1
00:00:00,880 --> 00:00:08,759
Let's open with a moment of silence

2
00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:08,759
followed by the serenity prayer.

3
00:00:26,400 --> 00:00:32,079
God

4
00:00:28,080 --> 00:00:36,160
grant me to accept the things I cannot

5
00:00:32,079 --> 00:00:40,440
change the courage to change things and

6
00:00:36,160 --> 00:00:40,440
the wisdom to know the difference.

7
00:00:41,520 --> 00:00:51,840
I'm Harvey Asher, a sexolic

8
00:00:45,520 --> 00:00:54,840
and my sobriety date is March 8th, 1984.

9
00:00:51,840 --> 00:00:54,840
Um,

10
00:00:55,199 --> 00:01:01,120
I used to be about six feet tall before

11
00:00:58,079 --> 00:01:06,240
I got into recovery. Having a lot out of

12
00:01:01,120 --> 00:01:08,560
me. Uh, I, um,

13
00:01:06,240 --> 00:01:11,840
can you read the essay purpose for us or

14
00:01:08,560 --> 00:01:15,400
someone at this point? They're just

15
00:01:11,840 --> 00:01:15,400
coming up here.

16
00:01:16,159 --> 00:01:18,479
Madam Sexaholic.

17
00:01:17,439 --> 00:01:21,040
Amen.

18
00:01:18,479 --> 00:01:22,479
DSA purpose. Sexaholics Anonymous is a

19
00:01:21,040 --> 00:01:24,000
fellowship of men and women who share

20
00:01:22,479 --> 00:01:25,759
their experience, strength, and hope

21
00:01:24,000 --> 00:01:27,200
with each other that they may solve

22
00:01:25,759 --> 00:01:29,439
their common problem and help others to

23
00:01:27,200 --> 00:01:30,960
recover. The only requirement for

24
00:01:29,439 --> 00:01:33,119
membership is to desire to stop lusting

25
00:01:30,960 --> 00:01:35,759
and become sexually sober. There are no

26
00:01:33,119 --> 00:01:36,880
dues or fees for SA membership. We are

27
00:01:35,759 --> 00:01:38,799
self-supporting for our own

28
00:01:36,880 --> 00:01:41,040
contributions. SA is not allowed with

29
00:01:38,799 --> 00:01:42,479
any sect, denomination, politics,

30
00:01:41,040 --> 00:01:44,320
organization, or institution. Does not

31
00:01:42,479 --> 00:01:46,240
wish to engage in any controversy,

32
00:01:44,320 --> 00:01:47,840
neither endorses nor opposes any causes.

33
00:01:46,240 --> 00:01:49,840
Our primary purpose is to stay sexually

34
00:01:47,840 --> 00:01:51,439
sober and help others to achieve sexual

35
00:01:49,840 --> 00:01:55,240
sobriety.

36
00:01:51,439 --> 00:01:55,240
Thank you. Thank you.

37
00:01:56,479 --> 00:02:01,680
Let's get to it. I'm um I'm going to

38
00:01:59,280 --> 00:02:05,920
start speaking a while and then

39
00:02:01,680 --> 00:02:10,479
hopefully Hey, Ryan. Um hopefully

40
00:02:05,920 --> 00:02:12,879
we'll have some time for you all to kind

41
00:02:10,479 --> 00:02:15,760
of share a little about some of the

42
00:02:12,879 --> 00:02:19,680
things that I'm going to bring up today.

43
00:02:15,760 --> 00:02:21,840
Um, I really didn't know how I was going

44
00:02:19,680 --> 00:02:25,280
to begin this because there are so many

45
00:02:21,840 --> 00:02:29,680
ways to begin. Uh but I got my answer

46
00:02:25,280 --> 00:02:31,840
last night when a young guy

47
00:02:29,680 --> 00:02:35,519
with we'll say young guy but whatever

48
00:02:31,840 --> 00:02:37,360
came up to me to say what really helped

49
00:02:35,519 --> 00:02:40,239
him

50
00:02:37,360 --> 00:02:44,720
some months ago when I asked a group in

51
00:02:40,239 --> 00:02:48,319
my own fel hometown in Nashville uh how

52
00:02:44,720 --> 00:02:51,319
many people believed they really had a

53
00:02:48,319 --> 00:02:51,319
disease.

54
00:02:51,360 --> 00:02:57,680
How many of you

55
00:02:53,680 --> 00:03:03,040
believe that your condition

56
00:02:57,680 --> 00:03:04,800
is like high blood pressure or diabetes

57
00:03:03,040 --> 00:03:08,080
or

58
00:03:04,800 --> 00:03:12,560
multiple sclerosis,

59
00:03:08,080 --> 00:03:15,360
especially MS where it will come in

60
00:03:12,560 --> 00:03:18,080
little increments and then go away and

61
00:03:15,360 --> 00:03:23,120
each time it comes and goes, it gets a

62
00:03:18,080 --> 00:03:26,560
little bigger, a little more or ulcers

63
00:03:23,120 --> 00:03:29,440
that will flare up or settle down. How

64
00:03:26,560 --> 00:03:32,319
many of you, and I'd like you to raise

65
00:03:29,440 --> 00:03:36,519
your hand, really believe

66
00:03:32,319 --> 00:03:36,519
you have a disease?

67
00:03:37,440 --> 00:03:44,239
Okay?

68
00:03:40,319 --> 00:03:47,599
Because if you don't, and let me tell

69
00:03:44,239 --> 00:03:50,799
you, this is a great response, but if

70
00:03:47,599 --> 00:03:53,599
you don't, you're probably

71
00:03:50,799 --> 00:03:56,560
in the majority

72
00:03:53,599 --> 00:03:58,400
because many people who come to this

73
00:03:56,560 --> 00:04:02,319
fellowship

74
00:03:58,400 --> 00:04:07,840
have a tremendous problem with chapter

75
00:04:02,319 --> 00:04:12,400
five in the AA book where it says we had

76
00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:16,239
to let go of our old ideas.

77
00:04:12,400 --> 00:04:19,120
It's such a simple statement that we

78
00:04:16,239 --> 00:04:22,160
read day after day and we don't give it

79
00:04:19,120 --> 00:04:25,280
much thought.

80
00:04:22,160 --> 00:04:27,360
And where is it placed?

81
00:04:25,280 --> 00:04:32,960
It's placed

82
00:04:27,360 --> 00:04:35,120
in the paragraphs before

83
00:04:32,960 --> 00:04:38,720
it says and here are the suggestions the

84
00:04:35,120 --> 00:04:42,240
steps. In other words, there are some

85
00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:44,400
basic requirements

86
00:04:42,240 --> 00:04:50,400
of acceptance

87
00:04:44,400 --> 00:04:53,440
prior to being able to take the steps.

88
00:04:50,400 --> 00:04:58,080
And the steps are our medicine for a

89
00:04:53,440 --> 00:05:02,400
disease. So if we can't take the steps,

90
00:04:58,080 --> 00:05:06,560
it's difficult to stay sober.

91
00:05:02,400 --> 00:05:10,000
And so we need to understand what's

92
00:05:06,560 --> 00:05:15,360
before the steps. And there are some

93
00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:19,039
keys. One says in these sections

94
00:05:15,360 --> 00:05:22,479
about being honest. It says we could be

95
00:05:19,039 --> 00:05:26,639
mentally ill and get this program, but

96
00:05:22,479 --> 00:05:29,840
if we're dishonest, we can't get it.

97
00:05:26,639 --> 00:05:34,039
Okay? So it says being crazy is no

98
00:05:29,840 --> 00:05:34,039
problem in getting this program.

99
00:05:36,639 --> 00:05:41,720
But that honesty and then it said

100
00:05:41,919 --> 00:05:50,639
if you want what we have and are willing

101
00:05:45,919 --> 00:05:55,840
to go to any length to get it

102
00:05:50,639 --> 00:05:59,120
any length. What does any length mean?

103
00:05:55,840 --> 00:06:02,240
you know, what are we willing to do to

104
00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:05,199
get it?

105
00:06:02,240 --> 00:06:09,039
And then it talks about

106
00:06:05,199 --> 00:06:11,520
letting go of old ideas.

107
00:06:09,039 --> 00:06:14,800
And this fellowship,

108
00:06:11,520 --> 00:06:16,479
in my opinion, is so

109
00:06:14,800 --> 00:06:21,840
entrenched

110
00:06:16,479 --> 00:06:25,919
with the old idea that we're sinners,

111
00:06:21,840 --> 00:06:32,240
that we're bad getting good. We're not

112
00:06:25,919 --> 00:06:35,440
sick getting well. I mean, what a job

113
00:06:32,240 --> 00:06:39,840
to help each other

114
00:06:35,440 --> 00:06:42,720
redo those brain circuits of going from

115
00:06:39,840 --> 00:06:46,759
bad to good,

116
00:06:42,720 --> 00:06:46,759
sick to well.

117
00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:52,000
And

118
00:06:49,360 --> 00:06:56,800
this whole concept

119
00:06:52,000 --> 00:06:59,199
is for one reason. Why do we get sober?

120
00:06:56,800 --> 00:07:01,520
I mean, why go through this? You know,

121
00:06:59,199 --> 00:07:04,720
we talk about masturbation. We talk

122
00:07:01,520 --> 00:07:07,280
about adultery. This, you know, this

123
00:07:04,720 --> 00:07:10,160
stuff's been going on for thousands of

124
00:07:07,280 --> 00:07:11,919
years.

125
00:07:10,160 --> 00:07:14,560
You know, like an AA, they're not

126
00:07:11,919 --> 00:07:15,840
prohibitionists.

127
00:07:14,560 --> 00:07:19,199
You know, we don't go around saying,

128
00:07:15,840 --> 00:07:22,319
"Oh, you better not masturbate. It's

129
00:07:19,199 --> 00:07:26,240
terrible. Look what happened to you."

130
00:07:22,319 --> 00:07:28,560
You know, and by the way, my program in

131
00:07:26,240 --> 00:07:34,840
Nashville when I went blind about six

132
00:07:28,560 --> 00:07:34,840
years ago on one eye, they'd say, "See,

133
00:07:37,120 --> 00:07:40,639
I mean, how did they know?"

134
00:07:41,919 --> 00:07:51,199
to this concept of the disease.

135
00:07:46,880 --> 00:07:55,360
The disease, you know, I was

136
00:07:51,199 --> 00:07:58,879
deep in meditation. I have a real

137
00:07:55,360 --> 00:08:02,400
hopefully comfortable sobriety,

138
00:07:58,879 --> 00:08:04,960
but I was deep in meditation

139
00:08:02,400 --> 00:08:10,240
doing TM the other day. Must have been

140
00:08:04,960 --> 00:08:12,639
about 15 minutes into it. just clear and

141
00:08:10,240 --> 00:08:16,160
out of nowhere

142
00:08:12,639 --> 00:08:19,199
and a a nude man. I had never had sex

143
00:08:16,160 --> 00:08:22,400
with him. A nude man showed up in my

144
00:08:19,199 --> 00:08:25,919
head so vivid.

145
00:08:22,400 --> 00:08:29,280
Where does that come from?

146
00:08:25,919 --> 00:08:31,440
How does it show up?

147
00:08:29,280 --> 00:08:34,080
The speaker last night was speaking

148
00:08:31,440 --> 00:08:37,200
about intimacy and all of a sudden I

149
00:08:34,080 --> 00:08:41,360
pictured a sexual thing I had done with

150
00:08:37,200 --> 00:08:46,320
someone 28 years ago

151
00:08:41,360 --> 00:08:49,360
out of nowhere. So real.

152
00:08:46,320 --> 00:08:53,760
What other explanation could be than I

153
00:08:49,360 --> 00:08:57,880
have screwed up cells circuits? My

154
00:08:53,760 --> 00:08:57,880
circuits are messed up.

155
00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:04,800
I'm a very sick man.

156
00:09:01,519 --> 00:09:07,440
And so why am I here? Why am I sharing?

157
00:09:04,800 --> 00:09:09,839
Why am I going to meetings after a lot

158
00:09:07,440 --> 00:09:13,440
of years? I've moved to Memphis for

159
00:09:09,839 --> 00:09:17,200
about seven months. And you know, it's

160
00:09:13,440 --> 00:09:19,040
my priority getting to meetings

161
00:09:17,200 --> 00:09:21,519
and I'm not going to act out today.

162
00:09:19,040 --> 00:09:23,120
Can't guarantee you tomorrow, but today

163
00:09:21,519 --> 00:09:26,080
I don't want to act out. I'm not going

164
00:09:23,120 --> 00:09:27,920
to act out today. I don't want to. done

165
00:09:26,080 --> 00:09:31,680
my contracts.

