WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:03.540 Imagine opening your mailbox, like back in 1983. 00:00:04.219 --> 00:00:06.780 You reach inside and pull out this package you've 00:00:06.780 --> 00:00:09.480 been waiting weeks for. Right, something you 00:00:09.480 --> 00:00:11.779 ordered from a catalog. Exactly. You ordered 00:00:11.779 --> 00:00:14.320 a cassette tape from an underground band. But 00:00:14.320 --> 00:00:16.399 what you pull out isn't sitting in a standard 00:00:16.399 --> 00:00:19.199 smooth plastic case. No, definitely not. Instead, 00:00:19.359 --> 00:00:21.899 it's wrapped in this heavy, scratchy burlap. 00:00:22.109 --> 00:00:25.070 or maybe it's entirely encased in actual heavy 00:00:25.070 --> 00:00:27.750 -duty roofing material, and the moment you hold 00:00:27.750 --> 00:00:30.309 it, your hands and your entire living room instantly 00:00:30.309 --> 00:00:32.850 smell like chemical tar. Oh, man. It's just such 00:00:32.850 --> 00:00:35.390 a radical way to introduce yourself to a listener. 00:00:35.609 --> 00:00:37.289 You're immediately establishing that, you know, 00:00:37.609 --> 00:00:39.770 this is not background music. This is a really 00:00:39.770 --> 00:00:42.710 imposing, tactile experience. Okay, let's unpack 00:00:42.710 --> 00:00:45.859 this. Welcome to today's Deep Dive. Our mission 00:00:45.859 --> 00:00:48.960 today is to explore a single genuinely fascinating 00:00:48.960 --> 00:00:51.859 source document. It's a Wikipedia article detailing 00:00:51.859 --> 00:00:54.920 the history of a highly unconventional English 00:00:54.920 --> 00:00:57.759 music group known as Zoviet France. Yeah, a really 00:00:57.759 --> 00:01:00.090 wild group. And if you've ever felt I don't know, 00:01:00.250 --> 00:01:02.990 entirely overwhelmed by today's hyper visible 00:01:02.990 --> 00:01:06.569 celebrity obsessed culture, you know, where artists 00:01:06.569 --> 00:01:08.549 document every breakfast they eat for social 00:01:08.549 --> 00:01:11.269 media. You were going to be fascinated by a group 00:01:11.269 --> 00:01:13.450 that looked at the rulebook of the music industry 00:01:13.450 --> 00:01:15.829 and just threw it into an industrial shredder. 00:01:16.049 --> 00:01:18.129 They really did. Yeah. I mean, even their name 00:01:18.129 --> 00:01:21.269 rejects standard formatting. The source notes, 00:01:21.269 --> 00:01:23.409 they've stylized it as Soviet France with an 00:01:23.409 --> 00:01:26.189 S, sometimes with a colon and a dollar sign or 00:01:26.189 --> 00:01:28.609 laterally all in lowercase with colons and an 00:01:28.609 --> 00:01:31.409 asterisk. You like just total typographic chaos. 00:01:31.829 --> 00:01:34.810 Exactly. The typography alone signals a deliberate 00:01:34.810 --> 00:01:37.230 disruption. You are dealing with something operating 00:01:37.230 --> 00:01:40.030 entirely outside the mainstream pop machine. 00:01:40.569 --> 00:01:43.010 Based on the source document, Zovia France formed 00:01:43.010 --> 00:01:46.230 in 1980 in Newcastle upon Tyne up in Northeastern 00:01:46.230 --> 00:01:48.129 England. Right. And they carved out a really 00:01:48.129 --> 00:01:50.769 specific sonic space categorized across a few 00:01:50.769 --> 00:01:54.500 evocative genres, mainly dark ambient. post -industrial 00:01:54.500 --> 00:01:57.000 and industrial. Which takes us to the detail 00:01:57.000 --> 00:01:59.280 that basically anchors their entire mythology. 00:01:59.659 --> 00:02:01.519 We know when they formed and we know they are 00:02:01.519 --> 00:02:03.560 from Newcastle, but when it comes to the question 00:02:03.560 --> 00:02:05.900 of who they actually are. Yeah, the big mystery. 