WEBVTT

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Yes, sir. How are you? I'm fine, sir. How are

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you? I am fine. Never better. Well, that's good

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to hear. I hope you're warm wherever you are.

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I am warm. I'm in Southern California, which

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is crazy with with our weather. You got the short

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with shorts and t -shirt nowadays. I know. I

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know. It was snowing last week here and today

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it's 72. Where are you? I'm just north of Atlanta,

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Georgia. Okay. Yeah. My parents are in Connecticut

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and I'm a transplanted New Yorker. So knowing

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in Atlanta. Yeah. Recently. What part of New

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York? I grew up in Brooklyn. Okay. I went to

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NYU and I lived in Westchester. I love that part

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of New York. Yeah. I can't get rid of my Brooklyn

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accent completely. That's a good thing. I think

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so. All right. So I'm already recording it. So

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all I'm going to do is just introduce you a little

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bit. Now I want to know exactly how to pronounce

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your name. Is it Kion? You got it. Perfect. Kion.

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Like a Kion something. And my last name is Sanei.

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Three syllables. Sanei. Sanei. What is that?

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It's Iranian. It's Iranian, okay. That's okay.

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My maiden name was Sicilian and no one could

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pronounce it. Oh, really? What's your maiden

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name? The Lethady. The Lethady. Military with

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a P, but it's spelled completely different. The

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Lethady. When I was in New York I played I played

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soccer for an Italian team and it was a true

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Italian team, like off the boat, they didn't

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speak English. Oh no! But I bet you had very

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good food. I had great food, I had amazing food

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and I also had like the guy who was our coach,

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I took a date out one night to this fancy restaurant

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and he was a maitre d' and an opera singer. I'm

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like what the heck? He came over to our table.

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He starts singing. I'm like, my God, I see you

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only on Sundays. And then he was an amazing cook.

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He invited us to his home. His wife went to Italy

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because he invited the whole team. And he made

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some weird, amazing food, like octopus or something.

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That sounds very Southern Italian. My mother

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and father were born and raised in Sicily. There

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you go. Yeah, yeah. So I'll tell you, do you

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have time for another funny story? You'll like

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it. Yeah, tell me. I'll tell you a few Italian

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stories you'd love. So it was me, one American

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guy and one Jamaican guy on this team. And the

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coach barely spoke English, but and the players

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barely spoke English, but at least they spoke.

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Yeah. Assistant coach spoke no English whatsoever.

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So there was a time where the coach couldn't

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make the game and I was playing And while I was

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playing, I just heard my name in the background.

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Gia! Gia! Gia! Like, every time I got the ball,

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he'd be like, Gia! At halftime, I told people,

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I said, tell this guy to dream. Why is he constantly

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calling my name? I don't understand what he's

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doing. It's just not good. So they told him,

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and he said, well, I have to, I have to say things,

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but he doesn't understand me, so I'll just call

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his name. Oh my God! That guy. So I told him,

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I said, please tell him to shut up the second

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half. He can't tell me anything. And I'm just

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making me nervous. Of course. Every time I got

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the ball. Yeah. Yeah. And the guys, we had a

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guy, Cesare, you know, he wasn't like Caesar

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or Cesare. And it wasn't like, like, it was Vincenzo

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and Cesare and those guys, you know, they were

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all Italian. And he smoked during halftime. He

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would smoke. a cigarette during halftime, but

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he used to play on the AC Milan under 18 team.

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He was a great player, but he would just sit

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there and smoke. I'm like, at least in the halftime,

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there's smoke coming out from our team. It's

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okay. And then I learned a lot from them. The

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funniest thing I learned was they would curse

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at each other and they would go at each other.

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Yeah. And I'm, you know, my background's Iranian.

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And if you did that, you would never talk to

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each other for the rest of your life. But I loved

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it. They were the best friends. They would say

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things to their mothers and their sisters and

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their fathers and everything in the middle of

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the game. And then we go out, they're like, oh,

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you want to go for a cappuccino later? I'm like,

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what the hell? I thought you were fighting. I

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know. My family is like that. Yeah. It sounds

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like they're arguing. It sounds like they're,

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you know, screaming, they're yelling, whatever.

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I know. One time I was running around and the

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ref goes, and then he puts a red card up. I'm

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like, there's nothing going on. What's the red

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card? I look back, two of our defenders are going

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at it with each other. The defenders on our own

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team, they're fighting and yelling. I know that

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Italian temper is like, yeah, I always swore

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I was not going to marry an Italian because,

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I mean, I grew up with all of that screaming

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and yelling, you know, in my house it was yelling

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and duck, you know. It's just a little too...

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A little too emotional, let's just say that.

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But I mean, they wear their emotions on their,

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what's the phrase on your sleeve? They're passionate.

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I love Italians. I love Italians. Very passionate.

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From there on out, I love Italians. Well, we're

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crazy. I gotta tell you, we're crazy. But it's

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true. The food is good. You know, I'll say that.

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Food is good. The people are good. Anyways, I

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thought I'd share those with you. I love those

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stories. I think those are great. Do you still

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play? I do. I play like three or four times a

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week even. Wow. I play more now than I've ever

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played. It's an amazing sport. I mean, you don't

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need to do anything else than that for your health

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because I mean, you're constantly running. Yeah.

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But as long as you protect your joints. That's

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true. You got to protect your joints and also,

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you know, you get injured from time to time.

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You got to keep going back. Yeah. Yeah. That's

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the price of getting older. All right. So, Kian,

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how do you want me to introduce you? Because

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you have got multiple things here. Education

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and care and independence. What can I say to

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introduce you? Maybe just make it simple. Just

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say I'm the founder and CEO of Independa and

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then just give the blurb on Independa. That's

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fine. All right. All right, everyone. I am so

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happy to have you here on our podcast or YouTube

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channel, however you're watching us or listening

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to us. I am so happy to be introducing you to

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the founder of Independa Incorporated. I am going

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to let him tell you all about this amazing amazing

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organization. It's Independent Health Hub. And

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if you haven't heard of it, you're going to hear

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all about it today. All right. Keon Sanayee.

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Did I say it right? Almost. You said Sanayee.

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You got the three syllables. Sanayee. Got the

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E. Sanayee. Keon Sanayee. It's a beautiful name.

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Thank you. Thank you. Great to be with you, Esther,

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and with your audience. Let's see, what did you

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ask me? You asked me to tell about Independence.

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So, Independence is a software company dedicated

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towards providing remote engagement, education

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and care, primarily for older adults and regardless

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of the residence. So, they could be at home or

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they could be in a senior living community. Literally,

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we have solutions from the hospital to the home

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and everything in between. And the whole idea

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is to provide the opportunity to live where you

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are longer, safer, more comfortably, and delay

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or maybe even eliminate the next, certainly episode,

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but possibly entire stage of care. And who wouldn't

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want that? Exactly. So how did you find it? What

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was the catalyst that brought this into fruition?

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It's it's almost funny, but first off on a personal

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note my parents were taking care of my Grandparents

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many moons ago. So the company was founded 17

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years ago and leading up to that my parents had

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taken care of my grandparents and I didn't think

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about it at the time, but everything was very

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manual as you know and and so there were no tools

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and when I was looking at the next big thing

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to do and certainly the demographic was very

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obvious we have you know, huge tsunami of the

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silver wave coming through our society and many

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other places in the world. But it was interesting

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to me the brand for technology for older adults,

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even 17 years ago was, guess what it was Esther,

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and it still is. I've fallen and I can't get

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up. I wasn't even going to say it. Yeah, so that

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was ingrained. Yeah. So that's kind of like a

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downer type of brand, but effective in that it

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got the point across. Also, the secondary brand

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was the Clapper. Yes, right. Anything remote.

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I was thinking like, yeah, exactly. So I was

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thinking, there's a huge opportunity for technology

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to do a much better job for older adults. You

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know, how come we haven't done a better job?

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And what does it take to do a better job? And

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first off, is there a market? The market was

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absolutely there and it still is. And then second

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is market. By that, I mean, is there a pain point?

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Is there a need? And really, the need is between

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having someone who cares for you personally,

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your daughter, your son, your friend, your neighbor

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with you when you need them doesn't have to be

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all the time. And and having no one or having

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a professional. So what if you don't have someone

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with you, but someone who loves you can leave

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something behind that brings you the world instead

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of, you know, necessarily a home care person.

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And if you're in home care, then you can leave

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us behind, because you're not with them necessarily

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24 seven, but you can actually engage and do

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things and allow the family to engage in really

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meaningful ways. And again, bring the world to

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the person. And same thing in senior living.

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If you're in senior living, it's still challenging

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to actually engage with someone down the hall.

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So what if you can bring the menus and the work

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orders and the community calendars and surveys

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and broadcast messages, everything else in a

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unified way to this person that makes operations

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easier and their life easier and more engaging.

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Exactly. Now, the independent service is really

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It's a TV. It's on the TV. So what made you decide

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to do it that way? Because I know a lot of things

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are apps or a lot of, you know, I'm speaking

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to a lot of people that are doing a lot of motion,

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either apps or motion detection kind of devices.

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So what made you think of or your engineers or

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however that came out that you're going to put

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it on the TV, which I think is a brilliant idea

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anyway. Well, I appreciate that actually. It's

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almost too obvious, right, because it has so

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many advantages, but it's also very, very hard

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to do. And when we did it, it was darn near impossible.

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So there's a few things that came to be. One

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is we actually had the world's first tablet for

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older adults. And and, you know, literally, like

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when tablets came out, we we launched at CES

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with a tablet for older adults with the application

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when people were just introducing the actual

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tablet. So it was it was a big hit. The reality

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is, though, we found that the tablets don't work.

