WEBVTT 00:00:01.070 --> 00:00:04.730 Hey dear listener, welcome! I'm Lore and this 00:00:04.730 --> 00:00:07.629 is Intimate Breath, a podcast where we get real 00:00:07.629 --> 00:00:10.970 about bodies, desire and the messy beautiful 00:00:10.970 --> 00:00:14.150 art of redating. Today's episode is special. 00:00:14.230 --> 00:00:17.690 I'm joined by Lynn and Annabelle, two participants 00:00:17.690 --> 00:00:20.269 from the Liberation Journey, and we talk about 00:00:20.269 --> 00:00:23.089 the power of simplicity, what it means to be 00:00:23.089 --> 00:00:26.309 deeply listened to and how honesty and safety 00:00:26.309 --> 00:00:29.929 grow over time in a group setting. It's a conversation 00:00:29.929 --> 00:00:33.649 about becoming more yourself. Not through intensity 00:00:33.649 --> 00:00:36.549 or drama, but through presence, play and the 00:00:36.549 --> 00:00:39.969 unexpected depth of connection. If you enjoyed 00:00:39.969 --> 00:00:42.189 this episode, it really helps when you like, 00:00:42.250 --> 00:00:45.329 share and leave a comment. Those small acts make 00:00:45.329 --> 00:00:48.009 a big difference and help me keep this work sustainable. 00:00:49.009 --> 00:00:55.189 Okay, let's dive in. Welcome Lena and Annabel. 00:00:56.109 --> 00:01:00.929 Thank you. As I already said, I would love to 00:01:00.929 --> 00:01:03.829 just dive right in with a question to both of 00:01:03.829 --> 00:01:07.329 you. If you think of your liberation journey, 00:01:07.969 --> 00:01:13.189 what would be the title? I'm trying to swing 00:01:13.189 --> 00:01:15.750 like the first title that popped in my head was 00:01:15.750 --> 00:01:20.409 like Sex and the City, but I'm trying to find 00:01:20.409 --> 00:01:28.810 a better title here. Intimacy and me, maybe. 00:01:30.230 --> 00:01:35.030 Intimacy and me. It's a whole other thing than 00:01:35.030 --> 00:01:37.129 Sex and the City, but it was like the vibe I 00:01:37.129 --> 00:01:45.450 felt. That's the vibe I'm feeling. Intimacy and 00:01:45.450 --> 00:01:48.829 me. Sex and the City on its own, it's like too 00:01:48.829 --> 00:01:51.870 plain for it. It's too white. It doesn't cover 00:01:51.870 --> 00:01:56.849 all the edges. It was so much more intense, more 00:01:56.849 --> 00:02:04.010 intimate for my journey and the difference was 00:02:04.010 --> 00:02:08.050 I started with the thought of I'm going to connect 00:02:08.050 --> 00:02:11.949 with others, which was still true. But it started 00:02:11.949 --> 00:02:14.250 more with maybe I need to connect with others 00:02:14.250 --> 00:02:18.550 to like find myself and it turned more like the 00:02:18.550 --> 00:02:22.139 opposite. No, it was more intimacy and me. parts 00:02:22.139 --> 00:02:27.919 and the recognition that it's all in me, not 00:02:27.919 --> 00:02:32.219 about the city only. It's also like the other 00:02:32.219 --> 00:02:35.840 people in it, but it's more like the focus me 00:02:35.840 --> 00:02:38.379 and there are others and not a focus. There are 00:02:38.379 --> 00:02:41.919 others and me. That's where the shift started. 00:02:42.699 --> 00:02:48.300 Yeah. You grew closer to yourself. And Annabelle, 00:02:48.360 --> 00:02:51.509 I saw you nodding a lot. Yeah, but how beautiful 00:02:51.509 --> 00:02:54.090 that she just explained, how she explained it. 00:02:54.090 --> 00:02:58.530 It's beautiful. I think my title would be more 00:02:58.530 --> 00:03:03.189 like something like simplicity of life. Because 00:03:03.189 --> 00:03:10.110 during the weekends, I really enjoyed the simplicity 00:03:10.110 --> 00:03:13.909 of everything. Like we were in nature, we were 00:03:13.909 --> 00:03:17.689 together, there was a lot of connection. Also, 00:03:17.949 --> 00:03:20.349 like Lin said, connection with myself, but also 00:03:20.349 --> 00:03:23.629 connection with other people. The playing with 00:03:23.629 --> 00:03:27.990 each other, just how simple it was to asking 00:03:27.990 --> 00:03:38.219 for a hug to somebody or dancing naked. It's 00:03:38.219 --> 00:03:42.659 all so simple and it's all so natural. It makes 00:03:42.659 --> 00:03:47.539 me really sad that it feels so natural, but I 00:03:47.539 --> 00:03:52.080 have to look for places where I can do it. For 00:03:52.080 --> 00:03:55.159 me, the journey was like that. In the weekends, 00:03:55.360 --> 00:03:59.639 it was all about simplicity of life, and during 00:03:59.639 --> 00:04:03.520 the weeks in between the weekends, I took it 00:04:03.520 --> 00:04:06.659 with me. I was like asking more people around 00:04:06.659 --> 00:04:11.360 me for hugs, like without anything more or something 00:04:11.360 --> 00:04:16.199 like just can you hold me? Can you? So that's, 00:04:16.379 --> 00:04:19.860 yeah. Yeah. So just simple, but I really love 00:04:19.860 --> 00:04:26.899 simple. So very natural. Yeah. So embracing more 00:04:26.899 --> 00:04:29.259 of what feels natural and also taking it with 00:04:29.259 --> 00:04:33.990 you in your daily life. Exactly. Dancing, singing, 00:04:34.230 --> 00:04:38.509 good eating, nice people, connection. It's not 00:04:38.509 --> 00:04:45.889 rocket science, you know, it's so simple. And 00:04:45.889 --> 00:04:48.350 you know, my title is simplicity of life. So 00:04:48.350 --> 00:04:51.589 there's also life. So life is ups and downs and 00:04:51.589 --> 00:04:55.730 easy and difficult. And so yeah, it was actually 00:04:55.730 --> 00:04:59.550 good to go a layer deeper than that you normally 00:04:59.550 --> 00:05:02.829 do. uh with the people that you know or with 00:05:02.829 --> 00:05:05.689 them in daily life because in daily life there 00:05:05.689 --> 00:05:08.970 is no time to go deep or you really have to make 00:05:08.970 --> 00:05:14.149 time