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Welcome back to Zero Signal. I am David and as
always, I'm sitting here with my co -host, Jay.
Today we're going back to the NASA archives and
into a mystery that's been hiding in plain sight
for almost 60 years. My guest is a historian
and researcher, Ed Wilson, author of a two -part
nonfiction investigation, the SimSkin NASA Archive
UFO and hidden under your nose. Across these
books, Ed documents more than 150 early NASA
photographs. Some of them once secret, digs into
Gemini 11 mission transcripts and technical.
debriefings and uses modern forensic imaging
and AI to argue that NASA's own archival photos
and film show a consistent unexplained craft,
a genuine UFO and the Gemini 11 material. And
that's been effectively hidden in plain sight
for decades. His work hasn't stayed on the fringe.
It's been taken seriously by scientists, journalists,
congressional staff, and is currently under study
by the House Oversight Committee UAP investigation.
Tonight, we're going to talk about what he found
in those archives, why it matters for NASA's
history and how war secrecy may still be shaping
what we think about what we know about space.
But before we dive into all that, let's start
with the person behind the lens. And for people
who are just meeting you through this conversation,
who are you and how do you describe what you
do? I want to say thanks to everybody out there.
It's nice to have a chance to talk to people
who are informed. My name is Ed Wilson and I
have a different background from most UFO researchers
today. Originally, I was a historian and rare
book and document dealer. That was only until
I rediscovered what is most important piece of
NASA photography ever. We're going to be talking
about a lot of pictures. For God's sake, I've
got all the pictures. You'll be able to see them
on my book covers, both front and back. I've
got all the pictures of the UFO you want. You
don't have to buy it. My idea is to get the pictures
out there, but don't wreck your car if you're
driving. The name is Simkinson. They just did
a podcast in England and they didn't realize
that it's not. I just think of Bart Simkins,
right? Remember they did a beautiful cartoon,
The Simpsons. Everybody loves The Simpsons. This
is Simkinson with a K -I -N, so S -I -N. N -P
-K -I -N -S -O -N. Go to Amazon and they show
lovely pictures, front covers of both books that
are already there. You can see these things without
paying for anything. I'll hold some of these
photos, these covers up for you guys to see them
and other photos. The photos are great. As I
said, that's the Simkinson NASA Archive UFO.
And the only reason it survived is because NASA's
original Space Task Group chief engineer, Scott
Simkinson, preserved it in his personal archive
where it sat untouched in the family basement
since 1996. saw it, it's obvious immediately
when you see it. It's an indisputable flying
saucer. I began cross -checking it against NASA's
own material. The lithograph wasn't an isolated
incident. The same object shows up again in NASA's
official Gemini 11 Hasselblad photographs, in
one Maurer camera photograph, and again in the
never -before -seen 16 ,000 -frame RCA D -15
mission that I recovered from the National Archives.
And when you line them all up, the secret lithograph,
the public NASA photos, the hidden RC camera
footage, the objects match. and all of them.
They're different angles, different lighting,
and different cameras, but it's the same craft.
We're dealing with a documented sequence of events
NASA never intended the public to see. This isn't
folklore. This isn't a story someone told somebody.
This is forensic archival scientific evidence.
We have NASA astronaut voice transcripts reporting
weird craft in real time. We have NASA's technical
debriefings where the astronauts deny seeing
any anomalies except one, the exact anomaly that
occurred during the D -15 battery failure. And
again, we have a six minute communications gap,
which is a classic signature marker in NASA.
anomalous events. We have a perfect, indisputable
cloud pattern match between the lithograph and
NASA's own frame S66 54585, a scientifically
verifiable match that proves the lithograph originated
from a real NASA Gen 11 photograph. We have timestamped
artifacts on the RCA film that indicate missing
digital frames that should exist, and you can
read it for yourself in NASA's own Johnson Space
Center oral history, the testimony from NASA's
legendary photographic director Richard Underwood
in his official oral history interview, he states
clearly that no one outside a small security
cleared group has ever seen a first generation
NASA photograph. Every image the public has ever
seen. Every image researchers have ever seen.
Every image you've ever seen and Congress too
is from a third generation negative. Make sure
you understand what this means. It means we have
never seen the original NASA negatives. So when
you take all of this together, the lost lithograph,
the matching Hasselblad photo, the 16 ,000 frames
of hidden RCA footage, the astronaut transcripts,
the cloud pattern verification, the missing timestamps,
the National Archives of Recovery, and the CIA.
MPIC duplication systems. We now know we're in
operation. That's something NASA can't explain.
The craft in these frames are not lights. They
are not lens flares. They are not reflections.
They are structured objects photographed by NASA
across multiple camera systems. It's all 100
% NASA imagery. Don't take my word for it. Follow
the NASA trail and believe your own eyes. The
American public deserves transparency and that's
why I'm here today. Now you know exactly what
some of these topics are. I'm ready to discuss
wherever you guys would like to start. You'd
like to start with a picture. Let me hold one
up. When you want to see a picture, just go to
Amazon website. The name is Simkins UFO. That's
the book cover. When you take away all that print,
the white lettering and stuff, that is the actual
six by nine inch lithograph that I found in the
back of the Gemini 11 binder, one of 31 binders
of imagery that I purchased from an auction.
And I had no idea it was in there. Now this book
is filled with over 150 artifacts. Let's close
in a little bit so that you can see what that
UFO is. actually looks like. Do you see the glow
around it? Do you see how the lights, the portholes
are not even? And that's what originally people
thought, oh, that's a cheap, they can't even
make the portholes even. They're not portholes.
Not really sure what they are, but I think they're
more than likely energy dispersal systems. The
way the craft works and what I know now from
some of the newest engineering feats being done
on the nano engineering level, that hall is layered
meta materials. That is energy being dispersed.
That's an energy dispersal system and it's verified
by the around it. That's in 1966, Sammy. There's
an 80 -page report from Micro Trace Laboratories
in Chicago, Illinois. I paid $5 ,000 for this
report, okay? And that's been back when Whoppers
were two for $5. It's extensive scientific report.
You look on the back, those color images are
part of the 80 -page report. They did an analysis
of the lithograph. I have the chain of custody
documentation on the back. You can look at them.
You can see for yourself what's going on. This
is the interesting photo right here. This is
who these guys are. You see that photograph?
That's the the very first Mercury capsule the
United States ever built. And those guys are
the group of engineers from Lewis Field. It was
called Lewis Field back when it was the Army
Air Corps, and that was the research center for
the Army Air Corps. Lewis Field was where NACA,
the predecessor to NASA, lived. And that guy
right there in the center, next to that lovely
girl, the big tubby one, that's Scott Hanson,
and that's his secretary, who was there with
him to the day of his death. You can read about
it. She was there. There's another archive. his
office in Cape Canaveral. When he died, she was
living with him in Houston, and that's where
the Johnson Space Center was. He had an office
in the Johnson Space Center, and that's where
my archive came from. When he died, she had to
go all the way to Cape Canaveral, and she was
alone. She never married. They didn't have any.
