Yes, sir. How are you? I'm fine, sir. How are
you? I am fine. Never better. Well, that's good
to hear. I hope you're warm wherever you are.
I am warm. I'm in Southern California, which
is crazy with with our weather. You got the short
with shorts and t -shirt nowadays. I know. I
know. It was snowing last week here and today
it's 72. Where are you? I'm just north of Atlanta,
Georgia. Okay. Yeah. My parents are in Connecticut
and I'm a transplanted New Yorker. So knowing
in Atlanta. Yeah. Recently. What part of New
York? I grew up in Brooklyn. Okay. I went to
NYU and I lived in Westchester. I love that part
of New York. Yeah. I can't get rid of my Brooklyn
accent completely. That's a good thing. I think
so. All right. So I'm already recording it. So
all I'm going to do is just introduce you a little
bit. Now I want to know exactly how to pronounce
your name. Is it Kion? You got it. Perfect. Kion.
Like a Kion something. And my last name is Sanei.
Three syllables. Sanei. Sanei. What is that?
It's Iranian. It's Iranian, okay. That's okay.
My maiden name was Sicilian and no one could
pronounce it. Oh, really? What's your maiden
name? The Lethady. The Lethady. Military with
a P, but it's spelled completely different. The
Lethady. When I was in New York I played I played
soccer for an Italian team and it was a true
Italian team, like off the boat, they didn't
speak English. Oh no! But I bet you had very
good food. I had great food, I had amazing food
and I also had like the guy who was our coach,
I took a date out one night to this fancy restaurant
and he was a maitre d' and an opera singer. I'm
like what the heck? He came over to our table.
He starts singing. I'm like, my God, I see you
only on Sundays. And then he was an amazing cook.
He invited us to his home. His wife went to Italy
because he invited the whole team. And he made
some weird, amazing food, like octopus or something.
That sounds very Southern Italian. My mother
and father were born and raised in Sicily. There
you go. Yeah, yeah. So I'll tell you, do you
have time for another funny story? You'll like
it. Yeah, tell me. I'll tell you a few Italian
stories you'd love. So it was me, one American
guy and one Jamaican guy on this team. And the
coach barely spoke English, but and the players
barely spoke English, but at least they spoke.
Yeah. Assistant coach spoke no English whatsoever.
So there was a time where the coach couldn't
make the game and I was playing And while I was
playing, I just heard my name in the background.
Gia! Gia! Gia! Like, every time I got the ball,
he'd be like, Gia! At halftime, I told people,
I said, tell this guy to dream. Why is he constantly
calling my name? I don't understand what he's
doing. It's just not good. So they told him,
and he said, well, I have to, I have to say things,
but he doesn't understand me, so I'll just call
his name. Oh my God! That guy. So I told him,
I said, please tell him to shut up the second
half. He can't tell me anything. And I'm just
making me nervous. Of course. Every time I got
the ball. Yeah. Yeah. And the guys, we had a
guy, Cesare, you know, he wasn't like Caesar
or Cesare. And it wasn't like, like, it was Vincenzo
and Cesare and those guys, you know, they were
all Italian. And he smoked during halftime. He
would smoke. a cigarette during halftime, but
he used to play on the AC Milan under 18 team.
He was a great player, but he would just sit
there and smoke. I'm like, at least in the halftime,
there's smoke coming out from our team. It's
okay. And then I learned a lot from them. The
funniest thing I learned was they would curse
at each other and they would go at each other.
Yeah. And I'm, you know, my background's Iranian.
And if you did that, you would never talk to
each other for the rest of your life. But I loved
it. They were the best friends. They would say
things to their mothers and their sisters and
their fathers and everything in the middle of
the game. And then we go out, they're like, oh,
you want to go for a cappuccino later? I'm like,
what the hell? I thought you were fighting. I
know. My family is like that. Yeah. It sounds
like they're arguing. It sounds like they're,
you know, screaming, they're yelling, whatever.
I know. One time I was running around and the
ref goes, and then he puts a red card up. I'm
like, there's nothing going on. What's the red
card? I look back, two of our defenders are going
at it with each other. The defenders on our own
team, they're fighting and yelling. I know that
Italian temper is like, yeah, I always swore
I was not going to marry an Italian because,
I mean, I grew up with all of that screaming
and yelling, you know, in my house it was yelling
and duck, you know. It's just a little too...
A little too emotional, let's just say that.
But I mean, they wear their emotions on their,
what's the phrase on your sleeve? They're passionate.
I love Italians. I love Italians. Very passionate.
From there on out, I love Italians. Well, we're
crazy. I gotta tell you, we're crazy. But it's
true. The food is good. You know, I'll say that.
Food is good. The people are good. Anyways, I
thought I'd share those with you. I love those
stories. I think those are great. Do you still
play? I do. I play like three or four times a
week even. Wow. I play more now than I've ever
played. It's an amazing sport. I mean, you don't
need to do anything else than that for your health
because I mean, you're constantly running. Yeah.
But as long as you protect your joints. That's
true. You got to protect your joints and also,
you know, you get injured from time to time.
