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NOTE
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Welcome to The Bird Guides
Podcast with me, Josh Jones.

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And me, David Campbell

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How's things, David?

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You all right?

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Yeah, really well.

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Been enjoying a bit more
migration the last few days.

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Don't know if it's been
busier around your local area

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Pretty steady really.

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I think it was a pretty quiet week,
but there was a bit of weather

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over the weekend which seemed to
get things going a little bit.

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But still fairly quiet my end.

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Why what, what have you been seeing?

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Well I've had a few passerines
starting to move through.

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So in the last week I've had a grasshopper
warbler, that was the most satisfying.

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Kicked one up from just inadvertently
from the edge of a field, it

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showed beautifully in the brambles.

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Um, I've had redstart, a few willow
warblers, a flyover siskin, house

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martins and swifts on the move.

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And at my local wetlands has been a
pair of ruddy shelducks, a peck sand's

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dropped in, wood sand, that kind of thing.

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So it's been… Yeah, yeah,
not my find unfortunately, but,

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Oh, okay.

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and not even a patch tick,
but still rather nice.

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Yeah.

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nice, I'd say

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Yeah.

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And little ringed plovers have
got late broods, some really cute

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little chicks I've been looking at.

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So yeah, it's been, been pretty busy.

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And it's not even August

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Exactly.

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Yeah, it really does begin in the
latter end of July, doesn't it?

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All this all this stuff

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It's amazing.

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I actually have had a tick since
we last spoke, can you believe?

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Well, a, a Baston tick.

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know a full fat tick, David.

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What?

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Oh, Ephraim?

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Yeah, I have.

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Yeah.

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It's not a bird.

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It's a dragonfly.

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Southern migrant hawker.

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Oh, wow, that was new for you, was it?

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Wow

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it was.

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Yeah, Yeah.

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We, We uh, haven't profited from the
recent expansion until this year, but

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just seems like this is the year for them.

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It seems like a big year the country
and yeah, several sites all of a

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sudden seem to have become occupied
by them this summer around here.

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There's quite a few sites around
Peterborough that have had them, so I went

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out looking at likely looking spots during
the warmth, at the end of last week.

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And yeah the squacco
heron spot in Crowland

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Oh yeah

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we had the squacco earlier this summer.

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little reedy pond quite sheltered
and a bit of a sun trap.

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And yeah, pretty much instantly
had one hawking up and down

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there, so that was really nice.

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And yeah, it seems like seems
like a good year for dragonflies

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Yeah, well, we were enjoying uh,
Leicester and Peru when we were up

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visiting you last time, so it's,
it's been pretty busy up there

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yeah, they seem to be they seem
to be well established here now.

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But anyway, just the two of us today.

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Ian is away.

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He's on holiday in Sweden.

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I suspect he's likely watching the first
migrant pied flycatchers, probably Caspian

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terns flying overhead and enjoying a nice
cold beer in the Swedish summer sunshine.

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so just the two of us here

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Yeah, I'm rather envious of Ian.

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I, I often go to Finland in July,
but I've skipped it this time.

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So yeah, wish I could be out
in Fennoscandia along with him.

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But yeah, I hope he's having a good time

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Yeah, and we're, we're starting today's
pod with a little bit of sad news which

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has come out this morning while we were
prepping to record, and that's that Bill

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Oddie has passed away at the age of 85.

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Bill is, of course, an absolute
icon of British birding, and many

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would say perhaps the most famous
British bird watcher of all time.

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Certainly I think a lot of people
would say that, although it was

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something that seemed to make
him a little bit uncomfortable

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when it was presented as such.

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He was a modest and quite shy chap.

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But an absolute icon of the scene.

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Yeah, I mean, he was just a, a legend.

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He was a significant part of why
I got into birding, as I'm sure

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is the case for many, many people.

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I remember meeting him at the Bird Fair.

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I only met him once.

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I know when you were editor
of the magazine, you, you

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spoke to him quite a lot.

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But I only had the pleasure of
meeting him once, and he signed

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a hat for me at Bird Fair.

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And I always remembered that fondly.

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And yeah, I, I just really admired how he
was always very outspoken for wildlife.

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He didn't really mince his words.

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He didn't hesitate.

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He said what needed to be
said about conservation

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Yeah, definitely.

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A huge character that,
that there is no doubt.

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And I think it's fair to say probably that
he did more to popularize birding than

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anyone during the '90s and early 2000.

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made bird- birding
mainstream in many respects.

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Primetime BBC television shows,
Birding with Bill Oddie, and then Bill

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Oddie Goes Wild after that as well.

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I, I remember I was very much of a,
an impressionable age back then, and

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I think it's fair to say that Bill was
definitely a big part in inspiring me

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and giving the, me the bug for birding.

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Not just birding really, for all wildlife.

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He did make it fun.

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He did make it seem fun, which it

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Absolutely.

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And I always remember that one
episode in Bill Oddie Goes Wild.

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Do you remember when he was
running around on that Dorset heath

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Oh, for handkerchiefs?

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Yeah

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trying to a- attract a nightjar in.

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That has really like permeated
into popular culture.

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I think a lot of people who aren't
even birders know that if you mention

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nightjars, they'll say, "Oh, you're waving
your hankies around like Bill Oddie."

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Have you ever done that?

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I've tried it in the past.

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I've not personally had a huge
amount of success with it, but I

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know people who, who swear by it
as a method of getting good views.

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No I remember doing it at
Dersingham Bog at work there

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I did it.

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Oh, nice

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years ago when I was a teenager.

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Yeah.

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got Bill to thank for that.

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Back when I was a, a kiddie birder
and I, you know, idolized Bill

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initially you know, 'cause he was
the first famous birder I, I knew of.

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I somehow got ahold of an old DVD
collection of The Goodies and watched

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them all and really enjoyed it.

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And I even loaded the-- It was the
first music I ever bought while I was

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still learning what music I, I liked.

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I downloaded The Best of The Goodies on
my PSP back when I was like nine or ten.

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So that was the first album I bought

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Yeah, iconic.

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Of course, he was the face of
Springwatch when it first came

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on the scene in 2005 as well.

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He's just, as I said, he's l- he's one
of the most, if not the most prominent

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British birder, that's for sure.

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And of course has done so
much more besides birds.

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But I think birds are really
his main lifelong passion,

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I think it's fair to say.

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And of course, Bill has had a
long-standing s- association with

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Birdwatch as well over the years.

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He appeared in only the second issue
of the magazine actually back in 1992

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when he reviewed Birds of Fair Isle.

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And then it was the following
summer, 1993, that he began writing

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a regular column in the magazine
as well, which he, I think he did

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for at least five years or so.

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Um, And he made a number of subsequent
appearances in the magazine, including

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to guest edit the February 2014 issue,
which featured a wonderful look back

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at his birding life uh, in which he
picked out 10 fond memories from around

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the world including a day in spring
in Central Park in New York looking

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at bright colored warblers a day at
Flamborough Head in autumn, which

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features loads of really exciting sibes.

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yeah, a d- a, a spring fall on
Fair Isle as well also features.

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But yeah, that we've re- we've
republished that article on

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Birdguides for all to read.

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So that's there for you to
di- digest at your will.

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But yeah, really nice read.

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Worth having a look back at.

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On a personal level, I'd say it was
quite nice and touching to be able

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to speak to Bill directly in my early
years as editor of the magazine.

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most recently, Bill wrote several columns
for the mag that ran until early 2023.

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And it was an honor to have been
in touch with him at those times.

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I must have uh, found it slightly sur-
like surreal really, that the guy that,

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who had undoubtedly inspired my birding
journey as a kid, and then I'd met as a

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child at the British Birdwatching Fair,
as it was known then, was now ringing

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me up on my personal phone and talking
about his columns and all things birding.

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It was all… It's all
a bit surreal really.

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It was one of your icons
there just dialing you up.

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It was mad.

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Must have been bizarre.

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Yeah.

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And his last column was about meeting
Peter Scott, I remember, wasn't it?

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Was that April 2023, I think?

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Yeah,

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I was digging that out earlier

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Yep, yeah.

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Eccentric slightly.

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No one else like him.

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Yeah.

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and he will be greatly missed.

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Absolutely.

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I'll be digging the Little Black Bird book
out before long, have another read of that

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Now, I know it's a few years since
I've read that, but yeah, I'll

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have to dig it out again, I think.

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Definitely

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So in today's episode, we're going to
have a look at some of the recent birding

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stories that have been cropping up.

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Some good news and some bad, . We're
gonna start with a look at dotterel,

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of which was the focus of a major
paper which came out earlier this,

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this month talking about the status
of it as a Scottish breeding bird.

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And pretty shocking statistics really.

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It looks like the numbers are down
pretty much 90%, i-in, in recent decades.

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And pretty, pretty harrowing statistic
and, and what looks like a pretty bleak

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future for this really charming wader.

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David, we had a feature in the
magazine in more detail about this.

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Do you wanna give some
of your, your thoughts?

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Yeah, Leah Kelly wrote a wonderful
summary of the findings for the

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July issue of, of Birdwatch.

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I need to say it's, it's
a really concerning read.

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So i- it was the results of the fourth
National Montane Bird Survey that it

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also looked at snow bunting and, and
ptarmigan, but really headlines with,

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with dotterel because that's, that's
the worrying news to come out of it.

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Yet again the second time in a row,
as with the previous survey in 2011,

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no breeding birds found in England,
Wales or, or even southern Scotland.

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So it really feels like
they're gone from those areas.

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And it's, it's looking like it's
getting pretty, pretty bad even

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in the sort of former strongholds.

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It doesn't really feel right calling
them strongholds anymore of, of like

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the Eastern Highlands and, and northern
Scotland, where they, they only actually

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found the species at 22 out of 217
sites, estimating about 112 males.

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And back in the 1980s, yeah,
back in the 1980s, there were

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nearly 1,981 males estimated.

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Wow

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Yeah, not good.

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And what does, what, what's being
cited as factors in this decline?

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The obvious one jumping out
is climate change, of course

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Yeah, it, well, it feels like
that's the main thing here.

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Fewer crane flies are around.

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They really rely on crane flies
in the breeding season, the

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larvae of a, a particular species
that you get in the hills.

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And people are saying they're, they're
not really seeing the adults of these

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crane flies flying around as, as much.

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So it seems like their food
source is, is you know, depleted.

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And on wintering grounds, declining
in-- declining rainfall in North

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Africa, that's not gonna help them.

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That's not gonna hope o-
help over winter survival.

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And meanwhile, you've got more and more
people up there bagging Monroes, often

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with their dogs, you know, often off
a lead grazing, you know, not always

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compatible with the interests of birds
like dotterel going on in large areas too.

