WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.180 I want you to try a little visualization experiment 00:00:02.180 --> 00:00:04.099 with me to kick things off. Okay, I'm ready. 00:00:04.480 --> 00:00:08.880 So imagine it's a Saturday afternoon, maybe it's 00:00:08.880 --> 00:00:11.220 1950, maybe it's today, and you're just scrolling 00:00:11.220 --> 00:00:13.599 through a classic movie channel. Right. And you 00:00:13.599 --> 00:00:16.780 land on a Western, you know the exact scene immediately. 00:00:17.100 --> 00:00:19.980 The saloon doors swing open. Exactly. The saloon 00:00:19.980 --> 00:00:23.800 doors swing open, the music swells up, lots of 00:00:23.800 --> 00:00:27.079 brass, lots of sweeping strings. Right. And in 00:00:27.079 --> 00:00:30.179 walks the hero. White hat, perfect teeth, you 00:00:30.179 --> 00:00:32.579 know, the fringe on his jacket that somehow isn't 00:00:32.579 --> 00:00:34.039 dirty at all, even though he's been riding a 00:00:34.039 --> 00:00:36.359 horse for three days. It's always spotless. Always. 00:00:36.840 --> 00:00:40.020 He walks up to the bar. But I want you to look 00:00:40.020 --> 00:00:42.619 past him. Look at the guy leaning against the 00:00:42.619 --> 00:00:44.920 wall in the back. Right. Look at that guy. He's 00:00:44.920 --> 00:00:47.479 not the main villain. He's the guy standing directly 00:00:47.479 --> 00:00:49.899 behind the villain. Yeah, the muscle. Right. 00:00:49.960 --> 00:00:51.920 He looks tough, maybe a little weathered. He's 00:00:51.920 --> 00:00:54.799 got a scar or a crooked nose or he's just got 00:00:54.799 --> 00:00:56.719 that look of someone who has actually worked 00:00:56.719 --> 00:00:59.340 for a living. And then five minutes later, a 00:00:59.340 --> 00:01:01.780 brawl inevitably breaks out. This guy throws 00:01:01.780 --> 00:01:05.739 one punch, misses wildly, gets hit in the jaw 00:01:05.739 --> 00:01:08.700 by the hero, falls backward over a breakaway 00:01:08.700 --> 00:01:11.099 table. And you never see him again. And you never 00:01:11.099 --> 00:01:13.980 see him again. The disposable bad guy. Henchman 00:01:13.980 --> 00:01:16.379 number three. Precisely. Henchman number three. 00:01:16.400 --> 00:01:19.780 If you have ever watched the old Cisco Kid shows 00:01:19.780 --> 00:01:24.459 or Heroes of the Alamo or literally hundreds 00:01:24.459 --> 00:01:27.099 of other Westerns from the Golden Age, you've 00:01:27.099 --> 00:01:29.799 seen this man's face. Oh, absolutely. You've 00:01:29.799 --> 00:01:31.980 probably seen him get fake shot off a roof or 00:01:31.980 --> 00:01:34.400 fall off a horse or get dragged through the dirt 00:01:34.400 --> 00:01:37.739 behind a wagon. But I guarantee you do not know 00:01:37.739 --> 00:01:40.750 his name. And honestly, that is a massive oversight 00:01:40.750 --> 00:01:43.609 in film history. Yeah. Because while the stars 00:01:43.609 --> 00:01:45.670 got their names on the poster, people like him 00:01:45.670 --> 00:01:47.909 were the actual, you know, the internal combustion 00:01:47.909 --> 00:01:50.590 engine of the industry. The machinery. Exactly. 00:01:50.909 --> 00:01:53.209 Without them, the hero is literally just a guy 00:01:53.209 --> 00:01:55.530 in a costume punching the empty air. Well, today 00:01:55.530 --> 00:01:57.269 we are pulling that guy out of the background. 00:01:57.290 --> 00:01:59.329 We're putting him center stage. We are doing 00:01:59.329 --> 00:02:01.909 a deep dive into the life of Carl Matthews. Yes, 00:02:01.909 --> 00:02:05.090 we are. And let me tell you. Looking at the sources 00:02:05.090 --> 00:02:07.590 we have compiled for this deep dive, we're talking 00:02:07.590 --> 00:02:10.830 biographical records, extensive filmographies, 00:02:10.930 --> 00:02:14.210 a bunch of census data. This is not your typical 00:02:14.210 --> 00:02:16.750 Hollywood story. No, it's not the classic star 00:02:16.750 --> 00:02:19.189 gets discovered sipping a milkshake at Schwab's 00:02:19.189 --> 00:02:21.449 pharmacy kind of thing. Not even close. This 00:02:21.449 --> 00:02:24.669 is a story about the absolute grind. We're talking 00:02:24.669 --> 00:02:29.430 about a man who appeared in over 200 films, shorts, 00:02:29.509 --> 00:02:34.620 and TV shows over a 33 -year career. 200. I mean, 00:02:34.620 --> 00:02:36.699 that number just completely blows my mind. It's 00:02:36.699 --> 00:02:39.240 a factory number. It really is. And that's really 00:02:39.240 --> 00:02:41.360 our mission for this deep dive, right? To look 00:02:41.360 --> 00:02:43.520 past those marquee names and try to understand 00:02:43.520 --> 00:02:46.139 the machinery of old Hollywood. And we're doing 00:02:46.139 --> 00:02:48.680 it through the lens of this one incredibly hardworking 00:02:48.680 --> 00:02:51.439 guy. A guy who spent decades falling off horses 00:02:51.439 --> 00:02:53.759 just to make the hero look good. While dealing 00:02:53.759 --> 00:02:58.139 with a reality that was far grittier than anything 00:02:58.139 --> 00:03:00.300 written in those scripts. So let's peel back 00:03:00.300 --> 00:03:03.939 the curtain here. Who was Carl Matthews? Because 00:03:03.939 --> 00:03:05.960 just looking at his resume, looking at where 00:03:05.960 --> 00:03:07.919 he came from, he might have been the toughest 00:03:07.919 --> 00:03:11.159 guy on any set he walked onto. Regardless of 00:03:11.159 --> 00:03:13.020 who was playing the sheriff that day. Exactly. 