1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:06,800 Time for another episode of Chelsea Reed's article for the first time to you all as a starter on the episode. 2 00:00:06,800 --> 00:00:14,560 This one's titled, Historian Sue Biden for illegally withholding 16,000 JFK assassination files. 3 00:00:14,560 --> 00:00:15,840 What are they hiding? 4 00:00:15,840 --> 00:00:16,960 They're just in his attic. 5 00:00:20,720 --> 00:00:23,200 They're his personal JFK files. 6 00:00:23,200 --> 00:00:28,560 Yeah. To be fair, he was probably there. Like, he's old enough. 7 00:00:28,560 --> 00:00:30,080 Probably was, yeah. 8 00:00:30,080 --> 00:00:32,160 So let's see what this article's about. 9 00:00:32,160 --> 00:00:39,440 The most expansive online directory of information on the assassination of President John F. Kennedy, 10 00:00:39,440 --> 00:00:45,520 JFK for short, has sued the Biden administration and the National Archives in an attempt to make 11 00:00:45,520 --> 00:00:52,560 the government publicize all the documents not yet shared concerning the murder in 1963. 12 00:00:52,560 --> 00:00:56,880 Just as an aside, I find it kind of off-putting that they called it a murder. 13 00:00:56,880 --> 00:01:01,760 In my mind, it's just strictly an assassination, which yes, I do get their interchangeable words, 14 00:01:01,760 --> 00:01:04,480 but it feels wrong to call it the JFK murder. 15 00:01:04,480 --> 00:01:07,280 In some cases, it's interchangeable, I guess. 16 00:01:08,240 --> 00:01:10,000 I feel like they're kind of different. 17 00:01:10,000 --> 00:01:14,400 Yeah. The real difference between an assassination and a murder is the 18 00:01:14,400 --> 00:01:16,960 fame of the person being killed. 19 00:01:16,960 --> 00:01:17,760 Yeah, I guess so. 20 00:01:17,760 --> 00:01:19,760 Or the wealth level. That's really it. 21 00:01:19,760 --> 00:01:23,760 Yeah. At that point, we're just like, what's the word for it? Like, I don't know. 22 00:01:23,760 --> 00:01:27,440 Oh, we're just the plebs. We barely get murdered. We just kind of get off. 23 00:01:28,000 --> 00:01:32,480 Okay. Yeah, I've never heard it put that way either. I was busy reading it out loud, 24 00:01:32,480 --> 00:01:34,480 so I didn't process the information. 25 00:01:34,480 --> 00:01:39,440 Lawsuit was filed on Wednesday by the Mary Farrell Foundation, 26 00:01:39,440 --> 00:01:45,200 one year after President Joe Biden shared a memo delaying the release of the final 16,000 27 00:01:45,200 --> 00:01:50,880 documents relating to the assassination slash murder. NBC News reported. 28 00:01:50,880 --> 00:01:54,800 By the way, this article is from the independent.co.uk. 29 00:01:54,800 --> 00:01:56,080 It's a picture of Beyonce. 30 00:01:56,080 --> 00:01:57,440 Did you do the reporting? 31 00:01:57,440 --> 00:02:00,800 Beyonce? I don't think so, but I can't tell you that for sure, 32 00:02:00,800 --> 00:02:02,240 because I haven't gotten to that part. 33 00:02:04,080 --> 00:02:05,600 They put that at the top. 34 00:02:05,600 --> 00:02:11,680 P.S. This is Beyonce. Oh, it's Gustav Killander. That's who wrote it. 35 00:02:11,680 --> 00:02:15,840 That's, unless Beyonce is just the pen name of Gustav. 36 00:02:15,840 --> 00:02:26,000 Gustav. So the JFK Records Collection Act of 1992 was signed into law by President Bill Clinton. 37 00:02:26,000 --> 00:02:31,200 The law states that the documents had to be released before the 26th of October 2017, 38 00:02:31,200 --> 00:02:34,720 but the publication of the documents was postponed by Donald Trump, 39 00:02:34,720 --> 00:02:38,320 leaving the decision by Mr. Biden. So hold up. 40 00:02:38,320 --> 00:02:41,840 Yeah, actually, after Trump lost the election or sorry, 41 00:02:41,840 --> 00:02:44,400 what's the correct way he would have put it? Just fuck it. 42 00:02:44,400 --> 00:02:47,840 After Trump lost the election, I'm surprised he didn't pull a ton of shit. 43 00:02:47,840 --> 00:02:51,120 Like just say, yeah, release this stuff. I don't care anymore. 44 00:02:51,120 --> 00:02:54,320 That's true, unless there wasn't anything of like importance. 45 00:02:54,320 --> 00:02:58,640 Also, he had the hiccup of he technically, he still thought he was president and wanted 46 00:02:58,640 --> 00:03:00,800 to maintain being president. So he didn't want to do anything. 47 00:03:00,800 --> 00:03:03,760 That's true. And he may be back, I guess. 48 00:03:03,760 --> 00:03:09,200 Yeah, let's not worry about that, though. Let's do the escapism that is conspiracy. 49 00:03:09,200 --> 00:03:14,480 Okay, so the Foundation's president, Jefferson Morley, said that it's high time that the 50 00:03:14,480 --> 00:03:19,440 government got its act together and obeyed the spirit and the letter of the law. 51 00:03:19,440 --> 00:03:22,960 I like that spirit comes first. According to NBC News, 52 00:03:22,960 --> 00:03:26,640 this is about our history and our right to know. It's true, though. 53 00:03:26,640 --> 00:03:30,800 We do deserve to know, even though it's we don't live in the United States. 54 00:03:30,800 --> 00:03:34,560 Robert Kennedy Jr., son of the 35th president's brother, 55 00:03:34,560 --> 00:03:39,200 told the outlet that it was a momentous crime, a crime against American democracy, 56 00:03:39,200 --> 00:03:44,240 and the American people have the right to know. Law requires the records to be released. 57 00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:49,280 It's bizarre. It's been almost 60 years since my uncle's death. What are they hiding? He asked. 58 00:03:49,280 --> 00:03:56,160 Majority of experts on the 22nd of November 1963 murder believe that the final trove of 59 00:03:56,160 --> 00:04:00,480 documents doesn't include clear evidence that others were behind the shooting alongside 60 00:04:00,480 --> 00:04:06,400 accused gunman Lee Harvey Oswald, Oswald that the records could add more general information 61 00:04:06,400 --> 00:04:11,920 about the U.S. Cold War history. Former CIA agent Rolfe, that's the name you don't hear anymore, 62 00:04:11,920 --> 00:04:18,000 Owen Larson, who was lectured about the assassination at Harvard, is critical of his former employer. 63 00:04:18,000 --> 00:04:22,720 He believes that the agency had contact with Oswald before the death of Mr. Kennedy and that 64 00:04:22,720 --> 00:04:27,200 the CIA covered it up. See, this is a much longer article than I anticipated. 65 00:04:27,200 --> 00:04:31,920 That's okay. I don't know if we have to go much further. One of the reasons that I've heard that 66 00:04:31,920 --> 00:04:37,760 makes a lot of sense to me is they won't release documents that have people who are still alive 67 00:04:37,760 --> 00:04:41,920 implicated in them. And I shouldn't say implicated. That's an incorrect term. Who are at least 68 00:04:41,920 --> 00:04:49,120 written about or might have their names mentioned in documents. If it's Biden. In 2017, 69 00:04:49,120 --> 00:04:57,280 George Bush, Sr., who was then the director of the CIA while J.S.K. was president, was still alive. 70 00:04:57,280 --> 00:05:01,360 From what I heard, the things that were not released likely had to do with George Bush, 71 00:05:01,360 --> 00:05:07,360 Sr., who died in 2018. So I don't know. Next time they come up, maybe they'll actually be released. 72 00:05:07,920 --> 00:05:14,080 And I'm just scanning this and basically sums up everything. Just, you know, you can make things 73 00:05:14,080 --> 00:05:19,360 wordy if you want, if you need to hit a certain amount of word counts in a... We've all written those 74 00:05:19,360 --> 00:05:24,640 essays. Yeah, exactly. Let's see opener. And with that, we've all heard about it for the very first 75 00:05:24,640 --> 00:05:30,640 time. Yes. And in fact, this JFK character that was murdered, or I did not know that. Yeah. 76 00:05:32,560 --> 00:05:34,640 So thank you for that. Let's get on to this episode. 