to go deep um and also there were of course 00:05:14.149 --> 00:05:17.290 there were triggers during the weekend but also 00:05:17.290 --> 00:05:19.329 like okay how can you handle it and there's like 00:05:19.329 --> 00:05:22.589 more time to reflect on it and to see okay normally 00:05:22.589 --> 00:05:25.769 this would be the way how i would react but can 00:05:25.769 --> 00:05:27.769 i do it in another way and because there are 00:05:27.769 --> 00:05:30.740 other people around you they in a way, they help 00:05:30.740 --> 00:05:36.079 you like to, hey, maybe you can try this. And 00:05:36.079 --> 00:05:39.019 then it's helping each other. And that's simplicity 00:05:39.019 --> 00:05:44.240 again, because we were born. And I mean, I really 00:05:44.240 --> 00:05:49.120 believe in living in tribes and maybe not living 00:05:49.120 --> 00:05:51.319 in tribes, but that you have a tribe around you 00:05:51.319 --> 00:05:55.560 to help yourself so you can grow. And that's 00:05:55.560 --> 00:05:59.399 what we did during the liberation journey. because 00:05:59.399 --> 00:06:03.019 the groups stayed the same for like half a year, 00:06:03.279 --> 00:06:06.100 for like the three weekends. So the first weekend, 00:06:06.240 --> 00:06:09.019 it's like looking, hmm, who is who? But like 00:06:09.019 --> 00:06:12.480 the second weekend, it's like mosque, they fell 00:06:12.480 --> 00:06:17.540 off. You can like just say something to somebody 00:06:17.540 --> 00:06:20.560 else, like very direct. And that is something 00:06:20.560 --> 00:06:25.230 that we, because we want to be polite. in daily 00:06:25.230 --> 00:06:28.689 life, we don't do it always. So it's nice that 00:06:28.689 --> 00:06:32.370 we could do it over there. So simplicity of life, 00:06:32.610 --> 00:06:40.589 it doesn't have to mean that it's always sparkling 00:06:40.589 --> 00:06:47.350 and things that we like. There's the up and there's 00:06:47.350 --> 00:06:50.110 the down. I don't want to call it good and bad 00:06:50.110 --> 00:06:52.129 or positive and negative because it's not like 00:06:52.129 --> 00:06:55.000 that, but it's like Things that you like and 00:06:55.000 --> 00:06:59.139 things that you don't like. Yeah. Okay. So also 00:06:59.139 --> 00:07:02.120 the simplicity and just saying something straightforward. 00:07:02.699 --> 00:07:08.759 Wow. I love it. I love it. I really like to be 00:07:08.759 --> 00:07:11.019 honest to people and just say what I think and 00:07:11.019 --> 00:07:15.060 what I want and like just expressing my needs, 00:07:15.120 --> 00:07:20.600 fears and desires. But I really, I need people 00:07:20.600 --> 00:07:24.269 who can receive it. because not everybody can 00:07:24.269 --> 00:07:28.589 receive what I say. And it feels really safe 00:07:28.589 --> 00:07:33.550 when you're in a group of people and they can 00:07:33.550 --> 00:07:36.350 say no. If I want something and I express my 00:07:36.350 --> 00:07:39.709 desire, I really want that if they don't feel 00:07:39.709 --> 00:07:43.050 it, if it's not a full yes, that they say no. 00:07:43.550 --> 00:07:46.389 So that's so simple. It's so simple. What do 00:07:46.389 --> 00:07:48.750 you want? Do you want this? Yes or no? Just say 00:07:48.750 --> 00:07:50.870 it. But the problem is we don't do it. We always 00:07:50.870 --> 00:07:55.920 say yes. Of course. because I'm a pleaser. I 00:07:55.920 --> 00:07:58.660 felt you a lot when you talked about the simplicity. 00:07:59.540 --> 00:08:04.000 For me, I also love the simplicity, but simplicity 00:08:04.000 --> 00:08:07.360 is for me very connected with safety, feeling 00:08:07.360 --> 00:08:13.660 safe enough, trust enough to be that simple or 00:08:13.660 --> 00:08:17.600 just you we want to be. And that's what the Liberation 00:08:17.600 --> 00:08:21.360 Journey also gave the group. also you Lora and 00:08:21.360 --> 00:08:24.040 all the assistants like the safeness of the space 00:08:24.040 --> 00:08:27.540 there in which way if you feel like oh this is 00:08:27.540 --> 00:08:30.439 out of my comfort zone it's felt all also safe 00:08:30.439 --> 00:08:34.259 to experiment with that a regular life you go 00:08:34.259 --> 00:08:37.759 for the not easy way but you're just going to 00:08:37.759 --> 00:08:41.559 yeah the way of less resistance because you don't 00:08:41.559 --> 00:08:44.120 have the time you have to go forward in life 00:08:44.120 --> 00:08:47.529 and and that's where the spaces there was like 00:08:47.529 --> 00:08:49.909 the time stood still and you had the opportunities 00:08:49.909 --> 00:08:53.710 to in the safeness of it all to experience with 00:08:53.710 --> 00:08:56.509 your okay I'm going to try now a little bit more 00:08:56.509 --> 00:09:00.250 to experience here or going out of my comfort 00:09:00.250 --> 00:09:05.909 zone here. Of course the safety is very very 00:09:05.909 --> 00:09:08.029 important it's like maybe it's key safety and 00:09:08.029 --> 00:09:11.370 communication and I really agree that A lot of 00:09:11.370 --> 00:09:13.850 the safetiness came of Laura and the assistants, 00:09:14.070 --> 00:09:18.389 but it's also inside you, inside everybody. And 00:09:18.389 --> 00:09:21.070 I think we, or maybe I have to talk for myself, 00:09:21.289 --> 00:09:23.710 like in the beginning there was already a base 00:09:23.710 --> 00:09:26.750 of safetiness, but like at the end of the journey, 00:09:26.850 --> 00:09:29.549 it's like there's more safetiness. What do you 00:09:29.549 --> 00:09:32.809 think were the elements that created that difference 00:09:32.809 --> 00:09:38.370 between the beginning and the end for you? Difficult 00:09:38.370 --> 00:09:43.419 question. I feel. I think it's more because I 00:09:43.419 --> 00:09:47.120 cannot pinpoint it, but I really believe there 00:09:47.120 --> 00:09:51.000 has been a growth during the six months for everybody. 