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So obviously you can reduce
the effects of those things.

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There, there's certain things you
can do to sort of take the edge off

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it with disturbance and grazing.

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But when climate change is obviously
pushing them back, as it is even in, in

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Europe, I think the population in, in
Scandinavia is fairly stable, but they're,

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they're being seen to move upslope
and further north already there too.

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Yeah, it feels like there's
only s- it's maybe just delaying

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the inevitable to be honest.

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It, it feels like it could be
the first climate change-driven

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extinction in Britain.

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Yeah, pretty har-harrowing really.

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And that's part of the problem, isn't
it?… Warming temperatures mean

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warming temperatures higher up the
hills as well not just at ground level.

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And there-therein lies
the problem in part.

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Once the dotterels get to a point
where there's nowhere left to go

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in Britain as seems to be becoming
the case, that worryingly seems to

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be spelling the end of this species
as a breeding bird in Britain.

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Have you ever seen dotterel on
breeding grounds in Scotland?

00:12:04.315 --> 00:12:05.965
No, I was gonna ask you if, if you had

00:12:06.690 --> 00:12:07.190
Yeah, I have.

00:12:07.190 --> 00:12:10.700
Yeah I, about years ago, I
think it was either 2005 or

00:12:10.700 --> 00:12:12.590
2006 off the top of my head.

00:12:13.070 --> 00:12:17.370
I remember going up Cairngorm and seeing
a male with two fluffy chicks in early

00:12:17.714 --> 00:12:18.194
Oh, wow.

00:12:18.194 --> 00:12:18.554
Yeah

00:12:18.980 --> 00:12:22.790
And at the time it was, it, don't get me
wrong, it was absolutely stunning to see.

00:12:22.790 --> 00:12:25.570
So exciting to see these lovely
birds on their breeding grounds.

00:12:25.580 --> 00:12:27.960
Dotterel is one of my favorite
waders, as I'm sure it probably

00:12:27.960 --> 00:12:28.820
is for a lot of people.

00:12:28.830 --> 00:12:31.320
We know you've got history
with the species, Dave.

00:12:31.700 --> 00:12:36.020
But yeah I just think it, at the time it
felt kind of part of the furniture really.

00:12:36.050 --> 00:12:39.390
You semi expected to go up Cairngorm
in summer and have a chance of

00:12:39.390 --> 00:12:43.570
seeing dotterel and of course now
that's, that, that's not the case.

00:12:43.912 --> 00:12:44.322
Yeah.

00:12:44.372 --> 00:12:46.232
So were they, how close
were they to the path?

00:12:46.272 --> 00:12:49.432
Were you, like, scoping them miles away,
or did you just kind of blunder upon them?

00:12:49.432 --> 00:12:49.472
What, how was it?

00:12:49.726 --> 00:12:51.006
We just chanced upon them really.

00:12:51.006 --> 00:12:53.916
It wasn't too far from the cafe
at the top of the ski lift.

00:12:54.396 --> 00:12:55.796
Yeah really quite close by.

00:12:55.816 --> 00:12:57.886
We were just walking around
looking for ptarmigan, as you do.

00:12:58.556 --> 00:13:00.836
And yeah, just found this male
with two, two fluffy chicks

00:13:01.638 --> 00:13:03.518
Oh, that's… Yeah, you
might never see that again.

00:13:03.518 --> 00:13:04.868
I might never see that now.

00:13:05.568 --> 00:13:06.188
That's amazing.

00:13:06.336 --> 00:13:07.006
to think, isn't it?

00:13:08.018 --> 00:13:09.412
Yeah., How about on passage?

00:13:09.412 --> 00:13:11.702
How about at, at, at
Trowsley, places like that?

00:13:11.712 --> 00:13:12.552
Have you seen them there?

00:13:12.963 --> 00:13:15.403
I was going to say that, that was
what I was going to get onto really.

00:13:15.645 --> 00:13:19.745
w-we as birders further south can see
what's happening really in terms of the

00:13:19.745 --> 00:13:21.445
numbers that we're seeing on passage.

00:13:21.645 --> 00:13:24.545
I think that's the distinctive
thing from my perspective.

00:13:24.545 --> 00:13:27.915
I rarely get to Scotland in the summer,
so it's not something I see firsthand.

00:13:27.925 --> 00:13:32.315
But what I can relate to is the
decline of northbound passage

00:13:32.315 --> 00:13:34.005
birds in late April and May.

00:13:34.405 --> 00:13:38.715
I think about it used to be a pretty,
pretty much an annual bird around here.

00:13:38.715 --> 00:13:42.205
There were regular tripping sites both
east of Peterborough and actually even

00:13:42.205 --> 00:13:43.825
closer to where I live near Deeping.

00:13:43.875 --> 00:13:47.375
They'd be there most years, but
been assigned to the history

00:13:47.375 --> 00:13:49.685
books really recent years.

00:13:50.261 --> 00:13:50.571
Yeah.

00:13:50.581 --> 00:13:53.401
Well, there used to be pubs n- well,
I suppose there are now pubs that

00:13:53.461 --> 00:13:56.831
are, are named after them from back
in the day when they were, you know,

00:13:57.061 --> 00:14:00.601
as you say, just part of the landscape
in spring and, and hunted even.

00:14:00.601 --> 00:14:03.871
They were quite a, a commonly hunted
bird, weren't they, on migration, which

00:14:04.281 --> 00:14:05.911
shows they must've been so much commoner.

00:14:06.101 --> 00:14:09.111
But I don't think they've even been
at, at Choseley drying barns, which was

00:14:09.111 --> 00:14:14.161
always like the most famous stop-off
point in my mind for them since 2023

00:14:15.039 --> 00:14:16.122
That, that's amazing in itself.

00:14:16.122 --> 00:14:18.312
But as you say, there were some really
big flocks there, and that doesn't even

00:14:18.432 --> 00:14:20.982
seem like too long ago, does it really?

00:14:21.256 --> 00:14:25.716
further back than that, I think about
sites when I was growing up and really

00:14:25.716 --> 00:14:29.296
keen on twitching and whatnot, and
places such as Tettney Marshes in

00:14:29.296 --> 00:14:33.526
Lincolnshire would often get them,
various places in the Cambridgeshire Fens.

00:14:33.526 --> 00:14:37.096
Pendle Hill in Lancashire, that's
another place that, almo- always would

00:14:37.106 --> 00:14:40.426
have dotterel in April and early May,

00:14:40.530 --> 00:14:40.940
Hmm

00:14:40.956 --> 00:14:41.816
year without fail.

00:14:41.816 --> 00:14:43.906
And it just it doesn't
seem to get them anymore.

00:14:44.008 --> 00:14:45.878
Yeah, I don't remember
that coming up recently.

00:14:46.048 --> 00:14:46.108
No

00:14:46.326 --> 00:14:46.506
No.

00:14:46.586 --> 00:14:49.326
And I think there have been local
issues there such as increased

00:14:49.326 --> 00:14:53.456
disturbance, which is similar to what
you mentioned on, on breeding grounds.

00:14:53.506 --> 00:14:55.856
But nonetheless, you'd expect
birds to be turning up there

00:14:55.856 --> 00:14:58.456
even if briefly, and doesn't be-
it doesn't seem to be the case.

00:14:58.456 --> 00:15:03.826
And yeah, th-th-this kind of overall
drying up of records on passage

00:15:04.336 --> 00:15:07.396
really does indicate, doesn't it,
that something's not right there.

00:15:07.616 --> 00:15:11.046
Yeah, I the the numbers of dotterel
being reported on BirdGuides have

00:15:11.046 --> 00:15:13.916
plummeted over the last 10 to 15 years.

00:15:13.976 --> 00:15:16.752
It was a- actually on BirdGuides, it
was… I checked this back before the pod.

00:15:16.752 --> 00:15:21.562
It was the 1st of January 2022 when
we upgraded dotterel to scarce on

00:15:21.562 --> 00:15:23.632
the BirdGuides sighting service.

00:15:23.912 --> 00:15:27.532
Previous to that, it had been on
there as local, which, is a status

00:15:27.532 --> 00:15:31.452
afforded to birds like long-tailed
duck and wood sandpiper, which

00:15:31.452 --> 00:15:32.702
seems scarcely believable now.

00:15:33.282 --> 00:15:37.672
Oh yeah, I always think scarce is like
the level where you would cross multiple

00:15:37.682 --> 00:15:41.492
counties to go and see that bird because
it, it's suitably rare, and, and dotterel

00:15:41.952 --> 00:15:43.992
firmly is in that bracket, isn't it now?

00:15:45.082 --> 00:15:46.202
It is, yeah, it is.

00:15:46.242 --> 00:15:50.232
And even in autumn as well, you get
the odd record, wouldn't you, birds

00:15:50.242 --> 00:15:55.152
roosting on beaches, often very incr-
of incredibly tame juveniles in little

00:15:55.152 --> 00:15:59.562
groups at coastal locations, and sort of
records seem to have dried up as well.

00:16:00.252 --> 00:16:01.312
It's just sad to be losing.

00:16:01.312 --> 00:16:02.502
It's such a unique bird.

00:16:02.562 --> 00:16:06.622
You know, not only the landscape
it lives in up in the uplands,

00:16:06.622 --> 00:16:09.312
but also so-called role reversal.

00:16:09.732 --> 00:16:16.792
A term maybe, y- you know, derived from
our human-centric ideas of what nature is.

00:16:16.792 --> 00:16:20.272
But, you know, where the, the males
take principal responsibility for

00:16:20.272 --> 00:16:24.132
incubation and, and chick rearing,
and the, the females being the, the

00:16:24.142 --> 00:16:26.042
bright, colorful one for a change.

00:16:26.746 --> 00:16:27.646
Yeah, absolutely

00:16:27.992 --> 00:16:28.532
yeah.

00:16:28.552 --> 00:16:31.562
So it's just sorry to think that
we might not be seeing so many

00:16:32.169 --> 00:16:35.639
So I think dotterel's a really
interesting one from a kind of

00:16:36.479 --> 00:16:38.429
birder's perspective on migration.

00:16:39.489 --> 00:16:43.509
and I think it's one of these
species that easily of slips

00:16:43.509 --> 00:16:45.179
into a negative feedback cycle.

00:16:45.179 --> 00:16:49.259
And by that I mean we know that
they're becoming less reliable

00:16:49.529 --> 00:16:53.149
on their spring staging grounds,
traditional tripping grounds, whether

00:16:53.149 --> 00:16:57.279
that be the Cambridgeshire Fens
or East Coast or wherever it might

00:16:57.279 --> 00:16:58.849
be, a Lancashire hill, for example.