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And the reason they don't work is, again, almost

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obvious, but we figured it out in the marketplace,

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which is the screen's kind of too small. The

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usage is not very user friendly, so you have

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to kind of hold the device if you want to engage

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with it. There's motions that not necessarily

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people are comfortable with. If you put it on

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a stand, some older adults actually have problems

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with the forearms actually getting tired after

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a while. If it's connected to batteries, so the

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batteries being charged, then it's really not

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mobile. So why do you have the small screen if

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it's not mobile? And if it's not connected, then

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it's on your lap or wherever it is, all the issues

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I mentioned. Plus, if it's a dedicated system,

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it's very expensive as a dedicated system. And

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if it's a general tablet that you have as well,

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you just can download the app. Then, you know,

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the son and the granddaughter and grandson comes

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over and they add their own apps and they do

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their own things and, you know, or you drop it.

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So there's all these reasons why the tablet wasn't

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the right platform. Now, everybody, including

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myself, said, OK, we got to get on the TV, got

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to get on the TV. And what happened was LG, our

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partner, who was actually an early investor in

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our company, was looking for the best platform

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for health care and remote engagement and remote

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care. And they chose us. And we're very fortunate

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that we've had a longstanding, wonderful partnership

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with them for many years now. And we then converted

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not just the application to go on the TV, but

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we redesigned it for the TV. And we've even redesigned

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it since then to get on consumer TVs. So it looks

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like a Netflix application on the TV or a tablet.

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And you're very comfortable with that because

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if you have a TV or a tablet, you know how that

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looks. But also we added it to a mobile device

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anyway, even for the older adults. So we always

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had it for children or staff. But now the older

00:14:10.450 --> 00:14:13.889
adult could be on a mobile app today. 17 years

00:14:13.889 --> 00:14:16.320
ago, that wasn't as prevalent today. A lot of

00:14:16.320 --> 00:14:18.120
people are mobile apps, so you can use that.

00:14:18.379 --> 00:14:21.779
You can use a tablet or any computer. Or any

00:14:21.779 --> 00:14:26.059
tablet or LG TV or Sony TV now as well. So we

00:14:26.059 --> 00:14:28.080
really take that whole question away of what

00:14:28.080 --> 00:14:30.500
do I have to to to engage with independent? You

00:14:30.500 --> 00:14:33.120
could just do whatever you like exactly. So walk

00:14:33.120 --> 00:14:37.039
me through it. So if I get if I get the product,

00:14:37.059 --> 00:14:40.799
it's a product. The physical service is a subscription

00:14:40.799 --> 00:14:43.480
service. Yeah, it's not a device. So how does

00:14:43.480 --> 00:14:48.120
that work? I get it. So I have it. I have my

00:14:48.120 --> 00:14:53.240
mom -in -law. You know that I'm going to be her

00:14:53.240 --> 00:14:57.279
primary whatever. And how does that work? Walk

00:14:57.279 --> 00:15:01.580
me through it. OK. So. We're primarily focused

00:15:01.580 --> 00:15:05.000
on organizations. So if you have, there's all

00:15:05.000 --> 00:15:07.580
sorts of different ways that we engage with organizations

00:15:07.580 --> 00:15:10.440
to help them engage with your mom. But if you

00:15:10.440 --> 00:15:12.360
want to engage with mom directly, we make it

00:15:12.360 --> 00:15:16.679
super simple to be giving and giving back. So

00:15:16.679 --> 00:15:19.779
you can go to independent .com and download the

00:15:19.779 --> 00:15:23.580
app. You could also go to the web store, the

00:15:23.580 --> 00:15:26.960
web OS store on LG and download independent.

00:15:27.480 --> 00:15:31.000
In both cases, it's called the independent companion.

00:15:31.159 --> 00:15:32.879
Actually, you'll look for independent. It'll

00:15:32.879 --> 00:15:35.899
come up and you download the app. So then what

00:15:35.899 --> 00:15:38.019
does the app do? Let's say mom has a computer

00:15:38.019 --> 00:15:41.419
so she can go to independent .com and launch

00:15:41.419 --> 00:15:44.720
the health app. She'll get a whole bunch of features

00:15:44.720 --> 00:15:47.620
and benefits for free. So she'll get games for

00:15:47.620 --> 00:15:51.039
free. You'll get the ability to download our

00:15:51.039 --> 00:15:54.159
mobile companion for mom from iOS or Android

00:15:54.159 --> 00:15:57.299
for free. And then you could send her pictures.

00:15:57.659 --> 00:16:00.399
You could send her voice messages. You could

00:16:00.399 --> 00:16:05.539
send her video messages. You could do video chat

00:16:05.539 --> 00:16:08.539
with her if she's on a computer. If she does

00:16:08.539 --> 00:16:12.879
it on a LG TV, you can add a USB camera and do

00:16:12.879 --> 00:16:15.580
video chat with her. All this is our own technology.

00:16:15.759 --> 00:16:17.460
It's all secure. I love the way you're giggling

00:16:17.460 --> 00:16:20.460
and happy about what I'm sharing. Yeah, because

00:16:20.460 --> 00:16:23.889
I love the idea. of the TV because it's so much

00:16:23.889 --> 00:16:26.649
easier for older adults. You know, I mean, my

00:16:26.649 --> 00:16:28.809
sister is nine years older than me. So she's

00:16:28.809 --> 00:16:32.169
in her 70s, you know, and she just every time

00:16:32.169 --> 00:16:34.870
she has to do a new app, she's just like, oh,

00:16:35.129 --> 00:16:38.710
you know, but the TV she can manage. So I just

00:16:38.710 --> 00:16:41.309
love that idea. And we consume things differently.

00:16:41.450 --> 00:16:44.269
People don't appreciate that. But as a TV consumer,

00:16:44.769 --> 00:16:47.870
we're sitting, you know, it's big for macular

00:16:47.870 --> 00:16:51.950
degeneration issues. It's comfortable. And it's

00:16:51.950 --> 00:16:53.809
technology that we learned much earlier. So we're

00:16:53.809 --> 00:16:56.190
very, very comfortable with it. So if you add

00:16:56.190 --> 00:16:59.190
the camera, you could do all of the things I

00:16:59.190 --> 00:17:01.809
mentioned. On top of that, we have a really wonderful,

00:17:02.409 --> 00:17:05.509
we've called her Angela for over a decade now.

00:17:05.670 --> 00:17:07.990
We have a trademark on Angela as a caregiver.

00:17:08.130 --> 00:17:11.400
So we have an AI -based. Angela caregiver for

00:17:11.400 --> 00:17:13.920
you also they can and we actually call it companion

00:17:13.920 --> 00:17:16.299
Angela companion So you could chat with her as

00:17:16.299 --> 00:17:20.259
a friend. You can ask health questions So it's

00:17:20.259 --> 00:17:24.079
really cool So is it based? Is it like Alexa?

00:17:24.559 --> 00:17:27.579
Is it big? I mean, can you ask it anything or

00:17:27.579 --> 00:17:30.359
it's all health related questions? No anything

00:17:30.359 --> 00:17:33.299
you could ask it, you know You can ask it any

00:17:33.299 --> 00:17:36.019
kind of research question philosophy question

00:17:36.019 --> 00:17:39.910
chat about it whatever you want. We use ChatGPT

00:17:39.910 --> 00:17:42.710
as an engine, but we add some other guardrails

00:17:42.710 --> 00:17:46.029
and health -related things, and also we add engagement

00:17:46.029 --> 00:17:48.509
back into our interface. So like the first time

00:17:48.509 --> 00:17:51.190
you log in, it helps you choose the interface

00:17:51.190 --> 00:17:52.930
with Angela that you're comfortable with. So

00:17:52.930 --> 00:17:55.490
you can pick a different face. Itself, it's helping

00:17:55.490 --> 00:17:57.769
you. Or itself, it helps you pick the voice that

00:17:57.769 --> 00:18:00.250
you like. And then it helps you make sure that

00:18:00.250 --> 00:18:02.380
your microphone is on. So if you don't have your

00:18:02.380 --> 00:18:04.819
microphone on, it sends you through that. So

00:18:04.819 --> 00:18:08.339
it's a specific application for us. I like that.

00:18:08.339 --> 00:18:11.119
I like that it guides you through. I mean, Alexa

00:18:11.119 --> 00:18:15.859
does that too, but it's very helpful to go through

00:18:15.859 --> 00:18:19.769
that. And it sounds like... Independent is constantly

00:18:19.769 --> 00:18:22.609
changing and growing. I mean, the fact that you're

00:18:22.609 --> 00:18:24.930
using ChatGPT, I mean, that hasn't been around

00:18:24.930 --> 00:18:29.250
for 17 years. So I love that. How else do you

00:18:29.250 --> 00:18:36.250
see AI impacting this service? Well, it's already

00:18:36.250 --> 00:18:39.910
impacted us in a number of positive ways. This

00:18:39.910 --> 00:18:42.349
is a service that's customer focused, so it's

00:18:42.349 --> 00:18:44.859
easy to kind of explain that. On our engineering

00:18:44.859 --> 00:18:47.180
side, it's impacted us quite a bit in a positive

00:18:47.180 --> 00:18:50.220
way where we can do more with less and faster.

00:18:52.480 --> 00:18:55.680
I'll give you an example. We had a hospital patient

00:18:55.680 --> 00:18:58.819
education system that was written in a different

00:18:58.819 --> 00:19:02.099
code base. And it would have taken us probably

00:19:02.099 --> 00:19:04.859
four months to convert it into our latest and

00:19:04.859 --> 00:19:07.220
greatest code base. We actually took the time

00:19:07.220 --> 00:19:10.059
during COVID to upgrade our entire code system.