166
00:09:27,920 --> 00:09:37,040
So why am I here doing this? Because

167
00:09:31,680 --> 00:09:41,000
this program is not about lust or sex.

168
00:09:37,040 --> 00:09:41,000
It's about comfort.

169
00:09:41,760 --> 00:09:48,080
It's about comfort. We're not

170
00:09:44,320 --> 00:09:50,560
prohibitionists. We're not um trying to

171
00:09:48,080 --> 00:09:54,480
change the world

172
00:09:50,560 --> 00:09:59,040
about sexual things. We're trying to be

173
00:09:54,480 --> 00:10:02,959
comfortable and I cannot be comfortable

174
00:09:59,040 --> 00:10:05,920
if I am using the allergen I'm allergic

175
00:10:02,959 --> 00:10:08,480
to.

176
00:10:05,920 --> 00:10:10,080
It doesn't work if you're allergic to

177
00:10:08,480 --> 00:10:12,959
penicellin.

178
00:10:10,080 --> 00:10:15,040
Even if you use aylin,

179
00:10:12,959 --> 00:10:16,720
you're not going to feel comfortable.

180
00:10:15,040 --> 00:10:19,440
You're going to get a rash. You're going

181
00:10:16,720 --> 00:10:22,720
to get sick.

182
00:10:19,440 --> 00:10:26,560
So, do I accept

183
00:10:22,720 --> 00:10:30,600
that I have an allergy?

184
00:10:26,560 --> 00:10:30,600
Do I accept it?

185
00:10:30,640 --> 00:10:38,320
and that if I do certain things, not

186
00:10:35,120 --> 00:10:41,760
that they're bad or they're good, but if

187
00:10:38,320 --> 00:10:47,000
I do certain things, like someone who is

188
00:10:41,760 --> 00:10:47,000
allergic to um peanuts

189
00:10:47,360 --> 00:10:53,839
and they don't check the labels on the

190
00:10:51,600 --> 00:10:57,120
boxes

191
00:10:53,839 --> 00:11:01,760
and they end up getting some peanuts and

192
00:10:57,120 --> 00:11:01,760
they end up being very si sick.

193
00:11:05,519 --> 00:11:10,079
Why are they going to be comfortable?

194
00:11:08,240 --> 00:11:13,600
No.

195
00:11:10,079 --> 00:11:16,640
So, this is about for me

196
00:11:13,600 --> 00:11:19,680
recognizing number one that I'm sick

197
00:11:16,640 --> 00:11:24,959
getting well. Number two, that my

198
00:11:19,680 --> 00:11:28,399
sickness is a phys is an allergy

199
00:11:24,959 --> 00:11:30,480
accompanied by a mental obsession.

200
00:11:28,399 --> 00:11:32,640
Now, where the heck am I getting this

201
00:11:30,480 --> 00:11:34,560
stuff from?

202
00:11:32,640 --> 00:11:36,880
You know, am I just making it up? Well,

203
00:11:34,560 --> 00:11:39,040
you know, I'm still still have trouble

204
00:11:36,880 --> 00:11:42,880
making things up. You have to check out

205
00:11:39,040 --> 00:11:47,120
whatever I say. Read it because I'll

206
00:11:42,880 --> 00:11:51,920
I'll create it to my own making.

207
00:11:47,120 --> 00:11:54,640
But this is what the big book says.

208
00:11:51,920 --> 00:11:57,920
And how do we know this is what they

209
00:11:54,640 --> 00:12:01,600
meant? because they did not put Bill W's

210
00:11:57,920 --> 00:12:04,240
story first in the AA book.

211
00:12:01,600 --> 00:12:07,040
It's not first. And by the way, I

212
00:12:04,240 --> 00:12:09,440
referred to the AA book because Roy in

213
00:12:07,040 --> 00:12:12,959
the SA book

214
00:12:09,440 --> 00:12:15,680
on a few occasions to my knowledge is

215
00:12:12,959 --> 00:12:19,560
alluding to the fact that he assumes we

216
00:12:15,680 --> 00:12:19,560
know the AA book.

217
00:12:20,000 --> 00:12:26,720
Okay. So, what do they do to begin the

218
00:12:23,360 --> 00:12:29,720
AA book? They begin with a doctor's

219
00:12:26,720 --> 00:12:29,720
opinion.

220
00:12:30,480 --> 00:12:38,600
They don't begin with Bill's revelation,

221
00:12:34,399 --> 00:12:38,600
his spiritual awakening.

222
00:12:40,160 --> 00:12:49,079
They begin with a physical allergy

223
00:12:44,399 --> 00:12:49,079
accompanied by a mental obsession.

224
00:12:49,200 --> 00:12:54,800
And I know my circuits are messed up.

225
00:12:52,240 --> 00:12:56,560
There's no way that naked body would

226
00:12:54,800 --> 00:12:58,320
have shown up in the middle of my

227
00:12:56,560 --> 00:13:00,560
meditation.

228
00:12:58,320 --> 00:13:03,680
No way.

229
00:13:00,560 --> 00:13:05,920
If I had some normal circuits.

230
00:13:03,680 --> 00:13:08,720
Now, let's say that happens to other

231
00:13:05,920 --> 00:13:11,120
people who don't have this disease

232
00:13:08,720 --> 00:13:13,680
because you all,

233
00:13:11,120 --> 00:13:17,600
many of you, you're addicts going to be

234
00:13:13,680 --> 00:13:20,720
listening to whatever I say to prove me

235
00:13:17,600 --> 00:13:23,120
wrong. Okay?

236
00:13:20,720 --> 00:13:25,519
I do it with people who are of the

237
00:13:23,120 --> 00:13:30,160
opposite political parties that I am.

238
00:13:25,519 --> 00:13:32,800
They can't say anything right.

239
00:13:30,160 --> 00:13:37,200
If I go to a denominational

240
00:13:32,800 --> 00:13:40,800
uh type of uh religious service in my

241
00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:43,440
religion, I'm going to listen and then

242
00:13:40,800 --> 00:13:45,440
prove everything's wrong.

243
00:13:43,440 --> 00:13:48,880
Okay.

244
00:13:45,440 --> 00:13:53,440
So here you're going to try to say but

245
00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:59,120
hey how you know this all doesn't make

246
00:13:53,440 --> 00:14:03,040
sense. I do such bad things you know

247
00:13:59,120 --> 00:14:05,680
how could he say it's it's just a

248
00:14:03,040 --> 00:14:09,360
physical allergy.

249
00:14:05,680 --> 00:14:13,279
But without this concept the rest of my

250
00:14:09,360 --> 00:14:16,160
talk is going to not work out

251
00:14:13,279 --> 00:14:20,519
because

252
00:14:16,160 --> 00:14:20,519
What is sex with self

253
00:14:21,360 --> 00:14:25,240
cannot be formalized.

254
00:14:27,040 --> 00:14:34,959
The reason is

255
00:14:29,839 --> 00:14:38,240
that I have to be honest with myself to

256
00:14:34,959 --> 00:14:42,880
what that allergen is,

257
00:14:38,240 --> 00:14:46,000
what part of this issue of sex with self

258
00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:48,480
I'm talking about. Now, this fellowship

259
00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:50,320
has certain subjects and I've noticed

260
00:14:48,480 --> 00:14:53,680
they've broken through some of these

261
00:14:50,320 --> 00:14:56,399
taboo areas we don't talk about this at

262
00:14:53,680 --> 00:14:59,199
this conference. One subject we don't

263
00:14:56,399 --> 00:15:01,040
talk about is what goes on in a marriage

264
00:14:59,199 --> 00:15:04,240
bed.

265
00:15:01,040 --> 00:15:07,240
Big secret in essay. It's like we're

266
00:15:04,240 --> 00:15:07,240
Unix.

267
00:15:08,000 --> 00:15:14,000
Nobody does anything.

268
00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:15,440
And they if they do it, it's a pure

269
00:15:14,000 --> 00:15:19,079
accident. I don't know. They don't know

270
00:15:15,440 --> 00:15:19,079
just how it happened.

271
00:15:21,360 --> 00:15:26,160
And we're just pure as a driven snow.

272
00:15:27,760 --> 00:15:34,320
The other taboo subject is what do

273
00:15:31,360 --> 00:15:36,639
couples do when they're engaged and

274
00:15:34,320 --> 00:15:39,040
they're getting married?

275
00:15:36,639 --> 00:15:40,959
Taboo subject.

276
00:15:39,040 --> 00:15:44,079
No one talks about what they do with

277
00:15:40,959 --> 00:15:48,320
each other.

278
00:15:44,079 --> 00:15:52,279
And the third taboo subject is what is

279
00:15:48,320 --> 00:15:52,279
sex with self?

280
00:15:52,720 --> 00:16:00,279
It's not really spoken about believe it

281
00:15:54,800 --> 00:16:00,279
or not. We use the term

282
00:16:00,399 --> 00:16:06,639
but you know a lot of people in the

283
00:16:03,600 --> 00:16:10,480
fellowship interpret sex with self

284
00:16:06,639 --> 00:16:13,120
meaning grabbing yourself

285
00:16:10,480 --> 00:16:15,600
doing something with it. This is going

286
00:16:13,120 --> 00:16:19,519
to be male oriented by the way. So,

287
00:16:15,600 --> 00:16:21,759
females, please bear with me and maybe

288
00:16:19,519 --> 00:16:25,720
you'll get up and translate it for us,

289
00:16:21,759 --> 00:16:25,720
but if you'd like

290
00:16:28,720 --> 00:16:36,240
and having something ejaculate out

291
00:16:34,160 --> 00:16:41,240
and that's what's considered

292
00:16:36,240 --> 00:16:41,240
masturbation to lots of people,

293
00:16:41,600 --> 00:16:47,360
okay,

294
00:16:43,199 --> 00:16:51,040
man, what goes on in this fellowship

295
00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:53,519
that walk the line and I don't know for

296
00:16:51,040 --> 00:16:55,519
we have some people here from Europe and

297
00:16:53,519 --> 00:16:57,839
I don't know if you have that expression

298
00:16:55,519 --> 00:17:03,399
walking the line

299
00:16:57,839 --> 00:17:03,399
going to the edge of the cliff

300
00:17:04,160 --> 00:17:14,079
going to the edge of the cliff

301
00:17:07,919 --> 00:17:16,400
more people go to the edge of that cliff

302
00:17:14,079 --> 00:17:19,039
then is spoken about because it's not

303
00:17:16,400 --> 00:17:21,600
spoken about

304
00:17:19,039 --> 00:17:23,839
because it's not the person says I

305
00:17:21,600 --> 00:17:28,199
haven't ejaculated

306
00:17:23,839 --> 00:17:28,199
so it's not sex with self

307
00:17:30,080 --> 00:17:37,760
and I asked Roy some years ago

308
00:17:34,559 --> 00:17:39,840
oneonone you know Roy when when he wrote

309
00:17:37,760 --> 00:17:42,559
this

310
00:17:39,840 --> 00:17:44,160
it's kind of vague what is sex with self

311
00:17:42,559 --> 00:17:46,960
what do you

312
00:17:44,160 --> 00:17:48,480
And he said to me, "Well, we have to be

313
00:17:46,960 --> 00:17:51,480
careful

314
00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:51,480
about

315
00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:59,080
dotting every eye because then it

316
00:17:55,280 --> 00:17:59,080
becomes like a religion

317
00:17:59,440 --> 00:18:05,679
if I remember the conversation right.

318
00:18:02,960 --> 00:18:09,760
And so I have to keep that in mind that

319
00:18:05,679 --> 00:18:11,919
I cannot define for you other than that

320
00:18:09,760 --> 00:18:14,480
being very obvious

321
00:18:11,919 --> 00:18:14,480
part

322
00:18:15,520 --> 00:18:21,840
Okay, I can't define it for you,

323
00:18:19,200 --> 00:18:23,840
but I could say

324
00:18:21,840 --> 00:18:27,440
what

325
00:18:23,840 --> 00:18:30,080
what do you do that ultimately

326
00:18:27,440 --> 00:18:34,240
negates your comfort?

327
00:18:30,080 --> 00:18:36,480
And what is it you do that sets off the

328
00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:40,160
reaction,

329
00:18:36,480 --> 00:18:41,760
the chemical reaction in the brain that

330
00:18:40,160 --> 00:18:45,440
becomes

331
00:18:41,760 --> 00:18:48,400
what we call craving

332
00:18:45,440 --> 00:18:52,919
that sets up the phenomenon

333
00:18:48,400 --> 00:18:52,919
of doing it again

334
00:18:53,440 --> 00:18:57,000
out of powerlessness.