You got to keep going back. Yeah. Yeah. That's
the price of getting older. All right. So, Kian,
how do you want me to introduce you? Because
you have got multiple things here. Education
and care and independence. What can I say to
introduce you? Maybe just make it simple. Just
say I'm the founder and CEO of Independa and
then just give the blurb on Independa. That's
fine. All right. All right, everyone. I am so
happy to have you here on our podcast or YouTube
channel, however you're watching us or listening
to us. I am so happy to be introducing you to
the founder of Independa Incorporated. I am going
to let him tell you all about this amazing amazing
organization. It's Independent Health Hub. And
if you haven't heard of it, you're going to hear
all about it today. All right. Keon Sanayee.
Did I say it right? Almost. You said Sanayee.
You got the three syllables. Sanayee. Got the
E. Sanayee. Keon Sanayee. It's a beautiful name.
Thank you. Thank you. Great to be with you, Esther,
and with your audience. Let's see, what did you
ask me? You asked me to tell about Independence.
So, Independence is a software company dedicated
towards providing remote engagement, education
and care, primarily for older adults and regardless
of the residence. So, they could be at home or
they could be in a senior living community. Literally,
we have solutions from the hospital to the home
and everything in between. And the whole idea
is to provide the opportunity to live where you
are longer, safer, more comfortably, and delay
or maybe even eliminate the next, certainly episode,
but possibly entire stage of care. And who wouldn't
want that? Exactly. So how did you find it? What
was the catalyst that brought this into fruition?
It's it's almost funny, but first off on a personal
note my parents were taking care of my Grandparents
many moons ago. So the company was founded 17
years ago and leading up to that my parents had
taken care of my grandparents and I didn't think
about it at the time, but everything was very
manual as you know and and so there were no tools
and when I was looking at the next big thing
to do and certainly the demographic was very
obvious we have you know, huge tsunami of the
silver wave coming through our society and many
other places in the world. But it was interesting
to me the brand for technology for older adults,
even 17 years ago was, guess what it was Esther,
and it still is. I've fallen and I can't get
up. I wasn't even going to say it. Yeah, so that
was ingrained. Yeah. So that's kind of like a
downer type of brand, but effective in that it
got the point across. Also, the secondary brand
was the Clapper. Yes, right. Anything remote.
I was thinking like, yeah, exactly. So I was
thinking, there's a huge opportunity for technology
to do a much better job for older adults. You
know, how come we haven't done a better job?
And what does it take to do a better job? And
first off, is there a market? The market was
absolutely there and it still is. And then second
is market. By that, I mean, is there a pain point?
Is there a need? And really, the need is between
having someone who cares for you personally,
your daughter, your son, your friend, your neighbor
with you when you need them doesn't have to be
all the time. And and having no one or having
a professional. So what if you don't have someone
with you, but someone who loves you can leave
something behind that brings you the world instead
of, you know, necessarily a home care person.
And if you're in home care, then you can leave
us behind, because you're not with them necessarily
24 seven, but you can actually engage and do
things and allow the family to engage in really
meaningful ways. And again, bring the world to
the person. And same thing in senior living.
If you're in senior living, it's still challenging
to actually engage with someone down the hall.
So what if you can bring the menus and the work
orders and the community calendars and surveys
and broadcast messages, everything else in a
unified way to this person that makes operations
easier and their life easier and more engaging.
Exactly. Now, the independent service is really
It's a TV. It's on the TV. So what made you decide
to do it that way? Because I know a lot of things
are apps or a lot of, you know, I'm speaking
to a lot of people that are doing a lot of motion,
either apps or motion detection kind of devices.
So what made you think of or your engineers or
however that came out that you're going to put
it on the TV, which I think is a brilliant idea
anyway. Well, I appreciate that actually. It's
almost too obvious, right, because it has so
many advantages, but it's also very, very hard
to do. And when we did it, it was darn near impossible.
So there's a few things that came to be. One
is we actually had the world's first tablet for
older adults. And and, you know, literally, like
when tablets came out, we we launched at CES
with a tablet for older adults with the application
when people were just introducing the actual
tablet. So it was it was a big hit. The reality
is, though, we found that the tablets don't work.
And the reason they don't work is, again, almost
obvious, but we figured it out in the marketplace,
which is the screen's kind of too small. The
usage is not very user friendly, so you have
to kind of hold the device if you want to engage
with it. There's motions that not necessarily
people are comfortable with. If you put it on
a stand, some older adults actually have problems
with the forearms actually getting tired after
a while. If it's connected to batteries, so the
batteries being charged, then it's really not
mobile. So why do you have the small screen if
it's not mobile? And if it's not connected, then
it's on your lap or wherever it is, all the issues
I mentioned. Plus, if it's a dedicated system,
it's very expensive as a dedicated system. And
if it's a general tablet that you have as well,
you just can download the app. Then, you know,
the son and the granddaughter and grandson comes
over and they add their own apps and they do
their own things and, you know, or you drop it.
So there's all these reasons why the tablet wasn't
the right platform. Now, everybody, including
myself, said, OK, we got to get on the TV, got
to get on the TV. And what happened was LG, our
partner, who was actually an early investor in
our company, was looking for the best platform
for health care and remote engagement and remote
care. And they chose us. And we're very fortunate
that we've had a longstanding, wonderful partnership
with them for many years now. And we then converted
not just the application to go on the TV, but
we redesigned it for the TV. And we've even redesigned
it since then to get on consumer TVs. So it looks
like a Netflix application on the TV or a tablet.
