WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:03.120 Okay, let's unpack this. When you hear the names 00:00:03.120 --> 00:00:05.419 Tom and Bix Mothers, you know, you immediately 00:00:05.419 --> 00:00:09.320 think folk music, the guitar, the yo -yo maybe, 00:00:09.900 --> 00:00:12.160 and that classic line, right? Mom always liked 00:00:12.160 --> 00:00:15.560 you best. Exactly. The gentle sibling rivalry, 00:00:16.000 --> 00:00:18.320 and of course the big battles with the TV sensors 00:00:18.320 --> 00:00:20.780 back in the late 60s. They really did change 00:00:20.780 --> 00:00:22.719 the game in terms of what you could say, what 00:00:22.719 --> 00:00:24.739 you could show on network television. But here's 00:00:24.739 --> 00:00:27.019 the thing that's always fascinated me. What if 00:00:27.019 --> 00:00:30.199 that whole stage act, that constant bickering, 00:00:30.519 --> 00:00:32.920 wasn't, well, wasn't just an act. What if that 00:00:32.920 --> 00:00:35.159 disagreement, that tension we saw was actually 00:00:35.159 --> 00:00:37.600 real and maybe even the engine driving their 00:00:37.600 --> 00:00:39.840 entire career for decades? That's the core of 00:00:39.840 --> 00:00:42.140 it, isn't it? The comedy, the bickering, the 00:00:42.140 --> 00:00:45.920 way Tom would gently provoke Dick. It seems it 00:00:45.920 --> 00:00:49.060 was rooted in two genuinely fundamentally different 00:00:49.060 --> 00:00:51.659 guys, philosophically different even. Right. 00:00:51.840 --> 00:00:54.479 So our mission today in this deep dive is to 00:00:54.479 --> 00:00:56.759 really dig into that paradox. We've got sources 00:00:56.759 --> 00:00:59.240 covering, I mean, their entire lives and careers. 00:00:59.619 --> 00:01:01.899 Richard Remick Smothers, that's Dick, and Thomas 00:01:01.899 --> 00:01:04.120 Bolland Smothers III, Tom. You know, we'll look 00:01:04.120 --> 00:01:05.840 at their beginnings, obviously, but also the 00:01:05.840 --> 00:01:08.180 stuff they did outside the comedy duo, which 00:01:08.180 --> 00:01:10.060 was surprisingly different for each of them. 00:01:10.400 --> 00:01:14.040 And crucially, how this deep, genuine split between 00:01:14.040 --> 00:01:16.219 them, this philosophical divide, somehow made 00:01:16.219 --> 00:01:19.000 their partnership stronger, not weaker. So this 00:01:19.000 --> 00:01:21.140 is for you, the listener. to kind of grapple 00:01:21.140 --> 00:01:24.760 with this puzzle. How does a duo built on real 00:01:24.760 --> 00:01:27.859 constant disagreement? You've got this outspoken, 00:01:28.019 --> 00:01:30.900 almost radical activist on one side, Tom, and 00:01:30.900 --> 00:01:33.560 then on the other, a more conservative, really 00:01:33.560 --> 00:01:37.219 pragmatic guy. Dick, how do they sustain that 00:01:37.219 --> 00:01:39.459 partnership? Especially when one becomes this 00:01:39.459 --> 00:01:41.739 political symbol and the other, well, he becomes 00:01:41.739 --> 00:01:44.099 a serious actor, even gets into endurance auto 00:01:44.099 --> 00:01:48.140 racing. It's a wild study in compatibility through 00:01:48.140 --> 00:01:51.260 conflict. It really is. And to get there, we 00:01:51.260 --> 00:01:52.760 need to set the stage, understand where they 00:01:52.760 --> 00:01:54.920 came from. Tom, the older one, born February 00:01:54.920 --> 00:02:00.180 2nd, 1937. Dick, November 20th, 1938. Both born 00:02:00.180 --> 00:02:01.900 in New York City, interestingly enough. Oh, I 00:02:01.900 --> 00:02:03.400 didn't realize they were East Coast born. I always 00:02:03.400 --> 00:02:05.349 associate them with California. They got there, 00:02:05.549 --> 00:02:07.890 but yet, born in New York. Their middle name, 00:02:08.189 --> 00:02:10.349 Remick, that comes from their mother Mary's maiden 00:02:10.349 --> 00:02:13.949 name. But the really defining event, the tragedy 00:02:13.949 --> 00:02:16.629 of their early childhood, was losing your father. 00:02:17.449 --> 00:02:21.330 Right. Major Thomas B. Smothers, army officer. 00:02:21.710 --> 00:02:24.430 He died as a prisoner of war. Held by the Japanese 00:02:24.430 --> 00:02:28.490 in the Philippines, died in April 1945. That 00:02:28.490 --> 00:02:32.129 kind of shared, profound loss. happening so early 00:02:32.129 --> 00:02:34.629 in their lives. It must have forged a powerful 00:02:34.629 --> 00:02:37.750 bond, a shared history, even before their personalities 00:02:37.750 --> 00:02:40.169 started diverging so much later. And that history 00:02:40.169 --> 00:02:42.590 eventually led them west. So despite being born 00:02:42.590 --> 00:02:44.110 in New York, they really grew up in Southern 00:02:44.110 --> 00:02:47.830 California, places like Altadena, Tujunga, Redondo 00:02:47.830 --> 00:02:50.069 Beach. Right. They both went to Verdugo Hills 00:02:50.069 --> 00:02:52.560 High School. then graduated from Redondo Union 00:02:52.560 --> 00:02:55.199 High, and eventually both ended up at San Jose 00:02:55.199 --> 00:02:57.419 State University, or San Jose State College, 00:02:57.520 --> 00:02:59.419 as it was called back then. OK, and this is where, 00:02:59.419 --> 00:03:01.120 as you said, the differences start to become 00:03:01.120 --> 00:03:03.479 really visible, even before the comedy. You picture 00:03:03.479 --> 00:03:05.259 them as these gentle folk singers, but they're 00:03:05.259 --> 00:03:08.639 actually serious athletes. Very serious and competitive. 00:03:09.500 --> 00:03:11.479 Dick, the younger brother, the pragmatist -to 00:03:11.479 --> 00:03:14.060 -be, he was focused, a distance runner on the 00:03:14.060 --> 00:03:16.520 track team. And get this, he was coached by Lloyd 00:03:16.520 --> 00:03:19.340 Budwinter, a pretty legendary Olympic coach. 00:03:19.439 --> 00:03:21.479 Wow. Distance running, that takes discipline, 00:03:21.840 --> 00:03:24.300 right? Pacing, consistency, predictable effort. 00:03:24.659 --> 00:03:27.759 Exactly. Very Dick Smothers in retrospect. And 00:03:27.759 --> 00:03:30.740 Tom. Tom was the gymnast. Total opposite, almost. 00:03:30.939 --> 00:03:33.819 Gymnastics requires flair, doesn't it? Acrobatics, 00:03:34.060 --> 00:03:36.240 artistry, a certain element of risk? Absolutely. 00:03:36.680 --> 00:03:38.759 And he was good. He actually tied for first place 00:03:38.759 --> 00:03:41.780 on the parallel bars at the 1958 State College 00:03:41.780 --> 00:03:44.620 Gymnastics Championships. He also pole vaulted. 