WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.200 Welcome to the Deep Dive. Today we're digging 00:00:02.200 --> 00:00:04.200 into someone you probably think you know really 00:00:04.200 --> 00:00:06.759 well, Lisa Kudrow. That's right. And for most 00:00:06.759 --> 00:00:09.460 people, she is Phoebe Buffay, isn't she? That, 00:00:09.519 --> 00:00:11.720 you know, wonderfully quirky guitar strumming 00:00:11.720 --> 00:00:14.480 character from Friends. Absolutely iconic. But 00:00:14.480 --> 00:00:17.019 the sources we've pulled together, they paint 00:00:17.019 --> 00:00:19.500 a much, much richer picture. We're talking about 00:00:19.500 --> 00:00:21.660 someone with a surprising background in, believe 00:00:21.660 --> 00:00:24.019 it or not, academic science. And not just science, 00:00:24.039 --> 00:00:27.239 but then this pivot into really physical comedy. 00:00:27.539 --> 00:00:30.980 And later, these very profound roles as an executive 00:00:30.980 --> 00:00:33.359 producer. She's way more than just Phoebe. So 00:00:33.359 --> 00:00:35.179 that's our mission today, right? Are you listening? 00:00:35.240 --> 00:00:37.380 We want to move past that, well, that caricature. 00:00:37.740 --> 00:00:40.960 hilarious as it is, and really understand Kudrow 00:00:40.960 --> 00:00:43.859 as this multi -talented force. Definitely. She's 00:00:43.859 --> 00:00:46.619 a primetime Emmy winner, yes, but also, you know, 00:00:46.619 --> 00:00:48.740 a critically acclaimed dramatic actress in her 00:00:48.740 --> 00:00:51.359 own right. And maybe most surprisingly, a really 00:00:51.359 --> 00:00:55.140 sophisticated creator and producer who basically 00:00:55.140 --> 00:00:58.020 took the reins of her own career. Yeah, she took 00:00:58.020 --> 00:01:01.439 control. Our deep dive today is built on, well, 00:01:01.520 --> 00:01:04.159 a pretty comprehensive look at her life and career 00:01:04.159 --> 00:01:06.900 timeline. We're going from her studies at Vassar 00:01:06.900 --> 00:01:09.219 all the way through to her latest work, which 00:01:09.219 --> 00:01:11.319 is getting really good reviews. And just to kick 00:01:11.319 --> 00:01:13.599 things off, here's that initial like shock factor 00:01:13.599 --> 00:01:16.400 fact we found. Before acting was even a serious 00:01:16.400 --> 00:01:19.120 thought, her plan was biology. Right. Specifically 00:01:19.120 --> 00:01:21.780 studying headaches. Right. Like her dad. Exactly. 00:01:22.019 --> 00:01:24.359 Following in her father's footsteps to become 00:01:24.359 --> 00:01:27.599 a headache specialist. It just it really sets 00:01:27.599 --> 00:01:30.099 the stage for how unexpected her whole journey 00:01:30.099 --> 00:01:32.760 is. Headache expert. I mean, it's hard to square 00:01:32.760 --> 00:01:35.019 that with Phoebe Buffay sometimes. The person 00:01:35.019 --> 00:01:37.780 who gave a smelly cat was ready to dive deep 00:01:37.780 --> 00:01:40.079 into neurological research. It's a fascinating 00:01:40.079 --> 00:01:42.400 contrast, isn't it? So let's unpack that. Let's 00:01:42.400 --> 00:01:45.879 trace that path from the biology lab to the improv 00:01:45.879 --> 00:01:47.900 stage. Okay, so the academic background first. 00:01:48.180 --> 00:01:50.859 She was born Lisa Valerie Kudrow right here in 00:01:50.859 --> 00:01:53.420 Los Angeles, 1963. And she went to Vassar College. 00:01:53.620 --> 00:01:55.859 That's in Poughkeepsie, New York, a pretty prestigious 00:01:55.859 --> 00:01:58.239 school. And she got her A .B., her Bachelor of 00:01:58.239 --> 00:02:01.299 Arts, in biology. So this wasn't just, like, 00:02:01.400 --> 00:02:04.260 dabbling. No, not at all. This was a serious 00:02:04.260 --> 00:02:07.400 academic pursuit. As you said, the original plan 00:02:07.400 --> 00:02:10.599 was to follow her dad, Dr. Lee Kudrow. He was 00:02:10.599 --> 00:02:13.199 a doctor, a specialist in headaches. And Lisa 00:02:13.199 --> 00:02:15.620 intended to become an expert in that same field. 00:02:15.740 --> 00:02:18.139 That was the goal. And what really underscores 00:02:18.139 --> 00:02:20.419 how serious she was about it is that she actually 00:02:20.419 --> 00:02:23.159 worked for her father for eight years. Eight 00:02:23.159 --> 00:02:25.580 years. Even while she was starting to try and 00:02:25.580 --> 00:02:28.240 break into acting. Yes, simultaneously. And this 00:02:28.240 --> 00:02:30.539 wasn't just, you know, filing papers or something. 