00:03:13.020 --> 00:03:15.060 He certainly had the background to back it up. 00:03:15.060 --> 00:03:17.599 But, you know, even pinning down his origin is 00:03:17.599 --> 00:03:20.219 a little tricky. The sources give us a bit of 00:03:20.219 --> 00:03:22.319 a mystery right out of the gate regarding his 00:03:22.319 --> 00:03:25.120 age. Yeah, I saw that in the notes. Pretty big 00:03:25.120 --> 00:03:27.460 discrepancy between the census data and his death 00:03:27.460 --> 00:03:29.520 certificate, right? It's a significant one. So 00:03:29.520 --> 00:03:33.180 if you track the census data, 1910, 1920, all 00:03:33.180 --> 00:03:36.520 the way up to 1940, the records are remarkably 00:03:36.520 --> 00:03:39.719 consistent. They all point to him being born 00:03:39.719 --> 00:03:44.599 on February 19th, 1903. But if you pull his death 00:03:44.599 --> 00:03:48.280 certificate from 1959, it lists his birth year 00:03:48.280 --> 00:03:52.360 as 1899. That's a four -year gap. What's your 00:03:52.360 --> 00:03:54.180 read on that? Like, was he aging himself down 00:03:54.180 --> 00:03:56.300 for Hollywood? You know, the whole, oh, I'm not 00:03:56.300 --> 00:03:58.979 40, I'm a spry 36. I can still jump off that 00:03:58.979 --> 00:04:01.300 balcony routine. It's very possible. I mean, 00:04:01.319 --> 00:04:03.419 Hollywood has always been hyper age conscious, 00:04:03.599 --> 00:04:06.340 even for stuntmen. Sure. If a casting director 00:04:06.340 --> 00:04:08.759 thinks you're too old to safely fall off a roof, 00:04:08.860 --> 00:04:11.780 you just don't eat that week. But it could also 00:04:11.780 --> 00:04:14.900 go the other way. Maybe he aged himself up earlier 00:04:14.900 --> 00:04:17.519 in life. To get a job. Or to join the military. 00:04:17.519 --> 00:04:20.019 We see that a lot in official records from that 00:04:20.019 --> 00:04:23.360 era. Kids lying about their age to enlist. Wow, 00:04:23.379 --> 00:04:25.740 yeah. We can't say definitively which one is 00:04:25.740 --> 00:04:28.399 the truth, but it adds this really fascinating 00:04:28.399 --> 00:04:31.139 layer of ambiguity to his history right from 00:04:31.139 --> 00:04:33.939 the very start. A guy who shifted his identity 00:04:33.939 --> 00:04:36.980 to fit the need of the moment. Exactly. What 00:04:36.980 --> 00:04:38.879 isn't ambiguous, though, is where he came from. 00:04:39.310 --> 00:04:41.610 Because this was definitely not a kid from the 00:04:41.610 --> 00:04:44.910 Hollywood Hills with a dad already in the studio 00:04:44.910 --> 00:04:47.490 system. Far from it. He was born on the Cherokee 00:04:47.490 --> 00:04:50.709 Reservation in Oklahoma. His parents were Sam 00:04:50.709 --> 00:04:53.170 and Hattie Matthews. And a really crucial piece 00:04:53.170 --> 00:04:55.329 of data we pulled from the sources here is that 00:04:55.329 --> 00:04:58.529 he was listed on the Dawes Rolls. Let's unpack 00:04:58.529 --> 00:05:00.350 that for a second for the listener. The Dawes 00:05:00.350 --> 00:05:02.269 Rolls, that sounds very official. But what does 00:05:02.269 --> 00:05:04.899 it actually mean for his life? So the Dawes Rules 00:05:04.899 --> 00:05:07.959 were the official federal records used to register 00:05:07.959 --> 00:05:10.360 members of the five civilized tribes around the 00:05:10.360 --> 00:05:12.139 turn of the century. And those were? The Cherokee, 00:05:12.319 --> 00:05:15.620 Creek, Choctaw, Chickasaw, and Seminole tribes. 00:05:15.920 --> 00:05:18.579 Right. Being on that role meant the U .S. government 00:05:18.579 --> 00:05:21.740 officially recognized his lineage. According 00:05:21.740 --> 00:05:24.819 to the records, Carl was one -eighth Cherokee. 00:05:25.019 --> 00:05:28.180 Okay, so he grows up in Muskogee, Oklahoma. The 00:05:28.180 --> 00:05:31.980 records also show his father was a butcher. That 00:05:31.980 --> 00:05:33.879 paints a pretty specific picture, doesn't it? 00:05:33.920 --> 00:05:37.860 It does. Very grounded, working class, dealing 00:05:37.860 --> 00:05:41.199 with physical, messy labor from day one. Exactly. 00:05:41.199 --> 00:05:44.120 And this is where the contrast with modern actors 00:05:44.120 --> 00:05:46.620 is so sharp. You know, today, if you want to 00:05:46.620 --> 00:05:48.500 be an action star, maybe you go to drama school. 00:05:48.639 --> 00:05:50.620 Right, you take stage combat classes. Or you 00:05:50.620 --> 00:05:52.759 hire a personal trainer for six months to get 00:05:52.759 --> 00:05:54.579 completely shredded on chicken and broccoli. 