00:03:44.719 --> 00:03:46.939 So right there, before they even strum a guitar 00:03:46.939 --> 00:03:49.199 on stage together, you've got this perfect duality, 00:03:49.319 --> 00:03:52.199 the steady, measured, runner -dick, and the high 00:03:52.199 --> 00:03:54.500 -flying, maybe slightly unpredictable artist 00:03:54.500 --> 00:03:57.340 -gymnast Tom. It's almost like a blueprint for 00:03:57.340 --> 00:03:59.379 their stage personas, wasn't it? It really feels 00:03:59.379 --> 00:04:01.500 like foreshadowing, yeah. But the path to the 00:04:01.500 --> 00:04:03.699 stage that started with music even earlier. Back 00:04:03.699 --> 00:04:05.919 in high school, they actually sang together in 00:04:05.919 --> 00:04:08.560 the school's magical choir. Get out. Magical 00:04:08.560 --> 00:04:11.139 choir? What parts? Dick was the tenor, hitting 00:04:11.139 --> 00:04:14.080 the higher harmonies. And Tom was the bass, providing 00:04:14.080 --> 00:04:17.319 that foundation. Huh. OK, so music was there 00:04:17.319 --> 00:04:21.120 early, but the folk thing, that came later. Yeah, 00:04:21.120 --> 00:04:23.740 that was the folk boom. They were really inspired, 00:04:23.839 --> 00:04:26.160 apparently, by the huge success of Tom Dooley 00:04:26.160 --> 00:04:28.480 by the Kingston Trio. That song just exploded, 00:04:28.759 --> 00:04:31.699 launched the whole craze. So initially, their 00:04:31.699 --> 00:04:35.769 goal was just be folk musicians. pure and simple. 00:04:36.050 --> 00:04:38.149 Makes sense. And they started playing gigs. Yep. 00:04:38.329 --> 00:04:40.870 After Dick transferred to San Jose State in 57, 00:04:41.189 --> 00:04:43.089 they started performing together at local San 00:04:43.089 --> 00:04:45.930 Jose nightclubs, mostly for college crowds, playing 00:04:45.930 --> 00:04:48.970 the folk songs. OK, so how did the comedy, the 00:04:48.970 --> 00:04:50.970 bickering creep in? This is where it gets interesting. 00:04:51.050 --> 00:04:53.990 The music was, you know, fine. Standard folk 00:04:53.990 --> 00:04:56.709 stuff. But the introductions to the songs. Tom 00:04:56.709 --> 00:04:59.009 started improvising those, just rambling, riffing, 00:04:59.089 --> 00:05:01.310 doing all the talking between numbers. Ah, classic 00:05:01.310 --> 00:05:03.730 Tom. Right. And Dick, being Dick, the practical 00:05:03.730 --> 00:05:07.009 one, saw. Well, he saw potential for structure. 00:05:07.529 --> 00:05:10.029 He suggested, hey, that funny stuff you improvised, 00:05:10.089 --> 00:05:11.850 let's repeat it. Let's make it part of the act. 00:05:12.129 --> 00:05:14.629 OK, so structure meets improvisation. But how 00:05:14.629 --> 00:05:16.990 did it become the argument? Well, according to 00:05:16.990 --> 00:05:19.189 Tom's own recollections later, once he started 00:05:19.189 --> 00:05:21.290 trying to repeat the banter, as Dick suggested, 00:05:21.850 --> 00:05:24.269 Dick's natural straight man instinct just took 00:05:24.269 --> 00:05:27.230 over immediately. The dynamic shifted. Dick started 00:05:27.230 --> 00:05:30.089 correcting him. Just correcting facts, or? It 00:05:30.089 --> 00:05:31.750 apparently went pretty quickly from Dick just 00:05:31.750 --> 00:05:34.629 saying, that's wrong. to the line that became 00:05:34.629 --> 00:05:36.350 their trademark, that's wrong, you're stupid. 00:05:36.870 --> 00:05:39.910 Wow, so that famous dynamic, the core of their 00:05:39.910 --> 00:05:43.149 comedy, it wasn't really scripted initially, 00:05:43.269 --> 00:05:46.629 it just emerged from Dick's genuine need to correct 00:05:46.629 --> 00:05:49.230 Tom's rambling, combined with Tom's willingness 00:05:49.230 --> 00:05:53.399 to, well... Play the fool. Seems like it. That 00:05:53.399 --> 00:05:56.060 improvised argument fueled by Dick's desire for 00:05:56.060 --> 00:05:59.379 order and Tom's creative tangents became the 00:05:59.379 --> 00:06:01.579 central conflict and ultimately the absolute 00:06:01.579 --> 00:06:03.660 winning formula for their whole career. It worked 00:06:03.660 --> 00:06:06.600 pretty fast. Almost instantly. January 1959, 00:06:06.720 --> 00:06:09.040 they get spotted by, of all things, a detective 00:06:09.040 --> 00:06:11.459 manager. Sounds like a movie. Right. Leads to 00:06:11.459 --> 00:06:13.620 an audition at the Purple Union in San Francisco, 00:06:13.740 --> 00:06:15.779 a really famous folk club back then. Yeah. They 00:06:15.779 --> 00:06:17.459 impressed enough that they left San Bay State 00:06:17.459 --> 00:06:19.839 the very next month. Their initial two -week 00:06:19.839 --> 00:06:22.819 contract got extended to 16 weeks. 16 weeks. 00:06:22.959 --> 00:06:24.939 So that was it. They were full -time pros. Never 00:06:24.939 --> 00:06:28.100 looked back. Full -time entertainers from basically 00:06:28.100 --> 00:06:30.740 February 59 onwards. And they started getting 00:06:30.740 --> 00:06:32.920 TV exposure pretty quickly too. Yeah, they got 00:06:32.920 --> 00:06:35.180 their feet wet. Tom was actually a regular on 00:06:35.180 --> 00:06:37.860 the Steve Allen show in 1961, which was huge 00:06:37.860 --> 00:06:40.199 exposure back then. Steve Allen was a giant. 00:06:40.300 --> 00:06:42.660 Definitely. And eventually, that led to them 00:06:42.660 --> 00:06:46.360 getting their own show on CBS. It did. But, and 00:06:46.360 --> 00:06:48.199 this is crucial, it wasn't the show everyone 00:06:48.199 --> 00:06:50.459 remembers. It wasn't the comedy hour. Before 00:06:50.459 --> 00:06:52.740 that groundbreaking counterculture variety show, 00:06:52.939 --> 00:06:55.800 there was, well, there was something else entirely. 00:06:55.980 --> 00:06:58.279 It's something almost nobody remembers. Ah, you're 00:06:58.279 --> 00:07:00.160 talking about the Smothers Brothers show, the 00:07:00.160 --> 00:07:02.800 sitcom. Exactly. The fantasy sitcom. Ran just 00:07:02.800 --> 00:07:06.480 one season, 32 episodes, from September 65 to 00:07:06.480 --> 00:07:10.250 April 66. Friday nights on CBS. It's this really 00:07:10.250 --> 00:07:12.550 bizarre footnote in their career and in TV history, 00:07:12.569 --> 00:07:14.550 frankly. And it had a strange pedigree, too, 00:07:14.610 --> 00:07:16.470 right? Aaron Spelling created it. Yeah, Aaron 00:07:16.470 --> 00:07:19.329 Spelling. Or before Charlie's Angels, before 00:07:19.329 --> 00:07:21.769 Dynasty. And here's another bit of trivia for 00:07:21.769 --> 00:07:24.990 you. Sources say it was the very last CBS sitcom 00:07:24.990 --> 00:07:27.509 filmed entirely in black and white. The network 00:07:27.509 --> 00:07:30.209 went full color in prime time right after. Well, 00:07:30.290 --> 00:07:32.250 OK, but the premise. Let's get into the premise 00:07:32.250 --> 00:07:34.689 because it sounds out there. Oh, it's completely 00:07:34.689 --> 00:07:37.610 surreal. You need to savor the weirdness. Dick 00:07:37.610 --> 00:07:39.850 Smothers played himself, basically. Richard, 00:07:40.269 --> 00:07:42.949 a young, rising executive at a publishing house 00:07:42.949 --> 00:07:45.930 called Pandora Publications. You know, the grounded, 00:07:46.250 --> 00:07:48.829 sensible, career -focused brother. OK, makes 00:07:48.829 --> 00:07:51.110 sense. Very dick. And Tom, what was Tom doing? 