And you're very comfortable with that because
if you have a TV or a tablet, you know how that
looks. But also we added it to a mobile device
anyway, even for the older adults. So we always
had it for children or staff. But now the older
adult could be on a mobile app today. 17 years
ago, that wasn't as prevalent today. A lot of
people are mobile apps, so you can use that.
You can use a tablet or any computer. Or any
tablet or LG TV or Sony TV now as well. So we
really take that whole question away of what
do I have to to to engage with independent? You
could just do whatever you like exactly. So walk
me through it. So if I get if I get the product,
it's a product. The physical service is a subscription
service. Yeah, it's not a device. So how does
that work? I get it. So I have it. I have my
mom -in -law. You know that I'm going to be her
primary whatever. And how does that work? Walk
me through it. OK. So. We're primarily focused
on organizations. So if you have, there's all
sorts of different ways that we engage with organizations
to help them engage with your mom. But if you
want to engage with mom directly, we make it
super simple to be giving and giving back. So
you can go to independent .com and download the
app. You could also go to the web store, the
web OS store on LG and download independent.
In both cases, it's called the independent companion.
Actually, you'll look for independent. It'll
come up and you download the app. So then what
does the app do? Let's say mom has a computer
so she can go to independent .com and launch
the health app. She'll get a whole bunch of features
and benefits for free. So she'll get games for
free. You'll get the ability to download our
mobile companion for mom from iOS or Android
for free. And then you could send her pictures.
You could send her voice messages. You could
send her video messages. You could do video chat
with her if she's on a computer. If she does
it on a LG TV, you can add a USB camera and do
video chat with her. All this is our own technology.
It's all secure. I love the way you're giggling
and happy about what I'm sharing. Yeah, because
I love the idea. of the TV because it's so much
easier for older adults. You know, I mean, my
sister is nine years older than me. So she's
in her 70s, you know, and she just every time
she has to do a new app, she's just like, oh,
you know, but the TV she can manage. So I just
love that idea. And we consume things differently.
People don't appreciate that. But as a TV consumer,
we're sitting, you know, it's big for macular
degeneration issues. It's comfortable. And it's
technology that we learned much earlier. So we're
very, very comfortable with it. So if you add
the camera, you could do all of the things I
mentioned. On top of that, we have a really wonderful,
we've called her Angela for over a decade now.
We have a trademark on Angela as a caregiver.
So we have an AI -based. Angela caregiver for
you also they can and we actually call it companion
Angela companion So you could chat with her as
a friend. You can ask health questions So it's
really cool So is it based? Is it like Alexa?
Is it big? I mean, can you ask it anything or
it's all health related questions? No anything
you could ask it, you know You can ask it any
kind of research question philosophy question
chat about it whatever you want. We use ChatGPT
as an engine, but we add some other guardrails
and health -related things, and also we add engagement
back into our interface. So like the first time
you log in, it helps you choose the interface
with Angela that you're comfortable with. So
you can pick a different face. Itself, it's helping
you. Or itself, it helps you pick the voice that
you like. And then it helps you make sure that
your microphone is on. So if you don't have your
microphone on, it sends you through that. So
it's a specific application for us. I like that.
I like that it guides you through. I mean, Alexa
does that too, but it's very helpful to go through
that. And it sounds like... Independent is constantly
changing and growing. I mean, the fact that you're
using ChatGPT, I mean, that hasn't been around
for 17 years. So I love that. How else do you
see AI impacting this service? Well, it's already
impacted us in a number of positive ways. This
is a service that's customer focused, so it's
easy to kind of explain that. On our engineering
side, it's impacted us quite a bit in a positive
way where we can do more with less and faster.
I'll give you an example. We had a hospital patient
education system that was written in a different
code base. And it would have taken us probably
four months to convert it into our latest and
greatest code base. We actually took the time
during COVID to upgrade our entire code system.
So we wanted to do that with a patient education
system. And we were never able to come up with
the many months to do that. And then we used
AI. And literally, within a week, we did the
whole thing. So there's a lot of operational
efficiencies. And just for me personally, I use
it all the time as heavy lifting things, like
if there's a market that we want to go after,
it's like having an MBA from. Wharton, you know,
work for you for six months and give you the
answers. But it's not necessarily a snap of a
finger. You have to engage and give it some really
good direction and question some things and maybe
run it through a few different engines and combine
things. But at the end of the day, you could
do all that. Sure. Yeah, we're not in the Star
Trek area yet. Not yet. We're getting close.
We're getting close. Yeah. Either we're getting
close to computer on Star Trek, or the Borg,
you know, we're all unified. One other thing
to be clear also, we get a lot of data on people
like the response to games, or how long they're
engaged in different things. We ask some health
related questions. So we have information that
way. And so the AI helps us quite a bit in the
background also, to see if something isn't quite
right. and not necessarily to diagnose, but maybe
raise a flag and say, hey, daughter. I mean,
there's simple things like if mom hasn't entered
her health information, like let's say she hasn't
stepped on a scale, or let's say things that
are maybe minor one at a time, but with certain
patterns, they become something that maybe you
should look at. Exactly. Is it integrated with
products like scales and blood pressure and whatever?
