Welcome back to the Deep Dive. Today we're tackling
a giant, really. So Ian Murray McKellen. We're
aiming to get beyond just, you know, Gandalf
and Magneto, important as they are, and really
look at the whole picture, the British cultural
icon. It's quite a task because those huge roles,
Gandalf, Magneto, they brought him global fame.
Absolutely. But they're relatively recent, really,
in the grand scheme of a six decade career. Right.
A career that started, you know, very traditionally
in British rep theater. Yeah. Mastering Shakespeare.
So we're looking at the artistry, but also the
activism. Exactly. They're intertwined. His life
is this incredible blend of serious stage work.
blockbuster fame and this really fierce personal
activism. Okay. So our sources give us a pretty
detailed map, his career phases, personal life,
that activism. And our mission here is to give
you, the listener, a solid, quick understanding
of how this man went from, well, Lancashire in
the north of England to commanding world stages,
starring in massive films, and then using that
fame to become, you know, a knighted co -founder
of Stonewall. It's quite the journey. It really
is an unprecedented path. That mix of sort of
hired gravity. and just massive popular appeal.
And the key thing, I think, is how he used that
visibility, that blockbuster fame, to push forward
his work in the real world. So let's unpack it.
Okay, let's start at the very beginning. Burnley,
Lancashire, May 1939. So literally born just
before World War II kicked off. Right on the
cusp. And the family moved around a bit, Wiggin,
then Bolton. That early experience, that wartime
childhood, it really shaped him. you can see
how it would build resilience. Definitely. The
sources often point to it when explaining his
calmness later. There's that amazing story after
9 -11, someone asked why he seemed so sort of
together about it all. And his answer was, Well,
darling, you forget. I slept under a steel plate
until I was four years old. Just puts it all
in perspective, doesn't it? That constant state
of alert almost became his normal. Wow, that
says so much. In his home life, his father was
a civil engineer. And a lay preacher. So a strong
Christian background, but described as non -Orthodox.
But here's a fascinating detail from the sources
connects to his later activism. Oh. His great
-great -grandfather, Robert J. Lowe's. He was
a campaigner back in Manchester. Campaigning
for what? For the Saturday half holiday, which,
you know, sounds small now, but it makes him,
as one source puts it, a grandfather of the modern
weekend. No way. So that instinct for social
campaigning, it's in the family history. Way
back. Over a century before Stonewall, that drive
to, you know, fight for something bigger, it
seems embedded. That makes sense. And the theater.
When did that start? Oh, very early. His parents
took him to see Peter Pan when he was just three.
And he got one of those Pollux toy theaters,
a foldaway Victorian stage. So the seed was planted
young. And his older sister, Jean, really nurtured
it. Took him to amateur Shakespeare, Twelfth
Night, Macbeth. She saw something there. And
that led to Cambridge. Yep. Won a scholarship
in 1958. St. Catherine's College, reading English
literature. He's an honorary fellow there now,
actually. But the real action was the Marlowe
Society. Right, absolutely. That was his training
ground. The sources say he did, get this, 23
plays in three years. 23! That's intense. Totally.
And he was being directed by future legends,
Peter Hall, Trevor Nunn. They were all there.
So when he graduated, he was already plugged
into the professional theater world. So the transition
was smooth. Pretty much immediate. Professional
debut in 61, Belgrade Theater in Coventry, a
man for all signals, that his first West End
show in 65, Ascent of Flowers, and he joined
Laurence Olivier's National Theater Company not
long after. Pretty prestigious start. But the
real breakthrough, the moment that signaled maybe
his willingness to provoke, came in 1969, Prospect
Theater Company. He played the leads in Richard
II and Marlowe's Edward II. Okay, Edward II,
that caused a stir, didn't it? It did. The play
itself deals with a homosexual king's downfall.
