Welcome to Fandom Shmandum, the fandom podcast
that covers everything you love and more. I'm
Sierra Obermark. And I'm Sam Williams. For today's
episode, we will be boastfully blathering about
Stranger Things, the Season 1 finale, Episode
8. And without further ado, we will, as Roger
Smith says, dive on in. So get up to 88, because
it's time to travel back for our one -episode
story recap. Just as everyone got together, they're
all apart again. Joyce and Hopper are trapped
inside Hawkins' lab. Joyce is having a lovely
chat with Brenner. And Hopper is trying to convince
the security to let him and Joyce find Will.
The children have been left alone at the gym.
Jonathan and Nancy are at the buyer's, putting
nails through a bat and loading a gun. In an
attempt to get rid of Joyce and Hopper, the lab
does indeed let them go into the Upside Down
to rescue Will, but only because Hopper tells
Brenner where Eleven is. We get flashbacks of
Hopper with his child Sarah. While it's clear
Jonathan and Nancy would do well on Survivor
together, they're going to lure the Demogorgon
to them and use human intelligence to fell the
big old beast of the buyer's burden. But Steve
is back! And winning our hearts somehow? He's
here to apologize, but Nancy pulls a gun on him.
And then the lights start blinking and welcome
to the party, Steve. There's a big ol' monster
coming for ya. With some ingenuity, they kill
the monster. Which is not the biggest victory
of the night. No! Dustin has found some chocolate
pudding! Chocolate pudding! And Mike kisses Eleven
while the bad men arrive to capture her. But
don't worry, she kills everyone trying to get
her, and that somehow doesn't raise any red flags
to Mike or even Lucas, who you would think would
be maybe like, ah, no, she is real bad. Hopper
and Joyce track some fresh blood to the public
library in the Upside Down. Brenner finds Eleven
finally, and she calls him Papa in front of everyone.
But all that blood leaking out of Eleven's murder
victims has drawn a new or the same Demogorgon.
And for some reason, Brenner approaches it and
it mauls him. I don't understand why he takes
a step towards the Demogorgon. Finally, Joyce's
find will. And he's got some sort of weird tube
shoved in him. Is it from Vecna? What's it doing?
Why is it in him? We don't know. Only that it
writhes when Hopper takes it out and then he
shoots it. since you can't actually ask it any
questions. Is L dying? Because it certainly seems
like it. She's used too much of her powers. Lucas
has no shot of killing the Demogorgon with a
slingshot, but L, using her powers, disintegrates
it. Hopper and Joyce find Will. They revive him,
and all seems right with the world again. Except,
maybe not. While Will is alive, Eleven is missing.
Hopper is taken for a drive by some sort of agents.
and Will can't quite shake the upside down. He's
throwing up leftover slugs from it and flashing
back to that strange, evil world. But don't worry.
Hopper is leaving food for someone in the woods.
Is that Eleven's theme music? Well, no, it's
Christmas music, so Merry Christmas, everyone.
Merry Christmas, Sierra, and Steve's wonderful
sweater. Well, Find your donut holes, Sam, because
it's time for our Knives Out category, where
we soothe out which three storylines are the
most vital to pay attention to. Number one, Hopper
and Joyce. Number two, Jonathan, Nancy, and a
smidgen of Steve. And number three, The Literal
Children. Okay, so. This first storyline, Hopper
and Joyce, they are captured at the end of episode
seven. The first conversation starts with Brenner
being like, hey, six people have been taken by
this monster. I just need 11 to save your son
and everybody else that might be killed by it.
And Joyce is like, no, you left my son to die.
And he's like, ah, the mom got me again. Interesting
to hear just how much he's really concerned about
11 only and really nothing else. Oh, yeah, definitely.
He is singularly focused, which is, I don't know.
I don't even know if there's a word for it. It's
not admirable. It's not great. He's obsessed.
Yes. He's obsessed. Obsessive. That's a good
one. Hopper has a lot of flashbacks to his daughter,
Sarah, just sort of instantly. humanize this
entire storyline and give it a lot of gravitas
and seriousness but they do it in a way that's
not so like oh dead child feels something people
and it's it feels really earned because he's
mentioned her several times you know that she's
passed like all of a sudden now we get to see
sort of his life before all of this and why he's
so hell -bent on uh really opening up and getting
will yeah And then they enter the upside down.
They go into it. They follow it through. They
find Will. They, you know, there's this awesome
sequence of Sarah's sort of demise and trying
to see if Will is going to have that same demise
or not. Some really heartfelt lines delivered
by Winona Ryder. Some incredible acting by David
Harbour. It's just really good. It's very, very
good. Really good. Then we've got Jonathan, Nancy,
and a smidgen. of steve so they leave the gym
unbeknownst to mike and company and they get
to the buyer's house and they're like we're going
to draw it with blood and and they do this great
thing where they're like they clearly already
had a plan but we're joining them halfway through
so we don't know what their plan is so that you
can see it visually unfold uh and they like they
slice their hands open with blood right there
why is it always the palm why is it always I'm
sorry. If you are about to need to grip something,
maybe your shoulder, a leg. Top of your forearm.
