WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.819 Welcome back to the Deep Dive. Today, we are 00:00:02.819 --> 00:00:06.500 opening a file that on the surface feels incredibly 00:00:06.500 --> 00:00:09.279 familiar. I mean, if you have owned a television 00:00:09.279 --> 00:00:12.199 in the last, what, 25 years? Oh, easily. You 00:00:12.199 --> 00:00:14.560 know the face, you know the voice, and you definitely, 00:00:14.619 --> 00:00:16.620 definitely know the attitude. We are talking 00:00:16.620 --> 00:00:19.539 about Leah Remini. And for, I'd say the vast 00:00:19.539 --> 00:00:21.460 majority of people, she is sort of frozen in 00:00:21.460 --> 00:00:24.339 amber as Carrie Heffernan from The King of Queens. 00:00:24.559 --> 00:00:28.039 Yes. She's the sharp -tongued, no -nonsense wife 00:00:28.039 --> 00:00:31.339 who could just verbally decimate Kevin James 00:00:31.339 --> 00:00:34.600 with a single look. She's, you know, a definitive 00:00:34.600 --> 00:00:37.700 sitcom icon of the early 2000s. Exactly. And 00:00:37.700 --> 00:00:40.039 usually when we do a deep dive on a sitcom star, 00:00:40.159 --> 00:00:42.060 the narrative is, well, it's pretty predictable. 00:00:42.219 --> 00:00:44.420 We talk about the audition process, the residuals, 00:00:44.420 --> 00:00:46.619 maybe a failed movie career or, I don't know, 00:00:46.679 --> 00:00:48.740 a reboot. years later. Right. It's usually a 00:00:48.740 --> 00:00:51.240 story about navigating fame. But this, this is 00:00:51.240 --> 00:00:54.280 not that story. Not even close. No. In fact, 00:00:54.299 --> 00:00:57.799 the sitcom stardom is almost just the prologue 00:00:57.799 --> 00:01:00.780 or maybe the financing mechanism for a second 00:01:00.780 --> 00:01:03.200 act that is unlike anything we have ever seen 00:01:03.200 --> 00:01:06.200 in Hollywood history. It's just, it's a wild 00:01:06.200 --> 00:01:08.799 pivot. We are talking about a woman who went 00:01:08.799 --> 00:01:12.560 from being a CBS staple, making millions of dollars 00:01:12.560 --> 00:01:15.680 an episode to make people laugh, to becoming 00:01:16.219 --> 00:01:19.239 arguably the most vocal high -profile whistleblower 00:01:19.239 --> 00:01:24.719 against a powerful, controversial, and deeply 00:01:24.719 --> 00:01:28.140 entrenched organization. It is a study in contrasts 00:01:28.140 --> 00:01:30.200 that is so stark, it's really hard to wrap your 00:01:30.200 --> 00:01:32.340 head around. On one side, you have the glossy 00:01:32.340 --> 00:01:34.260 magazine covers and the carpets, the whole Hollywood 00:01:34.260 --> 00:01:36.560 machine. And on the other, you have a woman who 00:01:36.560 --> 00:01:38.900 had to completely dismantle her entire worldview, 00:01:39.060 --> 00:01:42.120 lose her social circle, face what she alleges 00:01:42.120 --> 00:01:44.879 is harassment and stalking, all to rebuild her 00:01:44.879 --> 00:01:46.599 life from the ground up, right in the public 00:01:46.599 --> 00:01:48.379 eye. We aren't just skimming the headlines today 00:01:48.379 --> 00:01:51.239 either. We have pulled a massive stack of sources, 00:01:51.420 --> 00:01:53.799 a really comprehensive biographical overview, 00:01:54.060 --> 00:01:56.549 details from her memoir, Trouble. maker, court 00:01:56.549 --> 00:01:59.109 filings, hours and hours of interviews. Yeah. 00:01:59.209 --> 00:02:01.329 Our mission is to really unpack this trajectory. 00:02:01.510 --> 00:02:03.829 How do you go from a child actor in Brooklyn 00:02:03.829 --> 00:02:06.030 to a devotee of a high control group and then 00:02:06.030 --> 00:02:09.009 finally to its fiercest critic? It is a story 00:02:09.009 --> 00:02:12.090 about resilience. Absolutely. But I think more 00:02:12.090 --> 00:02:14.650 importantly, it is a story about the cost of 00:02:14.650 --> 00:02:18.280 speaking out. What does it actually take? We 00:02:18.280 --> 00:02:20.419 are going to look at the mechanics of the control 00:02:20.419 --> 00:02:22.840 she was under, the fair game tactics she faced, 00:02:22.900 --> 00:02:27.340 and this psychological concept of this sunk cost 00:02:27.340 --> 00:02:29.580 fallacy that keeps people trapped in these systems. 00:02:29.879 --> 00:02:31.819 And we'll look at the quieter victories, too. 00:02:32.219 --> 00:02:34.639 Because amidst all the noise and the lawsuits 00:02:34.639 --> 00:02:36.759 and the fighting, she did something really human 00:02:36.759 --> 00:02:39.000 and relatable. She went back to school in her 00:02:39.000 --> 00:02:43.240 50s. There's a lot to get into. Let's rewind 00:02:43.240 --> 00:02:45.840 the tape. Before the sitcoms, before the activism. 00:02:46.800 --> 00:02:49.360 We are going to Brooklyn. Bensonhurst, to be 00:02:49.360 --> 00:02:52.060 specific, which if you know New York in the 70s, 00:02:52.060 --> 00:02:54.580 it just it brings a very specific image to mind. 00:02:54.659 --> 00:02:58.780 Totally. Born June 15th, 1970. And looking at 00:02:58.780 --> 00:03:00.580 her background, you can immediately see where 00:03:00.580 --> 00:03:02.259 that trademark toughness that, you know, that 00:03:02.259 --> 00:03:04.639 don't mess with me energy comes from. Her dad, 00:03:04.860 --> 00:03:07.340 George Remini, owned an asbestos removal company. 00:03:07.520 --> 00:03:09.840 Which is just about the grittiest, toughest profession 00:03:09.840 --> 00:03:12.520 you can imagine. It's dangerous. It's hard labor. 00:03:12.699 --> 00:03:16.300 Her father had Italian ancestry rooted in Sicily. 00:03:16.400 --> 00:03:19.300 And her mother, Vicki Marshall, was of Austrian 00:03:19.300 --> 00:03:21.939 Jewish descent. So she is growing up in this 00:03:21.939 --> 00:03:26.159 very culturally rich. likely very loud, very 00:03:26.159 --> 00:03:29.219 vibrant environment. It's the classic melting 00:03:29.219 --> 00:03:31.259 pot of New York. You've got the Italian side, 00:03:31.360 --> 00:03:33.460 the Jewish side, the Brooklyn attitude all rolled 00:03:33.460 --> 00:03:36.400 into one. And religiously. It started out fairly 00:03:36.400 --> 00:03:38.240 traditional, right? Oh, yeah. The sources say 00:03:38.240 --> 00:03:40.400 she was baptized in the Catholic Church as an 00:03:40.400 --> 00:03:42.719 infant. She was. For the first few years of her 00:03:42.719 --> 00:03:44.740 life, that was the framework. She was raised 00:03:44.740 --> 00:03:46.740 in the Catholic faith. It provided the baseline 00:03:46.740 --> 00:03:48.800 of her spiritual understanding, whatever that 00:03:48.800 --> 00:03:51.060 means for a little kid. But then the timeline 00:03:51.060 --> 00:03:53.319 pivots. And this is the moment, really, that 00:03:53.319 --> 00:03:55.819 sets the course for the next 35 years of her 00:03:55.819 --> 00:03:58.159 life. She was eight years old. Eight. Years. 