WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:03.279 Have you ever just walked away from a sure thing? 00:00:03.439 --> 00:00:05.940 Ooh, that's a tough one. Right. I mean, imagine 00:00:05.940 --> 00:00:08.439 for a second reaching the absolute pinnacle of 00:00:08.439 --> 00:00:10.419 your career. You've got the awards. Yeah, you 00:00:10.419 --> 00:00:13.019 have the money, you have the massive mainstream 00:00:13.019 --> 00:00:16.219 recognition. And then you just... You just decide 00:00:16.219 --> 00:00:18.120 to walk away from that giant corporate machine 00:00:18.120 --> 00:00:21.239 to start a scrappy, independent project completely 00:00:21.239 --> 00:00:23.980 from scratch. It sounds a bit crazy, to be honest. 00:00:24.179 --> 00:00:28.170 It really does. But welcome. to today's custom 00:00:28.170 --> 00:00:31.050 tailored deep dive where we are looking at exactly 00:00:31.050 --> 00:00:33.630 that kind of leap i'm excited for this we are 00:00:33.630 --> 00:00:36.229 exploring a master class in creative reinvention 00:00:36.229 --> 00:00:39.829 and uh honestly a fascinating lesson in how to 00:00:39.829 --> 00:00:42.899 manage a highly volatile startup Because it is 00:00:42.899 --> 00:00:45.479 a massive risk. Usually when people hit the top 00:00:45.479 --> 00:00:47.719 of their field, they hold on for dear life. Yeah, 00:00:47.799 --> 00:00:49.840 they don't voluntarily go back to the garage 00:00:49.840 --> 00:00:52.679 to start over. Exactly. So I'm very curious to 00:00:52.679 --> 00:00:54.740 look at the mechanics of someone who actually 00:00:54.740 --> 00:00:57.960 makes that choice and how they navigate the inevitable 00:00:57.960 --> 00:01:00.539 turbulence that follows. To figure out how this 00:01:00.539 --> 00:01:03.340 works, we are pulling from a single, highly detailed 00:01:03.340 --> 00:01:05.799 source today. What are we looking at? It's a 00:01:05.799 --> 00:01:08.340 Wikipedia article chronicling the history and 00:01:08.340 --> 00:01:11.260 the discography of an American rock band from 00:01:11.260 --> 00:01:14.340 Los Angeles called... Against All Will. Okay. 00:01:14.420 --> 00:01:17.480 Against All Will. Yeah. And our mission for this 00:01:17.480 --> 00:01:20.560 deep dive is to explore what happens when veteran 00:01:20.560 --> 00:01:23.659 musicians from wildly different musical universes 00:01:23.659 --> 00:01:27.319 collide to form a new project. How wildly different 00:01:27.319 --> 00:01:29.140 are we talking? We're talking platinum -selling 00:01:29.140 --> 00:01:33.000 post -grunge, hardcore punk, heavy metal, and 00:01:33.000 --> 00:01:36.099 even Russian pop. Russian pop. Yes, Russian pop. 00:01:36.159 --> 00:01:38.299 Okay, let's unpack this. So who is the architect 00:01:38.299 --> 00:01:42.090 here? Because a band with that many diverse competing 00:01:42.090 --> 00:01:45.290 influences doesn't just spontaneously generate. 00:01:45.489 --> 00:01:47.549 Right. There has to be a founder driving the 00:01:47.549 --> 00:01:49.969 ship. The founder is a guitarist and songwriter 00:01:49.969 --> 00:01:53.049 named Jimmy Allen. Okay. And to really understand 00:01:53.049 --> 00:01:56.909 the DNA of Against All Will, you have to understand 00:01:56.909 --> 00:01:59.129 Jimmy Allen's pedigree. He didn't start out in 00:01:59.129 --> 00:02:01.150 the gritty rock clubs of Los Angeles. Where is 00:02:01.150 --> 00:02:03.349 he from? He spent his childhood far away from 00:02:03.349 --> 00:02:06.799 all of that in Chanute, Kansas. Oh, wow. Small 00:02:06.799 --> 00:02:10.300 town. Very much so. He's actually an alum of 00:02:10.300 --> 00:02:14.229 Chanute High School. But... He didn't stay in 00:02:14.229 --> 00:02:16.669 that small -town environment. He eventually made 00:02:16.669 --> 00:02:18.629 his way out to the coast. And what happened when 00:02:18.629 --> 00:02:20.710 