Welcome to Fandom Shmandom, the fandom podcast
that covers everything you love and more. I'm
Sierra Obermark. And I am Sam Williams. Today's
episode, we will be cringingly crying about the
simultaneous episodes of Clone Wars that correspond
with Episode 3, Revenge of the Sith. This will
be a little bit of a different mini viewing views
because of the unique... nature of these episodes.
Without further ado, we will, as Roger Smith
says, dive on in. So get up to 88 because it
is time to travel back to our story recap. Ahsoka
has been on a mission to provide two sisters
with a chance to reconnect, but now the war is
ending. She's overheard that Maul is on Mandalore,
and she and the Jedi are worried about Maul rising
to power as soon as the war ends. With Palpatine
captured by Grievous and Dooku, Anakin and Obi
-Wan cannot pursue Maul and the Mandy planet
storyline. So Anakin breaks the 501st in half,
promotes Rex to commander. Well done! Excellent
job, Commander Rex. And he assigns Ahsoka as
a special advisor, so Citizen, as Mace calls
her, Ahsoka, can join in the fun. Maul doesn't
expect Ahsoka and underestimates her, leading
to an incredible monologue and fight where Maul
is trapped and imprisoned. After dropping many
hints about Order 66, Maul senses it is close,
and lo and behold, he and Ahsoka feel it. The
clones turn on Citizen Ahsoka, all except Rex.
Ahsoka frees Maul as a distraction. She and Rex
fight their way out, but oops! Maul takes the
only ship, and Rex and Ahsoka survive a crashing
spaceship on a snowy planet. After marking a
grave for all of her 501st comrades, Ahsoka and
Rex leave. Sometime later, Vader investigates.
leaving us with a chilling scene of black -cloaked
Vader almost mourning his past life in the white
snow. Keep your finger on the pause button and
rewind that tape. It's time for the prestige
category. What did we notice on this watch through?
I cried through like half of this. I'm only partially
joking. There were a number of times that I was
genuinely tearing up. One specific at the beginning,
one very meaningful one in the middle. And I
wanted to yell at Rex at one point, because if
you cry, then I'm going to cry. And I've had
enough crying. I am already crying enough in
my life. I don't need this from you. I watch
TV to escape. But that is how well I think that.
This really pulls on those relationships that
these characters have had throughout Clone Wars,
throughout Star Wars prequels in general. So
I think it's very well done. On to plot points
that I'm really kind of honing in here. Obi -Wan
is no longer the only one on Maul's revenge list,
which I feel like is very key to Maul's character
in general. And he also... he being Maul, now
wants Sidious to lose his apprentice in the same
way that Maul lost Savage. So now Maul is after
Anakin as well, because he knows that Anakin
is set to be Sidious's apprentice. Which is like,
hey man, when'd you figure out that information?
It's a little... It's a little off page. It is
a little off page. I also think it's funny that
like in the condo that is Maul's revenge, it
is funny that he built a little like, like he
annexed a little bit of somebody else's condo
right next to him to fill with a closet of Palpatine
revenge line. It's like walking into a shrine
of Obi -Wan and off to the right is a little
picture of Sidious. I think it's really fascinating.
Yes, it absolutely does. I think it's fascinating
that Maul is super aware that Anakin is key to
all this. Like, he literally, in a very Dooku
way, where in Attack of the Clones, Dooku's like,
by the way, here's the whole plan. Why are you
telling me to this like a Bond villain? Well,
I was a Bond villain. Says Christopher Lee. But
Maul here is also kind of like... Yes, Anakin.
And Ahsoka's like, what does Anakin have to do
with any of this? And he's like, he has to do
with everything. It's crazy. It's super cool.
Really fun. Creates a chilling moment for Ahsoka
that even though we know it, I feel like really
works in a way that a lot of prequels don't.
Where it's like, I know who's living and who's
dying and I know what's going to happen. But
this is a moment where it's like. Whoa, that's
really cool. And I think that was a really super
well done tone wise and getting the message across
to the audience. Yeah, definitely. And I also
find it interesting that, you know, Ahsoka obviously
doesn't believe Maul when he says that Anakin
is turned to the dark side and Anakin's the key
to all this and et cetera, et cetera, even though
Maul is 100 % correct. But her main concern with
teaming up with Maul. to take down Sidious is
that she thinks that Maul will rise up to take
his place. And I, on kind of first blush, I go,
oh, but that makes sense, right? Like, she doesn't
want another villain coming in. He's clearly
shown that he's very cunning, very intelligent,
and he can work his way up in, you know, the
ladder of the world. However, I feel like this
isn't quite the valid concern. that she thinks
it is. Because as much as Maul has all of that
ability, and we've seen what he's able to do
with Mandalore, he doesn't have nearly the amount
of connections, plotting time, or ability to
be as dangerous as Sidious. And so if they were
to team up, take down Sidious, and then Maul
was going to try to step into that place, I feel
like it would be... Not easy, necessarily, because
we've seen that Maul is fairly formidable, but
it would definitely be easier than taking down
Sidious for Ahsoka and company to take down Maul.