Yeah. So there's really four value props that
we have. One is the social engagement, which
is a lot of what we wanted to offer society and
certainly in America, everyone who wants to use
it. There's a second one, which is organizational
engagement. So I mentioned things like all the
apps that are integrated in different companies
and organizations. Third one is, and there's
no order to this. Third one is clinical engagement.
So that's where we integrate with devices and
you have thresholds and alerts and you can say
things like, if mom hasn't stepped on the scale,
let me know for two days, let's say, or if mom,
you could do all sorts of things. But normally
those are reserved for organizations as well.
because it's harder to manage that one consumer
at a time. But an organization may say, you know,
I'd like to know if everyone staying with my
short term rehab community is stepping on the
scale like we asked them to every day. And if
they haven't for two days, you know, I'd like
my staff to be notified. So there's a lot of
interesting things. Or in home care, you could
leave this behind and empower the family to manage
mom from a distance. What if she steps on the
scales gained 10 % weight in five days, you know,
be notified. So there's a lot of both comfort
and really a peace of mind that you can give
family members by being able to manage things
more effectively. Exactly. I mean, knowledge
is, you know, just having that piece of information
can reduce a lot of stress and anxiety. It's
not knowing that increases for the families mostly.
So is it integrated with any telehealth services
like with the physicians or as of yet? It is.
Yeah. It is so where we sit as there's one level
above everything else. So, for instance, you
can have 24 7 access to a doctor, a dentist or
a therapist and those are through our partnerships
where you pay for that. If you're on the system
and you, but for second opinions for emergencies
for after hours for the under insured, under
insured, et cetera. There's, you know, this benefit
of being able to do that. So that's that. and
it's all 50 states and it's really a great service.
It applied to me once, you know, I had a really
bad toothache and it was a Friday and I'd woken
up at one in the morning and it just kept getting
worse during the day and suddenly at the end
of the day I'm like, what did you do now? You
can't even see anyone until Monday. I'm like,
I know where I can go. So I literally went on
to Panda and this wonderful dentist, he happened
to be out of Riverside, as I mentioned to you
before we started recording, I'm in California.
uh and and he looked at it and he said yeah you're
getting an infection and he gave me antibiotics
and went to the um to the pharmacy and i started
taking them the same day and monday i called
my dentist and she said no need to come in that's
what i would have done wow that is awesome i
love that i mean just to have that You know relief
not the only relief from the pain But also just
the relief of knowing that someone is watching
out for you somebody with that education Now
you mentioned about collecting the data, you
know on and as a user I could understand how
that can be Creepy as some people say but as
a marketer There's nothing better. I mean because
being able to provide what your target audience
needs or wants? I mean, it's never been easier.
Yeah. But at the same time, how do you protect
that data? What security do you have for that?
Or I know a lot of older people are just nervous
that they don't even want to have an Alexa device
in their home because, you know, it's always
listening or Yeah, so that's an awesome question.
And one of the design goals that we've had all
along was that we designed it for ourselves.
So like, what would you like to see in an application
like this? Or what would I like to see? And so
that means it's designing with the person, not
for them. It's really all about not being patronizing
and not being big brotherish. And when it comes
to marketing, We have always, not even once as
an exception, we tell people the data is yours,
we don't sell it, we don't rent it. So, and we
even went to great lengths. Now everybody has
some video chat, but we actually created video
chat technology very, very early on. Like ours
was out before Zoom, where because of security,
we wanted to make sure that we can control the
fact that if somebody's using. in our system,
somebody else does a market to them the next
day and says, hey, listen, you want to travel
to Bali with me, as long as you don't have a
little bit of money, I would love to travel the
world with you. So unfortunately, a lot of the
platforms that we're used to that are not we
call them public platforms, or they're not really
public, they're private companies. They sell
and rent and market to that data. And it's been
super scary to see like if you open up a Facebook
account. and just give it give yourself a profile
of being let's say 80 years old and you know
put a picture of whatever and see how fast people
are marketing to you all sorts of scary things
so yeah we're very mindful of that and we're
very respectful and very protective we're HIPAA
compliant and you know for us that's really really
important. It is very scary. I mean, I texted
someone the other day something about a liability
insurance, the name of the company, and now I
can't go on YouTube without commercials for that
company coming up. I have never seen a commercial
for that company ever until I texted that information
to someone. So yeah, it's a little scary. But
as a marketer - Which platform were you on? email
as far as texting, just my Amazon, I have a Samsung
Galaxy phone and just on just the regular texting,
just texted it out to her. That's it. So if I
can give two cents as a side note, that makes
sense because on an Android platform, you don't
have the same level of protection on that data.
Then you do on an Apple platform. That's the
difference. So I've never had that happen. That's
why I asked, because I'm on Apple. And I suspect
if I'm on Apple texting to Android on the other
side, it's probably the same. But if it's Apple
to Apple, at least I'm hoping, which is what
their commitment is, that they don't sell that
data. Yeah, I mean, I know that about Android.
