Hello everyone and welcome to the Every Movie Ever Podcast. My name is Ben Groats.
My name is Rob Macfarlane. Welcome to the show, a movie podcast slash mental health check-in
for two broken brained best friends talking around their problems, but not about their
problems whilst laughing at movies.
Never.
Given that this is a thinly veiled mental health check-in, Ben, I figure start with
the important stuff before we get to what we're doing. How you doing, bud?
I'm doing good, man.
How's the lung?
Two new jobs. Oh, lungs still collapsed. That's fine though. We're not worried about that.
Partially collapsed though.
Yeah, yeah. Just the top bit. It's not full. It's not a full one. So that's good. I'm just
being monitored at the minute. I have been to the doctors. I'm getting it checked. I'm
not being a silly like I was for six months.
Yeah. Nice.
I got two new jobs.
Painkillers though. Are you on painkillers?
No, God no.
You're being serious.
You're just raw dogging collapsed lungs.
I've got two new jobs, bud.
I suppose you don't want to change too much. You want to keep the vaping going on because
if you stop vaping...
I can't shock my lungs. That's what I mean. I smoked for over two decades and was fine
and then I quit a year and a half, two years ago. Lung collapsed.
Right. Exactly. Yeah. Don't do that.
I've got two new jobs.
Oh, you should have said.
I should have, man. I've kept it secret for all this time. I got two new jobs. They're
both incredible. It's my first week this week. So I'm very excited, very fresh, very new.
How are you buddy?
I'm good. Well, I'm not good.
What's going on?
I made the mistake of watching the news again.
Oh mate, you need to stop that.
I made the mistake. I was like, maybe it's time. Maybe I can do it. It's not time. I
can't do it. It makes me feel awful. The world is full of awful people and I can't stop them
being awful and they're making it more awful by the day. So we thought, hey, good week
to do the social network, right? Is that what we're doing? Are we doing the social network?
We are. This is it buddy. We are tuning back into the David Fincher verse with the social
network.
The social network. Now, Ben, not everyone likes everything.
True. Public bathroom jobs. It's not for everyone, man. You know what I mean?
Sardines.
Sardines is another one. What else don't people like? Some people don't like lovely walks
on a nice cold evening.
I mean, that's insane. That's you should like that. But dear listener, if you hear us cry
pineapple.
Oh yeah. Pineapple on pizza. Yeah. Pineapple on pizza.
Pineapple on pizza. There we go. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So if you hear us call that, it's just
a short bit of the chat that might not be to everyone's taste. Something a brand new
listener might not need, but not to worry. The full spicy Hawaiian version of every episode
is available over on Patreon days beforehand with all the pineapple you could ever want.
It's just a quid. It's a quid. The first tier is a quid. If you want to support the show,
it's the most direct way to do it. Benefits the show immensely. And plus we love you.
I mean, if you don't support the show, we still love you. You know what I mean? Of course
we do.
And our potty mouths are going to be censored in this version of the episode with some lovely
ukulele noises. But you can hear all the bad words you like on Patreon.
Like kut.
Yeah. There we go. Every time.
Oh, ukulele, ukulele, ukulele, ukulele ukulele ukulele ukulele ukulele ukulele ukulele ukulele
ukulele ukulele ukulele ukulele ukulele ukulele ukulele ukulele ukulele ukulele
You know last week where the first 20 minutes of the episode were like a swear word salad
and I didn't have much time. And then we got to that bit and I was fuming and that's when
I found it funny.
Yeah, I'm sorry, but I figured this time around you've already got the samples. You know what
I mean?
Yeah, no, guess what? There's still a pain in the balls to put in. We've got too much
to get into in this episode as it is. We're going to get into why Ben hates this film.
We're going to get into why Rob loves it. We're going to get into some soundtrack juice.
We're going to get into something that we know quite well. We hold quite dear to our
hearts. It's a very, very personal aspect. Cocaine! Cocaine addicts!
Yes, buddy. Now, this is often accused of being David Fincher's best film.
Mind blowing to me.
Well, not to me. And I think the criticisms of the world that this film makes only get
more and more relevant as we sink further into the hellscape that I took a direct hit
of earlier in the week.
This is what I mean, man. This is why I don't, it's why I simultaneously love it and despise
this film because it is A, good film, B, terribly affecting no matter what year you're in.
Yeah, you see, okay, we're going to have to get into that. We're going to have to get
into that. But first...
What's that man been? Where that man been? What that man do?
Well, again, loads of projects. So he, in the 2010s, he was looking at doing an adaptation
of David Cullen's book, Columbine, which would have been, you know, a laugh a minute.
He was going to do a project set within the culinary arts world that would star Keanu
Reeves. The film would eventually be released in 2015 as Burnt, starring Bradley Cooper.
Okay. Yeah, terrible film.
Oh, is that the one where he works at the Langham?
Possibly. Possibly.
Is he a chef?
He's a chef. It's like the film Chef, but nowhere near as good as the film Chef.
And not fun.
And not fun. Yeah. There was going to be a lone wolf and cub trilogy based on the Japanese
manga series. That's the thing you might know about. I don't. It's going to be David Fincher,
Tim Miller, and Andrew Kevin Walker. Now that is a lineup. Yeah. But then he got to 2010
and I can't really remember 2010 then. So can you refresh, refresh our memories?
So 2010 bud. And the Deepwater Horizon oil drilling platform is writing absolute mid
tier Mark Wahlberg movies of the future. It is. It's 2010 my dear boy. And Steve Jobs
changes the lives of menstruating women the world over as he unveils his new Apple iPad.
I'm not sure that's what that was for Ben, but we roll. It's 2010 my dear day. My little
angel baby boy. Oh, thank you. And Zimmer and Christopher Nolan are bending minds and
bursting it drums with inception. It's literally just a Zimmer. One. What I'm thinking for
this one is mate. It's just massive horn sound. But it's 2010 my dear boy. Beautiful golden
winged tiny infant smooth baby. Robert McFarlane. Love it when you talk dirty. Hated that. Yeah,
it's 2010. David Fincher is given $40 million to make the social network. $40 million. Is
that it's cheap. It's cheap, right? We'll get into why. This is a film featuring no
nudity. None. It's all dialogue. It is of rich people. It is in rooms. Yeah. Talking.