00:03:58.240 --> 00:04:01.400 Her mother, Vicki, joins the Church of Scientology. 00:04:01.639 --> 00:04:03.819 And from that moment on, for all intents and 00:04:03.819 --> 00:04:06.360 purposes, Leah Remini is raised as a Scientologist. 00:04:06.680 --> 00:04:08.560 I think we need to pause here and really explain 00:04:08.560 --> 00:04:10.960 what that means. Because when people hear Scientology, 00:04:11.080 --> 00:04:13.719 they often think of the celebrity centers or, 00:04:13.819 --> 00:04:16.399 you know, Tom Cruise jumping on a couch. But 00:04:16.399 --> 00:04:18.519 for an eight -year -old in the late 70s, this 00:04:18.519 --> 00:04:20.100 isn't just going to a different Sunday school. 00:04:20.319 --> 00:04:22.639 Oh, no. It's a total worldview shift. It's a 00:04:22.639 --> 00:04:25.660 complete immersion. Scientology describes itself 00:04:25.660 --> 00:04:28.399 as an applied... religious philosophy it has 00:04:28.399 --> 00:04:31.120 its own vocabulary a whole dictionary's worth 00:04:31.120 --> 00:04:34.860 of terms it has its own ethical codes and its 00:04:34.860 --> 00:04:37.480 own structure of progression called the bridge 00:04:37.480 --> 00:04:40.579 to total freedom so for a child what does that 00:04:40.579 --> 00:04:42.920 translate to it means you aren't just a kid anymore 00:04:42.920 --> 00:04:47.720 you are a spiritual being a thetan who just happens 00:04:47.720 --> 00:04:49.879 to be in a small body and you're on a path to 00:04:49.879 --> 00:04:52.879 recover your godlike abilities The whole world 00:04:52.879 --> 00:04:54.860 is framed differently. And the family's involvement 00:04:54.860 --> 00:04:57.819 escalated incredibly fast. It really did. By 00:04:57.819 --> 00:05:00.339 the time she was 13, things got... Well, intense 00:05:00.339 --> 00:05:02.540 is an understatement. We are not talking about 00:05:02.540 --> 00:05:04.579 attending services once a week anymore. We are 00:05:04.579 --> 00:05:07.899 talking about the C organization. The C org. 00:05:08.079 --> 00:05:11.540 The C org. And this is a crucial term to define 00:05:11.540 --> 00:05:14.500 if we want to understand her journey. The C org 00:05:14.500 --> 00:05:17.500 is described as the church's paramilitary wing. 00:05:18.040 --> 00:05:20.540 It's the clergy, essentially, but it's structured 00:05:20.540 --> 00:05:23.439 like a naval organization. They wear uniforms, 00:05:23.680 --> 00:05:25.959 right? They wear uniforms that resemble naval 00:05:25.959 --> 00:05:28.740 dress blues. They live communally in barrack 00:05:28.740 --> 00:05:31.660 -style housing. They dedicate their entire lives, 00:05:31.660 --> 00:05:34.480 24 -7, to the service of the church. It's the 00:05:34.480 --> 00:05:36.800 most dedicated level. And the source material 00:05:36.800 --> 00:05:39.139 here provides a detail that just subs you in 00:05:39.139 --> 00:05:43.300 your tracks. At 13 years old, Leah and her sister 00:05:43.300 --> 00:05:46.339 were taken to join this organization. And as 00:05:46.339 --> 00:05:48.839 part of that process, They were forced to sign 00:05:48.839 --> 00:05:51.220 contracts. And not just any contracts. These 00:05:51.220 --> 00:05:54.019 are the infamous billion year contract. A billion 00:05:54.019 --> 00:05:56.040 years. I mean, just saying that out loud sounds 00:05:56.040 --> 00:05:57.680 like science fiction. It sounds like a joke. 00:05:57.819 --> 00:06:00.680 It's not. It is literal in their theology. The 00:06:00.680 --> 00:06:02.660 idea is that you are an immortal spirit. You 00:06:02.660 --> 00:06:04.779 will live life after life after life. So you 00:06:04.779 --> 00:06:06.959 are pledging your loyalty to the Sea Org, not 00:06:06.959 --> 00:06:09.600 just for this lifetime, but for the next billion 00:06:09.600 --> 00:06:12.100 years of lifetimes. You're signing away your 00:06:12.100 --> 00:06:14.939 eternity. At age 13. So practically speaking, 00:06:15.199 --> 00:06:18.519 at 13. She's not worrying about which boy she 00:06:18.519 --> 00:06:21.139 likes in the homeroom or going to the mall. She's 00:06:21.139 --> 00:06:23.339 working. She's working for room and board. She's 00:06:23.339 --> 00:06:26.160 living in a dorm. She's treating this work as 00:06:26.160 --> 00:06:28.079 the most important thing in the universe because, 00:06:28.240 --> 00:06:31.180 you know, the fate of the planet depends on it. 00:06:31.220 --> 00:06:33.470 It's an incredible amount of pressure. It completely 00:06:33.470 --> 00:06:37.230 bypasses the normal developmental stages of being 00:06:37.230 --> 00:06:39.670 a teenager. You were treated as an adult worker. 00:06:39.889 --> 00:06:43.350 But interestingly, this stint in the Sea Org 00:06:43.350 --> 00:06:46.230 didn't last forever. The sources say her mother, 00:06:46.389 --> 00:06:49.209 Vicki, decided to pull them out within that same 00:06:49.209 --> 00:06:52.610 year. Why? Did she lose faith or have second 00:06:52.610 --> 00:06:54.670 thoughts about the whole thing? Not at all. The 00:06:54.670 --> 00:06:57.610 mother remained a dedicated Scientologist for 00:06:57.610 --> 00:07:00.199 decades after. From what we can gather, it was 00:07:00.199 --> 00:07:02.439 more about the conditions. She just decided to 00:07:02.439 --> 00:07:04.620 remove them from that specific paramilitary wing 00:07:04.620 --> 00:07:08.040 and return to civilian Scientology life. They 00:07:08.040 --> 00:07:10.360 moved from the Sea Org base in Florida back to 00:07:10.360 --> 00:07:12.860 regular life in Los Angeles. But you don't just 00:07:12.860 --> 00:07:14.920 walk away from the Sea Org without a bill, do 00:07:14.920 --> 00:07:18.279 you? I've heard about this. No, you do not. This 00:07:18.279 --> 00:07:21.879 is a fascinating and, frankly, coercive mechanism 00:07:21.879 --> 00:07:24.480 called the freeloader debt. Freeloader debt. 00:07:24.560 --> 00:07:27.639 That sounds aggressive. It is. The logic is this. 00:07:28.000 --> 00:07:30.379 While you are in the Sea Org, you receive all 00:07:30.379 --> 00:07:32.300 this training and auditing, that's their form 00:07:32.300 --> 00:07:35.040 of spiritual counseling, for free or at a massive 00:07:35.040 --> 00:07:37.740 discount because you're staffed. If you leave, 00:07:38.019 --> 00:07:41.000 or blow as they call it, the church bills you 00:07:41.000 --> 00:07:43.699 retroactively for every single service you received 00:07:43.699 --> 00:07:46.279 at its full exorbitant public right. So they 00:07:46.279 --> 00:07:48.139 hand you an invoice for your own exploitation. 