00:07:51.490 --> 00:07:54.550 Tom Smothers played Tommy, his brother, who had 00:07:54.550 --> 00:07:57.410 been lost at sea two years earlier, only to return 00:07:57.410 --> 00:07:59.589 to Earth as an apprentice angel. All right, wait. 00:07:59.810 --> 00:08:02.660 An apprentice angel? Yes. an apprentice angel, 00:08:03.079 --> 00:08:04.879 trying to do good deeds on earth so he could 00:08:04.879 --> 00:08:07.579 earn his wings. He got his orders from his boss, 00:08:07.720 --> 00:08:09.980 who was unseen and unheard, just a voice named 00:08:09.980 --> 00:08:13.579 Ralph. Ralph the angel boss. This is peak 60s 00:08:13.579 --> 00:08:17.540 sitcom weirdness. Totally. And naturally, Tom's 00:08:17.540 --> 00:08:19.930 attempts to help people using his, like, Clumsy 00:08:19.930 --> 00:08:22.850 trainee level heavenly powers always went sideways 00:08:22.850 --> 00:08:26.470 Which of course forced dick the straight man 00:08:26.470 --> 00:08:29.449 brother on earth to constantly clean up the messes 00:08:29.449 --> 00:08:32.549 So even in this bizarre fantasy setup, they locked 00:08:32.549 --> 00:08:35.230 right back into their established stage dynamic 00:08:35.230 --> 00:08:38.009 perfectly mirrored it pragmatic brother dick 00:08:38.440 --> 00:08:41.360 dealing with the chaos caused by the idealistic, 00:08:41.720 --> 00:08:44.159 boundary -pushing, slightly inept brother, Tom. 00:08:44.399 --> 00:08:47.320 Except here, Tom's literally got heavenly incompetence. 00:08:47.440 --> 00:08:49.840 The episode titles alone sound wild. You mentioned 00:08:49.840 --> 00:08:51.580 there's something about a sailor that must be 00:08:51.580 --> 00:08:53.539 the pilot where he comes back. That's the one. 00:08:53.639 --> 00:08:55.679 Then you had stuff like You're Only Old Once, 00:08:56.159 --> 00:08:59.340 where Tom magically gets aged 70 years to, I 00:08:59.340 --> 00:09:01.720 guess, relate better to nursing home residents. 00:09:01.879 --> 00:09:04.500 Or Never Trust a Naked Rembrandt, where Angel 00:09:04.500 --> 00:09:06.259 Tom tries to reform a burglar. It's a thing. 00:09:06.639 --> 00:09:08.399 Yeah. But the brothers themselves. They weren't 00:09:08.399 --> 00:09:11.480 happy with this, right? Especially Tom. Miserable. 00:09:11.639 --> 00:09:15.000 Particularly Tom. And that misery, that experience, 00:09:15.620 --> 00:09:18.019 ironically became the catalyst for the revolutionary 00:09:18.019 --> 00:09:20.740 TV they did next. Tom was really critical of 00:09:20.740 --> 00:09:23.580 the show. He felt the whole rigid sitcom format 00:09:23.580 --> 00:09:25.539 just completely stifle what they actually did 00:09:25.539 --> 00:09:28.279 well. The music, the improvisation, the banter. 00:09:28.299 --> 00:09:30.399 They were basically just after saying lines in 00:09:30.399 --> 00:09:33.000 this weird angel plot. Pretty much. And this 00:09:33.000 --> 00:09:35.220 brings up that crucial point about creative control. 00:09:36.039 --> 00:09:38.419 They were stars, sure. but they had no power 00:09:38.419 --> 00:09:41.799 on this show. Tom fought constantly with the 00:09:41.799 --> 00:09:43.860 executives at Four Star Television over the scripts, 00:09:43.919 --> 00:09:46.000 over the direction. And that had real consequences 00:09:46.000 --> 00:09:48.000 for him personally. Oh, yeah. The sources are 00:09:48.000 --> 00:09:50.840 pretty clear. The stress of that fight, the frustration 00:09:50.840 --> 00:09:53.139 of not being able to shape their own show, it 00:09:53.139 --> 00:09:56.779 was so intense that Tom developed an ulcer. And 00:09:56.779 --> 00:09:58.960 it apparently contributed significantly to his 00:09:58.960 --> 00:10:01.220 marriage ending around the time the season wrapped 00:10:01.220 --> 00:10:04.379 up. Wow. just from fighting over an angel sitcom. 00:10:04.759 --> 00:10:07.240 It speaks volumes about how much the creative 00:10:07.240 --> 00:10:10.120 aspect mattered to him, even then, and the artistic 00:10:10.120 --> 00:10:12.820 restrictions were galling. They were told, you're 00:10:12.820 --> 00:10:16.019 actors now, not folk singers. They hardly ever 00:10:16.019 --> 00:10:17.759 played their instruments on this show. Seriously, 00:10:18.039 --> 00:10:19.740 the Smothers Brothers without the guitar and 00:10:19.740 --> 00:10:22.299 bass? Barely featured. And they didn't even sing 00:10:22.299 --> 00:10:24.279 their own theme song until about halfway through 00:10:24.279 --> 00:10:26.639 the season run. That's just wrong. The whole 00:10:26.639 --> 00:10:28.740 experience just solidified something in Tom's 00:10:28.740 --> 00:10:32.179 mind. When the next chance came for a TV show, 00:10:32.250 --> 00:10:34.330 which turned out to be the legendary Smothers 00:10:34.330 --> 00:10:37.809 Brothers comedy hour in 67, there was one thing 00:10:37.809 --> 00:10:42.570 he absolutely insisted on. Non -negotiable. Creative 00:10:42.570 --> 00:10:45.909 control. 100%. He was not going through that 00:10:45.909 --> 00:10:48.549 again. The pain and the ulcer from the Angel 00:10:48.549 --> 00:10:51.490 sitcom directly led to him demanding and getting 00:10:51.490 --> 00:10:54.210 the power to shape their next show. And boy, 00:10:54.250 --> 00:10:56.570 did he shape it. Once he had those reins, he 00:10:56.570 --> 00:10:58.889 drove that comedy hour straight into the thick 00:10:58.889 --> 00:11:01.639 of the culture wars. Right into it the comedy 00:11:01.639 --> 00:11:04.500 hour became this this lightning rod almost immediately 00:11:04.500 --> 00:11:07.519 Because Tom had secured creative control over 00:11:07.519 --> 00:11:10.200 the variety show format They started tackling 00:11:10.200 --> 00:11:12.399 subjects that were just completely off limits 00:11:12.399 --> 00:11:15.600 for primetime TV in the late 60s and not just 00:11:15.600 --> 00:11:18.139 subtly right They were pretty direct. Oh, yeah, 00:11:18.179 --> 00:11:21.379 it wasn't just like edgy jokes hidden away. They 00:11:21.379 --> 00:11:24.399 were dealing with religion