WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.200 We live in an era that I think can best be described 00:00:02.200 --> 00:00:05.059 as the content mill. Oh, absolutely. That's the 00:00:05.059 --> 00:00:07.740 perfect term for it. If you're an artist, a creator, 00:00:07.900 --> 00:00:10.480 or I mean, even just a person with a brand today, 00:00:10.560 --> 00:00:14.599 the rule is so simple. You have to feed the beast. 00:00:14.859 --> 00:00:18.800 Post every day, story every hour. If you disappear 00:00:18.800 --> 00:00:21.780 for a month, the algorithm, you know, it just 00:00:21.780 --> 00:00:23.879 punishes you. If you disappear for a year, you 00:00:23.879 --> 00:00:25.960 are forgotten. You're irrelevant. The game moves 00:00:25.960 --> 00:00:28.300 on without you. But today we are diving into 00:00:28.300 --> 00:00:32.460 the anomaly, the glitch in that matrix. We're 00:00:32.460 --> 00:00:34.659 looking at an artist who has built a 40 -year 00:00:34.659 --> 00:00:38.880 career, sold nearly 75 million records, and achieved 00:00:38.880 --> 00:00:41.420 icon status by doing the exact opposite of all 00:00:41.420 --> 00:00:43.439 that. She doesn't feed the beast. She starves 00:00:43.439 --> 00:00:45.420 it. She starves it. And it just keeps coming 00:00:45.420 --> 00:00:47.979 back for more. It's the ultimate paradox of the 00:00:47.979 --> 00:00:49.679 modern music industry, isn't it? We're talking 00:00:49.679 --> 00:00:52.020 about someone who is, you know, arguably one 00:00:52.020 --> 00:00:54.659 of the most successful British female artists 00:00:54.659 --> 00:00:56.899 in history. One of the most successful, period. 00:00:57.280 --> 00:01:00.140 Right. Yet her fame is almost defined by her 00:01:00.140 --> 00:01:03.399 absence. In a world that is just so, so noisy, 00:01:03.600 --> 00:01:05.900 she has somehow managed to weaponize silence. 00:01:06.519 --> 00:01:08.819 We are talking, of course, about Saad. And I'm 00:01:08.819 --> 00:01:10.700 really excited about this one because I think 00:01:10.700 --> 00:01:15.719 people have this very specific, almost surface 00:01:15.719 --> 00:01:17.980 -level image of her. I know exactly what you 00:01:17.980 --> 00:01:20.439 mean. You know, the ponytail, the hoop earrings. 00:01:20.719 --> 00:01:23.640 The smooth jazz playlist at a dinner party. Yes, 00:01:23.739 --> 00:01:26.519 that's it. But when you actually dig into the 00:01:26.519 --> 00:01:29.540 source material, the biography, the discography, 00:01:29.739 --> 00:01:33.079 all the industry analysis, it's so much stranger. 00:01:33.760 --> 00:01:37.200 And frankly, more calculated than that. Calculated 00:01:37.200 --> 00:01:40.700 is the right word, but not in a cynical way. 00:01:40.819 --> 00:01:43.079 It feels more calculated in terms of preservation. 00:01:43.379 --> 00:01:46.640 Preservation of self or of the art. Both, I think. 00:01:46.700 --> 00:01:48.500 And look, before we even get into biography, 00:01:48.840 --> 00:01:51.019 we have to dismantle the first and biggest misconception. 00:01:51.500 --> 00:01:53.980 When most people say Saad, they're picturing 00:01:53.980 --> 00:01:57.489 the woman, Helen Follis -Addu. But Sod is not 00:01:57.489 --> 00:01:59.409 a solo act. Right. And this is something I think 00:01:59.409 --> 00:02:01.750 even casual fans forget all the time. Sod is 00:02:01.750 --> 00:02:03.769 a band. It is a band. Exactly. It's a collective. 00:02:03.930 --> 00:02:06.769 It's not just a singer with a revolving door 00:02:06.769 --> 00:02:09.189 of session musicians she hires for a tour. You 00:02:09.189 --> 00:02:11.650 have Stuart Matthewman on guitar and saxophone, 00:02:11.750 --> 00:02:14.810 Andrew Hale on keyboards, and Paul Denman on 00:02:14.810 --> 00:02:18.210 bass. And here is the real kicker. They have 00:02:18.210 --> 00:02:21.990 been together since 1983. Think about that. I 00:02:21.990 --> 00:02:24.650 mean, just try to name another band with that 00:02:24.650 --> 00:02:26.849 kind of stability. It's virtually non -existent 00:02:26.849 --> 00:02:28.849 in pop music. You have, what, the Rolling Stones, 00:02:29.150 --> 00:02:31.569 U2, maybe. The list of bands that keep their 00:02:31.569 --> 00:02:34.550 core lineup for four decades is incredibly short. 00:02:34.710 --> 00:02:36.610 And that continuity, it has to be the secret 00:02:36.610 --> 00:02:38.509 sauce for the sound, right? You just can't replicate 00:02:38.509 --> 00:02:41.050 that kind of musical telepathy if you're hiring 00:02:41.050 --> 00:02:42.830 new guys for every album. You absolutely cannot. 00:02:42.990 --> 00:02:46.360 That specific Sade sound. which we will absolutely 00:02:46.360 --> 00:02:48.280 break down later because it's so much more complex 00:02:48.280 --> 00:02:50.879 than just smooth jazz, is a direct result of 00:02:50.879 --> 00:02:53.000 four people growing up together musically. They 00:02:53.000 --> 00:02:55.740 lock in. They lock in. It's a hive mind. So our 00:02:55.740 --> 00:02:59.060 mission for this deep dive is to really look 00:02:59.060 --> 00:03:01.879 at how a fashion student from Essex and her bandmates 00:03:01.879 --> 00:03:04.780 created the sound that just conquered the world. 