WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:03.500 Welcome back to the deep dive. So I want to start 00:00:03.500 --> 00:00:06.219 today by asking you a question that I think I 00:00:06.219 --> 00:00:08.580 think most of us have asked ourselves at some 00:00:08.580 --> 00:00:10.900 point, usually at like three in the morning when 00:00:10.900 --> 00:00:13.160 you just can't sleep. Oh, yeah. The dreaded 3 00:00:13.160 --> 00:00:16.100 a .m. existential crisis. Right. Exactly. So 00:00:16.100 --> 00:00:19.179 what if you just what if you just stopped? Like 00:00:19.179 --> 00:00:21.239 what if you looked at the life you built, you 00:00:21.239 --> 00:00:24.000 know, the career, the house, all the expectations 00:00:24.000 --> 00:00:25.839 and you just walked out the door and never came 00:00:25.839 --> 00:00:28.179 back? Well, it is the ultimate fantasy, isn't 00:00:28.179 --> 00:00:30.539 it? The escape hatch. We all have it in the back 00:00:30.539 --> 00:00:33.359 of our minds. But usually when people actually 00:00:33.359 --> 00:00:35.280 pull that lever, it's because things are going 00:00:35.280 --> 00:00:37.380 wrong. Yeah, they're running away from something. 00:00:37.500 --> 00:00:39.679 Exactly. They're broke or they're in legal trouble 00:00:39.679 --> 00:00:42.579 or just running from a complete disaster. Right. 00:00:42.740 --> 00:00:45.399 But the story we are unpacking today is different. 00:00:45.859 --> 00:00:48.579 We are going to look at a man who pulled that 00:00:48.579 --> 00:00:51.840 lever when everything was going perfectly. We 00:00:51.840 --> 00:00:54.759 are talking about Dorian Paskovitz, or as most 00:00:54.759 --> 00:00:57.369 people know him. Doc Pascovitz. And to just call 00:00:57.369 --> 00:01:00.009 him a surfer, really, it really doesn't do it 00:01:00.009 --> 00:01:02.869 justice. Not at all. That is kind of like calling 00:01:02.869 --> 00:01:05.670 Ernest Hemingway just a fisherman. Yeah, that's 00:01:05.670 --> 00:01:07.590 a good way to put it. This is a guy who had what 00:01:07.590 --> 00:01:10.010 you could call the golden ticket. He was a Jewish 00:01:10.010 --> 00:01:12.810 doctor from Texas, and he graduated from Stanford 00:01:12.810 --> 00:01:16.349 Medical School in 1946, which we will get into 00:01:16.349 --> 00:01:18.569 because that is a massive deal. Oh, absolutely 00:01:18.569 --> 00:01:20.349 massive. And he basically looked to the American 00:01:20.349 --> 00:01:22.489 dream and just said, no, thank you. He ended 00:01:22.489 --> 00:01:25.269 up raising nine kids in a camper van, refusing 00:01:25.269 --> 00:01:28.760 to send them to any sort of school and just chasing 00:01:28.760 --> 00:01:31.640 waves for a quarter of a century. It is genuinely 00:01:31.640 --> 00:01:34.159 one of the most radical sociological experiments 00:01:34.159 --> 00:01:37.140 of the 20th century. And I do use the word experiment 00:01:37.140 --> 00:01:39.980 deliberately there because when you look at the 00:01:39.980 --> 00:01:43.060 sources we have for this deep dive, the biographical 00:01:43.060 --> 00:01:46.340 data, the Wikipedia archives, the 2007 documentary 00:01:46.340 --> 00:01:49.379 Surfwise, you realize this wasn't just a long 00:01:49.379 --> 00:01:52.260 family vacation. No, not at all. This was a man 00:01:52.260 --> 00:01:55.200 trying to engineer what he saw as a superior 00:01:55.200 --> 00:01:58.159 way of living, a superior type of human. completely 00:01:58.159 --> 00:02:01.340 within his own family unit. Which sounds a little 00:02:01.340 --> 00:02:04.819 ominous, honestly. It's extremely complex. It's 00:02:04.819 --> 00:02:08.659 a story about freedom, for sure, but it's equally 00:02:08.659 --> 00:02:11.939 a story about control. It forces us to ask if 00:02:11.939 --> 00:02:15.180 it's even possible to be truly free without inflicting 00:02:15.180 --> 00:02:17.740 a sort of chaotic reality on the people you love. 00:02:17.919 --> 00:02:20.080 And that is exactly the mission for this deep 00:02:20.080 --> 00:02:22.740 dive. We aren't just doing a biography of a famous 00:02:22.740 --> 00:02:25.340 surfer. We want to stress test this whole idea 00:02:25.340 --> 00:02:28.860 of the alternative lifestyle. Because, you know, 00:02:28.860 --> 00:02:30.699 you look on social media today and van life looks 00:02:30.699 --> 00:02:32.819 like these beautiful sunsets and portable espresso 00:02:32.819 --> 00:02:35.539 machines. Right. It looks curated. Yeah, curated. 00:02:35.819 --> 00:02:38.379 But the reality of the Pascoats family was something 00:02:38.379 --> 00:02:40.520 else entirely. We're going to go through his 00:02:40.520 --> 00:02:42.379 origin story, how he went from medical school 00:02:42.379 --> 00:02:44.960 to a surfboard. Then we'll get into the radical 00:02:44.960 --> 00:02:48.080 living situation, 25 years in a camper van. Which 00:02:48.080 --> 00:02:50.280 is just staggering to think about. We'll dig 00:02:50.280 --> 00:02:52.460 into his highly controversial philosophy on health 00:02:52.460 --> 00:02:54.639 and education, look at the shadow side of the 00:02:54.639 --> 00:02:56.599 family dynamics revealed in that documentary, 00:02:56.800 --> 00:02:59.639 and finally discuss his late -life activism in 00:02:59.639 --> 00:03:02.280 Gaza. It's a wild ride. So let's go back to the 00:03:02.280 --> 00:03:04.680 beginning. Because to really understand why he 00:03:04.680 --> 00:03:06.560 left, you have to understand what he was actually 00:03:06.560 --> 00:03:10.000 walking away from. We need to map this out, starting 00:03:10.000 --> 00:03:14.460 in Texas. The physician who quit. Right. Dorian 00:03:14.460 --> 00:03:18.439 Paskowitz, born March 3, 1921, in Galveston, 00:03:18.439 --> 00:03:21.319 Texas. Now, looking at the demographic context 00:03:21.319 --> 00:03:23.419 here is really important. He's the son of Russian 00:03:23.419 --> 00:03:25.699 Jewish immigrants, Louis and Rose Paskowitz. 