WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:03.080 Imagine you're standing on the absolute precipice 00:00:03.080 --> 00:00:05.839 of global rock stardom. Right, like you are right 00:00:05.839 --> 00:00:07.759 there. Yeah, exactly. You're touring with Marilyn 00:00:07.759 --> 00:00:11.119 Manson. The ink is drying on this massive Atlantic 00:00:11.119 --> 00:00:13.500 Records deal. I mean, you have essentially arrived. 00:00:14.000 --> 00:00:16.079 Definitely. That is the dream. Right. And then 00:00:16.079 --> 00:00:18.760 a copy editor, just sitting in a boardroom somewhere, 00:00:19.359 --> 00:00:23.219 presses the backspace key one single time. Wow. 00:00:23.440 --> 00:00:25.940 They delete a tiny punctuation mark from your 00:00:25.940 --> 00:00:28.800 band's name, and your entire career just completely 00:00:28.800 --> 00:00:32.320 implodes. It's really the ultimate butterfly 00:00:32.320 --> 00:00:35.460 effect, playing out those murky, high stakes 00:00:35.460 --> 00:00:39.200 waters of corporate branding and artistic identity. 00:00:39.380 --> 00:00:41.560 Yeah, it's wild. We like to think that careers 00:00:41.560 --> 00:00:44.140 end with this massive, undeniable explosion, 00:00:44.399 --> 00:00:47.469 but... Well, often the detonator is just entirely 00:00:47.469 --> 00:00:49.869 invisible to the naked eye. Welcome to today's 00:00:49.869 --> 00:00:51.869 Deep Dive. We are so glad you're here with us. 00:00:52.189 --> 00:00:54.369 Today, we are looking at the history of the American 00:00:54.369 --> 00:00:57.850 alternative and gothic metal band Piston. Originating 00:00:57.850 --> 00:01:00.229 out of Staten Island, New York. Yes, Staten Island. 00:01:00.549 --> 00:01:03.210 And I mean, their story is this wild, almost 00:01:03.210 --> 00:01:06.840 unbelievable case study. And it serves as a massive 00:01:06.840 --> 00:01:10.280 cautionary tale really about the friction between 00:01:10.280 --> 00:01:12.900 making art and selling a product. Totally. Our 00:01:12.900 --> 00:01:16.439 mission today is to explore that incredibly volatile 00:01:16.439 --> 00:01:19.659 intersection of art, corporate commerce, and 00:01:19.659 --> 00:01:22.069 identity. We're going to look at the mechanisms 00:01:22.069 --> 00:01:24.590 of a massive industry machine trying to take 00:01:24.590 --> 00:01:27.629 raw, authentic art, sanitize it for the masses. 00:01:27.890 --> 00:01:29.469 And the collateral damage that leaves behind 00:01:29.469 --> 00:01:31.709 it. Exactly. OK, let's unpack this because, I 00:01:31.709 --> 00:01:33.530 mean, this isn't just a music biography. It is 00:01:33.530 --> 00:01:36.430 a master class in what happens when you let someone 00:01:36.430 --> 00:01:38.670 else hold the pen to your own identity. Yeah. 00:01:38.670 --> 00:01:40.810 And to really understand the sheer magnitude 00:01:40.810 --> 00:01:43.390 of what this band lost, we have to establish 00:01:43.390 --> 00:01:45.930 the foundation of what they bet from the ground 00:01:45.930 --> 00:01:48.390 up entirely on their own terms. Right. Because 00:01:48.390 --> 00:01:51.069 the 1990s music industry It was a very specific 00:01:51.069 --> 00:01:54.230 beast. And, you know, independent success required 00:01:54.230 --> 00:01:56.730 a massive amount of grassroots labor. So let's 00:01:56.730 --> 00:01:58.969 establish that foundation. The year is 1993. 00:01:59.129 --> 00:02:01.489 The setting is Staten Island. Classic 90s metal 00:02:01.489 --> 00:02:03.909 scene. Oh, yeah. The alternative music scene 00:02:03.909 --> 00:02:07.189 is exploding globally. But locally in New York, 00:02:07.189 --> 00:02:10.590 there's this really heavy, dark, gothic metal 00:02:10.590 --> 00:02:13.090 undercurrent. Definitely. And right in the middle 00:02:13.090 --> 00:02:15.789 of it, a band forms around a core duo. You've 00:02:15.789 --> 00:02:19.599 got Henry Font on vocals and guitars. Valium 00:02:19.599 --> 00:02:22.780 playing bass and providing backing vocals. Which 00:02:22.780 --> 00:02:25.039 is, I mean, it's a brilliant creative nucleus. 