Honestly, I wish surgery was on the table much
earlier because my quality of life has, it's
just been complete 180, right? Like, and I kind
of wish that was something that was talked through
in more detail. And it might have been that my
consultant at the time could have said, look,
these are all of the treatment options available
for you. Obviously, as a young man. Or young
individuals who are out there who are maybe looking
at surgery. It is a big thing. It is life -changing.
And I think that's quite key. It is life -changing.
But my life changed for the better. So much better.
I wish that had been put on the table earlier
and sort of discussed through. This is Ent, who
got diagnosed with ulcerative colitis at age
19 in London. After struggling with IBD for years,
Ent ultimately made the call to have surgery.
Now living with a stoma, He's on a mission to
challenge the fear and stigma around life with
an ostomy. Today, he's telling us all about his
colitis journey. This is Talking S***, presented
by Colitis Unfiltered. My name is Frank Tavering,
and welcome to the show. Thanks, Frank. Absolute
pleasure to be here. Yeah, really looking forward
to talking s***, as you said. So, yeah, it'll
be great. So then let's talk shit and let's talk
shit straight from the beginning. I always say,
you know, the first question that I typically
have, because why not start at the beginning?
And that is symptoms, how your IBD journey started.
Tell me a little bit about what that moment was
like for you when you noticed that, hey, something
is definitely wrong here. Wow, this is, well,
I'll try and paint a picture. This was back in
2008. So for some listeners, this was well before
social media was a thing. Like Instagram wasn't
really around. TikTok was just the noise that
your clock made on the wall. It wasn't a thing
at all. So back then, my symptoms were just really
bad diarrhea to start with. I remember just sitting
there being like, this isn't normal. Every time
I go to the bathroom, I'm like... This is not
great. And then the frequency just surged. I
was going like a couple of times a day and then
it surged to like 10, 15 times a day. Then passing
blood came. Then the pain came. So, yeah, just
those first sort of moments, if you will, I remember
feeling like really worried, really quite frightened,
like something's really not right. Yeah. And
then going to doctors and they were just like,
oh, yeah. it'll be fine. Like take your standard
over the counter medication. You'll be okay.
Um, yeah. And then fast forward to 2020, have
my large colon removed. And now I'm, you know,
publicly talking about shit and showing my, my
stoma bag all the time. So, so yeah, that's,
that's interesting. You said, so you went to
the doctors and they say, take over. the counter
medication was it just like a regular like a
regular doctor did you really go to a gi like
how did that evolve because 2008 like yes social
media was not around but ibd was around right
or at least you think so so how did that develop
and evolve so it was uh i was at university at
the time um and i just started as well and i
wasn't feeling great and then it was sort of
christmas time where i Kept going to the university
doctor, which is like a pharmacist. And they
were like, yeah, have some just standard, like
we call it Imodium in the UK, like just standard
medication. And hopefully that should clear.
It's just a bad bout of diarrhea. Plus being
a university student, my diet wasn't exactly
great, probably too much alcohol and partying.
So I thought that's what it will be. It'll calm
down. And then it went on and on and on. When
I got to, I went home in December for Christmas
time and I went to my local GP where I live,
like a proper doctor. And he said the same thing,
like, look, let's just take it step by step.
But everything seems to be okay. I then came
back in Easter time and went back to my GP and
said, nothing's changed. And they were like,
right, we'll do some stool samples, we'll do
some tests. But yeah, after doing all those tests,
they said nothing was wrong. And that was a bit
for me that I was like, this doesn't make sense.
You can see, you can clearly see something's
wrong. Like, you know, I'm in pain. I'm passing
blood. This can't be normal results. And they
said, look, there's nothing more. We can either
look at changing your food or your diet, like
maybe tweaking that, but there's not really much
else we could do. We can try and refer you to
a specialist, but the waiting list will be a
very long time. And I remember just chatting
to my family about it and they said, look, just
let's go private. And I had... an initial consultation
with a doctor who just sort of talked me through
what the procedures would be then had a colonoscopy
and literally in after the colonoscopy they were
like yeah you've got severe ulcerative colitis
and i was like cool what's that hey what what
is this um yeah and my doctor just said look
we're going to put you on some medication and
we'll give you some prednisolone steroids to
calm the inflammation, then we'll look at, you
know, long -term treatment. And I remember being
like, I was 19 at the time. I was like, yeah,
fine, whatever, no issue. I just saw it as, as
you kind of do when you're a teen, like, you
know, a young adult. I'm invincible, it doesn't
matter. And I think looking back on it now and
really reflecting, I didn't really take on like
the enormity of this is a lifelong condition.