77 00:05:34,640 --> 00:05:42,880 From the unexplained to the mundane. Come join us on a Journey to the Fringe. 78 00:05:47,280 --> 00:05:52,800 Hello and welcome to Journey to the Fringe. Now with a different amount of subliminal messaging, 79 00:05:52,800 --> 00:05:58,240 because we don't legally need to tell you if it's more or less subliminal messaging. Just that it's 80 00:05:58,240 --> 00:06:03,680 changed. We are your Liability Obsolved hosts, Taylor and Chelsea. And today we look at what is 81 00:06:03,680 --> 00:06:09,280 known as an old classic in the conspiracy community. Chelsea, I think that's an apt way to put it, 82 00:06:09,280 --> 00:06:13,520 right? Yeah, I would say so. One that I think most people just kind of, you've heard it, 83 00:06:13,520 --> 00:06:18,480 but you just kind of vaguely know what's going on with it or what happened with it. I think I've 84 00:06:18,480 --> 00:06:22,480 done alluding to it today. We will be talking about the Philadelphia experiment, which you 85 00:06:22,480 --> 00:06:28,080 likely saw in the title of this episode. So no reason to beat around the bush. This has a 86 00:06:28,080 --> 00:06:33,360 winding path that you're probably not going to expect some of the things that come up, 87 00:06:33,360 --> 00:06:38,560 but just stick with us. I promise it all doesn't make sense in the long run. We'll try. Now, 88 00:06:38,560 --> 00:06:43,840 this all starts with a character by the name of Morris K. Jessup. Really outside of this, 89 00:06:43,840 --> 00:06:49,040 he does not come up a lot in really anything. He was kind of considered one of the most, 90 00:06:49,840 --> 00:06:54,960 this is a quote I found on him, probably the most original extraterrestrial hypothesizer 91 00:06:54,960 --> 00:07:02,240 of the 1950s. He was basically Eric Von Daniken and Zachariah Stigin before they became who they were. 92 00:07:02,240 --> 00:07:08,560 Basically the original ancient alien hypothesis guy. Okay, I'm intrigued. He had both training 93 00:07:08,560 --> 00:07:13,840 in astronomy and archeology and working experience in both. Although the educational background 94 00:07:13,840 --> 00:07:20,480 wasn't there, he did end up going to archaeological expeditions in Yucatan and Peru in the 1920s. And 95 00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:27,520 he also documented an expedition to Cusco he took part in in 1930. Why this man became so notorious 96 00:07:27,520 --> 00:07:33,840 and involved with the stories because he wrote a book in 1955 called The Case for the UFO. In it, 97 00:07:33,840 --> 00:07:39,520 he writes a lot of things, nothing to do with the Philadelphia experiment at all. It's mostly that 98 00:07:39,520 --> 00:07:44,000 he just says that there are UFOs out there and they represent a mysterious subject worthy of 99 00:07:44,000 --> 00:07:50,480 further study. And he speculates that UFOs were exploratory crafts of solid and nebulous character. 100 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:56,000 He also linked ancient monuments with prehistoric super science, probably close to, if not the first 101 00:07:56,000 --> 00:08:01,120 person to write about this with Eric Von Daniken coming out with Chariot of the Gods in 68. This 102 00:08:01,120 --> 00:08:07,200 came out 13 years before that. Wow, a pioneer truly. So he wrote this book, it got published, 103 00:08:07,200 --> 00:08:12,480 and then out of nowhere, Jessup starts getting letters in the mail from somebody who's read the 104 00:08:12,480 --> 00:08:18,560 book calling himself Carlos Miguel Allende. The first known letter showed up in 1955 and it warned 105 00:08:18,560 --> 00:08:24,240 Jessup not to investigate the levitation of unidentified flying objects. Allende put forward 106 00:08:24,240 --> 00:08:30,000 a story of dangerous science based on unpublished theories by Albert Einstein, and he further claimed 107 00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:35,200 a scientist named Franklin Reno put these theories into practice in the Philadelphia 108 00:08:35,200 --> 00:08:42,160 Naval Shipyard in October of 1943. Allende claimed to have witnessed this experiment while serving 109 00:08:42,160 --> 00:08:49,040 aboard the SS Andrew Furasith. What happened was to the SS Eldridge, which I always love the name of. 110 00:08:49,040 --> 00:08:54,880 It just fully, for what's going to happen, reminds me of like HP Lovecraft, which is commonly known 111 00:08:54,880 --> 00:09:00,560 as Eldridge Horror. Oh. And it's the SS Eldridge, which is a real ship. Okay, I was just about to 112 00:09:00,560 --> 00:09:05,200 say, and this was a real ship, right? We can prove it. It's a real ship, yes. There's documents about 113 00:09:05,200 --> 00:09:10,480 this ship everywhere. Interesting. That's the ship that was involved, all ships. It could have been 114 00:09:10,480 --> 00:09:17,360 the Titanic. He says that the SS Eldridge was a destroyer escort that was successfully made 115 00:09:17,360 --> 00:09:23,040 invisible, but the ship inexplicably teleported itself to Norfolk, Virginia for several minutes 116 00:09:23,040 --> 00:09:28,160 and then reappeared in the Philadelphia Shipyard. The ship's crew was supposed to have suffered 117 00:09:28,160 --> 00:09:32,960 various side effects, including insanity, intangibility, and being frozen in place, 118 00:09:32,960 --> 00:09:39,120 because you do these experiments on a ship, a naval ship, fully crewed with officers, not on 119 00:09:39,120 --> 00:09:46,560 just an empty ship. So yeah. Does he say why they do it with a ship full of officers? They do not, 120 00:09:46,560 --> 00:09:50,960 no. Okay, because just logically thinking, you wouldn't think that that's... That's not what you 121 00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:57,680 start with. Yeah. You start with like a dinghy and then work up from there. Yeah, like something that 122 00:09:57,680 --> 00:10:01,680 doesn't have like humans if you don't know what you're working with. Or you just say, fuck it, 123 00:10:01,680 --> 00:10:05,440 which is obviously what they did. Fuck it, we're doing it live. 124 00:10:07,840 --> 00:10:13,280 I'm ready now. I'm not waiting for this ship. Have no people on it and the one right next to it's 125 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:17,520 not going to work. Yeah. And you got to think this is, this is 43. There's only a couple of years of 126 00:10:17,520 --> 00:10:22,560 war left. You got to get this stuff going. It's going to get into the war. No time to wait. 127 00:10:22,560 --> 00:10:26,320 There are so many different stories and rumors as to what happened. In total, 128 00:10:26,320 --> 00:10:33,040 Allende sent... Well, I shouldn't say Allende. The man calling himself Allende sends 50 letters to 129 00:10:33,040 --> 00:10:37,840 Jessup over the course of his correspondence. In some of them, he's mentioning this. In several, 130 00:10:37,840 --> 00:10:43,200 he says that he has worked closely with Albert Einstein. He explains the craziness of the unified 131 00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:48,400 field theory, which he's working with and really the basis behind everything that's happening here 132 00:10:48,400 --> 00:10:53,680 in his mind. And Allende named other crew members with whom he served aboard the Andrew Furasith, 133 00:10:53,680 --> 00:10:58,240 the ship he was on. And he claimed to know the fate of some of the crew members of the Eldritch 134 00:10:58,240 --> 00:11:02,800 after the experiment, including one who he witnessed. He went into a bar, he saw a barfight, 135 00:11:02,800 --> 00:11:06,400 and then this person just disappeared in the middle of a bar fight. Like just... 136 00:11:06,400 --> 00:11:10,000 And this is the person that was on... On the Eldridge and survived. 