00:02:25.439 --> 00:02:26.759 Yeah. And what you have to understand about the 00:02:26.759 --> 00:02:30.900 1993 scene is that there was no viral internet 00:02:30.900 --> 00:02:33.400 fame. Right. No TikTok. Exactly. You couldn't 00:02:33.400 --> 00:02:35.439 just upload a track and wake up famous. You had 00:02:35.439 --> 00:02:37.939 to physically hand out cassette tapes. You had 00:02:37.939 --> 00:02:41.219 to drag your amplifiers into dive bars. Ah, the 00:02:41.219 --> 00:02:43.400 heavy lifting. Literally. You had to win over 00:02:43.400 --> 00:02:46.120 crowds one room at a time. And they're putting 00:02:46.120 --> 00:02:48.400 in that exact kind of work. They were at least 00:02:48.400 --> 00:02:52.840 two independent demos in the early 90s. And that 00:02:52.840 --> 00:02:56.000 second demo, which features the incredibly 90s, 00:02:56.000 --> 00:02:57.719 slightly abrasive title, You're in the Money. 00:02:58.099 --> 00:03:00.159 Such a great title. It actually gets produced 00:03:00.159 --> 00:03:02.879 by Josh Silver. Now, if you know your 90s metal, 00:03:03.280 --> 00:03:05.659 you know Josh Silver is the keyboardist and producer 00:03:05.659 --> 00:03:08.080 for the Brooklyn -based gothic metal titans type 00:03:08.080 --> 00:03:11.340 of negative. Right. So suddenly, Poston has this 00:03:11.340 --> 00:03:14.620 proximity to greatness. And that geographic and 00:03:14.620 --> 00:03:17.240 stylistic connection is, well, it's the defining 00:03:17.240 --> 00:03:19.439 mechanism of their early rise. Because they're 00:03:19.439 --> 00:03:21.650 neighbors, essentially. Yeah. Brooklyn and Staten 00:03:21.650 --> 00:03:24.629 Island are right next door. Right. But getting 00:03:24.629 --> 00:03:27.349 a major figure like Josh Silver to produce your 00:03:27.349 --> 00:03:30.129 demo in that era wasn't just about like getting 00:03:30.129 --> 00:03:33.650 a good audio mix. No. It was an anointing. It 00:03:33.650 --> 00:03:36.289 was the sonic watermark that told the rest of 00:03:36.289 --> 00:03:39.150 the underground metal scene, you know. These 00:03:39.150 --> 00:03:42.150 guys are the real deal. Absolutely. So by 1996, 00:03:42.189 --> 00:03:44.270 they've expanded the lineup. They bring in Paul 00:03:44.270 --> 00:03:46.949 Poulos on guitars and Danny Jamcovado on drums. 00:03:47.030 --> 00:03:49.789 Yep. And they released their first full length 00:03:49.789 --> 00:03:52.289 album titled Number One on this independent label 00:03:52.289 --> 00:03:55.430 called Mayhem Fierce. And the reception is just 00:03:55.430 --> 00:03:58.810 immediate and massive. Huge. We're talking critical 00:03:58.810 --> 00:04:00.990 acclaim pouring in, not just in the United States, 00:04:01.129 --> 00:04:03.710 but resonating heavily over in Europe too. They 00:04:03.710 --> 00:04:06.849 essentially built a grassroots political campaign. 00:04:06.969 --> 00:04:09.710 but like for heavy metal. I love that. It was 00:04:09.710 --> 00:04:12.030 hand -to -hand, door -to -door credibility. Yeah. 00:04:12.449 --> 00:04:15.009 And that naturally translated into touring momentum. 00:04:15.370 --> 00:04:17.350 Right, because they hit the road with absolute 00:04:17.350 --> 00:04:19.449 heavy hitters. I mean, they are touring with 00:04:19.449 --> 00:04:22.449 Typo Negative, they are opening for Marilyn Manson. 00:04:22.509 --> 00:04:25.810 That's massive exposure. Their notoriety is... 00:04:25.930 --> 00:04:29.529 absolutely skyrocketing. But, you know, you look 00:04:29.529 --> 00:04:32.009 at the historical retrospective of this era, 00:04:32.389 --> 00:04:35.250 and it is clear that their friendship with typonegative 00:04:35.250 --> 00:04:38.529 brought them both incredible help and intense 00:04:38.529 --> 00:04:41.629 scorn. Yeah, it's complicated. It makes me think 00:04:41.629 --> 00:04:44.410 of an analogy. It's exactly like having a highly 00:04:44.410 --> 00:04:46.750 popular, slightly intimidating older brother 00:04:46.750 --> 00:04:49.149 in high school. Oh, I love that visualization. 