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Welcome to the podcast. This is the slog the podcast where we talk about movies that totally

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suck the life out of you. I am your host Brandon stables. Welcome. Wait, hold on. Hold on. Yeah.

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Okay. Actually, this is the polarize pod. I'm just kidding. We're not too well. We're definitely

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still talking about a movie that could be described as a slog. But this is the polarized

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podcast. This is a podcast about polarizing movies polarizing movies in the sense of rotten

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tomato score. Critics love it. And audiences hate it or vice versa. Today we're talking about the

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hashtag slog the whiz. Yes, like I said, I am your host Brandon and this movie, just get the

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percentages and all of the stuff out of the way is 41% critics 65% audience. So not really too

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spicy on the audience. And I could probably understand why you got some this is 1978 classic

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starring the classic or it's probably that but this yeah, starts Diana Ross and the first on

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screen performance of those those. Sorry, the timing was good on that one. Continue. We're

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not working out. We're working it out. But yeah, the on screen for sunscreen performance of Michael

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Jackson, young 20 year old buck, but he's covered in a bunch of makeup. So you can tell what age he

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is really. So you know, he's got that going for him. Um, yeah, this is a movie, a musical, and

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we're going to get into it. Now I'd like to introduce my co host. We also like to call him

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the forever guest, my confidant in movies that are sluggish. Mr. James Lindsay, how's it going?

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Yes. Hello, I am James Lindsay. I am the the co host of forever guest. I'm back yet again. And

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Brandon just was getting up on down the road. And then he he picked me up along the way. Now we

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talk a little bit about a movie. This is a movie. This is a podcast. Yes, it is. polarizing movies.

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We do on this one. No. Yeah. But sometimes you and me agree on the movies on at least how we feel

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about it. And sometimes we spoiler alert, I feel like it's a lot. But you know, and then we

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polarize ourselves. I think more. Yeah, it's safe to say more often than not, we agree with one side

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or the other. And then that's the that's the journey we go on is to get to which side do we

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typically agree with and do we agree together as hosts on movies that we talk about. So this movie,

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the whiz James, I had never seen this movie before, definitely had heard about it for sure. But

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had never seen it. I will just preface to the people that we have been in this Motown universe,

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because we previously had done mahogany, which is stars Diana Ross, again, also directed by Barry

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Gordy. This movie is similar in that it stars Diana Ross. This time it is not directed by Barry

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Gordy, but produced by Motown produced by it.

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As adjacent to Barry Gordy as you could possibly be, but his name is absolutely anywhere to be seen.

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I don't think he's credited anywhere, but no, but Motown is prominently featured as like, as it

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being a production. So yeah, but you're right. Yeah. His name has been removed. You know,

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probably well after mahogany, if anybody hasn't listened to that episode, I implore you to do so

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because that's a crazy fucking movie. And this is equally as nuts. I found out even more because we

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are doing another podcast with our good pal Corey about music producers. And I was reading a little

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bit more of Barry Gordy's book. And yeah, that was like a tumultuous time between him and Diana Ross

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and their relationship. And in how we described it seemed like like the final nail in the coffin of

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their relationship. So much so that they fought at the very end of it where they only had like a few

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things left to shoot for continuity and some transition scenes or whatever. And they got in

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a huge fight and she like smacked him and left and said she was done. And then he had to like get

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some someone else to like use her arms to pretend to be Diana Ross in some of the scenes. Which

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I just if anyone had never heard of mahogany or didn't listen to the episode last week is another

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movie by Barry Gordy, who is the big big papa of Motown himself and for him to jump into the world

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of movies that we thought it'd be fun to do a little crossover series of our own here. And the

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the whiz is something that I think everybody I don't know a lot of people have heard of. I've

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never talked to anybody who's seen or got in gotten into it. I've never seen it or seen of it. I feel

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like I don't I don't see any merchandise or anything lasting or I've never saw it growing

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up on on TV really. And it was just something that I heard of. But here we are. And I see it

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in all in everything. Like I saw the movie and it's and it's a movie. It is a movie for sure. Well,

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it's a musical movie. So let's yeah, we've done some musicals on this podcast. It's been fun.

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Yeah, I mean, yeah, this is the but you know, yeah, maybe not this one. But yeah, musicals

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have been, you know, previous to this podcast were kind of something that I was like, yeah,

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I like these. But having now seen more of them, it's been really wonderful to kind of get to know

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some of these musicals that we've done and just kind of really appreciate musicals as a genre of

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film. This is not what I would recommend to people if they would like to get excited about musicals.

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And yeah, I think we're kind of bearing the lead. But I'm trying to think if there's anything else

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to say, oh, something that I thought that was really interesting about this is that not only

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did this kind of kill my spirits watching it, but it also ended the blaxploitation era films, which

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I thought was pretty interesting because this is like I would argue is like a poster child for

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blaxploitation, where there was a period of filmmaking during the 70s, where it would be

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like the black version of something. And I just know, you know, doing research into that, because

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I've seen some blaxploitation movies, you know, your shafts or whatever. But it's so I just found

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a particular thing so interesting about it is that at first blaxploitation was obviously used

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as a negative connotation by the black community, because it was promoting like,

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not it was promoting terrible stereotypes. But then it was co-opted by the black community within

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the same decade that they were making the movies, because people turn around and go like, well, yes,

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these are so there's a lot of like, racy like, stuff in this in the sense of like violence and

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sex and whatever, and some bad stereotypes. But the thing is, is that they featured

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black leads. And, you know, wasn't it was a shift of the black person being, you know, in the film

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being the bad guy, he was, you know, he or she was now being the star of this, just like this being

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Diana Ross and this movie being the, you know, it seems kind of a weird thing to say nowadays in 2023.