137 00:11:10,000 --> 00:11:13,520 Oh, they just continue to disappear after this. Okay. 138 00:11:13,520 --> 00:11:18,800 Yeah. And like you'll hear stories of the ship came back and this person lost their entire mind, 139 00:11:18,800 --> 00:11:24,240 not all the crew was on board. Some people were fused to the ship, like lower half would no longer 140 00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:27,360 be there and they'd be stuck between floors. Oh, it sucks. 141 00:11:27,360 --> 00:11:29,280 Yeah. And then others are suffering with 142 00:11:29,280 --> 00:11:33,040 spontaneous disappearing. Yeah. Just out of nowhere later on. 143 00:11:33,040 --> 00:11:36,960 Although Allende claimed to have observed the experiment while on the Andrew Furasith, 144 00:11:36,960 --> 00:11:41,920 he provided absolutely no information to substantiate this claim or any way of linking 145 00:11:41,920 --> 00:11:46,080 the experiment with Einstein's Unified Field Theory, which he talks about a lot. 146 00:11:46,080 --> 00:11:50,720 And that's an interesting turn. Well, not turn, just elation. 147 00:11:50,720 --> 00:11:54,640 That would be weird to receive that letter in the mail out of nowhere. Like, 148 00:11:54,640 --> 00:11:59,520 oh, I just published this book. Yeah, it was a UFO book, but it just says, yeah, by the way, 149 00:11:59,520 --> 00:12:02,960 don't look too much into this. This is what happened on this Philadelphia experiment. 150 00:12:02,960 --> 00:12:07,280 I was going to say that. Isn't that such a weird way to bring it up? Like, 151 00:12:07,280 --> 00:12:12,560 don't look into the levitation with UFOs because of the USS Aldridge. 152 00:12:12,560 --> 00:12:15,120 Like they tried to use this and it did this to this ship. 153 00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:19,200 So don't look into UFOs and how they move. Okay. 154 00:12:19,200 --> 00:12:24,160 Jessup does in fact respond to this guy and he says, like, I need further evidence to 155 00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:28,480 corroborate this. He ends up getting obviously more letters after that. 156 00:12:28,480 --> 00:12:34,400 Eventually this guy comes out and he says, yeah, Carlos Miguel Allende is a pseudonym 157 00:12:34,400 --> 00:12:38,560 that I write under. My real name is Carl M. Allen. 158 00:12:38,560 --> 00:12:42,400 It's interesting that he went with such a more complex N name. 159 00:12:42,400 --> 00:12:48,400 He went with a Spanish version of his exact damn name. Like, Allende is spelled A-L-L-E-N-D. 160 00:12:48,400 --> 00:12:50,400 Carlos M. Allen. 161 00:12:52,720 --> 00:12:57,200 Anyways, Allen says that he could not provide the details for which Jessup was asking, 162 00:12:57,200 --> 00:13:01,600 but he implied that he might be able to recall it by some sort of means of hypnosis. 163 00:13:01,600 --> 00:13:05,600 Anyways, Jessup keeps getting these letters and he's like, whatever, this guy's kind of 164 00:13:05,600 --> 00:13:10,320 fucked in the head. I'm not believing anything. And he just stops responding to these letters 165 00:13:10,320 --> 00:13:14,160 he's getting. Which in my mind, I would just hope that's the end of it. 166 00:13:14,160 --> 00:13:20,800 And this is 1955. In 1957, Jessup gets a call from the Office of Naval Research. 167 00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:25,040 Kind of out of nowhere, kind of a weird thing for somebody who's never been involved with the Navy 168 00:13:25,040 --> 00:13:32,640 to be called up on. They say in 1956, we received an anonymous package in the mail and it contained 169 00:13:32,640 --> 00:13:37,600 a copy of your book, The Case for the UFO Unidentified Flying Objects. And it is covered 170 00:13:37,600 --> 00:13:42,080 in handwritten notes, like everywhere. It's written in three different colors of pen. 171 00:13:42,080 --> 00:13:45,840 And it appears to be conversations between three different people who've been like, 172 00:13:45,840 --> 00:13:51,360 passing this book around. And they appear to be discussing propulsion of flying saucers, aliens, 173 00:13:51,360 --> 00:13:55,840 alien races, and the express concern that Jessup was too close to discovering their technology. 174 00:13:55,840 --> 00:13:59,440 So they say, hey, can you come in? Like, we just want to talk to you about this. 175 00:13:59,440 --> 00:14:05,040 So Jessup goes in, he sees the annotations in this book and he's like, oh fuck, I've been getting 176 00:14:05,040 --> 00:14:11,680 letters from this guy for years. It's the same guy. And he's written in three different colors of pen 177 00:14:11,680 --> 00:14:16,720 to make it look like he's having conversations with people. But it's one guy's handwriting. 178 00:14:16,720 --> 00:14:21,440 Harlow. So Jessup saw the annotations and said, these are from the guy who keeps sending me 179 00:14:21,440 --> 00:14:26,800 letters. And the two officers from the ONR, Captain Sydney Sherby and Captain George W. Hoover, 180 00:14:26,800 --> 00:14:31,440 took a personal interest in the matter. Hoover later explained that his duties as special projects 181 00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:36,400 officer required him to investigate many publications and that he ultimately found nothing of substance 182 00:14:36,400 --> 00:14:40,800 to the alleged invisibility experiment. Like they looked into this because it was brought up in that 183 00:14:40,800 --> 00:14:44,400 book. And apparently they're supposed to look into this stuff. I guess it seems kind of weird 184 00:14:44,400 --> 00:14:49,120 that they are drawing an interest to it, but they might just, because you know, bloated cold war 185 00:14:49,120 --> 00:14:54,800 budget, look into everything you get. It could have also raised a red flag or something like that. 186 00:14:54,800 --> 00:14:59,920 Maybe? I don't know. I don't know. Maybe. Yeah. It's alleging things about the Navy. So look into it. 187 00:14:59,920 --> 00:15:05,440 Yeah. Like at the very least, like the one phone call to be like, hey, you wrote this book, 188 00:15:05,440 --> 00:15:10,000 but does this mean? That's where I would start because it was an anonymous package. 189 00:15:10,000 --> 00:15:13,680 So I guess that's where he started. And it actually proved to be the right way to go too, 190 00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:20,800 because he could tell him straight up who it was. So one of these guys goes and talks to a friend at 191 00:15:20,800 --> 00:15:26,160 a manufacturing company called Barrow Manufacturing Corporation is in Garland, Texas. And the friend's 192 00:15:26,160 --> 00:15:32,880 name is Austin Stanton. Stanton gets super interested. They end up making 127 copy run of 193 00:15:32,880 --> 00:15:37,520 this book with the annotations and they actually sold it. So there are actually a bunch of copies 194 00:15:37,520 --> 00:15:42,560 of this book out there with the annotations in it. Okay. What are the annotations? It's just all the 195 00:15:42,560 --> 00:15:46,720 writing he wrote in the margins in the three different colors of ink. And they identify them 196 00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:53,040 as Mr. A, Mr. B, and Jemi. J-E-M-I as the characters, but they're the same writer. 