:35:45,460 --> 00:35:46,460 Love that. 529 00:35:46,460 --> 00:35:47,460 Yeah, those are fun. 530 00:35:47,460 --> 00:35:53,820 Or there's adaptive seating where you could do a wobble seat or just something where you 531 00:35:53,820 --> 00:35:57,340 can just kind of move slightly but you're not being overly distracted to the others 532 00:35:57,340 --> 00:35:59,340 around you. 533 00:35:59,340 --> 00:36:07,940 Definitely vibration is fun to play with too if you are with kids and with like for adults. 534 00:36:07,940 --> 00:36:12,980 I usually, you want to try to self-regulate your nervous system like before you get to 535 00:36:12,980 --> 00:36:16,160 the point of overstimulation of course. 536 00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:20,220 So there's definitely different things that you're going to use to help you like stay 537 00:36:20,220 --> 00:36:24,940 focused versus this is something else you're going to do when you're overstimulated because 538 00:36:24,940 --> 00:36:28,660 you're a little bit too far past the point. 539 00:36:28,660 --> 00:36:33,220 So there are different areas of that that you're going to have to like figure out. 540 00:36:33,220 --> 00:36:36,620 So like fidgets, a fidget is not going to help you if you're having a panic attack. 541 00:36:36,620 --> 00:36:40,740 I'm like, it's just a different level. 542 00:36:40,740 --> 00:36:46,420 But yeah, so like the deep breathe, I teach a lot of deep breathing and animal walks and 543 00:36:46,420 --> 00:36:55,460 basically like yoga for kids, deep pressure works well for certain kids when they're overstimulated. 544 00:36:55,460 --> 00:36:59,580 Flexion just in general is just soothing. 545 00:36:59,580 --> 00:37:04,500 That's like going into like a fetal position and yeah, and pressing like against the wall, 546 00:37:04,500 --> 00:37:06,980 like things like that where you're getting that input. 547 00:37:06,980 --> 00:37:12,340 We teach that to a lot of like my stroke patients that are coming back like any pressing just 548 00:37:12,340 --> 00:37:15,740 to get some joint activation. 549 00:37:15,740 --> 00:37:19,740 So you have so many receptors around all of your joints that give feedback that I'm in 550 00:37:19,740 --> 00:37:23,140 my body, I belong here, little things like that. 551 00:37:23,140 --> 00:37:29,860 And also re-emphasizes that the relationship to exercise, if it is kind of been askewed 552 00:37:29,860 --> 00:37:35,500 by our stupid diet culture, that movement in the body and finding the movement practice 553 00:37:35,500 --> 00:37:40,240 that works for you is doing so much more than working on your physical form. 554 00:37:40,240 --> 00:37:46,380 It's a really good way of regulating and it leads to more breath focus. 555 00:37:46,380 --> 00:37:51,380 Yeah, movement practices are very, very essential and finding what works. 556 00:37:51,380 --> 00:37:56,220 If something is not working for you, really pay attention to that because yeah, you can, 557 00:37:56,220 --> 00:38:00,340 there's so many things to trial and error and that's this conversation could go on for 558 00:38:00,340 --> 00:38:02,100 hours because it's so vast. 559 00:38:02,100 --> 00:38:07,180 But yeah, if you're working with, if you have children and you know that they have sensory 560 00:38:07,180 --> 00:38:14,940 needs, occupational therapy is an awesome option to explore sensory input. 561 00:38:14,940 --> 00:38:20,660 And yeah, if you're an adult struggling with this stuff, it's a really good journey just 562 00:38:20,660 --> 00:38:23,780 to play and learn what your neurodivergences are. 563 00:38:23,780 --> 00:38:28,180 Even if you get a diagnosis for one of these neurodivergences, that doesn't still always 564 00:38:28,180 --> 00:38:31,020 give you your answer for your sensory problems. 565 00:38:31,020 --> 00:38:37,380 It's still going to be a game of kind of figuring it out because everyone's is so different. 