WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:03.520 Welcome to The Debate. Today, we are dissecting 00:00:03.520 --> 00:00:05.960 a concept that, well, it dominates our adult 00:00:05.960 --> 00:00:08.380 lives yet often escapes rigorous definition, 00:00:08.779 --> 00:00:11.740 career development. When we think about a career, 00:00:11.939 --> 00:00:14.359 I think most of us have a very specific, almost 00:00:14.359 --> 00:00:17.339 cinematic image in our heads. It's a ladder. 00:00:17.480 --> 00:00:20.019 You start at the bottom, you work hard, you get 00:00:20.019 --> 00:00:22.960 a promotion, a corner office, and eventually 00:00:22.960 --> 00:00:26.059 you retire with a gold watch. But when you actually 00:00:26.059 --> 00:00:28.670 strip away the Hollywood narrative, and you look 00:00:28.670 --> 00:00:30.890 at the mechanics of how work functions, that 00:00:30.890 --> 00:00:33.630 ladder starts to look a lot less stable. Well, 00:00:33.689 --> 00:00:36.369 I'd argue for many people, the ladder is actually 00:00:36.369 --> 00:00:39.369 missing rungs or it's leaning against the wrong 00:00:39.369 --> 00:00:42.210 wall entirely. I mean, we're stuck in this tension 00:00:42.210 --> 00:00:45.009 between two very different realities. On one 00:00:45.009 --> 00:00:47.149 side, you have the definition of career development 00:00:47.149 --> 00:00:50.390 as the evolution of occupational status, which 00:00:50.390 --> 00:00:53.390 is that external, visible climb you just described. 00:00:53.649 --> 00:00:56.329 But on the other side, there is a much messier, 00:00:56.329 --> 00:01:00.350 more human definition, a process to align personal 00:01:00.350 --> 00:01:02.909 needs for physical or psychological fulfillment. 00:01:03.189 --> 00:01:05.769 Right. And that sets up the battleground for 00:01:05.769 --> 00:01:08.700 today. Is the primary function of a career to 00:01:08.700 --> 00:01:11.120 achieve vertical progression and specialized 00:01:11.120 --> 00:01:13.840 mastery within a structure, what we might call 00:01:13.840 --> 00:01:17.180 the organizational or linear view? Or is it a 00:01:17.180 --> 00:01:19.719 fluid process of self -realization and value 00:01:19.719 --> 00:01:23.739 alignment, the individual or spiral view? Essentially, 00:01:23.819 --> 00:01:26.219 are we building a resume or are we building a 00:01:26.219 --> 00:01:28.400 life? I'm going to take the hard line stance 00:01:28.400 --> 00:01:31.980 here. We are building a functional society, and 00:01:31.980 --> 00:01:35.090 that requires structure. I'll be representing 00:01:35.090 --> 00:01:37.430 the position that career development is best 00:01:37.430 --> 00:01:40.250 understood through the lens of advancement, stability, 00:01:40.489 --> 00:01:43.549 and organizational strategy. The steady state 00:01:43.549 --> 00:01:46.450 and linear paths aren't just old fashioned. I 00:01:46.450 --> 00:01:49.030 think they are the necessary frameworks for expertise 00:01:49.030 --> 00:01:52.049 and for institutional success. And I'm going 00:01:52.049 --> 00:01:55.030 to push back on that. I believe career development 00:01:55.030 --> 00:01:57.549 is fundamentally about individual adaptation. 