00:16:59.660 --> 00:17:02.316
But the thing is, if they're
becoming less reliable there's less

00:17:02.316 --> 00:17:04.246
people who are gonna go and make
the effort to go and look for them.

00:17:04.656 --> 00:17:07.016
Often looking for dotterel
involves quite a lot of effort.

00:17:07.646 --> 00:17:10.266
Around me it's looking in brown fields.

00:17:10.466 --> 00:17:15.056
In the spring there can be hundreds of
brown fields to look through, and if

00:17:15.056 --> 00:17:18.536
you think that the chance of finding a
dotterel is something like one percent

00:17:18.536 --> 00:17:22.486
or even less than that, as opposed to,
say, ten, twenty percent as it might

00:17:22.486 --> 00:17:26.676
have been a few decades ago, you're less
inclined to spend the time doing it.

00:17:26.746 --> 00:17:30.496
And the same goes for hiking up a, a
hill in North Yorkshire or Lancashire.

00:17:30.966 --> 00:17:35.346
If there's-- If it's less likely there's
gonna be birds there, you're perhaps

00:17:35.346 --> 00:17:36.466
not gonna push yourself to do it.

00:17:36.506 --> 00:17:39.656
And therefore, as a result, I think
potentially, even though they clearly

00:17:39.656 --> 00:17:45.676
are becoming less and less regular, I--
without doubt, I do think there is an

00:17:45.686 --> 00:17:49.656
element that they're probably getting
missed as well because people just

00:17:49.656 --> 00:17:51.086
aren't looking for them in some places

00:17:51.246 --> 00:17:52.836
Yeah, that makes sense.

00:17:53.196 --> 00:17:57.276
I mean there's not too much overlap
with other species in terms of the

00:17:57.276 --> 00:18:00.376
time and the habitat into other
things that people would be looking

00:18:00.376 --> 00:18:02.856
for where dotterel are gonna turn up.

00:18:03.416 --> 00:18:07.926
So you know, people probably aren't
going to Trowsey Drying Barns in May

00:18:07.966 --> 00:18:12.916
like they used to because as you say,
there's been a bit of a, a, a gap in the

00:18:12.916 --> 00:18:16.436
number of dotterel sightings, and it's
gonna become a bit of a self-fulfilling

00:18:16.756 --> 00:18:17.586
thing, isn't it, in the end?

00:18:17.948 --> 00:18:18.548
Yeah, totally.

00:18:18.548 --> 00:18:21.458
And I think f- from my perspective
around here, we always knew that they

00:18:21.468 --> 00:18:26.498
would be in, a couple of selections of
fields in various places on the fens,

00:18:26.498 --> 00:18:30.148
and it was like you just find the brown
fields in those areas, and somewhere

00:18:30.178 --> 00:18:33.208
between about the 20th of April and
the 15th of May, there'll be some

00:18:33.208 --> 00:18:34.958
dotterel there probably for a few days.

00:18:35.828 --> 00:18:38.578
But that just doesn't happen anymore,
so you're back to square one, and

00:18:38.578 --> 00:18:42.158
if the birds aren't using these
traditional tripping grounds, they

00:18:42.158 --> 00:18:46.378
could therefore just be anywhere,
the scale of the, the scale of the

00:18:46.378 --> 00:18:48.358
challenge becomes all the more difficult,

00:18:48.428 --> 00:18:48.658
yeah.

00:18:48.658 --> 00:18:52.418
So was it, was it pea fields, your
local ones when they turned up before?

00:18:52.518 --> 00:18:54.058
'Cause that, that was always
what they liked, wasn't it?

00:18:54.058 --> 00:18:54.728
Pea fields

00:18:54.756 --> 00:18:57.666
P- pea fields, also just
bro-- any brown fields really.

00:18:57.786 --> 00:19:01.906
Often pea fields, and they often
seem to like the blacker soil,

00:19:01.966 --> 00:19:03.456
kinda like the more peaty soil.

00:19:04.036 --> 00:19:08.106
So most of the traditional spots around
here have been on that darker soil rather

00:19:08.106 --> 00:19:09.576
than the kind of paler sandy stuff.

00:19:09.806 --> 00:19:11.116
Again, what that means, I don't know.

00:19:11.116 --> 00:19:13.596
It's perhaps something to do with
feeding opportunities, I guess

00:19:14.126 --> 00:19:16.996
Yeah, I wonder if they're looking out
for that while they're flying over,

00:19:17.026 --> 00:19:20.176
seeing that dark color and, and thinking,
"Right, that looks good. Let's drop in."

00:19:20.881 --> 00:19:21.451
Yeah, exactly.

00:19:21.451 --> 00:19:24.201
I mean, There was that flock in
Cambridgeshire this spring, wasn't there?

00:19:24.231 --> 00:19:25.631
Near, I think it was Gamblingey.

00:19:26.041 --> 00:19:30.371
And there was a trip of birds
there for about a couple of

00:19:30.371 --> 00:19:31.981
weeks on and off, I think.

00:19:31.981 --> 00:19:35.241
And that, as far as I know,
at least not in recent years,

00:19:35.241 --> 00:19:36.511
has not been a site for them.

00:19:36.561 --> 00:19:41.791
It was just by chance that Mark
Thomas, of the RSPB bumped into them.

00:19:41.911 --> 00:19:45.621
And, how often is that kind of situation
playing out across the country where

00:19:45.721 --> 00:19:48.921
birds are stopping off in random
locations and birders just aren't looking?

00:19:49.811 --> 00:19:51.471
so yeah, food for thought anyway

00:19:51.779 --> 00:19:54.699
Yeah, it would've been really
interesting, you know, if a sort of

00:19:54.699 --> 00:20:02.149
nocmig revolution came along sort of say
15 years earlier, maybe before the sort

00:20:02.149 --> 00:20:04.859
of latest part of the decline curve.

00:20:05.389 --> 00:20:09.269
And, and if we could compare that
data to today, see if nocturnal

00:20:09.269 --> 00:20:10.649
migrants had, had dropped off.

00:20:10.649 --> 00:20:13.239
Obviously, it wasn't really in
vogue back then, but it just

00:20:13.249 --> 00:20:16.129
occurred to me that would've been
a, an interesting comparison.

00:20:16.791 --> 00:20:17.641
Yeah, for sure.

00:20:18.054 --> 00:20:21.094
I do think there's probably
mileage in them actually being

00:20:21.094 --> 00:20:23.124
easier in the autumn these days.

00:20:23.394 --> 00:20:24.534
Certainly around me anyway.

00:20:24.584 --> 00:20:29.644
We have lots of golden plover flocks
in October, November, and, you do get

00:20:29.654 --> 00:20:30.884
the occasional dotterel in with them.

00:20:30.884 --> 00:20:35.384
It's-- Weirdly, it's gone from being that
kind of iconic bird of spring that you'd

00:20:35.384 --> 00:20:39.704
go out and look for to being more of a,
a mid to late autumn bird around here.

00:20:40.074 --> 00:20:41.574
So again, that's something to think about

00:20:41.978 --> 00:20:45.948
Yeah, and not unknown among winter
flocks of, of European golden plover

00:20:46.574 --> 00:20:47.224
Yeah, that's true.

00:20:47.224 --> 00:20:47.504
Yeah.

00:20:47.554 --> 00:20:49.274
There have been one or two
that have wintered in my area

00:20:49.918 --> 00:20:50.398
Yeah.

00:20:50.668 --> 00:20:53.458
So they're, they're on the
UK Red List quite firmly now.

00:20:53.818 --> 00:20:59.978
Internationally, least concern, but
the, the regional IUCN Red Lists you

00:20:59.978 --> 00:21:01.828
know, they are on that for the UK too.

00:21:02.538 --> 00:21:05.068
So yeah, it, it is, it's not looking good.

00:21:05.508 --> 00:21:08.588
No, it's a really interesting species
though, as we've touched on both in

00:21:08.588 --> 00:21:11.198
terms of the role reversal when it
comes to raising the young, but also

00:21:11.198 --> 00:21:16.278
in terms of their kind of connectivity
and where these birds actually breed

00:21:17.314 --> 00:21:21.304
Oh yeah, 'cause I think both males
and females have been known and

00:21:21.304 --> 00:21:25.164
shown in the same breeding season to
move between you know, Britain and

00:21:25.174 --> 00:21:27.284
Scandinavia, I think Norway specifically.

00:21:28.044 --> 00:21:32.804
So yeah, they'll… Like, a female will
mate with a male in Scotland, leave him to

00:21:32.804 --> 00:21:37.514
deal with the young, and then fly across
the North Sea and, and find some new fella

00:21:37.846 --> 00:21:38.316
Amazing.

00:21:38.690 --> 00:21:39.050
Yeah

00:21:39.436 --> 00:21:42.342
Dotterel, a clear loser of climate change.

00:21:42.762 --> 00:21:47.012
Of that there is no doubt,
and the British population now

00:21:47.192 --> 00:21:49.022
in a rather bleak situation.

00:21:49.702 --> 00:21:51.829
We're gonna take a short break   but
after we'll be back and we'll

00:21:51.829 --> 00:21:55.579
be talking about some of the
winners of recent climate change

00:22:00.397 --> 00:22:02.377
Welcome back to the Bird Guides Podcast.

00:22:03.237 --> 00:22:05.837
the second part of today's pod, we'll
be looking at some of the other key

00:22:05.837 --> 00:22:10.417
news stories that have been emerging
over recent weeks, one of these was

00:22:10.437 --> 00:22:12.707
the Heathland Bird Survey results.

00:22:12.797 --> 00:22:15.987
That's the the survey that
took place last year, 2025.

00:22:16.607 --> 00:22:20.927
And in particular, it focused on three
species that are doing really rather well

00:22:21.165 --> 00:22:21.965
Nice to have some happier news

00:22:22.308 --> 00:22:23.428
Yeah, absolutely.

00:22:23.468 --> 00:22:30.478
And the three species in question are
woodlark, warbler, and European nightjar.

00:22:31.078 --> 00:22:34.848
And all three species have shown
increases in their numbers.

00:22:36.248 --> 00:22:43.398
woodlark, it's 29%, nightjar is
20%, and Dartford warbler 27%.

00:22:44.588 --> 00:22:48.588
So all across the board, some good news
for these species which have at times

00:22:48.588 --> 00:22:52.798
been looking really rather precarious
in their status and plight in the UK

00:22:53.986 --> 00:22:54.146
Yeah.

00:22:54.156 --> 00:22:56.246
Have you been seeing more
of those species near you?

00:22:57.229 --> 00:23:00.359
Not really myself because I don't really
have any heathland habitat, to be honest.