The top of the forearm instead of under your
palm. A foot, maybe. The top of your foot. An
ankle. I don't know. I wouldn't even think that.
Gravity's sending blood down to constantly. Okay,
fine. There are still plenty of other locations
on your body than the palm of your hand. And
it's in everything. I'm a big forearm fan. Forearm
fan. Forearm's great. Yeah. Yeah. Nailed it.
It's really tough skin. It's out in the sun all
the time. It'll heal up pretty quick. Like, this
is a phenomenal point that I literally hadn't
thought about until you were like, why is it
the palm? And I was like, well, why not? It's
visually, oh, wait, it doesn't make any sense.
You're so right. And everybody in every TV show
or movie is like, I have to cut myself. Better
cut it right across my palm or I have to dramatically
wrap it and then proceed to do things gripping
with said open wound. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it doesn't
make any sense. Well, well spotted. Anyways,
they do lure it to them, but it's at the exact
same time that Steve, after washing the marquee,
after this little redemption arc that he has,
Shows up and is like, I'm sorry. And then they're
like, you gotta leave. And then Nancy pulls a
gun on him, which is just so funny. And Steve
Harrington's response where he's like, wait,
wait, what? It's so good. He's amazing in this
scene. That entire sequence of those three, I'm
like, wow. People playing the teenagers are phenomenal.
They're great. That scene works so well. And
even Jonathan's line where he channels his dad,
Lonnie, where he's like, I'm not telling you.
Get out. It's like, oh, oh, oh, man. Nancy, how
are you not with him instantly? Maybe not the
best time. That's true. To bring up with Steve
and then start dating Jonathan. Like literally
in one breath. Yeah, probably not. Probably not.
Probably not. Anyway, Steve shows up and he doesn't
run away. Chanting like a little Eddie Munster
in season four. He doesn't run away. He goes
out and he drops his keys. He has got that wonderful
horror moment of dropping his keys. Of course.
And then the lights start flickering again after
he's already seen this Demogorgon. And then he
comes in and he saves Jonathan. He picks up his
famous bat with the nails. Smacks the Demogorgon.
They're able to do the whole trap sequence where...
it goes into like the bear trap thing and then
they set it on fire and it melts and or evaporates
it's not really sure like i still don't know
if it's the same or a different demogorgon yeah
i don't know either i think it's i think it's
a little too unclear not dead yeah i see i'm
on the other side where i'm like i think it's
dead and they're just multiple demogorgons but
who knows who knows yeah And then we've got...
Questions abound. But they've done a really good
job of luring the main Demogorgon that's haunting
Hawkins away from Joyce and David Harbour, whose
name is Hopper. There we go. They do a great
job of luring him away. They've done their whole
piece. And now Steve is fully invested. And we
get to have more of him. And he's done just enough
to save his dating life to Nancy. Yes. Just enough.
Good job. good job by you buddy um then we've
got the literal children's storyline okay so
they're in there and they find chocolate pudding
which is great and they steal way too much of
it like too much it's an insane amount that they
grab they carl from walking dead amount of chocolate
pudding it's stupid how much they take they're
like there is a great post about how uh Cuddlefish
can exert self -control. And the caption of this
post, somebody wrote, Upstaged by a Cuddlefish
once again. They're all upstaged by Cuddlefish.
Don't be upstaged by Cuddlefish. Exert some self
-control. I get it. Chocolate pudding's amazing,
but come on. Anyways, the bad men find them because
Hopper... I don't think this gets talked enough
about. Hopper sells out Eleven's location to
go get Will. Yeah. And then he goes on to be
her protector and her dad. And to do everything
in his power to keep her. But, like, he absolutely
sells her. Yeah. I... I'd like to believe that
he's seen enough by now to be like, she can take
care of herself. Hopefully. Maybe he's banking
on that. It's not a great look. It's also his
only leverage. It is. It really is. He has one
final card to play. Yeah. And he has to play
it, otherwise he's not gonna get Will, and he's
standing there with the mother of said child,
like... He kind of is backed into a corner on
this one, but... He has no way of knowing that
they're going to not confirm that she's there
before they let them go into the Upside Down.
So I think that's why he gives her the real location,
but he's just like, she's in the gym, and Brenna's
like, great, good, you're good to go in. Go die.
Basically. But... Doesn't he send them somewhere
else? It just says the school and they don't
know that they're in the gym. No, they send them
and they go into the gym first, but they've already
moved to the cafeteria. But he doesn't know that.
Because I thought that they saw all the things,
all the vans pull up and go in a different area.
They do. So Mike and Eleven and everybody have
moved away from the gym location. The agents
go straight into the gym location, but I don't
think that Hopper knows that they've moved yet.
I could be wrong about that, but that's my, it
is great. And maybe that's what he's banking
on. He's banking on Mike and Levin and everybody
keeping her safe and that she can take care of
herself. But it's also, it's wild from all fronts
because he gives up his only bit of leverage.
