WEBVTT 00:00:03.880 --> 00:00:07.700 I got joy, joy, joy, joy down in my heart. Where? 00:00:07.940 --> 00:00:10.679 Down in my heart. No, no, where? Down in my heart. 00:00:11.300 --> 00:00:14.199 So you've got the joy, joy, joy, joy down in 00:00:14.199 --> 00:00:17.260 your heart? Down in my heart. But how long is 00:00:17.260 --> 00:00:20.379 it going to be there? Oh, to stay. And are you 00:00:20.379 --> 00:00:23.399 so happy? I'm so happy. So very happy. So very 00:00:23.399 --> 00:00:24.820 happy. You've got the love of Jesus in your heart. 00:00:25.000 --> 00:00:28.300 It's in my heart. So you're very happy. So is 00:00:28.300 --> 00:00:30.460 it just me, or does that actually sound like 00:00:30.460 --> 00:00:36.640 really circumstantial? I feel like, so I think 00:00:36.640 --> 00:00:38.600 that that's an interesting, I mean, so like we 00:00:38.600 --> 00:00:41.439 all grew up, we didn't all grow up. I didn't 00:00:41.439 --> 00:00:43.299 grow. I have still not grown up. Let's just, 00:00:43.340 --> 00:00:45.579 let's be honest. This is a, this is part of the 00:00:45.579 --> 00:00:47.479 reason we're filming a podcast is that we were 00:00:47.479 --> 00:00:49.700 trying to get in live action. This is actually 00:00:49.700 --> 00:00:51.859 like the, what is that old movie with that old 00:00:51.859 --> 00:00:54.119 dude who like his life is a TV show and he doesn't 00:00:54.119 --> 00:00:56.409 realize it. The Truman Show. This is the Truman 00:00:56.409 --> 00:00:57.750 Show. Oh, God, you just referred to the Truman 00:00:57.750 --> 00:01:00.409 Show as that old show. This is the Truman Show 00:01:00.409 --> 00:01:04.310 for your spiritual development. Yes, yes. That 00:01:04.310 --> 00:01:08.489 very, very old, extremely old movie. Yes. When 00:01:08.489 --> 00:01:10.150 did it come out? Like, what, 80 -something? I 00:01:10.150 --> 00:01:12.170 don't know. I'm pretty sure it came out in the 00:01:12.170 --> 00:01:14.569 2000s. I'm pretty sure it had a two at the beginning 00:01:14.569 --> 00:01:19.519 of when it came out. I might've been alive for 00:01:19.519 --> 00:01:21.439 this. Hold on. I'm going to give it. Oh my God, 00:01:21.480 --> 00:01:23.879 dude, that's actually a really like good movie. 00:01:23.959 --> 00:01:26.340 Like it's a good surface level movie, but at 00:01:26.340 --> 00:01:27.700 the same time, like when you start to do like 00:01:27.700 --> 00:01:30.959 introspective on that movie, like it gets to 00:01:30.959 --> 00:01:33.680 like, it's a good movie. It's a good movie. Oh, 00:01:33.700 --> 00:01:38.519 so the Truman show is PG. So you're still in 00:01:38.519 --> 00:01:39.819 the clear. Yeah, we can still, we can still, 00:01:39.840 --> 00:01:42.719 we keep talking about this movie, but yeah, no, 00:01:42.819 --> 00:01:48.450 I am one year younger than that movie. What year 00:01:48.450 --> 00:01:51.609 did it come out? It came out in 98. Oh no, it 00:01:51.609 --> 00:01:54.310 does have a 19 at the beginning. And so in all 00:01:54.310 --> 00:01:56.450 fairness, like I'm probably less than a year 00:01:56.450 --> 00:01:58.230 older than that movie because I'm January of 00:01:58.230 --> 00:02:01.530 99. So I'm so sorry to everybody out there who 00:02:01.530 --> 00:02:04.790 was born before January of 99. Because time existed. 00:02:05.400 --> 00:02:10.219 Time existed, yeah. But no, there's two distinct 00:02:10.219 --> 00:02:13.340 directions that we take here. One, I think in 00:02:13.340 --> 00:02:15.659 a very real sense, the Pursuing Jesus podcast 00:02:15.659 --> 00:02:18.800 is us, Truman, showing our spiritual development. 00:02:19.419 --> 00:02:21.960 In that, so I haven't seen the movie, so I actually 00:02:21.960 --> 00:02:24.840 don't know. I may be spitting completely off 00:02:24.840 --> 00:02:29.099 here, but we're doing spiritual growth in public. 00:02:29.360 --> 00:02:31.219 There have been things that I have learned on 00:02:31.219 --> 00:02:34.519 this podcast that I did not know before. Um, 00:02:34.519 --> 00:02:37.340 and, and, and like you shared with me, there've 00:02:37.340 --> 00:02:38.539 been things that like you didn't know before, 00:02:38.560 --> 00:02:41.199 or like I've been encouraged by things that I've 00:02:41.199 --> 00:02:43.539 heard on this podcast as we've been putting this 00:02:43.539 --> 00:02:45.879 together. Like, so like the process of discussing 00:02:45.879 --> 00:02:48.919 like our own spiritual experience in the text 00:02:48.919 --> 00:02:52.680 is spiritually formative for us. And so like, 00:02:52.740 --> 00:02:53.819 that's kind of one of the reasons I feel like 00:02:53.819 --> 00:02:56.860 we're doing this is to, is not just like to equip 00:02:56.860 --> 00:02:58.780 our people, but also for them just to see what 00:02:58.780 --> 00:03:00.699 it looks like for two dudes to sit down and try 00:03:00.699 --> 00:03:02.810 to follow Jesus in the same room. And you know 00:03:02.810 --> 00:03:05.729 what I love about that is, and it's one of the 00:03:05.729 --> 00:03:10.110 things that is deep in my personality of how 00:03:10.110 --> 00:03:12.349 I preach and what I do with my students and even 00:03:12.349 --> 00:03:15.789 on Sunday mornings, and that is I am constantly 00:03:15.789 --> 00:03:18.590 trying to make sure that I'm not on a pedestal. 00:03:18.830 --> 00:03:20.750 And I don't even mean from a spiritual aspect. 00:03:20.849 --> 00:03:22.530 I mean, like, I want people to know, like, I 00:03:22.530 --> 00:03:28.639 am human, right? I am not set apart. spiritually 00:03:28.639 --> 00:03:32.039 in a way because I am a pastor. You don't have 00:03:32.039 --> 00:03:34.520 an extra dose of the Holy Spirit. No, exactly. 00:03:35.159 --> 00:03:36.840 And so that's one of the things. And that's why 00:03:36.840 --> 00:03:40.180 I love using my own personal stories. I love 00:03:40.180 --> 00:03:42.860 using my own failures. Right now I'm writing 00:03:42.860 --> 00:03:45.800 my sermon that I'm going to be giving tomorrow 00:03:45.800 --> 00:03:48.539 night to our students, and I'm opening with a 00:03:48.539 --> 00:03:52.900 really bad story of when I deserve to get beat 00:03:52.900 --> 00:03:56.199 up in school because of my mouth. It makes me 00:03:56.199 --> 00:03:59.460 look bad. I want to do those things. I want people 00:03:59.460 --> 00:04:01.659 to know, hey, I'm real. I'm a real person. I 00:04:01.659 --> 00:04:04.060 can relate to what's going on. I'm an idiot too. 00:04:05.979 --> 00:04:08.719 Theologically, I think the word that Jesus uses 00:04:08.719 --> 00:04:13.120 is sheep, not idiot. But I get the point that 00:04:13.120 --> 00:04:15.000 you're trying to come across with. He also uses 00:04:15.000 --> 00:04:18.360 the word fool. He does, but he does not call, 00:04:18.600 --> 00:04:21.860 I don't