00:03:25.919 --> 00:03:28.199 And being part of a Jewish immigrant family in 00:03:28.199 --> 00:03:30.759 Texas in the 1920s, that comes with a very specific 00:03:30.759 --> 00:03:32.949 kind of pressure, doesn't it? immense pressure. 00:03:33.250 --> 00:03:35.770 You have to remember the narrative of that generation 00:03:35.770 --> 00:03:38.449 of immigrants. The ethos was very much we came 00:03:38.449 --> 00:03:40.250 here with a nothing so you could be everything. 00:03:40.469 --> 00:03:42.590 Right. Success wasn't really an option. It was 00:03:42.590 --> 00:03:45.469 a mandate. And the Paskowitz kids had serious 00:03:45.469 --> 00:03:47.370 drive. I mean, his sister was Sonya Derrick. 00:03:47.509 --> 00:03:49.530 The actress. She was in the big sleep with Humphrey 00:03:49.530 --> 00:03:51.449 Bogart. Correct. So you have this incredibly 00:03:51.449 --> 00:03:55.370 high achieving gene pool. And Dorian, he aims 00:03:55.370 --> 00:03:57.569 for the absolute peak of professional success. 00:03:57.870 --> 00:04:00.289 He goes to San Diego State, transfers to Stanford 00:04:00.289 --> 00:04:02.830 University. Then he gets into Stanford Medical 00:04:02.830 --> 00:04:04.610 School. OK, let's stop right there. I want to 00:04:04.610 --> 00:04:06.150 really drill down on this for you listening. 00:04:06.629 --> 00:04:10.030 Stanford Medical School in 1946. Today, obviously, 00:04:10.050 --> 00:04:12.750 being a doctor is highly prestigious. But in 00:04:12.750 --> 00:04:16.329 1946, what did that actually mean for his social 00:04:16.329 --> 00:04:19.279 standing? It is hard to overstate it. You have 00:04:19.279 --> 00:04:21.259 to look at the historical moment. World War II 00:04:21.259 --> 00:04:23.519 has just ended. The United States is really the 00:04:23.519 --> 00:04:26.160 only superpower left standing with its infrastructure 00:04:26.160 --> 00:04:29.379 completely intact. The economy is about to explode 00:04:29.379 --> 00:04:32.199 into this massive post -war boom. And medicine 00:04:32.199 --> 00:04:34.279 was changing, too. Exactly. Medicine was entering 00:04:34.279 --> 00:04:37.319 its golden age. Antibiotics like penicillin were 00:04:37.319 --> 00:04:39.779 becoming widely available. Doctors were actively 00:04:39.779 --> 00:04:42.040 conquering diseases that used to be death sentences. 00:04:42.360 --> 00:04:45.579 A doctor in 1946 wasn't just seen as a highly 00:04:45.579 --> 00:04:48.519 skilled service provider. A doctor was practically 00:04:48.519 --> 00:04:51.019 a god in a white coat. So he is holding this 00:04:51.019 --> 00:04:53.379 Stanford medical degree. He is set for life. 00:04:53.579 --> 00:04:55.959 Guaranteed wealth, guaranteed respect. The country 00:04:55.959 --> 00:04:57.860 club membership, the big house in the suburbs, 00:04:58.019 --> 00:05:00.160 the whole nine yards. He had the keys to the 00:05:00.160 --> 00:05:03.269 kingdom. He had made it by every single metric 00:05:03.269 --> 00:05:05.750 that American society had to offer. If he had 00:05:05.750 --> 00:05:07.350 just stayed on that path, he would have been 00:05:07.350 --> 00:05:10.709 a wealthy, retired physician playing golf in 00:05:10.709 --> 00:05:13.209 Palm Springs by the 1980s. But something happened 00:05:13.209 --> 00:05:16.550 in that exact same year he graduated. Yeah. 1946. 00:05:17.149 --> 00:05:18.949 There's a crack in the windshield. The catalyst. 00:05:19.170 --> 00:05:22.600 He visits Hawaii. Now, Hawaiian 46 wasn't the 00:05:22.600 --> 00:05:24.540 resort destination that you and I know today. 00:05:24.680 --> 00:05:27.220 It wasn't even a state yet. No, it was a territory. 00:05:27.259 --> 00:05:30.899 It was much wilder, much more raw. And while 00:05:30.899 --> 00:05:34.019 he is there, he goes surfing with Duke Hanamoku. 00:05:34.180 --> 00:05:36.850 The Duke. Basically, the father of modern surfing. 00:05:36.990 --> 00:05:38.990 The absolute legend. And you have to realize, 00:05:39.050 --> 00:05:41.009 this isn't like taking a surf lesson at a resort 00:05:41.009 --> 00:05:43.170 today where they push you into a wave on a soft 00:05:43.170 --> 00:05:47.670 foam board. Surfing in 1946 meant handling massive, 00:05:47.730 --> 00:05:50.129 heavy redwood planks. Right, they didn't have 00:05:50.129 --> 00:05:52.870 fiberglass. Exactly. These boards weighed nearly 00:05:52.870 --> 00:05:56.050 100 pounds. It was a deeply, physically demanding, 00:05:56.250 --> 00:05:59.649 visceral battle with the ocean. I am just imagining 00:05:59.649 --> 00:06:03.300 the contrast here. On one hand... He has the 00:06:03.300 --> 00:06:06.319 sterile, rigid, extremely high stakes world of 00:06:06.319 --> 00:06:08.160 the hospital, you know, fluorescent lights, life 00:06:08.160 --> 00:06:10.459 and death, rigid hierarchies. And on the other 00:06:10.459 --> 00:06:12.819 hand, he is out in the Pacific Ocean with the 00:06:12.819 --> 00:06:15.620 Duke wrestling a hundred pound piece of wood 00:06:15.620 --> 00:06:18.860 on a massive wave. That is the big aha moment 00:06:18.860 --> 00:06:21.540 for him. It wasn't just a fun afternoon. It was 00:06:21.540 --> 00:06:24.759 a spiritual awakening. He saw a fluidity and 00:06:24.759 --> 00:06:26.579 a connection to nature out in the water that 00:06:26.579 --> 00:06:28.360 suddenly made the hospital feel like a prison. 