WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:04.339 I want you to imagine a property line dispute. 00:00:04.700 --> 00:00:07.639 Not just a simple disagreement over offense, 00:00:07.820 --> 00:00:10.539 but a feud that has been going on for so long 00:00:10.539 --> 00:00:12.800 that nobody actually remembers the first argument. 00:00:13.160 --> 00:00:16.079 Now, I want you to imagine that exact same feud 00:00:16.079 --> 00:00:19.100 has played out publicly on a patch of grass and 00:00:19.100 --> 00:00:25.699 dirt over 2 ,500 times since 1885. It is... Honestly, 00:00:25.879 --> 00:00:27.899 a genuinely staggering number when you sit with 00:00:27.899 --> 00:00:30.579 it. Oh, totally. I mean, 2 ,500 meetings. It's 00:00:30.579 --> 00:00:33.079 like an entire alternate history of America played 00:00:33.079 --> 00:00:35.140 out in nine -inning increments. Exactly. And 00:00:35.140 --> 00:00:37.539 we have a massive stack of sources on the table 00:00:37.539 --> 00:00:40.420 today to look at this historical texts, media 00:00:40.420 --> 00:00:44.159 analyses, and this fantastic book by Buzz Bissinger, 00:00:44.560 --> 00:00:47.159 all to help us unpack the iconic rivalry between 00:00:47.159 --> 00:00:49.840 the Chicago Cubs and the St. Louis Cardinals. 00:00:50.100 --> 00:00:51.600 You know, a lot of people might know it as the 00:00:51.600 --> 00:00:54.619 Route 66 rivalry. Right, or the High 55 rivalry. 00:00:54.509 --> 00:00:57.549 But we're going to use this deep dive to explore 00:00:57.549 --> 00:01:00.670 why this isn't just a baseball rivalry. No, not 00:01:00.670 --> 00:01:02.890 at all. We're looking at a century -long turf 00:01:02.890 --> 00:01:06.349 war, one that was shaped by geography, economics, 00:01:06.730 --> 00:01:09.569 and honestly, some of the most spectacular pettiness 00:01:09.569 --> 00:01:12.109 in recorded history. And what makes this deep 00:01:12.109 --> 00:01:15.209 dive so fascinating to me is how sports rivalries, 00:01:15.209 --> 00:01:19.849 they act as a mirror. We are just talking about 00:01:19.849 --> 00:01:23.500 men hitting a baseball. We are looking at a mechanism 00:01:23.500 --> 00:01:25.780 that has fundamentally shaped the psychology 00:01:25.780 --> 00:01:28.140 of entire generations of fans in the Midwest. 00:01:28.859 --> 00:01:31.500 It dictates how millions of people view themselves 00:01:31.500 --> 00:01:33.900 and, crucially, how they view the people living 00:01:33.900 --> 00:01:36.239 just one town over. Let's start right there, 00:01:36.239 --> 00:01:38.540 actually, with the borders, because before we 00:01:38.540 --> 00:01:41.159 get to the literal riots. And yes, there are 00:01:41.159 --> 00:01:42.659 riots in the source material. Oh, absolutely. 00:01:42.859 --> 00:01:45.420 But before that, we have to establish why these 00:01:45.420 --> 00:01:47.819 two fan bases care with such a burning passion. 00:01:47.939 --> 00:01:51.000 And it really comes down to real estate. In Bissener's 00:01:51.000 --> 00:01:53.780 book Three Nights in August, he draws this brilliant 00:01:53.780 --> 00:01:56.500 contrast. He looks at the Yankees and Red Sox 00:01:56.500 --> 00:01:58.840 out on the East Coast, and he basically calls 00:01:58.840 --> 00:02:02.799 that rivalry a tabloid -filled soap opera about 00:02:02.799 --> 00:02:05.760 money and ego. Which is pretty accurate. Yeah. 00:02:06.519 --> 00:02:09.319 But the Cubs and Cardinals, he says that is entirely 00:02:09.319 --> 00:02:12.599 about geography and territorial rights. That 00:02:12.599 --> 00:02:15.000 distinction right there is the key to everything. 00:02:15.060 --> 00:02:17.800 How so? Well, the East Coast rivalries are largely 00:02:17.800 --> 00:02:20.340 about media markets, right? Star power. They're 00:02:20.340 --> 00:02:22.120 constantly fighting for the back page of the 00:02:22.120 --> 00:02:25.259 newspaper. Sure. But the Midwest rivalry is about. 00:02:25.419 --> 00:02:28.099 literal ground. If you look back to the first 00:02:28.099 --> 00:02:30.639 half of the 20th century, the St. Louis Cardinals 00:02:30.639 --> 00:02:33.080 were the southernmost team in the National League. 