00:02:06.079 --> 00:02:08.780 The source material states that since their formation, 00:02:08.979 --> 00:02:11.639 the group has remained largely anonymous. Which 00:02:11.639 --> 00:02:16.099 is huge. Deciding to create music but deliberately 00:02:16.099 --> 00:02:19.780 hiding your identity is a profound artistic choice. 00:02:20.180 --> 00:02:22.840 You're making a massive statement about ego. 00:02:23.039 --> 00:02:25.879 For sure. You are stripping away that whole cult 00:02:25.879 --> 00:02:28.419 of personality and demanding that the audience 00:02:28.419 --> 00:02:33.319 engages solely with the raw audio. Is it profound 00:02:33.319 --> 00:02:34.879 though? Let me push back on that for a second. 00:02:34.979 --> 00:02:38.159 Okay, go for it. Is it a profound artistic statement 00:02:38.159 --> 00:02:41.000 or is it just a, I don't know, a slightly pretentious 00:02:41.000 --> 00:02:43.860 way for introverted musicians to avoid doing 00:02:43.860 --> 00:02:46.840 press tours and taking press photos? That's a 00:02:46.840 --> 00:02:48.479 fair question. Like, think about this from a 00:02:48.479 --> 00:02:50.740 practical standpoint in the 1980s. But wait, 00:02:50.919 --> 00:02:52.800 how do you build a fan base if no one knows who 00:02:52.800 --> 00:02:55.020 you are? You build a fan base back then by putting 00:02:55.020 --> 00:02:57.280 your face on an album cover, showing up in magazines, 00:02:57.400 --> 00:02:59.759 or getting a video on MTV. Right, the traditional 00:02:59.759 --> 00:03:02.919 route. Yeah. If you are entirely anonymous, there's 00:03:02.919 --> 00:03:05.439 no charismatic lead singer for the fans to latch 00:03:05.439 --> 00:03:08.520 onto. True. But that assumes the goal of the 00:03:08.520 --> 00:03:12.060 music was mass commercial appeal, which, well... 00:03:12.110 --> 00:03:15.349 everything about their genre categorization actively 00:03:15.349 --> 00:03:18.069 rejects that. Okay, fair point. What's fascinating 00:03:18.069 --> 00:03:19.909 here is let's break down those labels the article 00:03:19.909 --> 00:03:22.729 uses, right? Industrial, post -industrial, and 00:03:22.729 --> 00:03:26.250 dark ambient. If there were a smiling, charismatic 00:03:26.250 --> 00:03:29.129 frontman on the cover of a magazine, it would 00:03:29.129 --> 00:03:31.449 completely shatter the illusion of the soundscape 00:03:31.449 --> 00:03:33.150 they were trying to build. Because it's supposed 00:03:33.150 --> 00:03:36.469 to feel detached. Exactly. When we hear ambient 00:03:36.469 --> 00:03:38.990 music today, we usually think of, like, a spa 00:03:38.990 --> 00:03:42.599 playlist or relaxing elevator music. But the 00:03:42.599 --> 00:03:45.080 source explicitly pairs their ambient nature 00:03:45.080 --> 00:03:48.300 with dissonance and industrial textures. So it's 00:03:48.300 --> 00:03:50.300 actively abrasive. It is not meant to put you 00:03:50.300 --> 00:03:52.680 to sleep. Far from it. Industrial textures evoke 00:03:52.680 --> 00:03:55.560 machinery, grinding metal, the mechanical repetition 00:03:55.560 --> 00:03:57.740 of factories. Oh, wow. And this makes perfect 00:03:57.740 --> 00:03:59.919 sense when you consider they formed a new castle 00:03:59.919 --> 00:04:02.840 upon time. That's a city with a massive history 00:04:02.840 --> 00:04:05.180 of shipbuilding and heavy industry that was, 00:04:05.319 --> 00:04:08.580 by the 1980s, facing severe post -industrial 00:04:08.580 --> 00:04:10.639 economic decline. Right, the whole Thatcher era. 00:04:11.000 --> 00:04:13.830 Exactly. By stripping away their