know. That's neither here nor there, 00:04:21.899 --> 00:04:25.259 and I'm not going to fight you. It's a different 00:04:25.259 --> 00:04:28.060 context. It is a different context. I was meeting 00:04:28.060 --> 00:04:30.000 with a guy who has followed Jesus a lot longer 00:04:30.000 --> 00:04:33.759 than I have, relatively recently. And he is often 00:04:33.759 --> 00:04:37.879 telling me, like, Ben, God wants to meet you 00:04:37.879 --> 00:04:41.699 in the present. Not in the past. Although he's 00:04:41.699 --> 00:04:45.439 there, you're not. Not in the future. He's there, 00:04:45.519 --> 00:04:47.160 you're not. And so the only place that you can 00:04:47.160 --> 00:04:50.879 genuinely... meet God is exactly where you're 00:04:50.879 --> 00:04:53.839 sitting in that room, but also in terms of the 00:04:53.839 --> 00:04:58.399 focus of your heart. And so I feel like some 00:04:58.399 --> 00:05:01.019 of what you and I do here in Pursuing Jesus is 00:05:01.019 --> 00:05:06.959 we engage with the text in the present. To the 00:05:06.959 --> 00:05:08.860 best of our abilities, of course, we talk about 00:05:08.860 --> 00:05:10.800 what we're going to talk about beforehand a little, 00:05:10.920 --> 00:05:15.370 not much, but performative spiritual. growth 00:05:15.370 --> 00:05:17.949 is not spiritual growth. And so for this to be 00:05:17.949 --> 00:05:20.829 really be of any value for me personally, I have 00:05:20.829 --> 00:05:22.889 to come at this with the real Ben Smith, not 00:05:22.889 --> 00:05:25.810 necessarily with like the polished pastor Ben 00:05:25.810 --> 00:05:28.149 Smith. 100%. I mean, if this is truly going to 00:05:28.149 --> 00:05:30.449 be a pursuing Jesus podcast and the two hosts 00:05:30.449 --> 00:05:32.610 are not pursuing Jesus, it's not going to work. 00:05:32.730 --> 00:05:36.170 No, it'd be pursuing tacos for you, honestly. 00:05:37.910 --> 00:05:40.810 So there's this new taco place in Albemarle that 00:05:40.810 --> 00:05:43.990 I really want to try that I've been hearing about. 00:05:44.069 --> 00:05:47.170 It's located in a tent, not in a building, and 00:05:47.170 --> 00:05:49.649 it's on the corner where... Man, forget food 00:05:49.649 --> 00:05:52.850 laws. I know. I want to go try this place, and 00:05:52.850 --> 00:05:54.730 hopefully I might be trying it tonight if it's 00:05:54.730 --> 00:05:55.990 there. I heard it's one of those things where 00:05:55.990 --> 00:05:58.029 maybe they're there, maybe they're not, if they're 00:05:58.029 --> 00:06:01.170 set up. So yes, I do like to pursue tacos. I 00:06:01.170 --> 00:06:04.250 am literally trying to pursue this place tonight, 00:06:04.430 --> 00:06:09.939 but at the same time. More importantly, I need 00:06:09.939 --> 00:06:12.560 to be pursuing Jesus. And that's the heart of 00:06:12.560 --> 00:06:15.160 why we sit down, why we put headphones on, and 00:06:15.160 --> 00:06:18.379 we sit in front of these mics, is as we're doing 00:06:18.379 --> 00:06:22.279 our daily devotionals separately, and then we 00:06:22.279 --> 00:06:24.040 get to come together and like, hey, man, this 00:06:24.040 --> 00:06:26.160 is what I learned from Jesus this week. And we 00:06:26.160 --> 00:06:28.040 get to do that with microphones and with our 00:06:28.040 --> 00:06:30.779 church family. I hope that they get to learn 00:06:30.779 --> 00:06:33.620 from that as well. I think that practice is something 00:06:33.620 --> 00:06:36.720 that we have to cultivate, though. I think there's 00:06:36.720 --> 00:06:41.300 a natural impulse in us to want to form an image 00:06:41.300 --> 00:06:43.560 or to hide who we really are or what we're really 00:06:43.560 --> 00:06:46.480 thinking. Dude, that goes back to our first grandparents, 00:06:46.819 --> 00:06:48.980 Adam and Eve. The first thing they do when they 00:06:48.980 --> 00:06:53.180 realize that they have royally messed up is hide 00:06:53.180 --> 00:06:56.279 in the garden from God and sow fig leaves to 00:06:56.279 --> 00:07:01.319 cover their nakedness. But it is only through 00:07:01.319 --> 00:07:04.439 being seen as we really are that we can relate 00:07:04.439 --> 00:07:06.600 to God that way. Otherwise, we're not bringing 00:07:06.600 --> 00:07:08.899 the real us, and he's not shaping the real us. 00:07:09.180 --> 00:07:12.360 But it is something different to do in front 00:07:12.360 --> 00:07:14.379 of an audience. Oh, 100%. Even though this is 00:07:14.379 --> 00:07:18.040 audio only, still, we could sit here, we could 00:07:18.040 --> 00:07:20.420 be fake, and we could do those things. It's a 00:07:20.420 --> 00:07:23.850 discipline. But I would rather... I think our 00:07:23.850 --> 00:07:26.649 church is going to learn more, and then we ourselves 00:07:26.649 --> 00:07:28.930 are going to grow more the more honest we are. 00:07:29.509 --> 00:07:33.870 100%. 100%. Dude, man. Well, hey, so I guess 00:07:33.870 --> 00:07:36.230 we're not going to bash children's Christian 00:07:36.230 --> 00:07:38.689 worship songs anymore, so that's probably a good 00:07:38.689 --> 00:07:40.509 thing. We'll move on from that. We'll save that 00:07:40.509 --> 00:07:42.610 for another day. That'll be another topic, like 00:07:42.610 --> 00:07:45.689 songs we grew up singing. Let's look at the theology 00:07:45.689 --> 00:07:48.470 of this. That's an interesting question that 00:07:48.470 --> 00:07:51.389 I'm not going to pursue hardcore today, but as 00:07:51.389 --> 00:07:55.670 a worship pastor, The songs that I put in the 00:07:55.670 --> 00:08:00.069 mouth of our congregation are so important. Our 00:08:00.069 --> 00:08:04.430 people and me are going to remember those easier 00:08:04.430 --> 00:08:06.990 than even the best sermon sometimes. There are 00:08:06.990 --> 00:08:08.670 certain moments that affect us for sure, but 00:08:08.670 --> 00:08:10.910 when you give something pitch and melody and 00:08:10.910 --> 00:08:13.329 meter and rhythm. It gives it more the ability 00:08:13.329 --> 00:08:16.209 to memorize much easier. You remember those things. 00:08:19.270 --> 00:08:22.029 If your songs aren't actually accurate to what 00:08:22.029 --> 00:08:24.790 the Bible says or to the reality of the Christian 00:08:24.790 --> 00:08:27.329 life, you could end up in trouble because you 00:08:27.329 --> 00:08:28.769 start to believe that stuff when you sing it. 00:08:29.350 --> 00:08:32.990 It's very true. Yeah, it is. So I think we're 00:08:32.990 --> 00:08:35.649 going to start opening up our pursuing Jesus 00:08:35.649 --> 00:08:38.269 devotionals. Sean gradually shepherding me in 00:08:38.269 --> 00:08:40.330 the direction our conversation needs to go. Thanks, 00:08:40.389 --> 00:08:42.370 G. So what day are you looking at there, buddy? 