00:04:49.209 --> 00:04:52.470 Yeah. Because the older brother dynamic is incredibly 00:04:52.470 --> 00:04:54.850 complicated. Right. Sure. Walking down the hallway 00:04:54.850 --> 00:04:57.629 with him open. The seniors don't shove you into 00:04:57.629 --> 00:04:59.810 lockers. You get invited to the cool parties 00:04:59.810 --> 00:05:01.509 where the industry insiders are hanging out. 00:05:01.569 --> 00:05:03.430 Read the perks. But at the same time, everyone 00:05:03.430 --> 00:05:05.750 is constantly comparing you to him. You're never 00:05:05.750 --> 00:05:08.310 just evaluated on your own merits. You're always 00:05:08.310 --> 00:05:10.790 the little brother. You have to fight twice as 00:05:10.790 --> 00:05:12.810 hard to prove you aren't just riding his coattails. 00:05:13.069 --> 00:05:15.089 What's fascinating here is that double -edged 00:05:15.089 --> 00:05:18.399 sword of proximity to fame. Touring with giants 00:05:18.399 --> 00:05:21.800 builds incredible authentic credibility in the 00:05:21.800 --> 00:05:24.740 independent scene. You are vetted by the kings 00:05:24.740 --> 00:05:27.899 of the genre. But that exact authenticity, that 00:05:27.899 --> 00:05:31.220 gritty street credit, it functions as a giant 00:05:31.220 --> 00:05:34.220 flashing neon magnet for corporate forces. Oh, 00:05:34.240 --> 00:05:37.240 the major label. Exactly. Major labels in the 00:05:37.240 --> 00:05:40.259 mid 1990s were just flush with cash from the 00:05:40.259 --> 00:05:42.720 CD boom, but they didn't know how to manufacture 00:05:42.720 --> 00:05:44.720 underground credibility. They only knew how to 00:05:44.720 --> 00:05:46.750 buy it. Exactly. They just tried to buy it. And 00:05:46.750 --> 00:05:49.490 so major labels start circling. They see this 00:05:49.490 --> 00:05:51.810 band generating their own gravitational pull, 00:05:51.810 --> 00:05:54.069 and they want to absorb that gravity into their 00:05:54.069 --> 00:05:57.129 corporate orbit, which sets the stage for what 00:05:57.129 --> 00:05:59.670 should be a triumph, but is actually a highly 00:05:59.670 --> 00:06:01.949 dangerous transition. Moving from an indie label 00:06:01.949 --> 00:06:05.110 to a major conglomerate is fundamentally a culture 00:06:05.110 --> 00:06:07.870 clash. Totally. You are taking a raw startup 00:06:07.870 --> 00:06:10.589 and dropping it into a rigid corporate bureaucracy. 00:06:11.069 --> 00:06:13.930 So within a year of their indie debut, they make 00:06:13.930 --> 00:06:17.089 the jump. The band leaves the independent Mayhem 00:06:17.089 --> 00:06:20.329 Fierce label and signs straight to Atlantic Records. 00:06:20.790 --> 00:06:24.269 Huge. A massive global major label. On paper, 00:06:24.430 --> 00:06:26.750 it is the dream of almost every working musician 00:06:26.750 --> 00:06:29.889 at the time. But as soon as the ink dries, the 00:06:29.889 --> 00:06:32.170 friction begins. Of course. And the first casualty 00:06:32.170 --> 00:06:35.350 is the lineup. Polos and Kavadlo leave the band. 00:06:35.490 --> 00:06:39.199 Which is a... classic mechanism of major label 00:06:39.199 --> 00:06:41.819 transitions. The pressure suddenly skyrockets. 00:06:42.300 --> 00:06:44.959 The expectations for touring, for media appearances, 00:06:45.220 --> 00:06:47.579 for relentless schedules. It fractures bands 00:06:47.579 --> 00:06:49.980 who are used to operating at an independent pace. 00:06:50.220 --> 00:06:53.180 So the core duo of Font and ValRM have to pivot. 00:06:53.360 --> 00:06:56.019 They bring in energetic New Blood, Burton Gans 00:06:56.019 --> 00:06:59.139 on guitars, and Jeff McManus on drums. They have 00:06:59.139 --> 00:07:01.160 this fresh lineup. They have this massive label 00:07:01.160 --> 00:07:04.240 backing them. And Atlantic decides their first 00:07:04.240 --> 00:07:06.379 move is to re -release the debut album, number 00:07:06.379 --> 00:07:08.360 one, to a wider audience. Makes sense on paper. 00:07:08.500 --> 00:07:10.579 But they don't just put the existing independent 00:07:10.579 --> 00:07:12.600 record back on the shelves. They change the photos. 00:07:12.699 --> 00:07:14.519 They update the artwork to make it glossier. 00:07:14.800 --> 00:07:18.079 And then, well, the copy editor steps in. The 00:07:18.079 --> 00:07:21.730 infamous disappearing doc. Yes. Atlantic Records 00:07:21.730 --> 00:07:24.029 looks at the band's name, pissed, unspelled, 00:07:24.310 --> 00:07:26.769 P -I -S -T dot O -N, and they drop the period. 