This edition of the Chatterbox Redux podcast
is brought to you in association with the Old
Glory Iconic Music and Sports Superstore. More
from them in a bit. Chatterbox. When the stars
talk, they talk to Nick and Sue. Welcome back
to the Chatterbox Redux podcast with Sue and
Nick and today our special guest is Ian Wills
from Wills and the Willing. This is Nick and
Sue with Chatterbox giving you all you need to
know about musical entertainment Chatterbox,
the best interviews with Nick and Sue Chatterbox,
the best news Chatterbox we're just lucky enough
to welcome back Ian Wills of Wills and the Willing.
Ian welcome back how are you sir? Very well thank
you Nick and yourself. Well good thank you thank
you. Right we've got this new single which is
coming from a forthcoming album which we're going
to have a big big chat about in the future about
the album when it comes out. Newton's Law yeah
right well I can think of three basic Newton's
Laws which ones it based on? Well, it was based
upon two really, the theory of gravity, what
goes up has got to come down and the balance
of physics. But in translating that into the
single, the idea being is that in my head was
that no matter what you do, you can't avoid inevitability.
So that's Newton's law, it goes up, it comes
down. I like it, yeah, because I was thinking,
well, yeah, I was kind of thinking, well, could
it be like the, I was thinking, well, could it
be acceleration, the force, something we were
going with it, so he went down that, that's fine,
perfect answer, as always. Thank you. The theory
being was what happened in the thought process
was there was another young life lost and in
tragic circumstances, and it made me feel very
uncomfortable with being alive. And that no matter
how well you try to live your life or atone for
the things that you've done in the past and try
to balance the books, there is inevitability.
And I think I captured that in the lyrics when
I said, when it's time, it's time. When it's
you up, you're up. And it seemed very tragic
in my mind. And, you know, the line, I think,
was no matter how you atone, the good die young
and alone. And that was really what set me down
that path. And then I thought about losing somebody.
And then they get to heaven, if it exists, who
knows. But on the basis that it does exist. That
when they asked me... what the reasons they were
this I would blame myself I would say it's Newton's
law okay and then the theory being is that when
it was my time um and I get to heaven being the
person I am I'm not going to go there with clean
hands I'm going to have a hacksaw because I know
there's a challenge that they might not let me
in and so therefore that was my sort of preparation
for that moment and that's what the song really
is about belief redemption inevitability and
and tragedy but okay we've been talking quite
some years now where we were locked down or when
you did your first album it was a very long time
we've been radio norsi international before chatterbox
even started i remember one sunday come on we
had a good chat about your background and yeah
denning spy ketchup in lay buys and I think you're
up to the age of 15 to have a story and maybe
we'll bring it up again when we perhaps talk
about the album. It's a great story. So, but
then again, you say about redemption, you have
spent a lifetime redeeming yourself. You had
a fantastic life as well, but a great story.
It's an incredible story. It fills up volumes
of autobiographies. You're so kind. but i mean
it's a very serious point now i know you've had
a lot of health issues and the way you're talking
about the newton's law and the the thought process
behind it is health really not good are you thinking
this could be the last project is it that serious
now or how is it you know you fight you have
a series of challenges all the time the days
when i get up and i feel like i'm 21 and and
i you know mentally i'm always going to be 21
But the physicality, again, Newton's law, the
outcome of physicality is physics. And there
are days when I really do struggle and times
when I really think like, wow, is this the inevitability
of the end? And again, I think I did get very
unwell when making this album. And I got diagnosed
with the cirrhosis of the liver. And then in
the pre -production of this album, I ended up
picking up a UTI that's the size of Mount Kilimanjaro.
It really was bad. And then in the process of
thinking that I've got out of that, you know,
I think that was caused by the prostate cancer
and the cirrhosis and everything else that's
going on internally. And then, you know, I ended
up getting sepsis. And so you do feel to yourself,
is this today? Is this the moment? Is it come
to the end? And I think that, so you live with
that. It's not fear. You live it with almost
like a motivation. And in using that Newton's
law, a very dear friend of mine, we've been friends
for over 50 years. I've got father to his second
child. I held each one of these babies in my
arms when they were born. And his son is about
as clean, living, good boy that you could get.