00:03:04.840 --> 00:03:06.960 And also why the hardest rappers in the game, 00:03:07.020 --> 00:03:09.240 you know, obsess over them. Which is such a fascinating 00:03:09.240 --> 00:03:11.990 part of the story. Ultimately, what this career 00:03:11.990 --> 00:03:14.430 teaches us about the economic value of scarcity. 00:03:14.750 --> 00:03:16.129 Okay, so let's start at the beginning, the origin 00:03:16.129 --> 00:03:18.590 story. Because it's surprisingly geographic, 00:03:18.830 --> 00:03:20.610 you can't really understand the aesthetic of 00:03:20.610 --> 00:03:22.949 the band without understanding where the lead 00:03:22.949 --> 00:03:25.949 singer came from. And it really is a tale of 00:03:25.949 --> 00:03:28.610 two very, very different worlds. It's a massive 00:03:28.610 --> 00:03:31.009 collision of cultures. Helen Felisata Dew was 00:03:31.009 --> 00:03:34.930 born on January 16th, 1959 in Ibadan, Nigeria. 00:03:35.469 --> 00:03:37.409 And Ibadan, we should say, it isn't some small 00:03:37.409 --> 00:03:40.430 village. It's a major city, a huge cultural and 00:03:40.430 --> 00:03:43.569 economic hub. A huge city. Her father, Adebisi 00:03:43.569 --> 00:03:46.069 Adu, was a Nigerian lecturer in economics. So 00:03:46.069 --> 00:03:48.629 very academic, very driven. Her mother, Anne 00:03:48.629 --> 00:03:51.090 Hayes, was an English district nurse. They'd 00:03:51.090 --> 00:03:53.590 met in London, married in 1955, and then moved 00:03:53.590 --> 00:03:55.669 to Nigeria. So right from birth, you have this 00:03:55.669 --> 00:03:58.849 mix of like the African academic elite and the 00:03:58.849 --> 00:04:01.889 pragmatic English working class. Precisely. And 00:04:01.889 --> 00:04:05.240 her name, Folasad, is Yoruba. It translates to 00:04:05.240 --> 00:04:07.560 crowned with wealth. Which, I mean, looking at 00:04:07.560 --> 00:04:09.520 her net worth and her legacy now, that feels 00:04:09.520 --> 00:04:12.039 a bit like destiny, doesn't it? A little on the 00:04:12.039 --> 00:04:14.580 nose, maybe. But she didn't spend her whole childhood 00:04:14.580 --> 00:04:17.660 in Nigeria, did she? No, and this is the traumatic 00:04:17.660 --> 00:04:19.740 pivot point in her early life. When she was just 00:04:19.740 --> 00:04:22.500 four years old, her parents separated. And her 00:04:22.500 --> 00:04:25.579 mother, Anne? took side and her older brother, 00:04:25.639 --> 00:04:28.220 Banji, and moved back to England. Back to England. 00:04:28.279 --> 00:04:30.040 They moved in with the grandparents at first 00:04:30.040 --> 00:04:32.759 near Colchester in Essex, and eventually they 00:04:32.759 --> 00:04:35.540 settled in a place called Holland -on -Sea. I 00:04:35.540 --> 00:04:37.420 want to pause on that for a second because that 00:04:37.420 --> 00:04:41.300 contrast is just, it's jarring. You go from the 00:04:41.300 --> 00:04:44.000 vibrant, rhythmic, heat -soaked environment of 00:04:44.000 --> 00:04:46.279 Ivedon. To Holland -on -Sea, yeah. For listeners 00:04:46.279 --> 00:04:48.180 who don't know Essex, especially that coastal 00:04:48.180 --> 00:04:52.370 part, I mean, it's gray, it's quiet. It's very 00:04:52.370 --> 00:04:55.470 traditional working -class England, the seaside 00:04:55.470 --> 00:04:58.050 in winter. It's a massive shock to the system 00:04:58.050 --> 00:04:59.610 for a four -year -old, and I think you can almost 00:04:59.610 --> 00:05:01.970 hear that tension in her music later on. How 00:05:01.970 --> 00:05:04.910 so? Well, there's a warmth to her sound, a rhythmic 00:05:04.910 --> 00:05:07.730 complexity that feels distinctly African, but 00:05:07.730 --> 00:05:10.670 it's overlaid with this very cool, very detached, 00:05:10.970 --> 00:05:14.050 slightly melancholic English delivery. That's 00:05:14.050 --> 00:05:16.209 a great way to put it. It's the sound of Ibadan. 00:05:16.759 --> 00:05:19.319 Filtering through the gray skies of Essex. Exactly. 00:05:19.519 --> 00:05:21.660 And another thing that sets her apart, unlike 00:05:21.660 --> 00:05:23.699 a lot of pop stars who were kind of groomed from 00:05:23.699 --> 00:05:26.519 age five to be on stage, you know, the whole 00:05:26.519 --> 00:05:29.019 Disney kid pipeline. Right, the stage school 00:05:29.019 --> 00:05:31.480 kids. She wasn't chasing fame at all. She was 00:05:31.480 --> 00:05:35.120 chasing art. The sources highlight her time at 00:05:35.120 --> 00:05:37.519 St. Martin's School of Art in London extensively. 