WEBVTT 00:00:11.080 --> 00:00:13.279 Hi everybody, welcome to the Canine Connection 00:00:13.279 --> 00:00:17.039 podcast. So today Lori and I are going to talk 00:00:17.039 --> 00:00:20.579 a little bit about where we're at with what we're 00:00:20.579 --> 00:00:23.559 doing with Stormy and Ever and that I think is 00:00:23.559 --> 00:00:26.579 going to lead us into some additional topics. 00:00:27.519 --> 00:00:31.800 So at my last trial like Lori and our friend 00:00:31.800 --> 00:00:35.859 Deb were saying to me like you know Zesh looks 00:00:35.859 --> 00:00:41.240 like he's really worried about what I think like 00:00:41.240 --> 00:00:43.479 he's feeling pressure from me in essence right 00:00:43.479 --> 00:00:46.659 is that what you would say yeah yeah definitely 00:00:46.659 --> 00:00:51.500 I mean yeah so I'm like Jesus Christ like I don't 00:00:51.500 --> 00:00:54.299 put pressure on him but it doesn't matter what 00:00:54.299 --> 00:00:58.719 I think it matters what he perceives right so 00:00:58.719 --> 00:01:05.120 okay so then um deb made a suggestion of like 00:01:05.120 --> 00:01:07.840 you know just go somewhere go different places 00:01:07.840 --> 00:01:10.239 and just bring him out of the car and have him 00:01:10.239 --> 00:01:14.180 like do some behaviors but i i kind of thought 00:01:14.180 --> 00:01:21.519 a lot about my like just where he was at or how 00:01:21.519 --> 00:01:24.739 i was feeling and i was always feeling lately 00:01:24.739 --> 00:01:28.500 like i'm begging him like i'm dragging him like 00:01:28.500 --> 00:01:32.469 i'm pulling him And I'm like, I don't understand 00:01:32.469 --> 00:01:35.609 that. Like, cause I shape things, I do games, 00:01:35.750 --> 00:01:37.849 whatever. But then I said, all right, let me 00:01:37.849 --> 00:01:40.049 go back and do one of these like foundational 00:01:40.049 --> 00:01:42.590 things, which I've done in the past and taught 00:01:42.590 --> 00:01:45.430 him in the past and see what happens. So basically 00:01:45.430 --> 00:01:49.769 I just walk around my garage and I wait for him 00:01:49.769 --> 00:01:53.790 to offer something. And I had nothing. And I 00:01:53.790 --> 00:01:56.189 was like, all right, nevermind going to new places 00:01:56.189 --> 00:01:59.079 and just being like, okay. do these behaviors 00:01:59.079 --> 00:02:01.180 until he brings it to the table I'm like I got 00:02:01.180 --> 00:02:03.620 nothing here like I can't even start there like 00:02:03.620 --> 00:02:06.620 he's like just standing there walking with his 00:02:06.620 --> 00:02:10.139 head down like I don't know what happened so 00:02:10.139 --> 00:02:15.340 I was like all right so I put I don't know if 00:02:15.340 --> 00:02:18.000 this even makes sense or if he perceives it the 00:02:18.000 --> 00:02:22.979 way I do but I took a bag of treats sealed and 00:02:22.979 --> 00:02:26.479 I took um a toy And I just threw him on the ground. 00:02:26.599 --> 00:02:29.379 And then I walked around, right? And I waited 00:02:29.379 --> 00:02:32.580 and I waited. And eventually he picked up the 00:02:32.580 --> 00:02:35.460 toy and kind of wandered over and looked at me. 00:02:35.520 --> 00:02:39.939 And I immediately went, wow, exploded. We tugged. 00:02:39.939 --> 00:02:42.599 And it was so interesting because in the past, 00:02:42.639 --> 00:02:46.159 I've tried to get him to tug in situations. And 00:02:46.159 --> 00:02:48.919 it always feels coercive. Like it feels like 00:02:48.919 --> 00:02:52.080 I'm like, come on, tug. And eventually he does. 00:02:52.830 --> 00:02:55.689 But even when he's growling and tugging, there's 00:02:55.689 --> 00:02:58.370 still part of me that felt like it was, I don't 00:02:58.370 --> 00:03:01.650 know, like he didn't really, he wasn't 100 % 00:03:01.650 --> 00:03:06.409 into it. Right. This was different. He was tugging. 00:03:06.409 --> 00:03:11.650 He was like, game on. So I did that for a few 00:03:11.650 --> 00:03:14.810 sessions and then it got better and better. Like 00:03:14.810 --> 00:03:17.569 he immediately, he would grab the toy and come 00:03:17.569 --> 00:03:19.909 running up to me. So then I was like, okay, grab 00:03:19.909 --> 00:03:23.330 the toy. Now I waited for him to like jump on 00:03:23.330 --> 00:03:27.550 me and push me. And then one day he went to the 00:03:27.550 --> 00:03:29.909 treats and he was sniffing the treats and sniffing 00:03:29.909 --> 00:03:31.830 the treats. So that said to me, he wants the 00:03:31.830 --> 00:03:34.169 treat, but I'm like, well, you have to do something. 00:03:34.889 --> 00:03:37.449 You have to, like, be more clear. Like, tell 00:03:37.449 --> 00:03:40.509 me you want the treat. Like, do something. Right. 00:03:40.610 --> 00:03:42.949 So he looked at me. I looked at him. I looked 00:03:42.949 --> 00:03:44.629 at the treat. I looked at him. I looked at the 00:03:44.629 --> 00:03:46.530 treat. Like, you can have the treat, but you 00:03:46.530 --> 00:03:49.750 got to do something. But I didn't cue him. I 00:03:49.750 --> 00:03:52.189 didn't say, what can you do? I didn't do my usual 00:03:52.189 --> 00:03:54.689 thing where I stand up really tall because that's 00:03:54.689 --> 00:03:58.830 a cue. I just controlled myself and did nothing. 00:03:59.870 --> 00:04:03.289 I think it's also super important. I should backtrack. 00:04:03.979 --> 00:04:08.460 Like when I was doing this, I went into my garage 00:04:08.460 --> 00:04:10.539 and I was like, I could be out here for an hour. 00:04:10.639 --> 00:04:14.080 That's fine. I can't get annoyed or frustrated 00:04:14.080 --> 00:04:17.839 because I created this. So I was perfectly content 00:04:17.839 --> 00:04:21.079 to wander aimlessly in a circle for as long as 00:04:21.079 --> 00:04:24.379 I needed to without getting frustrated, without 00:04:24.379 --> 00:04:27.579 getting annoyed, without trying to manipulate 00:04:27.579 --> 00:04:32.579 the situation, like look at him or. do something 00:04:32.579 --> 00:04:38.160 that is the hardest part as a human yeah the 00:04:38.160 --> 00:04:42.139 control piece yeah to do nothing right and just 00:04:42.139 --> 00:04:46.660 wait for them yes yes well that's the thing like 00:04:46.660 --> 00:04:50.339 um just so people who are listening can kind 00:04:50.339 --> 00:04:54.079 of get a little bit of a visual on it like It's 00:04:54.079 --> 00:04:57.360 easy enough for us to pull a dog out and we like 00:04:57.360 --> 00:05:00.100 that word manipulate. That's a perfect word. 00:05:00.199 --> 00:05:05.199 Like we can sort of create behavior. We can manipulate 00:05:05.199 --> 00:05:07.879 the situation. We could be the ones to be pressing 00:05:07.879 --> 00:05:10.920 the start button on the engine. But we really 00:05:10.920 --> 00:05:13.959 want like that activation to come from the dog, 00:05:14.019 --> 00:05:17.220 right? Like we want it like we want to be the 00:05:17.220 --> 00:05:21.240 ones who are absolutely not initiating. And we 00:05:21.240 --> 00:05:24.300 want the dogs to be almost activating and pushing 00:05:24.300 --> 00:05:28.120 us. Let's do the thing, even if it is for the 00:05:28.120 --> 00:05:30.180 motivator, even if it's for the bag of treats 00:05:30.180 --> 00:05:32.540 on the ground or the toy on the floor. Like we 00:05:32.540 --> 00:05:36.620 want them to be pushing to do something to get 00:05:36.620 --> 00:05:42.199 the motivator. Right. Right. So and and I didn't 00:05:42.199 --> 00:05:44.800 train him. I should also say that I didn't do 00:05:44.800 --> 00:05:48.319 competition behaviors for however many days. 00:05:48.560 --> 00:05:54.379 I just wanted to work on this piece, right? Because 00:05:54.379 --> 00:05:56.980 I felt like if I started to add behaviors and 00:05:56.980 --> 00:05:59.839 that would add pressure, right? From his end. 00:06:00.889 --> 00:06:03.689 which i didn't want so we just got to where we 00:06:03.689 --> 00:06:06.670 were playing freely and if he wanted a cookie 00:06:06.670 --> 00:06:09.730 he would offer me some behaviors and then i would 00:06:09.730 --> 00:06:12.009 give him some cookies but i wouldn't just hand 00:06:12.009 --> 00:06:14.750 him cookies i made it super fun i was like ready 00:06:14.750 --> 00:06:17.170 ready ready which way this way that way toss 00:06:17.170 --> 00:06:20.389 a cookie made it like super exciting right and 00:06:20.389 --> 00:06:23.050 then i put it down i turn my back to him walk 00:06:23.050 --> 00:06:27.569 away and go in a circle and so more very quickly 00:06:27.569 --> 00:06:30.410 because he does have a history if your dog has 00:06:30.410 --> 00:06:32.589 zero history with this it's gonna the process 00:06:32.589 --> 00:06:37.089 is gonna take much longer right but he has a 00:06:37.089 --> 