he got there? He became the co -founding lead 00:02:20.710 --> 00:02:23.349 guitarist for the massive rock band Puddle of 00:02:23.349 --> 00:02:25.629 Mud. Let's pause there for a second, because 00:02:25.629 --> 00:02:28.030 for anyone listening who might not be deeply 00:02:28.030 --> 00:02:31.789 embedded in early 2000s rock history, Puddle 00:02:31.789 --> 00:02:34.550 of Mud wasn't just a successful band. They were 00:02:34.550 --> 00:02:37.409 huge. They were a cornerstone of the post -grunge 00:02:37.409 --> 00:02:45.750 movement. the 1990s and the highly polished radio 00:02:45.750 --> 00:02:48.870 friendly rock of the 2000s. Highly polished and 00:02:48.870 --> 00:02:51.270 incredibly lucrative. And Jimmy Allen wasn't 00:02:51.270 --> 00:02:52.650 just standing in the background playing rhythm 00:02:52.650 --> 00:02:55.189 guitar. He was a writer. He was a primary creative 00:02:55.189 --> 00:02:57.750 engine. Yeah. The source details some incredibly 00:02:57.750 --> 00:02:59.909 heavy hitting accolades that he racked up. Let's 00:02:59.909 --> 00:03:02.189 hear them. He is an award winning songwriter 00:03:02.189 --> 00:03:06.250 responsible for massive era defining hits. For 00:03:06.250 --> 00:03:09.150 instance, he wrote Drift and Die. A huge track. 00:03:09.270 --> 00:03:11.960 And he wrote the absolute juggernaut track. Blurry. 00:03:11.979 --> 00:03:15.400 Man, Blurry was inescapable. Exactly. It completely 00:03:15.400 --> 00:03:19.800 dominated. Blurry won Ace Cap's 2003 Song of 00:03:19.800 --> 00:03:23.099 the Year. Wow. It was the Ace Cap Most Performed 00:03:23.099 --> 00:03:26.379 Song of 2002. Incredible. And it won a Billboard 00:03:26.379 --> 00:03:29.479 Rock Song Award. And just to prove it wasn't 00:03:29.479 --> 00:03:32.139 a fluke, he also won the Ace Cap Most Performed 00:03:32.139 --> 00:03:36.219 Song of 2004 for the track She Hates Me. For 00:03:36.219 --> 00:03:38.219 those who might not know the inner workings of 00:03:38.219 --> 00:03:40.939 the music industry, Ace Cap is one of the massive 00:03:40.939 --> 00:03:43.560 organizations that tracks performance royalties. 00:03:43.780 --> 00:03:45.699 Right. They monitor everything. Winning their 00:03:45.699 --> 00:03:47.759 song of the year or holding the title of most 00:03:47.759 --> 00:03:50.500 performed song for an entire calendar year means 00:03:50.500 --> 00:03:53.280 that track was literally everywhere. Everywhere. 00:03:53.500 --> 00:03:55.580 It was playing in every shopping mall, every 00:03:55.580 --> 00:03:58.800 car radio, every arena, and every television 00:03:58.800 --> 00:04:02.740 promo. It represents the absolute zenith of mainstream 00:04:02.740 --> 00:04:05.400 commercial success. Which makes his next move. 00:04:05.419 --> 00:04:07.620 move quite puzzling. Yeah, what does a guy who 00:04:07.620 --> 00:04:09.620 has conquered the industry do next? Does he just 00:04:09.620 --> 00:04:11.460 keep writing hits for other people? You would 00:04:11.460 --> 00:04:15.280 think so. But by 2007, after years of writing 00:04:15.280 --> 00:04:17.899 for others, Jimmy Allen decided it was time to 00:04:17.899 --> 00:04:20.199 start his own band. Which would eventually become 00:04:20.199 --> 00:04:23.420 Against All Will. Exactly. And the origin story 00:04:23.420 --> 00:04:26.899 for this pivot is incredible cinematic. According 00:04:26.899 --> 00:04:29.420 to the source, the genesis of the band happened 00:04:29.420 --> 00:04:32.540 in early 2007 on a stormy night in Hollywood. 