And this production, well, it didn't shy away
from it. The sources talk about the controversy
around the lurid death scene. Why was that so
controversial back then? Well, portraying a historical
gay figure with that level of dramatic weight
and explicitly showing the brutality of his death
linked to his sexuality and the intolerance around
him, it was pretty radical for 69. So even then,
he was using the stage to challenge things. Seems
like it. highlighting intolerance, pushing boundaries.
It kind of foreshadows his later activism, wouldn't
you say? Definitely. Okay, so the 1970s, he becomes
a real pillar of the British stage. Absolutely.
He's basically commuting between the Royal Shakespeare
Company, the RSC, and the Royal National Theatre,
just dominating. This is where he really honed
that incredible technique. And tackling the big
roles. Oh, yeah. Romeo in 76, Leontes in The
Winter's Tale in 77. And those legendary Trevor
Nunn productions with Judi Dench -McBeth and
Othello where he played Iago. Critically acclaimed,
award -winning stuff. And the awards did start
coming thick and fast in the UK. The Olivier's.
He started racking them up. Pillars of the Community,
77. The Alchemist, 78. But then came the big
leap across the pond, Broadway. Exactly. 1980.
Peter Shafter's play. McKellen took on Salieri,
the jealous composer obsessed with Mozart. And
Tim Curry played Mozart. Yep. Tim Curry is Mozart.
Jane Seymour was in it too. And McKellen Salieri,
it just blew people away. Elevated him from,
you know, respected British actor to genuine
international star. The critics loved it. Frank
Rich at the New York Times. Rich nailed it. He
said McKellen showed Salieri's descent into madness
in dark notes of almost bone -rattling terror.
It wasn't just playing envy. It was like existential
collapse. And that performance won him the Tony.
Best Actor in a Play, 1981. That Tony win cemented
his status over there, gave him real clout, transatlantic
clout. But he didn't just stay in the U .S.,
did he? He kept working back in the U .K., picking
up more Olivier's. Right. He won for Bent in
1979, which is significant. Why Bent specifically?
Because it dealt with the Nazi persecution of
gay men. So even before he came out publicly,
he was choosing roles that explored queer history,
queer suffering. It was a form of advocacy through
his work even then. Interesting. And he won for
Wild Honey, too. Check off. He did. He took Wild
Honey to Broadway in 86, but that one had a bit
of a mixed reception, actually. Oh, how so? Well,
critics like Frank Rich, again, praised McKellen
himself, his bravura and athletically graceful
technique, but felt the rest of the cast couldn't
quite keep up. So his own brilliance almost highlighted
weaknesses elsewhere. Kind of. It showed how
commanding his presence was. If the production
wasn't uniformly strong, you noticed it. A testament
to his power. in a way. And then he returned
to Shakespearean villainy with Richard III. Oh,
that 1992 stage production was immense. Toured
everywhere, won him another Olivier. And people
loved his take on Richard, that sort of sly conspiratorial
connection he made with the audience. You were
in on the joke almost. And that particular approach
to villainy, that self -aware quality. That set
the stage perfectly for his next big move, translating
that same energy, that same character onto the
big screen. Which brings us to a major turning
point. Right, the leap to screen stardom. It
wasn't overnight, though, was it? His first film
was way back in 69. Yeah, a touch of love. His
first lead film role wasn't until 1980, playing
D .H. Lawrence in Priest of Love. For a long
time, he was more of a supporting player in films.
Exactly. Respected, always good. Yeah. You know,
popping up in films like Plenty with Meryl Streep
or smaller parts in things like Last Action Hero,
The Shadow in the early 90s. Solid work. but
not career -defining like his stage roles. Until
the 1995 Richard III, that felt different. Completely
different. Because he wasn't just starring. He
co -wrote the screenplay. He was an executive
producer. He took control. And the setting fascist
1930s Britain, that was his idea. Yes. Transplanting
it like that was a bold move. It showed he was
bringing that high -concept, RSE -style thinking
to cinema. And his commitment was total. How
so? As executive producer, when they ran short
of money for the final battle scene, he returned
his own 50 ,000 pound acting fee to make sure
it got filmed properly. Wow. He literally put
his money where his mouth was. Absolutely. It
showed how invested he was in that specific vision.