00:08:45.160 --> 00:08:49.519 Oh, man. I'm looking at July 4th, Rockets, Red 00:08:49.519 --> 00:08:54.679 Glare, and All. And this is Luke 19, 11 through 00:08:54.679 --> 00:08:59.460 28. So this is a tremendously difficult parable, 00:08:59.480 --> 00:09:01.539 or it was to me initially when I first came to 00:09:01.539 --> 00:09:03.840 it. Maybe just the mindset I came into it. So 00:09:03.840 --> 00:09:06.200 this is a fat chunk of text. I'm going to read 00:09:06.200 --> 00:09:09.279 it anyways. Just go for it. Let's just run it. 00:09:09.340 --> 00:09:12.460 So this is Luke 19, 11 through 28. And as they 00:09:12.460 --> 00:09:15.460 heard these things, side note, this comes directly 00:09:15.460 --> 00:09:17.600 after the story of Zacchaeus. The wee little 00:09:17.600 --> 00:09:22.899 man? The wee little man was he. I mean, there's 00:09:22.899 --> 00:09:26.419 a kid's song there. Keep moving, keep moving. 00:09:26.700 --> 00:09:29.580 As they heard these things, he, who is Jesus, 00:09:29.639 --> 00:09:31.679 proceeded to tell a parable because he was near 00:09:31.679 --> 00:09:33.740 Jerusalem and because they supposed that the 00:09:33.740 --> 00:09:36.580 kingdom of God was to appear immediately. He 00:09:36.580 --> 00:09:39.240 said, therefore, a nobleman went into a far country 00:09:39.240 --> 00:09:41.779 to receive for himself a kingdom, then return. 00:09:42.440 --> 00:09:46.379 Calling 10 of his servants, he gave them 10 minas 00:09:46.379 --> 00:09:49.379 and said to them, engage in business until I 00:09:49.379 --> 00:09:52.940 come. But his citizens hated him and sent a delegation 00:09:52.940 --> 00:09:55.139 after him saying, we do not want this man to 00:09:55.139 --> 00:09:58.240 reign over us. And when he returned, having received 00:09:58.240 --> 00:10:01.740 the kingdom, he ordered the servants to whom 00:10:01.740 --> 00:10:03.889 he had given money to be called to him. that 00:10:03.889 --> 00:10:05.970 he might know what they had gained by doing business. 00:10:07.070 --> 00:10:09.409 First came before him, saying, Lord, your mina 00:10:09.409 --> 00:10:12.090 has made ten minas more. And he said to him, 00:10:12.169 --> 00:10:14.450 Well done, good servant. Because you have been 00:10:14.450 --> 00:10:16.970 faithful in very little, you shall have authority 00:10:16.970 --> 00:10:22.070 over ten cities. What? And the second came, saying, 00:10:22.169 --> 00:10:28.090 Lord, your mina has made five minas. And he said 00:10:28.090 --> 00:10:31.429 to him, And you are to be over five cities. And 00:10:31.429 --> 00:10:33.629 then another came saying, Lord, here is your 00:10:33.629 --> 00:10:36.190 mina, which I kept laid away in a handkerchief. 00:10:36.490 --> 00:10:39.190 For I was afraid of you because you are a severe 00:10:39.190 --> 00:10:42.210 man. You take what you did not deposit. You reap 00:10:42.210 --> 00:10:44.950 what you did not sow. And he said to him, I condemn 00:10:44.950 --> 00:10:47.769 you with your own words, you wicked servant. 00:10:48.190 --> 00:10:50.610 You knew that I was a severe man taking what 00:10:50.610 --> 00:10:52.529 I did not deposit and reaping what I did not 00:10:52.529 --> 00:10:55.769 sow. Why then did you put my money in the bank? 00:10:55.889 --> 00:10:58.730 And at my coming, I might have collected it with 00:10:58.730 --> 00:11:00.850 interest. And he said to those who stood by, 00:11:00.970 --> 00:11:03.169 take the mina from him and give it to the one 00:11:03.169 --> 00:11:05.049 who has 10 minas. And they said to him, Lord, 00:11:05.149 --> 00:11:09.470 he already has 10 minas. I tell you that everyone 00:11:09.470 --> 00:11:12.110 who has more will be given, but to the one who 00:11:12.110 --> 00:11:15.549 has not, even what he has will be taken away. 00:11:16.009 --> 00:11:19.350 But as for these enemies of mine who did not 00:11:19.350 --> 00:11:22.049 want me to reign over them, bring them here and 00:11:22.049 --> 00:11:27.360 slaughter them before me. Whoa. Sean, what is 00:11:27.360 --> 00:11:29.879 your overall vibe or impression when you come 00:11:29.879 --> 00:11:37.019 to this text? Just looking at the idea of, I 00:11:37.019 --> 00:11:40.360 think people are given different amounts from 00:11:40.360 --> 00:11:43.480 the Lord. And are you being faithful with what 00:11:43.480 --> 00:11:45.980 the Lord has given you? I mean, there is some 00:11:45.980 --> 00:11:48.320 definite different ways that we're going to be 00:11:48.320 --> 00:11:52.360 able to look at this and personalize this text. 00:11:52.480 --> 00:11:54.980 So yeah, tell me why you chose this one. So I 00:11:54.980 --> 00:11:58.519 zeroed in. So I feel like kind of the climax 00:11:58.519 --> 00:12:02.340 of the story, like the... big boss battle, you 00:12:02.340 --> 00:12:06.080 know, in terms of action movie things is where 00:12:06.080 --> 00:12:08.100 the master comes back and he's kind of getting 00:12:08.100 --> 00:12:10.419 account for the different people, the people 00:12:10.419 --> 00:12:12.820 have given, he's given money to, and then he 00:12:12.820 --> 00:12:15.720 talks with the wicked servant. Now, when we read 00:12:15.720 --> 00:12:19.039 a text, like sometimes the authors of scripture 00:12:19.039 --> 00:12:21.139 are kind to kind of give us a purpose statement 00:12:21.139 --> 00:12:24.259 before or after. Right. And so like, like in 00:12:24.259 --> 00:12:27.080 verse 11, Jesus tells us parable because he's 00:12:27.080 --> 00:12:29.679 near Jerusalem. And because the Jews suppose 00:12:29.679 --> 00:12:33.700 that the King, And you see that further on because 00:12:33.700 --> 00:12:35.320 he's about to walk into Jerusalem and they're 00:12:35.320 --> 00:12:37.299 going to say, Hosanna, Hosanna. God save us. 00:12:37.340 --> 00:12:38.940 God save us. They're going to call him the son 00:12:38.940 --> 00:12:40.820 of David. They will label him as the Messiah. 00:12:41.299 --> 00:12:44.240 And so partially the text tells us that Jesus 00:12:44.240 --> 00:12:47.419 is confronting their preconceived ideas about 00:12:47.419 --> 00:12:50.440 what it looks like for God to come reign in his 00:12:50.440 --> 00:12:54.519 kingdom. But kind of with that context in mind, 00:12:54.620 --> 00:13:00.240 I zeroed in on a couple of things from... really 00:13:00.240 --> 00:13:05.220 the master's response to the servants. So one, 00:13:05.299 --> 00:13:07.460 the first kind of truth thing that stuck out 00:13:07.460 --> 00:13:14.139 to me is the requirement for the servants was 00:13:14.139 --> 00:13:17.720 not based off of their results. Now hear me out 00:13:17.720 --> 00:13:19.980 here, because you see like these guys make money, 00:13:20.100 --> 00:13:23.419 they're praised, this guy doesn't, and he's not 00:13:23.419 --> 00:13:26.139 praised. But look at the very first thing that 00:13:26.139 --> 00:13:29.690 the nobleman says in verse 13. He gave them 10 00:13:29.690 --> 00:13:31.710 minus and he said, engage in business until I 00:13:31.710 --> 00:13:36.129 come. Yeah. Uh, dude never gives a goal in mind. 00:13:36.230 --> 00:13:40.509 No. All he says is be active. Yeah. And I think 00:13:40.509 --> 00:13:45.090 that's why the first two people that are addressed 00:13:45.090 --> 00:13:49.090 in this text, um, like I think that's why they 00:13:49.090 --> 00:13:51.570 get a, Hey, nice job. Like you did something. 