00:06:29.319 --> 00:06:32.379 But, and this is a key point, he didn't quit 00:06:32.379 --> 00:06:34.240 right then and there. Right. He tried to play 00:06:34.240 --> 00:06:35.959 the part for a while. He did. He went back to 00:06:35.959 --> 00:06:38.120 the mainland. He practiced medicine. But the 00:06:38.120 --> 00:06:40.579 source material points to a very turbulent personal 00:06:40.579 --> 00:06:42.939 life during this period. He had two marriages 00:06:42.939 --> 00:06:45.100 that ultimately failed while he was working as 00:06:45.100 --> 00:06:46.839 a doctor. And he had two daughters from those 00:06:46.839 --> 00:06:49.980 early marriages. Yes. And while we don't have 00:06:49.980 --> 00:06:52.779 extensive deep details on the day -to -day of 00:06:52.779 --> 00:06:55.500 those relationships, the overall pattern is super 00:06:55.500 --> 00:06:58.529 clear. He was trying to fit a square peg into 00:06:58.529 --> 00:07:01.930 a round hole. The golden handcuffs were chafing 00:07:01.930 --> 00:07:03.990 him. He was making money. He had the status, 00:07:04.050 --> 00:07:06.990 but he was completely miserable. The sources 00:07:06.990 --> 00:07:10.110 quote him simply realizing that he, quote, was 00:07:10.110 --> 00:07:13.050 not happy as a doctor. It sounds so simple when 00:07:13.050 --> 00:07:15.389 you say it like that. I wasn't happy. But think 00:07:15.389 --> 00:07:17.569 about the courage or maybe the madness it takes 00:07:17.569 --> 00:07:20.790 to admit that when you were that deep into a 00:07:20.790 --> 00:07:23.209 career. Most people in that situation would just 00:07:23.209 --> 00:07:25.089 die convertible or something. They wouldn't dismantle 00:07:25.089 --> 00:07:27.410 their entire existence. Well, that is the difference 00:07:27.410 --> 00:07:29.689 between a midlife crisis and a total paradigm 00:07:29.689 --> 00:07:32.149 shift. Paskowitz was looking for a completely 00:07:32.149 --> 00:07:35.290 new paradigm. And interestingly, his first major 00:07:35.290 --> 00:07:37.649 pivot wasn't actually moving into a van. It was 00:07:37.649 --> 00:07:39.790 moving to Israel. This is in the 1950s, right? 00:07:39.850 --> 00:07:42.870 Yes. He travels to Israel for a year. And he 00:07:42.870 --> 00:07:45.069 finds a real resonance there. He felt more at 00:07:45.069 --> 00:07:47.329 home, more himself in that environment than he 00:07:47.329 --> 00:07:49.389 ever did in the American medical establishment. 00:07:49.649 --> 00:07:51.709 He even tried to join the military. During the 00:07:51.709 --> 00:07:55.649 Suez Crisis in 1956. Right. He actively volunteered 00:07:55.649 --> 00:07:58.670 for the Israeli army. He wanted to fight. He 00:07:58.670 --> 00:08:00.889 wanted to be part of something visceral and real, 00:08:01.009 --> 00:08:03.110 something physical. But they turned him down. 00:08:03.310 --> 00:08:06.389 They did. But that rejection didn't send him 00:08:06.389 --> 00:08:08.769 crawling back to a hospital in California. It 00:08:08.769 --> 00:08:11.589 actually solidified his resolve. He realized 00:08:11.589 --> 00:08:13.829 he couldn't go back to the rat race. When he 00:08:13.829 --> 00:08:16.269 returned to the U .S., he was officially done. 00:08:16.629 --> 00:08:19.850 He decided to dedicate his life entirely to surfing. 00:08:20.069 --> 00:08:22.490 And this leads us right into the radical experiment. 00:08:22.870 --> 00:08:25.069 Because he didn't just become a solitary beach 00:08:25.069 --> 00:08:27.829 bum, he built a tribe. This is where the story 00:08:27.829 --> 00:08:30.490 shifts from a simple biography to a sociological 00:08:30.490 --> 00:08:33.269 study. He meets his third wife, Juliette Peyes. 00:08:33.450 --> 00:08:36.159 And Juliette, I mean... We really have to give 00:08:36.159 --> 00:08:38.220 her credit here. She went along with a life plan 00:08:38.220 --> 00:08:40.580 that almost anyone else would run screaming from. 00:08:40.659 --> 00:08:42.960 She was the anchor of this whole operation. Without 00:08:42.960 --> 00:08:45.120 her, Doc is just a guy shouting at the waves. 00:08:45.360 --> 00:08:48.019 With her, he became a patriarch, they get married, 00:08:48.240 --> 00:08:50.899 and they start having kids. A lot of kids. Nine 00:08:50.899 --> 00:08:53.460 children in total. Eight sons and one daughter. 00:08:53.850 --> 00:08:56.169 And they decide, or rather, the sources indicate, 00:08:56.370 --> 00:08:58.970 Doc largely decides, that they are not going 00:08:58.970 --> 00:09:00.610 to live in a house. They are going to live on 00:09:00.610 --> 00:09:03.909 the road, embracing this transient bohemian lifestyle. 00:09:04.190 --> 00:09:07.669 And they kept this up for roughly 25 years. A 00:09:07.669 --> 00:09:09.850 quarter of a century. I really want to pause 00:09:09.850 --> 00:09:12.470 here and visualize this. Because when we say 00:09:12.470 --> 00:09:15.490 they lived in a camper van, I think modern listeners 00:09:15.490 --> 00:09:18.769 might be picturing a luxury sprinter van. Or 00:09:18.769 --> 00:09:21.590 a big Winnebago with slide outs and a separate 00:09:21.590 --> 00:09:23.809 master bedroom. Not even close. We are talking 00:09:23.809 --> 00:09:26.929 about a succession of very basic used camper 00:09:26.929 --> 00:09:31.230 vans, often around 24 feet long, for 11 people. 