And critics really responded to that intelligence,
that ambition. Hal Henson called it lethally
flamboyant. And Roger Ebert praised how it captured
Richard's self -awareness, calling him one of
theater's first... truly self -aware characters.
It got BAFTA and Golden Globe nominations, won
a European Film Award. It worked. And that success
opened doors to more dramatic screen roles. It
definitely paved the way. Late 90s, he did some
really meaty, complex stuff. The Chilling Nazi
Officer and Apt Pupil. Briden Singer directed
that, right? Yeah, based on the Stephen King
story. And then the big one, playing the film
director, James Whale. in Gods and Monsters,
also 1998. Bill Condon directed that. And Gods
and Monsters got him his first Oscar nomination.
Best actor, finally. After nearly 40 years as
a professional actor, it was a complex, vulnerable,
brilliant performance. So he's playing Nazis,
aging gay directors, showing incredible range.
Exactly. He proved he could deliver that Hollywood
prestige drama. But just as he gets that recognition,
he pivots again, radically, toward the blockbuster.
Enter the X -Men, 2000. Magneto. Back with Bryan
Singer. And this leads to that great Patrick
Stewart story. Ah, yes. The Star Trek advice.
It's classic. Stewart gets offered Captain Picard
in Star Trek The Next Generation. McKellen, the
serious theater guy, apparently told him, don't
do it. It'll ruin your career. He must have loved
reminding him of that later. Oh, I'm sure. McKellen
admitted Stewart was smart to take it. And then
what does he do? He joins the superhero franchise
himself as Magneto. It shows a shift in thinking,
though, maybe realizing the power of those franchises.
I think so. A strategic move. If you can reach
that massive audience, why not? And use the platform
it gives you. Which became even bigger when he
took on Gandalf. Exponentially bigger. While
he was still filming X -Men, he got cast in The
Lord of the Rings. First trilogy from 2001, then
The Hobbit films later. Gandalf basically made
him immortal. And brought more awards recognition.
Another Oscar nomination. Supporting actor for
Fellowship of the Ring. Won the Screen Actors
Guild Award, too. But beyond the awards, it was
the experience, the bond with the cast. The tattoo.
The Elvish Nine tattoo. Almost all fellowship
actors got one, symbolizing their group. McKellen,
Elijah Wood, Viggo Mortensen, Orlando Bloom.
Didn't John Rhys -Davies pass on it? Gimli? He
did, but his stunt double got it instead, which
is kind of perfect. It just shows what a unique,
tight -knit experience that filming must have
been. So post Middle Earth, he didn't slow down.
He kept mixing it up. The Da Vinci Code in 2006.
Yep. And that led to one of his most talked about
interviews, didn't it? Where he questioned the
Bible. Right. Suggesting it needed a this is
fiction disclaimer. Yeah. He said, I mean, walking
on water, it takes an act of faith. He was basically
using his huge platform to challenge religious
literalism. Quite a bold move for someone with
his profile. And he did comedy, too. Extras with
Ricky Gervais. Hilarious. Playing an exaggerated
version of himself directing Gervais' character.
Got an Emmy nomination for it. Showed he didn't
take himself too seriously. Plus, more stage
work with Patrick Stewart. Oh, yeah. Their double
acts became legendary. Waiting for Gutto, Pinters,
No Man's Land. Sold out everywhere. UK, Broadway.
Their chemistry was just undeniable. And more
s***. serious film drama, Mr. Holmes. Brilliant
film. 2015, playing Sherlock in his final years.
Directed by Bill Condon again. But then, total
shift. He's voicing Cogsworth the Clock in Disney's
live action Beauty and the Beast. Which was massive.