00:13:51.669 --> 00:13:54.750 You, you engaged with the call that I put on 00:13:54.750 --> 00:13:59.220 your life. Um, And the second piece here is like, 00:13:59.320 --> 00:14:04.679 dude, the equipment that they are given is not 00:14:04.679 --> 00:14:08.200 at all consistent with the reward for their faithfulness. 00:14:08.399 --> 00:14:13.019 Not at all. Because look at that. So I looked 00:14:13.019 --> 00:14:16.159 it up. A mina is like three months wage or whatever. 00:14:16.740 --> 00:14:20.320 And so not a small sum of money by any means. 00:14:20.500 --> 00:14:24.159 But I think that like... Just from my own budget 00:14:24.159 --> 00:14:28.500 and household finance experience, dealing with 00:14:28.500 --> 00:14:32.419 three months of my wages is in no way consistent 00:14:32.419 --> 00:14:36.259 with literally running tensities. No, exactly. 00:14:36.659 --> 00:14:40.360 No, not at all. But, I mean, the whole premise 00:14:40.360 --> 00:14:43.659 here of being faithful in little correlates to 00:14:43.659 --> 00:14:46.500 the Lord giving you much more to be faithful 00:14:46.500 --> 00:14:48.980 for, I think is something that we carry into 00:14:48.980 --> 00:14:54.399 our daily lives. The mundane, the day -to -day, 00:14:54.580 --> 00:14:58.879 the things that we do each day feel meaningless 00:14:58.879 --> 00:15:03.080 sometimes to me. But like one of the things that 00:15:03.080 --> 00:15:05.159 this text reminded me of is that it is in the 00:15:05.159 --> 00:15:09.480 very mundane day -to -day that God prepares us 00:15:09.480 --> 00:15:14.259 for the big. But I think we expect the big things, 00:15:14.379 --> 00:15:18.320 the rule over 10 cities or even five, without 00:15:18.320 --> 00:15:23.259 having engaged in the mundane. And that was a 00:15:23.259 --> 00:15:27.500 big application point that I drew out for myself 00:15:27.500 --> 00:15:30.679 of like, Ben, how are you doing with your day 00:15:30.679 --> 00:15:32.940 -to -day? Your day -to -day walk with Jesus in 00:15:32.940 --> 00:15:35.980 your quiet time, yes. But also just your day 00:15:35.980 --> 00:15:38.679 -to -day, like, are you involving the Lord in 00:15:38.679 --> 00:15:41.340 the other things? Like when you set down your 00:15:41.340 --> 00:15:43.539 Bible, when you close it and you start your day. 00:15:43.960 --> 00:15:47.740 on your drive in as you're here in the office, 00:15:47.779 --> 00:15:49.620 as you're talking with your friend on the phone, 00:15:49.799 --> 00:15:54.039 as you're bugging Sean in his office, like, like 00:15:54.039 --> 00:15:57.039 how am I shepherding the mundane things of my 00:15:57.039 --> 00:15:59.940 life? I really, I really like where you went 00:15:59.940 --> 00:16:04.960 with that. And when I look at this, you know, 00:16:04.960 --> 00:16:10.259 so many, so many times I think people, People 00:16:10.259 --> 00:16:13.720 want the ten cities, like you said. They want 00:16:13.720 --> 00:16:17.539 the big thing first. And that varies person to 00:16:17.539 --> 00:16:18.919 person what that thing is. And that's what I'm 00:16:18.919 --> 00:16:24.019 saying. It depends on your desires, your goals, 00:16:24.220 --> 00:16:26.320 and all that stuff. But a lot of times people 00:16:26.320 --> 00:16:30.940 can look at whatever that is and they think, 00:16:30.960 --> 00:16:33.700 like, this is what I deserve. The worldly example 00:16:33.700 --> 00:16:35.559 I think about, one of the things I remember being 00:16:35.559 --> 00:16:39.470 told is, like, you know, I've seen people. that 00:16:39.470 --> 00:16:42.269 whenever they move out, Maybe even when they 00:16:42.269 --> 00:16:44.309 get married, they think that they're automatically 00:16:44.309 --> 00:16:45.970 going to be able to go out and get the house 00:16:45.970 --> 00:16:49.009 that their parents have. Yeah. It's like, no, 00:16:49.049 --> 00:16:52.509 it took them 30 years to get to the point where 00:16:52.509 --> 00:16:56.250 they were able to get to this level of house. 00:16:56.789 --> 00:16:59.149 And so for some people in that context, they 00:16:59.149 --> 00:17:00.610 think that, oh, no, I'm going to get out of here. 00:17:00.809 --> 00:17:03.210 And it's like, no, no, no, there's work involved 00:17:03.210 --> 00:17:05.549 behind the scenes. And so really even there, 00:17:05.549 --> 00:17:07.289 I mean, there is some worldly application as 00:17:07.289 --> 00:17:10.069 well to this passage. But when I look at it, 00:17:10.910 --> 00:17:12.789 And I look at this, and I love how you pointed 00:17:12.789 --> 00:17:17.869 out at the very beginning, in verse 13, he told 00:17:17.869 --> 00:17:20.170 them to engage in business until I come back. 00:17:20.329 --> 00:17:24.329 Yes. That's the lens you have to interpret the 00:17:24.329 --> 00:17:27.349 rest of this passage from. Each of them has been 00:17:27.349 --> 00:17:29.950 given a different amount. Yeah. But like you 00:17:29.950 --> 00:17:32.410 said, there's not a goal specifically for each 00:17:32.410 --> 00:17:34.130 of them. It's just like, hey, this is what you've 00:17:34.130 --> 00:17:36.849 been given. You are responsible for what you've 00:17:36.849 --> 00:17:39.700 been given. Now go engage in business. Yeah. 00:17:39.759 --> 00:17:42.599 Right? So I think there is something where we 00:17:42.599 --> 00:17:46.579 have each been given different spiritual responsibilities. 00:17:46.720 --> 00:17:49.799 Yes. This goes way beyond money. Yes. No, absolutely. 