WEBVTT

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Welcome in. It's so great to have you joining

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us for this deep dive. We are unpacking a truly

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fascinating journey today. Yeah, a really incredible

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life story. Right. We're guided by this comprehensive

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set of source material that details the life,

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the... profound struggles and the revolutionary

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work of Matthijs Vermeulen. And if you're asking

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yourself, you know, who is Matthijs Vermeulen?

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Well, that is exactly our mission today. We're

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going to explore how a blacksmith's son revolutionized

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Dutch music, fought the traditionalist establishment

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tooth and nail. Literally tooth and nail. Endured

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just unimaginable personal tragedy and still

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managed to encode his deepest political and philosophical

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beliefs into some of the most radical compositions

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of the 20th century. And to give you some overarching

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context right out of the gate, it's crucial to

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understand that Vermeulen wasn't just, you know,

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a man composing notes on a page to make a pleasant

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sound. Right. It wasn't just about entertainment.

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Exactly. For him, music was an aesthetic and

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an ethical message. It was a literal oral blueprint

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for how a free and functioning society should

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operate. A blueprint for society. Yeah. He viewed

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his symphonies as living, breathing representations

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of human interaction. Which is such a massive,

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ambitious concept to wrap your head around. But

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whether you're a hardcore music theory nerd who

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loves unpacking avant -garde structures, or you're

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just someone who appreciates a gripping story

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of rebellion and resilience against the odds,

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Vermeulen's life is a masterclass in sticking

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to your convictions. Oh, absolutely. So let's

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start at the beginning. He was born. in 1888

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in the town of Helmond in the Netherlands. But

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his birth name was Matthias Christianus Franciscus

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van der Meulen. Quite the mouthful. Yeah, a bit

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of a mouthful. And his trajectory was supposed

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to be very different. He was expected to follow

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his father into the family trade right after

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primary school. And his father was a blacksmith.

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Right. Which is a physically demanding, highly

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practical trade. It leaves very little room for

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the arts. Zero room, really. But fate intervened.

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The sources note that he suffered a severe illness

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in his youth, and during that prolonged period

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of recovery, his inclination shifted away from

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manual labor and toward the spiritual. Because

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he was raised in a strict Catholic environment.

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And he eventually decided he wanted to become

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a priest. So he actually entered a Catholic seminary.

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But the irony here is that going to the seminary

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to become a priest is the very thing that derailed

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his path to the priesthood. Yeah, completely.

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Or actually pushed him toward his true calling.

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So what happened there? Well, he started learning

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about music, specifically. the principles of

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counterpoint from the 16th century polyphonic

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masters. Counterpoint? Right. Now, to put it

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simply, counterpoint is the art of interweaving

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different musical voices. Imagine several people

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singing different melodies at the exact same

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time, but instead of clashing... Instead of just

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sounding like noise? Exactly. Instead of clashing,

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they fit together harmonically while remaining

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independent in their rhythm and shape. Which

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is incredible. It is. And studying these 16th

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century masters just flipped a switch in his

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brain. By the time he was 18, he abandoned his

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ideas of the priesthood entirely. He left school,

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and in the spring of 1907, he moved to Amsterdam,

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which is the musical capital of the country.

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Just imagine the sheer courage that takes. You're

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a teenager, you've pivoted from blacksmithing

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to the priesthood, and now you're dropping everything

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to move to the big city for music with no real

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safety net. Not at all. And amazingly, it pays

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off. He approaches Daniel Delange, who was the

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director of the conservatory in Amsterdam. And

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Delange clearly spots a rare talent in this kid

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because he ends up giving him free music lessons

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for two whole years. Which gave him the technical

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foundation he desperately needed to survive in

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that world. Yeah. But Vermeulen didn't just want

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to write music. He had fierce opinions about

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it, too. In 1909, he began writing for a Catholic

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daily newspaper called Detide. And the music

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journalism of that era was notoriously long -winded,

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polite, and dry, right? Incredibly dry. But Vermeulen

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brought this resolute, highly personal tone to

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his reviews. He was sharp, he refused to conform

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to the meandering style of his peers, and he

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really made waves. People definitely noticed,

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specifically a prominent figure named Alphonse

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Diepenbrock. Diepenbrock was struck by the fiery

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quality of Vermeulen's reviews. and recommended

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him to a progressive weekly paper called De Amsterdammer.