00:19:11.519 --> 00:19:14.380
So we wanted to do that with a patient education

00:19:14.380 --> 00:19:18.019
system. And we were never able to come up with

00:19:18.019 --> 00:19:19.980
the many months to do that. And then we used

00:19:19.980 --> 00:19:23.059
AI. And literally, within a week, we did the

00:19:23.059 --> 00:19:25.880
whole thing. So there's a lot of operational

00:19:25.880 --> 00:19:28.819
efficiencies. And just for me personally, I use

00:19:28.819 --> 00:19:33.160
it all the time as heavy lifting things, like

00:19:33.160 --> 00:19:35.359
if there's a market that we want to go after,

00:19:35.759 --> 00:19:39.640
it's like having an MBA from. Wharton, you know,

00:19:39.720 --> 00:19:41.640
work for you for six months and give you the

00:19:41.640 --> 00:19:44.160
answers. But it's not necessarily a snap of a

00:19:44.160 --> 00:19:46.119
finger. You have to engage and give it some really

00:19:46.119 --> 00:19:48.720
good direction and question some things and maybe

00:19:48.720 --> 00:19:50.720
run it through a few different engines and combine

00:19:50.720 --> 00:19:52.700
things. But at the end of the day, you could

00:19:52.700 --> 00:19:55.640
do all that. Sure. Yeah, we're not in the Star

00:19:55.640 --> 00:19:58.339
Trek area yet. Not yet. We're getting close.

00:19:58.660 --> 00:20:01.420
We're getting close. Yeah. Either we're getting

00:20:01.420 --> 00:20:04.779
close to computer on Star Trek, or the Borg,

00:20:05.079 --> 00:20:10.319
you know, we're all unified. One other thing

00:20:10.319 --> 00:20:13.940
to be clear also, we get a lot of data on people

00:20:13.940 --> 00:20:17.180
like the response to games, or how long they're

00:20:17.180 --> 00:20:19.460
engaged in different things. We ask some health

00:20:19.460 --> 00:20:22.019
related questions. So we have information that

00:20:22.019 --> 00:20:25.420
way. And so the AI helps us quite a bit in the

00:20:25.420 --> 00:20:27.740
background also, to see if something isn't quite

00:20:27.740 --> 00:20:30.779
right. and not necessarily to diagnose, but maybe

00:20:30.779 --> 00:20:33.339
raise a flag and say, hey, daughter. I mean,

00:20:33.380 --> 00:20:35.980
there's simple things like if mom hasn't entered

00:20:35.980 --> 00:20:37.720
her health information, like let's say she hasn't

00:20:37.720 --> 00:20:41.319
stepped on a scale, or let's say things that

00:20:41.319 --> 00:20:44.799
are maybe minor one at a time, but with certain

00:20:44.799 --> 00:20:47.680
patterns, they become something that maybe you

00:20:47.680 --> 00:20:50.740
should look at. Exactly. Is it integrated with

00:20:50.740 --> 00:20:54.519
products like scales and blood pressure and whatever?

00:20:54.960 --> 00:20:57.460
Yeah. So there's really four value props that

00:20:57.460 --> 00:20:59.200
we have. One is the social engagement, which

00:20:59.200 --> 00:21:03.680
is a lot of what we wanted to offer society and

00:21:03.680 --> 00:21:05.700
certainly in America, everyone who wants to use

00:21:05.700 --> 00:21:08.220
it. There's a second one, which is organizational

00:21:08.220 --> 00:21:09.920
engagement. So I mentioned things like all the

00:21:09.920 --> 00:21:12.559
apps that are integrated in different companies

00:21:12.559 --> 00:21:14.759
and organizations. Third one is, and there's

00:21:14.759 --> 00:21:17.140
no order to this. Third one is clinical engagement.

00:21:17.289 --> 00:21:19.630
So that's where we integrate with devices and

00:21:19.630 --> 00:21:21.910
you have thresholds and alerts and you can say

00:21:21.910 --> 00:21:24.569
things like, if mom hasn't stepped on the scale,

00:21:24.630 --> 00:21:27.250
let me know for two days, let's say, or if mom,

00:21:27.910 --> 00:21:30.849
you could do all sorts of things. But normally

00:21:30.849 --> 00:21:33.730
those are reserved for organizations as well.

00:21:33.980 --> 00:21:36.500
because it's harder to manage that one consumer

00:21:36.500 --> 00:21:39.059
at a time. But an organization may say, you know,

00:21:39.079 --> 00:21:41.660
I'd like to know if everyone staying with my

00:21:41.660 --> 00:21:44.099
short term rehab community is stepping on the

00:21:44.099 --> 00:21:45.720
scale like we asked them to every day. And if

00:21:45.720 --> 00:21:48.039
they haven't for two days, you know, I'd like

00:21:48.039 --> 00:21:50.200
my staff to be notified. So there's a lot of

00:21:50.200 --> 00:21:52.619
interesting things. Or in home care, you could

00:21:52.619 --> 00:21:55.299
leave this behind and empower the family to manage

00:21:55.299 --> 00:21:58.539
mom from a distance. What if she steps on the

00:21:58.539 --> 00:22:01.400
scales gained 10 % weight in five days, you know,

00:22:01.579 --> 00:22:06.039
be notified. So there's a lot of both comfort

00:22:06.039 --> 00:22:08.299
and really a peace of mind that you can give

00:22:08.299 --> 00:22:10.480
family members by being able to manage things

00:22:10.480 --> 00:22:13.339
more effectively. Exactly. I mean, knowledge

00:22:13.339 --> 00:22:17.279
is, you know, just having that piece of information

00:22:17.279 --> 00:22:19.819
can reduce a lot of stress and anxiety. It's

00:22:19.819 --> 00:22:23.180
not knowing that increases for the families mostly.

00:22:23.779 --> 00:22:27.279
So is it integrated with any telehealth services

00:22:27.279 --> 00:22:31.720
like with the physicians or as of yet? It is.

00:22:32.119 --> 00:22:35.490
Yeah. It is so where we sit as there's one level

00:22:35.490 --> 00:22:39.170
above everything else. So, for instance, you

00:22:39.170 --> 00:22:42.470
can have 24 7 access to a doctor, a dentist or

00:22:42.470 --> 00:22:44.690
a therapist and those are through our partnerships

00:22:44.690 --> 00:22:48.450
where you pay for that. If you're on the system

00:22:48.450 --> 00:22:52.549
and you, but for second opinions for emergencies

00:22:52.549 --> 00:22:55.569
for after hours for the under insured, under

00:22:55.569 --> 00:22:57.369
insured, et cetera. There's, you know, this benefit

00:22:57.369 --> 00:23:01.109
of being able to do that. So that's that. and

00:23:01.109 --> 00:23:04.170
it's all 50 states and it's really a great service.

00:23:04.390 --> 00:23:06.210
It applied to me once, you know, I had a really

00:23:06.210 --> 00:23:09.210
bad toothache and it was a Friday and I'd woken

00:23:09.210 --> 00:23:12.289
up at one in the morning and it just kept getting

00:23:12.289 --> 00:23:13.890
worse during the day and suddenly at the end

00:23:13.890 --> 00:23:15.349
of the day I'm like, what did you do now? You

00:23:15.349 --> 00:23:17.990
can't even see anyone until Monday. I'm like,

00:23:18.009 --> 00:23:21.910
I know where I can go. So I literally went on

00:23:21.910 --> 00:23:24.990
to Panda and this wonderful dentist, he happened

00:23:24.990 --> 00:23:27.230
to be out of Riverside, as I mentioned to you

00:23:27.230 --> 00:23:29.349
before we started recording, I'm in California.

00:23:30.269 --> 00:23:33.210
uh and and he looked at it and he said yeah you're

00:23:33.210 --> 00:23:35.509
getting an infection and he gave me antibiotics

00:23:35.509 --> 00:23:40.150
and went to the um to the pharmacy and i started

00:23:40.150 --> 00:23:41.930
taking them the same day and monday i called

00:23:41.930 --> 00:23:44.730
my dentist and she said no need to come in that's

00:23:44.730 --> 00:23:47.809
what i would have done wow that is awesome i

00:23:47.809 --> 00:23:52.069
love that i mean just to have that You know relief

00:23:52.069 --> 00:23:55.289
not the only relief from the pain But also just

00:23:55.289 --> 00:23:57.410
the relief of knowing that someone is watching

00:23:57.410 --> 00:24:00.190
out for you somebody with that education Now

00:24:00.190 --> 00:24:03.529
you mentioned about collecting the data, you

00:24:03.529 --> 00:24:07.869
know on and as a user I could understand how

00:24:07.869 --> 00:24:11.910
that can be Creepy as some people say but as

00:24:11.910 --> 00:24:15.549
a marketer There's nothing better. I mean because

00:24:15.549 --> 00:24:19.109
being able to provide what your target audience

00:24:19.109 --> 00:24:23.950
needs or wants? I mean, it's never been easier.

00:24:24.349 --> 00:24:28.190
Yeah. But at the same time, how do you protect

00:24:28.190 --> 00:24:31.670
that data? What security do you have for that?

00:24:32.130 --> 00:24:34.869
Or I know a lot of older people are just nervous

00:24:34.869 --> 00:24:37.210
that they don't even want to have an Alexa device

00:24:37.210 --> 00:24:39.009
in their home because, you know, it's always

00:24:39.009 --> 00:24:43.359
listening or Yeah, so that's an awesome question.

00:24:43.980 --> 00:24:47.079
And one of the design goals that we've had all

00:24:47.079 --> 00:24:49.400
along was that we designed it for ourselves.