She donated what was in his office there to the
University of Southern Florida. You can find
that documented too, and it says right there,
was donated by Emily. So they were never married,
but in all the documents found inside, you can
hear the astronauts. There's hearts. birthday
images, and the photos in here are amazing. This
is going to be the finest archive of the earliest
NASA photos ever. Here's exactly why. This is
the guy who took those boys from Cleveland and
formed NASA. That was the very first NASA space
capsule. He was the guy who pushed the button
that lit it off. Not only that, but he built
the block houses inside. Just some of the beautiful
pictures. That's inside the very first block
house. There's one of the missiles he's launched.
You just won't find these anywhere else. That's
Scott Jensen, the head of NASA at that time,
George Lowe. That guy standing... Next to him
is the first American in outer space. And the
guy in the bow tie, that's Scott. That's the
first capsule that they're going to launch him
on. That's how wonderful this archive is for
you. These are all big. This is a nine and a
half by 11. Nobody else has this collection of
photos. This is from the guy who built the block
houses. The head engineer, the lead engineer
you saw around the first capsule he built. Got
pictures of him in there with President Eisenhower.
You just saw America's very first astronaut there.
The archive is beautiful over 150 pictures. You
can see the components of the Atlas rocket that
they launched these guys up on. You can see exactly
every wire and what it was done. Those were secret.
Nobody was supposed to see those. That was our
ICBM missile. And that's how brave these guys
were. These great guys were so brave. Everyone
remembers there were nine manned Mercury missions,
but he includes all the documentation for all
17 Mercury missions. There were 17 Mercury missions.
Only nine of them were manned. And you've got
the beautiful pictures of the chimpanzees that
they launched off into space. Just eating fruit
and stuff after they got back successfully. Heritage
Auctions in Dallas, Texas, they make my living
on rare books and documents. I knew that these
were valuable photos. That's why I bought the
archive before I knew that lithograph was in
there. I'm a historian. That's the origins of
NASA when it was still NACA, okay? So that's
to me as a historian, it's the most valuable
thing ever. The last ones, the guys landing on
the moon and stuff, I sold those off. I sold
232 of those photographs at Heritage Auctions
for over $80 ,000. The pictures in this book
are not jokes. This whole collection is not a
joke. You can go to Heritage Auctions, and I
made sure they listed it as from the archive
of Scott Simpkins. So this is not a joke. When
you've got guys spending $80 ,000, to me, that
says a lot. There's a lot of investigation that
I do in resources, and I know you want to do
it too. When it comes to money, a lot of us say
that's proof enough. So if you want proof that
this is a valid archive, you can look that up
just by going to Heritage Auctions. Were you
shocked to find some of these pictures when you
bought this set off the auction? My business
is collecting stuff and getting it into museums
and not letting it be wasted. So I knew that
the pictures were great. The authenticity of
them had to be verified. As a rare book and document
dealer, the reason I researched so much is I
spend lots of money to buy things at auction,
but I have to know that they're valid. If I buy
something and it's a fake, I lose my entire investment.
So my whole life revolves around. documenting
genuine nature of artifacts. I knew what they
were and I said, these are valuable if they're
real. So I had to go there and verify for myself
that they were the real thing. And obviously
they were. I was so pleased. There were rare
documents and I still have those. I will auction
those off eventually, but there were things in
there that didn't belong and that's where the
confusion came in. You saw Emily Earl there.
In the first book, there's a whole page of a
NASA newsletter from mid -60s. It's got a lovely
picture of Emily. Everything I tell you is from
a document, not me making it. any event, you'll
see it with your own eyes. It says, Emily Erdl
of such and such a department, she was the first
female employee at Cape Canaveral. So not only
is Scott Simp, the guy who built the Rockets
and the Blockhouse, but his main squeeze, Emily,
was the very first female employee at NASA. She
started at NACA in 1945. Simkinson started at
NACA in 1943. He got out of college with a mechanical
engineering degree. I believe it was the University
of Cincinnati. And from there, he went up to
Lewis Field where he was hired to be an engineer,
he started out modifying and destructive testing
of propellers. Now 43 was right in the middle
of World War II. It was in 1943. So he was working
on propellers and destructive testing was the
methodology that he was a specialist in. Now,
whether you realize it or not, when you're working
with a new field, the most important thing is
destructive testing. It's why people see Elon
Musk launch one of those skyscrapers into the
air. And then it gets up there and it blows up.
And then you see everybody in the control room.
cheering wildly. And people are going, what's
going on? It just blew up. That's what Scott
Semkinson was a specialist in. And it's exactly
what Elon Musk is doing now. It's called destructive
testing. It's new technology that is only theorized
and not proven. And the only way to prove it
is to test it until it blows up. And that's what
he was a specialist in. Doing propellers in 1943,
the war ended in 45. Two years later, he moved
on to a place called Wallen Island. He was still
with NACA, running experiments out there because
he had some of the photographs in this archive.
You'll see him in there. He was testing Nazi
V2 rockets. So that's 1945. This guy was classified
from the very beginning. His security clearances
were top because he was doing experimental work
on military propellers, improving them and then
into the V2 rockets and rocket technology. And
so that goes way back to World War II. You have
to realize there's a train of evidence that's
going to be followed through all of these books.
And it's what's made it so difficult and why
no one has ever pieced it together. You have
things that you have to take in consideration,
such as was working for NACA. The documents that
I found show that NACA was actually affiliated
and the guys were running it. And now I use terms
loosely, but this is what I mean by difficult
to follow. They were CIA related even at that
time. What makes it difficult is it wasn't the
CIA. It was the OSS. They changed names from
time to time. And that's why it's hard to do
a good freedom of information act because you
don't know exactly who gets custody of what and
where to send it. And that That's all spycraft.
There's methodology that is used to keep it secret.
I understand it and you understand it too. I'm
not against all of it because some of it should
be released. But you got to remember these guys
are risking their lives, okay? They're military
men. We pay them to kill people. As taxpayer,
I've got to say, I'm not going to begrudge them.
The whole world is a dangerous and horrifying
place. And I'm just as bad as anybody else when
I get pushed into a corner. So I'm not going
to hold it against them. If my son or daughter
were in military and these things can be used
to kill them. I don't want them released. So
let me ask you this, right? You held up a picture
on your book that it fairly looks like a UFO.
Can you describe for the audience what we're
looking at? It's a little bit hard to distinguish
exactly, but can you describe what's in that
photo? Do you think the federal government is
intentionally withholding this information from
people? And if so, why? This picture was done
for me by Mark Ray. Mark Ray worked on some of
the images necessary for Gary Nolan's movies.
He's in Cleveland, so he's an experienced graphic
artist, does wonderful work. Let me see if I
can get this up. So this is a composite photograph
that he put free. This is what's going to be
on the third book that is going to come this
January. I'm working as fast as I can to get
this done and try to do some blog gaff at the
same time. What you're looking at here is a NASA
photograph and the red lit number label is S6654.
585 from the Gemini 11 mission. Now, for everybody
out here, you have to get familiar with where
you can find some of this information so that
you can do it with your own eyes. NASA is no
longer in the early image. They turned it over
to Arizona State University. So when you get
on a computer, just go ASU March to the Moon.
And March to the Moon means from man's early
start in space, marched all the way to the moon,
the Mercury, Gemini and Apollo missions, every
single photo NASA says it has. And guess what?