00:06:41.389 history so pretty quickly I'd go out in the garage 00:06:41.389 --> 00:06:43.990 and he'd immediately like pick up a toy start 00:06:43.990 --> 00:06:47.389 pushing me or indicate he wanted a treat start 00:06:47.389 --> 00:06:50.870 offering behaviors fine so then I just threw 00:06:50.870 --> 00:06:54.350 a couple little obedience oh then then what I 00:06:54.350 --> 00:06:58.769 did was I put those, the toy and the food down. 00:06:58.829 --> 00:07:01.589 And I also put a dumbbell down and a glove down. 00:07:01.629 --> 00:07:03.810 I just scattered it around. And pretty quickly 00:07:03.810 --> 00:07:06.089 he started running and like grabbing the dumbbell 00:07:06.089 --> 00:07:08.949 and bouncing in front of me or grabbing the glove 00:07:08.949 --> 00:07:11.209 and running up to me. And then I'd go, yes. And 00:07:11.209 --> 00:07:14.110 then he would get whatever, whichever reinforcer 00:07:14.110 --> 00:07:19.540 he wanted. But again, his choice, I didn't look 00:07:19.540 --> 00:07:22.680 at the stuff. I didn't say go get it. I just 00:07:22.680 --> 00:07:26.699 it was just there. I wanted him to pick it because 00:07:26.699 --> 00:07:29.100 I feel like he's got some baggage with those 00:07:29.100 --> 00:07:34.579 two exercises. So then when that was all going 00:07:34.579 --> 00:07:38.079 really well, I was like, OK, like, let me just 00:07:38.079 --> 00:07:40.500 throw the dumbbell. So I threw the dumbbell. 00:07:40.540 --> 00:07:42.480 I think I have this on video. I'm going to post 00:07:42.480 --> 00:07:47.889 it. He ran out to get it. And then. fucking labs 00:07:47.889 --> 00:07:52.189 there was a piece of the matting because i had 00:07:52.189 --> 00:07:55.449 just finished putting the mat down and he thought 00:07:55.449 --> 00:07:58.129 it was a treat so he leaves the dumbbell he runs 00:07:58.129 --> 00:08:02.589 and goes to the mat now what did i do nothing 00:08:02.589 --> 00:08:09.550 because i felt like if i said no i said go get 00:08:09.550 --> 00:08:14.509 the dumbbell guess what we're back to me running 00:08:14.509 --> 00:08:18.439 the show And now we're not offering. Right. Right. 00:08:18.439 --> 00:08:21.000 So I just walked over, picked up the dumbbell 00:08:21.000 --> 00:08:25.699 myself, like a good human retriever and told 00:08:25.699 --> 00:08:28.879 him, dude, that's the mat. Don't eat that, please. 00:08:31.980 --> 00:08:35.379 Put everything started over, let him offer again, 00:08:35.559 --> 00:08:39.240 whatever. Got to the point, got the dumbbell 00:08:39.240 --> 00:08:43.559 through it, ran out, ramp, beautiful, like. beautiful, 00:08:43.700 --> 00:08:48.340 beautiful. Yes. No front, no finish tug. I was 00:08:48.340 --> 00:08:53.940 done. Um, so then the other day I did it in the 00:08:53.940 --> 00:08:56.460 morning, kind of as like a refresher, like here's 00:08:56.460 --> 00:08:58.440 the toy, you know, let's do our little game. 00:08:58.980 --> 00:09:02.419 Then I went to the Lowe's and I was like, okay, 00:09:02.419 --> 00:09:05.559 if he decides to do it, he'll do it. If he doesn't, 00:09:05.559 --> 00:09:09.879 he doesn't, he gets to choose. Right. So, um, 00:09:10.080 --> 00:09:13.500 I brought him out of the car. had the stuff on 00:09:13.500 --> 00:09:16.820 the floor already on the ground outside. I was 00:09:16.820 --> 00:09:19.019 actually outside the store because I felt inside, 00:09:19.100 --> 00:09:21.019 you know, I wanted to do a little bit easier. 00:09:21.820 --> 00:09:24.120 And then I just walked him there and I stood 00:09:24.120 --> 00:09:27.039 there and I let him look around. I let him sniff, 00:09:27.240 --> 00:09:30.940 whatever, do his own acclimation. And I did nothing. 00:09:30.960 --> 00:09:34.559 And I just waited. And then relatively quickly, 00:09:34.559 --> 00:09:38.899 he started engaging and doing the whole game 00:09:38.899 --> 00:09:43.389 thing. So and then that was it. I just left. 00:09:43.590 --> 00:09:46.330 I wasn't like, oh, well, good. Let me do more. 00:09:46.549 --> 00:09:48.750 I was like, oh, good. He did it here. That's 00:09:48.750 --> 00:09:53.389 awesome. I left. So then it was super interesting. 00:09:53.590 --> 00:09:57.269 I had my training with my two training partners. 00:09:59.019 --> 00:10:03.600 So I went in there and he and they understand. 00:10:03.720 --> 00:10:06.240 I explained this is what I'm doing. I'm not training 00:10:06.240 --> 00:10:09.340 Zaina. I may not be doing any exercises when 00:10:09.340 --> 00:10:12.059 it's my turn. We just might be standing here 00:10:12.059 --> 00:10:18.340 for a while. And it took him a really while before 00:10:18.340 --> 00:10:22.179 he picked up his toy. And once he did, I did 00:10:22.179 --> 00:10:24.679 a really good tugging game. And then I just put 00:10:24.679 --> 00:10:28.649 him away because it took him a while. Yeah. So 00:10:28.649 --> 00:10:32.190 I felt like we're just going to play. So then 00:10:32.190 --> 00:10:35.590 it was my turn again. He came out once or twice. 00:10:35.590 --> 00:10:41.330 He came out relatively quickly, got going again. 00:10:41.429 --> 00:10:43.669 We just did some play. I'm trying to remember 00:10:43.669 --> 00:10:46.629 if I even did any exercises at all. Probably 00:10:46.629 --> 00:10:52.830 not. One time he came out and he just. was sniffing 00:10:52.830 --> 00:10:55.990 the ground and my training partner's like he's 00:10:55.990 --> 00:10:58.750 just displacing like he's not really there's 00:10:58.750 --> 00:11:01.730 nothing out here like so we just let him for 00:11:01.730 --> 00:11:04.309 a little bit and he didn't check in I just put 00:11:04.309 --> 00:11:08.090 him away not as a punishment but like he clearly 00:11:08.090 --> 00:11:12.950 in that moment was not choosing right to work 00:11:12.950 --> 00:11:18.759 right like He was choosing not to. So if I waited 00:11:18.759 --> 00:11:21.539 and waited or forced it again, what am I doing? 00:11:21.659 --> 00:11:25.299 I'm forcing the issue, right? So I put him away. 00:11:25.639 --> 00:11:28.340 I didn't say naughty dog. I just said, okay, 00:11:28.399 --> 00:11:31.720 buddy, go in your crate. There you go. You know, 00:11:31.779 --> 00:11:36.899 you get to choose, right? Skipped his turn, took 00:11:36.899 --> 00:11:40.269 him back out. He came out, ran right for his 00:11:40.269 --> 00:11:43.269 toy, started tugging right away. And I think 00:11:43.269 --> 00:11:45.169 part of it, too, is he has to put it together. 00:11:45.269 --> 00:11:48.750 And he's probably in that environment. I've probably 00:11:48.750 --> 00:11:52.629 at some point, clearly, not probably, I shifted 00:11:52.629 --> 00:11:55.750 the relationship inadvertently. Right. Right. 00:11:55.850 --> 00:11:59.590 And so he has a stronger, like, whatever feelings 00:11:59.590 --> 00:12:03.909 there. But I still felt like overall it was a 00:12:03.909 --> 00:12:09.639 success. And then yesterday. We went, I went 00:12:09.639 --> 00:12:12.740 to a different training building. It was me and 00:12:12.740 --> 00:12:18.039 three other people. And I was like, I had Zaina. 00:12:18.059 --> 00:12:19.980 So I'm like, if he doesn't want to work, he doesn't, 00:12:19.980 --> 00:12:23.179 you know, he doesn't have to. So I got in a little 00:12:23.179 --> 00:12:25.700 bit ahead of them, put my stuff on the floor, 00:12:25.940 --> 00:12:28.159 let him look around. He's been in this building 00:12:28.159 --> 00:12:31.100 before, but whatever. And then pretty quickly 00:12:31.100 --> 00:12:33.879 he picked up his toy, which. I should even say 00:12:33.879 --> 00:12:36.360 the fact that he's choosing his toy over food. 00:12:36.460 --> 00:12:38.480 Like I tried to get him to choose his toy over 00:12:38.480 --> 00:12:42.340 food. He never would again because I was trying. 00:12:42.639 --> 00:12:47.919 Yeah. It's so fascinating that now more like 00:12:47.919 --> 00:12:51.539 80 % of the time he's choosing his toy over the 00:12:51.539 --> 00:12:55.279 food, which if you know him is a miracle because 00:12:55.279 --> 00:13:01.169 he's obsessed with food. Right. So pick the toy. 00:13:01.409 --> 00:13:06.950 We tugged. And, you know, he picked the dumbbell 00:13:06.950 --> 00:13:08.730 and the glove off the floor and he was like, 00:13:08.769 --> 00:13:12.629 let's go, let's work. And I was like, OK, put 00:13:12.629 --> 00:13:15.330 him in his crate. So we start training. It's 00:13:15.330 --> 00:13:17.730 my turn. I take him out of the crate. I wait. 00:13:17.809 --> 00:13:19.590 I'm like, if he doesn't pick something, I'll 00:13:19.590 --> 00:13:22.450 put him back and take Santa. No, he wanted to 00:13:22.450 --> 00:13:25.110 work. And then he started throwing himself into 00:13:25.110 --> 00:13:28.200 heel position and bouncing like crazy. So I'm 00:13:28.200 --> 00:13:29.960 like, all right, let's see what you can do. So 00:13:29.960 --> 00:13:33.279 I didn't say I didn't even pre -cue my ring entrance 00:13:33.279 --> 00:13:36.440 because I'm standing in front of it. He's smart. 