His daughter is 11 months old. He was 34. He
sat down on the TV and he died. Just like that.
And when I was at the service a couple of weeks
ago, I sat there in isolation and felt to myself
that... If ever there was an applicable song
applied to what I was sitting through, it was
Newton's law, because the good do die young.
And so it continues to make me feel that every
day is a blessing and every sleep might be your
last. Sure. You have, of course, stared dead
in the face. A few times in your life. That's
when you were young of course. Hopefully you
will again. I think it's great that new listeners
in the years have been speaking. There's a lot
of new listeners come by. I'm sure we know the
stories. I'm sure we can skin through them. I
think they need to know that. It's just amazing.
You certainly had your fair experience of staring
death in the face. Are we connected with a teacher?
There was a couple of teachers that really, when
I was at school, they remember me, I don't remember
myself, if that makes sense. So I remember every
bad thing that I did, because it was outrageously
bad. And we were laughing and joking, so I promised
them a couple of years ago that I would do for
them a lunch at my house and do an acoustic gig,
just me and a guitar. I got my friend Steve to
come and do it with me. And Danny is such a great
man. And he went from being an English teacher
to chief executive of 12 academies. And he openly,
those who've read my book know that he actually
dined out on me for 40 years because of the things
that I did. And we were talking, a joke in a
light and a particular song. And we were talking
about my gardening business. And at the point
that I'd written this poem was the first thing,
it was really the first thing I'd written. I
got in my car one day when I got my license back
and I went, I drove across to France and I went
across to Flanders. And I was, came back and
it triggers something in me. So I wrote this
poem called Flanders. I was so proud of it. So
I went to school and at this point I think Danny
was, I think he was definitely head at that point,
or got up, let's see. and he saw me and embraced
me and I did this poem and I showed him this
poem he gave me this book of war poets from the
first world war and it stuck with me and I had
my gardening business and I was doing and I said
to him I will you know I'll give a job to somebody
like that this was a outrageous reprobate like
me now he actually genuinely believed that my
gardening business was the front for me to go
and burgle high -end houses because I was that
bad in the sense of like where you were so to
see that change in your personality and you know
I never burgled anybody's house but you know
people think that you're upgrading your criminality
Yeah, I never thought you were the Wimbledon
Proud or anything like that. They're so proud
of me. They're in their late 70s and early 80s,
these two friends, and they're so proud of me
that I came out the other side. And Gareth, who
is in his 80s now, he became the headmaster.
So I was forced to leave school when I was evicted
by the police from the school, but I had to attend,
it was part of what was my... probation that
I had to do in advance of trying to sort of keep
myself together. But he said to me that he didn't
believe that I'd make 18. And he was right. I
remember the things that happened to me in that
process. And so to get here either through ill
health to be still in your 60s, that violence
didn't take me, the way that I lived that early
life didn't take me. You know, I've been shot
at. and the bullet missed me and so you know
and so you you do believe so when you when you
when you reflect all of that into your creativity
or storytelling there's always the the part of
you that um there's always the truth in there
and um and I think I was looking in Newton's
law again for me it was about atonement and I
think the triggering that is you still try to
atone for the things that you did wrong and even
though you've probably done far more right than
you ever going to do wrong. But the wrong still
outweighs the right. Nick and Sue. Supporting
the show means supporting the brands that keep
the lights on and today I'm thrilled to talk
about a personal favorite of mine, Old Glory.
Old Glory is the ultimate destination for music,
sports and pop culture fans. They are a family
owned business founded back in 1969. Now Old
Glory and I actually share a birth year and while
I'll be the first to admit their vintage tees
have aged a little more gracefully than I have
that's exactly why I love them. With over 300
,000 officially licensed items, we aren't just
talking about generic prints. From the heavy
hitters like the Beatles, Metallica and the Rolling
Stones to official NASA gear, they cover every
corner of fandom. Most importantly, the quality
is top -tier. There aren't one -and -done shirts.