So obviously this is a long favorite of yours. You've been, you've been repping this film
for years. Cause if I had to pick a film that I knew my friend, Benjamin Kenneth Groves
was going to be a big fan of, I'd say the social network. When it came out, I saw this
when it came out and I was like, you know, Fincher, it's going to be cool. I'd recently
just come back from Japan. So I was like, cool. Traumatized. Trying to figure out how
to be in England again. Yeah. I saw this and I was like, it's, it's just talky, talky,
talky, rich posh nonsense with nothing for me to relate to. Yeah. And I don't care. I
just don't care about the plight of a millionaire. The same thing with the game. Right. Well,
I want to, I want to hear more about that. Yeah. I'm going to get into it more because
I've, I've grown, I've grown over the years. So that's, that's how it was back then. And
I've grown since then. So we'll, I'll save it for the actual show. But this film makes
the world a better place for me. Okay. Because it's, it's about rats in a bucket trying to
kill each other so that they can pile the bodies high enough that they can be the last
rat that manages to climb over the edge of the bucket. Okay. When you put it that way,
I love that concept. Right. But in the execution of this, it wasn't rats in a bucket. It was
millionaires in a courtroom going, but I didn't say that. Okay. Right. Brilliant. Will, I'm
going to, I'm going to show you just how wrong you are now before I do. No, that's fine.
Before I do, I think for the benefit of those people who haven't seen this film in years,
or those people who just know this isn't for them and want to enjoy the show, want to know
what we're talking about, but have no plans to see it. We're going to break down the plot
of this movie. Consider this your spoiler warning, just a little two minute segment
where we tell you everything that happens, including the end. It's been out for 14 years.
Right. You've had, you've had, you've had ample opportunity. This isn't on us. Right.
You've had your chance with the olives. All right. Yeah. That's what I'm saying. This
is not extra virgin. This is, this is promise oil at this point. Right. Yeah. Yeah. I'm
going to start cause I've, I've, I've, there's some words I couldn't get rid of. Also you've
color coded. Yeah. I heard that dyslexics can hear better off with off a yellow background.
I can hear better off a yellow background. I read better off a, I'm an, I'm an audio
guy man. All right. It is true though. I can hear better from the yellow. If you, okay,
you start this one. In 2003, Harvard student Mark Zuckerberg creates a website called face
mash where students can rate the attractiveness of their fellow female students like sexist
top trumps. Yeah. The site crashes Harvard servers, drawing attention to Mark's technical
skills, but also his disregard for privacy, social norms, or being a decent human being.
This leads him to being approached by wealthy twins, Cameron and Tyler Winklevoss, along
with their partner Divya Narendra to develop a social networking site called Harvard connection,
a social network driven by the exclusivity of having to be a Harvard student. Unreal.
While Mark agrees to help them, he secretly begins building his own platform, the Facebook
with financial backing from his friend, Eduardo Saverin. As Facebook grows in popularity,
Mark's flaws begin to grow. That's an understatement if I've ever said more. He minimizes Eduardo's
contributions downplaying his role as co-founder and becomes increasingly dismissive of Eduardo's
business advice. Meanwhile, the freaky twins. Okay. All right. Yeah. The freaky girls in
the bin in the bin. I used to be an audio guy. And then you drop stuff like that in
the bin. Cause we love the, we love the freaky stuff at the bomb. Oh, that's horrible. Look
at this. Look at how horrible this is. Yeah. Fair. Meanwhile, the freaky twins realized
Mark has used their idea and begin legal action against him. When Mark meets Sean Parker,
the flamboyant founder of Napster. That's one way to describe him. He is drawn to Sean's
vision of what Facebook could become further alienating Eduardo. Yellow works. Yellow works
great. Mark's awfulness comes to a head when Sean's influence prompts him to dilute Eduardo's
stake in the company. Essentially buying him out for pennies against his will because they
tricked him into signing the documents. Unreal. Eduardo confronts Mark in a heated showdown,
exposing the betrayal and greed that have kind of come to define their relationship.
Meanwhile, Mark refuses to acknowledge his unethical actions and it deepens the riff
with basically everyone who ever trusted him. Yep. His obsession with success comes at the
cost of personal connections. Ironic. Leaving him increasingly isolated as lawsuits from
Eduardo and the Winklevoss twins pile up should have colored it yellow. Sean Parker gets arrested
at a house party with underage interns, proving my theory once again that a driver's license
is the best card to use to cut lines. A hundred percent. Especially with new friends. Right.
Let me just. Yep. That's fine. All safety buddy. You know what I mean? Right. By the
end of the film, Mark sits alone, refreshing his Facebook page in a futile attempt to reconnect
with Erica Albright, the ex-girlfriend whose rejection partly fueled his ambitions. While
Facebook has become a global phenomenon, Mark's flaws, his selfishness, betrayal and inability
to maintain meaningful relationships leave him a lonely figure trapped by the consequences
of his own actions. So Rory and Shad and a row. Dude, yellow works a treat by the way.
In what context? Oh, the reading. Yes. I thought we were still on the Kim Jong and to take
exception sharp left turn because of you. Let's move on quickly. Let's move on quickly.
You hate this. Right. Tell me why. Give me the juice. It's not that I hate this because
it's, it's a very difficult film for me to process. Right. Okay. I hear that, but also
everything you say before the word, but it's bullshit. So let's just, it's hard to contextualize
because it is so out of my wheelhouse. Yeah. It's so far out of my wheelhouse. Yeah. And
it's so left field to what I would normally pay attention to because there's nothing,
there's nothing fun here for me. No. And I do, I do. I'm actually like in a non condescending
way, incredibly sorry that I have managed to drag you so far from what you love to the
point where you'll sit down and actually discuss the social network. I'm like, no, no, no,
but this is ruined for me though. No, no, no. It's good for me because I've like, I
feel like I've grown a lot over the last couple of years and this is why I can have this discussion,
not just sit here and go, Oh, but yeah, but shit though, in it. You know what I mean?