335
00:18:58,000 --> 00:19:04,919
You know, I laugh about it sometimes,

336
00:19:01,120 --> 00:19:04,919
but you know,

337
00:19:05,200 --> 00:19:12,000
powerlessness

338
00:19:07,520 --> 00:19:14,400
to me is a concept of, man, if I got to

339
00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:18,799
go to the bathroom,

340
00:19:14,400 --> 00:19:20,320
I could really hold off, but if I start

341
00:19:18,799 --> 00:19:24,520
going,

342
00:19:20,320 --> 00:19:24,520
I can't stop at midstream.

343
00:19:28,880 --> 00:19:33,840
Okay.

344
00:19:31,200 --> 00:19:37,200
Now,

345
00:19:33,840 --> 00:19:39,840
therefore, what is it?

346
00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:42,880
I came into the program before we had

347
00:19:39,840 --> 00:19:46,000
the essay book.

348
00:19:42,880 --> 00:19:48,720
Roy had written some of these in loose

349
00:19:46,000 --> 00:19:51,440
sheets. We had a brochure. There were

350
00:19:48,720 --> 00:19:53,760
two of us here in Nashville. We didn't

351
00:19:51,440 --> 00:19:56,480
know anyone else.

352
00:19:53,760 --> 00:19:59,360
Um,

353
00:19:56,480 --> 00:20:02,240
and so I didn't know anything about what

354
00:19:59,360 --> 00:20:06,720
to do or not to do or whatever. And I'll

355
00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:09,520
never forget it. I was in a health in a

356
00:20:06,720 --> 00:20:12,480
uh spa alone in a shower room and I

357
00:20:09,520 --> 00:20:14,240
said, "Oh, I think I'll let myself

358
00:20:12,480 --> 00:20:15,840
get aroused

359
00:20:14,240 --> 00:20:18,960
without

360
00:20:15,840 --> 00:20:23,120
physical touch."

361
00:20:18,960 --> 00:20:24,880
And after it happened, I said,

362
00:20:23,120 --> 00:20:27,440
"Hey,

363
00:20:24,880 --> 00:20:31,039
this isn't

364
00:20:27,440 --> 00:20:35,080
right for me.

365
00:20:31,039 --> 00:20:35,080
This isn't going to work."

366
00:20:35,120 --> 00:20:44,480
And I put a definition on that day.

367
00:20:40,960 --> 00:20:49,159
That's what hopefully we mean by

368
00:20:44,480 --> 00:20:49,159
progressive victory over lust.

369
00:20:49,440 --> 00:20:55,039
And again, this is male oriented, not on

370
00:20:53,280 --> 00:20:58,640
purpose, but that's my experience.

371
00:20:55,039 --> 00:21:03,200
Strength and hope. So,

372
00:20:58,640 --> 00:21:07,360
so what is it we're saying? We're saying

373
00:21:03,200 --> 00:21:10,080
that an erection isn't the issue because

374
00:21:07,360 --> 00:21:13,120
erections a lot of times are reflections

375
00:21:10,080 --> 00:21:15,200
of the REM sleep, what what level sleep

376
00:21:13,120 --> 00:21:19,760
you're in.

377
00:21:15,200 --> 00:21:23,360
So the erection isn't the issue. It's

378
00:21:19,760 --> 00:21:28,960
yet the erection is the issue

379
00:21:23,360 --> 00:21:33,280
because their word motive is before it

380
00:21:28,960 --> 00:21:36,880
and what do I do with it? I was so ill

381
00:21:33,280 --> 00:21:39,280
was I'm still so ill but I was so ill

382
00:21:36,880 --> 00:21:42,799
those first few years I could not

383
00:21:39,280 --> 00:21:44,880
meditate without arousal.

384
00:21:42,799 --> 00:21:47,880
Why could I tell you? you know I'm sex

385
00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:47,880
poppy

386
00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:53,120
and I had to learn a whole lot of stuff

387
00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:55,600
and on this subject I want to bring this

388
00:21:53,120 --> 00:22:00,320
up about what is sex with self because

389
00:21:55,600 --> 00:22:02,960
I've been thinking about it recently

390
00:22:00,320 --> 00:22:05,440
what justification

391
00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:09,039
for a sex addict

392
00:22:05,440 --> 00:22:12,880
is there in ever having an erection if

393
00:22:09,039 --> 00:22:15,600
you're in this program other than in bed

394
00:22:12,880 --> 00:22:18,000
with your wife

395
00:22:15,600 --> 00:22:20,159
or before you go to the bathroom in the

396
00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:23,840
morning or something.

397
00:22:20,159 --> 00:22:26,080
What happens from an erection?

398
00:22:23,840 --> 00:22:29,840
By the way, these are taboo subjects. No

399
00:22:26,080 --> 00:22:32,559
one talks about words like erection and

400
00:22:29,840 --> 00:22:34,880
a sexual addiction

401
00:22:32,559 --> 00:22:38,880
recovery program.

402
00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:41,120
What happens? Well, what happens are all

403
00:22:38,880 --> 00:22:43,919
kinds of chemicals get triggered off in

404
00:22:41,120 --> 00:22:45,840
the brain. That's what happens if

405
00:22:43,919 --> 00:22:48,000
chemicals aren't triggered off in the

406
00:22:45,840 --> 00:22:50,480
brain.

407
00:22:48,000 --> 00:22:54,919
Then how does it happen? Cuz it's

408
00:22:50,480 --> 00:22:54,919
regulated through blood flow.

409
00:22:55,760 --> 00:23:01,559
And I would imagine clitoreral issues

410
00:22:57,919 --> 00:23:01,559
are very similar,

411
00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:10,159
but I don't know that for a fact.

412
00:23:06,400 --> 00:23:12,880
Okay. So what's happening? Endorphins

413
00:23:10,159 --> 00:23:16,720
and other chemicals are coming into the

414
00:23:12,880 --> 00:23:19,360
brain which then for us because we are

415
00:23:16,720 --> 00:23:21,679
like men who have lost our leads and can

416
00:23:19,360 --> 00:23:25,039
never grow new ones,

417
00:23:21,679 --> 00:23:29,120
a chain reaction can come. And what am I

418
00:23:25,039 --> 00:23:32,400
all getting at? I'm getting at that

419
00:23:29,120 --> 00:23:34,480
I'd say the majority of people in SA are

420
00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:38,240
chronic relapsers

421
00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:41,440
or frequent relapsers.

422
00:23:38,240 --> 00:23:43,679
And my assumption is they're relapsing,

423
00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:46,559
feeling the program isn't working,

424
00:23:43,679 --> 00:23:49,440
getting kind of upset, rightfully so,

425
00:23:46,559 --> 00:23:53,120
when in reality they've never been

426
00:23:49,440 --> 00:23:55,919
sober. They're not relapsing. They've

427
00:23:53,120 --> 00:23:59,440
never been sober.

428
00:23:55,919 --> 00:24:00,960
They've never had a period of time, a

429
00:23:59,440 --> 00:24:05,880
detox,

430
00:24:00,960 --> 00:24:05,880
where their brain gets clear,

431
00:24:06,559 --> 00:24:13,520
where the craving phenomenon does not

432
00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:16,320
have to automatically trigger in

433
00:24:13,520 --> 00:24:18,480
because this fellowship is unbelievable

434
00:24:16,320 --> 00:24:21,600
for what you could get away with. in

435
00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:25,679
quotes. So you think

436
00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:28,159
you could be a voyer in this program, be

437
00:24:25,679 --> 00:24:30,000
looking through a window when a woman is

438
00:24:28,159 --> 00:24:33,440
undressing

439
00:24:30,000 --> 00:24:36,840
or a man or whatever,

440
00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:36,840
getting aroused,

441
00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:41,880
getting all stimulated

442
00:24:43,760 --> 00:24:50,960
and not have an orgasm.

443
00:24:47,679 --> 00:24:53,120
and say you're silver.

444
00:24:50,960 --> 00:24:55,520
Now, how do I know that? I hear it time

445
00:24:53,120 --> 00:24:59,440
and again, not voyism, but every other

446
00:24:55,520 --> 00:25:01,600
issue. One issue in particular that a

447
00:24:59,440 --> 00:25:05,919
lot of us old-timers

448
00:25:01,600 --> 00:25:08,799
are not really able to even fathom this.

449
00:25:05,919 --> 00:25:10,880
We came in before

450
00:25:08,799 --> 00:25:14,000
the internet.

451
00:25:10,880 --> 00:25:19,440
I mean, I actually had to go downtown to

452
00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:21,679
the pornos, find some man or some woman

453
00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:26,520
or combinations that I used to do

454
00:25:21,679 --> 00:25:26,520
because I my disease is very advanced

455
00:25:26,559 --> 00:25:32,799
and go through that whole process. I

456
00:25:29,120 --> 00:25:36,760
could I or see some porno at the porno

457
00:25:32,799 --> 00:25:36,760
store had to go there.

458
00:25:36,960 --> 00:25:42,080
Now you just turn on the excuse me the

459
00:25:39,679 --> 00:25:45,120
internet

460
00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:48,799
and what happens and I'll show you how

461
00:25:45,120 --> 00:25:51,679
unsophisticated I am about this. I

462
00:25:48,799 --> 00:25:53,919
finally first time the thought ever

463
00:25:51,679 --> 00:25:56,799
occurred to me when one of these guys

464
00:25:53,919 --> 00:25:59,200
who kept calling me about the internet

465
00:25:56,799 --> 00:26:03,440
and I said to them by the way when

466
00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:06,919
you're doing that stuff looking at it

467
00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:06,919
are you aroused

468
00:26:07,360 --> 00:26:13,440
and he said yeah

469
00:26:09,919 --> 00:26:15,039
and I said oh my god and you expect

470
00:26:13,440 --> 00:26:18,000
yourself

471
00:26:15,039 --> 00:26:20,799
I mean if you talk about Chinese tor

472
00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:24,480
torture.

473
00:26:20,799 --> 00:26:27,840
I mean, water boarding is nothing to me

474
00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:31,240
probably compared to having an erection

475
00:26:27,840 --> 00:26:31,240
on purpose

476
00:26:31,279 --> 00:26:38,320
and not having an orgasm.

477
00:26:35,360 --> 00:26:40,799
You know, that's the perfect example of

478
00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:43,799
the old term for masturbation, self-

479
00:26:40,799 --> 00:26:43,799
abuse.

480
00:26:48,799 --> 00:26:55,360
So here here's this

481
00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:57,200
this concept of what's happening in the

482
00:26:55,360 --> 00:27:01,440
brain.

483
00:26:57,200 --> 00:27:05,360
What is sex with self?

484
00:27:01,440 --> 00:27:11,159
And for me a lot of concepts of sex with

485
00:27:05,360 --> 00:27:11,159
self is involved with a motive.

486
00:27:12,640 --> 00:27:18,559
Why? Why have an erection

487
00:27:16,480 --> 00:27:21,679
if you're not really wanting to get off

488
00:27:18,559 --> 00:27:25,600
in your brain?

489
00:27:21,679 --> 00:27:27,200
Unless it's at night or with your wife.

490
00:27:25,600 --> 00:27:28,880
And you're going to say, "Well, how do

491
00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:31,039
you, you know, what do you do? It just

492
00:27:28,880 --> 00:27:33,919
happens." Well, first of all, that that

493
00:27:31,039 --> 00:27:36,799
has a point to it.

494
00:27:33,919 --> 00:27:39,840
But as my old sponsor Jess would say

495
00:27:36,799 --> 00:27:44,600
about thoughts, the first thought is on

496
00:27:39,840 --> 00:27:44,600
God. The second thought is on me.

497
00:27:45,360 --> 00:27:51,559
So the erection might be on God. But

498
00:27:47,600 --> 00:27:51,559
what do I do with that

499
00:27:51,840 --> 00:27:59,440
in my life? I shift the energy.

500
00:27:56,960 --> 00:28:02,799
Not because I feel it is sin because I

501
00:27:59,440 --> 00:28:06,399
feel it's evil. It's because I don't

502
00:28:02,799 --> 00:28:09,200
want my endorphins and my craving cycle

503
00:28:06,399 --> 00:28:11,840
to get triggered off.

504
00:28:09,200 --> 00:28:14,640
And I move the energy. I picture the

505
00:28:11,840 --> 00:28:17,520
energy and I let it run down my legs

506
00:28:14,640 --> 00:28:21,720
into the ground or I move it up to my

507
00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:21,720
heart and let it out.

508
00:28:21,760 --> 00:28:26,279
I surrender to it.

509
00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:33,840
I don't fight it. Fighting it makes it

510
00:28:30,399 --> 00:28:37,520
worse. This disease fighting anything in

511
00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:41,480
this disease we will always lose this.

512
00:28:37,520 --> 00:28:41,480
It's about surrender

513
00:28:42,080 --> 00:28:48,799
and and self-examination

514
00:28:46,559 --> 00:28:52,480
in inventory.

515
00:28:48,799 --> 00:28:55,679
What What is this for?