197 00:15:53,680 --> 00:15:57,440 That's so weird. I wonder what he was writing. But like, that's where it ends. Like they look 198 00:15:57,440 --> 00:16:02,240 into it. Like, I don't know why they decided to make copies of this book. Apparently he did find 199 00:16:02,240 --> 00:16:06,880 it interesting enough that we should do this. Not enough to actually make any sort of profit on it. 200 00:16:06,880 --> 00:16:12,320 And that's really the end of the O&R Office of Naval Research investigation into it. 201 00:16:12,320 --> 00:16:17,520 Fair enough. From there, not a lot ever happens with Jessup again. Well, it's a bad way to put it. 202 00:16:17,520 --> 00:16:22,320 Jessup attempted to make a living writing books on the subject of UFOs, but his follow-up books 203 00:16:22,320 --> 00:16:27,280 didn't sell well. And eventually his publisher rejected several other manuscripts. Just like, 204 00:16:27,280 --> 00:16:31,920 look, there's no point in doing this anymore. In 1958, his wife left him. He then traveled to 205 00:16:31,920 --> 00:16:36,800 New York where he saw some friends and they said he was being somewhat unstable. And then he returned 206 00:16:36,800 --> 00:16:42,800 to Florida and on April 20th, 1959, he was found dead in his car, he committed suicide. Oh no. Sad. 207 00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:50,240 Yeah. And that's literally the basis for the Philadelphia experiment. The attempt to turn a 208 00:16:50,240 --> 00:16:56,080 naval warship invisible, which then accidentally teleported it to another location and back and 209 00:16:56,080 --> 00:17:00,800 messed with the crew. And that's the first mention of the Philadelphia experiment ever. 210 00:17:00,800 --> 00:17:05,280 Yes. Ever. Other than when it actually happened. Yes. Okay. Robert Gorman, a journalist for a 211 00:17:05,280 --> 00:17:10,400 magazine called fate in 1980, he decided to look into this Carl Allen character and he said, 212 00:17:10,400 --> 00:17:15,680 who is this? He realized when he started looking into it that Carl Allen lived in New Kensington, 213 00:17:15,680 --> 00:17:21,360 Pennsylvania, where Robert Gorman also lived. So he's like, Oh, maybe I should go talk to this guy. 214 00:17:21,360 --> 00:17:25,200 And it turns out his parents were actually family friends with his parents. So he's just like, 215 00:17:25,200 --> 00:17:31,520 I'm just going to go talk to them. Like really weird coincidence. No kidding. What are the odds? 216 00:17:31,520 --> 00:17:36,800 It turns out Carl Allen has a history of psychiatric illness and he may have fabricated 217 00:17:36,800 --> 00:17:41,760 the primary story of the experiment as a result of this mental illness. That's what Gorman found. 218 00:17:41,760 --> 00:17:46,640 After he talked to the parents, they said he was a creative and imaginative loner sending bizarre 219 00:17:46,640 --> 00:17:51,280 writings and claims around the world. He does have his own Wikipedia page. Carl Allen was born 220 00:17:51,280 --> 00:17:56,800 May 31st, 1925 in Springdale, Pennsylvania, the eldest of five children. His family described 221 00:17:56,800 --> 00:18:01,920 him as brilliant in school with a fantastic mind, but also a person who never held any particular 222 00:18:01,920 --> 00:18:06,800 job for long and was a drifter. He was also known as a master leg puller, pulling pranks on people 223 00:18:06,800 --> 00:18:12,320 or to get out of work in general. In 1942, he joined the U S Marine Corps. So that part is true. 224 00:18:12,320 --> 00:18:17,600 He was part of the Marines at that time, but was discharged less than a year later. Right after that, 225 00:18:17,600 --> 00:18:21,760 he enlisted with the United States Merchant Marine at first serving in the SS Andrew 226 00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:26,720 Ferris set. So he was on that ship and then many other ships until 1952 when he left service. 227 00:18:26,720 --> 00:18:31,600 During his lifetime, he would use several aliases, which did include Carlos Miguel Allende, 228 00:18:32,240 --> 00:18:39,680 senior professor and Colonel Carlos Miguel Cristofero. I was not creative. 229 00:18:40,960 --> 00:18:43,760 I don't know. I would call that pretty creative. 230 00:18:43,760 --> 00:18:52,240 The most long titles and names, but he also, he just wrote letters to random people who were fairly 231 00:18:52,240 --> 00:18:58,000 big at the time. One to Dr. Carl Mertit-Ellenstein, which I didn't look up what he did, but he also 232 00:18:58,000 --> 00:19:04,400 wrote to Werner von Braun. What did he say to Werner? Yeah, I don't know. That's the only part on 233 00:19:04,400 --> 00:19:11,760 this page. And that's his background. His credibility isn't holding up well based on that information. 234 00:19:11,760 --> 00:19:17,680 And that's the story. These are the characters involved and how it goes. From there, some Hollywood 235 00:19:17,680 --> 00:19:22,000 execs get a hold of the few people that research this. They're books and they say, oh, this shit 236 00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:29,280 would make a good movie. So in 1984, a movie based on this whole weird situation with Allende's story 237 00:19:29,280 --> 00:19:33,680 was turned into a movie. They ran with it. Funny enough, not for anybody, but Chelsea, I mean, 238 00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:39,680 probably the original script was written by John Carpenter. Really? Yeah. And he described it as a 239 00:19:39,680 --> 00:19:45,360 great, shaky dog story. Absolute crap, but a great story. Yeah, that sounds like something John 240 00:19:45,360 --> 00:19:50,000 Carpenter would do. Apparently the script then went through like nine rewrites. He doesn't even get 241 00:19:50,000 --> 00:19:56,080 a writer's credit in the movie. Really? Yeah. And it was directed by Stuart Raffael. There were no 242 00:19:56,080 --> 00:20:02,560 big names in it. Like the lead actor credit is to a Michael Perry. And I have no idea who that is. 243 00:20:02,560 --> 00:20:06,960 Okay. Maybe he didn't want his name on it. No, you know what? It's just he got paid for it, 244 00:20:06,960 --> 00:20:13,440 whatever. And on Rotten Tomatoes, the film has an approval rating of 50%. Like exactly 50%. So it's 245 00:20:13,440 --> 00:20:20,240 like the blandest movie, apparently. Okay. In 1990, a man by the name of Al Beelick, he goes and sees 246 00:20:20,240 --> 00:20:25,600 this movie and he says, oh shit, it's all coming back to me now. So he believes that seeing this 247 00:20:25,600 --> 00:20:31,680 movie opened up some missing memories that have been forced out of his mind. And he has this tale 248 00:20:31,680 --> 00:20:38,720 to tell. So Al Beelick was born in 1927. He joined the Navy to help fight the Nazis. According to 249 00:20:38,720 --> 00:20:47,040 Beelick, he was a naval officer who was serving on the USS Eldridge in 1943. On August 13th, 1943, 250 00:20:47,040 --> 00:20:51,760 Beelick and his brother were on this ship when this experiment happened. And they said, shit, 251 00:20:51,760 --> 00:20:55,840 everything's going bad. And he's there with his brother. And they said, we got to jump off this 252 00:20:55,840 --> 00:21:01,040 thing. So they do. And they just keep falling and falling and falling. And eventually they land 253 00:21:01,040 --> 00:21:08,400 in the year 2137. Oh my God. How he knows it's the year 2137, I don't know. He probably fell 254 00:21:08,400 --> 00:21:13,280 on a calendar. I was just going to say that. Calendars are big in the year 2137. They are 255 00:21:13,280 --> 00:21:18,560 everywhere. No, everyone knows that when you're time traveling, you see like the calendar. Oh, 256 00:21:18,560 --> 00:21:23,760 yeah, you do. The clock's going forward really fast. Yeah, or the clock's going forward. And so 257 00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:29,520 they're jumping ship figuratively and literally as the experiment's happening, which is how they 258 00:21:29,520 --> 00:21:35,680 time travel. Yes. My other theory is that those calendar gift shops that jump up in like November, 259 00:21:35,680 --> 00:21:42,960 December, they become 98% of the economy in the future. So much so that there's just calendars 260 00:21:42,960 --> 00:21:49,120 everywhere. Probably not this timeline, but a timeline that did happen. Specifically 2137. 