00:01:58.590 --> 00:02:01.790 Concepts like spiral paths, transitory roles, 00:02:02.359 --> 00:02:05.260 and the whole phenomenon of quiet ambition, these 00:02:05.260 --> 00:02:07.859 things better reflect the reality of the total 00:02:07.859 --> 00:02:10.979 encompassment of an individual's work life. The 00:02:10.979 --> 00:02:13.500 organization is just the backdrop. The person 00:02:13.500 --> 00:02:16.699 is the point. So let's get into the nuts and 00:02:16.699 --> 00:02:18.819 bolts of this, because the definitions here, 00:02:18.919 --> 00:02:21.699 they aren't just academic. They dictate how we 00:02:21.699 --> 00:02:25.639 spend 40 hours a week. The classic model, and 00:02:25.639 --> 00:02:27.960 the one I think holds the most water, is the 00:02:27.960 --> 00:02:31.819 steady state career. Ah. The one job for life 00:02:31.819 --> 00:02:35.039 model? Well, it's not just one job. I mean, it's 00:02:35.039 --> 00:02:37.740 one commitment. Think about the example of a 00:02:37.740 --> 00:02:39.919 medical professional. You go to medical school, 00:02:40.060 --> 00:02:42.740 you do your residency, and you work as a doctor 00:02:42.740 --> 00:02:46.039 until you retire. You are acquiring a specific 00:02:46.039 --> 00:02:49.819 skill set and becoming highly specialized. Now, 00:02:49.879 --> 00:02:52.560 imagine if that doctor decided to spiral into, 00:02:52.699 --> 00:02:55.360 I don't know, graphic design or fast food management 00:02:55.360 --> 00:02:58.180 in their 40s. We would lose that depth of expertise. 00:02:59.060 --> 00:03:01.800 Society relies on people picking a lane and staying 00:03:01.800 --> 00:03:04.979 in it to master these complex fields. I don't 00:03:04.979 --> 00:03:07.419 think anyone is arguing against heart surgeons 00:03:07.419 --> 00:03:10.439 knowing what they're doing. But you are cherry 00:03:10.439 --> 00:03:13.180 -picking the most rigid, high -stakes example 00:03:13.180 --> 00:03:16.219 to justify a model that just doesn't fit most 00:03:16.219 --> 00:03:20.219 people. Okay, okay, fair enough. Let's look at 00:03:20.219 --> 00:03:22.919 the broader end of the economy then, the linear 00:03:22.919 --> 00:03:25.319 career. This is what most corporate structures 00:03:25.319 --> 00:03:28.289 are built on. You move vertically. Each new role 00:03:28.289 --> 00:03:30.550 brings increased responsibility and decision 00:03:30.550 --> 00:03:32.969 -making authority. This isn't just about ego 00:03:32.969 --> 00:03:36.129 or a bigger paycheck. It's about strategic management. 00:03:37.009 --> 00:03:39.550 Organizations use things like training, job rotation, 00:03:39.789 --> 00:03:42.849 transfers, all to groom leaders. If everyone 00:03:42.849 --> 00:03:45.129 is just following their bliss, who learns how 00:03:45.129 --> 00:03:47.090 to run the department? Who learns to manage the 00:03:47.090 --> 00:03:49.650 budget? But see, you're framing following your 00:03:49.650 --> 00:03:52.389 bliss as if it's frivolous. I'm talking about 00:03:52.389 --> 00:03:54.430 spiral careers, which is a legitimate developmental 00:03:54.430 --> 00:03:58.340 model. In a spiral career, you aren't just climbing 00:03:58.340 --> 00:04:01.699 up, you're moving across. You hold a role, you 00:04:01.699 --> 00:04:04.240 develop a specific competency, and then you take 00:04:04.240 --> 00:04:07.159 that competency into a new context. You aren't 00:04:07.159 --> 00:04:09.460 learning to command and control, you're learning 00:04:09.460 --> 00:04:12.080 to adapt and to integrate. But does that serve 00:04:12.080 --> 00:04:15.139 the institution? It serves the work. Look at 00:04:15.139 --> 00:04:17.939 the concept of the transitory career. The example 00:04:17.939 --> 00:04:20.180 often cited is someone moving from being a fast 00:04:20.180 --> 00:04:23.199 food worker to a bookkeeping role. To you, that 00:04:23.199 --> 00:04:25.600 looks like a restart. It looks like they fell 00:04:25.600 --> 00:04:27.939 off the ladder. But from the adaptive perspective, 00:04:28.399 --> 00:04:31.259 that is a massive developmental leap. They are 00:04:31.259 --> 00:04:33.699 moving from a high -paced, physical service environment 00:04:33.699 --> 00:04:36.839 to a detail -oriented, analytical one. They are 00:04:36.839 --> 00:04:39.379 expanding their total encompassment of work experiences. 