00:24:49.940 --> 00:24:53.059
So like, what would you like to see in an application

00:24:53.059 --> 00:24:55.799
like this? Or what would I like to see? And so

00:24:55.799 --> 00:24:58.599
that means it's designing with the person, not

00:24:58.599 --> 00:25:03.799
for them. It's really all about not being patronizing

00:25:03.799 --> 00:25:06.420
and not being big brotherish. And when it comes

00:25:06.420 --> 00:25:10.380
to marketing, We have always, not even once as

00:25:10.380 --> 00:25:12.880
an exception, we tell people the data is yours,

00:25:13.200 --> 00:25:17.599
we don't sell it, we don't rent it. So, and we

00:25:17.599 --> 00:25:19.619
even went to great lengths. Now everybody has

00:25:19.619 --> 00:25:22.960
some video chat, but we actually created video

00:25:22.960 --> 00:25:25.859
chat technology very, very early on. Like ours

00:25:25.859 --> 00:25:29.299
was out before Zoom, where because of security,

00:25:29.740 --> 00:25:31.700
we wanted to make sure that we can control the

00:25:31.700 --> 00:25:34.759
fact that if somebody's using. in our system,

00:25:34.859 --> 00:25:36.259
somebody else does a market to them the next

00:25:36.259 --> 00:25:37.920
day and says, hey, listen, you want to travel

00:25:37.920 --> 00:25:39.480
to Bali with me, as long as you don't have a

00:25:39.480 --> 00:25:41.140
little bit of money, I would love to travel the

00:25:41.140 --> 00:25:44.180
world with you. So unfortunately, a lot of the

00:25:44.180 --> 00:25:47.240
platforms that we're used to that are not we

00:25:47.240 --> 00:25:49.160
call them public platforms, or they're not really

00:25:49.160 --> 00:25:52.779
public, they're private companies. They sell

00:25:52.779 --> 00:25:56.119
and rent and market to that data. And it's been

00:25:56.119 --> 00:25:59.319
super scary to see like if you open up a Facebook

00:25:59.319 --> 00:26:02.529
account. and just give it give yourself a profile

00:26:02.529 --> 00:26:04.690
of being let's say 80 years old and you know

00:26:04.690 --> 00:26:07.450
put a picture of whatever and see how fast people

00:26:07.450 --> 00:26:09.730
are marketing to you all sorts of scary things

00:26:09.730 --> 00:26:12.210
so yeah we're very mindful of that and we're

00:26:12.210 --> 00:26:14.269
very respectful and very protective we're HIPAA

00:26:14.269 --> 00:26:17.450
compliant and you know for us that's really really

00:26:17.450 --> 00:26:21.200
important. It is very scary. I mean, I texted

00:26:21.200 --> 00:26:25.819
someone the other day something about a liability

00:26:25.819 --> 00:26:29.480
insurance, the name of the company, and now I

00:26:29.480 --> 00:26:32.980
can't go on YouTube without commercials for that

00:26:32.980 --> 00:26:36.019
company coming up. I have never seen a commercial

00:26:36.019 --> 00:26:39.980
for that company ever until I texted that information

00:26:39.980 --> 00:26:45.119
to someone. So yeah, it's a little scary. But

00:26:45.119 --> 00:26:49.059
as a marketer - Which platform were you on? email

00:26:49.059 --> 00:26:54.579
as far as texting, just my Amazon, I have a Samsung

00:26:54.579 --> 00:26:59.000
Galaxy phone and just on just the regular texting,

00:27:00.400 --> 00:27:02.400
just texted it out to her. That's it. So if I

00:27:02.400 --> 00:27:07.740
can give two cents as a side note, that makes

00:27:07.740 --> 00:27:10.559
sense because on an Android platform, you don't

00:27:10.559 --> 00:27:12.259
have the same level of protection on that data.

00:27:12.500 --> 00:27:14.359
Then you do on an Apple platform. That's the

00:27:14.359 --> 00:27:16.450
difference. So I've never had that happen. That's

00:27:16.450 --> 00:27:19.190
why I asked, because I'm on Apple. And I suspect

00:27:19.190 --> 00:27:22.869
if I'm on Apple texting to Android on the other

00:27:22.869 --> 00:27:25.549
side, it's probably the same. But if it's Apple

00:27:25.549 --> 00:27:28.130
to Apple, at least I'm hoping, which is what

00:27:28.130 --> 00:27:29.849
their commitment is, that they don't sell that

00:27:29.849 --> 00:27:33.009
data. Yeah, I mean, I know that about Android.

00:27:34.390 --> 00:27:38.049
But to see it, I mean, I'm telling you, it was

00:27:38.049 --> 00:27:41.029
within the hour. You know, I was all of a sudden

00:27:41.029 --> 00:27:43.740
seeing commercials for this company going. I

00:27:43.740 --> 00:27:45.599
didn't even know they had commercials. And why

00:27:45.599 --> 00:27:48.420
now that now every time I watch YouTube, that

00:27:48.420 --> 00:27:50.799
commercial comes up. It's it's interesting. Interesting.

00:27:51.220 --> 00:27:56.839
I get it. I get it. So I love that this technology.

00:27:57.559 --> 00:28:00.420
I mean, I do a lot for senior care. My as an

00:28:00.420 --> 00:28:04.420
OT working in geriatrics, head injury. That is

00:28:04.420 --> 00:28:08.799
my that's my thing. It's my skill set. And I

00:28:08.799 --> 00:28:14.630
love it. But I think this technology with independent

00:28:14.630 --> 00:28:18.930
is across the board. It's not just for senior

00:28:18.930 --> 00:28:23.069
care. Do you find that your clients are more?

00:28:23.930 --> 00:28:27.569
You know, what demographic are you seeing using

00:28:27.569 --> 00:28:30.230
independent more than any other? Or maybe maybe

00:28:30.230 --> 00:28:33.349
not. Maybe they're all equal. It's not all equal.

00:28:33.569 --> 00:28:36.130
There's there's a lot of opportunities and. You

00:28:36.130 --> 00:28:38.589
know, a lot of our success is based on what we

00:28:38.589 --> 00:28:40.809
say no to, actually, not what we say yes to,

00:28:41.009 --> 00:28:43.710
because like you said, it's just so much opportunity.

00:28:43.809 --> 00:28:46.569
Like I give you an example, prison systems. So,

00:28:46.670 --> 00:28:49.029
you know, many prisons have TVs in the cells.

00:28:49.349 --> 00:28:52.170
And if you can bring telehealth and engagement

00:28:52.170 --> 00:28:54.849
and education, one of our partnerships is with

00:28:54.849 --> 00:28:58.279
WebMD. It's exclusively fantastic where You get

00:28:58.279 --> 00:29:01.519
all this great content delivered to you over

00:29:01.519 --> 00:29:04.220
1 ,200 videos in English and Spanish in multiple

00:29:04.220 --> 00:29:06.599
categories and subcategories. You can do searches,

00:29:06.680 --> 00:29:09.380
so any kind of surgery you want to have for yourself,

00:29:09.420 --> 00:29:11.480
for your spouse, for your child, for your neighbor

00:29:11.480 --> 00:29:13.480
or friend. You can learn about it beforehand.

00:29:13.480 --> 00:29:15.339
You can learn about recovery after. You can learn

00:29:15.339 --> 00:29:18.720
about how to ask the right questions. It's phenomenal,

00:29:18.759 --> 00:29:24.519
and it's available to you. So you can learn that

00:29:24.519 --> 00:29:27.470
in a prison cell. Or if you imagine a doctor

00:29:27.470 --> 00:29:30.549
coming to you and having an engagement right

00:29:30.549 --> 00:29:33.029
in your cell instead of having that person. Now,

00:29:33.029 --> 00:29:35.809
if you go to the doctor in the prison, then maybe

00:29:35.809 --> 00:29:37.670
that's fine. But sometimes you have to go to

00:29:37.670 --> 00:29:40.789
a specialist. And that is super expensive. You

00:29:40.789 --> 00:29:43.349
have to have police guards and different types

00:29:43.349 --> 00:29:46.859
of vans and buses. Very expensive overtime coming

00:29:46.859 --> 00:29:49.079
and going for like a half hour session with a

00:29:49.079 --> 00:29:51.220
specialist. Well, they can come into you. So

00:29:51.220 --> 00:29:53.380
there's there's a lot of that on that side, which

00:29:53.380 --> 00:29:55.240
we haven't done. But the right partners, if they

00:29:55.240 --> 00:29:57.299
hear this, they can run with our application

00:29:57.299 --> 00:30:01.059
and do that. There's other things like really

00:30:01.059 --> 00:30:04.319
generally speaking, the delivery of health care

00:30:04.319 --> 00:30:07.630
and engagement into the consumer's home. And

00:30:07.630 --> 00:30:09.609
that's not about older adults. That's about how

00:30:09.609 --> 00:30:12.369
do I have a platform, not one silo versus another

00:30:12.369 --> 00:30:15.029
versus a third. And they can all be included,

00:30:15.029 --> 00:30:17.609
but having the same common interface, the same

00:30:17.609 --> 00:30:20.650
usability. There's two things about us as engagement

00:30:20.650 --> 00:30:23.930
in a holistic way that I've mentioned, and it's

00:30:23.930 --> 00:30:27.019
also simplicity. So how do we make things simple

00:30:27.019 --> 00:30:28.839
so you don't have to learn different things and,

00:30:28.839 --> 00:30:32.019
you know, get stuck and be universally available

00:30:32.019 --> 00:30:34.579
on different platforms? And we're having conversations

00:30:34.579 --> 00:30:37.200
with entire governments around that. So it's

00:30:37.200 --> 00:30:39.680
not just the older adult. It's like imagine if,

00:30:39.680 --> 00:30:42.240
if like, let's say for Medicare or for Medicaid,

00:30:42.720 --> 00:30:44.920
or the government of some country somewhere in

00:30:44.920 --> 00:30:47.180
the world that wants to have a better way to

00:30:47.180 --> 00:30:50.460
engage. their consumers, their citizens, educate

00:30:50.460 --> 00:30:52.880
them in health, be there quickly if they need

00:30:52.880 --> 00:30:54.680
to, if there's an interaction that's needed.

00:30:54.779 --> 00:30:57.119
Imagine a pharmacist, for instance, being able

00:30:57.119 --> 00:30:59.880
to have a conversation with someone because their

00:30:59.880 --> 00:31:02.500
pills maybe are not working well, or maybe they're

00:31:02.500 --> 00:31:04.180
old and they can't figure out the color difference.