00:07:26.850 --> 00:07:29.129 They just take it out. They make it just P -I 00:07:29.129 --> 00:07:32.949 -S -T -O -N, piston. Why? Because executives 00:07:32.949 --> 00:07:35.850 in a boardroom decided it looked, quote, friendlier. 00:07:36.910 --> 00:07:39.329 And if you understand the alternative metal scene, 00:07:39.850 --> 00:07:43.050 friendly is the absolute last adjective you ever 00:07:43.050 --> 00:07:45.730 want applied to your art. Here's where it gets 00:07:45.730 --> 00:07:47.649 really interesting, though, because I want to 00:07:47.649 --> 00:07:49.310 push back on this a little bit. OK, go for it. 00:07:49.430 --> 00:07:51.810 I am putting myself in the shoes of someone just 00:07:51.810 --> 00:07:54.829 observing this from the outside. Is dropping 00:07:54.829 --> 00:07:57.329 a period really that big of a deal? Right. Or 00:07:57.329 --> 00:08:00.730 were 1990s metal fans just being overly sensitive 00:08:00.730 --> 00:08:03.850 purists? I mean, functionally, it is just a grammatical 00:08:03.850 --> 00:08:06.149 mark on a piece of cardboard. This raises an 00:08:06.149 --> 00:08:08.480 important question. and it is a completely fair 00:08:08.480 --> 00:08:11.500 challenge. But to understand the outrage, you 00:08:11.500 --> 00:08:13.660 have to look at the psychology of the alternative 00:08:13.660 --> 00:08:16.819 metal scene and really the mechanics of 90s retail. 00:08:16.970 --> 00:08:19.529 In gothic and alternative metal, the aesthetic, 00:08:19.689 --> 00:08:21.990 the aggression, the feeling of being this jagged 00:08:21.990 --> 00:08:25.129 outsider, that is the entire value proposition. 00:08:25.569 --> 00:08:27.670 The punctuation wasn't just grammar. The dot 00:08:27.670 --> 00:08:30.410 in piston was a visual disruption. Oh, I see. 00:08:30.410 --> 00:08:32.490 It was an intentional stumbling block. Exactly. 00:08:32.529 --> 00:08:35.169 When you were flipping through CDs in a mainstream 00:08:35.169 --> 00:08:38.789 mall store like Sam Goody. Wow, Sam Goody throwback. 00:08:38.929 --> 00:08:41.009 Right. But when you're flipping through those 00:08:41.009 --> 00:08:45.210 racks, a dot in the middle of a word forces your 00:08:45.210 --> 00:08:48.289 brain to pause. It makes the name look slightly 00:08:48.289 --> 00:08:50.649 abrasive, almost hostile to standard English. 00:08:51.090 --> 00:08:54.490 By removing that dot to make it friendlier, Atlantic 00:08:54.490 --> 00:08:56.429 Records wasn't just making a spelling trick for 00:08:56.429 --> 00:08:59.529 the sake of radio DJs. They were engaging in 00:08:59.529 --> 00:09:02.110 active corporate sanitization. They were sanding 00:09:02.110 --> 00:09:04.830 down the rough edges of an inherently rough band 00:09:04.830 --> 00:09:06.929 so they could stock them more easily next to 00:09:06.929 --> 00:09:09.389 mainstream pop acts. And I want you, the listener, 00:09:09.509 --> 00:09:11.710 to think about how this translates to your own 00:09:11.710 --> 00:09:15.889 life. Imagine you spend months working on a brilliant 00:09:16.080 --> 00:09:18.919 slightly edgy, highly creative proposal. You 00:09:18.919 --> 00:09:21.820 bring it to your boss and they say, I love the 00:09:21.820 --> 00:09:24.419 raw energy of this. Let's just change all the 00:09:24.419 --> 00:09:26.740 formatting to a standard corporate template and 00:09:26.740 --> 00:09:28.820 put it in Comic Sans so it feels friendlier. 00:09:29.019 --> 00:09:32.000 Oh, that hurts. Technically, the words are the 00:09:32.000 --> 00:09:34.220 same, but the soul has been entirely stripped 00:09:34.220 --> 00:09:37.029 out of it. That is precisely what it felt like 00:09:37.029 --> 00:09:40.070 to the fans. To the people who loved them from 00:09:40.070 --> 00:09:43.509 those early, unpolished Brooklyn dive bar days, 00:09:44.250 --> 00:09:47.590 that missing dot was a massive glaring signal. 00:09:47.710 --> 00:09:50.769 A red flag. Exactly. It was physical proof that 00:09:50.769 --> 00:09:52.870 the band had been compromised by the machine. 00:09:53.450 --> 00:09:55.549 The fans immediately accused them of selling 00:09:55.549 --> 00:09:58.909 out. And the irony is just staggering. A major 00:09:58.909 --> 00:10:01.730 label actively tried to take a heavy metal band 00:10:01.730 --> 00:10:04.580 and make them friendly. It's an inherently contradictory 00:10:04.580 --> 00:10:06.919 gamble. It completely defeats the entire purpose 00:10:06.919 --> 00:10:09.860 of the genre. And you know, corporate entities 00:10:09.860 --> 00:10:12.440 are notoriously terrible at handling failure. 