WEBVTT

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Welcome back to the Deep Dive. Today we are opening

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up a file that I have to admit I thought was

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going to be a pretty straightforward history

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lesson. I saw the name Fernanda's List and my

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brain immediately went to classical music. You

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know, I pictured a dusty bust on a piano, polite

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applause, maybe a velvet smoking jacket. Which

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is the standard image for sure. It's what most

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people think of. Right. But after reading through

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this stack of research, the biographies, the

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letters, the music analysis, I realized that

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image is completely wrong. Or at least it's a

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tiny piece of the story. It's maybe 10 % of the

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story. We aren't just talking about a composer

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today. We are talking about the man who practically

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invented the concept of the superstar. It's not

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an exaggeration to say he was the blueprint for

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the modern rock guy. I mean, before Elvis, before

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the Beatles, before Michael Jackson. There was

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Franz Liszt. The sources describe scenes that

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sound like they're from a stadium tour in the

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1960s, not Europe in the 1840s. Fainting fans,

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actual hysteria, people collecting his garbage

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as souvenirs. It's just, it's wild. It really

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is. But the mission for this deep dive. isn't

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just to gawk at the celebrity aspect, as fun

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as that is. No, because the fame is almost a

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distraction. It's the shiny object. If you look

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deeper, as we're going to do, you find a man

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living what he himself called a tripartite existence.

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The three lives. I found that concept fascinating.

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Exactly. You have the hedonistic celebrity touring

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the world and, you know, breaking hearts. Okay,

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that's life number one. Then you have this serious,

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almost avant -garde musical innovator who changed

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the very... structure of how we listen to music.

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And then the third one, which is the twist I

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really didn't see coming. The religious recluse.

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Yeah. The man who retreats to a monastery to

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become an abbé. It is a massive, massive narrative

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arc. So we are going to unpack all of it. We've

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got the biographical data, the scandalous relationship

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details, the war of the romantics, and analysis

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of music that, frankly, was predicting the future.

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And to understand how you get a man this complex,

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you have to start... where every superhero origin

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story starts. The discovery of the power. The

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discovery of the power. Okay, let's jump into

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act one, the making of a prodigy. So List enters

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the world in 1811 in a small town called Doborzhan.

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Today it's in Austria, but back then it was part

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of the Kingdom of Hungary. And looking at his

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family background, it seems like the die was

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cast pretty early. His father, Adam List, wasn't

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just some random bureaucrat. Adam is a crucial

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figure here. He was a land steward for the Esterhazy

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princes. Now, if you know your music history,

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the name Esterhazy is huge. Right. That's Hayden's

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family. That's the family that employed Joseph

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Hayden for decades. So Adam List actually played

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cello in the court orchestra. He knew Hayden

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personally. He had seen musical greatness up

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close. So when his son, little Franz, crawls

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up to the piano at age five and starts not just

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plinking, but actually improvising melodies,

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Adam doesn't just think, oh, that's cute. No,

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he recognizes the spark immediately. And he becomes,

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well, let's say intense is a good word. The sources

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say Adam diligently encouraged his progress,

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which is a very polite way of saying he drilled

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the kid relentlessly. And it pays off. By age

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nine, Franz is giving his first public concert.

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And it goes incredibly well. So well, in fact,

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that a group of wealthy Hungarian sponsors steps

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in. They basically create a scholarship fund

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to finance his education in Vienna. So this is

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the first big pivot. The family packs up and

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moves to the capital of music. And Adam, through

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sheer will, manages to land him a teacher who

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is basically piano royalty, Carl Czerny. Now,

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for anyone listening who took piano lessons as

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a child, the name Czerny might trigger a little

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bit of PTSD. Oh, the finger exercises. Thousands

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of them. Exactly. But we have to remember, Czerny

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wasn't just a writer of exercise books. He was

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a student of Beethoven. He was the real deal.

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The direct lineage. But the funny thing is, the

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notes say Czerny initially didn't want to teach

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him. Right, he was overworked. He hated teaching

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children. He called them infant prodigies with

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a bit of a... sneer. But Adam List begged him

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just to listen to the boy play for a few minutes.

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So Fran sits down, plays a few bars, and Cherni

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is just floored. What did he say? He later wrote

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that it was like nature herself had formed a

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pianist. He was so impressed he ended up teaching

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List for free for the next year and a half. That's

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the ultimate endorsement right there. But there's

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an even bigger endorsement that pops up in the

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legends, right? The Beethoven kiss. Ah, yes.

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Yeah? This is one of the most famous stories

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in all of classical music lore. It's such a cinematic

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moment. It feels like it has to be true. The

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story goes that in 1823, Liszt gives his farewell

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concert in Vienna. He's 12 years old. And the

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great Ludwig van Beethoven himself, old and deaf,

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walks onto the stage, grabs the boy, and kisses

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him on the forehead. The passing of the torch.

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It is. The old king anointing the new prince.

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But I have to be the buzzkill historian here.

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Oh, no, it didn't happen. The evidence is very

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shaky. Beethoven was profoundly deaf by 1823.

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He rarely, if ever, attended public concerts.

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Most modern scholars are pretty sure this is

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apocryphal. A good story that got repeated. But

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the fact that people believed it for so long

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tells you everything you need to know. Liszt

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was seen as the heir apparent. You'd carry that

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weight. So the heir apparent heads to Paris.