00:31:04.359 --> 00:31:07.720
There's lots of ways that having a secure, holistic

00:31:07.720 --> 00:31:11.480
engagement is really valuable. Exactly. And I

00:31:11.480 --> 00:31:15.039
mean, nowadays with more and more homes becoming

00:31:15.039 --> 00:31:19.240
multi -generational, I can see how getting a

00:31:19.240 --> 00:31:23.099
platform that's simple and easy for, you know,

00:31:23.240 --> 00:31:25.400
all the generations living in that home, the

00:31:25.400 --> 00:31:28.640
new mother, you know, the senior parents, maybe

00:31:28.640 --> 00:31:31.759
a disabled son or somebody with some chronic

00:31:31.759 --> 00:31:34.539
illness, you know, all living under one roof

00:31:34.539 --> 00:31:38.119
and they can all use that independent, not the

00:31:38.119 --> 00:31:42.160
EAPs and the, you know, the website and the service

00:31:42.160 --> 00:31:45.900
itself. I think you know absolutely I just had

00:31:45.900 --> 00:31:48.900
a talk last week I think or maybe the week before

00:31:48.900 --> 00:31:52.880
with someone who contacted me from Nigeria and

00:31:52.880 --> 00:31:55.579
what's happening in Nigeria according to him

00:31:55.579 --> 00:31:58.480
is that so many young people are leaving because

00:31:58.480 --> 00:32:00.559
there's no work in Nigeria so they're moving

00:32:00.559 --> 00:32:03.099
to other countries but their elderly parents

00:32:03.099 --> 00:32:06.240
are still in Nigeria and they don't have the

00:32:06.240 --> 00:32:09.700
infrastructure in Nigeria at the moment to take

00:32:09.700 --> 00:32:13.059
care of these people so he is looking for he

00:32:13.059 --> 00:32:15.380
was looking for marketing help whatever information

00:32:15.380 --> 00:32:18.859
on he's building a like an adult daycare type

00:32:18.859 --> 00:32:22.299
of program along with caregivers that can go

00:32:22.299 --> 00:32:25.200
out and take care of these people while their

00:32:25.200 --> 00:32:28.680
children are you know in other countries earning

00:32:28.680 --> 00:32:32.380
a living yeah that's a great example if you want

00:32:32.380 --> 00:32:34.559
to have them get in touch with me maybe we can

00:32:34.559 --> 00:32:37.680
help in in the sense that adult daycare is another

00:32:37.680 --> 00:32:40.160
great example you're taking care of someone let's

00:32:40.160 --> 00:32:43.880
say nine to six or seven then they go home. And

00:32:43.880 --> 00:32:47.420
when they go home, what if the individual can't

00:32:47.420 --> 00:32:49.240
afford to come to you every day of the week,

00:32:49.259 --> 00:32:51.119
maybe they're coming three days a week? Well,

00:32:51.220 --> 00:32:52.859
the other four days a week, they may still be

00:32:52.859 --> 00:32:55.859
alone. And if it's a weekend, maybe the daughter

00:32:55.859 --> 00:32:58.599
has to go out to a gathering or maybe shopping

00:32:58.599 --> 00:33:00.759
and whatnot. Now, if the daughter has a better

00:33:00.759 --> 00:33:03.759
holistic way to engage, you know, their parent,

00:33:04.319 --> 00:33:06.940
that's great for everyone. And also if the daughter

00:33:06.940 --> 00:33:09.990
can send and propagate the application out, easily

00:33:09.990 --> 00:33:12.769
to everyone else the other siblings and you know

00:33:12.769 --> 00:33:14.730
somebody else living across the country or the

00:33:14.730 --> 00:33:17.450
world and they can send messages they can see

00:33:17.450 --> 00:33:19.869
mom they can chat with mom they could you know

00:33:19.869 --> 00:33:23.009
send an audio file video file all of that uh

00:33:23.009 --> 00:33:24.190
that's really and then we have something called

00:33:24.190 --> 00:33:26.869
life stories by the way so you can capture someone's

00:33:26.869 --> 00:33:29.130
life and audio files and they answer questions

00:33:29.130 --> 00:33:31.109
and you capture their wisdom you could share

00:33:31.109 --> 00:33:33.970
that and all that complements something like

00:33:33.970 --> 00:33:36.690
daycare complements home care complements senior

00:33:36.690 --> 00:33:41.210
exactly what about I had two people that I spoke

00:33:41.210 --> 00:33:43.190
with. I speak with a lot of people all over.

00:33:43.549 --> 00:33:47.630
I had a woman in Australia who teaches older

00:33:47.630 --> 00:33:51.029
adults, only older adults, French, how to speak

00:33:51.029 --> 00:33:53.809
French, and she does that online. So that's an

00:33:53.809 --> 00:33:56.450
online leisure activity, let's say. And then

00:33:56.450 --> 00:33:59.190
there's another woman, and I think she's in Massachusetts,

00:33:59.349 --> 00:34:05.430
I can't recall, but she teaches art online. Again,

00:34:05.710 --> 00:34:08.250
to older adults. So what about leisure services

00:34:08.250 --> 00:34:11.590
like that? Is that integrated into Independa

00:34:11.590 --> 00:34:15.369
as well? It is. We have a great partnership with

00:34:15.369 --> 00:34:18.050
a company called Spiro 100. They do exercise

00:34:18.050 --> 00:34:21.190
videos for older adults. Okay. Of all these videos,

00:34:21.190 --> 00:34:25.929
you can search by category, seated, standing,

00:34:26.550 --> 00:34:29.849
laying down. agility, flexibility, strength,

00:34:30.030 --> 00:34:32.809
whatever. And you can find the right videos with

00:34:32.809 --> 00:34:34.730
the right instructors that are teaching you.

00:34:34.989 --> 00:34:36.590
So you could do that right again on your big

00:34:36.590 --> 00:34:40.469
screen TV or tablet or whatever. Also, if the

00:34:40.469 --> 00:34:42.710
individual then wants to use our platform to

00:34:42.710 --> 00:34:45.500
engage with someone, they can do... Delivery

00:34:45.500 --> 00:34:47.480
of different things too. So it's yes video chat,

00:34:47.579 --> 00:34:49.659
but they can also deliver content. They can deliver

00:34:49.659 --> 00:34:52.960
PDF They can do surveys. They can ask people

00:34:52.960 --> 00:34:55.039
a bunch of questions. They could do broadcast

00:34:55.039 --> 00:34:57.119
messages So if it's a platform that they're using

00:34:57.119 --> 00:34:59.820
as a business not just let's say daughter mother

00:34:59.820 --> 00:35:02.119
Then they could do a survey to everyone and they

00:35:02.119 --> 00:35:04.340
they can have multiple categories and groups

00:35:04.340 --> 00:35:06.840
So they could have females versus males. They

00:35:06.840 --> 00:35:09.360
could have you know, younger older adults versus

00:35:09.360 --> 00:35:11.639
older adult older adults They can have people

00:35:11.639 --> 00:35:14.329
in different categories of French And they could

00:35:14.329 --> 00:35:17.389
gear their content that they send, the videos.

00:35:17.829 --> 00:35:19.889
They could gear the service that they have. If

00:35:19.889 --> 00:35:21.710
they were senior living, they could gear their

00:35:21.710 --> 00:35:23.449
menus, let's say. So you could have a diabetic

00:35:23.449 --> 00:35:25.849
menu, and diabetic videos, and diabetic surveys.

00:35:26.989 --> 00:35:29.789
In fact, two things. I saw there was a thumbs

00:35:29.789 --> 00:35:31.269
down that happened when you were chatting. I

00:35:31.269 --> 00:35:32.570
don't know if you saw that. I don't know. Oh,

00:35:32.650 --> 00:35:35.510
yeah. No, I saw something. No, on my side. So

00:35:35.510 --> 00:35:38.130
I don't. It just I wasn't moving. But somehow

00:35:38.130 --> 00:35:40.909
let's see if anything happens. So no, it has

00:35:40.909 --> 00:35:44.090
a mind of its own. But the other thing is offline,

00:35:44.349 --> 00:35:46.570
I'm happy to help you, Esther, in any way. If

00:35:46.570 --> 00:35:48.809
you want to use the platform for your own people,

00:35:49.210 --> 00:35:51.650
you could sort of give it and have a central

00:35:51.650 --> 00:35:53.550
way of managing it, similar to what you're saying

00:35:53.550 --> 00:35:55.849
in Australia. But if you have all these contacts

00:35:55.849 --> 00:35:59.070
and people that you want to have a universal

00:35:59.070 --> 00:36:01.849
way of engaging, I'm happy to chat with you.

00:36:02.389 --> 00:36:04.769
All right. Yeah, I absolutely love that. I mean.

00:36:05.099 --> 00:36:07.780
Wheels are already turning like thinking about

00:36:07.780 --> 00:36:11.820
how so what trends in senior care? Do you see

00:36:11.820 --> 00:36:14.980
because I know in America, you know, my family's

00:36:14.980 --> 00:36:19.900
all in Sicily and Italy So we're the only you

00:36:19.900 --> 00:36:22.960
know black sheep that left the country my parents

00:36:22.960 --> 00:36:27.119
left but What trends do you see? Because in America,

00:36:27.340 --> 00:36:30.719
I know that health care is a business. And the

00:36:30.719 --> 00:36:33.320
purpose of a business is to make a profit, to

00:36:33.320 --> 00:36:37.219
make money. So it doesn't necessarily focus on

00:36:37.219 --> 00:36:41.199
preventive care or anything, which I see these,

00:36:41.199 --> 00:36:44.019
you know, independent doing. That's basically

00:36:44.019 --> 00:36:48.480
what it is. So do you see those trends in senior

00:36:48.480 --> 00:36:52.150
care evolving as? 10 ,000 plus people a day are

00:36:52.150 --> 00:36:56.789
turning 65. And this year, 2026 is the first

00:36:56.789 --> 00:37:00.550
year that the oldest boomers start turning 80,

00:37:01.050 --> 00:37:04.889
which traditionally speaking, 80 is when things

00:37:04.889 --> 00:37:09.409
start happening. You need surgery, chronic illnesses,

00:37:09.710 --> 00:37:12.809
whatever, although people are living longer.