00:13:36.639 --> 00:13:39.980 He's done this a million times. He knows. I didn't 00:13:39.980 --> 00:13:43.519 even say it. I just leaned and he started bouncing 00:13:43.519 --> 00:13:47.279 and I went in. And then I didn't give him my 00:13:47.279 --> 00:13:50.039 transition pre -cue. I just leaned forward like, 00:13:50.159 --> 00:13:53.720 are you good? Can we go? And he's like, let's 00:13:53.720 --> 00:14:00.179 go. Right. Um, I, for whatever exercise we did, 00:14:00.259 --> 00:14:02.940 I didn't even do my pre -cues or my usual like 00:14:02.940 --> 00:14:06.519 bounce, bounce, bounce. I just did nothing. He 00:14:06.519 --> 00:14:09.360 started bouncing and then I just did my pivot, 00:14:09.460 --> 00:14:12.639 sent them. And then for everything, I just yessed 00:14:12.639 --> 00:14:16.120 it. No fronts, no finishes. I had cookies on 00:14:16.120 --> 00:14:19.019 me, which I usually don't, which I know kind 00:14:19.019 --> 00:14:21.320 of changes the situation a little, but for the 00:14:21.320 --> 00:14:25.279 step I'm at, I didn't care. Like, cause I just 00:14:25.279 --> 00:14:29.460 want him to offer, get rewarded for offering 00:14:29.460 --> 00:14:34.460 and be happy. And I think he came out every single 00:14:34.460 --> 00:14:37.379 time. I think one time he came out and acted 00:14:37.379 --> 00:14:40.580 weird and I just put him back in his crate and 00:14:40.580 --> 00:14:44.700 took Zaina out. Yep. Did her. Then when it was 00:14:44.700 --> 00:14:47.220 Zaina's turn, I said, okay, you can have another 00:14:47.220 --> 00:14:49.080 chance. If you don't want to, you don't have 00:14:49.080 --> 00:14:50.500 to. If you want to, he comes out, he's like, 00:14:50.559 --> 00:14:59.029 grabs the toy. He's like, let's go. um so i think 00:14:59.029 --> 00:15:05.029 over time i'm gonna i want to start without having 00:15:05.029 --> 00:15:07.610 the food and toy out that'll be the next step 00:15:07.610 --> 00:15:11.649 i think and i'm making this up as i go right 00:15:11.649 --> 00:15:15.710 and see if he chooses and offers and then i'll 00:15:15.710 --> 00:15:20.009 present and let him pick maybe right um which 00:15:20.009 --> 00:15:23.129 he want you know which one he wants I know in 00:15:23.129 --> 00:15:25.990 the past, sometimes like I've trained and said, 00:15:26.149 --> 00:15:29.309 toy, you're getting your toy. And he goes, I 00:15:29.309 --> 00:15:31.370 don't want the toy. And I'm like, you're getting 00:15:31.370 --> 00:15:34.309 the toy. Cause I marked toy and I want you to, 00:15:34.330 --> 00:15:36.830 I'm not going to do that. I'm not like, I think 00:15:36.830 --> 00:15:40.330 at one point I wanted to give him a toy and he 00:15:40.330 --> 00:15:42.309 was like, no, I said, okay, here's food. Like 00:15:42.309 --> 00:15:44.250 no argument. You want food? You can have food. 00:15:44.269 --> 00:15:47.080 I don't care here. Yeah. Yep. Yep. Yep. Because, 00:15:47.100 --> 00:15:50.240 again, that would be me saying, I want to reward 00:15:50.240 --> 00:15:53.500 you with a toy. And he's like, but I want food 00:15:53.500 --> 00:15:56.460 and I would rather have food. So I'm like, fine. 00:15:56.600 --> 00:15:59.120 You want food? You can have food. Yeah. You did 00:15:59.120 --> 00:16:02.240 your job. Yeah. And I've gotten that, too, sometimes 00:16:02.240 --> 00:16:07.899 with, like, I say game. So, like, if that's going 00:16:07.899 --> 00:16:11.750 to be their reinforcer, I go game. And they're 00:16:11.750 --> 00:16:14.450 supposed to look on the floor or they know I'm 00:16:14.450 --> 00:16:17.570 going to give them their toy. And if they opt 00:16:17.570 --> 00:16:21.730 out, it's kind of a tricky thing. If they opt 00:16:21.730 --> 00:16:24.409 out and they're like, well, I can clearly see 00:16:24.409 --> 00:16:26.529 like they're like, yeah, I don't really want 00:16:26.529 --> 00:16:30.950 that hand over the cookies. Then I go, you don't 00:16:30.950 --> 00:16:33.710 want your game? All right, let's put, I just 00:16:33.710 --> 00:16:36.610 put them away because I get a little, like, I 00:16:36.610 --> 00:16:41.279 don't, that gets a little tricky because. I get 00:16:41.279 --> 00:16:42.759 what you're saying. Like, you don't want to put 00:16:42.759 --> 00:16:46.019 more pressure on. Like, you must have this. This 00:16:46.019 --> 00:16:48.340 is your reinforcer. But at the end of the day, 00:16:48.360 --> 00:16:51.279 too, like, I don't want them calling shots on 00:16:51.279 --> 00:16:55.179 what reinforcer they get. You know what I mean? 00:16:56.059 --> 00:17:00.399 So I keep it very, like, I just go, oh, all right, 00:17:00.399 --> 00:17:02.429 you don't want it? You sure? Game? And they're 00:17:02.429 --> 00:17:04.349 like, no, I want food. And I go, all right, well, 00:17:04.410 --> 00:17:06.349 let's just go put you away. And maybe next time 00:17:06.349 --> 00:17:08.109 you play your game, I just put them in. That's 00:17:08.109 --> 00:17:10.130 what I do. I've done that with him. And then 00:17:10.130 --> 00:17:12.910 he just gets sucky and he doesn't. But I also 00:17:12.910 --> 00:17:19.069 think in fairness with him, because as a young 00:17:19.069 --> 00:17:23.890 dog, he was so high and his high and his tugging 00:17:23.890 --> 00:17:28.759 would turn into aggression very quickly. I didn't 00:17:28.759 --> 00:17:32.380 do the toy a lot. I minimized it. And I didn't 00:17:32.380 --> 00:17:36.779 have separate markers early on. And with certain 00:17:36.779 --> 00:17:40.160 exercises, I paired more with a toy and certain 00:17:40.160 --> 00:17:43.319 more with a food. And he definitely has developed 00:17:43.319 --> 00:17:47.059 very specific expectations. Like in this situation, 00:17:47.440 --> 00:17:50.599 you've always given me food. Therefore, that's 00:17:50.599 --> 00:17:55.460 what I expect and want. It's kind of like a patterned 00:17:55.460 --> 00:18:00.240 reinforcement history. So in that case, I feel 00:18:00.240 --> 00:18:03.500 like it's my fault. I think that eventually, 00:18:04.200 --> 00:18:10.839 I think that in his case, I'm letting him choose 00:18:10.839 --> 00:18:16.740 just because I'm trying to overall give him agency 00:18:16.740 --> 00:18:20.079 and choice. Do you know what I'm saying? I want 00:18:20.079 --> 00:18:22.900 him to think right now that everything is his 00:18:22.900 --> 00:18:27.259 idea. Right. And then I might change later if 00:18:27.259 --> 00:18:29.940 the relationship is changed. You know what I 00:18:29.940 --> 00:18:33.680 mean? Like then, like if you wanted to change 00:18:33.680 --> 00:18:36.059 that up and work on that, because it's something 00:18:36.059 --> 00:18:39.460 I'm always trying to work on too. I don't, that's 00:18:39.460 --> 00:18:41.730 a whole nother episode, but. You could do it 00:18:41.730 --> 00:18:43.950 outside of your obedience stuff. You know what 00:18:43.950 --> 00:18:46.650 I mean? Like you could do it in other things 00:18:46.650 --> 00:18:49.710 to work on that aspect. But I totally get what 00:18:49.710 --> 00:18:51.650 you're saying. Like you want that empowerment 00:18:51.650 --> 00:18:55.990 feeling for him. Right now, right? And what was 00:18:55.990 --> 00:19:01.130 pretty profound to me is that my training partner, 00:19:01.250 --> 00:19:03.650 one of my training partners said to me yesterday, 00:19:03.930 --> 00:19:10.839 she said, he looks. she at the end of the training 00:19:10.839 --> 00:19:13.400 session she goes oh my god what a difference 00:19:13.400 --> 00:19:17.279 he looks completely different his body looks 00:19:17.279 --> 00:19:22.640 different yeah he looks more his whole body looks 00:19:22.640 --> 00:19:28.980 more relaxed yeah yeah so that was um you know 00:19:28.980 --> 00:19:33.619 i was like wow so you know it's she's notice 00:19:33.619 --> 00:19:38.559 it it's noticeable to someone else So right now, 00:19:38.799 --> 00:19:41.700 yeah, I'm doing things that I might not do if 00:19:41.700 --> 00:19:44.660 I started a dog or I might not do in certain 00:19:44.660 --> 00:19:48.500 situations. I'm doing things purposefully now. 00:19:49.359 --> 00:19:52.799 Like at one point I did a front and his front 00:19:52.799 --> 00:19:55.779 was crooked. I didn't say anything. I just let 00:19:55.779 --> 00:20:01.380 it go because right now I don't want to say, 00:20:01.480 --> 00:20:05.240 don't, you know, fix it. I will at some point. 