00:02:33.219 --> 00:02:35.099 Right. And they were the westernmost team for 00:02:35.099 --> 00:02:38.039 a long time too. So they didn't just have a city. 00:02:38.719 --> 00:02:42.520 they claimed a massive multi -state empire stretching 00:02:42.520 --> 00:02:45.580 across the South and the lower Midwest. And how 00:02:45.580 --> 00:02:48.099 did they enforce that empire? It was radio. Yeah, 00:02:48.280 --> 00:02:50.960 exactly. Specifically, KMOX radio in St. Louis. 00:02:51.099 --> 00:02:53.800 We're talking about a 50 ,000 watt blowtorch, 00:02:54.039 --> 00:02:57.500 an AM radio station. Monster signal. It was. 00:02:57.800 --> 00:03:00.960 At night, that signal would bounce off the ionosphere 00:03:00.960 --> 00:03:03.919 and just blanket half the country. You had like... 00:03:03.919 --> 00:03:06.599 farmers in Arkansas and Oklahoma pulling in Cardinals 00:03:06.599 --> 00:03:08.400 games. Right, but Chicago wasn't just sitting 00:03:08.400 --> 00:03:10.479 there letting them take it. Right. No, definitely 00:03:10.479 --> 00:03:12.879 not. The Cubs were claiming the upper Midwest 00:03:12.879 --> 00:03:16.680 using their own clear channel AM monster stations 00:03:16.680 --> 00:03:21.264 like WGN and WBBM. So if you picture this... 00:03:21.259 --> 00:03:24.219 It's basically an invisible border war fought 00:03:24.219 --> 00:03:26.539 over radio waves in the middle of the night. 00:03:26.680 --> 00:03:28.860 It's a technological battleground. Yeah. And 00:03:28.860 --> 00:03:32.419 it created this very real geographic fault line. 00:03:32.500 --> 00:03:34.500 Yeah. Like, if you look at central Illinois, 00:03:35.000 --> 00:03:37.460 you are sitting right in the middle of that static. 00:03:37.639 --> 00:03:40.879 It was a literal front line. Wow. Families, friends, 00:03:41.199 --> 00:03:44.050 entire towns were... divided, based entirely 00:03:44.050 --> 00:03:46.969 on which radio signal came in clearer on their 00:03:46.969 --> 00:03:48.909 porch. Or just which broadcasts their parents 00:03:48.909 --> 00:03:50.810 had tuned into. Yeah, exactly. It became this 00:03:50.810 --> 00:03:53.090 profound cultural signifier. Which brings up 00:03:53.090 --> 00:03:55.490 this amazing observation from the commentator 00:03:55.490 --> 00:03:58.409 George Will. We found this 1998 commencement 00:03:58.409 --> 00:04:00.889 address he gave at Washington University in St. 00:04:01.009 --> 00:04:02.810 Louis. And he grew up in Champaign, Illinois, 00:04:02.909 --> 00:04:05.129 right? Yes, right in the teeth of that central 00:04:05.129 --> 00:04:07.750 battleground. And Will argued that this geographic 00:04:07.750 --> 00:04:10.169 split actually dictated his friend's political 00:04:10.169 --> 00:04:12.569 and psychological development. That is wild. 00:04:12.849 --> 00:04:15.169 It's fascinating. He said all his friends became 00:04:15.169 --> 00:04:18.029 Cardinals fans rooting for the great Stan Musel. 00:04:18.329 --> 00:04:21.129 And because the Cardinals won so consistently, 00:04:21.689 --> 00:04:23.670 his friends grew up cheerfully convinced that 00:04:23.670 --> 00:04:26.370 the world is a benign place. So they naturally 00:04:26.370 --> 00:04:29.269 became optimistic liberals. Exactly. While Will, 00:04:29.269 --> 00:04:32.209 on the other hand, chose the Cubs, he pointed 00:04:32.209 --> 00:04:34.310 out that Cubs hadn't won a World Series since 00:04:34.310 --> 00:04:37.649 1908, which he noted was two years before Mark 00:04:37.649 --> 00:04:39.829 Twain even died. That really puts it in perspective. 00:04:39.970 --> 00:04:42.649 It really does. So Will claimed that growing 00:04:42.649 --> 00:04:45.149 up a Cubs fan made him, and I'm quoting here, 00:04:45.449 --> 00:04:50.889 gloomy, pessimistic, morose. It's just a really 00:04:50.889 --> 00:04:54.050 striking framework, the idea that the operational 00:04:54.050 --> 00:04:56.709 success or failure of a local sports franchise 00:04:57.339 --> 00:05:00.560 might actually wire your worldview and your expectations 00:05:00.560 --> 00:05:02.660 of life. No, I do want to throw in a quick caveat 00:05:02.660 --> 00:05:04.800 here for you listening, just because we're looking 00:05:04.800 --> 00:05:07.560 directly at Will's text. We are definitely not 00:05:07.560 --> 00:05:09.800 endorsing his personal definitions of what makes 00:05:09.800 --> 00:05:12.560 someone psychology liberal or conservative. And 00:05:12.560 --> 00:05:15.899 we are absolutely not taking any political sides 00:05:15.899 --> 00:05:18.759 here. We're just laying out his argument to show 00:05:18.759 --> 00:05:22.180 you just how deeply... This rivalry penetrates 00:05:22.180 --> 00:05:24.300 the cultural identity of the region. Right. I 00:05:24.300 --> 00:05:25.579 mean, he wasn't talking about batting averages. 