Like this isn't going to go away. Even then when
someone said it was chronic, I assumed that was
like, oh, that just means it's more painful than.
acute if that makes sense um so yeah that was
that was it that was the start of the very long
journey that we've been on ever since so there's
there's definitely let's say at least a period
of months right that elapsed between you know
your first symptoms and the first conoscopy right
based on sort of like your timeline just you
know as a 19 year old you know normally what's
going on though like how did you how did you
navigate this pain because obviously symptoms
during those months didn't stop right it's just
a continuous sort of suffering like what was
that like for you especially at 19 as well oh
yeah and like i just started university trying
to make new friends going to my lectures and
stuff i think it's like most things right when
most people in this space will just put brave
face on and then just power through and that's
just what i did i remember There were a couple
of times where like, you know, honestly, I was
with friends. I shat myself a couple of times,
like genuinely was like, oh, sorry, guys, I'm
just just going to go. And again, it's not through
like design or anything like that. It's just
like I'm not feeling like, oh, my God, what's
happening? And then, you know, you run off. But
that was it. Just put brave face on and then
hopefully things will be OK. Because I remember
having exams as well. This is like fast forwarding
a little bit to the summer when I was doing my
first, first year exams. And I had really, I
had such a bad IBD flare. Nothing was working.
And I remember just being like, I can't do my
exam tomorrow. Like I can't do it. I'm in so
much pain. And just being like, it'll be all
right. It will be all right. And like having
to like manage my own emotions a bit with it
was challenging, but it was always, I don't know.
It was always like. this is just part of that
journey right it will get better i've just got
to you know navigate this at the moment and then
fingers crossed things improve yeah so you definitely
kept a positive mindset the way it seems and
then because a lot of ibd flare -ups diagnoses
you know for a lot of people life sort of kind
of comes to a halt a little bit based on the
severity of the disease right but you had university
so you power through now obviously we want to
get to the point of where you are today and that
includes surgery so Take us maybe to the next
step now, which is diagnosis there. You know
what ulcerative colitis is up to the point where
I guess you've been told, hey, it's time for
surgery. What kind of treatments were you on?
What time elapsed? And then ultimately, what
led to you having to have surgery? I was in remission
for quite a long time with the mesalazine. I
had like one tablet I would take a day. And I
was like, right, I'll have that forever. And
I was like, perfect. This is great. Life's easy.
I can do what I want. It was all good. And I
remember being on the treatment and it took six
months for it to really start working. And then
I remember being, at the time I worked in Sainsbury's
and I was closing up the shop with one of the
managers and I went to the toilet and I remember
having just a normal shit. And I was like, oh
my God. And I text my family and text my mates
being like. Best feeling ever. Oh my, honestly,
best feeling ever. Could not be happier. And
then from there, it was just like. I'd have periods
of normal remission. It'd be a couple of months
and then I'd have a flare up and then I'd go
back to the GP and they say, right, have some
more steroids. And it was kind of just that constant
balancing act of like fine tuning is the way
I looked at it. It was like my dosage always
needs to be tuned and then we'll see where it
gets to. I then did, from there we moved on to
azathioprine because everything stopped working.