Huge hit. Showed he could do the blockbuster
musical thing too. And then The Good Liar with
Helen Mirren. Also Bill Condon. It's fascinating
how he balanced the heavy drama with lighter
fare. Like the sitcom Vicious of Derek Jacoby.
playing an elderly gay couple, Freddie and Stuart,
together 50 years. That was unexpected. A multi
-cam sitcom late in his career. But important
for representation. Hugely. It normalized long
-term gay relationships in a very mainstream
format. Apparently the original title was Vicious
Old Queens, which caused a stir, but the show
itself was quite groundbreaking in its own way,
and critics noted how their classical timing
just worked perfectly for sitcom rhythm. And
his commitment to the stage is still there, even
recently, playing Falstaff in Player Kings. Incredible.
At 84, tackling Falstaff, he was getting rave
reviews in London. Then came that fall. Yeah,
June 2024. Fell off the stage during a performance.
Must have been scary. Shocking for everyone there.
He had to pull out of the rest of the run, understandably.
But reports came out quickly saying he was OK
in good spirits. Shows his resilience. And he's
already got his next gig lined up. Yep. Reprising
Magneto in Avengers. Doomsday scheduled for 2026.
So at 86, 87, he'll be back in the Marvel Universe.
Shakespeare one minute, supervillains the next.
Just amazing. OK, let's shift focus slightly
to the activism. It's impossible to separate
it from the performer, isn't it? Completely impossible.
To understand McKellen, you have to understand
his fight for LGBT rights. But maybe first, a
little context on his personal life before he
came out publicly. He had long -term partners.
Two main ones mentioned in the sources, Brian
Taylor, a history teacher from 1964 -72, then
the director, Sean Mathias, from 1978 -88. And
the relationship with Mathias was described as
difficult. Yeah, tempestuous is the word used.
Apparently, career pressures played a part. McKellen's
star was rising very fast. But significantly,
they stayed friends and worked together later.
Matthias directed him in Waiting for Godot with
Stuart, right? Exactly. Shows a certain maturity,
a professional respect that endured. And just
for context, he's also an atheist and has been
pesetarian since the late 80s. Right. So the
big moment, coming out publicly in 1988. On BBC
Radio, on a program called Third Ear. But this
wasn't just a personal announcement. It was absolutely
a political act. Triggered by Section 28. Precisely.
The government introduced Section 28 of the Local
Government Act, which basically banned local
authorities from promoting homosexuality. What
did that mean in practice? It meant schools,
libraries, public services couldn't acknowledge
gay relationships as valid or normal. It effectively
silenced discussion, denied support to young
gay people. It was designed to push gay lives
back into the shadows, reinforce shame. And McKellen
saw the danger immediately. He knew he couldn't
fight a law demanding invisibility while remaining
invisible himself. He later said, and it's a
powerful quote, Which led to co -founding Stonewall.
Yes. The UK LGBT rights group, named after the
Stonewall Ryans. And he instantly started using
his profile to challenge the establishment. Which
brings us to the Michael Howard story. Oh, the
legendary story. Yeah. 1988, Howard was environment
secretary responsible for the act. McKellen lobbies
him hard against Section 28. Howard won't budge.
But then... Then Howard asks for an autograph.
For his kids. McKellen agrees, takes the paper,
and writes... Fuck off, I'm gay! Exactly. Just...
Perfect defiance. Celebrity, anger, politics,
all colliding in that one moment. It became iconic.
A real rallying point. And he embraced his identity
publicly even after getting knighted in 91. The
Serena nickname. Yeah, apparently Stephen Fry
gave it to him. And McKellen used it himself
at the Gay Games closing ceremony in 94. I am
Sir Ian McKellen, but you can call me Serena.
Taking an establishment honor and sort of repurposing
it. Totally. Owning it. Making it a point of
pride for the whole community. Using that Sir
to amplify the message, not hide behind it. And
his activism went international too. Oh yes,
pushing boundaries everywhere, like that famous
interview in Singapore. Very conservative place,
where he just casually asked the morning show
host for a recommendation for a gay bar. Caused
a bit of chaos, I imagine. Apparently they cut
the interview short pretty quickly. But that
was his style, fearless, using his platform to
normalize things, even if it made people uncomfortable.