00:02:30.599 --> 00:02:32.360 She was involved in his research. She actually 00:02:32.360 --> 00:02:34.960 earned a research credit on one of his published 00:02:34.960 --> 00:02:37.219 studies. OK, we need the details on that study 00:02:37.219 --> 00:02:40.090 because, like you said. It speaks volumes about 00:02:40.090 --> 00:02:42.650 her early mindset, that analytical approach. 00:02:42.889 --> 00:02:45.469 Right. The paper was called Handedness and Headache. 00:02:45.610 --> 00:02:48.050 It was looking into whether left -handed people 00:02:48.050 --> 00:02:49.990 were more likely than right -handed people to 00:02:49.990 --> 00:02:52.530 develop a specific type of headache called cluster 00:02:52.530 --> 00:02:55.110 headaches. Cluster headaches. Those sound rough. 00:02:55.310 --> 00:02:58.250 And handedness. Why? Look at that. Well, cluster 00:02:58.250 --> 00:03:00.349 headaches are notoriously painful, sometimes 00:03:00.349 --> 00:03:02.490 called suicide headaches, apparently, because 00:03:02.490 --> 00:03:04.930 the pain is just that intense. They happen in 00:03:04.930 --> 00:03:08.810 cycles, clusters. Okay. And handedness. It's 00:03:08.810 --> 00:03:11.389 often used in research as a sort of proxy for 00:03:11.389 --> 00:03:13.509 brain organization, you know, differences between 00:03:13.509 --> 00:03:15.969 the left and right hemispheres. So they were 00:03:15.969 --> 00:03:18.990 exploring if that neurological difference indicated 00:03:18.990 --> 00:03:22.050 by being left -handed might correlate with getting 00:03:22.050 --> 00:03:24.250 these severe headaches. So she's deep in this 00:03:24.250 --> 00:03:27.129 world of analyzing patterns, neurological details, 00:03:27.490 --> 00:03:31.860 human discomfort. It's very systematic. Very 00:03:31.860 --> 00:03:34.319 observational. Exactly. That's the key, I think. 00:03:34.340 --> 00:03:37.340 She was thinking in systems, analyzing data before 00:03:37.340 --> 00:03:39.819 comedy was even really on the table. Which makes 00:03:39.819 --> 00:03:42.120 the pivot even more interesting. How does that 00:03:42.120 --> 00:03:44.159 analytical mind then jump into something like, 00:03:44.240 --> 00:03:48.469 well, the groundlings? Improv comedy. It started, 00:03:48.669 --> 00:03:51.009 as these things often do, with a nudge from a 00:03:51.009 --> 00:03:53.349 friend. Or rather, a friend of her brother's. 00:03:53.349 --> 00:03:55.310 Ah, the John Lovitz connection. That's the one. 00:03:55.430 --> 00:03:57.810 John Lovitz, the comedian, was a childhood friend 00:03:57.810 --> 00:04:00.030 of her older brother. And apparently he was the 00:04:00.030 --> 00:04:02.289 one who urged her to try comedy. And that led 00:04:02.289 --> 00:04:05.009 her to the Groundlings in L .A. Yep. The legendary 00:04:05.009 --> 00:04:07.069 improv and sketch comedy school. That's where 00:04:07.069 --> 00:04:09.430 she started really learning the craft. Improv 00:04:09.430 --> 00:04:11.409 seems like such a different skill set from biology 00:04:11.409 --> 00:04:14.729 research, though. So spontaneous. But think about 00:04:14.729 --> 00:04:18.139 it. Good improv requires intense observation, 00:04:18.540 --> 00:04:20.240 right? You have to read your scene partners, 00:04:20.459 --> 00:04:22.680 read the audience, spot patterns in the humor, 00:04:22.839 --> 00:04:25.980 synthesize information instantly. Oh, okay. I 00:04:25.980 --> 00:04:27.879 see that. It's like high -speed data analysis, 00:04:28.040 --> 00:04:30.939 but for laughs. Exactly. And she actually credits 00:04:30.939 --> 00:04:33.439 her improv teacher there, a woman named Cynthia 00:04:33.439 --> 00:04:37.180 Seghetti, as being hugely influential. Kudrow 00:04:37.180 --> 00:04:39.579 says Seghetti changed her whole perspective on 00:04:39.579 --> 00:04:42.100 acting, called her the best thing that happened 00:04:42.100 --> 00:04:44.670 on so many levels. So that improv training. And 00:04:44.670 --> 00:04:46.970 it was really foundational. Absolutely. Especially, 00:04:47.110 --> 00:04:48.930 you know, considering the kind of improvised 00:04:48.930 --> 00:04:51.610 format she'd later create herself, like web therapy. 00:04:51.990 --> 00:04:54.829 That Groundlings experience was crucial. But 00:04:54.829 --> 00:04:56.850 it wasn't an overnight success story, even with 00:04:56.850 --> 00:04:58.990 that training. There were some pretty significant 00:04:58.990 --> 00:05:01.350 near misses along the way. Oh, yeah. Two really 00:05:01.350 --> 00:05:02.870 big ones that could have changed everything. 00:05:03.470 --> 00:05:05.550 First, she auditioned for Saturday Night Live 00:05:05.550 --> 00:05:09.110 back in 1990. Wow. SNL. Who got the spot instead? 