Welcome everybody.
Today I'm welcoming Victoria Hackett, the founder of OutdoorClassrooms.
com and the Secret Gardens Outdoor Classroom.
She's also the host of the Outdoor Classrooms podcast, as a parent,
educational consultant, trainer and coach, Victoria inspires
playful learning outdoors.
She offers on site seminars, virtual masterclasses, summits and e courses
that blend theoretical information with hands on problem solving techniques.
She has been in the field of education for over 25 years and holds a Master's
in Education from Cambridge College.
After years of working with children, Educators and parents.
Victoria has cultivated a passion for inspiring teachers and
parents to reconnect children with nature using outdoor classrooms
and backyard teaching gardens.
Her vision is for every child to have access to an outdoor classroom and or
backyard, excuse me, teaching garden.
Welcome to Blooming Curious, Victoria.
Thank you for having me.
I'm thrilled to be here.
Oh, this is just such a lovely thing to be talking about one of
my favorite subjects, which is children being outdoors in a garden.
So, let's kick off by perhaps you sharing with us a pivotal moment
or an experience that inspired your journey into creating outdoor
classrooms or, and teaching gardens.
Ah, what a great question.
Absolutely.
I started with, um, outdoor classrooms with, I, yes, so I started with, uh,
outdoor classrooms actually as a parent.
I've always been an educator and taught workshops and teaching and teaching
at our local community college and also Uh, taught young children, but it
wasn't really until I became a parent.
And there was this very desolate courtyard at my children's elementary school.
And I had a first grader and, or a kindergartner and
a preschooler at the time.
And they, we would pass this desolate courtyard every morning during drop
off and every afternoon during pickup.
And I got this crazy idea of what would happen if we created a children's garden.
And so it was at that point where I gathered up the leadership in the school
and other parents and other teachers.
And we just moved towards this idea of.
Transforming this sort of courtyard space and I'm telling you, it was incredible
and I think the most the pivotal moment within that story is when I saw 5th
graders at the time that had never planted anything in the ground and 5th graders.
So I had a preschooler and a. Uh, kindergartner and fifth graders at the
time just seemed like humongous beings.
And I thought they should be able to, they should have had
this experience, but they hadn't.
So that really got me thinking about my own philosophy of education and
how I was teaching other teachers in child growth and development
at the local, community college
and so that.
Then, prompted me to start outdoor classrooms.
Amazing.
So, when you planted this, this space, was your intention just to
make it sort of pretty with flowers or were you doing vegetables or how
did, how did this whole thing start?
What did you decide?
What was your plan?
Wow, that's such a good question.
So the plan was to really create a teaching garden.
It was a teaching garden and, uh, so what I did at the time was fairly new.
I, there were other mentors of mine that had done similar things, but
I pretty much during that whole period threw my kids in the minivan
and drove around and learned about
children's gardens and teaching gardens , and I was just in this happy heaven and
learning as much as I possibly could.
And I found that they were actually four different types of gardens, and
this is what we wanted to integrate into the, um, the children's garden
at my children's elementary school.
And so what I found with the four different.
Camps of people and they were, uh, folks that were just focused on food and
they were so that folks that were just focused on wildlife and focus that, uh,
then I thought, oh, well, there's these mud kitchens and all these wonderful
things so we call those the gardens , for outdoor learning stations and then.
Folks that just wanted to make it beautiful, like you had just said.
So I call this in my work the four types of gardens.
So gardens that feed, gardens that attract wildlife, gardens as outdoor learning
stations, and gardens for art and beauty.
Because, and I see really creating outdoor classrooms using the elements
from all those different types of gardens.
So they can be Creating one of a kind outdoor classrooms wherever you are.
Right.
And when you, when you say, , a teaching garden, so somebody's hearing you saying
a teaching garden, what would come to one's mind when you say teaching garden?
Would it be a space then where teachers would take children to learn something?
Yes, it is.
There's so many different things that can be taught and learned and a playful spaces
where playful learning can happen as well.
So, yes, you can be measuring.
So, for instance, the mud kitchen is a wonderful space because it's so sensorial
and oftentimes the the space where many, many children learn the most, but there's
measuring, there's cooking, there's weight, there's all these different things
that actually happen in a real kitchen, but you're using nature's loose parts.