00:07:48.959 --> 00:07:50.819 For the labor you provided them. Essentially, 00:07:50.980 --> 00:07:53.519 yes. And for Leah's family, this was a massive 00:07:53.519 --> 00:07:56.600 crushing burden. The sources discuss the financial 00:07:56.600 --> 00:07:59.860 reality of this move. Leah spent her teenage 00:07:59.860 --> 00:08:02.240 years, her high school years, working regular 00:08:02.240 --> 00:08:04.560 jobs, you know, waitress, whatever she could 00:08:04.560 --> 00:08:06.819 find. Specifically to pay off the family's debt 00:08:06.819 --> 00:08:08.959 to the church? Exactly. Debt for the auditing 00:08:08.959 --> 00:08:11.420 they received while in the Sea Org. So instead 00:08:11.420 --> 00:08:13.860 of saving for college or a car or anything a 00:08:13.860 --> 00:08:16.300 normal teenager does, she's grinding to pay back 00:08:16.300 --> 00:08:18.500 the church. And it's a double whammy. Because 00:08:18.500 --> 00:08:20.519 she's also paying for continuing courses. Right. 00:08:20.579 --> 00:08:23.639 She is. Because in Scientology, you have to pay 00:08:23.639 --> 00:08:26.180 to move up the bridge. It's a pay -as -you -go 00:08:26.180 --> 00:08:28.699 system for spiritual enlightenment. So you have 00:08:28.699 --> 00:08:31.800 this teenage girl who should be dealing with 00:08:31.800 --> 00:08:34.860 normal high school drama just completely consumed 00:08:34.860 --> 00:08:37.779 with paying off this religious debt. This had 00:08:37.779 --> 00:08:40.120 to have a massive impact on her education. I 00:08:40.120 --> 00:08:42.220 mean, how could it not? It decimated it. We will 00:08:42.220 --> 00:08:44.360 touch on this more later because it becomes a 00:08:44.360 --> 00:08:47.039 huge part of her story. But she left school with 00:08:47.039 --> 00:08:49.899 only an eighth grade education. Wow. The family 00:08:49.899 --> 00:08:52.659 and the culture of the organization did not value 00:08:52.659 --> 00:08:55.960 traditional schooling. The wog world, which is 00:08:55.960 --> 00:08:58.220 their term for the non -Scientology world, was 00:08:58.220 --> 00:09:01.200 seen as lesser, as degraded. So the logic is, 00:09:01.279 --> 00:09:04.240 why learn history or geometry when you have the 00:09:04.240 --> 00:09:06.580 technology to save the human race? That's the 00:09:06.580 --> 00:09:09.100 mindset, exactly. So she enters adulthood with 00:09:09.100 --> 00:09:11.860 an eighth grade education, a massive chip on 00:09:11.860 --> 00:09:14.639 her shoulder, and a very, very strong work ethic 00:09:14.639 --> 00:09:17.379 born out of absolute necessity. She had no safety 00:09:17.379 --> 00:09:19.940 net. There was no backup plan. She had to make 00:09:19.940 --> 00:09:22.279 it work. She had to hustle. Which segues perfectly 00:09:22.279 --> 00:09:24.720 into her career because she didn't just walk 00:09:24.720 --> 00:09:27.480 onto the set of King of Queens. She was grinding 00:09:27.480 --> 00:09:30.919 in the late 80s and early 90s, taking any job 00:09:30.919 --> 00:09:33.860 she could get. It is a classic working actor 00:09:33.860 --> 00:09:36.279 resume. I mean, she was pounding the pavement. 00:09:36.360 --> 00:09:38.820 One of her early roles was on Who's the Boss? 00:09:39.000 --> 00:09:41.139 She played a character named Charlie Briscoe. 00:09:41.600 --> 00:09:44.019 I vaguely remember that. And she must have had 00:09:44.019 --> 00:09:46.559 serious charisma because that guest spot actually 00:09:46.559 --> 00:09:48.840 led to a spinoff. Living Dolls. I remember this. 00:09:48.919 --> 00:09:52.059 Living Dolls. It premiered in late 1989. And 00:09:52.059 --> 00:09:54.639 here is a piece of trivia that always blows my 00:09:54.639 --> 00:09:57.840 mind. She starred alongside Halle Berry. No way. 00:09:58.080 --> 00:10:00.259 Leah Remini and Halle Berry in the same show. 00:10:00.419 --> 00:10:02.519 Yes. They were both playing models living in 00:10:02.519 --> 00:10:04.480 a house together. It was, you know, very of its 00:10:04.480 --> 00:10:06.460 time. It was short lived and only ran for 12 00:10:06.460 --> 00:10:09.379 episodes. But still. That is a solid start. She 00:10:09.379 --> 00:10:11.279 was getting in the room. So from there, she just 00:10:11.279 --> 00:10:13.779 hits the sitcom circuit hard. Oh, yeah. She had 00:10:13.779 --> 00:10:15.519 a supporting role in The Man in the Family in 00:10:15.519 --> 00:10:18.840 1991. Then she pops up in Evening Shade playing 00:10:18.840 --> 00:10:21.720 a character named Daisy, who was the girlfriend 00:10:21.720 --> 00:10:24.759 of J .R. Ferguson's character. She was getting 00:10:24.759 --> 00:10:27.360 typecast a little bit. The tough street smart 00:10:27.360 --> 00:10:30.480 girl with the attitude. Which, I mean. It worked 00:10:30.480 --> 00:10:33.240 for her. It totally did. But for a certain generation, 00:10:33.580 --> 00:10:35.919 there is one role before King of Queens that 00:10:35.919 --> 00:10:38.399 everyone remembers. It was summer. It was the 00:10:38.399 --> 00:10:40.259 beach club. It was Bayside High on vacation. 00:10:40.559 --> 00:10:43.120 The Malibu Sands Beach Club, saved by the bell. 00:10:43.340 --> 00:10:47.100 Daisy Carosi. Yes. The tough -talking boss's 00:10:47.100 --> 00:10:50.600 daughter from New York who steals Zack Morris' 00:10:50.840 --> 00:10:53.639 heart. It is a cult classic arc. It's like a 00:10:53.639 --> 00:10:55.899 six -episode perfect little story. It really 00:10:55.899 --> 00:10:57.519 is. And she had that attitude even then. You 00:10:57.519 --> 00:10:59.320 watched her and you believed she could boss Zack 00:10:59.320 --> 00:11:02.179 Morris around. He was this slick operator, but 00:11:02.179 --> 00:11:04.259 she just shut him down. She had a natural authority. 00:11:04.379 --> 00:11:06.039 She also did a stint on Cheers, right? She did. 00:11:06.259 --> 00:11:08.120 This is another one of my favorite bits of casting 00:11:08.120 --> 00:11:10.720 trivia. She played Serafina, the daughter of 00:11:10.720 --> 00:11:13.340 Carla Tortelli. Which, casting -wise, is absolute 00:11:13.340 --> 00:11:16.460 perfection. Oh, absolutely. The attitude match 00:11:16.460 --> 00:11:19.019 between Rhea Perlman and Leah Remini is just 00:11:19.019 --> 00:11:22.179 it's spot on. If anyone could be Carla's daughter, 00:11:22.360 --> 00:11:24.519 it was Leah. She just had that energy. She was 00:11:24.519 --> 00:11:27.230 tough, but also. Yeah, vulnerable underneath. 