But to see it, I mean, I'm telling you, it was
within the hour. You know, I was all of a sudden
seeing commercials for this company going. I
didn't even know they had commercials. And why
now that now every time I watch YouTube, that
commercial comes up. It's it's interesting. Interesting.
I get it. I get it. So I love that this technology.
I mean, I do a lot for senior care. My as an
OT working in geriatrics, head injury. That is
my that's my thing. It's my skill set. And I
love it. But I think this technology with independent
is across the board. It's not just for senior
care. Do you find that your clients are more?
You know, what demographic are you seeing using
independent more than any other? Or maybe maybe
not. Maybe they're all equal. It's not all equal.
There's there's a lot of opportunities and. You
know, a lot of our success is based on what we
say no to, actually, not what we say yes to,
because like you said, it's just so much opportunity.
Like I give you an example, prison systems. So,
you know, many prisons have TVs in the cells.
And if you can bring telehealth and engagement
and education, one of our partnerships is with
WebMD. It's exclusively fantastic where You get
all this great content delivered to you over
1 ,200 videos in English and Spanish in multiple
categories and subcategories. You can do searches,
so any kind of surgery you want to have for yourself,
for your spouse, for your child, for your neighbor
or friend. You can learn about it beforehand.
You can learn about recovery after. You can learn
about how to ask the right questions. It's phenomenal,
and it's available to you. So you can learn that
in a prison cell. Or if you imagine a doctor
coming to you and having an engagement right
in your cell instead of having that person. Now,
if you go to the doctor in the prison, then maybe
that's fine. But sometimes you have to go to
a specialist. And that is super expensive. You
have to have police guards and different types
of vans and buses. Very expensive overtime coming
and going for like a half hour session with a
specialist. Well, they can come into you. So
there's there's a lot of that on that side, which
we haven't done. But the right partners, if they
hear this, they can run with our application
and do that. There's other things like really
generally speaking, the delivery of health care
and engagement into the consumer's home. And
that's not about older adults. That's about how
do I have a platform, not one silo versus another
versus a third. And they can all be included,
but having the same common interface, the same
usability. There's two things about us as engagement
in a holistic way that I've mentioned, and it's
also simplicity. So how do we make things simple
so you don't have to learn different things and,
you know, get stuck and be universally available
on different platforms? And we're having conversations
with entire governments around that. So it's
not just the older adult. It's like imagine if,
if like, let's say for Medicare or for Medicaid,
or the government of some country somewhere in
the world that wants to have a better way to
engage. their consumers, their citizens, educate
them in health, be there quickly if they need
to, if there's an interaction that's needed.
Imagine a pharmacist, for instance, being able
to have a conversation with someone because their
pills maybe are not working well, or maybe they're
old and they can't figure out the color difference.
There's lots of ways that having a secure, holistic
engagement is really valuable. Exactly. And I
mean, nowadays with more and more homes becoming
multi -generational, I can see how getting a
platform that's simple and easy for, you know,
all the generations living in that home, the
new mother, you know, the senior parents, maybe
a disabled son or somebody with some chronic
illness, you know, all living under one roof
and they can all use that independent, not the
EAPs and the, you know, the website and the service
itself. I think you know absolutely I just had
a talk last week I think or maybe the week before
with someone who contacted me from Nigeria and
what's happening in Nigeria according to him
is that so many young people are leaving because
there's no work in Nigeria so they're moving
to other countries but their elderly parents
are still in Nigeria and they don't have the
infrastructure in Nigeria at the moment to take
care of these people so he is looking for he
was looking for marketing help whatever information
on he's building a like an adult daycare type
of program along with caregivers that can go
out and take care of these people while their
children are you know in other countries earning
a living yeah that's a great example if you want
to have them get in touch with me maybe we can
help in in the sense that adult daycare is another
great example you're taking care of someone let's
say nine to six or seven then they go home. And
when they go home, what if the individual can't
afford to come to you every day of the week,
maybe they're coming three days a week? Well,
the other four days a week, they may still be
alone. And if it's a weekend, maybe the daughter
has to go out to a gathering or maybe shopping
and whatnot. Now, if the daughter has a better
holistic way to engage, you know, their parent,
that's great for everyone. And also if the daughter
can send and propagate the application out, easily
to everyone else the other siblings and you know
somebody else living across the country or the
world and they can send messages they can see
mom they can chat with mom they could you know
send an audio file video file all of that uh
that's really and then we have something called
life stories by the way so you can capture someone's
life and audio files and they answer questions
and you capture their wisdom you could share
that and all that complements something like
daycare complements home care complements senior
exactly what about I had two people that I spoke
with. I speak with a lot of people all over.
I had a woman in Australia who teaches older
adults, only older adults, French, how to speak
French, and she does that online. So that's an
online leisure activity, let's say. And then
there's another woman, and I think she's in Massachusetts,
I can't recall, but she teaches art online. Again,
to older adults. So what about leisure services
like that? Is that integrated into Independa
as well? It is. We have a great partnership with
a company called Spiro 100. They do exercise
videos for older adults. Okay. Of all these videos,
you can search by category, seated, standing,
laying down. agility, flexibility, strength,
whatever. And you can find the right videos with
the right instructors that are teaching you.
