WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:04.639 Okay, so picture this. It is 1996, the mid -90s. 00:00:04.639 --> 00:00:07.200 Right. You walk into a record store. You know, 00:00:07.240 --> 00:00:08.599 you can probably remember the smell of those 00:00:08.599 --> 00:00:10.740 places. Vinyl, dust, maybe a little incense. 00:00:11.140 --> 00:00:12.640 And you're flipping through the bins looking 00:00:12.640 --> 00:00:15.380 for something edgy, maybe some Britpop, or maybe 00:00:15.380 --> 00:00:17.120 the latest from the thin white Duke himself, 00:00:17.339 --> 00:00:19.519 David Bowie. Always a solid choice. Totally. 00:00:19.920 --> 00:00:22.440 But then, for whatever reason, you drift over 00:00:22.440 --> 00:00:24.859 to the classical section. And there, sitting 00:00:24.859 --> 00:00:27.260 right next to Mozart and Mahler, is a CD that 00:00:27.260 --> 00:00:29.980 just stops you cold. It says, Symphony No. 4, 00:00:30.140 --> 00:00:33.140 subtitled Heroes. Which creates this immediate, 00:00:33.140 --> 00:00:36.700 uh... moment of cognitive dissonance for the 00:00:36.700 --> 00:00:39.799 buyer. Because you expect the symphony to be 00:00:39.799 --> 00:00:42.560 about pastoral landscapes or fate knocking at 00:00:42.560 --> 00:00:45.000 the door, or maybe some abstract mathematical 00:00:45.000 --> 00:00:46.939 concept. You don't necessarily expect it to be 00:00:46.939 --> 00:00:49.840 about, well, a rock album recorded in Berlin 00:00:49.840 --> 00:00:53.600 in 1977. And the composer isn't some guy in a 00:00:53.600 --> 00:00:56.119 powdered wig from Vienna either. It's Philip 00:00:56.119 --> 00:00:59.380 Glass, the absolute king of minimalism, the guy 00:00:59.380 --> 00:01:01.640 who basically makes arpeggios sound like a religious 00:01:01.640 --> 00:01:03.520 experience. Yeah, that's a great way to put it. 00:01:03.520 --> 00:01:07.379 And he has written an entire massive orchestral 00:01:07.379 --> 00:01:10.079 symphony based on David Bowie's masterpiece. 00:01:11.040 --> 00:01:13.099 So today on the Deep Dive, we are unpacking this 00:01:13.099 --> 00:01:16.019 incredible collision of worlds. We're talking 00:01:16.019 --> 00:01:19.879 about Philip Glass's symphony number four, the 00:01:19.879 --> 00:01:23.260 hero's symphony. Though honestly, collision might 00:01:23.260 --> 00:01:25.280 actually be the wrong word for it. It feels a 00:01:25.280 --> 00:01:28.079 lot more like a fusion. or perhaps a translation, 00:01:28.640 --> 00:01:31.040 because what we're looking at here is a really 00:01:31.040 --> 00:01:33.099 fascinating experiment in cross -pollination. 00:01:33.599 --> 00:01:35.299 This isn't just a cover album. It's not, you 00:01:35.299 --> 00:01:37.040 know, Philip Glass plays the hits. Right. This 00:01:37.040 --> 00:01:39.959 isn't some elevator music version of Rebel designed 00:01:39.959 --> 00:01:42.140 to put you to sleep in a hotel lobby. Far from 00:01:42.140 --> 00:01:44.599 it. It's a full -on structural translation of 00:01:44.599 --> 00:01:47.719 a pop album into a massive six -movement orchestral 00:01:47.719 --> 00:01:49.680 work. So we're going to look at how Glass took 00:01:49.680 --> 00:01:52.780 a rock record and completely rewrote it for a 00:01:52.780 --> 00:01:54.659 room full of classically trained musicians. And 00:01:54.659 --> 00:01:56.650 we'll break down the specific instrument too, 00:01:56.930 --> 00:01:59.489 like why a tuba replaces an electric guitar. 00:02:00.049 --> 00:02:02.370 And we're going to solve a genuine mystery regarding 00:02:02.370 --> 00:02:05.790 a hidden track that Glass included, which, honestly, 00:02:06.049 --> 00:02:08.389 that one detail kind of changes how you view 00:02:08.389 --> 00:02:10.169 the entire project. It really does. It shows 00:02:10.169 --> 00:02:12.530 the depth of his research. Oh, I love a good 00:02:12.530 --> 00:02:14.830 hidden track mystery. But let's set the scene 00:02:14.830 --> 00:02:18.469 first. So it's 1996, Looking Glass Studios in 00:02:18.469 --> 00:02:20.669 New York City. That is where this magic happened. 