00:09:52.740 --> 00:09:56.000 And if you grow, then I think your safetiness 00:09:56.000 --> 00:10:00.899 in yourself also grows in a way. And that's what 00:10:00.899 --> 00:10:03.720 I like about the liberation journey, that it's 00:10:03.720 --> 00:10:06.100 like the three weekends it's spread. I think 00:10:06.100 --> 00:10:10.769 it's six months -ish. And the calls in between 00:10:10.769 --> 00:10:14.309 that we had, every week we had a call. So it 00:10:14.309 --> 00:10:18.990 helped me to reflect more. And I think, and I 00:10:18.990 --> 00:10:24.730 took time to do it. And I took time. Every time 00:10:24.730 --> 00:10:28.029 I like, I stepped out of the rat race, like the, 00:10:28.269 --> 00:10:29.750 we have to work, we have to be busy. We have 00:10:29.750 --> 00:10:33.610 to do a lot of things. And like just taking that 00:10:33.610 --> 00:10:36.289 moment, those weekends and first time and then 00:10:36.289 --> 00:10:39.740 like every week, an hour. Yeah, it's helped me 00:10:39.740 --> 00:10:45.100 a lot to be more centered with myself. Well, 00:10:46.039 --> 00:10:47.940 I want to add to the question because I'm still 00:10:47.940 --> 00:10:50.059 curious. I understand it's hard to pinpoint. 00:10:50.500 --> 00:10:52.940 So you can skip the question if no answer comes. 00:10:53.820 --> 00:10:58.200 How would you say you noticed that there was 00:10:58.200 --> 00:11:01.320 more safety in the group or even that people 00:11:01.320 --> 00:11:04.740 were growing? Like, what are you thinking of 00:11:04.740 --> 00:11:09.940 when you're saying that? For me, it's the little 00:11:09.940 --> 00:11:12.679 things like eye contact, but also the physical 00:11:12.679 --> 00:11:15.259 contact, the hugs. Like in the second weekend 00:11:15.259 --> 00:11:18.639 already, you see each other, ah hug. We just 00:11:18.639 --> 00:11:22.220 started always further, like where we stopped. 00:11:22.559 --> 00:11:24.960 It was like we just picked it up and like, okay, 00:11:25.559 --> 00:11:27.919 even though there was a month or two months between, 00:11:28.820 --> 00:11:31.259 it's a real life. You have the calls like Annabelle 00:11:31.259 --> 00:11:36.340 said that really helped. to maintain the focus 00:11:36.340 --> 00:11:40.799 on yourself and with each other also. For me, 00:11:41.019 --> 00:11:44.279 I also think that I make a lot of assumptions 00:11:44.279 --> 00:11:49.120 during life, during the day, during anything. 00:11:49.740 --> 00:11:54.419 And I learned to just ask the other people, like, 00:11:54.600 --> 00:11:58.299 hey, I assume that, blah, blah, blah, blah. And 00:11:58.299 --> 00:12:01.019 before, when I had the assumption, it was just 00:12:01.019 --> 00:12:04.860 in my head and it stayed in my head. And now 00:12:04.860 --> 00:12:12.039 I feel safe to go to that person and like, hey, 00:12:12.559 --> 00:12:15.919 I assume that. Is that correct or not? Or can 00:12:15.919 --> 00:12:19.940 you share something about it? And that's, yeah, 00:12:20.000 --> 00:12:23.259 that's like a little trick or something, but 00:12:23.259 --> 00:12:26.220 it really helps to open conversations or to like, 00:12:26.259 --> 00:12:28.679 if there are some loose ends or there is like 00:12:28.679 --> 00:12:31.179 something hanging and you don't know what it 00:12:31.179 --> 00:12:36.279 is. You just express it and, and it's still not 00:12:36.279 --> 00:12:39.259 easy to do it in daily life, especially with 00:12:39.259 --> 00:12:43.580 people who did not do work like this, because 00:12:43.580 --> 00:12:45.500 then they are like always, no, no, no, no, no, 00:12:45.500 --> 00:12:49.519 it's not true. Or they, or they answer the way 00:12:49.519 --> 00:12:52.019 they should answer, you know, like being polite. 00:12:53.320 --> 00:12:56.840 So it's nice when you're some people and they 00:12:56.840 --> 00:13:00.279 just, they just say what it is and how it is 00:13:00.279 --> 00:13:03.559 just like being honest. You know, it's like that, 00:13:03.720 --> 00:13:07.379 we are like not used to be honest anymore. We 00:13:07.379 --> 00:13:10.940 are learned how to be polite. You can be honest 00:13:10.940 --> 00:13:15.899 and polite in the same. So it's not because you're 00:13:15.899 --> 00:13:19.240 honest that you're not polite. Sorry, I just 00:13:19.240 --> 00:13:24.500 wanted to add that one. Because I'm not supporting 00:13:24.500 --> 00:13:29.019 people to be not polite. So we have to be rude. 00:13:29.419 --> 00:13:35.000 No, exactly. slightly different yeah what i wanted 00:13:35.000 --> 00:13:40.159 to add was also not only saying art show but 00:13:40.159 --> 00:13:43.799 also yeah for me it's also a big listening part 00:13:43.799 --> 00:13:47.480 i felt really they were listening what i was 00:13:47.480 --> 00:13:51.220 saying sometimes i in regular life i test people 00:13:51.220 --> 00:13:54.320 i will say something and i want to see if they 00:13:54.320 --> 00:13:57.860 remember what i said yeah why were you really 00:13:57.860 --> 00:14:00.860 listening here what what i was saying and that 00:14:00.860 --> 00:14:04.870 was especially in this group like you're saying 00:14:04.870 --> 00:14:09.169 things and then you have therefore not that first 00:14:09.169 --> 00:14:11.210 week but a second and there's feedback and it's 00:14:11.210 --> 00:14:15.529 like wow they really listen they really observe 00:14:15.529 --> 00:14:21.490 me and that's how I grow and yeah the trust goes 00:14:21.490 --> 00:14:25.370 bigger like okay what I'm saying here they are 00:14:25.370 --> 00:14:28.429 acknowledging me and listening really listening 00:14:28.429 --> 00:14:32.789 to me that gives me Yeah, a big safetiness. Yeah, 00:14:32.850 --> 00:14:35.409 like, okay. And observations they gave. Yeah. 00:14:35.870 --> 00:14:39.169 Yeah, beautiful. It's really cool to ask you 00:14:39.169 --> 00:14:43.210 these questions. I did plan to go to poke that 00:14:43.210 --> 00:14:47.690 deep, but as a facilitator, I am always trying 00:14:47.690 --> 00:14:51.409 to feel in, you know, I am very intentional about 00:14:51.409 --> 00:14:53.549 the practices I'm doing and how much are they 00:14:53.549 --> 00:14:56.960 building trust and, and whereas the level of 00:14:56.960 --> 00:15:00.700 safety now in this group and how much more intensity 00:15:00.700 --> 00:15:04.419 can there be in the space or not, right? And 00:15:04.419 --> 00:15:09.419 then to ask you like, how are you noticing these 00:15:09.419 --> 00:15:14.360 things and what is it actually that brings you 00:15:14.360 --> 00:15:18.820 that safety? And indeed, like in the very beginning, 00:15:19.240 --> 00:15:22.840 I'm naming like transparency or honesty. They're 00:15:22.840 --> 00:15:26.659 very close together. I really want to bring that 00:15:26.659 --> 00:15:30.600 in as a value and also as a practice that will 00:15:30.600 --> 00:15:33.220 build trust. And we're doing all these practices 00:15:33.220 --> 00:15:35.059 where there's the sharing and then we're marrying 00:15:35.059 --> 00:15:38.100 each other. We have the checking assumptions. 00:15:39.000 --> 00:15:42.019 I'm happy to hear that those also come up because 00:15:42.019 --> 00:15:46.820 that's obviously also my intention with them. 00:15:47.159 --> 00:15:51.279 For me, every time I'm with someone and I can 00:15:51.279 --> 00:15:54.080 really ask for what I want and they're not always 00:15:54.080 --> 00:15:57.070 saying yes. They're also giving me a no sometimes 00:15:57.070 --> 00:16:01.149 and that's hugely helpful in building trust and 00:16:01.149 --> 00:16:04.870 thus safety. And I think all these elements help 00:16:04.870 --> 00:16:08.149 me at least. So it's cool to hear you speak into 00:16:08.149 --> 00:16:14.549 that. I have to say like the honesty circle like 00:16:14.549 --> 00:16:17.730 in the beginning and the sharing circles and 00:16:17.730 --> 00:16:21.409 the mirroring, there was a lot of resistance. 00:16:21.840 --> 00:16:26.000 When you explained those exercises, I was like, 00:16:27.360 --> 00:16:34.440 why? And no, I don't think so. And the same with 00:16:34.440 --> 00:16:37.419 the assumptions and you had to go to people and 00:16:37.419 --> 00:16:41.639 like just clarify your assumptions. Like every 00:16:41.639 --> 00:16:45.120 time, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Like my whole 00:16:45.120 --> 00:16:48.759 body was like. Yeah, I have to admit it took 00:16:48.759 --> 00:16:56.580 me some time to see the big value in those exercises. 00:16:56.919 --> 00:17:00.259 But it's good because that's one of the things 00:17:00.259 --> 00:17:04.480 that I learned. If there is resistance, it's 00:17:04.480 --> 00:17:07.579 probably because there is something good under 00:17:07.579 --> 00:17:10.940 it. But first I need to go a little bit deeper 00:17:10.940 --> 00:17:14.759 into it. So it's not that I cheered up all your 00:17:14.759 --> 00:17:18.890 exercises. And where did you land? You can be 00:17:18.890 --> 00:17:23.369 very honest here. Where did you land around the 00:17:23.369 --> 00:17:25.630 practice where we share and give mirrors to each 00:17:25.630 --> 00:17:30.269 other? Yeah, with the people around me in daily 00:17:30.269 --> 00:17:34.109 life, the people that I trust, I try to do them 00:17:34.109 --> 00:17:37.410 as well. Like the assumptions, I express my assumptions. 00:17:37.960 --> 00:17:40.539 The mirroring is also very interesting to do 00:17:40.539 --> 00:17:43.059 from time to time and to people that I trust 00:17:43.059 --> 00:17:45.599 and that I know. And the honesty, oh my god, 00:17:45.660 --> 00:17:50.599 I love honesty since that first circle. And that's 00:17:50.599 --> 00:17:55.059 again the simplicity of life because you're not 00:17:55.059 --> 00:17:58.220 saying everything or something and just being 00:17:58.220 --> 00:18:02.079 full honest and putting your cards on the table. 00:18:02.180 --> 00:18:03.700 I don't know if you say it in English, but then 00:18:03.700 --> 00:18:07.660 Dutch you say it like that. just being honest 00:18:07.660 --> 00:18:14.880 and yeah, it's so easy. It's also freaking, uh, 00:18:15.380 --> 00:18:20.420 the, uh, exponent. I can actually, yeah, both. 00:18:21.039 --> 00:18:23.599 Yeah. But when you do it with the right people, 00:18:23.819 --> 00:18:27.480 it's, it's nice. I'm wondering, we're talking 00:18:27.480 --> 00:18:30.279 about this, you know, honesty and checking assumptions. 00:18:30.980 --> 00:18:35.400 Shall we just give one or two examples of things? 