It is every single photo now. as they did not
get them off. We will get into how that's done
and how we've been misled. But that's where you
go to ASU March to the Moon and then you just
follow all the links. You go to NASA Hasselblad
photos, Gemini 11, and then put the number in
S66 54585. There's a series of five images taken
all within 90 where they're coming up on the
target. You can find that at Arizona State University
S66. 54585. It's a small image. If you blow it
up close, you can see the nose of the spacecraft
approaching the target. They had just finished
a tether experiment. They tied a tether to the
Agena and did an artificial gravity experiment.
They rotated it in that slow rotation. They let
go of a pen and the pen went to the wall and
held up. At that time, they did not know if the
physics behind that would work in space. They
had 12 different missions that they performed
on this important Gemini 11 mission experiment.
This is October, 1960. Less than three years
from that mission, they landed Neil Armstrong
on the moon. The next mission, Gemini 12, is
within 30 days. It's a breakneck speed that these
guys were working at. Breakneck. The amount of
documentation that has to be done is phenomenal.
The Gemini mission report was secret for 12 years.
I've got a copy of it right in the book. The
title page shows and it reads right there not
to be released for 12 years. The same thing with
the technical debriefing. The purpose of that
debriefing is to get you fresh from the experience.
so that we can get every detail and make sure
that it's recorded. So I've got the Gemini 11
debriefing document, and that's where you find
the incident where they describe that they never
saw any anomaly except one, and that was right
during this D -15 experiment. The Gemini 11 mission
lasted for three days. There's a constant influx
of voice transmissions. They go from the capsule,
and they're listed as to who said it, either
the commander or the pilot, and which station
they were talking to. Was it NASA Florida or
was it NASA Australia or Canberra? or the various
stations. We didn't have satellites back then.
Boys and girls, I know how to use a slide rule.
Without cell phones, how did you get a newspaper?
When the Apollo 13 mission exploded in space.
You all recall that, right? Safety engineer for
Apollo 13 was Scott Simpkin. When Apollo 1 caught
fire in the pure oxygen atmosphere on the launch
pad, we lost three astronauts that day. To honor
them, they called that the Apollo 1 mission.
Now we know not to put pure oxygen where there's
electrical equipment. These things seem like
they're self -evident today. None of these things
were known. That first mission you saw was the
first testing of the ablative shield. They didn't
know if that would work or if it would burn up
into space. They were testing things like solid
titanium shields. That's not viable because the
rockets were so weak back then. The little ICBM
missiles could barely lift these guys up. They
were giving the astronauts like six ounces of
personal items they could take. The astronauts
were small because we could not lift safely.
We did not have these capabilities. But that
gemini - Gemini 11 mission had 12 experiments.
The first experiment they did, they had to open
the door and throw it out the hatch. There was
not enough room in there for them to continue.
But the primary mission of Gemini 11 was successfully
incorporated. Of all the 12 experiments, the
most important one was they launched the Agena
rocket up first so that it's in orbit. And then
the real test that they had to do before they
could get to the moon was they launched the Gemini
11 up and it had to rendezvous with that Agena
capsule and hook up within orbit. If they could
not do that, then there's no way they could launch
the lunar module back up from the moon and hook
up with the command module all within one orbit
while they had enough fuel. That is the landmark
test. The other 11 tests were also great too.
The artificial gravity experiment. We'll get
into D15, which is actually a spy camera. The
first TV camera in space was an important experiment.
You might not remember the headlines, but it
broke the record for the world's highest orbit,
the Gemini 11. Once they hooked up to the Agena
capsule, they didn't know if this would work.
They fired that baby up and went 867 nautical
miles high, which was not broken until last summer.
Last summer was the first time anyone orbited
higher and it was only a couple miles higher
than that. And of course that's important because
that demonstrated that by hooking up to a new
rocket engine, you'd be able to get to the moon.
These things were unknown. It's amazing how destructive
testing has to be done, but they had to get that
done. The secret mission report was 354 pages.
We did not have the internet. We had to send
paper copies. Now, in the back page of that mission
report, there are 22 solid pages. And this is
great for researchers. Anyone doing research,
get into that mission report. It'll tell you
every aspect, every photo that was ever taken,
every experiment, the status of the experiment,
what happened, diagrams of what they had. The
rear 22 pages contain this. They contain 200
-some names and addresses of the engineers and
departments involved in that NASA flight. The
whole report was classified or secret for 12
years. There was no other way to get information
to people without printing. ended up, you're
not going to wire that over a newspaper wire
system. You have to get that hard copy report
into the hands of McDonnell Douglas, the Pentagon.
There's 200 different offices and companies that
all were involved in the process. That 320 page
report to those, and not only that, it's like
McDonnell Douglas. You read McDonnell Douglas
and it'll say how many copies were sent. They
sent them 18 copies. The reason they tell you
how many copies are sent is because it's classified
information, secret for 12 years. They need to
know where every single copy. of that went so
that it cannot get into the enemy. So now you
do a little bit of mathematics on that thing.
Those rear 22 pages, the 200 -some -plus reports
that were made, and you have the actual offices
that you can go to search for new leads. You
guys out there are researchers. I'm counting
on you to read this stuff so that you know where
to find the new information. If I had the strength
and I was young enough, I would be looking at
those 22 pages and going over them with a fine
-tooth coat and looking for names and reading
the names, and then I'd be looking at the family
of the names. I'd find the nearest relatives
and I would be talking to them about, did your
dad leave you any documents? Someone combined.
There's treasure out there, guys. So this is
a map to the treasure. But I'm trying to get
to you how difficult things were done back then.
The records that were being broke, the missions
that had never been done before. The D -15 was
the first television camera in space. From those
22 pages, you get the exact number of copies
they had to make of just the mission report.
This is not the voice transmissions, not the
debriefing films. Just that report alone, when
you calculate the pages in it and the number
There are copies that had to be printed and sent
and then retrieved. It comes to over 320 ,000
pages. Not only that, this is the breakneck speed
and the criticality of trying to beat the Russian
threat. It was a matter of life and death. Those
320 ,000 pages had to be printed up. They had
to be gotten to the hands of the engineering
staff and all these 200 plus addresses. The engineers
had to read them, see if it was a success or
failure, analyze it, make any improvements, and
get any improvements or steps. status changes
back to NASA before they launched Gemini 12 30
days later. This is a gargantuan undertaking,
the likes of which I think the D -Day invasion
has no comparability. So these things that were
done back there, kids, this is a different time.
So what's the relationship in some of the proof?
There we see the actual photograph. You can find
it at March to the moon at 66. 54585. And when
you close in, there's the nose of the Gemini
capsule. There's the unhooked tether. And that's
the Agena craft that they did all of their documenting
with. You can see the Earth horizon, the curvature
of the Earth, probably about 154 miles. And you
can see the cloud patterns on there. See the
clouds? Those clouds are clear, right? But now
let me tell you what we've had done. And this
will be on the cover of the book. The big one
is S66 54585. That's the official red number
NASA photo. This black insert right here. You
see that? When you go to age of the Gemini 11
mission report. You can download it from NASA,
get into the NASA archives, download the entire
report. This is what's on page four. The first
three pages are documents signed by heads of
NASA saying nobody can see this for 12 years.
The very first page of the report after all that
subterfuge is page four. And on page four is
this black image. It has a number. And guess
what? That number is not listed anywhere in any
NASA archives. It's got a black label number
that nobody knows about. I've been looking for
it in the National Archives, trying to find it,
but there's no listing of that as a real photo.