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And that's where Vermeulen really found his voice

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as a champion of progressive music. He advocated

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for Claude Debussy, Gustav Mahler, and, of course,

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Diepenbrock himself. He even went so far as to

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call Diepenbrock his matre spiritel, his spiritual

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master. Yeah. And while he was building this

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reputation as a formidable critic, he was quietly

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honing his own crack on the side. Right, because

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between 1912 and 1914, he composed what is considered

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his opus one, his first symphony. He titled it

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Symphonia Carminum, and it was an expression

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of the joys of summer and youth. But structurally,

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it laid the groundwork for the radical techniques

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he would use for the rest of his life. He didn't

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just write about summer and youth, though. By

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1917, the First World War is raging across Europe,

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and he writes four songs that display his profound

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preoccupation with the war. Every piece handled

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the topic in its own unique manner. And by 1915,

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he had become the head of the art and literature

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department for The Telegraph, which was a major

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daily newspaper. And in his writing there, he

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made one thing absolutely clear. Politics and

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culture were entirely inseparable. You could

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not divorce the art a society produced from the

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political reality of that society. And that underlying

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belief is the spark that ignited the massive

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conflicts that would soon derail his career in

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the Netherlands. Vermeulen harbored an intense

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disdain for the unidirectional German orientation

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of Dutch musical life at the time. He felt the

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local establishment was just suffocating under

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this singular foreign influence. Here's where

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it gets really interesting, because this disdain

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leads to a climax that history calls the Vermeulen

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Incident. The famous incident. Right. To understand

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how we get to this explosive moment, we have

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to look at the timeline. Vermeulen had a complex

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relationship with the musical establishment.

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He deeply admired Willem Mengelberg, the legendary

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chief conductor of the Concertgebouw Orchestra.

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Right. And Vermeulen presented his beautiful

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first symphony to Mengelberg, hoping his idol

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would bring it to life on stage. And he waited

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for a whole year. Just imagine the agonizing

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anticipation of waiting for your hero. to validate

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your life's work. A whole year of waiting. And

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after 12 months of silence, Mengelberg rejected

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it with open disdain. Ouch. The rejection was

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devastating. Because of Mengelberg's immense

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influence, Vermeulen's orchestral work suddenly

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had no future in Amsterdam. So he's bruised,

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he's frustrated, and the tension is simmering.

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Let's fast forward to November 1918. You are

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sitting in the stands of the famed Concertgebouw

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in Amsterdam. The traditionalist composer Cornelis

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Stopper is on the podium conducting his own seventh

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symphony. It is the ultimate display of the traditional

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establishment parading its power. Right there,

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in the middle of the concert, Vermeulen stands

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up in the stands and shouts at the top of his

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lungs, Long live Sousa! Referring to the American

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March King, John Philip Sousa. Exactly. What's

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fascinating here is the sheer volatility of the

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historical context surrounding that specific

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moment. It wasn't just about the music. Not at

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all. Just days earlier, the socialist leader

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Peter Gels Trolstra had attempted a political

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revolution in the Netherlands. Wow. The country

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was on a knife's edge. Nerves were completely

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frayed. So when Vermeulen disrupts this concert,

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a significant portion of the audience misinterprets

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his intention entirely. They didn't view it as

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a sarcastic musical critique of Dopper's rigid

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style? No, they interpreted his words as Literal,

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dangerous political incitement. And turmoil erupts

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in the concert hall. It triggers a wild flurry

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of publications in the press. The orchestra's

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board actually holds meetings to debate banning

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specific journalists from the hall. It becomes

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a massive scandal. And it essentially forces

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a line in the sand. On one side, you had the

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traditionalists represented by Cornelis Doper

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and Willem Mengelberg. Right. On the other side,

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you had avant -garde figures, including the assistant

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conductor Everett Cornelis and Vermeulen himself.

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This incident ruined relations forever. Which

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leads to the tragic premiere of his first symphony.

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Because Mengelberg shut him out, the symphony

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finally got its first performance by the Arnhem

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Orchestral Society in March 1919. And the sources

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state it took place under abominable circumstances.

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It was a deeply traumatic experience for Vermeulen

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to hear his work played so poorly. And Mengelberg's

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petty vengeance didn't stop there. Vermeulen

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writes his second symphony between 1919 and 1920.