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The family moves there so he can attend the famous

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Conservatoire de Paris. And this is where they

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hit a wall that just feels incredibly unfair.

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It was pure bureaucratic nonsense. The director

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at the time, a composer named Luigi Cherubini,

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refused to let Liszt enroll. Not because he wasn't

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talented. No, no. He was probably more talented

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than the teachers. It was because he was a foreigner.

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The rules stated the conservatoire was for French

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citizens only. Imagine being the guy who rejected

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Franz Liszt because of his passport. Oof. Not

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a great look in retrospect. But this rejection

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seems to just fuel him. He studies privately.

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He writes a whole opera by age 14, Don Sanch.

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He's touring England, playing for King George

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IV. He is on the absolute fast -tracked glory.

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Until the floor just falls out from under him.

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In 1827, Adam Liszt dies suddenly of typhoid

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fever. And Franz is only 15 years old. 15. I

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want to pause on this because this feels like

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the moment where the child prodigy narrative

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just crashes and burns. He's 15. His father was

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his manager, his teacher, his mentor, his entire

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support sister. His whole world. And now he's

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alone in Paris and he has to support his mother.

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It was a brutal, brutal transition. The glamour

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was gone. Overnight, he had to work. The sources

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describe him just walking all over Paris, giving

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piano lessons from early morning until late at

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night. He was completely exhausted. And this

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is where some of the rock star habits start to

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form, isn't it? It is. He started smoking heavily,

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started drinking. He fell into a deep depression

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and had a crisis of faith. He actually considered

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becoming a priest right then and there. Wow.

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For a few years, he stopped touring. He was just

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drifting. He was reading voraciously. hanging

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out with intellectuals like Victor Hugo and George

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Sand. But musically, it was kind of stagnant.

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He needed a jumpstart. And according to the timeline,

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that jumpstart arrived in 1832. But it wasn't

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a pianist who inspired him. No, which is the

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fascinating part. It was a violinist. Niccolo

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Paganini. The devil's violinist. Just the best

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nickname ever. Paganini came to Paris and gave

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a concert that basically terrified people. He

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played with such speed, such violence, and such

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technical perfection that people legitimately

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whispered that he had sold his soul to Satan

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for his abilities. And List is in the audience

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for this. And List has an epiphany, a life -changing

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moment. He realizes that the piano is capable

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of that same level of sorcery. He looks at what

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Paganini is doing, the showmanship, the impossible

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leaps, the drama, and he says to himself, I will

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be the Paganini of the piano. So this isn't just

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about practicing a few more scales. This is a

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complete reconstruction of his entire It was

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obsessive. He basically locked himself away.

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He practiced for 10, 12, sometimes up to 14 hours

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a day. 14 hours? I mean, that's not practice.

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That's physical torture. He was drilling things

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no one else was doing. Double octaves, rapid

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-fire repeated notes, massive stretches for the

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hand. He wasn't just learning songs. He was expanding

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the very mechanics of what the human body could

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do on a keyboard. So he goes into this crucible.

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And he emerges from it, not just as a great pianist,

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but as a monster. This sets the stage perfectly

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for act two, the virtuoso in Listomania, because

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when he comes back to the public scene, he's

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ready for a fight. And he finds a rival almost

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immediately. Every great champion needs a foil.

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For List, that foil was Sigismund Thalberg. The

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descriptions of this rivalry are just hilarious.

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It's like a refined 19th century version of a

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rat beef. It really was. Thalberg was the reigning

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darling of the Paris salons. He was handsome.

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aristocratically aloof and he played with this

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beautiful singing tone the gimmick was that he

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never moved a muscle in his face he was the epitome

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of cool control and list is the complete opposite

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he's sweat and passion and hair flying everywhere

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and list being young and you know full of himself

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wrote an article publicly trashing thalberg's

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music calling it Impotent and monotonous. Shots

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fired. Big time. So the public, of course, demanded

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a showdown. It was billed as the Ivory Duel.

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Do you love that name? It happened at the salon

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of the Princess Belgio Shoso in 1837. Ostensibly,

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it was a charity event for Italian refugees,

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but everyone in that room knew it was a title

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fight. So they both play. Falberg plays his Fantasia

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on themes from Rossini. Liszt plays his Niobe

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fantasy. The tension in that room must have been

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suffocating. And then the princess has to deliver

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the verdict. Her verdict is absolutely legendary.

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She stands up and says, Thalberg is the first

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pianist in the world. Okay, so that sounds like

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a clear loss for Liszt, a public takedown. But

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then she continued. She let that sink in, and

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then she said, Thalberg is the first pianist

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in the world, but Liszt is unique. Ooh, that

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is such a masterful diplomatic sidestep. But

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it was the truth. Thalberg was perfect, but he

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was terrestrial. Liszt was something else entirely.

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And after that duel, Thalberg's star slowly faded

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and Liszt just exploded into the stratosphere.

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This is what launches the period that becomes

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known as Lisztomania. And we should be clear,

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we use that word lightly now. But it was coined

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by the poet Heinrich Hein as a genuine medical

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diagnosis. He wasn't being poetic, he was being

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literal. He was actually kind of horrified by

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it. It wasn't just applause, it was mass hysteria.

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When Liszt played, women would literally faint.

