WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:03.359 Welcome back to the deep dive. You know, usually 00:00:03.359 --> 00:00:05.339 when we talk about the NBA, we're obsessed with 00:00:05.339 --> 00:00:08.099 the flashy stuff. Oh, absolutely. Steph Curry 00:00:08.099 --> 00:00:11.240 logo threes, the LeBron Tomahawk dunks, you know, 00:00:11.240 --> 00:00:14.960 the guy dropping 50 points in a night. We are, 00:00:15.060 --> 00:00:17.420 I think, conditioned to just look at the ball 00:00:17.420 --> 00:00:18.920 going into the hoop. Well, that's what sells 00:00:18.920 --> 00:00:20.699 the ticket. That's what makes the highlight reels 00:00:20.699 --> 00:00:24.129 on social media. It is. But today. I want to 00:00:24.129 --> 00:00:26.070 flip the script completely. I want to look at 00:00:26.070 --> 00:00:27.789 the other end of the floor. Okay. I want to talk 00:00:27.789 --> 00:00:29.210 about the guys who wake up in the morning and 00:00:29.210 --> 00:00:34.189 decide, no one is scoring on me today. We are 00:00:34.189 --> 00:00:37.890 digging into the history of the NBA Defensive 00:00:37.890 --> 00:00:41.429 Player of the Year Award. The DPLY. And honestly, 00:00:41.590 --> 00:00:44.210 looking at this stack of notes and research you've 00:00:44.210 --> 00:00:46.710 built together. This isn't just a list of winners. 00:00:46.810 --> 00:00:48.890 This feels like a history of, I don't know, physical 00:00:48.890 --> 00:00:51.409 warfare. It really is. It's the grind with a 00:00:51.409 --> 00:00:53.350 capital G. And you're right, it's often the forgotten 00:00:53.350 --> 00:00:56.570 side of the game. But this award, which started 00:00:56.570 --> 00:01:01.170 back in the 1982 -83 season, is the highest honor 00:01:01.170 --> 00:01:02.969 for the guys who do the dirty work. The dirty 00:01:02.969 --> 00:01:05.950 work. The ones who bruise their ribs taking charges, 00:01:06.109 --> 00:01:09.370 who dive for loose balls, who stare down the 00:01:09.370 --> 00:01:11.549 most athletic people on the planet and just say 00:01:11.549 --> 00:01:14.469 no. I love that description. Because watching 00:01:14.469 --> 00:01:17.409 a great defensive possession doesn't always look 00:01:17.409 --> 00:01:21.250 pretty. It looks exhausting. It is exhausting. 00:01:21.349 --> 00:01:23.450 And that's why this award is so special. Winning 00:01:23.450 --> 00:01:27.069 a scoring title is about talent and, you know, 00:01:27.090 --> 00:01:29.450 opportunity. Winning Defensive Player of the 00:01:29.450 --> 00:01:32.510 Year is about will. It's about a refusal to concede. 00:01:32.879 --> 00:01:34.560 Okay, so we have a lot to get through today. 00:01:34.680 --> 00:01:37.519 We've got, I see here, voting scandals, some 00:01:37.519 --> 00:01:40.540 weird anomalies, the absolute legends of the 00:01:40.540 --> 00:01:42.859 sport, and even the new rules about how many 00:01:42.859 --> 00:01:44.719 games you actually have to play to qualify. A 00:01:44.719 --> 00:01:46.519 packed list. But before we get to the names, 00:01:46.620 --> 00:01:48.819 and there are some massive names here, how does 00:01:48.819 --> 00:01:51.459 this thing actually work? Because I feel like 00:01:51.459 --> 00:01:54.079 MVP voting gets all the headlines, all the speculation. 00:01:55.519 --> 00:01:58.849 Who decides who the best defender is? Is it the 00:01:58.849 --> 00:02:00.530 coaches? That's what a lot of people assume, 00:02:00.650 --> 00:02:02.269 right? Because they're the ones dissecting the 00:02:02.269 --> 00:02:03.950 game film every night. But it's actually a media 00:02:03.950 --> 00:02:08.669 panel. A media, okay. Yeah, it's about 124 sports 00:02:08.669 --> 00:02:11.409 writers and broadcasters from across the United 00:02:11.409 --> 00:02:14.349 States and Canada. Okay, so 124 writers. Are 00:02:14.349 --> 00:02:17.110 they just picking one name out of a hat? Or is 00:02:17.110 --> 00:02:19.909 it like a simple majority vote? No, and this 00:02:19.909 --> 00:02:21.770 is where the math gets a little spicy and honestly 00:02:21.770 --> 00:02:24.449 a little bit fairer. It's a weighted system. 00:02:25.240 --> 00:02:28.680 Each voter casts a ballot for first, second and 00:02:28.680 --> 00:02:30.699 third place. OK, walk me through the math on 00:02:30.699 --> 00:02:33.330 that. How does that work? So a first place vote 00:02:33.330 --> 00:02:36.590 gets you five points. Second place is three points. 00:02:36.629 --> 00:02:39.750 And third place is just one point. The winner 00:02:39.750 --> 00:02:42.229 is simply the player with the highest accumulated 00:02:42.229 --> 00:02:44.729 point total at the end. So it's not even necessarily 00:02:44.729 --> 00:02:47.069 the guy with the most first place votes. Exactly. 00:02:47.129 --> 00:02:49.550 And that's the key. Think about a scenario where 00:02:49.550 --> 00:02:51.789 the voting is really, really fractured. You could 00:02:51.789 --> 00:02:54.469 theoretically have a player who is everyone's 00:02:54.469 --> 00:02:57.150 second choice. The guy who everyone agrees is. 00:02:57.580 --> 00:02:59.819 really, really good, but maybe not their absolute 00:02:59.819 --> 00:03:02.759 favorite. The consensus guy. Right. And he could 00:03:02.759 --> 00:03:06.479 sneak a win over a guy who is maybe more polarizing. 00:03:06.879 --> 00:03:09.860 It allows for a consensus to build, a reward 00:03:09.860 --> 00:03:12.599 and consistency across the entire electorate 00:03:12.599 --> 00:03:15.099 rather than just having a passionate niche following. 00:03:15.340 --> 00:03:17.240 It's like a rain choice election for the toughest 00:03:17.240 --> 00:03:19.020 guy in the building. Exactly. It filters out 00:03:19.020 --> 00:03:21.979 the noise. And recently, the building got a new 00:03:21.979 --> 00:03:26.520 name. As of the 2022 -23 season, you aren't just 00:03:26.520 --> 00:03:29.419 winning the DPOY trophy anymore. You are officially 00:03:29.419 --> 00:03:32.719 winning the Hakeem Olajuwon trophy. The dream. 