One of the reasons is because they know who Maul
is. Like, half of Sidious' success is due to
the fact that he's sitting there as our pal Pateen
going, and Mace Windu's right next to him going,
what's funny, bud? Instead of being like, the
dark side surrounds this Chancellor. We should
do something about that. Yeah, I think it would
be an easier take out. Although, I... Sorry,
I'll give you your moment. I just... Mace's whole
thing there just really kills me every time.
This is specifically in Revenge. But... I sense
a plot to destroy the Jedi. I'm just sitting
there going, oh, you do, do you? Now you sense
this? I forget what animated thing this is from
where somebody goes, oh, do you? It makes me
think of Dory with do ya, do ya, do ya. Yeah,
absolutely. We should make a decision. Do you
want that part kept or do you want to save it
for revenge? I can say it twice. Okay. It just
cracks me up. Well, because the next part is,
the dark side surrounds the Chancellor. And I
just go, you're just now sensing this? Not literally
any other time you've been in the room with him,
but just now? Just right now. But yes, that's
a huge part of Palpatine slash Sidious' success,
is he's been able to disguise himself as - Nobody
recognizes his chin. Right. The lower half of
his very recognizable face is completely unrecognizable.
I don't know. It's like a Clark Kent situation
where you're like, how could people not notice?
But then Dolly Parton just takes off her wig
and goes out in public and no one ever recognizes
her. So, like, you know. Well, like, Daniel Radcliffe
talks about how he flies around on New York subways
all the time because he just wears, like, a medical
mask. Yeah. And nobody recognized. So maybe we
are just a bit stupider than we'd like to give
ourselves credit for. That being said, with Ahsoka
and Maul's part, I would rather have her go and
try and take him down rather than not try and
be wrong. So if we're going with best case of
win -win, win -lose, lose -lose, I'm good with
her going and doing this. Especially because
it's the only way that citizen Ahsoka is allowed
to go and do anything. I will also say that chemistry
between Maul and Ahsoka is wildly good. So good.
Like, their conversations, there is almost a...
It's hard to describe, because it is not a sexual
tension, but it is a magnetism between the two
of them that is... That feels almost and could
be misread as sexual in nature. There is an electricity
between the two of them as characters that make
me go, hey, can she be in the Maul show? Right.
Please? This would be great. I would love to
see them together. Because they balance each
other out. They're able to interact as a tete
-a -tete. And Maul has this hubris, but he has
this begrudging. like, respect for her. It's
almost very Han and Rey in that way. One of the
reasons why Han and Rey in Force Awakens work
so well is that Han is like, hey, kid, you're
pretty good. And Maul does that, but also is
seductive in his attempt to lure her to the dark
side. Right. I think it's super interesting because
while we get the very... kind of fun and amusing
chemistry between Maul and Obi -Wan with their
banter and their fighting back and forth, which
is also kind of represented in... I feel like
it's this middle ground, honestly, now that I'm
kind of talking it through. I feel like Maul
and Ahsoka is this middle ground between Maul
and Obi -Wan and Obi -Wan and Ventress. Yeah,
totally. Because Obi -Wan and Ventress definitely
leans more towards that, like... Flirtatious
side, which I think is is purposeful on both
of their parts to try to throw each other off
because both of them know that. No. But like
just the fact that it's this, you know, Sith
woman trying to tempt the the nice jet, the nice
clean Jedi, I think she thinks is hilarious.
So I think that it doesn't quite get that far
in the flirtation, but they still have this.
energy between them that i think really just
comes from the fact that they're both very evenly
matched in terms of not necessarily i mean ability
but also their convictions and what they stand
for not that they're opposite or the same but
just how strong they are in their yeah totally
you know ahsoka is very strong in her belief
in the force and her conviction that the jedi
life as it is is not right for her however the
force and all of that really connects with her
and who she is whereas maul is very much the
like i'm going to take what i can from the force
and use it for my own gain and that conviction
of this is the way the force should be used in
both cases is that polarizing effect that keeps
them kind of coming together, but also bouncing
off of each other. And it's very entertaining.
Yeah, totally. So moving on from Maul and Ahsoka,
we'll switch our attention over to Rex for a
minute, because Order 66 is occurring now, and
Rex is able to resist. his inhibitor chip just
long enough to issue this final warning to Ahsoka
to find Fives and to find out what happened to
him to explain what is Order 66 and what is happening
right now. And I find this so amazing because
it really shows the strength of the bond that
specifically Ahsoka, Anakin, Obi -Wan have had
with their clone captains. And the clones under
their command in general over the course of this
war. And obviously we don't see as much from
other Jedi, but specifically with the Anakin
Ahsoka Rex Bond, they've spent so much time together,
have had so many moments of life or death, have
been in this close proximity in all of these
situations that really test. your loyalty to
people and your trust in them. And the fact that
Rex is able to push through this programmed thing
in his brain to be able to give her a last warning
is a really wonderful and honestly was one of
those things that kind of had me tearing up because
I was like. Rex, my boy, like, just hang on for
one more second. Don't kill her. I think this
is a really good sequence all around to the start
of Order 66 to the end of the episode. As you
know, I'm not a big fan of the inhibitor chip.