516
00:28:52,480 --> 00:29:00,880
Do I feel frightened right now? I've

517
00:28:55,679 --> 00:29:04,640
discovered that my brain deals with fear

518
00:29:00,880 --> 00:29:08,960
by changing it to a sexual thought

519
00:29:04,640 --> 00:29:08,960
automatically. That's my first thought.

520
00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:16,000
So if I'm frightened of terrorists or

521
00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:18,240
I'm frightened of people and coming into

522
00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:20,399
my home and first thought is I picture

523
00:29:18,240 --> 00:29:23,200
that I'm going to hit them or protect my

524
00:29:20,399 --> 00:29:25,520
wife. A lot of times the next thought

525
00:29:23,200 --> 00:29:28,320
will be gee they might want to rape me

526
00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:31,840
or my wife. A thought will come to my

527
00:29:28,320 --> 00:29:34,960
mind and I'll have to say immediately

528
00:29:31,840 --> 00:29:40,559
Harvey there it is.

529
00:29:34,960 --> 00:29:42,960
you know, fear, lust, happiness, lust,

530
00:29:40,559 --> 00:29:45,520
sadness, lust,

531
00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:48,320
whatever it is, my circuits are screwed

532
00:29:45,520 --> 00:29:51,320
up. I'm ill,

533
00:29:48,320 --> 00:29:51,320
sick.

534
00:29:52,159 --> 00:29:57,600
So, it's been very important for me to

535
00:29:54,720 --> 00:30:01,840
define for myself

536
00:29:57,600 --> 00:30:05,039
my bottom line in more detail.

537
00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:07,600
See, I even have my sobriety definition

538
00:30:05,039 --> 00:30:10,559
is even based on my frequency with my

539
00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:12,080
wife because I was a sexually abusive

540
00:30:10,559 --> 00:30:14,960
husband.

541
00:30:12,080 --> 00:30:18,240
And if I have sex a certain amount of

542
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:21,799
times beyond my bottom line, that's a

543
00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:21,799
loss of my sobriety.

544
00:30:22,880 --> 00:30:28,720
You know, going into locker rooms on

545
00:30:26,799 --> 00:30:32,399
purpose

546
00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:36,760
where men are naked

547
00:30:32,399 --> 00:30:36,760
is a loss of my sobriety.

548
00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:42,640
It's just that simple.

549
00:30:40,799 --> 00:30:45,200
Yeah.

550
00:30:42,640 --> 00:30:47,200
And then I can't fool myself about

551
00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:50,000
motives. There have to be certain

552
00:30:47,200 --> 00:30:52,320
definite reasons. One is you're in a

553
00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:54,799
hotel and it has a bathroom and you go

554
00:30:52,320 --> 00:30:57,200
into the regular bathroom and it's a a

555
00:30:54,799 --> 00:31:00,159
locker room and you don't know, you

556
00:30:57,200 --> 00:31:03,480
know, but if you know then that's a

557
00:31:00,159 --> 00:31:03,480
different story.

558
00:31:03,919 --> 00:31:12,640
I have a part of my sobriety is that if

559
00:31:07,120 --> 00:31:16,399
I walk into walk into a porno shop,

560
00:31:12,640 --> 00:31:19,440
that's a loss of my sobriety. Unless it

561
00:31:16,399 --> 00:31:21,679
was because one of you all called me to

562
00:31:19,440 --> 00:31:23,600
pull him out

563
00:31:21,679 --> 00:31:25,360
and I tried to call someone else to go

564
00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:32,320
with me.

565
00:31:25,360 --> 00:31:37,519
I've had to my to my own self be true.

566
00:31:32,320 --> 00:31:39,919
What is sex with self for me?

567
00:31:37,519 --> 00:31:42,159
Now I want to ask this question. Let's

568
00:31:39,919 --> 00:31:45,120
go back to the voyer. No, let's go back

569
00:31:42,159 --> 00:31:48,640
to the internet.

570
00:31:45,120 --> 00:31:52,760
You're watching T. You're purposefully

571
00:31:48,640 --> 00:31:52,760
going on to the site.

572
00:31:53,360 --> 00:31:59,760
Then you gradually build up that session

573
00:31:57,679 --> 00:32:01,279
till you get

574
00:31:59,760 --> 00:32:04,960
the

575
00:32:01,279 --> 00:32:07,039
site of your choice.

576
00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:11,159
Because it doesn't matter where you

577
00:32:07,039 --> 00:32:11,159
begin, you're going to end

578
00:32:11,360 --> 00:32:17,120
at stuff that

579
00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:19,760
I can't Well, one day maybe you'll hear

580
00:32:17,120 --> 00:32:24,000
my story. I can't tell you. There's

581
00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:27,120
nothing anyone's done that I probably

582
00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:29,760
haven't done three times. Okay? There's

583
00:32:27,120 --> 00:32:32,559
a guy in but guys in Nashville know this

584
00:32:29,760 --> 00:32:36,000
story who would come into the our

585
00:32:32,559 --> 00:32:39,360
meetings and say by the way if anyone is

586
00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:42,320
so depressed today that you're because

587
00:32:39,360 --> 00:32:45,600
of what you've done in your disease and

588
00:32:42,320 --> 00:32:48,720
you've decided to kill yourself be sure

589
00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:51,919
that before you kill yourself you go to

590
00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:55,200
a meeting where Harvey's at say what

591
00:32:51,919 --> 00:32:58,080
you've done so he could tell you how

592
00:32:55,200 --> 00:33:02,600
he's done it at least three times before

593
00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:02,600
and you walk out feeling wonderfully.

594
00:33:03,120 --> 00:33:09,120
But let me tell you,

595
00:33:06,240 --> 00:33:11,039
I hear things

596
00:33:09,120 --> 00:33:15,440
from what

597
00:33:11,039 --> 00:33:19,600
people are watching on the internet

598
00:33:15,440 --> 00:33:21,600
because I don't let you guys or gals,

599
00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:24,559
well, girls I don't talk to that much,

600
00:33:21,600 --> 00:33:28,399
but guys get away with this hidden

601
00:33:24,559 --> 00:33:31,600
language. See, in this fellowship, we've

602
00:33:28,399 --> 00:33:35,279
learned how to hide. We hide behind

603
00:33:31,600 --> 00:33:38,080
words. One word is lust. I've been

604
00:33:35,279 --> 00:33:40,880
lusting today.

605
00:33:38,080 --> 00:33:45,120
Or another word is I've had a sexual

606
00:33:40,880 --> 00:33:47,679
fantasy today. Or I went on the internet

607
00:33:45,120 --> 00:33:51,000
today.

608
00:33:47,679 --> 00:33:51,000
And then say,

609
00:33:52,559 --> 00:34:00,159
well, I don't do that. Lust. What do you

610
00:33:55,679 --> 00:34:02,880
mean you've been lusting? Oh, I've been

611
00:34:00,159 --> 00:34:06,080
um I've been thinking about this woman.

612
00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:08,800
Oh, what have you been thinking about?

613
00:34:06,080 --> 00:34:12,720
And on and on. And if you do it with the

614
00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:17,320
internet, you hear things that I never

615
00:34:12,720 --> 00:34:17,320
knew existed. And that's tough.

616
00:34:18,399 --> 00:34:23,200
Okay.

617
00:34:20,639 --> 00:34:26,639
So

618
00:34:23,200 --> 00:34:29,440
if someone is purposefully looking at

619
00:34:26,639 --> 00:34:32,639
the internet,

620
00:34:29,440 --> 00:34:36,480
they're looking at it. They're going

621
00:34:32,639 --> 00:34:40,320
deeper and deeper in.

622
00:34:36,480 --> 00:34:44,240
They're getting aroused.

623
00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:47,119
They continue on it.

624
00:34:44,240 --> 00:34:50,240
What do we call that?

625
00:34:47,119 --> 00:34:54,040
They're by themselves.

626
00:34:50,240 --> 00:34:54,040
They're having an erection.

627
00:34:54,159 --> 00:34:59,639
What's that called? Help me.

628
00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:07,760
If now if it's not sex with self, it's

629
00:35:05,680 --> 00:35:10,800
not

630
00:35:07,760 --> 00:35:13,440
it's not sex with someone else. It's

631
00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:17,280
not.

632
00:35:13,440 --> 00:35:19,760
In other words, we get these calls

633
00:35:17,280 --> 00:35:21,440
about what should I do with my sobriety

634
00:35:19,760 --> 00:35:24,240
and what should I do with this and what

635
00:35:21,440 --> 00:35:27,440
should I do with that? I'm okay. You

636
00:35:24,240 --> 00:35:29,920
know, you all call it's your sobriety.

637
00:35:27,440 --> 00:35:31,839
It's not going to be any any sweat off

638
00:35:29,920 --> 00:35:34,560
my back.

639
00:35:31,839 --> 00:35:37,359
You have to live with you

640
00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:41,359
and your disease.

641
00:35:37,359 --> 00:35:45,599
But I want to know what you call it.

642
00:35:41,359 --> 00:35:49,079
I'm I'm open to it. Maybe it's not being

643
00:35:45,599 --> 00:35:49,079
called sex,

644
00:35:50,240 --> 00:35:58,760
but I don't know what it is. I If it's

645
00:35:53,119 --> 00:35:58,760
not sex with self, what is it?

646
00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:07,280
And towards the end, I'd like some

647
00:36:03,040 --> 00:36:10,000
volunteers to say what it is that's not

648
00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:12,720
sex with self

649
00:36:10,000 --> 00:36:17,359
because it's so frightening if it is sex

650
00:36:12,720 --> 00:36:19,440
with self and we're ignoring it.

651
00:36:17,359 --> 00:36:21,440
We're having people in leadership

652
00:36:19,440 --> 00:36:23,359
positions. We're having people in

653
00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:26,160
decisionmaking

654
00:36:23,359 --> 00:36:28,880
issues. We're having people sponsoring

655
00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:33,200
people. If you want what I have and are

656
00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:37,359
willing to go to any length to get it,

657
00:36:33,200 --> 00:36:42,520
well, is this what you want?

658
00:36:37,359 --> 00:36:42,520
And are you not drunk afterwards

659
00:36:43,040 --> 00:36:48,119
now?

660
00:36:44,560 --> 00:36:48,119
Maybe not.

661
00:36:48,320 --> 00:36:55,680
But I I I believe people are.

662
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:59,359
And matter of fact, I don't define their

663
00:36:55,680 --> 00:37:01,760
sobriety form. I I make suggestions that

664
00:36:59,359 --> 00:37:03,599
the next time they do it, they they call

665
00:37:01,760 --> 00:37:05,760
it their

666
00:37:03,599 --> 00:37:07,680
change of sobriety. But I've learned I

667
00:37:05,760 --> 00:37:09,680
it doesn't even pay almost say that

668
00:37:07,680 --> 00:37:12,079
there's people going to do exactly what

669
00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:15,040
their disease tells them to do. Unless

670
00:37:12,079 --> 00:37:17,359
they're actively working their program,

671
00:37:15,040 --> 00:37:20,079
they're just going to get hacked at the

672
00:37:17,359 --> 00:37:22,560
person telling them.

673
00:37:20,079 --> 00:37:27,440
I'm getting more and more into trying

674
00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:30,320
not to help my sponsors with inventories

675
00:37:27,440 --> 00:37:33,440
because I've started to notice I mean I

676
00:37:30,320 --> 00:37:35,760
do it with them but I started to notice

677
00:37:33,440 --> 00:37:39,200
giving someone an inventory about what

678
00:37:35,760 --> 00:37:43,040
they might be doing never really works.

679
00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:46,240
It's when they call me and do 10th steps

680
00:37:43,040 --> 00:37:49,520
and say, "Hey, I've been in greed today.

681
00:37:46,240 --> 00:37:51,280
I've been jealous today. I've been angry

682
00:37:49,520 --> 00:37:54,000
today.

683
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:56,480
Now, the first time I've had to be told

684
00:37:54,000 --> 00:37:58,560
from my sponsor and other time, you

685
00:37:56,480 --> 00:38:00,480
know, whatever. And we tell each other

686
00:37:58,560 --> 00:38:02,960
these things. Oh, maybe that's greed.

687
00:38:00,480 --> 00:38:06,240
Maybe that's jealousy. But at some

688
00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:08,720
point, it's I who have to make that

689
00:38:06,240 --> 00:38:11,280
inventory, written inventory, and call

690
00:38:08,720 --> 00:38:14,240
my sponsor about it and say, "Wow,

691
00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:16,480
there's that insanity again."

692
00:38:14,240 --> 00:38:20,480
You know,

693
00:38:16,480 --> 00:38:24,480
and very rare I get a call that says,

694
00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:26,240
"Oh god, I am so powerless. It happened

695
00:38:24,480 --> 00:38:28,960
again."