261 00:21:49,120 --> 00:21:53,680 Yeah. Huge that year. So they're everywhere. So just he fell and like you couldn't even 262 00:21:53,680 --> 00:22:02,560 land in the water. There were too many calendars. So while in 2137, Beelik was treated for radiation 263 00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:06,560 injuries through a highly advanced series of treatments that relied on vibration and light. 264 00:22:06,560 --> 00:22:11,280 And what's more, the entertainment at the hospital was solely educational and news program. The only 265 00:22:11,280 --> 00:22:16,560 choice for TV in the entire world, apparently. Not just, you know, the shitty TV that you get 266 00:22:16,560 --> 00:22:22,320 at the hospital. He also discovered that geographical shifts had transformed the globe. The coastlines of 267 00:22:22,320 --> 00:22:27,040 every continent had changed dramatically. Florida had disappeared except for the panhandle. Not 268 00:22:27,040 --> 00:22:33,200 again. The Great Lakes were just one greatest lake and Atlanta was three miles from the Atlantic 269 00:22:33,200 --> 00:22:37,520 ocean. Beelik said that the United States infrastructure had been completely destroyed as 270 00:22:37,520 --> 00:22:42,560 well. And the central government was a total thing of the past. Both Canada and the US were gone, 271 00:22:42,560 --> 00:22:48,800 ruled over with a kind of locally enforced martial law. And it was around 2005, the US and Europe had 272 00:22:48,800 --> 00:22:53,520 banded together to fight off the combined threat of China and Russia, resulting with a war that 273 00:22:53,520 --> 00:22:58,640 killed billions of people. And the total population of the world was only 300 billion and essentially 274 00:22:58,640 --> 00:23:05,120 ruined the world's government. From there, Beelik says that he was sent forward to the year 2749. 275 00:23:05,120 --> 00:23:10,160 Probably this time, the inevitable collapse of the calendar industry had happened. However, 276 00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:15,120 had resurged within those next 600 years. And again, just calendars everywhere because time 277 00:23:15,120 --> 00:23:21,040 is cyclical. And he stayed there for two years before being transported back to the year 2137 278 00:23:21,040 --> 00:23:26,640 to pick up his brother. In 2749, the world had adapted the technology to build mobile floating 279 00:23:26,640 --> 00:23:32,080 cities. Government of any kind was non-existent and everything was run by AI called the synthetic 280 00:23:32,080 --> 00:23:37,600 intelligent computer system that worked telepathically. He's describing the Jetsons. Yes. 281 00:23:38,480 --> 00:23:44,240 I've been waiting for that. Beelik also stated that there were no wars in the year 2749, 282 00:23:44,240 --> 00:23:49,600 which actually makes your 2137 feel kind of shitty that he specifically didn't state that about it. 283 00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:51,760 Yeah. Oh boy, were there wars. 284 00:23:53,680 --> 00:23:58,240 And he said there were no wars in 2749 because they were impossible. There were no militaries 285 00:23:58,240 --> 00:24:03,760 or soldiers or Navy or Air Force. So any conflict between countries was irrelevant. 286 00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:09,200 Beelik reported that no one needed money in 2749, basically making it a socialist utopia or a 287 00:24:09,200 --> 00:24:14,000 communist utopia. There's just no need to have it. Everyone had their own credits, which allowed 288 00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:18,000 them to buy everything they wanted. And sorry, I need to take that last statement back because 289 00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:22,560 it sounds like they had credits, which is just money in a different form. Yeah, that's not what 290 00:24:22,560 --> 00:24:29,360 they had. So at this point, he gets sent back for 2749 to 2137 to go get his brother. And from there, 291 00:24:29,360 --> 00:24:37,520 they're transported back to 1984. Why 1984? They need to meet Dr. John von Neumann, who convinces 292 00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:43,040 the two men to travel back to their original time and stop the Philadelphia experiment from ever 293 00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:49,360 happening. And these two men agree and they go back and the Philadelphia experiment actually never 294 00:24:49,360 --> 00:24:55,920 happened in this timeline. Al Beelik's on? Yeah, it happened in his original timeline, but not ours, 295 00:24:55,920 --> 00:25:04,400 because he went back in time and stopped it. Oh good. Okay. I'm not following his train of thought. 296 00:25:04,400 --> 00:25:09,440 After his time in the Navy, Beelik completed his education in electronics. Soon though, he found 297 00:25:09,440 --> 00:25:14,560 himself contracted out to various military contractors who slowly took the young electronics 298 00:25:14,560 --> 00:25:19,120 whiz into their confidence. They revealed to him that the US military was actively involved in 299 00:25:19,120 --> 00:25:25,200 adapting alien technology and forwarding research on psychic operations and soon is recruited for 300 00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:30,640 another project that I'm going to leave a secret for now. Though Beelik was working jobs in 301 00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:36,240 California, his importance at this other secret project was so great that he was given access to 302 00:25:36,240 --> 00:25:41,200 the super secret network of high speed trains running under the entire country of the US. This 303 00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:46,320 allowed him to work his normal jobs during business hours and then moonlight and another location. 304 00:25:46,320 --> 00:25:52,480 Are these underground trains on our timeline? Yes, they are. They are? Okay. So Beelik goes public 305 00:25:52,480 --> 00:25:56,800 with this extraordinary story. There's a bit more. I'm just going to skip past it because it has a 306 00:25:56,800 --> 00:26:01,520 lot more to do with your episode, Chelsea. I always love it when they say someone goes public with 307 00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:07,440 something like, if only I have a secret that I was like, should I go public or should I not go public? 308 00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:12,480 Then if I decided to go public. You probably have as good a stories as these guys to go public with. 309 00:26:12,480 --> 00:26:18,880 You just need to be a better liar. I need like a way better name, first of all. Like where would I 310 00:26:18,880 --> 00:26:24,480 go public to? Do I write a letter? I think you got to find a recorder. Like I bet you can go to Huff 18 311 00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:30,240 Post, Vox. I'm sure there's a few YouTubers you go public with. I write a letter to Tom DeLong. 