566 00:38:37,380 --> 00:38:42,140 Yeah, it's so much of trial and error and what works for one person is most likely not 567 00:38:42,140 --> 00:38:44,380 going to work for the next. 568 00:38:44,380 --> 00:38:50,340 And so my job is kind of like detective work and just trying something new all the time. 569 00:38:50,340 --> 00:38:54,300 Whatever is going to like hit, then just you could stick with that because it's, they're 570 00:38:54,300 --> 00:38:57,420 usually not going to become oversaturated by it. 571 00:38:57,420 --> 00:39:01,340 Like once you figure out you like this fidget, usually you're going to stick with it. 572 00:39:01,340 --> 00:39:08,220 I've seen, but yeah, it's really just playing around with it and seeing like what you need. 573 00:39:08,220 --> 00:39:13,260 And even if like sometimes isolation is all you need, if you get overstimulated by just 574 00:39:13,260 --> 00:39:20,020 people being around people in general, being by yourself is also a sensory tool. 575 00:39:20,020 --> 00:39:21,020 Just take a break. 576 00:39:21,020 --> 00:39:24,700 Yeah, take a moment and then come back or whatever. 577 00:39:24,700 --> 00:39:26,940 It's so linked to mindfulness. 578 00:39:26,940 --> 00:39:27,940 Exactly. 579 00:39:27,940 --> 00:39:28,940 Yeah. 580 00:39:28,940 --> 00:39:32,540 Some people live and just like cover their eye. 581 00:39:32,540 --> 00:39:36,740 Like you keep your eyes open, but you put your palms over your eye sockets. 582 00:39:36,740 --> 00:39:42,780 So you just see, just get rid of the visual overstimulation or same thing with hearing 583 00:39:42,780 --> 00:39:44,540 like your noise canceling headphones. 584 00:39:44,540 --> 00:39:46,940 Like just, you just need a break. 585 00:39:46,940 --> 00:39:47,940 Yeah. 586 00:39:47,940 --> 00:39:49,780 And telling people like I'm going to close that. 587 00:39:49,780 --> 00:39:52,660 Yeah, you're out and you're saying I'm going to close my eyes for just a second because 588 00:39:52,660 --> 00:39:54,500 I can tell I'm taking in a lot. 589 00:39:54,500 --> 00:39:57,060 Like these are just the little advertisements. 590 00:39:57,060 --> 00:39:58,660 We got to get better. 591 00:39:58,660 --> 00:40:03,900 This conversation is so important and the world so deeply at least needs to have the 592 00:40:03,900 --> 00:40:10,420 seed of this planted in their minds because viewing the world under this perspective of 593 00:40:10,420 --> 00:40:15,980 neurodivergencies and sensory needs is an essential part of moving through life with 594 00:40:15,980 --> 00:40:18,660 more intention, taking less things personal. 595 00:40:18,660 --> 00:40:24,780 I think this is definitely a very applicable part of the spiritual journey. 596 00:40:24,780 --> 00:40:30,420 Haley, I know you're also on this like a very spiritual path, but this stuff is important 597 00:40:30,420 --> 00:40:33,300 because it gets in the way of your nervous system being dysregulated. 598 00:40:33,300 --> 00:40:38,740 And when your nervous system is dysregulated, it's hard to listen into your intuition to 599 00:40:38,740 --> 00:40:44,140 do any of the, to even know where you start in these sensory things begin. 600 00:40:44,140 --> 00:40:48,020 It becomes all very blurred and it can make you very reactive. 601 00:40:48,020 --> 00:40:52,300 It can also make you hurt people around you when in reality the connection is so deeply 602 00:40:52,300 --> 00:40:56,460 important for us on this path and we need each other. 603 00:40:56,460 --> 00:40:59,620 So learning this stuff is very, very vital. 604 00:40:59,620 --> 00:41:02,700 Yeah, I absolutely agree. 605 00:41:02,700 --> 00:41:07,060 I think when we were in school, like it just wasn't known about yet. 606 00:41:07,060 --> 00:41:10,380 It just like wasn't the information just wasn't out there as much. 607 00:41:10,380 --> 00:41:14,820 And now these days I feel like you can hear at least a little bit more of it. 608 00:41:14,820 --> 00:41:17,620 So I think we're slowly getting there. 609 00:41:17,620 --> 00:41:18,620 Yeah. 610 00:41:18,620 --> 00:41:21,620 Well, I really, really appreciate your insight. 611 00:41:21,620 --> 00:41:25,220 This stuff is so fun to talk out. 612 00:41:25,220 --> 00:41:29,620 Thank you for coming on and sharing, sharing some of your thoughts. 613 00:41:29,620 --> 00:41:31,380 Of course, anytime I love it. 614 00:41:31,380 --> 00:41:34,380 I listened to all the episodes. 615 00:41:34,380 --> 00:41:37,380 I'm here for it. 616 00:41:37,380 --> 00:41:38,380 I love it, Haley. 617 00:41:38,380 --> 00:41:39,380 Yeah. 618 00:41:39,380 --> 00:41:41,580 So thank you all for listening. 619 00:41:41,580 --> 00:41:44,580 We will see you next week. 620 00:41:44,580 --> 00:41:45,580 Bye. 621 00:41:45,580 --> 00:41:48,580 Bye.