And that's because you can see it's just a blown
up image for the CIA. Why would that be the very
first photo in that important mission report?
It comes from S6654585. The most important mission,
of course, was the rendezvous. We can see its
part because the cloud pattern matches. That's
the photolithograph. And you see the clouds underneath
it? Those clouds match. Exactly. So the clouds
in the lithograph match S66 54585. Just as the
unknown document, page four, match S66 54585.
This is one that I did of myself. The Mark Gravel
one is such and such. This is from Travis Taylor.
Travis Taylor does a report on page 555 of my
book. Travis Taylor, for those of you who aren't
familiar, Skinwalker Ranch and all that. He's
at NASA. His business at NASA was photo analysis.
He's a photo specialist. He does a 20 page report
in my book. So I put this posted together. This
is page 555. And he's analyzing my lithograph,
trying to detect whether or not it's real. This
was before anyone ever found me. I'm the one
who discovered the match just through editness.
I finally looked and let me expand this picture.
I expanded a little corner of that thing. In
that little corner, the cloud pattern matched.
But this is what he found. There's UFO. What
he's done here, this is the lithograph. What
you're seeing is the UFO and the clouds underneath
it that we matched. I matched two years after
this report. He's pointing. orbital debris. There's
a piece of orbital debris there and a piece of
orbital debris there. When I first discovered
that the images were similar, I did this and
did analog production. There's the lithograph
and there's the cloud pattern from the photograph
and they match. The interesting thing is that
orbital debris he finds in the lithograph is
not visible in the actual S6654585, which means
this is a real image. It contains the orbital
debris. S6654585 has the orbital debris removed.
It's a doctored photograph. What do you think
they are? Do you think they're from a different
galaxy, interdimensional? The universe is such
a large thing and we know very little. Our physics
is rudimentary. Most of the stuff we know is
correct to a certain degree, but most of it's
wrong. When you talk about having to invent black
holes and dark energy and dark matter, you're
basically talking about cheating. You've got
a model and you say, yes, this model is right,
but you have to invent something to keep the
numbers from going to affinity. We'll call it
dark matter. We'll call it dark energy. The model
is as correct as we can get. I'm not saying it's
wrong. I'm just saying there are parts of it
that are so wrong that we're getting numbers
that aren't realistic. If the model doesn't work
everywhere, that means the model is wrong to
me. That said, it's very hard for me to understand
the significance of time as it is to anyone.
What is time? Is it a three -dimensional structure?
I particularly favor looking at the origami -shaped
universe or the cedar space. How do you describe
things? Multi -dimension. We don't even know
which of these. things may be the right one.
I say you have to admit that my belief is there's
more to the universe than just one. I've done
a couple papers using some of the latest technology
I can find on metamaterials that we're using
to build these supercomputer chips. We're talking
nanometer technology. All those electric currents
traveling almost at an atomic scale. Well, they're
working on that. I find particularly interesting.
Simon's Foundation puts out a magazine called
Quantum. magazine, I recommend it to everybody
because it links every document so that you can
read the actual scientific paper involved. Just
click on it and read the paper for yourself.
I'm a skeptic, okay? I want to read the paper.
I trust your expertise, but I want to read it.
And everybody lies, human beings, we're such
horrible creatures, but it's the stuff that I've
found out. A lot of this is spy craft. Did I
show you yet? This is - Why do they want to hide
it from the American public? Is it classified
secrets? They don't want it to get into Russian
Chinese hands or are they keep - First of all,
yes, Russian and Chinese hand. This is the story.
This is what happened. This is from the CIA document
that's presented. The 10 documents that are coming
out in the new book. I have the actual numbers.
These are actual CIA documents from the CIA reading
room. You need to go to the CIA reading room.
You can get online, just put CIA reading room.
They said, oh, we're giving you every single
file. It's right there. Guess what? They're not
put together in a way that you can find the document
easily. So I've been spending hours trying to
find the original documents. And this is SpyCraft.
SpyCraft is, yes, I've given you the documents.
And that's it. It's right there. And what they'd
give you is a haystack and you're trying to find
the needle. Same thing they just did with the
Epstein file. When you get into these CIA files,
I have the actual numbers. And even then, you'll
have a hard time backtracking them. I got into
1956 and 1958. The Automat file is the creation
of the National Photographic Interpretive Center.
It's a series of 80 pages of documents on the
creation of the National Photographic Interpretive
Center created by the CIA, 1956 as follow up
to other military map. We'll get back to the
one document that will answer your question in
part. There's a document listed and it'll be
in the new book. This is what it is. 1965, the
Gemini 5 mission. The Hasselblad camera was a
new camera. Now we had been doing spy imagery
the whole time, right? We had the Corona mission
where they had special spy cameras. They launched
up in space and everyone's familiar with the
Corona. It's a beautiful program. Very expensive
cameras, right? Launch it up into space and then
they would drop it down on a parachute and they
would have the airplane pick it up on a parachute.
Now does everyone recall that? I think the Corona
program was in 1960, but that's one of the documents
included to show how things worked. We knew how
valuable photography was. We were over there
getting a basis document and getting ready. We
can target these real easy, because we got pictures.
They can do that to us too. What they did not
realize with current up in this memo from 1965
in the CIA reading room documents is that the
Gemini 5 mission took their handheld camera and
took a series of photographs of their buddies
down in Cape Canaveral. Hey guys, look at us.
We're up here. You're making your picture right
now. The CIA saw those images. They made a montage.
There's a big CIA memo about it. It says, holy
cow, we can detect the exact layout of the surrounding
area and its perfect ICBM missile targeting data.
1965 Gemini 5 mission was confirmation that we
can back engineer from this thing and get horrible
military data. We cannot allow this to go on.
We need a solution. And the solution that came
up was from now on, NASA no longer has control
of their own photographs. Richard Underwood,
our CIA choice, developed every single photo.
When you read the NASA archives, he tells you
exactly how he did everything. Nobody has ever
seen anything but a third generation. That's
recorded there. So it goes from him. He's the
developer. He's there at NASA. NASA flies the
photographs back from the aircraft carrier that
picks up the astronauts. He develops it and makes
a series, making more than one set from that.
He is a photo analyst himself. So he makes some
master. He doesn't say how many, but he makes
a couple masters and he even tells it. I differentiate
them because I scratch a number into the negative.
So that's another way to tell what great a master
that you have. The first generation film is Saran
Wrap Thickness. He makes a couple masters from
it where he scratches a number into it. And that
Saran Wrap film goes back in the freezer. He
says in his interview, no one will ever see it
again. That's his testimony. Now that goes to
the 1965 testimony. We now know in 1965 when
the CIA said they can target their missile. from
these little handheld cameras. What they did
was said, no longer will NASA be in control of
their own pictures. The MPIC is for military
intelligence. When they detected the Cuban missile
crisis, the president had to see that right away.
These guys are on a hair trigger speed mechanism.
That's exactly what they were with NASA too,
because NASA was supposed to release and everybody
was waiting for the photographs. Underwood sent
the second generation. The first generation was
locked up and no one ever saw it again, but he
made copies and the second generation and scratched
numbers into it. He may have done some interpretation
himself on behalf of the government to make sure
that no one else got to see the second generation.
No one ever saw the second generation either,
except him. He's the one who made the second
generation. The 1965 memo says from now on we
will get the original, the second generation
one. They get to photograph negatives first.