00:04:39.860 --> 00:04:42.839 Total encompassment sounds lovely, but let's 00:04:42.839 --> 00:04:45.240 be real about what that transition feels like. 00:04:45.360 --> 00:04:48.439 It feels like instability. If I'm that worker 00:04:48.439 --> 00:04:51.339 and I'm jumping from fry cook to junior bookkeeper, 00:04:51.540 --> 00:04:54.829 I have zero seniority. I have zero decision -making 00:04:54.829 --> 00:04:57.629 authority. I am, you know, perpetually at the 00:04:57.629 --> 00:05:00.490 bottom of someone else's pyramid. The linear 00:05:00.490 --> 00:05:03.389 model offers protection. It offers a trajectory 00:05:03.389 --> 00:05:05.970 where your past effort compounds into future 00:05:05.970 --> 00:05:08.589 authority. It offers protection if the organization 00:05:08.589 --> 00:05:11.709 decides to keep you. But that's the trap, isn't 00:05:11.709 --> 00:05:14.089 it? You're trading your agency for a promise 00:05:14.089 --> 00:05:17.569 of stability that might not exist. The transitory 00:05:17.569 --> 00:05:20.629 or spiral path is scary, yes, because it requires 00:05:20.629 --> 00:05:23.550 constant reinvention. But it aligns with the 00:05:23.550 --> 00:05:26.389 reality that life isn't linear. Sociodemographic 00:05:26.389 --> 00:05:29.550 factors, things like age, gender, race, they 00:05:29.550 --> 00:05:32.389 often force people to adapt, change, or abandon 00:05:32.389 --> 00:05:35.389 career paths. If your only definition of success 00:05:35.389 --> 00:05:38.430 is up, then anyone who has to step sideways to 00:05:38.430 --> 00:05:40.569 care for a sick parent or because of a layoff 00:05:40.569 --> 00:05:43.930 is by that definition a failure. That's a fair 00:05:43.930 --> 00:05:46.379 point about the rigidity of the definition. But 00:05:46.379 --> 00:05:48.139 I want to drill down on this idea of competence. 00:05:48.560 --> 00:05:51.399 You mentioned that spiral careers build skills. 00:05:51.740 --> 00:05:54.019 I would argue they build a collection of surface 00:05:54.019 --> 00:05:56.620 -level traits, whereas the linear path builds 00:05:56.620 --> 00:06:00.220 deep structural competence. How so? Well, look 00:06:00.220 --> 00:06:02.980 at what higher -level management positions actually 00:06:02.980 --> 00:06:06.589 entail. It's not just doing the work. It's resource 00:06:06.589 --> 00:06:09.629 allocation, planning, controlling, leading, and 00:06:09.629 --> 00:06:12.750 organizing. You cannot learn how to allocate 00:06:12.750 --> 00:06:15.589 resources for a thousand -person division by 00:06:15.589 --> 00:06:17.889 spiraling through individual contributor roles. 00:06:18.170 --> 00:06:21.569 You learn that by being given authority, screwing 00:06:21.569 --> 00:06:24.550 it up, and being given more authority. The linear 00:06:24.550 --> 00:06:27.649 career is a crucible for leadership. I'd argue 00:06:27.649 --> 00:06:30.310 it's a crucible for bureaucracy. You're becoming 00:06:30.310 --> 00:06:32.949 an expert in the internal politics of an organization. 