So say in a vegetable garden or a kitchen garden, um, planting seeds and what, and
learning about how seeds are grown and what not and, I'm just thinking about
the secret gardens here we have a fishing bridge, and so we have letters and numbers
on the little fish that they can capture, with their magnet fishing poles.
So there's so many different things we, uh, adding literacy to outdoor
spaces with , story walks, uh, all sorts of different possibilities within
each of those four types of gardens.
So yes, really taking, ideally teachers taking their curriculum, what they're
doing indoors to, to see if they can take it outdoors and , adapt the space
and adapt the curriculum as well.
That's amazing.
Um, I know that there's, there's a website called Outdoor Classroom.
No, there's an Outdoor Classroom Day.
Have you ever heard of that?
Yes.
Yeah.
That's really incredible.
I've done that a few times where you join up with everybody else in the
world and have this day of learning outdoors, which is really amazing.
But sometimes I think it can be very, very difficult for
educators who never go outside.
So having a space where they can, I guess, with you learn how to use these outdoor
spaces and outdoor gardens in their planning and teaching.. We'll talk
about that as well , in a little while is how people can get involved with you.
But Victoria, what do you believe are the most significant benefits
children gain from learning in outdoor environments compared to, let's
say, a traditional indoor classroom?
Ah.
it is the one place that not only us adults, but children, we come
alive, we come alive outdoors.
So when you have our, when children are sitting at desks or wherever they
are indoors, there's a flatness to it.
But when they can go outdoors their brains come alive, all the research is
saying all the incredible benefits of spending more time outdoors and that's it.
You could feel it when you go outside.
So, I, there's just a very quick story.
I was talking to another colleague of mine who is actually in Kenya right now.
And we shared very similar stories.
And her story, and I'm like, oh, that's the same story that I've,
same experience that I've had.
Was when you have a child who does not do very well indoors and
, they're just not, they're just flat.
They're just not connecting to the curriculum,
they're not connecting to themselves.
They're not connecting to their peer group, and then you take them outside and
all of a sudden they're engaged, they're working, they're, they've come alive.
So my, my colleague and I share this story with very different
children, but , it's an example of
what happens when we take our children outside, and I know there
are many teachers out there that are afraid of all the things.
It, it seems like the indoors is such a controlled environment and that would make
it easier and let's keep it that way and the being outdoors, uh, there might be
risk involved and all of that, but there's , all this research around this Topic that
is showcasing the importance of spending more time outdoors and connecting children
to the outdoors to bring their mind alive.
That's so true because I think as teachers, you know, when the bell
goes for playtime, they can't wait just to get out, get out , onto the
playground and , into nature and outside.
Uh, kids do come alive when they're outside.
And as you said, I think many teachers have a story that they can relate to
where there's a child that indoors, and I've had those that just, as you
say, they're flat, but the minute you take them outside, suddenly you see
leadership skills coming to the fore.
It's incredible.
So how have you seen outdoor classrooms impact not only children,
you mentioned it earlier, but also educators and parents who engage
with them in that outdoor space?
It's magic.
There's there's no other way around describing it.
It's I again run this Secret Gardens nature classes, and have
many, many parent child programs,
and many of the parents said this is amazing because it's a yes environment.
We're creating these environments that kids can get messy and the messier they
get, the actual, the healthier they are, the more that they are getting
messy and mud and the more freedom that they're feeling, um, and for parents,
it's like, oh, wow, this is something, obviously we wouldn't make this, we
wouldn't want to make this mess indoors,
so there's restrictions and there's this constant no and being outdoors enables
children to have risks, take risks and to allow the parent or teacher to take a
step back and to watch Children in these environments where they can succeed.
But ultimately, it's a yes, it's It's a yes environment and allowing,
educators and or parents just to be able to step back and allow children to
explore the environment on their own.
Obviously people come to your space, right?
They can come to your space to learn, um, the people that come, would they
all be people of the same, mindset where they want to get kids outside
because they're already open to it, or do you also find that you're getting
people who've never done this before and are possibly quite reticent
'cause you know, they don't like the mud and they don't like the dirt and
they don't like the sand and the shoes.
Yeah.
And , do you get those parents or teachers as well, that to them,
this is a whole new experience?
I do.
It's funny.
And it's funny when I, it's like, Oh yes.
Yep.
Not everybody thinks the way I think.
Yeah.
And when I, it's, it's mind boggling actually.