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And I'll just denote that. But like, yeah, it's like this is the black version of

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the Wizard of Oz. And I think, you know, that idea and concept, it made sense why this movie

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got made because the Wizard of Oz is obviously a story that is, you know, a classic story,

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you know, something that is, I think, obviously, since there's so many remakes of it, you know,

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it's always kind of there sitting there and potentially, you know, the

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could be redone and to just kind of spark again some of the core tenets of what the story is about,

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because those are relatively timeless and to then, you know, co-opt those timeless, like

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plot points of the story or themes of Wizard of Oz and then update it with in this case, like,

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you know, we're talking about, you know, where are we? We're in New York, Queens.

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And then, yeah, to have Diana Ross be the main character in the film, you know,

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Diana Ross be the Dorothy character, I think all of it made sense on paper and everything.

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On paper, this movie seems like it's going to be a home run. And I was excited and looking forward

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to seeing it as well. And I think it was something that was always in my mind that like, I should

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check that out. I mean, look at that cast of people. And Wizard of Oz is always something nice to

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revisit every now and then the magic of that movie and the lasting power of it all is something

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that still remains. And there's still like side things like Wicked or whatever. And I believe

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that's being made into a movie right now as well. And with how what's her face? Ariana Grande,

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I believe. OK, yeah, I feel like I heard that. Yeah. Yeah. And that's and it's cool to expand

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on that universe. You can use this structure in a very almost like Odyssean way or like Story of a

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Hero in terms of someone being left taken from their home and put on this journey and having to

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come home with this newfound knowledge all can resonate within a lot of different forms.

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So there's there's just so many things going for this and so much so much potential.

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But to start off the bat, like the beginning of this movie and the end, I'll just say right

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right away, the prologue and epilogue, some of like the most satisfying elements, I feel like,

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of Wizard of Oz in some ways is like the. Pre Oz and with, you know, obviously without the color,

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that's that's a huge thing. But not only that, but seeing the real life versions of all the characters

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she's about to encounter in her adventure and seeing the the parallels between them and

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the duality of it all is really fun and satisfying. And it made me think of a movie that we love to

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reference on this broadcast. Like it's it's like imagining back to the future where they just

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immediately go, you know, back in time without anything of the the the mastercraft of that movie

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and for, you know, for leading things in and not giving it away right away,

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but leading the path for you to follow and then having a satisfyingly pay off at the end

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in the third act. And yeah, I just we love back to the future. But in this one, it's the song around,

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the song around, you know, the fam, the family dinner is nice. I like that as an idea and

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everyone gathered around and everything. But I just a simple thing is like having Michael Jackson

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be there, too, and having, you know, like real life versions of everyone there and having a little bit

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more of, yeah, who she is in that in that moment apart from just that one scene. And then at the

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end, she just goes back inside and that and that's it as well. Instead of like, and you were there and

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we don't need every not everything has to be exactly the same. And I don't want to go down

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that path so early as well. They didn't do this like the original. Like it doesn't have to be

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exactly the same. But that's just something narratively within the story that would I don't

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know, would just be an easy, obvious sort of thing to include as far as a beginning and an end.

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But that was that's kind of the beginning. And then, yeah, transition, transition getting into

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the world is kind of just like, I don't know, it's the trippiness is kind of fun, but it's so

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it's so out of nowhere and not connected to anything in reality, like a tornado or something

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like that. It just cuts to like space and she's got a tornado like in her hand. And there's like

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the babies, the star babies. It's pretty trippy. And there's a lot of trippy stuff. But just to

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backpedal a little bit, if it's OK with you, I think it would be really helpful, at least for me

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to just briefly talk about some of these plot points and then I mentioned like the plot that's

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happening and then we can talk about it because for me, this was like a fugue state. So it might be a

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little bit helpful. I don't know if you're OK with that. If I just. Oh, that's fine. I mean,

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how we start the differences from the original is kind of like how I like to think of it, because

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that's just so familiar to me. But yeah, we can. Yeah. Yeah.

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So the start of this movie is at a Thanksgiving dinner table.

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There's a family that is having Thanksgiving dinner. A 24 year old elementary school teacher,

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Dorothy Gales, who's played by Diana Ross and lives with her aunt and uncle.

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You should teach middle school. You should teach us. I like the kids and they keep practicing.

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I like the kids and they keep pressuring her to teach us like whatever she likes.

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I'll mention. What's the big deal?

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And I just write and I there was a lot of questions I had right off the bat because

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I just didn't understand. Like it just for me, it I didn't understand people's motivations and what

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like her Dorothy's problem is because I feel like in the original, it is so clear as to her

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frustrations, her wanting to leave, like all of these things of like, you know, trying to escape

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this little town in Kansas and then being transported into this fantastical area, you know,

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world where then she realizes how wonderful she has it and appreciative of all these things,

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yada yada. But like, yeah, she's extremely introverted. She's teased.

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And then the they're trying to hook her up with this like cousin of theirs or whatever.

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And she's just a super weird about it. And yeah, so I just I don't know for me,

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it just doesn't we don't start off on a good foot with this movie because I just don't know.

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Like, OK, so. I guess it's she doesn't want to go like, I don't know.

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Yeah, why doesn't she want to become a middle school teacher?

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But, you know, or at least she is a teacher and yeah, I don't understand.

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So is her getting the courage? Maybe is the setup of this of like needing to stand on her own two

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feet and that what we're getting trying to get solidified here, but it just wasn't really

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effective for me. I felt just very confused to the point. Yeah. I just I my notes saying,

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I'm like, I'm not sure what's going on with Diana and what she said about why she's shy.

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So I just yeah, from the get go, I'm yeah, already like, hmm, what's going on here?

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Like, what is our problem? You know, what is. Yeah, but I but I agree with you.

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So then, yes, Dorothy cleans up after the meal. Her dog, Toto, runs out

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the open kitchen door into a snowstorm. She succeeds in retrieving him, but finds her

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trapped in the storm in a magical whirlwind made of snow, materializes and transports her to the

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realm of Oz, which is depicted by dystopian version of New York City, which yes. So the

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trippy stuff I was into, I really enjoyed, especially when she gets there, what happens

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and I'll mention the Munchkin land and all that. But yeah, it reminded me so much of.