And I remember having. conversation with my consultant
then and he just said like these are quite heavy
drugs these are drugs that you give to people
that are having like organ transplants like he
said very similar to people have like kidney
transplants and i was like oh wow that's uh so
i've got to take this forever he was like yes
i remember sitting the thing like this is getting
more serious and he just said yeah we'll take
the medication again we'll find your dosages
and it was just next step literally next step
up in the ladder if you will before surgery fine
tune it periods of remission then i moved on
to cyclosporine which was another one and i remember
getting like just really weird side effects like
my eyes would just dehydrate like gel had really
sore eyes all the time my hands would shake uh
hair started falling out so i was like look i'm
gonna go change these and then the doctor said
if you're not getting on with these we can look
at other things like I know Vendelizolab or whatever
it's called, methotrexate and all these other
things. And they decided to go into like anti
-cancer categories. And I was like, this isn't
great. And then we literally hit a brick wall.
My doctor just said, look, we don't really know.
Let's see what other drugs come out. So he put
me back on azathioprine and was like, let's just
play the waiting game. And I said, enough's enough.
I want to, what's the point? The solution here
is. Get rid of your colon. And then I don't have
to be on these drugs. I don't have to have this
way of life. I don't have to have the poor quality
of life that I have. Surely that's the next logical
step, right? And he was like, yeah, we can do
that. He's like, but you will elect surgery.
He's like, you're not unwell enough to have surgery.
And then again, I sat there going, but what do
you mean? Like I'm so unwell because I'm going
to the bathroom like 30 times a day. None of
these medications are working. We're now going
back down to the drugs that weren't working.
Like it doesn't make sense to me. And he's like,
look, this is just what we can do. We can manage
your symptoms as best we can until we do surgery
or we look at all the other drugs that we can
try. It's up to you. So yeah, I chose let's go
with surgery because I just want to get it done.
And it was initially we can have this in. Maybe
like three months or so. So you've only got to
wait like 12 weeks. You're on the waiting list.
I was like, perfect. Okay. Not too long. Then
it turned into over a year. I think it was like
13, 13 months or so. Because I'm not from a,
I'm not an emergency case, right? And there are
other people who need to have that surgery who
may have to have like. preventative surgery for
cancer because they may have to have their bowel
removed so every time I'm on this list I'm getting
to the top here's your surgery date great three
weeks time start going through all the prep drop
back down it's moved six weeks up the ladder
drop back down and it was just that constant
cycle for 13 months until finally had surgery
I want to say the 12th or 13th of February I
can't remember the date exactly I should do but
12th or 13th February 2020. The word surgery
has sort of this stigma, and I think for a reason
attached to it, that, you know, this is the last
resort. This is what nobody wants, you know,
or this is what people are afraid of the most,
especially, you know, people who get diagnosed
with IBD, who actually find out a little bit
more about Crohn's, about colitis, obviously,
or if the doctor does a really great job sort
of at explaining, you know, the different treatment
options and, you know, climbing the ladder. And
let's face it, nobody really wants to get to
surgery, right? Unless they have to, or unless
their lifestyle is, their life is just so, so,
so, so bad that that's the only option left for
them to reclaim their life. So what would you
kind of tell the people? who might face surgery
in the future, right? As somebody who has experienced
it. And that's my first part of the question.
My second part of the question is how did you
deal with that? Did you have any fear attached
to it? Any sort of, you know, uncertainty of
what was to come? Because, you know, going to
a doctor and saying, hey, I want surgery is very
much different from the doctor coming to you
and saying, hey, we really need to do the surgery
now. Otherwise, you know, who knows what may
happen. Yeah, 100%. So, To the first point, people
who are facing surgery, I think to your point
you said earlier, doctors usually introduce it
as this is the last resort. And honestly, I wish
surgery was on the table much earlier because
my quality of life has, it's just been complete
180, right? Like, and I kind of wish that was
something that was talked through in a more detail.
And it might've been that my consultant at the
time could have said, look, These are all of
the treatment options available for you. Obviously,
as a young man or young individuals who are out
there who are having, you know, maybe looking
at surgery, like it is a big thing. It is life
changing. And I think that's quite key. It is
life changing. But my life changed for the better,
so much better. I wish that had been put on the
table earlier and sort of discussed through.
One of my consultants said it as soon as I stopped
azathioprine and started looking at other drugs.