Yeah. Yeah. Fair, fair, fair. It's out of my wheelhouse. There's not a lot of fun in
it for me because it's not monsters. It's not stumpy stuff. It's not goofy stuff. I
disagree and say it is monsters, but it's a different kind of monster. It is, it is,
but it's human monsters. It's very, it's monsters that you can see out and about on the street.
It's not Godzilla. It's not Mothra. It's not the creature from the black lagoon. You know
what I mean? If billionaires had the ability to get laser, laser eyes, they'd take that
thing. Yeah. I thousand percent Musk is working on it. 1000% he's just doing it in the bathroom
somewhere. Thousand percent. It's the fact that the characters in it are so unrelatable
to me that I just, it's so hard to care about the actual plot of the story that's going
on. It's a very interesting story and it's told incredibly well and the current in between
like current timeline and then the dramatization of the past events, whether they were true
or not. Cause a lot of the stuff that's acted out is based on the testimonies of people
from like, you know, um, Alice, Alice Albright, Erica Albright, um, from Erica Albright. She,
she gives a testimony. It's all dramatized and acted out. And then we find out in the
current time that Mark's like, well, no, I didn't say any of that. So that's a very interesting
way to look at it. It's very fun to sort of see which way it goes and to twist and the
turns. I just don't care about the characters. I don't care about the plight of Mark Zuckerberg.
I just don't. I don't care about the multi-millionaire Winklevoss twins that are like, oh, excuse
me. That was my idea. And it's like, yeah, it was your idea. And you gave it to a terrible
person. So given it to a terrible person with no like legal proceedings in place. They just
went, this is our, this is our idea. Can you help us with it? And he was like, yeah, yeah,
sure. Did it himself. Fair play. But Colonel, you have activated my trap card. That's fine.
That's fine. I'm fully, I'm ready for this. I'm ready to be educated. I hear your point.
But on the other hand, reality. So Mark Zuckerberg, at the time that this film, this 2010, now
this film has gotten more relevant in lots of ways, but what it has lost is a bit of
its bite because at the time we were at the forefront of tech billionaires. We hadn't
really had them for that long. Mark Zuckerberg was among the first. Yeah. Elon was still
acquiring Tesla or just in the early days of Tesla. And we were like, what a sound guy.
He wants to save the planet. He believes in climate change. He's trying to build electric
cars so we can save the climate. And he's trying to build spaceships in case plan a
doesn't work. What a guy. Just a chill guy. He's just a chill guy. He designs flame throwers.
He sells flame throwers. Hilarious. He's bought a company that digs tunnels. He's called it
the boring company. What a guy. Right? Sure. Mark Zuckerberg and their opinion of these
people hadn't been coloured by on the other hand, reality. I found an article, I found
an article from before this film was released. Plans to improve education. And this is talking
about Mark Zuckerberg. He plans to improve education and cure the world's most intractable
diseases by giving scientists access to engineers whose work could include artificial intelligence.
It's safe to say that no one is doing more in so many fields to bring about this singular
vision of connectivity. I certainly would not underestimate him said Ben Horowitz, who's
venture capital firm is a Facebook investor. He's totally determined, willing to fail and
try again. He has the resources and he's a genius. If he can't lead the way, then I'm
not sure who can. That's from an investor of Facebook. Do you remember early days of
the internet before Google, before web 2.0, before Facebook, where it was like you type
in a URL, you'd be like, let's go see what's on rotten.com. Let's go check out what's on
congregate.com where the internet was this beautiful, innocent, user generated thing
that had no big money. Bounds world. Do you remember e-bounds? Bounds were incredible.
I miss that on a daily basis. Yeah. Amazing. Think back to that internet. Yeah. Cause that's
what we were dealing with in the early 2000s. It was beautiful. It was MSN messenger. Oh,
my God. Windows media player. And we had Napster and we were downloading. We had that whole
thing about it when we went on no more late fees. That sort of how incredible that early
internet experience was. Line wire. Here comes a guy. Right. Here comes a guy who goes, well,
I'm going to connect people. And there was a time where we were like, wow, technology's
going to make society better. Yeah. That's the world that this film was released into.
Okay. That's why this film had bite back then. Cause it was like, nah, I see what you're
saying. I do. I do see what you're saying. So there's a, there's a point at which it's
become less relevant because a lot of what it's telling us is just known fact now. Yeah.
Right. We just go, yeah, of course. They're immoral small men. We know that because they
tell us every day. Right. I understand what you're saying. And this is, this is where
I'm just going to reveal stuff about me that I'm not proud of. I've grown out of it. Right.
Mostly right. Your dark web stuff. No, it's the chip on my shoulder. Oh, it's going to
reveal the chip on your shoulder. Then it walks in the room eight minutes before you
do. No, that's, that's my shame. That's my shame. It's easily confused. I've got like
a weird chip on my shoulder for these, these guys that are like, they're painted out to
be saints. And you just look at them and you go, but yeah. All right. There are very, very,
very easy ways for you to turn around and go, I've just done this. It's not for any
big reason. I've just done it. Everyone bangs on about Bono being this next, you know, the
next patron saint Bono and all this stuff. And it's like, yeah, it's great. It's amazing.
He organises all these festivals where he begs poor people to give them money to help
out other poor people. Whilst he sits in his billion dollar house, earning hundreds of
millions year upon year. I'm raising awareness. Not money then. No, not money. Oh yeah. I'm
sorry. Your charity Red raised how many million? 20. How much have it made it there? A couple
hundred thousand. Fantastic. Where's the rest? Lost in admin. Yeah. Patrons say fantastic.