00:05:25.639 --> 00:05:28.220 He was talking about the human soul. Perfectly 00:05:28.220 --> 00:05:31.019 put. And that cultural depth is so thoroughly 00:05:31.019 --> 00:05:33.439 baked into the region that Hollywood actually 00:05:33.439 --> 00:05:36.660 uses it as shorthand. Oh, like an Ozark. Yes. 00:05:37.259 --> 00:05:39.800 If you look at the Netflix show Ozark, they needed 00:05:39.800 --> 00:05:42.439 to establish Jason Dateman's character, Marty 00:05:42.439 --> 00:05:46.079 Bird, as a true Chicago guy who is totally out 00:05:46.079 --> 00:05:48.310 of his element in Missouri. Right. They don't 00:05:48.310 --> 00:05:50.290 give him a long monologue about missing deep 00:05:50.290 --> 00:05:53.170 dish pizza or the skyline. He just declares to 00:05:53.170 --> 00:05:55.470 a local that he was raised to hate the Cardinals. 00:05:55.769 --> 00:05:57.769 And the local instantly fires back that he was 00:05:57.769 --> 00:05:59.790 raised to hate the Cubs. That's it. Two lines 00:05:59.790 --> 00:06:02.029 dialogue and you instantly understand the cultural 00:06:02.029 --> 00:06:04.949 friction. So it's wild that AM radio and geography 00:06:04.949 --> 00:06:07.699 cemented these borders in the 20th century. But 00:06:07.699 --> 00:06:10.560 if we dig into the historical sources, the actual 00:06:10.560 --> 00:06:14.459 hatred predates radio by decades. Oh, long before 00:06:14.459 --> 00:06:16.420 radio. Yeah, it wasn't even about sports originally, 00:06:16.480 --> 00:06:20.160 was it? Not at all. It started as a really aggressive 00:06:20.160 --> 00:06:23.500 economic rivalry in the late eighteen hundreds. 00:06:23.759 --> 00:06:27.319 Chicago and St. Louis were locked in this fierce 00:06:27.319 --> 00:06:30.360 existential battle for trade dominance in the 00:06:30.360 --> 00:06:32.339 Midwest. Right. They were competing for railroad 00:06:32.339 --> 00:06:34.819 lines. Exactly. They were fighting over shipping 00:06:34.819 --> 00:06:38.180 routes along the Mississippi River and just generally 00:06:38.180 --> 00:06:41.579 battling for commercial supremacy as the true 00:06:41.579 --> 00:06:43.819 gateway to the West. Right. And according to 00:06:43.819 --> 00:06:47.579 the book, Before they were Cardinals, this broader 00:06:47.579 --> 00:06:50.839 civic rivalry directly led to the formation of 00:06:50.839 --> 00:06:54.240 the St. Louis Brown Stockings in 1875. And that 00:06:54.240 --> 00:06:57.240 team was created quite literally by local businessmen. 00:06:57.259 --> 00:06:59.360 Right. Just to compete with the Chicago White 00:06:59.360 --> 00:07:01.120 Stockings. It was corporate warfare. They just 00:07:01.120 --> 00:07:02.920 happened to be wearing baseball pants. I love 00:07:02.920 --> 00:07:06.000 that. And this tension culminated in the 1885 00:07:06.000 --> 00:07:08.660 World Series. Let me tell you, if you think modern 00:07:08.660 --> 00:07:11.980 sports have drama, the 1880s were absolute chaos. 00:07:12.100 --> 00:07:15.000 It was a completely different game. ends in a 00:07:15.000 --> 00:07:17.899 forfeit. Why? Because the St. Louis manager, 00:07:18.160 --> 00:07:21.079 Charles Komisky, got so incredibly mad at an 00:07:21.079 --> 00:07:22.959 umpire's call in the sixth inning that he just 00:07:22.959 --> 00:07:25.160 pulled his entire team off the field. He just 00:07:25.160 --> 00:07:27.899 refused to play. Yeah. Chicago was leading five 00:07:27.899 --> 00:07:30.459 to four, so the umpire just declared Chicago 00:07:30.459 --> 00:07:33.139 the winner. But here is where the lack of institutional 00:07:33.139 --> 00:07:36.160 control in early baseball becomes so fascinating. 