00:05:54.860 --> 00:05:57.420 Right. Carl Matthews. He didn't need a boot camp. 00:05:57.519 --> 00:06:00.480 He lived a full, genuinely dangerous life before 00:06:00.480 --> 00:06:02.759 he ever even saw a movie camera. I was looking 00:06:02.759 --> 00:06:04.899 at his pre -Hollywood timeline in our research, 00:06:05.100 --> 00:06:07.800 and it reads like an adventure novel. Or a cautionary 00:06:07.800 --> 00:06:10.600 tale. Right. First off, he was a veteran of World 00:06:10.600 --> 00:06:13.720 War I. Which, let's be honest, involves a level 00:06:13.720 --> 00:06:16.660 of trauma and sheer toughness that's hard for 00:06:16.660 --> 00:06:19.779 us to even quantify today. Totally. And then 00:06:19.779 --> 00:06:22.500 in the 1920s, he served in the Merchant Marines. 00:06:22.800 --> 00:06:24.939 Yeah. Stop there for a second. Merchant Marines. 00:06:25.199 --> 00:06:28.050 Yeah. That's not just casually sailing around. 00:06:28.230 --> 00:06:30.730 What does that actually entail on a day to day 00:06:30.730 --> 00:06:33.149 basis? Well, it means you're comfortable working 00:06:33.149 --> 00:06:37.089 at extreme heights. You're rigging sails, dealing 00:06:37.089 --> 00:06:39.069 with shifting decks in the middle of storms. 00:06:39.110 --> 00:06:41.699 You have to have incredible. Physical balance. 00:06:41.879 --> 00:06:43.379 Absolute balance. And you have to be able to 00:06:43.379 --> 00:06:46.139 take and execute orders instantly in a highly 00:06:46.139 --> 00:06:48.399 chaotic environment. Which sounds a lot like 00:06:48.399 --> 00:06:51.160 a movie set. Exactly. Think about how directly 00:06:51.160 --> 00:06:54.180 that translates to stunt work later on. Rigging, 00:06:54.180 --> 00:06:56.160 balance, chaos. Yeah, that tracks perfectly. 00:06:56.360 --> 00:06:58.199 And then by the end of the 1920s, he was back 00:06:58.199 --> 00:07:01.600 on dry land working for the railroads as a switchman. 00:07:01.740 --> 00:07:04.160 A switchman. Okay, just so we are totally clear, 00:07:04.300 --> 00:07:06.579 that's the guy physically running between the 00:07:06.579 --> 00:07:09.339 tracks, manually throwing the heavy iron levers 00:07:09.339 --> 00:07:11.899 to switch the rails. while massive trains are 00:07:11.899 --> 00:07:14.920 barreling around him. Yes. It was frankly one 00:07:14.920 --> 00:07:17.040 of the most dangerous jobs in America at the 00:07:17.040 --> 00:07:19.379 time. I can imagine. You make a mistake, you 00:07:19.379 --> 00:07:21.740 lose a finger, you trip, you lose a leg or get 00:07:21.740 --> 00:07:24.839 crushed between train cars. It required constant 00:07:24.839 --> 00:07:27.980 hypervigilance and agility. So we have a soldier, 00:07:28.180 --> 00:07:31.600 a sailor, and a railroad worker. Yeah. That is 00:07:31.600 --> 00:07:34.660 basically the trifecta of hard labor in the early 00:07:34.660 --> 00:07:37.100 20th century. It really is. By the time he actually 00:07:37.100 --> 00:07:39.779 gets to Hollywood, he's probably ten times tougher 00:07:39.779 --> 00:07:41.680 than the stunt coordinators telling him what 00:07:41.680 --> 00:07:44.620 to do. And that background provides a certain 00:07:44.620 --> 00:07:46.939 texture to his performances. What do you mean 00:07:46.939 --> 00:07:49.759 by texture? Well, when you see him on screen, 00:07:49.920 --> 00:07:51.779 even if he's just standing in the background 00:07:51.779 --> 00:07:54.660 holding a horse, he has a physicality that you 00:07:54.660 --> 00:07:56.620 just can't teach in an acting class. He knows 00:07:56.620 --> 00:07:59.379 how to inhabit his body. Yes. He knows how to 00:07:59.379 --> 00:08:02.279 move. He knows how to work with his hands. He 00:08:02.279 --> 00:08:04.259 knows what it actually looks like to be bone 00:08:04.259 --> 00:08:06.519 tired. He wasn't playing grit. He was grit. So 00:08:06.519 --> 00:08:09.220 he's in Muskogee. He's working the railroad. 00:08:09.839 --> 00:08:12.480 And he's got a family by this point, right? Yes. 00:08:12.540 --> 00:08:14.600 According to the records, he married a woman 00:08:14.600 --> 00:08:17.319 named Margaret sometime in the 1920s. And they 00:08:17.319 --> 00:08:20.839 had a son, Carl Jr., who was born in 1930. So 00:08:20.839 --> 00:08:23.379 he's a dad. He's a husband. He's a railroad switch 00:08:23.379 --> 00:08:27.199 man. What makes a guy with all those roots? Just 00:08:27.199 --> 00:08:29.339 pack up his family and move out to Tinseltown. 00:08:29.480 --> 00:08:32.620 Was it just the dream of fame? Yeah. Did he want 00:08:32.620 --> 00:08:34.879 his name in lights suddenly? Honestly, looking 00:08:34.879 --> 00:08:37.120 at the history, I don't think it was fame so 00:08:37.120 --> 00:08:40.320 much as sheer survival. Oh, interesting. Look 00:08:40.320 --> 00:08:43.100 at the dates. The census shows the family was 00:08:43.100 --> 00:08:47.440 in Muskogee in 1930. But by 1935, they had relocated 00:08:47.440 --> 00:08:50.519 and settled in Los Angeles. Ah, the mid -30s. 00:08:50.580 --> 00:08:52.480 Yeah. Right in the brutal thick of the Great 00:08:52.480 --> 00:08:54.679 Depression. Exactly. And think about where they 00:08:54.679 --> 00:08:58.850 were coming from. Oklahoma, the dust hole. The 00:08:58.850 --> 00:09:02.110 economy there was being utterly decimated. People 00:09:02.110 --> 00:09:04.129 were moving west for work, any work they could 00:09:04.129 --> 00:09:06.490 find. And the film industry in L .A. was one 00:09:06.490 --> 00:09:08.610 of the very few places that was actually booming. 