00:02:21.189 --> 00:02:23.509 But I have to ask, was this totally out of the 00:02:23.509 --> 00:02:26.039 blue? Because glass and bowies seem like they 00:02:26.039 --> 00:02:28.819 occupy completely different universes. They do 00:02:28.819 --> 00:02:31.580 on the surface, sure, but they are both avant 00:02:31.580 --> 00:02:34.280 -garde in their own respective ways. And to really 00:02:34.280 --> 00:02:36.080 understand the weight of this, you have to realize 00:02:36.080 --> 00:02:39.740 this wasn't a one -off whim for glass. This wasn't 00:02:39.740 --> 00:02:42.280 him just throwing darts at a board of rock albums 00:02:42.280 --> 00:02:44.780 and eating Bowie by accident. Right. If you look 00:02:44.780 --> 00:02:47.000 at his body of work, specifically his symphonies, 00:02:47.479 --> 00:02:50.000 a very clear pattern emerges. Yeah, because I 00:02:50.000 --> 00:02:52.039 was actually looking at the list of his compositions 00:02:52.039 --> 00:02:53.979 to prep for this, and this is Symphony No. 4. 00:02:54.400 --> 00:02:56.099 But if you scroll back a bit, Symphony No. 1 00:02:56.099 --> 00:02:59.800 is subtitled Low. Exactly. Lowe, of course, being 00:02:59.800 --> 00:03:02.460 the album that immediately preceded Heroes in 00:03:02.460 --> 00:03:04.879 David Bowie's famous Berlin trilogy. Ah, okay. 00:03:05.120 --> 00:03:07.099 So Grass had already dipped his toes into this 00:03:07.099 --> 00:03:09.659 water. He'd already translated Lowe. So him coming 00:03:09.659 --> 00:03:13.159 back for Heroes suggests a deliberate long -term 00:03:13.159 --> 00:03:15.280 artistic dialogue between the two of them. So 00:03:15.280 --> 00:03:17.460 he was basically working his way through Bowie's 00:03:17.460 --> 00:03:19.699 diary almost. Did he ever finish the trilogy 00:03:19.699 --> 00:03:22.280 then? Because the third album is Lodger. He did 00:03:22.280 --> 00:03:24.819 actually, but it took a really long time. Much 00:03:24.819 --> 00:03:28.400 later on, Glass composed Symphony No. 12, which 00:03:28.400 --> 00:03:31.139 is based on Lodger. So effectively, Glass eventually 00:03:31.139 --> 00:03:33.680 completed the entire Berlin trilogy, just in 00:03:33.680 --> 00:03:35.819 symphonic form. That is incredible dedication. 00:03:36.120 --> 00:03:40.659 It is. But in 1996, Heroes... was the focus. 00:03:40.900 --> 00:03:42.780 And it was released on Point Music, which was 00:03:42.780 --> 00:03:44.800 a joint venture involving Phillips Classics. 00:03:44.960 --> 00:03:47.159 Yeah, I noticed the catalog number in the source 00:03:47.159 --> 00:03:51.240 notes. It was 4543882. You really did a deep 00:03:51.240 --> 00:03:53.479 dive on those liner notes. Hey, in the era of 00:03:53.479 --> 00:03:55.580 physical media, those numbers meant something. 00:03:55.840 --> 00:03:58.900 It makes it feel like a real artifact. It signals 00:03:58.900 --> 00:04:01.240 that this was a commercial product sitting on 00:04:01.240 --> 00:04:03.360 shelves meant to be bought and consumed right 00:04:03.360 --> 00:04:06.379 alongside the serious classical repertoire. Absolutely. 00:04:06.960 --> 00:04:09.530 But let's get into the actual architecture. of 00:04:09.530 --> 00:04:11.810 this thing. Because a rock album is usually a 00:04:11.810 --> 00:04:15.430 collection of songs. Verse, chorus, verse, maybe 00:04:15.430 --> 00:04:17.689 a bridge if you're lucky. A symphony is built 00:04:17.689 --> 00:04:20.589 on movements. So how did Glass reconcile that 00:04:20.589 --> 00:04:23.170 structure? That is where it gets really fascinating. 00:04:24.009 --> 00:04:25.930 Glass didn't just take the melodies and loop 00:04:25.930 --> 00:04:28.430 them aimlessly. He structured the symphony into 00:04:28.430 --> 00:04:31.829 six very specific movements. And if you are a 00:04:31.829 --> 00:04:34.290 Bowie fan, the titles of these movements are 00:04:34.290 --> 00:04:36.430 going to ring some very loud bells for you. Let's 00:04:36.430 --> 00:04:39.500 walk through them then. Movement one is, naturally, 00:04:39.699 --> 00:04:42.620 Heroes, the title track, the big anthem. Which 00:04:42.620 --> 00:04:44.620 is a huge challenge in itself, taking one of 00:04:44.620 --> 00:04:47.139 the most famous rock songs ever written and stripping 00:04:47.139 --> 00:04:49.079 away the lyrics entirely. Right, taking away 00:04:49.079 --> 00:04:50.720 a Bowie's voice. And then we skip down a bit. 00:04:51.040 --> 00:04:53.360 Movement three is Sense of Doubt. Movement four 00:04:53.360 --> 00:04:56.680 is Sons of the Silent Age. Movement five is Neukölln. 