00:09:31.309 --> 00:09:34.470 11 people in 24 feet. That is basically prison 00:09:34.470 --> 00:09:36.750 density. It is tighter than a submarine. Imagine 00:09:36.750 --> 00:09:39.230 the logistics of that daily life. Where do people 00:09:39.230 --> 00:09:41.750 sleep? They were literally stacked like cordwood 00:09:41.750 --> 00:09:43.929 inside this thing. Where do you put the surfboards? 00:09:44.029 --> 00:09:46.049 How do you cook meals? The bathroom situation 00:09:46.049 --> 00:09:49.090 alone is enough to induce panic. It forced a 00:09:49.090 --> 00:09:52.570 level of intimacy that is almost incomprehensible 00:09:52.570 --> 00:09:55.049 to modern families. There is no going to your 00:09:55.049 --> 00:09:57.990 room to cool off. There is no privacy. If you 00:09:57.990 --> 00:10:00.250 have an argument, the whole family is part of 00:10:00.250 --> 00:10:03.009 the argument. If one person catches a cold, all 00:10:03.009 --> 00:10:06.490 11 people get the cold. But it wasn't just a 00:10:06.490 --> 00:10:08.629 chaotic free -for -all. This is what fascinates 00:10:08.629 --> 00:10:11.110 me the most. It wasn't some hippie commune where 00:10:11.110 --> 00:10:12.789 everyone just did whatever they felt like doing. 00:10:13.029 --> 00:10:16.950 It was a strict dictatorship. Doc? Ran that van 00:10:16.950 --> 00:10:19.309 like a boot camp. Absolutely. He was the commander. 00:10:19.490 --> 00:10:21.850 Yeah. And the overarching mission of this boot 00:10:21.850 --> 00:10:24.909 camp was health, but not health in the way you 00:10:24.909 --> 00:10:27.710 or I might casually think of it. He had a very 00:10:27.710 --> 00:10:30.769 specific, rigid philosophy. Let's talk about 00:10:30.769 --> 00:10:33.179 the Paskowitz regime. Where do the actual rules? 00:10:33.320 --> 00:10:35.559 Well, first and foremost, surfing was mandatory. 00:10:35.879 --> 00:10:37.659 Which sounds cool at first until you realize 00:10:37.659 --> 00:10:39.240 you have to do it every single day whether you 00:10:39.240 --> 00:10:41.940 want to or not. Exactly. It wasn't just playtime. 00:10:42.039 --> 00:10:44.679 It was rigorous training. Everyone was expected 00:10:44.679 --> 00:10:47.259 to improve their skills daily. Every morning 00:10:47.259 --> 00:10:49.700 they were out in the water. But the diet, the 00:10:49.700 --> 00:10:52.200 diet is where it gets really intense. Digi is 00:10:52.200 --> 00:10:53.980 the word that comes to mind. Tell us about breakfast. 00:10:54.480 --> 00:10:56.960 Doc achieved this sort of health guru status 00:10:56.960 --> 00:10:59.379 eventually. He was actually way ahead of his 00:10:59.379 --> 00:11:02.279 time in rejecting processed foods, refined sugars, 00:11:02.500 --> 00:11:04.919 and the whole fast food culture that was booming 00:11:04.919 --> 00:11:07.240 in the 60s and 70s. He was definitely onto something 00:11:07.240 --> 00:11:09.340 there. He was, but he took it to an absolute 00:11:09.340 --> 00:11:12.559 extreme. He advocated for natural diets, very 00:11:12.559 --> 00:11:15.600 low in fat. One of his children later described 00:11:15.600 --> 00:11:19.340 their stable breakfast meal as a multigrain gruel. 00:11:19.740 --> 00:11:23.200 Gruel. I am picturing this gray, flavorless paste. 00:11:23.820 --> 00:11:25.759 much exactly what it was. No sugar, no milk, 00:11:25.840 --> 00:11:29.100 just raw functional fuel. Doc fundamentally believed 00:11:29.100 --> 00:11:31.220 that food was for function, not for pleasure. 00:11:31.399 --> 00:11:33.120 He even believed that feeling a little hunger 00:11:33.120 --> 00:11:35.320 was good for you. He kept the kids incredibly 00:11:35.320 --> 00:11:38.159 lean. So you have these nine kids waking up in 00:11:38.159 --> 00:11:41.279 a cramped 24 -foot van, eating literal paste, 00:11:41.500 --> 00:11:43.580 and then being marched into the cold ocean to 00:11:43.580 --> 00:11:46.379 train. It feels less like the endless summer 00:11:46.379 --> 00:11:48.600 and more like ancient Spartan training. That 00:11:48.600 --> 00:11:51.519 is a fantastic analogy. He was raising Spartans. 00:11:51.559 --> 00:11:53.620 He wanted them to be tough, highly resilient, 00:11:53.659 --> 00:11:55.600 and completely independent of what he saw as 00:11:55.600 --> 00:11:58.159 the soft American lifestyle. He viewed modern 00:11:58.159 --> 00:12:00.460 comfort almost as a disease. But here is the 00:12:00.460 --> 00:12:02.419 thing that really rubs people the wrong way, 00:12:02.460 --> 00:12:04.500 and we have to dig into it. There's one thing 00:12:04.500 --> 00:12:07.139 to control their diet and their exercise. It 00:12:07.139 --> 00:12:09.700 is another thing entirely to control their minds. 00:12:10.519 --> 00:12:13.379 Which brings us to his philosophy on knowledge 00:12:13.379 --> 00:12:16.940 versus wisdom. This is undoubtedly the most controversial 00:12:16.940 --> 00:12:20.080 part of the Paskowitz legacy. Remember our context 00:12:20.080 --> 00:12:23.389 here. Doc is a Stanford man. He even spent time 00:12:23.389 --> 00:12:26.090 teaching at community colleges like Palomar College. 