00:05:37.839 --> 00:05:41.500 And this is arguably the most important non -musical 00:05:41.500 --> 00:05:46.620 fact about her. Now, St. Martin's is, I mean, 00:05:46.660 --> 00:05:48.779 it's hallowed ground. It's the Ivy League of 00:05:48.779 --> 00:05:51.600 art schools. It is. This is where Alexander McQueen, 00:05:52.000 --> 00:05:54.800 Stella McCartney, John Galliano went. It's not 00:05:54.800 --> 00:05:57.600 just a school. It's an incubator for the avant 00:05:57.600 --> 00:06:00.439 -garde. It teaches you a specific way of seeing 00:06:00.439 --> 00:06:02.779 the world. So she's being trained from the jump 00:06:02.779 --> 00:06:05.100 to think visually, to think about silhouette, 00:06:05.379 --> 00:06:08.220 texture, presentation. Exactly. She wasn't just 00:06:08.220 --> 00:06:09.980 a singer waiting for a microphone to be handed 00:06:09.980 --> 00:06:12.779 to her. She was a designer. actively constructing 00:06:12.779 --> 00:06:15.459 an image the sources say she worked as a fashion 00:06:15.459 --> 00:06:17.660 designer and even as a model after graduating 00:06:17.660 --> 00:06:20.120 and you see that so clearly when you look at 00:06:20.120 --> 00:06:22.600 the album covers the stage setups the way she 00:06:22.600 --> 00:06:26.300 dresses it's never cluttered never it's minimalist 00:06:26.300 --> 00:06:30.319 it's powerful it's curated that is the designer's 00:06:30.319 --> 00:06:33.399 eye at work she understands that what you don't 00:06:33.399 --> 00:06:35.899 show is just as important as what you do show 00:06:35.899 --> 00:06:38.240 which connects perfectly to the music later that 00:06:38.240 --> 00:06:41.600 idea of negative space of silence totally but 00:06:41.870 --> 00:06:44.550 How does she make the jump? How do we get from 00:06:44.550 --> 00:06:47.529 sketching designs in a London flat to fronting 00:06:47.529 --> 00:06:50.709 a world -famous band? It was almost by accident. 00:06:50.769 --> 00:06:53.370 It started with a band called Pride. This was 00:06:53.370 --> 00:06:55.610 an eight -piece Latin funk band in the early 00:06:55.610 --> 00:06:58.389 80s, a big, sprawling group. And she was just 00:06:58.389 --> 00:07:00.189 a backup singer in it. Just a backup singer. 00:07:00.370 --> 00:07:03.139 Yeah. But while in Pride, she struck up a friendship, 00:07:03.300 --> 00:07:05.699 a creative partnership, really, with the guitarist 00:07:05.699 --> 00:07:08.319 and saxophonist Stuart Matthewman. There he is, 00:07:08.360 --> 00:07:10.519 the nucleus of the Future Band. Right. They started 00:07:10.519 --> 00:07:12.500 writing together on the side, away from the rest 00:07:12.500 --> 00:07:14.800 of Pride. And they came up with this track called 00:07:14.800 --> 00:07:17.600 Smooth Operator. Which, ironically, is now one 00:07:17.600 --> 00:07:20.540 of the most famous songs in history. It is. And 00:07:20.540 --> 00:07:22.620 the problem for Pride was that when Sade and 00:07:22.620 --> 00:07:24.459 Stuart would get their little spotlight moment 00:07:24.459 --> 00:07:27.920 to perform Smooth Operator during the set. The 00:07:27.920 --> 00:07:30.079 audience went crazy for it. Oh, wow. So it was 00:07:30.079 --> 00:07:32.540 overshadowing the main act. Completely. It was 00:07:32.540 --> 00:07:34.540 sucking all the oxygen out of the rest of the 00:07:34.540 --> 00:07:37.000 show. It just became undeniable that this was 00:07:37.000 --> 00:07:41.040 the special thing. So in 1983, the split happened. 00:07:41.959 --> 00:07:44.079 Amicably. From what the sources say, it seems 00:07:44.079 --> 00:07:46.040 like it was just a natural evolution, no huge 00:07:46.040 --> 00:07:48.839 drama. Sade and Stewart grabbed the keyboardist, 00:07:48.920 --> 00:07:51.699 Andrew Hale, and the bassist, Paul Denman, and 00:07:51.699 --> 00:07:54.459 they broke away to form Sade. And the buzz was 00:07:54.459 --> 00:07:56.519 immediate, wasn't it? This wasn't a slow burn 00:07:56.519 --> 00:07:59.839 playing to empty pubs for years. It was an explosion. 00:08:00.199 --> 00:08:02.860 The source mentions their debut gig at a nightclub 00:08:02.860 --> 00:08:06.079 called Heaven in London, a legendary venue. And 00:08:06.079 --> 00:08:07.980 they hadn't even signed a record deal yet. Not 00:08:07.980 --> 00:08:10.100 yet. And a thousand people were turned away at 00:08:10.100 --> 00:08:12.339 the door. A thousand people turned away for an 00:08:12.339 --> 00:08:14.879 unsigned band. That's almost impossible to conceive 00:08:14.879 --> 00:08:18.139 of today without some massive viral TikTok hit. 00:08:18.300 --> 00:08:20.920 It really speaks to the power of the London club 00:08:20.920 --> 00:08:24.139 scene at that time. Word of mouth was physical. 00:08:24.600 --> 00:08:28.480 It was people in clubs, in pubs, on the street, 00:08:28.600 --> 00:08:30.699 just talking about this woman with the incredible 00:08:30.699 --> 00:08:33.379 voice and this unbelievably striking look. But, 00:08:33.419 --> 00:08:36.480 and I love this detail, despite all the glamour 00:08:36.480 --> 00:08:38.340 that was starting to form around her on stage, 00:08:38.679 --> 00:08:41.500 the reality of her life was very, very different. 00:08:41.620 --> 00:08:43.639 Oh, completely different. During this period 00:08:43.639 --> 00:08:45.899 of intense hype, she was squatting in a derelict 00:08:45.899 --> 00:08:48.100 fire station in Tottenham with her boyfriend 00:08:48.100 --> 00:08:50.419 at the time, the writer Robert Elms. I love that 00:08:50.419 --> 00:08:53.480 juxtaposition. On stage, she's the absolute epitome 00:08:53.480 --> 00:08:56.820 of elegance and sophistication. Off stage, she's 00:08:56.820 --> 00:08:59.440 living the gritty, cold, squatting life of 80s 00:08:59.440 --> 00:09:02.070 London. It adds this layer of authenticity to 00:09:02.070 --> 00:09:04.070 the cool, doesn't it? It wasn't bought. It was 00:09:04.070 --> 00:09:06.330 built from the ground up. It grounds the music. 