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See, I do a little bit and Zardoz, especially like the head of the whiz and everything like that

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reminded me of like and others. There was one big scene of like when they were, I think, after the

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scarecrow and it was a big building with like farmland and it just looked like a trippy

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watercolor painting that was kind of cool before she she actually gets transported, which is just

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by this space Glinda with a hand tornado and star babies. And she crashes through a Z sign

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for whiz. She does her there kind of which the music also is by Quincy Jones, like everything on

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everything on the page is like great. But this is this is the somewhere over the rainbow version

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of or like the parallel like the analog analog. Yeah. What they just give a little taste.

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I just I feel like I'm saying this early on in the song. It's not nothing wrong with it,

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but there's nothing really going on with it. That's great either. There's no hook

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in a lot of this stuff. There's nothing like grabbing.

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Something tells me that it's more than I can deal with sleepy.

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Though I know, right. It's relaxing.

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Yeah. So I mean, that's actually a good point because we're supposed to be kicking off this movie

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venture and this is a total snooze fest. It's it's it's there's a lot of a lot of this

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where it's aimless. It's just kind of aimless floating around. And then even some of the more

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high octane energy stuff also feels like they're throwing everything at the wall and not. Yeah.

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Right. Boiling down the essence of the song in a way that's more clean and palatable. It's

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that for the for the like a movie coming from Motown, the audio mixing and the songs are

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unfortunately not anything you can really hang your hat on. Yeah. And then I was noticing I

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I listened to a little bit after I watched the movie, I was like, let me get a little taste of

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the music just to remind myself. And it was kind of better when I didn't have to look at the visuals

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on some of it and when I was like, oh, like it's I mean, it's not great. But when I was like having

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to look at the crows and that whole set of where the scarecrow Michael Jackson was, I was like,

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is upsetting and just just not it's just boring to look at. Everything was just so boring

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and stripped down and no for a movie that's like notoriously known for color. The color is

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is kind of fucked in this movie, especially like we're getting into Munchkin Land and the coloring

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in that is so fucking dark. You can't even see what is going on. And that was upsetting. It was

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blue and just dark and I can I can tell what was happening. I could barely hear or see. And so I

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and so I think when I watched this movie, it was kind of like it wasn't too late at night, but it

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was at night an hour in, I just had to like call it and go to sleep because it was just I think it

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was depriving my senses from me. You said fugue state. Yeah, I did. Yeah, absolutely. Oh my

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goodness. Yeah, it's funny how the yeah that how it's effective in that, right? You know,

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because this is a fugue state for her as she's yeah, theoretically transported to like she's

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dreaming this whole time or something to that effect. But yeah, so speaking of Munchkin Land,

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so as Dorothy descends from the atmosphere, she smashes through the Oz sign falls upon and kills

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Evermeen, the wicked witch of the East. It's an Oz sign. OK, that makes more sense. I was like for

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Wizzy with the Z's and O with the Z in the middle. That's Oz. OK, that makes sense. So the wicked

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witch of the East who rules Munchkin Land as a result, she frees the Munchkins who populate

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the playground in which she lands. Dorothy soon meets the Munchkins. Yeah, they got turned into

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tunes. They said, well, the wicked witch of the East turned us into tunes on the wall. And I was

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like, oh, and they just like pop out of the wall. We're no longer like a Kip Haring or whatever

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that artist's name. But yeah, everybody kind of comes out of the wall in these. Yeah, like

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murder chalk drawings in a big like space that looks like it's just like an empty, dark space

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that has like a slide in the middle or something like plague. And then it's all this graffiti and

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everything. And then a lot of the sets in this movie are the stadium. And later on, when we see

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the Tin Man, the roller coaster and then whatever that courthouse set. But and then the wicked witch

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warehouse, all these like big, imposing sets with like sometimes a lot of people, sometimes no one.

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And it feels very empty and wide shots and like interesting pacing and editing of those shots as

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well. But there's these like wide shots they hang on a lot and just have things kind of happen

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as if filming like a stage play on stage. And there's just they haven't I don't know,

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they didn't figure out with this one how to make a musical exciting on on a visual element. And we

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us watching enough musicals on this broadcast to it's that's kind of been hit or miss as far as

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how people are successful in bringing bringing that across. But yeah, so they leave Munchkinland,

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then she she meets up with Scarecrow. And oh, yeah, the benefactor was an interesting thing.

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I want to touch on that because I was I just was so curious as to what her business is, because

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I mean, that's so she's like the voice of the Munchkins, right? So she comes in.

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Is that Glenda the good the good witch? Is that when she comes in?

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Hmm. Oh, yes. Miss one the good witch of the north. Right. Yeah. Yeah. She's a good witch.

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A magical numbers runner.

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Who gives who gives her the charm silver slippers.

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You know, what was so funny is I just like I mean, yeah, she looked she looked great.

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It was very dear elite.

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Everyone around her. Yes. But she was she had a good outfit.

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So, yeah, that's that's how I felt.

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Never going to get old for you, but not for us.

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But yeah, I registered to follow the yellow brick road to the road to the Emerald City,

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the yellow brick road. Cool concept. We saw it in the trailer for. Yeah.

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Always check us out. Check us out on Twitch. But yeah, it's like it's really

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where it slowly like pans up like they're like looking down the ground. They're like,

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wait a minute, there's a little there's some yellow bricks. There's a little bit more.

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And then it's just panning up. They're like, oh, my God, it's right there. And it's like,

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no, it was there in front of you the whole time for us as the camera. Yes, we had to like look up.

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But for you, you just had to open your eyes. It was right in front of you.

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It's like, how did that just appear in front of you like that?

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They were just looking down at the ground the whole time.

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Wait a minute. Look. Oh, then they get on down the road. That's a good song. The scaracos

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song was like, oh, cool, Michael Jackson. He's here. He's he's a magnetic performer. And then

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the first thing that he has to do is just be still on this thing as a scare. I know.