00:04:56.720 --> 00:04:59.750 And movement six is V2 Schneider. all iconic 00:04:59.750 --> 00:05:02.990 tracks from the original 1977 album. V2 Schneider 00:05:02.990 --> 00:05:04.490 is particularly interesting because the original 00:05:04.490 --> 00:05:06.129 is already quite repetitive and instrumental. 00:05:06.550 --> 00:05:08.430 It was honoring the band Kraftwerk, so it lends 00:05:08.430 --> 00:05:11.589 itself perfectly to Glass's signature minimalist 00:05:11.589 --> 00:05:14.149 style. Well, wait a second, I skipped one, Movement 00:05:14.149 --> 00:05:16.509 2. You did, and this is the key to the whole 00:05:16.509 --> 00:05:20.050 puzzle right here. Okay, so Movement 2 is titled 00:05:20.050 --> 00:05:23.449 Abdul Majid. Now, I consider myself a pretty 00:05:23.449 --> 00:05:26.670 decent Bowie fan. I have worn out my copy of 00:05:26.670 --> 00:05:29.990 Heroes. I know side A and side B by heart. I 00:05:29.990 --> 00:05:32.589 do not remember a song called Abdul Majid anywhere 00:05:32.589 --> 00:05:34.569 on that album. And you wouldn't have found it. 00:05:34.750 --> 00:05:37.970 Not on the original 1977 vinyl anyway. If you 00:05:37.970 --> 00:05:40.689 bought the record in the 70s or 80s, that song 00:05:40.689 --> 00:05:43.069 simply did not exist to you. OK, so let's unpack 00:05:43.069 --> 00:05:46.250 this. Did Glass just make up a song and attribute 00:05:46.250 --> 00:05:49.319 it to Bowie to mess with people? Or did he pull 00:05:49.319 --> 00:05:51.360 a track from a completely different era? Neither, 00:05:51.620 --> 00:05:53.439 actually. And this is where we see the difference 00:05:53.439 --> 00:05:55.939 between a fan and a true scholar, which is what 00:05:55.939 --> 00:05:58.079 Glass really is here. He wasn't just looking 00:05:58.079 --> 00:06:00.079 at the track list on the back of the LP jacket. 00:06:00.680 --> 00:06:02.519 Abdulmajid was a track recorded during the Hero 00:06:02.519 --> 00:06:06.160 Sessions in Berlin in 1977. Brian Eno and Bowie 00:06:06.160 --> 00:06:07.800 worked on it together, but it was left on the 00:06:07.800 --> 00:06:09.980 cutting room floor. It never made the final album. 00:06:10.060 --> 00:06:12.250 So it was just an outtake. Essentially, yeah. 00:06:12.490 --> 00:06:14.029 It wasn't released to the public at all until 00:06:14.029 --> 00:06:16.990 1991 on a reissue of the album by Rikadisc. Oh, 00:06:17.069 --> 00:06:20.050 the Rikadisc years. Those CD reissues were gold 00:06:20.050 --> 00:06:23.149 mines for bonus tracks and weird B -sides. They 00:06:23.149 --> 00:06:25.069 really were. Yeah. But think about what that 00:06:25.069 --> 00:06:27.649 means for Glass as a composer. He is putting 00:06:27.649 --> 00:06:31.250 together this symphony in 1996. He is not just 00:06:31.250 --> 00:06:33.889 engaging with the hits. He is engaging with the 00:06:33.889 --> 00:06:37.230 raw sessions. He found this obscure instrumental 00:06:37.230 --> 00:06:39.230 piece that most casual listeners didn't even 00:06:39.230 --> 00:06:42.129 know existed, and he elevated it to the second 00:06:42.129 --> 00:06:45.209 movement of a major symphony. Wow. And get this, 00:06:45.310 --> 00:06:47.269 it's almost nine minutes long in the symphony. 00:06:47.649 --> 00:06:49.870 It is longer than the movement for Heroes itself. 00:06:49.990 --> 00:06:52.089 That is wild. It's almost like he's telling the 00:06:52.089 --> 00:06:54.029 listener to understand this album. You have to 00:06:54.029 --> 00:06:56.170 understand what was left off of it too. Precisely. 