00:20:06.190 --> 00:20:09.890 But right now I just, I'm working on, I just 00:20:09.890 --> 00:20:17.849 want him to feel good and feel free. And just, 00:20:17.990 --> 00:20:21.609 yeah, I just need to shift the work relationship 00:20:21.609 --> 00:20:24.349 because I don't have this. So Debra mentioned 00:20:24.349 --> 00:20:26.930 like, you know, when she goes on a hike, she 00:20:26.930 --> 00:20:30.089 has them offer engagement. When I hike, like 00:20:30.089 --> 00:20:32.589 it's been annoying. He's been doing this for 00:20:32.589 --> 00:20:39.559 like a month where, I, when, when I hike, I'm 00:20:39.559 --> 00:20:42.359 on like these trails that have roots and rocks 00:20:42.359 --> 00:20:45.299 and there, I got to look where I'm going. He 00:20:45.299 --> 00:20:48.579 runs in front of me, walks backwards with his 00:20:48.579 --> 00:20:52.579 toy. And he's like, and he wants me to like interact 00:20:52.579 --> 00:20:55.640 with him. So then I have to like play with him 00:20:55.640 --> 00:20:57.920 and then I'm like, go. And then he runs. And 00:20:57.920 --> 00:21:01.380 then like 10 minutes later, he's back doing it 00:21:01.380 --> 00:21:04.700 again over. And he's staring at me in my eyeballs. 00:21:05.339 --> 00:21:10.890 Right. Yeah. So in that scenario, I don't have 00:21:10.890 --> 00:21:15.789 that issue. Right. Like he's giving me eye contact 00:21:15.789 --> 00:21:19.829 in everyday life, follows me room to room, stares 00:21:19.829 --> 00:21:23.930 at me, eyeball to eyeball. Somehow I inadvertently 00:21:23.930 --> 00:21:29.009 poisoned something in my work relationship. Yep. 00:21:29.029 --> 00:21:34.470 So in that relationship, I have. So I, and I 00:21:34.470 --> 00:21:37.670 always found that with offering, like I've done 00:21:37.670 --> 00:21:43.230 this with not, so for example, I had a student, 00:21:43.289 --> 00:21:47.190 she has a, oh God, I'm going to say it wrong. 00:21:47.369 --> 00:21:50.769 I want to say a bull terrier, total non -traditional. 00:21:50.789 --> 00:21:53.849 I mean, holy Hannah, right? So this dog, you 00:21:53.849 --> 00:21:57.730 know, they don't retrieve, duh. So I just had 00:21:57.730 --> 00:22:04.180 her for his meal. And the dog knew how to offer. 00:22:04.339 --> 00:22:07.960 So I just had her put the dumbbell down. And 00:22:07.960 --> 00:22:10.720 eventually he offered to pick it up. And then 00:22:10.720 --> 00:22:12.680 she will go, yes, and give him some of his food. 00:22:13.000 --> 00:22:14.759 And then he will pick it up and she will go, 00:22:14.779 --> 00:22:16.880 yeah. So she didn't tell him to pick it up. She 00:22:16.880 --> 00:22:19.440 didn't hold it. She didn't put it towards him. 00:22:19.759 --> 00:22:22.579 She just placed it on the ground and she looked 00:22:22.579 --> 00:22:26.440 at it. Right. And the dog is a shaped dog, a 00:22:26.440 --> 00:22:28.299 dog that understands how to offer behaviors. 00:22:28.519 --> 00:22:32.500 He voluntarily, that dog had an amazing retrieve, 00:22:32.640 --> 00:22:37.180 beautiful hold, beautiful retrieve. I've done 00:22:37.180 --> 00:22:42.059 it with my own dogs, like Zaina, long story, 00:22:42.259 --> 00:22:45.039 but she was having a problem with her dumbbell 00:22:45.039 --> 00:22:49.599 and hold and fronting. So I just took the dumbbell, 00:22:49.980 --> 00:22:55.480 took her in my sunroom. held it in my hand loosely 00:22:55.480 --> 00:22:59.200 like not like in the just it was there waited 00:22:59.200 --> 00:23:03.640 for her to volunteer to take it and to this day 00:23:03.640 --> 00:23:05.839 I do it as a warm -up I just put the dumbbell 00:23:05.839 --> 00:23:10.099 down and she like grabs it runs into front hold 00:23:10.099 --> 00:23:13.079 pushes it towards me like look I'm holding it 00:23:13.079 --> 00:23:15.000 and her eyes are really bright because she's 00:23:15.000 --> 00:23:18.220 like look I'm doing it because it's her idea 00:23:18.220 --> 00:23:23.519 right So I've done that a lot to solve problems 00:23:23.519 --> 00:23:27.539 or with things that dogs like uncomfortable with. 00:23:30.599 --> 00:23:33.980 Yeah, because it builds confidence and it empowers 00:23:33.980 --> 00:23:38.759 the dog, right? Hugely. Yeah. So, I mean, first 00:23:38.759 --> 00:23:42.700 you have to teach your dog how to offer, which 00:23:42.700 --> 00:23:45.920 a lot of people. have trouble with because they 00:23:45.920 --> 00:23:48.460 have trouble with the waiting piece, right? Yeah, 00:23:48.539 --> 00:23:50.960 the patience. You got to be patient. That's the 00:23:50.960 --> 00:23:53.059 first thing I always say. Like, you need to be 00:23:53.059 --> 00:23:57.319 patient. And not, like, it's easy because we 00:23:57.319 --> 00:24:00.779 want to micromanage. You can't. You got to stop 00:24:00.779 --> 00:24:05.640 and let the dog figure it out. Takes a lot of 00:24:05.640 --> 00:24:09.779 self -control. Yeah. But letting it be their 00:24:09.779 --> 00:24:13.099 idea, it has been a game changer. I mean, it's 00:24:13.099 --> 00:24:15.759 what was a game changer for Zeal when he was 00:24:15.759 --> 00:24:18.599 worried. I would say, what can you do? Like if 00:24:18.599 --> 00:24:20.960 I left him on signals, turn around and face him 00:24:20.960 --> 00:24:22.700 and he looked like he was going to die, go, what 00:24:22.700 --> 00:24:25.500 can you do? Which is his offering you. He wouldn't 00:24:25.500 --> 00:24:28.839 actually even offer behavior. His attitude would 00:24:28.839 --> 00:24:33.500 just change. And I'd go, yes. Right. Right. Because 00:24:33.500 --> 00:24:36.400 he was. If I turn and said bounce or back up, 00:24:36.460 --> 00:24:38.980 he'd be like, oh, God, to him, it was just another 00:24:38.980 --> 00:24:43.819 like command. Yeah. But if I said, what can you 00:24:43.819 --> 00:24:47.859 do? It's weird. He would just like light up like 00:24:47.859 --> 00:24:51.420 a Christmas tree. And then I could say I could 00:24:51.420 --> 00:24:55.619 just like mark that. Right. Because it was really 00:24:55.619 --> 00:24:57.799 the state of mind that I'm trying to change. 00:24:57.880 --> 00:24:59.819 Right. And which is what I'm trying to do with 00:24:59.819 --> 00:25:01.980 Sassy is just like change his state of mind about 00:25:01.980 --> 00:25:05.579 it and make it like. make him feel like he wants 00:25:05.579 --> 00:25:11.240 to do it instead of me saying, let's do it. Well, 00:25:11.339 --> 00:25:13.680 it's like liberating for him. That's what it 00:25:13.680 --> 00:25:17.039 is. Yeah. You know? Well, and I think it takes 00:25:17.039 --> 00:25:19.799 the pressure off. I think in his case, it's taking 00:25:19.799 --> 00:25:22.940 whatever pressure he feels I'm putting on him. 00:25:23.380 --> 00:25:28.910 It's taking that pressure off. Yeah. And I could, 00:25:28.970 --> 00:25:31.250 you know, sit here and argue till the cows come 00:25:31.250 --> 00:25:33.369 home. Well, no, I don't put pressure on him. 00:25:33.410 --> 00:25:35.890 I don't say this. I don't do that. Well, it doesn't 00:25:35.890 --> 00:25:39.329 matter. He thinks I do. Exactly. There you go. 00:25:39.609 --> 00:25:43.509 Right. And that's all that matters. So I have 00:25:43.509 --> 00:25:48.390 to listen to what he's doing. Yeah, because inadvertently. 00:25:50.009 --> 00:25:52.470 Like you said, like you may not even know where 00:25:52.470 --> 00:25:55.549 it happened, how it happened, but somewhere along 00:25:55.549 --> 00:25:58.789 the line, it happened. It happened in my relationship 00:25:58.789 --> 00:26:01.609 with Ever, too, in a little bit of a different 00:26:01.609 --> 00:26:05.769 way. But it's the same thing. So you using the 00:26:05.769 --> 00:26:08.529 offering, which is, you know, something that 00:26:08.529 --> 00:26:11.650 your dogs all know because you taught it, that 00:26:11.650 --> 00:26:15.130 definitely is going to help. I just always I 00:26:15.130 --> 00:26:17.609 have like a visual of them like in a vice, these 00:26:17.609 --> 00:26:20.869 poor dogs, like they're like being squeezed. 00:26:20.930 --> 00:26:24.250 However, I know it's so hard. Well, I think the 00:26:24.250 --> 00:26:28.400 work can. Yeah. It's just so hard. So it's that, 00:26:28.579 --> 00:26:35.440 and like, you know, we are, I mean, it's, it's 00:26:35.440 --> 00:26:38.980 high, it's highly competitive, the stuff that 00:26:38.980 --> 00:26:43.380 we're doing, like, and we're with whatever we're 00:26:43.380 --> 00:26:45.700 training, however we're training, there's still 00:26:45.700 --> 00:26:48.900 that, like, there's always going to be some sort 00:26:48.900 --> 00:26:52.380 of pressure in some form, shape or form that. 00:26:52.940 --> 00:26:55.220 We're trying to meet goals, right? Like that's 00:26:55.220 --> 00:27:00.359 a thing. And along the lines, we're only human 00:27:00.359 --> 00:27:05.200 beings. Like we do our best in the welfare of 00:27:05.200 --> 00:27:08.339 our dogs and making sure that their mental states 00:27:08.339 --> 00:27:11.539 stay healthy through the stupid fucking thing 00:27:11.539 --> 00:27:17.289 we ask them to do. But it is, it's hard. And 00:27:17.289 --> 00:27:19.269 somewhere along the lines, this stuff can leak 00:27:19.269 --> 00:27:23.809 in and it shows up and it'll show up in the ring, 00:27:23.990 --> 00:27:27.549 in the test. And it's also an ego thing, right? 