00:11:27.610 --> 00:11:31.629 She appeared in 1991 and 1993. She also did NYPD 00:11:31.629 --> 00:11:33.889 Blue, a show called First Time Out, another one 00:11:33.889 --> 00:11:36.230 called Fired Up. She was working constantly, 00:11:36.370 --> 00:11:39.210 just building that resume, paying her dues. But 00:11:39.210 --> 00:11:41.769 here is a what -if moment that could have changed 00:11:41.769 --> 00:11:43.850 television history. Oh, I love these sliding 00:11:43.850 --> 00:11:46.590 doors moments. What could have been? So in 1994, 00:11:47.070 --> 00:11:50.230 Leah Remini auditions for a pilot, a little show 00:11:50.230 --> 00:11:52.350 called Friends. Okay, okay, which character? 00:11:52.509 --> 00:11:54.690 It's got to be Phoebe, right? No. Monica Geller. 00:11:54.970 --> 00:11:58.090 Whoa. Get out of here. Monica Geller, can you 00:11:58.090 --> 00:11:59.929 imagine? It would have been a completely different 00:11:59.929 --> 00:12:01.309 show. I mean, I can't even picture it. Think 00:12:01.309 --> 00:12:03.549 about the energy difference. Courtney Cox brought 00:12:03.549 --> 00:12:07.929 this neurotic, high strung, but ultimately very 00:12:07.929 --> 00:12:11.350 sweet, lovable energy. Leah Remini would have 00:12:11.350 --> 00:12:13.690 brought a much tougher, if you don't use a coaster, 00:12:13.809 --> 00:12:16.029 I will break your fingers kind of vibe. It would 00:12:16.029 --> 00:12:19.169 have been hilarious, but totally different. Obviously, 00:12:19.169 --> 00:12:21.250 the role went to Courtney Cox and the rest is 00:12:21.250 --> 00:12:23.549 history. But Leah was clearly on their radar. 00:12:24.009 --> 00:12:25.909 The producers must have liked her. They did, 00:12:26.009 --> 00:12:28.529 because she did appear in the show later. In 00:12:28.529 --> 00:12:31.129 1995, in the episode The One with the Birth, 00:12:31.370 --> 00:12:34.090 she played Lydia, the pregnant woman whose LeMay's 00:12:34.090 --> 00:12:37.190 partner bails on her, and Joey Tribbiani steps 00:12:37.190 --> 00:12:39.210 in to help. I remember that. She was yelling 00:12:39.210 --> 00:12:42.169 at Joey. It was great. It's just wild to think 00:12:42.169 --> 00:12:44.909 she was that close to being a lead on the biggest 00:12:44.909 --> 00:12:46.909 show of the decade. But missing out on Friends 00:12:46.909 --> 00:12:50.049 left her available for 1998. For the King of 00:12:50.049 --> 00:12:52.769 Queens. The big break. She lands the role of 00:12:52.769 --> 00:12:55.649 Carrie Heffernan alongside Kevin James. And we 00:12:55.649 --> 00:12:58.149 have to give this show its due. It ran for nine 00:12:58.149 --> 00:13:03.049 seasons from September 1998 to May 2007. It was 00:13:03.049 --> 00:13:05.549 a juggernaut. It was a staple of CBS Monday nights. 00:13:05.610 --> 00:13:07.610 And looking back, it's interesting because the 00:13:07.610 --> 00:13:09.610 character of Carrie could have been very one 00:13:09.610 --> 00:13:12.370 note. The nagging wife trope was everywhere in 00:13:12.370 --> 00:13:14.029 the 90s. Oh, yeah. It was a stock character. 00:13:14.679 --> 00:13:17.200 But she played her with such specificity. She 00:13:17.200 --> 00:13:19.700 was scary, but you rooted for her. You understood 00:13:19.700 --> 00:13:21.659 why she was so frustrated with Doug all the time. 00:13:21.779 --> 00:13:24.480 She brought her real self to it. That Brooklyn 00:13:24.480 --> 00:13:28.200 grit, that refusal to take nonsense. The chemistry 00:13:28.200 --> 00:13:31.019 between her and Kevin James was just electric. 00:13:31.559 --> 00:13:33.159 And during that time, she became a household 00:13:33.159 --> 00:13:36.000 name. She was making serious money. She was even 00:13:36.000 --> 00:13:38.960 doing Quaker State oil commercials. She was everywhere. 00:13:39.259 --> 00:13:41.320 She was. She had a role in the comedy Old School 00:13:41.320 --> 00:13:44.480 in 2003. She had her own reality show. show on 00:13:44.480 --> 00:13:47.740 VH1, Inside Out, Leah Remini, which documented 00:13:47.740 --> 00:13:49.679 her wedding and then the birth of her daughter, 00:13:49.820 --> 00:13:53.539 Sophia. So from the outside, life looks perfect. 00:13:53.679 --> 00:13:55.919 She's on a hit show. She's wealthy. She's starting 00:13:55.919 --> 00:13:58.159 a family. She has achieved the American dream 00:13:58.159 --> 00:14:00.779 that her parents, you know, worked for. But as 00:14:00.779 --> 00:14:02.960 King of Queens wraps up, she transitions into 00:14:02.960 --> 00:14:05.279 a different kind of role. She joins the talk. 00:14:05.710 --> 00:14:08.409 This was 2010, the first season of the CBS daytime 00:14:08.409 --> 00:14:11.250 talk show. It was this big experiment, a panel 00:14:11.250 --> 00:14:13.889 of mothers. It was Leah, Julie Chen Moonviz, 00:14:14.049 --> 00:14:16.549 Sarah Gilbert, Holly Robinson -Pete, and Sharon 00:14:16.549 --> 00:14:19.149 Osbourne. And this is where we start to see some 00:14:19.149 --> 00:14:21.129 of that public conflict that becomes a theme 00:14:21.129 --> 00:14:24.029 later. Because she wasn't renewed after that 00:14:24.029 --> 00:14:26.809 first season. Right. Her and Holly Robinson -Pete 00:14:26.809 --> 00:14:28.970 were both let go. And it was messy. It wasn't 00:14:28.970 --> 00:14:32.070 a quiet departure. No. In 2012, this turned into 00:14:32.070 --> 00:14:34.570 a massive public Twitter dispute. With Sharon 00:14:34.570 --> 00:14:38.830 Osbourne. Yes. Leah did not hold back. She tweeted 00:14:38.830 --> 00:14:41.679 that Sharon Osbourne had them fired. And the 00:14:41.679 --> 00:14:44.799 specific accusations were pretty ugly. Leah claimed 00:14:44.799 --> 00:14:47.259 Sharon thought she and Holly were, and I'm quoting 00:14:47.259 --> 00:14:50.620 Leah's tweet here, too ghetto and awkward. Too 00:14:50.620 --> 00:14:53.259 ghetto. That is a heavy accusation. It carries 00:14:53.259 --> 00:14:56.159 a lot of class and racial coding. It does. Sharon 00:14:56.159 --> 00:14:58.460 Osbourne, for her part, denied it, calling it 00:14:58.460 --> 00:15:01.659 false gossip. But Leah challenged her to establish 00:15:01.659 --> 00:15:03.860 in a court of law what was untrue. She basically 00:15:03.860 --> 00:15:06.990 said, sue me if I'm lying. Which is such a Leah 00:15:06.990 --> 00:15:09.610 Remini move. It's a preview of the legal battles 00:15:09.610 --> 00:15:11.529 to come. She's saying, I have the receipts. Do 00:15:11.529 --> 00:15:13.389 you want to do this? She's not backing down. 00:15:13.549 --> 00:15:15.830 It shows that Leah isn't afraid to burn a bridge 00:15:15.830 --> 00:15:18.610 if she feels there's an injustice. She's willing 00:15:18.610 --> 00:15:21.009 to be loud about it. Most celebrities would just 00:15:21.009 --> 00:15:22.830 issue a polite statement wishing everyone the 00:15:22.830 --> 00:15:26.090 best to move on. Leah went for the throat. And 00:15:26.090 --> 00:15:28.629 interestingly, this friction resurfaced years 00:15:28.629 --> 00:15:32.230 later in 2021 when Sharon Osbourne was fired 00:15:32.230 --> 00:15:34.470 from the talk after her own on -air controversy 00:15:34.470 --> 00:15:38.009 regarding race. Leah and Holly Robinson -Pete 00:15:38.009 --> 00:15:40.929 both came forward and reiterated their claims 00:15:40.929 --> 00:15:43.929 about her past discriminatory behavior. And Osbourne 00:15:43.929 --> 00:15:46.610 threatened the defamation lawsuits again. Right. 