00:07:36.199 --> 00:07:38.389 What happened? The series just continued. There 00:07:38.389 --> 00:07:40.550 was no overarching commissioner to lay down the 00:07:40.550 --> 00:07:43.410 law. So ultimately, C. Lewis just claimed that 00:07:43.410 --> 00:07:46.310 the Game 2 forfeit shouldn't count. They just 00:07:46.310 --> 00:07:48.790 ignored the umpire. Completely. They ignored 00:07:48.790 --> 00:07:51.610 the official ruling, boldly declared themselves 00:07:51.610 --> 00:07:53.990 the champions of the world, and then the two 00:07:53.990 --> 00:07:56.569 clubs just agreed to split the thousand dollar 00:07:56.569 --> 00:07:58.889 prize money right down the middle. Wait, hold 00:07:58.889 --> 00:08:01.170 on. They just split the money? Five hundred bucks 00:08:01.170 --> 00:08:03.550 each. How is that even a championship? They just 00:08:03.550 --> 00:08:05.449 walked away with cash and a permanent grudge. 00:08:05.790 --> 00:08:09.300 Pretty much. which perfectly sets up the 1886 00:08:09.300 --> 00:08:12.339 rematch. Oh man, and this is where the sheer 00:08:12.339 --> 00:08:15.279 unadulterated pettiness really shines through 00:08:15.279 --> 00:08:17.720 in the history books. It gets so petty. So in 00:08:17.720 --> 00:08:20.660 game five, Chicago was dealing with massive injuries. 00:08:20.980 --> 00:08:23.680 Their pitchers arms are completely dead. Right. 00:08:23.899 --> 00:08:26.100 So Chicago tries to bring in a recruit from the 00:08:26.100 --> 00:08:27.860 minor leagues just to throw some pitches and 00:08:27.860 --> 00:08:31.319 get through the game. But St. Louis flat out 00:08:31.319 --> 00:08:33.259 refuses to let him on the field. It wouldn't 00:08:33.259 --> 00:08:36.419 allow it. No. They invoke the rigid rules and 00:08:36.419 --> 00:08:38.879 force Chicago to put their shortstop and their 00:08:38.879 --> 00:08:42.120 right fielder on the pitchers mound. And unpredictably. 00:08:42.269 --> 00:08:45.490 Or, well, very predictably, St. Louis crushes 00:08:45.490 --> 00:08:48.610 them 10 to 3. It was just a ruthless capitalization 00:08:48.610 --> 00:08:51.490 on an opponent's physical misfortune. Truly. 00:08:51.889 --> 00:08:55.330 And it forced a decisive. Game six, which they 00:08:55.330 --> 00:08:57.210 actually had to start early, right? Like a two 00:08:57.210 --> 00:08:59.509 point one eight p .m. Yeah, because stadiums 00:08:59.509 --> 00:09:01.389 didn't have lights yet and they needed to ensure 00:09:01.389 --> 00:09:03.509 they had enough daylight to finish all nine innings. 00:09:03.549 --> 00:09:05.730 Right. So it goes into the 10th inning tied three 00:09:05.730 --> 00:09:08.669 to three and a St. Louis player named Kurt Welch 00:09:08.669 --> 00:09:11.970 scores the winning run on a wild pitch with what 00:09:11.970 --> 00:09:14.269 became legendarily known as the fifteen thousand 00:09:14.269 --> 00:09:17.269 dollar slide. Yes. So St. Louis officially wins 00:09:17.269 --> 00:09:19.190 the championship and the bitterness between the 00:09:19.190 --> 00:09:21.610 two cities is sealed permanently. Sealed in stone. 00:09:21.759 --> 00:09:23.700 I have to ask about the mechanics of this era 00:09:23.700 --> 00:09:26.220 though. Were they even playing the same sport 00:09:26.220 --> 00:09:29.320 back then or was 19th century baseball just like 00:09:29.320 --> 00:09:31.600 a localized brawl that occasionally featured 00:09:31.600 --> 00:09:35.299 a bat? That's a very fair question. Right. Because 00:09:35.299 --> 00:09:38.700 we fast forward a bit to 1928 and the violence 00:09:38.700 --> 00:09:42.210 actually spills off the field. Hack Wilson a 00:09:42.210 --> 00:09:45.070 famous slugger for the Cubs, gets so fed up with 00:09:45.070 --> 00:09:47.269 a heckler at Wrigley Field that he physically 00:09:47.269 --> 00:09:50.009 jumps into the box seats to fight the guy. Just 00:09:50.009 --> 00:09:52.769 leaps right in. And this sparks a riot involving 00:09:52.769 --> 00:09:55.809 an estimated 5 ,000 fans swarming the field. 