00:04:32.949 --> 00:04:34.850 You can almost picture the rain lashing against 00:04:34.850 --> 00:04:37.290 the studio windows. It definitely sets a mood. 00:04:37.850 --> 00:04:41.370 So on this stormy night, a drummer named Mark 00:04:41.370 --> 00:04:44.589 Bistany, who goes by Moak, reaches out to a good 00:04:44.589 --> 00:04:47.550 friend of his. Who is that? A vocalist named 00:04:47.550 --> 00:04:50.689 Mizzy Pacheco. Now, Moak had actually toured 00:04:50.689 --> 00:04:53.199 with Jimmy Allen in Puddle of Mud. So there's 00:04:53.199 --> 00:04:55.660 an existing working relationship there, a level 00:04:55.660 --> 00:04:58.300 of trust. Yes, but Mizzy's situation is what 00:04:58.300 --> 00:05:00.920 really stands out. The source specifically notes 00:05:00.920 --> 00:05:03.279 that Mizzy was a recently departed solo artist 00:05:03.279 --> 00:05:05.660 from Virgin Records. Okay, major label background. 00:05:06.040 --> 00:05:08.560 Right. And at the time Moak called him, Mizzy 00:05:08.560 --> 00:05:11.259 was working on a new solo record in a dark and 00:05:11.259 --> 00:05:13.269 lonely part of Hollywood. What's fascinating 00:05:13.269 --> 00:05:16.149 here is the psychological landscape of that specific 00:05:16.149 --> 00:05:18.649 moment. You have Moak bringing together two guys 00:05:18.649 --> 00:05:20.810 who are at very strange crossroads in their careers. 00:05:21.050 --> 00:05:23.470 They both have East Coast roots too, right? Mizzy 00:05:23.470 --> 00:05:25.649 and Moak are both from the East Coast. Yes, and 00:05:25.649 --> 00:05:27.790 they've both experienced the highs and lows of 00:05:27.790 --> 00:05:30.550 the business. Jimmy Allen has reached the absolute 00:05:30.550 --> 00:05:34.029 peak of rock radio success and is stepping away 00:05:34.029 --> 00:05:37.509 to start fresh. And Mizzy. Mizzy Pacheco has 00:05:37.509 --> 00:05:40.050 just come off a major label deal with Virgin 00:05:40.050 --> 00:05:43.670 Records, a massive corporate entity, and is now 00:05:43.670 --> 00:05:46.829 toiling away in a dark, lonely corner of the 00:05:46.829 --> 00:05:49.329 city trying to figure out his next move. They've 00:05:49.329 --> 00:05:52.350 both been chewed up. or pass through the major 00:05:52.350 --> 00:05:54.569 label machine. They know exactly how the sausage 00:05:54.569 --> 00:05:57.290 is made. Yeah, they do. To experience that level 00:05:57.290 --> 00:06:00.149 of the industry, the massive tours, the major 00:06:00.149 --> 00:06:02.029 label contracts, the corporate expectations, 00:06:02.129 --> 00:06:04.810 and then to have the sheer hunger to start completely 00:06:04.810 --> 00:06:07.350 over from scratch on a rainy night in a dark 00:06:07.350 --> 00:06:09.970 studio. It's wild. That requires a very specific 00:06:09.970 --> 00:06:12.050 kind of drive. It's not about chasing the initial 00:06:12.050 --> 00:06:15.310 fame anymore. It's about a pure need to create 00:06:15.310 --> 00:06:17.810 something new on your own terms. That hunger 00:06:17.810 --> 00:06:20.839 is exactly what launches the project. But as 00:06:20.839 --> 00:06:22.620 anyone who has ever worked in a startup or a 00:06:22.620 --> 00:06:24.899 band knows, the initial team that launches the 00:06:24.899 --> 00:06:27.680 project is rarely the exact same team that brings 00:06:27.680 --> 00:06:30.079 the product to market. That is almost a universal 00:06:30.079 --> 00:06:33.040 rule. So fast forward to the spring of 2009. 00:06:33.399 --> 00:06:36.120 The band is gearing up to release their debut 00:06:36.120 --> 00:06:39.120 album, but the lineup has shifted. Okay. And 00:06:39.120 --> 00:06:41.680 it has shifted into a roster of industry veterans 00:06:41.680 --> 00:06:45.379 with pedigrees that, on paper, make absolutely 00:06:45.379 --> 00:06:48.620 no sense together. I'm looking at this 2009 roster, 00:06:48.720 --> 00:06:51.379 and it is a massive departure from the original 00:06:51.379 --> 00:06:54.300 trio. Let's run through this quartet. You still 00:06:54.300 --> 00:06:57.199 have Jimmy Allen on lead guitar, anchoring the 00:06:57.199 --> 00:06:59.240 project. Right. But now, stepping in on vocals, 00:06:59.360 --> 00:07:01.500 you have Jeff Current. He