00:23:00.459 --> 00:23:03.399
It's not really… they're not
really birds that are on my

00:23:03.399 --> 00:23:04.999
radar, you know, every year.

00:23:04.999 --> 00:23:08.199
If… We have had records of all
three, but it, the, they're all very

00:23:08.199 --> 00:23:12.099
much, as it stands anyway, they're
all very much vagrants to our areas.

00:23:12.099 --> 00:23:14.159
But you probably got a few
more heaths your way, Dave.

00:23:14.835 --> 00:23:15.405
Yeah.

00:23:15.455 --> 00:23:17.925
I certainly did when I was in West Sussex.

00:23:17.925 --> 00:23:20.645
I could easily nip up the road and
see those, those three species.

00:23:20.645 --> 00:23:21.565
I'm a bit further away.

00:23:21.565 --> 00:23:25.665
I'm about an hour's drive from that
kind of habitat here, but a nice

00:23:25.665 --> 00:23:27.295
run up the road to Ashdown Forest.

00:23:27.295 --> 00:23:30.795
You can fill your boots with Dartford
warblers, woodlarks, nightjars.

00:23:30.845 --> 00:23:32.625
They're all fairly tough birds.

00:23:32.625 --> 00:23:35.540
Well, apart from Dartford warbler the
woodlark and Dartford w- sorry, woodlark

00:23:35.540 --> 00:23:39.695
and nightjar are quite tough birds in my
sort of local listing area of Hastings

00:23:39.695 --> 00:23:43.245
and Rother 'cause l- we don't have any
heaths in, in that district either.

00:23:43.815 --> 00:23:47.685
But we do have breeding Dartford warblers
on some of the clifftops around here,

00:23:48.195 --> 00:23:53.515
and that just feels like a bit of, you
know, happy overspill from that really

00:23:53.515 --> 00:23:58.305
burgeoning and thriving really heathland
heathland population further inland.

00:23:58.835 --> 00:24:02.635
So yeah, really good to see, and they're
all just quality birds, aren't they?

00:24:02.675 --> 00:24:06.385
All really good vocalizations,
really charismatic animals

00:24:06.884 --> 00:24:07.394
Yeah, definitely.

00:24:07.394 --> 00:24:14.484
I, I-- my kind of experience with, with
all three really is when I go on holiday

00:24:14.484 --> 00:24:16.104
to Norfolk, to be honest, in the summer

00:24:16.244 --> 00:24:21.944
and, or in the spring, and whether it's
singing woodlarks or going at dusk to

00:24:21.944 --> 00:24:27.134
listen to churring nightjars, or just
listening to Dartford warblers scratching

00:24:27.134 --> 00:24:31.834
away on a warm sunny morning feels like
a bird associated with holidays for me.

00:24:31.964 --> 00:24:33.774
So I'm not lucky to have
them on my doorstep.

00:24:34.254 --> 00:24:36.964
But yeah, we do get the odd
one or two in, in our area.

00:24:37.364 --> 00:24:39.934
We-- for example, we did have a
woodlark this winter which spent

00:24:39.934 --> 00:24:42.804
the winter in a, a skylark flock
on the outskirts of Peterborough.

00:24:42.988 --> 00:24:43.378
Oh, cool

00:24:43.494 --> 00:24:46.984
S- yeah, so may- maybe that is
an indication that, these things

00:24:46.984 --> 00:24:49.144
are on the up and we should be
looking out for them a bit more.

00:24:49.164 --> 00:24:49.374
But

00:24:49.568 --> 00:24:49.848
Yeah

00:24:49.904 --> 00:24:53.134
of, one of the things about
the census we're not just the

00:24:53.864 --> 00:24:57.874
increase in the numbers, but also
the the growth in distribution

00:24:57.966 --> 00:24:57.976
嗯。

00:24:58.034 --> 00:24:58.724
Of each of them.

00:24:58.724 --> 00:25:02.504
For example, we're now seeing,
aren't we, that are being found more

00:25:02.504 --> 00:25:03.894
and more in Scotland, for example

00:25:04.230 --> 00:25:04.460
Yeah.

00:25:04.460 --> 00:25:07.310
And there's a Dartford warbler in,
is it North Yorkshire at the moment?

00:25:07.674 --> 00:25:08.834
Yeah, just north of Nork.

00:25:09.120 --> 00:25:09.540
Yeah.

00:25:10.514 --> 00:25:11.944
So just north of York

00:25:12.050 --> 00:25:12.750
Yeah, yeah.

00:25:12.760 --> 00:25:14.230
Which is really quite an outlier.

00:25:14.280 --> 00:25:17.460
And yeah, but fast-forward I
don't know, five, 10 years,

00:25:17.460 --> 00:25:18.560
maybe they could be breeding.

00:25:18.610 --> 00:25:21.330
It's probably a bit of a stretch, but they
could be- certainly be breeding closer

00:25:21.330 --> 00:25:23.280
to that kind of part, part of Britain

00:25:24.046 --> 00:25:24.346
Yeah.

00:25:24.396 --> 00:25:27.686
It feels like it's gonna just depend
on winter weather, doesn't it, really?

00:25:27.686 --> 00:25:31.006
That seems to be the key that,
that seems to be the key takeaway.

00:25:31.276 --> 00:25:34.936
I did-- back in my university
days, I did a, a study on Dartford

00:25:34.936 --> 00:25:37.626
warblers for my dissertation,

00:25:37.932 --> 00:25:38.022
Oh,

00:25:38.022 --> 00:25:38.242
right.

00:25:38.252 --> 00:25:38.562
Didn't know that

00:25:38.936 --> 00:25:42.526
yeah, doing species climate modeling
on Dartford warbler and projecting

00:25:42.546 --> 00:25:45.036
potential range into the future.

00:25:45.156 --> 00:25:46.726
That's going back 15 or so years

00:25:46.830 --> 00:25:48.670
So what did your crystal
ball tell you there?

00:25:49.568 --> 00:25:52.768
Pretty, pretty much what we're seeing
really that it was gonna be a case of,

00:25:52.828 --> 00:25:57.388
bar any kind of extreme weather, we're
gonna see a, a gradual increase further

00:25:57.388 --> 00:25:59.648
north in these specie- in the species.

00:26:01.508 --> 00:26:04.208
but yeah, we have h- obviously
had a couple of cold winters since

00:26:04.208 --> 00:26:05.828
then that have set them back a bit.

00:26:05.828 --> 00:26:09.038
I know that they are… Dartford
warbler is one of those species, isn't

00:26:09.038 --> 00:26:12.888
it, that seems to make advances and
then get knocked back periodically?

00:26:13.056 --> 00:26:17.356
Yeah, 'cause they were knocked back in--
After the winter of '62, '63, they were

00:26:17.356 --> 00:26:22.476
actually down to 11 pairs in Britain, so
like on the verge of national extinction.

00:26:22.956 --> 00:26:27.856
But when you've got 4,100 territories,
which i-is, is the estimate from

00:26:27.856 --> 00:26:32.586
the latest survey, you-- there,
there's surely a much lower risk,

00:26:32.586 --> 00:26:37.046
e-especially when those harsh winters
are so much less frequent now.

00:26:38.224 --> 00:26:39.204
I think that's the thing, isn't it?

00:26:39.254 --> 00:26:41.544
Often do we get extended
freeze-ups these days?

00:26:41.684 --> 00:26:43.364
Very scarcely if at all.

00:26:43.414 --> 00:26:45.994
It just feels like a very
unusual event now for any sort

00:26:45.994 --> 00:26:46.944
of cold weather, doesn't it?

00:26:46.984 --> 00:26:51.504
It feels like round here it's so rare
to see the lakes freezing up these days,

00:26:51.624 --> 00:26:53.064
and if they do, it's not for very long.

00:26:54.108 --> 00:26:54.468
Yeah.

00:26:54.468 --> 00:26:57.738
So I think, I think they're pretty safe
for the, for the time being, aren't they?

00:26:58.338 --> 00:27:00.668
But yeah, it's just
brilliant to, to see them.

00:27:00.668 --> 00:27:04.448
But it's, it's easy to forget that
heathland habitat wasn't always there for

00:27:04.448 --> 00:27:10.068
these birds when traditional management,
you know, all the sort of common land and,

00:27:10.448 --> 00:27:15.658
and grazing practices kind of fizzled out
in the, like, 18- 17th, 18th centuries.

00:27:16.118 --> 00:27:17.808
Heathland became much more fragmented.

00:27:17.808 --> 00:27:21.748
Forestry didn't help going forward from
there, and these birds just weren't

00:27:21.758 --> 00:27:23.528
left with, with the places to live

00:27:25.158 --> 00:27:25.768
Yeah, indeed.

00:27:25.788 --> 00:27:28.968
Although it does seem that
forestry, active forestry is

00:27:29.018 --> 00:27:30.698
particularly useful for nightjar.

00:27:30.708 --> 00:27:32.268
It's kind of a, an in…

00:27:33.206 --> 00:27:34.146
Oh, sorry.

00:27:34.186 --> 00:27:35.896
My dog's just barking at the postman.

00:27:36.198 --> 00:27:36.798
got an intruder

00:27:37.216 --> 00:27:38.426
Yeah, don't worry.

00:27:38.616 --> 00:27:39.276
She'll pipe down.

00:27:39.976 --> 00:27:40.236
Yeah

00:27:40.778 --> 00:27:43.408
Yeah, no, as I was saying, I think
it's i-in the case of nightjar, for

00:27:43.408 --> 00:27:48.688
example, it's quite a, intermittent
bird in the Midlands, pa- in part

00:27:48.688 --> 00:27:49.978
because of habitat availability.

00:27:49.978 --> 00:27:54.178
But where they do seem to crop up is
at these kind of forestry plantations

00:27:54.178 --> 00:27:58.438
where for, for a few years perhaps
there's some suitable habitat, and

00:27:58.438 --> 00:28:00.968
they might move in for a little
while and then disappear again.

00:28:01.378 --> 00:28:04.348
It-- for that reason, it's, it's not
a bird I've seen in my local area,

00:28:05.278 --> 00:28:08.298
although there-- annoyingly there
was one suppressed in 2024 which

00:28:08.298 --> 00:28:11.578
was there for a few days just in
a kind of area of rough ground not

00:28:11.588 --> 00:28:12.808
any heathland or anything like that.

00:28:12.858 --> 00:28:15.208
It was just… I guess it
was just a post-breeding bird

00:28:15.208 --> 00:28:16.088
at the end of the season.

00:28:17.078 --> 00:28:21.738
but it, but yeah, it's a bird that I feel
like maybe with a bit of luck one summer

00:28:21.738 --> 00:28:25.388
I might get one chirring, in one of the,
in one of the local forestry plantations

00:28:25.388 --> 00:28:26.878
o- in the sort of west of my area.

