WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:06.319 Today on Blooming Curious I am chatting not to one but two amazing educators. 00:00:06.380 --> 00:00:09.830 This is new territory for me interviewing two people on the same 00:00:09.830 --> 00:00:12.959 call and I'm really excited and just also a little bit nervous. 00:00:13.975 --> 00:00:18.994 So today I'm welcoming the creators behind Squish Resources, Alana and Meg. 00:00:19.165 --> 00:00:24.205 Each of these ladies have over a decade of experience having taught in IB, PYP 00:00:24.205 --> 00:00:28.535 schools, which means they know a thing or two about inquiry based learning. 00:00:29.115 --> 00:00:31.924 So welcome to Blooming Curious, Meg and Alana. 00:00:32.665 --> 00:00:33.144 Thanks. 00:00:33.195 --> 00:00:34.035 We're happy to be here. 00:00:35.425 --> 00:00:39.535 So let's start off with both of you giving listeners some insight into 00:00:39.565 --> 00:00:42.825 who you are and tell us a little bit about yourself and how you 00:00:42.825 --> 00:00:45.685 came to be teaching in IB schools. 00:00:45.975 --> 00:00:47.505 So let's start with you, Alana. 00:00:47.984 --> 00:00:53.294 Yeah, so I've been teaching for over a decade and during my time as a teacher, 00:00:53.294 --> 00:00:57.454 I worked, uh, overseas in London for the first couple of years of my career. 00:00:58.124 --> 00:01:04.044 Um, when I returned to Australia, I worked in a few different private schools, both 00:01:04.044 --> 00:01:05.894 in rural Queensland and in Brisbane. 00:01:06.624 --> 00:01:11.134 I've taught, I've taught all the grades, including, uh, nursery age kids 00:01:11.134 --> 00:01:13.684 at around four through to year six. 00:01:13.734 --> 00:01:18.384 But I have been told many a time that I'm a natural upper primary teacher 00:01:18.424 --> 00:01:23.194 and really found my stride and sort of year five and six, , which is where 00:01:23.194 --> 00:01:25.414 I also fell in love with inquiry. 00:01:25.809 --> 00:01:30.459 I ended up in a school that is an IB PYP school, which is where I met Meg. 00:01:30.719 --> 00:01:31.879 Meg, what about you? 00:01:33.209 --> 00:01:37.699 So I have only ever taught in an IB school. 00:01:37.839 --> 00:01:43.990 So for my 10 years of teaching that I've done thus far, um, I've taught 00:01:43.990 --> 00:01:47.670 the PYP., I finished off my PRAC. 00:01:48.215 --> 00:01:52.995 Um, to the final year of my practical uni, I also did at the same IB PYP school. 00:01:53.385 --> 00:01:57.415 So when people ask me, Oh, you know, what's the difference? 00:01:57.415 --> 00:02:03.715 I can't actually say, because I haven't taught in a non IB school since, 00:02:04.535 --> 00:02:07.205 you know, 2010, something like that. 00:02:07.935 --> 00:02:11.045 Um, and that would literally only be as a prac student. 00:02:11.175 --> 00:02:16.370 So I actually don't, know what I'm missing by not missing, 00:02:16.370 --> 00:02:17.180 but do you know what I mean? 00:02:18.520 --> 00:02:21.760 Like it's something that is so ingrained in how I teach. 00:02:21.800 --> 00:02:23.300 It's not anything out of the ordinary. 00:02:24.390 --> 00:02:25.900 That's just part of who you are. 00:02:25.920 --> 00:02:30.479 Inquiry is just part of how you function in other words. 00:02:30.479 --> 00:02:32.551 She lives and breathes it. 00:02:32.601 --> 00:02:34.591 Let's chat a little bit about inquiry. 00:02:34.631 --> 00:02:38.521 So Meg, obviously for you then, it's not like you were 00:02:38.521 --> 00:02:40.231 inspired or anything like that. 00:02:40.231 --> 00:02:45.071 You fell into this IB school and IB schools, for those who don't know, are 00:02:45.071 --> 00:02:48.821 very much inquiry based learning driven. 00:02:49.541 --> 00:02:53.181 So what did it mean to you when you started in this IB school 00:02:54.086 --> 00:02:59.206 and you had to teach inquiry, did it come naturally to you? 00:02:59.216 --> 00:03:00.336 Did you struggle? 00:03:00.356 --> 00:03:02.806 What was your whole feeling about the whole inquiry? 00:03:04.006 --> 00:03:10.316 I found it quite natural actually, because it's so everything is linked. 00:03:11.086 --> 00:03:15.176 So like when I would speak with friends who were at other schools and that 00:03:15.176 --> 00:03:17.976 kind of thing, they go, Oh, you know, we're doing this in science and we're 00:03:17.976 --> 00:03:21.766 doing this in HASS, we're doing this in math, we're doing this in English. 00:03:21.796 --> 00:03:26.246 And I was like, well, ours is all kind of in together, like obviously we teach 00:03:26.396 --> 00:03:31.136 English and Maths, but then for us we would teach Inquiry, which was, some of 00:03:31.136 --> 00:03:36.616 our inquiries would have Civics and HASS and, oh sorry, and History and Science 00:03:36.636 --> 00:03:40.916 all in the one sort of learning journey. 00:03:41.586 --> 00:03:44.736 , So rather than having everything standalone, it's quite natural 00:03:44.766 --> 00:03:45.976 to then have everything together. 00:03:45.976 --> 00:03:50.536 And if you're doing writing, , it was all about the topic, like, but not. 00:03:51.026 --> 00:03:51.796 Thematically. 00:03:52.316 --> 00:03:54.576 So it's not like we're doing, you know, dinosaurs, so we're 00:03:54.576 --> 00:03:55.736 just writing about dinosaurs. 00:03:55.736 --> 00:03:58.916 It would be, you would maybe write an information report and that 00:03:58.916 --> 00:04:02.991 would be your genre for the term or the unit or that kind of thing. 00:04:03.421 --> 00:04:08.491 Um, so it's very difficult to explain that sometimes if someone's never done it. 00:04:09.531 --> 00:04:10.171 Does that make sense? 00:04:10.171 --> 00:04:11.271 Yeah, totally. 00:04:11.271 --> 00:04:15.941 That makes total sense to me because that's, I guess, for me personally, 00:04:16.131 --> 00:04:23.321 although I, I've never really taught an IB school except for kindergarten, which I 00:04:23.681 --> 00:04:25.771 taught actually in an IB school in Dubai. 00:04:26.371 --> 00:04:29.551 But not here in Australia ever. 00:04:29.591 --> 00:04:31.191 And that was a long time ago. 00:04:32.181 --> 00:04:36.701 So I also feel that inquiry is just a natural part of me. 00:04:36.741 --> 00:04:38.371 And it's just how I teach. 00:04:38.381 --> 00:04:40.261 So I see the links everywhere. 00:04:40.701 --> 00:04:41.751 But what about you, Alana? 00:04:41.751 --> 00:04:46.676 Because you weren't IB originally, so you've actually had the experience 00:04:46.676 --> 00:04:51.396 in both IB and I guess we can call it a traditional school environment. 00:04:52.286 --> 00:04:54.106 So what about you? 00:04:54.116 --> 00:04:58.856 How did you become involved or how did your thinking really change 00:04:58.856 --> 00:05:02.266 , when you started getting involved with inquiry in an IB setting? 00:05:03.476 --> 00:05:08.136 I think because I, I taught overseas in London and I know that this is might 00:05:08.136 --> 00:05:12.826 not always be the case, but I found a really great school, um, that I taught 00:05:12.826 --> 00:05:17.556 over there for two years and I taught at that same school and they were very, I 00:05:17.556 --> 00:05:21.586 wouldn't say they were an inquiry school, but they will very student centered. 00:05:21.876 --> 00:05:24.596 And that was amazing to have straight out of uni. 00:05:24.626 --> 00:05:26.446 And I was very confused. 00:05:26.446 --> 00:05:30.466 This is back in the day, but they didn't have textbooks. 00:05:30.746 --> 00:05:35.311 They didn't have Um, many of the resources that I had come to rely on 00:05:35.311 --> 00:05:39.601 during my practice and I had seen my mentor teachers use, uh, and I was 00:05:39.651 --> 00:05:42.021 very confused how they actually taught. 00:05:42.031 --> 00:05:46.381 So I had sort of hit the ground running over there and they use a lot of, yeah, 00:05:46.381 --> 00:05:50.841 like I said, student centered, a lot of differentiation, um, a lot of student 00:05:50.841 --> 00:05:56.601 voice just very naturally in, and that's sort of how I started teaching. 00:05:56.601 --> 00:06:02.226 And then when I returned to Australia, I was, Like kind of shocked to find 00:06:02.586 --> 00:06:05.846 that, you know, we, the kids still got the math textbooks out and they 00:06:05.846 --> 00:06:09.776 turned to the next page and we would, do the lesson, they do the worksheet. 00:06:09.806 --> 00:06:18.436 And I just really missed that, that student voice and essentially inquiry 00:06:18.496 --> 00:06:19.966 learning, but I didn't know what it was. 00:06:20.356 --> 00:06:22.826 And I just thought, you know, this is just Australia. 00:06:22.826 --> 00:06:23.596 We're backwards. 00:06:26.036 --> 00:06:31.256 And I hopped around a couple of schools due to moving and personal circumstances 00:06:31.256 --> 00:06:37.586 and ended up teaching at the school where I met Meg, where it was a PYP IB school. 00:06:37.686 --> 00:06:43.296 And, um, I do remember one of my very first lessons that I had 00:06:43.296 --> 00:06:47.076 as an observation, my principal saying to me, you know what, you 00:06:47.116 --> 00:06:49.806 are a natural inquiry teacher. 00:06:49.896 --> 00:06:53.046 And that sort of hit me because that's just my style and 00:06:53.046 --> 00:06:55.276 that's how I love to teach. 00:06:55.316 --> 00:07:00.586 And don't get me wrong because when I fell into this school, I didn't have 00:07:00.586 --> 00:07:05.806 any training and, um, I thought inquiry meant sort of like, we're learning 00:07:05.806 --> 00:07:10.586 about space, write a question and go find out and just like let them at it. 00:07:10.616 --> 00:07:13.556 And it was shocking what they came up with. 00:07:13.941 --> 00:07:19.101 So, I really learned a lot while I was at that school and, really found my, 00:07:19.121 --> 00:07:23.961 yeah, really found my straps with it and just the learning that was happening. 00:07:24.321 --> 00:07:24.941 You know, you just, 00:07:24.951 --> 00:07:28.981 when you nailed a lesson and you, the kids came out just with a buzz 00:07:28.981 --> 00:07:32.861 because not only had they learned what you had intended them to learn, 00:07:33.071 --> 00:07:36.661 but they had driven it and they had 00:07:37.051 --> 00:07:37.991 voice in it. 00:07:38.021 --> 00:07:42.621 And that's, I find that it's not hard to achieve an upper 00:07:42.621 --> 00:07:45.071 primary, but It's not the norm. 00:07:45.481 --> 00:07:50.271 So that's when I was like, we need, we need more of this in more schools 00:07:50.621 --> 00:07:53.761 everywhere in our country, I should say. 00:07:54.511 --> 00:07:59.271 , I absolutely, and 100 percent agree with everything you've just said, I 00:07:59.271 --> 00:08:05.211 think as inquiry teachers, we naturally all have that same feeling about, 00:08:05.311 --> 00:08:09.881 you know, the child's voice and the integrating across the curriculum. 00:08:09.881 --> 00:08:14.901 So I don't understand because life is integrated. 00:08:14.901 --> 00:08:18.591 I don't understand this whole teaching in separate boxes, which 00:08:18.611 --> 00:08:20.901 I actually really struggled with. 00:08:21.241 --> 00:08:23.101 I just, it's not me and I couldn't do it. 00:08:23.761 --> 00:08:30.216 So if we really define inquiry based learning, and what distinguishes 00:08:30.216 --> 00:08:32.606 it from traditional learning? 00:08:33.906 --> 00:08:35.146 Meg, what would you say? 00:08:35.966 --> 00:08:36.656 What makes it different? 