00:37:13.349 --> 00:37:17.530
And so there's so many changes coming up. So

00:37:17.530 --> 00:37:21.840
how do you see Trends affecting? Independent

00:37:21.840 --> 00:37:26.440
in any way sure I'll just share a quick anecdote

00:37:26.440 --> 00:37:29.460
a joke in a way. I have two good friends through

00:37:29.460 --> 00:37:31.480
the years I've known them both probably close

00:37:31.480 --> 00:37:34.039
in one case over 20 years and the other case

00:37:34.039 --> 00:37:37.519
about 16 and they both recently turned 80 and

00:37:37.519 --> 00:37:39.800
They both separately they know each other through

00:37:39.800 --> 00:37:42.840
me, but then you know, they're not friends or

00:37:42.840 --> 00:37:46.920
they don't talk and They both separately told

00:37:46.920 --> 00:37:52.179
me Keon uh 60 is a new 40 70 is a new 50 but

00:37:52.179 --> 00:38:00.280
80 is 80 that was your point that was my point

00:38:00.280 --> 00:38:03.820
they are right on the button i mean i have friends

00:38:03.820 --> 00:38:07.260
there too i'm 67 so i have friends you know in

00:38:07.260 --> 00:38:10.719
this age range and further up and yeah they all

00:38:10.719 --> 00:38:13.679
tell me yeah something happens when you hit 80

00:38:13.679 --> 00:38:16.300
it's just your i don't know You know, it's not

00:38:16.300 --> 00:38:19.719
your body anymore. So and I've read that too.

00:38:19.780 --> 00:38:23.000
So I know that things start, you know, happening.

00:38:23.579 --> 00:38:27.980
So obviously, as a provider of this, of independent,

00:38:28.199 --> 00:38:30.820
you know, founder, I'm sure you guys are always

00:38:30.820 --> 00:38:33.460
looking a year, two years, three years, if you

00:38:33.460 --> 00:38:36.539
even can with AI anymore. Although it'd be interesting

00:38:36.539 --> 00:38:39.960
to see how what prompts would allow AI to give

00:38:39.960 --> 00:38:43.000
you that future predictions. But so for us, what's

00:38:43.000 --> 00:38:45.000
really important is what we started out from

00:38:45.000 --> 00:38:47.480
the outset, which is engagement. So what does

00:38:47.480 --> 00:38:49.900
it mean, engagement? I rattled off a whole bunch

00:38:49.900 --> 00:38:53.219
of different things that we've unified in a simplified

00:38:53.219 --> 00:38:57.579
way. So that's important. And so like AI is a

00:38:57.579 --> 00:38:59.380
good example. Three years ago, we didn't have

00:38:59.380 --> 00:39:03.159
an AI companion. But now we do. And it's necessary

00:39:03.159 --> 00:39:06.260
to be a part of that. I think engagement is one.

00:39:06.340 --> 00:39:09.139
The other one is the simplicity of the screen,

00:39:09.219 --> 00:39:11.760
so to speak. So it's still a screen. And the

00:39:11.760 --> 00:39:15.300
interface is audio, and if you want to type it.

00:39:15.480 --> 00:39:17.900
And we use a remote control from LG, so you can

00:39:17.900 --> 00:39:21.559
click on it, or Sony. In the case of LG, you

00:39:21.559 --> 00:39:23.239
also have a cursor with it, so you can actually

00:39:23.239 --> 00:39:26.440
click on it like a mouse. But I think to answer

00:39:26.440 --> 00:39:28.960
your question over time, I could see holographic

00:39:28.960 --> 00:39:31.880
images. I could see, you know, things that you

00:39:31.880 --> 00:39:34.360
wear glasses that put the world in front of you.

00:39:34.760 --> 00:39:37.179
And so we have to be agnostic in terms of how

00:39:37.179 --> 00:39:40.500
simple is it, not how tragedy, how simple it's

00:39:40.500 --> 00:39:42.360
got to be. If it's not simple, it doesn't mean

00:39:42.360 --> 00:39:45.699
anything. And also how effective is it in what

00:39:45.699 --> 00:39:48.909
we're trying to do. Does it make life easier?

00:39:48.989 --> 00:39:51.530
Does it make life more meaningful, more fun?

00:39:51.789 --> 00:39:54.130
So for us, it's all about doing fun things with

00:39:54.130 --> 00:39:57.929
games. And we have daily words, daily jokes,

00:39:58.150 --> 00:40:00.869
daily, did you know what happened today? We have

00:40:00.869 --> 00:40:03.690
a daily quote. So we want you to come in and

00:40:03.690 --> 00:40:06.090
engage and have fun. And then friends and family

00:40:06.090 --> 00:40:11.190
get to be more at peace with you and have peace

00:40:11.190 --> 00:40:13.530
of mind on what you're doing. And you get to

00:40:13.530 --> 00:40:15.829
enjoy life more, especially if the car keys are

00:40:15.829 --> 00:40:19.699
maybe maybe you're in rural America, maybe healthcare,

00:40:19.880 --> 00:40:22.179
and we're not a healthcare company. We're all

00:40:22.179 --> 00:40:24.719
about health and wellness. We allow you to stay

00:40:24.719 --> 00:40:26.719
where you are longer, stay for more comfortably,

00:40:26.900 --> 00:40:29.519
have a better quality of life, preventing things,

00:40:29.559 --> 00:40:32.619
but we can't say that we're a healthcare company

00:40:32.619 --> 00:40:34.219
because we're not a clinical company. We don't

00:40:34.219 --> 00:40:36.960
want to be a medical company. Otherwise, you're

00:40:36.960 --> 00:40:39.239
just one little silo to your point about a billing

00:40:39.239 --> 00:40:42.219
code and a broken system that we're all in with

00:40:42.219 --> 00:40:44.039
sick care, and we don't want to be that. We want

00:40:44.039 --> 00:40:47.420
to be this. Yeah, and and I think that's the

00:40:47.420 --> 00:40:51.099
only way really To provide that service you do

00:40:51.099 --> 00:40:53.800
kind of have to be on the outside of it You can't

00:40:53.800 --> 00:40:55.960
be in it because if you are then you just become

00:40:55.960 --> 00:40:58.539
part of the wheel But you do have funny you say

00:40:58.539 --> 00:41:01.280
that it's funny is that I literally before launching

00:41:01.280 --> 00:41:03.300
independent I went to a library back then there

00:41:03.300 --> 00:41:05.639
were physical things called Bookstores and libraries

00:41:05.639 --> 00:41:08.039
I went to a bookstore was a beat Dalton's I think

00:41:08.039 --> 00:41:10.780
and I bought a whole bunch of books in this category

00:41:10.780 --> 00:41:15.329
and my favorite one was Christiansen's innovators

00:41:15.329 --> 00:41:18.510
prescription. So he had my favorite book was

00:41:18.510 --> 00:41:21.429
innovators dilemma from before. And then innovators

00:41:21.429 --> 00:41:23.489
prescription was all about our health care system.

00:41:23.750 --> 00:41:27.389
And it scared me silly as a consumer realized

00:41:27.389 --> 00:41:29.849
all the things he was sharing, but his whole

00:41:29.849 --> 00:41:31.670
summary was exactly what you just said, which

00:41:31.670 --> 00:41:34.849
is the system is so broken and he showed why

00:41:34.849 --> 00:41:38.309
that it will never fix itself. And if you want

00:41:38.309 --> 00:41:40.710
to be in this system, just go in the edge and

00:41:40.710 --> 00:41:42.530
help people on the edge because there's so much

00:41:42.530 --> 00:41:45.849
opportunity in the edge. It's true. I mean, the

00:41:45.849 --> 00:41:48.190
more ever since I opened up, you know, the aging

00:41:48.190 --> 00:41:50.849
place directory last year. I mean, I am meeting

00:41:50.849 --> 00:41:53.610
people with some of the most amazing services

00:41:53.610 --> 00:41:56.010
and products and things I'd never even thought

00:41:56.010 --> 00:42:00.570
of. And it's so interesting to see this entrepreneurial.

00:42:01.950 --> 00:42:05.030
revolution, I guess, happening, you know, because

00:42:05.030 --> 00:42:08.789
of AI and with AI, you know, it's, it's going

00:42:08.789 --> 00:42:11.210
to be very interesting to see the next few years

00:42:11.210 --> 00:42:13.650
of how all of this develops. Because for sure,

00:42:13.730 --> 00:42:16.650
the demographic is there. I mean, these are people

00:42:16.650 --> 00:42:20.610
who need the services and boomers are used to

00:42:20.610 --> 00:42:24.329
having services, you know, so yeah, we all want

00:42:24.329 --> 00:42:28.329
that. So as the CEO and founder of independent,

00:42:28.469 --> 00:42:35.289
how do you foster that sense of innovation and

00:42:35.289 --> 00:42:37.610
empathy? Because I mean, you're kind of straddling

00:42:37.610 --> 00:42:41.489
both your technology and your health, you know,

00:42:41.530 --> 00:42:44.690
wellness. So it's it's not one or the other.

00:42:44.710 --> 00:42:47.750
It's really the beautiful combination of both.

00:42:47.929 --> 00:42:51.550
So how do you foster that in your team or your

00:42:51.550 --> 00:42:54.489
staff or I don't know what you call them? Yeah,

00:42:54.730 --> 00:42:58.000
it's their staff, the team, our tribe. You know,

00:42:58.179 --> 00:43:01.380
you you put it interestingly between technology

00:43:01.380 --> 00:43:05.239
and what was the other word? Wellness. Wellness.

00:43:05.519 --> 00:43:08.320
OK, so interesting. So if I were to superimpose

00:43:08.320 --> 00:43:11.119
those to the two words I use, technology is really

00:43:11.119 --> 00:43:13.940
the engagement side. How do we have a platform

00:43:13.940 --> 00:43:18.019
that's person centric that does all in one 360

00:43:18.019 --> 00:43:19.800
whatever way you want to explain that you go

00:43:19.800 --> 00:43:22.519
to one place, but then the wellness is the simplicity

00:43:22.519 --> 00:43:26.019
because it's not about feature function benefit.