00:28:27.226 --> 00:28:27.566
Yeah.

00:28:27.706 --> 00:28:30.496
That, well, I've, I've know a couple of
sites that you certainly wouldn't describe

00:28:30.496 --> 00:28:35.386
as heathland in, in Kent and Sussex where,
you know, the foresters have gone in,

00:28:35.776 --> 00:28:39.406
cleared a whole area, and nightjars, like
you say, have moved in for a short while.

00:28:39.416 --> 00:28:41.776
You have to make the most of it
while they are there, 'cause they're,

00:28:41.886 --> 00:28:45.366
they're just on the lookout for that
quite transient successional habitat.

00:28:45.926 --> 00:28:49.856
And once it becomes closed up
enough, they, they just move on

00:28:50.236 --> 00:28:50.906
Yeah.

00:28:50.906 --> 00:28:53.736
Dartford warbler is a little
bit of a trickier one for me.

00:28:53.766 --> 00:28:57.316
A nightjar tricky enough, but
Dartford warbler could be anywhere.

00:28:57.316 --> 00:28:57.976
That's the thing.

00:28:57.976 --> 00:29:01.036
It's-- we obviously don't have any
suitable breeding habitat around here,

00:29:01.036 --> 00:29:04.636
but i-i-it's one of those birds that at
some point you're just gonna look out

00:29:04.636 --> 00:29:08.206
on one in winter perhaps following s-
following a pair of stonechats around in

00:29:08.206 --> 00:29:09.586
some rough ground or something like that

00:29:10.386 --> 00:29:13.206
Yeah, they do like to move to the
sort of lower and more coastal

00:29:13.206 --> 00:29:14.346
areas in winter, don't they?

00:29:14.996 --> 00:29:17.636
Even, even though the winters aren't
as harsh as they used to be, they

00:29:17.636 --> 00:29:21.676
still seem to, to prefer that security
of that slightly warmer temperature

00:29:21.950 --> 00:29:25.660
Yeah, it's can be quite unforgiving on
the fens in winter, that's for sure.

00:29:25.660 --> 00:29:29.470
Though there have been a couple
of records, both in the Nene

00:29:29.470 --> 00:29:31.620
washes area over the years.

00:29:31.620 --> 00:29:32.810
So yeah I live in hope

00:29:33.248 --> 00:29:33.578
Yeah.

00:29:33.698 --> 00:29:37.618
But you know, one little figure I dug out
while I was reading up on these is that

00:29:38.018 --> 00:29:41.928
ac- people reckon that there's gonna be
more than 60% of the Dartford warbler's

00:29:41.928 --> 00:29:46.668
range in Europe as a whole is predicted
to be unsuitable later this century.

00:29:47.348 --> 00:29:52.078
So yeah, not all a rosy picture, and
that shows that it's actually a, a

00:29:52.078 --> 00:29:56.698
really good thing that we are able
to, to host so many of them here now.

00:29:56.698 --> 00:30:00.218
This, this really growing population
that, that might be a really good and

00:30:00.218 --> 00:30:04.548
important part of the world population of
Dartford warbler going forward if, if I

00:30:04.548 --> 00:30:08.758
guess because of aridification and maybe
more wildfires in Southern Europe, it's,

00:30:09.178 --> 00:30:11.358
it's just not gonna fit them so well.

00:30:12.168 --> 00:30:14.268
Yeah, certainly silver linings
and all that, isn't it?

00:30:14.268 --> 00:30:14.918
That's the thing.

00:30:14.918 --> 00:30:20.198
O-one of the things that I remember
concluding in my dissertation was just how

00:30:20.198 --> 00:30:21.938
much available habitat there is in Britain

00:30:22.388 --> 00:30:24.448
should the climate allow them to be here.

00:30:24.598 --> 00:30:27.298
You think about all the upland
heathland that's there that could

00:30:27.298 --> 00:30:32.498
potentially be colonized should it
prove to become a bit more habitable

00:30:32.558 --> 00:30:33.868
for Dartford warblers in the future.

00:30:34.028 --> 00:30:37.558
So yeah, it'll be interesting to
see what happens, although say

00:30:37.558 --> 00:30:41.678
interesting, it's slightly disconcerting
that the reasons underlining why

00:30:41.678 --> 00:30:42.808
these birds are moving, of course.

00:30:43.310 --> 00:30:43.700
Yeah.

00:30:43.730 --> 00:30:47.230
Although I think you can attrib-
attribute it in, in quite a large part

00:30:47.230 --> 00:30:51.340
to the positive thing of, of habitat
management by, you know, the likes of

00:30:51.340 --> 00:30:56.610
the RSPB, the Wildlife Trusts creating
the optimal habitat for these birds.

00:30:56.870 --> 00:31:00.760
I think that is, is a big thing to
thank for, for these positive trends.

00:31:01.176 --> 00:31:01.876
Yeah, totally.

00:31:01.946 --> 00:31:03.846
I think that's absolutely
fair to point out.

00:31:04.696 --> 00:31:08.151
But yeah, a- another kind of
heathland bird i- in some areas,

00:31:08.151 --> 00:31:09.661
of course, is common redstart.

00:31:09.821 --> 00:31:14.781
And while that's not really a, a climate
change related species in terms of

00:31:14.781 --> 00:31:19.121
its range and whatnot, it has cropped
up on the Bird Guide's website in

00:31:19.121 --> 00:31:23.151
the last couple of weeks following a
fascinating discovery in South Wales

00:31:24.047 --> 00:31:28.477
Yeah, Dante Shepherd found a, a
hybrid while he was on a family walk

00:31:28.487 --> 00:31:30.637
in a quarry in, in, in South Wales.

00:31:31.367 --> 00:31:33.507
Yeah, which is, is really
an extraordinary find

00:31:33.931 --> 00:31:37.571
Yeah, so this is a, a hybrid
Common times Black Redstart.

00:31:38.571 --> 00:31:40.071
very unusual find in Britain.

00:31:40.251 --> 00:31:42.721
Only a handful of
occurrences ever documented.

00:31:42.971 --> 00:31:46.831
And in fact, this is only the second
individual ever to have been photographed

00:31:46.831 --> 00:31:50.681
in Britain following the first, which
wasn't all that long ago, actually.

00:31:50.701 --> 00:31:52.861
The first was only in March 2025.

00:31:52.861 --> 00:31:57.471
It turned up in, in southern Cornwall
during an influx of Black Redstarts

00:31:57.611 --> 00:32:01.831
a classic early spring movement of
that species and a male hybrid was

00:32:01.831 --> 00:32:04.211
photographed down there on the lizard.

00:32:04.271 --> 00:32:06.631
But yeah, a very rare bird in Britain.

00:32:06.951 --> 00:32:10.981
But we do know that hybrids can and
do occur regularly on the continent,

00:32:11.011 --> 00:32:12.541
or reasonably regularly, I should say.

00:32:12.921 --> 00:32:16.651
And it's interesting that the
reason that is speculated for

00:32:16.651 --> 00:32:18.381
this is human intervention really.

00:32:18.381 --> 00:32:20.251
It's bringing the two species together

00:32:21.621 --> 00:32:22.071
Yeah.

00:32:22.111 --> 00:32:24.511
Like you say, it's, it's a
more common hybrid in Northern

00:32:24.511 --> 00:32:26.021
and, and Central Europe.

00:32:26.501 --> 00:32:29.831
But yeah, this, this situation where
you've got a quarry, you know, that rocky

00:32:29.831 --> 00:32:35.741
terrain that's more black redstart turf
right on the edge of prime woodland,

00:32:35.801 --> 00:32:39.901
like mature woodland for, for common
redstart, just brings these species

00:32:40.171 --> 00:32:43.131
i-into a meeting point that, that
just wouldn't have happened before.

00:32:44.745 --> 00:32:48.115
Yeah, I think it sounds like this,
this site that Danze had the bird

00:32:48.115 --> 00:32:51.685
at is a kind of established or
semi-established Black Redstart

00:32:51.725 --> 00:32:53.795
breeding site, or has been in the past.

00:32:54.165 --> 00:32:58.575
And of course then has Common Redstarts
breeding in the adjacent forest.

00:32:58.575 --> 00:33:02.675
So it brings these two species close
together and creates the conditions

00:33:02.675 --> 00:33:05.955
and of course, while there's nothing
to absolutely prove that this bird was

00:33:05.955 --> 00:33:12.349
born there, that it turned up in spring,
territory for several days suggests

00:33:12.349 --> 00:33:17.109
that it perhaps the area rather than it
being some really random coincidence.

00:33:17.531 --> 00:33:18.421
Yeah, yeah.

00:33:19.071 --> 00:33:20.781
Did you listen to recordings of it?

00:33:20.781 --> 00:33:22.111
It had a really interesting song

00:33:27.178 --> 00:33:27.758
Yeah, it did.

00:33:27.768 --> 00:33:29.178
It was quite curious, wasn't it?

00:33:30.038 --> 00:33:34.108
Yeah, I thought it, to my ear, it
actually sounded more like a, a common

00:33:34.108 --> 00:33:35.828
than a black redstart, I, I have to say.

00:33:35.828 --> 00:33:39.638
I think if I'd been walking the
area and not been analyzing it too

00:33:39.648 --> 00:33:42.338
hard, I might have just dismissed
it as, as a common redstart.

00:33:42.338 --> 00:33:46.288
It sort of had that almost
chaffinch-like opening and that kind

00:33:46.288 --> 00:33:49.948
of thoughtful trailing flourish at
the end, and I, I picked out quite

00:33:49.948 --> 00:33:51.508
a lot of mimicry in that as well.

00:33:52.208 --> 00:33:56.148
So that I, I've quite enjoyed listening to
the recording and trying to identify what

00:33:56.148 --> 00:33:58.398
species it seemed to be impersonating.

00:33:58.910 --> 00:34:01.510
Yeah, it's w- well worth having
a look at the article which is

00:34:01.510 --> 00:34:02.670
on the Bird Guide's website.

00:34:03.020 --> 00:34:05.410
It was published back on the 22nd of July.

00:34:06.240 --> 00:34:09.660
And Dante's done a really nice write-up
on the bird, the circumstances of the

00:34:09.660 --> 00:34:14.300
discovery his initial impressions of
the bird, both in terms of plumage,

00:34:14.300 --> 00:34:16.630
looks and vocalizations, as David says.

00:34:17.060 --> 00:34:20.400
And then also just talks through
in detail the identification

00:34:20.400 --> 00:34:24.350
of the bird and what led him to
believe it was a hybrid after all.