making not so veiled 00:11:24.399 --> 00:11:26.960 references to recreational drug use, talking 00:11:26.960 --> 00:11:30.899 about sex, and maybe most explosively criticizing 00:11:30.899 --> 00:11:34.039 the Vietnam War. Which inevitably led to huge 00:11:34.039 --> 00:11:37.299 fights with the network suits, the CBS standards 00:11:37.299 --> 00:11:40.639 and practices department, the censors. that became 00:11:40.639 --> 00:11:43.000 legendary. Relentless conflict. We're talking 00:11:43.000 --> 00:11:45.320 about entire sketches getting cut at the last 00:11:45.320 --> 00:11:47.659 minute, running gags about the censorship itself, 00:11:48.179 --> 00:11:50.019 massive tension behind the scenes between the 00:11:50.019 --> 00:11:52.299 brothers and the network brass. And it all came 00:11:52.299 --> 00:11:54.559 to a head pretty dramatically. It did. The whole 00:11:54.559 --> 00:11:57.580 war culminated in CBS just abruptly canceling 00:11:57.580 --> 00:12:01.000 the show. April 4th, 1969. Show's gone. What 00:12:01.000 --> 00:12:02.700 was the official reason? They couldn't just say, 00:12:02.840 --> 00:12:04.440 you're too political, could they? The network 00:12:04.440 --> 00:12:06.750 claimed it was a breach of contract. said the 00:12:06.750 --> 00:12:08.870 brothers failed to deliver the show tapes early 00:12:08.870 --> 00:12:12.309 enough for review before broadcast. But I mean, 00:12:12.409 --> 00:12:14.230 come on. Everyone knew it was political. The 00:12:14.230 --> 00:12:16.490 show is still hugely popular. Great ratings. 00:12:16.629 --> 00:12:19.090 And the brothers didn't just accept it. No way. 00:12:19.450 --> 00:12:21.649 Tom, especially. They refused to go quietly. 00:12:22.090 --> 00:12:24.730 They filed this massive lawsuit against CBS for 00:12:24.730 --> 00:12:28.600 wrongful termination and significantly. They 00:12:28.600 --> 00:12:33.059 won. They were awarded a settlement of $776 ,300. 00:12:33.440 --> 00:12:36.879 That's a huge sum for back then and winning against 00:12:36.879 --> 00:12:39.039 the network like that. It was a major statement. 00:12:39.259 --> 00:12:42.200 The lawsuit itself, the win, it really solidified 00:12:42.200 --> 00:12:45.490 Tom's image as this, you know, uncompromising 00:12:45.490 --> 00:12:47.750 figure fighting for free speech against the establishment. 00:12:47.789 --> 00:12:50.029 Yeah, I read one critic at the time saying something 00:12:50.029 --> 00:12:52.289 like, the most innovative show on TV was basically 00:12:52.289 --> 00:12:54.870 shut down by political pressure. And Tom himself 00:12:54.870 --> 00:12:56.649 said something interesting later about their 00:12:56.649 --> 00:12:58.950 dynamic. What was that? He admitted that he and 00:12:58.950 --> 00:13:01.070 Dick disagreed on basically everything, even 00:13:01.070 --> 00:13:03.490 politics. But he believed that very disagreement 00:13:03.490 --> 00:13:06.429 was kind of ironically essential to keeping their 00:13:06.429 --> 00:13:09.350 professional partnership going for so long. The 00:13:09.350 --> 00:13:12.789 tension was the act. That internal conflict fueling 00:13:12.789 --> 00:13:16.259 the external comedy. It makes sense. And after 00:13:16.259 --> 00:13:18.480 the cancellation, Tom really leaned into the 00:13:18.480 --> 00:13:20.860 activist role even harder. He said he became 00:13:20.860 --> 00:13:22.639 a kind of poster boy for the First Amendment, 00:13:22.940 --> 00:13:24.960 freedom of speech. But it took a toll on him 00:13:24.960 --> 00:13:28.080 personally. Seems like it. He confessed that 00:13:28.080 --> 00:13:30.480 for about three years after the show got axed, 00:13:30.820 --> 00:13:33.360 he became deadly serious about everything. Said 00:13:33.360 --> 00:13:35.419 he felt like he'd lost his sense of humor entirely, 00:13:35.799 --> 00:13:37.919 just consumed by the political fight. And his 00:13:37.919 --> 00:13:40.259 political stance was pretty clear. Definitely 00:13:40.259 --> 00:13:42.700 left leaning. Oh, absolutely. And very vocal. 00:13:43.179 --> 00:13:45.659 He publicly hammered the Democratic administration 00:13:45.659 --> 00:13:48.059 at the time, specifically President Lyndon B. 00:13:48.139 --> 00:13:51.320 Johnson, over Vietnam policy. He wasn't afraid 00:13:51.320 --> 00:13:54.580 to name names. And this intensity, this willingness 00:13:54.580 --> 00:13:57.879 to call people out. It led to some pretty dramatic 00:13:57.879 --> 00:14:00.240 confrontations, didn't it? Like the famous infant 00:14:00.240 --> 00:14:02.279 with Bill Cosby. Yeah, that's one of the most 00:14:02.279 --> 00:14:04.799 startling anecdotes in Tom's story. The sources 00:14:04.799 --> 00:14:07.519 explain that through the 1970s, time was really 00:14:07.519 --> 00:14:09.840 critical of entertainers he felt weren't using 00:14:09.840 --> 00:14:12.460 their platform to take political stance. He thought 00:14:12.460 --> 00:14:14.820 they should be more engaged. Exactly. And he 00:14:14.820 --> 00:14:17.620 apparently single out Bill Cosby, who was huge 00:14:17.620 --> 00:14:20.159 at the time, for not being more outspoken on 00:14:20.159 --> 00:14:23.610 issues like civil rights. Tom saw Cosby's, you 00:14:23.610 --> 00:14:26.389 know, more mainstream, less confrontational success 00:14:26.389 --> 00:14:29.509 as a kind of silence or even compliance. And 00:14:29.509 --> 00:14:31.669 he said this publicly? He mocked Cosby publicly 00:14:31.669 --> 00:14:33.490 for it. And it wasn't just a passing comment. 00:14:33.590 --> 00:14:35.490 This wasn't like a friendly debate. OK, so how 00:14:35.490 --> 00:14:38.629 bad did it get? According to the accounts, Tom's 00:14:38.629 --> 00:14:42.019 comments really pissed him Cosby off. Deeply. 00:14:42.259 --> 00:14:44.700 The tension just festered for years between them. 00:14:45.080 --> 00:14:47.580 And it finally exploded, physically, at a party 00:14:47.580 --> 00:14:50.919 at the Playboy Mansion in October 1976. Wait, 00:14:51.039 --> 00:14:53.559 physically, you mean? Cosby punched Tom Smothers. 00:14:54.299 --> 00:14:58.179 In the head. Get it! Bill Cosby punched Tom Smothers! 