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But it's like, man, get get him dancing early. You got to get him down from there. You got to

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get him dancing quick and early. Like, because any anytime after that, I was glued to this glued to

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his performance on screen, even if it was just walking around. Like, do you notice all of his

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scarecrow isms? I thought that it was just amazing because it was kind of random and chaotic in some

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ways. Like it wasn't predictable exactly what he would do. He kind of had this bow legged sort of

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hop, skip and jump. But then every every now and then he would just eat shit and like fall and then

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do like a topple and jump back up. And then like, and he would always be kind of like slipping and

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uncoordinated and clumsy. But then like when he had to do a dance or whatever with like a group

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of people, it was always so quick on and on top of it. And he would actually add little flourishes

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in between as a scarecrow. But yeah, all that got to get got to get him dancing. And then Diana Ross

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is a goofy dancer, too. I love totally a goofy dancer. I love her physicality. Yeah, because she

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really like like feels and throws it in there and like really like makes it snap and like has all

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this like, yeah. And it's really just throw her hands up and start spinning around and her and

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and very expressive eyes and she dances with her face, which is great, too, in a musical where you

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can see the expression in the back row. Yeah, I so much so that I heard that Sydney Lamed, the director

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who what a goat that guy is so many director awards. But yeah, she was so expressive that he

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didn't even have to turn the camera on in order for her image to be put onto the reel.

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Oh, I was laughing already.

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But yeah, I was speaking to Sydney Lamed now that I mentioned it is like, yeah, so that's I it's just

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it's kind of crazy to me that this movie is so uninteresting in its direction for a guy who

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is a well known director, I guess, like 12 Angry Men isn't necessarily something that's got a lot

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of kinetic directing to it. It is a lot of just, you know, putting the camera on people when they're

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talking in a way that just makes sense and pretty. But I don't know, I guess. Do you have any

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opinions about like, I guess the directing and 12 Angry Men doesn't like totally stand out to me.

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But it's not to say that he hasn't done other movies that are like, yeah, really good movies,

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you know, because you also have Dog Day Afternoon Network, all like, you know, movies. So 12

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Angry Men 57, really, then, yeah, it's crazy that. Yeah, I don't know that they picked him,

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though, I guess is something I would say about that. It's like that they landed on him. I know

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that you were showing a little bit about potentially Baron Samity, the guy who plays him doing being

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the director, right? Possibly. Yeah, it was just one of the things that I was thinking about.

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Possibly. Yeah, I was just watching that video for the first time with you before this kind of

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looking at some behind the scenes stuff and looks like he had a big part in the musical as well. And

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what creatively the creative process and creating everything in line with the stage play. And then

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they went in a different direction and did their thing. And then at the last minute, right, when

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the movie was about to come out, they reached out to Baron Samity again, the guy who played Baron

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Samity from Live and Let Die, a movie that we both love. Love it. Love it. Love it. Black

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Splatoon as well. Yeah. And and they reached out to him to try and fix whatever they felt was was

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wrong with the movie, which is kind of kind of telling. And it's I don't know, none of these

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movies really. It's really hard to compare them with The Wiz because they're so vastly different.

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And I mean, for you to be able to direct a movie that all takes place within within one room and

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have it be entertaining and and keep the pace and momentum that that speaks that you are a really

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great director. But yeah, I mean, to be honest, I haven't seen Dog Day Afternoon or Serpico. And

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these are my 70s blind spot, I feel like some. I know we've talked about it because I yeah,

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I'm aware of these films, but I haven't seen them either. You know that again. Yeah, I feel like this

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is another you know, this being brought up again is another reason why maybe we should

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not really get into 70s. Yeah, even just as like a little thing for me. And yes, like a little

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mini series of just like classics because I even picked up a little want to be film nerd myself.

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I picked up Tarantino's book and a lot of it is about 70s cinema and the movies that he grew up

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watching. And I kind of wanted to use that as kind of like a guide piece to watching some of those

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movies. And he has a chapter on each one and then kind of read a chapter, watch a movie,

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sounded kind of fun to me. So I might be doing that. Watching Mahogany was was cool. And then

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even before that we did was it Lady Sings the Blues, which I mean, to even just to just to speak

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to that again, I think we talked about it last episode, but Diana Ross's performance as Billie

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Halliday was legendary and such a good performance. But should we just talk about the Tin Man and the

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Lion Man and I want to mention that the screenplay is by Joel Schumacher. I think. Yeah, that's crazy.

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I saw that. That's an interesting little factoid because that guy's an insane person. I put in our

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general chat a picture of Joel Schumacher. He looks like he's a legend. Yeah, he looks like a plastic

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person. And yeah, he total legend for being. Yeah, I don't know. It just seems like a guy who's done

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a lot of cocaine in his life and has made some crazy movies. I mean, Batman, Robin is one of my

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favorite movies. We did Phantom of the Opera on this this year podcast. So it's he was he was

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involved in. So maybe maybe that's why he was in charge of Phantom of the Opera was was his

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involvement with with this movie and in musicals and everything. There's something about Batman

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and Robin where it does feel like you're watching like a stunt spectacular. Yeah. Like on stage or

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something like that. So I don't. Yeah, it's it's it's an interesting time for movies and something

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that maybe us were like, yeah, like we're just saying we're not as familiar with. However,

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yeah, it's it's based on a timeless movie. And so you're inevitably going to draw comparisons

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to the original, which you can't beat. But to do your own version of I would hope that like

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there's some some tenants and some some things within the music that I could hang my hand on and

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remember like a song besides just he's on get on down, get on down road like that. That's just

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like the one that I that I remember. And that's unfortunate for such a strong music driven

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movie on a on a base level. Visually, it's upsetting. And this tin man's song I thought was

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just like unsettling. Yeah. And his whole his whole way of being I know if it's like a what kind of

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affectation he's trying to draw on like I was like a Bing Crosby or something like that. Like he's

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just enunciating everything and just really slow and enunciating every every word like a current

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crooner sort of sort of song and not not my favorite, not my favorite. I was unsettled. And

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then the lion was just the where I think I had to stop my first half of viewing where I was just I

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can I can go anymore. Yeah, yeah. He was like doing that licking thing too. And he like later,

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I don't know maybe that was later on. But he was like, he's doing a lot of like actual cat stuff.