00:09:08.909 --> 00:09:10.690 Specifically the production of B -Westerns, right? 00:09:10.750 --> 00:09:13.149 Yes, the B -Western economy. We hear that term 00:09:13.149 --> 00:09:16.309 a lot in film history, B -Western. But what does 00:09:16.309 --> 00:09:19.149 it actually mean for a guy like Carl entering 00:09:19.149 --> 00:09:22.679 the workforce? What was that economy like? It 00:09:22.679 --> 00:09:25.120 was incredibly high volume, very low margin. 00:09:25.279 --> 00:09:27.980 These were not artistic sweeping masterpieces 00:09:27.980 --> 00:09:30.259 that took an entire year to film. These were 00:09:30.259 --> 00:09:33.100 consumer products like churning out cans of soup. 00:09:33.220 --> 00:09:35.899 The studios were just pumping them out. Sometimes 00:09:35.899 --> 00:09:38.080 they'd shoot a whole feature film in five or 00:09:38.080 --> 00:09:40.559 six days. Six days for an entire movie. Sometimes 00:09:40.559 --> 00:09:42.580 less. And because they were moving at that breakneck 00:09:42.580 --> 00:09:44.759 speed, they just needed bodies. They didn't have 00:09:44.759 --> 00:09:47.019 time for divas. No time at all. They needed guys 00:09:47.019 --> 00:09:50.059 who could... Ride horses, take a punch, hit the 00:09:50.059 --> 00:09:52.440 dirt, get back up, and do it again ten minutes 00:09:52.440 --> 00:09:54.240 later from a different angle without complaining. 00:09:54.480 --> 00:09:56.879 They needed absolute reliability. And that is 00:09:56.879 --> 00:10:00.179 exactly where Carl Matthews found his lane. His 00:10:00.179 --> 00:10:03.120 very first credited role in The Sources is from 00:10:03.120 --> 00:10:06.200 1935. It was a movie called Rough Riding Ranger. 00:10:06.559 --> 00:10:09.879 A B -Western. A low -budget western, which perfectly 00:10:09.879 --> 00:10:12.460 sets the tone for his entire career trajectory. 00:10:12.940 --> 00:10:16.090 He played a character named Cinch Clemens. Cinch 00:10:16.090 --> 00:10:18.929 Clemons? I absolutely love that name. It sounds 00:10:18.929 --> 00:10:20.750 like a guy who's definitely going to try to rob 00:10:20.750 --> 00:10:23.610 a stagecoach and just fail immediately. That 00:10:23.610 --> 00:10:26.190 is remarkably accurate for the kind of roles 00:10:26.190 --> 00:10:29.789 he got. This brings us to the specific archetype 00:10:29.789 --> 00:10:33.149 Matthews embodied on screen. The sources describe... 00:10:33.500 --> 00:10:35.799 Most of his roles as being one of the underlings 00:10:35.799 --> 00:10:37.759 of the antagonist. The classic henchman. The 00:10:37.759 --> 00:10:40.419 henchman. The guy who takes orders from the smooth 00:10:40.419 --> 00:10:42.980 -talking bad guy. He's the muscle. Right. And 00:10:42.980 --> 00:10:44.879 because he's the muscle, his job description 00:10:44.879 --> 00:10:47.460 in the script is inevitably to lose the fight. 00:10:47.580 --> 00:10:48.899 It's kind of funny when you really think about 00:10:48.899 --> 00:10:54.240 it. Here is a World War I vet, a merchant marine, 00:10:54.519 --> 00:10:56.720 a guy who survived work in the railroads. Yeah. 00:10:56.820 --> 00:10:59.700 And his professional life becomes getting beat 00:10:59.700 --> 00:11:03.169 up on camera. by actors who, let's be real, probably 00:11:03.169 --> 00:11:05.289 had manicures earlier that morning. That's the 00:11:05.289 --> 00:11:07.750 grand irony of Hollywood. Yeah. But we have to 00:11:07.750 --> 00:11:09.929 look at the sheer volume of his work to truly 00:11:09.929 --> 00:11:12.370 understand the grind he was on. We mentioned 00:11:12.370 --> 00:11:15.230 he was in over 200 productions. When you scroll 00:11:15.230 --> 00:11:17.269 through his filmography, you see titles that 00:11:17.269 --> 00:11:20.129 really capture the specific flavor of that era. 00:11:20.350 --> 00:11:22.350 Oh, I have the list right here in our research. 00:11:22.570 --> 00:11:25.110 These are just incredible. The Sagebrush Family 00:11:25.110 --> 00:11:28.110 Trails West. Classic. Billy the Kid's Gun Justice. 00:11:28.929 --> 00:11:31.070 Custer's Last Stand. And he wasn't just stuck 00:11:31.070 --> 00:11:33.669 in the series gritty ones, he did the spoof movies 00:11:33.669 --> 00:11:36.529 too. Yeah, I saw one title in the filmography 00:11:36.529 --> 00:11:38.549 that just stopped me in my tracks, Skip Along 00:11:38.549 --> 00:11:41.970 Rosenblum. Yes, Skip Along Rosenblum. Released 00:11:41.970 --> 00:11:46.350 in 1951, it was a parody western. That title 00:11:46.350 --> 00:11:49.649 alone deserves some kind of Academy Award. But 00:11:49.649 --> 00:11:51.769 it really shows he was working constantly. It 00:11:51.769 --> 00:11:54.629 didn't matter if it was high drama or total lowbrow 00:11:54.629 --> 00:11:57.250 comedy. If there was a paycheck, he was on set. 00:11:57.529 --> 00:12:00.389 And that intense work ethic continued right through 00:12:00.389 --> 00:12:03.450 the transition from film to television. The records 00:12:03.450 --> 00:12:05.789 show he appeared in dozens of episodes of The 00:12:05.789 --> 00:12:07.830 Cisco Kid. Now that's interesting because