WEBVTT 00:00:00.619 --> 00:00:03.140 Okay, start with the image of a classical orchestra 00:00:03.140 --> 00:00:05.299 conductor. Like, just close your eyes for a second. 00:00:05.360 --> 00:00:09.380 What do you see? Oh, probably the maestro on 00:00:09.380 --> 00:00:11.679 the mountaintop? Right. It's usually a very specific 00:00:11.679 --> 00:00:14.980 caricature, someone old, probably a bit tyrannical, 00:00:15.179 --> 00:00:17.620 white hair flying everywhere, obsessed with the 00:00:17.620 --> 00:00:20.519 past, and frankly, terrified of the future. Yeah, 00:00:20.519 --> 00:00:23.199 that's a very 19th century idea. You know, the 00:00:23.199 --> 00:00:25.620 isolated genius who stands with his back to the 00:00:25.620 --> 00:00:28.699 audience and just communes with God while everyone 00:00:28.699 --> 00:00:31.879 else is... just trying to keep up. Exactly. But 00:00:31.879 --> 00:00:34.340 today, we are doing a deep dive into someone 00:00:34.340 --> 00:00:36.780 who took that caricature, completely shattered 00:00:36.780 --> 00:00:39.259 it, and then rebuilt the pieces into something 00:00:39.259 --> 00:00:42.399 totally new. Issa Pekka -Salone. Issa Pekka -Salone. 00:00:42.780 --> 00:00:46.100 And based on the massive stack of sources we 00:00:46.100 --> 00:00:48.240 have here, we're talking biographies, concert 00:00:48.240 --> 00:00:50.219 reviews, and all the breaking news from late 00:00:50.219 --> 00:00:53.539 2025 and early 2026. This really isn't just a 00:00:53.539 --> 00:00:56.030 story about a guy waving a stick. Not at all. 00:00:56.170 --> 00:00:58.289 I mean, Slumman is what I call a hybrid creative. 00:00:58.850 --> 00:01:01.109 He's a composer who became a world famous conductor 00:01:01.109 --> 00:01:04.049 almost by accident. Which is wild. It is. He's 00:01:04.049 --> 00:01:06.430 a guy who deeply respects the history of music. 00:01:06.849 --> 00:01:09.170 He loves Stravinsky, for instance. But he also 00:01:09.170 --> 00:01:12.950 loves Apple products and cutting edge tech. And 00:01:12.950 --> 00:01:14.769 crucially, for our discussion today with you 00:01:14.769 --> 00:01:17.370 all, he's a fascinating study in leadership. 00:01:18.150 --> 00:01:20.730 Specifically, how you navigate that tightrope 00:01:20.730 --> 00:01:23.969 between rigid tradition and absolute innovation. 00:01:24.299 --> 00:01:26.659 And we have some serious ground to cover regarding 00:01:26.659 --> 00:01:28.519 his career management, too, because if you've 00:01:28.519 --> 00:01:30.560 been following the arts news over the last 12 00:01:30.560 --> 00:01:32.599 months, you know he's been at the center of a 00:01:32.599 --> 00:01:34.700 pretty significant storm in the classical world. 00:01:35.019 --> 00:01:36.959 Oh, absolutely. Moving from San Francisco back 00:01:36.959 --> 00:01:39.840 to Los Angeles under some very unique circumstances. 00:01:40.099 --> 00:01:42.260 Right. It's a classic case of creative differences 00:01:42.260 --> 00:01:46.150 on a massive institutional scale. But to understand 00:01:46.150 --> 00:01:49.310 why his moves in 2026 matter and why he's creating 00:01:49.310 --> 00:01:51.590 this entirely new creative director role for 00:01:51.590 --> 00:01:53.250 himself, we really have to understand where he 00:01:53.250 --> 00:01:55.329 came from. Because he didn't start out wanting 00:01:55.329 --> 00:01:58.730 to lead orchestras. No, in fact, he kind of actively 00:01:58.730 --> 00:02:00.930 avoided it. That's the part of the research that 00:02:00.930 --> 00:02:03.609 jumped out at me immediately. He was born in 00:02:03.609 --> 00:02:06.469 Helsinki, Finland in 1958. He goes to the famous 00:02:06.469 --> 00:02:09.289 Sibelius Academy, but he's not there to be the 00:02:09.289 --> 00:02:11.210 guy in the spotlight. No, he was a horn player. 00:02:11.310 --> 00:02:13.830 Which is, well, let's be honest. The French horn 00:02:13.830 --> 00:02:16.210 is the most stressful instrument in the orchestra. 