They do not go to NASA. NASA does not get to
see the negatives. What happens is they go to
the CIA, analyzes them, scrubs them, chooses
anything that needs to be deleted, chooses things
that need to be degraded so that you can't get
the information from it. I think when President,
when he held up the pictures of the missile silos
in Cuba, that was top secret information. Those
were YouTube pictures and you can back engineer
from the YouTube pictures exactly the parameters
of the camera they were using and from that you
can use that back engineering data to match it.
There's just so many things that you can get
from a photograph. That's why we created the
satellites, but the Hasselblad turns out is just
as good. So they sanitize the copies and then
NASA gets third generation images and from that
they are free to release anything in the third
generation image. That's because they'd already
been sanitized. We all grow so angry in these
cases. congressional hearings, time after time,
we hear NASA get up and testify. We have no record
of any UFOs. We just don't have records of it.
And everybody's going, you're lying. We've got
people out here doing these. And we're like,
you're lying, you're lying. They're not lying.
It's spycraft. It's what David talked about in
testimony. Spycraft is a wonderful thing. And
what is it? Everybody calls NASA every time and
says, we want those photos. The spycraft lets
NASA sit on the hot seat because they only have
what we. have, we sent the photos and NASA never
did have. So that's what's going on in these
hearings. It's driving everyone crazy. I've got
the documents you can read for yourself. It's
coming out in the book in January. That's the
document from 1965. I've got the document from
1960. The creation of the Center, the National
Photographic Interpretation, and that's changed
names too. It's like a political party. It's
like the Republican party is the Southern Democrats
of 1958. It's like spycraft. It's delusional.
We're such a horrible species. It's lucky we
can... even make a school of any kind, let alone
integrate one. It's, we have to be led. We're
a vicious, dangerous species and we have to be
led and protection has to be done for my kids
who I know have to fight a war to protect the
things we believe in. So I'm for secrecy, but
it gets carried away. There are military secrets
that can be back engineered from simple photographs.
If you gave them the sanitized photographs, they
would know what kind of planet it was, the altitude
that flew, the amount of data they can get. Then
you are able to develop countermeasures. Anytime
that satellite's over, we know it's taking pictures.
We'll put our things out of sight. Now, these
things weren't known back then. This is in the
birth of this form of spy technology. That's
documented. Now, here's the other thing that
goes on. And I like to go back to the book. One
of the best books I'd recommend to anyone out
there. If you read the background and research
who Philip Corso was, the day after Roswell,
Philip Corso is a real documented presidential
advisor. He was working under one of the greatest
generals of that time. That general was a magnificent
engineer. As was Philip Corso. Philip Corso had
a photographic memory. Just really wild how smart
he was. And I love him. He looks like the kneeling
mouth and the weaseliest little character. Short,
big black glasses like Barney Fife or something
like that with glasses. A trained killer. And
he's a killer documented from Korean War. And
the general he worked for, the reason he did
not release that book until 1996 is because he
loved the man he had plowed in Korea underneath
him. The head of the foreign technology division.
The famous battle of pork chops. hill bloody
horrifying battle absolutely with the last place
on earth and he's saying human being would want
to be he went to the front line of that hill
and was there with his men the inspiration of
that kind of leadership stuck with Philip Corso
and with all the other men who fought with him
this is devastating to me how a simple act of
bravery courage and leadership can transfer into
a sense of fidelity and dedication that can only
be broken by death Philip Corso had told him
he would not release this information until he
was dead. And he did as soon as he died. That's
when he wrote the book, The Day After Oswald.
The only problem with certain details in there,
Philip Corso takes the stance that he's the first
guy in line dispersing all of this UFO equipment
for back engineering. But he does not realize
they had been doing this. Tesla is the same thing,
right? When Tesla died, it took all his records
and it went black too, just like what Corso did.
So Corso's job, it's called the foreign technology
division. You can read all about it. This guy
was advising presidents. He worked for a great
general, the general gave him a file cabinet
of foreign technology from the Roswell incident.
They deal with foreign technology all day long.
They had spies that went down to Brazil and obtained
a copy of a Brazilian machine gun. And it was
the best machine gun ever designed on earth.
They caught it. They brought it back. They gave
it to their military contractors. They back engineered
it. Voila, your modern American world's best
machine gun. That's the foreign technology department.
a file cabinet from the general. He describes
them when he got it right there in the Pentagon.
There's animosity between the head of every department
in the world. I don't care if it's your ally
or not. You can read in the book. He had a little
bit of that technology. The majority of that
technology from the Roswell crash, he says, went
to the Air Force. He was working for the Army
Foreign Technology Division. He says he didn't
get most of it, but he helped develop the microchip.
He helped develop fiber optics. People look back
and say they were working on fiber optics much
before he gave it to him. That's true. Courser
doesn't mention it. that stuff, but it was the
actual fiber optics that he gave them from the
Roswell Crafts that enabled them to come up with
the technology and match it and make it viable.
We've got the missing stuff from Tesla as an
indicator of the kind of things that were predecessor
to Corso. A lot of people discredit him because
he doesn't point out the fact that he wasn't
the first. He was obviously a key player that
finished it up. He'll tell you exactly where
it came from. The autopsy of the aliens, the
cornea of the alien, when they autopsied it,
they determined light characteristics being done
by this membrane. I was eligible for draft age.
I lived through that horrible Vietnam war. I
saw every night on TV, these guys in the jungle
sweating, bleeding, being massacred in those
horrifying circumstances. But I remember the
weapon that they did with that M1, they had a
starlight scope. Philip Corso with the eyelid
from that autopsy was able to the first night
vision scope. We did not have night vision scopes.
This came from the eyelid of the alien. I remember
it well because It came from nowhere. There's
a big old orange scope rusted on top of your
gun and you can see your target at night. I lived
through that period and it seemed a little bit
aberrational to me. It was just like, gee, where
did they come up with this design? Little did
we know. You read Corso's book, you get an indication
of what he said the design was. Now, the point
I'm trying to make to you is another reason these
things don't get released. And this is an example
of it. In Corso's book, there's a segment where
he talks about his job to take foreign technology
to America's advantage. manufacturing facilities
for back engineering. Bell Laboratories knew
him well. He would go to Bell Laboratories often
and give them a piece of technology and say,
yes, this is foreign technology. We need you
to back engineer it. And everybody working on
it, we don't know where it came from. Some of
it was from his UFO files. And that's what his
contention is. But there's the stuff that he
did all the time that we do know, like the Brazilian
machine gun, that was indistinguishable. They
didn't tell him it came from Brazil. He told
it in the book. That's where it came from. The
animosity between people and government is just
as bad as the animosity between your wife and
your girlfriend. It's bad. We're human beings.
And this is the example. He was taking technology
to Bell Laboratories or some other manufacturer.
You can read it for yourself the day after Roswell.