00:10:12.460 --> 00:10:14.960 Oh, yeah. When that gamble failed, when the core 00:10:14.960 --> 00:10:17.779 fans rejected the sanitized version and the negative 00:10:17.779 --> 00:10:19.720 reviews from underground press started rolling 00:10:19.720 --> 00:10:21.899 in, the label didn't pivot. They didn't fix it. 00:10:22.059 --> 00:10:24.259 No, they didn't apologize and put the dot back. 00:10:24.759 --> 00:10:27.409 They simply abandoned the investment. Atlantic 00:10:27.409 --> 00:10:29.970 Records unceremoniously dropped the band. It 00:10:29.970 --> 00:10:32.529 is absolutely brutal. And it wasn't for a lack 00:10:32.529 --> 00:10:34.889 of hustle on the band's part. Not at all. They 00:10:34.889 --> 00:10:37.110 were working incredibly hard under this new label. 00:10:37.309 --> 00:10:40.169 They were touring exhaustively. They had deep, 00:10:40.429 --> 00:10:42.830 authentic friendships with massive acts like 00:10:42.830 --> 00:10:45.350 The Misfits and Queen's Race. They were putting 00:10:45.350 --> 00:10:47.899 in the work. There was even a moment where their 00:10:47.899 --> 00:10:50.799 new drummer, Jeff McManus, had to take a brief 00:10:50.799 --> 00:10:53.940 medical leave, and Johnny Kelly of Type O Negative 00:10:53.940 --> 00:10:56.879 literally stepped in to fill in on drums just 00:10:56.879 --> 00:10:59.240 so they wouldn't have to cancel tour dates. Wow. 00:10:59.340 --> 00:11:00.919 I mean, they were bleeding for this. They had 00:11:00.919 --> 00:11:02.899 the work ethic. They had the industry connections. 00:11:02.980 --> 00:11:06.639 They have the raw talent. But the label's corporate 00:11:06.639 --> 00:11:10.440 interference fundamentally broke the trust with 00:11:10.440 --> 00:11:13.139 their audience. Yeah. And once that trust is 00:11:13.139 --> 00:11:15.960 broken in an underground scene, the momentum 00:11:15.960 --> 00:11:17.840 just vanishes. And when you have a band that 00:11:17.840 --> 00:11:19.940 has been fundamentally stripped of its identity 00:11:19.940 --> 00:11:23.039 and unceremoniously dumped by the corporate machine, 00:11:23.919 --> 00:11:25.840 that creative energy doesn't just disappear, 00:11:26.220 --> 00:11:28.960 it curdles, it turns into venom, and that venom 00:11:28.960 --> 00:11:32.919 needs a place to go. Which brings us to 1999 00:11:32.919 --> 00:11:36.259 and the era of absolute resentment. The pivot 00:11:36.259 --> 00:11:39.740 from ambition to pure spite. Yeah. The band returns 00:11:39.740 --> 00:11:42.000 to Mayhem Records, their original independent 00:11:42.000 --> 00:11:44.659 label home, and they release their second full 00:11:44.659 --> 00:11:47.740 -length album, and they title it, very pointedly, 00:11:48.019 --> 00:11:51.179 Hell Out, spelled with a giant dollar sign. They 00:11:51.179 --> 00:11:53.299 took the worst accusation their fans had thrown 00:11:53.299 --> 00:11:56.019 at them and they... weaponized it as an album 00:11:56.019 --> 00:11:57.919 title. Right. And if you listen to Hell Out, 00:11:58.000 --> 00:12:01.820 it is just rife with crooked, spiteful poking 00:12:01.820 --> 00:12:03.820 at the music industry. Oh, it's heavy. They are 00:12:03.820 --> 00:12:06.159 taking shots at their former label, Atlantic. 00:12:06.399 --> 00:12:08.539 They're swinging wildly at the music press who 00:12:08.539 --> 00:12:11.480 turned on them. They're even taking deeply cynical 00:12:11.480 --> 00:12:14.399 shots at themselves. It is a pure, unfiltered 00:12:14.399 --> 00:12:17.159 expression of industry trauma. But this points 00:12:17.159 --> 00:12:19.720 to a larger mechanism of how artists interact 00:12:19.720 --> 00:12:22.000 with their audience. So what does this all mean? 00:12:22.019 --> 00:12:23.799 Because when I look at the release of Hell Out, 00:12:23.850 --> 00:12:25.889 My analogy here is that it feels exactly like 00:12:25.889 --> 00:12:28.450 burning down your own house just to prove to 00:12:28.450 --> 00:12:30.230 the landlord that you control the thermostat. 