So this whole sort of storyline is a bit lost
on me just due to the fact that I have hangups
around it. The inhibitor chip even existing to
begin with. But I will say I do like the bringing
in verbiage from Rogue One as if the Jedi prayer,
I am one with the Force, the Force is one with
me, is an actual thing that is not just the guardians
of the wills in Rogue One. And it is actually
in the Jedi Order itself and that this leads
to a Force moment where Ahsoka is able to remove
the chip from Rex. I think that's really neat.
Yeah, I really enjoy it. I also think kind of
on this topic of connection with the Force, it
is crazy that Maul and Ahsoka feel Order 66 happening
before it happens. They have these visions and
they're able to sense that something is wrong.
And then Order 66 occurs because their connection
to the Force, as we see here, is only on the
level of Anakin and Sidious at this point. Even
Yoda only feels this after it has occurred. He
only feels Order 66 happening after the Jedi
are dying. He doesn't get any kind of forewarning.
He's been so clouded by the dark side that we've
seen throughout Revenge and a little bit in Attack
of the Clones as well, where he's discussing
how the dark side is clouding all of their visions
and whatnot. Maul and Ahsoka are able to push
through that, or they're so connected to the
Force in their own way that they can sense it
before it happens, which is wild. So I, in the
way that that movie is structured, I'm in agreement
with you that it feels like to me that Yoda feels
it after the Jedi start dying. If you go back
and you look at that scene, Yoda feels something.
Then the commander of his clone in Green Kashyyyk
Battalion then receives Order 66 from the Emperor,
turns around, and that's when Yoda chops their
heads off. So there is room for any nitpickers
to say, actually, when Yoda clutches at his heart,
he's feeling mace die. Then Order 66 is given,
and then he chops their heads off. Because they
do the montage of all the Jedi dying, and then
we get to Yoda's part, it does feel like it's
afterwards. And that's the way I want to interpret
it, but I do feel like because it's not that
the Emperor gave Order 66, and then... you know,
gave it again to other people. So unless there's
some sort of satellite delay where it's, he's
like one of the furthest planets out. And so
therefore he's feeling all the Jedi die. And
then it, order 66 just happens to transmit, but.
It's mostly simultaneous. Yeah, I think so. And
so I think that when Yoda feels it, it's probably
him feeling Mace die. But I think what's really
cool about all of this is that Yoda has a super
great connection with Mace. Right. Which for
Yoda has been. a very quick relationship. So
I think it's really cool that they have a very
powerful relationship because Mace is, what,
in his 50s? And Yoda's 850? And also, so he's
got a connection with Mace that's really strong.
Ahsoka has a connection with Anakin, obviously,
that's really strong. And Maul has a connection
with Sidious, whether or not he likes it or not.
Yeah. So that's pretty cool. Yeah, very fascinating.
And also, I think that this scene... Much like
a lot of Clone Wars, which is so additive to
much, gives a lot of weight into Obi -Wan realizing
that Alderaan is gone in A New Hope. Oh, interesting.
Because that moment, because we are learning
for the first time about the Force, that moment
is essentially Luke picks up that something's
wrong with Obi -Wan because of Alec Guinness'
great acting. And then Alec Guinness explains
how it feels, but it's exposition. This is shown,
not told. And I just like, now I have a better
sense of what that feels like. Right. Oh, that's
so interesting. I hadn't, I hadn't placed that
together. Your boy's a genius. My last kind of
note on something that I noticed here is something
that I think I. Would never have thought about
before. Well, I know I would never have thought
about it before because it specifically deals
with the ride at Disneyland. Rise of the Resistance.
All of the clones line up to face Rex and Ahsoka
in this. They're trying to escape. They're trying
to figure out how to get to a ship. And all of
the clones line up in the hangar bay to prevent
them from getting to a ship. really struck me
how similar it is to, I don't want to spoil too
much, but on the Rise of Resistance ride, there
is a moment where some doors open and there are
a whole bunch of stormtroopers. I think anybody's
first time on that ride, it rocks your socks.
It really does. So that really just made that
connection for me. I go, wow, it's like reliving
that moment in this sequence. Yeah. It's just
the scale on the ride when it opens up and you're
like, whoa. And that's all I'll say about that.
I will say in terms of what you're talking about
in this show, I, I, you know, when we were doing
stranger things, we kept talking about like,
what's the best sequence. And I, I'm still fairly
aligned with the fact that, especially now that
we're done with season five, it's season twos.