They don't confirm. They sent him there into
the upside down and Brenner's like, let them
go. Yeah. Because, because they're going to die
in there. So this is an easy way of happening.
But it's like, but man, you haven't confirmed
if she's there yet, and he's the only one that
knows where she is, so... Oh, yeah, it's wild.
I know it's for plot reasons, but it is just
stupidity on both of their parts. Oh, yeah. Anyways,
they find them. Eleven has this, like, serial
killer moment. Oh, yeah. Which is the reason
why, in season four, we're willing to believe
that she killed everybody else in... Yeah. In
the lab with her. Because... The woman who kills
Benny, and then we think might kill the favorite
MVP, Mr. Clark, she's standing there pointing
a gun at Eleven, and Eleven just squishes all
the brains of everybody around her. Once again,
she collapses this time. That does seem like
a lot of effort to squeeze a bunch of brains.
They all die, and they all have blood running
everywhere, but it's kind of an eerie moment.
It's terrifying. This is another, like, I forgot
type of moment where I was like, um, her body
count is very high. Very high. She kills a lot
of people this season. Yeah. A lot. A lot. And
yes, they are quote, quote, bad guys. And yes,
you know, they're from the lab that was essentially
keeping her captive. brainwashing and whatever
else they're doing to, to these kids and, and
et cetera, et cetera. So they're not upstanding,
but that's a lot of death on her. It's also like,
she's already proven that she can incapacitate.
She broke Troy's arm. Yeah. She doesn't necessarily
have to kill her. So like the temper on her to
just go, Oh my God, this woman killed Benny,
who was nice to me. I'm going to kill everybody,
including her is. intense and i like talk about
like you're saying talk about forgetting moments
it's like oh i kind of think i put this at the
back of my head because i don't like thinking
about it because i don't like seeing her and
not just the the like hero l state of her you
know ripping apart the monster in season three
or closing the gate in season two or any of that
stuff so it's anyways it's very strange um but
it's very huge vecna vibes there In terms of
her willingness to kill. And again, they are
bad people. It's not Vecna killing innocent people.
But, oh man. It's a lot. It's just always, there's
always a question of morality and ethics when
you are being the deciding factor to end somebody's
life. Yes. But she does it and then the Demogorgon
comes through because there's a lot of blood.
So either it's the same Demogorgon that got kind
of melted by some fire. Or it's a different one.
I think it's a different one. You think it's
the same one? We don't know. And it chases them
around. And Lucas decides to... First of all,
why does Brenner take a step towards the stupid
Demogorgon? Do you know? I have to imagine that
it's, like, ego, essentially. Where he's like,
I am in control here. Yeah. Kind of a situation.
Where he's like... Maybe he thinks somehow he
has control over the Demogorgon that he, because
that's like, that was kind of my read on it from
the beginning, not knowing anything, you know,
in future seasons, but just on this, it almost
seems like Brunner kind of thinks of the Demogorgon
as like his discovery, his like pet tool, whatever
you want to, whatever creepy thing you want to
think. And that he's almost like, hey, like,
you belong to me, and this is the, like, pet
turning on its master type of situation. Which,
like, in this season... He's never seen it. Yeah,
but, like, in this season, we don't necessarily
know that. We don't necessarily know how much
contact he has or has not had with the upside
down. Yeah. And that he sent Elle to go find
it. Yeah. So, we don't know... enough about like
his relationship with the upside down and the
inhabitants they're in. So it could, from me
watching it, I was like, I could see how when
you're seeing it without any of the further story,
you're almost like, Oh, did he like do this?
Yeah. Yeah. I wonder too, if it's his scientific
curiosity, just taking over. He's like, Whoa.
Oh God. Yeah. So that's interesting. So then
the Demogorgon, you know, is chasing down the
kids for a second. It enters the room. Lucas
shoots it with his little slingshot, which is
stupid. And then Eleven takes it out, is right
up against it, starts using her telekinesis to,
like, disintegrate it, but also send it into
the Upside Down like she did Vecna. But also
we see in Season 2 that she also ends up in the
Upside Down, and she completely disappears. But
we're not really sure why. Like, there's a lot
of questions around this moment. It's very fishy,
yeah. It's really fishy. It's really, like, almost
absurdly fishy for the world building. But we
do know that it looks visually stunning. Because
they give her all those dark blood vessels sort
of starting to pop out around her eyes. She gets
all dark and focused and she looks like evil
almost while she's doing it. And it's that wonderful
combination that this show has of innocence and
evil put together. And the unexpected. And it's
just this, it's like a microcosm of what makes
this show work so well. And she's forcing this
thing to go through the wall into the upside
down slash disintegrate. But we're not really
sure. But it's just, it's a great, it's a great
moment. And those are our three storylines. Yes,
indeed, indeed. So, keep your finger on the pause
button. Rewind that tape. It's time for the prestige
category. For what did we notice on this? Watch
through. We've mentioned this a couple times,
so I won't belabor the point, but Brenner is
completely uninterested in the deaths of the
civilians. He really only truly wants 11. As
noted, six people, so there's like the two people
from the hunting, his son, Barb, Will, and then
some other person that I'm missing at the moment.