312 00:26:30,240 --> 00:26:34,400 Actually, no, sorry. You know who you go public with? George Norrie. That guy. Oh, he sucks. 313 00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:40,000 He's very easy to convince on things. It's true. But I think- And he has a very big following with 314 00:26:40,000 --> 00:26:45,440 the 70 plus. I just love it when they say go public and like, I wouldn't even know someone who's not 315 00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:50,880 a public, like in the public eye, like where you would go public to. It's just a thought I had. It 316 00:26:50,880 --> 00:26:55,200 has nothing to do with anything really. Fair enough. I get that. It's not like declaring 317 00:26:55,200 --> 00:27:00,320 bankruptcy where you just yell it in the air. Yeah, I declare it. I can't yell that out loud, 318 00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:06,160 though. You tried to trick me. Because you can't declare it public. Yeah, tried to trick me. I 319 00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:10,640 almost declared it public. Bieluk goes public with this information in the 90s. Apparently the 320 00:27:10,640 --> 00:27:15,760 government disavowed him. They didn't even do him the divmete of calling him a crazy kook. Bieluk 321 00:27:15,760 --> 00:27:22,080 believes he has not been harmed or stopped from talking about this situation because his time 322 00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:26,720 traveling experience locked him into this timeline and everything he's talking about happens on 323 00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:31,680 different timelines. So somehow by being here today, he, among others in the program, served 324 00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:37,120 to balance the effects they produced from prior time traveling experiments. So he's okay to talk 325 00:27:37,120 --> 00:27:44,720 about this. Bieluk died on October 10th, 2011 in Guadalajara, Mexico. He was 84 at the time and 326 00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:50,800 was buried at a local cemetery. Al Bieluk's birth certificate is dated March 31st, 1927. Whether he 327 00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:55,920 was born at that time or not depends on how much of Al's story you're willing to believe. He also 328 00:27:55,920 --> 00:28:02,080 says that his real identity was a guy by the name of Edward Cameron, son of a career naval officer, 329 00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:07,040 and that he had been regressed back in time to that of a nine-month-old baby in California in 330 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:14,320 December of 1927 when he was raised as Al Bieluk by Arthur E. and Albertina Bieluk. That's a super 331 00:28:14,320 --> 00:28:19,440 weird whiff. And that's basically because he came to that new timeline. He had to assume an identity 332 00:28:19,440 --> 00:28:25,360 that existed. I've never heard of anyone being regressed back to a different baby that was not 333 00:28:25,360 --> 00:28:31,360 them as a baby. Yeah. It's regressing his print. That memory just happened to come out. I thought 334 00:28:31,360 --> 00:28:37,120 it would be important to talk about because that is a story. That is important information. 335 00:28:37,120 --> 00:28:41,520 I'm going to finish. I say finish. We still have a bit of episode to go, but this is the last thing 336 00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:48,800 we're really going to talk about. This is a paper written by Juan Jacques Vallee in 1994. It was 337 00:28:48,800 --> 00:28:54,400 published in the society for scientific exploration. It's called the anatomy of a hoax, the Philadelphia 338 00:28:54,400 --> 00:28:59,920 experiment 50 years later. Basically he had written an article in 1991, basically said this thing 339 00:28:59,920 --> 00:29:04,320 didn't happen. And then somebody reached out to him and said, no, something actually did happen. 340 00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:08,080 Does these ships do exist? We know where they were. They weren't in Philadelphia at the time, 341 00:29:08,080 --> 00:29:14,640 but he basically said, and this is on par with exactly what the office of naval research has on 342 00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:19,600 their page as to what people are actually saying happened. And I'm just going to pull it right from 343 00:29:19,600 --> 00:29:24,560 the website's page. This is a information sheet on the Philadelphia experiment published September 344 00:29:24,560 --> 00:29:30,800 8th, 1996 on the history.navy.mil website. Personnel at the fourth naval district believe that the 345 00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:35,680 questions surrounding the so-called Philadelphia experiment arise from quite routine research, 346 00:29:35,680 --> 00:29:39,920 which occurred during world war II at the Philadelphia Naval Shipyard. Until recently, 347 00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:45,200 it was believed that the foundation of the apocryphal stories arose from degaussing experiments, 348 00:29:45,200 --> 00:29:50,960 which have the effect of making a ship undetectable or invisible to magnetic mines and 349 00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:57,360 torpedoes. So basically demagnetize it so that these ships can't be hit by mines that are 350 00:29:57,360 --> 00:30:02,960 everywhere in the ocean at that time or torpedoes being shot from U-boats. Another likely genesis 351 00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:08,640 of bizarre stories about levitation, teleportation, and effects on human crew members might be 352 00:30:08,640 --> 00:30:13,360 attributed to experiments with the generating plant of a destroyer, the USS Timmerman. In the 353 00:30:13,360 --> 00:30:17,840 1950s, the ship was part of the experiment to test the effects of a small high-frequency generator 354 00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:23,040 providing 1000 Hertz instead of the standard 400 Hertz. Higher frequency generator produced 355 00:30:23,040 --> 00:30:28,160 corona discharges and other well-known phenomena associated with high-frequency generators. None 356 00:30:28,160 --> 00:30:32,960 of the crew suffered effects from the experiment, except the ones who were, you know, grafted into 357 00:30:32,960 --> 00:30:38,160 the ship, but they're, they don't care about them. But yeah, Jacques Vallee gets information from 358 00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:42,080 somebody who says they were on the ship at this time and they're basically just doing experiments 359 00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:47,920 to make demagnetized ships so that they could not be hit by magnetic mines, which basically are in 360 00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:52,480 the ocean. They're big magnets. If your ship comes near it, it moves the mine over, hits it, and 361 00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:56,880 explodes because they don't have anything more advanced than that at that time. This is the 362 00:30:56,880 --> 00:31:01,600 conclusion that Jacques Vallee comes to in his article. Few tasks are as important in the field 363 00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:05,920 of paranormal investigation as the detection and elimination of hoaxes. An area of research that 364 00:31:05,920 --> 00:31:11,760 does