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He's doing like a lot of licking and snarling little snarls and stuff. I guess it's fine.

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And then I don't know the whiz. There's the big Xardas kind of head

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and Emerald City. Anything to say about the three color songs and Emerald City? Everything still

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felt blue. I know it was green, but I was like, how does it still like feel like blue and dark?

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It's dark, like so dark and big, open, dark spaces.

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It was. Yeah, the whole situation was so fucking bizarre because instead of getting there and my

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recollection of the original is not. It's pretty foggy. But like, you know, you get there and it's

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like a city. It's like the ladies come in. Yeah, that's that's before. Yeah, the poppies,

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the girls, the prostitutes, because that's that's how when they are getting in the original,

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it's like the flowers and shit. Right. Opium.

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But yes, so like the Emerald City is like a place where all of the like elitists are,

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you know, all the people that are well taken care of. And then, you know, this movie does that as

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well. We're like where we met the scarecrow is in this like abandoned building that stands alone by

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itself run down. He's being hassled by crows. The ten men in the cowardly lion are met in this

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abandoned amusement park. So all of these analogues to the original where these like deprecated,

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dilapidated like city analogues to what they were in the original, which the lions like

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turned into a little statue thing like a gargoyle lion thing. Yeah.

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And banished from the jungle. The tin man's a carny old carny broken down at like Coney Island

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Rolls-Royce. He's got the his little cane and stuff like that. And then that set too is just

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like there's like some scant little patches of little things they just threw on the ground and

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it's just like trash. Everything is trash. It's a lot of trash. Scarecrow is made of trash.

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I know, right. And there's some really gruesome stuff towards the end here where we get to the

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like factory that the Wicked Witch. Yeah. Yeah. Is that it is like really fucking crazy. That's

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on like this scene. Terrifying to children. Oh, yeah. If I saw this as a kid, I'd have

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fucking nightmares for sure. Nightmare, nightmare fuel in this where yeah. Yeah. What is it? It's

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like scarecrow or the tin man is just getting disembodied. Now, the tin man gets pressed

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and then gets completely flattened. See that scarecrows get disembarked. Yeah. Oh, God. Some

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really fucking wild ass shit in here. But yeah. So the Emerald City and then Richard Pryor

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as the Wizard of Oz, I just I, you know, this it's one of those things where it's not a good

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sign for me when we get to the Emerald City and I look at the time I stopped the movie and go like,

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oh, wait a minute, we just fucking got because I know the story where it's we meet the wizard

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the first time and he's behind the curtain. Then they have to go out to the Wicked Witch,

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come back and then have that. After the and I'm like, we are just now getting to the Emerald City

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to talk to the the fake dude. And it's like an hour, all the songs, hour 20 instead of like

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into it. Getting to Emerald City, you get one song, you get three different ones about, oh, no, now

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reds the color reds the color we wear now, whatever, whatever, how it goes. Oh, gold's the color.

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I am in the same boat. And then you get you get back and you see Richard Pryor and

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it's by that point, I'm so drained. The Wicked Witch scene really, really drained me because

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it was just screaming the whole time. I don't want any bad news. It was just like, ah,

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don't scream. At the end of it, you're like, I'm not going to tell you bad news. OK,

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I've been beaten over the head by this song saying over and over and over and it's so long

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and it's just and it's a bunch of factory sounds and screaming. And it's just like it's so gothic

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and dark and scared. And it's like, yeah, I get it. OK, it should be oppressive to a degree. But

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it's just it's so funny how this movie fails to have fun at its core and fundamental level.

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It tries so hard to think it is way smarter than it is by creating all of these like allegories

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or these, you know, these metaphors out of what it what the this version's like settings are.

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But my God, it is just so oppressive. And the songs, like you said, like from Motown,

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none of these are like pop songs where it's like a supreme song where you're like, oh, yeah,

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this is got a it's got a hook. It's a jam. You know, none of that really exists in this movie.

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And it's just so crazy that all again, all of these things on paper should be good. And it just

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comes out like this where it's yeah, it's quite the weight, the slog like I said.

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Yeah, the same way the songs don't have a hook like the scenes themselves don't really in the

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movie itself. And it doesn't have a hook and is designed for stage like all the sets are designed

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for stage where it'd be fine if you had a couple scant little patches of thing and you're you're

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sitting in this in the seats and you're in your watch and you're just focused on the person

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singing and they're doing they're they're doing a fine job singing, they're doing to the back row.

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And it's I can picture seeing the whiz in broad on Broadway and having a good time. And the way

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that it is done here is grading and almost like forcing you to just sit there and listen to someone

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just yell and scream for five minutes and they get flushed down a toilet like it was nothing and then

372
00:38:40,680 --> 00:38:45,960
just move it like things would just move on in a way to the next portion of the movie.

373
00:38:47,320 --> 00:38:53,400
In a way that was like assuming you that you knew the story of the first one and kind of

374
00:38:54,120 --> 00:38:59,160
in a very unsatisfied way like okay, you get it she's it's water blah blah blah will move on

375
00:38:59,160 --> 00:39:03,240
rather than like, oh, you could have done maybe a fresh take or made it interesting or just

376
00:39:03,800 --> 00:39:09,560
kind of making letting the audience assume and then making these songs way too long as well.

377
00:39:09,560 --> 00:39:17,960
I don't know it's a long it's a pretty fucking movie like over two hours. And then she gets

378
00:39:17,960 --> 00:39:21,800
she gets back to the whiz they do that whole thing of like, oh, it's in you the whole time.