Hopper's storyline, as mentioned in all the episodes,
is I think the reason why this show works so
well for adults. They can hold onto his backstory
and his reasonableness and just everything. We
both have the same observation here, which I'll
let you take. Egg, egg, egg, egg, egg. Egg, egg,
egg, egg. Ah! Rewatching this, I have seen Alien
in between the first time that I watched Stranger
Things and this time of watching Stranger Things.
Growing babies in humans. So, you know, with...
The whole, you were saying, we get to this as
well, but what's that tube doing in Will? Yeah.
Growing babies. Maybe. That was my initial thought.
But then we get season three, but then we get
season three and the tube is turning them into
Flayed. Yeah. So it's something in that realm
of it's either... doing the flay thing now um
before the plans of creating a flayed army um
or it's growing i mean for lack of a better term
alien babies but okay so here's the problem that
i have with the egg because i don't think it
stays consistent for future episodes we see dart
in season two little little itty bitty guy That
egg's way too big for the little itty bitty guy.
So is it just multiples of the little itty bitty
guys and an egg? But also, that egg isn't inside
a human. So is this egg a totally different creature
than we've seen? Is that egg the thing that birthed
the spider that is the shadow creature? Like,
what is the egg? I don't know. But it is egg.
It is egg. Egg, egg, egg, egg, egg, egg, egg.
How on earth is Will alive is what I put. He's
just got this tube. I don't know. It does feel
like flayed baby things, because it seems like
an umbilical cord for a kid, but just in the
mouth and nose. How is he getting oxygen? Also,
it's been like a week. He's had no food. But
he hasn't been... No water. How is he lying?
I don't know. Sweat. He's drinking his sweat
from running. I don't know. I don't know. I don't
understand. He's reaching into the liminal space
and drinking the water off the ground. He's going
into El's purgatory and just cupping some water.
That's funny. I don't know. See, that also brings
up, like, the whole, like, it's a mirror situation.
Because Castle Byers exists in the Upside Down
as well. Which, like, Vecna wouldn't have known
about. So, like, if he had supplies in Castle
Byers, is there an upside -down supplies store?
Yeah, that's a good point, but then would they
be spoiled? Unless it's, like, bottled water?
Like, are there Eggos everywhere in the upside
-down? I don't know. And also, one thing for
water, though, is that the rivers might exist.
So any of the creeks and stuff, he might have
been able to go to and drink there. So I take
that one back, but... And he does seem like he's
fading away when the monster finds him at the
end of season seven. Okay. I get that. That's
fine. Here's a big question for you and all of
our audience. Okay. Is Steve's redemption arc
better than Zuko's? I'm talking about Avatar
The Last Airbender for listeners who don't know.
Yeah. Which has an amazing... This is spoilers.
Well, the show's over 10 years old. Nice. But
it is a bit of a spoiler. There's a great character
in that show called Zuko. He has an excellent
redemption arc. But like... I so easily have
forgiven Steve as soon as he starts to wash the
marquee with starring Nancy the Slut Wheeler.
And then when he comes back, I'm like instantly
in. And that was true the first season regardless
of me. And so I'm like, is this redemption arc
more effective? So here's the thing. Yeah. Steve
doesn't have quite as much to redeem. That's
true. As Zuko. Yeah, Zuko's done a lot by the
point of his redemption. Yeah. For a long time.
Yeah. And he's been really working on it. And
he also has a really rough backstory to overcome
as well. So I feel like it's just... I don't
know that it's necessarily better. I just...
It does blow me away how quickly... That's my
point. I am like... Steve! Because that's the
thing. I'm like... Wow, I forgot we, like, actually
hate Steve. Yeah. Like, he's horrible for a little
bit. He's awful. And then I'm like, wait, how
do we love him so much going forward? And then
all of a sudden I'm like, wait, I already love
him. What's going on? So, I also don't think
that it's better than Zuko's redemption arc.
I think that whole season three of Zuko's redemption
and him turning and being more of his mother
than his father is really good. However, I am
surprised at how highly ranked this Steve's redemption
is for me because I do absolutely hate him. I
hate everything about him. He's awful to Nancy.
He's manipulative. He's a big bully. He's completely
unsatisfying as a romantic partner for Nancy.
His callous attitude towards them after they
sleep together. Of not recognizing, you know,
this is her first time. She needs to be taken
care of and nurtured and helped along. It's just
that selfish teenageness. That selfish teenage
boyness about him. I'm like, this guy's terrible.
And then, like, he just wants to help and he
washes the marquee. And it's amazing. And then
I'm totally, I just totally hooked mine and sicker
bought. I still don't like Nancy with him, but
I'm in for him as a character. and that's it's
just amazing speaking of nancy her and jonathan's
love story is really so believable yeah i it's
it's entirely 80s cliche and yet i don't it doesn't
feel cliche it it's so good oh i really think
that it makes a lot of sense just with the way
that they come together and how they kind of
bond just over this intense situation that they
find themselves in and then from there they just
start finding the common ground and whatnot.