00:02:16.409 --> 00:02:18.610 Oh, without a doubt. It's the one where if you 00:02:18.610 --> 00:02:20.689 miss a note, it sounds like a dying goose and 00:02:20.689 --> 00:02:22.449 everyone turns to look at you. It's the Miss 00:02:22.449 --> 00:02:25.219 Note Factory. It's incredibly difficult. And 00:02:25.219 --> 00:02:27.819 I think that really shapes his psychology early 00:02:27.819 --> 00:02:30.400 on. If you're a horn player, you learn humility 00:02:30.400 --> 00:02:32.500 very quickly because the instrument will just 00:02:32.500 --> 00:02:35.539 embarrass you if you aren't careful. But his 00:02:35.539 --> 00:02:38.000 real passion wasn't playing. It was writing. 00:02:38.740 --> 00:02:41.080 He studied composition. He was part of this group 00:02:41.080 --> 00:02:43.620 called Corvette Aukey. Which translates to ears 00:02:43.620 --> 00:02:46.500 open, right? Exactly. Ears open. They were these 00:02:46.500 --> 00:02:49.259 young fiery Finnish idealists. They wanted to 00:02:49.259 --> 00:02:51.699 shake up the establishment. They felt Finnish 00:02:51.699 --> 00:02:54.620 music was way too stuck in the past, too obsessed 00:02:54.620 --> 00:02:57.199 with Sibelius. They wanted to open Finnish ears 00:02:57.199 --> 00:02:59.879 to the rest of the world. Right. And this is 00:02:59.879 --> 00:03:02.719 the funny part. Solonen only picked up the baton. 00:03:02.840 --> 00:03:05.460 He only started conducting for self -defense. 00:03:05.740 --> 00:03:07.939 Wait, self -defense? Like physical self -defense? 00:03:08.120 --> 00:03:10.939 Artistic self -defense. He realized that if he 00:03:10.939 --> 00:03:13.419 wanted his own compositions to be played correctly, 00:03:13.699 --> 00:03:16.099 or frankly played at all, he had to be the one 00:03:16.099 --> 00:03:19.099 to lead them. He didn't trust anyone else to 00:03:19.099 --> 00:03:21.960 get the nuance right. So he viewed conducting 00:03:21.960 --> 00:03:25.620 as this necessary evil to support his composing 00:03:25.620 --> 00:03:29.129 habit. He wasn't chasing power. He was chasing 00:03:29.129 --> 00:03:32.430 accuracy. So he's a reluctant leader, which ironically 00:03:32.430 --> 00:03:35.770 is often the best kind. But then we hit 1983, 00:03:36.250 --> 00:03:38.310 and this is the moment that feels like it's straight 00:03:38.310 --> 00:03:41.210 out of a Hollywood movie script. The classic 00:03:41.210 --> 00:03:44.129 understudy steps up trope. It really is. So the 00:03:44.129 --> 00:03:46.009 Philharmonie Orchestra in London, which is one 00:03:46.009 --> 00:03:48.069 of the best in the world, is scheduled to perform 00:03:48.069 --> 00:03:50.629 Mahler's Symphony No. 3. Now, for those of you 00:03:50.629 --> 00:03:52.789 who aren't Mahler nerds, we need to context set 00:03:52.789 --> 00:03:55.189 here. This is not a tight little 20 mini Mozart 00:03:55.189 --> 00:03:56.969 symphony. Right. Give us the scale. What are 00:03:56.969 --> 00:03:59.330 we dealing with? Mahler 3 is a universe. It is 00:03:59.330 --> 00:04:01.909 roughly 100 minutes long. It requires a massive 00:04:01.909 --> 00:04:05.590 orchestra, a women's choir, a boy's choir, and 00:04:05.590 --> 00:04:08.810 an alto soloist. It is structurally complex, 00:04:09.349 --> 00:04:12.310 emotionally exhausting, and technically a complete 00:04:12.310 --> 00:04:15.930 minefield. And the scheduled conductor, the legendary 00:04:15.930 --> 00:04:18.930 Michael Tilson Thomas, falls ill. He can't do 00:04:18.930 --> 00:04:21.430 it. And the orchestra management looks at their 00:04:21.430 --> 00:04:24.670 Rolodex and lands on a 25 -year -old Finnish 00:04:24.670 --> 00:04:27.949 guy who nobody knows. They call Solonen. And 00:04:27.949 --> 00:04:30.269 here is the absolute kicker. He had never studied 00:04:30.269 --> 00:04:32.629 the score before. Wait, pause right there. He 00:04:32.629 --> 00:04:34.689 hadn't studied it. I assumed he knew it really 00:04:34.689 --> 00:04:36.410 well and just hadn't conducted it yet. You're 00:04:36.410 --> 00:04:38.790 saying he went in cold. He knew the music as 00:04:38.790 --> 00:04:40.980 a listener, of course. He probably had the sound 00:04:40.980 --> 00:04:43.560 of it in his head. But there is a massive difference 00:04:43.560 --> 00:04:45.439 between listening to a record in your living 00:04:45.439 --> 00:04:47.860 room and knowing how to signal the entrance of 00:04:47.860 --> 00:04:50.279 the oboe in the third movement while balancing 00:04:50.279 --> 00:04:52.660 the tempo of the strings. That's terrifying. 