Awesome. I get it. I, I, I do get it. And it's, it's trust issues. It comes from like
way, way, way back when even like, do you remember when we had the early internet and
it was all about like Microsoft and there was the gaming consoles wars, you know, there
was between like Xbox and PlayStation and Nintendo was still kind of there. The like
GameCube was GameCube going to do it. Ooh. Yeah. Is the new donkey controller really
going to change the way we work as humans? No, obviously not. But no, it's just going
to affect dark sold speed runs 20 years from now. You'll love it. That's exactly it. But
you've got, that's so true. That's so unbelievably true. Just started playing Elden Ring. That's
hilarious. But we had this thing and there was loads of stuff about Bill Gates back then
being all like all this charitable work and this lovely stuff that he does in like third
world countries. He's curing malaria. But then bit by bit you just see these horrible
experiments that are going on behind the scenes and you're like, how is he funding this? Right.
Why am I on MSN messenger right now talking about this on a Bill Gates machine? Right.
You know what I mean? Yeah, I get that. That's where it comes from. I think a large part
of the chip that I share with you or shared with you for a long time is that we both grew
up on benefits with single moms and in the era that we were growing up, the conservative
party government was campaigning on this whole ridiculous idea that there were women out
there who were having babies for the benefits. Right. Yes. And like single mothers were the
enemy. So we were seeing these rich bastards come on television and be like, it's not us
spending all the money on nuclear submarines. It's all these single mothers who are stealing
from the state. We were being raised by women in poverty and we were being told that our
mothers were the, what was wrong with the country. By the people that are represented
in this film. And I'm like, I get it. I had it for a long time. I was the, I was the poorest
kid. I was the richest kid in primary school. I got bullied for being posh because I sound
like this. And then I was the poorest kid in grammar school and I got bullied for not
summering in the Maldives. Yeah. So I get it. I get it. And it's part of what it's going
to feed into why this is a happy place film for me. Okay. That's going to be good. I'm
going to, I'm just really quickly. I need to get this off my shoulder, right? The chip
that I'm talking about is no longer there to this extent. This is where I was when it
came out, the world that was released into when I first watched it. And I was like, I
don't care. I don't care about these evil guys that's taking my data and selling it
to ad companies. Cause all this stuff started coming out bit by bit by bit. We realized
that our data and our privacy is no longer any product. Exactly. And that's the bit that
didn't sit well. So when I'm watching this film, this is all in my mind. I'm like, I
don't care. It's absolute nonsense. There's nothing here that I'm going to feel sorry
for. You get that you're supposed to hate them. You get that this is not a heroic journey.
This is, this is a villain origin story. Yes. But the villain in this story is a weird incel
that's doing it because someone broke up with him for not being like a better, a slightly
better person or not being the best in his field. So what he does is he then changes
the entire field irreparably for the worse, single-handedly destroying the society that
we've been working on and the hopes and dreams that we had by hitting one nuclear button.
We should point out as Aaron Sorkin and Mark Zuckerberg have both pointed out on their
own Aaron Sorkin, who wrote this, this is loosely based on Facebook and Mark Zuckerberg.
There's an awful lot that just didn't happen or isn't true. It's almost a parable or a
metaphor for the emerging billionaire class. And this is where I come in with my, how I
viewed it to like this week. This is where I'm at with it now. This is arguably one of
the best films I've seen in such a long time. And it, it's changed my mind about Fincher,
maybe not changed my mind. I had a bit of an epiphany about Fincher whilst watching
this film. Because not only is it gorgeous to look at, there is not a single frame in
this film that you could change and it would add anything to the film. There is nothing
in it. It's, it's, it's, it's perfect. Perfect. Perfection from start to finish every single
shot angle. The way that I resent Fincher a bit because the way that he uses the camera
to tell this story forces empathy. And I hated it because I picked up on it straight away.
Cause you pointed out in Benjamin Button, how he forces empathy with stuff. And I've
picked up on it on this film and I was like, nah, not working on me bud. Still hate him.
Nah. But it was, that was happening and it was incredible.
It makes you feel what they're feeling. It does. It does. It's insane. So, so he forces
his empathy and you really, you really see like the depth and the severity of the situation
that's going on. Even though I've got no vested interest in it whatsoever, you feel the gravity
of the situation. It's an incredible film of a horrible story. It's an incredible, it's
incredibly executed film about a horrible, horrible story that makes me feel on a fundamental
level sad for the human race. Oh yeah. Do you know what I mean? And this is what it
is. Oh no, I totally do. That's exactly why I love it. Okay. Okay. We'll come back to
that. We'll come back to that. No, no, no. It's good. This is good. I feel like there's
a, there might be a bridge here. We're on different sides, but there's a bridge. I'm,
I'm, I've got the last brick in that bridge at the end and it's going to click into place.
It's going to be the keystone. Incredible. It's going to make everything about my week
better. Amazing. Okay. So, so this is where I'm up with Fincher, the epiphany that hit
me. Um, the way that he tells his stories and the scripts that he chooses to work with
right. We'll flip a story so that you're seeing it from unexpected viewpoints. Yeah. We're
not seeing, we're not seeing this story from Mark Zuckerberg's viewpoint, right? No, it's
all told through these three court cases brought against him. And we're all hearing the different
testimony of the people suing him. Exactly. But what it is is there is no, there is no
refute of the villainy that's going on. It's just people telling these awful, awful recollections
of what's happened to them because of this one human and him going, so it's a perfect
storm of super uncomfortable and weirdly empathetic. And it's, it's a, it's like a weird goo that
I sat in for two and a half hours over along this film is, and by the end of it, I was
like, Oh God, I just feel like I need a shower. Just feel like a quick wash just to get it
off. You know what I mean? It's the sort of thing it, there's a practical reason that
it comes from this, but it's, you're right. It's a perfect Fincher move. It is. It's incredible
that where it comes from is Aaron Sorkin. Uh, there was a book, uh, being written about
founding of Facebook. Aaron Sorkin caught one of it, read a bit, was like, this is brilliant.
I'm going to make the film version books. Not even finished yet. Let's sit in a room
together. You write the book, pass me the chapters. I'll turn it into a movie. Okay.