00:15:46.649 --> 00:15:49.649 She did, but ultimately took no action. So this 00:15:49.649 --> 00:15:52.509 whole incident. It really illustrates her personality, 00:15:52.710 --> 00:15:55.210 perfectly unafraid of conflict and willing to 00:15:55.210 --> 00:15:57.210 go public with grievances, a trait that becomes 00:15:57.210 --> 00:16:00.090 absolutely crucial later. Because while all this 00:16:00.090 --> 00:16:02.190 Hollywood drama is happening behind the scenes, 00:16:02.370 --> 00:16:05.830 she is still a dedicated high -level Scientologist. 00:16:05.950 --> 00:16:07.490 She's been in it since she was a kid. She's a 00:16:07.490 --> 00:16:09.590 celebrity member now. She's at the gala event. 00:16:09.649 --> 00:16:12.230 She's donating millions of dollars. But cracks 00:16:12.230 --> 00:16:14.850 start to form. And according to the sources, 00:16:15.110 --> 00:16:18.090 the catalyst, the single event that started the 00:16:18.090 --> 00:16:21.830 avalanche was a specific wedding in 2006. The 00:16:21.830 --> 00:16:24.269 wedding of the century, essentially. Tom Cruise 00:16:24.269 --> 00:16:26.789 and Katie Holmes. In a castle in Italy. It was 00:16:26.789 --> 00:16:29.009 the event. The biggest. Yeah. And Leah Remini's 00:16:29.009 --> 00:16:31.070 there. She's in the inner circle. But she notices 00:16:31.070 --> 00:16:33.490 something missing. Or rather, someone missing. 00:16:34.029 --> 00:16:36.929 And she asks a simple question. Where is Shelley? 00:16:37.490 --> 00:16:39.850 Shelley Miscavige. The wife of the church leader, 00:16:40.009 --> 00:16:42.990 David Miscavige. Correct. Shelley Miscavige had 00:16:42.990 --> 00:16:46.110 been a constant presence for years. She was the 00:16:46.110 --> 00:16:48.610 first lady of the church in a sense. She was 00:16:48.610 --> 00:16:51.250 at every event. But by 2006, she hadn't been 00:16:51.250 --> 00:16:54.049 seen in public for quite some time. And when 00:16:54.049 --> 00:16:56.049 Leah asked this question at the wedding, just 00:16:56.049 --> 00:16:58.450 a casual conversational question to an official. 00:16:58.649 --> 00:17:01.470 What was she told? According to former high -ranking 00:17:01.470 --> 00:17:04.650 Sea Org member Mike Rinder and Leah's own accounts, 00:17:04.930 --> 00:17:07.230 the church spokesman at the time, Tommy Davis, 00:17:07.529 --> 00:17:09.900 turned to her and told her she didn't and I'm 00:17:09.900 --> 00:17:11.900 censoring slightly here. She didn't have the 00:17:11.900 --> 00:17:13.720 taving rank to ask that question. You don't have 00:17:13.720 --> 00:17:16.519 the rank. You don't have the rank. Let that sink 00:17:16.519 --> 00:17:20.059 in. She is a famous wealthy woman a top donor 00:17:20.059 --> 00:17:22.799 who has given millions. But in the eyes of the 00:17:22.799 --> 00:17:26.210 organization she is a subordinate. It implies 00:17:26.210 --> 00:17:29.990 this rigid military -style hierarchy where asking 00:17:29.990 --> 00:17:33.509 about the well -being of a leader's wife is considered 00:17:33.509 --> 00:17:36.210 an act of insubordination. It's such a revealing 00:17:36.210 --> 00:17:38.029 statement about the structure of the organization. 00:17:38.309 --> 00:17:40.490 It tells you everything you need to know about 00:17:40.490 --> 00:17:43.450 the power dynamic. You are there to pay and perform. 00:17:44.119 --> 00:17:47.279 Not to think or ask. Exactly. But Leah didn't 00:17:47.279 --> 00:17:49.519 just let it go. She didn't just swallow the insult 00:17:49.519 --> 00:17:51.680 and sit down. She did what she had been trained 00:17:51.680 --> 00:17:54.859 to do her whole life. She filed a knowledge report. 00:17:55.160 --> 00:17:56.839 Which is an internal church report, right? It's 00:17:56.839 --> 00:17:59.539 like filing a complaint with HR. Sort of. In 00:17:59.539 --> 00:18:02.380 Scientology, members are encouraged and, in fact, 00:18:02.380 --> 00:18:04.839 required to write reports on each other if they 00:18:04.839 --> 00:18:07.500 see out ethics behavior. It's a system of internal 00:18:07.500 --> 00:18:10.339 policing. So Leah asserted that the behavior 00:18:10.339 --> 00:18:12.579 of David Miscavige, Tom Cruise, and others at 00:18:12.579 --> 00:18:14.519 the wedding was inconsistent with church rules. 00:18:14.819 --> 00:18:17.359 She was trying to use the system to correct the 00:18:17.359 --> 00:18:19.220 system. She was trying to call the manager on 00:18:19.220 --> 00:18:21.839 the CEO. And how did that go for her? I imagine 00:18:21.839 --> 00:18:24.460 not well. Terribly. It led to years of what she 00:18:24.460 --> 00:18:27.680 describes as interrogations and thought modification. 00:18:28.720 --> 00:18:30.660 She was sent to the church's headquarters in 00:18:30.660 --> 00:18:33.559 Clearwater, Florida, for a month at a time for 00:18:33.559 --> 00:18:36.660 reeducation. She was essentially blackballed 00:18:36.660 --> 00:18:39.339 internally. Friends she had known for decades, 00:18:39.539 --> 00:18:41.920 people she grew up with, wrote these internal 00:18:41.920 --> 00:18:44.200 reports about her, criticizing her behavior, 00:18:44.440 --> 00:18:47.640 her tone, her attitude. The church even investigated 00:18:47.640 --> 00:18:50.160 her family, trying to find leverage. It sounds 00:18:50.160 --> 00:18:52.579 like a paranoid thriller. But this is her life. 00:18:52.640 --> 00:18:54.740 She's going to work on King of Queens or later 00:18:54.740 --> 00:18:57.859 The Talk and then going home to this intense 00:18:57.859 --> 00:19:00.480 psychological warfare. And this went on for years, 00:19:00.640 --> 00:19:05.099 seven years roughly, from 2006 to 2013. And that 00:19:05.099 --> 00:19:07.319 is the sunk cost fallacy we talked about. Right. 