00:12:26.350 --> 00:12:29.250 He knew exactly what the value of a formal education 00:12:29.250 --> 00:12:31.970 was. And yet he completely banned it for his 00:12:31.970 --> 00:12:34.750 own kids. Completely. None of the nine Pasquitz 00:12:34.750 --> 00:12:37.009 children received any formal education while 00:12:37.009 --> 00:12:38.750 they were living on the road. No high school, 00:12:38.870 --> 00:12:41.350 no elementary school. Did he even homeschool 00:12:41.350 --> 00:12:43.309 them? Was there some kind of curriculum in the 00:12:43.309 --> 00:12:46.419 van? Not in any traditional sense, no. There 00:12:46.419 --> 00:12:49.059 were no textbooks. There were no exams. Doc's 00:12:49.059 --> 00:12:51.559 entire philosophy was based on a very sharp distinction 00:12:51.559 --> 00:12:54.700 between knowledge and wisdom. Break that down 00:12:54.700 --> 00:12:56.779 for us. What was his argument? He believed that 00:12:56.779 --> 00:12:59.840 formal school systems were just factories. He 00:12:59.840 --> 00:13:02.059 thought that formal education homogenized the 00:13:02.059 --> 00:13:04.320 mind, that it taught you to think like everyone 00:13:04.320 --> 00:13:07.100 else, to just be a compliant cog in the machine. 00:13:07.539 --> 00:13:10.220 The source material shows he viewed formal education 00:13:10.220 --> 00:13:14.279 as literally dangerous to young minds. Dangerous. 00:13:14.659 --> 00:13:17.120 That is a heavy accusation coming from a guy 00:13:17.120 --> 00:13:19.799 with a medical degree. He believed that true 00:13:19.799 --> 00:13:22.879 wisdom came from real -world experience. From 00:13:22.879 --> 00:13:25.620 travel, from meeting everyday people in beach 00:13:25.620 --> 00:13:28.259 parking lots, from negotiating with local mechanics 00:13:28.259 --> 00:13:30.659 when the van broke down, from learning to read 00:13:30.659 --> 00:13:33.120 the currents of the ocean. He wanted his children 00:13:33.120 --> 00:13:35.379 to be street smart in the deepest possible sense 00:13:35.379 --> 00:13:37.899 of the term. He wanted them to live in the world, 00:13:37.960 --> 00:13:40.340 not just read about it in a classroom. I had 00:13:40.340 --> 00:13:42.539 to play devil's advocate here, though. That sounds 00:13:42.539 --> 00:13:44.779 very romantic, but isn't it also incredibly limiting? 00:13:45.120 --> 00:13:47.779 I mean, street smarts are great, but they don't 00:13:47.779 --> 00:13:50.139 help you understand calculus or world history 00:13:50.139 --> 00:13:52.940 or even how to write a standard resume. That 00:13:52.940 --> 00:13:56.940 is the critical flaw in his experiment. He personally 00:13:56.940 --> 00:13:58.700 had the safety net. He had the Stanford degree. 00:13:58.919 --> 00:14:01.379 He could always go back to being a doctor if 00:14:01.379 --> 00:14:03.500 the surfing lifestyle failed. And in fact, he 00:14:03.500 --> 00:14:05.240 occasionally did pick up short -term medical 00:14:05.240 --> 00:14:08.620 work just to fund the gas tank. But his children, 00:14:08.899 --> 00:14:11.980 they had zero safety net. He cut the net away 00:14:11.980 --> 00:14:14.100 entirely. He burned their bridges before they 00:14:14.100 --> 00:14:16.259 even had a chance to cross them. Precisely. He 00:14:16.259 --> 00:14:18.879 bet their entire futures on his personal philosophy. 00:14:19.159 --> 00:14:21.340 So the million -dollar question. Did the bet 00:14:21.340 --> 00:14:23.700 actually pay off? Were they successful? Well, 00:14:23.759 --> 00:14:26.179 it depends entirely on what metrics you use to 00:14:26.179 --> 00:14:28.519 define success. If you define it by the metrics 00:14:28.519 --> 00:14:31.139 dog valued surfing ability, physical health, 00:14:31.220 --> 00:14:33.840 artistic output, then yes, it was a massive success. 00:14:34.059 --> 00:14:35.799 They became known as the first family of surfing. 00:14:35.919 --> 00:14:38.500 They did. They were absolute icons in that world. 00:14:38.600 --> 00:14:41.000 For instance, Israel Paskowitz Izzy became a 00:14:41.000 --> 00:14:43.100 world class competitive surfer. He won the U 00:14:43.100 --> 00:14:45.740 .S. Longboarding Championship in 1989. You also 00:14:45.740 --> 00:14:48.000 had significant commercial success with endorsement 00:14:48.000 --> 00:14:51.179 income and creative output, too. Salvador became 00:14:51.179 --> 00:14:53.679 a successful screenwriter and producer. Adam 00:14:53.679 --> 00:14:55.840 and Josh started a rock band called The Flies. 00:14:55.940 --> 00:14:59.000 The Flies. Got you where I want you. That song 00:14:59.000 --> 00:15:01.480 was absolutely everywhere in the late 90s. Right. 00:15:01.539 --> 00:15:04.120 So clearly, these kids weren't unintelligent. 00:15:04.139 --> 00:15:06.960 They were highly creative, driven, and talented. 00:15:07.340 --> 00:15:09.600 You could certainly argue that the lack of formal 00:15:09.600 --> 00:15:11.940 schooling allowed their natural creativity to 00:15:11.940 --> 00:15:15.039 flourish uncensored by institutional rules. But, 00:15:15.039 --> 00:15:17.539 and there's always a but, when we talk about 00:15:17.539 --> 00:15:19.610 this family, we really have to look at the human 00:15:19.610 --> 00:15:22.730 cost. Because you simply cannot lock nine kids 00:15:22.730 --> 00:15:25.789 in a van for two decades without creating some 00:15:25.789 --> 00:15:29.330 serious psychological scar tissue. Which brings 00:15:29.330 --> 00:15:31.730 us to the shadow side of the story. This is where 00:15:31.730 --> 00:15:34.309 the narrative sharply shifts from the sunny legend 00:15:34.309 --> 00:15:37.570 to the gritty reality. For years, the Paskowitz 00:15:37.570 --> 00:15:40.649 family was this mythical, perfect entity in surfing 00:15:40.649 --> 00:15:43.590 magazines. But in 2007, a documentary called 00:15:43.590 --> 00:15:46.169 Surfwise came out. Directed by Doug Prey. And 00:15:46.169 --> 00:15:47.690 I've read about this. It was definitely not a 00:15:47.690 --> 00:15:50.190 promotional puff piece. No, it was a deep, often 00:15:50.190 --> 00:15:52.710 painful confessional. And here is a detail from 00:15:52.710 --> 00:15:54.870 the sources that I find absolutely staggering. 