00:05:09.410 --> 00:05:11.870 Julia Sweeney was chosen that year. So close, 00:05:11.990 --> 00:05:14.019 but no cigar on that one. And the second one 00:05:14.019 --> 00:05:16.800 is maybe even more famous, the Frasier situation. 00:05:17.199 --> 00:05:19.720 Right. This is wild. She was originally cast 00:05:19.720 --> 00:05:22.899 as Roz Doyle in the pilot episode of Frasier. 00:05:22.959 --> 00:05:25.439 Roz Doyle. Perry Gilpin's role, that's a huge 00:05:25.439 --> 00:05:27.839 part. Very different from Phoebe, too. Much more 00:05:27.839 --> 00:05:29.980 sort of sharp and cynical. Totally different 00:05:29.980 --> 00:05:32.459 vibe. And apparently it just, it didn't click 00:05:32.459 --> 00:05:35.319 during rehearsals. Kudrow herself admitted later 00:05:35.319 --> 00:05:38.120 that she knew it wasn't working. Really? She 00:05:38.120 --> 00:05:39.639 felt it wasn't right. Yeah, she said, I could 00:05:39.639 --> 00:05:42.300 feel it all slipping away and I was panicking, 00:05:42.319 --> 00:05:46.139 which only made things worse. They ended up recasting 00:05:46.139 --> 00:05:49.399 the role during the pilot taping. Wow. That must 00:05:49.399 --> 00:05:52.319 have been tough. But also incredibly self -aware 00:05:52.319 --> 00:05:54.639 of her to recognize it wasn't the right fit. 00:05:54.910 --> 00:05:57.170 even amidst the panic. It shows that analytical 00:05:57.170 --> 00:05:59.410 side again, doesn't it? Assessing the situation, 00:05:59.649 --> 00:06:01.910 her own performance, even under pressure, she 00:06:01.910 --> 00:06:04.129 understood why it wasn't working. And maybe that 00:06:04.129 --> 00:06:06.689 experience helped steer her towards the kind 00:06:06.689 --> 00:06:09.410 of quirky observational characters where she 00:06:09.410 --> 00:06:11.790 really excelled. Seems likely, because the role 00:06:11.790 --> 00:06:14.050 that did stick, her first recurring TV role, 00:06:14.209 --> 00:06:18.680 was Ursula Buffet. Ah, yes, the genesis of the 00:06:18.680 --> 00:06:21.399 buffet dynasty. It's crucial to remember Ursula 00:06:21.399 --> 00:06:23.639 came first. Absolutely. People forget that. Ursula 00:06:23.639 --> 00:06:26.500 Buffet, the kind of spacey, definitely eccentric 00:06:26.500 --> 00:06:29.399 waitress on Mad About You, that was her first 00:06:29.399 --> 00:06:32.240 regular gig starting in 1993. She was in quite 00:06:32.240 --> 00:06:34.279 a few episodes of that, wasn't she? Yeah, 24 00:06:34.279 --> 00:06:37.279 episodes between 93 and 99. So Ursula was established. 00:06:37.319 --> 00:06:38.899 She was out there. People knew the character. 00:06:39.259 --> 00:06:42.100 And then Friends comes along in 1994. They cast 00:06:42.100 --> 00:06:44.310 Kudrow as Phoebe. And they make that brilliant 00:06:44.310 --> 00:06:47.089 decision to connect the dots. They decided Ursula 00:06:47.089 --> 00:06:49.670 and Phoebe would be identical twin sisters. Which 00:06:49.670 --> 00:06:52.290 is just genius, really. It instantly gives Phoebe 00:06:52.290 --> 00:06:56.750 this built -in, slightly strange backstory. Explains 00:06:56.750 --> 00:06:59.279 some of her... let's say, unique perspectives 00:06:59.279 --> 00:07:02.639 on life. Totally. Having Ursula as her twin provides 00:07:02.639 --> 00:07:05.939 this context for Phoebe's sort of chaotic upbringing 00:07:05.939 --> 00:07:08.620 and her detachment sometimes. It grounds the 00:07:08.620 --> 00:07:11.240 eccentricity in something specific. And Phoebe 00:07:11.240 --> 00:07:13.439 Buffay just exploded, became this global icon 00:07:13.439 --> 00:07:15.779 almost overnight. What was it about Kudrow's 00:07:15.779 --> 00:07:17.810 performance that hit so hard? I think it was 00:07:17.810 --> 00:07:20.470 the combination of genuine warmth and complete, 00:07:20.649 --> 00:07:23.470 utter strangeness delivered with total conviction. 00:07:23.949 --> 00:07:27.110 She wasn't playing Phoebe as dumb. No, definitely 00:07:27.110 --> 00:07:30.040 not dumb. Operating on a different wavelength. 00:07:30.319 --> 00:07:32.879 Exactly. A different internal logic. And Kudrow 00:07:32.879 --> 00:07:35.740 committed to that logic absolutely. Whether she 00:07:35.740 --> 00:07:39.339 was singing Smelly Cat or talking about her questionable 00:07:39.339 --> 00:07:42.879 past, she played it with this core of sincerity. 