00:04:52.800 --> 00:04:55.079 He accepted the gig on extremely short notice. 00:04:55.680 --> 00:04:57.800 He essentially crammed for the exam of a lifetime 00:04:57.800 --> 00:05:00.920 in a matter of days. That is the definition of 00:05:00.920 --> 00:05:04.050 a high -risk, high -reward maneuver. Most people 00:05:04.050 --> 00:05:05.790 would crumble. I mean, standing in front of a 00:05:05.790 --> 00:05:08.329 hundred professional musicians who were probably 00:05:08.329 --> 00:05:10.930 highly skeptical of this kid. Most would totally 00:05:10.930 --> 00:05:15.910 crumble. But Salonen has this icy Nordic cool. 00:05:16.490 --> 00:05:18.569 He stepped onto the podium and by all accounts, 00:05:18.689 --> 00:05:21.329 it was a sensation. Wasn't just good enough. 00:05:21.709 --> 00:05:25.629 It was a revelation. Incredible. Overnight, literally 00:05:25.629 --> 00:05:29.379 overnight, he went from Issa Peckahoo to the 00:05:29.379 --> 00:05:32.220 hottest young property in Europe. By 1985, he 00:05:32.220 --> 00:05:34.199 was the principal guest conductor of that very 00:05:34.199 --> 00:05:36.740 same orchestra. So he conquers Europe. He's the 00:05:36.740 --> 00:05:39.519 golden boy. But then he makes a move that, at 00:05:39.519 --> 00:05:41.459 the time, must have seemed really confusing to 00:05:41.459 --> 00:05:44.920 the establishment. In 1992, he heads to the American 00:05:44.920 --> 00:05:47.620 West Coast. He takes over the Los Angeles Philharmonic. 00:05:47.660 --> 00:05:49.540 And this is the pivot point. This is where the 00:05:49.540 --> 00:05:51.439 hybrid we talked about earlier really gets built. 00:05:51.680 --> 00:05:53.259 You have to understand the baggage he arrived 00:05:53.259 --> 00:05:55.019 with. He came from the European avant -garde 00:05:55.019 --> 00:05:57.300 tradition. Can we unpack that term for a second? 00:05:57.420 --> 00:05:59.459 Avant -garde gets thrown around a lot, but musically, 00:05:59.579 --> 00:06:01.959 what did that actually mean for him in the 80s? 00:06:02.160 --> 00:06:05.620 It meant modernism with a capital M. Think of 00:06:05.620 --> 00:06:08.600 someone like Pierre Boulet. The philosophy was 00:06:08.600 --> 00:06:11.579 very intellectual, very mathematical. Salonan 00:06:11.579 --> 00:06:14.240 later described it as being inculcated with negatives. 00:06:14.579 --> 00:06:16.560 Inculcated with negatives. Meaning what, exactly? 00:06:16.620 --> 00:06:18.959 Meaning the rules were all about what you could 00:06:18.959 --> 00:06:21.379 not do. You couldn't write a catchy melody that 00:06:21.379 --> 00:06:23.519 was considered cheap. You couldn't have a steady 00:06:23.519 --> 00:06:25.819 foot -tapping rhythmic pulse. That was way too 00:06:25.819 --> 00:06:28.220 simplistic. If the audience left the concert 00:06:28.220 --> 00:06:30.839 hall whistling a tune, you had essentially failed 00:06:30.839 --> 00:06:33.879 as a serious composer. It sounds completely exhausting, 00:06:34.060 --> 00:06:36.519 like art designed specifically to alienate the 00:06:36.519 --> 00:06:38.319 people experiencing it. Like, if you enjoyed 00:06:38.319 --> 00:06:40.459 this, I did it wrong. It was very cerebral. It 00:06:40.459 --> 00:06:43.259 was paper music, brilliant on the page, intricate 00:06:43.259 --> 00:06:46.019 mathematics, but often very cold to the ear. 00:06:46.160 --> 00:06:49.259 So, Salonan lands in Los Angeles with this strict 00:06:49.259 --> 00:06:51.959 mindset, and there's this great story about an 00:06:51.959 --> 00:06:54.279 older player in the L .A. Phil coming up to him 00:06:54.279 --> 00:06:57.220 after his first concert in 1984, before he even 00:06:57.220 --> 00:06:59.379 officially took the job. What did he say? He 00:06:59.379 --> 00:07:02.439 said, consider this your future home. Which is 00:07:02.439 --> 00:07:05.319 welcoming, but also a bit of a prophecy. It was, 00:07:05.680 --> 00:07:07.680 because the California environment physically 00:07:07.680 --> 00:07:09.839 and mentally changed him. He started spending 00:07:09.839 --> 00:07:12.240 time with American composers like John Adams. 