He also worked with charities outside LGBT causes.
Yes, Age UK is one he supports strongly. And
his love for theater came through when he helped
raise funds to rebuild the Isaac Theater Royal
in New Zealand after the Christchurch earthquake,
giving back to the institutions that supported
him. And a nice personal touch, officiating Patrick
Stewart's wedding. Became ordained just for that
purpose in 2013. Lovely gesture between old friends.
And his activism was formally recognized, too.
Yes. In 2014, made a Freeman of the City of London.
And the citation specifically mentioned his work
for gay rights, putting his activism on par with
his artistic contributions. It's seen as equally
important to his legacy. Oh, and health wise,
he mentioned being diagnosed with prostate cancer
back in 2006, but said in 2012 it was contained
and hadn't needed treatment, which is good news.
OK, so let's try and synthesize all these awards
and his continuing presence. It's quite a haul.
It's staggering, really. And across all mediums,
the Tony win for Amadeus plus another nomination.
But the Olivier Awards in the UK show the sheer
depth. Six wins from 12 nominations. Covering
drama, comedy. Even his one -man show, Ian McKellen
on stage, won an Olivier in 2020. Then you've
got the film side. Two Oscar nominations, Gods
and Monsters in Fellowship. Plus the Golden Globes
for Rasputin and Emmy's nods. Right. And don't
forget the Critics Awards for Gods and Monsters.
He basically swept the board in 98, LA, Chicago,
National Board of Review. Everyone agreed it
was the performance of the year. And he's still
incredibly active, evolving even now. That 2019
one -man show tour. Ian McKellen on stage with
Tolkien, Shakespeare, others, and you. That wasn't
just about performing. It was a fundraiser. For
theaters. Exactly. Touring around the UK, raising
money specifically for the venues he played in.
A direct way of supporting the regional theater
ecosystem that launched him decades ago. Paying
it forward. Which is wonderful. And then there's
the knitting. Huh. Yes. The viral videos with
Bjorn Ulvaeus from ABA. Just sitting there knitting
Christmas jumpers on Instagram. It's so unexpected.
Completely charming. And it perfectly shows his
modern engagement. This knighted Shakespearean
legend doing something utterly relatable with
a pop music icon on social media. And it wasn't
just a joke. It led to a commission. They were
commissioned to knit stage wear for Kylie Minogue's
Vegas residency. You couldn't make it up. It
just proves even in his mid 80s, he moves effortlessly
between high art, blockbusters and, well, viral
knitting content. So wrapping this all up for
you, the listener. We've gone from that boy in
wartime Bolton through decades mastering the
stage to co -founding Sternwald, becoming Sir
Ian and then Gandalf and Magneto. The sheer range
is. Wow, it's breathtaking. I think the key takeaway,
the thread through it all, is how he managed
to fuse that incredible artistry with such authentic,
sometimes aggressive, self -expression and activism.
He proved high culture and mass appeal weren't
opposites. He made them work together. Amplified
each other. He used the spotlight from the wizard
and the mutant to power real world change. It's
a unique, powerful model of modern celebrity,
really. That mastery across different world stage
screen politics, that's his power. So we've seen
how he leveraged those fantasy roles for his
activism. But now thinking about him. knitting
with Bjorn Olweus and getting ready to play Magneto
again, it makes you wonder what completely new,
totally unexpected platform might the world's
most famous working octogenarian actor embrace
next? How else could he use that incredible influence?
He's conquered the stage, the screen, the political
arena. He's done film, TV, viral videos. What's
left for Serena McKellen to master? And more
importantly, how will he use it to help others?
Something for you to think about. Thanks for
joining us for this deep dive into the phenomenal
career of Sir Ian McKellen.