00:09:06.389 --> 00:09:09.570 That sophistication wasn't elitist. It was aspirational. 00:09:09.669 --> 00:09:11.970 It was something beautiful being created from 00:09:11.970 --> 00:09:14.649 a very real, very unglamorous place. Exactly. 00:09:14.669 --> 00:09:17.889 So they get signed to Epic Records. They go into 00:09:17.889 --> 00:09:20.649 the studio, the power plant in London, to record 00:09:20.649 --> 00:09:24.549 the debut, Diamond Life. And this leads us into 00:09:24.549 --> 00:09:26.830 what we're calling the golden era. Roughly 1984 00:09:26.830 --> 00:09:30.740 to 1992, four albums. world domination it's an 00:09:30.740 --> 00:09:32.820 incredible run but let's talk about the production 00:09:32.820 --> 00:09:34.840 of diamond life first they did it in six weeks 00:09:34.840 --> 00:09:37.519 six weeks from start to finish which for a debut 00:09:37.519 --> 00:09:39.639 album that sounds that polished that confident 00:09:39.639 --> 00:09:42.059 is remarkably fast they worked with a producer 00:09:42.059 --> 00:09:45.019 named robin millar And this is where the Sade 00:09:45.019 --> 00:09:47.940 sound was truly codified. If you listen to Diamond 00:09:47.940 --> 00:09:49.840 Life, it just doesn't sound like other records 00:09:49.840 --> 00:09:52.799 from 1984. Not at all. Let's set the scene. 1984 00:09:52.799 --> 00:09:56.080 was the year of loud, synthesized pop. You had 00:09:56.080 --> 00:09:58.399 Van Halen's Jump. Prince's Purple Rain. Cyndi 00:09:58.399 --> 00:10:00.100 Lauper's Girls Just Wanna Have Fun. Everything 00:10:00.100 --> 00:10:03.149 was neon. Big hair, big shoulder pads, and big 00:10:03.149 --> 00:10:06.509 gated reverb on the drums. High energy. Exactly. 00:10:06.509 --> 00:10:08.730 And then Sade comes in with Diamond Life, and 00:10:08.730 --> 00:10:11.889 it's quiet. It's warm. It's dry. It has room 00:10:11.889 --> 00:10:15.330 tone. It breathes. It draws from jazz and soul, 00:10:15.490 --> 00:10:17.769 but it strips away all the indulgent noodling. 00:10:17.929 --> 00:10:20.250 It's incredibly disciplined. I want to dig into 00:10:20.250 --> 00:10:22.769 that word discipline, especially with the band. 00:10:22.990 --> 00:10:26.350 You mentioned the bassist, Paul Denman. His playing 00:10:26.350 --> 00:10:30.210 is fascinating to me because he plays. He does. 00:10:30.269 --> 00:10:31.990 He's a huge reggae fan, and you can hear it. 00:10:32.029 --> 00:10:34.370 If you isolate the bass lines on tracks like 00:10:34.370 --> 00:10:37.190 Smooth Operator or Your Love is King, they're 00:10:37.190 --> 00:10:39.850 very prominent, very melodic, and they sit just 00:10:39.850 --> 00:10:42.090 slightly behind the beat. It gives the music 00:10:42.090 --> 00:10:45.350 this heavy, almost dub -influenced anchor. It's 00:10:45.350 --> 00:10:47.570 what makes you nod your head. It's the foundation. 00:10:47.909 --> 00:10:49.929 Yeah. Then you have Stuart's saxophone, which 00:10:49.929 --> 00:10:52.389 is so soulful, but it's never screechy or over 00:10:52.389 --> 00:10:55.129 the top. It's restrained. And then floating on 00:10:55.129 --> 00:10:57.210 top of all of that, you have Sade's voice. The 00:10:57.210 --> 00:10:59.029 New Yorker had a brilliant quote about her voice, 00:10:59.090 --> 00:11:01.649 describing it as a grainy contralto full of air. 00:11:01.789 --> 00:11:04.470 And they said she values imperfect dignity over 00:11:04.470 --> 00:11:06.509 a show of pain. That is the crucial distinction. 00:11:06.769 --> 00:11:09.149 That phrase is perfect. Think about the other 00:11:09.149 --> 00:11:12.389 great female vocalists of that era. Whitney Houston, 00:11:12.570 --> 00:11:15.519 later on Mariah Carey. Power. houses. Absolute 00:11:15.519 --> 00:11:18.779 power houses. The style was melisma. It was vocal 00:11:18.779 --> 00:11:20.820 gymnastics. It was about showing you how high 00:11:20.820 --> 00:11:23.059 you can go and how loud you can bell. It's a 00:11:23.059 --> 00:11:25.259 look what I can do style of singing. Exactly. 00:11:25.480 --> 00:11:28.000 And Sade does the absolute opposite. She whispers. 00:11:28.039 --> 00:11:30.559 She holds back. She implies emotion rather than 00:11:30.559 --> 00:11:33.980 screaming it at you. It's cool in the truest 00:11:33.980 --> 00:11:36.379 original sense of the word. It's lowered temperature. 00:11:36.519 --> 00:11:39.019 It draws you in instead of pushing you back. 00:11:39.440 --> 00:11:41.480 And the world was clearly ready to cool down 00:11:41.480 --> 00:11:44.940 because Diamond Life sold over 6 million copies. 00:11:45.200 --> 00:11:46.960 It went on to become the best -selling debut 00:11:46.960 --> 00:11:51.279 album ever by a British female vocalist. A record 00:11:51.279 --> 00:11:53.720 that stood for a long time. And it just set them 00:11:53.720 --> 00:11:56.039 up perfectly for the follow -up, Promise, in 00:11:56.039 --> 00:11:58.899 1985, which was somehow even bigger. Promise 00:11:58.899 --> 00:12:01.879 hit number one in both the UK and the US. It 00:12:01.879 --> 00:12:04.559 gave us the sweetest taboo. A song which stayed 00:12:04.559 --> 00:12:07.299 on the Billboard Hot 100 for six months. Six 00:12:07.299 --> 00:12:10.019 months is an eternity in short years. It's just 00:12:10.019 --> 00:12:12.480 unheard of. And it wasn't just commercial success. 