was formerly the lead 00:07:01.500 --> 00:07:03.500 singer of the alternative rock band Seven Story 00:07:03.500 --> 00:07:05.899 Drop. Okay, alternative rock, that fits. But 00:07:05.899 --> 00:07:08.660 on bass guitar, you have Cello Dias. He comes 00:07:08.660 --> 00:07:11.209 from the veteran heavy metal band Soulfly. Let 00:07:11.209 --> 00:07:14.350 me just jump in there because the leap from Jimmy 00:07:14.350 --> 00:07:17.709 Allen's mainstream post -grunge background to 00:07:17.709 --> 00:07:21.149 the aggressive, tribal, rhythmic intensity of 00:07:21.149 --> 00:07:24.709 a band like Soulfly is a massive stylistic gap 00:07:24.709 --> 00:07:26.449 to bridge. It's totally different. Those are 00:07:26.449 --> 00:07:28.509 entirely different musical languages. Here's 00:07:28.509 --> 00:07:30.810 where it gets really interesting because the 00:07:30.810 --> 00:07:33.069 rhythm section gets even more complex. How so? 00:07:33.430 --> 00:07:36.730 On drums, you have Steve Wilson, who goes by 00:07:36.730 --> 00:07:39.629 the nickname Boomstick. Boobsick's resume is 00:07:39.629 --> 00:07:42.209 just incredible. What's his background? He previously 00:07:42.209 --> 00:07:44.550 drummed for the legendary punk band Dead Kennedys. 00:07:44.649 --> 00:07:48.290 Wow. And he drummed for the Russian pop duo T 00:07:48.290 --> 00:07:50.490 .A .T .U. Wait, but does that actually work? 00:07:50.629 --> 00:07:53.060 That sounds chaotic, right? On paper, throwing 00:07:53.060 --> 00:07:55.860 a heavy metal bassist and a drummer who fluctuates 00:07:55.860 --> 00:07:58.620 between hardcore punk and Russian synth pop into 00:07:58.620 --> 00:08:01.680 an alternative rock band sounds less like a creative 00:08:01.680 --> 00:08:04.100 melting pot and more like a total train wreck. 00:08:04.259 --> 00:08:06.500 It does. How do they avoid sounding completely 00:08:06.500 --> 00:08:08.899 disjointed? That's a fair question because the 00:08:08.899 --> 00:08:11.720 contrast is extreme. Think about the pure mechanical 00:08:11.720 --> 00:08:15.370 demands of Boomstick's resume alone. Playing 00:08:15.370 --> 00:08:18.350 for the Dead Kennedys requires blistering, chaotic, 00:08:18.670 --> 00:08:21.850 politically charged, hardcore punk speed. It's 00:08:21.850 --> 00:08:24.850 very raw and aggressive. Exactly. Then, playing 00:08:24.850 --> 00:08:27.769 for TATU, which is driven by heavily produced, 00:08:27.949 --> 00:08:31.110 precise synth -pop beats, requires an entirely 00:08:31.110 --> 00:08:33.389 different kind of discipline. Playing strictly 00:08:33.389 --> 00:08:36.090 to a grid. Yes, matching electronic sequences. 00:08:36.789 --> 00:08:38.789 To bring a drummer with that exact background 00:08:38.789 --> 00:08:41.830 into a room with a bassist from a legendary heavy 00:08:41.830 --> 00:08:44.789 metal band, a vocalist from alternative rock, 00:08:45.029 --> 00:08:47.990 and a guitarist who writes massive radio anthems, 00:08:48.029 --> 00:08:50.549 the technical versatility required from every 00:08:50.549 --> 00:08:53.289 person in that room is immense. It really makes 00:08:53.289 --> 00:08:55.309 you wonder what the initial jam session sounded 00:08:55.309 --> 00:08:57.370 like. They had to strip away their default settings 00:08:57.370 --> 00:08:59.730 and find a brand new sonic middle ground that 00:08:59.730 --> 00:09:01.389 honored all those backgrounds. And they don't 00:09:01.389 --> 00:09:03.230 have the luxury of faking it. Not at all. When 00:09:03.230 --> 00:09:05.470 you have that much varied high -level experience 00:09:05.470 --> 00:09:07.789 in a single room, you either find a common language 00:09:07.789 --> 00:09:10.710 immediately or the project collapses under the 00:09:10.710 --> 00:09:13.350 weight of competing egos and styles. Well, they 00:09:13.350 --> 00:09:15.710 actually did find that common language. This 00:09:15.710 --> 00:09:18.789 Frankenstein -like lineup produced tangible results. 