Hello there, I'm George Hall and welcome back to the Good Growth Podcast.
Now if you cast your mind back 18 months or so ago, it felt like you couldn't open your
phone or turn on the news without seeing some sort of mention of the metaverse. It was the
hot topic in tech for a long time, but in recent months it seems to have somewhat faded
away, being replaced by the likes of generative AI and machine learning.
Here today to tell us a bit more about what's happened to the metaverse is Jacob Nichols,
Account Executive here at Good Growth. Jacob, how are you?
I'm very well, thank you, George. Thanks for having me on.
Now firstly, I know I alluded to it there in the intro, but I'm sure you've got some
stats to back this up. The metaverse seems to have lost a bit of its relevance and a
bit of its momentum, doesn't it?
Yeah, it seems so. I think the hype was definitely generated around 2021 with Mark Zuckerberg
changing Facebook to meta and all the massive investment that's gone with that. Meta was
once valued at one trillion and nearly lost three quarters of its valuation. Further to
that, meta spent 10 billion on the metaverse alone. I think the product that's come from
that that everyone has seen that's kind of killed off the hype was the screenshots from
Horizon Worlds of Mark Zuckerberg taking a selfie and it basically became the laughing
stock of the internet for a few months.
I remember it vividly. It sort of looked like a bit of a creepy face that was somewhat akin
to the Nintendo Wii characters.
Yeah, I mean, he was clearly embarrassed. He shared a new photo three days later saying
the graphics are better, I promise.
And then casting your mind back sort of 18 months back to I guess 2021, what were the
initial projections around the metaverse and how it was going to change and revolutionize
how we communicate digitally? And then why hasn't that come to fruition?
Yeah, I think first of all, there was kind of a lot of confusion about one, what the
metaverse was and two, kind of how it would apply to my life as a consumer, as a business
leader. And I think really, it was initially projected to transform, absolutely transform
the way we worked, the way we interacted with our machines, but also to kind of improve
our lives in the in the real world as well and bring us closer together using technology.
But it kind of didn't happen in the way that I think most people expected it to because
with Meta's vision that I think everyone kind of heard about, they expected something to
happen very quickly and very instantly. But with the kind of technology that's required,
especially in terms of like VR, the adoption of VR, by the adoption of VR headsets has
basically fallen flat over the past few years. It's a massive consumer shift if you're going
to get people wearing VR headsets to work in to kind of play in as well. I think it's
it's a massive thing to to have to convince them to do especially when they cost a few
hundreds or a few thousand pounds and they've been making people sick from motion sickness
and they're not hugely comfortable either. So yeah, I think that kind of like consumer
transformation is is definitely what's one what slowed it down, but to the pace of the
technology that's been coming onto the market as well.
So do you think if if AR and VR were were not only more accessible, but also less motion
sickness inducing, I guess we'd be in a very different place, wouldn't we?
Yes, it's an interesting question, because I think if like nowadays, there's a lot of
people working from home, you know, companies like international companies that have offices
in various different countries, they would probably want to spend that money per employee
to try and bring them closer together and bring back that kind of collaboration without
having to spend all the money on flights on trains, etc. on on travel in general. I think
in that case, it probably would have picked up a bit quicker. But then it's a case of
do the will do like employees and consumers actually enjoy it, because I think it can
feel a little bit forced if you're forcing everyone together in a room in a virtual room
with customized avatars and they're still sat at home with just the only difference
is they're wearing a pair of goggles. So I think when you kind of frame it like that,
it does sound a little bit silly and not not worth the investment. But I think once there's
actually something that Apple Vision Pro is something that I've looked at and seen and
I was like, yeah, this this feels a bit more like it. I think the like the likes of HTC
vibes, Oculus VR, etc. They've been focused a lot more around kind of gaming and really
immersing yourself in a different world. Whereas the Apple Vision Pro is kind of taking it
like it's more of a mixed reality. So you're pulling your your apps, your your work, your
displays and putting them into context. So I think I think something like that makes
a lot more sense in terms of consumer adoption, because consumers generally don't want to
completely take themselves out of reality, I would say they want to like augment or be
able to seamlessly bring the bring the tech that they know and love into their reality,
which I think that Apple Vision Pro is trying to tackle. I mean, we'll find out early early
next year when it gets released into the US. But yeah. But again, a massive price point
is nearly like $2,500, I think. So, you know, it's not especially in the cost of living
crisis as well. It's not probably the thing that everyone's lining up to buy. But but
yeah, I'm quite excited personally by it.