television 00:12:07.830 --> 00:12:10.409 was the wild new frontier back then. It must 00:12:10.409 --> 00:12:12.789 have changed the workflow completely. It made 00:12:12.789 --> 00:12:15.370 it even more of a grind, actually. It was essentially 00:12:15.370 --> 00:12:18.049 the gig economy long before we even had a phrase 00:12:18.049 --> 00:12:21.360 for it. The Cisco Kid was a huge hat. For a character 00:12:21.360 --> 00:12:23.679 actor like Matthews, a recurring gig on a show 00:12:23.679 --> 00:12:26.440 like that, even if he was playing a totally different 00:12:26.440 --> 00:12:28.940 henchman or background character week after week, 00:12:29.159 --> 00:12:33.259 was incredibly valuable steady pay. So he's basically 00:12:33.259 --> 00:12:36.659 the Uber driver of Hollywood henchmen, just picking 00:12:36.659 --> 00:12:38.980 up rides wherever and whenever he can. In a way, 00:12:39.059 --> 00:12:42.299 yes, but with significantly higher physical stakes. 00:12:42.519 --> 00:12:44.379 Right. Let's really dig into those physical stakes. 00:12:44.500 --> 00:12:47.679 Because you say he acted in 200 films, but a 00:12:47.679 --> 00:12:50.820 lot of what he was doing was. way more dangerous 00:12:50.820 --> 00:12:53.259 than just standing there and delivering a line 00:12:53.259 --> 00:12:55.879 of dialogue. Absolutely. We have to talk about 00:12:55.879 --> 00:12:57.799 the stunt work. In the production sources, he's 00:12:57.799 --> 00:13:00.259 frequently listed as a stuntman or a body double. 00:13:00.419 --> 00:13:03.480 Okay. This is where that insane background, the 00:13:03.480 --> 00:13:05.559 balance from the ships, the special awareness 00:13:05.559 --> 00:13:08.220 from the railroad really pays dividends. What 00:13:08.220 --> 00:13:09.659 kind of stunts are we actually talking about 00:13:09.659 --> 00:13:11.799 here? We're talking about the absolute classics 00:13:11.799 --> 00:13:15.379 of the genre. Horse falls, wagon crashes, massive 00:13:15.379 --> 00:13:17.879 bar brawls. He performed stunts in films like 00:13:17.879 --> 00:13:21.100 Heroes of the Alamo in 1937 and Buffalo Bill 00:13:21.100 --> 00:13:24.820 Rides Again in 1947. And he worked in the serials 00:13:24.820 --> 00:13:26.450 too, right? Like The Great Adventures of Wild 00:13:26.450 --> 00:13:29.429 Bill Hickok. Yes. And think about the actual 00:13:29.429 --> 00:13:32.629 structure of a movie serial back then. It's usually 00:13:32.629 --> 00:13:35.830 12 or 15 chapters, and every single one ends 00:13:35.830 --> 00:13:38.690 in a crazy cliffhanger. So the hero is always 00:13:38.690 --> 00:13:42.409 in peril. Exactly. That means 12 or 15 major 00:13:42.409 --> 00:13:46.669 action sequences per production. Chases, fistfights, 00:13:46.669 --> 00:13:49.730 explosions. They required consistent, repeated, 00:13:49.990 --> 00:13:52.889 physical exertion. And Matthews was right there 00:13:52.889 --> 00:13:54.690 in the thick of it, taking the hits. Every time. 00:13:55.309 --> 00:13:57.470 You mentioned body doubling earlier. That seems 00:13:57.470 --> 00:13:59.590 like a very specific skill set. It's not just 00:13:59.590 --> 00:14:01.669 being brave and willing to fall down. It's about 00:14:01.669 --> 00:14:04.690 mimicry, isn't it? It is. The records show he 00:14:04.690 --> 00:14:07.529 doubled for stars like Fred Scott and Ray Corrigan, 00:14:07.610 --> 00:14:09.889 who is known as Crash Corrigan. Crash Corrigan. 00:14:09.929 --> 00:14:12.590 Now, Ray Corrigan was a big guy, a very physical 00:14:12.590 --> 00:14:15.570 actor, hence the nickname Crash. The fact that 00:14:15.570 --> 00:14:17.830 Matthews could seamlessly double for him tells 00:14:17.830 --> 00:14:20.429 us a lot about Matthews' own physique and presence. 00:14:20.750 --> 00:14:22.370 He had to match his body language perfectly. 00:14:22.629 --> 00:14:25.750 Down to the way he walked. If Ray Corrigan had 00:14:25.750 --> 00:14:28.429 a specific swagger or a specific way of swinging 00:14:28.429 --> 00:14:31.070 up into a saddle, Matthews had to replicate that 00:14:31.070 --> 00:14:33.629 exactly. Right, because if he didn't, the audience 00:14:33.629 --> 00:14:36.730 would spot the fake immediately. Exactly. You 00:14:36.730 --> 00:14:38.809 have to convince the camera from 50 feet away 00:14:38.809 --> 00:14:41.090 that you are the star. You essentially have to 00:14:41.090 --> 00:14:43.850 erase your own ego and become someone else's 00:14:43.850 --> 00:14:47.519 shadow. It's a pretty thankless job, isn't it? 00:14:47.519 --> 00:14:50.200 I mean, you do the dangerous jump, you risk the 00:14:50.200 --> 00:14:52.659 broken collarbone, and then the film cuts to 00:14:52.659 --> 00:14:55.399 a close -up of the beautiful star dusting off 00:14:55.399 --> 00:14:58.120 his hat, and the star gets all the applause in 00:14:58.120 --> 00:15:00.740 the theater. It is entirely thankless, and it's 00:15:00.740 --> 00:15:03.840 incredibly physically punishing over time. We 00:15:03.840 --> 00:15:06.799 have to remember, safety standards in the 1930s 00:15:06.799 --> 00:15:09.039 and 40s were virtually non -existent compared 00:15:09.039 --> 00:15:11.679 to today. Right. There was no CGI to fake it, 00:15:11.720 --> 00:15:14.360 no hidden wires removing the impact of a fall. 00:15:14.700 --> 00:15:16.740 If the script said fall off the horse at a full 00:15:16.740 --> 00:15:19.019 gallop, you fell off the horse at a full gallop. 