00:27:27.650 --> 00:27:32.730 Like when someone tells you your dog looks like 00:27:32.730 --> 00:27:36.589 it's, I forget whatever you guys exactly said, 00:27:36.630 --> 00:27:38.930 but it's basically like, you know, your dog looks 00:27:38.930 --> 00:27:41.789 like it's afraid to be wrong. Like you put pressure 00:27:41.789 --> 00:27:45.609 on it. Like your first reaction is like, no, 00:27:45.710 --> 00:27:49.250 I don't. No, I don't. I don't know. And my dog 00:27:49.250 --> 00:27:51.769 should not feel that way because I don't. And 00:27:51.769 --> 00:27:54.470 therefore, I'm not even going to explore this 00:27:54.470 --> 00:27:59.910 idea. Right. Like. It's kind of like Jesus, like, 00:28:00.130 --> 00:28:04.109 yeah, like I have to be honest, like I and I 00:28:04.109 --> 00:28:08.390 even said I'm like, I know he looks like. I'm 00:28:08.390 --> 00:28:10.869 like, but I don't do it. But then I have to say, 00:28:10.930 --> 00:28:14.190 OK, like, doesn't matter if I don't put pressure 00:28:14.190 --> 00:28:19.130 on him. Right. I had to say, but if he thinks 00:28:19.130 --> 00:28:22.630 that. Right. Then I have to put my ego aside. 00:28:24.329 --> 00:28:28.750 And accept that even though I'm uncomfortable 00:28:28.750 --> 00:28:34.500 saying like. You know, like I feel terrible feeling 00:28:34.500 --> 00:28:38.519 that he feels that way. And I want to say, well, 00:28:38.559 --> 00:28:42.019 he shouldn't, but he does. And it's not about 00:28:42.019 --> 00:28:47.700 me or how I feel or what I perceive. It's about 00:28:47.700 --> 00:28:52.039 how he feels. And so then I need to say, okay, 00:28:52.119 --> 00:28:57.339 then if that's the case, what can I do to make 00:28:57.339 --> 00:29:01.140 him feel? differently right and I think that 00:29:01.140 --> 00:29:04.660 is a hindrance for people a lot of times is like 00:29:04.660 --> 00:29:08.619 oh yes oh yes right and like people will ask 00:29:08.619 --> 00:29:11.299 me for help sometimes this is like a pet peeve 00:29:11.299 --> 00:29:16.099 look if you ask me for help I I'm I help people 00:29:16.099 --> 00:29:19.200 all the time happily but if you ask me for help 00:29:19.200 --> 00:29:22.160 and as soon as I start making suggestions you 00:29:22.160 --> 00:29:24.279 start going well I already did that and it's 00:29:24.279 --> 00:29:26.900 the dog and then well then forget it you don't 00:29:26.900 --> 00:29:31.400 really want my help Right. Right. Because you 00:29:31.400 --> 00:29:34.619 got to put your ego aside. It's our responsibility. 00:29:35.140 --> 00:29:39.420 Right. In the partnership with our dogs. It's 00:29:39.420 --> 00:29:41.359 our responsibility, even though it's teamwork. 00:29:41.539 --> 00:29:45.119 Right. And we're partners. It's it's the human, 00:29:45.200 --> 00:29:50.920 the handler's responsibility to be. We have to 00:29:50.920 --> 00:29:53.420 be humble enough to really look at it for what 00:29:53.420 --> 00:29:56.400 it is. The honesty factor of what's going on 00:29:56.400 --> 00:29:59.730 in your training. I mean, it is not comfortable 00:29:59.730 --> 00:30:02.309 sometimes, like you just said, like it was hard 00:30:02.309 --> 00:30:06.829 to hear that. And sometimes it is, but it is, 00:30:06.829 --> 00:30:09.630 it's on us, our responsibility to put that aside 00:30:09.630 --> 00:30:15.890 and figure out where, you may not even figure 00:30:15.890 --> 00:30:18.109 out where it happened, but somewhere along the 00:30:18.109 --> 00:30:20.589 lines it happened and we need to figure out how 00:30:20.589 --> 00:30:23.490 to fix it. That's really the bottom line. Yeah. 00:30:25.980 --> 00:30:29.160 What I thought was interesting is with you and 00:30:29.160 --> 00:30:33.039 Ever, like you were telling me how with her, 00:30:33.160 --> 00:30:36.079 like she couldn't even sit still and you were 00:30:36.079 --> 00:30:39.099 working on her just getting to sit still. And 00:30:39.099 --> 00:30:42.400 I don't know, I was, I mean, I understood technically 00:30:42.400 --> 00:30:44.299 what you were saying, but I was like, I'm not, 00:30:44.319 --> 00:30:46.319 I don't understand how that's helping her. But 00:30:46.319 --> 00:30:48.859 then you made a Facebook post and you were saying 00:30:48.859 --> 00:30:55.460 that it was an arousal issue. Like you had, I 00:30:55.460 --> 00:30:59.460 think, tell me if inadvertently taught her that 00:30:59.460 --> 00:31:01.559 when you sit still that she should raise her 00:31:01.559 --> 00:31:04.059 arousal, but then that would put her into anxiety. 00:31:05.380 --> 00:31:08.880 Yeah, it's complicated. It's complicated. And 00:31:08.880 --> 00:31:15.200 it wasn't until it wasn't until. actually deb 00:31:15.200 --> 00:31:17.500 one of our training partners actually was like 00:31:17.500 --> 00:31:20.500 you need to just just have her sit like just 00:31:20.500 --> 00:31:23.079 put her in a sit it wasn't even in heel position 00:31:23.079 --> 00:31:26.880 when we like messed around with it just put her 00:31:26.880 --> 00:31:29.859 in a sit you're just gonna feed the sit the dog 00:31:29.859 --> 00:31:32.700 couldn't fucking sit because she would offer 00:31:32.700 --> 00:31:36.099 is what you're saying yeah she would offer right 00:31:36.099 --> 00:31:39.039 which is like she would offer whether it was 00:31:39.039 --> 00:31:41.960 like she'd start whining her feet would start 00:31:41.960 --> 00:31:44.890 going the tail would start like but but And Debbie's 00:31:44.890 --> 00:31:47.289 like, well, just have her, have her sit. So I 00:31:47.289 --> 00:31:50.130 tell her to sit. I couldn't not get past one 00:31:50.130 --> 00:31:52.630 second with this dog without her doing that. 00:31:52.750 --> 00:31:56.509 Right. And then, so I thought about it and I'm 00:31:56.509 --> 00:32:00.670 like, I go back in my head and I'm like, well, 00:32:00.710 --> 00:32:03.430 this is what, this is what I did. Like all the 00:32:03.430 --> 00:32:07.549 offering, all the shaping, but I net. So what 00:32:07.549 --> 00:32:13.299 happens is when. I would ask her to offer, right? 00:32:13.440 --> 00:32:17.700 Then it kicks her into a higher arousal, right? 00:32:17.839 --> 00:32:20.880 And that's where I'm going to start to get some 00:32:20.880 --> 00:32:25.799 whining, the foot movement. So that had become 00:32:25.799 --> 00:32:29.400 kind of the pattern in that static position of 00:32:29.400 --> 00:32:33.660 sit. Does this make sense? I feel like it's complicated. 00:32:34.160 --> 00:32:37.200 No, I understand that because we basically teach 00:32:37.200 --> 00:32:41.799 our dogs that if we're not doing anything, Yeah. 00:32:41.880 --> 00:32:44.480 Right. That you should start to offer behaviors 00:32:44.480 --> 00:32:48.420 for us. Like we taught them that. Right. And 00:32:48.420 --> 00:32:51.599 I and and that and that's exactly what I did. 00:32:51.680 --> 00:32:56.480 And then what happened was I never went and really 00:32:56.480 --> 00:33:03.799 reinforced. Like that optimal arousal state in 00:33:03.799 --> 00:33:07.180 a static position where there is no. movement 00:33:07.180 --> 00:33:10.599 or whining just that beautiful quiet drive like 00:33:10.599 --> 00:33:13.599 I always I always go back to that example of 00:33:13.599 --> 00:33:16.500 a visual of like just that working you know border 00:33:16.500 --> 00:33:19.759 collie who just is so still and they're completely 00:33:19.759 --> 00:33:22.319 focused and they don't move you know like that 00:33:22.319 --> 00:33:26.319 just that beautiful look I never was I think 00:33:26.319 --> 00:33:31.240 in her case, when she puts herself into high 00:33:31.240 --> 00:33:34.640 arousal or you put her into high arousal and 00:33:34.640 --> 00:33:39.779 she's in the ring, it spills into anxiety. Yeah, 00:33:39.819 --> 00:33:43.599 I think that can definitely happen. But what 00:33:43.599 --> 00:33:49.480 I've been figuring out then is because of whoever 00:33:49.480 --> 00:33:57.079 is, like she truly cares. in the most she cares 00:33:57.079 --> 00:34:00.740 the most about being right even in her life like 00:34:00.740 --> 00:34:06.119 the dog is just if she has any inclination that 00:34:06.119 --> 00:34:11.079 she might not be right then she worries and when 00:34:11.079 --> 00:34:16.179 she does that then she dips down into low arousal 00:34:16.179 --> 00:34:21.199 and then she's sucky and arousal is arousal so 00:34:21.199 --> 00:34:24.719 if she's too low Just the same as she's too high, 00:34:24.820 --> 00:34:27.159 she's not going to be able to function correctly. 