00:06:56.240 --> 00:06:58.259 It turns the symphony into something way more 00:06:58.259 --> 00:07:00.720 than just a tribute. It becomes a piece of active 00:07:00.720 --> 00:07:03.279 musicology. He's excavating the source material. 00:07:03.819 --> 00:07:05.819 And musically, it is brilliant because Abdul 00:07:05.819 --> 00:07:08.600 -Majid has these complex, shifting rhythms that 00:07:08.600 --> 00:07:11.439 sound very Middle Eastern, which fits perfectly 00:07:11.439 --> 00:07:13.920 with Glass's own long -standing interest in global 00:07:13.920 --> 00:07:17.040 music structures. That makes total sense. So 00:07:17.040 --> 00:07:19.319 we've got these six movements. We've got obscure, 00:07:19.319 --> 00:07:21.759 hidden tracks. Now I want to pivot to the sound 00:07:21.759 --> 00:07:24.639 itself because when I hear phrases like rock 00:07:24.639 --> 00:07:27.860 symphony or orchestral rock. I usually imagine 00:07:27.860 --> 00:07:31.649 a rock band on stage You know, a drummer, bassist, 00:07:31.850 --> 00:07:34.589 electric guitar, backed up by a huge string section, 00:07:34.949 --> 00:07:37.550 playing long, sweeping notes to make it sound 00:07:37.550 --> 00:07:39.990 epic. Right. The sweet child of mine with strings 00:07:39.990 --> 00:07:42.329 approach. Exactly. Is that what is happening 00:07:42.329 --> 00:07:44.550 here? Absolutely not. And this is probably the 00:07:44.550 --> 00:07:46.350 most critical takeaway for the listener today. 00:07:46.850 --> 00:07:48.629 There is no rock band on this recording. There 00:07:48.629 --> 00:07:50.629 is no drum kit. There is no electric guitar. 00:07:51.029 --> 00:07:54.029 This is a purely acoustic, traditional, orchestral 00:07:54.029 --> 00:07:57.170 score. So how on earth do you replicate the sheer 00:07:57.170 --> 00:08:01.209 power of a song like Heroes or V2 Schneider without 00:08:01.209 --> 00:08:03.129 electricity? I mean, those songs are driven by 00:08:03.129 --> 00:08:06.009 volume and distortion and feedback. You use mass. 00:08:06.430 --> 00:08:08.589 You replace the electronic amplification with 00:08:08.589 --> 00:08:10.829 sheer acoustic weight. Let's look at the instrumentation 00:08:10.829 --> 00:08:12.990 list because it paints a very specific, very 00:08:12.990 --> 00:08:15.410 heavy sonic picture. Lay it on me. I want the 00:08:15.410 --> 00:08:17.550 specs. OK, let's start with the brass section 00:08:17.550 --> 00:08:19.810 because that is where the electric guitar essentially 00:08:19.810 --> 00:08:22.370 lives in this symphony. You have three horns, 00:08:22.850 --> 00:08:26.569 three trumpets, two trombones plus a bass trombone 00:08:26.569 --> 00:08:29.870 and a tuba. A tuba! You really do not get a lot 00:08:29.870 --> 00:08:32.830 of tubas in glam rock. Not usually, no. But think 00:08:32.830 --> 00:08:36.129 about its function. In a rock band, bass guitar 00:08:36.129 --> 00:08:37.909 and the rhythm guitar are working together to 00:08:37.909 --> 00:08:41.350 create a thick, low -end wall of sound. In an 00:08:41.350 --> 00:08:44.179 orchestra, A bass trombone and a tuba doing those 00:08:44.179 --> 00:08:47.519 rapid rhythmic pulses can create that exact same 00:08:47.519 --> 00:08:49.460 physical pressure in the room. It hits you right 00:08:49.460 --> 00:08:51.480 in the chest, just like a marshal stack would, 00:08:51.840 --> 00:08:54.379 but it's entirely organic. That is so cool. It's 00:08:54.379 --> 00:08:56.379 about replacing the electronic fuzz with a dense 00:08:56.379 --> 00:08:58.720 brass texture. It's heavy, but in a totally different 00:08:58.720 --> 00:09:01.299 way. Exactly. And then look at the woodwinds. 00:09:01.519 --> 00:09:03.639 It is not just a couple of delicate flutes floating 00:09:03.639 --> 00:09:05.460 on top of the melody. You have two flutes plus 00:09:05.460 --> 00:09:09.360 a piccolo, two oboes, two clarinets plus a bass 00:09:09.360 --> 00:09:12.389 clarinet, two bassoons. That is a lot of wood 00:09:12.389 --> 00:09:14.429 especially that bass clarinet and the bassoons 00:09:14.429 --> 00:09:17.750 that suggests some really serious low -end texture 00:09:17.750 --> 00:09:20.110 to ground the whole thing. It does ground the 00:09:20.110 --> 00:09:22.190 sound. It keeps it from sounding too flighty 00:09:22.190 --> 00:09:24.850 or too conventionally pretty. Bowie's Berlin 00:09:24.850 --> 00:09:27.669 era was gritty. It was industrial. It was a big 00:09:27.669 --> 00:09:31.470 gray. That low reedy sound captures that industrial 00:09:31.470 --> 00:09:34.470 atmosphere perfectly without needing a distortion 00:09:34.470 --> 00:09:37.120 pedal. But here's the real challenge, I think. 