And yeah, it definitely flows very, very well
and doesn't feel forced. Yeah, absolutely. Okay.
Nancy fires the gun. I think too many times.
I think there's only six shots in that revolver.
Revolver. Yeah. That would make sense for a revolver.
And she shoots it like nine times. And this is
just my inner Archer. I usually count. Yeah.
I usually count, especially with rollers. Maybe
it's an eight shot revolver, but I, I'm pretty
sure she's out of shots there. And that's, like,
Archer, the cartoon, has just trained me so much
into, like, hey, how many shots does that gun
have? Yeah. Okay. Then, we've talked a little
bit about this, but my biggest question is, why
does the upside -down mirror Hawkins? We talked
about this last episode. But I just, like, I
don't... I know it's different dimensions, and
so if there's an infinite amount of dimensions,
there's bound to be one that's, like, a rotten,
decayed thing. Mm -hmm. But, like, why? Yeah.
I think that it's supposed to be because it's
just, like, a parallel universe. So it's existing
in tangent, but it's, like, a dark version. That's
the best answer that I can come up with. So is
there, like, a Teletubby version, too? And then,
like... It's just, like, there's a positive version.
And there's heaven and hell, too. I just... I
want to know the answer to that so bad. Yeah.
I think it's just that it's a twisted... It's
just a twisted version of reality. Yeah. Yeah,
but, like, if they build a new store, does that
store get created down there? I just don't get
it. I mean, I feel like it has to. Yeah. Okay.
Because they build Castle Buyers, and then Castle
Buyers exists, and... Yeah, that's true. The
next question is, so Will destroys Castle Dyers.
Is Castle Dyers gone? It's gone down there, too.
It must be. How can the Demogorgon open its own
portal and go for people in high school? We talked
about that one. How? Yeah, for the tree as well.
I just don't understand. Yeah, for the tree,
yeah. The rift that El created weakened the worlds,
and so it can open its own with its Demogorgon
magic? Yeah, I don't know. I don't understand.
We talked about this too. What is the tube doing
in Will? Maybe Flayed. Maybe something more specific.
I'm not sure. Because Barb doesn't have a tube
in her. Barb's just like eating. Yeah, Barb's
just dead. Cue the overmark. Dun dun dun. We
talk about this a lot over the last two episodes.
The inconsistency in Elle's like how fatigued
she is. Why is she almost dying after squishing
a bunch of brains? But, like, she can lift a
human 500 feet out of the air and place them
back down safely with very little effort. Yeah,
it's a lot. She does a lot, and then she, like,
almost dies, but then somehow has more power,
and then somehow has enough power to take out
the Demogorgon. Has enough, yeah. It's very confusing,
for sure. Uh, using the slingshot is just plain
stupid. I really, like, they should be hiding.
Yeah. Or running. Oh, 100%. Or trying to get
out the window. Like, I feel like they're all
smart enough to know that Lucas is, they're all
old enough to know that Lucas' slingshot is not
gonna work. This feels like a six -year -old
move, not a 12 -year -old move. Yeah, I'd agree.
For sure. But, I mean, it is, it is a nice callback
to... Mike being like, what are you going to
do with that slingshot? Are you going to shoot
it? And they're like, yeah, I am. And then that
moment of him using the third shot and then doing
the slow motion and then the Demogorgon getting
blasted backwards and it's actually just L is
a pretty awesome moment. I don't know if you
noticed this, but Eleven's eyes glow a dark red
when she first uses her moves against the Demogorgon.
It's not a reflection? No. A reflection of what?
They are... They're a completely different color
than any other thing in that room. It's something
I had not noticed until this episode, and I had
to pause and be like, am I seeing this correctly?
And it is. They're just straight up red. Do you
have any idea why that would be? I mean, wow.
I'm literally drawing a blank on potential. Because
I just thought it was like... Kind of like a
reflection. Of like whatever was happening. With
the Demogorgon. Was like reflecting back. With
like the power that she was exuding. And then
the rift. Because the. The port. Sorry the gate
between. Us and the upside down. Is red. And
like glows that color. So that I always thought.
That it was like. Because she's pushing it back
through. That it. was reflecting back on her
and it was more of a reflection not that her
eyes were actually exuding that color but that
that um besides her being potentially bloodshot
yeah no and it's not that either it's her irises
around the eyes are like this sort of brownish
dark brownish red they're completely different
color than what they've been before and maybe
it's just like a little you know color theory
in order to make the scene work correctly but
It is interesting, and it made me have to go
and look at Vecna's eye colors as well. But his
eyes are blue. Straight up blue. So I'm not really
sure what's going on there or why. And it seems
to have been just a that moment scene. So interesting.
Yeah, so my next question. So when we're in the
Upside Down, Hopper and Joyce are in the Upside
Down looking for Will. They come across like
a stuffed tiger. Yeah. And Hop picks it up and
then has one of his flashbacks to his daughter
with the stuffed tiger. Yeah. And it just seemed
odd. Like, I'm sure Hopper has seen. plenty of
stuffed tigers since his daughter passed away.