He was like, we can do it. he was like but i
won't force you and he was the first doctor was
like we can do it and i remember sitting there
at the time just being like oh that seems a bit
scary i won't do that but there wasn't at that
point there wasn't many people on social media
necessarily talking about surgery and things
or like not as many that i saw now there's okay
i'm not a podcast with you john i mean so there's
so many more people talking about it which is
amazing i've seen that transition firsthand So
I think to people who are facing surgery, really
have a conversation about it, speak to others
who have gone through it, and that will hopefully
alleviate some of your fears by hopefully having
this conversation and listening to this podcast
may also give you that. And secondly, one thing
that helped me, which then comes to your second
part of the question, is what did I do? Because
I elected, I had time to mentally prepare, whereas
if you are an emergency patient, you don't. necessarily
have that and that's where the exception your
body and stuff can be very challenging i bought
some test kits from some stone supplies so in
the uk you can actually get them for free but
i messaged some some companies and said do you
have any trial kits because i'm due to have surgery
and i want to essentially get familiar with what
my body is going to look and feel like so i got
a couple they sent me some i just put a stoma
bag on for the day filled up with water walked
around, like went to the gym with it on. And
I was just like, this is what my life's going
to be like. So I was like, okay, like it's not
as, the first time I saw a stoma bag, I was like,
oh, it's going to be like wearing a nappy, isn't
it? Like, it's going to be so embarrassing. Not
at all. And I was like, it's going to smell,
doesn't smell. Like you can't tell that I've
got a bag unless I physically show you. And it's,
I think those are my biggest concerns. And then
body image. what am i going to look like fortunately
like the bags i use and i haven't prepared this
but the bags i use are black so they look cool
right and that's why i'm like oh that's not too
bad and that sort of really helped mentally for
me get me in a place where i was like this is
happening i've chosen to do this this seems to
be like the right decision and i'll never forget
waking up after surgery your your stoma For those
of you, if you're going to get one or have one,
like it's huge, it's ginormous. And that is like,
whoa, what's that? And then you've got a big
clear bag. Obviously that's for doctors to look
at. It shrinks down. But I remember just looking
at it being like, oh my God, this is crazy. But
I wasn't in pain. And like I was in hospital
for 19 days, I think it was in total, because
my stoma fell asleep and then we had to wake
up and it was this sort of cycle. But I had no
urgency and I couldn't get my head around that
because for like, at that time I was 30. So for
a third of my adult life, a third of my life,
I was like, I have to run away and go to the
toilet. And I wasn't, I was just sat there like,
okay, well, this is working. I can't feel really
feel this. I've noticed the bags filling up,
but, but that's it. And that was the, that was
such a weird transition. And even now, like I
can't. I can't remember like that sensation,
that pain of having to run off to the toilet
all the time, but that was my, my everyday. So
yeah, so that massively helped. And then connecting
with other people. There's a few people I reached
out to who had stoma bags and I was like, what's
it like? And they just said, honestly, my life
is so much better. They're like, you'll get like
the first couple of weeks, obviously is going
to be, it's major surgery. You'll have hiccups,
you'll have like teething problems, but honestly
you will be. so much better off and i'm really
glad i listened to them because well i am so
there you go sure sure that that's that's really
great so in a sense rehearsing really did help
you prepare it's a very interesting story i mean
this is the first time that i you know talked
to someone who literally like you said you know
ordered a trial kit and rehearsed living with
it before actually experiencing it So rehearsal
can work, definitely. And then yet, you know,
you wake up, you see the stoma for the first
time, you're like, whoa, you know, it still obviously
takes a little bit of, you know, adjusting and
sort of overcoming the change, at least visually.
Now, do you consider yourself cured? Oh, what
a question. No, yes and no. I still have colitis.
It's still in my body. So I had a subcolectomy,
so I still have my rectum. I have to monitor
that because that's where my colitis was active.
So it could return. I know in a couple of years,
I'm going to have to have that removed because
A, it's a cancer risk because I've got an organ
or part of my organ that isn't working. And B,
if the colitis flares up in that area again,
not really. But for the main. It's interesting.