00:43:26.019 --> 00:43:28.920
All that could be cool. But if it's hard to use

00:43:28.920 --> 00:43:31.820
and so the empathy that goes into simplicity,

00:43:32.300 --> 00:43:34.559
the respect that goes into simplicity is all

00:43:34.559 --> 00:43:37.119
about how do we affect change and how do we make

00:43:37.119 --> 00:43:39.480
your life better? And if we don't respect you

00:43:39.480 --> 00:43:41.860
in a way that we design something that makes

00:43:41.860 --> 00:43:44.559
it simple and easy for you and engaging and fun,

00:43:44.960 --> 00:43:47.900
nobody pays us to do a word of the day or to

00:43:47.900 --> 00:43:51.219
add games or to have all these cool things or

00:43:51.219 --> 00:43:53.460
to do life stories. There's a whole industry

00:43:53.460 --> 00:43:56.360
of people that charge you for that. We include

00:43:56.360 --> 00:43:58.960
that because we think any way we can help you

00:43:58.960 --> 00:44:01.480
have a better life makes us better makes you

00:44:01.480 --> 00:44:04.320
better and you enjoy things more your friends

00:44:04.320 --> 00:44:06.699
and family enjoy things more and then we can

00:44:06.699 --> 00:44:09.510
help the organizations who are using us to be

00:44:09.510 --> 00:44:12.730
more efficient, to be more effective, to be operationally

00:44:12.730 --> 00:44:15.690
better. So it's really a price of admission is

00:44:15.690 --> 00:44:18.309
to be engaging in your wellness, engaging in

00:44:18.309 --> 00:44:20.110
your health, and then everything else happens

00:44:20.110 --> 00:44:22.769
after that. If you start with that, in my opinion,

00:44:22.929 --> 00:44:24.730
you know, you don't get anywhere. And that's

00:44:24.730 --> 00:44:26.610
part of partially, by the way, Esther, because

00:44:26.610 --> 00:44:30.110
a lot of health applications don't have compliance.

00:44:30.329 --> 00:44:32.690
And the reason you don't have compliance is because

00:44:32.690 --> 00:44:35.210
you're not engaging. And the reason you're not

00:44:35.210 --> 00:44:38.090
engaging is because you're not fun. So if you

00:44:38.090 --> 00:44:41.969
can make an application or a platform fun, then

00:44:41.969 --> 00:44:43.610
respect the person. They're going to want to

00:44:43.610 --> 00:44:45.289
do something that's fun. If they're not engaging,

00:44:45.590 --> 00:44:49.010
it's on me. It's not on them. Right. But in addition

00:44:49.010 --> 00:44:52.230
to the fun, I think what you guys have done or

00:44:52.230 --> 00:44:56.210
are doing is that you're making it so integral,

00:44:56.510 --> 00:45:01.349
integral, integrated into. Daily life, you know,

00:45:01.369 --> 00:45:04.750
I mean, it's not an additional thing to do that

00:45:04.750 --> 00:45:09.030
to remember to do It's the thing to do, you know

00:45:09.030 --> 00:45:11.849
with your with video chatting with telehealth

00:45:11.849 --> 00:45:15.309
with connection to products It's the place to

00:45:15.309 --> 00:45:19.289
go. It's sort of like, you know googling it Everybody

00:45:19.289 --> 00:45:22.590
goes to Google, you know do you just Google it

00:45:22.590 --> 00:45:25.369
Google it? Well now, you know AI's chat is taking

00:45:25.369 --> 00:45:29.239
that over but It's like that. Now it's just go

00:45:29.239 --> 00:45:31.840
to independent. Independent will do it. Independent

00:45:31.840 --> 00:45:35.679
will do it. So that becomes integrated. You could

00:45:35.679 --> 00:45:37.719
do a hearing assessment right on the platform.

00:45:39.480 --> 00:45:42.380
And if you need something for your hearing, our

00:45:42.380 --> 00:45:45.659
partners can sell you the hearing aid at Lucid

00:45:45.659 --> 00:45:50.380
Hearing. We have partners that provide lab. tests

00:45:50.380 --> 00:45:52.380
into your home. So if you go, you go, you want

00:45:52.380 --> 00:45:54.320
to buy something, you can buy it and it comes

00:45:54.320 --> 00:45:57.300
to your home. So we, we have a pharmacy discount

00:45:57.300 --> 00:45:59.920
card from capital RX, our partners there. So

00:45:59.920 --> 00:46:03.699
we have an ecosystem of wellness benefits that

00:46:03.699 --> 00:46:07.880
again, are curated. So we're not buying your

00:46:07.880 --> 00:46:09.739
thing. Like if you come and say, I'm interested

00:46:09.739 --> 00:46:11.260
in that and you go do the service, you don't

00:46:11.260 --> 00:46:14.400
get ads from someone else. It's just, it's respectful

00:46:14.400 --> 00:46:16.980
to try to give you these services, you know,

00:46:16.980 --> 00:46:19.960
as simple and effective way as we can. Is there

00:46:19.960 --> 00:46:22.400
anything that it doesn't do that you wanted to

00:46:22.400 --> 00:46:24.780
do at this point? It doesn't brush your teeth.

00:46:27.980 --> 00:46:35.059
I would like to add transportation service partnership

00:46:35.059 --> 00:46:39.559
or ships, but at least one food delivery. That's

00:46:39.559 --> 00:46:42.820
a big thing as well. And veterinarian support.

00:46:42.820 --> 00:46:45.460
Those are the three that I think would be helpful.

00:46:46.349 --> 00:46:48.969
to the demographic. We just haven't done it because

00:46:48.969 --> 00:46:51.170
we're busy doing so many other things. And also,

00:46:51.309 --> 00:46:53.309
frankly, we do so much that nobody ever does

00:46:53.309 --> 00:46:56.110
anything close to us that adding those three

00:46:56.110 --> 00:46:58.349
doesn't really buy us anything. It's just the

00:46:58.349 --> 00:47:00.530
right thing to do at some point. We want to do

00:47:00.530 --> 00:47:03.449
that. Right. It would be more. It would be a

00:47:03.449 --> 00:47:05.690
more complete service. But you're right. When

00:47:05.690 --> 00:47:08.530
you have 38 things to do that day, it's hard

00:47:08.530 --> 00:47:11.510
to add another one or two others. Or I get it.

00:47:11.590 --> 00:47:13.889
I get it. But to answer your question candidly,

00:47:13.889 --> 00:47:16.880
those three, I think, are still important to

00:47:16.880 --> 00:47:19.360
add at some point it's just we don't get any

00:47:19.360 --> 00:47:21.340
brownie points for them no matter what it's like

00:47:21.340 --> 00:47:23.019
adding another game we have a bunch of games

00:47:23.019 --> 00:47:25.219
we can add two more games that we think are fun

00:47:25.219 --> 00:47:27.659
nobody's going to not use us because we don't

00:47:27.659 --> 00:47:29.860
have them yeah and who's going to use us maybe

00:47:29.860 --> 00:47:31.820
more i would think maybe some people might for

00:47:31.820 --> 00:47:33.659
the extra two same thing same thing with those

00:47:33.659 --> 00:47:36.079
i think so especially the food delivery because

00:47:36.079 --> 00:47:38.300
that really is an issue i know my mom -in -law

00:47:38.300 --> 00:47:41.920
lived to 102 and that was the hardest thing for

00:47:41.920 --> 00:47:46.969
her near the end you know 98 99 100 and so on

00:47:46.969 --> 00:47:50.030
is getting the food you know because it was just

00:47:50.030 --> 00:47:54.429
difficult to go and pack it and bring it home

00:47:54.429 --> 00:47:57.670
and unpack it and it was just a lot easier for

00:47:57.670 --> 00:48:01.130
her to get it delivered as she used to say like

00:48:01.130 --> 00:48:04.210
we used to do when i was a kid i said yeah okay

00:48:04.210 --> 00:48:06.889
only this time it's not in a wagon it's in a

00:48:06.889 --> 00:48:10.500
car Well, now it's in a robot, too. It just goes

00:48:10.500 --> 00:48:13.780
out in a robot. I know. I know. Well, if Elon

00:48:13.780 --> 00:48:17.159
Musk has his way, yeah, we'll have our robots

00:48:17.159 --> 00:48:22.579
for sure. So you also host a podcast, Keon's

00:48:22.579 --> 00:48:25.420
Kiosk. Is that true? Yeah, it's true. So tell

00:48:25.420 --> 00:48:27.380
me about that. We haven't done it recently. I

00:48:27.380 --> 00:48:30.840
just have so many contacts and people that I

00:48:30.840 --> 00:48:34.059
respect tremendously that I've known. to be really

00:48:34.059 --> 00:48:37.199
instrumental in healthcare, in different parts

00:48:37.199 --> 00:48:40.320
of healthcare. So we put together this series

00:48:40.320 --> 00:48:43.480
for me to get a chance to sort of memorialize

00:48:43.480 --> 00:48:45.619
my respect for them and admiration for where

00:48:45.619 --> 00:48:47.400
they were, how they did what they did to get

00:48:47.400 --> 00:48:50.880
us to where we are. And so I really enjoyed interviewing

00:48:50.880 --> 00:48:54.500
them and memorializing that. We're probably not

00:48:54.500 --> 00:48:57.460
gonna do the same format going forward, because

00:48:57.460 --> 00:49:00.869
this was literally like only six. but each one

00:49:00.869 --> 00:49:03.449
was like a deep dive with people that I've known

00:49:03.449 --> 00:49:06.610
and like the person who kind of essentially started

00:49:06.610 --> 00:49:09.610
digital health, the person who started PACE programs

00:49:09.610 --> 00:49:11.909
in America, the person who was the head of all

00:49:11.909 --> 00:49:16.289
of health caring for older adults in America

00:49:16.289 --> 00:49:19.469
and Kaiser Permanente, you know, and person who

00:49:19.469 --> 00:49:23.409
essentially leads the CCRC at home or life plan

00:49:23.409 --> 00:49:26.869
at home community, you know. I don't say revolution,

00:49:27.130 --> 00:49:32.670
but really momentum that they have. So there's

00:49:32.670 --> 00:49:34.630
a lot of admiration that I had for these folks.