00:12:12.519 --> 00:12:15.100 It was critical acclaim. She won the Grammy for 00:12:15.100 --> 00:12:17.840 Best New Artist in 1986. Which was a watershed 00:12:17.840 --> 00:12:20.519 moment. The first Nigerian -born artist to win 00:12:20.519 --> 00:12:23.509 that specific award. A huge moment. And you can 00:12:23.509 --> 00:12:25.929 see her influence spreading. She dabbled in acting 00:12:25.929 --> 00:12:28.509 right around this time in the 1986 film Absolute 00:12:28.509 --> 00:12:30.590 Beginners. But she didn't stick with it, did 00:12:30.590 --> 00:12:33.529 she? No, not at all. She played a jazz singer, 00:12:33.710 --> 00:12:37.519 a character named Athene Duncanon. So it was 00:12:37.519 --> 00:12:39.980 a role very, very close to her stage persona. 00:12:40.200 --> 00:12:43.259 Typecasting, basically. A little bit, yeah. But 00:12:43.259 --> 00:12:45.639 by all accounts, she hated the experience of 00:12:45.639 --> 00:12:47.919 filmmaking. She didn't like the lack of control, 00:12:48.139 --> 00:12:52.019 the endless waiting around, the fakeness of it 00:12:52.019 --> 00:12:55.000 all. She realized her medium was music, where 00:12:55.000 --> 00:12:58.259 she and the band could control every single variable. 00:12:58.419 --> 00:13:00.659 That control freak tendency, and I mean that 00:13:00.659 --> 00:13:02.639 in the best possible way, seems to be a running 00:13:02.639 --> 00:13:04.840 theme throughout her whole career. It is. So 00:13:04.840 --> 00:13:06.929 they released Stronger Than... Pride in 88, which 00:13:06.929 --> 00:13:09.269 is another huge success. Paradise becomes a number 00:13:09.269 --> 00:13:12.950 one R &B hit. Then comes Love Deluxe in 92. And 00:13:12.950 --> 00:13:15.309 Love Deluxe is where I feel the sound shifted 00:13:15.309 --> 00:13:18.600 a bit. It got darker. More melancholic. It got 00:13:18.600 --> 00:13:20.779 more atmospheric, I think. Love Deluxe is just 00:13:20.779 --> 00:13:23.059 a masterpiece of mood. This is the album with 00:13:23.059 --> 00:13:25.299 no ordinary love. Of course. The production becomes 00:13:25.299 --> 00:13:27.480 more spacious. You can really hear the influence 00:13:27.480 --> 00:13:29.440 of the emerging trip -hop scene coming out of 00:13:29.440 --> 00:13:32.100 Bristol at that time. That slow, down -tempo, 00:13:32.100 --> 00:13:34.419 moody vibe. That's a great point. It feels like 00:13:34.419 --> 00:13:37.940 a late -night album. And visually, this is her 00:13:37.940 --> 00:13:40.659 absolute peak. The album covers Say Topless, 00:13:40.860 --> 00:13:43.580 covered her chest, with that sleek ponytail and 00:13:43.580 --> 00:13:46.840 the red lipstick is iconic. It's so vulnerable 00:13:46.840 --> 00:13:49.659 and yet so armored at the same time. Perfectly 00:13:49.659 --> 00:13:53.340 put. So by 1992, they are untouchable. They've 00:13:53.340 --> 00:13:56.139 had a decade of nonstop hits. They're rich. They're 00:13:56.139 --> 00:13:59.379 respected. And then the pattern changes. This 00:13:59.379 --> 00:14:01.159 brings us to what I think is the most fascinating 00:14:01.159 --> 00:14:04.379 part of her entire career strategy. The hiatus. 00:14:04.399 --> 00:14:06.740 The strategy of scarcity. But was it really a 00:14:06.740 --> 00:14:08.539 strategy, do you think? Or was she just tired 00:14:08.539 --> 00:14:11.269 of it all? I think it started as life. After 00:14:11.269 --> 00:14:13.429 the massive world tour for Love Deluxe, the band 00:14:13.429 --> 00:14:16.429 was just exhausted. And Saida Du's personal life 00:14:16.429 --> 00:14:19.049 was in flux. She'd had a brief marriage to the 00:14:19.049 --> 00:14:21.289 Spanish film director Carlos Pliego that ended. 00:14:21.409 --> 00:14:23.269 And then she gave birth to her first child in 00:14:23.269 --> 00:14:25.629 1996. Right. And she moved to the Caribbean for 00:14:25.629 --> 00:14:27.850 a while. She basically just stepped off the carousel. 00:14:27.870 --> 00:14:30.190 She wanted a real life away from the spotlight. 00:14:30.429 --> 00:14:33.669 But stepping off for eight years. In the 90s. 00:14:33.669 --> 00:14:36.450 The decade of Britpop and grunge and gangster 00:14:36.450 --> 00:14:38.509 rap. I mean, that was considered career suicide. 00:14:39.220 --> 00:14:41.659 Conventional wisdom says yes, absolutely. The 00:14:41.659 --> 00:14:44.039 industry model is built entirely on momentum. 00:14:44.320 --> 00:14:47.480 You tour, you do press, you release an album, 00:14:47.559 --> 00:14:49.919 you repeat. If you stop, you lose your spot. 00:14:50.179 --> 00:14:52.659 But Sod proved that if the product is premium 00:14:52.659 --> 00:14:55.440 enough, the normal economic rules just don't 00:14:55.440 --> 00:14:57.700 apply. Exactly. Think of it like luxury fashion. 00:14:57.960 --> 00:15:01.100 H &M or Zara, they need to have new clothes in 00:15:01.100 --> 00:15:03.220 the store every single week to keep you coming 00:15:03.220 --> 00:15:05.870 back. Right. Hermes can have a waiting list for 00:15:05.870 --> 00:15:08.990 a Birkin bag that lasts for three years. Sod 00:15:08.990 --> 00:15:11.769 became the Birkin bag of music. I love that analogy. 