00:34:28.000 --> 00:34:31.639 So I think what was happening was I, I know this 00:34:31.639 --> 00:34:34.380 is complicated, but this is like where my brain's 00:34:34.380 --> 00:34:36.139 been going. I'm trying to figure all this out. 00:34:36.239 --> 00:34:41.219 Like, because I paired so much of the offering, 00:34:41.460 --> 00:34:44.280 which created the high arousal in some of that 00:34:44.280 --> 00:34:47.320 static position, which was the sit. And then 00:34:47.320 --> 00:34:50.940 I paired all of it with like definitely with 00:34:50.940 --> 00:34:55.880 articles. I trained articles 90 % of the time 00:34:55.880 --> 00:35:00.000 with kicking her into high arousal, even in that 00:35:00.000 --> 00:35:02.639 static position so that she would fly out to 00:35:02.639 --> 00:35:05.539 the pile, grab like I wanted speed, fast, sexy, 00:35:05.679 --> 00:35:08.440 crazy. I had her barking like a fucking lunatic. 00:35:08.500 --> 00:35:15.590 Like I didn't train that exercise. Like. purposely 00:35:15.590 --> 00:35:19.250 where it should have been trained for ring picture 00:35:19.250 --> 00:35:24.670 so I think then what happened was I wouldn't 00:35:24.670 --> 00:35:27.949 say like I corrected the arousal when she would 00:35:27.949 --> 00:35:30.889 bark but then all of a sudden I was asking her 00:35:30.889 --> 00:35:33.590 because I was like well I can't I can't trial 00:35:33.590 --> 00:35:35.929 her like that obviously so she needs to be quiet 00:35:35.929 --> 00:35:39.250 and still in her mind then she was like fucking 00:35:39.250 --> 00:35:43.070 a like I'm wrong. Like I'm being corrected. And 00:35:43.070 --> 00:35:46.329 then I think that's where it poisoned that exercise. 00:35:46.409 --> 00:35:49.909 So sitting there in heel position, she didn't 00:35:49.909 --> 00:35:52.650 know what to fucking do. And so I think her head 00:35:52.650 --> 00:35:55.789 went into, oh my God, I'm wrong. It created enormous 00:35:55.789 --> 00:35:58.170 pressure sitting there and it just bled into 00:35:58.170 --> 00:36:01.230 sucky freaking articles. Like, I don't know for 00:36:01.230 --> 00:36:03.849 sure. Like this is where I'm at. It could also 00:36:03.849 --> 00:36:07.690 be that like in the ring a lot of times. She 00:36:07.690 --> 00:36:11.150 can't put herself like she'll get flat and she 00:36:11.150 --> 00:36:14.210 and she can't put herself into high arousal. 00:36:14.210 --> 00:36:17.469 And then maybe she thinks she's wrong, too. Do 00:36:17.469 --> 00:36:19.389 you know what I'm saying? Because you might give 00:36:19.389 --> 00:36:22.150 her a pre -cue or you might be like, come on, 00:36:22.269 --> 00:36:26.250 bump yourself up. And she's like, I can't. And 00:36:26.250 --> 00:36:28.789 then when she can't, she's probably immediately 00:36:28.789 --> 00:36:31.690 thinking. And therefore, I'm wrong. I'm wrong. 00:36:31.789 --> 00:36:35.789 And yes, right. Right. That's exactly where I'm 00:36:35.789 --> 00:36:40.829 at with her. which like is, I know that sounds 00:36:40.829 --> 00:36:45.590 really complicated to a lot of people. But right 00:36:45.590 --> 00:36:50.070 now what I'm doing with her is because that dog 00:36:50.070 --> 00:36:53.869 will like in training, like even, even like if 00:36:53.869 --> 00:36:57.750 I just have her sitting there and I look at her 00:36:57.750 --> 00:37:00.429 long enough, she starts to offer, you know, like 00:37:00.429 --> 00:37:03.940 we trained all that, but I need to. I need to 00:37:03.940 --> 00:37:07.099 teach her not to offer. Like I need her to be, 00:37:07.280 --> 00:37:12.760 I need to teach and reinforce stillness in optimal 00:37:12.760 --> 00:37:16.940 arousal in that position. Right. So that's what 00:37:16.940 --> 00:37:20.739 I've been doing. So she knows what to do. She 00:37:20.739 --> 00:37:25.360 knows it's correct not to offer. So what I've 00:37:25.360 --> 00:37:28.230 been doing is I'm. Literally, I can get to three 00:37:28.230 --> 00:37:31.630 or four seconds now, which isn't very long. So 00:37:31.630 --> 00:37:34.489 even when the judge takes the article, you know, 00:37:34.510 --> 00:37:37.929 sometimes it feels like forever. She's still 00:37:37.929 --> 00:37:40.289 I can like she's good for a couple seconds and 00:37:40.289 --> 00:37:42.610 then I can see like where she's like, oh, God, 00:37:42.630 --> 00:37:46.869 oh, God. So it's a work in progress, but I am 00:37:46.869 --> 00:37:49.550 giving her cues and training like I've been calling 00:37:49.550 --> 00:37:52.690 it just the doodling stuff where I go set her 00:37:52.690 --> 00:37:55.769 up. I put all our articles out. I set her up. 00:37:56.409 --> 00:37:59.050 I do the whole thing. I let her see him. I turn. 00:37:59.170 --> 00:38:01.710 We sit. And now I'm just giving her a cue. It's 00:38:01.710 --> 00:38:04.570 kind of stupid. I just rub the side of my leg 00:38:04.570 --> 00:38:07.929 and I say, one, two, sit. One, two. Because that's 00:38:07.929 --> 00:38:09.489 what I've been doing to try to count to see how 00:38:09.489 --> 00:38:11.530 far I can go. So it's become a little bit of 00:38:11.530 --> 00:38:15.280 a verbal cue for her. And then I feed it in training. 00:38:15.579 --> 00:38:18.960 And then I do a with me. I do another setup. 00:38:19.179 --> 00:38:23.280 I do all, I don't do just relaxed doodling where 00:38:23.280 --> 00:38:25.340 we're just like moving around. I actually am 00:38:25.340 --> 00:38:28.599 putting her cues in that I would use in the ring. 00:38:28.760 --> 00:38:32.079 I'm putting a setup. I'm putting with me so that 00:38:32.079 --> 00:38:35.320 it's all interactively paired so that we can 00:38:35.320 --> 00:38:39.329 carry this into the ring, which did help. um, 00:38:39.409 --> 00:38:41.789 the last weekend when we were up at Schenectady, 00:38:41.929 --> 00:38:44.610 I saw like, there's a lot of work to be done, 00:38:44.690 --> 00:38:47.869 but I did see a lot of improvement because she 00:38:47.869 --> 00:38:52.929 feels better in static position with, cause now 00:38:52.929 --> 00:38:58.610 she knows what to do. And therefore it ha it. 00:38:58.940 --> 00:39:02.239 Then, because the two exercises, gloves and articles, 00:39:02.380 --> 00:39:04.280 is where they have to sit the longest in utility, 00:39:04.500 --> 00:39:07.860 so that's where I had so much crap and she'd 00:39:07.860 --> 00:39:11.139 be sucky on going out to get her whatever, article 00:39:11.139 --> 00:39:13.360 or glove, and then she'd come back all sucky 00:39:13.360 --> 00:39:17.059 because I saw a huge difference. Like it just, 00:39:17.340 --> 00:39:23.260 just that helping her in that static position. 00:39:24.180 --> 00:39:26.440 bled into the actual exercise because it's not 00:39:26.440 --> 00:39:29.519 the exercise like i taught the dogs train and 00:39:29.519 --> 00:39:32.099 the dog's been motivated up the wing like we 00:39:32.099 --> 00:39:35.480 do the games we do all the things so it's not 00:39:35.480 --> 00:39:39.119 the actual exercise it this is where i'm going 00:39:39.119 --> 00:39:43.260 where where i think this is my problem It's actually 00:39:43.260 --> 00:39:47.800 in those little nuances of sitting in a static 00:39:47.800 --> 00:39:50.420 position with me. Well, the arousal thing is 00:39:50.420 --> 00:39:52.699 super tricky, right? Because it's always like 00:39:52.699 --> 00:39:56.460 we're always trying. We tend most people to try 00:39:56.460 --> 00:39:59.099 and get more arousal and then you'll get it in 00:39:59.099 --> 00:40:01.480 training. So then in training, you're constantly 00:40:01.480 --> 00:40:04.519 training the dog in a higher state of arousal, 00:40:04.539 --> 00:40:08.300 which is fine if the dog can transfer that state 00:40:08.300 --> 00:40:12.960 of arousal into the ring. Tyler. my dog way back 00:40:12.960 --> 00:40:15.539 he was able to do that he trained in arousal 00:40:15.539 --> 00:40:19.139 he worked in arousal he showed an arousal so 00:40:19.139 --> 00:40:22.760 it was all the same he was an exceptional animal 00:40:22.760 --> 00:40:26.380 in that sense right but what happens with most 00:40:26.380 --> 00:40:30.340 dogs is that's not the state of arousal they're 00:40:30.340 --> 00:40:34.210 in when they compete Right now, some dogs go 00:40:34.210 --> 00:40:36.389 in a higher state of arousal when they compete. 