And they were like, well, we're going to have to ask Facebook and Harvard and all these
guys to get involved. And they all read it and were like, absolutely not. Yeah. Of course.
They were like, look, but then of course these court cases are public documents. Yeah. You
can write whatever you want around them. Yeah, of course. So Facebook said, no, we're not
going to get involved. Aaron Sorkin says, well, you can't stop me writing about what
was claimed in a court of law because it's a public document. You've got no right to
tell me I can't use this information. That's okay. That's kind of genius. And it makes
me like it a little bit more. Right. Right. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Speaking of genius, I've
got a confession to make and I'm not Dave Grohl. So it's not adultery. It's, uh, it's
a Dave Grohl related thing, which is for all of my life, I came out of the womb in a nine
inch nails t-shirt. Right. I am obsessed with nine. I have to declare that first. I had
been for a long time before this film came out. Right. And the soundtrack for which Trent
Reznor won the Oscar. Amazing. For the social network. Incredible. Is done by Trent Reznor.
Right. It is. And Atticus Ross, who are now nine inch nails. Yeah. This was like a huge
coming together of my worlds, but I think without this soundtrack, the film doesn't
work. At 1000%, I'll agree with you. 150%. There's an interesting behind the scenes fact
that it's not quite true. Trent Reznor was asked in, in interview if it was Elvis Costello.
He's like, I don't think it was Elvis Costello, but when Mark Zuckerberg is walking across
the university campus after just being dumped at the start of the film was originally some
indie rock, jangly guitar music. Yeah. Like Elvis Costello. Yeah. And he was like, Trent
Reznor said, I just remember some jangly college rock, sort of everything, everything's all
right. Let's all have a beer sort of track. Right. And the film then sort of became some
sort of John Hughes esque kids at college, light life, which is not what the film should
be. No. If you did, if you changed the soundtrack of this film, it would creep into your mind
that maybe we're supposed to be looking up to this guy or maybe this is a biography or
like, Oh, we were telling the story of this man's life because we're interested in this
man. And we think what he's done is good. A positive, a positive spin on it almost.
Okay. Instead you've got what sounds like tortured air conditioners and this incredibly
sad bit of piano. The thing, Oh my God, you're so right. The thing that I love about the
soundtrack in this is the obviously the air conditioning drone and the, like the weird
playful stuff that happens in between is the fact that at some point they were like, yeah,
they're in a club. We need someone sort of like dancey and you know, upbeat, but also
something that's really, it's really going to drive the severity of the situation is
like, yeah, easy, mate. Here, I'll just give me 20 minutes. Boom. And then just puts like
a, it looks like a dance beat under it and it works perfectly. And you're like, Oh my
God, I hate this because I know it's not in its nails. I'm listening to it and I'm like,
Oh, this is all right. Oh, Oh no. So, Oh no. Now, now, okay, here we go. And then it just
melts. It's slowly like it peels off the walls. It's the, it's horrible. If you listen to
it on its own, horrifying that I adore the soundtrack to this film so much so that I've
actually created a playlist for our Patreon listeners. Yes. Other nine inch nails music
that if you enjoy the soundtrack to this and you don't necessarily know nine inch nails,
nine inch nails go very heavy, very noisy at parts of that catalog. They also go very
quiet and very odd and very whatever this soundtrack is. So I've made a little playlist
that's some selected tracks from this soundtrack and other tracks on other albums to help serve
as like a little intro for people who like this soundtrack. There's lots more that's
actually better from their music catalog that I've put into a little playlist. That's awesome,
man. Does it have the hand that feeds on it? Of course it doesn't bother them. That song,
that song that plays during the opening credits, I have to point out it's played two more times
in the film, once at the midpoint and once at the very end. But every time you won't
notice this when you watch the film, but when you listen to the soundtrack, every time that
phrase is repeated, the piano mics move further away. Right. Okay. So the, the, the emotion
of the piece gets physically more, more distant and the air con gets closer. The inhuman mechanical
machine noise is growing. And it cuts to the heart of why I think this deserved the Oscar
because quite often soundtracks are like quite simplistic, emotional nails, sort of driving
home how you're supposed to be feeling about the image on screen. Like John Williams, undoubtedly
a genius soundtrack. Incredible, incredible. But you, you never listened to a piece of
John Williams music and go, Hmm, that's a bit ambiguous about how I'm supposed to feel.
Yeah. I agree. I'm not sure what I'm supposed to feel here. Whereas Reznor looks at what's
on screen and goes, I'm not going to amplify what's on screen. I'm going to complicate
what's on screen. I'm going to run counter to what's happening and I'm going to make
it more confusing. Does he mean that? No, man. You've just pointed that out. He does
loads of stuff like this. It's a bit where he's like, um, where it's almost like a celebratory
moment where like Facebook, it's either just after he gets the new interns or he's planning
on doing the interviews, but the soundtrack is horrid. Like it's like a damning moment
audibly, but verbally it's a celebratory thing. You need to come back to California. This
is amazing. We've done it. And the music's horrid. Yeah. Okay. But then in reality it's
because Mark is lying through his teeth. He wants Eduardo to come back and it's that complexity
and that subtlety and that trust in the audience. I'm not going to tell you how to feel. Right.
That's not my job. Trenton is your job. He's like, no, he's a grownups. We're all grownups
here. I'm going to make you feel something and it's going to change your relationship
to this film. Yeah. Um, yeah. And if you look at the film, it beat interstellar. Yeah. This
was up against for the Oscar Hans Zimmer interstellar. Wow. Not the subtlest of soundtracks. No,
but also incredible soundtrack, incredible soundtrack, incredible soundtrack, but it
is an emotional nail to the face. It is. Whereas this is a surgical complex. I mean, there
were bits in this where, um, I'll quote here to end, we're also aware that it's not just
a piece of music. There's dialogue, the sound effects, there's room tone. There's an air,
funny enough, air conditioner running. There's a truck going by. We'll consult and we'll
say, Hey, what key is the tone of that aircon? Can we can transpose our track or can you
pitch up the aircon? So it becomes an in concert symphony of sound that spills from traditional
music into sound design. To me, they're interlocked. Wow. Okay. I love Trent and Atticus. I also
love that they've been dropping spoilers about this film since 2010 and just no one has picked
up on it. I mean, they've literally, they spell it out for you as the film plays out.