00:09:55.889 --> 00:09:57.490 Yeah, the police had to be called in to break 00:09:57.490 --> 00:10:00.610 it up. And the craziest part? The fans sued Wilson 00:10:00.610 --> 00:10:04.350 for $20 ,000, and a jury actually ruled in favor 00:10:04.350 --> 00:10:06.450 of the player. You know what's fascinating here 00:10:06.450 --> 00:10:09.370 is that the chaos of the early game perfectly 00:10:09.370 --> 00:10:13.200 mirrored the unregulated booming economies of 00:10:13.200 --> 00:10:15.019 the cities themselves. Oh, that makes a lot of 00:10:15.019 --> 00:10:17.320 sense. You have to remember, Chicago and St. 00:10:17.440 --> 00:10:20.519 Louis were raw, rapidly expanding, and fiercely 00:10:20.519 --> 00:10:22.980 competitive metropolises. Right. There wasn't 00:10:22.980 --> 00:10:26.379 much room for decorum or like institutional oversight. 00:10:26.399 --> 00:10:29.399 Right. The jury ruling in Hack Wilson's favor 00:10:29.399 --> 00:10:32.440 tells you everything you need to know about the 00:10:32.440 --> 00:10:34.759 era's attitude towards settling disputes. It 00:10:34.759 --> 00:10:37.440 was frontier justice. Exactly. If you provoked 00:10:37.440 --> 00:10:40.429 a fight, The public consensus was that you deserved 00:10:40.429 --> 00:10:43.090 whatever happened next. The baseball diamond 00:10:43.090 --> 00:10:46.149 wasn't a pristine sanctuary. It was just an extension 00:10:46.149 --> 00:10:48.529 of the frontier capitalism happening out on the 00:10:48.529 --> 00:10:50.289 streets. That makes perfect sense. It was the 00:10:50.289 --> 00:10:53.190 Wild West, just with a ball and a glove. So the 00:10:53.190 --> 00:10:56.450 tone is set. The hatred is very real. And as 00:10:56.450 --> 00:10:59.309 we move deeper into the 20th century, these two 00:10:59.309 --> 00:11:02.029 franchises start trading these massive eras of 00:11:02.029 --> 00:11:05.090 dominance. The Cubs dominate early on. They win 00:11:05.090 --> 00:11:08.899 championships in 1907 and 1908. But then they 00:11:08.899 --> 00:11:12.519 fall into this legendary 108 year drought. A 00:11:12.519 --> 00:11:14.120 very long drought. They wouldn't win another 00:11:14.120 --> 00:11:17.340 World Series until 2016. That isn't just a slump. 00:11:17.539 --> 00:11:19.879 That's multiple generations of fans living and 00:11:19.879 --> 00:11:21.840 dying without ever seeing a championship. And 00:11:21.840 --> 00:11:23.419 while the Cubs are wandering in the wilderness 00:11:23.419 --> 00:11:26.659 for a century, the Cardinals become an absolute 00:11:26.659 --> 00:11:29.950 dynasty. They rack up 11 World Series titles 00:11:29.950 --> 00:11:32.850 over the decades. Only the New York Yankees have 00:11:32.850 --> 00:11:35.470 more in the entire history of Major League Baseball. 00:11:35.590 --> 00:11:39.509 That is wild. It is. And this disparity in success 00:11:39.509 --> 00:11:42.470 fundamentally altered the psychological dynamic 00:11:42.470 --> 00:11:45.570 of the rivalry. How so? Well, the Cardinals became 00:11:45.570 --> 00:11:49.529 the established, confident, almost arrogant powerhouse. 00:11:49.929 --> 00:11:52.429 you know, the cardinal way. Right. While the 00:11:52.429 --> 00:11:55.450 Cubs fully embraced the identity of the lovable 00:11:55.450 --> 00:11:58.269 cursed underdogs. Which sets the stage perfectly 00:11:58.269 --> 00:12:01.860 for the modern era. Specifically, a game in 1984 00:12:01.860 --> 00:12:04.320 that shifted the national narrative entirely. 00:12:04.620 --> 00:12:09.080 The Sandberg game. Yes. It's June 23, 1984. The 00:12:09.080 --> 00:12:11.039 Cubs are actually having a really good season, 00:12:11.120 --> 00:12:13.179 but nobody outside of Chicago takes them seriously 00:12:13.179 --> 00:12:15.159 because of that baggage. A century of losing. 00:12:15.360 --> 00:12:17.419 Exactly. And they have this second baseman, Ryan 00:12:17.419 --> 00:12:19.720 Sandberg. He's a great fielder, he's fast, but 00:12:19.720 --> 00:12:22.320 he is not known as a power hitter. He is practically 00:12:22.320 --> 00:12:24.480 invisible to the rest of the country. And on 00:12:24.480 --> 00:12:26.480 the mound for the St. Louis Cardinals, you have 00:12:26.480 --> 00:12:29.100 their closer Bruce Sutter. To understand the 00:12:29.100 --> 00:12:31.440 stakes here, you have to understand Sutter's 00:12:31.440 --> 00:12:33.759 status at the time. He was the premier closer 00:12:33.759 --> 00:12:36.659 of the era. He saved 45 games that year alone. 