00:07:12.899 --> 00:07:15.879 Now, Adams is a minimalist. His music pulses, 00:07:16.040 --> 00:07:19.000 it has drive. It's not afraid of beauty or repetition. 00:07:19.259 --> 00:07:20.860 And I imagine the weather helps. It's got to 00:07:20.860 --> 00:07:23.560 be hard to be a rigid, cold modernist when it's 00:07:23.560 --> 00:07:26.139 75 degrees and sunny in January and you're driving 00:07:26.139 --> 00:07:29.139 down the Pacific Coast Highway. Solonin explicitly 00:07:29.139 --> 00:07:31.860 said the doggos of Europe started to feel ridiculous 00:07:31.860 --> 00:07:34.319 in the California sun. He actually called his 00:07:34.319 --> 00:07:37.779 old adherence to those rules madness He shifted 00:07:37.779 --> 00:07:40.279 from what he called the ideological principle 00:07:40.279 --> 00:07:42.519 doing things just because the theory says so 00:07:42.519 --> 00:07:44.990 to the pleasure principle The pleasure principle, 00:07:44.990 --> 00:07:46.990 that sounds so much better for everyone involved. 00:07:47.089 --> 00:07:48.970 It really does. It means allowing yourself to 00:07:48.970 --> 00:07:51.310 enjoy the sound, allowing the rhythm to groove. 00:07:51.970 --> 00:07:54.470 And the tangible result of this internal shift 00:07:54.470 --> 00:07:57.829 was his piece, LA Variations, which premiered 00:07:57.829 --> 00:08:00.709 in 1997. And this was his big breakout hit as 00:08:00.709 --> 00:08:03.689 a composer. Huge hit. It's one of the most performed 00:08:03.689 --> 00:08:06.949 orchestral works of the last 30 years. It's brilliant. 00:08:07.129 --> 00:08:09.509 because it doesn't dumb anything down. It is 00:08:09.509 --> 00:08:13.389 still incredibly technically difficult and virtuosic, 00:08:13.389 --> 00:08:18.009 but it has this joy, this kinetic energy that 00:08:18.009 --> 00:08:19.930 he simply wouldn't have written back in Finland. 00:08:20.129 --> 00:08:21.970 It's a great example of how your environment 00:08:21.970 --> 00:08:23.990 shapes your output. If you stay in the same room, 00:08:24.029 --> 00:08:25.850 you write the same book. If you move to a new 00:08:25.850 --> 00:08:27.930 continent, you write something else entirely. 00:08:28.310 --> 00:08:30.610 Precisely. But speaking of rooms and houses, 00:08:31.050 --> 00:08:32.750 we really have to talk about this Stravinsky 00:08:32.750 --> 00:08:35.330 story. In all our research, this stood out to 00:08:35.330 --> 00:08:38.049 me as the most humanizing moment for him and 00:08:38.049 --> 00:08:40.690 a real key to understanding his psychology. Oh, 00:08:40.710 --> 00:08:43.110 I love this story. So Igor Stravinsky, arguably 00:08:43.110 --> 00:08:45.289 the most important composer of the 20th century, 00:08:45.610 --> 00:08:47.470 lived in Beverly Hills for a long time. Right. 00:08:47.590 --> 00:08:50.009 And when Stravinsky died and the house eventually 00:08:50.009 --> 00:08:52.450 went up for sale, Salonan went to look at it. 00:08:52.570 --> 00:08:55.250 He was seriously considering buying it. I mean, 00:08:55.370 --> 00:08:57.929 just imagine the prestige. You tell people, come 00:08:57.929 --> 00:08:59.629 over to my place. It used to be Sturinski's. 00:08:59.769 --> 00:09:02.509 The ultimate power -mover conductor. Oh, this 00:09:02.509 --> 00:09:05.830 old thing. Igor just left it here. Exactly. But 00:09:05.830 --> 00:09:08.029 he walks into the study. He looks down at the 00:09:08.029 --> 00:09:11.759 carpet, and he sees the indentations. The marks 00:09:11.759 --> 00:09:15.379 left by the piano legs. Yes. He saw exactly where 00:09:15.379 --> 00:09:18.259 Stravinsky's piano had stood. The exact spot 00:09:18.259 --> 00:09:20.500 where masterpieces like The Rake's Progress and 00:09:20.500 --> 00:09:23.019 Symphony of Psalms were written. And he just 00:09:23.019 --> 00:09:25.639 froze. He said he realized he could never compose 00:09:25.639 --> 00:09:27.419 in that room. He would just be sitting there 00:09:27.419 --> 00:09:30.019 staring at the ghosts, trying to fill shoes that 00:09:30.019 --> 00:09:32.679 were entirely too big. It's pure imposter syndrome, 00:09:32.779 --> 00:09:35.379 isn't it? Even at his elite level. It is. But 00:09:35.379 --> 00:09:39.379 it's also profound self -awareness. He realized 00:09:39.379 --> 00:09:42.080 that to find his own voice, he couldn't literally 00:09:42.080 --> 00:09:44.039 live in the house of his hero. He didn't buy 00:09:44.039 --> 00:09:46.039 the house. He walked away. I think that is a 00:09:46.039 --> 00:09:48.519 massive takeaway for anyone in a creative field. 