00:18:35.819 --> 00:18:38.940 That we can check with each other here whoever 00:18:38.940 --> 00:18:42.539 comes up with something first maybe around how 00:18:42.539 --> 00:18:48.180 the other person experienced the journey or maybe 00:18:48.180 --> 00:18:50.900 around how how we're doing right now in this 00:18:50.900 --> 00:18:53.240 moment what we're feeling what we're thinking 00:18:53.240 --> 00:18:57.819 and sometimes for me someone just moved in with 00:18:57.819 --> 00:19:03.539 me here where I live and I can, I can check assumptions 00:19:03.539 --> 00:19:06.579 really stating what I think is obvious. Hey, 00:19:06.619 --> 00:19:10.119 I'm, I'm assuming that we will talk about things 00:19:10.119 --> 00:19:12.799 when, and this is how I'm phrasing things because 00:19:12.799 --> 00:19:15.380 it's still an assumption, but it's also my default, 00:19:15.660 --> 00:19:17.599 but I'm aware it might not be the default for 00:19:17.599 --> 00:19:20.319 someone else. So I just want to say it can just 00:19:20.319 --> 00:19:25.599 be stating the obvious. Do you want to do that? 00:19:26.880 --> 00:19:33.740 Right. Abel, can I ask a question? Okay, I have 00:19:33.740 --> 00:19:37.240 an assumption that you are more... I have the 00:19:37.240 --> 00:19:41.440 assumption that you know more what kind of simple 00:19:41.440 --> 00:19:46.819 life you want. That's an assumption I have. There's 00:19:46.819 --> 00:19:55.539 more goal there. I think I have no clue about 00:19:55.539 --> 00:20:05.079 my goal in life. Not at all, unfortunately. But 00:20:05.079 --> 00:20:09.920 I have to say that I knew it already a little 00:20:09.920 --> 00:20:14.720 bit, but it's like a confirmation of that I like 00:20:14.720 --> 00:20:17.319 simple life and simplicity of life and that I 00:20:17.319 --> 00:20:19.839 like nature and that I like people around me 00:20:19.839 --> 00:20:23.180 and that I really want to build a life where 00:20:23.180 --> 00:20:27.700 all these elements are more present. than they 00:20:27.700 --> 00:20:30.319 are now. But how that I have to do it, I have 00:20:30.319 --> 00:20:34.400 no idea. But it's like, I know my values and 00:20:34.400 --> 00:20:38.160 the things that I found important in life during 00:20:38.160 --> 00:20:41.000 the liberation journey, it got a little bit more 00:20:41.000 --> 00:20:49.660 clear. Lynn, I have one for you. Cute. I am assuming 00:20:49.660 --> 00:20:54.019 that you feel proud of your partner when you 00:20:54.019 --> 00:20:57.240 think of the liberation journey. Is that true? 00:20:58.599 --> 00:21:02.160 Yes. It's a very good assumption. Yeah, spot 00:21:02.160 --> 00:21:08.220 on. What surprised you most about yourself? Like 00:21:08.220 --> 00:21:10.400 what, what is this something that happened in 00:21:10.400 --> 00:21:13.140 the journey that you're like, huh, that was a 00:21:13.140 --> 00:21:20.039 surprise. For me, it's, um, I think it's, uh, 00:21:20.059 --> 00:21:26.279 that I showed up, that I just came. Because two 00:21:26.279 --> 00:21:30.579 days before the journey, a lot of things happened 00:21:30.579 --> 00:21:34.720 to me and I was like, no, I'm not going. I'm 00:21:34.720 --> 00:21:40.440 staying home. But I came to the journey and it 00:21:40.440 --> 00:21:42.779 was the best decision that I could make. But 00:21:42.779 --> 00:21:45.779 at the moment, on that Friday afternoon, I was 00:21:45.779 --> 00:21:53.039 like, can I go home now, please? And it's because 00:21:53.039 --> 00:21:55.599 I was really sad because of a relation breakup. 00:21:56.720 --> 00:22:02.119 But after a couple of days and hours, yeah, it 00:22:02.119 --> 00:22:05.980 felt like I wasn't at the right spot. Just being 00:22:05.980 --> 00:22:09.720 with people and being, yeah, people took care 00:22:09.720 --> 00:22:12.839 of me and I liked it. And you know, it's not 00:22:12.839 --> 00:22:15.859 so easy for me to admit that I like it when people 00:22:15.859 --> 00:22:21.150 take care of me. So yeah, that surprised me actually, 00:22:21.450 --> 00:22:24.829 that I just let it happen and I enjoyed it in 00:22:24.829 --> 00:22:31.589 a way. There are two in my head that came spontaneously. 00:22:32.049 --> 00:22:37.609 First one is my and other person's energy. I 00:22:37.609 --> 00:22:42.170 felt I was always like an energetic person, but 00:22:42.170 --> 00:22:47.150 I really felt it a couple of times on the weekends. 00:22:47.400 --> 00:22:51.240 the body and and other person's energy and I 00:22:51.240 --> 00:22:54.299 had also like an energetic play and yeah it was 00:22:54.299 --> 00:22:59.240 like it was very surprising very intense but 00:22:59.240 --> 00:23:04.640 in a good way of it and how much it grew also 00:23:04.640 --> 00:23:09.480 like it's like once it's yeah it happened it's 00:23:09.480 --> 00:23:12.559 like it's easier to go back to that feeling felt 00:23:12.559 --> 00:23:15.970 like your first orgasm it's like once you had 00:23:15.970 --> 00:23:18.130 your orgasm, it's like, okay, I know the feeling, 00:23:18.130 --> 00:23:21.829 I know the build up here, and you can try to 00:23:21.829 --> 00:23:23.869 under control, not really, but you can play with 00:23:23.869 --> 00:23:28.609 it, experiment with it. And the other surprising 00:23:28.609 --> 00:23:34.170 part for me was like, people talk about traumas, 00:23:34.630 --> 00:23:38.369 and I never see my life and the things that happened 00:23:38.369 --> 00:23:42.430 as traumas, I see them more like memories, like, 00:23:42.589 --> 00:23:47.349 oh, that happened, it's a memory, and I was certain 00:23:47.349 --> 00:23:51.849 I have a memory and I fixed it, not really fixed 00:23:51.849 --> 00:23:56.829 it, but accepted it. And I'm still in acceptance, 00:23:56.930 --> 00:23:59.269 that's not what the weekend triggered, but what 00:23:59.269 --> 00:24:06.049 was surprising for me was how the memories made 00:24:06.049 --> 00:24:10.930 me, how I react in some connections, in some 00:24:10.930 --> 00:24:14.829 situations. And it was like... yeah because you 00:24:14.829 --> 00:24:17.849 reflect more it's like oh maybe yeah we're like 00:24:17.849 --> 00:24:19.910 finding the dots for the puzzle the right puzzle 00:24:19.910 --> 00:24:23.910 piece okay that's memory or trauma made or can 00:24:23.910 --> 00:24:28.930 be a part of it why i act or feel that way and 00:24:28.930 --> 00:24:31.869 it was surprising for me because yeah in my head 00:24:31.869 --> 00:24:35.670 it's a memory so it's like i'm past this yes 00:24:35.670 --> 00:24:41.230 next and there were many links in from my past 00:24:41.230 --> 00:24:45.089 that i found that i could link Now. Yeah. Like, 00:24:45.690 --> 00:24:48.769 maybe there's something there. Yeah. That's slinking. 