00:07:43.439 --> 00:07:46.079 Critics really picked up on that intellectual 00:07:46.079 --> 00:07:48.920 commitment behind the quirkiness. And that massive 00:07:48.920 --> 00:07:51.220 success, the whole Friends phenomena, led to 00:07:51.220 --> 00:07:53.519 that incredible negotiating power for the cast. 00:07:53.779 --> 00:07:56.060 Oh yeah. Unprecedented at the time. The six of 00:07:56.060 --> 00:07:58.399 them together, they basically changed how stars 00:07:58.399 --> 00:08:01.000 got paid in television. We're talking the famous 00:08:01.000 --> 00:08:03.740 million dollars per episode deal. So the ninth 00:08:03.740 --> 00:08:06.480 and tenth seasons. Yeah. Kudrow, Jennifer Aniston, 00:08:06.620 --> 00:08:09.100 Courtney Cox. They became the highest paid TV 00:08:09.100 --> 00:08:11.860 actresses ever at that point. It was a huge statement 00:08:11.860 --> 00:08:13.579 about the value they brought to the show. And 00:08:13.579 --> 00:08:15.060 a little bit of trivia. She was actually the 00:08:15.060 --> 00:08:18.160 oldest of the main six cast members. She was. 00:08:18.279 --> 00:08:20.620 And interestingly, she was also the first one 00:08:20.620 --> 00:08:22.860 of the Friends cast to win an Emmy for her role. 00:08:23.259 --> 00:08:26.680 Really? Before the others? Yep. She won Outstanding 00:08:26.680 --> 00:08:28.980 Supporting Actress in a comedy series back in 00:08:28.980 --> 00:08:32.840 1998. So that critical recognition came relatively 00:08:32.840 --> 00:08:35.860 early for her specific contribution. While all 00:08:35.860 --> 00:08:37.980 this Friends madness is happening, she's also 00:08:37.980 --> 00:08:39.820 making some really interesting choices in her 00:08:39.820 --> 00:08:42.379 film career. Not just coasting on the Phoebe 00:08:42.379 --> 00:08:45.379 fame. Not at all. She was clearly using the security 00:08:45.379 --> 00:08:47.980 Friends gave her to explore different things. 00:08:48.580 --> 00:08:51.139 Balancing these like broader comedies with more 00:08:51.139 --> 00:08:53.649 character driven stuff. Like Romy and Michelle's 00:08:53.649 --> 00:08:56.190 high school reunion. That's become such a cult 00:08:56.190 --> 00:08:58.750 classic. Totally. Perfect use of her deadpan 00:08:58.750 --> 00:09:01.870 timing opposite Mira Servino. But then just a 00:09:01.870 --> 00:09:04.049 year later, she does the opposite of sex. Ah, 00:09:04.289 --> 00:09:06.730 OK. That's the one that really made critics sit 00:09:06.730 --> 00:09:08.690 up and take notice, right? Showed a different 00:09:08.690 --> 00:09:11.549 side entirely. Absolutely. It was a comedy drama, 00:09:11.750 --> 00:09:15.029 quite dark and cynical in tone. She played Lucia, 00:09:15.210 --> 00:09:17.629 this very sharp -tongued, somewhat repressed 00:09:17.629 --> 00:09:20.370 woman. It was miles away from Phoebe. And the 00:09:20.370 --> 00:09:22.730 performance was really well received. Hugely. 00:09:22.830 --> 00:09:25.850 She won the New York Film Critics Circle Award 00:09:25.850 --> 00:09:28.610 for Best Supporting Actress. That's a major critical 00:09:28.610 --> 00:09:31.950 prize. Plus an Independent Spirit Award nomination. 00:09:32.250 --> 00:09:35.330 It proved she had serious dramatic chops and 00:09:35.330 --> 00:09:37.210 wasn't just going to be typecast. So she's doing 00:09:37.210 --> 00:09:39.570 mainstream comedies like Analyze This and its 00:09:39.570 --> 00:09:41.909 sequel. Right. With De Niro and Billy Crystal 00:09:41.909 --> 00:09:44.990 and voice work like Dr. Dolittle 2, Keeping Her 00:09:44.990 --> 00:09:47.870 Hand and big studio films. But also getting these 00:09:47.870 --> 00:09:51.259 serious critical nods for indie films. She's 00:09:51.259 --> 00:09:53.580 building this really diverse portfolio during 00:09:53.580 --> 00:09:56.220 the Friends years. Precisely. Setting the stage, 00:09:56.220 --> 00:09:57.899 really, for what came next. Because when Friends 00:09:57.899 --> 00:10:00.460 ended in 2004, she didn't just, you know, take 00:10:00.460 --> 00:10:02.620 a long vacation or keep doing supporting roles. 00:10:02.779 --> 00:10:04.919 No, this is where that control element really 00:10:04.919 --> 00:10:07.379 kicks in, the power shift. Exactly. That million 00:10:07.379 --> 00:10:09.120 -dollar -an -episode paycheck wasn't just money. 00:10:09.220 --> 00:10:12.500 It was freedom. Creative freedom. She immediately 00:10:12.500 --> 00:10:15.059 pivoted towards creating, writing, and producing 00:10:15.059 --> 00:10:18.080 her own material. Which brings us to the comeback. 00:10:18.759 --> 00:10:22.100 HBO 2005. This feels like a defining moment. 00:10:22.200 --> 00:10:24.500 It absolutely is. The comeback. She co -created 00:10:24.500 --> 00:10:26.919 it, co -wrote it, and starred as Valerie Cherish, 00:10:27.019 --> 00:10:30.019 a truly unforgettable character. Valerie Cherish. 