00:34:24.810 --> 00:34:27.620
As, as we've said, v- a really
unusual and interesting bird,

00:34:27.880 --> 00:34:29.700
certainly in a British perspective.

00:34:30.286 --> 00:34:34.046
Yeah, it was top field work I think there,
and well worth listening to recordings.

00:34:34.046 --> 00:34:37.366
It does… It, I say it sounds more
like a common redstart, but it does

00:34:37.376 --> 00:34:41.276
throw in that wonderful crackling
sound of black redstart now and then.

00:34:41.676 --> 00:34:44.616
And yeah, it's throwing in like
tree pipit, song thrush meadow

00:34:44.616 --> 00:34:46.466
pipit, great tit, chaffinch calls.

00:34:46.936 --> 00:34:49.976
Yeah, just, just love… You can get
a lot out of listening to a redstart.

00:34:51.152 --> 00:34:54.362
Yeah it's both species I don't really
hear enough of, to be honest, where

00:34:54.362 --> 00:34:56.032
I am in the lowland Eastern England.

00:34:56.032 --> 00:34:56.832
We just don't get them.

00:34:56.832 --> 00:35:00.272
We get common redstarts on passage
in spring and more often autumn.

00:35:00.612 --> 00:35:03.772
In fact, I had my first of the autumn just
a couple of days ago over the weekend.

00:35:03.782 --> 00:35:03.962
But

00:35:04.042 --> 00:35:04.382
Nice

00:35:04.492 --> 00:35:07.542
black redstart is a
rarity for me around here.

00:35:07.542 --> 00:35:10.532
They have a history of breeding
sporadically in Peterborough,

00:35:10.572 --> 00:35:14.082
but yeah, it's-- they're just not
species I see enough of, sadly

00:35:14.584 --> 00:35:17.094
Yeah, I think they must be
under-recorded as a, as a breeding bird.

00:35:17.464 --> 00:35:20.314
You know, I've been in areas where they
are breeding, and unless you're walking

00:35:20.314 --> 00:35:24.494
around a, usually a town, usually a very
urban area, unless you're getting up at

00:35:24.494 --> 00:35:29.324
3:00, 4:00 in the morning to hear that
song they're just gonna be very high

00:35:29.324 --> 00:35:33.784
on the rooftops and dropping in and out
of people's gardens, and just not very

00:35:33.784 --> 00:35:35.664
conspicuous for the rest of the day

00:35:36.361 --> 00:35:40.321
Yeah, I I made the mistake of going
into Peterborough at 4:30 in the morning

00:35:40.611 --> 00:35:44.711
on a Sunday m- on a Sunday morning
recently, which I was… it was quiet.

00:35:44.751 --> 00:35:48.271
I was anticipating it to be quiet,
but there were a few interesting

00:35:48.271 --> 00:35:51.441
sights and sounds, shall we say,
as I was wandering around the city

00:35:51.451 --> 00:35:53.121
center hoping to hear black redstarts.

00:35:53.281 --> 00:35:56.501
Failed on black redstarts, but
there were some late-night revelers

00:35:56.511 --> 00:35:58.821
still out and about enjoying
themselves, let's put it that way.

00:35:59.021 --> 00:36:00.561
Yeah, some cultural content.

00:36:01.521 --> 00:36:02.691
Yeah, quite indeed.

00:36:03.671 --> 00:36:04.021
Hmm.

00:36:05.531 --> 00:36:08.041
from that cultural content, let's move on.

00:36:08.151 --> 00:36:11.591
Have you seen the news about bearded
vulture in the Netherlands, Dave?

00:36:11.885 --> 00:36:15.715
Yeah, so if you're a keen Dutch
lister, you- it's now fair game.

00:36:15.715 --> 00:36:16.555
You can, you can tick it

00:36:17.165 --> 00:36:18.485
I thought that was really interesting.

00:36:18.505 --> 00:36:23.135
And yeah, in the context of the British
records that we've had over the last

00:36:23.135 --> 00:36:27.375
decade, some really fascinating news
and a really interesting revelation.

00:36:27.475 --> 00:36:31.555
Essentially what's happened is that the
Dutch Rarities Committee has said that

00:36:31.555 --> 00:36:38.865
it will accept all known wild-born or
wild-hatched birds, I should say, from

00:36:38.865 --> 00:36:43.185
the alpine population as wild, and they
will be accepted as naturally occurring.

00:36:43.335 --> 00:36:45.895
In other words and that's--
this is obviously the most

00:36:45.895 --> 00:36:48.795
important thing for birders in
many cases they're now tickable.

00:36:49.395 --> 00:36:54.665
So yeah an extensive review was conducted
by some Dutch ornithologists, of which--

00:36:54.675 --> 00:36:58.785
one of which was Hans Polman, who is a
name that many birders might recognize.

00:36:58.785 --> 00:37:04.615
He was heavily involved in determining the
origins and the story of the, the famous

00:37:04.615 --> 00:37:09.245
twenty-twenty British bird that, that
occurred between May and was it October?

00:37:09.591 --> 00:37:12.051
Yeah, when it left at Beachy
Head, it flew out to sea there.

00:37:12.171 --> 00:37:12.841
Did you see it there?

00:37:13.081 --> 00:37:16.061
No, I was just, I was on my way back
from city when that was going on.

00:37:16.545 --> 00:37:16.745
Ouch.

00:37:16.765 --> 00:37:17.355
Did you see it at all?

00:37:17.791 --> 00:37:21.321
Yeah, I got it at I think it was at that
place wonderfully called Cutthroat Bridge.

00:37:22.037 --> 00:37:23.057
Oh, yeah, up in, in the Peak

00:37:23.067 --> 00:37:23.397
District

00:37:23.881 --> 00:37:26.801
I didn't fancy the big hike with
a-- It sounded like there was a

00:37:26.801 --> 00:37:30.131
pretty treacherous hole that half
of Britain's birders fell into.

00:37:30.701 --> 00:37:30.991
Yeah.

00:37:32.071 --> 00:37:32.841
So I didn't fancy that.

00:37:32.841 --> 00:37:34.931
So f- when, when it came through
that you could just see it from

00:37:34.931 --> 00:37:36.871
a lay-by, I thought, "Yeah,
let's, let's get a bit of that."

00:37:37.221 --> 00:37:38.391
That sounds nice and easy

00:37:38.441 --> 00:37:38.901
Yeah.

00:37:39.081 --> 00:37:39.321
Yeah.

00:37:39.321 --> 00:37:40.711
It would've been nice to have
seen it in Sussex, though.

00:37:42.001 --> 00:37:43.041
Yeah, it was quite surreal.

00:37:43.071 --> 00:37:44.451
It actually turned up in
the Peterborough area.

00:37:44.461 --> 00:37:44.901
Did you know that?

00:37:45.363 --> 00:37:47.043
Oh, it's on just on a road, wasn't it?

00:37:47.063 --> 00:37:48.123
Or just blocking traffic?

00:37:48.245 --> 00:37:51.225
Yeah, have you seen that legendary photo
of it just s- sitting in the middle

00:37:51.225 --> 00:37:53.005
of the road with cars like queuing up

00:37:53.163 --> 00:37:53.973
That was amazing.

00:37:54.023 --> 00:37:54.193
Yeah

00:37:54.345 --> 00:37:55.245
Absolutely amazing.

00:37:55.245 --> 00:37:57.965
But yeah, to see that knocking
about in the Fens was something

00:37:58.135 --> 00:37:59.135
that I don't think I'll see again.

00:37:59.385 --> 00:38:01.405
I was actually in Ireland
for most of its stay there.

00:38:01.405 --> 00:38:03.315
I think it was around
a few days in the Fens.

00:38:03.705 --> 00:38:07.205
And yeah, I was actually on my
way back from Ireland and up

00:38:07.205 --> 00:38:09.255
with the bird on my last morning.

00:38:09.675 --> 00:38:14.075
Oh, sorry, its last morning when I got
back, and yeah just absolutely mad just

00:38:14.075 --> 00:38:18.745
driving down this Fenland road and f-
flat landscape for miles around, and

00:38:18.745 --> 00:38:22.735
then just literally flying straight over
my car, this massive bearded vulture.

00:38:23.415 --> 00:38:27.285
it was just a sight that'll Totally
surreal and f- will probably never

00:38:27.285 --> 00:38:28.825
happen again, but amazing bird.

00:38:28.825 --> 00:38:32.345
But this new Dutch criteria
that bird would be tickable.

00:38:32.889 --> 00:38:33.209
Yeah.

00:38:33.209 --> 00:38:33.849
So is it,

00:38:34.015 --> 00:38:34.625
born bird, wasn't it?

00:38:35.189 --> 00:38:36.999
so are, are they backdating it like that?

00:38:37.109 --> 00:38:40.369
Are they saying, you know, five years
ago if you saw one it, it counts?

00:38:40.707 --> 00:38:41.657
That I don't know.

00:38:41.777 --> 00:38:44.487
But it does beg questions about
what the BoU might do about them

00:38:44.849 --> 00:38:45.429
Yeah.

00:38:45.479 --> 00:38:49.419
I wonder yeah, I wonder if it won't
quite be quite such a, a expeditious

00:38:49.419 --> 00:38:52.419
decision, but it might be down the line

00:38:52.743 --> 00:38:57.210
no, of c- of course at the moment
birds like that sit on category

00:38:57.210 --> 00:39:00.420
E, which feels like a bit of
a disservice to me to a degree

00:39:00.726 --> 00:39:01.256
Hmm.

00:39:01.806 --> 00:39:04.526
Yeah, I mean, it feels like
if you're-- the only, the only

00:39:04.526 --> 00:39:06.956
other alternative… You've got
two choices really, haven't you?

00:39:06.956 --> 00:39:09.866
You've, you're either looking at a
population like that of a bird that's been

00:39:09.866 --> 00:39:13.096
reintroduced and thinking it, it's looking
like it's going in the right direction.

00:39:13.486 --> 00:39:14.666
They're breeding in the wild.

00:39:15.406 --> 00:39:16.556
Looks like a success.

00:39:16.946 --> 00:39:19.296
You know, let's enjoy them,
let's count them on a list.

00:39:19.306 --> 00:39:22.056
Or you say, we're gonna wait,
I don't know, what would it be?

00:39:22.056 --> 00:39:26.996
Ten, 20, could be 30 years
before y-you've really got a,

00:39:27.086 --> 00:39:30.826
a firmly long-term established
population of multiple generations.

00:39:31.316 --> 00:39:31.776
And

00:39:31.882 --> 00:39:33.322
with long-lived birds like that, isn't it?