00:09:37.259 --> 00:09:39.639 The Berlin albums are famously defined by Brian 00:09:39.639 --> 00:09:43.820 Eno's synthesizers. That icy, shimmering, ambient 00:09:43.820 --> 00:09:46.299 texture that just coats everything. You cannot 00:09:46.299 --> 00:09:48.679 get that from a trombone or a bassoon. Yeah, 00:09:48.679 --> 00:09:51.500 you certainly can. So Glass uses a very specific 00:09:51.500 --> 00:09:53.840 combination in the percussion and rhythm section 00:09:53.840 --> 00:09:56.600 to achieve that. He uses a harp, a piano, and 00:09:56.600 --> 00:09:58.960 a celesta. A celesta. Like the Harry Potter -themed 00:09:58.960 --> 00:10:00.799 instrument. The dance of the sugar plum fairy. 00:10:00.940 --> 00:10:03.200 It's basically a little bell piano. That's exactly 00:10:03.200 --> 00:10:06.610 what it is. It has that... highly ethereal quality 00:10:06.610 --> 00:10:08.509 to him. That just seems like such a weird choice 00:10:08.509 --> 00:10:11.590 for a gritty Berlin -era Bowie album. But is 00:10:11.590 --> 00:10:14.590 it, really? Think about the ambient side of the 00:10:14.590 --> 00:10:17.460 Heroes album. Tracks like Sense of Doubt or No 00:10:17.460 --> 00:10:21.039 Comb. They are deeply atmospheric, moody, almost 00:10:21.039 --> 00:10:24.279 fragile. A synthesizer produces a tone that is 00:10:24.279 --> 00:10:27.279 pure and sustain -heavy. A celesta produces a 00:10:27.279 --> 00:10:30.559 tone that is bell -like, piercing and cold. When 00:10:30.559 --> 00:10:32.700 you layer a celesta over a harp and a piano, 00:10:33.059 --> 00:10:35.840 you get this shimmering translucent texture that 00:10:35.840 --> 00:10:38.200 mimics the ambient side of Bowie's work beautifully. 00:10:38.379 --> 00:10:41.500 Oh, that is a fantastic connection. So the harp 00:10:41.500 --> 00:10:43.820 and celesta are essentially doing the job of 00:10:43.820 --> 00:10:46.120 eno synths, and the brass is doing the job of 00:10:46.120 --> 00:10:49.299 the electric guitars. And the strings, the violins, 00:10:49.440 --> 00:10:51.940 violas, cellos, basses, they act as the glue 00:10:51.940 --> 00:10:54.240 holding it all together. It creates a texture 00:10:54.240 --> 00:10:56.620 that is dense, organic, and purely acoustic. 00:10:57.179 --> 00:10:59.039 He's finding the emotional equivalent of the 00:10:59.039 --> 00:11:01.080 instrument, not just the sonic equivalent. It 00:11:01.080 --> 00:11:02.919 is really amazing to think about. You take away 00:11:02.919 --> 00:11:05.279 the electricity entirely, but you keep all of 00:11:05.279 --> 00:11:08.549 the power. And it requires a massive highly skilled 00:11:08.549 --> 00:11:10.429 team to pull that off. You can't just record 00:11:10.429 --> 00:11:12.809 this in someone's garage over a weekend. The 00:11:12.809 --> 00:11:14.710 credits for this album are essentially a who's 00:11:14.710 --> 00:11:17.090 who of the contemporary classical world. Yeah, 00:11:17.129 --> 00:11:20.090 I saw the personnel list. The orchestra performing 00:11:20.090 --> 00:11:22.549 it is the American Composers Orchestra. Right, 00:11:22.649 --> 00:11:24.750 a highly prestigious group known for tackling 00:11:24.750 --> 00:11:28.110 new notoriously difficult American work. They 00:11:28.110 --> 00:11:30.029 aren't afraid of the avant -garde at all. And 00:11:30.029 --> 00:11:32.750 the conductor is Dennis Russell Davies. Davies 00:11:32.750 --> 00:11:35.620 is a massive figure here. He's a longtime champion 00:11:35.620 --> 00:11:39.100 of Glass's work. He deeply understands minimalism. 