00:49:34.650 --> 00:49:38.210
So it was my way of memorializing that. But we'll

00:49:38.210 --> 00:49:42.190
do some more things. I love that. It sounds like,

00:49:42.610 --> 00:49:45.469
do you watch the YouTube show Diary of a CEO?

00:49:46.369 --> 00:49:48.659
Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's sort of like that.

00:49:48.699 --> 00:49:51.800
He interviews these very influential people,

00:49:51.880 --> 00:49:54.340
but they're not famous. You know, it's not like

00:49:54.340 --> 00:49:56.300
someone you heard of. But yet when you listen

00:49:56.300 --> 00:49:59.099
to them, I mean, they know their stuff. They

00:49:59.099 --> 00:50:01.739
are in it and they are all about whatever the

00:50:01.739 --> 00:50:05.119
topic is for that particular show. Exactly. And

00:50:05.119 --> 00:50:07.780
he's such a great interviewer. He is a great

00:50:07.780 --> 00:50:09.940
interviewer. I mean, talk about. He's curious.

00:50:10.579 --> 00:50:14.059
He's curious. Yeah, he is. And he's actually

00:50:14.059 --> 00:50:17.199
interested in all of these topics. It doesn't

00:50:17.199 --> 00:50:19.840
matter if it's economics or if it's nutrition

00:50:19.840 --> 00:50:23.239
or technology. You know, he's very fascinated

00:50:23.239 --> 00:50:25.780
by it. So that's what makes him such a good interviewer.

00:50:26.159 --> 00:50:28.940
But it sounds like that, like Keon's kiosk is

00:50:28.940 --> 00:50:31.440
like that. You're interviewing these very influential

00:50:31.440 --> 00:50:35.139
people who really have their head in that industry

00:50:35.139 --> 00:50:38.460
or niche or whatever. And but yet it's not like

00:50:38.460 --> 00:50:41.179
they're famous. They're on the news. Yeah, exactly.

00:50:41.369 --> 00:50:43.670
And so for someone who was interested in the

00:50:43.670 --> 00:50:48.230
topics that they all I would say are both engaging

00:50:48.230 --> 00:50:51.170
and informative and also I think a little bit

00:50:51.170 --> 00:50:56.190
just positive in terms of how somebody could

00:50:56.190 --> 00:50:57.710
make such a difference. And like you said, we

00:50:57.710 --> 00:51:01.289
don't know them. But, you know, like Dr. Jenny

00:51:01.289 --> 00:51:04.869
Chen Hansen, who started on lock in the San Francisco

00:51:04.869 --> 00:51:07.889
area, which was a very special health program

00:51:07.889 --> 00:51:12.429
for primarily Chinese Americans. And the program

00:51:12.429 --> 00:51:15.389
was so successful, it was getting some special

00:51:15.389 --> 00:51:17.150
dispensation from the government for Medicare

00:51:17.150 --> 00:51:20.710
and Medicaid to keep them in the homes. And that

00:51:20.710 --> 00:51:22.929
became the PACE programs that we have today.

00:51:23.230 --> 00:51:26.789
So she basically started legislation. And she's

00:51:26.789 --> 00:51:28.730
done so much more since then, so many titles.

00:51:29.210 --> 00:51:32.090
And the humblest, nicest, most engaging, wonderful.

00:51:32.309 --> 00:51:35.090
And every one of those guests is like that. So

00:51:35.090 --> 00:51:37.809
yeah. I mean, I love that. I mean, the fact that

00:51:37.809 --> 00:51:41.769
you have that in your sphere, I think is beautiful.

00:51:42.150 --> 00:51:45.670
How do you stay grounded, you know, with all

00:51:45.670 --> 00:51:48.010
of this going around you and happening and all

00:51:48.010 --> 00:51:51.010
these changes and all these needs and not only

00:51:51.010 --> 00:51:53.710
the demographic changing but the technology changing

00:51:53.710 --> 00:51:57.710
as well and systems I'm sure are changing, you

00:51:57.710 --> 00:51:59.769
know, everything from government to local to

00:51:59.769 --> 00:52:03.869
whatever. How do you stay grounded? And by the

00:52:03.869 --> 00:52:06.369
way, I think your staff, your tribe, your team

00:52:06.369 --> 00:52:09.000
are very fortunate to have you. I appreciate

00:52:09.000 --> 00:52:12.360
that it's very kind of you. I'm grounded because

00:52:12.360 --> 00:52:15.579
we're all the same and we all do the same things

00:52:15.579 --> 00:52:17.400
and we're all shooting for the same things and

00:52:17.400 --> 00:52:19.880
basically humans at some level we just want to

00:52:19.880 --> 00:52:23.300
have safety and some opportunity and you know

00:52:23.300 --> 00:52:25.920
some future for our children if we have any and

00:52:25.920 --> 00:52:29.340
that the really basic levels and but I think

00:52:29.340 --> 00:52:31.900
maybe a different question is how do I stay somewhat

00:52:31.900 --> 00:52:36.579
sane instead of grounded? That's tougher, that's

00:52:36.579 --> 00:52:41.119
tougher. I was just actually telling someone,

00:52:42.119 --> 00:52:45.219
past couple years I came across this saying about

00:52:45.219 --> 00:52:48.159
your greatest challenges are dreams for someone

00:52:48.159 --> 00:52:51.579
laying in a hospital bed. And when you think

00:52:51.579 --> 00:52:53.619
about that, whether it's like big challenges

00:52:53.619 --> 00:52:56.340
or daily challenges, they really are nothing.

00:52:57.069 --> 00:53:00.010
compared to like health issues and the fact that

00:53:00.010 --> 00:53:02.550
we can walk around and breathe and you know wake

00:53:02.550 --> 00:53:05.369
up and do things so gratitude is a big thing

00:53:05.369 --> 00:53:08.230
that you know I practice all the time and it's

00:53:08.230 --> 00:53:09.829
easy to be grateful when things are going your

00:53:09.829 --> 00:53:12.130
way but when they're not that's really hard but

00:53:12.130 --> 00:53:15.329
you have to do it the other thing for me personally

00:53:15.329 --> 00:53:20.010
is I love what I do so it's not work so it's

00:53:20.010 --> 00:53:22.590
you know if and I can't say to everyone this

00:53:22.590 --> 00:53:24.650
cliche oh if you don't love what you do do finds

00:53:24.650 --> 00:53:26.500
I don't know it's hard sometimes you got to go

00:53:26.500 --> 00:53:29.639
make money and all that. But for me, I love what

00:53:29.639 --> 00:53:31.840
I do. I love the people I work with. So I'm equally

00:53:31.840 --> 00:53:34.980
fortunate with that tribe. It is a tribe. And

00:53:34.980 --> 00:53:37.659
I have a lot of people I work for. I work for

00:53:37.659 --> 00:53:40.039
the people in this company and my shareholders

00:53:40.039 --> 00:53:44.260
and our partners and our customers and my children

00:53:44.260 --> 00:53:47.699
and everything. But you have to love what you

00:53:47.699 --> 00:53:51.500
do. Yeah, because then it truly is. You have

00:53:51.500 --> 00:53:53.800
to love what you do because then it's not work.

00:53:54.039 --> 00:53:56.019
you know it really is my friends are forever

00:53:56.019 --> 00:53:58.039
telling me Esther when are you going to retire

00:53:58.039 --> 00:54:02.099
and I'm like I am retired I mean I'm enjoying

00:54:02.099 --> 00:54:05.360
everything that I do yeah you know you like to

00:54:05.360 --> 00:54:08.079
travel to China or wherever but I like doing

00:54:08.079 --> 00:54:10.579
this you know this is maybe I'm retired too the

00:54:10.579 --> 00:54:14.960
way it's going yeah it's okay it's good it's

00:54:14.960 --> 00:54:17.449
good because at the end of the day you can lay

00:54:17.449 --> 00:54:19.469
your head on your pillow knowing that you helped

00:54:19.469 --> 00:54:22.809
so and so or you did this or you know, it's very

00:54:22.809 --> 00:54:25.349
fulfilling. And I think that's so very important

00:54:25.349 --> 00:54:27.949
as you get older. So then doing your best doing

00:54:27.949 --> 00:54:30.989
your best if you do your best. That's it is going

00:54:30.989 --> 00:54:33.150
to happen or not happen. But if it's your human

00:54:33.150 --> 00:54:35.710
best, which is a lot because a lot of us don't

00:54:35.710 --> 00:54:38.230
do our human best. But if we do our best, then

00:54:38.230 --> 00:54:40.630
the rest is whatever it is. And then you just

00:54:40.630 --> 00:54:44.010
enjoy the moment. That's very stoic of you. It's

00:54:44.010 --> 00:54:47.360
true. And it's true. I want to thank you. Stay

00:54:47.360 --> 00:54:49.599
on the line. I want to thank you so very much,

00:54:49.820 --> 00:54:52.199
everyone. I know that you learned a lot on this

00:54:52.199 --> 00:54:55.619
interview and I cannot wait to publish it and

00:54:55.619 --> 00:54:58.119
post it. If you have any questions or anything,

00:54:58.260 --> 00:55:06.800
what is your website again, Keon? There you go.

00:55:07.059 --> 00:55:09.360
Please check out independent .com because I don't

00:55:09.360 --> 00:55:11.559
think there's anything except for maybe brushing

00:55:11.559 --> 00:55:14.320
your teeth that that little program doesn't do.

00:55:14.579 --> 00:55:16.940
And I definitely am going to be checking it out

00:55:16.940 --> 00:55:19.579
and writing some more about it. Thank you so

00:55:19.579 --> 00:55:21.260
much, Keon. I appreciate it. You're very kind

00:55:21.260 --> 00:55:23.679
to us. It was my pleasure. My pleasure. Thank

00:55:23.679 --> 00:55:24.019
you.