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They would fight each other to get close to the

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stage. I was reading about the souvenirs. It

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wasn't just asking for an autograph. Oh, not

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even close. If Liszt left a pair of velvet gloves

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on the piano after a concert, the audience would

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rush the stage and rip them to shreds so everyone

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could have a little scrap of fabric. That's insane.

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They collected his cigar stubs and wore them

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in lockets around their necks. Wait, cigar stubs?

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In a locket? Yeah. That is... That's a new level

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of dedication. There are documented reports of

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women keeping his used coffee dregs in glass

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vials. There was a level of obsession that was

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completely new. So you have to ask, why? I mean,

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was he just handsome? The portraits show he was

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very striking. Long hair, sharp features. He

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was, no doubt. But it's the performance style.

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Before Liszt, pianists... played with their backs

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to the audience or facing them directly over

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the piano. You couldn't really see their hands

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or face. Liszt was the one who turned the piano

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sideways, creating the profile position that

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is standard for every concert pianist today.

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He wanted them to see his face. He's thinking

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about the optics. He wanted them to see the suffering,

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the ecstasy, the sweat. He made the music visual.

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He understood instinctively that an audience

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listens with their eyes just as much as their

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ears. He also completely changed the format of

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the concert itself. Before him, you didn't go

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to a piano recital. No, that word didn't even

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exist in that context. A concert was a variety

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show. You'd have an orchestra, then a singer,

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maybe a poet, a violinist, and then a pianist

00:12:07.929 --> 00:12:10.269
might play one or two pieces. A real grab bag.

00:12:10.450 --> 00:12:12.610
Right. And Liszt decided that wasn't enough.

00:12:12.870 --> 00:12:16.409
In 1839, he wrote a now famous letter where he

00:12:16.409 --> 00:12:19.649
just declared, Le concert. C 'est moi. The concert

00:12:19.649 --> 00:12:22.289
is me. The sheer arrogance of it. And it was

00:12:22.289 --> 00:12:24.730
arrogant, but he backed it up. He was the first

00:12:24.730 --> 00:12:26.629
person to walk out on stage completely alone

00:12:26.629 --> 00:12:29.009
with no orchestra, no other acts, and play for

00:12:29.009 --> 00:12:31.710
two hours straight. And from memory, too, which

00:12:31.710 --> 00:12:33.970
was not standard at the time. Not at all. It

00:12:33.970 --> 00:12:35.870
was high wire acrobatics with no safety net.

00:12:36.460 --> 00:12:39.440
And the audiences just ate it up. He toured Europe

00:12:39.440 --> 00:12:42.740
relentlessly. Russia, Turkey, Ireland, Portugal.

00:12:42.860 --> 00:12:45.299
He played over a thousand concerts in eight years.

00:12:45.399 --> 00:12:47.519
He was the most famous man in Europe, bar none.

00:12:47.799 --> 00:12:50.460
But, and here is the nuance that I think makes

00:12:50.460 --> 00:12:52.279
him so much more interesting. He wasn't just

00:12:52.279 --> 00:12:54.759
hoarding the cash like some kind of diva. The

00:12:54.759 --> 00:12:57.440
research really emphasizes his charity. That's

00:12:57.440 --> 00:13:00.200
a crucial counterpoint to his ego. He made a

00:13:00.200 --> 00:13:03.419
fortune, an absolute fortune, but he gave massive

00:13:03.419 --> 00:13:06.100
amounts of it away. Like what? When the Great

00:13:06.100 --> 00:13:09.440
Fire of Hamburg in 1842 left thousands homeless,

00:13:09.679 --> 00:13:12.320
Liszt immediately rushed there to play a series

00:13:12.320 --> 00:13:15.220
of charity concerts. He donated huge sums to

00:13:15.220 --> 00:13:17.320
the completion of the Cologne Cathedral. He set

00:13:17.320 --> 00:13:19.779
up pension funds for struggling musicians. He

00:13:19.779 --> 00:13:22.080
really established a precedent that the artist

00:13:22.080 --> 00:13:24.860
has a moral duty to society. So he's burning

00:13:24.860 --> 00:13:27.240
the candle at both ends. He's touring. He's composing.

00:13:27.259 --> 00:13:29.360
He's giving away money. He's dodging screaming

00:13:29.360 --> 00:13:31.799
fans. It sounds completely unsustainable. It

00:13:31.799 --> 00:13:35.419
was. And then, abruptly... In 1847, he stops.

00:13:35.679 --> 00:13:38.840
He just quits. Quits. Cold turkey. But he's 35

00:13:38.840 --> 00:13:41.600
years old. He is at the absolute zenith of his

00:13:41.600 --> 00:13:44.360
fame. That's like Mick Jagger retiring in 1975.

00:13:44.620 --> 00:13:46.919
Why on earth would he walk away from that? He

00:13:46.919 --> 00:13:49.500
was tired of the circus. He felt that being a

00:13:49.500 --> 00:13:53.460
traveling virtuoso was, in his own words, a mountebank's

00:13:53.460 --> 00:13:56.519
trade, like being a carnival act. He wanted to

00:13:56.519 --> 00:13:59.279
be taken seriously as a composer. He wanted to

00:13:59.279 --> 00:14:01.539
create art that would last longer than the applause

00:14:01.539 --> 00:14:04.200
of one night. So he accepts a job in a small,

00:14:04.220 --> 00:14:07.139
quiet German court called Weimar. And this kicks

00:14:07.139 --> 00:14:09.639
off Act III, the Weimar years and the infamous

00:14:09.639 --> 00:14:12.059
War of the Romantics. This is the intellectual

00:14:12.059 --> 00:14:14.620
heart of his life. He becomes the Kapelmeister,

00:14:14.799 --> 00:14:16.960
the official music director in Weimar. Yeah.