March through the. The Demogorgons, the Demodogs
with Samwise Gamgee helping Hopper find an escape
route. So good. I think that this is the best
sequence of all of Clone Wars. Is the Order 66
starts Ahsoka's fight to survive all the way.
Like in terms of it is three quarters of an episode.
It is tight. It is emotional the entire way.
There is a plot to free Maul. which seems very
unlike Ahsoka, but is absolutely in character
in this moment. Maul is even confused. And then
she's like, wait, wait, wait, your bait, which
is a moment of huge triumph for everybody rooting
for Ahsoka's character. There's getting Rex's
chip out of his head, which is a huge victory.
There's his resistance, like you were talking
about, which again goes into this idea of like
little kids loving these clones and being like,
wait, how could they kill all these Jedi? Well,
it turns out one of them can resist. There's
the poor justice for the droids that I want.
These droids that are being so helpful that get
absolutely obliterated by clones. So sad. Because
the droids are so full of joy for me, anytime
that they're obliterated, it actually makes me
a little bit more emotional than anything else
in the show. It's like in a movie when the dog
dies. Right, exactly. And so it almost feels
traumatizing in a way. But then you've got this,
like, Maul's running around causing chaos, kind
of. The droid's going around causing chaos. Ahsoka
and Rex working really hard together. Ahsoka
facing some really tough choices. Ahsoka holding
onto a spaceship as Maul tries to take off, letting
him go. And then surviving an entire crash on
the planet with her dueling with two lightsabers.
Where we've seen her train for this, specifically.
So, it... It's just a mind -blowing sequence,
and I think out of all seven seasons, it's my
favorite. It's definitely fantastic, for sure.
The Ahsoka holding on to Maul's ship is very
reminiscent of Rey trying to pull back on Chewie's
ship, the ship that Chewie is on in Rise of Skywalker.
And I will say it here, folks, Ahsoka did it
better. So Sierra, not to do a whole lore galore
for a second, but I'm going to pull the curtain
back for a moment. There's not just two people
that have done this. Holding onto a spaceship
is an EU thing that happens. But even if you're
not like, okay, let's just count the books. Sam
Witwer's original Star Wars character, Starkiller
from the Force Unleashed games, does this in
a majorly better way than what we see. Additionally,
Once you watch the Obi -Wan Kenobi show, I will
not say anything more, but I think actually that
show does it the best. Oh man, I'm so excited
for you to watch it. I'm very excited to watch
it. For anybody who's listening and is like,
why hasn't Sierra watched it? Sierra's trying
to watch everything in chronological order as
we go through Star Wars. And I have specifically
saved certain shows and things. To be able to
watch in context. Yes, excellent. Otherwise,
I would have watched a lot of these things a
long time ago. Well, I know you just lost a hand
losing an argument to me about stuff that you
don't know about. But listen up. It's the I am
your father category for most iconic character
moment. And what is the most important character
moment of this entire arc? So, iconic. Character
moment. Sierra, what do you got? Find him. Fives.
Rex's moment. I do like it. I will say, I think
the more iconic one, when people think about
all of the Revenge of the Sith corresponding
episodes, is the line from Sam Witwer as he appears
out of the tunnels of Mandalore in darkness going,
I was hoping for Kenobi. What are you doing here?
Which I do think is more iconic. Not more important
and not better, but more iconic. I can give you
that. The delivery is really where it's at. Precisely.
It's the delivery. For important, I had... Ahsoka
has this incredibly pivotal character moment
where she's been ride or die for her squad. And
for Anakin. And not for the Jedi. And not for
Obi -Wan. And not for everybody else. But ride
or die for her clones and Anakin. And now she
has to choose to fight the 501st Legion. And
it takes a bit of Rex telling her, they don't
care about you. They're going to take you down
and this ship. Because they want to kill you
for her to do it. But she does choose to fight
and to kill them. Which I think is the thing
that makes her character what it becomes. Moving
forward in Rebels than the Ahsoka show. I agree.
I had the same thing for important. It really
is just the most pivotal character moment in
these episodes. Hands down. And speaking of down,
everybody sit down. It's time for our I am Iron
Man. Most iconic and most important scene category.
Would you like to start with your honorable mention?