379
00:39:22,360 --> 00:39:26,840
Like the scarecrow Michael Jackson pulling out those little fortune cookie things was kind of

380
00:39:26,840 --> 00:39:32,440
fun. And I like that part at the end where she's like, well, who said that? I did.

381
00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:44,040
That was that was kind of cute. I like that. Yeah, it's it is rewarding to have gone through this

382
00:39:44,040 --> 00:39:50,840
journey, especially this one that seemed that was just so like, oh, I feel like I'm walking in cement

383
00:39:50,840 --> 00:39:58,280
and I want to get through this and to get to the point of like, oh, okay, we're gonna we're

384
00:39:58,280 --> 00:40:05,160
gonna realize all of these wonderful things that we had inside of us. And I Yeah, but then that gets

385
00:40:05,160 --> 00:40:13,000
fucking cut in my mind and goes right into this whole like, the Wizard of Oz is this politician

386
00:40:13,000 --> 00:40:19,320
from Atlantic City. And then you have to deal with all of Yeah, then it was I ran for dog catcher or

387
00:40:19,320 --> 00:40:26,280
whatever. And and was dropping all the papers down below. Yeah, that shit. Oh, God, that old monologue.

388
00:40:26,280 --> 00:40:33,240
And his voice was so high the whole time. It was like, why is he doing this thing? I was waiting

389
00:40:33,240 --> 00:40:37,720
for it to drop back down into like a normal register. He's just doing that like, high,

390
00:40:37,720 --> 00:40:45,400
high voice the whole time. But I think this is the last little song of hers.

391
00:40:46,920 --> 00:40:52,520
Because you've had them all along. Scarecrow, you figured out how to find a yellow brick road

392
00:40:52,520 --> 00:40:57,320
and destroy evil lean and every smart way because nothing really happens after this. No.

393
00:40:58,680 --> 00:41:06,040
But lion, it's a reprise when Evelyn strung you up by your tail, I was gonna fast forward a little bit.

394
00:41:07,560 --> 00:41:08,360
It's your

395
00:41:12,040 --> 00:41:16,520
belief. There's a reason to be snooze.

396
00:41:16,520 --> 00:41:28,040
Believe you can make time stand still. You know, from the moment you try, if you believe,

397
00:41:31,400 --> 00:41:38,040
I know you will. If you believe in yourself,

398
00:41:38,040 --> 00:41:46,520
if you believe in yourself, if you believe in yourself,

399
00:41:49,320 --> 00:41:51,960
you believe in yourself.

400
00:42:00,440 --> 00:42:04,440
There's this there's the part I think you I don't know if you you saw but the

401
00:42:04,440 --> 00:42:08,520
I don't know the very end she just stares at the camera the whole time and it starts

402
00:42:08,520 --> 00:42:13,080
like that and that's so sort of way but it just builds and builds and I just feel like her eyes

403
00:42:13,080 --> 00:42:18,040
and emotion just gets more and more intense over three minutes and that I'm just in my seat just

404
00:42:18,040 --> 00:42:23,000
like, Oh my god, her head's gonna explode. She's just like,

405
00:42:26,040 --> 00:42:33,080
it just keeps getting louder and just like, Oh my god. And then all the all these like visions of

406
00:42:33,080 --> 00:42:37,720
the lion and the tin man come floating behind her like pictures of their head floating pictures of

407
00:42:37,720 --> 00:42:43,720
their head. And that's their way of like getting like, like, yeah, remember your your friends along

408
00:42:43,720 --> 00:42:48,200
the way rather than her waking up in the bed and being like, Dorothy, are you okay, Dorothy, Dorothy?

409
00:42:48,840 --> 00:42:53,320
And oh, you were in my dream and you and you none of that. It doesn't have to be but this one,

410
00:42:53,320 --> 00:42:59,800
what they chose to do was just shoot floating heads by her as she's like screaming into the camera.

411
00:42:59,800 --> 00:43:09,640
Oh, floating heads like this is fucking and then Glinda's song Oh my god, her eyes are, I don't know.

412
00:43:10,520 --> 00:43:15,400
I assume cocaine was involved in this movie in some way but she she looks like she's like

413
00:43:17,480 --> 00:43:20,920
really happy to be there. That's all I'll say. I don't know how to say it but

414
00:43:20,920 --> 00:43:28,360
vibrating. Yeah, like her, her energy is just vibrating man. But let's let's see some reviews

415
00:43:28,360 --> 00:43:37,320
from some some critics and see what they have to say about it. It's a 41% by the critics

416
00:43:38,200 --> 00:43:42,760
on the old Ron tomatoes. Let's check out some little tidbits.

417
00:43:46,920 --> 00:43:54,200
Let's go to Entertainment Weekly David Barber, Barboar. Whatever fun this is, he gives it a 16.

418
00:43:54,200 --> 00:43:59,720
Precise David. Whatever fun this funked up Wizard of Oz had on Broadway is erased by

419
00:43:59,720 --> 00:44:08,440
miscasting and a hideous design. Oz as a New York slum. Yeah. TV Guide Magazine 25.

420
00:44:09,960 --> 00:44:15,320
Staff not credited and whatever. Sidney Lumet's overblown direction strips the story of its magic.

421
00:44:15,320 --> 00:44:20,280
Ross is too old for the part and never quite captures Dorothy's innocence and prior is wasted

422
00:44:20,280 --> 00:44:31,400
in a film ill suited to his talents. The New Yorker Pauline Kale. Kale 40. This film brings out all

423
00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:35,720
the weaknesses of its director Sidney Lumet and none of his strengths. The whole production has

424
00:44:35,720 --> 00:44:40,840
a stagnant atmosphere and the big dance numbers are freeform traffic jams.