00:24:49.329 --> 00:24:54.170 Yeah. You had more awareness and understanding 00:24:54.170 --> 00:24:57.470 of how those memories are still impacting you 00:24:57.470 --> 00:25:00.670 today and in the interactions you're having. 00:25:02.450 --> 00:25:07.069 Powerful, Lien. Yeah. And you were explaining, 00:25:07.730 --> 00:25:11.130 I got like goosebumps while you were like explaining. 00:25:11.349 --> 00:25:14.720 I was like, yeah. Yeah, all goosebumps on my 00:25:14.720 --> 00:25:20.779 body. And most of the links was when I was in 00:25:20.779 --> 00:25:24.420 a forum and or in a was most of the time and 00:25:24.420 --> 00:25:27.759 was a real group thing that I was just started 00:25:27.759 --> 00:25:30.519 starting to talk and was like, yeah, on that 00:25:30.519 --> 00:25:33.339 spot, like, something came up. And afterwards, 00:25:33.559 --> 00:25:38.140 like, yeah, so it was surprising. Yeah, for me. 00:25:39.680 --> 00:25:43.759 So. Lin, you just used the word Fordham and Fordham 00:25:43.759 --> 00:25:46.579 is the same practice as Annabel referred to as 00:25:46.579 --> 00:25:49.519 well as the sharing in group and having mirrors. 00:25:50.480 --> 00:25:57.759 So I just wanted to link that as well. And then 00:25:57.759 --> 00:26:01.579 about the energetic side of you, there was actually 00:26:01.579 --> 00:26:04.019 another assumption that I had, because we've 00:26:04.019 --> 00:26:07.240 been talking before the journey about you and 00:26:07.240 --> 00:26:10.940 your... energetic sensitivity and sensitivity 00:26:10.940 --> 00:26:15.500 to energetic pleasure. And I had the assumption 00:26:15.500 --> 00:26:18.779 that during the journey you've been embracing 00:26:18.779 --> 00:26:21.700 that more, taking that more as like, yeah, this 00:26:21.700 --> 00:26:24.180 is a part of me. Is that what you're saying? 00:26:25.259 --> 00:26:31.859 Am I doing that right? True, true. It was a safetiness 00:26:31.859 --> 00:26:39.220 again for me and feeling safe enough to Experiments 00:26:39.220 --> 00:26:44.579 and also be there in that way. Yeah. And the 00:26:44.579 --> 00:26:48.180 people who connected with me and triggered it 00:26:48.180 --> 00:26:52.079 even more like let's do this. Yeah. What's here 00:26:52.079 --> 00:26:54.000 right now for you that you're like, ah, I want 00:26:54.000 --> 00:26:57.240 to grab that and take it forward with me next. 00:26:58.519 --> 00:27:01.039 I felt like we did a lot of, I mean, in the last 00:27:01.039 --> 00:27:03.440 weekend, we worked a little bit about the shadow 00:27:03.440 --> 00:27:08.490 work. And I feel for me, I can go deeper into 00:27:08.490 --> 00:27:14.589 the shadow work. There's a lot to explore. Explore 00:27:14.589 --> 00:27:17.569 is maybe not the right word. A lot that wants 00:27:17.569 --> 00:27:20.910 to be seen or something. And it's not so easy 00:27:20.910 --> 00:27:24.109 for me to go there. I really feel that I need 00:27:24.109 --> 00:27:28.289 people around me to do it, to go there. Yeah, 00:27:28.289 --> 00:27:33.289 so it was interesting during the journey to... 00:27:34.180 --> 00:27:38.359 dip my toe in it and I feel like I want to go 00:27:38.359 --> 00:27:48.299 deeper. For me the most fun I had was the desire 00:27:48.299 --> 00:27:51.819 recount. The second one. The second one, thank 00:27:51.819 --> 00:27:55.339 you. It was about desires and so it was very 00:27:55.339 --> 00:28:00.220 playful for me and I loved the playfulness. Also 00:28:00.220 --> 00:28:04.359 of course it was very intimate like sharing and 00:28:04.359 --> 00:28:09.920 but the third weekend the shadows in that weekend 00:28:09.920 --> 00:28:12.700 was like like I said for me it's like memories 00:28:12.700 --> 00:28:15.259 and I'm like well I know all my memories and 00:28:15.259 --> 00:28:18.039 they're fine and yeah okay and I can't talk about 00:28:18.039 --> 00:28:21.440 it and I had no shame to talk about it but it 00:28:21.440 --> 00:28:25.319 was the reflection after that weekend and the 00:28:25.319 --> 00:28:28.920 links I told you about like you start reflecting 00:28:28.920 --> 00:28:33.450 more like huh maybe I have to revisit kind of 00:28:33.450 --> 00:28:37.630 memories now to find links or maybe to feel in 00:28:37.630 --> 00:28:41.609 is this really settled or not. So it had more 00:28:41.609 --> 00:28:47.509 a wave after the third weekend for me. What I 00:28:47.509 --> 00:28:50.950 also feel right now about liberation journey 00:28:50.950 --> 00:28:54.970 I feel also a little bit fear because it's coming 00:28:54.970 --> 00:28:57.710 to an end. I think we have this week our last 00:28:57.710 --> 00:29:00.710 call and it's like by the online call it's like 00:29:00.710 --> 00:29:04.779 ha Yeah, somewhere my mind can't settle on that 00:29:04.779 --> 00:29:11.940 yet. It feels like a little fear of losing the 00:29:11.940 --> 00:29:15.380 constant safe space, like the constant thing 00:29:15.380 --> 00:29:17.740 in your life that brings you back to time out 00:29:17.740 --> 00:29:20.940 now and come back to yourself. So I know from 00:29:20.940 --> 00:29:24.079 this point I will have to take more responsibility 00:29:24.079 --> 00:29:29.799 to do this for myself. That's also something 00:29:29.799 --> 00:29:33.329 I feel now. And we're coming to the end of it. 00:29:34.390 --> 00:29:37.549 Yeah. So there's a longing for more intentional 00:29:37.549 --> 00:29:45.329 moments that are built into your life. I have 00:29:45.329 --> 00:29:50.910 so much trust in your capacity or in your ability 00:29:50.910 --> 00:29:56.589 to create that. Yeah. I