00:12:36.799 --> 00:12:39.860 Wow. He was the prototype for the modern, hard 00:12:39.860 --> 00:12:42.299 -throwing relief pitcher who comes in exclusively 00:12:42.299 --> 00:12:44.639 for the ninth inning to completely shut the door. 00:12:45.259 --> 00:12:48.139 He was untouchable. So Sutter is basically the 00:12:48.139 --> 00:12:50.799 final boss of a video game. That is the perfect 00:12:50.799 --> 00:12:52.559 way to describe him. You aren't supposed to be 00:12:52.559 --> 00:12:55.019 able to beat him once, let alone twice in a row. 00:12:55.480 --> 00:12:57.440 So it's the bottom of the ninth. Cubs are trailing 00:12:57.440 --> 00:13:00.100 nine to eight. Sandberg steps up. And he hits 00:13:00.100 --> 00:13:02.700 a home run off setter to tie the game. The crowd 00:13:02.700 --> 00:13:05.720 goes wild, but it's not over. The game goes to 00:13:05.720 --> 00:13:07.840 extra innings, and the Cardinals score two runs 00:13:07.840 --> 00:13:09.899 in the top of the 10th. Right. So now it's the 00:13:09.899 --> 00:13:12.539 bottom of the 10th. Cubs are down by two. One 00:13:12.539 --> 00:13:16.269 man on base. Samberg comes up again, he faces 00:13:16.269 --> 00:13:18.789 Sutter again, and he hits another game -tying 00:13:18.789 --> 00:13:21.389 home run. It's unbelievable. The broadcast calls 00:13:21.389 --> 00:13:24.029 for that moment are completely etched into baseball 00:13:24.029 --> 00:13:26.570 history. They really are. On the radio, you had 00:13:26.570 --> 00:13:28.690 the legendary Harry Carrey screaming, he did 00:13:28.690 --> 00:13:32.549 it again, the game is tied. Holy cow. Yeah, and 00:13:32.549 --> 00:13:35.149 on the national NBC broadcast, Bob Costas is 00:13:35.149 --> 00:13:37.269 just yelling in disbelief, do you believe it? 00:13:37.519 --> 00:13:40.200 and the Cubs go on to win in the 11th. But wait, 00:13:40.220 --> 00:13:42.820 hold on. You're painting this as this monumental 00:13:42.820 --> 00:13:45.379 narrative -shifting event, right? Mm -hmm. But 00:13:45.379 --> 00:13:47.779 looking at the historical stats, the Cubs didn't 00:13:47.779 --> 00:13:49.600 even win the World Series that year. They lost 00:13:49.600 --> 00:13:53.059 in the playoffs. Right. They did. So did a single 00:13:53.059 --> 00:13:55.659 regular season game actually change the trajectory 00:13:55.659 --> 00:13:58.340 of the franchise, or is this just nostalgia talking? 00:13:58.580 --> 00:14:01.299 It is an excellent question, and the answer lies 00:14:01.299 --> 00:14:04.940 in the media landscape of 1984. Okay. It didn't 00:14:04.940 --> 00:14:08.019 change their ultimate postseason fate, sure, 00:14:08.879 --> 00:14:12.980 but it unequivocally changed their national brand. 00:14:13.320 --> 00:14:15.620 Because it was on TV. Because of the NBC Game 00:14:15.620 --> 00:14:17.879 of the Week. Yeah. Before the explosion of cable 00:14:17.879 --> 00:14:19.940 sports networks, this was the game the entire 00:14:19.940 --> 00:14:22.519 country was watching. Oh, I see. It legitimized 00:14:22.519 --> 00:14:26.360 the 1984 Cubs to the rest of the nation. It transformed 00:14:26.360 --> 00:14:29.320 Ryan Sandberg from a regional talent into a national 00:14:29.320 --> 00:14:31.720 superstar, literally putting him on the path 00:14:31.720 --> 00:14:33.820 to the Hall of Fame. But most importantly for 00:14:33.820 --> 00:14:36.580 the rivalry, it proved on national television 00:14:36.580 --> 00:14:39.440 that the cursed cubs could stand toe to toe with 00:14:39.440 --> 00:14:42.639 the ruthless Cardinal machine and win. It re 00:14:42.639 --> 00:14:44.639 -energized the border war for the television 00:14:44.639 --> 00:14:47.179 era. OK, so we've moved from the radio waves 00:14:47.179 --> 00:14:50.639 to the national TV screens. But a true rivalry 00:14:50.639 --> 00:14:53.960 isn't just about pure hatred. No, it's hot. If 00:14:53.960 --> 00:14:56.360 it was just blind animosity, it would eventually 00:14:56.360 --> 00:14:59.120 burn itself out. It's really a shared ecosystem, 00:14:59.120 --> 00:15:02.299 you know? These teams rely on each other. They 00:15:02.299 --> 00:15:05.419 do. And as we pivot into the late 90s and early 00:15:05.419 --> 00:15:09.080 2000s in our sources, we see how deeply intertwined 00:15:09.080 --> 00:15:11.879 they actually are. You cannot discuss this rivalry 00:15:11.879 --> 00:15:14.639 without talking about the summer of 1998. The 00:15:14.639 --> 00:15:17.860 home run chase. Yes. McGuire Sosa home run chase. 