00:15:11.909 --> 00:15:14.029 By not being available, she actually increased 00:15:14.029 --> 00:15:16.529 her value. The demand just built and built. It 00:15:16.529 --> 00:15:18.169 did. So when they finally returned in the year 00:15:18.169 --> 00:15:20.740 2000 with the album Lovers Rock. Yeah. It wasn't 00:15:20.740 --> 00:15:22.799 just another album release. It was a major cultural 00:15:22.799 --> 00:15:26.279 event. And Lovers Rock was a huge sonic pivot, 00:15:26.320 --> 00:15:28.899 too. A major one. They stripped away a lot of 00:15:28.899 --> 00:15:31.620 the overt jazz elements. They leaned very heavily 00:15:31.620 --> 00:15:34.759 into acoustic guitars and reggae rhythms. Hence 00:15:34.759 --> 00:15:37.500 the title, Lovers Rock, which is a specific subgenre 00:15:37.500 --> 00:15:40.419 of romantic reggae. Exactly. The whole album 00:15:40.419 --> 00:15:42.720 was warmer, more domestic, more intimate. It 00:15:42.720 --> 00:15:44.460 sounds like a band playing together in a living 00:15:44.460 --> 00:15:48.000 room, not a slick studio. And it worked. It won 00:15:48.000 --> 00:15:50.259 the Grammy for Best Pop Vocal Album. And the 00:15:50.259 --> 00:15:53.559 tour. Yeah. The Lovers Rock tour was gigantic. 00:15:53.580 --> 00:15:56.039 It was the 13th biggest tour in North America 00:15:56.039 --> 00:15:58.399 at the time. Which just proved that the fan base 00:15:58.399 --> 00:16:00.320 hadn't left. They hadn't gone anywhere. They 00:16:00.320 --> 00:16:03.279 had just been waiting patiently. And so, having 00:16:03.279 --> 00:16:06.100 seen that this works, she tests them again. She 00:16:06.100 --> 00:16:09.179 disappears for another 10 years. 10 years. A 00:16:09.179 --> 00:16:12.039 full decade between Lovers Rock and Soldier of 00:16:12.039 --> 00:16:15.309 Love. That is just... It's an incredible amount 00:16:15.309 --> 00:16:17.490 of silence in the music business. And think about 00:16:17.490 --> 00:16:21.169 the decade she skipped from 2000 to 2010. That's 00:16:21.169 --> 00:16:22.970 when the entire music industry was turned upside 00:16:22.970 --> 00:16:25.110 down and reinvented. Right. Napster came and 00:16:25.110 --> 00:16:27.289 went. The iTunes store took over everything. 00:16:27.370 --> 00:16:29.730 Social media was born. Facebook, Twitter. And 00:16:29.730 --> 00:16:32.340 yet sold was nowhere to be found. She was living 00:16:32.340 --> 00:16:34.460 in the English countryside, raising her child, 00:16:34.679 --> 00:16:37.600 renovating a house, just living. And when Soldier 00:16:37.600 --> 00:16:40.559 of Love finally drops in 2010, it debuts at number 00:16:40.559 --> 00:16:43.620 one on the Billboard 200 chart. After a 10 -year 00:16:43.620 --> 00:16:46.320 absence, that is staggering. It broke a record, 00:16:46.419 --> 00:16:48.399 actually, for the longest time between number 00:16:48.399 --> 00:16:51.379 one albums for a group. It was almost 25 years 00:16:51.379 --> 00:16:53.820 between Promise hitting number one and Soldier 00:16:53.820 --> 00:16:56.299 of Love doing the same. Wow. It showed that her 00:16:56.299 --> 00:16:59.259 appeal is completely multi -generational. You 00:16:59.259 --> 00:17:01.379 have the original fans from the 80s who grew 00:17:01.379 --> 00:17:03.240 up with her, and then you have this whole new 00:17:03.240 --> 00:17:05.640 generation who had discovered her through sampling 00:17:05.640 --> 00:17:08.960 and, you know, cultural osmosis. Okay, let's 00:17:08.960 --> 00:17:11.160 talk about that cultural osmosis, specifically 00:17:11.160 --> 00:17:13.640 the hip -hop connection. Because on paper, it 00:17:13.640 --> 00:17:15.680 really doesn't make any sense. It seems like 00:17:15.680 --> 00:17:18.359 a mismatch. A huge one. You have these rugged, 00:17:18.539 --> 00:17:21.660 often - aggressive rappers obsessing over this 00:17:21.660 --> 00:17:25.019 quiet, elegant, British -Nigerian woman singing 00:17:25.019 --> 00:17:27.259 these soft songs about love and heartache. But 00:17:27.259 --> 00:17:29.460 spiritually, it's a perfect fit. Hip -hop at 00:17:29.460 --> 00:17:32.660 its core values cool. It values authenticity. 00:17:32.980 --> 00:17:35.319 And it values someone who stays in their own 00:17:35.319 --> 00:17:37.599 lane and just completely dominates it. She has 00:17:37.599 --> 00:17:40.660 an undeniable mystique. She does. And the pioneers 00:17:40.660 --> 00:17:44.289 loved her. Rukim, arguably the god MC, has said 00:17:44.289 --> 00:17:46.690 in interviews he grew up listening to her. He 00:17:46.690 --> 00:17:49.109 even references Smooth Operator in his classic 00:17:49.109 --> 00:17:52.049 track, Microphone Fiend. And it's not just the 00:17:52.049 --> 00:17:54.730 lyrical references, it's the samples. The sound 00:17:54.730 --> 00:17:57.490 of her music is woven into the DNA of so much 00:17:57.490 --> 00:17:59.670 hip -hop. The production of Sade, that heavy 00:17:59.670 --> 00:18:02.109 bass, the clean drums, the space between the 00:18:02.109 --> 00:18:04.720 notes, it's ready -made for hip -hop loops. The 00:18:04.720 --> 00:18:08.119 producer Jay Dilla used her. MF Doom, maybe the 00:18:08.119 --> 00:18:10.500 greatest underground rapper ever, sampled