00:12:30.389 --> 00:12:33.309 That is a perfect visualization. Like, yes, you 00:12:33.309 --> 00:12:35.470 made your point. You showed everyone you are 00:12:35.470 --> 00:12:38.610 mad. But now you're standing in the ashes. If 00:12:38.610 --> 00:12:41.610 we connect this to the bigger picture, it really 00:12:41.610 --> 00:12:45.809 shows the danger of spite -driven art. Internal 00:12:45.809 --> 00:12:48.789 industry grievances are all consuming for the 00:12:48.789 --> 00:12:51.389 artist. Yeah. It is all they can think about. 00:12:52.029 --> 00:12:54.590 But it deeply alienates the actual listener. 00:12:55.409 --> 00:12:57.490 Because the listener wasn't in the Atlantic Records 00:12:57.490 --> 00:12:59.309 boardroom. Exactly. The listener doesn't care 00:12:59.309 --> 00:13:01.429 about the A &R guy who dropped you. They just 00:13:01.429 --> 00:13:04.970 want to hear good, heavy, cathartic metal that 00:13:04.970 --> 00:13:07.009 helps them deal with their own lives. Exactly. 00:13:07.070 --> 00:13:09.110 When you release an album that is essentially 00:13:09.110 --> 00:13:12.350 an inside baseball complaint about record contracts 00:13:12.350 --> 00:13:15.889 and media reviews, the average fan has nothing 00:13:15.889 --> 00:13:17.909 to connect with. Honestly at all. And the reception 00:13:17.909 --> 00:13:21.039 reflected that. Elhaut was met with lukewarm 00:13:21.039 --> 00:13:24.100 reviews and slow sales, and the foundation of 00:13:24.100 --> 00:13:26.139 the band just started fracturing under the weight 00:13:26.139 --> 00:13:28.480 of all that bitterness. The emotional baggage 00:13:28.480 --> 00:13:30.639 attached to the project was just, well, it was 00:13:30.639 --> 00:13:32.679 too heavy to carry. Yeah. It wasn't about the 00:13:32.679 --> 00:13:35.419 technical quality of the music anymore. The narrative 00:13:35.419 --> 00:13:38.809 had become entirely toxic. Following that second 00:13:38.809 --> 00:13:41.149 release, the cracks become really visible. The 00:13:41.149 --> 00:13:44.970 drummer, Jeff McManus, departs. Now he does come 00:13:44.970 --> 00:13:47.909 back briefly in the spring of 2001 to record 00:13:47.909 --> 00:13:51.870 a three -song independent EP called Saves. And 00:13:51.870 --> 00:13:54.190 that EP actually brought a little bit of optimism. 00:13:54.210 --> 00:13:56.269 Yeah, glimmer. A glimmer that maybe they could 00:13:56.269 --> 00:13:58.950 get back to basics. A brief attempt to stabilize 00:13:58.950 --> 00:14:01.309 the ship. It just wasn't enough to hold the center. 00:14:01.769 --> 00:14:05.230 By late August 2001, the core duo finally breaks 00:14:05.230 --> 00:14:08.940 apart. Wow. Bassist Val. Each of them decides 00:14:08.940 --> 00:14:11.799 to leave the band. The founding partnership, 00:14:12.019 --> 00:14:13.840 the engine that started the whole thing in Staten 00:14:13.840 --> 00:14:16.960 Island back in 1993, is over. End of an era. 00:14:17.360 --> 00:14:19.500 And even though they didn't issue some grand, 00:14:19.539 --> 00:14:22.159 dramatic breakup statement at the time, Peace 00:14:22.159 --> 00:14:24.960 Strong goes completely silent. They do not release 00:14:24.960 --> 00:14:27.759 any new material as a band for over two decades. 00:14:27.940 --> 00:14:31.000 The 20 -year winter sets in. But this leads to 00:14:31.000 --> 00:14:33.220 one of the most interesting phases of their entire 00:14:33.220 --> 00:14:35.860 trajectory. Because, you know, musicians don't 00:14:35.860 --> 00:14:38.159 just stop being musicians when a pan dissolves. 00:14:38.299 --> 00:14:40.980 No, the drive to create is still there. But looking 00:14:40.980 --> 00:14:43.200 at this 20 -year gap where they all go off to 00:14:43.200 --> 00:14:46.340 do these incredibly niche independent solo projects, 00:14:46.840 --> 00:14:49.259 to me that looks exactly like a trauma response. 