696
00:38:26,240 --> 00:38:31,440
I'll get the call, "Oh, I was just on

697
00:38:28,960 --> 00:38:34,160
the internet and this and that." That

698
00:38:31,440 --> 00:38:38,599
term powerlessness, the disease

699
00:38:34,160 --> 00:38:38,599
connection never comes up

700
00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:46,800
because if we are powerless and I am

701
00:38:43,839 --> 00:38:50,640
powerless.

702
00:38:46,800 --> 00:38:54,640
I am I had sex with people who had

703
00:38:50,640 --> 00:38:58,359
lesions on their body.

704
00:38:54,640 --> 00:38:58,359
I love to get them

705
00:38:58,880 --> 00:39:04,359
because it helps us see how insane

706
00:39:05,119 --> 00:39:12,320
I had sex under the table at a

707
00:39:08,960 --> 00:39:15,280
restaurant with this guy next to me and

708
00:39:12,320 --> 00:39:17,839
his wife was on one side and my wife was

709
00:39:15,280 --> 00:39:19,520
on the other side and we did it under

710
00:39:17,839 --> 00:39:22,400
the tape.

711
00:39:19,520 --> 00:39:24,880
Now, if that's not powerlessness, if

712
00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:28,720
that's not insanity,

713
00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:30,400
what the hell do we call it? If it's not

714
00:39:28,720 --> 00:39:34,240
disease,

715
00:39:30,400 --> 00:39:36,960
and if it were just sin or badness, why

716
00:39:34,240 --> 00:39:39,040
am I not doing it today? I'm the same

717
00:39:36,960 --> 00:39:43,240
sinner.

718
00:39:39,040 --> 00:39:43,240
Why am I not doing it today?

719
00:39:43,920 --> 00:39:50,400
It's because I'm not in the craving

720
00:39:47,200 --> 00:39:50,400
cycle today.

721
00:39:50,960 --> 00:39:57,440
I deal with it like the plague.

722
00:39:54,240 --> 00:39:59,359
It drives my wife nuts at times because

723
00:39:57,440 --> 00:40:01,119
I'm screening my movies and I'm doing

724
00:39:59,359 --> 00:40:03,760
this and I'm jumping up and leaving the

725
00:40:01,119 --> 00:40:06,480
room and

726
00:40:03,760 --> 00:40:11,240
it's not because I'm a goody goodie. Let

727
00:40:06,480 --> 00:40:11,240
me tell you, I'm not a goody goodie.

728
00:40:14,640 --> 00:40:21,000
It's because I know I am powerless.

729
00:40:24,480 --> 00:40:32,640
Once the door opens, I can't close that

730
00:40:28,960 --> 00:40:36,720
door. Whether it's for my wife or my

731
00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:40,560
kids or my religion, I cannot close the

732
00:40:36,720 --> 00:40:43,200
door once it's open.

733
00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:45,200
And the problem in the fellowship to me

734
00:40:43,200 --> 00:40:49,200
today

735
00:40:45,200 --> 00:40:52,640
and for me today is if I'm not careful

736
00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:56,319
of what is the door,

737
00:40:52,640 --> 00:40:59,040
what is the allergen,

738
00:40:56,319 --> 00:41:02,040
what is that first

739
00:40:59,040 --> 00:41:02,040
peanut?

740
00:41:07,839 --> 00:41:14,400
What is the insanity that lets me go and

741
00:41:11,440 --> 00:41:18,839
buy a package if I'm allergic to peanuts

742
00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:18,839
and not look at the package

743
00:41:19,119 --> 00:41:25,599
ingredients?

744
00:41:22,079 --> 00:41:28,240
So this whole disease concept of a

745
00:41:25,599 --> 00:41:30,160
physical allergy accompanied by a mental

746
00:41:28,240 --> 00:41:33,440
obsession

747
00:41:30,160 --> 00:41:36,079
is is so fundamental for me in my

748
00:41:33,440 --> 00:41:39,040
recovery,

749
00:41:36,079 --> 00:41:43,280
but it's not necessarily fundamental

750
00:41:39,040 --> 00:41:46,160
from what I've seen in the fellowship.

751
00:41:43,280 --> 00:41:49,520
I think we're lost a lot. I shouldn't

752
00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:53,119
say we who how can I I know a few people

753
00:41:49,520 --> 00:41:56,079
but who feel this way old-timers but I'm

754
00:41:53,119 --> 00:42:00,839
lost with dealing with people with the

755
00:41:56,079 --> 00:42:00,839
internet. I'm lost.

756
00:42:01,280 --> 00:42:08,319
It's like its own category.

757
00:42:05,440 --> 00:42:11,200
It's not sex with self. It's not sex

758
00:42:08,319 --> 00:42:12,720
with someone else. It's not really sex

759
00:42:11,200 --> 00:42:17,599
because you might not be touching

760
00:42:12,720 --> 00:42:21,119
yourself. I don't I'm It's somewhere

761
00:42:17,599 --> 00:42:24,880
in in another dimension that needs to be

762
00:42:21,119 --> 00:42:28,800
brought into this dimension because

763
00:42:24,880 --> 00:42:32,640
recently I got an iPhone.

764
00:42:28,800 --> 00:42:37,160
It's the coolest thing ever.

765
00:42:32,640 --> 00:42:37,160
I mean, I'm I'm amazed.

766
00:42:38,319 --> 00:42:47,160
And one day it dawned on me, my god, if

767
00:42:42,880 --> 00:42:47,160
I were my active disease,

768
00:42:51,760 --> 00:42:56,280
I wouldn't be eating, sleeping,

769
00:42:57,440 --> 00:43:01,760
and driving the car. I'd be dead. AIDS

770
00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:05,160
would have killed me. Driving the car

771
00:43:01,760 --> 00:43:05,160
would kill me.

772
00:43:08,400 --> 00:43:17,119
And for you people today, I think people

773
00:43:12,880 --> 00:43:20,960
are are going to just start coming up

774
00:43:17,119 --> 00:43:23,359
coming out of the woodwork in in being

775
00:43:20,960 --> 00:43:26,319
helping us

776
00:43:23,359 --> 00:43:28,880
know that there is recovery from

777
00:43:26,319 --> 00:43:32,760
internet pornography.

778
00:43:28,880 --> 00:43:32,760
that it is possible

779
00:43:33,280 --> 00:43:39,680
because you cannot

780
00:43:37,680 --> 00:43:43,079
assume there's not going to be a

781
00:43:39,680 --> 00:43:43,079
computer somewhere.

782
00:43:43,599 --> 00:43:48,800
You know, I often tease people when they

783
00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:51,040
call and complain, "Oh,

784
00:43:48,800 --> 00:43:53,440
you mean I should avoid all those

785
00:43:51,040 --> 00:43:55,680
women?" And I said, "What are you

786
00:43:53,440 --> 00:43:59,119
complaining about?" 50% of the

787
00:43:55,680 --> 00:44:04,040
population. I do it with women, men,

788
00:43:59,119 --> 00:44:04,040
animals. I can't be around anybody.

789
00:44:08,319 --> 00:44:14,800
You know that bottle of booze you find

790
00:44:11,440 --> 00:44:21,200
up in the North Pole that the AA book

791
00:44:14,800 --> 00:44:25,240
talks about about alcoholic mentality.

792
00:44:21,200 --> 00:44:25,240
Sexaholic mentality.

793
00:44:26,000 --> 00:44:31,839
What is sexaholic mentality? How do we

794
00:44:28,800 --> 00:44:33,680
get around it? we get around it. And

795
00:44:31,839 --> 00:44:36,319
someone recently has been sharing with

796
00:44:33,680 --> 00:44:38,400
me even further on this disease model

797
00:44:36,319 --> 00:44:40,960
and how some people are saying how many

798
00:44:38,400 --> 00:44:45,520
months it takes

799
00:44:40,960 --> 00:44:48,240
for those endorphins to get out and how

800
00:44:45,520 --> 00:44:51,599
if you do almost anything it triggers up

801
00:44:48,240 --> 00:44:54,599
again and the circuits never relearn

802
00:44:51,599 --> 00:44:54,599
pathways.

803
00:44:56,560 --> 00:45:01,200
And you know, this sounds a little

804
00:44:58,240 --> 00:45:06,280
scientific.

805
00:45:01,200 --> 00:45:06,280
And where the heck's God in all this,

806
00:45:06,480 --> 00:45:13,200
you know, well, God is everywhere in

807
00:45:10,319 --> 00:45:15,280
this,

808
00:45:13,200 --> 00:45:18,960
you know. I I couldn't be here today

809
00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:20,960
without my higher power saying, "My God,

810
00:45:18,960 --> 00:45:23,920
this guy,

811
00:45:20,960 --> 00:45:26,160
look at him in the pornos doing what

812
00:45:23,920 --> 00:45:29,760
he's doing."

813
00:45:26,160 --> 00:45:33,880
and I love him so much. Anyway, I'm

814
00:45:29,760 --> 00:45:33,880
going to get him to essay.

815
00:45:34,720 --> 00:45:43,440
You know, the miracle of this

816
00:45:39,119 --> 00:45:48,400
and how my higher power is so loving and

817
00:45:43,440 --> 00:45:52,480
can move so many strings of

818
00:45:48,400 --> 00:45:55,800
whatever cosmic strings if he wants or

819
00:45:52,480 --> 00:45:55,800
doesn't want.

820
00:45:56,000 --> 00:46:03,160
that he has permitted us to learn from

821
00:45:59,760 --> 00:46:03,160
each other.

822
00:46:04,880 --> 00:46:09,119
Okay, I'm going to wind down in a few

823
00:46:06,880 --> 00:46:12,119
moments and then take questions. I see a

824
00:46:09,119 --> 00:46:12,119
hand.

825
00:46:12,480 --> 00:46:22,040
And that my higher power

826
00:46:17,040 --> 00:46:22,040
talks to me through you.

827
00:46:22,960 --> 00:46:28,560
And what I learned from you is

828
00:46:25,760 --> 00:46:32,720
tremendous. He just,

829
00:46:28,560 --> 00:46:35,200
you know, my AA sponsor used to

830
00:46:32,720 --> 00:46:38,319
some some street person would come to a

831
00:46:35,200 --> 00:46:41,040
meeting and about a week later my

832
00:46:38,319 --> 00:46:44,319
sponsor would say

833
00:46:41,040 --> 00:46:46,880
quote what the street person said. And I

834
00:46:44,319 --> 00:46:48,960
said, "Cerry, how did you remember what

835
00:46:46,880 --> 00:46:51,839
this guy was a street person? They've

836
00:46:48,960 --> 00:46:54,880
been there once, never came back

837
00:46:51,839 --> 00:46:58,480
drinking. He said, "Oh, I have to listen

838
00:46:54,880 --> 00:47:01,359
to every word everyone says in the

839
00:46:58,480 --> 00:47:06,839
meeting because I never know who God

840
00:47:01,359 --> 00:47:06,839
picked that day to talk to me through."

841
00:47:08,079 --> 00:47:14,480
Okay.

842
00:47:10,720 --> 00:47:19,680
And so I really haven't talked about

843
00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:19,680
what is sex with self very much.

844
00:47:19,760 --> 00:47:27,599
But I've asked a lot of questions.

845
00:47:24,000 --> 00:47:30,560
I wrote an article. This is like that

846
00:47:27,599 --> 00:47:33,839
the skit last night. I wrote an article

847
00:47:30,560 --> 00:47:36,640
in the there's an article

848
00:47:33,839 --> 00:47:39,119
in one of the essays or the best of

849
00:47:36,640 --> 00:47:42,160
essay talking about what is sex itself.

850
00:47:39,119 --> 00:47:44,960
I wrote it some years ago. I've been

851
00:47:42,160 --> 00:47:49,200
really evolving from it and thinking

852
00:47:44,960 --> 00:47:52,720
more and more about what it means. And

853
00:47:49,200 --> 00:47:58,400
the way I did it then is still how I'm

854
00:47:52,720 --> 00:48:01,920
doing it. This is about you all.

855
00:47:58,400 --> 00:48:05,359
This is about bringing this topic up,

856
00:48:01,920 --> 00:48:09,839
getting it out of being a secret,

857
00:48:05,359 --> 00:48:13,040
not going not hiding behind that awful

858
00:48:09,839 --> 00:48:17,040
statement that we read meeting after

859
00:48:13,040 --> 00:48:20,319
meeting. It's awful about we shouldn't

860
00:48:17,040 --> 00:48:23,599
be explicit. Raise your hand. Tough

861
00:48:20,319 --> 00:48:26,079
shit. If you can't handle it, walk out

862
00:48:23,599 --> 00:48:28,400
of the room.