00:10:30.320 --> 00:10:33.759 The washed -up sitcom actress trying to reignite 00:10:33.759 --> 00:10:37.340 her career via reality TV. It's painfully brilliant. 00:10:37.620 --> 00:10:40.299 Painful is the word. It's this incredibly sharp, 00:10:40.480 --> 00:10:44.580 often uncomfortable satire about... fame, desperation, 00:10:44.960 --> 00:10:48.980 and the, well, the horror of early reality television. 00:10:49.419 --> 00:10:51.639 It feels like her science background is back 00:10:51.639 --> 00:10:54.360 in play here, doesn't it? Observing human behavior 00:10:54.360 --> 00:10:56.340 under the microscope of the camera. Totally. 00:10:56.519 --> 00:10:58.759 It's like she's conducting an experiment on celebrity 00:10:58.759 --> 00:11:01.700 narcissism. Yeah. Using that mockumentary format, 00:11:01.840 --> 00:11:04.120 the camera's always there, always unflinching 00:11:04.120 --> 00:11:07.379 to just observe Valerie's unraveling. Its sociological 00:11:07.379 --> 00:11:10.039 study is cringe comedy. But it didn't quite land 00:11:10.039 --> 00:11:12.120 with audiences initially, did it? Only one season 00:11:12.120 --> 00:11:15.000 back in 2005. No, it was. It was maybe too ahead 00:11:15.000 --> 00:11:17.620 of its time. Too raw, too meta, perhaps. Reality 00:11:17.620 --> 00:11:19.580 TV was still kind of finding its feet and maybe 00:11:19.580 --> 00:11:21.580 audiences weren't ready for a show that implicated 00:11:21.580 --> 00:11:23.639 them in the exploitation. So it got canceled 00:11:23.639 --> 00:11:25.980 after that first run. Yep. Which must have been 00:11:25.980 --> 00:11:28.480 disappointing. But the story doesn't end there, 00:11:28.559 --> 00:11:31.220 which is crucial. Right. The revival. This is 00:11:31.220 --> 00:11:33.879 what cemented its legacy. Exactly. Nine years 00:11:33.879 --> 00:11:37.169 later, nine. HBO brought the comeback back in 00:11:37.169 --> 00:11:39.809 2014 for a second season. And by then, the culture 00:11:39.809 --> 00:11:42.100 had caught up. People got it. Completely. It 00:11:42.100 --> 00:11:45.259 was hailed as this masterpiece. Critics adored 00:11:45.259 --> 00:11:47.840 it. And it really resonated because by 2014, 00:11:48.080 --> 00:11:50.720 we were all deep in that reality TV culture. 00:11:50.919 --> 00:11:53.580 Valerie was navigating back in 05. And it's not 00:11:53.580 --> 00:11:55.419 even done yet, right? There's talk of more. There 00:11:55.419 --> 00:11:57.960 is. A third season was announced supposedly for 00:11:57.960 --> 00:12:01.799 2026. So Valerie Cherish lives on. And importantly, 00:12:02.039 --> 00:12:04.419 this work finally got her Emmy nominations as 00:12:04.419 --> 00:12:07.320 a lead actress in a comedy series twice. That's 00:12:07.320 --> 00:12:09.590 a significant shift. From supporting on Friends 00:12:09.590 --> 00:12:12.409 to lead actress and creator on her own acclaimed 00:12:12.409 --> 00:12:14.490 show. A huge leap. And while she was doing the 00:12:14.490 --> 00:12:16.389 comeback, she was also pioneering something else 00:12:16.389 --> 00:12:19.570 entirely, web content. Web therapy. Okay, this 00:12:19.570 --> 00:12:21.850 started online, right? Way before streaming was 00:12:21.850 --> 00:12:24.710 the norm. Yeah, launched back in 2008 on lstudio 00:12:24.710 --> 00:12:26.889 .com. It was an improvised web series she co 00:12:26.889 --> 00:12:29.009 -created and starred in. Super innovative for 00:12:29.009 --> 00:12:30.909 the time. And the format was key here, these 00:12:30.909 --> 00:12:33.379 really short... therapy sessions. That was the 00:12:33.379 --> 00:12:36.120 genius of it. She played Fiona Wallace, this 00:12:36.120 --> 00:12:38.440 therapist who offered patients therapy sessions 00:12:38.440 --> 00:12:42.190 over iChat. Remember iChat? But only for three 00:12:42.190 --> 00:12:44.309 minutes. Three minutes. That's the whole joke, 00:12:44.309 --> 00:12:46.909 isn't it? The absurdity of trying to do therapy 00:12:46.909 --> 00:12:49.509 that quickly. Exactly. It's inherently comedic. 00:12:49.769 --> 00:12:52.389 Fiona's total lack of patience or self -absorption 00:12:52.389 --> 00:12:55.190 crammed into this impossible time limit. It forced 00:12:55.190 --> 00:12:58.049 incredible improvisational discipline from Kudrow 00:12:58.049 --> 00:13:00.129 and her guest stars. Let's get another analytical 00:13:00.129 --> 00:13:02.450 exercise almost. Setting a strict parameter to 00:13:02.450 --> 00:13:04.750 the three -minute rule and seeing what comedic 00:13:04.750 --> 00:13:07.389 chaos results. Totally. It's observational comedy 00:13:07.389 --> 00:13:09.549 about impatience and... professional arrogance. 