Yeah, the honorable mention that I have is Maul
and Ahsoka's throne room duel on Mandalore. It
is so cool. I think probably very iconic. I don't
think it's as important as what we've got in
first place, though. I would agree. What we have
in first place is the very, very end of Clone
Wars, the very, very end of these episodes we're
talking about, which is... Darth Vader standing
in front of a line of clone graves and finding
Ahsoka's lightsaber in the snow. Yeah. He now
thinks slash knows that all of the 501st is dead,
that Ahsoka is dead, that Rex is dead, and that
he basically caused this to happen slash allowed
it to happen. And this is huge, huge for him,
especially since the lightsaber that he's holding
is the customized blue that he has given her
specifically on her return. So this is just broadening
out for a second, bigger picture, zooming out
away from just the narrative. TV series endings
are hard. Yes. You get really good classic ones
like The Soprano, which was super controversial
and now is extremely beloved. You get Parks and
Rec's endings, which was beloved immediately
and still beloved now. It is hard to nail. Sitcoms,
I think, actually are a little easier because
you just kind of bring up nostalgia and say goodbye
to everybody. But it's still really hard to do
TV endings. And this has got to be one of the
best ones, I think. It's very well done. It's
even if you don't like the last whole season
seven, which a lot of people don't because of
Ahsoka's like sister storyline, which goes on
for like five episodes and takes a lot of time
away from literally anybody else. It's quite
lackluster. And it does very much seem like the
only reason is to get to this. To get her to
find out the audience. I feel like they felt
like they owed the audience what was going on
with Ahsoka. I just don't know that that was
a story worth telling. Yeah. That being said,
in terms of being responsible with your women
characters, that is a whole arc about women,
like supporting women, which is cool, especially
with how they nerf Padme. But still a little
lackluster, as you say, with only one real thing,
which is, oh, Maul. Right. Which then launches
this sequence. So from a big perspective, like
this is a chilling, awesome scene. And from a
character perspective for Anakin, some of the
best stuff that has come out in Disney canon,
in my opinion, is the contextualization around
Anakin still being inside Vader. Because this
is not Vader. No. Who's standing in the snow.
I mean, like literally is. It's Darth Vader in
his black costume and all that sort of stuff
with his helmet. But it's Anakin. Mourning his
past life. And you think about he's lost his
brother, Obi -Wan, who's betrayed him and cut
him up. And he now has like a sort of Maul -like
revenge sense against him. He lost his wife.
And whether that was done by Palpatine or if
that was just she dying of a broken heart, that's
up for debate. But he doesn't know anything other
than he's lost his baby because he doesn't know
about twins. And he's lost his wife and he's
lost his brother and he's done horrible things
to try and save his wife, which hasn't worked
out. And now he's stuck in this life and there's
no respite. And it's going to be interesting
because there is a point where Ahsoka and Darth
Vader are going to meet. But there's a lot of
change that will have happened between those
two events. So be on the lookout for that, listeners,
when we cover Rebels. Crack open an encyclopedia.
It's time for our, as Elijah Wood once said,
no, how could we have known category, where we
discuss the most important information disseminated
to the fandom in this television show. It's really
just two pieces of information. One is Vader
thinks that Ahsoka and Rex are dead. That's important
enough. You know, it covers why Ahsoka is still
around, why Rex is still around. But the main
thing, I think, is that Maul survives because
Ahsoka lets him go and then he steals the ship.
Yep. That's why we're getting a mall show. Heck
yeah. Let's go. Time to keep your horses safe,
because it's my favorite category. I'm going
to make him an offer he can't refuse. Category
of best lines. We have just a couple here. There
was only a couple episodes. A lot of it was fighting,
guys. So here we go. My favorite line was, blast,
blast. This first one, I think it might be my
favorite one of Clone Wars because of the impact
that it has. And it made me cry. It did. I said
this at the beginning. I said these episodes
made me cry. And this was the very beginning
of it. And this is where it started. They know
what you went through for them. Day after day,
battle after battle. loyalty means everything
to the clones. And if that doesn't put a chill
in your spine, knowing what's to come. Yikes.
Yeah. Uh, I survived and I can thrive in the
chaos that is to come. That's a mall quote. It's
a great line. So good. This. And then this last
one is just indicative of what we were talking
about between Maul and Ahsoka. Do you want me
to do the Maul part and you can do the Ahsoka
part? Yes, please. Excellent. You have Kenobi's
arrogance. You'll find I have many qualities
for you to dislike. I really like that exchange.
Their connection is just so electric. And I could
have done with a whole series arc of her and
him. Yes. That would have been incredible. It
would have been so good. And I've already said
my favorite line, which is, I was expecting Kenobi.
What are you doing here? It's a great line. So
good. But it's time for us to board the TARDIS
and explore what ifs with our get out category.
So what are the what ifs provided by this TV
show? What if Ahsoka and Maul joined forces?
What if she said yes? Obviously, Maul is mostly
playing Ahsoka here, or at least just trying
to get her on board enough to accomplish what
he wants. But in a world where Ahsoka believes
him about Anakin, which she kind of should because
he is right. But I get it. Her unwavering faith.
I understand. Maul is disenfranchised by the
Sith. Ahsoka is disenfranchised by the Jedi.
They could make a f - fascinating team to find
the middle ground. Yeah. If they're able to each
budge from their convictions, which they never
will. Which I actually don't think is like literally
physically possible because of the whole Mortis
storyline in season three of Clone Wars where
Ahsoka is. killed, becomes the dark side puppet,
but then literally saved by the light side. So
I don't think that physically Ahsoka could ever
sort of shirk her morals like that. But that
being said, first of all, Ahsoka would look really,
really pretty sweet. In some tatted, Maul -inspired,
like, red and black outfits. That would be super
cool. Crimson Dawn, like, being run by Kira,
Ahsoka, and Maul would be amazing. I also think
that they would become so powerful that the Emperor
and Vader would have to kill them a lot earlier
and that we wouldn't get any interesting storylines.