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And Mengelberg publicly states that he refuses

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to even look at the score. Refused to even open

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it. Yeah. Because of this blockade, that symphony

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wouldn't get its premiere until the 1950s. Faced

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with this impenetrable wall of institutional

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hostility, Vermeulen realizes he has no future

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in Amsterdam. He makes one last fruitless appeal

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to Mengelberg. And when that fails, he makes

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a drastic choice. Right. In 1921. backed financially

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by some friends, he packs up his family and moves

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to France. Embarking on an exile, he hopes it

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will provide a more favorable climate for his

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avant -garde ideas. OK, let's unpack this. We

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keep using the word avant -garde, but what does

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his music actually sound like? The sources describe

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his symphonies as atonal but extremely contrapuntal.

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It involves many different musical lines combining

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simultaneously. Exactly. The focus was obsessively

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on melody, but not melody as we traditionally

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think of it. If you listen to modern pop or even

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classical period pieces, you hear distinct structures.

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You have four bar phrases, predictable periods,

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clear beginnings, clear ends. Vermeulen rejected

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all of that. He used what he called free declamation.

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Wait, if he's throwing out all the traditional

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structures and mixing all these atonal melodies

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together at the same time, doesn't that just

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sound like a wall of noise? How does that actually

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work in practice? It works through brilliant

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psychological pacing rather than rigid rules.

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He used what the sources call anti -metric figures,

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basically, intentionally writing notes that rebel

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against the steady ticking of a metronome. It

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throws the listener off balance in a beautiful

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way. Interesting. He would spin these long flowing

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lines into continuous. melodies where any memory

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of traditional structure is just gone. And unlike

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a composer like Arnold Schoenberg, who essentially

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invented a strict mathematical grid to govern

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his notes, the 12 -tone system, Vermeulen hated

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strict systems. He didn't want to be boxed in.

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Exactly. He let his melodies flow naturally based

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on psychology and emotion, supported by underlying

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harmonies that alternate between tension and

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relief. Wow. If we connect this to the bigger

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picture, we get to the core of Vermeulen's genius.

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His philosophy of polymelodicism. In his writings,

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Vermeulen drew a direct parallel between melody

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and the individual human being. He wrote, the

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melody is a frame of mind expressed in tones.

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That is such a vivid way to look at music, a

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frame of mind expressed in tones. Seen in that

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light, a multi -voiced, polymelodic composition

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isn't just a musical choice. It takes on the

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meaning of an oral representation of society

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itself. By combining several distinct, independent

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melodies, he was revealing his ultimate wish

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for society. Which was? He wanted a world where

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every single individual is able to freely express

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and develop themselves without infringing upon

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other people's freedom to develop their own abilities.

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It is a utopian blueprint encoded into sheet

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music. The open simple textures alternating with

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complex ones. It is literally the sound of a

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free society. But despite the brilliance of this

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concept, the reality of his exile in France was

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incredibly harsh. The French concert halls ignored

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his symphonic works, just like the Dutch ones

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had. And you really have to feel for the guy

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here. Oh, Devin. From sheer necessity just to

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put food on the table for his family, he had

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to return to the exhausting grind of journalism.

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And this wasn't just casual occasional writing.

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In 1926, he became the Paris correspondent for

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the Sorabayash Handelsblad, a daily paper in

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the Dutch East Indies, what is now Indonesia.

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Think about the crushing weight of that reality.

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For 14 years, he had to write two extensive articles

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a week on every possible topic. I want you to

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really put yourself in his shoes for a second.

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Yeah. Imagine knowing you possess this world

00:12:33.120 --> 00:12:35.679
-changing artistic vision, a vision you are desperate

00:12:35.679 --> 00:12:38.639
to share. But instead of composing, you're staring

00:12:38.639 --> 00:12:41.519
at a blank page, churning out endless newspaper

00:12:41.519 --> 00:12:43.960
copy about daily politics and mundane events

00:12:43.960 --> 00:12:47.399
for a paper thousands of miles away just to survive.

00:12:47.659 --> 00:12:49.379
While your piano just sits silent. Your piano

00:12:49.379 --> 00:12:51.379
sits silent while you meet another looming deadline.

00:12:51.759 --> 00:12:54.710
It is a profound test. of endurance. It took

00:12:54.710 --> 00:12:57.470
a massive mental toll, essentially forcing him

00:12:57.470 --> 00:13:00.549
to hit pause on his life's true work. But his

00:13:00.549 --> 00:13:02.769
creative spirit was never fully extinguished.