00:09:19.090 --> 00:09:21.049 I'm glad to hear it didn't just implode. On October 00:09:21.049 --> 00:09:25.279 20th, 2009, against all will, released their 00:09:25.279 --> 00:09:29.580 debut extended play, or EP, titled A Rhyme and 00:09:29.580 --> 00:09:32.159 Reason. Okay, A Rhyme and Reason. The source 00:09:32.159 --> 00:09:34.879 notes, it was recorded at Korn Studios, it was 00:09:34.879 --> 00:09:37.259 produced by Tim Harkins, and released under the 00:09:37.259 --> 00:09:39.620 label Subsonic Industries. And looking at the 00:09:39.620 --> 00:09:42.679 specs of the release, it's a very lean, focused 00:09:42.679 --> 00:09:45.580 project. Highly focused. It features exactly 00:09:45.580 --> 00:09:48.360 seven tracks, clocking in at 25 minutes and 13 00:09:48.360 --> 00:09:51.220 seconds. They weren't indulging in long, wandering 00:09:51.220 --> 00:09:53.500 jam sessions. No, they got right to the point. 00:09:53.789 --> 00:09:56.690 and that discipline paid off. The tracks All 00:09:56.690 --> 00:09:59.610 About You and The Drug I Need from this debut 00:09:59.610 --> 00:10:02.289 release actually ranked in the National Rock 00:10:02.289 --> 00:10:05.610 Radio Top 50 in 2010. Hitting the National Top 00:10:05.610 --> 00:10:07.990 50 as an independent release, especially while 00:10:07.990 --> 00:10:10.009 trying to blend all those diverse musical backgrounds, 00:10:10.169 --> 00:10:12.889 is a serious validation. It really is. It proves 00:10:12.889 --> 00:10:14.830 that the chemistry they found in the studio actually 00:10:14.830 --> 00:10:18.049 translated to the listeners. But I have to ask... 00:10:18.299 --> 00:10:20.820 With Jeff Current stepping in on vocals for this 00:10:20.820 --> 00:10:24.159 2009 release, what happened to Mizzy Pachoco? 00:10:24.440 --> 00:10:26.740 The original singer from The Stormy Night in 00:10:26.740 --> 00:10:29.740 2007. Yeah. Did his contributions just vanish? 00:10:30.659 --> 00:10:33.519 Not at all. In fact, there is a phantom element 00:10:33.519 --> 00:10:36.059 to this success, and Mizzy is right at the center 00:10:36.059 --> 00:10:38.320 of it. Oh, really? Even though he parted ways 00:10:38.320 --> 00:10:41.480 with the band as their frontman, Mizzy left a 00:10:41.480 --> 00:10:44.820 massive fingerprint all over A Rhyme and Reason. 00:10:45.320 --> 00:10:48.190 How so, if he wasn't singing? Even though Jeff 00:10:48.190 --> 00:10:51.529 Curran is the one singing on the 2009 EP, Mizzy 00:10:51.529 --> 00:10:54.110 actually wrote the song The Drug I Need, which 00:10:54.110 --> 00:10:56.350 was one of those top 50 hits. So he is still 00:10:56.350 --> 00:10:58.590 fundamentally shaping the sound of the band. 00:10:58.809 --> 00:11:02.009 He is heavily woven into the DNA. He also wrote 00:11:02.009 --> 00:11:04.429 the track Nothing Good Anymore, and he co -wrote 00:11:04.429 --> 00:11:07.230 the songs Swept Away in the Blue. That's a significant 00:11:07.230 --> 00:11:09.950 chunk of the writing. Plus, if you look back 00:11:09.950 --> 00:11:13.669 at their earlier single releases. Mizzy's actual 00:11:13.669 --> 00:11:17.370 voice can be heard on the 2007 track, You Can't 00:11:17.370 --> 00:11:20.309 Change Me, and the 2008 track, Tomorrow and Today. 00:11:20.570 --> 00:11:23.409 So his presence is definitely still felt. But 00:11:23.409 --> 00:11:27.830 his contribution to Against All Will didn't stop 00:11:27.830 --> 00:11:30.450 at songwriting and laying down early vocal tracks. 00:11:30.730 --> 00:11:32.789 He had another skill set he brought to the table. 00:11:32.950 --> 00:11:35.769 A completely different skill set. Mizzy isn't 00:11:35.769 --> 00:11:38.850 just a musician. He's a visual artist. How interesting. 