And so why is this so important? It just seems
like, do they have the exact same tiger? Is there
something, is this her tiger that is somehow
reflected in the upside down? It seemed like
it was a little bit more. of a stronger moment
than just like there just happens to be another
stuffed animal that looks similar to the one
that she had um so that that kind of confused
me um and i was like well maybe there's something
like with her death that connected her to the
upside down but i could i was like i don't think
that that's the case so i think that's a really
interesting thought i think They kind of poo
-pooed that in the extra materials, and I don't
remember where this is. It may even be in the
show, and I've just forgotten. But it's explained
at some point that Sarah's death is due to Hopper's
military involvement. So Hopper in Vietnam is
using Agent Orange a lot and inhaling it without
masks, not knowing the dangers of Agent Orange.
And it makes a lot of, and this is true in real
life, it made a lot of Vietnam vets who used
it infertile. And so they thought he couldn't
have children, and then lo and behold, they have
Sarah, but she develops this illness that she
has, and I believe it's cancer, because of his,
like, chemicalized seed, essentially. So that's
her death. It's the sort of after effects of
chemicalized warfare going to extremes that the
U .S. brings in with Agent Orange. And so I think
this is, like, just... Maybe a little thick visual,
you know, symbolism of trying to connect Hopper
so invested in Will and one of the reasons is
he couldn't save his own child. And I think that's
all that's coming out of this. Plus, the tiger
is the school mascot. We see that, like, very
shortly after with the kids and the, in the gym
and there's the big tiger. Yeah. So I think that
this is just, like, a thing that he got his kid
because he likes Hawkins, you know. Yeah. That
sort of thing. Speaking of Sarah. Every time
I see Sarah dying and Will coming back to life
sequence, it really gets me. Oh, yeah. It's very
impactful. Hopper losing his daughter and hugging
his wife. And then Joyce's relief when Will starts
breathing again. And then Hopper sort of, like,
he feels two seconds after he does this, he feels
like he imposes on that family moment. Because
he's there and suddenly they're like a family
unit. And then he's like, oh, I should get this
mask for this kid. And I'm not actually the dad.
And like, it's just, it's just a phenomenal sequence.
Yeah. Yeah. Very, very good. And then Will is
such a lovely child. He's so sweet. He's immediately
concerned about Jonathan's hand. I know. And
I'm like, you just went through hell for a week.
And your first thought is, what did you do to
your hand? Are you okay? You okay? It's amazing.
sweetie um i will say mike promising 11 hey you
can stay in my basement or you can stay in my
room and i can take the basement because i'm
down there all the time and you'll get this an
actual bed and clothes and they'll be like your
mom and your sister and then i'll be your romantic
partner and here's your new life and we're gonna
get to it that's actually a very good like i
don't know it's a very good mike moment of him
being caring And it's also very serious, hairy
Prisoner of Azkaban. Yeah, it really is. It very,
very much is. But yeah, I mean, Mike does have
a good moment here because he understands that
like, this is probably what she needs slash wants
is to not have to be in hiding, to have a family,
to feel like she belongs, to be able to stay
with her friends that she's now made. And yeah.
like stay close and whatnot. So it's very sweet.
That is, it's very sweet. And then the biggest
question of all, I know Steve looks great in
a sweater. I know he's got good hair. I know
that he's an attractive man, especially to Nancy.
But why, Sierra, is she still with him and not
with Jonathan? Okay. I have two. factors okay
here one sweater and hair she no no one is that
he did come back to apologize and then stayed
and fought came in at the last second slinging
did a good job integrated himself into the situation
that they were in and so she's giving him another
chance the second part is denial of her feelings
for jonathan yeah okay so she stays with steve
she doesn't have to confront potentially confusing
feelings about jonathan for at least a few more
months okay it's fine i understand you know it's
really interesting because at the end of season
four they're setting up this love triangle again
for season five because nancy's been with c for
most of season four and Jonathan has been avoiding
her and they've been maybe going to break up
and they don't know where they're going to go
to college. And then Jonathan gets back and he's
like, better than Steve, right? And Nancy's like,
he's not as bad as you think anymore. And it's
like, oh no, we're back to the sort of same thing
that we were doing in season one. But I get it
then. Yeah. Like, Steve is thoughtful, is considerate,
has been a great babysitter, is well beloved
by Dustin, who Nancy even... enough to dance
with at the snowball or whatever. And says, of
all of my brother's friends, you're my favorite.
You're my favorite. And so if Dustin approves,
maybe Steve isn't such a bad guy. I get it all
then. But at the very end here, part of me was
like, is she just trying to not break up during
the holidays? Like, oh, I can't do this during
Christmas. It's too close. No, I gotta wait for
the next big holiday. Halloween next year. Halloween
next year! That's so true. Anyways, it's stupid.