00:13:09.870 --> 00:13:12.509 And it worked. It got Webby nominations. Kudrow 00:13:12.509 --> 00:13:14.710 won a Webby for her performance. And it got picked 00:13:14.710 --> 00:13:16.870 up by Showtime eventually. Yeah, they reformatted 00:13:16.870 --> 00:13:19.169 it into a regular half -hour show that ran from 00:13:19.169 --> 00:13:22.350 2011 to 2015. It showed she could create this 00:13:22.350 --> 00:13:25.309 lean, innovative format online and then scale 00:13:25.309 --> 00:13:28.250 it up for premium cable. Very savvy. So she's 00:13:28.250 --> 00:13:31.110 creating these edgy comedies, but her producing 00:13:31.110 --> 00:13:33.610 work goes beyond fiction too, right? Yeah. Into 00:13:33.610 --> 00:13:36.259 something quite serious and historical. Yes, 00:13:36.299 --> 00:13:38.860 through her production company, Is or Isn't Entertainment. 00:13:39.419 --> 00:13:42.360 She's the executive producer for the U .S. version 00:13:42.360 --> 00:13:44.539 of that genealogy show, Who Do You Think You 00:13:44.539 --> 00:13:46.960 Are? Oh, right. Where celebrities trace their 00:13:46.960 --> 00:13:49.820 family histories. Exactly. And her work producing 00:13:49.820 --> 00:13:52.080 that show has been really well regarded. It's 00:13:52.080 --> 00:13:54.759 earned five Emmy nominations for Outstanding 00:13:54.759 --> 00:13:57.320 Structured Reality Program. And she didn't just 00:13:57.320 --> 00:13:59.080 stay behind the camera for that one. She actually 00:13:59.080 --> 00:14:01.600 participated as a subject. She did in the very 00:14:01.600 --> 00:14:04.639 first series. And that led to this incredibly 00:14:04.639 --> 00:14:07.600 profound and quite tragic personal discovery. 00:14:07.919 --> 00:14:09.320 This connects back to her family background. 00:14:09.940 --> 00:14:12.320 Deeply. Through the research for the show, she 00:14:12.320 --> 00:14:14.440 found out that her paternal great grandmother. 00:14:15.289 --> 00:14:17.909 she was murdered during the Holocaust. Oh, wow. 00:14:18.350 --> 00:14:21.509 That's incredibly heavy. Yeah. Her family came 00:14:21.509 --> 00:14:23.549 from a village called Ilia, which is now in Belarus, 00:14:23.830 --> 00:14:26.129 and the records showed that almost all the Jewish 00:14:26.129 --> 00:14:28.450 residents of Ilia, including her great -grandmother, 00:14:28.590 --> 00:14:31.289 were killed by the Nazis. Discovering that on 00:14:31.289 --> 00:14:34.129 camera while producing the show, I can't even 00:14:34.129 --> 00:14:36.970 imagine. It must have been devastating. But it 00:14:36.970 --> 00:14:39.669 also gives her work on that show such a deep... 00:14:39.899 --> 00:14:42.419 personal resonance. It's not just celebrity ancestry. 00:14:42.860 --> 00:14:46.059 It's about uncovering these vital, often painful 00:14:46.059 --> 00:14:49.220 historical truths. It definitely puts her commitment 00:14:49.220 --> 00:14:52.559 to that show and maybe defining substance in 00:14:52.559 --> 00:14:54.720 her projects generally into a different light. 00:14:54.820 --> 00:14:56.779 Absolutely. It connects her analytical side, 00:14:56.980 --> 00:15:00.039 that need for truth and documentation directly 00:15:00.039 --> 00:15:02.539 to her own family's history and this immense 00:15:02.539 --> 00:15:04.600 historical trauma. It really grounds her work. 00:15:05.980 --> 00:15:08.379 Moving towards more recent years, she hasn't 00:15:08.379 --> 00:15:10.960 stopped working or showing that range. She keeps 00:15:10.960 --> 00:15:13.000 popping up in really interesting supporting roles. 00:15:13.179 --> 00:15:15.259 Definitely. She has this great ability to just 00:15:15.259 --> 00:15:17.419 slot into an ensemble and deliver something memorable. 00:15:17.539 --> 00:15:19.720 Think of her in Easy A. Yeah, the guidance counselor. 00:15:19.899 --> 00:15:22.399 Or as the university dean in Neighbors and its 00:15:22.399 --> 00:15:24.539 sequel. Just really solid comedic supporting 00:15:24.539 --> 00:15:28.059 turns, but then also things like the girl on 00:15:28.059 --> 00:15:30.309 the train. Right, the thriller. That was a very 00:15:30.309 --> 00:15:32.409 different register for her. Straight drama, quite 00:15:32.409 --> 00:15:34.789 dark. Exactly. No real comedy there. It showed 00:15:34.789 --> 00:15:37.029 she could still access that purely dramatic side 00:15:37.029 --> 00:15:39.490 effectively. And she's done some great guest 00:15:39.490 --> 00:15:41.889 spots on TV, too. Her role in The Good Place 00:15:41.889 --> 00:15:44.850 was fantastic. Playing Hypatia of Alexandria 00:15:44.850 --> 00:15:48.289 or Patty required that perfect blend of intellectual 00:15:48.289 --> 00:15:51.809 weight and the show's specific comedic sensibility. 