So you could do that right again on your big
screen TV or tablet or whatever. Also, if the
individual then wants to use our platform to
engage with someone, they can do... Delivery
of different things too. So it's yes video chat,
but they can also deliver content. They can deliver
PDF They can do surveys. They can ask people
a bunch of questions. They could do broadcast
messages So if it's a platform that they're using
as a business not just let's say daughter mother
Then they could do a survey to everyone and they
they can have multiple categories and groups
So they could have females versus males. They
could have you know, younger older adults versus
older adult older adults They can have people
in different categories of French And they could
gear their content that they send, the videos.
They could gear the service that they have. If
they were senior living, they could gear their
menus, let's say. So you could have a diabetic
menu, and diabetic videos, and diabetic surveys.
In fact, two things. I saw there was a thumbs
down that happened when you were chatting. I
don't know if you saw that. I don't know. Oh,
yeah. No, I saw something. No, on my side. So
I don't. It just I wasn't moving. But somehow
let's see if anything happens. So no, it has
a mind of its own. But the other thing is offline,
I'm happy to help you, Esther, in any way. If
you want to use the platform for your own people,
you could sort of give it and have a central
way of managing it, similar to what you're saying
in Australia. But if you have all these contacts
and people that you want to have a universal
way of engaging, I'm happy to chat with you.
All right. Yeah, I absolutely love that. I mean.
Wheels are already turning like thinking about
how so what trends in senior care? Do you see
because I know in America, you know, my family's
all in Sicily and Italy So we're the only you
know black sheep that left the country my parents
left but What trends do you see? Because in America,
I know that health care is a business. And the
purpose of a business is to make a profit, to
make money. So it doesn't necessarily focus on
preventive care or anything, which I see these,
you know, independent doing. That's basically
what it is. So do you see those trends in senior
care evolving as? 10 ,000 plus people a day are
turning 65. And this year, 2026 is the first
year that the oldest boomers start turning 80,
which traditionally speaking, 80 is when things
start happening. You need surgery, chronic illnesses,
whatever, although people are living longer.
And so there's so many changes coming up. So
how do you see Trends affecting? Independent
in any way sure I'll just share a quick anecdote
a joke in a way. I have two good friends through
the years I've known them both probably close
in one case over 20 years and the other case
about 16 and they both recently turned 80 and
They both separately they know each other through
me, but then you know, they're not friends or
they don't talk and They both separately told
me Keon uh 60 is a new 40 70 is a new 50 but
80 is 80 that was your point that was my point
they are right on the button i mean i have friends
there too i'm 67 so i have friends you know in
this age range and further up and yeah they all
tell me yeah something happens when you hit 80
it's just your i don't know You know, it's not
your body anymore. So and I've read that too.
So I know that things start, you know, happening.
So obviously, as a provider of this, of independent,
you know, founder, I'm sure you guys are always
looking a year, two years, three years, if you
even can with AI anymore. Although it'd be interesting
to see how what prompts would allow AI to give
you that future predictions. But so for us, what's
really important is what we started out from
the outset, which is engagement. So what does
it mean, engagement? I rattled off a whole bunch
of different things that we've unified in a simplified
way. So that's important. And so like AI is a
good example. Three years ago, we didn't have
an AI companion. But now we do. And it's necessary
to be a part of that. I think engagement is one.
The other one is the simplicity of the screen,
so to speak. So it's still a screen. And the
interface is audio, and if you want to type it.
And we use a remote control from LG, so you can
click on it, or Sony. In the case of LG, you
also have a cursor with it, so you can actually
click on it like a mouse. But I think to answer
your question over time, I could see holographic
images. I could see, you know, things that you
wear glasses that put the world in front of you.
And so we have to be agnostic in terms of how
simple is it, not how tragedy, how simple it's
got to be. If it's not simple, it doesn't mean
anything. And also how effective is it in what
we're trying to do. Does it make life easier?
Does it make life more meaningful, more fun?
So for us, it's all about doing fun things with
games. And we have daily words, daily jokes,
daily, did you know what happened today? We have
a daily quote. So we want you to come in and
engage and have fun. And then friends and family
get to be more at peace with you and have peace
of mind on what you're doing. And you get to
enjoy life more, especially if the car keys are
maybe maybe you're in rural America, maybe healthcare,
and we're not a healthcare company. We're all
about health and wellness. We allow you to stay
where you are longer, stay for more comfortably,
have a better quality of life, preventing things,
but we can't say that we're a healthcare company
because we're not a clinical company. We don't
want to be a medical company. Otherwise, you're
just one little silo to your point about a billing
code and a broken system that we're all in with
sick care, and we don't want to be that. We want
to be this. Yeah, and and I think that's the
only way really To provide that service you do
kind of have to be on the outside of it You can't
be in it because if you are then you just become
part of the wheel But you do have funny you say
that it's funny is that I literally before launching
independent I went to a library back then there
were physical things called Bookstores and libraries
I went to a bookstore was a beat Dalton's I think
and I bought a whole bunch of books in this category
and my favorite one was Christiansen's innovators
prescription. So he had my favorite book was
innovators dilemma from before. And then innovators
prescription was all about our health care system.