00:17:49.920 --> 00:17:53.380 And here's where I think in our context we need 00:17:53.380 --> 00:17:58.890 to understand that because... This was on July 00:17:58.890 --> 00:18:02.710 4th. We live in a country that we just celebrated 00:18:02.710 --> 00:18:06.210 our 250th anniversary, our 250th anniversary 00:18:06.210 --> 00:18:08.950 of some incredible freedoms that we've been given 00:18:08.950 --> 00:18:13.329 living in this country. And because we have those 00:18:13.329 --> 00:18:17.329 governmental freedoms, there are spiritual freedoms 00:18:17.329 --> 00:18:19.690 that we also have that other countries and other 00:18:19.690 --> 00:18:23.390 Christians don't have. So we have been given 00:18:23.390 --> 00:18:27.079 more. I believe that we have been given more. 00:18:27.119 --> 00:18:32.059 We have more access to not only the Bible, but 00:18:32.059 --> 00:18:36.000 theology. We've got freedom of speech. We've 00:18:36.000 --> 00:18:39.099 got the ability to go almost anywhere and share 00:18:39.099 --> 00:18:44.740 the gospel. We have been given 10 minus. I mean, 00:18:44.759 --> 00:18:47.680 just in this country, we have a big spiritual 00:18:47.680 --> 00:18:53.759 responsibility. And so now, knowing that, That 00:18:53.759 --> 00:18:56.599 I feel like we, just because of where our location 00:18:56.599 --> 00:19:00.539 is and the freedom we have, we have a very large 00:19:00.539 --> 00:19:03.259 spiritual responsibility. The question is now 00:19:03.259 --> 00:19:07.299 like, oh, okay. When we realize that, how much 00:19:07.299 --> 00:19:10.240 more do we think of, okay, what business of the 00:19:10.240 --> 00:19:14.539 Lord am I engaging in? Yeah. No, that is a great 00:19:14.539 --> 00:19:18.180 question. I mean, because look at the end of 00:19:18.180 --> 00:19:21.259 the passage. I tell you, everyone who has more 00:19:21.259 --> 00:19:23.140 will be given, but the one who has not even what 00:19:23.140 --> 00:19:28.180 he has will be taken away. Yeah. I'm not editing 00:19:28.180 --> 00:19:30.299 that out. Sean threw his bottle across the room 00:19:30.299 --> 00:19:33.059 and it clunked on the floor and he knows better. 00:19:33.140 --> 00:19:35.779 Like he knows better that I would have to edit 00:19:35.779 --> 00:19:38.319 that out. He made eye contact while he did it 00:19:38.319 --> 00:19:42.220 like a child. And so I'm going to keep that in. 00:19:42.279 --> 00:19:43.859 I hope he picked it up. That was good stuff. 00:19:44.720 --> 00:19:46.799 Wow, that threw off the conversation. Dang it. 00:19:46.819 --> 00:19:48.779 There's two truths here, though. Please get us 00:19:48.779 --> 00:19:53.119 back on track. One, like you and I have been 00:19:53.119 --> 00:19:55.279 heavily emphasizing, and I'm going to beat this 00:19:55.279 --> 00:19:56.720 drum until the day that I die, dude, because 00:19:56.720 --> 00:20:00.619 performance -based faith is the enemy. If you 00:20:00.619 --> 00:20:07.839 are judged by your success or failure, then that 00:20:07.839 --> 00:20:11.410 is not the gospel. If you are judged by how good 00:20:11.410 --> 00:20:15.569 you are or how you ought to be, that is anti 00:20:15.569 --> 00:20:18.910 -gospel. And you are trying to make up for in 00:20:18.910 --> 00:20:21.650 your own effort what Jesus has already died for. 00:20:21.910 --> 00:20:24.549 And God is not going to honor that. You may have 00:20:24.549 --> 00:20:26.210 earthly success, but at the end of the day, that 00:20:26.210 --> 00:20:29.529 will burn in the fire. Yes, it will. But here's 00:20:29.529 --> 00:20:34.329 the other piece. The king is coming. Yes, he 00:20:34.329 --> 00:20:36.950 is. Look at the beginning. This nobleman goes 00:20:36.950 --> 00:20:41.170 into the far country to receive a kingdom. Obviously, 00:20:41.170 --> 00:20:43.309 Jesus is using this as an analogy for himself 00:20:43.309 --> 00:20:46.390 and the people of Israel. Yes. They send a delegation 00:20:46.390 --> 00:20:48.250 after him saying, we don't want this man to rule 00:20:48.250 --> 00:20:51.309 over me, which is what they did a week later 00:20:51.309 --> 00:20:54.230 when they crucified him. But, dude, the seeds 00:20:54.230 --> 00:20:56.869 of that are in all of our hearts. Yeah. That 00:20:56.869 --> 00:21:00.759 is the thought process of... the wicked servant. 00:21:01.440 --> 00:21:03.700 Because I think we take what he says is true. 00:21:03.819 --> 00:21:05.779 The wicked servant is like, oh, you're a hard 00:21:05.779 --> 00:21:09.380 man and you take money you didn't deposit and 00:21:09.380 --> 00:21:14.140 you reap what you did not sow. No. It's all already 00:21:14.140 --> 00:21:19.680 the king's. And so his mindset is just warped. 00:21:19.880 --> 00:21:23.140 It's bent on his own good. It's bent on his own 00:21:23.140 --> 00:21:25.779 comfort. It's bent on his own ownership, except 00:21:25.779 --> 00:21:29.089 for he's... Nothing is his. Well, isn't this 00:21:29.089 --> 00:21:31.529 exactly the same principle that we're looking 00:21:31.529 --> 00:21:33.210 at in Galatians on Sunday morning right now? 00:21:33.210 --> 00:21:36.150 Yes. And that is anytime you begin to add anything 00:21:36.150 --> 00:21:39.210 to the gospel, anything you add to the gospel 00:21:39.210 --> 00:21:42.410 is going to distort the gospel, and it's no longer 00:21:42.410 --> 00:21:44.630 going to have the power it once did. Because 00:21:44.630 --> 00:21:47.450 if you add anything to the work of Christ, you 00:21:47.450 --> 00:21:52.470 are diluting the power of God. Well, a false 00:21:52.470 --> 00:21:54.900 gospel is no gospel at all, dude. No. Because 00:21:54.900 --> 00:21:58.519 if, I mean, Paul says it in Romans, like, if 00:21:58.519 --> 00:22:01.319 we could do this ourselves, then Christ died 00:22:01.319 --> 00:22:05.400 for nothing. Nothing, yeah. And so, but dude, 00:22:05.539 --> 00:22:09.700 for those of us... As we labor, it's so hard 00:22:09.700 --> 00:22:12.680 to be a Christian sometimes. Like the day -to 00:22:12.680 --> 00:22:14.700 -day mundane that we were talking about, that 00:22:14.700 --> 00:22:17.299 can get dry. That can get difficult. Being a 00:22:17.299 --> 00:22:20.380 Christian costs us. I think in different parts 00:22:20.380 --> 00:22:22.099 of the world where they don't have the same freedoms 00:22:22.099 --> 00:22:24.400 that they are, people die because they take the 00:22:24.400 --> 00:22:28.480 name of Jesus. But so for us, the notion that 00:22:28.480 --> 00:22:32.160 our works, that our salvation, our standing before 00:22:32.160 --> 00:22:36.509 God is not based off of our own efforts. or our 00:22:36.509 --> 00:22:38.970 own success, rather. It's based off of our faithfulness. 