not police itself and eventually policed by others with utterly devastating consequences 365 00:31:11,760 --> 00:31:17,280 as recent examples of fraud and academic research have shown. Popular ufology, which thrives on 366 00:31:17,280 --> 00:31:22,000 rumors, poorly investigated reports, shoddy scholarships, and outright fraud to the detriment 367 00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:27,360 of these genuine facts that are potentially relevant to science provide a long history of 368 00:31:27,360 --> 00:31:33,040 colorful hoaxes that have come to define the field in the mind of general public and have tainted it 369 00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:37,600 with a negative image of the view of scientists and educated laymen. The problem with hoaxes is 370 00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:44,000 that they are charming, tantalizing, entertaining, and often correspond to what we would like to be 371 00:31:44,000 --> 00:31:49,440 true as opposed to what is actually true. We have seen that the Philadelphia experiment had all of 372 00:31:49,440 --> 00:31:55,120 these characteristics. This hoax, which should have died a long time ago under the combined efforts 373 00:31:55,120 --> 00:32:00,880 of several researchers, is an example of a story that simply refuses to die. It is surrounded with 374 00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:06,240 such an aura of mystery that it has continued to be successfully exploited. Like some other exhausted 375 00:32:06,240 --> 00:32:10,880 gold mines in the hills of Colorado, which were drained of every ounce of metal in the 19th century, 376 00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:16,480 it revived periodically in the authoring circulars of unscrupulous underwriters as penny stock mining 377 00:32:16,480 --> 00:32:23,760 companies with new fancy names. Certain UFO stories always find gullible new investors. Even in 1993, 378 00:32:23,760 --> 00:32:29,200 the tale of the disappearance of the DE-173 has lost none of its peculiar charm. Hoaxes have been 379 00:32:29,200 --> 00:32:34,560 defined as deliberately concocted truths made to masquerade as facts. In a recent theoretical 380 00:32:34,560 --> 00:32:40,720 articles on hoaxes, Marcello Truzi notes that there has been little deductive efforts in social 381 00:32:40,720 --> 00:32:46,400 science specifically to describe or explain hoaxes. He points out that according to Curtis McDougall, 382 00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:51,840 a hoax's success is the result of two sets of psychological forces acting within the victim. 383 00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:58,960 Under the rubric of Why We Don't Disbelieve, McDougall lists ignorance, superstition, suggestion, 384 00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:04,800 and prestige. Under the incentive to believe, he lists financial gain, vanity, chauvinism, 385 00:33:04,800 --> 00:33:09,600 prejudice, pet theories, the thirst of thrills, and cultural climate. We have seen that such 386 00:33:09,600 --> 00:33:14,960 factors were indeed at work in the infrastructure of the present story. McDougall also remarked, 387 00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:20,560 when a hoax achieves the longevity to qualify for classification as either myth or legend, 388 00:33:20,560 --> 00:33:25,360 hope of stopping it almost may be abandoned. After 50 years, we may well have reached that 389 00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:29,440 point in the matter of the Philadelphia experiment. I think that's well put. Yeah, 390 00:33:29,440 --> 00:33:34,320 I really like it. He also lists six tentative guidelines for avoiding falling for things like 391 00:33:34,320 --> 00:33:38,960 the Philadelphia experiment in the future, which I'm just going to quickly go over. Yeah, 392 00:33:38,960 --> 00:33:44,080 run through those please. I'm very interested on how not to fall for hoaxes because I'm unsure of 393 00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:49,360 how many I've actually fallen for in real life. I really like Jacques Vallee. I find him a very 394 00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:55,280 credible source and I like him too. A smart individual. So I feel like he's somebody who 395 00:33:55,280 --> 00:34:00,240 should actually listen to. First off, disregard self-described experts. Many of the pundits of 396 00:34:00,240 --> 00:34:07,040 ufology keep their notoriety alive by pandering to each other and small cohorts of a few hundred 397 00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:11,920 readers of their magazines, forming a tiny hardcore. There are very few scientifically 398 00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:16,560 trained individuals within this group where mutual admiration is the rule and the sociology 399 00:34:16,560 --> 00:34:21,120 of the field is such that reinforcement of the dominant extraterrestrial hypothesis is more 400 00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:26,240 highly rewarded than exposing hoaxes, bringing novel knowledge or highlighting contradictions. 401 00:34:26,240 --> 00:34:30,640 Do you want an example of that? Please go back and listen to our David Wilcock episodes 402 00:34:30,640 --> 00:34:37,760 and how that guy is on his research. Good episodes. Good episodes. Great episodes. 403 00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:44,720 I gotta go back. What a whirlwind of episodes. Yeah. Number two, disregard the media. Television 404 00:34:44,720 --> 00:34:51,520 reports of UFO events are geared to ratings, not knowledge. Number three, look for logical flaws. 405 00:34:51,520 --> 00:34:56,560 They are often flagged by perilous and loaded terms. Therefore, most of the mistakes that have 406 00:34:56,560 --> 00:35:02,000 been made in ufology over the last 50 years have resulted from a simple fallacy based on the misuse 407 00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:07,760 of a simple word. Examples. Something crashed at Roswell. True. It was obviously covered up by the 408 00:35:07,760 --> 00:35:13,520 U.S. Air Force. True. Therefore, it has to have been flying saucer. False deduction. Doesn't have 409 00:35:13,520 --> 00:35:19,680 to have been a UFO. That's just one answer. He is using reasoning. Case in point, he uses it here. 410 00:35:19,680 --> 00:35:24,560 In the present case, a destroyer left its place in the harbor under highly secretive circumstances. 411 00:35:24,560 --> 00:35:29,440 True. And moved to another location in an impossible time. True, given the witnesses' 412 00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:33,600 limited knowledge of the facts. Therefore, it must have been subject to artificial invisibility, 413 00:35:33,600 --> 00:35:38,800 dematerialization or time travel. False deduction. There are other things. It turns out that the 414 00:35:38,800 --> 00:35:43,440 Navy has secret channels to the U.S. to move faster than things should. Which I didn't get to in this 415 00:35:43,440 --> 00:35:48,320 episode, but that's part of the story. I just wanted to keep this as tight as I could of an episode. 