00:39:33.396 --> 00:39:34.006
yeah.

00:39:34.252 --> 00:39:34.482
ages

00:39:34.796 --> 00:39:39.746
And that's just not, certainly
not compatible with the game, so

00:39:39.816 --> 00:39:41.366
to speak, of birding, of listing.

00:39:41.436 --> 00:39:42.776
It, it's not gonna work.

00:39:42.776 --> 00:39:46.816
So I definitely favor this approach of
if it looks like it's going in the right

00:39:46.816 --> 00:39:52.176
direction, rubber stamp it, and then, you
know, if it turns out it was just a blip

00:39:52.176 --> 00:39:55.566
and, and it all, and they fizzle out and
the population doesn't do well, then you

00:39:55.566 --> 00:39:57.746
can always revise that at a later date

00:39:59.076 --> 00:40:00.336
Yeah I completely agree.

00:40:00.386 --> 00:40:03.346
I think it's it's something that
needs looking at and, while it

00:40:03.416 --> 00:40:06.419
perhaps doesn't need major  ch-
changes to how we treat these birds,

00:40:06.419 --> 00:40:09.179
it feels a bit of a disservice
lumping them in with things that have

00:40:09.179 --> 00:40:10.879
genuinely escaped from captivity.

00:40:11.137 --> 00:40:11.497
Mm-hmm.

00:40:11.837 --> 00:40:15.127
Yeah, and similar with-- I
wonder if it might somehow set

00:40:15.127 --> 00:40:17.977
a precedent for the white-tailed
eagles in, in England as well.

00:40:17.997 --> 00:40:22.447
You know, obviously we can go up to
Scotland and, and see longer established

00:40:22.447 --> 00:40:25.197
populations of, of reintroduced
white-tailed eagles up there.

00:40:25.197 --> 00:40:28.877
But we're having a similar situation
of the birds that we're seeing roaming

00:40:28.877 --> 00:40:31.747
around here in Sussex that, you know,
I know have, have roamed towards your

00:40:31.747 --> 00:40:35.467
way too, and people have seen them
from Cornwall up to northern England.

00:40:35.467 --> 00:40:39.927
And that population, do you wait, say,
decades or shall we just say, "Look,

00:40:39.967 --> 00:40:43.397
they're, they're breeding now, you
know, let's, let's call them category C

00:40:43.397 --> 00:40:44.967
and, and put them on our list as well"?

00:40:45.223 --> 00:40:45.603
Exactly.

00:40:45.603 --> 00:40:48.863
Per- perhaps it's a case of wild-born
birds, as the Dutch have done, it's

00:40:48.863 --> 00:40:51.863
just treating the wild-born birds
as the ones that are tickable rather

00:40:51.863 --> 00:40:53.683
than the, the introduced individuals.

00:40:53.833 --> 00:40:58.183
I was just, I was actually just looking
at this story about, about from 2020 about

00:40:58.273 --> 00:41:03.113
the the bearded vulture that toured the UK
that year, and its parents, so bear, bear

00:41:03.113 --> 00:41:08.843
in mind this was 2020, but the parents
of that bird released in 1988 and 199…

00:41:08.843 --> 00:41:11.253
'80, sorry, 1988 and 1989.

00:41:11.263 --> 00:41:14.193
So gives you a s- a sense of the scale
that we're dealing with here, and

00:41:14.273 --> 00:41:16.783
of course it's gonna be similar-ish
with white-tailed eagles, isn't it?

00:41:16.833 --> 00:41:20.473
How many of the birds up in Scotland
are direct releases from Norway?

00:41:20.523 --> 00:41:24.573
Certainly if you go to Ireland now and
you're lucky enough to see a, eagle there,

00:41:24.593 --> 00:41:27.973
as I have been on one or two occasions
and you- you're wondering, are these birds

00:41:27.973 --> 00:41:32.673
that have been introduced from Norway, 10,
15 years ago, however long it might be?

00:41:33.011 --> 00:41:33.361
Yeah.

00:41:33.501 --> 00:41:33.831
Yeah.

00:41:34.001 --> 00:41:38.061
And isn't that how they, they play it
in, in the States with California condor

00:41:38.101 --> 00:41:41.571
that they basically said, "Yeah, we
could be waiting forever." You know,

00:41:41.571 --> 00:41:44.831
some birders might have, have died
by the time we can really prove that

00:41:44.841 --> 00:41:46.521
these things are, are bedded in again.

00:41:46.981 --> 00:41:49.681
So let's just let everyone
enjoy them and, and count them.

00:41:50.475 --> 00:41:53.425
I think that's a reasonable
position to take, to be honest,

00:41:53.519 --> 00:41:54.059
Yeah.

00:41:54.169 --> 00:41:56.049
Yeah, I think that's how
they played it out there.

00:41:56.049 --> 00:41:58.189
So I, I definitely favor that approach.

00:41:58.199 --> 00:41:59.419
I think it's, it's sensible.

00:41:59.419 --> 00:42:02.189
It's it doesn't need to be-- You
know, this thing doesn't need to be

00:42:02.189 --> 00:42:08.579
tied into, you know, decades-long
population dynamic studies necessarily

00:42:09.097 --> 00:42:09.697
Yeah, absolutely.

00:42:09.747 --> 00:42:13.377
And ultimately though the underlying
thing here is that Bearded Vulture

00:42:13.377 --> 00:42:14.567
is doing well in Europe again,

00:42:14.627 --> 00:42:15.317
which is great.

00:42:15.607 --> 00:42:21.317
It's been a long time since the, the
species has been like this, and, these

00:42:21.427 --> 00:42:24.277
inc- this increase in extralimital
records that we're seeing now,

00:42:24.277 --> 00:42:28.637
including the, the two British records,
but they seem to be almost annual

00:42:28.637 --> 00:42:29.847
really on the near continent now.

00:42:29.847 --> 00:42:33.047
It seems like most years the, the
Dutch or the Germans are, or even

00:42:33.047 --> 00:42:34.867
the Danes are getting these birds.

00:42:35.207 --> 00:42:38.207
We just have to remember that's
a reflection of the species'

00:42:38.217 --> 00:42:40.737
success in the Alps, and that's
something to be celebrated

00:42:41.143 --> 00:42:42.053
Yeah, yeah.

00:42:42.223 --> 00:42:45.113
I mean, w- wasn't it amazing
seeing that one, that picture of

00:42:45.173 --> 00:42:48.023
that one in the Arctic tussling
with, with a white-tailed eagle?

00:42:48.203 --> 00:42:48.963
What a picture

00:42:49.309 --> 00:42:49.849
Amazing.

00:42:49.849 --> 00:42:52.589
It if you haven't seen it, it is on
the Bird Guide's website, listener.

00:42:52.849 --> 00:42:56.319
Really extraordinary series of
photographs from the island of Røst

00:42:56.359 --> 00:42:58.239
in northern Norway, I think, isn't it?

00:42:58.239 --> 00:42:58.439
Where

00:42:58.439 --> 00:43:00.779
this, it's tussling with one of
the local white-tailed eagles.

00:43:01.059 --> 00:43:01.999
Absolutely bonkers

00:43:02.471 --> 00:43:02.831
Yeah.

00:43:03.091 --> 00:43:05.371
Bird photo of, of all time for me.

00:43:05.371 --> 00:43:07.551
That, that's just one, one of
the top ones I've ever seen.

00:43:07.561 --> 00:43:11.231
Just the, the way they're looking at
each other and yeah, the, the posture

00:43:11.261 --> 00:43:12.731
and the background is just perfect.

00:43:12.761 --> 00:43:13.761
Pin sharp as well

00:43:14.175 --> 00:43:15.445
Yeah, absolutely.

00:43:15.709 --> 00:43:18.489
So it might not be too long until
we're seeing another bearded

00:43:18.489 --> 00:43:20.269
vulture over here in Britain.

00:43:20.319 --> 00:43:23.589
And to be honest, you thought this
summer, the way it's been with so much

00:43:23.589 --> 00:43:26.589
high pressure and hot weather, it might
have been the year for it to happen.

00:43:26.709 --> 00:43:28.019
But it hasn't yet, at least.

00:43:28.389 --> 00:43:32.249
But there have been some really good
rarities around last week or so.

00:43:32.249 --> 00:43:36.459
Of course, our last- on our last pod, we
talked about some legendary July rarities.

00:43:36.859 --> 00:43:39.269
And before that we were talking
about some of the, the latest

00:43:39.379 --> 00:43:40.949
highlights being seen across Britain.

00:43:40.949 --> 00:43:43.669
But a lot's happened since
then, hasn't it, Dave?

00:43:43.959 --> 00:43:45.149
Long-tailed shrike-note,

00:43:45.249 --> 00:43:45.689
yeah.

00:43:46.079 --> 00:43:50.469
Who, who would have thought that, that--
I mean, when Ian missed he, he didn't

00:43:50.469 --> 00:43:53.819
quite get up there in time for the,
the bird in Fife, and I said, "Well,

00:43:53.819 --> 00:43:57.309
you know how these things are. It's not
necessarily gonna be decades until the

00:43:57.309 --> 00:44:00.149
next one. Y-y-you might be surprised
how fast it comes around again."

00:44:00.149 --> 00:44:05.239
I didn't expect it to be almost the
next day that one was found again, you

00:44:05.239 --> 00:44:06.819
know, in a very accessible location.

00:44:07.167 --> 00:44:08.957
Yeah, and just a little
bit more context on this.

00:44:08.957 --> 00:44:11.447
So it does appear to be a different bird.

00:44:11.559 --> 00:44:11.849
Mm-hmm.

00:44:12.427 --> 00:44:17.857
so the news broke on the 18th,
I think it was on Birdguides.

00:44:17.907 --> 00:44:20.557
It was put out on the morning of the
18th that this bird had been found on

00:44:20.557 --> 00:44:22.507
the Gloucestershire Oxfordshire border.

00:44:22.577 --> 00:44:26.087
But it transpired that it had been
found up- on approximately the

00:44:26.087 --> 00:44:29.837
8th of July, which was the final
day of the Fife bird's presence.

00:44:29.837 --> 00:44:32.947
That was the day that David and I were up
there seeing it with David's dog, Nevis.

00:44:33.277 --> 00:44:36.637
But it's since transpired that it had
been found-- this bird in Gloucestershire

00:44:36.637 --> 00:44:40.637
was found on the 9th, so the day
after the Fife bird disappeared.

00:44:41.087 --> 00:44:47.727
So an extraordinary coincidence you have
this Fife bird disappearing, then the next

00:44:47.727 --> 00:44:49.297
day one turning up in Gloucestershire.