00:14:17.019 --> 00:14:19.379
And he basically turns this sleepy little town

00:14:19.379 --> 00:14:21.740
into the European center of the avant -garde.

00:14:21.860 --> 00:14:24.100
He gathers a posse. He does. Becomes known as

00:14:24.100 --> 00:14:26.620
the New German School. And this group included

00:14:26.620 --> 00:14:29.299
some heavy hitters like Hector. berlioz and most

00:14:29.299 --> 00:14:31.759
famously a young controversial composer named

00:14:31.759 --> 00:14:34.419
richard wagner and they were united by a specific

00:14:34.419 --> 00:14:37.559
philosophy about what music should be a philosophy

00:14:37.559 --> 00:14:40.899
that caused a war A literal war of words and

00:14:40.899 --> 00:14:43.940
ink that raged for decades. On one side, you

00:14:43.940 --> 00:14:46.320
had the conservatives, led by Johannes Brahms,

00:14:46.379 --> 00:14:48.940
and the powerful critic Edward Hanslick. They

00:14:48.940 --> 00:14:50.720
believed in what they called absolute music.

00:14:51.000 --> 00:14:53.360
Which means what exactly? Music for music's sake.

00:14:53.539 --> 00:14:56.720
Pretty much. The idea that music shouldn't be

00:14:56.720 --> 00:14:59.480
about anything. A symphony shouldn't tell a story.

00:14:59.600 --> 00:15:01.580
It shouldn't represent a painting or a poem.

00:15:01.679 --> 00:15:03.940
It should just be pure sound, form, structure,

00:15:04.159 --> 00:15:07.019
harmony. It's abstract art. Okay, so that's Team

00:15:07.019 --> 00:15:10.340
Brahms. And Liszt's side. Liszt and the New German

00:15:10.340 --> 00:15:13.480
School were champions of program music. They

00:15:13.480 --> 00:15:15.539
believed music should be explicitly linked to

00:15:15.539 --> 00:15:18.080
literature, poetry, and painting. It absolutely

00:15:18.080 --> 00:15:20.539
should tell a narrative. So it's like, is music

00:15:20.539 --> 00:15:23.179
a beautiful, abstract pattern, or is it a painting

00:15:23.179 --> 00:15:25.500
of a story? That's a perfect way to put it. And

00:15:25.500 --> 00:15:27.899
to prove his point, Liszt invents a brand new

00:15:27.899 --> 00:15:31.330
genre, the symphonic poem. Right. This is a huge

00:15:31.330 --> 00:15:34.110
innovation. It is. A symphonic poem is a piece

00:15:34.110 --> 00:15:36.809
for orchestra, usually in one long, continuous

00:15:36.809 --> 00:15:39.610
movement that is driven entirely by an extra

00:15:39.610 --> 00:15:43.289
musical idea. So Liszt writes Le Prelude, based

00:15:43.289 --> 00:15:46.429
on a poem by Lamartine. He writes Mazepa. based

00:15:46.429 --> 00:15:48.610
on a Victor Hugo poem about a Ukrainian hero

00:15:48.610 --> 00:15:50.730
being strapped to a wild horse. He's literally

00:15:50.730 --> 00:15:53.350
painting with sound. Exactly. And the conservatives

00:15:53.350 --> 00:15:56.409
absolutely hated it. They thought it was formless,

00:15:56.549 --> 00:15:59.350
self -indulgent, and that it was destroying the

00:15:59.350 --> 00:16:01.769
purity of the classical tradition established

00:16:01.769 --> 00:16:04.929
by Beethoven and Mozart. This war of the romantics

00:16:04.929 --> 00:16:07.009
got nasty, right? Oh, it was brutal. They were

00:16:07.009 --> 00:16:09.230
savaging each other in newspapers and journals

00:16:09.230 --> 00:16:12.169
for decades. It was the major artistic fault

00:16:12.169 --> 00:16:14.309
line of the 19th century. But while he's fighting

00:16:14.309 --> 00:16:18.000
this big artistic war, His personal life is arguably

00:16:18.000 --> 00:16:20.559
even more dramatic. We can't talk about List

00:16:20.559 --> 00:16:22.240
without talking about the women in his life.

00:16:22.759 --> 00:16:26.779
List's love life was, well, complicated is an

00:16:26.779 --> 00:16:29.179
understatement. His first major partner was Marie

00:16:29.179 --> 00:16:32.059
de Gaulle. A countess. A countess, yes. And she

00:16:32.059 --> 00:16:35.100
was married with children. She basically abandoned

00:16:35.100 --> 00:16:37.299
her husband and family to run away with List.

00:16:37.500 --> 00:16:39.320
That's scandal number one. They lived together

00:16:39.320 --> 00:16:41.120
for years, traveling through Switzerland and

00:16:41.120 --> 00:16:43.759
Italy. Those travels directly inspired one of

00:16:43.759 --> 00:16:46.820
his most famous piano cycles, Anne de Pelerinache,

00:16:46.980 --> 00:16:49.340
Years of Pilgrimage. And they had three children

00:16:49.340 --> 00:16:52.860
together. They did. Blandine, Kosuma, and Daniel.