00:19:07.359 --> 00:19:09.940 It's the idea that you've invested so much time, 00:19:09.980 --> 00:19:12.700 money and emotion into something that you can't 00:19:12.700 --> 00:19:14.720 walk away, even when it's actively hurting you. 00:19:14.970 --> 00:19:16.730 Her whole life was there. Her mother was there. 00:19:16.769 --> 00:19:18.970 Her sister was there. Her husband, all her friends, 00:19:19.049 --> 00:19:21.349 her business contacts. Walking away meant detonating 00:19:21.349 --> 00:19:24.470 her entire existence. But finally, in July 2013, 00:19:24.750 --> 00:19:27.529 she breaks. She leaves. And the reasons she cited 00:19:27.529 --> 00:19:30.170 are important. It wasn't just the Shelley Miscavige 00:19:30.170 --> 00:19:32.650 incident. It was the policies forbidding the 00:19:32.650 --> 00:19:35.250 questioning of leadership. It was the stories 00:19:35.250 --> 00:19:37.650 of abuse of Sea Orc members that she was starting 00:19:37.650 --> 00:19:39.390 to learn about on the Internet, which, by the 00:19:39.390 --> 00:19:41.549 way, she wasn't supposed to be reading. And it 00:19:41.549 --> 00:19:45.269 was the policy of disconnection. disconnection 00:19:45.269 --> 00:19:47.910 that's the practice where if you leave your family 00:19:47.910 --> 00:19:51.170 and friends who are still in are required by 00:19:51.170 --> 00:19:54.130 church scripture to cut you off completely you're 00:19:54.130 --> 00:19:56.849 declared a suppressive person or an sp right 00:19:56.849 --> 00:19:59.930 an enemy and no one in good standing can speak 00:19:59.930 --> 00:20:03.109 to an sp leah knew this was coming she has spoken 00:20:03.109 --> 00:20:05.230 about losing friends who are not permitted to 00:20:05.230 --> 00:20:07.970 contact her to this day people she loved but 00:20:07.970 --> 00:20:10.630 she had a very significant support system that 00:20:10.630 --> 00:20:13.130 saved her from the worst of it her family left 00:20:13.130 --> 00:20:15.720 with her This is the miracle of her story, really. 00:20:15.819 --> 00:20:19.160 Her mother, Vicky, and her sister, Nicole, they 00:20:19.160 --> 00:20:21.900 all got out. They chose Leah. They refused to 00:20:21.900 --> 00:20:25.039 be split up. That is rare. It's incredibly rare. 00:20:25.200 --> 00:20:28.240 Often these exits tear families apart for decades. 00:20:28.559 --> 00:20:31.200 But the Reminisce stayed together. And she also 00:20:31.200 --> 00:20:33.660 got public support from Paul Haggis, the Oscar 00:20:33.660 --> 00:20:36.660 -winning director of Crash, who is a famous ex 00:20:36.660 --> 00:20:39.740 -Scientologist. He wrote an open letter praising 00:20:39.740 --> 00:20:42.680 her integrity and courage. So she's out. She's 00:20:42.680 --> 00:20:45.619 free. She has her family. The safe move, the 00:20:45.619 --> 00:20:48.460 typical Hollywood move, would be to issue a quiet 00:20:48.460 --> 00:20:51.019 statement, say, I'm pursuing other spiritual 00:20:51.019 --> 00:20:54.200 paths, and go enjoy her residual. Right. Keep 00:20:54.200 --> 00:20:56.180 your head down. Don't get sued. Move on with 00:20:56.180 --> 00:20:58.099 your life. But she doesn't do that. She goes 00:20:58.099 --> 00:21:00.220 on the offensive. Immediately. Immediately. She 00:21:00.220 --> 00:21:03.220 becomes fair game to use the church's own terminology 00:21:03.220 --> 00:21:06.180 for how its enemies are treated. In August 2013, 00:21:06.599 --> 00:21:08.519 just a month after leaving, she walks into the 00:21:08.519 --> 00:21:11.039 Los Angeles Police Department and files a missing 00:21:11.039 --> 00:21:14.299 person report for Shelly Miscavige. That is such 00:21:14.299 --> 00:21:16.740 a bold move. Yeah. Taking an internal church 00:21:16.740 --> 00:21:19.279 question to the actual police. It was a strategic 00:21:19.279 --> 00:21:21.839 masterstroke. It took the issue out of the realm 00:21:21.839 --> 00:21:24.599 of church gossip and internal policy and put 00:21:24.599 --> 00:21:27.019 it squarely into the realm of criminal law. It 00:21:27.019 --> 00:21:28.960 made headlines everywhere. What happened with 00:21:28.960 --> 00:21:31.400 the report? The outcome was that the LAPD spoke 00:21:31.400 --> 00:21:33.579 with Shelley Miscavige, or claimed to have made 00:21:33.579 --> 00:21:36.779 contact, and closed the investigation as unfounded. 00:21:37.160 --> 00:21:40.299 The church called it a publicity stunt. But the 00:21:40.299 --> 00:21:43.440 message Leah sent was crystal clear. I am not 00:21:43.440 --> 00:21:46.200 afraid of you and I will use real world institutions 00:21:46.200 --> 00:21:49.259 to challenge you. And then came the media blitz. 00:21:49.299 --> 00:21:51.480 She realized that her best protection was to 00:21:51.480 --> 00:21:54.059 be as loud and as public as possible. Exactly. 00:21:54.180 --> 00:21:56.680 Silence makes you a target. Being loud makes 00:21:56.680 --> 00:21:59.819 you a witness. She wrote a memoir in 2015 called 00:21:59.819 --> 00:22:02.700 Troublemaker, surviving Hollywood and Scientology. 00:22:02.900 --> 00:22:05.359 It hit number one on the New York Times bestseller 00:22:05.359 --> 00:22:07.680 list. She laid it all out. And then the show 00:22:07.680 --> 00:22:09.839 that really changed the cultural conversation, 00:22:10.359 --> 00:22:13.279 Leah Remini, Scientology and the Aftermath on 00:22:13.279 --> 00:22:16.500 A &E. Running from 2016 to 2019, this wasn't 00:22:16.500 --> 00:22:18.380 just another reality show. This was documentary 00:22:18.380 --> 00:22:20.759 activism. It was heavy. I remember watching it. 00:22:20.779 --> 00:22:22.700 It wasn't just Leah talking about herself. It 00:22:22.700 --> 00:22:25.819 was barely about her at all, in a way. No, she 00:22:25.819 --> 00:22:28.059 used her platform to interview people who didn't 00:22:28.059 --> 00:22:31.259 have a voice. Former Sea Org members, people 00:22:31.259 --> 00:22:33.240 who had been bankrupted by the church, people 00:22:33.240 --> 00:22:35.480 who had lost their children to disconnection. 