00:08:37.026 --> 00:08:40.026 Is it just children's voice or do you think there's something else? 00:08:41.396 --> 00:08:43.726 It's a lot about getting a depth of knowledge rather 00:08:43.726 --> 00:08:44.796 than a breadth of knowledge. 00:08:45.506 --> 00:08:49.926 And so really getting deep, rich, meaningful, all of those 00:08:50.076 --> 00:08:51.776 synonyms that go within them. 00:08:52.196 --> 00:08:56.236 Um, it's about getting all of that understanding in there rather than just 00:08:56.236 --> 00:08:58.036 knowing bits and pieces about everything. 00:08:58.046 --> 00:09:01.076 Like you can think about it in so many different ways, like especially 00:09:01.076 --> 00:09:04.086 with PYP, you talk about conceptual understanding and all of the 00:09:04.336 --> 00:09:05.736 approaching things in different ways. 00:09:06.156 --> 00:09:09.916 Um, but yeah, so depth rather than breadth would be my response. 00:09:10.066 --> 00:09:11.291 Allanah, what about you? 00:09:11.501 --> 00:09:12.846 Do you wanna respond there? 00:09:13.466 --> 00:09:17.656 I think if you were to define it, it would incorporate quite a lot. 00:09:17.746 --> 00:09:21.346 You know, we've talked about now breadth and depth over, no depth, 00:09:21.351 --> 00:09:23.626 over breadth, and then student voice. 00:09:24.461 --> 00:09:28.926 But something that I took away from like inquiry learning that's very 00:09:28.926 --> 00:09:31.566 different to traditional learning is the structure of a lesson. 00:09:31.916 --> 00:09:38.436 And this is, I think what really drove me to create Sqwish because 00:09:38.716 --> 00:09:44.196 structuring a lesson, um, is something that any teacher can do. 00:09:44.916 --> 00:09:49.976 But how you decide that I think depends on whether you are going to 00:09:49.976 --> 00:09:52.126 teach it in an inquiry way or not. 00:09:52.476 --> 00:09:58.136 So for me, upper primary is very content heavy and very, 00:09:58.196 --> 00:10:00.156 like extremely content heavy. 00:10:00.196 --> 00:10:05.741 And you can't force children to have an interest in A topic they 00:10:05.741 --> 00:10:09.121 don't have an interest in, but we have to teach the curriculum. 00:10:09.461 --> 00:10:13.391 So this is where I think that inquiry learning has to become quite creative 00:10:13.421 --> 00:10:17.251 from the teacher, where you actually need to create the environment that 00:10:17.561 --> 00:10:22.231 ignites the curiosity, that creates the students to have these questions. 00:10:22.231 --> 00:10:27.151 And once you've got that, then that learning comes with the depth over the 00:10:27.161 --> 00:10:32.011 breadth, you know, like that's when they want to find out if I don't want to find 00:10:32.011 --> 00:10:35.441 out they're going to be forced to learn it and they're going to not, it's not 00:10:35.441 --> 00:10:41.581 going to stick, but you know, igniting that curiosity and withholding answers 00:10:41.811 --> 00:10:48.901 until they want them is what I think is so beautiful about inquiry, because then 00:10:48.901 --> 00:10:53.141 you share the answers and they're like, yes, we finally have figured it out. 00:10:53.141 --> 00:10:57.191 Or, you know, even better, they come to the answers themselves and that's 00:10:57.191 --> 00:10:59.431 all just about structuring your lesson and thinking about how I'm 00:10:59.451 --> 00:11:00.851 going to get my students interested. 00:11:01.071 --> 00:11:05.421 In this horribly boring topic that I have to teach because the curriculum 00:11:05.421 --> 00:11:09.301 tells me to, and then seeing what they come up with and guiding 00:11:09.301 --> 00:11:11.421 them to get them where we need to. 00:11:11.691 --> 00:11:17.451 So for me, it's, it's less about, um, chalk and talk and all those things. 00:11:17.671 --> 00:11:21.611 Although there is a place for that within inquiry , , it's making sure 00:11:21.611 --> 00:11:25.976 that our kids really have that drive to want to learn because they do. 00:11:26.026 --> 00:11:27.676 We all want to learn something. 00:11:27.896 --> 00:11:32.256 I think even as adults, we all still crave learning something new. 00:11:32.316 --> 00:11:36.466 So for our kids are walking into class every single day, trying to 00:11:36.466 --> 00:11:39.286 get them excited is a big thing. 00:11:40.561 --> 00:11:45.311 Yes, I've been actually talking about this quite a lot on the podcast, and 00:11:45.311 --> 00:11:50.881 that is about that desire to want to learn, that nurturing of the curiosity, 00:11:51.461 --> 00:11:56.961 because there is quite a lot of statistics coming out that shows that 00:11:56.971 --> 00:12:02.996 yes, we are all born innately curious, But that curiosity wanes over time. 00:12:03.326 --> 00:12:06.856 So how do we keep kids curious then? 00:12:06.896 --> 00:12:11.586 How do we, and Allanah, you said that so beautifully, structure a lesson 00:12:12.276 --> 00:12:18.306 where we actually have to hook them so that they are interested in the topic 00:12:18.316 --> 00:12:21.956 or interested in the concept or what it is that we're trying to teach them. 00:12:22.356 --> 00:12:25.576 So I think that's what makes it different is that we don't go in with 00:12:25.576 --> 00:12:28.256 just Oh, I've got to teach this today. 00:12:28.536 --> 00:12:33.096 It's all, Oh, how am I going to hook these kids so that they actually 00:12:33.096 --> 00:12:35.206 want to learn what I have to teach? 00:12:36.446 --> 00:12:37.706 Would you agree with that? 00:12:38.476 --> 00:12:43.346 Yes, definitely , and I think that's why inquiry lends itself so easily 00:12:43.346 --> 00:12:47.666 and in the early years, younger years, because, you know, it, we really are 00:12:47.666 --> 00:12:49.376 just following the lead of the child. 00:12:49.906 --> 00:12:53.806 When they start getting older, you can see that sort of curiosity. 00:12:53.846 --> 00:12:55.726 They lose a little bit of that spark. 00:12:55.776 --> 00:12:58.366 , I mean, I can't count the amount of times I've been in a class and said, 00:12:58.366 --> 00:13:01.426 right, we're going to do some maths, and then the collective grown in the 00:13:01.426 --> 00:13:06.796 class, like it's just, you know, that's the worst thing to hear as a teacher. 00:13:06.936 --> 00:13:09.426 You don't want that because you just know that if they're already going 00:13:09.426 --> 00:13:14.386 in there with that mindset, what are the chances of them actually learning 00:13:14.396 --> 00:13:16.086 the thing that I need to teach them? 00:13:16.506 --> 00:13:20.296 So, yeah, I think, nurturing that spark, not just in the early 00:13:20.296 --> 00:13:26.456 years, but continually through to, , Primary upper primary and beyond. 00:13:26.846 --> 00:13:28.606 Um, that's the dream. 00:13:30.266 --> 00:13:34.156 I am wanting to add something I had a lesson last year, we were talking about, 00:13:34.156 --> 00:13:37.386 you know, that withholding answers until they actually want to learn about it. 00:13:37.766 --> 00:13:42.716 Um, year five class all boys, and we were doing, decimals, percentages, 00:13:42.716 --> 00:13:44.936 fractions, all of that within number. 00:13:45.536 --> 00:13:49.956 And, we're just placing, you know, some fractions, some decimals, some percentages 00:13:49.986 --> 00:13:53.716 along a number line and going, okay, how does this work, blah, blah, blah. 00:13:53.716 --> 00:13:55.446 And they're going, Oh yeah, well, we know that's equivalent 00:13:55.486 --> 00:13:56.546 of all that kind of thing. 00:13:57.186 --> 00:14:02.786 But watching them figure out, I think it was how 25 percent matches 00:14:02.856 --> 00:14:06.436 as how that turns into 25 out of a hundred to then become a quarter. 00:14:07.316 --> 00:14:08.696 , and watching their little faces. 00:14:08.696 --> 00:14:11.136 I remember them going, Oh my goodness is that how it works? 00:14:11.136 --> 00:14:16.061 Yes, and so the lesson was supposed to finish or whatever it was, 00:14:16.061 --> 00:14:16.601 and they're like, no, no, no. 00:14:16.611 --> 00:14:19.241 We want to have a look at the rest of them, and so by that stage, they 00:14:19.241 --> 00:14:22.311 actually wanted to know how it all worked 00:14:23.071 --> 00:14:27.361 How did you , in that specific lesson, what was the hook? 00:14:27.421 --> 00:14:30.931 Why did they enjoy learning about those fractions so much? 00:14:30.961 --> 00:14:32.661 What is it that you used? 00:14:34.021 --> 00:14:39.791 I think, I'm trying to remember, I'm pretty sure we had a masking tape 00:14:39.791 --> 00:14:44.821 number line along the floor and we had all of these little cut out, this 00:14:44.821 --> 00:14:49.761 is in grade five, so not in early primary, um, we had just, I think it 00:14:49.761 --> 00:14:52.711 might have even been, we were talking about probability within this as well. 00:14:53.071 --> 00:14:56.321 And like just little post it notes that had different things written on them. 00:14:56.901 --> 00:14:59.761 And so we were going, okay, where do these belong on the number 00:14:59.761 --> 00:15:00.841 line and that kind of thing. 00:15:00.891 --> 00:15:02.611 And then when, okay, how does this work? 00:15:02.661 --> 00:15:04.121 Like, let's line them up properly. 00:15:04.641 --> 00:15:09.321 And watching them go, oh, okay, so there's all my percentages and there's 00:15:09.321 --> 00:15:12.501 all my equivalent fractions and there's all my decimals and that kind of thing. 00:15:12.501 --> 00:15:16.781 And watching them go, oh, that doesn't fit there because, those numbers 00:15:16.781 --> 00:15:18.091 don't line up and that kind of thing. 00:15:18.151 --> 00:15:22.051 So starting with manipulatives, so starting with stuff rather 00:15:22.051 --> 00:15:24.261 than just on the board. 00:15:24.741 --> 00:15:26.221 That was just the word I was waiting for. 00:15:26.221 --> 00:15:30.441 Manipulatives. 00:15:30.441 --> 00:15:33.651 So people always think that manipulatives 00:15:34.326 --> 00:15:36.786 , whatever they are, whether they are counters, whether they 00:15:36.786 --> 00:15:40.376 are pebbles, whether they are something on a sticky note, that 00:15:40.406 --> 00:15:42.136 all equates to hands on learning. 00:15:42.616 --> 00:15:47.506 And I think it's shocking that you don't even find them very often 00:15:47.506 --> 00:15:49.416 in an upper primary classroom. 00:15:50.196 --> 00:15:50.786 It's true. 00:15:51.076 --> 00:15:51.336 Yes. 00:15:51.916 --> 00:15:55.706 Well, not at, you know, the IBPYP school we worked at, but. 00:15:55.766 --> 00:15:56.626 I was going to say, really? 00:15:56.776 --> 00:15:57.006 Yeah. 00:15:57.166 --> 00:15:57.826 That's all I had. 00:15:57.826 --> 00:15:58.376 Yeah. 00:15:58.886 --> 00:16:02.546 Well, that's the thing is that, you can take that example in many ways 00:16:02.546 --> 00:16:03.976 is that kids want to be involved. 00:16:04.276 --> 00:16:07.826 You know, the alternative to that lesson would be that you drew with a number 00:16:07.826 --> 00:16:10.756 line or you had it projected on the board and you would say, right, kids, 00:16:10.756 --> 00:16:12.166 listen, this is how it's going to be. 00:16:12.206 --> 00:16:14.566 And you would stick it all up and you would show them straight away. 00:16:15.116 --> 00:16:18.056 And they would be like, yeah, whatever, like, how is it going in their heads? 00:16:18.086 --> 00:16:22.456 But what Meg's done there is, , the children have things in their hands and 00:16:22.456 --> 00:16:25.086 they're talking about it with each other and they're trying to problem solve. 