00:44:49.317 --> 00:44:51.597
The, the automatic assumption
would be, "Ah, surely that's the

00:44:51.597 --> 00:44:56.037
same bird relocating." But it does
seem, looking at the photos and

00:44:56.047 --> 00:44:59.517
analyzing the bird's, the two birds'
plumage that they're different birds

00:45:00.065 --> 00:45:00.365
Yeah.

00:45:00.425 --> 00:45:04.405
And of course, the, the next thought
is, is this too good to be true?

00:45:04.865 --> 00:45:08.855
Could this be you know, some
kind of escape event or… 'Cause

00:45:08.915 --> 00:45:12.465
people have been breeding, not many
people, but it has been bred in

00:45:12.465 --> 00:45:14.775
captivity in recent years in Britain.

00:45:15.315 --> 00:45:16.945
So that's an inevitable question.

00:45:16.945 --> 00:45:22.215
Personally, I think, you know, the forces
that led to one arriving in Britain could

00:45:22.215 --> 00:45:25.785
easily lead to two, and probably in a
lot of cases of these extreme vagrants,

00:45:25.845 --> 00:45:27.365
there may well be another one out there.

00:45:27.365 --> 00:45:31.465
It may not have been the one individual
that has made it across continents, and

00:45:31.465 --> 00:45:37.035
it's just that, you know, luck usually
means that, or, you know, s- probability

00:45:37.065 --> 00:45:38.865
usually means that only one is found.

00:45:39.445 --> 00:45:40.935
But in this case, a second one has.

00:45:41.505 --> 00:45:44.795
And if you're keeping long-tailed shrikes,
it's gonna be a pretty valuable bird.

00:45:45.135 --> 00:45:48.065
You wouldn't think you'd
just easily let them go.

00:45:48.459 --> 00:45:49.179
No, quite.

00:45:49.279 --> 00:45:51.759
Ultimately this bird remains on site.

00:45:52.089 --> 00:45:55.709
And I think this one is doing what we
expected the Fife bird to do really,

00:45:55.779 --> 00:45:57.149
and that's just sit around and molt.

00:45:57.209 --> 00:46:00.079
A lot of the photos from the last few
days show it to be in really heavy

00:46:00.079 --> 00:46:03.939
molt, so I can't envisage this bird's
gonna be going anywhere anytime soon.

00:46:04.329 --> 00:46:06.249
So yeah, it could be around
for a few weeks to come yet

00:46:06.779 --> 00:46:07.349
Absolutely.

00:46:07.369 --> 00:46:07.669
Yeah.

00:46:07.679 --> 00:46:08.619
Well, all for it.

00:46:08.709 --> 00:46:11.209
You know, more and more people can
enjoy that species in Britain now

00:46:11.781 --> 00:46:14.021
Yeah, a huge twitch there on
the first couple of days, wasn't

00:46:14.021 --> 00:46:16.991
there, by the looks of things, and
un-unsurprisingly given the location.

00:46:17.521 --> 00:46:18.021
Yeah.

00:46:18.081 --> 00:46:18.421
get to

00:46:18.901 --> 00:46:19.941
Yeah, absolutely.

00:46:19.971 --> 00:46:21.621
And there's been some
other stuff going on.

00:46:21.621 --> 00:46:24.771
There was a, a Pale Moth, Eleonora's
Falcon seen flying in off the sea

00:46:24.771 --> 00:46:26.861
at North Foreland on the 24th.

00:46:26.861 --> 00:46:29.741
There's been quite a few night
herons turning up, including a, a

00:46:29.741 --> 00:46:31.461
flock of four in North Yorkshire.

00:46:31.811 --> 00:46:36.351
North Ronaldsay scored a Barolo's
Shearwater or a Barolo type the other day.

00:46:36.451 --> 00:46:38.051
So yeah, there's been
quite a lot going on.

00:46:38.351 --> 00:46:40.281
Yeah, it seems like there's
a few night herons about.

00:46:40.341 --> 00:46:44.581
Whether that's a legacy of this lasting
hot and dry summer, I'm not sure.

00:46:44.581 --> 00:46:47.921
But feels like if you're a patch birder
pretty much anywhere in the UK at the

00:46:47.921 --> 00:46:50.131
moment night heron is surely in play.

00:46:50.361 --> 00:46:54.371
It's probably gonna be a case of getting
out very early or very late and trying

00:46:54.371 --> 00:46:56.201
some of your local heron hotspots.

00:46:56.701 --> 00:46:59.871
Whether that's a, whether that's a
colony or just a favored feeding spot.

00:46:59.871 --> 00:47:03.561
For example, around me at the moment
at Baston Fen, there's a few of the,

00:47:03.641 --> 00:47:06.161
the few of the scrapes there are just
drying out, so they're absolutely

00:47:06.161 --> 00:47:07.781
full of little egrets at the moment.

00:47:07.781 --> 00:47:09.821
I had up to 60 little
egrets there the other day.

00:47:10.141 --> 00:47:14.091
And yeah, you're just thinking it would
be so nice for a night heron to be here.

00:47:14.101 --> 00:47:16.411
I keep going back and checking,
but it's gonna be dry in a few

00:47:16.411 --> 00:47:18.921
days, so that opportunity may pass.

00:47:18.921 --> 00:47:21.011
But yeah, definitely one
to be on the lookout for.

00:47:21.351 --> 00:47:25.741
And as I alluded to earlier, was a bit of
weather over the weekend, wasn't there?

00:47:25.961 --> 00:47:29.441
After such a hot and dry July so
far, there was a bit of a westerly

00:47:29.441 --> 00:47:32.901
kicked in and there was a little
bit of rain in western areas.

00:47:32.911 --> 00:47:36.321
And finally, we saw a bit of
sea watching action with Bridges

00:47:36.321 --> 00:47:37.771
of Ross picking up, didn't it?

00:47:37.841 --> 00:47:39.651
It had some good tallies over the weekend.

00:47:39.651 --> 00:47:43.751
Saturday produced 28 Wilson's
Storm-Petrels, which I think is the

00:47:43.771 --> 00:47:46.341
second highest ever land-based total

00:47:47.149 --> 00:47:47.309
Wow.

00:47:47.481 --> 00:47:47.771
Ireland.

00:47:48.209 --> 00:47:48.609
Yeah

00:47:48.631 --> 00:47:53.221
and there were hundreds, several hundred
Cory's and a few hundred Greats, I think.

00:47:53.221 --> 00:47:56.251
So yeah, it feels like the
birds are clearly out there.

00:47:56.251 --> 00:47:59.681
It's just gonna be a case of waiting
for the westerlies to properly kick

00:47:59.681 --> 00:48:02.651
in, which surely at some point they're
going to, although looks like it's

00:48:02.651 --> 00:48:03.771
gonna be another hot week ahead.

00:48:04.247 --> 00:48:04.847
Oh, another one.

00:48:04.887 --> 00:48:05.307
Gosh.

00:48:05.357 --> 00:48:05.767
Yeah.

00:48:05.807 --> 00:48:07.457
Well we'll look forward
to that weather coming.

00:48:07.467 --> 00:48:10.997
I think Wales had its record count of
Wilson's storm petrel as well, didn't it?

00:48:11.007 --> 00:48:12.927
Of nine this week.

00:48:12.987 --> 00:48:14.957
So yeah, it's all to play for

00:48:15.339 --> 00:48:16.259
It's amazing, really.

00:48:16.919 --> 00:48:17.809
Yeah, so we'll see.

00:48:17.809 --> 00:48:20.659
And oh, just a shout-out
actually to Belvide Reservoir.

00:48:20.659 --> 00:48:25.569
That place constantly amazes me and
frustrates me as a, as an inland Midlands

00:48:25.589 --> 00:48:28.009
patcher, just how many good birds it gets.

00:48:28.099 --> 00:48:32.029
You see it had a Whiterump Sandpiper
over, over the weekend following

00:48:32.029 --> 00:48:33.639
a, a Stone Curlew last week.

00:48:33.639 --> 00:48:37.279
But yeah, that's, I saw something
from Steve Nuttall on social media

00:48:37.279 --> 00:48:40.239
saying that's the 10th Whiterump
Sandpiper that he's seen at

00:48:40.705 --> 00:48:42.125
Does that include that big flock?

00:48:42.849 --> 00:48:44.269
Yeah, it do- it does, to be fair.

00:48:44.269 --> 00:48:47.059
So he had that flock of eight last
autumn, but then he also had an adult,

00:48:47.119 --> 00:48:50.349
I think it was August 2022, he said,
so that's 10 in the space of what?

00:48:50.349 --> 00:48:51.619
Four years or something.

00:48:51.859 --> 00:48:56.179
For a water body in the middle of the
Midlands that's pretty impressive going.

00:48:56.179 --> 00:48:56.389
And

00:48:56.525 --> 00:48:56.875
Yeah

00:48:57.249 --> 00:49:01.009
Him and his cohort seem to dig out
some cracking stuff there repeatedly.

00:49:01.059 --> 00:49:04.149
And he did-- he wrote a good, really
good article about Belvide in in

00:49:04.149 --> 00:49:05.139
Birdwatch a couple of years ago.

00:49:05.139 --> 00:49:06.909
I think it was the May 2024 issue.

00:49:06.909 --> 00:49:08.279
It's well worth having a read of that

00:49:08.493 --> 00:49:09.063
Absolutely.

00:49:09.103 --> 00:49:11.103
Yeah, they do call it the
Golden Pond for a reason

00:49:12.671 --> 00:49:14.401
Plenty of golden rarities
there over the years.

00:49:15.281 --> 00:49:15.601
Okay.

00:49:15.661 --> 00:49:20.061
That's all we've got time for in today's
episode of the Birdguides podcast.

00:49:20.331 --> 00:49:24.201
We'll be back next week with episode
five, uh, when we'll be looking at the

00:49:24.201 --> 00:49:28.981
joys of patch birding in August, arguably
the best birding month of the calendar,

00:49:29.761 --> 00:49:31.321
that I'm certainly very excited about.

00:49:32.171 --> 00:49:35.211
In the meantime, you can keep up
with everything Birdguides related

00:49:35.301 --> 00:49:38.701
at birdguides.com, where you'll
find the latest news, sightings,

00:49:38.701 --> 00:49:40.481
and everything else that we do.

00:49:40.910 --> 00:49:44.510
All the stories that we talked about
in today's pod,  can be found as

00:49:44.510 --> 00:49:47.660
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which you can sign up for for

00:49:47.660 --> 00:49:50.630
free at birdguides.com/newsletter.

00:49:51.019 --> 00:49:54.059
But in the meantime, say bye for
now and we'll see you next week

00:49:54.504 --> 00:49:54.884
See ya