And I'm like, and then I've had parents that have said, okay, and we run straight
through the winter and it's very, gets very cold here in New England.
And I've had parents said, okay, we'll see you in the spring.
So they, they won't have anything to do with the colder weather.
And they, they will be sort of helicopter parenting because they don't want
their child to get too, too dirty.
But I've also seen parents and the growth of parents this,
especially this past year, when kids are wearing the right gear.
If kids are wearing the right and proper gear, like rain suits and
the right gloves and the mittens, it enables them the freedom to get
dirty and messy as much as they want because all the parent has to do is
unzip them and then all of a sudden they're dry and happy on the inside.
So it's, it's about.
, educating parents about the best way to do this so their kids can feel that freedom.
And for some parents, it's more of a learning curve for others, and, and I see
kids that come to my program and they're not dressed appropriately, so it's,
it's just this gentle learning curve,
and I think when they see other parents and other kids engrossed
in their play, the light bulb goes off and they're all there.
We had a class at the beginning of the winter where they're all
ordering their rain mittens.
So on Amazon so they're all kind of learning from each other and aren't we
doing that anyway as as young parents so they're they're learning from each other
and I think, again, I work with schools as well, and there's lots of resistance
in terms of, well, I, just all the pressures of what needs to be happening
in schools, and really changing that mindset around the outdoor classrooms.
I mean, and it shouldn't be an additional thing.
It should be something that is, is woven in, so it's, it's a natural,
uh, the indoor should be as natural as being outdoors and, and whatnot.
It's so exciting.
Can you describe, Victoria a particularly memorable transformation
moment that you've witnessed while you've been implementing these
outdoor learning experiences?
Is there, is there someone or a moment that stands out for you that
really showed you how transformational outdoor learning is for children.
Oh, there's been so many, there's been so many just here at the secret gardens.
There's been so many that I see when I'm working with different schools, but for
myself, when, uh, when I have a mentor, uh, Phil Solomon, many, many years ago,
she started a. classroom at the Chenery Middle School and I'll never forget it.
I saw what she had done and thought, holy cannoli, I think
this is really what we could do.
And that was the inspiration of that my children's elementary school, when
I saw that, because a lot of what was happening again, this is 20 years
ago, so a lot of what was happening was happening on the West Coast.
So there wasn't a lot of outdoor classrooms, and people thought
like, if I talk about it, they thought I was this cuckoo brain.
But just now, I mean, I think COVID has been.. The silver lining because it
forced all of us to go outside and to see what our campuses and our landscapes
are that we can use for children.
So, , I would say that that one initial mentor of mine and just
this, these slow progressions of witnessing, what educators are doing
around the country, it's exciting
I don't know what it's like for you there.
But I've noticed where I live in Perth,, we're actually very fortunate.
There are a lot of playgrounds around for families and children.
Um, a lot of them are really getting into this whole nature playground.
So there's a lot of natural elements in the playground, moving
away from the plastic fantastic.
But I have a question , in that I also notice, and I think there's
a, there's a slow progression.
It's a slow change coming that some schools are now, and I can see it
when I'm driving around, changing their own outdoor spaces or their
own playgrounds to be more natural.
I'm seeing this movement towards a more natural playground for children.
Simultaneously.
We're seeing schools change their playgrounds, you know, putting
softer surfaces, making it more natural, but they're still
pretty structured and manicured.
What are your thoughts around that?
Because Isn't it the wildness and the freedom of nature that really attract
children, where they can really learn, as opposed to the sort of
manicured, perfect nature playground where everything has a place.
So I think we're moving in the right direction, but perhaps not enough.
So what are your thoughts around that, about these beautifully manicured Spaces,
when you're thinking about more of a wild, natural space, what are your thoughts
around that, perhaps for schools or municipalities or people thinking about
changing their outdoor spaces to make them not only more child friendly, but
more learning friendly for children?
Oh, such a good question.
I I And I get very sad when I see what you're describing.
It's sort of this, oh, we have to go purchase these outdoor classrooms and
we have to, and look, we're doing it.
And it's oftentimes there's a disconnect.
And I think that what children really need it's, they love, um, nature's loose parts.
And so being able to play with sticks in, different capacities, being
able to with stones and feathers and all of nature's loose parts and
creating these outdoor classrooms.
And again, I like to create outdoor classrooms on a shoestring budget.
. And it just goes back to children would much rather play with an empty
box than what's actually in the box.