human identities, 00:04:14.349 --> 00:04:16.790 the anonymous members of Zoviet France allow 00:04:16.790 --> 00:04:18.589 the music to sound as though it was generated 00:04:18.589 --> 00:04:21.170 by the decaying landscape itself. That makes 00:04:21.170 --> 00:04:24.250 so much sense. Listening to Zoviet France, especially 00:04:24.250 --> 00:04:26.889 those really early recordings, it feels like 00:04:26.889 --> 00:04:30.250 finding a mysterious, unlabeled broadcast on 00:04:30.250 --> 00:04:32.930 an old shortwave radio late at night. Oh, that's 00:04:32.930 --> 00:04:34.629 a great way to put it. You know, you're turning 00:04:34.629 --> 00:04:37.029 the dial, pushing through heavy static, and suddenly 00:04:37.029 --> 00:04:39.810 you hit this strange atmospheric transmission. 00:04:40.329 --> 00:04:42.170 You don't You don't know who's broadcasting it. 00:04:42.230 --> 00:04:43.870 You don't know where it's coming from. Yeah, 00:04:43.889 --> 00:04:46.389 exactly. Because there is no face and no personality 00:04:46.389 --> 00:04:48.670 attached to it, you have no choice but to focus 00:04:48.670 --> 00:04:52.110 entirely on the signal. The anonymity essentially 00:04:52.110 --> 00:04:54.569 becomes another instrument in their toolkit. 00:04:55.269 --> 00:04:58.649 It forces you, the listener, to grapple with 00:04:58.649 --> 00:05:01.069 the dissonance without the comforting anchor 00:05:01.069 --> 00:05:04.149 of a recognizable human persona. But if you don't 00:05:04.149 --> 00:05:06.569 have a face and you don't do interviews, the 00:05:06.569 --> 00:05:09.310 only tangible connection your fan has to you 00:05:09.310 --> 00:05:11.850 is the physical object they buy. Right, the actual 00:05:11.850 --> 00:05:14.529 tape. Which logically brings us back to that 00:05:14.529 --> 00:05:16.930 really visceral sensory hook we started with. 00:05:17.410 --> 00:05:19.910 This rejection of standard music industry practices 00:05:19.910 --> 00:05:22.329 didn't just stop at their hidden identities. 00:05:22.689 --> 00:05:25.069 It dictated the actual physical artifacts they 00:05:25.069 --> 00:05:27.050 mailed out to their listeners. The source notes 00:05:27.050 --> 00:05:29.670 that Zoviet France participated heavily in the 00:05:29.670 --> 00:05:33.410 early 1980s underground tape scene. And to understand 00:05:33.410 --> 00:05:36.069 why their packaging was so bizarre, we really 00:05:36.069 --> 00:05:37.949 have to understand how that seemed functioned. 00:05:38.009 --> 00:05:40.649 It wasn't exactly standard corporate distribution. 00:05:40.790 --> 00:05:43.310 Not at all. The underground tape network was 00:05:43.310 --> 00:05:47.370 a totally decentralized mail order culture. Musicians 00:05:47.370 --> 00:05:49.790 would record on cheap four -track recorders, 00:05:49.990 --> 00:05:52.350 dub their own cassettes, and just mail them directly 00:05:52.350 --> 00:05:54.790 to fans or specialized independent distributors 00:05:54.790 --> 00:05:57.189 across the world. It was like the ultimate DIY 00:05:57.189 --> 00:05:59.970 ethos. Yeah. Here's where it gets really interesting 00:05:59.970 --> 00:06:02.670 though, because even within that highly independent 00:06:02.670 --> 00:06:05.810 scene, Zoviet France took things to an absolute 00:06:05.810 --> 00:06:08.430 extreme. The article points out that their packaging 00:06:08.430 --> 00:06:11.129 materials included Hessian, aluminum foil, and 00:06:11.129 --> 00:06:13.509 tar paper. Let's analyze what those materials 00:06:13.509 --> 00:06:16.129 represent, because it's not random. Hessian. 