00:14:49.419 --> 00:14:51.779 It's like they had to retreat to the smallest, 00:14:51.919 --> 00:14:54.399 most controllable musical environments possible 00:14:54.399 --> 00:14:57.100 just to feel safe making art again without a 00:14:57.100 --> 00:15:00.019 corporate shadow looming over them. That is precisely 00:15:00.019 --> 00:15:02.299 the mechanism at work. You can't just bounce 00:15:02.299 --> 00:15:04.720 back from that level of identity theft. You have 00:15:04.720 --> 00:15:06.840 to relearn how to love your own craft. And we 00:15:06.840 --> 00:15:08.480 see them doing exactly that. Exactly that throughout 00:15:08.480 --> 00:15:12.200 the 2000s. Henry Font creates a project called 00:15:12.200 --> 00:15:14.879 Summer Flu. Yep. Jeff McManus releases music 00:15:14.879 --> 00:15:17.340 under the brilliant moniker Weekends with Dan. 00:15:17.740 --> 00:15:21.379 And actually, in 2006, he drops a punk single 00:15:21.379 --> 00:15:24.740 called Anorexia that gets serious critical acclaim 00:15:24.740 --> 00:15:26.980 in independent punk rock publications. Oh, that's 00:15:26.980 --> 00:15:29.000 awesome. Burton Gans is also busy building his 00:15:29.000 --> 00:15:31.720 own worlds. He forms a band called American Popular 00:15:31.720 --> 00:15:34.080 and another called The Dead Liz, which releases 00:15:34.080 --> 00:15:37.360 a self -titled debut in 2009 and a follow -up, 00:15:37.600 --> 00:15:40.740 Fabulous Disaster, in 2011. See, these solar 00:15:40.740 --> 00:15:43.879 projects acted as a necessary psychological palate 00:15:43.879 --> 00:15:45.700 cleanser. They were making music where they were 00:15:45.700 --> 00:15:48.120 the sole decision makers, where no one in a suit 00:15:48.120 --> 00:15:51.059 was telling them to be friendly or, you know, 00:15:51.200 --> 00:15:53.179 changing their punctuation to please a retail 00:15:53.179 --> 00:15:56.379 buyer. It was pure creative autonomy, which is 00:15:56.379 --> 00:15:58.480 exactly what they needed to heal. And the beautiful 00:15:58.480 --> 00:16:01.179 thing is the healing actually worked because 00:16:01.179 --> 00:16:03.539 after all that time, after letting the venom 00:16:03.539 --> 00:16:06.740 leave their system, we get the inevitable resurrection. 00:16:06.820 --> 00:16:11.029 Yes. In March 2015, Post On breaks two decades 00:16:11.029 --> 00:16:13.250 of silence to announce they are reforming and 00:16:13.250 --> 00:16:16.889 working on new material. In early October 2017, 00:16:17.129 --> 00:16:20.190 they announced a formal official reformation. 00:16:20.389 --> 00:16:22.470 And returning two decades later is a profound 00:16:22.470 --> 00:16:25.289 statement of endurance. It really is. By June 00:16:25.289 --> 00:16:28.029 2018, they aren't just practicing. They are doing 00:16:28.029 --> 00:16:30.809 a seven -date tour in the UK. Incredible. Henry 00:16:30.809 --> 00:16:33.230 Font, Burton Gans, and Jeff McManus are back 00:16:33.230 --> 00:16:36.149 together. And they bring in a new bassist, Jack 00:16:36.149 --> 00:16:39.320 Hanley, to complete the lineup. I just love the 00:16:39.320 --> 00:16:41.240 joy of discovery here. When you look at the sheer 00:16:41.240 --> 00:16:43.500 resilience required to come back after 20 years, 00:16:43.779 --> 00:16:46.600 it is incredibly inspiring. It allowed Piston 00:16:46.600 --> 00:16:49.379 to finally reclaim the narrative. The Atlantic 00:16:49.379 --> 00:16:52.399 Records disaster and the Bitter Owl Out era no 00:16:52.399 --> 00:16:54.779 longer got to be the final chapter of their story. 00:16:55.279 --> 00:16:57.600 They took the pen back. And it culminates on 00:16:57.600 --> 00:17:01.980 March 25, 2022. They release the Cold World EP. 00:17:02.120 --> 00:17:04.440 It is their first new studio recording since 00:17:04.440 --> 00:17:07.920 2001. Wow. And later they expand it into a release 00:17:07.920 --> 00:17:10.980 called Cold World plus AP, which beautifully 00:17:10.980 --> 00:17:13.380 gathers up all the fragmented pieces of their 00:17:13.380 --> 00:17:16.380 history. It includes that new EP that original 00:17:16.380 --> 00:17:19.690 2001 saves EP. and some unreleased demos from 00:17:19.690 --> 00:17:22.250 the year 2000. They synthesize their past and 00:17:22.250 --> 00:17:24.329 their present but entirely on their own terms. 00:17:24.710 --> 00:17:27.670 It is a beautiful poetic irony. After going through 00:17:27.670 --> 00:17:29.710 the corporate meat grinder, after burning the 00:17:29.710 --> 00:17:32.289 house down with spite, after years of quiet solo 00:17:32.289 --> 00:17:34.890 recovery, they ended up exactly where they started 00:17:34.890 --> 00:17:38.109 in 1993. Making raw, authentic, heavy metal. 