00:22:35.759 --> 00:22:39.240 The mission was explicit. to shed light on alleged 00:22:39.240 --> 00:22:42.619 abuses, bullying, harassment, coerced abortions, 00:22:42.619 --> 00:22:45.019 and to encourage other victims to speak up. And 00:22:45.019 --> 00:22:46.920 the industry recognized it. It wasn't treated 00:22:46.920 --> 00:22:50.759 as tabloid fluff. It won two primetime Emmy Awards 00:22:50.759 --> 00:22:54.279 and a Television Critics Association Award. It 00:22:54.279 --> 00:22:56.259 legitimized the criticism in a way that hadn't 00:22:56.259 --> 00:22:58.359 happened on that scale before. And she didn't 00:22:58.359 --> 00:23:01.799 stop there. In 2020, she started a podcast, Scientology, 00:23:01.980 --> 00:23:04.660 Fair Game, with Mike Rinder. The irony there 00:23:04.660 --> 00:23:07.440 is so potent. Mike Rinder was the former head 00:23:07.440 --> 00:23:10.039 spokesman. He was the guy who in previous years 00:23:10.039 --> 00:23:11.779 would have been the one on TV attacking her. 00:23:11.900 --> 00:23:13.519 He was a high ranking official. He was part of 00:23:13.519 --> 00:23:16.079 the machinery that enforced these policies. But 00:23:16.079 --> 00:23:18.500 he got out, too, and they joined forces. It's 00:23:18.500 --> 00:23:20.579 a very powerful alliance. And most recently, 00:23:20.660 --> 00:23:23.160 in 2023, she took it to the courts. She sued 00:23:23.160 --> 00:23:25.119 the Church of Scientology and David Miscavige 00:23:25.119 --> 00:23:29.000 personally. This is a major escalation. She isn't 00:23:29.000 --> 00:23:31.119 just making documentaries anymore. She is seeking 00:23:31.119 --> 00:23:34.170 damages in a court of law. What are the specific 00:23:34.170 --> 00:23:37.069 allegations in that lawsuit? It's a long list. 00:23:37.349 --> 00:23:40.730 She is accusing them of harassment, stalking, 00:23:40.730 --> 00:23:43.910 psychological torture and a coordinated decade 00:23:43.910 --> 00:23:47.619 -long campaign to ruin her livelihood. She claims 00:23:47.619 --> 00:23:49.279 they have been interfering with her business 00:23:49.279 --> 00:23:52.400 contracts, scaring off potential employers, and 00:23:52.400 --> 00:23:54.420 sending private investigators to follow her and 00:23:54.420 --> 00:23:56.640 her family. It's a battle that is still ongoing. 00:23:56.920 --> 00:23:58.839 Yeah. And it takes a toll. You can hear it in 00:23:58.839 --> 00:24:01.859 her voice in interviews. She is exhausted, but 00:24:01.859 --> 00:24:04.259 she just won't stop. But amidst all this, the 00:24:04.259 --> 00:24:06.700 lawsuits, the documentaries, the fighting, she 00:24:06.700 --> 00:24:09.019 did something really personal and quiet for herself. 00:24:09.119 --> 00:24:11.299 She went back to school. This is one of the most 00:24:11.299 --> 00:24:13.799 touching parts of her narrative for me. Because 00:24:13.799 --> 00:24:15.400 remember, we talked about her leaving school 00:24:15.400 --> 00:24:17.319 in the eighth grade. Because of the Sea Org. 00:24:17.609 --> 00:24:20.309 She missed high school. She missed college. She 00:24:20.309 --> 00:24:22.230 felt that that was a huge chunk of her life that 00:24:22.230 --> 00:24:24.630 had been stolen. She has spoken really openly 00:24:24.630 --> 00:24:27.089 about feeling insecure in rooms full of educated 00:24:27.089 --> 00:24:29.690 people, feeling like she wasn't smart in the 00:24:29.690 --> 00:24:33.569 traditional sense. So in May 2021, she announces 00:24:33.569 --> 00:24:36.009 she was accepted into an associate degree program 00:24:36.009 --> 00:24:39.369 at NYU. New York University. That is no small 00:24:39.369 --> 00:24:41.630 feat for anyone, let alone someone with an eighth 00:24:41.630 --> 00:24:44.269 grade education starting in her 50s. And she 00:24:44.269 --> 00:24:47.230 was so honest about it on social media. She posted 00:24:47.230 --> 00:24:50.309 photos of herself studying, stressing about essays, 00:24:50.670 --> 00:24:52.910 pulling all -nighters. She said it was one of 00:24:52.910 --> 00:24:55.650 the most difficult experiences of her life. She 00:24:55.650 --> 00:24:58.829 was in her 50s, sitting in classes, writing papers 00:24:58.829 --> 00:25:02.150 on logic and history and math. But she stuck 00:25:02.150 --> 00:25:06.549 with it. And in January 2024, at age 53, she 00:25:06.549 --> 00:25:09.299 was awarded an associate in arts degree. It's 00:25:09.299 --> 00:25:11.240 amazing. She's working toward a bachelor's now, 00:25:11.359 --> 00:25:13.559 right? She is. She called it taking back her 00:25:13.559 --> 00:25:15.880 life. It's such a powerful reclaiming of self. 00:25:15.940 --> 00:25:18.099 It's saying, you took my education from me, so 00:25:18.099 --> 00:25:20.539 now I'm going to go get it myself on my own terms. 00:25:20.779 --> 00:25:23.289 And speaking of reclaiming. She also reclaimed 00:25:23.289 --> 00:25:26.069 her faith. She did. She went back to Catholicism, 00:25:26.109 --> 00:25:28.349 the religion she was baptized into as a baby. 00:25:28.609 --> 00:25:31.450 In interviews, she has contrasted the peace she 00:25:31.450 --> 00:25:34.109 finds in saying the rosary with the chaos and 00:25:34.109 --> 00:25:36.210 constant expense and judgment of Scientology. 00:25:36.430 --> 00:25:39.990 It seems like she really sought out stability 00:25:39.990 --> 00:25:43.460 and tradition after decades. of something else 00:25:43.460 --> 00:25:46.839 i think so she even had her daughter sophia baptized 00:25:46.839 --> 00:25:49.579 in the catholic church in 2015. it was a very 00:25:49.579 --> 00:25:52.200 symbolic return to her roots before that pivot 00:25:52.200 --> 00:25:54.140 happened when she was eight years old now let's 00:25:54.140 --> 00:25:56.319 catch up on her career outside of the activism 00:25:57.170 --> 00:26:00.269 Because despite the alleged attempts to ruin 00:26:00.269 --> 00:26:02.930 her livelihood, she didn't stop working in Hollywood. 00:26:03.150 --> 00:26:05.490 Not at all. She did Dancing with the Stars in 00:26:05.490 --> 00:26:08.589 season 17. She made it to fifth place. She even 00:26:08.589 --> 00:26:10.769 came back as a guest host and a judge later on. 00:26:10.910 --> 00:26:13.650 She has a personality that just works great for 00:26:13.650 --> 00:26:17.670 reality TV. She's honest and funny and unfiltered. 00:26:17.890 --> 00:26:19.809 And there was a big reunion with Kevin James. 00:26:20.089 --> 00:26:22.819 Wait. Now, this is a fascinating and kind of 00:26:22.819 --> 00:26:25.380 brutal sidebar in TV history. Oh, it's brutal. 