00:06:33.920 --> 00:06:36.699 A spiral careerist, someone who has been a teacher, 00:06:36.839 --> 00:06:39.319 then a project manager, then a consultant, they 00:06:39.319 --> 00:06:41.259 understand how to solve problems from multiple 00:06:41.259 --> 00:06:43.819 angles. They have cross -pollinated their skills. 00:06:44.079 --> 00:06:46.959 They might not be experts in controlling, but 00:06:46.959 --> 00:06:49.259 they are experts in connecting. Connecting is 00:06:49.259 --> 00:06:52.819 valuable, sure. But organizations operate on 00:06:52.819 --> 00:06:56.040 retention. The material makes it very clear. 00:06:56.459 --> 00:06:59.579 Managers nurture work environments to influence 00:06:59.579 --> 00:07:03.240 employee retention. If the workforce is entirely 00:07:03.240 --> 00:07:05.980 made up of spiral careerists who are just going 00:07:05.980 --> 00:07:09.040 to leave in two years to pursue their next psychological 00:07:09.040 --> 00:07:12.060 fulfillment, how do you build a long -term strategy? 00:07:12.319 --> 00:07:15.399 You can't. You're assuming that retention is 00:07:15.399 --> 00:07:18.379 the employee's problem. It's not. It's the company's 00:07:18.379 --> 00:07:21.439 problem. The individual's responsibility is self 00:07:21.439 --> 00:07:24.439 -awareness. The planning process requires being 00:07:24.439 --> 00:07:27.680 self -aware of personal needs. If my need is 00:07:27.680 --> 00:07:30.399 growth and your company offers stagnation, I 00:07:30.399 --> 00:07:33.240 should leave. That's not a betrayal. That's development. 00:07:33.600 --> 00:07:37.620 And that attitude brings us directly to a concept 00:07:37.620 --> 00:07:41.060 that I find frankly alarming. Quiet ambition. 00:07:41.819 --> 00:07:44.959 I had a feeling this would trigger the rigorous, 00:07:45.120 --> 00:07:49.480 structured side of you. It absolutely does. Quiet 00:07:49.480 --> 00:07:52.660 ambition is defined as a mindset where individuals 00:07:52.660 --> 00:07:56.420 prioritize personal values and life goals over 00:07:56.420 --> 00:07:59.319 organizational advancement or financial outcomes. 00:07:59.540 --> 00:08:02.689 Now, On a human level, I get it. We all want 00:08:02.689 --> 00:08:05.350 work -life balance. But from a career development 00:08:05.350 --> 00:08:07.949 standpoint, this sounds like throwing in the 00:08:07.949 --> 00:08:10.589 towel. If you aren't striving for advancement 00:08:10.589 --> 00:08:13.410 or financial growth, which are the objective 00:08:13.410 --> 00:08:16.610 measures of value creation, are you really developing 00:08:16.610 --> 00:08:19.810 or are you just coasting? You're conflating development 00:08:19.810 --> 00:08:23.730 with conquest. Quiet ambition isn't about doing 00:08:23.730 --> 00:08:26.329 nothing. It's about redefining what the target 00:08:26.329 --> 00:08:29.329 is. If the definition of career development includes 00:08:29.329 --> 00:08:32.389 aligning with psychological fulfillment, which 00:08:32.389 --> 00:08:35.730 it does, then quiet ambition is a strategic choice. 00:08:36.230 --> 00:08:39.870 Strategic? How? Because it acknowledges the cost 00:08:39.870 --> 00:08:42.909 of that linear climb. We aren't machines. The 00:08:42.909 --> 00:08:46.129 environment affects us. The data shows that work 00:08:46.129 --> 00:08:48.230 -life balance is a massive factor in decision 00:08:48.230 --> 00:08:51.889 -making. If I choose quiet ambition, I am deciding 00:08:51.889 --> 00:08:54.169 that my mental health or my family is the metric 00:08:54.169 --> 00:08:56.570 I want to maximize, rather than my job title. 