00:40:36.530 --> 00:40:39.150 Some go in a lower state of arousal when they 00:40:39.150 --> 00:40:42.150 compete. So if that's the state of arousal they're 00:40:42.150 --> 00:40:44.889 in when they're competing and you're training 00:40:44.889 --> 00:40:48.110 in a different state, it's apples and oranges. 00:40:48.269 --> 00:40:54.269 Right. So what you have to do is train your dog. 00:40:55.119 --> 00:40:58.019 in the state of arousal they're going to be in 00:40:58.019 --> 00:41:02.119 in the ring in order to get carryover so i could 00:41:02.119 --> 00:41:07.980 train zesty like and push him artificially into 00:41:07.980 --> 00:41:10.539 arousal which is what i was doing in training 00:41:10.539 --> 00:41:15.280 like i was manufacturing it And then when I went 00:41:15.280 --> 00:41:17.960 in the ring, I couldn't manufacture it because 00:41:17.960 --> 00:41:20.559 he wasn't responding to it. Right. And maybe 00:41:20.559 --> 00:41:23.139 then in that case, he was perceiving that as 00:41:23.139 --> 00:41:27.559 pressure. But regardless, he was he trials in 00:41:27.559 --> 00:41:29.760 a different state of arousal. So another thing 00:41:29.760 --> 00:41:32.960 I had to do was I had to say, I can't keep manufacturing 00:41:32.960 --> 00:41:37.849 this arousal and training. Because I can't manufacture 00:41:37.849 --> 00:41:40.510 it in the ring. So what use is it? Like, why 00:41:40.510 --> 00:41:43.050 am I training him in this state? It's not the 00:41:43.050 --> 00:41:50.630 same. So I have to get what I want without manufacturing 00:41:50.630 --> 00:41:53.969 it, right? So I either have to, so in part, I 00:41:53.969 --> 00:41:57.230 have to train him in lower arousal. So I think 00:41:57.230 --> 00:42:02.969 the whole thing about, you know, arousal in and 00:42:02.969 --> 00:42:08.530 of itself is like we have to we I think people 00:42:08.530 --> 00:42:12.949 look at it as just like this blanket simple like 00:42:12.949 --> 00:42:17.929 I tug my dog is excited my dog works better that's 00:42:17.929 --> 00:42:20.530 the solution but it's so much more complicated 00:42:20.530 --> 00:42:25.550 than that it is it is very complicated and I 00:42:25.550 --> 00:42:30.130 think what you just said you know the way you're 00:42:30.619 --> 00:42:33.380 train it you know the the apples and oranges 00:42:33.380 --> 00:42:36.360 right chalk and cheese as some of them say like 00:42:36.360 --> 00:42:42.420 because it's true like that's what kind of happened 00:42:42.420 --> 00:42:48.400 with ever like I I and I love like I somebody 00:42:48.400 --> 00:42:52.980 said to me you really do love the high arousal 00:42:52.980 --> 00:42:56.079 dogs. I do. Like, I love training that. Like, 00:42:56.079 --> 00:42:59.320 that's the dog I love to train. So I'm comfortable 00:42:59.320 --> 00:43:02.019 there, which means I have to be careful because 00:43:02.019 --> 00:43:04.800 that's where I like to get them in training. 00:43:05.400 --> 00:43:08.619 But we have to be realistic because that's exactly 00:43:08.619 --> 00:43:13.320 the mistake I made with Ever. I had her in way 00:43:13.320 --> 00:43:16.380 high arousal in training. And then I was like, 00:43:16.500 --> 00:43:19.159 oh, no, no, no, you can't do that in the ring. 00:43:19.949 --> 00:43:22.670 And never explained any of that or taught her 00:43:22.670 --> 00:43:26.670 how to work in the arousal state. She needs to 00:43:26.670 --> 00:43:28.190 be in the ring, just like you just said with 00:43:28.190 --> 00:43:31.110 Zesty. And that's how, when she started to perceive 00:43:31.110 --> 00:43:33.610 that she was wrong, you know, and that's where 00:43:33.610 --> 00:43:37.190 I had a problem. Also, you said something which 00:43:37.190 --> 00:43:42.190 is really important. You're comfortable in high 00:43:42.190 --> 00:43:46.269 arousal or with a high arousal dog, but all dogs. 00:43:47.159 --> 00:43:50.000 are not comfortable in high arousal. So like 00:43:50.000 --> 00:43:54.599 zeal, I would be like, come on, get high. And 00:43:54.599 --> 00:43:56.960 then I go to teach him something and he'd be 00:43:56.960 --> 00:44:00.940 like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, hold on a 00:44:00.940 --> 00:44:03.780 minute. And then he'd go through this elaborate 00:44:03.780 --> 00:44:07.039 production of sneezing and shaking and all this 00:44:07.039 --> 00:44:09.500 stuff and bring his arousal down. Cause he's 00:44:09.500 --> 00:44:12.920 like, no, can't do it in that state of arousal. 00:44:13.139 --> 00:44:18.389 So didn't matter what I wanted, like, he was 00:44:18.389 --> 00:44:23.949 not comfortable there yeah right like for a lot 00:44:23.949 --> 00:44:29.269 of his life and in general he was not like he 00:44:29.269 --> 00:44:34.050 learned to work in higher arousal but very high 00:44:34.050 --> 00:44:37.929 arousal was not his jam right so it didn't matter 00:44:37.929 --> 00:44:41.429 what I wanted or that I like it or that I want 00:44:41.429 --> 00:44:49.539 my dogs there right he Is not happy there. Right. 00:44:50.159 --> 00:44:53.619 Right. So we also have to look at that, like 00:44:53.619 --> 00:44:57.739 where it doesn't matter. Now it doesn't mean 00:44:57.739 --> 00:45:01.800 you can't take a dog and teach it to be comfortable 00:45:01.800 --> 00:45:06.059 in a high earth state, but he is never, he was 00:45:06.059 --> 00:45:09.929 never going to work. comfortably where Zaina 00:45:09.929 --> 00:45:13.769 Zaina very happily and comfortably works like 00:45:13.769 --> 00:45:17.070 she loves being on the edge of that cliff ideally 00:45:17.070 --> 00:45:20.210 she'd go over the cliff that's her favorite place 00:45:20.210 --> 00:45:24.030 to be is over the cliff incomplete and utter 00:45:24.030 --> 00:45:27.750 chaos she's happy as a clam there yelling she 00:45:27.750 --> 00:45:34.920 loves it there right so I have my job is that 00:45:34.920 --> 00:45:38.019 balancing act of the fine line. And I can just, 00:45:38.079 --> 00:45:41.699 you know, I, most of the time she goes, she tilts 00:45:41.699 --> 00:45:44.079 over just that tiny little bit, just to get, 00:45:44.119 --> 00:45:46.460 just to take away that extra, you know, little 00:45:46.460 --> 00:45:52.079 bit in the ring, but she's happy up there. Very 00:45:52.079 --> 00:45:55.059 happy. That's where she, I don't even, it's not 00:45:55.059 --> 00:45:57.159 even a problem putting her there. Cause she's 00:45:57.159 --> 00:46:01.639 like, this is where I like to be. I'm happy here. 00:46:02.000 --> 00:46:09.699 Right. And Zest, I don't think he, he does not 00:46:09.699 --> 00:46:13.480 like being where she's at. Right. You know, he'd 00:46:13.480 --> 00:46:17.280 rather, similar to Zeal, he can work in higher 00:46:17.280 --> 00:46:22.300 arousal. But if I get him in too high arousal, 00:46:22.320 --> 00:46:24.820 it completely degrades. He starts screaming. 00:46:24.880 --> 00:46:28.619 He starts barking. He starts going, like this 00:46:28.619 --> 00:46:32.920 pitchy whine. That's not a good place, you know, 00:46:32.940 --> 00:46:41.079 or I'm like, okay, hold like, right. So he can't 00:46:41.079 --> 00:46:45.480 be there. He needs to be somewhere lower down. 00:46:45.659 --> 00:46:48.460 Now, part of it is because I've worked him a 00:46:48.460 --> 00:46:51.099 lot in more moderate arousal. But part of it, 00:46:51.139 --> 00:46:55.239 I think, is like when he's and in life, if he 00:46:55.239 --> 00:47:00.210 spills into super high arousal, it's like. zero 00:47:00.210 --> 00:47:03.690 and you can't even penetrate at that moment it's 00:47:03.690 --> 00:47:09.809 like he can't even hear you right so all dogs 00:47:09.809 --> 00:47:13.929 like stormy can function in high arousal like 00:47:13.929 --> 00:47:17.429 she she likes it there that's where she's happy 00:47:17.429 --> 00:47:23.429 but every dog that yes they can get there but 00:47:23.429 --> 00:47:28.460 can they function there every dog can't I agree. 