Because if Sidious was already like, you have
become a rival with a dunce like Savage, who's
powerful, but a dunce. Imagine Ahsoka. Being
with Maul. Sidious would be like, wait a second.
You guys might actually rule us. So we got to
kill you now. My what if is, what if Anakin and
Ahsoka did actually get to speak to each other?
Because you remember there's this moment where
Ahsoka's like, I would like to speak with Master
Skywalker. And Obi -Wan is like, no, actually
Anakin's gone off to do such and such. And I
really wonder what would happen if Ahsoka had
been able to talk to Anakin right there. I don't
know why. There's no actual evidence for me to
feel this way. But it feels like that was a missed
moment of light side or dark side for Anakin.
I do feel that way as well. I think that there
is justification because throughout Clone Wars,
we do see that Ahsoka really speaks to a little
bit more of the innocence of Anakin and him seeing
what it was like as a Padawan himself. be interested
in the force and being a jedi for the first time
and i think that she also really touches on that
where obi -wan is his brother ahsoka is his little
sister and he feels protective of her but also
that he can learn from her and i feel that that
connection Would really have spoken to him in
that moment. And depending on exactly when that
conversation takes place, I would argue pre or
post youngling situation. Yeah. Would really
dictate. What would happen because if Ahsoka
can get to Anakin before that occurs. That's
when this conversation would have occurred. Yeah.
Which, which I think that could make a real case
for him. Understanding what he's walking into
and the lure of the dark side and how he needs
to be a little bit more on his guard. And then
if, because I believe that there's also a moment
where she has another. time that she could try
to speak to him or leave a message for him essentially
and just says i'll talk to him when i see him
yeah and that would have been post younglings
but i think that it could have made anakin hesitate
A little bit. And maybe Padme would have lived
or maybe, you know, depending on how you kind
of read that whole situation, or perhaps he would
not have gone full Vader. Something in that could
be twisted. But I also think that if they do
have a actual conversation, it's not just Ahsoka
leaving him a message. That opens up Ahsoka to
a lot more choices. Yeah. And she may join Maul
in the attempt to save Anakin. Yeah. From Sidious,
potentially. Because Younglings is after Order
66, which is, like, Ahsoka is not joining Maul
at that point because the clones are attacking
her, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. Except
for that she does interact with him to let him
go as bait. And that situation could be different.
Right, but there's no way that she's having a
conversation with Anakin post -Order 66. Oh,
I understand. Yes. Yeah, I am. So, and I just
have a tough time thinking, by the time that
Anakin has killed younglings, I think he's in.
I don't think there's any changing him on that.
You know, mind hesitancies, I think he's full
of those for the next 20 plus years. And that's
one of the reasons why the Emperor never truly
trusts him. And it continues to manipulate and
control him. But I do, it just, it does feel
like a missed opportunity. It feels like a moment
where... I don't know. Just, you know, it's just
it's a classic one of those setups where, hey,
hey, don't. No, no, no, no, no. And you've seen
the movie a thousand times and you know that
the character is going to make the wrong decision
and they do it anyways. And you're like, oh,
and that's what that moment is to me. And it's
very effective that way. Yeah, I agree. Rip open
that candy wrapper and show us your golden ticket.
It's time for the Veruca Salt Award for piece
of memorabilia that we really, really need. We
kind of have the same thing. Kind of. Kind of.
Kind of. A 501st helmet. A 212th helmet. And
I do have those. So that shows you how much I
really, really needed them. So my pick is coming
from the fact that I think that a lot of Ahsoka
merch out there stinks in general for adults.
I think that there's a lot of great Ahsoka merch
for kids, obviously. And in general, I'm not
a big, like, trooper helmet guy. That changes
when it comes to Mandalorian gear, let me tell
you. And I still don't own any Mandalorian gear.
But in general, I'm like, yeah, the helmets are
cool, et cetera, et cetera. But man, would I
pay money for the 501sts in Ahsoka's paint that
they do for this last art. Which I think it's
just, it just warms my heart. It's so... Yeah,
exactly. Precisely. That sigh is exactly what
it feels like in a sound. And I think that it
is also signified by that quote that I said,
you know, the reason why they do this for her
and paint their helmets for her is because they're
so loyal and because they truly care for her
and trust her and totally missed her when she
was gone. Yes. Big sigh. Heavy sigh. Big sigh
indeed. So in a segment that is not planned and
not scripted, we've now come to the end of the
Clone Wars. And so I just have two questions
for you, really. Maybe three. Let's go with three.
One is, over all the Clone Wars, Sierra, what
is your favorite arc? Wow. Wow, what a question.
Holy moly. To me, it's the Immortus planet arc.