425
00:44:40,840 --> 00:44:51,240
Oh, bam. Time's back. John Scowell 50. So much wit and talent and energy crowd the scene, the

426
00:44:51,240 --> 00:44:57,080
screen in this lavishly filmed variant of the Oz story that it is depressing to realize that the

427
00:44:57,080 --> 00:45:04,360
production never had a chance. And that's what our critics have to say about that. Let's move on over

428
00:45:04,360 --> 00:45:14,840
into audience territory and check out their side of things here. They gave it a 65. Let's check out

429
00:45:14,840 --> 00:45:25,640
some. Yeah, 65 percent. 65 percent. Let me pull these pull these up here and give me one moment.

430
00:45:25,640 --> 00:45:35,160
Sorry, folks. But the. But the better vamp. But the better better better. But the better.

431
00:45:36,120 --> 00:45:44,040
Oh, my God, is it who I think it is? We have a blarge entering into the polarized zone

432
00:45:45,000 --> 00:45:50,280
into the polar kingdom. All right. Well, he gets to he gets to witness the end of our whiz

433
00:45:50,280 --> 00:45:57,240
whiz reviews. Let's we're whizzing in here. Blarge. Yeah, we've got a five star from a

434
00:45:57,240 --> 00:46:02,600
Rotten Tomato person. It's a really good movie and totally iconic. Everyone remembers scenes

435
00:46:02,600 --> 00:46:07,480
they saw once as a child. The performances by the entire cast are wonderful. If you dislike it,

436
00:46:07,480 --> 00:46:13,880
you're just being stuck up. Yeah, that's me. Well, excuse me while I go get the stick out of my ass.

437
00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:20,120
And this is another Rotten Tomato anonymous user five stars. If you don't like this movie,

438
00:46:20,120 --> 00:46:26,920
you're anti black. Just kidding. But being from the generation Z, this is the only whiz I

439
00:46:26,920 --> 00:46:31,880
acknowledge. The cast is amazing. The sets were beautiful. The soundtrack made me cry.

440
00:46:31,880 --> 00:46:36,760
I watch this movie at least every four months because this is my favorite movie of all time.

441
00:46:36,760 --> 00:46:45,800
Hello. Another Rotten Tomato user five stars. This movie way better than the original Wizard

442
00:46:45,800 --> 00:46:51,960
of Oz, which will put you to sleep. Impressive for 1978. Relatable stories of life's pitfalls

443
00:46:51,960 --> 00:46:59,720
and songs to get you out of them. Great kids movie. Kids movie. Not true. Not true. The opposite.

444
00:46:59,720 --> 00:47:03,800
Lots of symbolism to update for the modern audience. Very on the nose with it could cut

445
00:47:03,800 --> 00:47:09,880
30 minutes and would be better for it. Yeah. Yeah. But you left it. Yeah. Uh huh. OK. Can

446
00:47:09,880 --> 00:47:13,160
you imagine your favorite movie? You're like, yeah, it doesn't need 30 minutes.

447
00:47:13,160 --> 00:47:21,960
It doesn't need 30 minutes of it. Yeah. Five stars. This movie is an amazing art piece.

448
00:47:22,520 --> 00:47:25,640
Truly underrated. It's one of the most beautiful movies I've ever seen.

449
00:47:25,640 --> 00:47:33,240
That is category five stars. Amazing. What a wonderful tribute to Black Lives Matter.

450
00:47:33,240 --> 00:47:39,240
Ah, OK. All right. Oh, and we know when that was written.

451
00:47:41,240 --> 00:47:47,640
Let's see. One of my favorite childhood movies. One of the greatest in black cinema history.

452
00:47:47,640 --> 00:47:53,160
These are some of the some of the things people are saying. Five stars. This movie is both Diana

453
00:47:53,160 --> 00:47:58,280
Ross and Michael Jackson. And the music is written by Quincy Jones. It's a trifecta of musical genius

454
00:47:58,280 --> 00:48:03,480
and a must see for my family. For my family. The plot is based off of Wizard of Oz, so it will

455
00:48:03,480 --> 00:48:08,120
likely be familiar to most audiences. But for me, the music is what makes this version more exciting

456
00:48:08,120 --> 00:48:13,480
than the original. It has some subtle jokes, but maintains a dramatic feel throughout. I think it's

457
00:48:13,480 --> 00:48:20,680
great musical and worth seeing. Hopefully you'll agree. I do not. And this is probably a good time

458
00:48:20,680 --> 00:48:26,600
to move into our view. Should I kick it off? Actually, I need to go get something at the door,

459
00:48:26,600 --> 00:48:32,120
but I don't know. I guess if you want to kick it off, you can. Or if you just. Yeah, I can just

460
00:48:32,120 --> 00:48:40,120
start talking. OK. Brandon will be back. I'll give him a final score. Corey's somewhat here.

461
00:48:40,120 --> 00:48:51,400
But yeah, I was not a fan of this movie. It was a drain of my energy and life force in many ways.

462
00:48:51,400 --> 00:48:57,880
When I was looking forward to watching a fun musical, it ended up being two hours and 13 minutes

463
00:48:57,880 --> 00:49:08,280
of kind of a slog. And the things that I did really enjoy, I was really stretching to find the

464
00:49:08,280 --> 00:49:14,280
to find the reasons to and primarily that being what got me in the door, which was the cast of

465
00:49:14,280 --> 00:49:26,840
Diana Ross and Michael Jackson. And they have. In arguably have. A whole bunch of fucking talent,

466
00:49:26,840 --> 00:49:30,120
both of those people, so they're going to shine through no matter what you put them in.

467
00:49:30,120 --> 00:49:38,040
But this was hard even for them to make their mark on and have it be successful,

468
00:49:38,760 --> 00:49:44,440
because the songwriting wasn't wasn't there and there was no hooks for me to

469
00:49:46,440 --> 00:49:56,680
remember and find catchy apart from the get on down the road song. And it's it was

470
00:49:56,680 --> 00:50:05,080
it was a drag visually because it was so fucking dark. And for the original movie to be

471
00:50:06,120 --> 00:50:14,680
revolving around its use of color in many ways, this one really messed up something so simple as

472
00:50:15,480 --> 00:50:23,480
just color. And I can see certain things that were going on. I can hear others. And it was

473
00:50:23,480 --> 00:50:32,600
unfortunate that they took something that had so much potential and didn't make full use of it.