00:15:52.029 --> 00:15:54.570 And Space Force with Steve Carell. Yep, playing 00:15:54.570 --> 00:15:57.490 Maggie Naird, his incarcerated wife. Plus, she's 00:15:57.490 --> 00:16:00.090 doing voice work now as Honey the Dog on the 00:16:00.090 --> 00:16:02.629 animated show Housebroken. It seems like even 00:16:02.629 --> 00:16:05.350 when nostalgia calls, like with the Friends reunion, 00:16:05.690 --> 00:16:08.159 she maintains that... producer's perspective 00:16:08.159 --> 00:16:10.899 good point she was an executive producer on friends 00:16:10.899 --> 00:16:15.220 the reunion in 2021 so she had a hand in shaping 00:16:15.220 --> 00:16:17.700 how that massive cultural moment was presented 00:16:17.700 --> 00:16:20.120 not just showing up as phoebe she's also involved 00:16:20.120 --> 00:16:22.379 in that game show 25 words or less yeah she's 00:16:22.379 --> 00:16:24.659 an executive producer on that too and often appears 00:16:24.659 --> 00:16:27.240 as a celebrity guest it shows she's still very 00:16:27.240 --> 00:16:29.120 much involved in the mechanics of television 00:16:29.120 --> 00:16:32.460 production not just performing and most recently 00:16:32.460 --> 00:16:35.620 she starred in a new netflix show That's right. 00:16:35.700 --> 00:16:38.340 No Good Deed, a comedy drama that came out in 00:16:38.340 --> 00:16:41.679 December 2024. She played the main role, Lydia 00:16:41.679 --> 00:16:44.580 Morgan, and got really positive reviews for it. 00:16:44.879 --> 00:16:47.440 Critics highlighted the complexity and restraint 00:16:47.440 --> 00:16:50.519 in her performance. So three decades after Friends 00:16:50.519 --> 00:16:53.340 started, she's still headlining shows and getting 00:16:53.340 --> 00:16:55.820 critical acclaim for challenging roles. That's 00:16:55.820 --> 00:16:57.899 pretty remarkable staying power. It really is. 00:16:57.980 --> 00:17:00.059 No sign of slowing down or becoming irrelevant. 00:17:00.500 --> 00:17:02.399 Let's circle back to her personal life for a 00:17:02.399 --> 00:17:04.619 moment, because it intersected so directly with 00:17:04.619 --> 00:17:07.099 friends in a way that's quite unique. You mean 00:17:07.099 --> 00:17:09.680 her pregnancy? Yeah. She married Michael Stern, 00:17:09.900 --> 00:17:12.640 a French advertising executive, back in 1995. 00:17:12.980 --> 00:17:15.980 And their son, Julian, was born in May 1998. 00:17:16.519 --> 00:17:18.500 And rather than trying to hide her pregnancy 00:17:18.500 --> 00:17:21.099 on friends with, you know... big coats or laundry 00:17:21.099 --> 00:17:23.900 baskets they wrote it in in probably one of the 00:17:23.900 --> 00:17:27.140 most memorable and frankly bizarrely sweet storylines 00:17:27.140 --> 00:17:29.500 the show ever did phoebe becoming a surrogate 00:17:29.500 --> 00:17:32.200 for her half -brother frank jr and his wife alice 00:17:32.200 --> 00:17:35.160 carrying their triplets it was such a wild idea 00:17:35.160 --> 00:17:37.720 but it worked it allowed kudrow's real life to 00:17:37.720 --> 00:17:40.119 become part of the show and it gave phoebe this 00:17:40.119 --> 00:17:45.440 incredible arc of responsibility and uh well 00:17:45.920 --> 00:17:48.880 altruism amidst all the usual quirkiness it really 00:17:48.880 --> 00:17:50.680 deepened the character didn't it showed a different 00:17:50.680 --> 00:17:53.640 dimension absolutely and it speaks to the kind 00:17:53.640 --> 00:17:56.259 of collaborative maybe even family atmosphere 00:17:56.259 --> 00:17:58.539 on that set that they could integrate something 00:17:58.539 --> 00:18:01.480 so personal so seamlessly she's also been quite 00:18:01.480 --> 00:18:04.309 open especially in recent years, about some of 00:18:04.309 --> 00:18:06.490 the personal struggles she faced during that 00:18:06.490 --> 00:18:09.509 intense friends period. Yeah, particularly about 00:18:09.509 --> 00:18:12.450 body image. In 2019, she revealed she'd experienced 00:18:12.450 --> 00:18:14.710 body dysmorphic disorder while she was on the 00:18:14.710 --> 00:18:17.880 show. Wow. That must have been incredibly difficult, 00:18:18.039 --> 00:18:20.299 dealing with that internally while being one 00:18:20.299 --> 00:18:22.559 of the most famous faces on the planet. You imagine 00:18:22.559 --> 00:18:25.099 the pressure, the constant scrutiny. For her 00:18:25.099 --> 00:18:28.059 to talk about BDD openly, it