00:15:19.019 --> 00:15:21.000 Ouch. They used to use these things called running 00:15:21.000 --> 00:15:23.720 W wires to actually trip the horses during a 00:15:23.720 --> 00:15:26.120 chase. Which is incredibly cruel and totally 00:15:26.120 --> 00:15:29.080 illegal now. Very illegal now. But back then, 00:15:29.100 --> 00:15:31.879 it meant the crash was violent, chaotic, and 00:15:31.879 --> 00:15:34.320 completely unpredictable for the rider. So you're 00:15:34.320 --> 00:15:37.480 hitting the hard dirt. Repeatedly. Take after 00:15:37.480 --> 00:15:40.419 take. Exactly. And gravity is gravity. You do 00:15:40.419 --> 00:15:42.720 that for 30 years, your body is going to keep 00:15:42.720 --> 00:15:45.720 the score. Yeah. Every single fall is a micro 00:15:45.720 --> 00:15:48.120 trauma. And I think that brings us to the darker 00:15:48.120 --> 00:15:50.919 side of this story, because you really can't 00:15:50.919 --> 00:15:53.539 live that kind of life. The chronic physical 00:15:53.539 --> 00:15:57.019 pain, the constant hustle for the next gig, the 00:15:57.019 --> 00:15:59.960 massive adrenaline spikes without it taking a 00:15:59.960 --> 00:16:02.539 serious toll on your personal life. Unfortunately, 00:16:02.700 --> 00:16:05.039 the historical records regarding his personal 00:16:05.039 --> 00:16:07.480 life reflect exactly that kind of instability. 00:16:07.899 --> 00:16:10.460 We mentioned his first wife, Margaret, earlier. 00:16:10.960 --> 00:16:13.740 They moved to L .A. together around 1935, right 00:16:13.740 --> 00:16:15.399 at the start of his film career. Right. They 00:16:15.399 --> 00:16:17.620 make the big move. The career starts to pick 00:16:17.620 --> 00:16:19.679 up some momentum and the marriage collapses. 00:16:19.980 --> 00:16:22.320 Really? Yeah. Shortly after he entered the film 00:16:22.320 --> 00:16:25.220 industry, they divorced. The census sources show 00:16:25.220 --> 00:16:27.440 that Margaret actually returned to Oklahoma with 00:16:27.440 --> 00:16:29.860 their young son, Carl Jr., to live with her parents. 00:16:30.080 --> 00:16:32.460 Oh, man, that's rough. So the Hollywood dream 00:16:32.460 --> 00:16:35.539 starts to become a reality and his family falls 00:16:35.539 --> 00:16:37.899 apart almost immediately. It definitely seems 00:16:37.899 --> 00:16:40.559 that way based on the timeline, and the pattern 00:16:40.559 --> 00:16:44.019 unfortunately repeated itself. By the 1940 census, 00:16:44.460 --> 00:16:47.379 records show he had remarried. Okay. His new 00:16:47.379 --> 00:16:50.620 wife was a woman named Irene. But further sources 00:16:50.620 --> 00:16:53.320 indicate that this marriage also eventually ended 00:16:53.320 --> 00:16:55.799 in divorce. It's the classic Hollywood tragedy, 00:16:56.019 --> 00:16:57.840 isn't it? Yeah. We always hear about the massive 00:16:57.840 --> 00:17:00.600 A -list stars having, you know, seven husbands 00:17:00.600 --> 00:17:03.059 or wives, the whole Elizabeth Taylor lifestyle. 00:17:03.440 --> 00:17:06.329 Right. But even for the blue collar guys working 00:17:06.329 --> 00:17:08.490 in the background, the pressure was exactly the 00:17:08.490 --> 00:17:11.650 same or honestly, maybe even worse. I'd argue 00:17:11.650 --> 00:17:14.210 it was much worse. They dealt with the same incredibly 00:17:14.210 --> 00:17:16.930 long hours, the same constant travel to locations, 00:17:17.069 --> 00:17:20.210 the same deep instability. But they didn't have 00:17:20.210 --> 00:17:22.289 the mansions or the personal assistants or the 00:17:22.289 --> 00:17:24.289 massive bank accounts to smooth things over. 00:17:24.349 --> 00:17:26.609 Yeah, they were just scraping by. And then you 00:17:26.609 --> 00:17:28.130 have to factor in the physical pain we talked 00:17:28.130 --> 00:17:30.849 about. Right. If you're waking up incredibly 00:17:30.849 --> 00:17:33.089 sore every single day from being thrown through 00:17:33.089 --> 00:17:35.130 a breakaway window and you have to get up at 00:17:35.130 --> 00:17:37.710 4 a .m. to drive to some dusty ranch in the valley 00:17:37.710 --> 00:17:40.410 to do it all again, how do you actually cope 00:17:40.410 --> 00:17:44.230 with that? In 1940s Hollywood, you drink. Yeah. 00:17:44.269 --> 00:17:46.390 There wasn't physical therapy for bit players. 00:17:46.829 --> 00:17:49.490 There wasn't advanced sports medicine or pain 00:17:49.490 --> 00:17:51.710 management as we know it today. There was just 00:17:51.710 --> 00:17:53.930 whiskey at the end of the day. Which sadly leads 00:17:53.930 --> 00:17:56.859 us to the end of his story. Yes. Carl Matthews 00:17:56.859 --> 00:18:00.380 died on May 3rd, 1959 in Los Angeles County. 