00:11:39.309 --> 00:11:41.649 He is a photographer and a video director based 00:11:41.649 --> 00:11:44.950 in Los Angeles. He actually owns his own fine 00:11:44.950 --> 00:11:47.629 art gallery called Pacheco Fine Art Photography. 00:11:47.730 --> 00:11:50.090 That's a huge pivot. It's located right on the 00:11:50.090 --> 00:11:52.990 Pacific Coast Highway in Malibu. So applying 00:11:52.990 --> 00:11:55.809 those visual skills to his former band, Mizzy 00:11:55.809 --> 00:11:57.629 became their visual architect. He shot their 00:11:57.629 --> 00:12:00.070 videos? Yes. He is responsible for directing 00:12:00.070 --> 00:12:01.970 and shooting the music videos for Love the Way 00:12:01.970 --> 00:12:04.309 You Hate Me, The Drug I Need, and So Wept Away. 00:12:04.720 --> 00:12:07.159 Wow. He even steps out from behind the camera 00:12:07.159 --> 00:12:09.539 to make a cameo appearance in the 2012 video 00:12:09.539 --> 00:12:12.539 for Love the Way You Hate Me. If we connect this 00:12:12.539 --> 00:12:15.419 to the bigger picture, Mizzy's multifaceted role 00:12:15.419 --> 00:12:18.259 highlights something crucial about survival in 00:12:18.259 --> 00:12:20.799 the modern independent music industry. What's 00:12:20.799 --> 00:12:23.230 that? having a visionary who understands your 00:12:23.230 --> 00:12:25.830 core identity and can control your visual aesthetic 00:12:25.830 --> 00:12:29.169 is incredibly valuable think about it he helped 00:12:29.169 --> 00:12:32.009 write the song so he inherently understands the 00:12:32.009 --> 00:12:34.149 emotional core of the music better than a hired 00:12:34.149 --> 00:12:37.809 director ever could he lived it exactly he then 00:12:37.809 --> 00:12:40.909 translates that exact emotional core into the 00:12:40.909 --> 00:12:44.210 music videos That creates a level of artistic 00:12:44.210 --> 00:12:47.450 consistency that independent bands usually cannot 00:12:47.450 --> 00:12:49.929 afford to buy. It's a massive competitive advantage. 00:12:50.049 --> 00:12:52.450 It's like having an in -house creative director 00:12:52.450 --> 00:12:54.330 who also just happened to co -write your biggest 00:12:54.330 --> 00:12:56.870 hit. It's brilliant. But while their visual identity 00:12:56.870 --> 00:12:59.610 remained remarkably consistent thanks to Mizzy, 00:12:59.710 --> 00:13:03.090 the internal lineup of the band, well, it continued 00:13:03.090 --> 00:13:05.629 to be incredibly volatile. More changes. Specifically, 00:13:05.870 --> 00:13:08.350 the drummer position seemed to be on a constantly 00:13:08.350 --> 00:13:11.399 revolving stool. The rhythm section is the heartbeat 00:13:11.399 --> 00:13:13.879 of a rock band. If the drummer keeps changing, 00:13:14.080 --> 00:13:16.460 the entire foundation of the music is constantly 00:13:16.460 --> 00:13:19.120 shifting. How many drummers did they actually 00:13:19.120 --> 00:13:21.919 go through? It's a dizzying timeline, so let's 00:13:21.919 --> 00:13:26.059 trace it carefully. It started in 2007 with Moke 00:13:26.059 --> 00:13:28.620 Bistany. The guy from the Stormy Night. Right. 00:13:28.759 --> 00:13:31.820 Moke is another guy with a massive resume. The 00:13:31.820 --> 00:13:34.259 source knows he was a former drummer for O -Tep. 00:13:34.590 --> 00:13:37.809 cellophane and head pe and he may have also played 00:13:37.809 --> 00:13:41.809 with puddle of mud between 2005 and 2007. okay 00:13:41.809 --> 00:13:44.690 so that's drummer number one then as we discussed 00:13:44.690 --> 00:13:47.490 boomstick wilson the punk and russian pop veteran 00:13:47.490 --> 00:13:51.070 took over for the 2009 debut ep drummer number 00:13:51.070 --> 00:13:54.409 two but then in march 2011 a drummer named philip 00:13:54.409 --> 00:13:57.590 gagne briefly steps in to replace wilson and 00:13:57.590 --> 00:14:00.110 gagne brings yet another distinct flavor to the 00:14:00.110 --> 00:14:03.139 table The source mentions he comes from instinctive 00:14:03.139 --> 00:14:05.279 aggression and later served as the percussionist 00:14:05.279 --> 00:14:07.440 for the L .A. heavy metal band Before the Morning. 