00:16:25.126 --> 00:16:28.206 And you have, it's like less talk from you. 00:16:28.216 --> 00:16:29.616 It's way less talk from you. 00:16:29.616 --> 00:16:32.866 You just have to ask a couple of questions and give them the post it notes. 00:16:32.906 --> 00:16:36.726 Like that's, that's the beauty of that situation. 00:16:37.501 --> 00:16:40.461 Well, I think they are doing the work 00:16:40.741 --> 00:16:41.101 Yeah 00:16:42.231 --> 00:16:45.271 that's how you learn, you learn by doing. 00:16:45.321 --> 00:16:48.821 I mean, we know this from our university studies, you learn 00:16:48.821 --> 00:16:50.681 by doing, kids learn by doing. 00:16:51.061 --> 00:16:54.671 And then they get to year three and four and five, and then we 00:16:54.671 --> 00:16:58.441 take away the manipulatives because now we think that they, that they, 00:16:58.541 --> 00:17:00.111 , they can now think abstractly. 00:17:00.831 --> 00:17:04.501 And that's such a huge mistake because they need those manipulatives 00:17:06.561 --> 00:17:08.851 even in upper primary. 00:17:09.341 --> 00:17:12.371 So that's an amazing thing and I love that you said that Meg. 00:17:13.111 --> 00:17:17.651 I went to a PD a couple of months ago with Cath Murdoch actually, and she was 00:17:17.651 --> 00:17:22.311 speaking exactly about this, that she was in a class and I think it was a year 00:17:22.351 --> 00:17:27.181 three class if I'm not mistaken, and she was doing an activity with them and there 00:17:27.181 --> 00:17:29.421 were no manipulatives in that classroom. 00:17:29.471 --> 00:17:34.291 So I think this is a really important point about inquiry is that it is hands 00:17:34.291 --> 00:17:42.101 on and that children really need those hands on manipulatives to show their 00:17:42.311 --> 00:17:46.931 understanding and to go through their thinking so that they get the concept. 00:17:46.971 --> 00:17:50.281 And so Meg, that must've been an amazing lesson because obviously 00:17:50.281 --> 00:17:51.481 the kids didn't want it to end. 00:17:51.481 --> 00:17:54.021 And that's what inquiry is about, isn't it? 00:17:54.801 --> 00:17:55.031 Yeah. 00:17:55.671 --> 00:17:56.341 That's the dream. 00:17:58.161 --> 00:18:02.631 Meg, how do you go incorporating student voice and choice? 00:18:03.441 --> 00:18:06.281 Why do you think it's so important in inquiry? 00:18:07.191 --> 00:18:11.911 It lets students have, like we, it's actually voice choice and then the 00:18:11.911 --> 00:18:13.521 third one that we use is ownership. 00:18:14.011 --> 00:18:16.151 So they have the voice, they have the choice and they have 00:18:16.181 --> 00:18:17.481 ownership over their learning. 00:18:17.831 --> 00:18:20.291 And therefore they want to learn. 00:18:21.201 --> 00:18:21.821 Does that make sense? 00:18:22.291 --> 00:18:25.881 If you have, ownership over a project that you're working on, then 00:18:25.881 --> 00:18:29.151 you want to be able to drive it in the way that you want, so that you 00:18:29.151 --> 00:18:30.281 actually want to be successful. 00:18:31.221 --> 00:18:35.001 The three of us are trying to do is to get everybody to do inquiry, because 00:18:35.041 --> 00:18:39.851 we've seen what a fantastic strategy it is to get kids to love learning. 00:18:40.701 --> 00:18:45.951 But when we talk about student voice and choice and giving them 00:18:46.811 --> 00:18:49.941 ownership of their learning, which I think is so important because it's 00:18:49.961 --> 00:18:53.801 only when you know that your results are because of what you've put in. 00:18:55.091 --> 00:19:00.111 What would we say to non IB or non inquiry educators when they're saying, 00:19:00.111 --> 00:19:02.231 well, we've got to drive the curriculum? 00:19:02.826 --> 00:19:04.646 And this is what kids need to know. 00:19:05.076 --> 00:19:07.336 Where does student voice going to come in then? 00:19:07.786 --> 00:19:13.826 And so how do we say to these teachers that, hang on a minute, if you try this 00:19:13.826 --> 00:19:18.756 way, you might actually find you're going to be doing less work, perhaps. 00:19:20.566 --> 00:19:23.816 So yeah, I wouldn't say it's necessarily less work. 00:19:23.816 --> 00:19:28.006 I find that it's actually the pre work is where you're having to do, 00:19:28.506 --> 00:19:32.596 like, in our IB school is, even though we might be teaching a unit 00:19:32.596 --> 00:19:35.446 of inquiry, that kind of thing, say, how the world works, we're still 00:19:35.446 --> 00:19:40.016 trying to teach all of the Australian curriculum descriptors for that year. 00:19:40.426 --> 00:19:43.596 Um, so which makes it quite tricky if you are trying to make links. 00:19:44.126 --> 00:19:46.596 But if you're able to make authentic links to begin with. 00:19:47.541 --> 00:19:53.941 Then you can use the curriculum and rather than having that as an answer 00:19:53.941 --> 00:19:55.451 is use that to ask your questions. 00:19:57.121 --> 00:19:58.051 Does that make sense? 00:19:58.531 --> 00:19:59.821 It's not free for all. 00:19:59.861 --> 00:20:04.331 It's very specifically the prompt or the hook. 00:20:04.631 --> 00:20:06.351 I'm trying to think of the word Allanah you might 00:20:06.351 --> 00:20:07.171 remember what it is. 00:20:07.251 --> 00:20:08.261 Provocation. 00:20:08.271 --> 00:20:08.751 There we go. 00:20:10.131 --> 00:20:15.331 Provocation is so important to then drive the rest of your inquiry. 00:20:15.621 --> 00:20:18.701 Because it's all that pre work, as you say, the pre planning, the 00:20:18.701 --> 00:20:21.681 figuring out the provocations, the figuring out the questions. 00:20:22.591 --> 00:20:26.121 But then once you're into that learning, the kids do the work. 00:20:27.591 --> 00:20:29.121 Alana, do you have something to add there? 00:20:29.761 --> 00:20:33.401 Well, yes, because, I've taught in both different types of schools. 00:20:33.461 --> 00:20:38.541 Um, and this is where, , Sqwish was born for us because, and this 00:20:38.541 --> 00:20:41.691 is why I coaxed Meg to come on because she's such a gun at inquiry. 00:20:41.951 --> 00:20:48.191 But, , in our non PYP schools, I think to become an inquiry teacher, I had to 00:20:48.191 --> 00:20:53.461 go, I sort of had this natural, , way of teaching in an inquiry method, but 00:20:54.301 --> 00:20:59.251 when I started teaching at this IB PYP school, I had training, you know, we 00:20:59.251 --> 00:21:05.301 had days out of the classroom to learn the IBPYP, how it works as a structure, 00:21:05.351 --> 00:21:07.651 how we do embed the curriculum in it. 00:21:07.891 --> 00:21:09.091 And it's very complex. 00:21:09.241 --> 00:21:12.951 You can't just do a quick PD online and you're done. 00:21:12.951 --> 00:21:14.871 No, it's, it's ongoing and it changes every year. 00:21:14.871 --> 00:21:16.711 And for me, , I thought. 00:21:17.276 --> 00:21:21.956 We can make inquiry so much simpler so that our everyday teachers, because 00:21:21.956 --> 00:21:26.126 then this is another thing that sort of drove me to want to do this, is 00:21:26.426 --> 00:21:31.706 my own children will not be going to an I-B-P-Y-P school, and I want them 00:21:31.711 --> 00:21:36.566 to have just as good a learning as those kids who are in that school. 00:21:36.866 --> 00:21:42.756 So my endeavor is to make inquiry so much more accessible and easy for teachers 00:21:42.756 --> 00:21:44.856 who haven't had bucket loads of training. 00:21:45.426 --> 00:21:48.416 And this is where the idea for Sqwish came from. 00:21:48.416 --> 00:21:52.441 And it's just to try and make it easier. 00:21:52.471 --> 00:21:58.651 So yes, if you're going to teach a singular lesson on, I don't even 00:21:58.651 --> 00:22:04.101 know anything, a singular standalone lesson, you can still make an inquiry. 00:22:04.111 --> 00:22:06.901 It doesn't necessarily have to be embedded across everything. 00:22:07.121 --> 00:22:08.161 That would be lovely. 00:22:08.171 --> 00:22:10.601 And it's great that there are schools that do that and it's 00:22:10.621 --> 00:22:11.581 brilliant to work with them. 00:22:11.581 --> 00:22:16.341 But the reality is, is that most schools in Australia are not IBPYP 00:22:16.341 --> 00:22:20.541 schools and so I want to find this middle ground where we can help. 00:22:21.556 --> 00:22:26.516 Teachers find an easy way to make learning so wonderful within their 00:22:26.516 --> 00:22:28.866 class because it's just going to stick better for our kids. 00:22:29.896 --> 00:22:37.336 I guess then if you're thinking about that, helping non PYP schools integrate 00:22:37.476 --> 00:22:42.976 inquiry into the existing lessons, it's, would it, would you agree that it would 00:22:42.976 --> 00:22:46.006 just be a change, shift in perspective? 00:22:46.256 --> 00:22:47.096 Absolutely. 00:22:47.401 --> 00:22:52.001 And then just questioning, getting the question right, because that's what it's 00:22:52.001 --> 00:22:57.201 about, the questioning, and then not jumping in with the answer, but allowing 00:22:57.201 --> 00:23:01.651 the kids to go through the struggle, which is not really a struggle, but to 00:23:01.651 --> 00:23:08.171 get the kids to go through that whole problem solving hands on and finding the 00:23:08.331 --> 00:23:10.581 answer for themselves before you jump in. 00:23:10.751 --> 00:23:13.211 It's just flipping the structure of your lessons, which is what I keep 00:23:13.401 --> 00:23:16.551 going on about, because I think that's one thing that teachers, can control 00:23:16.601 --> 00:23:19.606 is how they teach a singular lesson. 00:23:19.996 --> 00:23:20.276 Sure. 00:23:20.276 --> 00:23:21.896 They might not be able to embed it. 00:23:22.236 --> 00:23:25.646 So like we've been talking about, I think that like how Meg was saying, you 00:23:25.646 --> 00:23:32.097 know, if you're doing a whole beautiful disciplinary theme unit, that's amazing, 00:23:32.107 --> 00:23:36.317 but it's just not the reality for most of our schools and most of our teachers. 00:23:36.317 --> 00:23:40.897 But one thing we can suggest that is easy is just following a structure that 00:23:40.897 --> 00:23:45.317 flips your lesson where you firstly start with igniting that student curiosity. 00:23:45.897 --> 00:23:50.607 And then you let them explore whether that's through manipulatives, 00:23:50.627 --> 00:23:53.957 through reading, through talking, through brainstorming, whatever it 00:23:53.957 --> 00:23:55.857 is, let them explore that concept. 00:23:55.857 --> 00:24:00.747 Let them have that opportunity to voice their thoughts, make prior connections, 00:24:00.747 --> 00:24:04.737 have a go, fail, um, or not fail. 00:24:04.787 --> 00:24:07.967 They might already know it might, you know, it might strike them, but 00:24:07.967 --> 00:24:13.757 you're holding back until they're literally like, tell us the answers or. 00:24:14.032 --> 00:24:17.132 You know, they've found them out themselves and then they can practice. 00:24:17.202 --> 00:24:21.852 That's when the practice comes in and then, , round it off at the 00:24:21.852 --> 00:24:24.252 very end with that reflection. 00:24:24.532 --> 00:24:29.052 And, you know, and if they need to a little bit more extension, a little 00:24:29.052 --> 00:24:31.852 bit more delve a little bit deeper. 00:24:32.172 --> 00:24:36.292 Um, and it's just, if we could just get teachers to follow that structure, 00:24:36.922 --> 00:24:39.892 I just think inquiry could be easier, 00:24:40.502 --> 00:24:45.742 and you don't have to do bucket loads of PD and, , know, all the 00:24:45.822 --> 00:24:48.492 jargon that comes with PYP IB. 00:24:48.542 --> 00:24:51.302 I mean, people listening to this might be like, what are they on 00:24:51.302 --> 00:24:53.062 about with all this IB, PYP stuff? 