00:16:53.460 --> 00:16:55.899
But the relationship was incredibly volatile,

00:16:56.039 --> 00:16:58.440
and they eventually had a very bitter split.

00:16:58.759 --> 00:17:01.740
And then, in 1847, right around the time he decides

00:17:01.740 --> 00:17:04.779
to retire from touring, he meets Princess Caroline.

00:17:04.920 --> 00:17:08.420
Princess Caroline Zuzane Wittgenstein. A Polish

00:17:08.420 --> 00:17:12.319
noblewoman? Immensely wealthy. Very, very intellectual.

00:17:12.700 --> 00:17:15.339
Also married. Also very married. I'm sensing

00:17:15.339 --> 00:17:18.539
a pattern here. He liked powerful, intelligent

00:17:18.539 --> 00:17:21.480
women who were technically unavailable. He certainly

00:17:21.480 --> 00:17:24.730
did. But Carolyn was different. She wasn't just

00:17:24.730 --> 00:17:27.789
a lover, she became his manager, his muse, his

00:17:27.789 --> 00:17:30.029
intellectual equal. She was the one who really

00:17:30.029 --> 00:17:32.250
convinced him to stop touring and focus on composing.

00:17:32.470 --> 00:17:35.069
She moved to Weimar to be with him, setting up

00:17:35.069 --> 00:17:37.450
a home called the Villa Altenburg, which became

00:17:37.450 --> 00:17:39.470
the headquarters of the new German school. But

00:17:39.470 --> 00:17:41.630
they couldn't get married. Not while her husband

00:17:41.630 --> 00:17:43.690
was alive. This was the Catholic Church. There

00:17:43.690 --> 00:17:46.210
was no divorce. So they spent over a decade and

00:17:46.210 --> 00:17:48.009
a fortune trying to get her marriage annulled

00:17:48.009 --> 00:17:49.970
by the Vatican. They pulled every string. They

00:17:49.970 --> 00:17:51.750
paid every lawyer. And finally, it looks like

00:17:51.750 --> 00:17:54.069
they've done it. Finally, in 1861, it looks like

00:17:54.069 --> 00:17:57.130
they have succeeded. The Pope himself gives the

00:17:57.130 --> 00:17:59.210
green light. They plan the wedding for Liszt's

00:17:59.210 --> 00:18:02.589
50th birthday in a church in Rome. The stage

00:18:02.589 --> 00:18:05.329
is set for the happy ending. And then... And

00:18:05.329 --> 00:18:08.450
then, the day before the wedding, literally hours

00:18:08.450 --> 00:18:11.150
before they are to be married, a messenger from

00:18:11.150 --> 00:18:13.980
the Vatican arrives. Don't tell me. The annulment

00:18:13.980 --> 00:18:16.759
is halted. The permission is withdrawn. What

00:18:16.759 --> 00:18:19.839
happened? How? It turns out Caroline's estranged

00:18:19.839 --> 00:18:22.319
husband's family and even the Tsar of Russia

00:18:22.319 --> 00:18:25.640
were pulling strings behind the scenes. They

00:18:25.640 --> 00:18:27.720
were terrified that if she married Liszt, her

00:18:27.720 --> 00:18:30.099
massive fortune would leave their control and

00:18:30.099 --> 00:18:33.079
go to this Hungarian musician. So they used their

00:18:33.079 --> 00:18:35.720
political power to block it at the last possible

00:18:35.720 --> 00:18:37.359
second. That is just absolutely heartbreaking

00:18:37.359 --> 00:18:40.079
to get that close. It broke them. The wedding

00:18:40.079 --> 00:18:42.500
never happened. Caroline became a religious recluse,

00:18:42.599 --> 00:18:44.940
and List's life took another sharp, dark turn.

00:18:45.119 --> 00:18:48.099
This leads us right into Act IV, tragedy, the

00:18:48.099 --> 00:18:50.839
church, and teaching. The 1860s seemed to be

00:18:50.839 --> 00:18:53.359
just a cascade of one piece of bad news after

00:18:53.359 --> 00:18:55.819
another for him. He called it his decade of sadness.

00:18:56.180 --> 00:18:59.319
And it really was. In 1859, his son Daniel died

00:18:59.319 --> 00:19:02.279
of tuberculosis at age 20. Then just a few years

00:19:02.279 --> 00:19:05.279
later, in 1862, his daughter Blandine died in

00:19:05.279 --> 00:19:08.140
childbirth. She was only 26. So he's lost two

00:19:08.140 --> 00:19:10.910
of his three children. The love of his life is

00:19:10.910 --> 00:19:13.390
legally barred from marrying him. He's feeling

00:19:13.390 --> 00:19:15.829
isolated in the music world because of the war.