00:14:07.639 --> 00:14:09.639 So we're pulling back into heavy metal territory 00:14:09.639 --> 00:14:12.840 again. Drummer number three. Exactly. But Gagne's 00:14:12.840 --> 00:14:15.940 tenure was incredibly brief because by 2012, 00:14:16.399 --> 00:14:19.960 Boomstick Wilson returns to reclaim the drumstole. 00:14:20.059 --> 00:14:22.159 So that's four different drummer shifts, counting 00:14:22.159 --> 00:14:25.590 Boomstick coming back. Despite all this shuffling, 00:14:25.590 --> 00:14:27.570 all these different players moving in and out, 00:14:27.649 --> 00:14:30.330 the band's output strategy remained surprisingly 00:14:30.330 --> 00:14:33.590 aggressive. They kept putting stuff out. Yes. 00:14:33.909 --> 00:14:36.450 According to their discography, between 2007 00:14:36.450 --> 00:14:40.730 and 2013, Against All Will released a total of 00:14:40.730 --> 00:14:43.429 10 singles. 10 singles is a lot of material. 00:14:43.629 --> 00:14:46.190 This steady drip of music concluded with the 00:14:46.190 --> 00:14:48.629 tracks Sunset Jupiter and Another Nail in the 00:14:48.629 --> 00:14:51.679 Coffin in 2013. Okay. But here is the critical 00:14:51.679 --> 00:14:54.379 detail. Throughout all of those single releases 00:14:54.379 --> 00:14:57.559 across six years, their full -length debut studio 00:14:57.559 --> 00:15:01.120 album remained listed entirely as TBD to be determined. 00:15:01.320 --> 00:15:04.120 Ten singles over six years, national top 50 radio 00:15:04.120 --> 00:15:06.820 placement, multiple music videos, but no official 00:15:06.820 --> 00:15:08.960 full -length studio album to anchor it all. None 00:15:08.960 --> 00:15:11.120 at all. That is a very deliberate or perhaps 00:15:11.120 --> 00:15:13.899 necessary approach to releasing music when your 00:15:13.899 --> 00:15:16.659 internal team is constantly in flux. So what 00:15:16.659 --> 00:15:19.120 does this all mean? It's a great question. For 00:15:19.120 --> 00:15:21.179 you listening. Think about your own collaborative 00:15:21.179 --> 00:15:24.159 projects or businesses. We are really looking 00:15:24.159 --> 00:15:26.480 at a master class in project management here. 00:15:26.700 --> 00:15:29.620 Absolutely. How do you keep a creative vision 00:15:29.620 --> 00:15:32.679 moving forward? How do you keep releasing a consistent 00:15:32.679 --> 00:15:36.120 product when key team members like your lead 00:15:36.120 --> 00:15:39.600 singer or your drummer continuously change? It's 00:15:39.600 --> 00:15:42.080 a fundamental challenge that applies far beyond 00:15:42.080 --> 00:15:43.860 the music industry. It applies to everything. 00:15:44.299 --> 00:15:46.820 Whether you are putting together an office presentation, 00:15:47.259 --> 00:15:49.240 trying to get a tech startup off the ground, 00:15:49.360 --> 00:15:52.220 or playing in an independent rock band, success 00:15:52.220 --> 00:15:54.720 relies entirely on the core founder maintaining 00:15:54.720 --> 00:15:57.720 the mission despite external turbulence. And 00:15:57.720 --> 00:15:59.700 Jimmy Allen did that. Jimmy Allen started this 00:15:59.700 --> 00:16:02.340 project with a specific vision. Even when his 00:16:02.340 --> 00:16:04.440 original singer left to focus on a photography 00:16:04.440 --> 00:16:07.039 gallery in Malibu, even when he had to recruit 00:16:07.039 --> 00:16:09.240 a bassist from a metal band and a drummer from 00:16:09.240 --> 00:16:12.139 a Russian pop duo. Even when that drumstole became 00:16:12.139 --> 00:16:14.700 a revolving door. Jimmy kept the machine moving 00:16:14.700 --> 00:16:17.159 forward. He didn't let the turbulence stop the 00:16:17.159 --> 00:16:19.240 output. The