00:08:57.039 --> 00:08:59.559 That takes a tremendous amount of maturity. It's 00:08:59.559 --> 00:09:01.700 a rejection of the idea that more always equals 00:09:01.700 --> 00:09:05.120 better. Or it's a rejection of the economic reality 00:09:05.120 --> 00:09:08.620 of the occupational role. We are paid to perform 00:09:08.620 --> 00:09:11.899 a function. The text discusses strategic management 00:09:11.899 --> 00:09:14.559 and long -term careers leading to retirement. 00:09:14.919 --> 00:09:17.600 That implies you need to maximize your footprint 00:09:17.600 --> 00:09:21.299 to secure your future. Quiet ambition feels like 00:09:21.299 --> 00:09:24.460 a luxury belief. It's easy to say you don't care 00:09:24.460 --> 00:09:26.960 about financial outcomes until you need to pay 00:09:26.960 --> 00:09:29.519 for that retirement. But financial outcomes and 00:09:29.519 --> 00:09:31.360 climbing the corporate ladder are not the same 00:09:31.360 --> 00:09:33.840 thing anymore. You can have a very successful, 00:09:34.000 --> 00:09:36.659 financially stable, spiral career without ever 00:09:36.659 --> 00:09:38.860 wanting to be a vice president. You can be a 00:09:38.860 --> 00:09:41.919 specialist, a consultant, a creator. Quiet ambition 00:09:41.919 --> 00:09:44.080 is just saying, I don't need to rule the world 00:09:44.080 --> 00:09:46.980 to be happy in it. Maybe. But let's look at how 00:09:46.980 --> 00:09:49.539 people are actually navigating this brave new 00:09:49.539 --> 00:09:52.429 world of individual choice. Because they aren't 00:09:52.429 --> 00:09:54.830 just meditating on their values. They are using 00:09:54.830 --> 00:09:58.230 tools. And this brings us to the role of technology, 00:09:58.590 --> 00:10:02.149 specifically large language models, or AI. Ah, 00:10:02.409 --> 00:10:04.610 this is where the rubber meets the road. Exactly. 00:10:04.990 --> 00:10:08.169 And I think the way people use AI actually proves 00:10:08.169 --> 00:10:11.149 my point about the dominance of structure. What 00:10:11.149 --> 00:10:14.190 is the primary use case mentioned? Resume tailoring. 00:10:14.250 --> 00:10:16.909 People are using these massive supercomputers 00:10:16.909 --> 00:10:19.889 to rewrite their life stories. to emphasize role 00:10:19.889 --> 00:10:22.070 -specific experience for targeted positions. 00:10:22.470 --> 00:10:25.429 Right. Think about the psychology there. They 00:10:25.429 --> 00:10:28.110 aren't asking the AI to help them create a new 00:10:28.110 --> 00:10:31.490 role or redefine the industry. They are asking 00:10:31.490 --> 00:10:36.110 the AI, how do I fit myself into this box so 00:10:36.110 --> 00:10:39.330 the HR algorithm accepts me? They are desperate 00:10:39.330 --> 00:10:41.850 to align with these strategic organizational 00:10:41.850 --> 00:10:44.809 objectives I mentioned earlier. The structure 00:10:44.809 --> 00:10:47.700 is still the king. The individual is just using 00:10:47.700 --> 00:10:50.779 better camouflage. That is such a cynical take. 00:10:51.039 --> 00:10:53.940 I see the complete opposite. Think about who 00:10:53.940 --> 00:10:56.480 is using these tools. The material points out 00:10:56.480 --> 00:11:00.100 that AI assists those who lack access to informal 00:11:00.100 --> 00:11:03.059 networks or insider knowledge. The outsiders. 00:11:03.440 --> 00:11:05.899 The people who didn't go to the Ivy League. The 00:11:05.899 --> 00:11:07.899 people who don't have an uncle in the C -suite. 