00:24:53.082 --> 00:24:54.892 Because it's so niche. 00:24:55.102 --> 00:24:55.612 It is. 00:24:55.782 --> 00:24:59.942 Maybe we should just tell everybody that IB stands for international baccalaureate 00:25:00.542 --> 00:25:04.912 and PYP and PYP is the prime. 00:25:04.982 --> 00:25:05.312 What is it? 00:25:05.312 --> 00:25:06.112 The primary years. 00:25:06.112 --> 00:25:07.412 Primary years program 00:25:07.632 --> 00:25:11.812 All those acronyms and all that jargon that Meg and I are across it. 00:25:11.822 --> 00:25:16.142 But It turns people away from it because it's like, I don't know what that's about. 00:25:16.512 --> 00:25:18.642 I know what I know. 00:25:18.922 --> 00:25:22.822 And teaching is one of those, you know, jobs where you can't get ahead 00:25:22.822 --> 00:25:26.162 of the curb, and your to do list is as long as it's ever going to be. 00:25:26.162 --> 00:25:27.552 And it's never going to get shorter. 00:25:27.902 --> 00:25:32.142 So how are they going to have that time to look into it, to research it, to 00:25:32.142 --> 00:25:34.982 find out those acronyms, to figure it all out, unless they have, you know, 00:25:34.982 --> 00:25:39.282 support from their admin team and from their school is just not going to happen. 00:25:39.772 --> 00:25:40.022 So. 00:25:40.737 --> 00:25:44.997 That's our dream with Sqwish , is to use, you know, the 5e structure 00:25:45.137 --> 00:25:46.837 to help, empower teachers 00:25:48.832 --> 00:25:50.132 in inquiry learning. 00:25:50.992 --> 00:25:54.582 So you've just read my mind because that was going to be my very next question. 00:25:54.972 --> 00:25:55.752 Two things. 00:25:55.772 --> 00:26:00.642 First, you've got to tell people about Sqwish and because 00:26:00.642 --> 00:26:01.962 you've mentioned it a few times. 00:26:02.352 --> 00:26:06.432 And secondly, inquiry is often driven by this inquiry cycle. 00:26:06.432 --> 00:26:11.252 And if people know Kath Murdoch, she has her inquiry cycle, but there's 00:26:11.252 --> 00:26:16.692 also a different model of inquiry, which is the five E model of inquiry. 00:26:17.052 --> 00:26:19.322 Now with all your resources, now I'm just. 00:26:19.752 --> 00:26:22.722 Assuming, or maybe I shouldn't, is that you guys were probably 00:26:22.722 --> 00:26:26.382 doing the five, were you doing the 5e model in your school? 00:26:26.382 --> 00:26:28.172 No, 00:26:29.052 --> 00:26:29.282 no, 00:26:29.512 --> 00:26:29.702 We weren't. 00:26:29.702 --> 00:26:34.542 Funnily enough, our school actually goes off the Kath Murdoch model. 00:26:34.602 --> 00:26:37.622 So we're tuning in, finding out, sorting out, making connections. 00:26:37.892 --> 00:26:39.412 I'm sure I've missed one in there somewhere. 00:26:39.852 --> 00:26:44.342 However, I find that, um, cycle is less achievable in a lesson. 00:26:44.592 --> 00:26:45.362 I find it. 00:26:45.382 --> 00:26:50.092 It's a very, it's great for a whole unit of work and that kind of thing. 00:26:50.542 --> 00:26:55.242 However, if you're trying to go through that many stages in a cycle in one lesson, 00:26:55.322 --> 00:26:57.542 it can feel rushed and that kind of thing. 00:26:58.052 --> 00:27:03.472 So that's why for us, we've been using to at least for our 00:27:03.482 --> 00:27:04.992 products and calling products. 00:27:05.502 --> 00:27:05.772 Yeah. 00:27:06.062 --> 00:27:06.542 Our lessons. 00:27:06.632 --> 00:27:06.912 Yeah. 00:27:06.982 --> 00:27:10.812 For digital products we've, been using the 5Es model. 00:27:11.442 --> 00:27:16.132 So that's what Allanah said before, where you engage, you explore, you explain, you 00:27:16.132 --> 00:27:19.892 elaborate, you evaluate, and then we've got extension in there as well, obviously, 00:27:19.892 --> 00:27:21.692 that's added on a little 6th E. 00:27:22.162 --> 00:27:27.672 But I was thinking back to, I know when Allanah tested, or, asked teachers 00:27:27.672 --> 00:27:32.847 to trial the original lessons, some of the feedback that she got was, 00:27:33.207 --> 00:27:37.167 Oh, you know, but , they need to know how to do that before you teach a 00:27:37.167 --> 00:27:38.667 lesson on that, before they do it. 00:27:38.667 --> 00:27:42.067 Yes, but not really. 00:27:42.087 --> 00:27:45.987 That's where, like, you've got your engage in your explore phases 00:27:46.597 --> 00:27:50.427 for them to be actually curious about what they want to learn. 00:27:50.477 --> 00:27:53.117 And then you do actually tell them in the explain phase. 00:27:53.167 --> 00:27:54.927 That's what the explain is there for. 00:27:55.257 --> 00:27:58.732 You're not, letting them go off on a complete tangent if they're 00:27:58.732 --> 00:28:01.632 trying to, you know, learn about time or something like that. 00:28:01.992 --> 00:28:03.482 You are actually explaining it. 00:28:03.522 --> 00:28:05.582 It's just not the first thing you do. 00:28:06.337 --> 00:28:07.397 Two things there. 00:28:07.467 --> 00:28:12.557 I remember on that course that I went on with Kath Murdoch just a few months ago. 00:28:13.397 --> 00:28:16.917 She actually also said that inquiry, of course, when you go through that 00:28:16.917 --> 00:28:21.587 cycle, it can be in a lesson, but that inquiry could go on for a term. 00:28:21.617 --> 00:28:22.987 It could go on for several terms. 00:28:22.997 --> 00:28:24.167 It could go on for a whole year. 00:28:24.537 --> 00:28:26.047 I think that 00:28:26.047 --> 00:28:27.827 Freaks other teachers out, you know? 00:28:28.077 --> 00:28:32.127 I think if we start saying that, that then this whole open ended, 00:28:32.127 --> 00:28:34.087 beautiful ordeal, like, when do I stop? 00:28:34.107 --> 00:28:36.987 And it, you know, we are very confined by the curriculum. 00:28:37.017 --> 00:28:41.127 And I think that in an ideal world, yes, it would go on 00:28:41.397 --> 00:28:45.017 like Meg's beautiful lesson on percentages and equivalent fractions, et cetera. 00:28:45.237 --> 00:28:50.602 I'm sure she could have done more on that, but we are so You know, confined 00:28:50.642 --> 00:28:55.082 by time, especially in upper primary because of how intense our curriculum 00:28:55.082 --> 00:28:59.832 is that I think that that idea when we start talking about how it can go on 00:28:59.832 --> 00:29:04.132 forever and it can in the Kath Murdoch cycle is really great like Meg said in a 00:29:04.132 --> 00:29:10.952 unit , but I think that that can be a bit of a deterrent to non inquiry teachers. 00:29:11.592 --> 00:29:14.592 Like how, how long do I give my students then, you know, and 00:29:14.592 --> 00:29:16.382 then it becomes a bit stressful. 00:29:16.682 --> 00:29:22.932 So we stuck to our five E's model because it, sort of wraps things up nicely. 00:29:23.172 --> 00:29:27.052 And then the idea with our extension task is never like an add on task. 00:29:27.302 --> 00:29:31.452 It's usually delving deeper if you have the time and if you want 00:29:31.462 --> 00:29:36.992 to, or if your students really are asking for more, our extension task 00:29:36.992 --> 00:29:39.257 always links back into the lesson. 00:29:39.257 --> 00:29:43.437 Yeah, it's building on authentically what you've actually learned in that lesson. 00:29:43.707 --> 00:29:47.337 I don't know if you know that there's science resources called Primary 00:29:47.337 --> 00:29:50.917 Connections, and they use the 5e, model. 00:29:50.957 --> 00:29:54.317 And I think that's probably where I first came across the 5e model. 00:29:54.797 --> 00:29:58.407 And because they applied throughout a unit of science. 00:29:58.467 --> 00:30:03.647 So whether it be, you know, growth and change or whatever it might be, that whole 00:30:03.687 --> 00:30:08.817 inquiry cycle goes across that unit, which for me, that would be across a term or 00:30:08.817 --> 00:30:10.897 even two terms with growth and change. 00:30:10.907 --> 00:30:14.687 And if you were thinking about following, let's say someone's sibling 00:30:14.697 --> 00:30:18.427 or with a little baby, you could actually go through that for the entire 00:30:18.437 --> 00:30:19.967 year that you were in that grade. 00:30:20.317 --> 00:30:26.897 So you can see how certain things naturally apply themselves to an extended 00:30:27.292 --> 00:30:31.682 inquiry cycle, whereas other things you could, cover that in a lesson, 00:30:31.702 --> 00:30:33.642 like your fractions, for example. 00:30:34.282 --> 00:30:34.682 Yes. 00:30:34.682 --> 00:30:39.982 And that's, that is where I also first saw it in Primary Connections, 00:30:39.982 --> 00:30:41.002 but you're, you are right 00:30:41.002 --> 00:30:46.077 it does go over a unit and, you know, Yeah, we love the Kath Murdoch cycle 00:30:46.097 --> 00:30:50.937 for, for a unit, but it does lend itself so beautifully to a singular lesson 00:30:50.947 --> 00:30:55.457 because it has that winning formula of, you know, hiking student curiosity. 00:30:55.467 --> 00:30:57.247 Why can't we do that for every lesson? 00:30:57.667 --> 00:31:01.147 Um, allows them to have a go and formulate their own questions. 00:31:01.647 --> 00:31:06.647 It then moves on to that explicit teaching, which I think that a lot 00:31:06.647 --> 00:31:09.367 of people don't think is inquiry. 00:31:09.717 --> 00:31:12.427 If you don't know about it, but it is because we do need 00:31:12.437 --> 00:31:13.417 to get the content across. 00:31:13.417 --> 00:31:16.637 And just like Meg said, it is the, when that is important, it 00:31:16.637 --> 00:31:18.877 should be step three, not step one. 00:31:19.357 --> 00:31:22.617 And then, you know, move on to the reflections and elaborations and the 00:31:22.617 --> 00:31:24.297 practicing of that understanding. 00:31:24.627 --> 00:31:29.117 That's pretty much what that cycle is and a good lesson should also. 00:31:29.782 --> 00:31:30.662 reflect that. 00:31:30.692 --> 00:31:32.522 So, and it makes it easy. 00:31:32.752 --> 00:31:33.422 Five steps. 00:31:33.672 --> 00:31:34.252 Beautiful. 00:31:34.292 --> 00:31:39.472 So for us, it's taking that inquiry, making it fun, making 00:31:39.472 --> 00:31:41.342 it easy, making it meaningful. 00:31:41.382 --> 00:31:42.712 And that's our motto. 00:31:42.912 --> 00:31:48.982 That's what drives us to help other teachers, you know, achieve that goal. 00:31:48.982 --> 00:31:53.857 It also lets students ask questions earlier on , in the lesson cycle, 00:31:54.197 --> 00:31:57.317 because if they're holding on to these lessons until I do have any questions 00:31:57.317 --> 00:31:59.337 right at the end before you're going to go out to lunch, nobody's going 00:31:59.337 --> 00:32:00.557 to want to , ask questions then. 00:32:00.997 --> 00:32:01.887 They want to go to lunch. 00:32:02.117 --> 00:32:05.567 Whereas if you're asking questions and actually, you know, engaging them that 00:32:05.567 --> 00:32:09.547 way earlier in the lesson, they're more likely to have that ownership over it 00:32:09.547 --> 00:32:10.647 like they were talking about before. 00:32:12.107 --> 00:32:16.697 And in any case, between those two cycles, they dovetail, so, it's very 00:32:16.697 --> 00:32:20.847 similar, but I loved how, Allanah, you've also just brought up another thing, 00:32:21.307 --> 00:32:24.387 because so many people, and you see it in the media all the time, and there's 00:32:24.387 --> 00:32:28.127 this whole new thing that came out of the government recently, ah, explicit 00:32:28.127 --> 00:32:31.982 instruction, explicit instruction, I was going to bring this up earlier. 