He was taking technology and he's a spy. He was
in Italy after the Korean War trying to recover
Mussolini's purported UFOs. And he was killing
Russians over there. He died. But he's a killer
and he's there in the Pentagon and he had been
followed the previous day by who he knew was
a CIA agent so he takes his service revolver
he goes to the CIA agent who was following him
to his boss's office he walks in this is in the
book he sets his revolver on the desk and he
tells him if he follows me again you will not
have him now consider what's going on here this
is an American army officer talking to an American
CIA officer the animosity that arises between
departments fighting for huge multi -million
dollar budgets is incredible. One half of the
Pentagon saying this is true. We know what Lou
Alessandro said is true. We're agreeing with
him. And then you have the other half saying,
no, he's crazy. The vying for power is a fatal
problem of a human being and is exemplified by
those things. So that is the other part. You've
got the valid part saying we've got to keep these
secrets for the safety of ourselves. And the
other half is that I'm a human being and my department
is not getting enough research money. I want
that research money. I'm going to follow and
get it. And the other half is saying, no, you're
not. I will actually kill your agent and you
know, I am a killer. So that's what's going on.
And then you add the third component that you're
seeing today. You're seeing things like Bell
Laboratories is not stupid. These are some of
the most brilliant men in the world. Now, even
though they had the cover that he was delivering
foreign technology, some of the stuff that he
was delivering was otherworldly. You can tell
them, yes, this is foreign technology. The guys
are some of the smartest people on earth. When
they see the technology, they're going, yeah,
foreign technology. Okay, we'll get to work on
it. So they work on it and come up with these
breakthroughs. Those breakthroughs result in
patents and those patents extend to this day.
If you break any information out there that the
patent was originally United States government
property, you got a world of shit between you
and your profits. So there's all kinds of things
involved with being a human being that we can't
do anything about, but I'm not going to sweat
about it. I'm just going to do the best I can.
and try and have the right morals that shows
a way to escape the consequences of my evil nature,
just as we almost tried. So those are some of
the things that I believe explain why these things
were being kept secret. And I think there's a
logical progression pattern to it. I've documented
the mechanisms, the CIA documents, the NASA documents.
These are all readable. They're all listed. The
reason it's unclassified is because I don't know
if we mentioned this or covered it yet, but it's
part of spycraft. Spycraft. says you have to
read the history of spycraft because every time
you have a spy in mission it's good for a while
and then it gets broken. Originally in the classification
system classification meant military classification.
According to our U .S. Constitution the subservience
of the military to the civilian means anything
the military does is subject to approval by Congress.
Well you can't trust these guys with a dime to
go down to the candy store and make sure you
get it back. In the military knows this too,
because military secrets always slip through
the fingers of Congress. We see it every day.
So they changed the methodology of the secret
classification system. So what is the rise of
a new classification? The classification called
SBU, and it means sensitive, but unclassified.
And it derives from just this specific thing,
what you're seeing right here on this document.
And by the way, this document format comes directly
from the Gemini 11 mission. That's exactly what
the other lithograph. or the photographs. They're
lithographs because they had print them on paper.
320 ,000 pages of it. You can't do photographs
in those things. You do a lithograph. That's
exactly what it looks like. And this strange
object is exactly CIA. There's a whole department
of photographic interpreters in the National
Photographic Interpretive Center who was making
these. This is a sanitized briefing document
and it has to have a heading. It doesn't say
UFO. Christ, it should say flying saucer. You
look at it and look, you want to put a label
on it. Let's call it Gemini 11 flying saucer,
but they call it as seen during such and such.
The title itself, there's a whole department
in there of photographic interpreters. Let me
ask you this. We've seen that photo of the UFO.
Has it been seen in other instances, other photographs
and other documentation that you've seen? And
has any public officials commented on that particular
photograph? The third book is actually the completion
of the investigation. When I started working
on this program with Leslie Keene, I told her
I've got to get something up because my dad has
been with me to all these auctions. He was astounded
by what we found. I said, dad, Leslie will get
this published and we'll be really happy, but
it was too long of an investigation. I couldn't
wait. So I wrote the first book and published
it myself just so dad could see what we had.
He died 60 days ago. Mommy's dead too. This is
the first important letter to everybody right
in the front of the book. It states, this is
not. finished, but I have to print this because
I want my dad to be able to hold this in his
hand before he dies. And I did. But just because
I printed it doesn't mean I did anything with
it. I let it get printed. This book will document
every step that gets you to the D -15 experiment.
There's three voice transcripts in here. Here,
you guys, you want to see what a secret document
looks like? I think that's the mission report.
Gemini 11 mission report. Secret for 12 years.
And then I've got the other technical briefings
in there. Charles Matthews had a NASA, right?
There's his signature page. Do you see that?
It says at the top unclassified. At the bottom
it says unclassified. That's the end of the Gemini
11 mission. It's the exact same format and the
exact same size as the lithograph. This is on
a 9 by 11 page and the lithograph is 6 by 9.
And you can see it just fits perfectly. There
you go. Secret. What is that thing? Gemini voice
communication. Oh, that's what I was going to
show you. Voice communication. So what this first
one does, these are the voice communication.
There, look at this. This is in the book. You
can read for yourself their descriptions about
what they're seeing out the window. At hour 54,
four hours, 39 minutes, 42 seconds into the mission
right there. And now when it gets to the D -15
film, there's a military timestamp clock. Every
time they take a picture, it gives a minute and
a second too. So this is evidence that you're
using. You have to cross reference all this stuff.
And then it says, whether it's a pilot, the co
-pilot saying it, I found three instances. Something
go by your window out there. And he goes, let's
turn around and go the other way. He wants to
turn around and see it. These guys, you're trained
not to let on what's going on out there. Come
on, Gemini 11, this is Hawaii. Go ahead. Could
you give me a reading on stack two Charlie, please?
Roger, two Charlie's down at the bottom. Roger,
two Hawaii again, and they're blank. Might as
well turn it off, Roger. Go along with it. We
plan to stay in blank mode until we get D -15.
That's just seconds before they start the D -15.
And that's just the indication of the photograph.
So you can match it by the second. The D -15,
I didn't know at the time. I had to do so much
studying to figure out the significance of stack
two Charlie. The significance is there were six
batteries running the whole spaceship, but they
called them stacks. It's a typical UFO electro.
magnetic impact. When a UFO flies over a car,
what happens to the car battery? It dies. It
goes dead, doesn't it? The UFO, they saw it out
the window, and the second they saw it, NASA
calls out and says, hey, check your number two
battery, and it died. Zero amps, zero voltage.
Then once in a minute, there's a six minute voice
gap. The battery had gone dead. We show the recorder
monitor operating normally, and then it goes
dead for six minutes. Richard Haynes says when
he's looking for anomalies, he says, I look for
anomalous voice gaps. And that's it. So that's
one of the first instances. These are in the
voice They're in there, guys. I want you to know
that everything is in here in the actual documents.
I'm not paraphrasing anything. I don't trust
people who paraphrase because I'm the worst liar
out there. Okay, let me explain. I can mislead
you if I choose. I don't choose to do that. We
should be approaching daylight. There might be
something crossing the coast here right here.
Oh, that was another meter. It's crazy. Oh, there's
one of them. Wow, look at that. What is that?
That on our left. It just passed over us. I can't
see anything. There's a blossom. Look at that.
And then the other guy says, I'd say that's Calcutta.
I can't see. What in the world is that reflected
light on my window? These are actual voice transcripts.
That's the second one that I thought was anomalous.
And then right after that comes five minutes
of missing transcript. And then there's another
one in the four minute gap. I want you to read
the actual documents. I don't believe someone
when they tell me something. I want to read it
for myself. For instance, here in the diary,
this confirms that he took a picture. What does
it say? 15 photo recorder using. I've already
commented on that. I took pictures when I thought
there was something worthwhile to take pictures
of. So you're crossing the voice transcripts
where they're saying, what the hell is that flying
out the window? the look at it to the debriefing.