00:18:00.500 --> 00:18:02.799 And what did the record say? The official cause 00:18:02.799 --> 00:18:05.440 of death listed on his certificate is psoriasis 00:18:05.440 --> 00:18:08.279 of the liver. Which usually points pretty directly 00:18:08.279 --> 00:18:10.740 to long -term alcohol abuse. It does. It's a 00:18:10.740 --> 00:18:14.079 very tragic, very common ailment for men of that 00:18:14.079 --> 00:18:16.200 specific generation, and especially in that line 00:18:16.200 --> 00:18:19.140 of physical work. It strongly suggests a life 00:18:19.140 --> 00:18:21.019 of self -medication. He was trying to get through 00:18:21.019 --> 00:18:23.599 the days. Exactly. He was likely in constant 00:18:23.599 --> 00:18:26.720 pain, both physical and perhaps emotional from 00:18:26.720 --> 00:18:29.359 the broken marriages. And alcohol was the cheapest, 00:18:29.539 --> 00:18:32.170 most available remedy. And if we circle back 00:18:32.170 --> 00:18:34.250 to that age discrepancy we talked about at the 00:18:34.250 --> 00:18:36.789 very beginning of the deep dive. Right. If he 00:18:36.789 --> 00:18:40.450 was actually born in 1903, like the census consistently 00:18:40.450 --> 00:18:42.730 said, he was only 56 years old when he died. 00:18:42.910 --> 00:18:45.650 Wow. If the death certificate was right and he 00:18:45.650 --> 00:18:50.210 was born in 1899, he was 60. 56 or 60. I mean, 00:18:50.210 --> 00:18:52.309 either way, that is not a ripe old age. That 00:18:52.309 --> 00:18:55.640 is startlingly young to pass away. It really 00:18:55.640 --> 00:18:58.920 highlights the ultimate cost of that tough guy 00:18:58.920 --> 00:19:01.920 lifestyle. Think about his whole arc. He survived 00:19:01.920 --> 00:19:05.079 the brutal trenches of World War I. He survived 00:19:05.079 --> 00:19:07.180 the treacherous storms in the Merchant Marines. 00:19:07.359 --> 00:19:09.980 He survived dodging trains on the railroads. 00:19:10.059 --> 00:19:12.720 But Hollywood. Hollywood kind of chewed him up. 00:19:13.049 --> 00:19:15.250 It really did. It's very sobering. You look at 00:19:15.250 --> 00:19:17.630 a list of 200 credits on an actor's page and 00:19:17.630 --> 00:19:19.410 you naturally think, wow, what an incredibly 00:19:19.410 --> 00:19:21.930 successful career. And to be fair, it was successful. 00:19:21.970 --> 00:19:24.569 He worked more consistently than 99 % of actors 00:19:24.569 --> 00:19:27.670 who come to L .A. ever do. That's true. But the 00:19:27.670 --> 00:19:30.589 human cost behind that long list of credits is 00:19:30.589 --> 00:19:33.269 just immense. I think that's a very fair assessment 00:19:33.269 --> 00:19:36.940 based on the sources. The studio industry needed 00:19:36.940 --> 00:19:39.119 men like him. They needed men who could take 00:19:39.119 --> 00:19:42.200 a heavy hit, men who could ride fast, men who 00:19:42.200 --> 00:19:44.559 genuinely looked the part of a hardened pioneer. 00:19:45.000 --> 00:19:47.039 But the industry didn't necessarily take care 00:19:47.039 --> 00:19:49.940 of them in return. No, it's an extractive industry 00:19:49.940 --> 00:19:52.480 at its core. Once those guys couldn't take the 00:19:52.480 --> 00:19:54.779 hard fall anymore or once their bodies gave out, 00:19:54.880 --> 00:19:57.920 they were often just replaced, just gone. But 00:19:57.920 --> 00:19:59.779 I think it's really important as we wrap up here 00:19:59.779 --> 00:20:02.460 that we don't just view Carl Matthews as a victim 00:20:02.460 --> 00:20:05.789 of the system. He was a true professional. Absolutely. 00:20:05.990 --> 00:20:08.049 We shouldn't pity him at all. We should respect 00:20:08.049 --> 00:20:10.789 the incredible hustle. He worked consistently 00:20:10.789 --> 00:20:14.210 for 33 years in what is famously the most fickle 00:20:14.210 --> 00:20:16.670 industry on Earth. Right. That takes an immense 00:20:16.670 --> 00:20:19.049 amount of talent, endurance, and profound reliability. 00:20:20.109 --> 00:20:22.190 Directors knew that if they hired Carl Matthews 00:20:22.190 --> 00:20:24.589 for a shoot, he would show up on time, he would 00:20:24.589 --> 00:20:26.450 hit his mark perfectly, and he would make the 00:20:26.450 --> 00:20:29.390 scene work. That's such a great point. Reliability 00:20:29.390 --> 00:20:31.819 is its own kind of talent. Especially when the 00:20:31.819 --> 00:20:33.859 sun is going down, you're losing light and you 00:20:33.859 --> 00:20:35.960 only have one shot to get the wagon crash right 00:20:35.960 --> 00:20:38.099 because the studio can't afford to rebuild the 00:20:38.099 --> 00:20:40.200 wagon. Exactly. You need the guy who gets it 00:20:40.200 --> 00:20:43.019 right the first time. Yeah. And connecting his 00:20:43.019 --> 00:20:45.880 specific story to the bigger historical picture. 00:20:46.750 --> 00:20:48.529 When we talk about the golden age of Westerns, 00:20:48.529 --> 00:20:50.089 we spend a lot of time talking about the myth 00:20:50.089 --> 00:20:52.630 of the West. Right. The rugged individualism, 00:20:52.670 --> 00:20:55.589 the frontier spirit, the whole taming of the 00:20:55.589 --> 00:20:58.329 wild land narrative. The John Wayne fantasy. 00:20:58.390 --> 00:21:02.269 The idea that one stoic man with a gun can solve 00:21:02.269 --> 00:21:06.039 every complex problem. Carl Matthews was. In 00:21:06.039 --> 00:21:08.740 a very strange way, the actual reality behind 00:21:08.740 --> 00:21:11.779 that shiny myth. Yes. He was the actual laborer. 