00:11:39.440 --> 00:11:41.940 See, minimalism is physically and mentally exhausting 00:11:41.940 --> 00:11:44.779 for musicians to play. You are playing these 00:11:44.779 --> 00:11:47.360 rapid arpeggios, those broken chords over and 00:11:47.360 --> 00:11:50.320 over again for minutes at a stretch. If you drag 00:11:50.320 --> 00:11:52.279 the tempo, the whole thing collapses. If you 00:11:52.279 --> 00:11:54.799 rush it, it falls apart. It requires this machine 00:11:54.799 --> 00:11:57.559 -like precision. And Davies knows exactly how 00:11:57.559 --> 00:11:59.539 to keep that pulse moving forward so it feels 00:11:59.539 --> 00:12:02.639 hypnotic rather than just boring. Exactly. He 00:12:02.639 --> 00:12:04.720 is the engine. And we definitely can't forget 00:12:04.720 --> 00:12:06.879 Michael Riesman. He is listed as the director 00:12:06.879 --> 00:12:08.960 and one of the producers right alongside Kurt 00:12:08.960 --> 00:12:11.740 Mocacchi. Riesman is essentially Glass's right 00:12:11.740 --> 00:12:13.899 -hand man when it comes to the Philip Glass ensemble 00:12:13.899 --> 00:12:17.389 and his studio recordings. Having Riesman and 00:12:17.389 --> 00:12:20.830 Munkasi producing means this is the definitive 00:12:20.830 --> 00:12:23.830 authentic glass sound. This isn't some loose 00:12:23.830 --> 00:12:26.269 interpretation by a stranger. It's coming straight 00:12:26.269 --> 00:12:28.870 from the inner circle. It's the A -team of contemporary 00:12:28.870 --> 00:12:31.610 classical. It really is. And that signals something 00:12:31.610 --> 00:12:34.470 very important to the listener. It says, take 00:12:34.470 --> 00:12:37.100 this seriously. This isn't a novelty record you 00:12:37.100 --> 00:12:39.220 buy for your dad for Christmas just because he 00:12:39.220 --> 00:12:41.860 happens to like Bowie. This is a serious major 00:12:41.860 --> 00:12:44.519 artistic statement. Speaking of taking it seriously, 00:12:44.620 --> 00:12:46.379 let's talk about how the world actually reacted 00:12:46.379 --> 00:12:48.519 to it. Because you draw the classical symphony 00:12:48.519 --> 00:12:51.720 based on David Bowie in 1996, people are definitely 00:12:51.720 --> 00:12:53.860 going to have opinions. Britpop was happening. 00:12:54.059 --> 00:12:56.820 Grunge was fading out. Where did this even fit 00:12:56.820 --> 00:12:59.539 in the cultural landscape? It was mixed. to be 00:12:59.539 --> 00:13:01.720 honest, but mixed in a very interesting way. 00:13:02.080 --> 00:13:04.860 The source material actually highlights a specific 00:13:04.860 --> 00:13:07.399 review from Entertainment Weekly. Yes, I saw 00:13:07.399 --> 00:13:10.120 that. They gave it a B. A solid B. Now, I don't 00:13:10.120 --> 00:13:13.240 know about you, but a B feels, I don't know, 00:13:13.360 --> 00:13:16.460 it feels a bit like good effort, see me after 00:13:16.460 --> 00:13:19.259 class. It's respectable, but it's not exactly 00:13:19.259 --> 00:13:21.700 setting the world on fire. I think we really 00:13:21.700 --> 00:13:24.480 need to contextualize that B, though. I actually 00:13:24.480 --> 00:13:27.139 view it as a massive victory for Glass. Okay, 00:13:27.220 --> 00:13:29.659 defend the B. I'm listening. You have to remember 00:13:29.659 --> 00:13:32.279 where this is being reviewed. Entertainment Weekly. 00:13:32.940 --> 00:13:35.759 This is a mainstream pop culture magazine. They 00:13:35.759 --> 00:13:38.899 are reviewing blockbuster movies, network sitcoms, 00:13:39.059 --> 00:13:41.620 Spice Girls albums. They do not usually review 00:13:41.620 --> 00:13:45.059 Symphony No. 4 by anyone. The mere fact that 00:13:45.059 --> 00:13:46.820 a contemporary classical symphony is getting 00:13:46.820 --> 00:13:49.259 reviewed in Entertainment Weekly at all is the 00:13:49.259 --> 00:13:51.649 victory. That is a really fair point. Most symphonies 00:13:51.649 --> 00:13:53.970 don't get a letter grade printed right next to 00:13:53.970 --> 00:13:56.169 the latest Tom Cruise movie review. Exactly. 