00:06:16.250 --> 00:06:20.389 which is often called burlap, is a rough, scratchy, 00:06:20.509 --> 00:06:23.569 woven fabric used for shipping agricultural goods. 00:06:24.110 --> 00:06:27.029 Super rough. Yeah. And aluminium foil is metallic, 00:06:27.430 --> 00:06:30.629 highly reflective, but easily torn. And then 00:06:30.629 --> 00:06:33.209 you have tar paper, which is a heavy duty construction 00:06:33.209 --> 00:06:36.769 material used for waterproofing roofs. It's literally 00:06:36.769 --> 00:06:40.350 thick paper impregnated with asphalt or coal 00:06:40.350 --> 00:06:43.149 tar. tar paper, like the stuff they use on active 00:06:43.149 --> 00:06:45.550 construction sites. The exact same. If you wrap 00:06:45.550 --> 00:06:47.889 a cassette in that, the entire package is going 00:06:47.889 --> 00:06:50.189 to just reek of chemicals. If you're listening 00:06:50.189 --> 00:06:52.129 to this deep dive right now while driving or 00:06:52.129 --> 00:06:54.209 making dinner, you're probably thinking, why 00:06:54.209 --> 00:06:56.250 would anyone actually pay hard earned money to 00:06:56.250 --> 00:06:58.709 be subjected to dissonant, terrifying noise wrapped 00:06:58.709 --> 00:07:00.470 in garbage that makes your house smell like a 00:07:00.470 --> 00:07:03.029 freshly paved road? I mean, it sounds crazy. 00:07:03.430 --> 00:07:05.170 But if we connect this to the bigger picture, 00:07:05.670 --> 00:07:08.389 the medium literally mirrors the message. OK. 00:07:08.639 --> 00:07:10.959 The use of these materials isn't just a quirky 00:07:10.959 --> 00:07:13.120 gimmick to stand out in a mail order catalog. 00:07:13.279 --> 00:07:16.040 It is a physical manifestation of their post 00:07:16.040 --> 00:07:18.319 -industrial sound. Oh, I see. Yeah, if your music 00:07:18.319 --> 00:07:21.180 is built on dissonant mechanical textures and 00:07:21.180 --> 00:07:24.240 the decay of heavy industry, then packaging that 00:07:24.240 --> 00:07:27.079 cassette in standard pristine plastic creates 00:07:27.079 --> 00:07:30.350 cognitive dissonance. By using burlap. metal 00:07:30.350 --> 00:07:33.290 foil and roofing tar, they bridge the gap between 00:07:33.290 --> 00:07:35.709 the audio and the physical world. You have to 00:07:35.709 --> 00:07:37.829 physically wrestle with the aesthetic before 00:07:37.829 --> 00:07:40.490 the tape even goes into the deck. It transforms 00:07:40.490 --> 00:07:43.069 the simple act of putting on a record into a 00:07:43.069 --> 00:07:46.230 gritty, tactile ritual. Exactly. You are literally 00:07:46.230 --> 00:07:48.290 holding the industrial grit in your hands while 00:07:48.290 --> 00:07:51.009 it plays in your ears. It demands an active participant. 00:07:51.329 --> 00:07:53.470 You cannot be a passive consumer when you have 00:07:53.470 --> 00:07:56.500 to pry a cassette out of glued tar paper. Which 00:07:56.500 --> 00:07:58.740 is brilliant, honestly, but it also creates a 00:07:58.740 --> 00:08:01.399 massive logistical question for me. Like, how 00:08:01.399 --> 00:08:03.779 does a faceless band deliberately making their 00:08:03.779 --> 00:08:06.139 music difficult to consume and wrapping it in 00:08:06.139 --> 00:08:08.620 roofing materials manage to survive? Great question. 00:08:08.959 --> 00:08:10.720 Because the source document states they formed 00:08:10.720 --> 00:08:13.480 in 1980 and are still active to the present day. 00:08:14.040 --> 00:08:16.680 We're talking about decades of longevity for 00:08:16.680 --> 00:08:19.980 an underground ambient industrial project. How 00:08:19.980 --> 00:08:21.920 does an anonymous collective maintain enough 00:08:21.920 --> 00:08:24.610 momentum to keep going that long? The survival 00:08:24.610 --> 00:08:27.569 mechanism seems to be constant fluid evolution. 