474
00:50:32,600 --> 00:50:35,560
And I think that's what makes it even more upsetting. If there was a movie that

475
00:50:37,880 --> 00:50:45,400
that was going to be crap to begin with, then I'd be more maybe forgiving to some of the things

476
00:50:45,400 --> 00:50:52,760
that they did well. But for them to not really find many things, they didn't really find

477
00:50:52,760 --> 00:51:00,760
many things to do well. With so much good stuff going on there is is a real bummer. I'm curious

478
00:51:00,760 --> 00:51:07,960
to see if the if the musical is a is a thing that I could see on stage, I would be interested in that.

479
00:51:08,760 --> 00:51:15,640
But beyond that, it's going to be a do not recommend. It will be close to the rotten side of things.

480
00:51:15,640 --> 00:51:21,400
I'm going to go with our brains not back yet, but I'm just going to go ahead and share my score.

481
00:51:21,400 --> 00:51:31,000
It's going to be it's going to be a 30, I think a 30 25 to 30 hours.

482
00:51:31,000 --> 00:51:42,520
I'll do 28. I'll do 28. It's gonna be 28 for me. While he is gone, I'm wondering if yeah,

483
00:51:42,520 --> 00:52:01,880
we haven't listened to Eason down the road. So let's check that check that one out real quick.

484
00:52:12,520 --> 00:52:42,120
I'm gonna take us home so we can start the other thing. So the whiz. My final thoughts on this is

485
00:52:42,120 --> 00:52:49,640
that I think it was an enormous misstep to visually to have this movie be set in this dystopian New

486
00:52:49,640 --> 00:52:53,960
York City. I know that it probably seems like a really like deep and insightful thing to do,

487
00:52:53,960 --> 00:52:58,600
but it makes the movie seem so drab, hard to see at times and really, really unfun.

488
00:52:59,560 --> 00:53:07,560
Again, like we were just riffing on is that we're just talking. The songs in this are so are

489
00:53:07,560 --> 00:53:16,840
surprisingly, yeah, are shockingly boring and not and yeah, just not memorable. And that is

490
00:53:17,880 --> 00:53:22,360
really, really sad. You have Michael Jackson and Diana Ross in your movie. None of these songs.

491
00:53:22,840 --> 00:53:28,760
Like almost every other musical we've done, I have listened to a song from it after the fact,

492
00:53:28,760 --> 00:53:34,120
there are no songs like and then not even that like just even like the the chorus or the hook

493
00:53:34,120 --> 00:53:38,040
is in my head coming out of it for some of these songs and none of these songs do that for me.

494
00:53:38,040 --> 00:53:45,160
So weird. It's so bizarre. And yeah, it just is makes for this movie being overall very long

495
00:53:45,160 --> 00:53:54,280
and unfun. I'm going to give this movie a I'm going to give this movie a 16%. Yeah, that's me.

496
00:53:55,160 --> 00:54:01,320
And that's the whiz. That's polarized. That's that's that's polarized. That's that's one where

497
00:54:01,320 --> 00:54:08,200
we like, yeah, we were we delayed our recording of this podcast as well a couple of times,

498
00:54:08,200 --> 00:54:12,200
because even to the point where like, man, we're almost kind of just like dreading going through

499
00:54:12,200 --> 00:54:18,840
this. But I think as I've said in the past, it is cathartic to go through it and to know that

500
00:54:20,520 --> 00:54:26,600
I'm not alone, whereas like, man, yeah, I should like this more than I than how I'm feeling. And

501
00:54:26,600 --> 00:54:33,720
then just instead of being, yeah, super I was pretty upset, but also like unsettled and tired

502
00:54:33,720 --> 00:54:41,080
and bored a lot during this and don't recommend. And that's unfortunate, but it is what it is.

503
00:54:42,360 --> 00:54:47,080
I think I hope I pray I've seen this movie once before our next movie that we're that we're doing.

504
00:54:47,080 --> 00:54:51,960
I'm looking forward to it. I'm looking forward to Brandini checking it out. It is the last dragon.

505
00:54:51,960 --> 00:55:00,360
And our last little Barry Gordy adjacent film that we will be discussing. Let me pull up those

506
00:55:00,360 --> 00:55:09,880
numbies for all of you fine people before we send you on your way. It is a 59 percent from critics,

507
00:55:09,880 --> 00:55:16,920
an 86 percent audience. And I'll read the description here on Rotten Tomatoes.

508
00:55:17,640 --> 00:55:21,880
Leroy Green, a young martial artist living in New York City, trains tirelessly to attain

509
00:55:21,880 --> 00:55:25,880
the same level of mastery as the great Bruce Lee. One night, his life changes forever when

510
00:55:25,880 --> 00:55:33,480
he rescues television personality Laura Charles from evil businessman Eddie Arcadian. Impressed

511
00:55:33,480 --> 00:55:39,800
by Leroy's bravery, Laura falls for Leroy, but to keep her safe, he will have to defeat a gang

512
00:55:39,800 --> 00:55:47,480
leader named Shonuf, the self-styled shogun of Harlem. Fuck, it's so sad. No one's just moving.

513
00:55:47,480 --> 00:55:54,120
It's not sad. We'll we'll be doing this one next week. If you want to reach us in the meantime,

514
00:55:55,080 --> 00:56:00,520
Polarize Pod, www.twitch.tv slash Polarize Pod. If you want to watch this live,

515
00:56:01,080 --> 00:56:05,160
Twitter, dot com, same place, Polarize Pod. If you want to send us an email,

516
00:56:05,160 --> 00:56:13,400
polarize the pod at gmail dot com. Any movie ideas, segment ideas, fan mail, hate mail and

517
00:56:13,400 --> 00:56:18,920
rate reviews, subscribe on Apple Podcasts. We love you all and we'll see you next time for The Last Dragon.