her 00:18:10.500 --> 00:18:14.150 extensively on his album Operation. And it gives 00:18:14.150 --> 00:18:16.329 those tracks this instant layer of sophisticated, 00:18:16.730 --> 00:18:19.970 melancholic cool. It does. Then you have Kanye 00:18:19.970 --> 00:18:22.569 West back in his blog era, just geeking out, 00:18:22.650 --> 00:18:25.450 posting SADE IS BACK in all caps because he was 00:18:25.450 --> 00:18:27.529 so excited for her return. And then there's Rick 00:18:27.529 --> 00:18:29.609 Ross, who literally has a tattoo of her face 00:18:29.609 --> 00:18:32.349 on his body. On his leg, I think. He's the ultimate 00:18:32.349 --> 00:18:34.430 super fan. He is. Rick Ross said, and I quote, 00:18:34.589 --> 00:18:36.670 there's never been a bad SADE track. And I think 00:18:36.670 --> 00:18:39.089 what rappers like him respect is the game. SADE 00:18:39.089 --> 00:18:41.069 has ultimate game. Explain that. What do you 00:18:41.069 --> 00:18:43.230 mean by game? She doesn't beg for attention. 00:18:43.589 --> 00:18:46.369 She doesn't chase trends. She doesn't show up 00:18:46.369 --> 00:18:49.529 to every party. She releases music on her terms 00:18:49.529 --> 00:18:52.089 when she feels it's ready, and the world stops 00:18:52.089 --> 00:18:55.369 to listen. In a genre like hip -hop that is so 00:18:55.369 --> 00:18:58.750 often about posturing and power plays, side represents 00:18:58.750 --> 00:19:01.710 this quiet, unshakable power. It's a different 00:19:01.710 --> 00:19:04.670 kind of authority. A different kind. Talad Kweli 00:19:04.670 --> 00:19:07.509 said he learned precision from listening to her. 00:19:07.869 --> 00:19:09.670 That's a great word for it. She never wastes 00:19:09.670 --> 00:19:11.730 a single note or a single word. So she's the 00:19:11.730 --> 00:19:14.349 queen of Quiet Storm, but she's got the undisputed 00:19:14.349 --> 00:19:17.230 respect of the streets. It's such a unique position 00:19:17.230 --> 00:19:19.849 to hold in music. It is. And all of this has 00:19:19.849 --> 00:19:22.509 cemented her legacy. Rolling Stone put her at 00:19:22.509 --> 00:19:24.970 number 51 on their 200 Greatest Singers of All 00:19:24.970 --> 00:19:28.009 Time list in 2023. And she was inducted into 00:19:28.009 --> 00:19:31.150 the Songwriters Hall of Fame in 2023, nominated 00:19:31.150 --> 00:19:33.910 for the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. She is canon 00:19:33.910 --> 00:19:36.940 now. Utterly. I want to pivot to the personal 00:19:36.940 --> 00:19:39.519 side briefly because for someone so intensely 00:19:39.519 --> 00:19:42.279 private, the few glimpses we do get are very 00:19:42.279 --> 00:19:44.319 telling about her character. We mentioned she 00:19:44.319 --> 00:19:48.640 moved to the countryside. Yes. In 2005, she bought 00:19:48.640 --> 00:19:51.440 a rundown cottage in Gloucestershire. And this 00:19:51.440 --> 00:19:53.920 wasn't one of those celebrity, I bought a farmhouse 00:19:53.920 --> 00:19:56.519 situations where they hire a famous contractor 00:19:56.519 --> 00:19:58.480 and then just show up for the photo shoot. She 00:19:58.480 --> 00:20:01.119 was deeply involved in the renovation herself. 00:20:01.720 --> 00:20:04.359 Apparently, she really likes manual labor. She 00:20:04.359 --> 00:20:06.700 likes building things, fixing things. It grounds 00:20:06.700 --> 00:20:08.980 her. It's that practical district nurse mother 00:20:08.980 --> 00:20:10.839 influence coming through again. No nonsense. 00:20:11.180 --> 00:20:12.819 Absolutely. And she's been with her partner, 00:20:12.920 --> 00:20:15.299 Ian Watts, who is a former Royal Marine since 00:20:15.299 --> 00:20:18.680 2007. It's a very stable, very un -Hollywood 00:20:18.680 --> 00:20:20.799 life that she's built for herself. But the most 00:20:20.799 --> 00:20:23.240 significant personal story to emerge in recent 00:20:23.240 --> 00:20:25.420 years has been her relationship with her child, 00:20:25.640 --> 00:20:28.680 Isaac Theo Adu. Yes. Isaac is her child from 00:20:28.680 --> 00:20:30.680 a relationship she had with the Jamaican music 00:20:30.680 --> 00:20:34.750 producer. Bob Morgan. And in 2016, Isaac came 00:20:34.750 --> 00:20:37.390 out as a transgender man. A journey he documented 00:20:37.390 --> 00:20:39.970 very openly on social media. He did. And this 00:20:39.970 --> 00:20:41.910 was obviously a major moment for their family. 00:20:42.089 --> 00:20:44.789 And by all accounts, from Isaac's own words, 00:20:45.329 --> 00:20:47.670 Sade was incredibly supportive through the entire 00:20:47.670 --> 00:20:50.769 process. He's posted some very moving tributes 00:20:50.769 --> 00:20:53.509 to her online, thanking her for standing by him 00:20:53.509 --> 00:20:55.390 during his transition, during the surgeries. 00:20:55.789 --> 00:20:59.150 He called her his rock. And what I find so beautiful 00:20:59.150 --> 00:21:02.910 and so quintessentially Saad is how she handled 00:21:02.910 --> 00:21:05.670 it publicly. She didn't issue a press release. 