So it's that same mindset in terms of these, these folks spending thousands
and thousands of dollars on these very manicured, playgrounds or playscapes
and whatnot, when actually the children are going to be much happier in a
homegrown, do it yourself, outdoor space that has different elements, like those
four types of garden pieces, elements.
Uh, it might have a garden that grows food, so there's that whole learning
that can go on there and a garden that has mud kitchens and water walls and
music walls and, but those elements that go into that can all be homegrown.
Parents and families can pull those items from recycled materials.
The kids don't care.
I've seen adventure playgrounds popping up and where they have
all sorts of different loose parts that kids can play with.
Kids want their own environment.
When they're so manicured, I feel like it's too structured, it's, then we're,
we're expecting a certain type of play to come out of these manicured play spaces.
But when they have loose parts, and these different elements from these four
different types of gardens, the play changes, it, it becomes organic, it's
authentic, it's, kids can feel freedom.
So yeah, I, I get really sad, I feel like, oh.
You know, let's just not, let's go this direction, but let's not miss the mark.
And again, if, and obviously if these schools are getting funding to,
, purchase , these new school grounds, uh, that makes me sad too, because I
feel like that they've been misdirected.
And, and again, it goes back to educating and having these conversations and
talking more about the essence of child development and what they need and how
we can incorporate our outdoor spaces to be not just spaces where they go
out and have recess, but spaces where they can actually take extra time.
That they would normally have indoors they can have it outdoors
and still fulfill all the academia that learning that is required.
Yes.
That is also, a massive bone of contention and something that I really struggle with.
Because.
I think people think, you have to be this hippie type , to have this.
It's just for like people that are hippies well, no, because in
essence, all children are the same.
They all want the same thing.
I think all of us humans want that freedom to explore, but if
everything's so beautifully laid out and manicured, there's nothing to explore.
There's nothing that they can create for themselves.
And so then, do you want a space where children, where they can grow their
own creativity, where they can have agency, but when we put everything
out for them and everything's all perfectly manicured, it's boring.
It might look very pretty, but it's completely boring.
Yeah.
I couldn't agree with you more.
I could not agree with you more.
And again, it goes back to it's clean.
And kids need to be messy and muddy and dirty and, I mean, there's nothing
that makes me happier when I see kids leave my program and they're, they've
got mud on their face and their clothes and, and whatnot, but, and
they have a smile because they created something that they couldn't necessarily
create in doors, but they were given the permission and the word yes.
Like, go for it.
So I think it's, it's just this conversation that we need to have.
We need to really understand child development.
We need to really understand the essence of loose parts and where that
creativity and imagination and nurturing.
All of that and how that comes into our outdoor classrooms and the development
of our children, but because so many children and parents and families are
spending too much time in front of a screen, and that's, we need to sort of
shift that, take them outdoors and get them into this creative zone again.
Funny you say that.
I just, Yesterday, I recorded an episode where I'm talking about play
and looked at some research around play.
And here in Australia, a poll was done to parents and discovered
the most prevalent form of play.
Was digital.
Yeah.
You know, my brain just about exploded.
54 percent of families were in front of screens on digital devices.
And it was something like 27 percent or something, which I think, and 27
percent sounds like nothing, but I think that's really, really high of
young children and even toddlers.
These are the things where you're giving kids It's not just television, it's
phones, it's screens, it's an iPad.
Anyway, don't even get me started because then I start thinking about, you know,
we've got all these issues in society, but if you just take away the screens and put
them in nature, I really feel that so many of those problems would just evaporate.
Yeah, I do too.
And that's why I do what I do.
And I think that's why you do what you do.
And I think that's, that's why our paths have crossed.
But I do so, so wholeheartedly believe that the essence of changing the
trajectory of where our mental health is going is to actually very simply open up
the door and spend more time outdoors.
And if we are, if we can get schools to think about and educators to
think about, hmm, how can I take what I'm already doing and actually
enhance it by taking it outdoors?
And how can I create a space at my school to even make it greater?
Or how can I even explore my campus at school to, to use it more?
And there are teachers that there's such a huge fear factor and a lack of
time factor and all of these things.
I work with so many educators to really try to flip that into an opportunity.
All these challenges that they have, how can we flip it to an
opportunity where we are actually going outside because the benefits
are huge and the research is huge.
It's all there.