No one clicks on. I didn't click on it until you've just pointed out. I'm going to have
to watch it again, but I'm just, I'm just going to pay attention to the soundtrack.
It's so, so good. But I think the best thing about this film by a long shot for me is the
soundtrack. The soundtrack. That's it. Yeah. Yeah. That's the one. Yeah. It's incredible.
Did you know who was Trent and Atticus man? So this thing about aircon and machines and
there's like a mic on a piano that moves further away. That's intense. Yeah. It's crazy, man.
It's crazy. I did my research, but it's all my own research. And that is incredible podcasts.
Yeah. It's all right. It's the performances man. Oh, Jesse Eisenberg has never been in
another film compared to this. It's night and day. I mean, now you see me, right? Right.
It's three's just finished filming by the way. Three's just wrapped. Yeah, but they
can't, they've ruined it already because the second one should have been called Now You
Don't, but they have that ship as well. Yeah. That's exactly it. But I'm saying like Jesse
Eisenberg in this film is ridiculous because not only, it's wizardry. I don't get how he
does this, right? He does this whole thing where he's, he is completely monotonous and
robotic and calculated and horrid, but simultaneously you can feel every single lingering emotion
behind his eyes. And I'm like, how, how do humans craft this wizardry? Like where does
it come from? He complained about this film lovingly because he suffers with a genuine
obsessive compulsive disorder, not like, Oh, I need to make sure my emails are sorted.
He's like, he's got to lock the door eight times and all this kind of stuff. And so he
had to readopt speech patterns that he trained himself out of. Oh, that's brutal. So he had
to return to the well of like, Oh, well that stuff that I spent a lifetime trying to not
do you're now needing me to do. Brilliant. Thanks David. That's way more brutal. That
makes, that makes a lot more sense though. Okay. Right. Okay. It's, it's his eyes, man.
It's his eyes. You get the depression, you get the heartbreak, but you also get the childlike
timid I'm going to do something kind of thing. Like a little kid with a new, with a new pack
of crayons. And then it's like, there's not a bad performance in the film. Andrew Garfield,
insane, insane, insane. Yeah. Yeah. He's, he's mint. Everyone in this film is mint.
And I, it's slight tangent, but the Jesse Eisenberg returning to the well of his trauma,
his lived trauma is that happens quite a lot on this. Right. Okay. So, uh, this film won
three Oscars, one for film editing, one for soundtrack, one for writing. Amazing. 66%
of those Oscars were by cocaine addicts. Outstanding. So Aaron Sorkin was arrested in Hollywood
Burbank airport, airport in the airport. Okay. Possession of hallucinogenic mushrooms. You're
right. It does affect every aspect of our waking life now a little bit like in the fifties,
the newspaper men. So it's a little bit like a modern citizen cane, except it's written
by addicts. So it's citizen cocaine. Oh my God. All right. I was going to say that's
a bit of a stretch, but I'm glad that I waited off because that's fantastic. It's not a stretch
though because it's about people who control information and make money off it. No, you,
yeah, you are right. I feel like this is a much more evil, then again, cocaine is more
evil than, you know, a whiskey and shooting someone on a boat. I'm back in. I'm back in.
This film is incredible and I cannot stress that enough. It's incredible. It's also deeply,
deeply, deeply upsetting. The villainy in it is so small scale and so easy to come by and
so prevalent. It's just slowly being ingrained into newer generations. It's just ingrained
that this is how it is. And it's like, Jesus Christ. I know my sister doesn't remember
a time before Facebook for her. Facebook is like BBC two. Yes. And that's insane. That's
insane to me. It's always existed. Yeah. Maybe it's just because I'm like 36 now and I'm
really contemplating death. This is the long stretch. Now this is where I'm at. No, and
here we come. Here we come to my keystone, babe. Okay. This is why this is an incredibly
uplifting film. Okay. Hit me with it. Because you're right. It's a villain origin story
about autistic people doing an anti-heist on society so that they can get some form
of personal slight against their egos corrected. I will burn the world down before they exclude
me. Yes. It's small, tiny men burning the world. Yep. But here's the thing. We've sat
and we've watched a film shining a light on them for the small, tiny, pathetic men they
are. Yeah. And it's a little bit like David Fincher and Aaron Sorkin and Trent Reznor
sit you down and go, we agree. The fact that this film is getting made is a sign that there
is a huge market. There is a $40 million worth market. And trust me, I'm going to tell you
how much this made in a minute. Okay. They are the minority and we are still at a point
where we can all get together and go, that's pathetic. We're not going, oh wow, look at
his incredible achievements. We're not going, wow, he's a genius. And if anyone knows how
to change the future, it's going to be him. You know, he's going to cure diseases. He's
going, what a loser. And there's nothing that keeps my teeth whiter than sitting down with
David Fincher and Trent Reznor and pointing at a rich loser and going, you're still a
prick. I get that. I can see that. I can see that. Yeah. It's so cathartic when I'm watching
the news this week, right? I'm watching the news this week and I'm like, Musk is going
to drive us all to hell. And then you've got the people I respect just going, don't worry
about them. They're little men. They're pricks. They're absolute bellends. And I love, no matter
how much money you make, no matter how much you build an empire and change the fabric
of society, there's always going to be some dude with bells on his shoes and a silly hat
going, you're a bellend now, aren't you? Yeah. I can respect that. I can respect that. I
think the worst thing is, is just sort of like the more they take over. I mean, do you
remember when Facebook bought WhatsApp? Yeah. And it was supposed to be like a big celebratory.