863
00:48:26,079 --> 00:48:31,119
Walk out of the room. If you can't say

864
00:48:28,400 --> 00:48:34,960
it other than if it were about minors or

865
00:48:31,119 --> 00:48:37,520
something. If you can't say it. Now, how

866
00:48:34,960 --> 00:48:40,160
do we protect ourselves? B. We're very

867
00:48:37,520 --> 00:48:43,040
explicit at our meetings. We do the

868
00:48:40,160 --> 00:48:46,160
30-day imperative. We have people with

869
00:48:43,040 --> 00:48:49,280
30 days or more sobriety speaking. So,

870
00:48:46,160 --> 00:48:52,079
if a guy has just left a porno shop or

871
00:48:49,280 --> 00:48:54,640
been with a prostitute 20 minutes before

872
00:48:52,079 --> 00:48:56,160
and comes in and is explicit, they're

873
00:48:54,640 --> 00:48:58,319
drunk.

874
00:48:56,160 --> 00:49:00,079
And that's not good for the fellowship.

875
00:48:58,319 --> 00:49:02,400
And then you don't need one hand. You

876
00:49:00,079 --> 00:49:04,319
need every hand up.

877
00:49:02,400 --> 00:49:08,920
So then everyone could leave and he's

878
00:49:04,319 --> 00:49:08,920
left there till he so up.

879
00:49:10,240 --> 00:49:17,079
But other than that, if someone has been

880
00:49:13,200 --> 00:49:17,079
sober for a while

881
00:49:17,200 --> 00:49:22,000
and we assume everyone has this

882
00:49:19,520 --> 00:49:24,400
wonderful intimate relationship with

883
00:49:22,000 --> 00:49:26,079
their sponsor, a lot of people don't

884
00:49:24,400 --> 00:49:30,520
have sponsors.

885
00:49:26,079 --> 00:49:30,520
The meetings are what they got.

886
00:49:32,240 --> 00:49:37,200
And so on that

887
00:49:34,880 --> 00:49:39,440
gr

888
00:49:37,200 --> 00:49:42,079
Oh, I get so passionate. It's just

889
00:49:39,440 --> 00:49:45,920
ridiculous. Can you imagine my wife

890
00:49:42,079 --> 00:49:49,280
having to live with me all these years?

891
00:49:45,920 --> 00:49:52,000
Um, but I'm better than I used to be and

892
00:49:49,280 --> 00:49:55,440
not as well as I'm going to get.

893
00:49:52,000 --> 00:49:58,079
And we sure have a loving God to have

894
00:49:55,440 --> 00:50:00,000
produced this conference for us to give

895
00:49:58,079 --> 00:50:05,160
us an opportunity to talk about this

896
00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:05,160
stuff. So, thanks a lot. Okay.

897
00:50:06,880 --> 00:50:12,240
The guy back there whose hand was up

898
00:50:09,440 --> 00:50:13,839
originally. No. Yeah. Hit you.

899
00:50:12,240 --> 00:50:17,160
You were speaking Harvey and you asked

900
00:50:13,839 --> 00:50:17,160
what is it?

901
00:50:17,920 --> 00:50:21,040
If I don't use that much porn on the

902
00:50:19,920 --> 00:50:22,559
internet or wherever, I'm going to

903
00:50:21,040 --> 00:50:25,920
masturbate. I'm not going to accuse

904
00:50:22,559 --> 00:50:28,960
myself. But uh our literature answers

905
00:50:25,920 --> 00:50:30,480
the question. I believe 192. It says the

906
00:50:28,960 --> 00:50:32,400
real problem for all of us, single,

907
00:50:30,480 --> 00:50:34,480
married, man, woman, internet, no

908
00:50:32,400 --> 00:50:37,520
internet from whatever lifestyle is one

909
00:50:34,480 --> 00:50:39,920
and the same. A spiritual misconnection.

910
00:50:37,520 --> 00:50:41,680
And how I'm not connected to the one who

911
00:50:39,920 --> 00:50:44,160
has all power when I'm on the internet

912
00:50:41,680 --> 00:50:45,599
or looking at a magazine or have fantasy

913
00:50:44,160 --> 00:50:46,400
in my head about the woman down the

914
00:50:45,599 --> 00:50:48,319
hallway.

915
00:50:46,400 --> 00:50:50,000
Absolutely. And then it goes on to say,

916
00:50:48,319 --> 00:50:52,240
"Better to acknowledge what we really

917
00:50:50,000 --> 00:50:54,160
are

918
00:50:52,240 --> 00:50:56,079
than hide behind the bag of a sobriety

919
00:50:54,160 --> 00:50:58,319
date, cheat ourselves, and threaten our

920
00:50:56,079 --> 00:51:00,319
union with one another." And that's I go

921
00:50:58,319 --> 00:51:02,000
to AA as well, and they hammer on the

922
00:51:00,319 --> 00:51:04,160
physical allergy, and it's the first

923
00:51:02,000 --> 00:51:06,079
drink that gets you drunk. I make a

924
00:51:04,160 --> 00:51:08,960
decision in my heart to get drunk first

925
00:51:06,079 --> 00:51:11,520
before I drink in that image. And I

926
00:51:08,960 --> 00:51:13,359
don't, my sponsor is just real adamant

927
00:51:11,520 --> 00:51:15,119
about letting go of the lust and fantasy

928
00:51:13,359 --> 00:51:17,359
in my head. even labels. If I'm trying

929
00:51:15,119 --> 00:51:19,599
to control what you think, even if it's

930
00:51:17,359 --> 00:51:21,599
not sexual, that's fantasy. I'm getting

931
00:51:19,599 --> 00:51:23,359
high off of your approval. And that

932
00:51:21,599 --> 00:51:25,200
approval, attention, affection stuff is

933
00:51:23,359 --> 00:51:28,000
what leads to the sexual stuff.

934
00:51:25,200 --> 00:51:30,640
Thanks. Because you brought up something

935
00:51:28,000 --> 00:51:32,400
that I wanted to mention. And in AA,

936
00:51:30,640 --> 00:51:35,839
they say it beautifully. Oh, the

937
00:51:32,400 --> 00:51:40,760
person's sober in alcohol, but he's on a

938
00:51:35,839 --> 00:51:40,760
on a marijuana maintenance program.

939
00:51:42,880 --> 00:51:50,079
And um and I'm so glad you brought this

940
00:51:47,680 --> 00:51:52,960
up because I really did not want to

941
00:51:50,079 --> 00:51:58,800
sound like what I am

942
00:51:52,960 --> 00:52:01,040
a militant in many ways but

943
00:51:58,800 --> 00:52:03,599
sexual thoughts are not permitted in my

944
00:52:01,040 --> 00:52:06,079
head.

945
00:52:03,599 --> 00:52:10,240
The first thought is on God and then I

946
00:52:06,079 --> 00:52:12,559
do poor guys in this program I sponsor I

947
00:52:10,240 --> 00:52:14,480
don't sponsor in Nashville. They get

948
00:52:12,559 --> 00:52:18,880
calls from me during the day. Hey, I

949
00:52:14,480 --> 00:52:22,559
just had this image. I cast out images

950
00:52:18,880 --> 00:52:27,680
the second or whenever they come in

951
00:52:22,559 --> 00:52:31,599
because I cannot give myself a motion

952
00:52:27,680 --> 00:52:35,040
picture in my head.

953
00:52:31,599 --> 00:52:36,880
It's gone. I'm too sick. I could have a

954
00:52:35,040 --> 00:52:39,680
two-dimensional

955
00:52:36,880 --> 00:52:43,920
photograph that happens to come in. I

956
00:52:39,680 --> 00:52:46,400
sponsor a guy for 20 years at least. His

957
00:52:43,920 --> 00:52:49,960
sobriety definition is he can't have

958
00:52:46,400 --> 00:52:49,960
sexual fantasies.

959
00:52:51,839 --> 00:52:56,880
Okay, good. That's it. Thank you.

960
00:52:55,119 --> 00:53:00,960
Yes.

961
00:52:56,880 --> 00:53:03,599
Harvey Dave Jacksonville, can you can

962
00:53:00,960 --> 00:53:06,720
you give a couple

963
00:53:03,599 --> 00:53:09,599
examples in your experience

964
00:53:06,720 --> 00:53:11,599
where there's been what I would call a

965
00:53:09,599 --> 00:53:13,839
progressive

966
00:53:11,599 --> 00:53:16,559
revelation?

967
00:53:13,839 --> 00:53:19,119
What I'd like I can but you know I think

968
00:53:16,559 --> 00:53:24,240
these answer things is not necessarily

969
00:53:19,119 --> 00:53:26,720
good for my ego. So I because I continue

970
00:53:24,240 --> 00:53:29,760
to be center. So I'd like Mike to come

971
00:53:26,720 --> 00:53:32,240
up if you would. You read my mind, Mike.

972
00:53:29,760 --> 00:53:36,640
And can you take some of these questions

973
00:53:32,240 --> 00:53:39,760
or give us some response about what your

974
00:53:36,640 --> 00:53:42,240
feelings of sex itself is?

975
00:53:39,760 --> 00:53:45,359
I'm Mike Sexaholic.

976
00:53:42,240 --> 00:53:47,119
Um, wonderful talk. I mean, I've heard

977
00:53:45,359 --> 00:53:49,520
it before, but it is developing and it

978
00:53:47,119 --> 00:53:52,880
it's it's very very important. uh your

979
00:53:49,520 --> 00:53:54,880
question. Uh one of the things that some

980
00:53:52,880 --> 00:53:58,240
of the guys at St. Teresa's in Chicago

981
00:53:54,880 --> 00:54:00,400
are starting to do and I'm not sure how

982
00:53:58,240 --> 00:54:02,240
conscious they are of the allergy, you

983
00:54:00,400 --> 00:54:04,000
know, the the concept, but they're

984
00:54:02,240 --> 00:54:07,119
they're figuring it out. they may just

985
00:54:04,000 --> 00:54:10,000
be using different words is people are

986
00:54:07,119 --> 00:54:12,400
beginning to say and I'll use an example

987
00:54:10,000 --> 00:54:13,520
of one member who we do a short share at

988
00:54:12,400 --> 00:54:14,960
the beginning of every meeting which

989
00:54:13,520 --> 00:54:18,800
would basically say the nature of your

990
00:54:14,960 --> 00:54:20,720
addiction how long you're sober and um

991
00:54:18,800 --> 00:54:25,680
what this guy says and I won't remember

992
00:54:20,720 --> 00:54:27,520
all of it is he says uh for me

993
00:54:25,680 --> 00:54:30,720
just getting a woman in the car whether

994
00:54:27,520 --> 00:54:33,280
she's a hooker or not

995
00:54:30,720 --> 00:54:34,960
jogging in certain communities he's is a

996
00:54:33,280 --> 00:54:37,599
jogger, but there are certain places he

997
00:54:34,960 --> 00:54:41,359
knows if I'm jogging here, it ain't

998
00:54:37,599 --> 00:54:42,960
exercise I'm looking for, you know. Um,

999
00:54:41,359 --> 00:54:44,240
and I don't know, Pete, if you can

1000
00:54:42,960 --> 00:54:46,400
remember the rest of it, but this

1001
00:54:44,240 --> 00:54:48,400
particular member has a list. And in his

1002
00:54:46,400 --> 00:54:52,240
short chair, he says, and here's what he

1003
00:54:48,400 --> 00:54:54,240
doesn't say. He doesn't say, um, this is

1004
00:54:52,240 --> 00:54:55,760
in addition to the sobriety definition

1005
00:54:54,240 --> 00:54:59,200
because a lot of people say it that way,

1006
00:54:55,760 --> 00:55:02,480
and that's wrong. What he says is, "For

1007
00:54:59,200 --> 00:55:04,240
me, this is the sobriety definition or

1008
00:55:02,480 --> 00:55:05,839
something like that. For me, the

1009
00:55:04,240 --> 00:55:09,119
sobriety, here's what he said. For me,

1010
00:55:05,839 --> 00:55:11,680
the sobriety definition includes not

1011
00:55:09,119 --> 00:55:13,440
getting a hooker or any other woman in

1012
00:55:11,680 --> 00:55:16,480
my car, whether we act out or not."

1013
00:55:13,440 --> 00:55:18,480
That's his exact quote. Um, not jogging

1014
00:55:16,480 --> 00:55:22,160
in certain communities. And he's got

1015
00:55:18,480 --> 00:55:23,920
more. Um,

1016
00:55:22,160 --> 00:55:25,520
I think, you know, Royy's point is we

1017
00:55:23,920 --> 00:55:27,040
don't want to get nitpicking that every

1018
00:55:25,520 --> 00:55:28,400
time you have a sexual thought, did I

1019
00:55:27,040 --> 00:55:30,160
lose my sobriety? Cuz we're all

1020
00:55:28,400 --> 00:55:33,280
obsessive enough. We'll drive each other

1021
00:55:30,160 --> 00:55:35,920
nuts for the rest of our lives.