They hold their shape and the color wash after
wash. Beyond the Gear, I'm proud to partner with
them because every purchase through our link
supports a bigger goal. Abortion of our commission
goes directly to the Stripe Climate Programme,
helping fund carbon removal technologies to combat
climate change. Upgrade your wardrobe and support
the planet. Use code CBUKRDUX at oldglory .com
for 15 % off your entire order. The link is also
waiting for you in the show notes of this podcast.
Don't forget CBUKRDUX. So here's Nick and Sue,
your musical duo. This is Nick and Sue with Cheddar
Box, giving you all you need to know about musical
entertainment. Cheddar Box! Cheddar Box! Cheddar
Box! Cheddar Box! Cheddar Box! Cheddar Box! Cheddar
Box! Cheddar Box! Right, you've got an album
coming out which we're going to chat about in
detail when it comes out. When is it coming out
actually? Well, I'm not sure. I think it would
be late summer, early autumn. It's been mixed
as we speak. It's called, that's why I wrote
this song. Yes, yes. And I thought if ever there's
a great story, a title for an album, it will
intrigue people to see well what's that about?
And so that's what I thought, well I hope that
has the effect. Sure. Last time we spoke, it
wasn't the last album I guess, you were doing
a concert, was it St Martin in the Field? St
Pancras, St Pancras Old Church. Oh the Old Church,
oh it's beautiful that is, yes. Oh my god, thank
you. Yes so many people we chat to are there,
yes of course. And I think you were giving a
free copy of the CD or something? Yeah I gave
copies to the album to everybody and I'll tell
you a little story if we've got time Nick about
that. So I plan to do it in the June of 2024.
Again, I got ill. I knew I wasn't match fit.
But there's a guy, his name's Paul. I'm not gonna
say his last name, but his first name's Paul.
He's been a fan of mine since the very, very
beginning. And Curbside, he even texted me the
other day saying how much Curbside is one of
his favorite albums of all time. So he's a working
class man, doesn't have much money, lives in
Norfolk, and he was making the journey from Norfolk
to London to come and see me. Now he booked everything,
he booked his tickets and everything else, and
I cancelled. He was like, oh, Ian, no problem.
And I know he couldn't get his money back and
everything else. So I said, you know what, I
have a morality here. I need to make this right.
Covered his air his train ticket and his hotel
for him as much as came up on a coach He took
the day off work rights was costing him money
to come and see me he came and And I remembered
Paul from the time of curbside. So it was wonderful
to connect to something but what gave me the
most Pleasure from that was he wrote me a card
Okay, and in that car, he obviously said thank
you for aware But he also said to me how much
my music had meant to him in his life and so
I feel that like every time one person says to
me that there is some connection between the
music and myself that that to me that feels like
a million people and so it's so that's why I
wrote this song I think reflects that. And it's
going to be fantastic talking about the new album
when we do it. I mean, we do it before it comes
out. We're not going to wait for it. As soon
as I get the press release. But since we had
the last interview, I mean, Chatterbox has obviously
gone from strength to strength. 200 radio stations
well now there's a podcast so all the interviews
go on a podcast on all the platforms as well
so we've grown to the next stage so uh whatever
happens you are going to have a new audience
you know even thank you so it's nice so i'm looking
forward to sharing that album with you and uh
you know we we give it the time it deserves like
we've done in the past you know absolutely throwing
a whole load of the tracks that are meaningful
to you and stuff like that um but um before we
let you go let's do some social medias i know
you've got one great website so if you chuck
all your social media at them please ian yeah
it's obviously willsandowillin .com you can find
me on instagram and facebook what's impressed
what really got me i have to tell you this before
we go right in april i had 96 listeners on spotify
in may i've got just under 5 000 brilliant yeah
And Newton's Law has had, I think, like one way
or another, it's had like 20 or 1 ,000 plays
across all the platforms streaming -wise. Now,
that's not the same as like Springsteen or Coldplay
or YouTube, but for Ian Wills, that's like, for
me, that is a massive recognition for what, making
six albums, what will be the sixth album, and
the strength of those carry me. And what I thought
was really cool, you know, Spotify, they've done
now an essential... wheels and the willing so
anybody's listening to this i know right i was
like wow i was like winning the fa cup yes brilliant
brilliant well with us i mean we only launched
on february the 9th and of course it was slow
to start with you know think oh my god we got
29 that day you think but uh yeah uh we're now
obviously three months in just and uh i i expect
a minimum of 500 downloads a week now on the
new podcast oh wonderful that's a good start
That's really good stuff. What I'm saying is
though 500 people is 500 people that want to
listen to you. Yes. That's the point. So it's
not like it's people listening to a radio at
home and now they just listen to an interview.