00:03:32.979 --> 00:03:35.539 The dream. And we will get to why it's named 00:03:35.539 --> 00:03:37.659 after him later in the show because his 1994 00:03:37.659 --> 00:03:40.099 season is, well, it's practically a statistical 00:03:40.099 --> 00:03:42.740 impossibility, but naming it after Hakeem sets 00:03:42.740 --> 00:03:45.780 a standard. Right. It says, this isn't just about 00:03:45.780 --> 00:03:48.180 steals and it isn't just about blocks. It's about 00:03:48.180 --> 00:03:50.520 dominance. I love that they're honoring the history 00:03:50.520 --> 00:03:53.099 like that. Speaking of dominance. Yeah. Let's 00:03:53.099 --> 00:03:55.020 open up the history books. Because when I look 00:03:55.020 --> 00:03:57.219 at the list of winners you sent over, there is 00:03:57.219 --> 00:04:00.340 a very, very clear hierarchy. There's a VIP section 00:04:00.340 --> 00:04:02.400 at the very top. The four -timer club. Right. 00:04:02.460 --> 00:04:05.259 In over 40 years of this award, only three human 00:04:05.259 --> 00:04:07.639 beings have ever won it four times. That's it. 00:04:08.000 --> 00:04:11.439 Just three. It is the Mount Rushmore of defense. 00:04:11.719 --> 00:04:14.159 And what I find fascinating about these three 00:04:14.159 --> 00:04:17.160 guys is that they could not be more different 00:04:17.160 --> 00:04:20.379 from each other. How so? They achieved the same 00:04:20.379 --> 00:04:23.459 result, four trophies, but they did it in completely 00:04:23.459 --> 00:04:25.920 different eras with different body types and, 00:04:25.939 --> 00:04:28.040 you know, completely different styles of play. 00:04:28.279 --> 00:04:30.439 Okay, so let's start with the first one. The 00:04:30.439 --> 00:04:33.139 guy who I think culturally put shot blocking 00:04:33.139 --> 00:04:36.870 on the map in the 90s to come in Mutombo. No, 00:04:36.910 --> 00:04:38.790 no, no. The finger wag. You know, you have to 00:04:38.790 --> 00:04:40.610 talk about the finger wag. The finger wag is 00:04:40.610 --> 00:04:42.750 iconic. But think about what Mutombo represented. 00:04:43.129 --> 00:04:46.689 He stands 7 '2". He played in an era, the 90s 00:04:46.689 --> 00:04:48.870 and early 2000s, that was defined by isolation 00:04:48.870 --> 00:04:52.250 scoring and heavy physical play. And he won his 00:04:52.250 --> 00:04:54.629 four awards across three different teams. That 00:04:54.629 --> 00:04:56.709 stood out to me in the notes. He won with the 00:04:56.709 --> 00:04:59.490 Denver Nuggets in 95, then twice with the Atlanta 00:04:59.490 --> 00:05:01.870 Hawks in 97 and 98, and then finally with the 00:05:01.870 --> 00:05:05.430 Philadelphia 76ers in 2001. That is hard to do, 00:05:05.470 --> 00:05:07.490 isn't it? Changing systems and still being the 00:05:07.490 --> 00:05:10.930 best. It's incredibly hard. I mean, usually a 00:05:10.930 --> 00:05:12.889 defender relies heavily on the system around 00:05:12.889 --> 00:05:15.529 him. He needs the guards to funnel the ball a 00:05:15.529 --> 00:05:16.910 certain way. He needs to know where the help 00:05:16.910 --> 00:05:20.509 is coming from. But Mutombo, he was a system. 00:05:20.589 --> 00:05:23.750 You could drop him into Denver, Atlanta, or Philly, 00:05:23.750 --> 00:05:27.029 and instantly your paint was closed for business. 00:05:27.850 --> 00:05:30.550 He was a mobile ecosystem of rim protection. 00:05:30.810 --> 00:05:33.389 I remember that 2001 run with the Sixers. He 00:05:33.389 --> 00:05:35.649 was essentially the goalie for Allen Iverson. 00:05:35.670 --> 00:05:38.129 That's the perfect analogy. Yeah. Iverson would 00:05:38.129 --> 00:05:40.209 gamble for steals on the perimeter. He led the 00:05:40.209 --> 00:05:42.430 league in steals, actually, but he gambled a 00:05:42.430 --> 00:05:45.290 lot. And if he missed... It didn't matter. Because 00:05:45.290 --> 00:05:47.310 Mutombo was back there. Because Mutombo was standing 00:05:47.310 --> 00:05:50.389 behind him. That longevity to be that dominant 00:05:50.389 --> 00:05:53.569 from 1995 all the way to 2001 just speaks to 00:05:53.569 --> 00:05:55.569 his physical durability and his intelligence. 00:05:55.610 --> 00:05:57.850 He knew exactly where to be before the offense 00:05:57.850 --> 00:06:00.850 did. So you have the giant Mutombo. Then you 00:06:00.850 --> 00:06:02.949 have the second member of the four -time club. 00:06:03.230 --> 00:06:05.790 And this guy, man, he might be my favorite player 00:06:05.790 --> 00:06:08.610 on this entire list. Ben Wallace. Big Ben. Yes. 00:06:08.670 --> 00:06:11.629 The fear. The afro. The going to work pistons. 00:06:12.189 --> 00:06:17.370 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006. He almost won five in 00:06:17.370 --> 00:06:19.709 a row. He was pure intimidation. And here's the 00:06:19.709 --> 00:06:22.629 difference. Mutombo was seven foot two. Then 00:06:22.629 --> 00:06:25.470 Wallace was listed at six nine. I was generous. 00:06:25.750 --> 00:06:27.730 That was very generous. If you stood next to 00:06:27.730 --> 00:06:30.569 him. He was maybe six, seven, six, eight on a 00:06:30.569 --> 00:06:33.110 good day. Maybe six, seven on a good day. But 00:06:33.110 --> 00:06:35.810 he was made of granite. He was incredibly strong. 00:06:35.990 --> 00:06:38.149 And he had the afro, which made him look bigger. 00:06:38.310 --> 00:06:40.769 And he played with this terrifying intensity. 00:06:41.490 --> 00:06:44.430 But the most amazing stat about Ben Wallace. 