00:15:55.350 --> 00:15:57.389 Doc Paskowitz attended the premiere. He went 00:15:57.389 --> 00:15:59.990 to the screenings. But he never actually watched 00:15:59.990 --> 00:16:02.029 the film. Wait, explain that. He was physically 00:16:02.029 --> 00:16:04.559 in the theater. He would go to the event, shake 00:16:04.559 --> 00:16:07.220 hands, smile for the press cameras, and then 00:16:07.220 --> 00:16:09.320 he would wait out in the lobby or just leave 00:16:09.320 --> 00:16:12.399 while the movie actually played. He point -blank 00:16:12.399 --> 00:16:15.100 refused to see the mirror that the film held 00:16:15.100 --> 00:16:17.700 up to his life. That is the ultimate form of 00:16:17.700 --> 00:16:20.080 denial. Sort of a, I lived it, I don't need to 00:16:20.080 --> 00:16:23.259 see it attitude. Or maybe it was more like, I 00:16:23.259 --> 00:16:25.159 can't bear to hear how my kids actually felt 00:16:25.159 --> 00:16:28.600 about me. I heavily lean toward the latter. Because 00:16:28.600 --> 00:16:31.100 the film revealed what was described as a very 00:16:31.100 --> 00:16:34.559 uneasy atmosphere, the kids didn't paint a picture 00:16:34.559 --> 00:16:37.519 of endless summer joy. They spoke openly about 00:16:37.519 --> 00:16:39.820 holding very deep resentments. Who were the main 00:16:39.820 --> 00:16:42.340 grievances they had? The lack of education was 00:16:42.340 --> 00:16:45.120 a huge one. Many of them felt completely crippled 00:16:45.120 --> 00:16:46.659 when they finally stepped out of the van and 00:16:46.659 --> 00:16:49.519 into the real world. They felt stupid. They didn't 00:16:49.519 --> 00:16:51.480 know how to open a bank account, how to interact 00:16:51.480 --> 00:16:53.679 with normal society. They felt like aliens. And 00:16:53.679 --> 00:16:55.700 there was something darker too, right? The privacy 00:16:55.700 --> 00:16:59.789 issue in the van. Yes. In a 24 -foot van, sexual 00:16:59.789 --> 00:17:02.769 privacy between the parents is essentially impossible. 00:17:03.529 --> 00:17:05.950 The children were exposed to their parents' sexual 00:17:05.950 --> 00:17:08.289 activity in a way that was unavoidable given 00:17:08.289 --> 00:17:11.049 the space, but also deeply inappropriate for 00:17:11.049 --> 00:17:13.849 kids to be around. That is just a trauma. You 00:17:13.849 --> 00:17:16.410 can't spin that as being bohemian or natural. 00:17:16.470 --> 00:17:18.529 That is psychologically damaging. It blurred 00:17:18.529 --> 00:17:20.450 vital boundaries that children fundamentally 00:17:20.450 --> 00:17:23.009 need for their own security. And then on top 00:17:23.009 --> 00:17:25.529 of that, there were the rules. Doc was a tyrant. 00:17:25.950 --> 00:17:29.210 It was his way or the highway, literally. If 00:17:29.210 --> 00:17:31.430 you disagreed with his philosophy, you were seen 00:17:31.430 --> 00:17:34.009 as crushing the family's vibe. Did anyone manage 00:17:34.009 --> 00:17:36.769 to break out early? Yes, David, the eldest son. 00:17:36.890 --> 00:17:39.730 He left the van at age 23 to find his own life. 00:17:39.970 --> 00:17:42.170 23 seems pretty late to be running away from 00:17:42.170 --> 00:17:45.069 home. It is late. But think about the psychology 00:17:45.069 --> 00:17:48.529 of the situation. When you were raised in a sort 00:17:48.529 --> 00:17:51.150 of cult -like environment, and I use that term 00:17:51.150 --> 00:17:53.529 loosely, but it fits, the isolationist dynamic 00:17:53.529 --> 00:17:57.240 they had. Leaving is terrifying. The outside 00:17:57.240 --> 00:17:59.900 world is framed as the enemy. Doc had taught 00:17:59.900 --> 00:18:01.740 them their whole lives that the world was sick 00:18:01.740 --> 00:18:04.799 and the van was the only healthy place. So leaving 00:18:04.799 --> 00:18:07.259 meant entering the sick world completely alone. 00:18:07.460 --> 00:18:10.180 And without a high school diploma. Exactly. So 00:18:10.180 --> 00:18:12.819 David leaving was a massive rupture for the family. 00:18:12.960 --> 00:18:14.940 And there were various periods of estrangement 00:18:14.940 --> 00:18:16.640 where different children wouldn't speak to their 00:18:16.640 --> 00:18:19.000 parents for a long time. But and this is the 00:18:19.000 --> 00:18:21.480 twist that makes this whole story so human. They 00:18:21.480 --> 00:18:23.980 didn't stay away forever. No. By the time SurfWise 00:18:23.980 --> 00:18:26.299 was being filmed, all the children had reconciled 00:18:26.299 --> 00:18:28.279 with Doc and Juliet. Why do you think that is? 00:18:28.319 --> 00:18:31.220 Is it some form of Stockholm syndrome? Or is 00:18:31.220 --> 00:18:33.920 it just deep family love? I think it's what psychologists 00:18:33.920 --> 00:18:36.079 call a trauma bond. They went through something 00:18:36.079 --> 00:18:38.240 together that literally no one else on Earth 00:18:38.240 --> 00:18:41.099 could ever understand. Only a Paskovitz knows 00:18:41.099 --> 00:18:43.559 what it is like to be a Paskovitz. They are a 00:18:43.559 --> 00:18:46.119 tribe in the truest sense. They fought. They 00:18:46.119 --> 00:18:48.539 screamed. It was traumatic. But they remained 00:18:48.539 --> 00:18:51.400 a tight -knit unit. That first family of surfing 00:18:51.400 --> 00:18:54.059 title held true despite all the internal friction. 