00:11:08.649 --> 00:11:11.370 Historically, the linear and steady state paths 00:11:11.370 --> 00:11:14.370 were gated communities. You needed a mentor to 00:11:14.370 --> 00:11:17.309 tell you the unwritten rules. Now an LLM gives 00:11:17.309 --> 00:11:20.210 you that insider knowledge instantly. It levels 00:11:20.210 --> 00:11:22.590 the playing field. It gets you past the first 00:11:22.590 --> 00:11:26.710 gate, sure. It empowers you to steer your longer 00:11:26.710 --> 00:11:29.590 -term career development pathways independently. 00:11:30.070 --> 00:11:32.230 You don't have to wait for your manager to nominate 00:11:32.230 --> 00:11:34.950 you for a training program. You can ask the AI, 00:11:35.110 --> 00:11:37.529 what skills do I need to move from marketing 00:11:37.529 --> 00:11:39.570 to data science? And it gives you a curriculum. 00:11:39.950 --> 00:11:42.330 That is the ultimate act of individual agency. 00:11:42.509 --> 00:11:44.950 It bypasses the organizational gatekeepers entirely. 00:11:45.330 --> 00:11:47.850 It bypasses the gatekeeper, but it still leads 00:11:47.850 --> 00:11:50.120 you to the gate. You're still trying to get hired 00:11:50.120 --> 00:11:53.080 by the institution. But let's pivot to something 00:11:53.080 --> 00:11:55.019 even more fundamental than technology. Let's 00:11:55.019 --> 00:11:58.059 talk about who we are as people. Is career choice 00:11:58.059 --> 00:12:01.759 a free for all or is it determined by our nature? 00:12:02.019 --> 00:12:04.519 You're talking about the Holland Codes. I am 00:12:04.519 --> 00:12:07.480 John L. Holland's typology. It's been around 00:12:07.480 --> 00:12:10.460 for decades for a reason. It categorizes people 00:12:10.460 --> 00:12:14.000 into types. Investigative, realistic, artistic, 00:12:14.480 --> 00:12:18.139 social, enterprising, conventional. And the research 00:12:18.139 --> 00:12:21.000 says these personality traits influence career 00:12:21.000 --> 00:12:24.019 choice and progression. It's useful framework, 00:12:24.240 --> 00:12:27.139 sure. It's more than useful. It's deterministic. 00:12:27.320 --> 00:12:30.279 If you are an investigative type, you are going 00:12:30.279 --> 00:12:32.639 to be miserable in an enterprising sales role. 00:12:32.820 --> 00:12:35.220 This supports the idea that careers should be 00:12:35.220 --> 00:12:38.759 stable and role specific. You need to find the 00:12:38.759 --> 00:12:42.000 box that fits your shape and stay there. It argues 00:12:42.000 --> 00:12:45.440 against this fluid spiral idea where anyone can 00:12:45.440 --> 00:12:48.179 be anything. We have natural inclinations. We 00:12:48.179 --> 00:12:51.139 have inclinations, yes. But we also have lives, 00:12:51.340 --> 00:12:53.399 and this is where the linear model completely 00:12:53.399 --> 00:12:56.700 breaks down for, what, half the population? The 00:12:56.700 --> 00:12:58.799 text immediately complicates Holland's clean 00:12:58.799 --> 00:13:01.320 little boxes by bringing in social identity. 00:13:01.720 --> 00:13:05.259 You mean demographics? I mean reality. Look at 00:13:05.259 --> 00:13:08.179 the research on gender. It notes that men often 00:13:08.179 --> 00:13:11.220 emphasize income growth and advancement. But 00:13:11.220 --> 00:13:14.240 women, often because society dumps the caregiving 00:13:14.240 --> 00:13:17.299 burden on them, may prioritize balancing work 00:13:17.299 --> 00:13:20.019 and caregiving. Which leads to different career 00:13:20.019 --> 00:13:23.360 outcomes. It leads to the necessity of the spiral 00:13:23.360 --> 00:13:26.720 path. If a woman is on a strict linear track, 00:13:26.960 --> 00:13:30.200 up or out, and she