And it scared me silly as a consumer realized
all the things he was sharing, but his whole
summary was exactly what you just said, which
is the system is so broken and he showed why
that it will never fix itself. And if you want
to be in this system, just go in the edge and
help people on the edge because there's so much
opportunity in the edge. It's true. I mean, the
more ever since I opened up, you know, the aging
place directory last year. I mean, I am meeting
people with some of the most amazing services
and products and things I'd never even thought
of. And it's so interesting to see this entrepreneurial.
revolution, I guess, happening, you know, because
of AI and with AI, you know, it's, it's going
to be very interesting to see the next few years
of how all of this develops. Because for sure,
the demographic is there. I mean, these are people
who need the services and boomers are used to
having services, you know, so yeah, we all want
that. So as the CEO and founder of independent,
how do you foster that sense of innovation and
empathy? Because I mean, you're kind of straddling
both your technology and your health, you know,
wellness. So it's it's not one or the other.
It's really the beautiful combination of both.
So how do you foster that in your team or your
staff or I don't know what you call them? Yeah,
it's their staff, the team, our tribe. You know,
you you put it interestingly between technology
and what was the other word? Wellness. Wellness.
OK, so interesting. So if I were to superimpose
those to the two words I use, technology is really
the engagement side. How do we have a platform
that's person centric that does all in one 360
whatever way you want to explain that you go
to one place, but then the wellness is the simplicity
because it's not about feature function benefit.
All that could be cool. But if it's hard to use
and so the empathy that goes into simplicity,
the respect that goes into simplicity is all
about how do we affect change and how do we make
your life better? And if we don't respect you
in a way that we design something that makes
it simple and easy for you and engaging and fun,
nobody pays us to do a word of the day or to
add games or to have all these cool things or
to do life stories. There's a whole industry
of people that charge you for that. We include
that because we think any way we can help you
have a better life makes us better makes you
better and you enjoy things more your friends
and family enjoy things more and then we can
help the organizations who are using us to be
more efficient, to be more effective, to be operationally
better. So it's really a price of admission is
to be engaging in your wellness, engaging in
your health, and then everything else happens
after that. If you start with that, in my opinion,
you know, you don't get anywhere. And that's
part of partially, by the way, Esther, because
a lot of health applications don't have compliance.
And the reason you don't have compliance is because
you're not engaging. And the reason you're not
engaging is because you're not fun. So if you
can make an application or a platform fun, then
respect the person. They're going to want to
do something that's fun. If they're not engaging,
it's on me. It's not on them. Right. But in addition
to the fun, I think what you guys have done or
are doing is that you're making it so integral,
integral, integrated into. Daily life, you know,
I mean, it's not an additional thing to do that
to remember to do It's the thing to do, you know
with your with video chatting with telehealth
with connection to products It's the place to
go. It's sort of like, you know googling it Everybody
goes to Google, you know do you just Google it
Google it? Well now, you know AI's chat is taking
that over but It's like that. Now it's just go
to independent. Independent will do it. Independent
will do it. So that becomes integrated. You could
do a hearing assessment right on the platform.
And if you need something for your hearing, our
partners can sell you the hearing aid at Lucid
Hearing. We have partners that provide lab. tests
into your home. So if you go, you go, you want
to buy something, you can buy it and it comes
to your home. So we, we have a pharmacy discount
card from capital RX, our partners there. So
we have an ecosystem of wellness benefits that
again, are curated. So we're not buying your
thing. Like if you come and say, I'm interested
in that and you go do the service, you don't
get ads from someone else. It's just, it's respectful
to try to give you these services, you know,
as simple and effective way as we can. Is there
anything that it doesn't do that you wanted to
do at this point? It doesn't brush your teeth.
I would like to add transportation service partnership
or ships, but at least one food delivery. That's
a big thing as well. And veterinarian support.
Those are the three that I think would be helpful.
to the demographic. We just haven't done it because
we're busy doing so many other things. And also,
frankly, we do so much that nobody ever does
anything close to us that adding those three
doesn't really buy us anything. It's just the
right thing to do at some point. We want to do
that. Right. It would be more. It would be a
more complete service. But you're right. When
you have 38 things to do that day, it's hard
to add another one or two others. Or I get it.
I get it. But to answer your question candidly,
those three, I think, are still important to
add at some point it's just we don't get any
brownie points for them no matter what it's like
adding another game we have a bunch of games
we can add two more games that we think are fun
nobody's going to not use us because we don't
have them yeah and who's going to use us maybe
more i would think maybe some people might for
the extra two same thing same thing with those
i think so especially the food delivery because
that really is an issue i know my mom -in -law
lived to 102 and that was the hardest thing for
her near the end you know 98 99 100 and so on
is getting the food you know because it was just
difficult to go and pack it and bring it home
and unpack it and it was just a lot easier for
her to get it delivered as she used to say like
we used to do when i was a kid i said yeah okay
only this time it's not in a wagon it's in a
car Well, now it's in a robot, too. It just goes
out in a robot. I know. I know. Well, if Elon
Musk has his way, yeah, we'll have our robots
for sure. So you also host a podcast, Keon's
Kiosk. Is that true? Yeah, it's true. So tell
me about that. We haven't done it recently. I
just have so many contacts and people that I
respect tremendously that I've known. to be really
instrumental in healthcare, in different parts
of healthcare. So we put together this series
for me to get a chance to sort of memorialize
my respect for them and admiration for where
they were, how they did what they did to get
us to where we are. And so I really enjoyed interviewing
them and memorializing that. We're probably not
gonna do the same format going forward, because
this was literally like only six. but each one
was like a deep dive with people that I've known
and like the person who kind of essentially started
digital health, the person who started PACE programs
in America, the person who was the head of all
of health caring for older adults in America
and Kaiser Permanente, you know, and person who
essentially leads the CCRC at home or life plan
at home community, you know. I don't say revolution,
but really momentum that they have. So there's
a lot of admiration that I had for these folks.