00:14:58.299 --> 00:14:59.659 That's what the sources say. It's a shocking 00:14:59.659 --> 00:15:02.029 moment, right? But it really underscores how 00:15:02.029 --> 00:15:04.470 deeply Tom felt about political engagement. He 00:15:04.470 --> 00:15:06.110 was willing to provoke, willing to call people 00:15:06.110 --> 00:15:08.970 out, even if it led to, well, getting decked 00:15:08.970 --> 00:15:10.870 by one of the biggest stars in the world. He 00:15:10.870 --> 00:15:13.409 was almost embracing that martyr role for his 00:15:13.409 --> 00:15:17.629 ideals. Wow. OK, that that definitely adds a 00:15:17.629 --> 00:15:20.750 layer to the gentle folk comedian image. But. 00:15:20.970 --> 00:15:23.710 His activism wasn't just about arguments and 00:15:23.710 --> 00:15:26.350 getting punched. He also had this really unexpected 00:15:26.350 --> 00:15:28.870 connection to the rock and roll counterculture, 00:15:28.909 --> 00:15:31.190 right? Absolutely, which is fascinating given 00:15:31.190 --> 00:15:33.750 their folk roots. He had this deep connection 00:15:33.750 --> 00:15:36.190 to the protest music scene that was exploding 00:15:36.190 --> 00:15:38.789 then. He was one of the people introducing acts 00:15:38.789 --> 00:15:41.950 at the legendary Monterey Pop Festival in 1967. 00:15:42.210 --> 00:15:44.789 Monterey Pop, that was huge. That gave him serious 00:15:44.789 --> 00:15:47.570 cred with the younger, more radical generation 00:15:47.570 --> 00:15:50.210 and the musicians. For sure, and that credibility 00:15:50.210 --> 00:15:53.009 that... involvement naturally led to him befriending 00:15:53.009 --> 00:15:55.350 John Lennon. The John Lennon. Yep. And this isn't 00:15:55.350 --> 00:15:58.230 just like they met once. If you listen closely 00:15:58.230 --> 00:16:00.289 to the recording of Give Peace a Chance, you 00:16:00.289 --> 00:16:02.429 know, the one recorded live during John and Yoko's 00:16:02.429 --> 00:16:04.789 famous bed in for peace in Montreal. Yeah, iconic 00:16:04.789 --> 00:16:08.110 recording. June 1st, 1969. Tom Smothers is on 00:16:08.110 --> 00:16:10.149 that recording. He's not just in the room. He's 00:16:10.149 --> 00:16:11.929 playing acoustic guitar right alongside John 00:16:11.929 --> 00:16:14.289 Lennon. And you can actually hear Lennon shout 00:16:14.289 --> 00:16:16.860 out his name in the lyrics. No way. I have to 00:16:16.860 --> 00:16:18.879 listen to that again. So he's literally part 00:16:18.879 --> 00:16:22.220 of that massive global peace anthem recorded 00:16:22.220 --> 00:16:24.379 right at the heart of the movement. Placed him 00:16:24.379 --> 00:16:27.019 smack dab in the middle of it. Yeah. A very visible 00:16:27.019 --> 00:16:28.919 participant in the international peace movement 00:16:28.919 --> 00:16:32.179 at a really critical time. It showed his commitment 00:16:32.179 --> 00:16:35.379 went way beyond just fighting CBS. OK, so you've 00:16:35.379 --> 00:16:38.320 got the political firebrand, the Lenin collaborator, 00:16:38.440 --> 00:16:41.909 but then there's also the yo -yo man. Yeah, the 00:16:41.909 --> 00:16:44.409 Yo -Yo Man. Completely different gear. He created 00:16:44.409 --> 00:16:47.370 this comedic character in the late 60s. Totally 00:16:47.370 --> 00:16:50.330 non -speaking, just doing amazing yo -yo tricks 00:16:50.330 --> 00:16:52.289 with his deadpan expression. I remember seeing 00:16:52.289 --> 00:16:54.370 that. It was bizarre, but hilarious. Right. He 00:16:54.370 --> 00:16:56.389 actually trademarked the name Yo -Yo Man and 00:16:56.389 --> 00:16:58.529 used the accolade in their later tours. It was 00:16:58.529 --> 00:17:02.610 almost like this necessary escape hatch. Purely 00:17:02.610 --> 00:17:04.910 visual physical comedy. A break from all the 00:17:04.910 --> 00:17:06.509 intense political and intellectual battles he 00:17:06.509 --> 00:17:09.950 was fighting. Makes sense. A moment of pure nonsensical 00:17:09.950 --> 00:17:12.170 fun. Now, before we move fully over to Dick, 00:17:12.390 --> 00:17:14.390 we absolutely have to talk about the Emmy story. 00:17:14.849 --> 00:17:16.490 Because that feels like the ultimate vindication 00:17:16.490 --> 00:17:19.309 for Tom. Oh, the Emmy story is fantastic. It 00:17:19.309 --> 00:17:22.829 perfectly encapsulates his fight. So, 1969, the 00:17:22.829 --> 00:17:25.269 writing staff of the Smothers Brothers Comedy 00:17:25.269 --> 00:17:28.309 Hour wins the Emmy Award for Outstanding Writing 00:17:28.309 --> 00:17:31.250 in a Comedic Series. Huge achievement. They deserved 00:17:31.250 --> 00:17:33.009 it. The writing was groundbreaking. Totally. 00:17:33.450 --> 00:17:36.410 But Tom. Tom refused to let them put his name 00:17:36.410 --> 00:17:38.589 on the official list of nominees submitted to 00:17:38.589 --> 00:17:40.970 the Academy. Why would he do that? He was the 00:17:40.970 --> 00:17:44.509 star, the driving force. He was afraid. He genuinely 00:17:44.509 --> 00:17:47.750 believed that CBS, who were obviously furious 00:17:47.750 --> 00:17:49.789 with him and had just canceled the show, would 00:17:49.789 --> 00:17:52.650 lean on the Television Academy to deny the writers 00:17:52.650 --> 00:17:55.589 the award if his contentious name was attached 00:17:55.589 --> 00:17:58.039 to it. So he took his own name off to protect 00:17:58.039 --> 00:18:00.140 his writers. Exactly. It was a protest move. 00:18:00.299 --> 00:18:02.720 A statement saying, look, my political dissent 00:18:02.720 --> 00:18:04.660 is so radioactive that I fear they'll punish 00:18:04.660 --> 00:18:07.380 everyone around me. He felt his contribution 00:18:07.380 --> 00:18:09.660 was being effectively erased because of his politics. 00:18:09.880 --> 00:18:12.099 That's incredible self -sacrifice, in a way. 00:18:12.519 --> 00:18:14.839 But the story has a coda, right? A beautiful 00:18:14.839 --> 00:18:17.839 one. Fast forward almost 40 years. 40 years. 00:18:18.119 --> 00:18:21.799 To 2008. The Television Academy finally decides 00:18:21.799 --> 00:18:24.759 to correct the historical record. The award tom... 00:18:24.829 --> 00:18:27.789 a special belated Emmy for his contribution to 00:18:27.789 --> 00:18:31.009 that very writing award back in 69. Wow, after 00:18:31.009 --> 00:18:34.569 all that time. And get this, the person who presented 00:18:34.569 --> 00:18:38.319 him with the honorary Emmy. None other than Steve 00:18:38.319 --> 00:18:40.720 Martin. Steve Martin, why him? Because Steve 00:18:40.720 --> 00:18:43.059 Martin was one of the young, unknown writers 00:18:43.059 --> 00:18:46.259 on that very staff back in 1969 who did get his 00:18:46.259 --> 00:18:48.680 name on the original Emmy. No way. That's perfect. 