00:19:16.049 --> 00:19:19.950
He felt completely and utterly alone. So what

00:19:19.950 --> 00:19:22.130
does the former rock star, the great hedonist,

00:19:22.130 --> 00:19:25.309
do? He retreats. He retreats. He moves into a

00:19:25.309 --> 00:19:28.210
monastery in Rome, the Madonna del Rosario. And

00:19:28.210 --> 00:19:31.390
in 1865, he shocks the entire world by taking

00:19:31.390 --> 00:19:33.470
minor orders in the Catholic Church. He becomes

00:19:33.470 --> 00:19:36.549
a monk. Well, not a full priest. He couldn't

00:19:36.549 --> 00:19:39.009
say mass or hear confession. But he became an

00:19:39.009 --> 00:19:41.119
abbé. He had to shave his head in the tonsure

00:19:41.119 --> 00:19:44.119
style. He wore the black cassock. He lived in

00:19:44.119 --> 00:19:47.059
a Spartan cell with just a hard bed, a crucifix,

00:19:47.059 --> 00:19:49.839
and a piano. That image is just wild to me. The

00:19:49.839 --> 00:19:52.160
guy who had women fighting over his silk handkerchiefs

00:19:52.160 --> 00:19:54.680
is now known as Abbe List, living in a monastery

00:19:54.680 --> 00:19:57.240
and writing choral music. And he wrote some beautiful,

00:19:57.359 --> 00:20:00.220
profound religious works in this period, pieces

00:20:00.220 --> 00:20:02.900
like his Oratorio Christus and the very stark

00:20:02.900 --> 00:20:05.680
Viacrucis. But he didn't just stop being List.

00:20:05.900 --> 00:20:08.490
This is where that tripartite existence he talked

00:20:08.490 --> 00:20:10.490
about really solidifies. He divides his year.

00:20:10.589 --> 00:20:13.170
He divides his year into three parts. He would

00:20:13.170 --> 00:20:15.990
spend part of the year in Rome living his monastic

00:20:15.990 --> 00:20:19.599
life. Then he'd go to Weimar. to teach and advise

00:20:19.599 --> 00:20:22.000
the court. And then he'd go to Budapest, where

00:20:22.000 --> 00:20:24.460
he was a national hero and helped found their

00:20:24.460 --> 00:20:26.940
Academy of Music. The source notes say he was

00:20:26.940 --> 00:20:29.619
traveling something like 4 ,000 miles a year

00:20:29.619 --> 00:20:32.059
in his old age. I mean, that's grueling even

00:20:32.059 --> 00:20:34.920
today, let alone in the 1870s on steam trains

00:20:34.920 --> 00:20:37.799
and carriages. He was restless. Yeah. But he

00:20:37.799 --> 00:20:40.640
dedicated a huge part of this later life to teaching.

00:20:41.069 --> 00:20:42.950
And this is another major innovation we have

00:20:42.950 --> 00:20:45.470
to credit him for. He basically invented the

00:20:45.470 --> 00:20:47.869
master class. So how is his teaching different

00:20:47.869 --> 00:20:50.690
from a normal lesson? Before Liszt, piano lessons

00:20:50.690 --> 00:20:53.269
were almost always one -on -one, a very private

00:20:53.269 --> 00:20:56.250
affair. Liszt held group lessons. A student would

00:20:56.250 --> 00:20:57.690
get up and play a piece in front of everyone

00:20:57.690 --> 00:21:00.250
else, a room full of their highly talented peers.

00:21:00.509 --> 00:21:02.210
And Liszt would critique them while the others

00:21:02.210 --> 00:21:04.109
watched and learned. So it was a performance

00:21:04.109 --> 00:21:06.309
and a lesson rolled into one. High pressure.

00:21:06.589 --> 00:21:09.599
Very high pressure. And his teaching style was

00:21:09.599 --> 00:21:11.240
fascinating. He didn't care about your technique.

00:21:11.480 --> 00:21:13.160
He assumed if you were in his class, you could

00:21:13.160 --> 00:21:15.579
already play the notes. He famously told the

00:21:15.579 --> 00:21:18.380
students, wash your dirty linen at home. Meaning,

00:21:18.539 --> 00:21:21.200
do your boring skills and exercises before you

00:21:21.200 --> 00:21:23.519
come to me. Right. Don't waste my time with that.

00:21:23.619 --> 00:21:26.140
He focused entirely on interpretation. on the

00:21:26.140 --> 00:21:28.680
poetry, the soul of the music. There's a funny

00:21:28.680 --> 00:21:30.519
quote where a student was banging on the keys

00:21:30.519 --> 00:21:33.119
too hard and Liz stopped him and said, do not

00:21:33.119 --> 00:21:36.259
chop beefsteak for us. He wanted art, not just

00:21:36.259 --> 00:21:39.519
noise. He wanted poetry. But here is the absolute

00:21:39.519 --> 00:21:41.460
kicker, and this really speaks to the transformation

00:21:41.460 --> 00:21:44.420
in his character. Yeah. He never charged a single

00:21:44.420 --> 00:21:47.359
penny for these lessons. What? For decades. For

00:21:47.359 --> 00:21:49.220
the last 20 years of his life, he taught hundreds

00:21:49.220 --> 00:21:51.299
of students, the next generation of Europe's

00:21:51.299 --> 00:21:55.450
greatest virtuosos, completely for free. He believed

00:21:55.450 --> 00:21:57.589
that since God had given him the gift of music,

00:21:57.809 --> 00:22:00.190
he had a moral duty to give it back to others.

00:22:00.450 --> 00:22:04.190
That is such a stark, unbelievable contrast to

00:22:04.190 --> 00:22:07.470
le concert, c 'est moi. It creates this fascination

00:22:07.470 --> 00:22:10.089
duality, doesn't it? The ego and the servant.