00:18:54.339 --> 00:18:56.920 It's incredibly complicated. It's messy. But 00:18:56.920 --> 00:19:00.079 it's real. Now, I want to pivot to the final 00:19:00.079 --> 00:19:03.720 act of Doc's life. Because just when you think 00:19:03.720 --> 00:19:06.259 you have him completely pegged as this selfish, 00:19:06.480 --> 00:19:09.200 controlling patriarch, he does something incredibly 00:19:09.200 --> 00:19:11.599 selfless. Let's talk about Surfing for Peace. 00:19:11.859 --> 00:19:13.819 This is a fascinating chapter. It's August 2007. 00:19:14.589 --> 00:19:16.569 Doc is in his 80s at this point. He's an old 00:19:16.569 --> 00:19:18.609 man. He is, but he reads an article in the LA 00:19:18.609 --> 00:19:20.509 Times about the situation in the Gaza Strip. 00:19:20.609 --> 00:19:22.390 And just for context for you listening, 2007 00:19:22.390 --> 00:19:25.990 in Gaza was an extremely volatile time. Yes. 00:19:26.009 --> 00:19:28.730 To provide the geopolitical facts here, Hamas 00:19:28.730 --> 00:19:31.589 had just taken control of Gaza in June of 2007. 00:19:32.150 --> 00:19:35.549 The region was incredibly tense. Israel had imposed 00:19:35.549 --> 00:19:38.190 a strict blockade, and they were only allowing 00:19:38.190 --> 00:19:40.589 essential humanitarian supplies to cross the 00:19:40.589 --> 00:19:43.430 border. Food. medicine, that sort of thing. And 00:19:43.430 --> 00:19:45.769 Doc reads this article about this blockaded zone 00:19:45.769 --> 00:19:48.029 and what does he take away from it? Well, the 00:19:48.029 --> 00:19:50.230 article specifically mentioned that there was 00:19:50.230 --> 00:19:52.529 a small community of surfers in Gaza, but they 00:19:52.529 --> 00:19:54.329 didn't have any surfboards. They were trying 00:19:54.329 --> 00:19:57.210 to surf by sharing broken pieces of foam. And 00:19:57.210 --> 00:19:59.789 Doc, this Jewish doctor who had tried to join 00:19:59.789 --> 00:20:02.230 the Israeli army back in the 50s, looks at that 00:20:02.230 --> 00:20:04.630 and thinks, that is a tragedy I can actually 00:20:04.630 --> 00:20:07.329 fix. To him, a surfer without a board was almost 00:20:07.329 --> 00:20:09.230 worse than a patient without a medicine. In a 00:20:09.230 --> 00:20:12.490 way, yes. He viewed surfing as a universal language, 00:20:12.589 --> 00:20:15.220 almost a fundamental human right. So he launches 00:20:15.220 --> 00:20:18.500 this project called Surfing for Peace. But practically 00:20:18.500 --> 00:20:20.680 speaking, how do you get surfboards into a highly 00:20:20.680 --> 00:20:23.220 secured, blockaded zone? You can't exactly just 00:20:23.220 --> 00:20:26.480 ship them through the mail. No, it required serious 00:20:26.480 --> 00:20:30.380 negotiation. You had to personally persuade the 00:20:30.380 --> 00:20:32.099 Israeli government and the defense forces to 00:20:32.099 --> 00:20:34.740 let them through. So Doc teamed up with his son 00:20:34.740 --> 00:20:37.720 David, the same one who walked away at 23, as 00:20:37.720 --> 00:20:40.440 well as Arthur Rochevan and the legendary Kelly 00:20:40.440 --> 00:20:42.960 Slater. Basically the Michael Jordan of surfing. 00:20:43.140 --> 00:20:45.880 Exactly. Having Kelly Slater involved brought 00:20:45.880 --> 00:20:48.599 massive global attention to the effort. They 00:20:48.599 --> 00:20:50.799 also worked with an organization called the One 00:20:50.799 --> 00:20:54.819 Voice Movement, which is a pro -Israeli -Palestinian 00:20:54.819 --> 00:20:57.500 peace organization. And was his pitch to the 00:20:57.500 --> 00:21:00.509 government? Why let surfboards in? Duck's core 00:21:00.509 --> 00:21:03.250 philosophy here was about using the shared experience 00:21:03.250 --> 00:21:05.910 of surfing to bridge cultural and political barriers. 00:21:06.269 --> 00:21:08.630 He argued that if people from opposite sides 00:21:08.630 --> 00:21:10.470 are out in the water catching waves together, 00:21:10.589 --> 00:21:12.930 they aren't fighting. He believed surfing could 00:21:12.930 --> 00:21:15.569 bridge those divides. And against all odds, he 00:21:15.569 --> 00:21:17.990 actually pulled it off. He did. They successfully 00:21:17.990 --> 00:21:20.269 crossed the border, delivered the boards, and 00:21:20.269 --> 00:21:22.710 even held a follow -up concert in Tel Aviv later 00:21:22.710 --> 00:21:25.519 that year. I just love the visual of this 86 00:21:25.519 --> 00:21:28.299 -year -old man standing on a beach in Gaza handing 00:21:28.299 --> 00:21:31.619 a surfboard to a local kid. It complicates his 00:21:31.619 --> 00:21:34.000 character so much. He wasn't just the tyrant 00:21:34.000 --> 00:21:36.200 of the camper van. He was also this visionary 00:21:36.200 --> 00:21:38.779 who believed in the power of the ocean. He truly 00:21:38.779 --> 00:21:40.859 believed the ocean didn't care about your politics 00:21:40.859 --> 00:21:43.119 or your religion. It was the one place where 00:21:43.119 --> 00:21:45.900 everyone was completely equal. It connects right 00:21:45.900 --> 00:21:48.559 back to his time in Israel in the 50s. So let's 00:21:48.559 --> 00:21:51.279 look at the end of the road. Doc's legacy and 00:21:51.279 --> 00:21:54.259 his final years. He lived a remarkably long time. 00:21:54.319 --> 00:21:57.299 He made it to 93. So the multigrain drill actually 00:21:57.299 --> 00:22:00.009 worked. It certainly seems to have done the trick. 