1022
00:55:33,280 --> 00:55:37,599
But on the other side of that extreme is

1023
00:55:35,920 --> 00:55:40,480
what Harvey's talking about. Well, then

1024
00:55:37,599 --> 00:55:43,440
therefore, anything goes as long as I

1025
00:55:40,480 --> 00:55:47,520
haven't physically touched myself, which

1026
00:55:43,440 --> 00:55:51,119
is also absurd. And so what we're

1027
00:55:47,520 --> 00:55:53,680
learning uh is,

1028
00:55:51,119 --> 00:55:55,359
you know, if a guy's a newcomer and he's

1029
00:55:53,680 --> 00:55:57,760
not masturbating or she's not

1030
00:55:55,359 --> 00:55:59,920
masturbating, that's great. But then you

1031
00:55:57,760 --> 00:56:02,799
begin to hear the patterns of what's

1032
00:55:59,920 --> 00:56:06,799
going on in people's heads. And after a

1033
00:56:02,799 --> 00:56:10,319
while, you start to say, you know, Joe

1034
00:56:06,799 --> 00:56:11,920
or whoever, uh, I know you you're saying

1035
00:56:10,319 --> 00:56:14,079
you're sober and and you know, but

1036
00:56:11,920 --> 00:56:16,640
you've been around 6 months now and you

1037
00:56:14,079 --> 00:56:20,160
keep reporting that you're spending time

1038
00:56:16,640 --> 00:56:21,440
on the internet and um I don't know,

1039
00:56:20,160 --> 00:56:23,200
Harvey and I probably have a

1040
00:56:21,440 --> 00:56:24,960
disagreement about how explicit you get

1041
00:56:23,200 --> 00:56:26,720
in the meeting, but certainly with the

1042
00:56:24,960 --> 00:56:29,280
sponsors and after the meeting and in

1043
00:56:26,720 --> 00:56:31,440
the conversation, um, we would say,

1044
00:56:29,280 --> 00:56:32,480
"What do you mean?" And then he's

1045
00:56:31,440 --> 00:56:34,079
telling you, "Oh, I look at

1046
00:56:32,480 --> 00:56:36,559
pornography." And my first question is

1047
00:56:34,079 --> 00:56:39,920
always, "For how long?" A few minutes.

1048
00:56:36,559 --> 00:56:42,160
Nobody wants to tell you.

1049
00:56:39,920 --> 00:56:44,079
What does a few minutes mean? I a few

1050
00:56:42,160 --> 00:56:47,280
minutes has meant anywhere from 3 or 4

1051
00:56:44,079 --> 00:56:49,119
minutes to 3 or 4 hours. One guy told me

1052
00:56:47,280 --> 00:56:51,040
four hours. I said, "That's not a few

1053
00:56:49,119 --> 00:56:55,319
minutes.

1054
00:56:51,040 --> 00:56:55,319
That's 240 minutes."

1055
00:56:55,680 --> 00:57:00,000
So, I think what we're beginning to come

1056
00:56:58,160 --> 00:57:03,119
to, and we don't have any answers, but

1057
00:57:00,000 --> 00:57:04,559
is no, we don't want to nitpick about

1058
00:57:03,119 --> 00:57:05,920
every time something pops into your

1059
00:57:04,559 --> 00:57:07,839
head, did you lose your We don't want to

1060
00:57:05,920 --> 00:57:09,280
sit around and talk about did you did

1061
00:57:07,839 --> 00:57:11,440
you lose your sobriety or didn't you? We

1062
00:57:09,280 --> 00:57:14,400
don't want to drive ourselves nuts, but

1063
00:57:11,440 --> 00:57:16,319
at the same time, we don't want to be

1064
00:57:14,400 --> 00:57:18,960
living lies.

1065
00:57:16,319 --> 00:57:22,559
And hopefully as sponsors, what we can

1066
00:57:18,960 --> 00:57:24,319
begin to do is guide people to those

1067
00:57:22,559 --> 00:57:26,319
deeper truths about what's going on in

1068
00:57:24,319 --> 00:57:30,319
their hearts and in their heads. Get

1069
00:57:26,319 --> 00:57:32,240
them to talk clearly about what that

1070
00:57:30,319 --> 00:57:34,000
really is and get see if and and

1071
00:57:32,240 --> 00:57:36,160
Harvey's right about one thing. If I say

1072
00:57:34,000 --> 00:57:38,079
to Harvey,

1073
00:57:36,160 --> 00:57:39,359
you know, Harvey, that internet thing,

1074
00:57:38,079 --> 00:57:40,880
you want to you might want to think

1075
00:57:39,359 --> 00:57:42,720
about including that as part of your

1076
00:57:40,880 --> 00:57:46,559
sobriety definition. I've just set up a

1077
00:57:42,720 --> 00:57:48,000
fight. All I can say is I don't know if

1078
00:57:46,559 --> 00:57:50,880
that's a loss of sobriety or not,

1079
00:57:48,000 --> 00:57:53,839
Harvey, but it looks like a duck and it

1080
00:57:50,880 --> 00:57:56,480
walks like a duck. And then let Harvey

1081
00:57:53,839 --> 00:57:58,799
be the one, you know, let the spons be

1082
00:57:56,480 --> 00:58:01,440
the one to finally figure it out. I'm

1083
00:57:58,799 --> 00:58:03,119
just holding the mirror up and saying,

1084
00:58:01,440 --> 00:58:05,440
you know, you keep talking about looks

1085
00:58:03,119 --> 00:58:07,359
and glances. That's a classic looks and

1086
00:58:05,440 --> 00:58:09,680
glances. I'm struggling with looks and

1087
00:58:07,359 --> 00:58:11,599
glances. Well, of course I struggle with

1088
00:58:09,680 --> 00:58:13,920
looks and glances. But what does it mean

1089
00:58:11,599 --> 00:58:16,640
to be struggling with looks and glances?

1090
00:58:13,920 --> 00:58:19,200
For me, it means maybe I lasted 5

1091
00:58:16,640 --> 00:58:21,359
seconds instead of three. But for

1092
00:58:19,200 --> 00:58:23,520
someone else, it might mean they sat

1093
00:58:21,359 --> 00:58:26,079
there all day staring.

1094
00:58:23,520 --> 00:58:27,520
Well, you know, again, don't want to

1095
00:58:26,079 --> 00:58:31,760
knit. Well, which guy's sober? Let's

1096
00:58:27,520 --> 00:58:36,000
nitpick. Who cares? But

1097
00:58:31,760 --> 00:58:37,760
are you for me? Here's the test.

1098
00:58:36,000 --> 00:58:39,119
I suddenly get emotional whenever I talk

1099
00:58:37,760 --> 00:58:41,200
about these two people. I have a

1100
00:58:39,119 --> 00:58:44,400
20-year-old son and a 13-year-old

1101
00:58:41,200 --> 00:58:47,040
daughter. Here's the test. Would I

1102
00:58:44,400 --> 00:58:48,480
without any compunction say to my

1103
00:58:47,040 --> 00:58:51,839
20-year-old son and 13-year-old

1104
00:58:48,480 --> 00:58:55,200
daughter, guess what I was doing today?

1105
00:58:51,839 --> 00:58:57,680
Then all of a sudden, this foggess,

1106
00:58:55,200 --> 00:58:58,799
hey, James, 20-year-old son, hey, James,

1107
00:58:57,680 --> 00:59:00,960
I want to teach you something about

1108
00:58:58,799 --> 00:59:02,240
sexuality. You know what I did today? I

1109
00:59:00,960 --> 00:59:06,760
stayed on the internet for two and a

1110
00:59:02,240 --> 00:59:06,760
half hours, but I didn't touch myself.

1111
00:59:10,000 --> 00:59:16,799
you know, um

1112
00:59:13,680 --> 00:59:18,720
I was at a play the other night and I've

1113
00:59:16,799 --> 00:59:20,799
been going to this series of plays in

1114
00:59:18,720 --> 00:59:23,040
Chicago for years, so I don't check it

1115
00:59:20,799 --> 00:59:24,960
out cuz it's always been safe. But sure

1116
00:59:23,040 --> 00:59:27,440
enough,

1117
00:59:24,960 --> 00:59:29,119
nudity and then something that wasn't,

1118
00:59:27,440 --> 00:59:31,359
but it was close enough and it was

1119
00:59:29,119 --> 00:59:33,760
triggering all my buttons. And who did I

1120
00:59:31,359 --> 00:59:36,559
bring to the play? my wife, my

1121
00:59:33,760 --> 00:59:39,200
13-year-old daughter, and her one of her

1122
00:59:36,559 --> 00:59:43,680
best friends whose parents trust us.

1123
00:59:39,200 --> 00:59:46,960
Probably not. Probably not anymore.

1124
00:59:43,680 --> 00:59:49,599
Suddenly, this moment comes and I do

1125
00:59:46,960 --> 00:59:51,200
believe there's a God because I happen

1126
00:59:49,599 --> 00:59:52,559
to be sitting in a seat. I'm like, "Oh,

1127
00:59:51,200 --> 00:59:54,160
we didn't get the best seats this time

1128
00:59:52,559 --> 00:59:57,280
because we had to change our tickets."

1129
00:59:54,160 --> 01:00:00,000
There's a post in my way. Thank God

1130
00:59:57,280 --> 01:00:02,559
because I knew what was coming. I didn't

1131
01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:05,599
ha I knew what was coming. I didn't have

1132
01:00:02,559 --> 01:00:08,000
to wait to see it. I could sense it. And

1133
01:00:05,599 --> 01:00:11,119
I just positioned myself so that the

1134
01:00:08,000 --> 01:00:13,599
pole protected me and my sobriety. And

1135
01:00:11,119 --> 01:00:15,599
as this is unfolding, I'm hearing my

1136
01:00:13,599 --> 01:00:17,119
family. I'm not saying anything, but I'm

1137
01:00:15,599 --> 01:00:19,359
just protecting myself behind the wall.

1138
01:00:17,119 --> 01:00:22,480
I hear my daughter three seats down go,

1139
01:00:19,359 --> 01:00:24,400
"Oh my god."

1140
01:00:22,480 --> 01:00:28,599
And I hear my wife saying to me very

1141
01:00:24,400 --> 01:00:28,599
quietly, "Don't look.

1142
01:00:30,480 --> 01:00:33,839
And then afterward, we're in the car on

1143
01:00:32,319 --> 01:00:37,359
the way back. Well, how'd everybody like

1144
01:00:33,839 --> 01:00:39,599
the play? I say

1145
01:00:37,359 --> 01:00:43,559
my daughter's 13-year-old friend says,

1146
01:00:39,599 --> 01:00:43,559
"Well, it was kind of R-rated."

1147
01:00:43,680 --> 01:00:48,480
But my point is, I could have had the

1148
01:00:45,839 --> 01:00:51,359
greatest excuse in the world. Well, I

1149
01:00:48,480 --> 01:00:55,200
didn't know. And here I was. I didn't

1150
01:00:51,359 --> 01:00:56,960
want to look. I didn't want to look

1151
01:00:55,200 --> 01:00:59,119
because I didn't want to be sitting

1152
01:00:56,960 --> 01:01:02,240
there lusting with my 13-year-old

1153
01:00:59,119 --> 01:01:04,240
daughter three seats down and and I

1154
01:01:02,240 --> 01:01:06,480
could go into one of my big struggles.

1155
01:01:04,240 --> 01:01:08,400
Well, it's art, you know, and it's and

1156
01:01:06,480 --> 01:01:10,559
it's and I I thought this isn't about

1157
01:01:08,400 --> 01:01:15,359
whether these people should be doing the

1158
01:01:10,559 --> 01:01:18,000
play this way. This is about

1159
01:01:15,359 --> 01:01:19,920
me staying sober.

1160
01:01:18,000 --> 01:01:21,599
Uh now, I am going to write the theater

1161
01:01:19,920 --> 01:01:23,200
and I am going to complain. Not that

1162
01:01:21,599 --> 01:01:24,960
they did it that way, but in the thing

1163
01:01:23,200 --> 01:01:27,760
that they send out two weeks in advance,

1164
01:01:24,960 --> 01:01:29,599
they didn't say, "Fair warning for, you

1165
01:01:27,760 --> 01:01:32,799
know, the people I take to this plate

1166
01:01:29,599 --> 01:01:35,200
are either fellow recovering sex, my

1167
01:01:32,799 --> 01:01:37,119
teenage children, or until she recently

1168
01:01:35,200 --> 01:01:39,119
died, my 90-year-old mother-in-law, who

1169
01:01:37,119 --> 01:01:43,240
had she not died of cancer, would have

1170
01:01:39,119 --> 01:01:43,240
died seeing that play."