Yeah. But you know, now it's all in one place. And the first thing I was like, I was like,
what is Telegram? How do I download Telegram? What is this thing? Is it a different, is
it the same? You are exceptionally paranoid. I just hate it. I just hate, I hate one person
having everything. It's odd. It's odd. Oh, yeah. If he buys my bank and then also the
people that gave the mortgage on the house. There is, there is, there is no way to be
a moral billionaire, right? Of course not. It's just, you are a dragon sat on a big pile
of money. I understand that. And the mere act of having a billion dollars makes you
an evil person because you are never going to spend that much money. To an extent. Yeah.
500 million, go crazy. Do what you want. You've got 500 million. There's nothing you can want
that you can't have. There's nothing reasonable that you could want that you can't have. For
500 million, you can buy some small countries, right? You don't need another 500 million.
This is my thing though, right? Is if you, it's what you do with it that matters after
the fact. You know what I mean? 100, 100%. But there is nothing reasonable that you could
want to do that you cannot achieve with 500 million. By the time you get to a billion,
what do you need that, what do you need that for? What is it that you could want that you
can't get for 500 million? That's a great point. I think it would just be sort of, I
don't know. I think at a certain point I'd get bored. Right. I'd just be on street corners
being like, all right, mate, what are you doing? Right. Exactly. Going to work. Because
you're a rational person. All right. Sounds how much to quit the job. I don't know. I'm
on 40 grand a year. All right. It's 50. Have a great year. See you in a bit. Right. Right.
I'd go, let's invent anti-gravity. Let's end homelessness for a laugh. Yeah. Let's make
a massive trampoline park. How big do you want it? Madagascar. Madagascar big is how
big I want my trampoline park. Exactly. I'm just going to buy solar panels for everyone.
Because I can. For banter. But they don't do that. Right? They go, no, I'm going to
make a number go up. And you're like, that's an immoral thing. It is mental. But again,
there's very little to say or to do or to rationalize or try and understand. Cause we're
from a different world. We always will be from a different world. And that's fine. We
can't change it. We can't change it. So there's no sense. Read the back of your coin. Grant
me the serenity to accept the things I can't change. I literally have it in my hand right
now. Like this is my, this is my talisman right now. This is like, read the back. Yeah, I've
got you. So it says, I know it's not yellow. I've just thrown it once. It's not yellow.
Yeet. God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change. Courage to change
the things I can and the wisdom to know the difference. And that's great. Right. That
is great. That's sound advice. It's solid. Quick sidebar. He does prefer it when you
pronounce it properly. Jod. Oh, my bad. Sorry, Jod. Sorry, Jod. I was getting confused with
Gizus. I got them mixed up. Do you want to know how much this made? More than anything.
From its 40 million. More than anything. So at the end of its theatrical run, the film
grossed $97 million in the United States. Wow. Okay. And 128 million in other territories
for a worldwide total of 225 million. Jesus Christ. That's insane. That is. In its first
week of release on DVD, sales totaled 13 million in a week from DVDs. Yeah. Okay. That is 225
million reasons that Mark Zuckerberg is a bellend. I get that. And that is what keeps
me. This is why I'm like, yeah. Yeah, no, I hear you. Beautiful. And it's not even calling
it's not calling him Satan. It's not calling him the great destroyer because that would
imply he's got power. Just calling him a little bit of a prick. I think the worst thing about
it is though, is me giving him that bit of attention. It's still paying attention to
this little, this little bit. I don't think that's what doesn't sit with me. While I'm
like, I don't care. I don't want to care. I don't want to know you. Fine. Fine. We have
to cause I know we live in. I know. I know. It's weird. It also appeared on 78 film critics
top 10 lists. Amazing. Best films of 2010. I'll agree. It's incredible. It's mint. It's
incredible. Perfectly executed film. You hate it. Horrible story. Hate the story. Perfectly
executed film. And I love it because I'm just like, yeah, get them, get them Dave. Yeah.
All right. I'd love to. Right. So there's loads of good trivia. There's loads of good
trivia for this film that just didn't fit into what we wanted to say about it. So I'm
going to just give you a couple of bits. There's a part in this film where they're legal deposition
and the lawyer says to Zuckerberg, Zuckface, uh, 19, noble, uh, he says you went to Harvard
with 19 noble laureates, 15 Pulitzer prize winners, two future Olympians and a movie
star. Who was the movie star that Zuckface went to Harvard with? I don't know. Let me
take a guess. I'm going to take a stab in the dark. Can I have a clue? Can I have a
clue of like a film that they were in? Uh, uh, one in which a Frenchman wants to get
handsy with a child. The dude from Leon. Oh, okay. There's only three of them. I don't
think it's Darryl. I don't think it's Natalie Portman. I don't think it's, is it Natalie
Portman? It's Natalie Portman. He went to Harvard with Natalie Portman. Okay. She called
Aaron Salkin when she heard of the project and met him for dinner to discuss life at
Harvard. She dated a member of the Porcelain club, the knobby club that the freaky twins
go to. Oh, get it girl. Okay. And so she was, she was kind of half consultant on the movie
about what life at Harvard was like. That's incredible. Okay. All right. All right. I
didn't say Portman cause I was like, ah, she's a kid. Yeah. So Zuckface, um, how many
takes did the first scene, the breakup take? Okay. So I think this is a trick question
if I'm being honest with you. I think because Fincher is famous for doing loads of takes.
Right. I'm going to assume that it's on this quiz because it's the opposite. I'm going
to say three. You know, he normally just loads of takes. Yes. And you went one way. Yeah.
Go the other way. Okay. 150 takes. 51 takes less than that. But yes. 99 takes of that
one. 99 takes. Jesus Christ. You could put a flake in it and sell it out of a van. Oh
my God. It was an ice cream joke. That's fantastic. Okay. Awesome. What did this film add to Mark
Zuckerberg's life? You're never going to get this. This is, I don't know why I phrased
this question this way. Yeah. It's a drink. It's a drink that he'd never had before.