I'm not military. I do what I'm told. And then
we match that with the debriefing. What's the
purpose of the debriefing? To get the facts before
they're lost. So you've got the facts in the
voice transcript and you match it to the facts
in the debriefing. This is the evidence we've
got. There's the B -15 experiment. Look what
you get. Guys, I'm giving you the documents.
These stories I'm telling you are documented.
This is not me. And there's of course, Scott
Stinson and all that stuff. When you're speaking
to the TikTok generation where they're not going
to probably... They go through 600 pages of manuscript
series. No, that's what the book's for. But I'm
saying that might even be too much for them.
The younger generation that's raised on Facebook
and TikTok reels, they want that instant dopamine
hit and learn something. So how would you encourage
them to go look at this? What they would learn
and what they should learn by observing and reading
this material? In my estimation, everybody has
a purpose in life. Nothing happens by accident.
In my estimation, what's happened today is I'm
talking to a couple guys who've got a website
that speaks directly to people whose mission
is the same. is my mission. It's a mission of
research and thought. Somebody's got to do work.
My mission was to read and I read voraciously
and I have a very strange memory that I can recite
most of what I read anytime. Believe me, as a
kid I was like this. I couldn't understand that
I was different. It's hard enough to fit in when
you're a teenager, let alone when no one understands
your jokes. When I was 11 years old during this
mission, my parents had bought a 1959 26 volume
edition of Funk and White Encyclopedia. One day
I picked it up when I went to the bathroom to
read and I read every single page through all
26 volumes that summer. It's because we're born
to do different things. So when you ask about
the TikTok generation that is listening to you
right now are very intrigued by what you've just
presented to them. It's their job to follow through
on the analysis. No, Dr. Diane Powell, she's
my cousin. Okay. And she's read the books on
ESP. She has the ESP files going on now. She's
created a foundation. She was in taught psychology,
clinical psychologist, Oxford in England, and
at Harvard here in the United States. a brilliant
woman with synchronicity because she and I have
the same synchronicity. We'll get in contact
and she'll mean it when she says I was just thinking
about you because it's true with us. Somewhere
out there in your audience today because of who
you guys are I have no doubt in my mind you ask
how do you get through that generation. I don't
have to worry about that because there's a synchronicity
that leads us all down our path. You got to this
path by many things you haven't taken the time
to consider yet and realize just how you've been
guided step by step into what you're doing right
this minute on your podcast. You have been guided
into that. Synchronous events occurred in your
life that put you where you are today. Just as
me being with you is a synchronous event I was
put in your life so that this message will get
out to some TikTok generation member listening
right now in your audience. And I know in my
heart that somewhere out there is someone who
heard us today and he will pick up the book and
do the research and be the next great contributor
in the search for truth in our So that's the
way the world works. Ed, you shared some exciting
information with us earlier. You're partnering
with the history or discovery channel for us.
Yeah, I've been negotiating today and it looks
like if we come to an infractual agreement, which
I'm sure we will, I just want this information
out there. I'll be recording for their season
six, January 17th. I've got a lot to get through
to them because there's so much information they
need to know. Some of this is blockbuster stuff.
The stuff you got today, I can't imagine. The
New York Times would run an article. on what
you now have as information. It wouldn't be anything
about the foes. The New York Times headline would
read basically this, NASA did not have control
of its own photos. CIA documents proof. And it
would also be the second headline would be, nobody
has ever seen an original NASA photo. That's
headline news around the world, just there. And
it's documented in the two sources that I gave
you. You guys recall anything that I've said
today? You did mention earlier, you've done great
work. You can tell you have this amazing passion
for it and you've dot your I's and crossed your...
But you did say something about UFO encounter.
Do you want to tell that story quick? Not for
you specifically, but for someone else. I forgot
the gentleman's name. Gordon Cooper. Mercury
astronaut, Gordon Cooper. There's a whole chapter.
Richard Haynes from the CHEM program retired.
He let me include it in the book because this
book is a handbook for how to do studies. There's
that TikTok guy out there who doesn't even know
yet that his whole life is going to be joyfully
devoted to something along these lines. And remember,
I told you today, look at that UFO. comes from
a Chilean photo. And look at the similarity to
the Simpkinson UFO. This is like a 20 -page analysis.
You can see, so you were asking earlier if there's
anything similar to it. Yes, so he's got a 40
-page report. There's a really interesting drawing
from 1966 also. The school incident, you guys
familiar with the UFOs that landed on the school
playground in Australia in 1966? I don't remember
the name of the school, but I was going to show
what I found interesting in my research. Oh,
and here's documents. These are voice transcripts.
from Gemini 10. Basically, they're talking about
UFOs they're seeing out the window on Gemini
10. It says, do you want to tell NASA? I don't
know if I want to tell NASA. They're worried
about talking on the voice chat. And they finally
say, OK, tell them. So they tell NASA, have you
been listening to what we've been saying? And
they say, yes. And then they say, don't forget
to censor it. But they didn't. But then again,
it was secret for 12 years. I was trying to find
the children's photos of the Australian incident
the very same year they were overhead seeing
the UFO. There are some photos of UFOs that landed
in the school. art in Australia and it was a
big stink because the whole school was terrorized
and they had to send investigators from around
the world 1966 Australian school UFO incident
search it'll come up I had to look through all
the newspaper articles because they stymied those
people they had to threaten the schoolmaster
who took a photograph with alcoholism and dismissal
just like everyone else they're not messing around
when you get threatened called the Westall did
I tell you the story of Richard Underwood what
happened to him in Guatemala and his wife this
is in the Johnson space center, Richard Underwood,
oral transcript. This is a two hour interview.
And he says in his earlier career, while he was
working on the secret photographs, he doesn't
mention the word CIA, but we know who it is,
right? He was working on a mission down in Guatemala.
He went on the mission, surreptitious photos.
He's a photo interpreter. And when he comes back
on the landing field, he tells this story. There
on the tarmac was the most beautiful Guatemalan
woman I had ever seen in my life. fell in love
with her and I married her. When the general
I was working for found out what I had done,
he called me into his office. He said, I should
have you shot without a trial right now because
you married this Guatemalan woman and you don't
have the classification where you're allowed
to do that. You can read these documents. And
that's what I do. I'm giving you the references.
Any of these stories you want to verify, you
can verify them. This is what I love about military
guys too, because they're just as full of piss
and vinegar as anybody on this planet because
what he says towards me and after that transpires,
you can tell he still remembers that general
telling him, I should have you taken out and
shot without a trial. We stayed married and we've
had four children and they all live with us here
in Houston and they work for NASA now. What a
way that he sees rubbing that general's nose
and I'm still with the bitch, my reverend, that
kind of ad. You're getting me close for a cause.
I use them sometimes just because for me it's
humorous and I apologize. No offense to anyone.
No worries, brother. You can read these stories.