00:21:11.779 --> 00:21:14.160 He was the actual war veteran. He was the actual 00:21:14.160 --> 00:21:16.859 guy with Cherokee heritage working day in and 00:21:16.859 --> 00:21:19.779 day out in a movie genre that often simplified 00:21:19.779 --> 00:21:22.640 or completely mythologized all of those complex 00:21:22.640 --> 00:21:24.940 things. He was the real deal pretending to be 00:21:24.940 --> 00:21:27.279 a fake cowboy while the fake cowboys got all 00:21:27.279 --> 00:21:30.160 the glory. That is perfectly said. And without 00:21:30.160 --> 00:21:32.509 him. And without the hundreds of other working 00:21:32.509 --> 00:21:34.630 class stuntmen and bit players just like him, 00:21:34.710 --> 00:21:37.089 that Hollywood myth would have just been actors 00:21:37.089 --> 00:21:39.349 in clean costumes standing around talking on 00:21:39.349 --> 00:21:41.670 a soundstage. He gave it the necessary grit. 00:21:41.809 --> 00:21:45.450 He gave it the illusion of real danger. When 00:21:45.450 --> 00:21:47.509 you watch an old film and a fight scene feels 00:21:47.509 --> 00:21:50.009 surprisingly visceral, it's not because of the 00:21:50.009 --> 00:21:52.490 star throwing the fake punch. It's because of 00:21:52.490 --> 00:21:54.569 the guy taking the hit and selling it to the 00:21:54.569 --> 00:21:57.089 camera. So, after digging through all these records 00:21:57.089 --> 00:21:59.369 and filmographies, what does this all mean for 00:21:59.369 --> 00:22:02.390 us, the viewers, sitting at home today? I think 00:22:02.390 --> 00:22:04.190 it fundamentally changes how you watch these 00:22:04.190 --> 00:22:06.609 films. Or at least, it really should. How so? 00:22:06.950 --> 00:22:09.390 Well, the next time you watch The Cisco Kid or 00:22:09.390 --> 00:22:12.279 Buffalo Bill rides... Again, don't just focus 00:22:12.279 --> 00:22:14.259 on the guy with the most lines. Look at the edges 00:22:14.259 --> 00:22:16.599 of the frame. Right. Look at the guy quietly 00:22:16.599 --> 00:22:18.759 holding the horses in the background. Look at 00:22:18.759 --> 00:22:20.720 the guy taking the punch and falling over the 00:22:20.720 --> 00:22:23.619 table. That's where the real physical work of 00:22:23.619 --> 00:22:26.460 cinema is happening. That's Carl Matthews. It's 00:22:26.460 --> 00:22:28.960 like seeing the hidden strings on a puppet. But 00:22:28.960 --> 00:22:31.519 instead of ruining the magic of the show, it 00:22:31.519 --> 00:22:33.740 actually makes you appreciate the skill of the 00:22:33.740 --> 00:22:37.359 puppeteer even more. Exactly. It deepens your 00:22:37.359 --> 00:22:40.559 appreciation for the sheer collective craft of 00:22:40.559 --> 00:22:44.000 filmmaking. It's a massive group effort built 00:22:44.000 --> 00:22:46.500 on the bruised backs of people whose names usually 00:22:46.500 --> 00:22:49.000 don't ever make it onto the movie poster. Carl 00:22:49.000 --> 00:22:52.500 Matthews. Born on a reservation, worked the dangerous 00:22:52.500 --> 00:22:56.500 railroads, and died in Hollywood. 150 plus films 00:22:56.500 --> 00:22:59.039 where his only job was to play the underling 00:22:59.039 --> 00:23:01.839 who loses. Yeah. But today, for a few minutes 00:23:01.839 --> 00:23:03.900 at least, he gets to be the star of the show. 00:23:04.019 --> 00:23:06.880 And deservedly so. He really represents a massive, 00:23:06.980 --> 00:23:09.720 largely invisible workforce that quite literally 00:23:09.720 --> 00:23:12.480 built the cinema history we cherish today. You 00:23:12.480 --> 00:23:13.920 know, it really makes you wonder the next time 00:23:13.920 --> 00:23:15.700 you're scrolling through a streaming app or watching 00:23:15.700 --> 00:23:18.339 an old black and white movie on cable, just pause 00:23:18.339 --> 00:23:20.720 it during a big crowded scene like a bar fight. 00:23:20.859 --> 00:23:22.480 Just freeze the frame. Yeah, freeze the frame 00:23:22.480 --> 00:23:23.900 and really look at the faces in the background. 00:23:24.019 --> 00:23:26.619 We focus so much of our cultural energy on the 00:23:26.619 --> 00:23:30.140 stars, the offscreen drama, the big awards. But 00:23:30.140 --> 00:23:31.559 here's a thought I want you to take with you. 00:23:32.319 --> 00:23:34.980 How many other Carl Matthews are frozen in those 00:23:34.980 --> 00:23:38.799 frames? How many of those nameless extras stormed 00:23:38.799 --> 00:23:41.339 a beach in Normandy or built a skyscraper with 00:23:41.339 --> 00:23:43.960 their bare hands or lived a life that was ten 00:23:43.960 --> 00:23:46.059 times more dramatic than the script they were 00:23:46.059 --> 00:23:48.000 filming that day? We see them for split second, 00:23:48.059 --> 00:23:50.119 but they carried a whole rich world with them. 00:23:50.240 --> 00:23:53.079 A whole world in a single frame. Well, thanks 00:23:53.079 --> 00:23:55.319 for listening to this deep dive into the life 00:23:55.319 --> 00:23:57.599 of the invisible cowboy. We'll catch you on the 00:23:57.599 --> 00:23:57.900 next one.