00:21:05.849 --> 00:21:08.190 She didn't do an Oprah interview about her journey 00:21:08.190 --> 00:21:10.869 as a parent. No, she put it in the music. She 00:21:10.869 --> 00:21:14.230 put it in the music. Yeah. In 2024, she released 00:21:14.230 --> 00:21:17.170 a track called Young Lion as part of a Red Hot 00:21:17.170 --> 00:21:19.750 Organization compilation album for trans awareness. 00:21:20.089 --> 00:21:34.380 The song is dedicated to Isaac. Young Lyon. Such 00:21:34.380 --> 00:21:36.880 a powerful, protective title. It just shows that 00:21:36.880 --> 00:21:39.559 even in her 60s, she's still using her art to 00:21:39.559 --> 00:21:42.039 process the most intimate, most important parts 00:21:42.039 --> 00:21:43.859 of her life. And that's why the music resonates, 00:21:44.019 --> 00:21:46.160 isn't it? It's real. It's not just product churned 00:21:46.160 --> 00:21:48.299 out for the algorithm. Not at all. So that brings 00:21:48.299 --> 00:21:50.279 us up to the present day, more or less. We've 00:21:50.279 --> 00:21:52.799 had Young Lion. We had those two brilliant soundtrack 00:21:52.799 --> 00:21:55.519 songs in 2018. Right. Flower of the Universe. 00:21:55.980 --> 00:22:00.759 For Disney's A Wrinkle in Time. Yeah. The director, 00:22:00.920 --> 00:22:03.259 Ava DuVernay, said she basically just put it 00:22:03.259 --> 00:22:04.920 out into the universe, never thinking a million 00:22:04.920 --> 00:22:07.359 years that Sod would actually say yes. But she 00:22:07.359 --> 00:22:10.359 did. She did. And she also did the big unknown 00:22:10.359 --> 00:22:13.700 for Steve McQueen's movie Widows. And the reason 00:22:13.700 --> 00:22:16.039 she said yes to that was because the original 00:22:16.039 --> 00:22:18.740 TV series from the 80s resonated with her as 00:22:18.740 --> 00:22:20.880 a story about women surviving against the odds. 00:22:21.299 --> 00:22:23.880 She picks projects that have real artistic merit. 00:22:24.200 --> 00:22:26.460 But the big question that every fan is always 00:22:26.460 --> 00:22:28.720 asking, is there another album? It's been 14 00:22:28.720 --> 00:22:30.859 years now since Soldier of Love. There is smoke, 00:22:31.039 --> 00:22:33.700 so there might be fire. The sources have confirmed 00:22:33.700 --> 00:22:37.000 that in 2022, the band, the original four, Saad, 00:22:37.079 --> 00:22:39.980 Stuart, Andrew and Paul, reconvened at Miraval 00:22:39.980 --> 00:22:42.259 Studios in France. Miraval, that's legendary. 00:22:42.359 --> 00:22:44.299 That's where they recorded Parts of Promise and 00:22:44.299 --> 00:22:45.960 Stronger Than Pride back in the 80s. Exactly. 00:22:45.960 --> 00:22:48.160 Returning to the scene of the crime, Brad Pitt 00:22:48.160 --> 00:22:50.480 actually owns the studio now, along with a French 00:22:50.480 --> 00:22:52.720 producer named Damien Quintard. So they were 00:22:52.720 --> 00:22:55.579 there in the studio. They were there. Quintard 00:22:55.579 --> 00:22:58.279 himself confirmed it. He said they were working 00:22:58.279 --> 00:23:00.940 and that Sod and the band were special people. 00:23:01.980 --> 00:23:04.519 Now, does that mean an album is coming next month? 00:23:05.140 --> 00:23:08.220 With Sod, you never ever know. But the machine 00:23:08.220 --> 00:23:10.819 has been turned on. So we wait, as we always 00:23:10.819 --> 00:23:13.200 do. As we always do. You know, as we wrap this 00:23:13.200 --> 00:23:15.660 up, I keep going back to this idea of her career 00:23:15.660 --> 00:23:19.019 as a masterclass in mystique. In a world where 00:23:19.019 --> 00:23:21.359 we are just drowning in content, where everything 00:23:21.359 --> 00:23:24.539 is disposable and forgotten by next week, Saad 00:23:24.539 --> 00:23:27.500 feels like an heirloom. She is an heirloom. That's 00:23:27.500 --> 00:23:30.019 a perfect description. She represents a completely 00:23:30.019 --> 00:23:32.440 different value system. She proves that you don't 00:23:32.440 --> 00:23:34.220 have to play the game by the industry's rules. 00:23:34.400 --> 00:23:36.859 You can just opt out. You can live in the countryside. 00:23:37.160 --> 00:23:39.400 You can take 10 years off to be a mother. You 00:23:39.400 --> 00:23:42.160 can refuse to do 99 % of interviews. And if your 00:23:42.160 --> 00:23:44.240 art is true, if it is of a high enough quality. 00:23:44.940 --> 00:23:46.779 The world will wait for you. It's actually a 00:23:46.779 --> 00:23:49.220 really comforting thought. It suggests that maybe 00:23:49.220 --> 00:23:52.079 we aren't as addicted to the new as we think 00:23:52.079 --> 00:23:53.980 we are. Maybe we're just starved for the good. 00:23:54.140 --> 00:23:56.099 I think that's it right there. We don't actually 00:23:56.099 --> 00:23:58.859 need more. We need better. Inside is always, 00:23:58.940 --> 00:24:01.279 always better. Here's a final thought to leave 00:24:01.279 --> 00:24:04.609 you with. In this age of AI -generated music 00:24:04.609 --> 00:24:07.609 and constant digital noise, what does it say 00:24:07.609 --> 00:24:10.069 about us as listeners that the thing we might 00:24:10.069 --> 00:24:13.289 crave most is the scarcest resource of all, an 00:24:13.289 --> 00:24:16.069 artist's patient, human, and deliberate silence? 00:24:16.470 --> 00:24:18.470 Something to think about. Thanks for diving in 00:24:18.470 --> 00:24:19.490 with us. We'll see you on the next one.