00:08:28.389 --> 00:08:30.529 Even though the group is largely anonymous, the 00:08:30.529 --> 00:08:32.830 Wikipedia article pulls back the curtain just 00:08:32.830 --> 00:08:35.750 enough to reveal a sprawling history of personnel 00:08:35.750 --> 00:08:38.730 changes. A revolving door. Yeah. The current 00:08:38.730 --> 00:08:41.129 lineup consists of co -founder Ben Ponten and 00:08:41.129 --> 00:08:43.850 Mark Warren. So there is a thread of continuity 00:08:43.850 --> 00:08:47.080 back to the beginning with Ponten. The list to 00:08:47.080 --> 00:08:49.799 former members is really extensive. Let's not 00:08:49.799 --> 00:08:51.679 just read the list. Let's look at the sheer volume 00:08:51.679 --> 00:08:53.620 of turnover. We're talking about people like 00:08:53.620 --> 00:08:57.759 Neil Ramsha, Peter Jensen, Lisa Hale, Palo di 00:08:57.759 --> 00:09:01.419 Paolo, Robin Story, Mark Spivey, and Andy Erdley. 00:09:01.460 --> 00:09:03.179 All of them passing through the ranks. That's 00:09:03.179 --> 00:09:05.139 a lot of people. In a traditional rock band, 00:09:05.159 --> 00:09:07.659 if you lose your charismatic lead singer or your 00:09:07.659 --> 00:09:10.000 star guitarist, the band's career is usually 00:09:10.000 --> 00:09:12.940 over. The brand is dead. Right, because the brand 00:09:12.940 --> 00:09:15.460 in a traditional rock band is tied entirely to 00:09:15.460 --> 00:09:17.879 the ego and face of those specific individuals. 00:09:18.600 --> 00:09:21.460 But with Zoviet France, we run into a fascinating 00:09:21.460 --> 00:09:24.279 real -world example of the Ship of Theseus. Oh, 00:09:24.379 --> 00:09:26.620 I love this analogy. For anyone unfamiliar, the 00:09:26.620 --> 00:09:28.860 Ship of Theseus is the classic philosophical 00:09:28.860 --> 00:09:31.620 thought experiment. If you have a wooden ship, 00:09:32.019 --> 00:09:35.159 and over the years you replace every single rotting 00:09:35.159 --> 00:09:37.659 plank of wood until none of the original pieces 00:09:37.659 --> 00:09:40.860 remain, is it still the same ship? Exactly. And 00:09:40.860 --> 00:09:43.179 applied to Zovia France, if the identity of the 00:09:43.179 --> 00:09:46.000 band is built on anonymity, dissonance, and an 00:09:46.000 --> 00:09:48.779 industrial aesthetic, the actual human beings 00:09:48.779 --> 00:09:51.240 generating the sounds are almost secondary to 00:09:51.240 --> 00:09:53.740 the concept. The overarching philosophy of the 00:09:53.740 --> 00:09:56.200 band is the ship. The members are just the planks 00:09:56.200 --> 00:09:59.669 of wood. When one leaves and another joins, the 00:09:59.669 --> 00:10:01.950 fresh blood brings new techniques for generating 00:10:01.950 --> 00:10:04.990 those dark ambient textures. But the central, 00:10:05.230 --> 00:10:08.049 imposing aesthetic of Zoviet France remains intact. 00:10:08.240 --> 00:10:10.820 The anonymity actually protects the longevity 00:10:10.820 --> 00:10:13.159 of the project. That is wild. It really is. And 00:10:13.159 --> 00:10:15.639 we can see just how potent the creative energy 00:10:15.639 --> 00:10:18.279 of those individual members was because the source 00:10:18.279 --> 00:10:20.899 details seven significant spinoff projects that 00:10:20.899 --> 00:10:23.159 grew out of the band's revolving door. The musical 00:10:23.159 --> 00:10:25.519 family tree branches out in some really successful 00:10:25.519 --> 00:10:28.840 ways. Former member Robin Story left and began 00:10:28.840 --> 00:10:31.580 recording under the name Rapoon. And that project 00:10:31.580 --> 00:10:34.200 became highly influential in its own right, blending 00:10:34.200 --> 00:10:36.840 ambient music with world music elements. Awesome. 