00:13:56.470 --> 00:13:59.009 And a B implies that it's accessible, it's enjoyable, 00:13:59.009 --> 00:14:02.190 it works. It says to the reader, you, the casual 00:14:02.190 --> 00:14:04.750 music fan, might actually like this. It might 00:14:04.750 --> 00:14:07.070 not be the impenetrable revolutionary masterpiece 00:14:07.070 --> 00:14:09.690 that Einstein on the Beach was, but it succeeds 00:14:09.690 --> 00:14:12.409 in what it sets out to do. It successfully bridged 00:14:12.409 --> 00:14:14.649 the gap between the rigid academy and the mainstream 00:14:14.649 --> 00:14:17.169 pop audience. And let's look at the bigger picture 00:14:17.169 --> 00:14:20.200 of Glass's career for a second. The sheer list 00:14:20.200 --> 00:14:22.419 of his works is exhausting just to scroll through. 00:14:22.539 --> 00:14:24.799 I mean, we're talking huge operas like Satagra 00:14:24.799 --> 00:14:28.539 and Ockenton, massive film scores like The Truman 00:14:28.539 --> 00:14:31.059 Show or The Hours. Dracula, Koyana, Squatsy, 00:14:31.100 --> 00:14:34.559 the list goes on and on. Ray, he is incredibly 00:14:34.559 --> 00:14:37.179 prolific. And Bowie obviously has a discography 00:14:37.179 --> 00:14:40.860 that spans decades in genres. So where does this 00:14:40.860 --> 00:14:43.559 particular symphony sit in that massive combined 00:14:43.559 --> 00:14:46.659 library? Is it just a footnote? I see it as a 00:14:46.659 --> 00:14:49.019 vital bridge. On one side, you have the world 00:14:49.019 --> 00:14:52.019 of the Academy, the serious tuxedo -clad concert 00:14:52.019 --> 00:14:54.399 hall represented by Glass. On the other side, 00:14:54.519 --> 00:14:56.659 you have the Art Rock avant -garde represented 00:14:56.659 --> 00:14:59.419 by Bowie. This symphony, along with the Low and 00:14:59.419 --> 00:15:01.779 Lodger symphonies, proves that those two seemingly 00:15:01.779 --> 00:15:03.779 opposite worlds aren't actually that far apart. 00:15:03.929 --> 00:15:06.490 It's deeply validating in a way. It says that 00:15:06.490 --> 00:15:08.870 the music Bowie wrote in a studio in the 70s 00:15:08.870 --> 00:15:11.549 has the exact same structural integrity as the 00:15:11.549 --> 00:15:13.990 music written for grand concert halls. Conversely, 00:15:14.049 --> 00:15:16.070 it says that classical music can be relevant, 00:15:16.330 --> 00:15:18.570 pulsing, and directly connected to modern pop 00:15:18.570 --> 00:15:20.889 culture. It doesn't have to be a dusty museum 00:15:20.889 --> 00:15:23.700 piece. I just love that idea that you can take 00:15:23.700 --> 00:15:26.919 a track like V2 Schneider, a track named after 00:15:26.919 --> 00:15:29.539 a member of Kraftwerk, largely instrumental, 00:15:29.740 --> 00:15:32.639 kind of funky, and treat it with the exact same 00:15:32.639 --> 00:15:35.200 reverence and weight as a Mahler symphony. And 00:15:35.200 --> 00:15:37.799 by doing so, you actually hear things in the 00:15:37.799 --> 00:15:40.580 music you never heard before. When you hear that 00:15:40.580 --> 00:15:43.370 familiar melody. played by a flute instead of 00:15:43.370 --> 00:15:46.490 a synthesizer, or a rhythm played by a celesta 00:15:46.490 --> 00:15:49.070 instead of a drum machine, your brain processes 00:15:49.070 --> 00:15:52.070 it entirely differently. You start to appreciate 00:15:52.070 --> 00:15:55.009 the raw composition, not just the cool studio 00:15:55.009 --> 00:15:57.610 production. It strips away the cool factor of 00:15:57.610 --> 00:15:59.929 the rock production and leaves the raw, naked 00:15:59.929 --> 00:16:03.110 musical ideas exposed. Exactly. And in the case 00:16:03.110 --> 00:16:06.600 of the Hero Symphony, Those raw ideas absolutely 00:16:06.600 --> 00:16:08.539 hold up to the scrutiny. It really makes me want 00:16:08.539 --> 00:16:10.539 to go back and listen to both the original album 00:16:10.539 --> 00:16:12.639 and the symphony back -to -back, especially that 00:16:12.639 --> 00:16:14.919 Idul Majid track. I feel like I missed a whole 00:16:14.919 --> 00:16:17.179 chapter of the story by not knowing that existed. 00:16:17.379 --> 00:16:19.360 That's the beauty of these deep dives, isn't 00:16:19.360 --> 00:16:21.519 it? Yeah. There's always another layer to uncover. 00:16:21.779 --> 00:16:23.860 So what does this all mean for you, the listener? 