00:13:02.950 --> 00:13:06.350
The turning point finally began in 1930. When

00:13:06.350 --> 00:13:08.950
he received a commission. Right, to compose incidental

00:13:08.950 --> 00:13:11.629
music for the play The Leaker to Hollander, The

00:13:11.629 --> 00:13:14.629
Flying Dutchman by Martinus Niehoff. This offered

00:13:14.629 --> 00:13:17.600
him a glimmer of hope. But the monumental breakthrough

00:13:17.600 --> 00:13:20.580
comes nine years later in 1939. And this is such

00:13:20.580 --> 00:13:22.879
a triumphant moment. The Concertgebouw Orchestra,

00:13:23.179 --> 00:13:25.139
the very institution that had shunned him for

00:13:25.139 --> 00:13:28.419
decades, finally performs his work. Yes, Edward

00:13:28.419 --> 00:13:31.200
Van Bynum conducted his third symphony. And after

00:13:31.200 --> 00:13:33.200
years of waiting in the wilderness, that long

00:13:33.200 --> 00:13:35.279
-anticipated confrontation with the resounding

00:13:35.279 --> 00:13:38.200
notes proved him right. It confirmed the effectiveness

00:13:38.200 --> 00:13:41.370
of his musical concepts in the real world. This

00:13:41.370 --> 00:13:44.110
validation carries him into a new era of productivity,

00:13:44.409 --> 00:13:46.970
even as the world descends into darkness. During

00:13:46.970 --> 00:13:49.429
the heart of World War II, from 1940 to 1944,

00:13:49.789 --> 00:13:52.769
he's composing again. Does his music from this

00:13:52.769 --> 00:13:55.190
era reflect the despair of the war? Actually,

00:13:55.210 --> 00:13:57.970
the exact opposite. During this terrifying period,

00:13:58.169 --> 00:14:00.809
he wrote his fourth and fifth symphonies. titling

00:14:00.809 --> 00:14:03.450
them Les Victoires and Les Lendemains Chantons,

00:14:03.490 --> 00:14:05.789
The Victories and The Singing Tomorrows. The

00:14:05.789 --> 00:14:08.629
Singing Tomorrows. The titles alone symbolize

00:14:08.629 --> 00:14:11.370
his unshakable faith in a good outcome for the

00:14:11.370 --> 00:14:15.090
war. He was projecting hope into a dark world.

00:14:15.450 --> 00:14:17.909
But right as the war was reaching its climax,

00:14:18.389 --> 00:14:21.330
Vermeulen was dealt a shattering blow. During

00:14:21.330 --> 00:14:24.190
the fall of 1944, in a devastatingly short space

00:14:24.190 --> 00:14:27.399
of time, he lost his wife. And he also lost his

00:14:27.399 --> 00:14:29.980
most cherished son, who was tragically killed

00:14:29.980 --> 00:14:32.059
while serving in the French Liberation Army.

00:14:32.320 --> 00:14:34.559
The magnitude of that loss is difficult to even

00:14:34.559 --> 00:14:37.419
comprehend. To maintain such optimism for the

00:14:37.419 --> 00:14:39.440
world, pouring all of your hope into The Singing

00:14:39.440 --> 00:14:41.980
Tomorrows, only to have the war claim the people

00:14:41.980 --> 00:14:44.820
you love most. So what does this all mean? How

00:14:44.820 --> 00:14:47.000
does a man whose entire philosophy is built on

00:14:47.000 --> 00:14:49.139
the beauty of human expression process that level

00:14:49.139 --> 00:14:51.460
of grief? Does he just give up? He turned, as

00:14:51.460 --> 00:14:53.120
he always did, to his intellect and his spirit.

00:14:53.500 --> 00:14:55.879
The sources note that he documented his agonizing

00:14:55.879 --> 00:14:58.519
mourning process in a deeply moving diary titled

00:14:58.519 --> 00:15:01.559
Hatenage Heart, which translates to the singular

00:15:01.559 --> 00:15:04.179
heart. Wow. But he didn't stop at documenting

00:15:04.179 --> 00:15:07.100
his pain. Seeking the true meaning of this loss,

00:15:07.399 --> 00:15:10.240
Vermeulen drew up a complex philosophical construction

00:15:10.240 --> 00:15:13.519
to process his grief. He further developed this

00:15:13.519 --> 00:15:16.580
framework into a book titled Het Avantur Vanden

00:15:16.580 --> 00:15:20.539
Geest, or The Adventure of the Mind. What exactly

00:15:20.539 --> 00:15:22.820
was in this philosophical construction? How did

00:15:22.820 --> 00:15:25.720
it help him survive? He essentially built a philosophical