00:10:37.519 --> 00:10:39.860 Spidey went on to record as Dead Voices On Air. 00:10:40.639 --> 00:10:42.620 What is particularly interesting is that the 00:10:42.620 --> 00:10:45.600 shared experimental DNA kept these artists in 00:10:45.600 --> 00:10:47.960 the same creative orbit long after they left 00:10:47.960 --> 00:10:49.940 the main project. Oh, they worked together again. 00:10:50.019 --> 00:10:54.320 They did. In 2005, Story, Spidey, and Andy Erdley 00:10:54.320 --> 00:10:57.120 actually reconvened to form a new group called 00:10:57.120 --> 00:10:59.879 Reformed Faction. It proves that the collaborative 00:10:59.879 --> 00:11:02.700 environment of Zoviet France was just an incredible 00:11:02.700 --> 00:11:06.259 incubator for experimental musicians. They learn 00:11:06.259 --> 00:11:08.639 how to build these massive cinematic soundscapes 00:11:08.639 --> 00:11:10.779 together and then took those skills out into 00:11:10.779 --> 00:11:13.240 the broader world. Absolutely. And you can really 00:11:13.240 --> 00:11:15.860 chart the evolution of all that shifting fluid 00:11:15.860 --> 00:11:18.720 creativity when you look at Zoviet France's discography. 00:11:19.360 --> 00:11:21.539 The source provides a timeline of their releases 00:11:21.539 --> 00:11:24.419 and the album titles alone tell a story of a 00:11:24.419 --> 00:11:27.159 highly idiosyncratic group basically playing 00:11:27.159 --> 00:11:29.850 games with their audience. They absolutely weaponize 00:11:29.850 --> 00:11:32.029 their album titles to keep the listener off balance. 00:11:32.509 --> 00:11:34.870 They start in 1982 with an album called Garista, 00:11:35.330 --> 00:11:37.470 and then their very next release that same year 00:11:37.470 --> 00:11:40.710 is just listed as untitled in brackets. Which 00:11:40.710 --> 00:11:42.769 perfectly aligns with the ethos of hiding your 00:11:42.769 --> 00:11:45.649 identity. Why name the album if you refuse to 00:11:45.649 --> 00:11:48.070 name yourselves? Right. But then they pivot. 00:11:48.230 --> 00:11:51.690 They start using wildly evocative, almost provocative 00:11:51.690 --> 00:11:55.049 titles. In 1985, Right in the middle of the Cold 00:11:55.049 --> 00:11:57.710 War, they released an album called Popular Soviet 00:11:57.710 --> 00:12:00.789 Songs and Youth Music. Think about the deliberate 00:12:00.789 --> 00:12:03.950 misdirection there. You are an underground English 00:12:03.950 --> 00:12:06.870 band creating harsh post -industrial ambient 00:12:06.870 --> 00:12:10.029 noise. Naming your tape Popular Soviet Songs 00:12:10.029 --> 00:12:12.230 and Youth Music sounds like you are releasing 00:12:12.230 --> 00:12:14.769 a sterile state -sponsored government propaganda 00:12:14.769 --> 00:12:17.620 compilation. It is a remarkably ironic subversive 00:12:17.620 --> 00:12:20.440 choice. Exactly. Anyone buying that tape expecting 00:12:20.440 --> 00:12:22.679 catchy pop tunes from the Eastern Bloc was in 00:12:22.679 --> 00:12:25.580 for a terrifying sonic surprise. Seriously. Then 00:12:25.580 --> 00:12:27.879 the next year, 1986, they drop an album called 00:12:27.879 --> 00:12:30.360 Misfits, Looney Tunes, and Squalid Criminals. 00:12:30.620 --> 00:12:32.919 Fast forward to the year 2000, and they release 00:12:32.919 --> 00:12:35.620 the Decriminalization of Country Music. They 00:12:35.620 --> 00:12:38.259 are playing with massive cultural signifiers. 