00:18:48.759 --> 00:18:51.380 Full circle. Absolutely. The establishment, the 00:18:51.380 --> 00:18:53.579 Academy, finally acknowledging the value of the 00:18:53.579 --> 00:18:55.559 work and the person they had effectively tried 00:18:55.559 --> 00:18:58.500 to sideline decades earlier. It's proof you couldn't 00:18:58.500 --> 00:19:00.480 erase his legacy, even by taking his name off 00:19:00.480 --> 00:19:02.819 a list. That's a fantastic story. And outside 00:19:02.819 --> 00:19:05.160 of all that, he also had a vineyard. Yeah, another 00:19:05.160 --> 00:19:08.099 long -term venture. In 1977, he established Remick 00:19:08.099 --> 00:19:10.059 Ridge Vineyards up in Sonoma County, California. 00:19:10.440 --> 00:19:12.039 Named after his mother's maiden name, remember? 00:19:12.339 --> 00:19:14.519 He kept that going for decades, only selling 00:19:14.519 --> 00:19:17.480 it in 2023, not long before he passed. Shows 00:19:17.480 --> 00:19:19.259 that persistence again, whether it was activism, 00:19:19.519 --> 00:19:22.799 comedy, or winemaking. OK, so that's Tom. The 00:19:22.799 --> 00:19:26.460 whirlwind. Activist, gymnast, Emmy protester, 00:19:26.720 --> 00:19:29.920 Lennon's guitarist, yo -yo man, winemaker. To 00:19:29.920 --> 00:19:32.200 really grasp the partnership though, we need 00:19:32.200 --> 00:19:35.359 the other poll. We need Dick. The counterpoint. 00:19:35.500 --> 00:19:37.720 The essential straight man, in life as much as 00:19:37.720 --> 00:19:41.660 on stage. Tom himself nailed it. He described 00:19:41.660 --> 00:19:44.400 Dick as, quote, more conservative politically 00:19:44.400 --> 00:19:47.079 and also as a pragmatist. He's very pragmatic 00:19:47.079 --> 00:19:48.799 and wants everything to line up and put in a 00:19:48.799 --> 00:19:51.900 box. That's the absolute Auntie Tom. And Dick's 00:19:51.900 --> 00:19:53.960 career outside the duo really reflects that, 00:19:53.980 --> 00:19:57.160 doesn't it? He seemed drawn to more structured, 00:19:57.420 --> 00:20:00.519 serious roles. Very much so. While Tom was out 00:20:00.519 --> 00:20:02.400 battling the establishment, Dick was often playing 00:20:02.400 --> 00:20:04.619 establishment figures, or at least working comfortably 00:20:04.619 --> 00:20:06.480 within the system. Look at his serious acting 00:20:06.480 --> 00:20:09.119 roles. Way back in 66, he played Tweedledee in 00:20:09.119 --> 00:20:11.099 a TV movie of Alice Through the Looking Glass. 00:20:11.299 --> 00:20:13.539 OK, maybe not establishment, but definitely structured, 00:20:13.839 --> 00:20:16.109 following a script. Right. But then look later. 00:20:16.450 --> 00:20:19.130 His most striking non -comedic role is probably 00:20:19.130 --> 00:20:22.809 in Martin Scorsese's Casino, the 1995 crime epic. 00:20:23.410 --> 00:20:25.509 Casino. Who did Dick Smothers play in Casino? 00:20:25.789 --> 00:20:28.549 He played Harrison Roberts, a dishonest Nevada 00:20:28.549 --> 00:20:31.849 state senator. It's noted as an uncharacteristically 00:20:31.849 --> 00:20:34.720 serious role for him. Think about that image. 00:20:35.220 --> 00:20:37.680 Dick Smothers, the guy singing folk songs next 00:20:37.680 --> 00:20:40.619 to his goofy brother, playing a corrupt politician 00:20:40.619 --> 00:20:43.759 in a gritty Scorsese gangster film. That's jarring. 00:20:43.859 --> 00:20:46.099 And there was a real -life basis for that character. 00:20:46.319 --> 00:20:48.710 Apparently, yeah. The source has mentioned his 00:20:48.710 --> 00:20:50.930 character, Senator Roberts, and particularly 00:20:50.930 --> 00:20:53.630 some of the dialogue in one key scene were partly 00:20:53.630 --> 00:20:55.609 based on the career of Harry Reid. The Harry 00:20:55.609 --> 00:20:58.630 Reid, former Senate majority leader who used 00:20:58.630 --> 00:21:00.849 to chair the Nevada gaming commission. That's 00:21:00.849 --> 00:21:03.509 the one. So Dick wasn't just playing a generic 00:21:03.509 --> 00:21:06.009 corrupt politician, he was embodying aspects 00:21:06.009 --> 00:21:09.529 of a very real figure within the power structure, 00:21:09.890 --> 00:21:12.250 the very kind of system his brother Tom was constantly 00:21:12.250 --> 00:21:15.259 railing against. Wow. The contrast is incredible. 00:21:15.420 --> 00:21:17.660 And it continued. He later played Judge Harold 00:21:17.660 --> 00:21:20.019 Baker in Stephen Soderbergh's 2009 film, The 00:21:20.019 --> 00:21:22.880 Informant, playing a judge. OK, yeah, a judge 00:21:22.880 --> 00:21:25.019 and a corrupt senator. It's almost like while 00:21:25.019 --> 00:21:27.240 Tom was trying to tear down the system, Dick 00:21:27.240 --> 00:21:29.460 was busy playing roles within it, understanding 00:21:29.460 --> 00:21:31.880 its mechanisms. It's a stunning dissonance when 00:21:31.880 --> 00:21:35.460 you put their paths side by side. Tom's getting 00:21:35.460 --> 00:21:38.440 punched by Cosby over political inaction, playing 00:21:38.440 --> 00:21:41.700 guitar with Lenin for peace. Meanwhile. Dick 00:21:41.700 --> 00:21:44.299 is portraying figures of institutional power 00:21:44.299 --> 00:21:47.220 in major Hollywood films. He seemed comfortable 00:21:47.220 --> 00:21:50.140 with structure, with roles, with the system. 00:21:50.299 --> 00:21:54.380 And that embrace of structure, of rules, of pragmatism, 00:21:54.400 --> 00:21:57.000 it really comes through in his other great passion, 00:21:57.160 --> 00:21:58.779 right? The one that seems totally out of left 00:21:58.779 --> 00:22:01.519 field for a Smothers brother. Auto racing. Auto 00:22:01.519 --> 00:22:03.500 racing. Not just watching, but participating. 00:22:03.940 --> 00:22:06.059 Seriously. Oh, yeah. This is the key differentiator 00:22:06.059 --> 00:22:08.880 for Dick's persona outside the act. He wasn't 00:22:08.880 --> 00:22:11.880 just a casual fan tinkering in his garage. He 00:22:11.880 --> 00:22:14.960 was highly active in amateur auto racing. both 00:22:14.960 --> 00:22:17.579 road racing, which requires finesse and strategy, 00:22:17.779 --> 00:22:20.319 and drag racing, which is about pure power and 00:22:20.319 --> 00:22:22.240 reaction time. And he even had his own team. 00:22:22.400 --> 00:22:24.420 He did. He started this mother's brother's racing 00:22:24.420 --> 00:22:27.670 team. And they were serious contenders. They 00:22:27.670 --> 00:22:29.829 competed properly in three championship seasons 00:22:29.829 --> 00:22:32.970 between 1968 and 1971. Right when the comedy 00:22:32.970 --> 00:22:35.390 hour was exploding and then imploding, he's dealing 00:22:35.390 --> 00:22:37.309 with network censorship fights and managing a 00:22:37.309 --> 00:22:40.170 race team. Apparently so. And he specialized 00:22:40.170 --> 00:22:42.789 in endurance racing, driving high -performance 00:22:42.789 --> 00:22:46.390 cars at famous grueling events like the 12 Hours 00:22:46.390 --> 00:22:49.480 of Sebring. Endurance racing. That seems like 00:22:49.480 --> 00:22:52.359 the ultimate expression of that pragmatic, structured 00:22:52.359 --> 00:22:55.279 personality Tom described. It's not just about 00:22:55.279 --> 00:22:57.660 raw speed. It's about meticulous preparation, 00:22:57.940 --> 00:23:00.460 precision, reliability, following the rules, 00:23:00.880 --> 00:23:03.440 managing resources over a long haul. Absolutely. 