00:32:32.342 --> 00:32:35.957 Just think that if you're an inquiry person, we don't know how to do 00:32:35.977 --> 00:32:39.547 explicit instruction or it doesn't exist in an inquiry classroom. 00:32:39.547 --> 00:32:44.467 And what nonsense, explicit instruction, everybody, if you're worth your salt 00:32:44.482 --> 00:32:46.967 knows that that is how children learn. 00:32:46.967 --> 00:32:49.847 Especially when you're teaching new concepts and new skills. 00:32:49.937 --> 00:32:50.357 Oh my gosh. 00:32:50.357 --> 00:32:53.387 It's anything like if I wanted to learn how to sew, I can't just 00:32:53.387 --> 00:32:54.947 figure it out on a sewing machine. 00:32:54.947 --> 00:32:55.907 I need YouTube. 00:32:55.967 --> 00:32:57.527 I need someone to show me 00:32:58.047 --> 00:33:01.907 . Your early years as well like you're not just going to let them play with numbers. 00:33:01.927 --> 00:33:03.547 They need to know how the numbers work. 00:33:03.647 --> 00:33:07.717 They need to know how that the letters go together to make the words that have 00:33:07.717 --> 00:33:08.837 the sounds and all that kind of thing. 00:33:08.837 --> 00:33:11.807 There's definitely has to be a place for explicit instruction 00:33:11.807 --> 00:33:14.707 for them to, learn the rules, but 00:33:17.587 --> 00:33:23.097 the way that you can do that is very different in that sole 00:33:23.097 --> 00:33:26.867 explicit instruction model versus in an inquiry model. 00:33:27.857 --> 00:33:31.062 And , the other place, of course, is that you're going to be teaching your 00:33:31.062 --> 00:33:33.347 writing, like your report writing or your. 00:33:34.192 --> 00:33:34.982 narrative, whatever. 00:33:34.982 --> 00:33:36.582 You're teaching that explicitly. 00:33:36.832 --> 00:33:40.622 And then you're going to be using that, let's say, in upper primary, or 00:33:40.652 --> 00:33:45.082 even from year two, they're already writing reports, they are doing that. 00:33:45.212 --> 00:33:45.462 Yeah. 00:33:45.462 --> 00:33:45.702 Yeah. 00:33:45.702 --> 00:33:49.982 You're using those skills that you've taught them in an English lesson, 00:33:49.992 --> 00:33:54.492 for example, on your guided writing lesson, that skill, they're then 00:33:54.492 --> 00:33:59.462 applying to an inquiry project that they might be doing in science or 00:33:59.492 --> 00:34:01.642 in HASS or in whatever it might be. 00:34:02.252 --> 00:34:06.222 This used to be my favorite unit in grade one that I taught for many, 00:34:06.222 --> 00:34:10.692 many years is we would do sharing the planet and it was living things. 00:34:11.042 --> 00:34:14.142 So, you know, you're looking at, their habitat, their 00:34:14.142 --> 00:34:15.402 diet, all that kind of thing. 00:34:15.422 --> 00:34:19.892 And so you're, I honestly can't even remember the curriculum's changed anyway, 00:34:19.892 --> 00:34:25.347 so I can't remember the descriptor, but we would spend a whole term going through all 00:34:25.347 --> 00:34:28.067 of the characteristics of living things. 00:34:28.467 --> 00:34:31.737 And then we would also be writing information reports and like, you know, 00:34:31.907 --> 00:34:36.617 information report is it's very, very simple at grade one, but they're still 00:34:36.627 --> 00:34:40.867 having to find out information on a given animal and that kind of thing. 00:34:41.267 --> 00:34:43.167 It's not just standalone English. 00:34:44.337 --> 00:34:45.137 Do you know what I'm saying? 00:34:45.147 --> 00:34:45.317 Yeah. 00:34:45.317 --> 00:34:48.557 So that's where that integration comes in. 00:34:48.907 --> 00:34:49.177 Yes. 00:34:49.837 --> 00:34:53.517 Because now they're understanding that, okay, oh, so this 00:34:53.517 --> 00:34:54.537 is how you write a report. 00:34:54.547 --> 00:34:58.667 And then they understand that I actually use this knowledge that I've gained 00:34:59.027 --> 00:35:03.387 when I'm applying it to writing about this animal or whatever it is. 00:35:03.737 --> 00:35:06.387 So , that's where the integration comes in so beautifully. 00:35:07.207 --> 00:35:07.867 Yeah, exactly. 00:35:07.867 --> 00:35:11.257 Meg, you mentioned earlier with the 5e model that you've actually 00:35:11.357 --> 00:35:13.867 added on, what was it, extension? 00:35:14.057 --> 00:35:15.707 Extension, um, yeah. 00:35:17.067 --> 00:35:20.872 I'm assuming that would include, Reflection? 00:35:21.692 --> 00:35:24.212 No, not necessarily. 00:35:24.282 --> 00:35:27.892 Your reflection would be in your, evaluation step, in your last step. 00:35:28.712 --> 00:35:30.362 So before you would go on to it. 00:35:30.372 --> 00:35:30.722 To the extension. 00:35:32.182 --> 00:35:32.472 Yeah. 00:35:32.472 --> 00:35:34.052 So you would go for 00:35:34.052 --> 00:35:35.002 us optional. 00:35:35.092 --> 00:35:35.752 Like it's yeah. 00:35:36.262 --> 00:35:36.622 Yeah. 00:35:36.662 --> 00:35:41.552 And add on, um, because I have found, I'm sorry, Meg, I'm totally jumping in here. 00:35:43.122 --> 00:35:49.562 I have found in, non PYP schools that, oh, yuck, fast finishes are a thing. 00:35:49.742 --> 00:35:53.967 What can I do once my kids have got through X, Y, Z. Do 00:35:53.967 --> 00:35:55.587 some coloring, read a book. 00:35:55.587 --> 00:35:56.387 I need fast finishes. 00:35:56.417 --> 00:35:57.287 I need fast finishes. 00:35:57.337 --> 00:36:01.417 And it's just frustrates me because if your children are finishing fast, if 00:36:01.457 --> 00:36:06.427 the students are finishing fast, then has their learning been deep enough? 00:36:06.437 --> 00:36:09.167 You know, um, are they rushing through their work? 00:36:09.447 --> 00:36:11.947 Are those pathways truly formed? 00:36:11.987 --> 00:36:13.257 Are they all on the flip side? 00:36:13.257 --> 00:36:14.977 Are they taking care with their work? 00:36:15.007 --> 00:36:16.037 Like it's one of those two. 00:36:16.037 --> 00:36:19.667 It's either they're not taking any care with their work, or they're 00:36:19.667 --> 00:36:22.207 not giving it enough time to sink in. 00:36:22.497 --> 00:36:26.617 And so for us, extension was important to add in there, as we 00:36:26.617 --> 00:36:30.917 would like to help other teachers who are not in an inquiry school. 00:36:31.767 --> 00:36:36.287 We wanted to show and add in our lessons that extension can be 00:36:36.877 --> 00:36:41.647 something to do with the task they've done to deepen their knowledge. 00:36:41.767 --> 00:36:44.897 So I think I'm trying to think of an example of one of our 00:36:44.897 --> 00:36:46.287 lessons, Meg, do you have one? 00:36:46.287 --> 00:36:50.607 I was, I've got one that I'm in the middle of writing at the moment, which 00:36:50.607 --> 00:36:53.947 is that one speaking and listening. 00:36:54.047 --> 00:36:57.367 It's, um, about retelling stories , and manipulating 00:36:57.397 --> 00:36:58.381 stories and that kind of thing. 00:36:58.381 --> 00:36:59.367 And so I'm looking at it. 00:36:59.377 --> 00:37:02.497 It's, , about fairy tales, , the students for speaking and listening, 00:37:02.537 --> 00:37:07.937 they have to, um, retell a story as part of a speaking and listening, for 00:37:07.937 --> 00:37:09.027 report cards and that kind of thing. 00:37:09.377 --> 00:37:13.072 , So you've got all five of our steps in the five E's. 00:37:13.442 --> 00:37:18.932 Um, however, is for extension, we're looking at, , comparing and contrasting, 00:37:18.962 --> 00:37:23.512 um, how could you make a different adaptations of the same fairy tale? 00:37:23.932 --> 00:37:27.652 Or, , can you use technology to tell the story in a different way? 00:37:27.992 --> 00:37:29.672 Or can you act it out? 00:37:29.682 --> 00:37:32.622 Can you do, like, what can you do that's still to do with. 00:37:33.582 --> 00:37:34.522 What you've done. 00:37:35.412 --> 00:37:36.802 Um, right. 00:37:36.802 --> 00:37:37.732 In another way. 00:37:37.733 --> 00:37:38.832 Yeah, that's 00:37:38.832 --> 00:37:39.382 it. 00:37:39.382 --> 00:37:39.612 Yeah. 00:37:39.612 --> 00:37:40.472 And I think we did one. 00:37:40.482 --> 00:37:41.462 I'm trying to think of one too. 00:37:41.462 --> 00:37:47.892 We did an area for grade five where the students jump out a square and then they 00:37:47.892 --> 00:37:49.802 measure it and they calculate the area. 00:37:49.842 --> 00:37:51.322 And if they're like, I'm done. 00:37:51.382 --> 00:37:52.452 I figured it out. 00:37:52.772 --> 00:37:56.823 Well then let's think about what else could we measure that isn't 00:37:56.883 --> 00:37:58.603 a square right in front of us. 00:37:58.823 --> 00:38:01.683 What if we were to measure the area of our classroom? 00:38:01.913 --> 00:38:07.033 And it's just asking more questions to deepen the understanding 00:38:07.273 --> 00:38:08.503 that they've just gained. 00:38:09.068 --> 00:38:11.948 And it's also, can they apply the understanding that they've just gained? 00:38:12.598 --> 00:38:15.468 To a different, you know, context. 00:38:15.478 --> 00:38:15.838 Yeah. 00:38:15.878 --> 00:38:16.188 Yeah. 00:38:16.988 --> 00:38:19.578 So that was really important for us to include. 00:38:20.028 --> 00:38:24.098 Um, even though it's technically not in the five E's, it's just 00:38:24.108 --> 00:38:26.328 to try and kill fast finishers. 00:38:27.388 --> 00:38:31.808 Yeah, because I think, We've got a blog post forming on why fast finishes. 00:38:34.278 --> 00:38:36.908 That's also what you just mentioned there. 00:38:36.908 --> 00:38:39.138 As you said, you question, right? 00:38:39.208 --> 00:38:43.568 You ask more questions and that's very much an inquiry mindset and inquiry 00:38:43.568 --> 00:38:45.618 mindset is just, you ask more questions. 00:38:45.618 --> 00:38:46.818 Just ask more questions. 00:38:46.818 --> 00:38:49.498 And that's hard to do if you're not practiced in it. 00:38:49.598 --> 00:38:51.488 Like that's very hard to think on your feet. 00:38:52.528 --> 00:38:55.488 And it can be when you have kids staring at you like, Oh, I'm finished. 00:38:55.578 --> 00:38:56.368 I don't know what to do. 00:38:56.508 --> 00:38:56.788 And. 00:38:57.003 --> 00:39:00.833 And they also, like, I also have found students who, who are not 00:39:01.163 --> 00:39:05.363 from an inquiry classroom, they can then struggle to go deeper. 00:39:05.603 --> 00:39:06.483 Um, yeah. 00:39:07.993 --> 00:39:12.588 And it's hard to think on the spot, like you, you know, You've 00:39:12.588 --> 00:39:14.048 got so many things in your brain. 00:39:14.048 --> 00:39:15.398 You've got 10 minutes till lunch. 00:39:15.398 --> 00:39:16.578 You've got to get the marking done. 00:39:16.578 --> 00:39:18.608 You've got all this stuff going on. 00:39:18.968 --> 00:39:20.758 It's hard to think of those deeper questions. 00:39:20.758 --> 00:39:24.758 And so we are trying to do it in advance for teachers. 00:39:25.138 --> 00:39:29.573 Listen, I think that so many of us, Something that's always been with me 00:39:29.583 --> 00:39:34.383 since I was a kid, I think, but so many of us go through life and we don't really 00:39:34.383 --> 00:39:36.883 take time to reflect on our choices. 00:39:38.113 --> 00:39:41.363 And not just in our role as teachers, but just in life too. 00:39:41.443 --> 00:39:47.083 And what I love about inquiry is that it does make space for reflection. 