00:12:38.960 --> 00:12:41.659 They take terms loaded with specific imagery. 00:12:42.360 --> 00:12:45.899 Soviet propaganda, classic cartoons, American 00:12:45.899 --> 00:12:48.519 country music, and slap them onto music that 00:12:48.519 --> 00:12:50.559 sounds absolutely nothing like any of those things. 00:12:50.639 --> 00:12:52.879 Bottle date and switch. Yeah, it prevents the 00:12:52.879 --> 00:12:54.700 audience from ever getting comfortable. You cannot 00:12:54.700 --> 00:12:57.200 pigeonhole them because the moment you try, they 00:12:57.200 --> 00:12:59.059 release something with a title that completely 00:12:59.059 --> 00:13:01.240 undercuts your assumptions. It's a masterful 00:13:01.240 --> 00:13:03.700 use of aesthetic friction, but perhaps the most 00:13:03.700 --> 00:13:06.519 surprising twist in their entire timeline happens 00:13:06.519 --> 00:13:09.340 much later in their career. The source document 00:13:09.340 --> 00:13:12.429 notes that this bizarre underground cassette 00:13:12.429 --> 00:13:15.350 culture group from the northeast of England eventually 00:13:15.350 --> 00:13:18.750 provided the music for a 2015 American mockumentary 00:13:18.750 --> 00:13:21.690 film called Savage Land. This raises an important 00:13:21.690 --> 00:13:24.070 question about how avant -garde art permeates 00:13:24.070 --> 00:13:26.690 mainstream culture. Think about the trajectory 00:13:26.690 --> 00:13:29.149 here. It's a long road. It really is. You start 00:13:29.149 --> 00:13:32.730 in 1980 operating in a fiercely niche localized 00:13:32.730 --> 00:13:35.070 underground scene mailing out cassettes wrapped 00:13:35.070 --> 00:13:38.419 in roofing tar. Decades pass the format shifts 00:13:38.419 --> 00:13:41.139 from physical tapes to digital audio right and 00:13:41.139 --> 00:13:44.360 eventually American filmmakers working on a thriller 00:13:44.360 --> 00:13:47.960 or horror mockumentary realize that your highly 00:13:47.960 --> 00:13:52.080 specific dissonant sound is the absolute perfect 00:13:52.080 --> 00:13:55.440 emotional backdrop to build tension on screen. 00:13:55.740 --> 00:13:57.480 It proves a point about sticking to your creative 00:13:57.480 --> 00:13:59.399 guns, doesn't it? If you make something unique 00:13:59.399 --> 00:14:01.100 enough and you do it for long enough without 00:14:01.100 --> 00:14:04.179 compromising, the broader world eventually catches 00:14:04.179 --> 00:14:06.799 up. They find an application for the very thing 00:14:06.799 --> 00:14:08.860 that made you an outcast. It also highlights 00:14:08.860 --> 00:14:12.419 the inherent nature of dark ambient music. By 00:14:12.419 --> 00:14:14.940 its very design, ambient music is spatial. It 00:14:14.940 --> 00:14:17.379 creates an environment rather than a traditional 00:14:17.379 --> 00:14:20.370 verse chorus. It's about the vibe, the atmosphere. 00:14:20.730 --> 00:14:22.610 Exactly. Even when Sylvia France was just mailing 00:14:22.610 --> 00:14:25.929 out tapes in 1983, they were essentially composing 00:14:25.929 --> 00:14:28.929 soundtracks for imaginary post -apocalyptic films. 00:14:29.450 --> 00:14:31.789 Their music was always cinematic. It just took 00:14:31.789 --> 00:14:34.509 35 years for an actual film production to formally 00:14:34.509 --> 00:14:37.929 tap into that catalog and use those mechanical, 00:14:38.330 --> 00:14:41.169 dread -inducing textures to manipulate an audience's 00:14:41.169 --> 00:14:43.679 emotions in a theater. That's incredible. What 00:14:43.679 --> 00:14:47.379 was once on the extreme fringes of DIY music 00:14:47.379 --> 00:14:50.200 culture becomes a vital storytelling tool in 00:14:50.200 --> 00:14:52.340 an American movie. So what does this all mean 00:14:52.340 --> 00:14:55.419 for us today? We started this deep dive by looking 00:14:55.419 --> 00:14:58.080 at our modern landscape of hypervisibility, where 00:14:58.080 --> 00:15:01.000 musicians are expected to be constant lifestyle 00:15:01.000 --> 00:15:03.379 influences. You're asaustic, right? Very. And 00:15:03.379 --> 00:15:06.659 then we traveled back to 1980s Newcastle to find 00:15:06.659 --> 00:15:09.080 Zoviet France, a collective that deliberately 00:15:09.080 --> 00:15:12.179 hid their faces, obscured their individual identities, 00:15:12.419 --> 00:15:15.639 and crafted dissonant, imposing soundscapes. 00:15:15.659 --> 00:15:18.120 Yeah. We explored the underground tape network 00:15:18.120 --> 00:15:20.080 and how they forced their listeners to physically 00:15:20.080 --> 00:15:22.600 engage with their art by wrapping cassettes in 00:15:22.600 --> 00:15:25.389 rough burlap and foul -smelling tar paper. We 00:15:25.389 --> 00:15:27.710 saw how a revolving door of members acted like 00:15:27.710 --> 00:15:30.190 the ship of Theseus, allowing the central concept 00:15:30.190 --> 00:15:32.830 to survive for decades, spawning offshoots like 00:15:32.830 --> 00:15:35.629 Rapoon, and eventually carrying their uncompromising 00:15:35.629 --> 00:15:37.990 underground sound all the way into contemporary 00:15:37.990 --> 00:15:41.129 American cinema. If there is a core lasting insight 00:15:41.129 --> 00:15:43.809 to be drawn from their history, it is a powerful 00:15:43.809 --> 00:15:45.830 lesson about the nature of legacy and attention. 00:15:46.009 --> 00:15:49.509 In an era completely defined by information overload, 00:15:49.789 --> 00:15:51.710 where artists are terrified of being forgotten 00:15:51.710 --> 00:15:54.549 if they don't post a daily update, Zovia France 00:15:54.549 --> 00:15:57.269 proves that withholding information can actually 00:15:57.269 --> 00:15:59.350 be the most powerful choice an artist can make. 00:15:59.769 --> 00:16:02.149 By hiding who they were and by making their physical 00:16:02.149 --> 00:16:04.789 music deliberately difficult to unwrap and categorize, 00:16:05.110 --> 00:16:07.789 they didn't push true audiences away. Instead, 00:16:08.190 --> 00:16:10.769 they demanded a deeper level of engagement. They 00:16:10.769 --> 00:16:12.970 require the listener to step forward, overcome 00:16:12.970 --> 00:16:15.549 the friction, and really do the work. It really 00:16:15.549 --> 00:16:17.889 highlights how passive our relationship with 00:16:17.889 --> 00:16:20.789 art has become in the digital age, which brings 00:16:20.789 --> 00:16:22.830 me to the final thought I want to leave you with 00:16:22.830 --> 00:16:25.090 today. The next time you pull out your phone, 00:16:25.529 --> 00:16:28.070 tap a smooth glass screen and effortlessly stream 00:16:28.070 --> 00:16:30.690 a frictionless, pristine digital track straight 00:16:30.690 --> 00:16:34.230 into your wireless earbuds, ask yourself, how 00:16:34.230 --> 00:16:36.909 much does the physical absence of the music change 00:16:36.909 --> 00:16:39.639 your relationship to it? We have gained all the 00:16:39.639 --> 00:16:41.919 convenience in the world, but what did we lose 00:16:41.919 --> 00:16:44.019 when the friction disappeared? If you had to 00:16:44.019 --> 00:16:46.240 physically unwrap your absolute favorite song 00:16:46.240 --> 00:16:48.820 today from a rough, foul -smelling layer of heavy 00:16:48.820 --> 00:16:51.100 tar paper just to hear it, would you listen to 00:16:51.100 --> 00:16:52.080 it entirely differently?