00:26:25.619 --> 00:26:27.599 So Kevin James has this new sitcom. He has a 00:26:27.599 --> 00:26:29.500 wife on the show, played by the actress Erin 00:26:29.500 --> 00:26:32.480 Hayes. Leah comes on as a guest star in the season 00:26:32.480 --> 00:26:36.279 finale. And the audience goes nuts. The chemistry 00:26:36.279 --> 00:26:38.880 is just undeniably still there. So what do the 00:26:38.880 --> 00:26:41.460 producers do? They fire the actress playing the 00:26:41.460 --> 00:26:44.059 wife, kill off her character between seasons, 00:26:44.220 --> 00:26:47.160 and bring Leah in as a series regular for season 00:26:47.160 --> 00:26:50.019 two. It was such a polarizing move. The backlash 00:26:50.019 --> 00:26:52.359 was huge. It was ruthless, but it just shows 00:26:52.359 --> 00:26:55.480 you how powerful the Leah and Kevin dynamic is 00:26:55.480 --> 00:26:58.319 in the eyes of network television. They tried 00:26:58.319 --> 00:27:00.380 to recapture the magic. Unfortunately, the show 00:27:00.380 --> 00:27:01.940 was canceled after that second season anyway, 00:27:02.160 --> 00:27:04.799 but it kept her in the game. She also teamed 00:27:04.799 --> 00:27:07.079 up with her real -life best friend, Jennifer 00:27:07.079 --> 00:27:11.079 Lopez. In the movie Second Act in 2018, she played 00:27:11.079 --> 00:27:13.240 Joan, J -Lo's best friend. It makes sense. They 00:27:13.240 --> 00:27:16.079 are very, very close in real life. J -Lo stood 00:27:16.079 --> 00:27:18.099 by her through the Scientology exit, which was 00:27:18.099 --> 00:27:19.880 a big deal because not a lot of other celebrities 00:27:19.880 --> 00:27:22.880 did publicly. And she's been hosting. She hosted 00:27:22.880 --> 00:27:25.599 People Puzzler on the Game Show Network and was 00:27:25.599 --> 00:27:28.460 a judge. So you think you can dance? So she keeps 00:27:28.460 --> 00:27:30.380 reinventing herself. She refuses to be pushed 00:27:30.380 --> 00:27:32.200 out of the industry. She just keeps finding new 00:27:32.200 --> 00:27:34.299 lanes. But we also have to touch on a recent 00:27:34.299 --> 00:27:37.150 personal update. A big one. We mentioned her 00:27:37.150 --> 00:27:40.269 husband, Angelo Pagan. They met in 1996 at a 00:27:40.269 --> 00:27:42.829 Cuban restaurant. A very classic meeting story. 00:27:43.210 --> 00:27:46.490 They married in 2003. It was actually a Scientology 00:27:46.490 --> 00:27:48.930 wedding at the time. Angelo was a Scientologist, 00:27:48.970 --> 00:27:51.190 too. He left with her, didn't he? He did. He 00:27:51.190 --> 00:27:53.410 stood by her side during the exit and through 00:27:53.410 --> 00:27:55.450 all of the aftermath. He was right there with 00:27:55.450 --> 00:27:59.549 her. But recently. Yes. In August 2024, they 00:27:59.549 --> 00:28:02.109 announced they were divorcing. And it was finalized 00:28:02.109 --> 00:28:05.000 in October 2024. After more than 20 years of 00:28:05.000 --> 00:28:07.500 marriage, it's just another major life transition 00:28:07.500 --> 00:28:09.799 for her. It feels like the ground is always shifting 00:28:09.799 --> 00:28:12.019 under her feet. When you look at the whole picture, 00:28:12.160 --> 00:28:15.420 from the billion -year contract at 13, to the 00:28:15.420 --> 00:28:18.500 Friends audition, to King of Queens, to the whistleblowing, 00:28:18.619 --> 00:28:21.400 the NYU degree, the divorce, it is an exhausting 00:28:21.400 --> 00:28:24.579 amount of life to have lived by age 55. It is. 00:28:24.680 --> 00:28:26.880 And I think the key takeaway here isn't just 00:28:26.880 --> 00:28:28.960 about Scientology. It's about the difficulty 00:28:28.960 --> 00:28:31.200 of breaking away from any system that raised 00:28:31.200 --> 00:28:34.529 you. It applies to anything. A bad job, a toxic 00:28:34.529 --> 00:28:37.750 family dynamic, a political party, a bad relationship. 00:28:38.150 --> 00:28:41.109 Exactly. It's about overcoming that sunk cost 00:28:41.109 --> 00:28:44.589 fallacy. She had decades invested. She had millions 00:28:44.589 --> 00:28:47.170 of dollars invested. Her whole identity was invested 00:28:47.170 --> 00:28:50.390 in this thing. Walking away was the hardest possible 00:28:50.390 --> 00:28:52.410 choice. It would have been so, so much easier 00:28:52.410 --> 00:28:55.430 to stay and pretend. But she chose the hard road. 00:28:55.569 --> 00:28:57.529 And she used her platform. She could have just 00:28:57.529 --> 00:29:00.710 left and stayed quiet. But she chose to be loud. 00:29:00.849 --> 00:29:03.390 And that loudness has changed the cultural conversation. 00:29:03.769 --> 00:29:06.569 I mean, think about it. Before Leah Remini, Scientology 00:29:06.569 --> 00:29:09.269 was this mysterious, quirky celebrity thing. 00:29:09.349 --> 00:29:12.289 After Leah Remini, the general public knows terms 00:29:12.289 --> 00:29:14.650 like disconnection. They know about the whole. 00:29:14.869 --> 00:29:17.190 They know about the allegations of abuse. She 00:29:17.190 --> 00:29:19.529 took the mystery away and showed the human cost. 00:29:19.829 --> 00:29:22.250 So as we wrap up this deep dive into Leah Remini, 00:29:22.430 --> 00:29:25.369 we are left with a woman who has worn so many 00:29:25.369 --> 00:29:28.400 masks. sitcom wife, talk show host, activist, 00:29:28.680 --> 00:29:31.140 student. But the common thread seems to be this 00:29:31.140 --> 00:29:33.940 absolute refusal to be told no. Or to be told 00:29:33.940 --> 00:29:36.180 she doesn't have the rank. Exactly. And that 00:29:36.180 --> 00:29:38.299 brings us to our final thought for you, the listener. 00:29:38.740 --> 00:29:41.160 Leah Remini was silenced, or they tried to silence 00:29:41.160 --> 00:29:44.480 her, with a claim of rank. She was told she wasn't 00:29:44.480 --> 00:29:46.400 important enough to ask where a missing woman 00:29:46.400 --> 00:29:48.859 was. She eventually realized that in the real 00:29:48.859 --> 00:29:51.430 world, the truth doesn't care about rank. Rank 00:29:51.430 --> 00:29:54.269 is just a construct. It's a tool used to keep 00:29:54.269 --> 00:29:56.490 people in line. So the question we want to leave 00:29:56.490 --> 00:29:59.650 you with is this. In your own life or your own 00:29:59.650 --> 00:30:02.369 organization or your own community, what are 00:30:02.369 --> 00:30:04.849 the questions you are not allowed to ask? What 00:30:04.849 --> 00:30:07.109 are the topics that are off limits? And more 00:30:07.109 --> 00:30:09.589 importantly, what does that silence, that taboo 00:30:09.589 --> 00:30:12.269 tell you about the power dynamic at play? If 00:30:12.269 --> 00:30:14.549 you aren't allowed to ask, there's usually a 00:30:14.549 --> 00:30:16.230 reason why someone doesn't want you to know the 00:30:16.230 --> 00:30:18.329 answer. Something to think about. Thanks for 00:30:18.329 --> 00:30:20.410 listening to The Deep Dive. We'll catch you next 00:30:20.410 --> 00:30:20.670 time.