00:06:44.649 --> 00:06:47.810 That's it. He is the only undrafted player in 00:06:47.810 --> 00:06:50.269 NBA history to be this dominant. Undrafted to 00:06:50.269 --> 00:06:52.269 four -time defensive player of the year. Yeah. 00:06:52.779 --> 00:06:55.360 That sounds like a movie script. It is. And his 00:06:55.360 --> 00:06:58.060 style is different. Mutombo blocked shots because 00:06:58.060 --> 00:07:00.180 he was tall. Ben Wallace blocked shots because 00:07:00.180 --> 00:07:02.220 he outworked you. He would get switched onto 00:07:02.220 --> 00:07:04.480 a guard on the perimeter, stay in front of them 00:07:04.480 --> 00:07:06.399 with lateral quickness that didn't make sense 00:07:06.399 --> 00:07:08.819 for his size, and then recover to the rim to 00:07:08.819 --> 00:07:10.759 block a dunk. He was the heart and soul of that 00:07:10.759 --> 00:07:13.000 Detroit team that beat the Shaq and Kobe Lakers 00:07:13.000 --> 00:07:15.600 in the 2004 finals. That's the ultimate validation, 00:07:15.779 --> 00:07:18.319 right? Stopping Shaq in his prime. Right. If 00:07:18.319 --> 00:07:20.519 you can slow down prime Shaquille O 'Neal without 00:07:20.519 --> 00:07:23.000 a double team, you deserve a trophy. And Wallace 00:07:23.000 --> 00:07:26.439 did that. He won four times in five years. That 00:07:26.439 --> 00:07:28.480 concentration of dominance is something we haven't 00:07:28.480 --> 00:07:30.060 really seen since. Okay, so we have the tall 00:07:30.060 --> 00:07:34.279 genius, Mutombo. The undrafted brawler, Wallace. 00:07:34.759 --> 00:07:37.139 And then we have the modern entry, the third 00:07:37.139 --> 00:07:40.379 guy with four trophies, Rudy Gobert. The Stifle 00:07:40.379 --> 00:07:42.500 Tower. Now, Rudy gets a lot of flack on social 00:07:42.500 --> 00:07:44.220 media these days. People say he gets played off 00:07:44.220 --> 00:07:46.220 the floor in the playoffs or that he can't guard 00:07:46.220 --> 00:07:48.839 the perimeter. But you cannot argue with the 00:07:48.839 --> 00:07:52.360 hardware. Nope. 2018, 2019, 2021 with the Utah 00:07:52.360 --> 00:07:55.360 Jazz and then 2024 with the Minnesota Timberwolves. 00:07:55.399 --> 00:07:58.579 Four times. People misunderstand Rudy Gobert's 00:07:58.579 --> 00:08:01.699 impact because it isn't always flashy. He isn't 00:08:01.699 --> 00:08:03.720 wagging his finger like Mutombo and he isn't 00:08:03.720 --> 00:08:05.800 shoving people into the third row like Ben Wallace. 00:08:06.079 --> 00:08:10.240 Rudy Gobert wins with geometry. Geometry. Break 00:08:10.240 --> 00:08:11.980 that down for me. What do you mean by that? I 00:08:11.980 --> 00:08:14.139 mean, it's about angles and space. We call it 00:08:14.139 --> 00:08:17.379 drop coverage. In the modern NBA, everyone shoots 00:08:17.379 --> 00:08:20.259 three -pointers. The court is spaced out. It's 00:08:20.259 --> 00:08:22.019 a nightmare to defend because you have to cover 00:08:22.019 --> 00:08:25.160 so much ground. Rudy Gobert allows his teammates 00:08:25.160 --> 00:08:26.920 to stay glued to those three -point shooters 00:08:26.920 --> 00:08:28.819 because they know Rudy can handle the paint all 00:08:28.819 --> 00:08:31.160 by himself. Okay, but what does drop coverage 00:08:31.160 --> 00:08:34.039 actually look like in a game? So imagine a pick 00:08:34.039 --> 00:08:37.340 and roll. The guard comes off a screen. Instead 00:08:37.340 --> 00:08:39.779 of stepping up to meet the guard, Rudy sinks 00:08:39.779 --> 00:08:43.820 back. He drops deep into the paint. He turns 00:08:43.820 --> 00:08:46.440 himself into a massive obstacle between the ball 00:08:46.440 --> 00:08:49.379 handler and the rim. He is daring the guard to 00:08:49.379 --> 00:08:51.879 take a mid -range jumper, which is the least 00:08:51.879 --> 00:08:54.340 efficient shot in basketball, while simultaneously 00:08:54.340 --> 00:08:57.220 taking away the lob pass to the rolling big man. 00:08:57.399 --> 00:08:59.399 So he's essentially guarding two people at once. 00:08:59.939 --> 00:09:02.100 Constantly. And the advanced metrics back it 00:09:02.100 --> 00:09:04.279 up. When Rudy Gobert is on the floor, the other 00:09:04.279 --> 00:09:06.100 team's shooting percentage at the rim just falls 00:09:06.100 --> 00:09:09.179 off a cliff. He forces players to make U -turns. 00:09:09.179 --> 00:09:11.620 They drive in, see him, and dribble back out. 00:09:11.740 --> 00:09:14.259 That doesn't show up as a block. No, but it's 00:09:14.259 --> 00:09:17.539 a defensive win. That's the Gobert effect. Just 00:09:17.539 --> 00:09:20.240 being there changes the entire game plan. Exactly. 00:09:20.240 --> 00:09:22.679 He is the modern standard for rim protection. 00:09:23.059 --> 00:09:24.679 It's interesting that all three of these guys, 00:09:25.159 --> 00:09:29.230 Mutombo, Wallace, Gobert, are centers. It feels 00:09:29.230 --> 00:09:31.389 like there is a do not enter sign on this club 00:09:31.389 --> 00:09:34.929 for anyone under like 6 '10". It is definitely 00:09:34.929 --> 00:09:38.009 a big man's award historically. But that brings 00:09:38.009 --> 00:09:41.669 us to the anomaly. The guy who sits just below 00:09:41.669 --> 00:09:43.970 them with three awards. Dwight Howard. Superman. 00:09:44.149 --> 00:09:46.850 His run was different though. Mutombo and Wallace 00:09:46.850 --> 00:09:49.710 spread their wins out a bit. Gobert too. Dwight 00:09:49.710 --> 00:09:52.590 went back to back to back. 2009, 2010, 2011. 00:09:52.950 --> 00:09:55.049 Three consecutive years. No one else has ever 00:09:55.049 --> 00:09:57.110 done that. Not Motomo, not Wallace, not Gobert. 00:09:57.309 --> 00:10:00.169 Why was that specific window so special for Dwight? 