00:15:18.500 --> 00:15:20.860 After the devastating players strike in 1994, 00:15:21.519 --> 00:15:24.080 baseball was bleeding fans. People were so angry. 00:15:24.220 --> 00:15:26.779 They were. The sport desperately needed a narrative 00:15:26.779 --> 00:15:29.100 to bring people back to the stadiums. and they 00:15:29.100 --> 00:15:31.299 got it in the form of Mark McGuire of the Cardinals 00:15:31.299 --> 00:15:34.059 and Sammy Sosa of the Cubs. Racing to break Roger 00:15:34.059 --> 00:15:36.980 Maris' single season home run record of 61. It 00:15:36.980 --> 00:15:39.759 was a global phenomenon, and the script couldn't 00:15:39.759 --> 00:15:42.820 have been written better by Hollywood. In early 00:15:42.820 --> 00:15:45.240 September, the two teams meet for a two game 00:15:45.240 --> 00:15:49.139 series in St. Louis. McGuire... hits his record 00:15:49.139 --> 00:15:51.899 tying 61st home run against the Cubs. Right. 00:15:52.340 --> 00:15:55.200 And then the very next day, he hits number 62, 00:15:55.580 --> 00:15:58.059 also against the Cubs. But the most incredible 00:15:58.059 --> 00:16:00.980 part of that moment isn't the swing itself. No, 00:16:01.080 --> 00:16:04.080 it's what happens after. Yeah. As McGuire is 00:16:04.080 --> 00:16:06.820 rounding the bases, Sammy Sosa comes all the 00:16:06.820 --> 00:16:09.700 way in from the outfield and physically embraces 00:16:09.700 --> 00:16:12.590 his rival on the field. That image of the embrace 00:16:12.590 --> 00:16:15.129 is vital because it showed a profound mutual 00:16:15.129 --> 00:16:18.129 respect. Totally. Sosa ended up hitting 66 home 00:16:18.129 --> 00:16:21.570 runs that year and McGuire hit 70. But Sosa won 00:16:21.570 --> 00:16:25.070 the MVP and he dedicated every single one of 00:16:25.070 --> 00:16:27.350 his runs to the memory of Harry Carrey. Who had 00:16:27.350 --> 00:16:28.870 passed away earlier that year. And we have a 00:16:28.870 --> 00:16:30.909 talk about Carrey because he is the ultimate 00:16:30.909 --> 00:16:33.289 symbol of this shared ecosystem. He really is. 00:16:33.549 --> 00:16:35.610 Because Carrey didn't just broadcast for the 00:16:35.610 --> 00:16:37.830 Cubs. He called games for the Cardinals for 24 00:16:37.830 --> 00:16:41.200 seasons. Yeah, long time. He was drinking Anheuser 00:16:41.200 --> 00:16:43.679 -Busch in the booth in St. Louis before he ever 00:16:43.679 --> 00:16:47.440 got to Chicago. How does a fan base even process 00:16:47.440 --> 00:16:49.860 that kind of cognitive dissonance? It's wild. 00:16:49.980 --> 00:16:52.899 Like, the legendary voice of your hated enemies 00:16:52.899 --> 00:16:56.100 suddenly moves up I -55 and becomes the beloved 00:16:56.100 --> 00:16:59.279 grandfather figure of your own franchise. It 00:16:59.279 --> 00:17:02.610 creates a strange sort of shared custody. You 00:17:02.610 --> 00:17:05.069 know, it proves that despite the territorial 00:17:05.069 --> 00:17:07.970 wars, the two cities are speaking the exact same 00:17:07.970 --> 00:17:10.670 baseball language. Right. And that shared bond 00:17:10.670 --> 00:17:13.750 becomes even more apparent during moments of 00:17:13.750 --> 00:17:16.210 real devastating tragedy. Yeah, we have to touch 00:17:16.210 --> 00:17:19.450 on 2002. Right. In 2002, the Cardinals pitcher, 00:17:19.589 --> 00:17:22.759 Darrell Kill, tragically passed away in his hotel 00:17:22.759 --> 00:17:25.160 room while the team was in Chicago to play the 00:17:25.160 --> 00:17:27.160 Cubs. It was awful. The game obviously had to 00:17:27.160 --> 00:17:29.440 be canceled. But it was the Cubs catcher Joe 00:17:29.440 --> 00:17:31.680 Girardi, a guy who had actually played for both 00:17:31.680 --> 00:17:33.220 the Cubs and the Cardinals during his career 00:17:33.220 --> 00:17:35.880 who took a microphone. He stood in front of a 00:17:35.880 --> 00:17:38.500 confused Wrigley Field crowd with tears in his 00:17:38.500 --> 00:17:41.559 eyes and he asked the Chicago fans to pray for 00:17:41.559 --> 00:17:43.680 the St. Louis Cardinals family. When you look 00:17:43.680 --> 00:17:46.740 at that Girardi speech or the Sosa embrace, it 00:17:46.740 --> 00:17:50.190 really proves that these franchises are inextricably 00:17:50.190 --> 00:17:53.150 linked. Absolutely. The animosity is real, certainly. 