But I, someone had just told me that there's research about, uh,
inmates at jails are spending more time outside than our children.
Today.
Yes, I've read that research that inmates actually have more
time outdoors than children do.
It's quite frightening, really.
And I'll just say that in the podcast that I was talking about play, I also
found some other research done way back in the sixties, where the psychiatrist
discovered that amongst inmates that had committed really violent crimes,
one of the threads was that they were all deprived of play in their childhood.
So they're not saying that a lack of play caused them to be violent
criminals, but certainly the lack of play shaped their development.
Oh, wow.
Just really, really fascinating and I think it's time.
The time has come.
We're going full circle for us to perhaps be thinking about going back
again to the way we were supposed to be, and that is naturally to be outside,
but as you've said, it is a very difficult switch to flip for educators
when they have so much pressure.
You know, they've got all these time constraints, budget constraints, for
them to flip that switch and think, well, how, as you've said, how can I do what
I'm doing indoors, but just outdoors where children will perhaps be able to
focus better, concentrate better and learn better and really be happier.
Yes.
And I think it's, it's something that happened during COVID
because it, we had to do it.
So in my eyes, I'm like, why, we know we can do it.
So, so I think that, , we just keep plugging forward.
So you've probably touched on it already, but in your view, what are
those key elements or principles , that make outdoor classrooms successful?
Is it just that we're seeing children are happier and they're learning better?
Or are there other things that you have noticed for yourself that you think
just make outdoor learning a success?
It's twofold.
I think that part of the design of an outdoor classroom is critical.
I think it's critical , I talk to a lot of, educators and the
design of the outdoor space.
Again, not that it's going to be a fancy space, but it, I think you'd need to
have a space where, um, children gather.
So just like you do in an indoor classroom, you need a, you need a
designated area where children gather.
So, and again, I like to design my outdoor classroom with using the four
elements from the four types of gardens.
And I think using that.
benefits children because there's something that's
happening around every corner.
So that element of wonder and curiosity and I think if the space is connecting,
age appropriately to whatever the children are playfully learning.
So it might be just that they are, but if they're learning about colors or
alphabets or measuring or learning about planting seeds and, or whatever it is,
that the outdoor classroom provides a space where it can extend that learning.
And, I guess the best way to describe it is that it's a space that you
can do, you can learn something that you can't learn indoors.
So if you were going to learn about trees or the width of trees and whatnot,
you can only, I mean, you can do that by looking at pictures indoors, right?
But if you go outdoors and you go for a walk, you get the
wind blowing through the trees.
You get, you're talking about all the different types of trees.
So that's an experience that you have outdoors that you can't
necessarily have that same wow factor.
Indoors.
So that's where the outdoor classroom really becomes an extension of the indoor,
and it shouldn't be either or, it should just be the extensions of each other.
But I wholeheartedly believe that the design of the space, if you're so lucky
to have a space to design , having that gathering space, I, I do like a check-in
with rocks, with kids' names on them.
I'm here , and , then having routines and systems in place, which will
enable children to understand, okay, what are the boundaries of this space?
Where can I go?
So they can have that freedom to be themselves in that space.
But there's some structure and routine, as there are in an indoor classroom.
So it's, I think it's twofold.
I think it's There's a design element and I think it's also
a curriculum element as well.
Incredible.
That's really, really good advice for anybody or any institution or
municipality thinking about creating or designing an outdoor space for
children is to really keep that in mind.
Let's talk for a moment about risk, Victoria, because we're so worried
about kids getting hurt, aren't we?
Yes.
So worried about that.
And a lot of parents are very risk averse.
So if their children get hurt, I think this might be one of the reasons
that schools are afraid of the backlash that we may get from parents
because their child has been hurt somehow on an outdoor playground.
What are your feelings around that?
Every child needs to take risks.
And we need to create environments and a mindset to give them
the freedom to take risks.
So there's healthy risks and there's dangerous risks.
So we need to distinguish what that is.
We need to sort of set ground rules and we need to have a risk, our own risk
assessment in terms of, the age and stage of the children that we are working
with, that we are with, and we need to make sure that our outdoor spaces are
safe, but we also need to include things in the outdoor space where children can
try a balance beam or walk on a log or all of these different things that Oh,
well, they might fall off, but we, but falling off isn't necessarily a bad thing.
It's, part of taking risks, healthy risks.