What? Appletini? Yes. He drinks them all the time now. Because of this film? Yeah. He'd
never had one before. Right. And then he was like, well, I'll try one seeing as they claim
that I love them so much. And then he was like, oh my God, this is incredible. This
is the best thing I've ever drunk. The tits. They're insanely good. Last question of the
quiz. Yep. There is a blink in your misset reference to one of David Fincher's earlier
films in this movie. Did you spot it? Is this the scene where they attend a fight club in
the basement of Harvard's bicycle room? It's not. It's not. But you're not far off because
in one scene Zuckerberg is using a Facebook profile and the name on his Facebook profile
is? Tyler Durden. It is. A reference to Brad Pitt's character in Fight Club. That's insane.
Okay. I need to go back and watch that. Yeah. I need to go back and watch it. Jesus Christ.
Okay. That's a good quiz, man. I like that one. Thanks man. What are you going to rate
the social network? This is going to be complicated. Yeah. I've dreaded this bit. Okay. So I'm
going to have to give it two ratings. I like it. I categorically have to. Standard Benjamin
Gannett Groves move. No, no, no, no, no, no. It's, it's Benjamin. What's your definitive
rating of this film? Well, I've got five. Yeah. If it needs five, I'm giving it five.
I'm doing my due diligence. All right. Okay. Okay. Right. Apologies to Rosie on letterbox,
but yeah, there's two, right? So one is for as a film. So as a standalone film, it's a
piece of technical filmmaking. It's a piece of filmmaking. It is perfection. It is a fat
10. It is a fat 10 as a choice of story to tell again, the way that he does it, the way
that it's executed fat 10. Oh, okay. Right. The other rating, the second rating, sorry,
that was all built, built into one. The other rating, which is my enjoyability and how much
did I, how much did I enjoy this film? Would I sit down to watch it again without that
little quiz? The answer would probably be no. Without the information about the soundtrack,
the answer would probably be no, but I'm going to, I will, I'm going to rate it a four because
it's a harrowing film and I really didn't enjoy my time here because it just made me
very sad and a bit annoyed. Trip advisor for the two hours spent with this film is four
out of 10. Four out of 10 for the, for my time spent because it's so far removed from
my wheelhouse. If you're after a film experience, 10 out of 10, watch it immediately. Watch
it immediately. It is perfection. Right. Right. Nice. Nice. Nice. Nice. How about yourself?
I am going to go in with a lower score of fat 10. A lower score of fat 10. Okay. Yeah. Because
I adore Nine Inch Nails. I adore David Fincher and it is a technically perfect film. Like
there's so little that I can tell the listeners about how he made this because it's just not the
most important thing for me in the film. The, the, the most like it's David Fincher and at this point
in his career, he's firing on all cylinders. Yes. Yeah. Like he, we've got this, we've got
Gone Girl coming up. Oh my God. I can't wait. We've got Girl With A Dragon Tattoo, which I,
every day of my life, I wake up sad that they didn't continue that version of the trilogy.
I've never seen it. I adore it. It's a ridiculous thing to get invested in because
it's part one of a three part story that they never made parts two and three.
That's infuriating. Yeah. I already hate it. Yeah. You'll hate it more once you've seen it
and you've seen how brilliant it is. But yeah. This is like Mack and Me. Mack and Me at the end,
the blow up bubble saying we'll be back. They never will be. They know. You're right. Exactly.
It's like dad all over again. Yeah. Except for not as upsetting as Mack and Me. It's true. I would
rather have Mack and Me too than a father. Right. Thank you. Well, unfortunately guys, that is
everything that we have for you this week. We have sincerely enjoyed hanging out with you
for this hour. We really have. It means the absolute world to us. If you want to support the show,
if you want to help us grow, if you're able to, our Patreon is there. There are extra episodes
ready and waiting for you. There's a poll open right now to see which is going to be the content.
Very first Patreon exclusive episode. It's going to be super fun. There's a great community of
people in there. That's one way to support the show. We truly, truly, the only one's worth knowing.
No, I'm joking. It's, it truly does mean the world to us that you're willing to support us that way.
Equally, if you don't want to sign up to Patreon, you could simply tell a friend,
just literally, Hey buddy, that's what I listened to the other day. This podcast. What's it about?
About movies. Oh, okay. Ben's being very nice, but I'm going to go one further and say that if you
don't join us on Patreon and you then that's fine. But if you then also don't recommend a friend,
you are stealing and we will call the government. We will call the government. You wouldn't download
a car. You wouldn't steal a handbag. You wouldn't download a wife. Some people download wives.
I'm sure they do. I've, I've watched a documentary about Japanese men in love with their DS and it
really put into context. I think I saw some of that too. It was amazing, but also I keep getting
these weird AI pop-ups for sort of like get your new AI girlfriend. And I'm like, no, I'm not that
lonely. I see now Instagram recommended reels. I know exactly. Dude, I've been doing this with you
every time I open it. I'm like, Rob, no, so it's not just me and it's not you. So someone's on there.
I think it's Instagram. I think that's what it is. Instagram's like the, you two are men. Who owns
Instagram? Rob Mark Zuckface, Mark Zuckerberg is I again, I'm suing him for 600 mil. All right.
Stop making it weird when I open Instagram in public.
Ben is right there. That is sadly all the time we have. And to thank you for spending an hour of
your week with us, especially at the start of the week, we know a lot of you listen on a Monday.
So Ben's going to wrap up the thoughts, themes and feelings of this film into a little Monday
Motivation Pep Talk while I just tell you to consume. I don't know where to go with this.
Well, there's different ways. I mean, you could be the Winklevoss twins and just give away your
multi-million dollar ideas to any programmer that's willing to work with you because they built an MP3
thing and didn't sell it to Microsoft. That's a big red flag. Number one, or you can go Zuckerberg
and be sort of like, Oh, I'm sorry. Did you just upset me a little bit? Did you make me feel like
a little incel weirdo? Or how about this? Boom, nuclear button, change the world. Now you're
fucked forever. Your bloodline will never recover. In fact, none of humanity ever will.
So what I'm saying is choose your battles wisely. And maybe, maybe, maybe if you're going to change
the world with a revolutionary idea, hope that David Fincher can turn it into a perfect movie.
Is that all I'm going to say?