00:10:00.409 --> 00:10:02.769 What was it about that Orlando magic era? Why 00:10:02.769 --> 00:10:05.009 haven't we seen a three -peat since? It was peak 00:10:05.009 --> 00:10:07.409 athleticism. Think about Dwight in Orlando. He 00:10:07.409 --> 00:10:09.629 was wearing the cape literally in the dunk contest 00:10:09.629 --> 00:10:12.090 and, you know, figuratively in games. He was 00:10:12.090 --> 00:10:15.250 so bouncy. He could jump out of the gym. He covered 00:10:15.250 --> 00:10:17.710 ground like a tennis player but hit like a linebacker. 00:10:18.009 --> 00:10:20.629 For those three years, there was just no question. 00:10:20.850 --> 00:10:22.929 The voters didn't even have to think about it. 00:10:22.970 --> 00:10:25.909 It was Dwight's league. It makes you wonder if 00:10:25.909 --> 00:10:27.950 he hadn't had those back injuries later in his 00:10:27.950 --> 00:10:30.409 career. Could he have caught Mutombo and Wallace? 00:10:30.809 --> 00:10:32.950 Could he have gotten a fourth or fifth? I think 00:10:32.950 --> 00:10:34.429 he would have shattered the record. He was on 00:10:34.429 --> 00:10:37.169 a trajectory to win five or six easily. But that 00:10:37.169 --> 00:10:40.289 style of play, that explosive, violent leaping 00:10:40.289 --> 00:10:43.350 on every single possession, it takes a toll on 00:10:43.350 --> 00:10:46.029 the body. It just does. Okay, so we've established 00:10:46.029 --> 00:10:48.870 that the Giants rule the land. But let's dig 00:10:48.870 --> 00:10:50.889 into that bias a little bit, because when I look 00:10:50.889 --> 00:10:53.230 at the full list of winners, I mean, I see Mark 00:10:53.230 --> 00:10:56.549 Eaton, Manute Bull, David Robinson, Alonzo Mourning. 00:10:56.809 --> 00:10:59.870 It's a forest of tall trees. There is a definite 00:10:59.870 --> 00:11:02.649 positional bias, and the source material even 00:11:02.649 --> 00:11:05.629 explicitly states this. The award is traditionally 00:11:05.629 --> 00:11:08.649 given to big men who rebound and block shots. 00:11:09.049 --> 00:11:11.289 Why is that? Is it just because blocks are easier 00:11:11.289 --> 00:11:13.470 to see? Are they more tangible? That's a huge 00:11:13.470 --> 00:11:16.169 part of it. A block is a tangible event. You 00:11:16.169 --> 00:11:18.610 stopped a score. A rebound ends a possession. 00:11:18.830 --> 00:11:20.649 Those are stats you can point to on a box score. 00:11:21.169 --> 00:11:23.570 Perimeter defense, staying in front of your man, 00:11:23.730 --> 00:11:27.090 denying the ball, fighting over screens, is much, 00:11:27.129 --> 00:11:29.389 much harder to quantify, especially back in the 00:11:29.389 --> 00:11:31.649 80s and 90s before we had player tracking cameras. 00:11:31.990 --> 00:11:34.450 It's harder to see the value of a guy who just 00:11:34.450 --> 00:11:36.129 prevents his man from getting the ball in the 00:11:36.129 --> 00:11:38.169 first place. So let's give some love to the little 00:11:38.169 --> 00:11:41.730 guys, or I guess the not -so -giant guys, the 00:11:41.730 --> 00:11:44.490 Perimeter 8. Because out of all the winners since 00:11:44.490 --> 00:11:48.100 1983... Only eight times has a perimeter player 00:11:48.100 --> 00:11:50.960 won. It is a very short, very exclusive list. 00:11:51.159 --> 00:11:53.379 It really is. Let's read it out. Sidney Moncrief, 00:11:53.519 --> 00:11:57.480 Alvin Robertson, Michael Cooper, Michael Jordan, 00:11:57.659 --> 00:12:01.539 Gary Payton, Ron Artest. Later known as Metta 00:12:01.539 --> 00:12:05.860 World Peace. Right. Cubby Leonard and Marcus 00:12:05.860 --> 00:12:08.899 Smart. That's it. In over 40 years, only eight 00:12:08.899 --> 00:12:11.120 guys who play away from the basket have convinced 00:12:11.120 --> 00:12:13.000 the voters they were the most impactful defender 00:12:13.000 --> 00:12:15.279 in the league. And it gets even rarer if you 00:12:15.279 --> 00:12:17.480 look at the specific position of point guard. 00:12:17.620 --> 00:12:20.200 Oh, the point guard drought. This is fascinating 00:12:20.200 --> 00:12:22.759 to me. How bad is it? Only two point guards have 00:12:22.759 --> 00:12:25.039 ever won this award. Two. Ever. In the entire 00:12:25.039 --> 00:12:27.220 history of the award. Ever. Gary Payton won it 00:12:27.220 --> 00:12:31.220 in 1996. The glove. I loved watching Peyton. 00:12:31.259 --> 00:12:34.159 He was nasty. He was. He was known for that intense 00:12:34.159 --> 00:12:37.059 full court pressure. He would pick you up 94 00:12:37.059 --> 00:12:40.139 feet from the basket and just harass you, talk 00:12:40.139 --> 00:12:42.879 trash to you the entire game. He made it personal. 00:12:43.080 --> 00:12:47.019 And then, after Peyton in 96? And then nothing. 00:12:47.299 --> 00:12:51.149 For decades. Until Marcus Smart won it in 2022 00:12:51.149 --> 00:12:53.470 with the Boston Celtics. Wait, so that's a 26 00:12:53.470 --> 00:12:55.429 -year gap between point guards winning the award? 00:12:55.649 --> 00:12:58.529 26 years. It shows you how incredibly hard it 00:12:58.529 --> 00:13:00.769 is for a small guard to impact the game enough 00:13:00.769 --> 00:13:03.230 to override the value of a dominant rim protector. 00:13:04.189 --> 00:13:06.690 Peyton and Smart were anomalies. They were so 00:13:06.690 --> 00:13:09.669 tenacious, so physically disrupting that they 00:13:09.669 --> 00:13:11.990 forced the voters to pay attention. How did Smart 00:13:11.990 --> 00:13:14.129 do it? Marcus Smart, for example, was incredible 00:13:14.129 --> 00:13:16.490 at drawing charges, diving for loose balls, getting 00:13:16.490 --> 00:13:19.350 steals. He created chaos. He was a wrecking ball 00:13:19.350 --> 00:13:21.250 on the perimeter. It's ironic, though, isn't 00:13:21.250 --> 00:13:23.490 it? Because the award didn't start with a big 00:13:23.490 --> 00:13:26.570 man. That is the great irony of the DPOY history. 