00:39:47.193 --> 00:39:49.403 And even in the 5E model, it does that. 00:39:50.523 --> 00:39:57.373 Can you discuss the role of reflection and metacognition in inquiry based 00:39:57.373 --> 00:40:02.403 education, how you support students in developing those skills in your 5E model? 00:40:03.163 --> 00:40:04.403 Is this the thinking about thinking? 00:40:04.403 --> 00:40:05.233 That's a big question. 00:40:07.293 --> 00:40:11.403 I think I'm, the word metacognition is like setting off alarm bells for 00:40:11.413 --> 00:40:17.883 me because traditionally, because traditionally, in the PYP, they 00:40:17.883 --> 00:40:20.863 used to be your, um, your skills. 00:40:21.483 --> 00:40:24.623 And so there were all of these different skills and metacognition 00:40:24.683 --> 00:40:27.153 was one of the skills in the PYP. 00:40:27.393 --> 00:40:29.653 And you would sit there and go, what on earth does that mean? 00:40:30.063 --> 00:40:30.363 Yeah. 00:40:30.373 --> 00:40:33.313 Like you go, you know, we're doing metacognition in this unit. 00:40:33.363 --> 00:40:34.243 Okay, sure. 00:40:34.293 --> 00:40:35.583 Like, whatever. 00:40:35.933 --> 00:40:36.873 Google's it, real quick. 00:40:38.863 --> 00:40:40.093 Siri, hey, Siri. 00:40:41.213 --> 00:40:41.993 Yes, exactly. 00:40:42.243 --> 00:40:45.673 Um, they've actually changed that now to, they no longer call it 00:40:45.673 --> 00:40:48.553 skills, they're your approach, the way that you approach your learning. 00:40:48.703 --> 00:40:53.883 , if I think more on reflection, reflection was always, um, again, 00:40:53.883 --> 00:40:57.673 I'm talking about the PYP was its own standalone key concept. 00:40:58.223 --> 00:41:01.983 However, when they updated the PYP about five years ago, they realized 00:41:01.983 --> 00:41:06.203 that actually we don't want to have reflection as its standalone concept. 00:41:06.233 --> 00:41:08.953 We want reflection to be embedded. 00:41:09.418 --> 00:41:10.058 Yes, exactly. 00:41:10.058 --> 00:41:12.178 Embedded within the inquiry. 00:41:12.558 --> 00:41:16.098 So it was interesting that the IB, like the international baccalaureate, 00:41:16.138 --> 00:41:19.518 they reflected on their own practice and went, no, we actually need 00:41:20.138 --> 00:41:23.848 students and teachers and everything to be doing that authentically all 00:41:23.848 --> 00:41:25.798 the time, all of their lessons. 00:41:26.248 --> 00:41:31.178 Um, Because it can be really hard to reflect, reflect authentically 00:41:31.518 --> 00:41:36.738 on your lesson as a teacher, but also to get kids to reflect on their 00:41:36.738 --> 00:41:39.648 learning authentically rather than just, Oh yeah, I did a good job. 00:41:40.318 --> 00:41:42.558 So why, how did you do that? 00:41:42.758 --> 00:41:45.128 What were you thinking around why you did that? 00:41:45.198 --> 00:41:47.228 How did you come about writing it this way? 00:41:47.758 --> 00:41:54.193 So I think that's that part where You get kids to take responsibility for 00:41:54.193 --> 00:41:58.693 their own learning is when they can start thinking about why they do things 00:41:58.693 --> 00:42:02.253 in a certain way, why they approach their learning in a certain way. 00:42:02.703 --> 00:42:05.153 And I think for teachers, , you're so busy, right? 00:42:05.193 --> 00:42:07.603 And at the end of the day, you're like, Oh, kids have left. 00:42:07.603 --> 00:42:11.473 No, now you've got your marking and 4 million emails and 00:42:11.493 --> 00:42:12.813 admin and all the rest of it. 00:42:13.423 --> 00:42:17.163 And sometimes it doesn't leave space for us to actually reflect on 00:42:17.253 --> 00:42:19.493 how, how did I actually do today? 00:42:19.828 --> 00:42:21.188 How did the kids do today? 00:42:21.198 --> 00:42:22.918 Was I effective in what I did? 00:42:23.018 --> 00:42:24.428 Did they actually learn anything? 00:42:24.438 --> 00:42:26.898 Did they enjoy what they learned today? 00:42:27.178 --> 00:42:28.408 Did I learn anything? 00:42:29.098 --> 00:42:35.858 So I think that we need somehow to find the space as educators and 00:42:35.858 --> 00:42:38.878 as students, for that reflection. 00:42:40.108 --> 00:42:43.268 Because otherwise, like I always say to kids, you guys, you can't go through like 00:42:43.278 --> 00:42:45.888 those little, what, and I always have to ask them, because I never remember, 00:42:45.888 --> 00:42:50.328 because of my menopause brain, what you call those guys in star wars, a 00:42:50.338 --> 00:42:52.868 little, you know, they're like robot y things that just keep marching. 00:42:53.138 --> 00:42:53.148 Droids? 00:42:53.158 --> 00:42:53.878 The droids. 00:42:53.878 --> 00:42:57.358 You can't go through life just being a droid, you know, you 00:42:57.358 --> 00:43:01.928 have to actually say, hang on a minute, how do I feel about this? 00:43:01.928 --> 00:43:03.178 Or what about this? 00:43:03.178 --> 00:43:05.848 And how do I, or what am I struggling with? 00:43:06.023 --> 00:43:07.553 Or what do I find easy? 00:43:08.543 --> 00:43:13.053 So I was interested in how you applied that through that 5e 00:43:13.073 --> 00:43:16.503 model, because it does make space for that, which is pretty cool. 00:43:17.423 --> 00:43:21.688 I'm thinking as well, A very obvious plug for our business, we actually 00:43:21.688 --> 00:43:27.378 have um, a download that's for free is a bunch of exit tickets that allow 00:43:27.858 --> 00:43:31.768 teachers and students to reflect on their learning for that lesson. 00:43:31.818 --> 00:43:35.718 Um, whether it's to collect it as a formative assessment, it's up to you, 00:43:35.728 --> 00:43:41.838 but by having that opportunity to reflect and for want of a better word, making 00:43:41.838 --> 00:43:45.668 them reflect, um, is really powerful. 00:43:45.718 --> 00:43:47.618 It's a learned skill and I think 00:43:47.878 --> 00:43:48.358 it's kind of the 00:43:48.388 --> 00:43:49.538 reason to have it. 00:43:49.898 --> 00:43:53.458 And we didn't call it reflection in our, in our five E's. 00:43:53.488 --> 00:43:57.688 It actually comes under evaluate and it's meant to be at the end of the lesson. 00:43:57.708 --> 00:44:02.388 And you should really, take 10 minutes at the end of your lesson, and if you 00:44:02.388 --> 00:44:05.368 don't have that 10 minutes at the end of your lesson, because the kids are so 00:44:05.368 --> 00:44:08.868 into what they're doing, then you come back to it beginning of the next lesson, 00:44:09.108 --> 00:44:10.958 you have to make time for it somewhere. 00:44:11.208 --> 00:44:14.818 And it's something that we, you know, we're trying, I think it's one of the 00:44:14.828 --> 00:44:20.673 hardest things about teaching because, um, It is one of those things sort 00:44:20.673 --> 00:44:22.313 of like formulating the questions. 00:44:22.333 --> 00:44:25.153 It's hard to know what kind of reflection do you want from your 00:44:25.153 --> 00:44:26.263 children, from your students? 00:44:26.873 --> 00:44:29.653 And that's another reason we put these exit tickets together 00:44:29.653 --> 00:44:33.113 because some of them are about making connections to their world. 00:44:33.113 --> 00:44:39.113 So like one of our exit tickets says, um, how would you apply what you have learned 00:44:39.113 --> 00:44:41.843 today to the world that you live in? 00:44:41.933 --> 00:44:47.198 Where might we see, you know, , Meg's example of the math's percentages and 00:44:47.208 --> 00:44:50.328 equivalent fractions, where might we see these numbers in the real world? 00:44:50.528 --> 00:44:53.698 They have to write down a quick sentence and they can go out to lunch. 00:44:53.708 --> 00:44:54.378 You know what I mean? 00:44:54.378 --> 00:44:55.898 It's that quick reflection. 00:44:55.898 --> 00:44:59.748 And with our exit tickets, it might not be, that might not be applicable. 00:44:59.748 --> 00:45:03.408 It might be more a reflection on how well do I think I did this lesson? 00:45:03.438 --> 00:45:05.698 Did I communicate effectively with my peers? 00:45:05.728 --> 00:45:10.138 It might be an intrinsic sort of assessment on their skills of 00:45:10.138 --> 00:45:11.658 that, you know, during that time. 00:45:12.138 --> 00:45:16.248 And we do, I think it should be embedded into every lesson. 00:45:16.508 --> 00:45:19.318 That's the reason why we've offered these, um, you know, those exit 00:45:19.318 --> 00:45:22.978 tickets up for free, because I think it's such an important thing for 00:45:23.438 --> 00:45:24.738 teachers and students to have. 00:45:25.548 --> 00:45:31.067 I feel like it also allows them to cement their understanding and their learning 00:45:31.147 --> 00:45:34.187 into their brains rather than just going, Oh, look, we just finished maths off. 00:45:34.187 --> 00:45:36.777 I go to lunch, ask them when they come back, Oh, what did you learn about? 00:45:36.947 --> 00:45:37.237 I don't know. 00:45:38.982 --> 00:45:43.922 So actually making them reflect helps them to make the connections 00:45:43.942 --> 00:45:48.032 within their minds as well, and to hopefully commit some of it to memory. 00:45:49.437 --> 00:45:54.167 And I'm just thinking as you said that you can just imagine you're getting to an end 00:45:54.457 --> 00:45:58.847 of a lesson and now the bells about to go and now you want to ask kids to reflect. 00:45:58.917 --> 00:45:59.897 It ain't going to happen. 00:45:59.897 --> 00:46:00.357 Right? 00:46:00.358 --> 00:46:03.077 Absolutely. 00:46:03.077 --> 00:46:03.687 Timing is everything. 00:46:03.737 --> 00:46:04.017 Yeah. 00:46:04.257 --> 00:46:11.522 And so that's why actually flexibility is everything because that's when you have to 00:46:11.522 --> 00:46:14.582 think, well, you know, next after lunch, I was going to do this and this and this, 00:46:14.582 --> 00:46:16.442 but actually we didn't quite finish there. 00:46:16.442 --> 00:46:19.232 And maybe you just have to can what you were going to do after lunch. 00:46:19.402 --> 00:46:19.802 That's right. 00:46:19.812 --> 00:46:23.872 That you actually can finish up and actually end that lesson. 00:46:24.142 --> 00:46:24.742 Properly. 00:46:24.962 --> 00:46:29.262 Properly and get that reflection in and tomorrow's another day. 00:46:30.712 --> 00:46:35.592 You know, and I think sometimes we're so bound by the curriculum and our 00:46:35.593 --> 00:46:41.502 timetables that we forget about that flexibility, which is so essential when 00:46:41.502 --> 00:46:46.072 we're teaching young children because their thinking and their time spans are 00:46:46.072 --> 00:46:48.412 not like our thinking and our time spans. 00:46:48.832 --> 00:46:52.402 And as we all know, everything takes longer. 00:46:53.152 --> 00:46:54.502 When you're working with kids, right? 00:46:54.512 --> 00:46:55.972 It's never what you think. 00:46:56.052 --> 00:46:58.222 It's never going to be 30 minutes or 50 minutes. 00:46:58.232 --> 00:46:59.732 It's always going to be two days. 00:46:59.733 --> 00:47:02.362 So you may as well just plan for that. 00:47:03.032 --> 00:47:03.822 Yeah, it's true. 00:47:03.902 --> 00:47:06.462 When , I started teaching grade three and it was like, okay, great. 00:47:07.322 --> 00:47:09.312 End of grade three, you basically got grade fours. 