00:22:39.109 --> 00:22:41.450 But the second one, man, the king is coming back. 00:22:41.750 --> 00:22:46.410 And so while we labor, we know that Jesus himself 00:22:46.410 --> 00:22:50.289 is already on his way. Recognizing whether the 00:22:50.289 --> 00:22:55.109 rapture comes tomorrow or in 2 ,000 years, all 00:22:55.109 --> 00:22:59.009 of this that we're experiencing today, the good 00:22:59.009 --> 00:23:01.109 and the bad, are part of his plan to redeem his 00:23:01.109 --> 00:23:04.269 people and to restore his creation. Yeah, man, 00:23:04.450 --> 00:23:07.519 I love it. That's so good. There's one more thing 00:23:07.519 --> 00:23:11.019 I want to ask you about. What do you make of 00:23:11.019 --> 00:23:14.480 that verse 26? Anyone who has more will be given, 00:23:14.579 --> 00:23:17.759 but from the one who has not even more, or even 00:23:17.759 --> 00:23:20.920 what he has will be taken away. That's a weird 00:23:20.920 --> 00:23:24.740 phrase to end this with, particularly then going 00:23:24.740 --> 00:23:27.000 on to say slaughter the enemies of mine who did 00:23:27.000 --> 00:23:29.839 not want me to. I tell you that to everyone who 00:23:29.839 --> 00:23:35.339 has, more will be given. And from the one who 00:23:35.339 --> 00:23:37.779 does not have, that's the phrase that I'm stuck 00:23:37.779 --> 00:23:42.160 on right now. I mean, you don't have it. Even 00:23:42.160 --> 00:23:46.480 what he does have will be taken away. I'm trying 00:23:46.480 --> 00:23:48.039 to figure out what he's talking about. I'm very 00:23:48.039 --> 00:23:54.259 confused. I feel like it could refer to like 00:23:54.259 --> 00:23:57.420 genuine belief or genuine relationship with God. 00:23:58.029 --> 00:24:01.849 Because if you do, at the end of days, like I'm 00:24:01.849 --> 00:24:04.230 presuming Jesus is talking about his return, 00:24:04.390 --> 00:24:07.710 right? If you do have a walk with Christ, more 00:24:07.710 --> 00:24:10.630 will be given to you. We see the example in the 00:24:10.630 --> 00:24:13.789 text, like more responsibility, right? The very 00:24:13.789 --> 00:24:15.950 beginning of verse 26, I tell you that everyone 00:24:15.950 --> 00:24:19.490 who has, more will be given. Like that part. 00:24:20.359 --> 00:24:22.619 I think there's very good correlation to what's 00:24:22.619 --> 00:24:27.000 going on here, right? And just me reading from 00:24:27.000 --> 00:24:29.579 the cuff right now, and from the one who does 00:24:29.579 --> 00:24:36.440 not have, okay? So they don't have. This is even 00:24:36.440 --> 00:24:40.259 what he does have will be taken away. So are 00:24:40.259 --> 00:24:43.589 we talking about this? is this like someone's 00:24:43.589 --> 00:24:45.769 heart's going to be more hardened because they're 00:24:45.769 --> 00:24:49.150 not pursuing? Where are you at with this? I think 00:24:49.150 --> 00:24:51.410 that this is someone who does not have a relationship 00:24:51.410 --> 00:24:55.950 with God. It sounds like someone, and from the 00:24:55.950 --> 00:24:59.069 one who does not have, so does not have salvation, 00:24:59.269 --> 00:25:02.930 does not have Jesus, right? Even what he does 00:25:02.930 --> 00:25:05.710 have will be taken away. You know what I think 00:25:05.710 --> 00:25:09.420 he does have? His works. I think those are the 00:25:09.420 --> 00:25:11.819 good things that he did trying to justify himself 00:25:11.819 --> 00:25:15.420 before God. I think that those can be the things 00:25:15.420 --> 00:25:18.079 that they hold as important to things that they've 00:25:18.079 --> 00:25:20.680 strived for for their whole lives that ultimately 00:25:20.680 --> 00:25:22.940 didn't have spiritual value. So this could be 00:25:22.940 --> 00:25:25.279 like the guy who buried his coin because that 00:25:25.279 --> 00:25:27.059 was his work. Yes. He's like, hey, I'm going 00:25:27.059 --> 00:25:30.799 to protect what you've given me by doing not 00:25:30.799 --> 00:25:33.079 what you asked. I'm not going to engage in business, 00:25:33.140 --> 00:25:37.410 but I'm still doing something physical. but it's 00:25:37.410 --> 00:25:39.769 not what you wanted. It's interesting to think 00:25:39.769 --> 00:25:45.130 that you can go your whole life in an effort 00:25:45.130 --> 00:25:47.390 to protect something, but if it's not what you've 00:25:47.390 --> 00:25:50.210 actually been asked to do with it, then you can 00:25:50.210 --> 00:25:52.890 still be doing the wrong thing. And so I think 00:25:52.890 --> 00:25:54.210 that's where I'm struggling right now, and I'm 00:25:54.210 --> 00:25:55.650 trying to figure out, so from the one who does 00:25:55.650 --> 00:25:59.369 not have, I mean, the phrase right there lends 00:25:59.369 --> 00:26:01.450 itself to believe this is someone that's not 00:26:01.450 --> 00:26:05.299 a believer. Yes. Can you be a believer and still 00:26:05.299 --> 00:26:07.599 do Christian things? From the outside perspective, 00:26:07.839 --> 00:26:09.880 yes. Yes. Absolutely. Yeah, you can make it look 00:26:09.880 --> 00:26:13.440 like you have it all together. There's a lot 00:26:13.440 --> 00:26:16.940 of things you can do based on your mind. Yeah. 00:26:17.160 --> 00:26:21.279 You have the knowledge of what is the right thing 00:26:21.279 --> 00:26:24.660 to do. Or even just your desire to be justified. 00:26:25.019 --> 00:26:27.390 Yeah. And that's something like you have, like, 00:26:27.450 --> 00:26:30.269 I think that I've met some people that are extremely 00:26:30.269 --> 00:26:34.170 moral people. Yeah. Right? And there's no Christian 00:26:34.170 --> 00:26:39.410 foundation to it, but they try to do what is 00:26:39.410 --> 00:26:43.309 right. That is just built in them to do what 00:26:43.309 --> 00:26:49.970 is right. And so here, even what he does have 00:26:49.970 --> 00:26:57.009 will be taken away. Yeah. even though you've 00:26:57.009 --> 00:27:00.069 tried to dig your own hole for the Lord, that's 00:27:00.069 --> 00:27:02.970 not what he asked you to do. And so that's not 00:27:02.970 --> 00:27:09.970 going to benefit you in any way. So it's an interesting 00:27:09.970 --> 00:27:13.089 passage, man. It reminds me of 1 Corinthians 00:27:13.089 --> 00:27:15.589 3, just kind of the idea that we're talking about 00:27:15.589 --> 00:27:21.130 here, where Paul kind of talks about each believer's 00:27:21.130 --> 00:27:24.920 works and ministries. It's 1 Corinthians 3, verse 00:27:24.920 --> 00:27:28.619 10. I looked it up while you were talking. And 00:27:28.619 --> 00:27:30.619 it says, according to the grace given to me, 00:27:30.740 --> 00:27:33.519 this is Paul talking, like a skilled master builder, 00:27:33.619 --> 00:27:35.960 I laid a foundation and somebody else is building 00:27:35.960 --> 00:27:38.279 upon it. He's kind of fleshing out the idea that 00:27:38.279 --> 00:27:41.599 like multiple different people can invest in 00:27:41.599 --> 00:27:45.039 one person spiritually. Let each take care how 00:27:45.039 --> 00:27:48.089 he builds upon it, that foundation. For no one 00:27:48.089 --> 00:27:50.130 can lay a foundation other than that which is 00:27:50.130 --> 00:27:52.390 laid, which is Jesus Christ. There's no other 00:27:52.390 --> 00:27:54.650 rock this thing can get built on. Now, if anyone 00:27:54.650 --> 00:27:57.849 builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious 00:27:57.849 --> 00:28:00.869 stones, wood, hay, straw, each one's work will 00:28:00.869 --> 00:28:05.130 become manifest for the day. In my text, the 00:28:05.130 --> 00:28:07.750 day, that D is capitalized. So he's referring 00:28:07.750 --> 00:28:09.869 to the day that Jesus comes back. We'll disclose 00:28:09.869 --> 00:28:13.819 it because it will be revealed by fire. And the 00:28:13.819 --> 00:28:16.220 fire will test what sort of work each one has 00:28:16.220 --> 00:28:18.539 done. If the work that anyone has built on the 00:28:18.539 --> 00:28:20.319 foundation survives, he will receive a reward. 