00:09:49.019 --> 00:09:50.960 You have to respect your idols, but you cannot 00:09:50.960 --> 00:09:53.639 try to beat them. Exactly. He had to step out 00:09:53.639 --> 00:09:56.299 of the shadow to become Salonan. And part of 00:09:56.299 --> 00:09:58.539 becoming Salonan meant embracing things that 00:09:58.539 --> 00:10:00.279 the ghosts of the past would never have even 00:10:00.279 --> 00:10:03.039 touched, like technology. This is where he really 00:10:03.039 --> 00:10:05.779 diverges from the old maestro stereotype. In 00:10:05.779 --> 00:10:08.820 2014, he's in an Apple commercial. And not just 00:10:08.820 --> 00:10:11.820 a little print ad in a magazine. No, he was the 00:10:11.820 --> 00:10:14.179 star of the Your Verse campaign for the iPad 00:10:14.179 --> 00:10:17.860 Air. He was shown composing on a tablet, whistling 00:10:17.860 --> 00:10:20.620 a tune, climbing rocks, and then conducting. 00:10:20.919 --> 00:10:22.700 I remember seeing that and thinking, wait, is 00:10:22.700 --> 00:10:25.919 that a classical conductor on Brimetime TV? It 00:10:25.919 --> 00:10:28.120 felt like a glitch in The Matrix. It was culturally 00:10:28.120 --> 00:10:30.700 significant. It showed classical music not as 00:10:30.700 --> 00:10:33.620 a dusty museum piece, but as a living, breathing, 00:10:33.860 --> 00:10:37.080 tech -enabled art form. He even led the Philharmonia 00:10:37.080 --> 00:10:39.500 Orchestra in a performance inside an Apple store 00:10:39.500 --> 00:10:41.320 in Berlin. Which must have been a logistical 00:10:41.320 --> 00:10:43.580 nightmare, by the way. Acoustics in a retail 00:10:43.580 --> 00:10:46.279 store, glass and metal everywhere. Terrible acoustics, 00:10:46.399 --> 00:10:48.759 probably. But the message was what mattered. 00:10:49.000 --> 00:10:51.779 The message was, we are where the people are. 00:10:52.139 --> 00:10:54.320 He didn't stop at ads, though. He actually helped 00:10:54.320 --> 00:10:56.639 build tools. He worked on an iPad app called 00:10:56.639 --> 00:10:59.279 The Orchestra. Slate called it the perfect classical 00:10:59.279 --> 00:11:01.519 music app. It really was. It was developed with 00:11:01.519 --> 00:11:03.799 TouchPress, and it allowed you to watch the score 00:11:03.799 --> 00:11:07.320 scroll by in real time, isolate different sections 00:11:07.320 --> 00:11:09.700 of the orchestra, watch different camera angles 00:11:09.700 --> 00:11:12.799 of the musicians. It completely demystified the 00:11:12.799 --> 00:11:15.399 process. It took the secret code of classical 00:11:15.399 --> 00:11:18.440 music and gave the user the decoder ring. And 00:11:18.440 --> 00:11:21.440 then there was the Rewrite project. Rewrite was 00:11:21.440 --> 00:11:25.139 an award -winning installation. Giant video projections, 00:11:25.679 --> 00:11:28.440 a massive sound system. You could literally walk 00:11:28.440 --> 00:11:30.720 through the orchestra. You could stand next to 00:11:30.720 --> 00:11:33.320 the violins, hear what they hear, then walk over 00:11:33.320 --> 00:11:36.240 to the percussion. It broke the fourth wall between 00:11:36.240 --> 00:11:38.559 the audience and the stage. It seems like his 00:11:38.559 --> 00:11:41.000 mission has always been to lower the barrier 00:11:41.000 --> 00:11:44.220 to entry without ever lowering the quality of 00:11:44.220 --> 00:11:46.409 the art itself. That is the perfect way to put 00:11:46.409 --> 00:11:49.049 it. He refuses to compromise on the complexity 00:11:49.049 --> 00:11:52.230 of the music. As we said, he writes very difficult 00:11:52.230 --> 00:11:54.809 stuff, but he wants to give you every possible 00:11:54.809 --> 00:11:57.490 tool to understand it. He also served as an advisor 00:11:57.490 --> 00:12:00.450 