00:47:09.652 --> 00:47:12.462 And then I moved from grade three to grade one. 00:47:12.682 --> 00:47:15.112 And so the beginning of the following year, you don't really have grade ones, 00:47:15.162 --> 00:47:18.702 you have preps or, you know, reception, foundation, whatever you want to call it. 00:47:19.262 --> 00:47:25.022 And I could not even tell you what the lesson was that I taught on my first 00:47:25.022 --> 00:47:30.863 day of grade one, because it took like three sessions to finish off like an 00:47:30.863 --> 00:47:37.503 about me activity, like just the time it takes little people to do stuff, but 00:47:37.503 --> 00:47:41.513 also I'm reflecting that sometimes you think something is going to take them, 00:47:41.553 --> 00:47:46.513 20 minutes to do even at a grade five or six level, but then they surprise you and 00:47:46.513 --> 00:47:48.053 it takes them, as you said, three days. 00:47:48.758 --> 00:47:52.218 Or something that you expected to be, you know, really challenging for them 00:47:52.218 --> 00:47:55.038 to understand and then they surprise you and it takes only takes them 20 minutes. 00:47:55.708 --> 00:47:58.778 The flexibility that you need is astounding. 00:47:58.828 --> 00:48:01.528 Like is that I've seen a meme go around where it's teachers make 00:48:01.558 --> 00:48:04.518 more split second decisions in a day than what a brain surgeon does. 00:48:06.988 --> 00:48:08.278 It's something ridiculous like that. 00:48:08.488 --> 00:48:09.808 That's why you're tired all the time. 00:48:09.808 --> 00:48:14.318 And then you still have to juggle everything else, right? 00:48:14.388 --> 00:48:16.778 Like little babies and all the rest of it. 00:48:17.358 --> 00:48:20.888 Listen, ladies, can you share a success story or an anecdote that 00:48:20.888 --> 00:48:26.698 demonstrates the impact of inquiry based learning on student achievement? 00:48:29.418 --> 00:48:35.298 I think about some stories that could show just how amazing inquiry is and 00:48:35.438 --> 00:48:37.628 how kids have done so well with it. 00:48:38.278 --> 00:48:43.468 I would say it's the fact that something that you might have taught in, in term 00:48:43.468 --> 00:48:48.428 one, When one of the kids comes back and say, turn three or four and goes, 00:48:48.488 --> 00:48:53.168 Hey, remember when we did this, So when I used to teach grade one, one 00:48:53.168 --> 00:48:57.688 of the first units that we did was how we organize ourselves and my lovely 00:48:57.688 --> 00:49:01.288 teaching partner at the time, she doesn't work at that school anymore. 00:49:01.288 --> 00:49:05.633 She's gone off to do fantastic things as a curriculum leader. 00:49:06.123 --> 00:49:11.003 Um, we decided to expose the students to what it would be like 00:49:11.073 --> 00:49:12.893 if our classroom wasn't organized. 00:49:13.303 --> 00:49:14.973 So we trashed our classrooms. 00:49:15.853 --> 00:49:17.053 They had no idea. 00:49:17.183 --> 00:49:20.183 So these little grade ones, it was like their second day of grade one. 00:49:20.773 --> 00:49:27.128 And they walked in to tables turned over And, um, you know, 00:49:27.158 --> 00:49:29.918 all the books were all over the floor, the blocks were everywhere. 00:49:29.948 --> 00:49:34.498 And it was just total mayhem when they walked in at the end of second break. 00:49:35.348 --> 00:49:41.348 And for them to experience that, this was the provocation for them to experience 00:49:41.508 --> 00:49:45.708 total chaos and disorganization for them to then make the connections 00:49:45.708 --> 00:49:50.828 to go, Oh, well, this is why we need organization was fantastic. 00:49:50.838 --> 00:49:53.648 So not just wasn't watching a video or that kind of thing. 00:49:53.648 --> 00:49:58.156 It made them feel disorganized and feel stressed and that kind of thing. 00:49:58.156 --> 00:50:01.163 And then that's how we could go, well, this is why we need to be organized. 00:50:01.613 --> 00:50:05.873 But then on the flip side, seeing those boys, you know, like later in the year, 00:50:05.873 --> 00:50:09.843 they go, Hey, Miss Anderson, remember when you and Mrs. Guy trashed our classroom 00:50:10.453 --> 00:50:13.243 and go, yeah, mate, like, and like, that's what it looks like now, right? 00:50:13.393 --> 00:50:14.293 Like, yes, it does. 00:50:15.173 --> 00:50:16.793 That's why we need to reorganize. 00:50:19.313 --> 00:50:19.623 Yes. 00:50:20.163 --> 00:50:24.383 And those little boys would be in what grade, grade seven or eight now. 00:50:25.413 --> 00:50:26.453 They probably still remember 00:50:26.453 --> 00:50:27.189 it. 00:50:27.189 --> 00:50:28.661 Yeah, exactly. 00:50:28.661 --> 00:50:29.397 And 00:50:29.397 --> 00:50:32.403 aren't those the experiences that kids remember? 00:50:32.693 --> 00:50:34.323 They don't remember sitting at the desk. 00:50:34.333 --> 00:50:37.983 I mean, if you think back, , to your own school years, you don't remember 00:50:38.433 --> 00:50:42.163 anything about sitting at a desk and filling in a sheet of paper. 00:50:43.383 --> 00:50:44.863 You don't remember those things. 00:50:44.903 --> 00:50:46.823 You remember the hands on stuff. 00:50:47.643 --> 00:50:48.093 That's true. 00:50:48.103 --> 00:50:50.223 The things that you were doing, you remember. 00:50:51.043 --> 00:50:53.733 You know, like I remember in high school dissecting a rat, that was the 00:50:53.813 --> 00:50:55.613 most fun I've ever had in my life. 00:50:56.373 --> 00:50:59.493 I'm looking for the skolex, the head of the tapeworm. 00:50:59.493 --> 00:51:00.693 It was awesome. 00:51:01.153 --> 00:51:01.383 Yeah. 00:51:02.113 --> 00:51:04.633 I think I was sitting outside at that point. 00:51:05.033 --> 00:51:05.503 Yeah, me too. 00:51:06.123 --> 00:51:07.263 I'm not a biology person. 00:51:09.123 --> 00:51:10.493 Love science, not biology. 00:51:11.513 --> 00:51:13.393 So, those are the things I remember. 00:51:13.493 --> 00:51:15.073 Those hands on things. 00:51:15.083 --> 00:51:15.103 Yeah. 00:51:15.213 --> 00:51:19.783 It's The experiences that stick with the students rather than like half 00:51:19.783 --> 00:51:24.303 the time, rather than the actual, you know, rote learning they 00:51:24.303 --> 00:51:26.983 remember the experience rather than what it was actually linked to. 00:51:27.123 --> 00:51:30.573 Like those kids probably have no idea what we actually learned, like why we do it. 00:51:31.383 --> 00:51:31.763 They just remember 00:51:32.853 --> 00:51:36.303 But they would remember the feeling and they would remember the skill, like they 00:51:36.303 --> 00:51:41.283 would have those skills from that lesson, um, regardless of whether they like 00:51:41.283 --> 00:51:45.853 really understood the curriculum behind it, it's still so valuable because It's 00:51:45.853 --> 00:51:50.383 just so memorable to them that's, that learning would be so deeply embedded. 00:51:50.383 --> 00:51:51.023 So ladies. 00:51:51.073 --> 00:51:55.363 Together you created Sqwish, which is an online company. 00:51:56.403 --> 00:51:59.673 That provide digital resources to educators. 00:52:00.213 --> 00:52:04.373 I'd love you to share with the listeners why you started Sqwish, I think you've 00:52:04.373 --> 00:52:08.383 already alluded to it a bit during the interview, but why you started Sqwish 00:52:08.403 --> 00:52:12.483 and what's your mission with Sqwish? 00:52:12.743 --> 00:52:14.533 Sqwish was born in my brain. 00:52:14.603 --> 00:52:18.763 Um, a few, quite a few years ago now. 00:52:18.873 --> 00:52:23.523 I just believe that there's not very many brilliant inquiry based 00:52:23.523 --> 00:52:25.033 resources for upper primary out there. 00:52:25.943 --> 00:52:30.683 The, the templates that are out there are either, you need to know 00:52:30.913 --> 00:52:35.553 everything about IBPYP or a different inquiry model to be able to access, or 00:52:35.553 --> 00:52:37.503 they're just not designed very well. 00:52:37.513 --> 00:52:39.853 They're just like a bit ugly. 00:52:39.853 --> 00:52:40.458 Outdated. 00:52:40.458 --> 00:52:45.568 Since I left the full time classroom teaching, I have learned so much 00:52:45.618 --> 00:52:51.728 about the power of design and how a well formed template can empower 00:52:51.728 --> 00:52:53.438 students to structure their thinking. 00:52:53.588 --> 00:52:55.578 Isn't that what inquiry is about? 00:52:55.838 --> 00:53:00.018 So to be offering resources to our students, I was either like remaking 00:53:00.018 --> 00:53:06.688 resources or giving them such terrible designed resources that it just fell flat 00:53:06.688 --> 00:53:08.148 and I knew there could be something more. 00:53:08.148 --> 00:53:08.468 So. 00:53:09.278 --> 00:53:15.573 Sqwish for me marries a couple of loves, which is inquiry for me in upper years, 00:53:15.733 --> 00:53:19.593 you know, Meg's jumped on board and I'm so glad she has because she has so 00:53:19.683 --> 00:53:21.323 much more knowledge than lower primary. 00:53:21.353 --> 00:53:24.803 So, you know, it can be transferred even further, , I'm 00:53:24.803 --> 00:53:26.393 a fully trained graphic designer. 00:53:26.443 --> 00:53:33.543 So being able to create, uh, professionally designed resources, that 00:53:33.543 --> 00:53:37.813 use the same fonts, styles, layouts, they empower students to become 00:53:37.813 --> 00:53:42.793 familiar with that resource type, which enables them to then predict how 00:53:42.793 --> 00:53:44.263 the resource is going to be set up. 00:53:44.393 --> 00:53:48.363 And it frees their cognitive energy to interpret the task they need to 00:53:48.363 --> 00:53:52.003 do rather than actually interpreting the task itself, if that makes sense. 00:53:52.003 --> 00:53:58.543 So Sqwish came about to kind of pull all of those things together. 00:53:58.623 --> 00:54:02.033 I want to help other teachers who are not in inquiry school and 00:54:02.033 --> 00:54:04.173 make inquiry learning accessible. 00:54:04.513 --> 00:54:09.683 I want to use design as a really powerful tool to help our students 00:54:09.903 --> 00:54:14.573 help out teachers to get down to the nitty gritty of actually learning. 00:54:15.033 --> 00:54:20.513 Um, I think that a lot of the resources that are out there are not in education 00:54:20.513 --> 00:54:24.433 in general, are just not designed by professional graphic designers. 00:54:24.493 --> 00:54:30.493 And I want to ask why it's such a powerful tool and how many times 00:54:30.493 --> 00:54:35.708 do you have a worksheet that just has random clip art on it for, for 00:54:35.708 --> 00:54:38.358 what reason images are so powerful. 00:54:38.398 --> 00:54:40.888 We have so many visual learners now class. 00:54:40.948 --> 00:54:44.518 If the images aren't adding to anything, then get rid of them. 00:54:44.538 --> 00:54:49.438 It's just deterring away from what they need, which is just, white 00:54:49.438 --> 00:54:53.768 space, like templated designs that help structure their thinking. 00:54:54.068 --> 00:54:58.658 And it can, it also makes learning so much more accessible. 00:54:58.668 --> 00:55:03.878 I have witnessed firsthand upper primary where I've had maybe a student with 00:55:03.878 --> 00:55:08.148 learning difficulties and I've had to sit down and create a very intense template 00:55:08.428 --> 00:55:11.808 for them to be able to access the learning that was occurring in my classroom. 00:55:12.678 --> 00:55:15.938 And then it occurred to me, if I'm doing this for one student, why 00:55:15.988 --> 00:55:17.478 can't, they all have access to it. 00:55:17.798 --> 00:55:23.098 And lo and behold, the learning that came out from one particular, lesson 00:55:23.098 --> 00:55:26.828 or a unit or whatever I was teaching was almost so much better because 00:55:27.108 --> 00:55:28.978 students could see, I start here. 00:55:29.028 --> 00:55:30.068 I end here. 00:55:30.588 --> 00:55:37.398 Um, And I could just see the power of this and how it could just free 00:55:37.438 --> 00:55:42.008 our students more cognitively, help those who struggle with structuring 00:55:42.008 --> 00:55:43.828 their ideas, their learning. 