00:15:25.720 --> 00:15:28.179
house to live in when his real house was destroyed

00:15:28.179 --> 00:15:31.360
by tragedy. The book explored the journey of

00:15:31.360 --> 00:15:33.539
the human spirit, searching for enduring meaning

00:15:33.539 --> 00:15:37.139
beyond temporary suffering. Okay. He argued that

00:15:37.139 --> 00:15:39.259
the mind's adventure is to push through the darkest

00:15:39.259 --> 00:15:41.419
elements of human existence and connect with

00:15:41.419 --> 00:15:44.679
a higher, creative source. He used this writing

00:15:44.679 --> 00:15:47.259
to spiritually resurrect himself, proving that

00:15:47.259 --> 00:15:49.179
the human spirit could withstand even the most

00:15:49.179 --> 00:15:51.379
crushing blows if it remained focused on the

00:15:51.379 --> 00:15:53.799
pursuit of truth and beauty. Which brings us

00:15:53.799 --> 00:15:56.659
to the final act of his life, a period marked

00:15:56.659 --> 00:16:00.080
by profound activism and remarkably unflagging

00:16:00.080 --> 00:16:03.299
optimism. In 1946, he returned to the Netherlands

00:16:03.299 --> 00:16:06.279
and married Thea Deppenbroek. And if that last

00:16:06.279 --> 00:16:08.440
name sounds familiar to you, she was the daughter

00:16:08.440 --> 00:16:11.220
of his former mentor, Alphonse Deppenbroek. Right.

00:16:11.679 --> 00:16:13.700
He also went back to work for the weekly De Groen

00:16:13.700 --> 00:16:16.320
Amsterdammer, and his articles on music from

00:16:16.320 --> 00:16:18.679
this period are still ranked among the most compelling

00:16:18.679 --> 00:16:21.139
ever written in that area. But he wasn't just

00:16:21.139 --> 00:16:24.480
writing about music anymore. Politics and society

00:16:24.480 --> 00:16:27.580
continued to occupy him passionately. As the

00:16:27.580 --> 00:16:29.980
world transitioned from World War II into the

00:16:29.980 --> 00:16:33.440
Cold War, Vermeulen found the stifling, paranoid

00:16:33.440 --> 00:16:37.289
atmosphere increasingly depressing. He was deeply

00:16:37.289 --> 00:16:39.730
afraid of a nuclear confrontation. And we are

00:16:39.730 --> 00:16:41.929
just reporting his stances here based on the

00:16:41.929 --> 00:16:43.909
source material to understand the man. But he

00:16:43.909 --> 00:16:45.970
became fiercely active against the armored race.

00:16:46.110 --> 00:16:48.909
He published his arguments in several periodicals.

00:16:48.909 --> 00:16:50.769
Yeah. And during the first large scale peace

00:16:50.769 --> 00:16:53.169
demonstration in 1955, he gave a speech where

00:16:53.169 --> 00:16:56.549
he stated. The atomic bomb is an anti -life,

00:16:56.590 --> 00:16:59.450
anti -God, anti -man weapon. That's a powerful

00:16:59.450 --> 00:17:02.210
statement. It is. This raises an important question,

00:17:02.250 --> 00:17:04.049
one that Vermeulen answered through his actions.

00:17:04.470 --> 00:17:06.470
What is the role of the artist when the world

00:17:06.470 --> 00:17:09.329
is facing an existential global threat? For Vermeulen,

00:17:09.589 --> 00:17:12.509
the answer was engagement. You cannot separate

00:17:12.509 --> 00:17:14.950
the art from the survival of the society that

00:17:14.950 --> 00:17:17.930
produces it. If you believe your music is a blueprint

00:17:17.930 --> 00:17:20.549
for a free society, you have to fight for that

00:17:20.549 --> 00:17:23.289
society to exist. And the poetic justice of his

00:17:23.289 --> 00:17:26.029
later years is that he finally got the widespread

00:17:26.029 --> 00:17:30.250
validation he deserved. In 1953, his second symphony,

00:17:30.369 --> 00:17:34.089
the exact same symphony that Mengelberg so insultingly

00:17:34.089 --> 00:17:37.049
refused to even look at back in the 1920s, won

00:17:37.049 --> 00:17:39.430
a prize at the Queen Elizabeth Music Competition

00:17:39.430 --> 00:17:41.549
in Brussels. And then it was performed during

00:17:41.549 --> 00:17:44.430
the 1956 Holland Festival. That is just incredible.