These people in my opinion on a podcast want
to listen to you. Yes and it's great that's great
and well done you know you deserve it you've
been banging away like I've been banging away
and and and you know the great thing the recipe
of success is failure. Yes About time you have
no idea what success feels like I had 20 years
out of radio in the middle of that There's a
lot of stories there, but they guess I totally
agree. It's a great great thing, you know And
of course you you are being called many times
and quite rightly so the the injury of the the
new century the Millennium so I still I still
treasure that and you know what was really quite
nice in making sound with the band Was Simon
and uh donnie uh simon said to me that he felt
like um i was now sort of in his mind lennard
cohen and uh donnie said to me he felt like nick
drake oh yes yes i know yeah yeah yeah so that
was really uh you know he did quite a lot of
stuff didn't he yeah yeah yeah i remember bless
him rest in peace yes i know right So it's really
nice to feel that, but the injury thing is such
a, I wear that with pride. It means a lot to
me, and it is quite fitting and quite right what
you've been through and your health and everything.
It wasn't that long ago we actually interviewed
Chas Jank, of course we had quite a chat then.
It's fantastic, it is well deserved of course.
Thank you. uh yeah always love to chat longer
but we will make a big thing of it on the what
i do because i've got your facebook and everything
i can always make sure by messenger we've got
an alternative just in case there's a problem
yes yeah next time we got that lisa sent me your
whatsapp thing so Yeah, I'm here. We'd be good,
mate. But we've never had a front before, so
he's just a one -off, I'm sure, but, you know.
But, Ian, great, every success with the single.
Thank you. And we'll chat again with the album
anyway. Thank you again for all your support.
It's a pleasure, as always. Cheers, Ian. You
know I appreciate it. Cheers, mate. Take care.
Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. You have been listening
to the Chatterbox Redux podcast with Sue and
Nick and today our special guest was Ian Wills
of Wills and the Willing. If you're interested
in becoming a future guest on the Chatterbox
Redux podcast or the radio show Chatterbox UK,
you're welcome to submit songs, books or whatever
it is you do and send us a CV, synopsis or press
release. However, we receive several thousand
such press releases every week and it's impossible
to reply to each one individually. Why not email
us or leave a comment because we'd love to know
what you think of the podcast. Our email address
is nickelbum at myyahoo .com Alternatively, you
could write to us at P .O. Box 26, The Old Observer
Building, Telford Road, St. Leonard -on -Sea,
East Sussex, England, TN389LZ. And wherever it
is you choose to listen to the Chatterbox Redux
podcast, don't forget to give us a like, a follow,
a favorite, or whatever it is on that platform.
just so you don't miss a future episode. Sue,
myself Nick and Twinkle the tuxedo cat. Thank
you very much for your company and we look forward
to welcoming you again next time for another
Chatterbox Redux podcast. In the meantime, take
care, we thank you for your company and we catch
you then. Bye bye. This is Nick and Sue with
Chatterbox giving you all you need to know about
musical entertainment. Oh yeah! Chatterbox, the
best interviews with Nick and Sue. Chatterbox,
the best news