00:23:03.579 --> 00:23:06.299 Unlike, say, Tom's high -flying gymnastics, which 00:23:06.299 --> 00:23:08.880 has that element of improvisation and flair, 00:23:09.359 --> 00:23:10.920 endurance racing is about obsessive planning, 00:23:11.259 --> 00:23:13.440 engineering tolerances, pit stop strategies, 00:23:13.700 --> 00:23:15.880 lap times. Everything has to line up perfectly. 00:23:16.140 --> 00:23:18.180 It's the ultimate, put it in a box sport. And 00:23:18.180 --> 00:23:20.039 he took it to the highest level, didn't he? Le 00:23:20.039 --> 00:23:22.440 Mans. He did. The 24 hours of Le Mans in France, 00:23:23.019 --> 00:23:25.039 the absolute pinnacle of endurance racing. He 00:23:25.039 --> 00:23:27.099 competed once. OK, we need the details on that. 00:23:27.200 --> 00:23:29.039 Competing at Le Mans is serious business. What 00:23:29.039 --> 00:23:32.119 happened? It was a major effort. 1972, he drove 00:23:32.119 --> 00:23:34.839 a beast of a car, a Chevrolet Corvette C3 for 00:23:34.839 --> 00:23:37.240 the John Greenwood racing team. He actually co 00:23:37.240 --> 00:23:39.500 -drove with John Greenwood himself, who was a 00:23:39.500 --> 00:23:41.799 legendary Corvette racer. A Corvette at Le Mans. 00:23:41.859 --> 00:23:45.299 What class were they in? the GTS plus 5 .0 class, 00:23:45.859 --> 00:23:48.200 basically the big engine grand touring sports 00:23:48.200 --> 00:23:50.720 cars, serious muscle. And the sources confirmed 00:23:50.720 --> 00:23:53.599 they managed to complete 53 laps of that incredibly 00:23:53.599 --> 00:23:56.859 demanding circuit. 53 laps. OK, but in a 24 hour 00:23:56.859 --> 00:23:59.519 race, that usually means. Yeah, they were ultimately 00:23:59.519 --> 00:24:03.279 classified as DNF did not finish. Ah, so something 00:24:03.279 --> 00:24:06.980 broke or a crash. The records just say DNF, but 00:24:06.980 --> 00:24:09.220 with endurance racing, especially back then, 00:24:09.759 --> 00:24:11.559 mechanical failure on a heavily stressed car 00:24:11.559 --> 00:24:14.119 is the most likely culprit after that many laps. 00:24:14.359 --> 00:24:16.339 Still, just getting there, preparing the car, 00:24:16.599 --> 00:24:18.900 qualifying, completing 53 laps at Le Mans, that 00:24:18.900 --> 00:24:22.099 requires incredible discipline, focus, and, well, 00:24:22.299 --> 00:24:25.269 pragmatism. It's the polar opposite of Tom's 00:24:25.269 --> 00:24:34.950 chaotic, improvised political activism. Now, 00:24:37.890 --> 00:24:39.630 we should also touch on the fact that Dick faced 00:24:39.630 --> 00:24:41.750 his own set of public struggles later in life, 00:24:41.809 --> 00:24:43.450 but they seemed very different in nature from 00:24:43.450 --> 00:24:46.630 Tom's political battles. That's true. While Tom's 00:24:46.630 --> 00:24:49.579 big fights were ideological, against institutions 00:24:49.579 --> 00:24:52.539 like CBS or the government. Dick's later challenges 00:24:52.539 --> 00:24:54.779 were much more personal, tangible. Like what? 00:24:55.079 --> 00:24:57.259 Well, there was a widely reported domestic violence 00:24:57.259 --> 00:25:00.940 incident in 2004 involving his then -wife Denby. 00:25:01.420 --> 00:25:03.440 That led to their divorce being finalized in 00:25:03.440 --> 00:25:06.339 2006. And there seemed to be financial fallout, 00:25:06.619 --> 00:25:09.839 too. Their condo in Florida was later foreclosed 00:25:09.839 --> 00:25:12.299 on and sold for what seemed like a low price, 00:25:12.680 --> 00:25:15.000 suggesting financial strain. And that financial 00:25:15.000 --> 00:25:17.720 pressure became more public later. It did. In 00:25:17.720 --> 00:25:20.740 February 2010, Dick had to file for Chapter 11 00:25:20.740 --> 00:25:23.220 bankruptcy protection. That's a major public 00:25:23.220 --> 00:25:25.839 declaration of financial difficulty. And then, 00:25:25.980 --> 00:25:28.380 adding to it, later that same year, in October 00:25:28.380 --> 00:25:31.500 2010, he publicly announced he didn't diagnose 00:25:31.500 --> 00:25:33.599 with Barrett's esophagus, which is a serious 00:25:33.599 --> 00:25:35.980 precancerous condition. Right. So these are very 00:25:35.980 --> 00:25:38.440 real -world problems. Marriage breakdown, financial 00:25:38.440 --> 00:25:41.539 ruins, serious health issues. It's a stark contrast 00:25:41.539 --> 00:25:43.779 to Tom's fights over censorship or the Vietnam 00:25:43.779 --> 00:25:46.339 War. Exactly. It highlights the different ways 00:25:46.339 --> 00:25:49.059 life seemed to challenge each of them. Tom battled 00:25:49.059 --> 00:25:52.420 abstract powers, censorship, war policy, political 00:25:52.420 --> 00:25:55.559 apathy. Dick grappled with the concrete, often 00:25:55.559 --> 00:25:58.359 harsh realities of personal finance, relationships, 00:25:58.799 --> 00:26:01.150 and health. So we have this incredible picture, 00:26:01.670 --> 00:26:05.269 the activist artist versus the conservative racer, 00:26:05.609 --> 00:26:08.730 a partnership somehow forged and sustained by 00:26:08.730 --> 00:26:11.890 this constant real life contradiction. How did 00:26:11.890 --> 00:26:14.630 their joint story finally wind down? Well, they 00:26:14.630 --> 00:26:16.609 formally announced their retirement from touring 00:26:16.609 --> 00:26:19.529 back in May 2010. They seem to think that was 00:26:19.529 --> 00:26:21.769 genuinely it. But they came back, didn't they, 00:26:21.970 --> 00:26:24.000 briefly? They did. couldn't quite stay away. 00:26:24.200 --> 00:26:27.019 They reunited briefly in 2019, specifically to 00:26:27.019 --> 00:26:29.200 mark the 50th anniversary of The Comedy Hour 00:26:29.200 --> 00:26:31.779 being canceled. A nice symbolic gesture, still 00:26:31.779 --> 00:26:33.900 defiant after all those years. 50 years. And 00:26:33.900 --> 00:26:35.819 they even planned another tour after that. They 00:26:35.819 --> 00:26:38.119 tried. In December 2022, they announced they 00:26:38.119 --> 00:26:39.700 were actually going to go back on the road in 00:26:39.700 --> 00:26:42.849 2023. But sadly, that tour had to be canceled 00:26:42.849 --> 00:26:45.029 before it began. Tom's health was declining. 