00:13:26.870 --> 00:13:29.639 The very first one. The inaugural winner in the 00:13:29.639 --> 00:13:33.759 1982 -83 season was Sidney Moncrief, a shooting 00:13:33.759 --> 00:13:35.940 guard for the Milwaukee Bucks. And he won the 00:13:35.940 --> 00:13:39.100 second one too, 1983 -84. He went back to back. 00:13:39.320 --> 00:13:41.580 Correct. And if you look at the early history, 00:13:41.679 --> 00:13:43.860 it's pretty wild. Five of the first six winners 00:13:43.860 --> 00:13:46.600 were perimeter players. You had Moncrief twice, 00:13:46.679 --> 00:13:49.559 then Alvin Robertson, Michael Cooper, Michael 00:13:49.559 --> 00:13:52.019 Jordan. Why did it start that way? Was the game 00:13:52.019 --> 00:13:54.559 just different back then? It was. In the early 00:13:54.559 --> 00:13:57.279 80s, you had a lot more isolation play on the 00:13:57.279 --> 00:14:00.200 perimeter. The strategy was often give the ball 00:14:00.200 --> 00:14:02.279 to your best scorer and get out of the way. So 00:14:02.279 --> 00:14:04.279 if you had a guy like Moncrief who could just 00:14:04.279 --> 00:14:07.299 shut down the other team's best scorer one on 00:14:07.299 --> 00:14:09.779 one, that felt like the most valuable defensive 00:14:09.779 --> 00:14:12.200 thing. It was a more direct matchup. Exactly. 00:14:12.539 --> 00:14:15.519 But then as the 90s approached, defenses became 00:14:15.519 --> 00:14:18.259 more sophisticated. Team concepts became more 00:14:18.259 --> 00:14:20.700 important and the value of the center, the anchor 00:14:20.700 --> 00:14:22.620 who cleans everything up, became undeniable. 00:14:23.019 --> 00:14:25.480 Mark Eaton won his second. Dennis Rodman started 00:14:25.480 --> 00:14:29.250 winning. big man era really began. Speaking of 00:14:29.250 --> 00:14:32.389 Michael Jordan, we need to talk about the unicorns, 00:14:32.389 --> 00:14:36.649 the players who didn't just defend, but did absolutely 00:14:36.649 --> 00:14:39.610 everything. The intersection of offense and defense. 00:14:39.669 --> 00:14:41.509 This is where you find the true legends of the 00:14:41.509 --> 00:14:44.289 sport. The guys who are just, you know, on another 00:14:44.289 --> 00:14:46.850 level entirely. We're talking about players who 00:14:46.850 --> 00:14:50.190 have won both the NBA MVP and the defensive player 00:14:50.190 --> 00:14:52.549 of the year in their careers. It's a club of 00:14:52.549 --> 00:14:57.149 five. Michael Jordan, Hakeem Olajuwon, David 00:14:57.149 --> 00:15:01.789 Robinson, Kevin Garnett, and Giannis Antetokounmpo. 00:15:02.289 --> 00:15:04.149 That's a good list. I mean, if you're on the 00:15:04.149 --> 00:15:05.669 list with those five names, you're doing something 00:15:05.669 --> 00:15:07.929 right with your life. That's the pantheon. But 00:15:07.929 --> 00:15:10.009 let's narrow it down even further. How many of 00:15:10.009 --> 00:15:12.399 them won both awards in the same season? That 00:15:12.399 --> 00:15:14.840 is the holy grail of individual achievement in 00:15:14.840 --> 00:15:17.240 a season. Only three players have ever done that. 00:15:17.360 --> 00:15:19.240 Okay, let's break them down. First up, Michael 00:15:19.240 --> 00:15:22.860 Jordan, 1988. The 1988 season for Jordan is, 00:15:22.940 --> 00:15:24.720 well, statistically, it just doesn't make any 00:15:24.720 --> 00:15:27.179 sense. It's an outlier in every possible way. 00:15:27.320 --> 00:15:29.059 Tell me about it. I know he scored a lot, but 00:15:29.059 --> 00:15:31.320 put it in perspective for me. So he wins Defensive 00:15:31.320 --> 00:15:33.159 Player of the Year. That means he's locking people 00:15:33.159 --> 00:15:35.980 down, jumping passing lanes, playing heavy minutes 00:15:35.980 --> 00:15:38.960 on the defensive end, total commitment. But in 00:15:38.960 --> 00:15:41.220 that same season, he also wins the scoring title. 00:15:41.419 --> 00:15:43.559 He was the best scorer and the best defender 00:15:43.559 --> 00:15:47.039 in the entire league. And not just the best scorer. 00:15:47.159 --> 00:15:51.019 He averaged 35 point Zua points per game. Wait, 00:15:51.059 --> 00:15:55.700 35? 35 points. He is the only player to win DPOY 00:15:55.700 --> 00:15:58.600 while averaging over 30 points per game. And 00:15:58.600 --> 00:16:01.700 he wasn't just over 30, he averaged 35. Think 00:16:01.700 --> 00:16:04.179 about the energy expenditure. Yeah. To carry 00:16:04.179 --> 00:16:06.440 the offensive load of 35 points a night, taking 00:16:06.440 --> 00:16:08.120 all those shots, driving to the rim, getting 00:16:08.120 --> 00:16:11.019 fouled, and still have the energy and focus to 00:16:11.019 --> 00:16:14.039 lock down opponents enough to win DPOY, it's 00:16:14.039 --> 00:16:16.019 superhuman conditioning. That is the definition 00:16:16.019 --> 00:16:18.360 of a two -way player. I mean, most guys today, 00:16:18.460 --> 00:16:20.500 if they score 35, they're taking a few plays 00:16:20.500 --> 00:16:22.899 off on defense. It's just human nature. Exactly. 00:16:22.980 --> 00:16:25.559 Jordan didn't rest. So that's Jordan in 88. Then 00:16:25.559 --> 00:16:29.120 we have Hakeem Olojuwon in 1994. This is why 00:16:29.120 --> 00:16:31.059 the trophy is named after him. Jordan had the 00:16:31.059 --> 00:16:33.860 scoring title, but Hakeem had all the hardware. 00:16:34.100 --> 00:16:36.980 Unpack the 1994 season for us. I was looking 00:16:36.980 --> 00:16:39.700 at this, and it's just a laundry list of awards. 