00:22:10.309 --> 00:22:13.369
He was somehow simultaneously both. So let's

00:22:13.369 --> 00:22:16.230
move to Act V, his musical legacy and a glimpse

00:22:16.230 --> 00:22:18.809
into the future. Because while he's traveling

00:22:18.809 --> 00:22:20.630
and teaching for free, he's still composing.

00:22:21.210 --> 00:22:23.829
And the music he writes in his final years, the

00:22:23.829 --> 00:22:27.130
old age works, is, for lack of a better word,

00:22:27.309 --> 00:22:30.009
bizarre. Bizarre is exactly the right word. If

00:22:30.009 --> 00:22:32.049
you listen to his early stuff, the Hungarian

00:22:32.049 --> 00:22:34.410
Rhapsodies, for example, it's flashy, romantic,

00:22:34.630 --> 00:22:38.509
full of catchy melodies. But his late work, pieces

00:22:38.509 --> 00:22:42.089
like Nuige's Gris, which means gray clouds, or

00:22:42.089 --> 00:22:45.180
the Bagatelle's Sans Tonalité. It sounds like

00:22:45.180 --> 00:22:47.740
it was written in the 1950s, not the 1880s. How

00:22:47.740 --> 00:22:50.140
so? For the non -musicians listening, what was

00:22:50.140 --> 00:22:52.380
he doing that was so strange? He was systematically

00:22:52.380 --> 00:22:54.960
dismantling the rules of music. He abandoned

00:22:54.960 --> 00:22:57.460
traditional keys. He was using harsh dissonance,

00:22:57.539 --> 00:22:59.980
strange chords like the tritone, which used to

00:22:59.980 --> 00:23:02.299
be called the devil in music, and harmonies that

00:23:02.299 --> 00:23:04.440
just hang in the air and never resolve. Why is

00:23:04.440 --> 00:23:06.480
never resolving such a big deal? Think of a simple

00:23:06.480 --> 00:23:08.680
song like Happy Birthday. At the end, on the

00:23:08.680 --> 00:23:10.619
last note, it feels finished. You've arrived

00:23:10.619 --> 00:23:13.799
home, musically. That's tonality. Liszt, in these

00:23:13.799 --> 00:23:15.579
late pieces, took away the home. The music just

00:23:15.579 --> 00:23:17.880
floats in this anxious, gray, uncertain space.

00:23:17.940 --> 00:23:20.700
It's unsettling. So he saw the cliff edge of

00:23:20.700 --> 00:23:22.940
romantic music, where everything was big and

00:23:22.940 --> 00:23:25.500
heroic and emotional, and he just jumped off

00:23:25.500 --> 00:23:28.059
into the void. He completely predicted the breakdown

00:23:28.059 --> 00:23:30.519
of tonality that would define 20th century music.

00:23:30.799 --> 00:23:33.440
He was anticipating impressionism, like Debussy,

00:23:33.660 --> 00:23:37.119
and even atonality, like Schoenberg, by decades.

00:23:37.380 --> 00:23:39.920
He famously told one of his students, the time

00:23:39.920 --> 00:23:42.200
for such things has not yet come. I can wait.

00:23:42.680 --> 00:23:44.819
He knew. It's incredible. We also need to touch

00:23:44.819 --> 00:23:47.220
on his relationships with other composers because

00:23:47.220 --> 00:23:49.480
he was like the Kevin Bacon of the 19th century.

00:23:49.619 --> 00:23:52.279
He knew absolutely everyone. And he was, for

00:23:52.279 --> 00:23:55.099
the most part, incredibly generous. He championed

00:23:55.099 --> 00:23:58.079
Berlioz when no one else would. He transcribed

00:23:58.079 --> 00:24:00.420
all nine of Beethoven's symphonies for piano

00:24:00.420 --> 00:24:02.539
so people in small towns without an orchestra

00:24:02.539 --> 00:24:05.119
could hear them. But his relationship with Richard

00:24:05.119 --> 00:24:07.900
Wagner is the most complex and dramatic. Here

00:24:07.900 --> 00:24:11.319
we go. The soap opera part again. List. was Wagner's

00:24:11.319 --> 00:24:13.839
greatest champion. He helped Wagner when Wagner

00:24:13.839 --> 00:24:15.720
was a political refugee and nobody would touch

00:24:15.720 --> 00:24:18.519
him. He gave him money. He conducted the premieres

00:24:18.519 --> 00:24:20.720
of his operas in Weimar when no one else would.

00:24:20.960 --> 00:24:24.359
He was his cheerleader, his banker, his promoter.

00:24:24.440 --> 00:24:27.839
And how did Wagner repay this incredible loyalty?

00:24:28.420 --> 00:24:31.839
By having an affair with Liszt's daughter, Cosima.

00:24:32.000 --> 00:24:33.480
Who was already married at the time. She was

00:24:33.480 --> 00:24:36.140
married to Hans von Bülow, who wasn't just anybody.

00:24:36.910 --> 00:24:39.710
He was Liszt's favorite student and a brilliant

00:24:39.710 --> 00:24:42.170
conductor in his own right. It was an absolute

00:24:42.170 --> 00:24:45.250
mess, a complete betrayal. How did Liszt handle

00:24:45.250 --> 00:24:47.029
that? I mean, that would destroy most families.

00:24:47.349 --> 00:24:50.650
It caused a massive rift. Liszt and Wagner didn't

00:24:50.650 --> 00:24:53.529
speak for years. Imagine the pain your best friend

00:24:53.529 --> 00:24:55.769
runs off with your daughter, destroying your

00:24:55.769 --> 00:24:59.849
favorite student's life in the process. But eventually...