Yeah, it'll be interesting to see how it pans out. And then beyond, I guess, AR, VR, and
the cost implications. Are there other hurdles that are yet to be crossed, whether it's infrastructure
technology that's contributed to the cooling off of the hype?
I think there's definitely been some influencer hype around it as well. The likes of NFTs,
for example, everyone kind of saw those as a bit of a get rich quick scheme and didn't
kind of recognise them for the value that they could potentially have. So I think there
was a lot of kind of speculation around, okay, these would be great for kind of like entertainment
events like concerts, etc. Like without having that worry or like even like travel tickets,
without having that worry that like someone's it's been passed down multiple times, like
it's been able to be to be validated. But I also think it's not had the massive adoption,
because to be honest, metaverse technology and that sort of web free technology that
makes it that tries to make everything a bit more immersive is one really expensive. And
two, you do need a very skilled technological workforce to be able to do it. I mean, and
I think the meta example really does put a lot of other companies off because, you know,
they've dropped 10 billion in it, and they're still posting massive, massive losses, then
it's kind of like, why, why would anyone, anyone else do it? But there is there is interesting
examples in terms of one that springs to mind is BMW, actually, they've created some virtual
factories to run simulations on and understand efficiencies before they actually go and build
the factories that they build cars in, which I thought was a really interesting application
in terms of using it as a test bed, basically. And I think that it kind of goes back to what
we did good growth in terms of, you know, test testing and learning and understanding
before you go and, you know, drop 10 billion on a metaverse project, which I don't think
Zuckerberg went through. So
and it's interesting, we talk about meta that they're always in the news around, you know,
data privacy security. Do you think there's some consumer concerns around privacy when
it comes to the likes of AR VR? I mean, I'm sure we could have a quick Google and there'll
be a conspiracy theory about VR headset stealing retina scans and using them for God knows
what, do you think that's held consumers back a bit and maybe not giving them the confidence
that they need to buy in?
I mean, it definitely came into my head when I was looking at the this Apple headset, like
they're definitely scanning the environment some way. But, but, you know, I think it's
that it's that balance, isn't it? If you if you want these hyper personalised experiences,
then and that's a value to you, then you're going to have to give up a bit of personal
data to be able to enjoy and achieve those experiences. But I think generally, there
probably is quite a bit of scepticism around, you know, why why are brands getting involved
in this? Is it to get their proposition out there? Or is it to just is it another opportunity
for a data grab? Is it another opportunity to learn more about about your customers?
But I think there's definitely caution to be taken around hyper personalised experiences
in terms of how much how much should how much should consumers have to be giving away to
have a more tailored experience? Like, there's no need for for scanning of their environment
unless it provides value within something. So it's all about that kind of value exchange,
I think.
Perfect. And then to sort of close things off, if you were to put yourself in the shoes of
whether it's Zuckerberg or one of the heads of digital at one of these big companies,
what do you think's the logical next step in terms of reigniting that hype around the
metaverse and getting consumers back interested and more likely to make a purchase? I guess,
further on from that, is any of that already happening out there in the market?
I think I think so. I think, first of all, the fact that like the metaverse really, even
though it's kind of a catch all term, it is kind of all around us like this zoom call
we're sat on today is an example of technology bringing us closer together. And, you know,
like things like cross platform gaming, by socialising in fortnight, VR chat, etc. That
it is here in a way, but it's just, okay, how do we take it a step further? And I think
kind of going back to my excitement of this Apple headset again, but I think something
like that is is kind of the next step. And if if consumers pick that up, then I think
it could be a really interesting kind of like jumpboard, the things they use in gymnastics
to like, launch it into into something even bigger. But but no, I think there'll definitely
be a resurgence. I know everyone's focused on kind of AI generated AI at the moment.
But I think that's just a smaller piece of the puzzle of a wider picture, really. Yeah,
sounds like a question.
Perfect. It does indeed. And look, I don't think Apple have officially released a specific
date yet. I think it's still slated for early 2024. Whatever that means, I mean, with with
Apple, you can never quite tell whether they're going to completely stick to that. But I think
look, price is starting at three and a half thousand dollars, it'll be interesting to
see what uptake is. But Jacob, it's been great to have you on the podcast. And I'm sure it
won't be the last time we hear from you. Or the last time we hear about the metaverse.
You've been listening to the good growth podcast. If you'd like to find out more about us, check
out our website, which is www.goodgrowth.co.uk. Or why not check us out on LinkedIn? Thanks
very much for listening.