00:17:38.690 --> 00:17:40.410 Independently, completely free of the corporate 00:17:40.410 --> 00:17:42.670 machine. The arc of their career is a powerful 00:17:42.670 --> 00:17:44.769 testament to the fact that, well, an industry 00:17:44.769 --> 00:17:46.849 might be able to temporarily steal your identity, 00:17:47.329 --> 00:17:49.089 but if you have the patience to wait out the 00:17:49.089 --> 00:17:51.349 storm and do the internal work, you could eventually 00:17:51.349 --> 00:17:54.390 take it back. It really is an incredible journey. 00:17:54.799 --> 00:17:57.720 To summarize our deep dive today, we've watched 00:17:57.720 --> 00:18:01.319 Piston go from gritty Staten Island indie darlings 00:18:01.319 --> 00:18:04.359 producing raw tapes with gothic metal royalty 00:18:04.359 --> 00:18:08.480 to becoming corporate casualties literally derailed 00:18:08.480 --> 00:18:11.680 over a missing punctuation mark. We watched them 00:18:11.680 --> 00:18:14.220 turn into self -aware rebels lashing out at the 00:18:14.220 --> 00:18:17.180 industry and finally transforming into resurrected 00:18:17.180 --> 00:18:20.240 veterans releasing new music with absolute creative 00:18:20.240 --> 00:18:24.079 control in 2022. It's a highly specific story 00:18:24.079 --> 00:18:26.799 about a the 90s metal band. But the underlying 00:18:26.799 --> 00:18:29.460 mechanisms apply to almost any field where creativity 00:18:29.460 --> 00:18:32.279 meets commerce. Exactly. And that is why I want 00:18:32.279 --> 00:18:33.880 you, the listener, to think about this in the 00:18:33.880 --> 00:18:35.980 context of your own life, your own career, or 00:18:35.980 --> 00:18:38.619 your own passion projects. Have you ever found 00:18:38.619 --> 00:18:40.900 yourself in a situation where you accepted a 00:18:40.900 --> 00:18:43.319 minor compromise? Maybe you smoothed over an 00:18:43.319 --> 00:18:46.039 edge of your personality or changed your metaphorical 00:18:46.039 --> 00:18:48.019 spelling to appear more friendly, more palatable, 00:18:48.160 --> 00:18:50.480 or more acceptable to a boss or a client. Right. 00:18:50.670 --> 00:18:52.789 And did you realize later that in making that 00:18:52.789 --> 00:18:55.589 tiny supposedly harmless concession, you actually 00:18:55.589 --> 00:18:57.730 compromised the core of what made your work special 00:18:57.730 --> 00:19:00.529 in the first place? It is remarkably easy to 00:19:00.529 --> 00:19:02.869 let someone else delete your dot in the name 00:19:02.869 --> 00:19:06.390 of progress. But the consequence of that deletion, 00:19:06.650 --> 00:19:08.930 the loss of your authentic voice, can echo for 00:19:08.930 --> 00:19:12.329 decades. Which brings us to one final lingering 00:19:12.329 --> 00:19:15.170 thought to leave you with today. We've seen how 00:19:15.170 --> 00:19:18.210 an entire band's trajectory, their career, their 00:19:18.210 --> 00:19:20.349 livelihood, their deepest relationship with their 00:19:20.349 --> 00:19:24.470 fans could be fundamentally derailed by a single 00:19:24.470 --> 00:19:27.589 tiny grammatical tweak meant to make them more 00:19:27.589 --> 00:19:30.230 marketable. So as you go through your week, consider 00:19:30.230 --> 00:19:33.509 this. How much of the media, the art, the corporate 00:19:33.509 --> 00:19:35.349 messaging, and the information that you and I 00:19:35.349 --> 00:19:38.430 consume every single day has been similarly sanitized 00:19:38.430 --> 00:19:41.160 and scrubbed without us ever noticing the missing 00:19:41.160 --> 00:19:43.259 dots. The next time you see something that looks 00:19:43.259 --> 00:19:45.619 perfectly friendly, perfectly polished, and flawlessly 00:19:45.619 --> 00:19:47.740 marketable, just remember the copy editor sitting 00:19:47.740 --> 00:19:50.380 at the desk in the boardroom, remember the backspace 00:19:50.380 --> 00:19:52.940 key, and ask yourself what was erased before 00:19:52.940 --> 00:19:55.339 it ever got to you. Thanks for joining us on 00:19:55.339 --> 00:19:55.940 this deep dive.