00:16:39.919 --> 00:16:43.539 It's absurd. So in the 1993 -94 season, Hakeem 00:16:43.539 --> 00:16:46.840 Olojuwon wins the NBA MVP. Check. He wins the 00:16:46.840 --> 00:16:48.519 Defensive Player of the Year. Check. But then 00:16:48.519 --> 00:16:50.840 he goes to the playoffs. It doesn't stop. And 00:16:50.840 --> 00:16:52.919 he wins the championship. He wins the NBA championship 00:16:52.919 --> 00:16:55.779 with the Houston Rockets, and he wins the finals 00:16:55.779 --> 00:17:00.840 MVP. So MVP, DPOY, finals MVP championship, all 00:17:00.840 --> 00:17:03.870 in one year. He is the only player in history 00:17:03.870 --> 00:17:06.589 to accomplish that quadruple feat in a single 00:17:06.589 --> 00:17:10.849 season. It is the perfect season. Complete dominance 00:17:10.849 --> 00:17:13.109 on both ends of the floor in the regular season 00:17:13.109 --> 00:17:14.730 and the postseason. That explains everything. 00:17:15.089 --> 00:17:17.069 That's why the league decided to put his name 00:17:17.069 --> 00:17:19.049 on the trophy. It's the gold standard. There's 00:17:19.049 --> 00:17:21.390 no other argument to be made. Exactly. Jordan 00:17:21.390 --> 00:17:24.529 was flashy, but Hakim in 94 was the most complete 00:17:24.529 --> 00:17:27.039 center we've ever seen. And the third member 00:17:27.039 --> 00:17:29.740 of the same season club is Giannis Antetokounmpo, 00:17:29.940 --> 00:17:33.319 who did it recently in the 2019 -20 season. The 00:17:33.319 --> 00:17:35.779 Greek freak? He plays that free safety role where 00:17:35.779 --> 00:17:37.900 he roams around and helps everywhere. It's a 00:17:37.900 --> 00:17:40.079 modern version of what Hakeem did, just from 00:17:40.079 --> 00:17:43.480 the forward position. So Jordan, Hakeem, Giannis, 00:17:43.599 --> 00:17:45.880 that's the list. That's the whole list. Now I 00:17:45.880 --> 00:17:47.539 want to get into some of the weird stuff, the 00:17:47.539 --> 00:17:51.940 quirks. Because when you have 124 media members 00:17:51.940 --> 00:17:56.460 voting, sometimes things get messy. there have 00:17:56.460 --> 00:17:59.839 been some very, very confusing outcomes, specifically 00:17:59.839 --> 00:18:02.279 regarding the all -defensive team. Right. You 00:18:02.279 --> 00:18:04.279 would assume that if you were voted the defensive 00:18:04.279 --> 00:18:06.000 player of the year, the single best defender 00:18:06.000 --> 00:18:08.680 in the league, you would automatically be on 00:18:08.680 --> 00:18:10.319 the all -defensive first team. You would assume 00:18:10.319 --> 00:18:13.319 that. It seems logical. It's the only thing that 00:18:13.319 --> 00:18:15.539 makes sense. But it hasn't always happened. There 00:18:15.539 --> 00:18:17.779 are four times in history where the DPOY was 00:18:17.779 --> 00:18:20.099 snubbed from the first team. It happened to Alvin 00:18:20.099 --> 00:18:24.099 Robertson in 1986, Dikembe Mutombo in 1995, Tyson 00:18:24.099 --> 00:18:28.170 Chandler in 2012. And Marc Gasol in 2013. Wait, 00:18:28.190 --> 00:18:30.450 let's pause on Marc Gasol in 2013. He was named 00:18:30.450 --> 00:18:32.309 Defensive Player of the Year, but he was on the 00:18:32.309 --> 00:18:34.849 second team all defense. Correct. How is that 00:18:34.849 --> 00:18:37.529 even possible? What is the logic there? Here 00:18:37.529 --> 00:18:39.630 is your trophy for being the best defender in 00:18:39.630 --> 00:18:41.269 the league, but we don't think you're one of 00:18:41.269 --> 00:18:43.630 the top five. It comes down to who is doing the 00:18:43.630 --> 00:18:45.849 voting. See, the defensive player of the year 00:18:45.849 --> 00:18:47.690 is voted on by the media, like we discussed. 00:18:48.049 --> 00:18:51.450 But prior to 2014, the all -defensive teams were 00:18:51.450 --> 00:18:54.309 voted on by the NBA coaches. Ah, so you had two 00:18:54.309 --> 00:18:56.809 different voting bodies. A difference of opinion 00:18:56.809 --> 00:18:58.549 between the writers and the coaches. Exactly. 00:18:58.589 --> 00:19:01.529 In 2013, the media looked at the advanced stats 00:19:01.529 --> 00:19:03.829 and the Memphis Grizzlies' top -ranked defense 00:19:03.829 --> 00:19:06.809 and said, Marc Gasol is the anchor. He is the 00:19:06.809 --> 00:19:10.710 player of the year. But the coaches... who value 00:19:10.710 --> 00:19:12.670 different things, maybe more one -on -one lockdown 00:19:12.670 --> 00:19:15.450 defense, or maybe they were just voting on reputation 00:19:15.450 --> 00:19:19.150 for guys like Tyson Chandler or Joakim Noah Put 00:19:19.150 --> 00:19:21.369 -Gasol on the second team. That is a fantastic 00:19:21.369 --> 00:19:24.150 cocktail party fact, the disconnect between the 00:19:24.150 --> 00:19:26.769 press box and the bench. It is. And since 2014, 00:19:27.069 --> 00:19:29.009 the voting for all defensive teams changed to 00:19:29.009 --> 00:19:31.490 the media as well. So that specific anomaly is 00:19:31.490 --> 00:19:33.990 less likely to happen now. But for a while, it 00:19:33.990 --> 00:19:36.250 was a real source of confusion and debate. OK, 00:19:36.309 --> 00:19:38.269 let's look at the teams. We talked about Mutombo 00:19:38.269 --> 00:19:40.849 traveling around. But which franchises are the 00:19:40.849 --> 00:19:43.450 factories for defenders? Which teams just churn 00:19:43.450 --> 00:19:45.710 these guys out? If you want to see good defense, 00:19:45.950 --> 00:19:47.670 you have to look at the history of the Detroit 00:19:47.670 --> 00:19:49.869 Pistons. The bad boys and the going to work crew. 00:19:50.029 --> 00:19:52.849 They have six awards total. Dennis Rodman won 00:19:52.849 --> 00:19:56.490 two there in 1990 and 1991. And of course, Ben 00:19:56.490 --> 00:19:58.170 Wallace won his four there. That makes sense. 00:19:58.410 --> 00:20:01.089 Detroit prides itself on that identity, that 00:20:01.089 --> 00:20:03.150 whole Detroit versus everybody thing. It's a 00:20:03.150 --> 00:20:05.990 blue collar city and they love blue collar basketball. 