00:22:00.190 --> 00:22:03.089 He passed away on November 10th, 2014, in Newport 00:22:03.089 --> 00:22:05.349 Beach. And frankly, it was only a hip surgery 00:22:05.349 --> 00:22:07.609 earlier that year that finally caused his decline. 00:22:07.950 --> 00:22:10.289 The sources note he was actively surfing well 00:22:10.289 --> 00:22:13.109 into his late 80s. That is just incredible longevity. 00:22:13.490 --> 00:22:15.509 He even authored a book called Surfing and Health, 00:22:15.650 --> 00:22:18.190 which came out in 1997 and was republished in 00:22:18.190 --> 00:22:21.450 2007. He received numerous accolades. He was 00:22:21.450 --> 00:22:23.329 inducted into the Southern California Jewish 00:22:23.329 --> 00:22:26.089 Sports Hall of Fame in 2000. He was referred 00:22:26.089 --> 00:22:28.319 to as a legend by Everyone in the community, 00:22:28.440 --> 00:22:30.619 including Kelly Slater. There was even Hollywood 00:22:30.619 --> 00:22:33.299 interest in his life. Yes. Variety reported in 00:22:33.299 --> 00:22:36.279 2010 that Sean Penn expressed serious interest 00:22:36.279 --> 00:22:38.859 in producing and starring in a movie about Doc. 00:22:39.039 --> 00:22:41.259 Which would be absolutely perfect casting. It 00:22:41.259 --> 00:22:43.779 really would be. But now that he is gone, we 00:22:43.779 --> 00:22:46.039 are left to make sense of the experiment he ran. 00:22:46.240 --> 00:22:48.630 So let's synthesize all of this. We have a man 00:22:48.630 --> 00:22:51.710 who was essentially a walking bundle of contradictions, 00:22:51.769 --> 00:22:54.529 a highly trained doctor who hated the medical 00:22:54.529 --> 00:22:57.569 establishment, a father who clearly loved his 00:22:57.569 --> 00:23:00.349 kids but denied them basic education and privacy. 00:23:00.859 --> 00:23:03.839 a Jewish man who championed Palestinian surfers. 00:23:03.960 --> 00:23:06.619 He forces us to look at our own priorities. We 00:23:06.619 --> 00:23:09.000 live in a modern society that values security 00:23:09.000 --> 00:23:11.819 above almost everything else. We insure everything, 00:23:12.000 --> 00:23:14.259 we plan everything out, we get educated for jobs 00:23:14.259 --> 00:23:16.359 we might not even like just to have stability. 00:23:17.079 --> 00:23:20.160 Doc Paskowitz valued experience above all else. 00:23:20.359 --> 00:23:22.619 But the cost of prioritizing that pure experience 00:23:22.619 --> 00:23:24.960 was creating a lot of chaos for the people around 00:23:24.960 --> 00:23:28.480 him. Chaos, yes, but also an incredible vitality. 00:23:28.539 --> 00:23:30.900 He lived every single day on his own terms. He 00:23:30.900 --> 00:23:33.019 certainly didn't sleepwalk through life. Here's 00:23:33.019 --> 00:23:35.160 the big takeaway for you listening to this. We 00:23:35.160 --> 00:23:37.720 all have scripts we are following. Doc burned 00:23:37.720 --> 00:23:40.460 his script. But when you burn the script, you 00:23:40.460 --> 00:23:42.279 have to write a new one every single morning. 00:23:42.380 --> 00:23:45.700 And that is exhausting. And sometimes it inevitably 00:23:45.700 --> 00:23:48.150 hurts the people closest to you. That is the 00:23:48.150 --> 00:23:51.210 ultimate tradeoff. You can have total unbridled 00:23:51.210 --> 00:23:53.349 freedom or you can have stability and comfort. 00:23:53.549 --> 00:23:56.230 You very rarely get to have both. I want to leave 00:23:56.230 --> 00:23:59.130 you with one final thought to mull over. Doc 00:23:59.130 --> 00:24:01.809 firmly believed that traditional education was 00:24:01.809 --> 00:24:04.819 dangerous because it homogenized the mind. That 00:24:04.819 --> 00:24:07.079 it just made us all think exactly the same way. 00:24:07.299 --> 00:24:10.460 Now look at our world today. In an age of constant 00:24:10.460 --> 00:24:13.240 information overload, where we are all doom -scrolling 00:24:13.240 --> 00:24:15.640 the exact same social feeds, reading the same 00:24:15.640 --> 00:24:17.960 news algorithms, watching the same viral shows. 00:24:18.559 --> 00:24:21.539 Was he actually right? Is there a real danger 00:24:21.539 --> 00:24:24.420 in homogenizing our minds? Or did he just replace 00:24:24.420 --> 00:24:27.140 society's form of control with his own? Did he 00:24:27.140 --> 00:24:29.259 free his children from the machine only to imprison 00:24:29.259 --> 00:24:31.779 them inside his own ego in that van? That is 00:24:31.779 --> 00:24:33.319 the question you have to answer for yourself. 00:24:33.799 --> 00:24:35.539 And I really don't think there was an easy answer. 00:24:35.779 --> 00:24:38.480 But I bet the view from the window of that van 00:24:38.480 --> 00:24:42.980 was pretty spectacular. Just don't ask about 00:24:42.980 --> 00:24:44.839 what was for breakfast. Thanks for joining us 00:24:44.839 --> 00:24:48.299 on this deep dive. Go catch a wave or maybe just 00:24:48.299 --> 00:24:50.480 take a different unplanned route to work today. 00:24:50.539 --> 00:24:52.660 See what happens when you break the script. Goodbye. 00:24:52.960 --> 00:24:53.460 See ya.