416 00:35:48,320 --> 00:35:54,560 Item four. Identify and remove irrelevant drama. The remarkable feature of the present hoax is that 417 00:35:54,560 --> 00:36:00,240 the principal actor, Carl Allen, was only peripherally involved in the events he sensationalized 418 00:36:00,240 --> 00:36:04,160 and had no direct knowledge of the equipment he described. That he managed to create the entire 419 00:36:04,160 --> 00:36:09,440 myth almost single-handedly. He originated the drama of Jessup's involvement, the O&R study, 420 00:36:09,440 --> 00:36:13,600 and an excitement of his own elusiveness. None of these facts had anything to do with the actual 421 00:36:13,600 --> 00:36:18,000 events in Philadelphia. And in the same vein, Bill Moore amplifies the spurious dramatization 422 00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:23,200 of the Tavern Brawl. A lot of this stuff is secondhand sources, is what he's saying. 423 00:36:24,160 --> 00:36:29,040 Five. Discover and test independent sources of information. Are there witnesses hundreds of 424 00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:33,760 people work around harbors? Surely some of them, somebody, has to remember the event. 425 00:36:33,760 --> 00:36:34,480 It's true. 426 00:36:34,480 --> 00:36:40,480 And six. Disregard any claim of secrecy. Some of the facts surrounding the subject of UFOs 427 00:36:40,480 --> 00:36:45,680 are classified. If only because the objects represent spurious signals that trigger classified 428 00:36:45,680 --> 00:36:51,840 sensors. There may well be a massive cover-up of relevant data as ufologists claim, but most of 429 00:36:51,840 --> 00:36:56,320 the secrecy around stories like the present one exists only in the minds of those who seek to 430 00:36:56,320 --> 00:37:02,560 enhance the thrill of the chase or live their own romantic myth as intrepid investigators of the ML. 431 00:37:02,560 --> 00:37:08,240 And I think this is a great paragraph to finish off with, just because it's in the same article 432 00:37:08,240 --> 00:37:13,280 and leads very well into our next episode. Today, most students of ufology are in agreement that the 433 00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:19,600 Philadelphia Experiment hoax, which rested on very flimsy data to begin with, should have died a long 434 00:37:19,600 --> 00:37:24,880 time ago. It did not even involve any clear indication that might be directly relevant 435 00:37:24,880 --> 00:37:30,480 to ufology, since none of the witnesses described unusual objects in the sky or unusual beings. 436 00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:35,120 The case should have died a peaceful death in the 60s, yet it has survived and thrived in a 437 00:37:35,120 --> 00:37:40,240 peculiar niche of the paranormal to this day. After a UFO lecture or during a talk show, 438 00:37:40,240 --> 00:37:44,640 it is a common experience to have members of the audience eagerly raise the question, 439 00:37:44,640 --> 00:37:50,000 what about the Philadelphia Experiment? And the whole mystery is now rebounding in a new form 440 00:37:50,000 --> 00:37:54,320 through the Mon Talk Project. Oh, that was a perfect paragraph to leave it off on. 441 00:37:54,320 --> 00:37:59,840 And with that, we are going to end this episode. If that last paragraph has kept you intrigued, 442 00:37:59,840 --> 00:38:03,280 stay tuned for the next episode. Chelsea, do you have anything you want to say? 443 00:38:03,280 --> 00:38:10,080 Yeah, so it got me to thinking. I like what Jacques Vallee had to say. I had no idea about a lot 444 00:38:10,080 --> 00:38:14,960 of things that you said in this episode about the Philadelphia Experiment. And somehow I did think 445 00:38:14,960 --> 00:38:20,000 that there were government documents saying that something did happen there, but apparently it did 446 00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:26,480 not. Something did. If you actually look at the records, the boat was not in Philadelphia. 447 00:38:26,480 --> 00:38:31,520 It was somewhere else. Like you can find those records. Yeah, I recall that. I didn't find it 448 00:38:31,520 --> 00:38:36,800 really that pertinent to get into just because I really wanted to focus a lot on the Jacques Vallee 449 00:38:36,800 --> 00:38:41,520 article. It's a great article. I've read a lot of it, you would think. It's 25 pages long, 450 00:38:41,520 --> 00:38:45,440 so there's a lot more. If you want to go read it, by all means, it's free online. Go take a look at 451 00:38:45,440 --> 00:38:50,160 it. Great article. He was heated up about the Philadelphia Experiment. Well, Jacques Vallee 452 00:38:50,160 --> 00:38:54,720 actually wants to figure out what's going on with shit. And he hates the fact that so much time is 453 00:38:54,720 --> 00:39:01,280 wasted on spurious claims. And he brings up a good point. No one actually in the shipyard actually 454 00:39:01,280 --> 00:39:05,840 came forward. It was all people were like, yeah, I remember being on that ship. When really, 455 00:39:05,840 --> 00:39:11,200 especially in Philadelphia, like you can't get that far away from land in Philadelphia. And then just 456 00:39:11,200 --> 00:39:17,520 the last thing I wanted to say was when you said that there's people embedded into the metal on 457 00:39:17,520 --> 00:39:24,080 the ship when it moved, it got me to thinking like, where is this ship today with human body parts, 458 00:39:24,080 --> 00:39:31,920 like embedded into the metal? And it was sold to Greece in January 1951. And apparently it doesn't 459 00:39:31,920 --> 00:39:38,320 say anything about where it is today. It just ends with being sold to Greece. It's decommissioned. 460 00:39:38,320 --> 00:39:43,440 Where is it? Like, did they take it apart for parts? Yeah, it basically got recycled. Okay. 461 00:39:43,440 --> 00:39:48,800 So somewhere out there, I can't remember where I read it, but it has been decommissioned. It's 462 00:39:48,800 --> 00:39:55,200 basically just been recycled and or it's been exploded to make a coral reef somewhere. So I 463 00:39:55,200 --> 00:40:00,560 didn't look that far into that part of it. That's fine because wherever it is and wherever those 464 00:40:00,560 --> 00:40:08,000 parts are that had humans embedded into the parts of the mast and not the mast, but fancy shipworts 465 00:40:08,000 --> 00:40:13,600 where human parts were embedded into there's somewhere, somewhere and only Greece knows. 466 00:40:13,600 --> 00:40:21,520 Yeah, it was sold as scrap to the Horaeus based firm, V&J Scrap Metal Trading Limited in 1999, 467 00:40:21,520 --> 00:40:26,720 November 11th. So it's somewhere. It's scrap is somewhere. Yes. Yeah. And a little part of the 468 00:40:26,720 --> 00:40:32,960 USS Eldridge lives in all ships built after that. Oh good. And probably some people if the story's 469 00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:39,600 true. And that's all I had. Okay. Well with that, then I think we can finish off this episode, 470 00:40:39,600 --> 00:40:44,080 which will move nicely into the next episode, especially if you're listening live. If not, 471 00:40:44,080 --> 00:40:51,280 thank you all for listening and we will see you next week. Thank you for listening to Journey to 472 00:40:51,280 --> 00:40:58,000 the Fringe. If you have liked what you have listened to, please like, share, subscribe or follow 473 00:40:58,000 --> 00:41:03,680 depending on what venue you are listening to us through. Also, please, if possible, leave a five 474 00:41:03,680 --> 00:41:09,120 star review as that really helps us in the algorithms. Should you wish to interact with us, 475 00:41:09,120 --> 00:41:15,120 please check us out on your social media of choice. I bet you we are there. And if you really want to 476 00:41:15,120 --> 00:41:20,000 communicate with us and give us ideas for new episodes or tell us that we're wrong and terrible 477 00:41:20,000 --> 00:41:39,840 either way, please send us an email at journeytothefringe.gmail.com. For now, I'll see you in the next episode.