00:20:06.680 --> 00:20:09.180 Defense is effort, and Detroit fans appreciate 00:20:09.180 --> 00:20:12.119 effort more than flash. It's in their DNA. Then 00:20:12.119 --> 00:20:14.579 you have the Utah Jazz with five awards. Mark 00:20:14.579 --> 00:20:17.279 Eaton won two in the 80s, the mechanic who became 00:20:17.279 --> 00:20:20.799 a 7 '4 center, and Rudy Gobert won three while 00:20:20.799 --> 00:20:23.500 he was there. So Utah is the land of the giant 00:20:23.500 --> 00:20:25.779 defensive centers. They build their defense inside 00:20:25.779 --> 00:20:27.880 out. That's their brand. And then the San Antonio 00:20:27.880 --> 00:20:31.579 Spurs with four, Alvin Robertson, David Robinson, 00:20:31.740 --> 00:20:33.980 and Cowie Leonard with two. It's interesting 00:20:33.980 --> 00:20:36.400 that the Spurs winners are spread across positions. 00:20:37.099 --> 00:20:39.539 Robertson was a guard, Robinson a center, Cowie 00:20:39.539 --> 00:20:42.200 a small forward. It reflects the Spurs system, 00:20:42.299 --> 00:20:44.099 doesn't it? It's less about a type of player 00:20:44.099 --> 00:20:47.079 and more about a philosophy. It does. The Greg 00:20:47.079 --> 00:20:50.119 Popovich era was all about adaptability. They 00:20:50.119 --> 00:20:52.160 didn't just have one way to defend. They had 00:20:52.160 --> 00:20:54.960 a culture of defense. If you didn't play defense, 00:20:55.339 --> 00:20:57.940 you wouldn't play for the Spurs, period. Now, 00:20:57.960 --> 00:21:00.730 I want to shift gears to the modern era. We mentioned 00:21:00.730 --> 00:21:02.789 the name change to the Hakeem Olajuwon Trophy, 00:21:02.910 --> 00:21:05.190 but the players winning it have changed too, 00:21:05.289 --> 00:21:08.470 specifically where they come from. Oh, the international 00:21:08.470 --> 00:21:10.910 shift in this award is profound. It's one of 00:21:10.910 --> 00:21:13.170 the biggest stories of the award's history. If 00:21:13.170 --> 00:21:15.069 you look at the early years, it was almost entirely 00:21:15.069 --> 00:21:18.890 American -born players. Right. Moncrief, Eaton, 00:21:18.910 --> 00:21:22.309 Cooper, Jordan, all American. But look at the 00:21:22.309 --> 00:21:24.829 list now. Hakeem Olajuwon was the pioneer, born 00:21:24.829 --> 00:21:27.269 in Nigeria. Though he did naturalize as a U .S. 00:21:27.269 --> 00:21:29.680 citizen in 93, right? Yes. But then you have 00:21:29.680 --> 00:21:32.119 Dikembe Mutombo from Zaire, which is now the 00:21:32.119 --> 00:21:34.420 Democratic Republic of the Congo. And then the 00:21:34.420 --> 00:21:37.339 European wave hit hard. It really did. Marc Gasol 00:21:37.339 --> 00:21:39.480 became the first European winner in 2013. He's 00:21:39.480 --> 00:21:42.359 from Spain. Then Joachim Noah the very next year, 00:21:42.500 --> 00:21:45.240 2014, representing France, though he has Swedish 00:21:45.240 --> 00:21:47.640 roots and U .S. ties as well. And then Rudy Gobert, 00:21:47.720 --> 00:21:50.220 also from France. And Giannis from Greece. Why 00:21:50.220 --> 00:21:52.400 do you think that is? Why are international players 00:21:52.400 --> 00:21:55.579 so dominant on the defensive end now? I think 00:21:55.579 --> 00:21:57.720 it comes down to fundamentals. In a lot of European 00:21:57.720 --> 00:21:59.819 academies, they teach the game differently. They 00:21:59.819 --> 00:22:02.019 teach positioning, footwork, and team defense 00:22:02.019 --> 00:22:04.240 from a very, very young age. Whereas in the U 00:22:04.240 --> 00:22:07.119 .S.? In the U .S., the AAU circuit often rewards 00:22:07.119 --> 00:22:10.119 individual scoring and raw athleticism. But guys 00:22:10.119 --> 00:22:12.200 like Gobert and Gasol grew up learning how to 00:22:12.200 --> 00:22:14.500 rotate, how to be in the right spot two steps 00:22:14.500 --> 00:22:16.839 ahead of the play. And also, you simply have 00:22:16.839 --> 00:22:20.000 a global talent pool now. The best athletes in 00:22:20.000 --> 00:22:21.720 the world are playing basketball, regardless 00:22:21.720 --> 00:22:23.920 of where they were born. It really shows that 00:22:23.920 --> 00:22:26.259 defense isn't just an American grit thing anymore. 00:22:26.660 --> 00:22:29.200 The international academies are producing elite 00:22:29.200 --> 00:22:32.019 rim protectors and defensive minds. Absolutely. 00:22:32.039 --> 00:22:34.559 The global game has taken over the DPOY list, 00:22:34.799 --> 00:22:36.940 and I don't see that trend reversing. There is 00:22:36.940 --> 00:22:39.579 one more major change we have to discuss, and 00:22:39.579 --> 00:22:41.339 this one isn't about where you're from. It's 00:22:41.339 --> 00:22:44.319 about how much you play. the so -called load 00:22:44.319 --> 00:22:46.880 management rules. This is the biggest structural 00:22:46.880 --> 00:22:50.079 change to the award in decades. Effective with 00:22:50.079 --> 00:22:53.779 the 2023 -24 season, the NBA implemented a 65 00:22:53.779 --> 00:22:58.039 -game threshold. So to even be eligible for Defensive 00:22:58.039 --> 00:23:00.079 Player of the Year or MVP or any of the major 00:23:00.079 --> 00:23:02.859 awards, you have to play in at least 65 games. 00:23:03.180 --> 00:23:05.200 Correct. This was part of the new collective 00:23:05.200 --> 00:23:08.140 bargaining agreement. The league and the networks 00:23:08.140 --> 00:23:11.180 wanted to curb the trend of star players sitting 00:23:11.180 --> 00:23:14.180 out for rest. especially in nationally televised 00:23:14.180 --> 00:23:16.519 games. And it's not just checking into the game, 00:23:16.599 --> 00:23:19.680 right? You can't just sub in, commit a foul to 00:23:19.680 --> 00:23:22.539 keep your streak alive, and then leave. No, they 00:23:22.539 --> 00:23:25.039 thought of that. To receive credit for a game 00:23:25.039 --> 00:23:27.319 played, you must be on the floor for at least 00:23:27.319 --> 00:23:30.380 20 minutes. 20 minutes. That's a real shift. 