I'd say yes, because I haven't got any real symptoms
at this time, but I've had all the side effects
of years and years and years of taking very strong
medication. So I guess it is. Does that make
sense? Absolutely. And I asked the question because
typically... it's not really easy to say, yes,
I'm cured, right? And surgery is actually not
always the cure. I mean, yes, we're talking about
colitis, but a lot of Crohn's patients that I
talk to as well, then typically it's like, no,
you know, it can still be there, you know, even
though they might live with a stoma. So, but
you know, definitely, I think you put it very
well. So it's no secret, you mentioned it earlier
as well, you're extremely... active online as
well on social media. And that's part of your
efforts to raise awareness, but also to share
your story. And I think sharing our stories is
really the core, the heart of awareness. In one
of your posts, I don't know exactly if you remember
what it was, but in one of your posts, you wrote
or you said in a kind of quote, some days are
easier and some are harder. I would love for
you to tell me about the hard ones. Yeah, it's
interesting because I try to, as best I can,
portray a very positive attitude and mindset
just generally towards things. So even with what
I post, I want to show that even after life -changing
surgery, battling chronic conditions, you can
still have an amazing life, right? And I think
that's, for me, that's always going to be the
important part because there will be people out
there that will be struggling. The days that
I struggle with, I'll be brutally honest, I hate
my stoma sometimes. So that's why I'm like, am
I cured? That's another part of it. I'd reframe
cured to have I got my quality of life back?
And the answer is yes. I've now got a different
route that I've taken to get back to where I
was before. But there are days where I'll get
really sore skin. You do the best things you
can. I'll get sore skin and I'll itch my skin.
And it's like, oh, this is crazy. Blockages.
So for those of you that don't know, you do have
to be careful what food you eat. You can't just
shove it all in. And I've had three or four blockable,
I think, but yeah, about three or four major
blockages in my life. So I've been hospitalized
because of it. I sometimes just hate. how my
bag sits. So for example, when your bag is full,
you can tell you've got a big bag, right? You
can just tell. And you might be walking somewhere
and the wind is blowing at you and it just looks
like you've got this massive lump just sticking
out of your top, right? And sometimes my stoma,
like, although I love it, it's quite a long stoma.
So it's about the size of my thumb, just underneath,
right? And I see other people who've got stomas
and they're like, oh, theirs is smaller and flatter.
Like I wish mine was like that. And there's just
times where I'm like, sometimes I'm just very
aware that I've got a bag. And those are the
challenging days because I sit there going, I'm
not cured. Do you know what I mean? That's, that's
my point. I'm not, I still got this. So lots
of people ask me normally like. Do you consider
yourself disabled? And that's something that's
quite pertinent in sort of from our side. And
I'll say yes, because I've got this big medical
device that I have to physically wear all the
time. And those are days where I'm like, although
surgery has helped me, I wish this wasn't the
only way to get to where I am now. So yeah, that's
it. So you very bluntly said some days I hate
my stoma. But it's with you. It's with you for
life. So how do you mentally make peace with
it? How do you make peace with your stoma? I
mean, to be fair, it's like anything. I'm just
frustrated. It's emotional. So I'll end up just
feeling like, look, I'm annoyed about something.
It'll be fine. I'll go away. And then I'll take
my mind off it, go and do something, whatever.