for the Sync Project, which was a global collaboration 00:12:00.450 --> 00:12:03.169 researching how music affects brain health. So 00:12:03.169 --> 00:12:05.330 he's constantly bringing art, science, and tech. 00:12:05.870 --> 00:12:08.230 Well, speaking of difficult stuff, let's talk 00:12:08.230 --> 00:12:10.620 about his compositions again. Because while LA 00:12:10.620 --> 00:12:13.100 Variations is accessible and joyous, some of 00:12:13.100 --> 00:12:15.740 his other work is, well, quirky is the polite 00:12:15.740 --> 00:12:18.100 word. He has a wicked sense of humor. He is not 00:12:18.100 --> 00:12:20.519 afraid of the bizarre. Take the piece Wing on 00:12:20.519 --> 00:12:23.139 Wing from 2004. Ah, this is the one with the 00:12:23.139 --> 00:12:26.480 fish. It is. It features two sopranos singing 00:12:26.480 --> 00:12:29.200 these ethereal lines. It uses samples of the 00:12:29.200 --> 00:12:31.340 architect Frank Gehry's voice that are distorted 00:12:31.340 --> 00:12:34.200 and processed, and it uses the sound of the Plainfin 00:12:34.200 --> 00:12:37.299 midshipman fish. Okay, I have to know. What does 00:12:37.299 --> 00:12:39.759 a plainfin midshipman fish actually sound like? 00:12:40.220 --> 00:12:45.100 Is it a splash? It's actually a hum. It's a low 00:12:45.100 --> 00:12:48.059 drone. The fish vibrate their swim bladders to 00:12:48.059 --> 00:12:51.059 attract mates. Salonan took that organic underwater 00:12:51.059 --> 00:12:53.820 drone and made it a foundational texture in a 00:12:53.820 --> 00:12:56.259 symphony. That is wild. It's taking nature sounds 00:12:56.259 --> 00:12:59.120 to a weirdly specific level. Like, I need a C 00:12:59.120 --> 00:13:00.620 sharp. Somebody get me the fish. And then you 00:13:00.620 --> 00:13:03.049 have floof. I just like saying it. It sounds 00:13:03.049 --> 00:13:05.169 like a brand of marshmallow fluff. It does, but 00:13:05.169 --> 00:13:08.450 it's actually a piece from 1982 based on texts 00:13:08.450 --> 00:13:11.429 by Stanisa Lem, the famous sci -fi author who 00:13:11.429 --> 00:13:14.429 wrote Solaris. Lem wrote about cybernetic poetry 00:13:14.429 --> 00:13:17.090 and machines trying to write verse. So, Salonen 00:13:17.090 --> 00:13:19.529 wrote this piece for soprano and ensemble that 00:13:19.529 --> 00:13:22.470 is jerky, mechanical, and incredibly acrobatic. 00:13:22.750 --> 00:13:24.730 It's meant to sound exactly like a machine learning 00:13:24.730 --> 00:13:26.690 how to emote. It really aligns with this quote 00:13:26.690 --> 00:13:29.750 about music being bodily. Right. He says musical 00:13:29.750 --> 00:13:33.029 expression is bodily expression. He hates abstract, 00:13:33.309 --> 00:13:36.350 dry, cerebral music. Whether it's a fish humming 00:13:36.350 --> 00:13:38.649 or a soprano pretending to be a malfunctioning 00:13:38.649 --> 00:13:41.190 robot, he wants you to feel it in your gut. He 00:13:41.190 --> 00:13:43.409 even wrote a piece called Concertitude for Solar 00:13:43.409 --> 00:13:45.629 Horn, which is designed as a competition piece. 00:13:46.129 --> 00:13:48.370 It's purely about testing the extreme physical 00:13:48.370 --> 00:13:51.269 capability of the player. So we have the innovator, 00:13:51.289 --> 00:13:53.769 the composer, the tech guy. But we need to bring 00:13:53.769 --> 00:13:55.590 this up to the present day because we are in 00:13:55.590 --> 00:13:59.169 2026 and the last few years, specifically the 00:13:59.169 --> 00:14:01.889 San Francisco saga, have been incredibly dramatic. 00:14:02.269 --> 00:14:05.309 Saga is definitely the right word. In 2020, Solonin 00:14:05.309 --> 00:14:07.610 took over as music director of the San Francisco 00:14:07.610 --> 00:14:10.330 Symphony. On paper, it was the perfect marriage. 