was pretty brave 00:18:28.059 --> 00:18:29.880 and probably helpful for a lot of people. It 00:18:29.880 --> 00:18:32.359 really contrasts with that carefree image Phoebe 00:18:32.359 --> 00:18:35.059 projected. And just to reinforce that point about 00:18:35.059 --> 00:18:36.839 her heritage and the who -do -you -think -you 00:18:36.839 --> 00:18:39.339 -are discovery. It feels central, doesn't it? 00:18:39.380 --> 00:18:41.460 Being raised in a middle -class Jewish family, 00:18:41.619 --> 00:18:44.680 having a bat mitzvah, knowing her ancestors came 00:18:44.680 --> 00:18:46.890 from Belarus. And then finding out about her 00:18:46.890 --> 00:18:49.369 great grandmother's murder in the Holocaust. 00:18:49.769 --> 00:18:51.910 It's not just ancestry. It's bearing witness 00:18:51.910 --> 00:18:54.150 to history. Exactly. And she's talked about how 00:18:54.150 --> 00:18:56.089 that discovery gave her a different perspective, 00:18:56.150 --> 00:18:58.809 a need to ensure those stories, those histories 00:18:58.809 --> 00:19:01.210 are treated with seriousness and authenticity. 00:19:01.470 --> 00:19:04.930 It fuels that drive for substance you see in 00:19:04.930 --> 00:19:07.140 her producing work. So when you pull it all together, 00:19:07.319 --> 00:19:09.119 I mean, the journey is kind of staggering. Yeah. 00:19:09.259 --> 00:19:11.460 From biology researcher focused on headaches. 00:19:11.759 --> 00:19:15.000 To improv comedy star global icon with Phoebe. 00:19:15.180 --> 00:19:17.680 And then reinventing yourself as this creator, 00:19:17.779 --> 00:19:20.779 writer, producer of really challenging, critically 00:19:20.779 --> 00:19:23.900 lauded work like the comeback in Web Therapy. 00:19:23.940 --> 00:19:26.240 It's a testament to this relentless intellectual 00:19:26.240 --> 00:19:29.839 curiosity, I think, and a refusal to be boxed 00:19:29.839 --> 00:19:33.380 in by that one incredibly famous role. That analytical 00:19:33.380 --> 00:19:35.700 mind, the one studying handedness. and headaches, 00:19:35.859 --> 00:19:37.819 it feels like it never switched off. It just 00:19:37.819 --> 00:19:40.200 changed its subject matter. I completely agree. 00:19:40.660 --> 00:19:43.980 She applied the same observational rigor to dissecting 00:19:43.980 --> 00:19:46.640 human behavior, first through the lens of eccentric 00:19:46.640 --> 00:19:49.099 comedy with Phoebe, and then through the much 00:19:49.099 --> 00:19:52.019 sharper satirical lens of Valerie Cherish or 00:19:52.019 --> 00:19:55.180 Fiona Wallace. And what's really striking is 00:19:55.180 --> 00:19:59.019 how she used the power Friends gave her. Not 00:19:59.019 --> 00:20:02.220 just the money, but the influence. She didn't 00:20:02.220 --> 00:20:05.690 play it safe. No, she invested it literally and 00:20:05.690 --> 00:20:07.849 figuratively in making the things she wanted 00:20:07.849 --> 00:20:10.390 to make. Things that were risky, unconventional, 00:20:10.609 --> 00:20:13.190 things that maybe wouldn't have gotten made otherwise. 00:20:13.430 --> 00:20:15.630 She took control of the narrative. Which brings 00:20:15.630 --> 00:20:17.710 us to our final thought for you, the listener, 00:20:17.869 --> 00:20:20.359 to sort of chew on. What does it really tell 00:20:20.359 --> 00:20:22.880 us about success or maybe about creativity when 00:20:22.880 --> 00:20:25.039 someone like Lisa Kudrow, who clearly had the 00:20:25.039 --> 00:20:27.299 chops for serious scientific research, publishing 00:20:27.299 --> 00:20:30.359 work on cluster headaches, takes that same analytical 00:20:30.359 --> 00:20:33.240 brain. That skill for detailed observation. And 00:20:33.240 --> 00:20:35.759 applies it instead to comedy, specifically to 00:20:35.759 --> 00:20:38.000 creating characters like Valerie Cherish or Fiona 00:20:38.000 --> 00:20:40.420 Wallace, who are themselves these intense studies 00:20:40.420 --> 00:20:43.650 in human behavior, vanity, and dysfunction. Is 00:20:43.650 --> 00:20:45.950 there less distance between the scientist observing 00:20:45.950 --> 00:20:49.730 phenomena and the comedian observing human absurdity 00:20:49.730 --> 00:20:52.410 than we think? It feels like with Kudrow, that 00:20:52.410 --> 00:20:54.670 analytical engine was always running, just pointed 00:20:54.670 --> 00:20:56.710 in different directions. A fascinating question 00:20:56.710 --> 00:20:59.670 to ponder. Indeed. Thank you for joining us for 00:20:59.670 --> 00:21:01.690 this deep dive into the surprisingly complex 00:21:01.690 --> 00:21:04.069 world of Lisa Kudrow. We'll see you next time.