00:55:44.258 --> 00:55:46.888 And that's why Sqwish was born. 00:55:46.968 --> 00:55:52.128 I walked away from a full time classroom position to basically upskill in graphic 00:55:52.128 --> 00:55:57.813 design so that I could achieve this and the resources that we have on the site, 00:55:58.263 --> 00:56:04.883 we, pour so much time and energy and love into them because I want them to be 00:56:04.883 --> 00:56:07.933 perfect because often it's not perfect 00:56:08.618 --> 00:56:10.028 in a classroom You have to make do. 00:56:10.598 --> 00:56:13.128 Um, and I don't think that's good enough. 00:56:14.618 --> 00:56:17.588 Meg, would you like to add anything to that? 00:56:18.208 --> 00:56:20.118 I think Allanah's just about said it all. 00:56:20.358 --> 00:56:24.888 I know I found when you log on to another website to go, okay, I need 00:56:24.888 --> 00:56:29.498 something maybe to support how I'm going to teach,, probability and you 00:56:29.508 --> 00:56:33.108 log on and half the time, the stuff that you download is just rubbish. 00:56:33.448 --> 00:56:38.108 Like you have no idea what you can only use half of it. 00:56:38.648 --> 00:56:42.853 Like you might go through a PowerPoint or that kind of thing 00:56:42.853 --> 00:56:43.678 and go, well, that's rubbish. 00:56:43.678 --> 00:56:44.898 Why would I teach that? 00:56:44.908 --> 00:56:47.988 They already know that, or you download something you go, I 00:56:47.988 --> 00:56:51.528 don't actually understand what they want me to do with this. 00:56:51.958 --> 00:56:57.268 So that's what we are making is it's a whole lesson. 00:56:57.628 --> 00:57:01.598 So if you were to download one of our lessons, it would be and have 00:57:01.598 --> 00:57:05.428 a full lesson plan within it that goes through the five E steps. 00:57:05.438 --> 00:57:10.128 It has what you need to do some prior, like any teacher preparation, 00:57:10.188 --> 00:57:12.628 um, any information that you need, all of that kind of thing. 00:57:12.858 --> 00:57:14.878 It's all Australian curriculum aligned. 00:57:15.318 --> 00:57:19.028 Um, so you know that you're ticking off the right kind of 00:57:19.028 --> 00:57:19.928 things that you need to teach. 00:57:19.938 --> 00:57:22.178 It would have, um, templates. 00:57:23.103 --> 00:57:24.103 for students to work on. 00:57:24.103 --> 00:57:27.292 It might have posters, it might have a PowerPoint to work 00:57:27.292 --> 00:57:29.481 through, it might have a game. 00:57:29.481 --> 00:57:34.224 There's all sorts of things that we've put in basically all of the 00:57:34.224 --> 00:57:39.918 effort to enable you to Teach that content descriptor to the best of your 00:57:39.918 --> 00:57:41.708 ability in an inquiry way as well. 00:57:41.708 --> 00:57:46.968 I love how squish just like Blooming Curious I think it supports educators to 00:57:46.968 --> 00:57:53.903 try and lessen the load for educators and also to give them quality resources 00:57:53.903 --> 00:57:59.263 because as you see, there's so much rubbish out there and I found children 00:58:00.393 --> 00:58:02.923 love something really beautiful. 00:58:03.183 --> 00:58:07.783 They love working on something really nice and so why would you just give them 00:58:07.783 --> 00:58:11.063 some horrible blurry thing , to do a task. 00:58:11.063 --> 00:58:14.363 I think that's really important and kudos to you guys. 00:58:15.023 --> 00:58:15.573 Thank you. 00:58:15.633 --> 00:58:18.903 That's what, Allanah and I spoke about a few weeks ago when we were 00:58:18.953 --> 00:58:22.123 getting ready to launch our business and all that kind of thing we were 00:58:22.123 --> 00:58:27.473 wondering how much time actually went into each lesson that we've created. 00:58:27.793 --> 00:58:32.363 And some of them have actually taken about 40 hours to create one, lesson 00:58:32.363 --> 00:58:33.763 that's give or take about an hour. 00:58:34.243 --> 00:58:41.853 Um, and, but as a teacher, I don't have that time to be able to create such 00:58:41.913 --> 00:58:44.403 a wonderful resource for my students. 00:58:44.433 --> 00:58:49.743 I'd love to, but I also need to, you know, eat and breathe and sleep. 00:58:50.473 --> 00:58:57.153 We're trying to take the jargon, Allanah's favorite word, um, the jargon 00:58:57.753 --> 00:59:03.483 and the questions out of what do I actually need to teach this lesson? 00:59:03.533 --> 00:59:05.103 What's their enduring understanding? 00:59:05.163 --> 00:59:07.973 What do I need and what can I get rid of? 00:59:08.043 --> 00:59:09.903 That's going to be like white noise for them. 00:59:10.373 --> 00:59:10.723 Yeah. 00:59:10.723 --> 00:59:14.223 And we really look at a lesson and I'll write one and then send it to Meg. 00:59:14.233 --> 00:59:16.303 And she'll say, do you need that? 00:59:16.313 --> 00:59:17.573 Do we need this instead? 00:59:17.573 --> 00:59:20.653 And, you know, I think we also need posters and I also think we need this. 00:59:20.653 --> 00:59:22.843 And then it just becomes this big thing. 00:59:22.843 --> 00:59:24.893 We've just tried to think of everything. 00:59:24.903 --> 00:59:29.713 So you download something about, I don't know, you need to teach subjective 00:59:29.713 --> 00:59:32.438 and objective language and bias. 00:59:32.468 --> 00:59:33.398 We've thought of everything. 00:59:33.398 --> 00:59:36.148 There's posters, there's a student template, it's digital, 00:59:36.148 --> 00:59:38.758 it's print, it's whatever is going to work in your classroom. 00:59:38.758 --> 00:59:42.178 We just want it to have thought of literally everything because often when 00:59:42.178 --> 00:59:46.728 you're teaching, you just don't, you just can't, you just throw some stuff up on the 00:59:46.728 --> 00:59:49.028 wall that you've just done really quickly. 00:59:49.038 --> 00:59:53.148 You've written it up before on a blank piece of paper before recess and run out. 00:59:53.158 --> 00:59:58.878 Like, um, yeah, we've just really tried to think of everything to make it easier 00:59:59.828 --> 01:00:03.748 I know Allanah, you've, I can't remember if you said it already today was that 01:00:03.878 --> 01:00:08.098 when you did some supply teaching and you said just the dribble that that the kids 01:00:08.098 --> 01:00:12.568 were having to do was pretty atrocious. 01:00:12.668 --> 01:00:19.878 So if you're giving them that real quality lesson and understanding, then you're 01:00:19.878 --> 01:00:22.278 going to engage them and they're actually going to want to be there as well. 01:00:22.308 --> 01:00:25.928 And you know, they might be able to learn something in the process. 01:00:26.738 --> 01:00:30.138 Just to finish off, just tell people where they can go to 01:00:30.158 --> 01:00:32.648 get hold of Sqwish's resources. 01:00:32.648 --> 01:00:34.388 We have a, we have a website up. 01:00:34.448 --> 01:00:35.928 It's sqwish. 01:00:35.948 --> 01:00:36.258 com. 01:00:36.268 --> 01:00:36.278 au. 01:00:37.368 --> 01:00:38.678 Um, all our resources are up there. 01:00:39.088 --> 01:00:43.838 We don't have a lot because we are about quality, not quantity. 01:00:43.868 --> 01:00:49.908 However, one day we do hope to have many up catering for lots and lots of grades, 01:00:49.908 --> 01:00:53.028 but we can only do what we can do when we are really honing in on that quality. 01:00:53.428 --> 01:00:54.688 You can find our resources on there. 01:00:54.748 --> 01:00:59.078 We're also on Instagram as squish underscore resources on 01:00:59.078 --> 01:01:02.038 Instagram and the same on TikTok. 01:01:02.068 --> 01:01:03.268 And we've just started a Facebook. 01:01:03.268 --> 01:01:05.218 I think that's just squish though, isn't it, Meg? 01:01:05.278 --> 01:01:05.548 Yes. 01:01:05.788 --> 01:01:08.008 That one's just a just straight squish. 01:01:08.793 --> 01:01:14.803 I will put the links to your website and Instagram and everything onto our 01:01:14.803 --> 01:01:18.513 show notes so that listeners can go there very easily and click and go 01:01:18.513 --> 01:01:20.163 and look at your wonderful resources. 01:01:20.623 --> 01:01:24.103 And to finish off, what advice would you give to educators who are just 01:01:24.123 --> 01:01:26.083 coming into inquiry based learning? 01:01:26.393 --> 01:01:27.353 What would you say to them? 01:01:28.423 --> 01:01:30.763 I would say be patient with yourself. 01:01:30.783 --> 01:01:34.213 Continue to reflect, and just enjoy the ride. 01:01:34.223 --> 01:01:35.693 It's wonderful. 01:01:35.773 --> 01:01:38.823 And ask other teachers, you know, ask the teacher next door. 01:01:38.843 --> 01:01:43.433 If you can sit on, on their lesson, go and see how other teachers are doing 01:01:43.433 --> 01:01:47.283 it even if you have to sacrifice some of your beloved planning time, it is 01:01:47.313 --> 01:01:52.543 so, so worth it because that is how I have grown as a teacher the most is 01:01:52.843 --> 01:01:57.203 having an open door and walking into other open doors within the school. 01:01:57.453 --> 01:02:01.213 Not everyone's door is open but find those teachers who have that open door 01:02:01.213 --> 01:02:03.483 and learn as much as you can from them. 01:02:04.463 --> 01:02:04.913 Meg? 01:02:05.753 --> 01:02:10.343 Um, I was going to build on what Alana said and say that there's not actually 01:02:10.463 --> 01:02:13.933 many wrong ways to teach inquiry. 01:02:13.933 --> 01:02:18.093 There's lots of right ways to do it and your way of doing it might be different 01:02:18.103 --> 01:02:20.083 to the person next door and that's okay. 01:02:20.583 --> 01:02:22.263 It's not as hard as you think it is. 01:02:23.243 --> 01:02:24.493 Absolutely true. 01:02:24.773 --> 01:02:26.483 It's not one way of doing it. 01:02:26.513 --> 01:02:31.413 You find your own way of doing inquiry that fits with you, with your personality 01:02:31.773 --> 01:02:34.073 and with your cohort of students. 01:02:34.333 --> 01:02:37.953 Because you could have a way of inquiry that works really well for one cohort 01:02:37.993 --> 01:02:40.143 and then the next year it doesn't at all. 01:02:40.143 --> 01:02:41.953 And you have to really rethink the wheel anyway. 01:02:42.463 --> 01:02:47.253 So Meg and Allanah from Sqwish Resources, I think this has been a wonderful 01:02:47.253 --> 01:02:49.033 opportunity to chat to you both. 01:02:49.533 --> 01:02:53.233 I'd like to thank you both for coming on Blooming Curious and I look forward 01:02:53.283 --> 01:02:57.143 to us perhaps meeting up again at a later stage and I wish you all the 01:02:57.143 --> 01:03:01.493 very very best with your business with Sqwish resources and I hope everybody 01:03:01.493 --> 01:03:06.883 goes there and also to Blooming Curious and go and have a look and see how 01:03:07.183 --> 01:03:11.533 the ladies at Sqwish can actually help lessen your load in your classroom. 01:03:11.533 --> 01:03:12.743 So thank you very much. 01:03:13.408 --> 01:03:14.498 Thanks so much for having us. 01:03:14.498 --> 01:03:15.698 I had such a great time. 01:03:15.758 --> 01:03:18.528 It's always nice to talk about your why and your passion. 01:03:18.568 --> 01:03:19.648 So we've loved it. 01:03:19.668 --> 01:03:20.298 Thanks, Edwina. 01:03:20.878 --> 01:03:21.118 Yes. 01:03:21.168 --> 01:03:21.658 Thank you.