00:14:10.549 --> 00:14:13.710 The most tech savvy conductor in the world lands 00:14:13.710 --> 00:14:15.809 in the tech capital of the world. But the honeymoon 00:14:15.809 --> 00:14:18.769 didn't last. He left in 2025 just five years 00:14:18.769 --> 00:14:21.799 later. What went wrong? It fundamentally came 00:14:21.799 --> 00:14:24.960 down to money and vision. Post -pandemic, a lot 00:14:24.960 --> 00:14:27.480 of orchestras were tightening their belts. The 00:14:27.480 --> 00:14:29.399 Board of Governors in San Francisco wanted to 00:14:29.399 --> 00:14:32.399 cut costs, reduce the number of concerts, and 00:14:32.399 --> 00:14:35.159 generally play it safe. Salon wanted to push 00:14:35.159 --> 00:14:37.980 forward, do more experimental projects, and grow. 00:14:38.460 --> 00:14:40.679 And usually these disputes are kept strictly 00:14:40.679 --> 00:14:43.259 behind closed doors. You get a polite press release 00:14:43.259 --> 00:14:46.379 saying, he is leaving to pursue other opportunities 00:14:46.379 --> 00:14:48.620 and everyone smiles for the camera. Exactly. 00:14:48.919 --> 00:14:52.080 But Salonen went entirely off script. When he 00:14:52.080 --> 00:14:54.279 announced he was leaving, he issued a highly 00:14:54.279 --> 00:14:56.860 specific statement saying, quote, I do not share 00:14:56.860 --> 00:14:58.740 the same goals for the future of the institution 00:14:58.740 --> 00:15:01.700 as the Board of Governors does. Ouch. In the 00:15:01.700 --> 00:15:05.019 polite, refined world of classical music, that 00:15:05.019 --> 00:15:06.960 is effectively flipping the boardroom table. 00:15:07.000 --> 00:15:09.419 There's a bombshell. Yeah. And the audience, 00:15:09.759 --> 00:15:12.539 the patrons, actually sided with Salonen. They 00:15:12.539 --> 00:15:14.519 were furious that the board was letting a visionary 00:15:14.519 --> 00:15:17.259 walk away just to save a few dollars. It highlighted 00:15:17.259 --> 00:15:19.679 a massive tension in the arts right now. Do you 00:15:19.679 --> 00:15:22.440 cut costs to survive, or do you innovate to survive? 00:15:23.279 --> 00:15:25.620 Salon clearly believes in the latter. And to 00:15:25.620 --> 00:15:27.679 add insult to injury, right as he's walking out 00:15:27.679 --> 00:15:31.500 the door in 2025, he wins a Grammy. Yes. The 00:15:31.500 --> 00:15:33.940 San Francisco Symphony's recording of Kaija Saria 00:15:33.940 --> 00:15:37.840 Ho's opera, Adriana Mader, conducted by Salonan, 00:15:38.019 --> 00:15:40.600 won a Grammy Award. So he effectively dropped 00:15:40.600 --> 00:15:42.840 the mic on his way out. It's like saying, here's 00:15:42.840 --> 00:15:44.340 the award -winning excellence you're letting 00:15:44.340 --> 00:15:47.220 go of. Goodbye. That is some serious style. Yeah. 00:15:47.320 --> 00:15:50.480 So SF is in the past. Now, here we are in 2026, 00:15:50.600 --> 00:15:53.299 and he has pulled a very interesting maneuver. 00:15:53.539 --> 00:15:55.679 He's back in Los Angeles, but not as the boss. 00:15:55.779 --> 00:15:57.279 This is the most fascinating development for 00:15:57.279 --> 00:16:00.480 me. The LA Philharmonic created an entirely new 00:16:00.480 --> 00:16:02.620 position specifically for him. They named him 00:16:02.620 --> 00:16:04.720 the creative director. How is it different from 00:16:04.720 --> 00:16:07.240 his old job as music director? The music director 00:16:07.240 --> 00:16:10.039 is essentially the CEO of the art. You hire the 00:16:10.039 --> 00:16:12.379 musicians, you fire them, you deal with all the 00:16:12.379 --> 00:16:14.740 union negotiations, you plan the entire 52 -week 00:16:14.740 --> 00:16:18.320 season. It is a grind. It's heavy administrative 00:16:18.320 --> 00:16:20.500 lifting. The creative director role, starting 00:16:20.500 --> 00:16:23.559 in 2026, is pure dessert. He conducts about six 00:16:23.559 --> 00:16:26.159 weeks of concerts per year, he curates special 00:16:26.159 --> 00:16:28.759 festivals, and he provides big picture ideas. 00:16:29.200 --> 00:16:32.460 No administration, no endless fundraising dinners. 00:16:32.799 --> 00:16:35.159 He isn't involved in general programming or hiring. 00:16:35.259 --> 00:16:37.440 That sounds like the absolute dream. He gets 00:16:37.440 --> 00:16:39.919 the artistic freedom and the prestige without 00:16:39.919 --> 00:16:41.919 the boardroom headaches that drove him crazy 00:16:41.919 --> 00:16:44.720 in San Francisco. Exactly. He learned his lesson. 