The points are in there. The Warden Cooper story
that you were asking about. I already described
that right about the UFO he saw when he was building
the airfield must be Hollis Air Force Base or
else it could have been an area 51 Gordon Cooper
go to the chapter on Gordon Cooper tells the
story about when he was a fighter pilot in Germany
and he had UFOs fly up in the upper reaches of
the atmosphere where he could not possibly reach
him he saw them in his whole flight solid says
I knew then their behavior they were intelligent
craft being operated up where we would he says
they were UFOs I saw those in Germany before
he was an astronaut during his fighter pilot
days. He describes how we had to keep secrets
and he talks about where you came up with the
SBU secret, but unclassified. He talks about
how we could not let Congress know anything.
Every time Congress got something, they blabbed
it everywhere and men's lives were in danger.
They did this on the U -2 mission. When they
made the U -2, the military craft under the classification
of secret, but unclassified. And because it was
unclassified, it did not have to be reported
to Congress. talk specifically about when the
U -2 is shot down. American buddy didn't know
anything about that, right? What is this they
shot down over Russia and it's got Gary Paulson.
It was an unclassified mission and that's why
nobody knew about it, he said. Nobody knew about
the U -2 craft at all, except the Russians, which
goes to show how important espionage is because
no one in America knew it, but the Russians knew
about it. So in the chapter on Gordon Cooper,
he tells the story of what he was doing after
he left NASA. When he left NASA, he was working
still for the military. He was a valuable military
pilot. And he had great expertise in classifications
that allowed him to do important work without
the concern of classification. He reports he
was at, I've heard somewhere of a Hollis airfield,
UFO landing. He was in charge of the construction
of a barrier at the end of the aircraft runway.
He had to produce a movie to show to the generals
exactly how they build it, what it was designed
to do and how it was designed. He had a Jeep
at the end of the airfield. He had a camera crew
out there making live film that they were recording
the barrier. built at the end of the airfield
he was in charge of that he gets a call from
them and they tell him and you can hear it in
the YouTube video we've just had a UFO land out
here and landed on three legs in the middle of
the field it's taken off now and he says wow
we got it on film that's what they were out there
doing they were filming and they captured and
they said what do we do he's in charge of it
and he still doesn't know what to do this doesn't
happen every day I don't know what I'm supposed
to do so he starts making calls to all his upper
commanders to find out what he should do when
he finally gets in contact with the right person
they give him these explicit instructions have
them come in right now have them take it to be
developed make sure it's the only film developed
no copies are allowed to be made have them bring
you that film directly after it's been developed
and you sit there in your office and wait until
my courier arrives to pick it up they didn't
say anything about me not looking at film so
i took the film to the window i looked at the
film and yes everything they said was there on
the film i saw the UFO, I saw the three legs,
I saw it take off. And this is Gordon Cooper.
These are reliable guys. These things are in
the book, all these hundreds of pieces of evidence,
and I'm giving you the location to them. I don't
expect people to do the research, but I want
to make sure that those who are entrusted, journalists
like you, who are entrusted with presenting these
facts to the public know where to go and get
this. And you can now say that all that he was
telling us is documented. That's your job. Absolutely.
And it's been amazing being able to... spend
some time with you. I think we could talk all
night, right? Like a conversation. And I can't
throw myself away from the CIA files. Now that
I've discovered the CIA files. And I do have
one question for you. We always like to ask a
spiritual question, right? And what you see a
lot in the news today, and obviously you're connected
with NASA. You've done a ton of research. Many
people say we have not gone to the moon, that
it was faked. What is your opinion on that? That
one, I think, is not a reliable estimation of
the situation. My book will show you through
the CIA documentation. and how these things are
kept secret. It'll show you that only four copies
at most were ever made. Four to eight copies
at most. The MPIC didn't know more than 25 copies.
There is a logical explanation of why no one
has seen it. And I can show you the methodology
that we use to keep it a secret. Yes, secrets
can be kept, but you have to show the methodology
how it could be done. It's absolutely impossible
that there's any methodology that would have
allowed that to occur. That's not a possibility.
Not with the life. It's just too far. are fetched
when you can see the actual space launches. You
say those space launches weren't doing what they
were supposed to do, and you've got the whole
nation following it. There's no evidentiary trail
to my knowledge that will verify that. It's okay
to be skeptical, but be prepared to do the research.
Until you show me research where that is absolutely
feasible, I will continue to say all of the things,
all the evidence I've seen, contrary. But that's
the important thing. I'm a skeptic. Those of
you who believe that, prove me wrong. Find the
evidence. That's what it's all about. We can't
trust each other. We're human. I salute you for
your skepticism. Find some evidence because the
evidence I know is contrary to that belief, but
I could be wrong. I appreciate everything we
talked about tonight, Ed. You've been a fantastic
guest. Can you remind folks where to find your
book? Where can they go out, seek it out, and
find it? You can order it in any bookstore if
you know the title. Have them look it up. Ed
Wilson said, just remember not Bart Simpson,
but Simpkinson. I put pictures on the book. Look
at these UFO pictures that are NASA photographs.
Those are... NASA images and it's on the back
of the book. A Report to Congress by Ed Wilson.
That's the UFO. That's the D1540. I tried to
put as many pictures as I could on the covers
of the book. My books are expensive. I intend
to make some money from it. I quit my job selling
stuff to auction houses and putting stuff in
museums. When I found this lithograph, I had
to quit my entire job that I made a living. I
had to spend thousands of dollars to publish
all this stuff. Anyone who has a problem with
making money from your labor, I like to go to
the Bible. Jesus said, don't muzzle the ox while
he treads the grain. Fat Americans, we're humans.
And I may be fat, but I still like to eat. So
I quit my job. My income suffered because I found
something that has absolutely absorbed me. When
you find it's like a man who finds a great pearl
buried in a field, he sells everything he has
to buy that field. That's what happened to me.
I put everything I did to make money because
there is the pearl in the I would have done this
without renumeration. That's why, but I do try
and put this information out there so that you
don't have to buy the book. These photos are
beautiful. Look at it. You want to see some ICBM
components? Nine by nine? These launch photos.
Look at these things. Look at that Wallops Island.
Look at this. This stuff is amazing. It's the
best history on earth. It's a story that has
never been told and it pulls together all the
ends of our frustration. What you're going to
get, I believe in my heart, you're getting the
final story. that explains why we've had all
this subterfuge and problems and how it was done.
That's what I feel. I agree with you. You've
been fantastic. Like I said, we enjoyed every
minute with you. I encourage folks to reach out
to you, watch you on your History Channel show,
jump on Amazon, pick up a book. Gotcha. But yeah,
pick up the book on Amazon or your local barns
and whatever bookstores near you. The reason
I tell them to go to Amazon, I tried to put those
pictures on the cover. You can look at the cover
on Amazon. It's important to get the information
out. I've got a website. Seth Lamancusa is my
technical director who you guys have met and
spoken. Wasn't able to be here tonight, but he
has a website and he may have sent it to you,
the link, but it's called Gemini 11 UFO on YouTube.
Seth Lamancusa. Gemini 11, and you got to spell
11 XI. So Gemini XI UFO. You can download photos,
film footage from there, his Dropbox connection.
I want this information out there. I want a couple
bucks, but you get what you pay for too. I'm
proud of my work. It's great work. I don't mind.
As you shouldn't be. Yeah, go to Amazon and look
at the pictures. You don't have to pay for those
and let it stir your imagination. Thank you so
much, Ed. Until next time, we are Zero Signal.
We're out. You've been listening to Zero Sigma.
We're out.