00:17:44.730 --> 00:17:47.230
It really is. That performance instigated an

00:17:47.230 --> 00:17:50.130
entirely new burst of creativity for him in his

00:17:50.130 --> 00:17:52.849
late 60s. He moved to the rural town of Lorraine

00:17:52.849 --> 00:17:55.730
with his wife and child. There he composed his

00:17:55.730 --> 00:17:58.450
sixth symphony. followed by various songs and

00:17:58.450 --> 00:18:00.529
a string quartet. And what about his final work?

00:18:00.630 --> 00:18:03.049
What is the tone of his last major composition?

00:18:03.410 --> 00:18:05.589
His final work, his seventh symphony, carries

00:18:05.589 --> 00:18:10.490
the title for the times to come. The source emphasizes

00:18:10.490 --> 00:18:13.069
that this final piece reveals an unflagging optimism.

00:18:13.230 --> 00:18:15.230
After everything he went through. Everything.

00:18:15.769 --> 00:18:18.150
He composed it as an ode to the beauty of the

00:18:18.150 --> 00:18:20.930
earth, maintaining his faith in humanity right

00:18:20.930 --> 00:18:23.690
up until the end. He died of a wasting disease

00:18:23.690 --> 00:18:28.819
on July 26th. When we look at his legacy, it's

00:18:28.819 --> 00:18:31.079
clear that his primary goal was to create music

00:18:31.079 --> 00:18:33.740
that appealed to the spirituality of man. He

00:18:33.740 --> 00:18:36.240
wanted to bestow feelings of happiness and connect

00:18:36.240 --> 00:18:39.279
listeners with what he called the creative spirit,

00:18:39.420 --> 00:18:42.400
the source of life. Because his ambitions and

00:18:42.400 --> 00:18:44.460
his ethical messages were at right angles to

00:18:44.460 --> 00:18:46.759
the mainstream movements of his time, he didn't

00:18:46.759 --> 00:18:48.839
leave behind a specific school of followers or

00:18:48.839 --> 00:18:51.819
direct disciples. Right. He was too unique. Exactly.

00:18:52.039 --> 00:18:54.519
But his work has been cited as seminal by highly

00:18:54.519 --> 00:18:56.880
influential Dutch composers like Louis Anderson.

00:18:57.619 --> 00:18:59.839
Almost all of his true recognition took place

00:18:59.839 --> 00:19:02.559
well after his death. He left behind a body of

00:19:02.559 --> 00:19:04.740
work that includes symphonies, cello sonatas,

00:19:04.859 --> 00:19:07.240
string quartets, and an enduring belief in the

00:19:07.240 --> 00:19:09.920
power of the individual voice. He proved that

00:19:09.920 --> 00:19:12.119
art isn't just entertainment, it's a moral stance,

00:19:12.440 --> 00:19:14.819
which leaves us with a fascinating, provocative

00:19:14.819 --> 00:19:17.640
thought to mull over today. If Matisse Vermeulen

00:19:17.640 --> 00:19:20.779
fundamentally believed that a polymelodic musical

00:19:20.779 --> 00:19:24.200
structure where every individual voice can freely

00:19:24.200 --> 00:19:26.559
express and develop itself without stepping on

00:19:26.559 --> 00:19:29.019
the freedom of the other voices was the ultimate

00:19:29.019 --> 00:19:32.180
oral representation, of a healthy, functioning

00:19:32.180 --> 00:19:35.579
society. Right. What does the heavily manufactured,

00:19:35.920 --> 00:19:38.519
highly repetitive, and strictly controlled music

00:19:38.519 --> 00:19:40.920
that dominates so much of our own modern pop

00:19:40.920 --> 00:19:43.259
charts say about the current state of our society?

00:19:43.579 --> 00:19:45.680
That's a great question. Are we fostering free

00:19:45.680 --> 00:19:47.640
expression or just repeating the same tightly

00:19:47.640 --> 00:19:49.720
controlled loops? Something to think about the

00:19:49.720 --> 00:19:52.119
next time you turn on the radio. Thank you so

00:19:52.119 --> 00:19:54.079
much for joining us on this deep dive into the

00:19:54.079 --> 00:19:56.579
resilient, revolutionary life of Matisse Vermeulen.

00:19:56.720 --> 00:19:57.859
We will see you next time.