Because of the ramifications of what the Force
is. The father, the son, and the daughter being
the force. And then the light side and the dark
side. And what Anakin is able to do. And what
happens to Ahsoka. And what happens to Obi -Wan.
It's not, like, my favorite story. If that makes
any sense. Like, I find all the Mandalore stuff
much more interesting. I find the clones. Fighting
against that one awful Jedi who's like, I'm going
to rule the, whatever his name is, Krell. Krell,
yeah. Krell, yeah. That is a more interesting
story. But in terms of the ramifications of Force
lore, which we will continue to explore in Ahsoka's
show, I just feel like that is my favorite at
the end of the day. Interesting. So. I have a
hard time narrowing down. And I think it's because
there are arcs that I enjoy. Like the young Padawans
going and getting their kyber crystals and becoming
Jedi for real and all of that. I love that arc.
I think it's a great - Lightsaber to your head
though, Sierra. You gotta pick one. Oh my gosh.
What's the one that comes up sort of instinctually?
I think it's, honestly, as much as I hate it,
I love it. It's the clones with Master Krell.
Yeah. That's what I thought you were going to
say, to be fair. When you talk about that, that's
the one that you get the most passionate about,
certainly. Because I hate it so much, and I love
it so much. Because I love the clones so much,
and I have very passionate feelings about these
characters. And Krell is just so awesome. horrible
that i agonize over it yeah but that is the one
that when i when i think about clone wars that
is the first thing i think of yeah okay so second
question of all the pieces of information disseminated
now i'm not talking about just solo pieces of
information so like you could say Anakin's character
being completely explored could be an answer.
Of all the information disseminated over the
course of Clone Wars, one piece of information,
what's the one that you come away with that you
feel like is the most interesting to you? I mean,
it is that. It's Anakin's character arc. It's
understanding why they will grant him the rank
of Master. It is understanding why the Council
even... tolerates him. It's the reason why he's
in the position that he's in, why they trust
him with certain missions, why they think that
he'll actually spy on Palpatine. It explains
everything about who he is, and you understand,
I mean, even why Padme cares for him. You know,
I feel like there's so much missing. I feel like
there's so much missing if you just go from Attack
of the Clones to Revenge of the Sith. And this
really, you know, you were my brother. Even that
one line is so dictated by the events of Clone
Wars. Yeah. So that really is it. For me, it's
really a toss up between these two, but I'll
say this one is most interesting to me because
you've already gone with Anakin. It's the exploration
of what's wrong with the Jedi. Culminating in
Ahsoka leaving the Order and that incredible
monologue by Barriss, who's already turned her
lightsaber red with dark side energy, still being
dead on correct about the fact that this is not
the way that the Jedi are supposed to be. And
it really shows me the corruption from within
that Anakin is annoyed and frustrated with. And
that Obi -Wan is turning a bit of a blind eye,
too, by the time we get to Revenge of the Sith.
So I think the exploration of what's wrong with
the Jedi Order is, to me, the most interesting
thing. And my third question. When we first started
coming up with this podcast idea, and we thought
that we were going to do Star Wars first, and
that was before we decided to do Stranger Things,
we talked a lot about, man, it'll be really interesting
to see. What preconceived opinions that we have
about Star Wars or about characters might change?
So for you, what has changed? I think in general,
most of my opinions have remained the same. I
still don't fully care for Ahsoka in general.
However, I do respect her place in the canon.
a little bit more. And especially on this watch
with these final episodes that we've been talking
about, I think that that really has a much more
impactful going forward for me that I didn't
really feel before. So I think that's one thing
that has shifted a little bit in terms of kind
of who I Like or dislike or the storylines that
I have found impactful. I feel like a lot of
that has remained the same. I will say, though,
that I do think I have a little bit more of an
attention to detail when it comes to issues with
the Jedi Order. Because beforehand, I think it
was more just due to the fact that I wasn't honing
in on it or. focused on it at all and so I was
able to let a lot of those things slide but then
re -watching from kind of that framework and
that lens on it did open my eyes a lot more to
the problems and I think that that really comes
to a head when I think about Yoda and Mace and
I don't like them as much as I used to I think
that's the biggest thing for me that's the biggest
change in my views on characters specifically,
but situations as well, is that I feel like most
people who are maybe around our age, when you
saw Yoda in the prequels, it was, he's this funny
green guy. And oh my gosh, look at him flipping
around and fighting and all that. And you got
excited about it. And I know that he's always
been my brother's, one of my brother's favorite
characters. And I think Mace is also one of my
brother's favorite characters. And so, Really
watching kind of from this lens of what is going
on with the Jedi Order and what's wrong with
it. I find myself angry at them because they're
really allowing all of this to happen. And they're
turning this blind eye. And I think that that
has really colored my opinion of both of those
characters, which is a little sad. It is what
it is, but I do find myself... from maybe a nostalgia
standpoint, feeling a little upset about it because
I did truly really enjoy both of these characters.