00:17:53.589 --> 00:17:56.750 We saw that heat up again in the 2000s with the 00:17:56.750 --> 00:17:59.390 intense managerial feud between the Cubs Dusty 00:17:59.390 --> 00:18:01.970 Baker and the Cardinals Tony La Russa. Oh, they 00:18:01.970 --> 00:18:04.369 could not stand each other. They fiercely protected 00:18:04.369 --> 00:18:07.029 their players. They both believed in old school 00:18:07.029 --> 00:18:09.910 unwritten protocol and they despise being shown 00:18:09.910 --> 00:18:13.170 up. But underneath that fierce competition is 00:18:13.170 --> 00:18:15.990 a shared history. They are two halves of the 00:18:15.990 --> 00:18:18.569 same Midwestern soul. A rivalry without respect 00:18:18.569 --> 00:18:21.269 is just a mismatch, right? Exactly. The fact 00:18:21.269 --> 00:18:23.410 that they have pushed each other for over 140 00:18:23.410 --> 00:18:26.109 years means they validate each other's existence. 00:18:26.630 --> 00:18:28.789 Yeah. St. Louis needs Chicago to measure its 00:18:28.789 --> 00:18:31.130 success and Chicago needs St. Louis to give its 00:18:31.130 --> 00:18:33.789 underdog narrative meaning. So think about it 00:18:33.789 --> 00:18:37.430 for a second. Does a century -long rivalry actually 00:18:37.430 --> 00:18:40.230 require a foundation of deep grudging respect 00:18:40.230 --> 00:18:42.829 to survive this long? Because based on everything 00:18:42.829 --> 00:18:45.210 we've read today, the answer seems to be a resounding 00:18:45.210 --> 00:18:48.150 yes. It really does. To recap our journey today. 00:18:48.460 --> 00:18:50.579 Wait, no ellipsis for me to recap our journey. 00:18:50.740 --> 00:18:54.680 We started with the 1885 forfeits and the sheer 00:18:54.680 --> 00:18:58.380 unregulated pettiness of early baseball. We fought 00:18:58.380 --> 00:19:01.799 an invisible war over AM radio frequencies bouncing 00:19:01.799 --> 00:19:04.359 off the atmosphere in the dead of night. We watched 00:19:04.359 --> 00:19:06.660 Ryan Sandberg hit impossible home runs against 00:19:06.660 --> 00:19:09.619 the final boss of relievers. And we saw Sammy 00:19:09.619 --> 00:19:12.680 Sosa and Mark McGuire save baseball while honoring 00:19:12.680 --> 00:19:15.400 the exact same legendary broadcaster. Right. 00:19:15.559 --> 00:19:18.190 This deep dive reveals how sports rival Rivalries 00:19:18.190 --> 00:19:21.089 act as a living, breathing historical record 00:19:21.089 --> 00:19:24.170 of a region's economy, technology, and psychology. 00:19:24.450 --> 00:19:26.410 And if we connect this to the bigger picture, 00:19:26.809 --> 00:19:28.450 it raises a really important question for the 00:19:28.450 --> 00:19:30.609 future. What's that? Well, we learned that this 00:19:30.609 --> 00:19:33.769 rivalry was built on geographic borders. Local 00:19:33.769 --> 00:19:36.069 radio signals battling for physical territory 00:19:36.069 --> 00:19:38.619 in the Midwest. Yeah. It makes you wonder. in 00:19:38.619 --> 00:19:41.380 our modern era of borderless streaming, where 00:19:41.380 --> 00:19:43.619 you can watch any team from anywhere in the world 00:19:43.619 --> 00:19:46.240 right on your phone at any time. Will geographic 00:19:46.240 --> 00:19:48.420 rivalries like the Cubs and Cardinals eventually 00:19:48.420 --> 00:19:52.059 fade away, or will we just find entirely new 00:19:52.059 --> 00:19:54.740 digital borders to fight over? Oh, that is a 00:19:54.740 --> 00:19:56.740 fascinating thought to leave on. Are we losing 00:19:56.740 --> 00:19:59.720 the turf war to the internet? It's entirely possible. 00:20:00.039 --> 00:20:01.559 Well, thank you so much for joining us on this 00:20:01.559 --> 00:20:04.900 deep dive. Keep exploring. Stay curious. And 00:20:04.900 --> 00:20:07.160 the next time you cross a state line, just remember 00:20:07.160 --> 00:20:09.640 you might be stepping over an invisible property 00:20:09.640 --> 00:20:12.420 line in a 140 year old feud. We'll catch you 00:20:12.420 --> 00:20:12.799 next time.