fact that they just kept putting 00:16:19.240 --> 00:16:21.200 out singles instead of waiting for the perfect 00:16:21.200 --> 00:16:24.460 moment to record a full album shows a high level 00:16:24.460 --> 00:16:27.740 of adaptability. It truly is a testament to the 00:16:27.740 --> 00:16:30.320 relentless hustle required to make it in the 00:16:30.320 --> 00:16:32.580 independent arts. You can't wait for perfect 00:16:32.580 --> 00:16:35.340 conditions. No, you really can't. Just to recap 00:16:35.340 --> 00:16:37.879 the incredible journey of Against All Will that 00:16:37.879 --> 00:16:40.299 we've explored today. Let's hear it. This was 00:16:40.299 --> 00:16:43.690 a project born on a stormy Hollywood night. out 00:16:43.690 --> 00:16:46.750 of a desire to start over it was fueled by the 00:16:46.750 --> 00:16:50.129 proven songwriting chops of a rock veteran who 00:16:50.129 --> 00:16:52.090 had already conquered the billboard charts with 00:16:52.090 --> 00:16:54.870 puddle of mud A true veteran. It was powered 00:16:54.870 --> 00:16:58.190 by an eclectic, Frankenstein -like mix of industry 00:16:58.190 --> 00:17:00.710 heavyweights who had to figure out how to bring 00:17:00.710 --> 00:17:04.369 punk, metal, and pop sensibilities into a single 00:17:04.369 --> 00:17:06.690 cohesive room. Which is still mind -blowing. 00:17:06.890 --> 00:17:08.910 And it was ultimately defined by a relentless 00:17:08.910 --> 00:17:11.269 hustle to get on the radio and keep putting out 00:17:11.269 --> 00:17:13.490 music no matter who was sitting behind the drum 00:17:13.490 --> 00:17:16.009 kit. It's a brilliant case study in reinvention 00:17:16.009 --> 00:17:18.509 and endurance. But looking at the sheer diversity 00:17:18.509 --> 00:17:21.250 of the musicians involved in this project, this 00:17:21.250 --> 00:17:23.309 raises an important question for you to consider. 00:17:23.490 --> 00:17:25.630 I love these questions. What should we be thinking 00:17:25.630 --> 00:17:28.109 about? Jimmy Allen essentially built a musical 00:17:28.109 --> 00:17:31.150 Frankenstein, pulling human parts from heavy 00:17:31.150 --> 00:17:34.349 metal, hardcore punk, alternative rock, and synth 00:17:34.349 --> 00:17:37.230 pop. Right. The band released a steady stream 00:17:37.230 --> 00:17:40.450 of singles until 2013, while their official debut 00:17:40.450 --> 00:17:44.509 studio album remained TBD. So ask yourself to 00:17:44.509 --> 00:17:47.769 consider the evolution of media. In a fast -paced, 00:17:47.890 --> 00:17:50.630 digital -first world, is the traditional full 00:17:50.630 --> 00:17:52.930 -length album even necessary anymore to leave 00:17:52.930 --> 00:17:56.230 a lasting creative legacy? Or is a steady drip 00:17:56.230 --> 00:17:58.490 of high -quality singles actually the smarter 00:17:58.490 --> 00:18:01.569 way to adapt to modern attention spans? That 00:18:01.569 --> 00:18:03.809 is a phenomenal question to chew on, especially 00:18:03.809 --> 00:18:05.990 as the tools we use to consume and create art 00:18:05.990 --> 00:18:08.190 continue to evolve so rapidly. Things are moving 00:18:08.190 --> 00:18:10.930 faster than ever. There is something truly special 00:18:10.930 --> 00:18:14.039 about the human friction. that creates a band 00:18:14.039 --> 00:18:17.480 like Against All Will. We want to enthusiastically 00:18:17.480 --> 00:18:20.000 thank you for joining us on this custom -tailored 00:18:20.000 --> 00:18:22.259 deep dive into their unpredictable history. It's 00:18:22.259 --> 00:18:24.259 been a great ride. We hope it gave you some fresh 00:18:24.259 --> 00:18:27.359 perspective on the chaos, the adaptability, and 00:18:27.359 --> 00:18:29.940 the magic of creative collaboration. Until next 00:18:29.940 --> 00:18:32.579 time, keep exploring, keep asking questions, 00:18:32.839 --> 00:18:34.259 and always stay curious.