And now when I watch them, I just want to yell
at them. Yeah. I think for me, certainly my opinions
on Yoda have changed a lot. And in the way that
my opinions about Albus Dumbledore changed, the
further I got into adulthood and the more I was
like, wait a second. Hold on a minute. What are
we doing here, Dumble? Come on. There wasn't
a better plan? You weren't a bit smarter than
you are? I really respect Ahsoka more than ever.
Her arc in Seasons 4, 5, and then in 7, in the
second half with Mandalore and stuff, made me
really enjoy her character a lot more. Makes
me respect her more in Rebels. Makes me respect
her more in... The Ahsoka show. I think without
this show. Revenge of the Sith isn't as good.
And I. I talked about this. In our Revenge of
the Sith pod. So I don't need to belabor it.
But essentially. The movie works a lot better.
Because of this show. Which is frustrating to
me. Because as I've mentioned. In all sorts of
different podcasts. That I've been on. I want
the story to be able. to be at its peak and best
within the main medium it's in. So if you're
doing the movies, let's have the movies be as
good as possible and have everything else be
additive in not such an important way as this
fleshing out of Anakin's character does. Now,
I'm still glad that we got it. I think the thing
that surprises me most is that I feel very similar
about this show from a big picture perspective
than I did the first time. And what I mean by
that is it's like it is a show that struggles.
The first three seasons are not nearly as good
as the last four seasons. It is a show that is
not as deep as a lot of people want to make it.
They don't dive into some of these politics and
problems with the world as deeply as I think
a lot of fans are like, yeah, it does this and
this and this. Well, no, it touches upon it.
And what you're able to do. What you're able
to read in subtextually can be really interesting.
But I think about juxtaposing this show with
Avatar The Last Airbender, Dave Filoni's other
big material that I've worked with. They go hard
in about capitalism and imperialism. There's
that huge monologue from Zuko about, like, we
were taught in the Fire Nation that this was
the best nation in the world, parroting what
a lot of— elementary and middle schools were
teaching at the time in the United States, like
some real bravery there in tackling that. And
to me, this show goes only so far in doing that.
And I think that was the biggest surprising to
me. Now there's a lot more information to be
gleaned in the universe and all that stuff, but
I came out feeling still, yeah, this show is
good, but it's not S tier to me. And that was,
it's a hard place to be after spending this much
time with it because I really want it to be an
S tier and it's just not. Today's public service
announcement. When faced with a red -horned devil
and an offer to take down a Sith Lord and rule
the underworld together, do it. What could go
wrong? What could go wrong? Thank you, dear listeners,
for listening to this episode of Fandom Shmandom.
If you'd like to discuss this episode or any
other episode we've done, please hit us up on
our social media channels. You can find us on
TikTok and Instagram at Fandom Shmandom Pod,
or you can head on over to patreon .com slash
CW slash Fandom Shmandom. We have a new bit on
there about Sierra's trip to Epic Universe and
us talking about that park. So go ahead and check
that. Out. Please don't forget to rate and review
us if you liked the episode. It really helps
the algorithm place us in front of other like
-minded schmishners out there. And with that,
we're out, y 'all. Don't forget to tip your loyal
clone troopers. And fare thee well. Fun fact,
my mic picks up my claps now. Oh, good. Yeah.
Not sure why. It said, f*** Montana. Yeah, pretty
much. Let's do this before I overheat and have
a hot flash on live podcasting. Okay. It's fine.
It's what happens. I'm just imagining what. It
was like 87 today. Yeah. It's supposed to be
like 34 in like two days. It's hot here. And
it's 87 today. In California too. I just don't
imagine like what a hot flash would be like on
a podcast. It's just me heavy breathing. It's
hot. I'm hot. Well, that's the thing is like
the humidity kicked in like yesterday. Yeah.
And I, I mean, I've got asthma. So like. Right.
And I've got asthma and I'm pregnant. And so
I can't breathe anyway. So I'm just like, I'm
just like. And now it's hot on top of it. So
I'm just like. All right. Well, here goes a good
recording. This morning's a real thing. It's
great. Let's go. Leaving us with a chilling scene
of black cloaked Vader. Nope. Black. Cloaked
Vader. Vader. Vader. It's revealed in Rebels
that Rex actually removes his inhibitor chip
before Order 66. Blah, blah, blah. It's revealed
in Rebels that Rex actually removes his inhibitor
chip before Order 66. Oh my god. I got this.
It's revealed in Rebels that Rex actually removes
his inhibitor chip before Order 66. Good God.
One more time. Here we go. The kind of last thing
that struck me in these couple of episodes. Sorry,
I'm going to redo that. Please do. That sounded
rude. Go ahead. No, that's fine. Please do. You
better. I think it really is just the most pivotable.
Pivotable. It's pivotable. Pivotable. You can
pivot on it. Pivot. Pivot. I can't say sick as
fuck, can I? Don't. Even. What is the word I'm
looking for? Fucks with him. Sorry, editors.
Bye.