needs to take two years to 00:13:30.200 --> 00:13:33.259 care for a child or an aging parent, the linear 00:13:33.259 --> 00:13:36.220 model treats her as a failure. She has stepped 00:13:36.220 --> 00:13:39.840 off. But the adaptive view says, okay, she is 00:13:39.840 --> 00:13:42.440 adapting to a life circumstance. She can pick 00:13:42.440 --> 00:13:45.240 up a different strand later. But that adaptation 00:13:45.240 --> 00:13:48.899 has a cost. The text links that male focus on 00:13:48.899 --> 00:13:51.419 career advancement directly to income growth. 00:13:51.620 --> 00:13:55.139 The linear path is the path to wealth. If we 00:13:55.139 --> 00:13:57.259 embrace the spiral model because it feels more 00:13:57.259 --> 00:13:59.879 inclusive, are we actually condemning people 00:13:59.879 --> 00:14:03.059 to lower economic outcomes? We might be, but 00:14:03.059 --> 00:14:05.399 are we measuring wealth in dollars or insanity? 00:14:05.919 --> 00:14:09.919 If I spiral and make 20 % less money, but I can 00:14:09.919 --> 00:14:12.440 actually pick my kids up from school and I'm 00:14:12.440 --> 00:14:15.580 not burning out, have I lost? The linear view 00:14:15.580 --> 00:14:18.700 says yes. The individual view says I've won. 00:14:18.860 --> 00:14:23.039 And that is the crux of the disagreement. I look 00:14:23.039 --> 00:14:25.480 at the economy and I see a machine that needs 00:14:25.480 --> 00:14:29.320 parts to function reliably. We need the steady 00:14:29.320 --> 00:14:32.279 state experts to keep the lights on and the surgery 00:14:32.279 --> 00:14:35.720 safe. We need the linear managers to make the 00:14:35.720 --> 00:14:39.059 hard decisions about resource allocation. The 00:14:39.059 --> 00:14:42.019 organization provides the training and development, 00:14:42.200 --> 00:14:45.669 the job rotation. the infrastructure that makes 00:14:45.669 --> 00:14:49.070 work possible. Without that scaffolding, we are 00:14:49.070 --> 00:14:52.370 all just individuals drifting in a vacuum. Back. 00:14:52.470 --> 00:14:55.490 So they are using AI to navigate their own paths, 00:14:55.669 --> 00:14:58.470 they are adopting quiet ambition to protect their 00:14:58.470 --> 00:15:00.950 energy, and they are moving through transitory 00:15:00.950 --> 00:15:03.490 and spiral careers to build a life that actually 00:15:03.490 --> 00:15:06.490 fits them. The organization is just a tool the 00:15:06.490 --> 00:15:10.090 individual uses, not the other way around. I 00:15:10.090 --> 00:15:13.029 suppose, in the end, we are both right. Career 00:15:13.029 --> 00:15:15.649 development is defined as a process. It's not 00:15:15.649 --> 00:15:18.909 a destination. It's a constant negotiation between 00:15:18.909 --> 00:15:22.730 the individual versus organizational needs. Exactly. 00:15:22.909 --> 00:15:24.970 Sometimes you need the latter, and sometimes 00:15:24.970 --> 00:15:27.590 you need the parachute. The key is knowing which 00:15:27.590 --> 00:15:30.210 one you're grabbing and why. A fair conclusion. 00:15:30.809 --> 00:15:33.090 It is a tension that I suspect will continue 00:15:33.090 --> 00:15:36.070 as long as people go to work. Thank you for joining 00:15:36.070 --> 00:15:38.620 me to hammer this out. It was a pleasure. And 00:15:38.620 --> 00:15:41.220 thank you to our listeners. We hope this helps 00:15:41.220 --> 00:15:44.200 you look at your own career, whether it's a line, 00:15:44.320 --> 00:15:47.779 a spiral, or something in between, with a little 00:15:47.779 --> 00:15:50.179 more clarity. Until next time.