00:16:24.080 --> 00:16:26.679 Why should you care about a 1996 symphony today? 00:16:26.799 --> 00:16:28.840 I think it's a powerful reminder to look for 00:16:28.840 --> 00:16:32.080 connections in unlikely places. We all tend to 00:16:32.080 --> 00:16:34.669 heavily categorize our interests. I like rock. 00:16:35.049 --> 00:16:38.070 I like classical. I like jazz. Projects like 00:16:38.070 --> 00:16:40.769 this remind us that true creativity doesn't care 00:16:40.769 --> 00:16:43.389 about those boxes at all. Well, Glass didn't 00:16:43.389 --> 00:16:45.590 care that Bowie was labeled a pop star. He just 00:16:45.590 --> 00:16:48.029 heard a fellow composer. And he heard a symphony 00:16:48.029 --> 00:16:51.110 hiding inside a rock album. He did. And he brought 00:16:51.110 --> 00:16:54.250 a massive Team Davies Reisman, a full orchestra, 00:16:54.669 --> 00:16:56.529 to help him dig it out and show it to the world. 00:16:56.710 --> 00:16:58.289 Well, I am certainly never going to look at a 00:16:58.289 --> 00:17:00.929 tuba the same way again. It is officially... 00:17:00.909 --> 00:17:03.909 the unsung hero of the Hero's Symphony. Absolutely. 00:17:04.329 --> 00:17:06.509 It is carrying the heavy weight of the Rock Gods. 00:17:07.029 --> 00:17:08.930 Before we wrap up, I want to leave you with a 00:17:08.930 --> 00:17:11.670 thought to mull over. We've talked a lot today 00:17:11.670 --> 00:17:14.549 about translation and covers, but at what point 00:17:14.549 --> 00:17:17.789 does a cover become an entirely new original 00:17:17.789 --> 00:17:20.779 work? That is the ultimate question here. It's 00:17:20.779 --> 00:17:23.099 basically the Ship of Theseus paradox, right? 00:17:23.299 --> 00:17:25.619 If you replace every single plank in a wooden 00:17:25.619 --> 00:17:28.380 ship, is it still the same ship? If you change 00:17:28.380 --> 00:17:30.740 the instruments, change the core structure, strip 00:17:30.740 --> 00:17:33.079 away the lyrics, and even add a hidden track 00:17:33.079 --> 00:17:35.700 that wasn't on the original release, is it still 00:17:35.700 --> 00:17:39.200 David Bowie's Heroes? Or is it now 100 % Philip 00:17:39.200 --> 00:17:42.140 Glass's Symphony No. 4? Does the source material 00:17:42.140 --> 00:17:43.920 eventually dissolve if you change it enough? 00:17:44.059 --> 00:17:47.400 It is a very fuzzy line. Glass's musical DNA 00:17:47.400 --> 00:17:51.529 is so incredibly strong, those relentless arpeggios, 00:17:51.890 --> 00:17:54.930 that driving pulse, that it tends to completely 00:17:54.930 --> 00:17:56.849 consume whatever it touches. When you listen 00:17:56.849 --> 00:18:00.750 to it, you really hear glass first and Bowie 00:18:00.750 --> 00:18:04.029 second. Which I think is the true mark of a successful 00:18:04.029 --> 00:18:06.849 transformation. It's not just a fancy karaoke 00:18:06.849 --> 00:18:09.269 version. No. It's a completely new entity. So 00:18:09.269 --> 00:18:10.789 for everyone listening, here is your assignment 00:18:10.789 --> 00:18:12.869 for the week. Go find Symphony No. 4. It's out 00:18:12.869 --> 00:18:14.349 there on streaming, but don't just put it on 00:18:14.349 --> 00:18:16.289 in the background while you do dishes. Try to 00:18:16.289 --> 00:18:18.309 listen to it side by side with the original Bowie 00:18:18.309 --> 00:18:20.829 album. Play Sense of Doubt by Bowie, then immediately 00:18:20.829 --> 00:18:23.609 play Movement Through by Glass. Really listen 00:18:23.609 --> 00:18:26.230 to how that icy synthesizer transforms into the 00:18:26.230 --> 00:18:28.150 celesta and the woodwinds. It's just something 00:18:28.150 --> 00:18:31.009 to chew on while you stream this. Or, better 00:18:31.009 --> 00:18:34.390 yet, go to a record store and try to find that 00:18:34.390 --> 00:18:38.910 CD with the catalog number 4543882. Good luck 00:18:38.910 --> 00:18:41.170 if you can find it in the wild. Thanks for taking 00:18:41.170 --> 00:18:43.269 this deep dive with us today. A pleasure as always. 00:18:43.490 --> 00:18:44.269 Catch you on the next one.