can really say that I 00:29:56.589 --> 00:30:00.640 have that in my life. I'm making a lot of. It's 00:30:00.640 --> 00:30:03.160 just very important for me but I have moments 00:30:03.160 --> 00:30:06.319 where I do the play practices with my friends 00:30:06.319 --> 00:30:09.680 and we mirror each other and we have the checking 00:30:09.680 --> 00:30:14.940 moments and we do the mirroring and when one 00:30:14.940 --> 00:30:17.920 of us wants support, we're also like telling 00:30:17.920 --> 00:30:20.519 each other how we would love to be received in 00:30:20.519 --> 00:30:22.700 that. Hey, can you just share impact? Hey, can 00:30:22.700 --> 00:30:24.640 you just tell me what you're hearing? Hey, can 00:30:24.640 --> 00:30:30.569 you give me your advice now? I feel like I'm 00:30:30.569 --> 00:30:36.730 a very simple person. So then I really, really 00:30:36.730 --> 00:30:40.950 believe that everyone can build that in if it's 00:30:40.950 --> 00:30:46.049 important to them. Yeah. And you know, it makes 00:30:46.049 --> 00:30:50.490 me actually a little bit sad that it's so simple, 00:30:50.490 --> 00:30:52.829 like you say, and like all the things that you 00:30:52.829 --> 00:30:56.230 did, it's all pretty simple, but not everybody 00:30:56.230 --> 00:31:00.609 is open to that. I'm open for that. So you need 00:31:00.609 --> 00:31:07.150 the right people to do it. Although it's very 00:31:07.150 --> 00:31:11.690 natural and simple, you need a mini course or 00:31:11.690 --> 00:31:14.869 something with some rules, or I don't know how 00:31:14.869 --> 00:31:17.089 to explain it. So it makes me a little bit sad. 00:31:17.410 --> 00:31:20.529 Things like that, it would be so nice if you 00:31:20.529 --> 00:31:23.849 go to school when you're six and it's like you 00:31:23.849 --> 00:31:26.900 go to the... to the course of mathematics, you 00:31:26.900 --> 00:31:30.140 go to the course of French English, and then 00:31:30.140 --> 00:31:33.420 you go to the course like this, like mirroring 00:31:33.420 --> 00:31:37.420 and open communication. And it's so weird that 00:31:37.420 --> 00:31:41.900 they don't learn us that at school. I feel that 00:31:41.900 --> 00:31:45.099 a lot. And it looks like Lina wants to add, because 00:31:45.099 --> 00:31:51.000 yeah, you work at schools. What I want to say 00:31:51.000 --> 00:31:55.019 is I... take a lot from liberation journey. So 00:31:55.019 --> 00:31:59.680 I use many lessons from that in my daily life. 00:31:59.819 --> 00:32:04.099 So I'm a schoolteacher. So I use it in my team 00:32:04.099 --> 00:32:06.279 and with my children. But the only difference 00:32:06.279 --> 00:32:13.700 is there I use it. So there is no, they don't, 00:32:13.700 --> 00:32:20.480 I don't receive it. So I guess. So without explaining, 00:32:20.779 --> 00:32:23.140 I give like, hey, I make the assumption that 00:32:23.140 --> 00:32:25.980 or hey, how you're walking now to me is like, 00:32:26.160 --> 00:32:28.900 this is what your body language looks for me. 00:32:28.980 --> 00:32:33.259 And I do little kids exercise with them about 00:32:33.259 --> 00:32:38.140 communicating about that. So, yeah, I really 00:32:38.140 --> 00:32:41.420 use it in my daily life, but the only difference 00:32:41.420 --> 00:32:44.339 is I don't receive it. And that's the longing 00:32:44.339 --> 00:32:47.680 part that I feel like, huh, yeah, I want to receive 00:32:47.680 --> 00:32:52.619 that. Yeah, because if I can add on it, it's 00:32:52.619 --> 00:32:55.539 like the same. We haven't seen it in the liberation 00:32:55.539 --> 00:32:57.980 journey, but the wheel of consent, if it's about 00:32:57.980 --> 00:33:01.960 giving and receiving. I think every kid of six, 00:33:02.039 --> 00:33:08.299 even three, it's so easy. But now when you explain 00:33:08.299 --> 00:33:10.700 it to people or you say, can you give me something 00:33:10.700 --> 00:33:12.700 for my pleasure or can I give you something for 00:33:12.700 --> 00:33:14.940 your pleasure or for my pleasure? People are 00:33:14.940 --> 00:33:18.799 looking at me like, what are you saying? Um, 00:33:18.819 --> 00:33:20.940 of course, if, if, if you do this with people 00:33:20.940 --> 00:33:23.640 who have done some work and some personal work, 00:33:23.700 --> 00:33:27.099 then it's okay. But some people, they have no 00:33:27.099 --> 00:33:30.700 clue. Or even like, if you ask, what do you want 00:33:30.700 --> 00:33:35.759 to receive from me? I don't know. Yeah, let's 00:33:35.759 --> 00:33:39.079 do it from the age of three. I think like learning 00:33:39.079 --> 00:33:44.619 stuff like that. Or even earlier or even earlier. 00:33:45.039 --> 00:33:48.019 Indeed. Or it's just with whichever adult is. 00:33:48.220 --> 00:33:52.759 in contact with you, right? But I really feel, 00:33:52.920 --> 00:33:54.799 you know, when you started sharing Annabelle, 00:33:55.140 --> 00:33:57.960 I have that so strongly also, like, oh my God, 00:33:58.200 --> 00:34:00.880 why do we need to relearn this? Because it's 00:34:00.880 --> 00:34:05.220 so natural for kids, right? And I get so intensely, 00:34:05.500 --> 00:34:08.360 intensely happy, Lynn, when I hear you're like, 00:34:08.639 --> 00:34:10.539 you know, I'm bringing this into the school. 