And I... and then forget why i was angry do you
know what i mean like it is one of those things
it's more of an emotive reaction um because i'll
then go and do something like i'll go to the
gym we'll go for a walk or do whatever i'm not
having to plan my whole day or my activity around
how close is the nearest toilet i think that's
the hardest thing what i say the hardest thing
the solution to those harder days is where am
i now where was i looking and i'm being reflective
and looking back to go There were days where
I couldn't, like literally I couldn't stand,
like I'd just have to pass out and go to sleep
to I'm deciding what I want to eat and I'm going
to go cook dinner or I'm going to go to the gym
and all these things I couldn't really do before
surgery. So yeah, there were days where I'm like,
oh, that bottom line is it's, yeah, saved me
from so much worse. I would like to know from
you, especially since you've... had the diagnosis
at 19 then a surgery around like the age of 30
you know now you've had it a couple of years
you know how has colitis and your ostomy as well
changed you as a person before even having like
stoma or even even being diagnosed with colitis
like i was just a normal happy -go -lucky individual
couldn't care less i'll just do anything try
and get away with like being naughty or whatever
stuff like that like you know Typical teenager,
right? And I think having this condition, like
colitis, immediately made me think I need to
grow up. I know it sounds a bit weird, but like
this is serious. So we need to start thinking
about this seriously. But also like how everything
doesn't matter other than your health. Your health
is seriously the most important thing. Jobs will
come and go, you know. Partners, girlfriends,
boyfriends, whomever they can come and go, but
your health bottom line is always going to be
the most important thing. And then getting a
stoma that changed me to be so much more vigilant
of inclusivity, how people have different differing
needs and how like a lot of the world is not
catered for people have differing needs. Um,
and I, again, like. going into disabled toilets
going into like general toys things like there's
still a huge stigma around these sorts of things
and yeah my again to point back to my bio my
mission is to be like the bag life's not bad
and i've been very privileged to be able to not
just go on podcasts like yours but work with
medical companies i've gone and spoken in parliament
in the uk i've been on the news and it's it's
like i have an opportunity to try and progress
things and make things better. Whereas if I hadn't
had this condition, probably wouldn't be doing
any of that. I'd probably just be going down
the pub with my mates. Do you know what I mean?
So I guess it's giving me a bit more of a unique
selling point as well. And a purpose, right?
Yeah, 100%. Like I've always been somebody who
wants to give back. Like my whole career path
has always been around how can I help others?
I've had people reach out to me. Like generally
just through messages, like stuff like all these
sorts of things. I remember once, it will always
stick with me. I had a young mum whose daughter
was going to go have surgery and she was really
scared. So she was like, can I call you? And
this was during the pandemic. So I was like,
yeah, sure. So she called me and she was really
upset, cried down the phone. I was like, it's
all right. Like this will be what happens. Like
they'll go into theater and then this will happen
and this will happen. And it had nothing to do
with. like the daughter who i think it was the
daughter who was having surgery it was the mom
and i was just chatting to her mom and she was
after it she was like you've been so helpful
like everything you've done is just incredible
like thank you and that's it all everything we
do is just to help that one person yeah yeah
it's it's very interesting you say that and And
I'm going to share a very similar story that
happened to me recently as well. And then just,
I'm telling this as well to really sort of lift
the spirit of positivity and this importance
of awareness is that I had somebody recently
who was struggling. And then I asked, you know,
cause this is one of the questions I was asked,
like, so how proactive is your specialist, right?
Your GI and, um, basically responded and saying
that not very much takes a long time to get an
answer. It's not very clear. And I basically
said. I think what you should really consider
is try and change, right? Try and find somebody
else. And in the end, you know, the person came
back and said, you know what, thank you so much
because I just, tomorrow I'm going to call my
network and see what other sort of clinics I
can have, right? Sort of like just finding this
tiny little courage to make something, to do
something very simple, which is picking up the
phone potentially and, you know, try and find
another medical team, another provider, right?
And then I thought about this and I was like,
you know, in the end, it's really not about views.
It's not about engagement. It's about like, you
know, here's one day been able to sort of help
or motivate or inspire one person to do something
that could potentially change something positively
in that person's IBD journey. I mean, that's
what a great purpose, right? Yeah, 100%. And
look, what an amazing story for you as well.
Like, thank you for sharing that. That's awesome.
Sure. And it's, you're right. That's the main
thing is. If you can help just that one person.
And I don't even have to reach out and tell you,
right? What you're doing, especially with your
amazing podcast, is people will be listening
to it and they'll be going, oh, I didn't think
of it that way around. Or maybe I should try
and do something different. That's it, right?
That's it. And that comes through the stories
of people like you and others who go through
this journey. So that's really great. Now, if
you could go back to the 19 -year -old self,
based on everything you've experienced based
on everything that you've learned now through
this journey what would you tell yourself if
i knew the journey ahead was going to be exactly
the same i think i would simply say embrace it
uh don't be scared it'll be all right and there'll
be hard days but you'll pull through and where
you end up like today as of recording everything
you ever wanted in your life you will get So
I've got a beautiful wife. I've got a house.