00:47:28.579 --> 00:47:31.679 And that's actually what I'm really seeing a 00:47:31.679 --> 00:47:40.039 lot with Salty, the puppy, because he can go 00:47:40.039 --> 00:47:45.239 to high arousal super fucking fast. But when 00:47:45.239 --> 00:47:48.380 he goes there, it's not comfortable for him. 00:47:48.559 --> 00:47:58.389 He starts screaming. He can't think. genetics, 00:47:58.389 --> 00:48:04.630 the work kicks him there really fast. So I have 00:48:04.630 --> 00:48:09.489 to be really careful on my training strategies 00:48:09.489 --> 00:48:16.050 with him because I need, like right now, all 00:48:16.050 --> 00:48:20.449 I'm working on with him is just doing behaviors 00:48:20.449 --> 00:48:25.730 in optimal arousal. Like, because And I have 00:48:25.730 --> 00:48:28.849 to be really careful because I like that high 00:48:28.849 --> 00:48:31.869 arousal, as you guys know. And you're like, dude. 00:48:32.369 --> 00:48:36.570 So I have to be mindful, even though it feels 00:48:36.570 --> 00:48:41.550 fun and glamorous. It's not. how this dog is 00:48:41.550 --> 00:48:43.889 going to be able to, he can't properly function 00:48:43.889 --> 00:48:46.630 that way, which I see, like even doing articles, 00:48:46.869 --> 00:48:51.409 like if he's too high, he can't do them. So I 00:48:51.409 --> 00:48:54.530 do a lot of work right now with him, just working 00:48:54.530 --> 00:49:00.539 him in. And helping him be in a good state of 00:49:00.539 --> 00:49:03.360 mind, whether it's just going from a platform 00:49:03.360 --> 00:49:06.699 to a platform, which is what I now have out. 00:49:06.780 --> 00:49:09.739 Like even if I'm going to go do an actual training 00:49:09.739 --> 00:49:12.960 segment of like a piece of exercise or behavior, 00:49:13.199 --> 00:49:16.380 obedience behavior, if I see that state going 00:49:16.380 --> 00:49:18.980 up because the work kicks in there, I just go, 00:49:19.019 --> 00:49:22.159 I take him out of that, like doing the formal 00:49:22.159 --> 00:49:24.880 pieces and I just do some work like that doodling 00:49:24.880 --> 00:49:31.230 stuff. Um, because, and he, and he goes there, 00:49:31.329 --> 00:49:35.070 I think he goes there because like I said, like 00:49:35.070 --> 00:49:38.150 genetically the work takes him there. Like that's 00:49:38.150 --> 00:49:42.269 what he's been bred to do sort of, but I can't, 00:49:42.269 --> 00:49:44.550 he can't operate there. You know what I mean? 00:49:45.050 --> 00:49:49.730 I also think with a lot of dogs, like with Zeal, 00:49:49.889 --> 00:49:54.239 his... He did everything in the ring really fast, 00:49:54.360 --> 00:50:00.219 but that came of it all on its own over time 00:50:00.219 --> 00:50:04.860 when he got really confident with the exercise. 00:50:05.380 --> 00:50:10.050 Yep. Over time, like, I mean, he did things so 00:50:10.050 --> 00:50:13.670 painfully slow. It was like my eyes were bleeding. 00:50:13.849 --> 00:50:17.150 I was dying inside. Like, it was horrible. It 00:50:17.150 --> 00:50:21.030 was slow. Well, because you're not comfortable 00:50:21.030 --> 00:50:24.130 there. No, I'm not. Because I want it fast and 00:50:24.130 --> 00:50:27.909 relaxed. But it was horribly slow. But I just 00:50:27.909 --> 00:50:31.070 was like, all right, whatever. Just shut up. 00:50:31.150 --> 00:50:35.119 Just deal with it, right? And then once he learned 00:50:35.119 --> 00:50:37.539 it, it will get a little bit faster. And then 00:50:37.539 --> 00:50:39.719 he got more comfortable and he'd get a little 00:50:39.719 --> 00:50:42.619 faster. And then when he was like, I know what 00:50:42.619 --> 00:50:47.139 to do. He got really fast, all on his own. Like, 00:50:47.139 --> 00:50:49.659 I'm not saying, yes, I did games and stuff like 00:50:49.659 --> 00:50:55.039 that. But like my training in essence didn't 00:50:55.039 --> 00:51:00.840 change. It just, he changed all on his own, right? 00:51:01.579 --> 00:51:06.119 Like. As he got more and more confident and more 00:51:06.119 --> 00:51:09.780 and more comfortable, he got faster and faster. 00:51:10.059 --> 00:51:13.320 And so with some, in some situations, like I 00:51:13.320 --> 00:51:16.699 have a student with a border collie and dude, 00:51:16.800 --> 00:51:19.639 you know, they are insane with the dumbbell. 00:51:19.880 --> 00:51:24.699 So, so totally counterintuitive. I said to her, 00:51:24.760 --> 00:51:28.800 do not restrain this dog. Do not fire this dog 00:51:28.800 --> 00:51:32.449 up for this dumbbell. Just train it calm. Back 00:51:32.449 --> 00:51:35.610 chain it, right? And this is a very thoughtful 00:51:35.610 --> 00:51:37.909 border collie. The dog doesn't want to be wrong, 00:51:38.190 --> 00:51:41.110 right? It's very soft. But I was like, yeah. 00:51:41.530 --> 00:51:43.769 And in my head, there's part of me that's like, 00:51:43.869 --> 00:51:46.210 oh God, I hope you don't like ruin this person's 00:51:46.210 --> 00:51:48.369 Dumbo where the dog trots out, trots back for 00:51:48.369 --> 00:51:51.530 the rest of its career, right? No, all on its 00:51:51.530 --> 00:51:53.909 own. Dog's getting faster. In fact, dog's already 00:51:53.909 --> 00:51:56.309 starting to want to anticipate the retrieve. 00:51:56.590 --> 00:52:01.679 And she's done no games. no drive building, no 00:52:01.679 --> 00:52:06.320 restraining. Right. Cause it's in the dog already 00:52:06.320 --> 00:52:09.119 genetically. Like it's just, that's how the breed 00:52:09.119 --> 00:52:12.840 is with these things. And even though this dog 00:52:12.840 --> 00:52:16.199 is not, is on the softer slide, more thoughtful 00:52:16.199 --> 00:52:21.199 side and so on, it's coming on its own. Right. 00:52:21.260 --> 00:52:24.820 And so even with some breeds that aren't prone 00:52:24.820 --> 00:52:28.460 to high arousal or that kind of thing, confidence, 00:52:29.710 --> 00:52:34.510 build speed right like confidence and understanding 00:52:34.510 --> 00:52:41.889 their job which takes a while um will bring in 00:52:41.889 --> 00:52:45.610 a lot of cases things will get faster because 00:52:45.610 --> 00:52:50.269 the dog's like oh especially if we're very clear 00:52:50.269 --> 00:52:56.309 and clean with our training and consistent with 00:52:56.309 --> 00:53:00.630 our information the dog will just get faster 00:53:00.630 --> 00:53:06.190 on its own exactly exactly because it's it's 00:53:06.190 --> 00:53:09.710 yeah like you said with the border collie like 00:53:09.710 --> 00:53:15.679 it's easy it's easy to want to Like put like 00:53:15.679 --> 00:53:17.940 what you just don't need with a Ferrari. You 00:53:17.940 --> 00:53:19.920 don't need to step on the gas hard. You don't 00:53:19.920 --> 00:53:22.320 need to put the fuel on the fire. It's there 00:53:22.320 --> 00:53:25.699 already. Right. And you can easily kick it out 00:53:25.699 --> 00:53:28.159 of orbit and then have a lot of problems down 00:53:28.159 --> 00:53:30.219 the road. But you're right. Like with other dogs, 00:53:30.300 --> 00:53:36.699 like just confidence building will. Like innately, 00:53:36.760 --> 00:53:42.780 organically build more speed. Definitely. Yeah. 00:53:42.860 --> 00:53:45.159 And again, it's that patience thing. It's not 00:53:45.159 --> 00:53:48.760 us trying to, cause like in some cases, especially 00:53:48.760 --> 00:53:51.460 with dogs that aren't Ferraris, right? Like, 00:53:51.500 --> 00:53:54.639 but even I think what happened with Zesty, like 00:53:54.639 --> 00:53:59.739 we're trying to get speed. So in a lot of cases, 00:53:59.840 --> 00:54:02.519 I think they start perceiving that as pressure. 00:54:03.059 --> 00:54:06.239 And then that has, that has either the opposite 00:54:06.239 --> 00:54:11.389 effect. They slow down more or. They'll go faster, 00:54:11.630 --> 00:54:14.610 but there's that element of anxiety in there. 00:54:14.730 --> 00:54:18.050 And that causes a whole host of other problems. 00:54:19.510 --> 00:54:24.449 In both cases, it's a manifestation of pressure 00:54:24.449 --> 00:54:30.550 where we're trying to artificially create something 00:54:30.550 --> 00:54:34.030 that maybe the dog in that moment is not ready 00:54:34.030 --> 00:54:36.869 for. Like maybe they're like, I don't understand 00:54:36.869 --> 00:54:40.760 the job well enough or. Okay. I'm thinking I'm 00:54:40.760 --> 00:54:44.059 still at a point in my learning where I'm thinking 00:54:44.059 --> 00:54:48.360 about what I'm doing or I don't want to be wrong. 00:54:48.480 --> 00:54:52.679 So I'm overthinking like, and whatever the case, 00:54:52.699 --> 00:54:55.940 the dogs were just like, come on, do it fast. 00:54:56.199 --> 00:55:01.300 And the dogs like not in a mental place where 00:55:01.300 --> 00:55:05.199 they're innately able to do it quickly yet. And 00:55:05.199 --> 00:55:11.500 so then that causes pressure. yeah conflict definitely 00:55:11.500 --> 00:55:17.079 definitely it's hard dog training's fucking hard 00:55:17.079 --> 00:55:20.280 that's what we should have named the podcast 00:55:20.280 --> 00:55:22.980 because i feel like every week that's what we 00:55:22.980 --> 00:55:27.019 say we're like we should not have we should have 00:55:27.019 --> 00:55:34.239 named it dog training is hard because we say 00:55:34.239 --> 00:55:40.000 it all the time oh my god All right, guys. Yeah. 00:55:40.119 --> 00:55:42.139 That's where we're at. And I'm not for a while. 00:55:43.199 --> 00:55:47.500 To be continued because it's not done. Never 00:55:47.500 --> 00:55:50.539 ending. Never ending. Bye. Thanks, everybody. 00:55:50.679 --> 00:55:50.960 Bye.