00:34:11.239 --> 00:34:14.239 And it starts like that, right? You're just embodying 00:34:14.239 --> 00:34:18.400 it. Maybe it seems like it doesn't have a big 00:34:18.400 --> 00:34:21.860 impact, but I really believe it has for the kids 00:34:21.860 --> 00:34:26.139 that come in contact with you. Good job. Yeah. 00:34:26.619 --> 00:34:31.139 Teacher Lindy. It feels like, yeah, simple. And 00:34:31.139 --> 00:34:34.340 the kids are just very open for it. I can say 00:34:34.340 --> 00:34:36.820 it's easier with them than with grownups too. 00:34:38.300 --> 00:34:40.280 To do this, it's like you said, look, it's for 00:34:40.280 --> 00:34:42.460 them. It's like second nature. They only just 00:34:42.460 --> 00:34:44.260 need a structure. Like, ah, yeah, okay. Yeah. 00:34:44.679 --> 00:34:48.099 Okay. Logic. Yeah, it's logic that if I do that 00:34:48.099 --> 00:34:51.159 with my body or how I say things or how I assume 00:34:51.159 --> 00:34:54.840 things that maybe can come across different with 00:34:54.840 --> 00:34:57.480 the other and you just give them like a little 00:34:57.480 --> 00:35:01.880 space to experiment with that and a little... 00:35:01.880 --> 00:35:05.980 Frame? Framework. Frame, yeah, frame. Yeah, and 00:35:05.980 --> 00:35:10.559 it's the progress you can see it happens very 00:35:10.559 --> 00:35:13.559 quickly, but the maintaining part is also for 00:35:13.559 --> 00:35:16.630 them the... the hardest way. So that's why I 00:35:16.630 --> 00:35:19.710 go full blown one year, because I have a class 00:35:19.710 --> 00:35:23.150 of my own for one year. And then we do it like, 00:35:23.150 --> 00:35:32.210 yes, a lot. I love it. Thank you. Sweethearts, 00:35:32.489 --> 00:35:35.469 if we're wrapping up soon, is there anything 00:35:35.469 --> 00:35:42.829 more that you want to add? Yeah, I'm glad I did 00:35:42.829 --> 00:35:48.139 the journey. I'm glad I met amazing people. Yeah, 00:35:48.239 --> 00:35:53.800 it was a nice six month journey. Yeah, and I 00:35:53.800 --> 00:35:56.480 learned some more things about myself and it 00:35:56.480 --> 00:36:00.179 was interesting. And it's also for me amazing 00:36:00.179 --> 00:36:03.239 to see how I came into the first weekend, like 00:36:03.239 --> 00:36:07.820 as a broken middle bird who just fell out the 00:36:07.820 --> 00:36:11.360 nest. And then a couple of months later, I'm 00:36:11.360 --> 00:36:17.090 like... I found maybe my liberation back in the 00:36:17.090 --> 00:36:21.170 simplicity of it. Because what I'm actually hearing 00:36:21.170 --> 00:36:25.110 now, when you use the word simple, you feel like 00:36:25.110 --> 00:36:29.150 you can do it. Like it's right there, it's accessible, 00:36:29.389 --> 00:36:34.809 it's easy for you to grab it and hold it. That's 00:36:34.809 --> 00:36:36.550 actually what I'm hearing now when you speak. 00:36:36.809 --> 00:36:39.429 Yeah, exactly. And now at this moment, I feel 00:36:39.429 --> 00:36:43.929 really centered. in a way, and I can pinpoint 00:36:43.929 --> 00:36:52.409 things better than before, yeah. I just want 00:36:52.409 --> 00:37:00.210 to thank you, thank you all, so grateful, so... 00:37:00.210 --> 00:37:03.429 I'm going to get emotional here, but it's just 00:37:03.429 --> 00:37:10.659 such a different version of myself and... I'm 00:37:10.659 --> 00:37:15.440 feeling stronger, more confident, more woman 00:37:15.440 --> 00:37:27.219 -y. Yeah. And it's just like, sometimes that's 00:37:27.219 --> 00:37:29.059 something I remember and that also the liberation 00:37:29.059 --> 00:37:33.420 journey like triggers or showed me. It's like, 00:37:33.739 --> 00:37:35.820 I remember like when I was a kid and you grow 00:37:35.820 --> 00:37:42.449 up and you get things re -learned and sometimes 00:37:42.449 --> 00:37:45.090 it's like it was in my head like does it has 00:37:45.090 --> 00:37:47.829 to be that complicated does it have to be like 00:37:47.829 --> 00:37:50.650 that and and all the social rules and other rules 00:37:50.650 --> 00:37:56.969 and okay and it felt normal and in the exercises 00:37:56.969 --> 00:38:00.010 it was so many times that I felt like oh yeah 00:38:00.010 --> 00:38:03.929 I was I was thinking that too like okay it doesn't 00:38:03.929 --> 00:38:07.530 have to be that complex and then like the affirmation 00:38:07.530 --> 00:38:10.420 of it like yes indeed what you're feeling doesn't 00:38:10.420 --> 00:38:14.320 have to be complex or how we communicate or how 00:38:14.320 --> 00:38:21.420 things can go and it gave my inner voice or inner 00:38:21.420 --> 00:38:25.159 thoughts like more strength like hey if I feel 00:38:25.159 --> 00:38:30.079 that this is the way then this is the fucking 00:38:30.079 --> 00:38:35.760 way and yeah it doesn't it made me so so much 00:38:35.760 --> 00:38:40.179 stronger and Yeah, confident in who I am, who 00:38:40.179 --> 00:38:44.719 I want to be and with the recognition like it 00:38:44.719 --> 00:38:48.699 was always there. It's not like a new Lynn, it's 00:38:48.699 --> 00:38:53.800 like the old one. Yeah, showing up more again. 00:38:57.239 --> 00:39:00.699 Beautiful. Beautiful how you say it, Lynn. Love 00:39:00.699 --> 00:39:07.710 it. Your tears are welcome. Thank you. Happy 00:39:07.710 --> 00:39:13.670 tears. Thank you both so much for wanting to 00:39:13.670 --> 00:39:19.969 sit together online, virtually, and share pieces 00:39:19.969 --> 00:39:23.670 of your mind and your heart, and maybe your body 00:39:23.670 --> 00:39:25.829 and I don't know from where you were speaking. 00:39:28.489 --> 00:39:32.780 Thank you for listening. If you're curious about 00:39:32.780 --> 00:39:35.440 the liberation journey yourself or want to explore 00:39:35.440 --> 00:39:38.059 one -on -one coaching, you can find more info 00:39:38.059 --> 00:39:41.280 on my website or reach out directly. I'd love 00:39:41.280 --> 00:39:43.840 to hear how this episode landed for you. Feel 00:39:43.840 --> 00:39:45.920 free to share it with someone who might need 00:39:45.920 --> 00:39:48.340 it or leave a comment to let me know what touched 00:39:48.340 --> 00:39:51.800 you. Until next time, keep breathing, keep being 00:39:51.800 --> 00:39:54.179 real and I'll meet you in the next episode.