00:23:30.500 --> 00:23:32.460 That's a serious amount of playing time. It is. 00:23:32.539 --> 00:23:34.460 And there are some small exceptions. They allow 00:23:34.460 --> 00:23:37.359 for two near misses. So if you play between 15 00:23:37.359 --> 00:23:39.859 and 19 minutes in a game, maybe you get in foul 00:23:39.859 --> 00:23:42.440 trouble early or roll an ankle, that can count 00:23:42.440 --> 00:23:45.119 towards your 65, but only twice. So basically 00:23:45.119 --> 00:23:47.220 you have to be available. Availability is now 00:23:47.220 --> 00:23:51.480 a codified rewarded skill. If you are the best 00:23:51.480 --> 00:23:53.339 defender in the world when you play, but you 00:23:53.339 --> 00:23:56.559 only play 58 games, you cannot win the award. 00:23:56.799 --> 00:23:59.259 Are there any exceptions for major legitimate 00:23:59.259 --> 00:24:02.240 injuries? There is a season -ending injury protection. 00:24:02.660 --> 00:24:05.480 If a player suffers a legitimate season -ending 00:24:05.480 --> 00:24:08.859 injury, they can be eligible with 62 credited 00:24:08.859 --> 00:24:12.039 games. And there's some vague provisions for 00:24:12.039 --> 00:24:15.099 bad faith circumstances, but generally the rule 00:24:15.099 --> 00:24:18.019 is strict. You have to play. This changes the 00:24:18.019 --> 00:24:20.099 strategy for teams and players, doesn't it? Yeah. 00:24:20.160 --> 00:24:22.460 We talked about Dwight Howard's incredible burst 00:24:22.460 --> 00:24:25.420 of dominance. But going forward, a player like 00:24:25.420 --> 00:24:27.920 Evan Mobley, who's the most recent winner mentioned 00:24:27.920 --> 00:24:31.299 in our notes for 2025, has to manage his body 00:24:31.299 --> 00:24:34.039 not just to be effective, but to hit that 65 00:24:34.039 --> 00:24:36.160 number. It creates a different kind of pressure. 00:24:36.440 --> 00:24:38.759 You can't just strategically rest on back -to 00:24:38.759 --> 00:24:40.299 -backs if you want the hardware. You have to 00:24:40.299 --> 00:24:42.480 be out there grinding it out. Even on nights, 00:24:42.539 --> 00:24:45.039 you don't feel 100%. And frankly, for an award 00:24:45.039 --> 00:24:48.299 that's all about the grind, that feels well it 00:24:48.299 --> 00:24:50.759 feels appropriate i agree defense is about effort 00:24:51.099 --> 00:24:52.839 And showing up is the first part of the effort. 00:24:52.960 --> 00:24:54.420 If you aren't on the court, you aren't stopping 00:24:54.420 --> 00:24:56.859 anyone. So let's just recap what we've unpacked 00:24:56.859 --> 00:24:59.220 here. It's a lot. We have the legends, the four 00:24:59.220 --> 00:25:02.480 timers, Mutombo, Wallace, Gobert. We have the 00:25:02.480 --> 00:25:04.720 extreme rarities, the guards like Gary Payton 00:25:04.720 --> 00:25:07.400 and Marcus Smart. We have the unicorns like Hakeem 00:25:07.400 --> 00:25:09.740 and Jordan winning everything in sight. And we 00:25:09.740 --> 00:25:12.220 have the evolution of the voters mindset from 00:25:12.220 --> 00:25:15.680 loving perimeter stoppers in the 80s to obsessing 00:25:15.680 --> 00:25:18.859 over blocks in the 90s and 2000s to the modern 00:25:18.859 --> 00:25:20.970 analytics era where we value. you things like 00:25:20.970 --> 00:25:23.769 drop coverage and overall defensive versatility. 00:25:23.930 --> 00:25:26.210 It's such a rich history. Yeah. But I want to 00:25:26.210 --> 00:25:27.650 leave you with a final thought, and I'd love 00:25:27.650 --> 00:25:30.309 your take on this. Go ahead. We look at the dominance 00:25:30.309 --> 00:25:32.869 of the Detroit Pistons and the Utah Jazz. We 00:25:32.869 --> 00:25:35.210 look at the four -time winners. These were eras 00:25:35.210 --> 00:25:38.990 of sustained, specific defensive systems. But 00:25:38.990 --> 00:25:42.049 with this new 65 -game rule and just the sheer 00:25:42.049 --> 00:25:46.059 pace and space of the modern game. Do you think 00:25:46.059 --> 00:25:48.240 we will ever see a three -peat like Dwight Howard's 00:25:48.240 --> 00:25:50.279 again? That's a great question. Is the physical 00:25:50.279 --> 00:25:53.000 toll of modern defense just too high to sustain 00:25:53.000 --> 00:25:56.140 that absolute peak level for 65 -plus games three 00:25:56.140 --> 00:25:58.799 years in a row? That is the big question hanging 00:25:58.799 --> 00:26:00.579 over the league. I mean, the game is faster, 00:26:00.660 --> 00:26:02.880 the court is more spread out, defenders have 00:26:02.880 --> 00:26:04.980 to cover more ground than Marquette never dreamed 00:26:04.980 --> 00:26:08.500 of. Asking a player to do that at an elite, award 00:26:08.500 --> 00:26:11.519 -winning level for 65 games three years straight. 00:26:12.190 --> 00:26:14.549 It might be the hardest record to break in the 00:26:14.549 --> 00:26:16.990 modern NBA. The human body has limits. It might 00:26:16.990 --> 00:26:19.650 be. We might see more variety in the winners 00:26:19.650 --> 00:26:22.509 list going forward simply because the grind is 00:26:22.509 --> 00:26:24.650 harder than ever. It's almost built to prevent 00:26:24.650 --> 00:26:28.089 dynasties now. Or we might find the next unicorn 00:26:28.089 --> 00:26:30.829 who redefines those limits. Someone like a Victor 00:26:30.829 --> 00:26:34.049 Wambanyama or a Chet Holmgren who has the size 00:26:34.049 --> 00:26:36.349 and skill to change the geometry all over again. 00:26:36.509 --> 00:26:39.029 That's the beauty of the NBA. You never know 00:26:39.029 --> 00:26:41.990 who is coming next. But until then, we honor 00:26:41.990 --> 00:26:45.210 the wall. The grinders. The Hakeem Olajuwon trophy 00:26:45.210 --> 00:26:47.250 winners. The ones who stopped the ball. Thanks 00:26:47.250 --> 00:26:49.309 for listening to this deep dive. Keep digging 00:26:49.309 --> 00:26:51.049 deep, and we'll catch you on the next one.