So , I think risk is a huge topic and I think it's, it's been, uh, discussed.
I think that there are schools that are so nervous about being
sued and this and that, and it's safer to keep the kids indoors.
So we're just going to keep it that and not.
let them run because they might fall and all of the become these either helicopter
parents or helicopter educators,
, but it's so important for Children's.
innate growth, and confidence to be able to try different things and for educators
and parents to take a step back and really figure out what their relationship is
with, with risk and what, and not be so, I mean, be close, but depending on what
it is, , and what the child is doing to give them some space to actually explore.
Because I think children are Smart.
And I think they know what they're capable of.
And I think if they fall off something, it's, important for us as educators
and parents to get them back on the horse and say, let's try that again.
And that develops their competence.
But yes, there are many schools and teachers and educators
and parents out there that
feel like let's just keep them safe.
And so what we're doing is we're raising children in the bubble wrap, and we're
not allowing them to run free or do what their bodies are telling them to do.
Uh, because we're, we're lining them up and we're moving them from one place
to the second place and all in order.
And so we can't that again, like you said earlier, it's just ends up being boring,
you know, so we Need a little more risk.
That's going to
look different for everybody.
Yes, exactly.
And I also wonder whether a lack of risk is perhaps also contributing
to the fact that we're seeing less grit, less resilience in children.
you know, they fall and it's the end of the world.
So I think that risky play, a little bit of risk, I think it should be
managed risks, as you said, educators, parents, you need to do that risk
assessment beforehand, go and make sure that there's no, you know, shards of
glass or sharp things sticking out.
But for a child to go and experience, , balancing on stepping stones,
walking on a log, climbing a rope.
These are healthy risks to take, and even if they do fall
and break an arm, that's okay.
It'll heal, you know, a broken arm.
It's okay.
It's a story.
And there is also a lot of research.
That kids who don't have these little risks as they're growing
up, these are these kids that when they're 18, 19, 20, take risks that
are way beyond their capability.
You know, things like just think about them getting a driver's
license, for example, and speed because they haven't experience those
little baby risks as they've been children and as they've grown up.
And so they don't really know how to handle the big risks.
So risk is important.
And I think for anybody listening, parents, especially, and teachers, we
need to allow children that element of risky play and see where it goes.
And if they do fall, Obviously, you've got to stand back and just watch a
little bit because , more than likely they just get up, dust themselves
off and get back on the horse.
Yeah.
So we've got to also control ourselves a little bit and just stand back
and observe and watch and allow children that freedom to take risks
and, and push their own boundaries.
Yes.
I think,
It's critical, it's critical.
And you can tell children that have spent more time in outdoor
classrooms, when they do fall, they, they pop right back up again.
And you can tell children that have not spent time in outdoor classrooms because
they, uh, they fall and they fall apart.
Emotionally, physically.
So it shows that the outdoor classrooms are really enabling children that
opportunity to explore, to go beyond the limits and to make themselves stronger.
Victoria, you've worked with a lot of schools and teachers and educators.
You know, when they come up with all the barriers, like you've said, you work with
a lot of them that are trying to figure out how they can get kids outdoors more.
What were some of your tips or some of your advice that you give
educators when it comes to getting kids outside and still meeting those
curriculum outcomes, because I think as teachers, they're always worried.
We're always worried because we're under pressure to cover curriculum, right?
We need to meet these outcomes.
And so it becomes a really stressful situation because we're thinking, well,
if they take the kids out, then they're not going to be able to cover this and
that and the next thing to meet those outcomes for assessment very often.
So what?
What are some of your tips that you've given to educators that you've worked
with then to be able to meet curriculum
. And at the same time, get kids outside doing things that will
actually benefit their learning.
That's such a good question.
I work.
Yes, I work with many, many, many different schools and many
different capacities and many, uh, grade levels and whatnot.
And my biggest recommendation , to all is to take baby steps.
And that Rome was not built in a day and to take up something very, very
small, whether you just go out and read a story and, or you go just create a
gathering space so you have a place to go.
So in my work, I, during COVID came up with the five phases of teaching
outdoors and the phase one being.
Infrastructure.
So making sure that you have an infrastructure in
your, , outdoor classroom.
So you again that gathering space.
Uh, what are you going to do when you get out there?
What are the routines, the physical space and the phase two
is actually getting outdoors.
Moving kids outdoors and phase three is teaching and learning.