It's fine. But you know what, Sam? You don't
always have to face down a horde of angry soldiers
by yourself. Buckle up, Schmisseners. It is time
for our Sansa is Smarter Than John category for
most important character moment of this Okay,
first of all - We have the same thing, essentially.
Yes, we do. It's Hopper. Yep. Coming to terms
with Sarah's death while reviving Will, saving
Will. That's it. That's it. That's it. It's the
most important. He, like, is able to do what
he couldn't do for Sarah. He saves Will. He brings
him back. Yep. Boom. That's the most important
character moment. That is Hopper's, like, he
has a complete arc in this episode. And that's
one of the reasons why - It's, you know, sometimes
people have a complaint about, well, what's going
on with Hopper in seasons two, three or four?
Because his arc isn't as good. And it's like,
yeah, he's the single best arc of season one.
You're not topping that. Yeah. He did the work.
Let him enjoy. Let him enjoy the work. And, you
know, now he's going to have this work as a dad
and then as a romantic partner and all of this
stuff. But yeah. His arc is just incredible in
season one. And it's my favorite part of the
show. And I think this is the most important
character moment. But I know you just lost a
hand, Sierra. But listen up. Because it's the
I am your father category for most iconic character
moment. Not important. Iconic. And again, we
have the same thing. Will spitting up the slug.
And then flashing back to the upside down. Flashing
back. Flashing sideways. The now memories. The
now memories. It brings up so many questions
about is Will special? Yes. But it is the most
iconic because he throws up the slug, it slides
down the sink, and then he like drowns it with
the water. But while that water's running, lightning,
lightning noises. Boom. He's in the sink in the
upside down. And it's like, wait, does he have
this ability or is somebody else doing this?
Right. Exactly. Very interesting. Very interesting.
Everybody sit down. It's time for our I am Iron
Man. Most iconic and most important scene category.
Okay. I have an honorable mention for Hopper's
CPRing Will. With that whole sequence of Sarah
and Hopper and Joyce. It's both iconic and it's
important. It is not, however, as... hugely important
for the ramifications of preparing you all for
season five. Right. As Eleven killing Demogorgon.
Yes. It mirrors. So first of all, she's holding
the Demogorgon. She's pushing it up against the
chalkboard. It disintegrates and then she disappears.
And she goes in. We don't know where she goes.
We know that Hopper is dropping off food somewhere
and is that Eleven's entry music I hear. But
we don't know. where she goes. So it looks like
she disintegrates the Demogorgon and vanishes
herself. This mirrors as well the way that she
banishes Vecna to the Upside Down in Season 4.
Where, you know, she pins him up against the
board and she opens the portal for the first
time, but it doesn't stay open. And he gets banished
and then he gets disfigured a la Palpatine style
and then meets Shadow Monster thing, etc. So
I think that there's just a ton of information
in there. How does she disintegrate it? Did it
go back to the upside down or did she actually
just like tear it to pieces? Why did she end
up in the upside down? Like I, it's huge. There's
huge questions. Yeah. That is a lot. And definitely
that wins for most iconic, most important. Yeah,
certainly. Crack open an encyclopedia. It's time
for our, as Elijah Wood once said, no, how could
we have known? category, where we discuss the
most important information disseminated to the
fandom during this Season 1 finale. To me, it's
Will is held, for some reason, in the Upside
Down. Now, it may be Babies, it may be Flare,
but we don't know. But it is for a purpose. Yeah.
Barb doesn't have that tube. Will does. He's
kept alive. By what? Is the Demogorgon doing
that? Is it Vecna? Don't know. Don't know. Need
to find out. What is going on with Will? What
is going on? But it is important information
because it keeps that question going. It is interesting
to me, too, that season four with all the Vecna
stuff made everybody go, wait, what was going
on with Will? Like, there were questions murmuring
in the fandom about what was going on with Will.
But season four, everyone was like, wait a second.
Hold on a minute. What was going on with Will
Byers? Yeah, very good questions. Well, it's
time to keep your horses safe. It's the, I'm
gonna make him an offer he can't refuse, category
of best lines. Okay, there's one. It's interesting,
because season eight, or season eight, episode
eight doesn't really have that many killer lines.
No. I mean, you could be like, Moments. Moments,
absolutely. Sequences. Sequences. Visuals. The
episode in its whole self? Yes. It's great. The
episode wins. So, like, there's not, like, a
mouth breathers or, oh, did I say O 'Bannon?
Punch. No. But, and there isn't even, like, Mr.
Clark really in it. And he has some great choice
lines. So, for me, it goes to Dustin. Where he
and Lucas are raiding the chocolate pudding.
And he goes, found it! I knew she was hoarding
it. Knew it. Always lying, saying she's out.
Bald -faced liar. It's a very, like, Gollum -esque.
Like, she was hoarding it. I knew it. Lying.
She had it. She had it the whole time. Mine,
my own, my pudding. My precious pudding. My precious
pudding. None of us are doing the Gollum voice,
but it's fine. We all know who we're talking
about. Not at all. We're just trying not to get
sued over here. Yeah, please don't. That's so
funny. Oh my gosh. Dust off that card deck, Sierra,
and get ready to shuffle. It's our Joker category.