1171
01:01:45,040 --> 01:01:51,400
Ah, I that's where we disagree. I'm not

1172
01:01:48,079 --> 01:01:51,400
going to say

1173
01:01:53,599 --> 01:01:57,720
Nothing explicit here.

1174
01:01:58,960 --> 01:02:03,599
So anyway, I I I don't know if what if

1175
01:02:01,760 --> 01:02:05,280
I'm done or what I'm supposed to do.

1176
01:02:03,599 --> 01:02:08,240
Question. Okay.

1177
01:02:05,280 --> 01:02:11,119
Yeah. Yeah. I have a question Harvey or

1178
01:02:08,240 --> 01:02:13,359
Mike. Uh I'm Slava Sexaholic from

1179
01:02:11,119 --> 01:02:16,000
Atlanta. I

1180
01:02:13,359 --> 01:02:18,160
Oh, sorry. Come on. Use the mic.

1181
01:02:16,000 --> 01:02:21,599
Oh, wow. Being put on the spot, I guess.

1182
01:02:18,160 --> 01:02:24,319
Uh I'm Slava sexaholic. Uh you uh

1183
01:02:21,599 --> 01:02:25,839
referred to alluded to your sobriety

1184
01:02:24,319 --> 01:02:27,200
definition including your wife and for

1185
01:02:25,839 --> 01:02:29,359
me it's a big concern. And I've been in

1186
01:02:27,200 --> 01:02:31,359
the fellowship for over a couple years

1187
01:02:29,359 --> 01:02:34,079
and I get I can get a fantasy that

1188
01:02:31,359 --> 01:02:36,480
involves my wife and and I think it the

1189
01:02:34,079 --> 01:02:38,960
program says it's okay but I know but I

1190
01:02:36,480 --> 01:02:40,960
have I'm kind of fuzzy about that and I

1191
01:02:38,960 --> 01:02:44,400
have a gut feeling that it may not be

1192
01:02:40,960 --> 01:02:46,960
okay and and uh and sometimes I get an

1193
01:02:44,400 --> 01:02:49,119
idea that I might have to run you know

1194
01:02:46,960 --> 01:02:51,599
away from my wife and and I'm very

1195
01:02:49,119 --> 01:02:53,599
scared because I want to have uh I want

1196
01:02:51,599 --> 01:02:57,760
to have a family. I have kids and I love

1197
01:02:53,599 --> 01:02:59,680
them. Uh, so I want to be healthy, but

1198
01:02:57,760 --> 01:03:01,359
you know, uh, there there she is. She's

1199
01:02:59,680 --> 01:03:03,200
just like any other woman, you know,

1200
01:03:01,359 --> 01:03:03,440
sometimes. So, if you can elaborate on

1201
01:03:03,200 --> 01:03:06,319
that.

1202
01:03:03,440 --> 01:03:09,319
Appreciate it.

1203
01:03:06,319 --> 01:03:09,319
Um,

1204
01:03:11,200 --> 01:03:17,359
I treat the day after

1205
01:03:15,200 --> 01:03:21,760
our intimacy

1206
01:03:17,359 --> 01:03:24,160
like any other lust issue. If I flash

1207
01:03:21,760 --> 01:03:28,720
anything about what happened the night

1208
01:03:24,160 --> 01:03:32,000
before, I you treat it like any other

1209
01:03:28,720 --> 01:03:34,160
sexual fantasy or lust thought and I

1210
01:03:32,000 --> 01:03:37,440
work my program on it. Just because

1211
01:03:34,160 --> 01:03:40,960
she's my wife doesn't mean when I'm not

1212
01:03:37,440 --> 01:03:43,839
with her I could do that successfully.

1213
01:03:40,960 --> 01:03:47,680
Now maybe some others can't. I can't do

1214
01:03:43,839 --> 01:03:49,920
it successfully. So that is a no no for

1215
01:03:47,680 --> 01:03:52,960
me.

1216
01:03:49,920 --> 01:03:58,480
replaying anything I have been intimate

1217
01:03:52,960 --> 01:04:00,160
with my wife about. So that's my

1218
01:03:58,480 --> 01:04:02,480
when Harvey was talking about the the

1219
01:04:00,160 --> 01:04:04,960
things we don't talk about. I I totally

1220
01:04:02,480 --> 01:04:07,920
agree. We don't talk much about sex or

1221
01:04:04,960 --> 01:04:10,400
the lack thereof in marriage. And in

1222
01:04:07,920 --> 01:04:12,960
this program you will find people who

1223
01:04:10,400 --> 01:04:14,480
think the ideal is no sex in marriage

1224
01:04:12,960 --> 01:04:17,359
ever because that's how you stay

1225
01:04:14,480 --> 01:04:19,440
lustfree. And you will find people who

1226
01:04:17,359 --> 01:04:21,119
at the other extreme say, "Look, as long

1227
01:04:19,440 --> 01:04:24,000
as it's with my wife, it's none of your

1228
01:04:21,119 --> 01:04:27,039
business." Which is a great way to lust.

1229
01:04:24,000 --> 01:04:30,319
If it's nobody's business, you're dead.

1230
01:04:27,039 --> 01:04:32,079
You know, um I don't think this one is

1231
01:04:30,319 --> 01:04:34,079
one sizefits-all.

1232
01:04:32,079 --> 01:04:35,839
I just don't. I think different

1233
01:04:34,079 --> 01:04:39,200
marriages are going to have to deal with

1234
01:04:35,839 --> 01:04:41,440
this differently. But I do think like

1235
01:04:39,200 --> 01:04:44,400
everything else with us, if you keep it

1236
01:04:41,440 --> 01:04:46,319
in the light, if you do if if you talk

1237
01:04:44,400 --> 01:04:48,240
about it, and we don't talk. In fact, a

1238
01:04:46,319 --> 01:04:50,559
few years ago, Harvey had me down here

1239
01:04:48,240 --> 01:04:51,760
to talk about sex and marriage. And I

1240
01:04:50,559 --> 01:04:53,280
don't think I knew that's what I was

1241
01:04:51,760 --> 01:04:55,839
talking about till I got here. I

1242
01:04:53,280 --> 01:04:57,680
probably wouldn't have come. And uh and

1243
01:04:55,839 --> 01:05:00,960
I know and I it's probably on a tape

1244
01:04:57,680 --> 01:05:05,119
somewhere. I I had to talk about, you

1245
01:05:00,960 --> 01:05:06,960
know, my sex life with my wife. I will

1246
01:05:05,119 --> 01:05:10,480
allow myself what I would call brief

1247
01:05:06,960 --> 01:05:12,720
moments of either anticipation or memory

1248
01:05:10,480 --> 01:05:14,640
because they don't feel lustful to me.

1249
01:05:12,720 --> 01:05:16,240
They don't feel objectifying to me. But

1250
01:05:14,640 --> 01:05:18,319
on the other hand, I know where I can go

1251
01:05:16,240 --> 01:05:20,079
with it. So after about 10 seconds, I'm

1252
01:05:18,319 --> 01:05:21,920
like, "Okay, so you're you're looking

1253
01:05:20,079 --> 01:05:24,319
forward to something or yeah, it's a

1254
01:05:21,920 --> 01:05:27,599
nice memory." But I don't dwell on it.

1255
01:05:24,319 --> 01:05:31,280
That's just me. Um, the other thing is

1256
01:05:27,599 --> 01:05:33,760
today I rarely have a problem with the

1257
01:05:31,280 --> 01:05:36,000
image of another person coming up when

1258
01:05:33,760 --> 01:05:38,880
I'm intimate with my wife. But earlier

1259
01:05:36,000 --> 01:05:42,160
on I did and the way I worked through it

1260
01:05:38,880 --> 01:05:43,119
and again every marriage is is is a

1261
01:05:42,160 --> 01:05:44,400
little different but the way I worked

1262
01:05:43,119 --> 01:05:46,559
through it is I would just say to my

1263
01:05:44,400 --> 01:05:48,480
wife I need to stop for a minute and

1264
01:05:46,559 --> 01:05:50,160
depending how bad it was I might get up,

1265
01:05:48,480 --> 01:05:52,400
go to the bathroom and then come back

1266
01:05:50,160 --> 01:05:54,960
and say I thought tonight was my night

1267
01:05:52,400 --> 01:05:56,880
but it's not. or I might come back and

1268
01:05:54,960 --> 01:05:58,559
now now I'm fine. Or I might just roll

1269
01:05:56,880 --> 01:06:00,079
over for 10 seconds, say a prayer, and

1270
01:05:58,559 --> 01:06:04,000
say, "Thanks for the break. I'm ready to

1271
01:06:00,079 --> 01:06:07,839
go." Um, you know, and and to just in

1272
01:06:04,000 --> 01:06:12,079
that moment be you. That's intimacy.

1273
01:06:07,839 --> 01:06:13,920
Whether we have sex or not,

1274
01:06:12,079 --> 01:06:15,680
the intimacy was and I didn't have to

1275
01:06:13,920 --> 01:06:17,520
tell her cuz I'm thinking, remember that

1276
01:06:15,680 --> 01:06:19,760
girl we met at the restaurant? I don't

1277
01:06:17,520 --> 01:06:21,599
have to tell her what she's not an

1278
01:06:19,760 --> 01:06:22,960
idiot.

1279
01:06:21,599 --> 01:06:24,079
She knows it's okay. the guy's

1280
01:06:22,960 --> 01:06:25,520
struggling. I don't have to tell her

1281
01:06:24,079 --> 01:06:26,799
what I'm struggling with. If it's bad

1282
01:06:25,520 --> 01:06:28,240
enough, I'll pick up the phone and call

1283
01:06:26,799 --> 01:06:30,480
one of you and tell you what I'm

1284
01:06:28,240 --> 01:06:34,400
struggling with. But I had to be honest

1285
01:06:30,480 --> 01:06:37,520
in the moment because a lot of guys who

1286
01:06:34,400 --> 01:06:39,359
are struggling have never had sexual

1287
01:06:37,520 --> 01:06:41,119
intimacy. They've had sexual

1288
01:06:39,359 --> 01:06:42,799
experiences,

1289
01:06:41,119 --> 01:06:45,520
you know, by the thousands. They've

1290
01:06:42,799 --> 01:06:48,720
never had sexual intimacy the way they

1291
01:06:45,520 --> 01:06:50,559
fuel their their uh sex in their

1292
01:06:48,720 --> 01:06:52,799
marriage so that their wives think

1293
01:06:50,559 --> 01:06:55,920
they're okay. Talk about sick is by

1294
01:06:52,799 --> 01:06:58,559
lusting over somebody else while they're

1295
01:06:55,920 --> 01:07:00,240
supposedly making love to their wives.

1296
01:06:58,559 --> 01:07:02,319
Now, you know, are they technically

1297
01:07:00,240 --> 01:07:04,319
sexually sober or not? I don't know. I

1298
01:07:02,319 --> 01:07:07,200
get crazy when I get into that. All I

1299
01:07:04,319 --> 01:07:09,280
know is it's probably not a good idea.

1300
01:07:07,200 --> 01:07:09,599
Well, you know, I think we only had an

1301
01:07:09,280 --> 01:07:10,319
hour.

1302
01:07:09,599 --> 01:07:12,880
Yeah, I think so.

1303
01:07:10,319 --> 01:07:15,680
So, we need to close, but some of us

1304
01:07:12,880 --> 01:07:17,520
will stay around and anyone who wants to

1305
01:07:15,680 --> 01:07:22,200
stay around if they're not moving the

1306
01:07:17,520 --> 01:07:22,200
room, we will. So, uh,

1307
01:07:32,799 --> 01:07:36,880
it's nice to be talking together.

1308
01:07:34,960 --> 01:07:39,839
Yeah, it really is. Thank you. Thank

1309
01:07:36,880 --> 01:07:41,680
you.

1310
01:07:39,839 --> 01:07:45,520
Whose Father?

1311
01:07:41,680 --> 01:07:49,920
Our Father, who art in heaven, be thy

1312
01:07:45,520 --> 01:07:52,799
name. Thy kingdom come, thy will be done

1313
01:07:49,920 --> 01:07:56,000
on earth as it is in heaven. Give us

1314
01:07:52,799 --> 01:07:59,280
this day our daily bread, and forgive us

1315
01:07:56,000 --> 01:08:02,160
our trespasses as we forgive those who

1316
01:07:59,280 --> 01:08:04,799
trespass against us. And lead us not

1317
01:08:02,160 --> 01:08:07,520
into temptation, but deliver us from

1318
01:08:04,799 --> 01:08:10,160
evil. For thine is the kingdom, the

1319
01:08:07,520 --> 01:08:14,280
power, and the glory forever and ever.

1320
01:08:10,160 --> 01:08:14,280
Amen. Keep coming.