Phase four is weather and phase five is, sustainability.
So what finding that teachers are in all different phases of teaching
outdoors, not one teacher is going to be in the exact same phase.
And I tell educators that it's so important to identify where they are at.
So you're going to get educators that may
love going outside and they're just like, yeah, this is awesome.
And they will just have ideas spinning through their mind and they'll just,
they'll take, take it like water.
You know, they'll, they'll just swim, swim right out.
Other teachers will be petrified and so they're really not.
Sure, what, what that experience will be like.
So what I like to tell educators is like to, to acknowledge that in
yourself and your, and where you are at in your teaching practice
and your outdoor teaching practice, and then to start taking baby steps.
So whether you're in the infrastructure stage, maybe you need to just set up a
gathering space, take your kids outdoors, read a story, and go back indoors.
So it could be as simple as that.
That experience is huge.
So to not negate the fact that Rome, it's all going to happen all at once.
But then once you get kids used to going indoor and outdoor.
Then you can move on to, um, maybe we'll do a little lesson
outside while we're out here.
Maybe we'll tag on a lesson.
So it's just like creating a habit and figuring out what's that first domino.
And it's just, okay, acknowledging where I'm at and then getting those kids
outdoors for very something very simple.
And then adding on to.
So you get in the habit of doing it and then adding on to that.
And with that, then you start really learning to, okay, wow, we're actually
probably covering more ground outdoors.
Kids are happier.
They're making more connections.
So all of these ahas that I wish I could just show them initially,
but they will eventually.
See the magic that happens, , and then they'll be like, Oh,
why didn't I do this earlier?
So it's, there's a certain magic that happens when this, when you
start taking your kids outdoors and when that happens, they're the, the
ahas to start sparking everywhere.
So I always tell the teachers that I introduced the five phases of
teaching outdoors, figure out where you are, take it very, very slow
and then think of it as a habit.
And to add on to your habit.
That's really good advice.
Victoria, tell people where they can find you, how you can help
them, how they can join Outdoor Classrooms and your Circle community.
So if anybody is listening and they need help with getting started with
Outdoor Classrooms, and they can get hold of you and your amazing
knowledge and experience in this field.
Tell them how they can get hold of you and how you can help them.
Oh, thank you for that.
You can find me at my, on my website, all the information is there and that's www.
outdoor dash classrooms with an s. com.
And I work with schools.
I work with parents.
I work with in any capacity that I usually, will do a introductory call
just to find out what your needs are.
So happy , to do that.
So a lot of my information is on my website.
I'm also on Instagram and Facebook.
And, we have a lovely, , community called the Circle Membership Community, which
is , a group of educators from all over the world, that we come together, we
come together live twice a month and we have different workshops and masterclasses
and they get access to a lot of the resources that I offer on the website.
so, and again, if you didn't want to have consulting or anything like
that, you can also go to the website to find one hour workshops, , and
our community and, , what else?
It's just, a potpourri of wonderful support if you're looking for that.
So it's, it's a very niche world, this world of outdoor classrooms, and it's,
the circle community has enabled a lot of us educators to come together
and talk just like this, to, um, Share what's working, what's not working
and, and again, what you really need is that we're all over the country.
So
it's amazing.
So even for international educators and international school leaders,
you also would help them and they can get hold of you and even get
some consulting advice from you.
I will put all your details in the show notes as well.
So anybody who's interested, I really, really, Victoria's got a fabulous website
and loads and loads of information because I've been on there many, many
times and there is just a plethora.
of information for anybody who's interested in outdoor
classrooms or outdoor learning.
Victoria, is there anything else that you would like to add to everything
that we've already discussed today?
Just get outdoors and create fun environments that allow
you to say yes to the mess.
Oh,
what a great slogan, say yes to the mess,
I love that, that
there it is.
Yes to the mess.
I , also I have a podcast as well, so it's, uh, the Outdoor Classrooms podcast.
The Outdoor Classroom Podcast.
I'll put that in the show notes as well for anyone who's interested.
So, , I'm just going to finish off by saying thank you so much, Victoria,
for being on Blooming Curious.
It's been absolutely amazing.
And I think the information that you've given is incredible for
any educator or parent out there.
So I'm really, really thrilled and grateful.
That you have shared your knowledge today with everybody listening.
And as I always say to everybody listening, stay Blooming Curious.
And thank you for being here.