00:28:20.440 --> 00:28:22.960 If anyone's work is burned up, he will suffer 00:28:22.960 --> 00:28:24.960 loss, though he himself will be saved. But it 00:28:24.960 --> 00:28:29.240 is only through fire. And so I think here the 00:28:29.240 --> 00:28:32.160 conversation shifts maybe a little, and maybe 00:28:32.160 --> 00:28:34.059 it doesn't. Maybe there's a point where this 00:28:34.059 --> 00:28:35.839 could talk about somebody who knows Jesus and 00:28:35.839 --> 00:28:38.880 somebody who doesn't. But I also see here the 00:28:38.880 --> 00:28:42.079 person who has, right? There is some spiritual 00:28:42.079 --> 00:28:46.140 something. But what that is will be taken away 00:28:46.140 --> 00:28:48.640 in that if you're doing it by yourself without 00:28:48.640 --> 00:28:51.920 Jesus, then you're not getting fed the way that 00:28:51.920 --> 00:28:56.160 he intends you to. So going back to our text, 00:28:56.440 --> 00:29:04.180 the person that is being referred to there at 00:29:04.180 --> 00:29:12.200 the end, what do you think it takes for them? 00:29:15.209 --> 00:29:20.609 to recognize their works are not working, that 00:29:20.609 --> 00:29:26.210 they need the master. There are a couple of things 00:29:26.210 --> 00:29:30.410 that come to mind. I'm reading a book. I don't 00:29:30.410 --> 00:29:31.730 remember the name of the author. I'm not even 00:29:31.730 --> 00:29:34.230 going to give him credit here. There are a couple 00:29:34.230 --> 00:29:39.329 of things that come to mind. And I see this in 00:29:39.329 --> 00:29:43.160 our context here in Stanley County. I don't have 00:29:43.160 --> 00:29:45.799 anybody specific in mind. I'm not shooting shots, 00:29:46.039 --> 00:29:49.859 but I am thinking of a category of people that 00:29:49.859 --> 00:29:54.019 I come across frequently here who trust in their 00:29:54.019 --> 00:29:58.380 Christian cultural heritage in a way that they 00:29:58.380 --> 00:29:59.960 don't recognize they're not actually engaging 00:29:59.960 --> 00:30:03.019 with Jesus. They focus exclusively on the outward 00:30:03.019 --> 00:30:06.119 trappings of Christianity. Go to church, been 00:30:06.119 --> 00:30:10.140 baptized, tithe. Mama and daddy were Christians. 00:30:10.750 --> 00:30:13.789 Nana and Papa were Christians. This is just who 00:30:13.789 --> 00:30:18.250 we are. And the way that they treat people who 00:30:18.250 --> 00:30:20.650 may have come up in the church but who have not 00:30:20.650 --> 00:30:22.450 shown any fruit and who haven't been there since 00:30:22.450 --> 00:30:25.789 they were a child still focuses on the external. 00:30:26.049 --> 00:30:27.450 Man, they really need to turn their life around 00:30:27.450 --> 00:30:30.210 and get back in church. And it's like, dude, 00:30:30.269 --> 00:30:33.829 you're still focused on your works. And so I 00:30:33.829 --> 00:30:37.130 think asking those questions of like, what actually 00:30:37.130 --> 00:30:40.019 matters to me about the Christian life? Is it 00:30:40.019 --> 00:30:42.980 a set of traditions that I follow and the way 00:30:42.980 --> 00:30:46.000 that I feel about me and God is hinged on how 00:30:46.000 --> 00:30:49.539 often I've been to church or how regularly I 00:30:49.539 --> 00:30:52.000 tune in on pursuing Jesus? Or do I recognize 00:30:52.000 --> 00:30:57.380 that those external actions are a symptom of 00:30:57.380 --> 00:31:01.140 an internal reality? Because I think that, listen, 00:31:01.279 --> 00:31:04.640 this dude in our verses was a servant of the 00:31:04.640 --> 00:31:08.170 master. But you see from the way that he talks 00:31:08.170 --> 00:31:11.470 about the master's actions and from the rebellion 00:31:11.470 --> 00:31:13.170 at the beginning of the verse that his heart 00:31:13.170 --> 00:31:16.930 was not with the master. He was focusing on himself. 00:31:17.190 --> 00:31:20.690 And that is one of the, going back to just our 00:31:20.690 --> 00:31:24.630 culture, and I recognize, I've been here in Stanley 00:31:24.630 --> 00:31:29.069 County for nine years, and I think it's not just, 00:31:29.230 --> 00:31:31.450 I don't want to say it's symptomatic of, it's 00:31:31.450 --> 00:31:35.720 not symptomatic of just this county. But Bible 00:31:35.720 --> 00:31:39.000 Belt culture. Yeah. I mean, it really is. You 00:31:39.000 --> 00:31:40.720 know, people look, we look at the Bible Belt, 00:31:40.779 --> 00:31:45.440 and we are so culturally Christian that so many 00:31:45.440 --> 00:31:48.720 times that's where it stops. Yeah. It stops with 00:31:48.720 --> 00:31:51.799 your culture. You do things out of tradition, 00:31:51.980 --> 00:31:56.779 and I believe that a lot of people are hurting 00:31:56.779 --> 00:32:00.759 spiritually because of that. And perhaps have 00:32:00.759 --> 00:32:03.299 false assurance of their rightness with God. 00:32:04.360 --> 00:32:07.799 Oh, 100%. 100%. Even if you've prayed the sinner's 00:32:07.799 --> 00:32:09.599 prayer as an eight -year -old and got baptized 00:32:09.599 --> 00:32:12.740 as a nine -year -old, I have to wonder, going 00:32:12.740 --> 00:32:14.660 back to the parable of the sower, like, are you 00:32:14.660 --> 00:32:16.920 one of those people who got choked up by the 00:32:16.920 --> 00:32:19.539 weeds, the cares of this world, or the devil 00:32:19.539 --> 00:32:21.980 came and stole that word away? Because we see 00:32:21.980 --> 00:32:23.619 from the book of James that the evidence of a 00:32:23.619 --> 00:32:27.309 believer is the fruit. Yeah. Not the salvation 00:32:27.309 --> 00:32:29.529 of the believer. Salvation is by grace through 00:32:29.529 --> 00:32:32.609 faith alone. But because of what Christ does 00:32:32.609 --> 00:32:35.789 in you, because of the Holy Spirit in you, we 00:32:35.789 --> 00:32:37.910 see their fruit and their works. And this is 00:32:37.910 --> 00:32:42.069 why I ended my sermon this past Sunday the way 00:32:42.069 --> 00:32:45.549 I did, talking about my transformation. Yeah. 00:32:45.690 --> 00:32:49.910 And I mentioned on Sunday that I don't have a 00:32:49.910 --> 00:32:53.819 date, right? I don't have the date that... It 00:32:53.819 --> 00:32:56.319 was this big Holy Spirit movement. For me, it 00:32:56.319 --> 00:32:59.240 took time. It was over years. And sometime through 00:32:59.240 --> 00:33:01.960 those years, man, I realized Jesus was Lord. 00:33:02.559 --> 00:33:10.660 And how I know, because I remember at the beginning 00:33:10.660 --> 00:33:12.579 feeling like, oh, I'm not saved because I don't 00:33:12.579 --> 00:33:15.960 have a date, right? Yeah. But what I realized, 00:33:16.019 --> 00:33:18.519 but no, I started to look at how I was being 00:33:18.519 --> 00:33:23.019 transformed. My desires began to change, and 00:33:23.019 --> 00:33:25.660 my desires were not changing to prove my love 00:33:25.660 --> 00:33:28.940 for God. My desires were changing because I loved 00:33:28.940 --> 00:33:32.440 God. And that is where I think people get tripped 00:33:32.440 --> 00:33:35.480 up. So many people get stuck in cultural Christianity 00:33:35.480 --> 00:33:38.839 because they're doing things to prove their love 00:33:38.839 --> 00:33:43.319 for God instead of they're seeing a renewal of 00:33:43.319 --> 00:33:47.579 their mind, as Paul says. and their desires are 00:33:47.579 --> 00:33:50.259 changing because of the love they've experienced. 