For who's the MVP of this episode? And you've
got... I have a tie between Elle and Hop. Eleven
for killing a Demogorgon. Killing the blonde.
And muscling her way way past exhausted in order
to make all of this happen. Saving the day. And
then Hop for saving Will. Making deals with the
devil. I mean, the government. And for personal
growth. He goes through it. As we said, he goes
through it. Honorable mention goes to Steve.
The hair. For coming in with the save and the
apology, good use of Negan Bat. Negan Bat! If
nobody has seen the best friend sketch with Key
and Peele about miscommunications over texting,
Keegan Michael Keyes also has a bat. Very similar
to Steve Harrington at the end. Negan Bat is
absolutely the name of that for all eternity,
for any time that that comes up. It's like the
Wilhelm scream and the Negan Bat. Yes. And yes,
yes, yes, don't at me. I know Negan's Bat is
technically barbed wire, not nails, but you know
what I mean. You know what we mean. Same thing.
Essentially. Essentially. So, I... The pound
-for -pound screen time MVP argument for Steve
is fairly strong. Especially when you throw in,
like, he also has an apology. Yeah. That's a
strong argument. I think it ultimately, you know,
he does a lot of work, but that's still... Nancy
and Jonathan seem more valuable to me in those
scenes. Yeah, yeah. Because they, like, actually
get rid of it and have a plan. Eh. Hop, saving
Will. But selling out Elle's location, I feel
like, is what the tiebreaker is. Okay. Also,
Elle saves herself and the other three children.
So that's four people she saves. Hop saves one.
Uh, uh. But how many does Eleven kill off -setting?
But they're all bad guys. If we're doing wins
for one team or the other. But Hop wouldn't kill
anybody. Even if you're gonna give, like, partial
credit. Even if each bad guy counts as 10 % of
one. Hopper didn't kill anybody. That's true.
But if it's basketball, Eleven's murders, while
horrible, are still points for the good team.
Oh, gosh. Even with serial killer vibes. I'm
just saying, she wrecks hard on the front of
saving and killing bad things. Oh, my gosh. Fair
enough. To be fair, this podcast does not condone
murder. We do believe Elle should have incapacitated.
Like, disintegrating the Demogorgon's fine. But,
like, the real human beings just, you know, incapacitate
them in some way, shape, or form. Ugh. Yeah,
I would say, to me, it's 11 in this one. Mm -hmm.
Fair enough. And, to be fair, Hopper did win
MVP on the first episode. Yes, he did. Fine.
We'll spread the love. It's crazy that Mr. Clark
is up there on the podium with them. Well, it
is time to clean up your evil lair and get ready
for our I was the turkey all along category for
what is the biggest takeaway viewers should leave
with in preparation for season five. We've been
talking about it for this entire first season.
Getting the intricacies of Eleven's power, how
they work and what happens to show exactly how
powerful she is, is, I think, one of the main
takeaways. And, of course, the other main thing
that we've been talking about is for what purpose
is Will down there? What is going on in the gaps
that we don't see? When he's running, when he's
being chased by the Demogorgon, how does he get
away? What's special about him? Because very
shortly, we're about to see that Will develops
a tick on the back of his neck when he sees the
big shadow monster. So what's happened here?
I think those are the two things in preparation
for season five that you all should be speculating
about, thinking about, trying to formulate your
own plans and then having a great time as we
learn this information. Today's public service
announcement is when encountering odd creatures
in a parallel world, make sure to cover your
mouth lest an egg be laid inside you. Please,
please. We don't want to lose any listeners to
aliens exploding out of them in some way, shape
or form. Or slugs coming up and being vomited
into a sink. Yeah. Even if they turn into adorable
little darts. Anyway, thank you, listener schmissners,
for listening to this episode of Fandom Schmandom.
If you'd like to discuss this episode or any
other episode we've done, please hit us up on
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and on X at Fandom underscore schmandum. Please
don't forget to rate and view us either if you
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placing us in other like -minded schmissioners
algorithms out there. And with that, we're out,
y 'all. Don't forget to tip your eggos. Season
two next episode. Fare thee well. Fandom Schmandum
was created by Sam Williams and Sierra Obermark.
The show is produced by Avelia Lieb. The editor
is Brittany Fisher. The music is by Jeremiah
Alves. Lucas has not shot... What? Wait, wait,
what? Has... Wait. Lucas has... Oh, no. I was
like, there's clearly one letter. One of these
words is wrong. Which one is it? Which one is
it? Okay. Oh my gosh, yeah. The meltdown in your
brain. I was like, what is happening? Fandom.
Fandom. Fandom. Fandom. Fandom. Fandom. Fandom.
Fandom, fandom, fandom, fandom, fandom, fandom,
fandom, fandom, fandom, fandom, fandom, fandom,
fandom, fandom, fandom, fandom Do you like large
eggs for breakfast? Have you already had the
ostrich -sized one? Well, then make your way
to the Upside Down to collect the largest egg
you've seen in your life.