I've got an amazing job. I am doing some incredible
things on social media. And at 19, those are
all the questions and the doubts and the fears
that I had, right? How am I going to be able
to do this? Will someone love me for my condition?
All these sorts of things. And the answer is,
yeah, all of those things and more. And I think
to anyone that's listening to this, that's just
the start of their journey. Like it's natural.
You're going to have doubts. You're going to
have worries, but everything will work out. That's
a very positive way and it's exactly how I'd
like to end the show. But before I let you go,
there is one question that I have and it's a
very difficult question. I am going to ask you
that question because earlier when we were talking
about this, you know, are you cured or not cured,
you said yes and no. So you didn't say yes and
you didn't say no. So I'd like to know from you,
based on sort of your hopes, your sort of optimism,
Do you think that we'll see a cure to IBD in
our lifetime? Yes. I think we will for the advancement
of, I think AI is going to play a huge part in
the medical scene. There's so many advancements
that have taken place in the last five to 10
years anyway. Like there's more drugs available
on the market. Stoma care is improving. And I
think generally our understanding of our sort
of gut, our biome that we have, all these sorts
of things, our health is going to improve. So
yeah, in my lifetime, I think there would definitely
be, there would definitely be some, a cure. The
only reason why it wouldn't be is because there's
other conditions that then take the priority
in that list for funding and research, you know?
And I think we'll have more people talking about
it. And do you know what? It might be something
so simple that it's like, Don't have olives.
All right, cool. Amazing. Then no one gets it.
It'll be, it could be something so simple or
don't use this type of plastic and microwaving
stuff or do you know what I mean? And I'm, I'm
really hopeful that the work that, that obviously
you're doing, other people are doing in this
space, um, will help at least push that narrative
forward. So our, you know, next generations,
my children, um, I mean, I haven't had them yet,
but hopefully I will, um, won't have to go through
the same. So. So, yeah. What about you? Do you
think that'll be a cure? You know, it's interesting
to say because you seem so convinced and I'm
very positive about this as well, even though
sometimes I look at the world, you know, and
it's tough to stay positive. But in this domain
as well, I say yes. Now, the one thing I would
say is, will it happen in my lifetime? I am not
so sure. Things sort of tend to move a little
bit slower sometimes based on the reality. But
then again, there's a hope. So I'm confident
there's something positive is going to happen.
I just hope that we'll not be dragged through
lots of political or bureaucratic things and
that people will actually be able to benefit
from a cure, a really, really positive development.
But I do also believe that it is going to come.
And listen, you and I are both young still. Who
knows, right? So maybe it will be in our lifetime,
right? Maybe we change the question. Maybe we
change it to, will everyone have access to the
healthcare for their stoma care and things? And
I think if we can at least strive towards that,
then a cure should hopefully come after that.
Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. And there's a lot
of optimism needed in that space as well. So
we'll send that optimism into the universe and
we'll hopefully get to that point quicker than
potentially the real cure or while we wait for
the cure. So, Anne, thank you so much. This has
really been fascinating. Obviously, this is a
topic that we could keep on talking about for
hours and hours, but I'd say we'll just leave
that to our respective audiences, right, and
the community. So, you know, we can continue
the conversation. conversation there. We're going
to also have your social media handles in the
show notes so that people can reach out to you
and bring all these great questions that they
have. From my end, I wish you nothing but the
best moving forward with your life and your health
as well. And keep doing what you're doing because
it's really, really important. And I think you're
definitely one of the major players in this field.
Keep it up, man. Thank you. I'm going to go red.
That means a lot. Thank you. But same to you.
Keep doing what you're doing. Keep getting amazing
people on your podcast. And yeah, just keep smashing
it. We'll do it together. Perfect. Ant, thank
you so much. Really appreciate it. Thanks, mate.
Appreciate it. That's it for today's episode
of Talking S***, presented by Colitis Unfiltered.
I'm Frank Tabering. And if this hit home or hit
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from the bathroom floor.