00:24:59.960 --> 00:25:01.740
The pull of the music and the fact that Kosima

00:25:01.740 --> 00:25:03.440
had children with Wagner, his grandchildren,

00:25:03.720 --> 00:25:05.519
brought them back together. A reconciliation.

00:25:06.079 --> 00:25:09.660
A tense one, but yes. And in a poetic, almost

00:25:09.660 --> 00:25:12.799
tragic twist of fate, Liszt actually died in

00:25:12.799 --> 00:25:15.460
Bayreuth. Bayreuth is the town where Wagner built

00:25:15.460 --> 00:25:18.380
his massive custom opera house, right? The temple

00:25:18.380 --> 00:25:20.700
to his own music. Exactly. Liszt died there in

00:25:20.700 --> 00:25:23.900
1886 during the annual Wagner Festival. He passed

00:25:23.900 --> 00:25:25.980
away essentially in the shadow of the man he

00:25:25.980 --> 00:25:28.200
had helped make famous, the man who had also

00:25:28.200 --> 00:25:31.299
caused him so much pain. Wow. That's a complicated

00:25:31.299 --> 00:25:34.359
end. It is. But by that time, I think Liszt was

00:25:34.359 --> 00:25:37.799
beyond caring about worldly fame or slights.

00:25:37.900 --> 00:25:41.440
He had lived enough for 10 lifetimes. So let's

00:25:41.440 --> 00:25:43.299
try and bring all of this together. We started

00:25:43.299 --> 00:25:45.599
by calling him a rock star, but clearly rock

00:25:45.599 --> 00:25:48.539
star is too small a label for this man. He is

00:25:48.539 --> 00:25:50.940
the Brudge. That's how I see him. He was supposedly

00:25:50.940 --> 00:25:53.440
kissed by Beethoven, representing the classical

00:25:53.440 --> 00:25:56.160
past. And he wrote music that sounded like the

00:25:56.160 --> 00:25:58.640
atonal modernists representing the 20th century

00:25:58.640 --> 00:26:02.180
future. He contains the entire 19th century within

00:26:02.180 --> 00:26:04.660
his own life and work. And he completely transformed

00:26:04.660 --> 00:26:07.799
the piano. He took it from being a polite parlor

00:26:07.799 --> 00:26:09.940
instrument into a powerhouse that could rival

00:26:09.940 --> 00:26:12.339
an entire orchestra. He changed how we listen

00:26:12.339 --> 00:26:14.900
to music. He changed how we sit at a concert.

00:26:15.079 --> 00:26:17.079
He changed how we think about the role of the

00:26:17.079 --> 00:26:19.720
artist in society, from celebrity to servant.

00:26:19.900 --> 00:26:21.940
It's just incredible to think about that journey.

00:26:22.569 --> 00:26:24.710
From the boy practicing 14 hours a day to be

00:26:24.710 --> 00:26:27.430
like Paganini, to the superstar dodging fans,

00:26:27.849 --> 00:26:31.029
to the old abbé in a robe teaching for free.

00:26:31.269 --> 00:26:33.369
It's a life of constant radical reinvention.

00:26:33.470 --> 00:26:36.049
He never settled. Just when the world thought

00:26:36.049 --> 00:26:38.190
they had him figured out, he would change into

00:26:38.190 --> 00:26:40.869
someone else. Okay, so here's a final thought

00:26:40.869 --> 00:26:43.809
for you to chew on as we close out. We talked

00:26:43.809 --> 00:26:47.289
about his famous, unbelievably arrogant, quote,

00:26:47.869 --> 00:26:51.059
Le concert c 'est moi. The concert is me. It's

00:26:51.059 --> 00:26:54.420
the ultimate statement of ego. The peak of his

00:26:54.420 --> 00:26:57.299
celebrity phase. Right. But he ended his life

00:26:57.299 --> 00:26:59.759
living in a monastery cell, serving the church,

00:26:59.920 --> 00:27:02.079
and teaching the next generation of artists for

00:27:02.079 --> 00:27:05.480
zero profit. It raises the question, which was

00:27:05.480 --> 00:27:08.539
the real Liss? Was the humility of his old age

00:27:08.539 --> 00:27:11.019
a genuine penance for the arrogance of his youth?

00:27:11.180 --> 00:27:14.900
Or was the performance of the humble abbé just

00:27:14.900 --> 00:27:17.500
another role he was playing, the ultimate act

00:27:17.500 --> 00:27:20.410
of a lifelong showman? That is something to mull

00:27:20.410 --> 00:27:22.829
over. Was the monk just the final costume change?

00:27:23.109 --> 00:27:25.170
Or was it the man who was trying to be all along?

00:27:25.329 --> 00:27:27.730
We'll never truly know. And that mystery, I think,

00:27:27.730 --> 00:27:29.750
is part of his legend. Thanks for diving deep

00:27:29.750 --> 00:27:31.490
with us today. If you enjoyed this, maybe go

00:27:31.490 --> 00:27:33.509
listen to Nuez's, it's only about two minutes

00:27:33.509 --> 00:27:35.589
long, and see if you can hear the 20th century

00:27:35.589 --> 00:27:37.549
hiding inside it. We'll catch you on the next

00:27:37.549 --> 00:27:38.029
deep dive.