00:16:44.779 --> 00:16:47.080 He structured his life to protect his creativity, 00:16:47.100 --> 00:16:49.399 and he's combining this with a major role in 00:16:49.399 --> 00:16:51.519 Europe. He's the principal conductor designate 00:16:51.519 --> 00:16:54.039 for the Orchestra de Paris, which ramps up fully 00:16:54.039 --> 00:16:57.309 in the 2027 -2028 season. So he's splitting his 00:16:57.309 --> 00:17:00.509 time between sunny LA and Paris. Not a bad set 00:17:00.509 --> 00:17:03.330 up for this stage of his career. It's pure optimization. 00:17:03.710 --> 00:17:06.349 He has removed the friction from his professional 00:17:06.349 --> 00:17:10.180 life so he can focus entirely on the music. It's 00:17:10.180 --> 00:17:13.079 a brilliantly strategic move. He knows exactly 00:17:13.079 --> 00:17:15.140 what he's good at, and he knows what he hates. 00:17:15.539 --> 00:17:18.299 He's simply cut out the part he hates. It really 00:17:18.299 --> 00:17:20.299 brings us back to that hybrid idea we started 00:17:20.299 --> 00:17:23.480 with. He's constantly reinventing the role of 00:17:23.480 --> 00:17:26.660 the conductor to suit his own needs. He is. He's 00:17:26.660 --> 00:17:29.440 someone who flatly refuses to be trapped by a 00:17:29.440 --> 00:17:32.700 job title. When the European modernist box got 00:17:32.700 --> 00:17:35.809 too small, he moved to LA. When the traditional 00:17:35.809 --> 00:17:38.410 conductor box got too small, he built apps and 00:17:38.410 --> 00:17:41.190 immersive installations. When the music director 00:17:41.190 --> 00:17:43.910 box got too administrative, he just invented 00:17:43.910 --> 00:17:46.309 a new creative director role. And he did it all 00:17:46.309 --> 00:17:48.880 while avoiding Strudinski's carpet. That image 00:17:48.880 --> 00:17:50.759 really sticks, doesn't it? It does. It's the 00:17:50.759 --> 00:17:52.660 perfect metaphor for his entire career. It's 00:17:52.660 --> 00:17:55.259 about recognizing greatness without being suffocated 00:17:55.259 --> 00:17:57.119 by it. He didn't try to fill the indentations. 00:17:57.119 --> 00:17:58.720 He just bought a different house. So if we're 00:17:58.720 --> 00:18:00.640 pulling the final thread together for you listening 00:18:00.640 --> 00:18:03.420 at home, what's the big takeaway here? Aside 00:18:03.420 --> 00:18:05.180 from, you know, listen to more orchestral music, 00:18:05.200 --> 00:18:07.500 which you absolutely should do. I think the real 00:18:07.500 --> 00:18:09.660 takeaway is about having the courage to pivot. 00:18:10.380 --> 00:18:13.319 Solomon was highly successful as a rigid modernist, 00:18:13.559 --> 00:18:16.079 but he changed because it didn't feel authentic 00:18:16.079 --> 00:18:18.910 anymore. He was successful as a traditional music 00:18:18.910 --> 00:18:21.990 director, but he quit to find a better, healthier 00:18:21.990 --> 00:18:24.950 model. He never let the way things are done dictate 00:18:24.950 --> 00:18:27.410 the way he does things. And sometimes, that means 00:18:27.410 --> 00:18:29.650 looking at the heavyweights in your own industry, 00:18:29.970 --> 00:18:32.329 the Stravinsky's of your world, and saying, I 00:18:32.329 --> 00:18:34.369 respect you, but I'm not going to sit in your 00:18:34.369 --> 00:18:37.230 chair. Exactly. Find your own chair or stand 00:18:37.230 --> 00:18:40.019 up. Or record a humming fish. or a quarter fish. 00:18:40.299 --> 00:18:42.299 That works, too. Think about that Stravinsky 00:18:42.299 --> 00:18:45.259 carpet moment in your own life. How often do 00:18:45.259 --> 00:18:48.140 you let the ghosts of the past or the absolute 00:18:48.140 --> 00:18:51.119 greats in your field intimidate you from doing 00:18:51.119 --> 00:18:54.720 your own unique work? Salonen found his ultimate 00:18:54.720 --> 00:18:57.779 voice by leaving that house behind, both literally 00:18:57.779 --> 00:18:59.960 and metaphorically. It's a powerful thought to 00:18:59.960 --> 00:19:02.680 leave on. That's it for this deep dive into the 00:19:02.680 --> 00:19:05.359 fascinating world of Issa Pekka Salonen. Hopefully, 00:19:05.380 --> 00:19:07.240 we've helped you see the man behind the baton 00:19:07.240 --> 00:19:09.319 a little more clearly. Thanks for listening. 00:19:09.660 --> 00:19:10.180 See you next time.