00:26:45.450 --> 00:26:48.230 Ah, right. And the final chapter for Tom came 00:26:48.230 --> 00:26:51.029 not long after that. Tragically, yes. He had 00:26:51.029 --> 00:26:53.430 announced in July 2023 that he'd been diagnosed 00:26:53.430 --> 00:26:55.690 with stage 2 lung cancer. He passed away from 00:26:55.690 --> 00:26:58.789 the disease on December 26, 2023. He was 86. 00:26:59.390 --> 00:27:01.700 Died at his home in Santa Rosa, California. a 00:27:01.700 --> 00:27:04.240 huge loss for comedy and really for American 00:27:04.240 --> 00:27:07.259 culture. And Dick, how is he doing now? Dick 00:27:07.259 --> 00:27:09.559 Smothers is still with us. As of recent reports, 00:27:09.579 --> 00:27:11.900 he's been living in upstate New York, seems focused 00:27:11.900 --> 00:27:14.460 on family and a more private life. He has six 00:27:14.460 --> 00:27:17.559 children from his various marriages, Dick Jr., 00:27:17.559 --> 00:27:20.680 Andrew, Stephen, Sarah, Susan, and Rimmick. And 00:27:20.680 --> 00:27:24.680 in September 2022, he remarried to Marie Navarroly 00:27:24.680 --> 00:27:27.099 Krupp. So looking back at this whole incredible 00:27:27.099 --> 00:27:29.480 saga, this four decade partnership, it really 00:27:29.480 --> 00:27:31.660 comes back to that insight Tom had, doesn't it? 00:27:31.759 --> 00:27:33.900 About the disagreement being the key. It seems 00:27:33.900 --> 00:27:35.980 to be the core lesson. Tom himself said their 00:27:35.980 --> 00:27:37.539 ability to disagree on literally everything, 00:27:37.960 --> 00:27:40.160 politics, personality, philosophy, hobbies, you 00:27:40.160 --> 00:27:42.599 name it, was somehow crucial to making the act 00:27:42.599 --> 00:27:44.900 work for so long. There were these two opposing 00:27:44.900 --> 00:27:47.720 forces, the artist and the pragmatist. By positive 00:27:47.720 --> 00:27:50.240 and negative poles. Exactly. And maybe they needed 00:27:50.240 --> 00:27:52.700 that tension, that constant push and pull between 00:27:52.700 --> 00:27:55.839 them to create the energy, the spark that made 00:27:55.839 --> 00:27:57.920 the comedy resonate. Like you need tension on 00:27:57.920 --> 00:28:00.220 a guitar string to make music. It really is a 00:28:00.220 --> 00:28:02.180 rare example, isn't it? A partnership that seemed 00:28:02.180 --> 00:28:04.539 to thrive because of conflict, not just in spite 00:28:04.539 --> 00:28:07.059 of it. Absolutely. You had Tom, the dreamer, 00:28:07.079 --> 00:28:10.259 the idealist, chasing the First Amendment, hanging 00:28:10.259 --> 00:28:12.960 out with John Lennon, fighting the power. And 00:28:12.960 --> 00:28:15.740 you had Dick, the grounded one, seeking order 00:28:15.740 --> 00:28:18.279 on the racetrack, playing senators and judges 00:28:18.279 --> 00:28:20.319 in movies, dealing with the practicalities of 00:28:20.319 --> 00:28:23.670 life. Their comedy act was almost just the professional 00:28:23.670 --> 00:28:26.549 stage where they managed that genuine deep -seated 00:28:26.549 --> 00:28:28.809 philosophical friction between them. So just 00:28:28.809 --> 00:28:30.670 to recap the ground we've covered, we went from 00:28:30.670 --> 00:28:33.269 their contrasting athletic roots at San Jose 00:28:33.269 --> 00:28:35.789 State. The gymnast versus the runner. To that 00:28:35.789 --> 00:28:38.630 utterly bizarre apprentice angel sitcom nobody 00:28:38.630 --> 00:28:41.829 remembers. A crucial failure in a way. Then Tom's 00:28:41.829 --> 00:28:43.829 huge battles over censorship, the cancellation, 00:28:44.049 --> 00:28:46.849 the Emmy protests, the political activism, getting 00:28:46.849 --> 00:28:49.630 punched by Cosby, playing on Give Peace a chance. 00:28:49.990 --> 00:28:52.230 While Dick was carving out this serious acting 00:28:52.230 --> 00:28:55.210 career in films like Casino and becoming obsessed 00:28:55.210 --> 00:28:57.250 with the precision of endurance auto racing, 00:28:57.609 --> 00:28:59.970 even competing at Le Mans. Right, the DNF at 00:28:59.970 --> 00:29:02.869 Le Mans. It's just this incredibly rich, almost 00:29:02.869 --> 00:29:06.690 unbelievable narrative of contradiction, all 00:29:06.690 --> 00:29:09.490 wrapped up in one comedy duo. The duality is 00:29:09.490 --> 00:29:12.049 just staggering. It's a remarkable case study 00:29:12.049 --> 00:29:14.789 in how completely different temperaments, different 00:29:14.789 --> 00:29:17.849 worldviews can actually combine to create something 00:29:17.849 --> 00:29:20.509 powerful and lasting, as long as they have some 00:29:20.509 --> 00:29:23.349 kind of structure, like their stage act, to contain 00:29:23.349 --> 00:29:25.890 and channel that fundamental disagreement. Which 00:29:25.890 --> 00:29:28.289 brings us, then, to our final provocative thought 00:29:28.289 --> 00:29:30.750 for you, the listener, to mull over. We know 00:29:30.750 --> 00:29:32.549 their stage humor was built on this premise. 00:29:32.809 --> 00:29:35.130 Tom, the lovable fool, always pushing boundaries, 00:29:35.250 --> 00:29:37.549 getting things wrong, and Dick, the sensible 00:29:37.549 --> 00:29:40.089 straight man, constantly trying to impose order, 00:29:40.269 --> 00:29:42.750 logic, correction. Mom, always like you best. 00:29:43.069 --> 00:29:45.109 The classic setup. But now, knowing what we know 00:29:45.109 --> 00:29:47.670 from all these sources, that Dick genuinely was 00:29:47.670 --> 00:29:49.829 a conservative pragmatist who liked things in 00:29:49.829 --> 00:29:52.269 neat boxes, and Tom genuinely was a boundary 00:29:52.269 --> 00:29:55.250 -pushing liberal -to -radical activist who thrived 00:29:55.250 --> 00:29:59.390 on challenging norms, should we maybe rethink 00:29:59.390 --> 00:30:01.849 how we view their act? You mean see it less as 00:30:01.849 --> 00:30:04.529 just a performed sibling rivalry. Exactly. Should 00:30:04.529 --> 00:30:07.130 we see it less as a simple act and more as a 00:30:07.130 --> 00:30:09.109 highly successful professional management of 00:30:09.109 --> 00:30:11.750 a real deep philosophical conflict between two 00:30:11.750 --> 00:30:14.490 brothers? If their partnership truly was defined 00:30:14.490 --> 00:30:16.849 and maybe even fueled by this constant genuine 00:30:16.849 --> 00:30:19.670 friction, what does their whole career trajectory 00:30:19.670 --> 00:30:21.970 tell us about the nature of compromise or perhaps 00:30:21.970 --> 00:30:23.930 the lack of it in creative partnerships that 00:30:23.930 --> 00:30:24.650 actually endure?