So it was my way of memorializing that. But we'll
do some more things. I love that. It sounds like,
do you watch the YouTube show Diary of a CEO?
Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's sort of like that.
He interviews these very influential people,
but they're not famous. You know, it's not like
someone you heard of. But yet when you listen
to them, I mean, they know their stuff. They
are in it and they are all about whatever the
topic is for that particular show. Exactly. And
he's such a great interviewer. He is a great
interviewer. I mean, talk about. He's curious.
He's curious. Yeah, he is. And he's actually
interested in all of these topics. It doesn't
matter if it's economics or if it's nutrition
or technology. You know, he's very fascinated
by it. So that's what makes him such a good interviewer.
But it sounds like that, like Keon's kiosk is
like that. You're interviewing these very influential
people who really have their head in that industry
or niche or whatever. And but yet it's not like
they're famous. They're on the news. Yeah, exactly.
And so for someone who was interested in the
topics that they all I would say are both engaging
and informative and also I think a little bit
just positive in terms of how somebody could
make such a difference. And like you said, we
don't know them. But, you know, like Dr. Jenny
Chen Hansen, who started on lock in the San Francisco
area, which was a very special health program
for primarily Chinese Americans. And the program
was so successful, it was getting some special
dispensation from the government for Medicare
and Medicaid to keep them in the homes. And that
became the PACE programs that we have today.
So she basically started legislation. And she's
done so much more since then, so many titles.
And the humblest, nicest, most engaging, wonderful.
And every one of those guests is like that. So
yeah. I mean, I love that. I mean, the fact that
you have that in your sphere, I think is beautiful.
How do you stay grounded, you know, with all
of this going around you and happening and all
these changes and all these needs and not only
the demographic changing but the technology changing
as well and systems I'm sure are changing, you
know, everything from government to local to
whatever. How do you stay grounded? And by the
way, I think your staff, your tribe, your team
are very fortunate to have you. I appreciate
that it's very kind of you. I'm grounded because
we're all the same and we all do the same things
and we're all shooting for the same things and
basically humans at some level we just want to
have safety and some opportunity and you know
some future for our children if we have any and
that the really basic levels and but I think
maybe a different question is how do I stay somewhat
sane instead of grounded? That's tougher, that's
tougher. I was just actually telling someone,
past couple years I came across this saying about
your greatest challenges are dreams for someone
laying in a hospital bed. And when you think
about that, whether it's like big challenges
or daily challenges, they really are nothing.
compared to like health issues and the fact that
we can walk around and breathe and you know wake
up and do things so gratitude is a big thing
that you know I practice all the time and it's
easy to be grateful when things are going your
way but when they're not that's really hard but
you have to do it the other thing for me personally
is I love what I do so it's not work so it's
you know if and I can't say to everyone this
cliche oh if you don't love what you do do finds
I don't know it's hard sometimes you got to go
make money and all that. But for me, I love what
I do. I love the people I work with. So I'm equally
fortunate with that tribe. It is a tribe. And
I have a lot of people I work for. I work for
the people in this company and my shareholders
and our partners and our customers and my children
and everything. But you have to love what you
do. Yeah, because then it truly is. You have
to love what you do because then it's not work.
you know it really is my friends are forever
telling me Esther when are you going to retire
and I'm like I am retired I mean I'm enjoying
everything that I do yeah you know you like to
travel to China or wherever but I like doing
this you know this is maybe I'm retired too the
way it's going yeah it's okay it's good it's
good because at the end of the day you can lay
your head on your pillow knowing that you helped
so and so or you did this or you know, it's very
fulfilling. And I think that's so very important
as you get older. So then doing your best doing
your best if you do your best. That's it is going
to happen or not happen. But if it's your human
best, which is a lot because a lot of us don't
do our human best. But if we do our best, then
the rest is whatever it is. And then you just
enjoy the moment. That's very stoic of you. It's
true. And it's true. I want to thank you. Stay
on the line. I want to thank you so very much,
everyone. I know that you learned a lot on this
interview and I cannot wait to publish it and
post it. If you have any questions or anything,
what is your website again, Keon? There you go.
Please check out independent .com because I don't
think there's anything except for maybe brushing
your teeth that that little program doesn't do.
And I definitely am going to be checking it out
and writing some more about it. Thank you so
much, Keon. I appreciate it. You're very kind
to us. It was my pleasure. My pleasure. Thank
you.