00:33:50.359 --> 00:33:53.079 And that's how you realize there's fruit. And 00:33:53.079 --> 00:33:55.400 I wonder if the, if it's, if, if a component 00:33:55.400 --> 00:33:57.599 of this too, is that they're also thinking they've 00:33:57.599 --> 00:34:01.559 done all they need to do to have to, to rather 00:34:01.559 --> 00:34:04.519 than I'm doing what I need to do to prove that 00:34:04.519 --> 00:34:06.200 I, that I love God or God's love for me. It's 00:34:06.200 --> 00:34:10.630 like, no, dude, I'm good. I'm set. I'm set. But 00:34:10.630 --> 00:34:13.949 like hearing you talk about your testimony, like 00:34:13.949 --> 00:34:16.010 every time you bring it up, it reminds me of 00:34:16.010 --> 00:34:18.730 Philippians. Like he who began to work in you 00:34:18.730 --> 00:34:21.469 will bring it complete to completion in the day 00:34:21.469 --> 00:34:23.369 of Jesus Christ. That's another one of those 00:34:23.369 --> 00:34:26.150 passages where the day, the capital D is capitalized, 00:34:26.150 --> 00:34:29.630 where Jesus comes back. It's like our spiritual 00:34:29.630 --> 00:34:32.610 walk is not a one -time event. And I think that's 00:34:32.610 --> 00:34:34.789 one of the things that we can treat our walk 00:34:34.789 --> 00:34:37.690 as. Like I got saved, bam, donezo. I've done 00:34:37.690 --> 00:34:40.369 what I need to do. And it's like, you've done 00:34:40.369 --> 00:34:43.389 all that you needed to do to be saved, provided 00:34:43.389 --> 00:34:45.789 that this leads to a lifelong relationship with 00:34:45.789 --> 00:34:49.949 Jesus. If it doesn't, then I don't know if that's 00:34:49.949 --> 00:34:52.030 a, I don't know if that was a genuine call to 00:34:52.030 --> 00:34:54.190 salvation because there's not fruit there. If 00:34:54.190 --> 00:34:55.849 the Holy Spirit isn't working in your life, like, 00:34:55.869 --> 00:34:58.170 you know. And it's one of the, and all I can 00:34:58.170 --> 00:35:00.909 speak of is from how the Holy Spirit has worked 00:35:00.909 --> 00:35:04.090 in my life. And what I know and what I've experienced 00:35:04.090 --> 00:35:09.159 is that the closer I get to Jesus, the more I 00:35:09.159 --> 00:35:11.920 absolutely fall in love with Jesus and the more 00:35:11.920 --> 00:35:14.980 I desire to represent him well in everything 00:35:14.980 --> 00:35:17.760 I do. And that process is like the least linear 00:35:17.760 --> 00:35:19.840 thing ever. It's like four steps forward, two 00:35:19.840 --> 00:35:22.219 steps back, three steps back, one step forward. 00:35:22.300 --> 00:35:24.659 I think that's the whole podcast in itself, like 00:35:24.659 --> 00:35:27.300 quite honestly. Once again, going back to the 00:35:27.300 --> 00:35:30.019 very beginning of... towards the beginning of 00:35:30.019 --> 00:35:33.400 this podcast, of my desire to not paint myself 00:35:33.400 --> 00:35:36.119 on a pedestal as a pastor. Facts. I want people 00:35:36.119 --> 00:35:38.880 to know I tell stories of my past. I tell stories 00:35:38.880 --> 00:35:42.980 now that I am still messing up. I am still, as 00:35:42.980 --> 00:35:45.380 the Apostle Paul says, I am still being saved. 00:35:45.639 --> 00:35:49.099 Yes. And that is the case for all of us. We're 00:35:49.099 --> 00:35:51.340 all going to mess up. We're all on this journey. 00:35:51.500 --> 00:35:54.320 But that's what I love about pursuing Jesus together, 00:35:54.619 --> 00:35:56.960 is that's what the Christian faith is all about. 00:35:57.440 --> 00:36:01.320 100%. Sean and I aren't sitting here like, oh 00:36:01.320 --> 00:36:03.500 yeah, you're not saved and you're not saved and 00:36:03.500 --> 00:36:07.079 you're not saved. I'm not the Holy Spirit. But 00:36:07.079 --> 00:36:10.119 I would encourage anybody listening to this podcast, 00:36:10.159 --> 00:36:14.960 and I think I'll land the plane here, ask the 00:36:14.960 --> 00:36:19.710 Lord to examine your heart. Because I think he 00:36:19.710 --> 00:36:23.369 really will show you. Yes, he will. Do I have 00:36:23.369 --> 00:36:28.989 a living relationship with Jesus? Is it the fact 00:36:28.989 --> 00:36:30.550 that I'm a Christian that drives my behavior? 00:36:30.710 --> 00:36:34.989 Or does my daily walk with God inform what I 00:36:34.989 --> 00:36:40.050 do and how I think and feel and function? We 00:36:40.050 --> 00:36:43.789 can go a long way on willpower just to do stuff. 00:36:45.519 --> 00:36:48.739 it's hard for us to change who we are under the 00:36:48.739 --> 00:36:52.340 hood. And I think that's what that soul transformation 00:36:52.340 --> 00:36:55.639 looks like. That's a good final thought, buddy. 00:36:55.840 --> 00:36:59.280 Yeah. We all thank you for jumping in with us 00:36:59.280 --> 00:37:01.880 here on this Pursuing Jesus episode. One of these 00:37:01.880 --> 00:37:03.440 days, Sean, we're going to get to both texts. 00:37:04.000 --> 00:37:08.690 You know, if we do, we do. If we don't. I think 00:37:08.690 --> 00:37:12.309 we need feedback always. That's true. We're only 00:37:12.309 --> 00:37:14.789 doing what we feel that our conversations are 00:37:14.789 --> 00:37:16.969 just fluid and we do what we can. If you want 00:37:16.969 --> 00:37:19.030 to hear us talk about more text instead of laboring 00:37:19.030 --> 00:37:21.329 on number one, let us know. If you want to hear 00:37:21.329 --> 00:37:24.570 us talk about more tacos, I would love to talk 00:37:24.570 --> 00:37:28.150 more about tacos. Pursuing Tacos is going to 00:37:28.150 --> 00:37:31.289 go up on our Patreon in a couple of weeks. All 00:37:31.289 --> 00:37:32.750 right. Well, we love you guys. This has been 00:37:32.750 --> 00:37:35.409 Pursuing Jesus. I'm Ben Smith. I am Sean Green. 00:37:35.659 --> 00:37:42.340 And we will catch you later. Pursuing Jesus is 00:37:42.340 --> 00:37:45.320 a ministry of Memorial Baptist Church in Norwood, 00:37:45.380 --> 00:37:47.539 North Carolina. To learn more about our church, 00:37:47.659 --> 00:37:51.079 please visit memorial4norwood .com.